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View Full Version : Pat Devlin, QB, Delaware


JPP90
01-08-2011, 12:00 AM
Had another impressive, efficient performance tonight in the FCS championship, and headed to East/West Shrine. So mechanically and fundamentally sound and very accurate, can make all the throws evwn though he doesn't have Flacco's arm. IMO this guy belongs right in the 2nd round discussion and will make a team very happy. Some of other guys have more flair or come from bigger programs but Devlin has a lot more potential to be a deadly accurate pocket passer in the right system.

xcfan
01-08-2011, 12:57 AM
i agree, but ours is not a popular opinion on the boards. go figure.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 12:59 AM
i agree, but ours is not a popular opinion on the boards. go figure.

Oh well. Popular opinion is pretty much limited to Cam Newton and Tyrod Taylor...go figure

FUNBUNCHER
01-08-2011, 12:09 PM
Oh well. Popular opinion is pretty much limited to Cam Newton and Tyrod Taylor...go figure

Huh??

That's BS.
Sounds like you have an agenda, JPP90.

What's ironic is that Locker fits right in perfectly in terms of physical tools and style of play you seem to detest in the other dual-threat QBs available in this draft.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 12:17 PM
Not a big fan of Devlin. I don't see much about him that screams NFL to me. Lots of underneath stuff, doesn't have to use his footwork. He does read defenses pretty well, but his arm strength is average and his accuracy in terms of ball placement is a little spotty in my opinion. He's not asked to throw the ball down the field like Flacco is and his receivers make most of the plays for him. Seen a lot of him lately and I expected to see so much more.

If you're taking a quarterback in the FCS as high as the second round, you expect them to be a bit more dominant than Devlin was. Not a bad guy to take in the second day, but I'm just not seeing the top three rounds like some people are. Mostly hype and people looking to find the next Flacco.

FUNBUNCHER
01-08-2011, 12:55 PM
I still don't have any idea what kind of arm Devlin has.
Last night it looked so-so.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 01:00 PM
I still don't have any idea what kind of arm Devlin has.
Last night it looked so-so.

That's about what it is. His arm strength is pretty overblown.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 01:06 PM
He made some downfield throws last night that definentl ylooked adequate. Have a look at the Jets and Patriots offenses sometime...lots of "underneath stuff". It works. Mark Sanchez doesn't have a huge arm...people like him. Brady doesn't have a huge arm, he's just deadly accurate when he does go downfield. I saw a lot of these traits in him throughout the FCS playoffs. How can anyone say he's not that accurate too? Check the numbers...he's the most efficient QB probably at any level of college football this year. He threw 3 ints the entire season and 2 were tipped to defenders. Yes it has a lot to do with the offense but hey, like I said it works, and it works at the next level. Arms are overrated anyway..ask Jamarcus Russell and Ryan Leaf. Ill take a smart pocket QB with a lesser arm anyday.

SickwithIt1010
01-08-2011, 01:11 PM
Not a big fan of Devlin. I don't see much about him that screams NFL to me. Lots of underneath stuff, doesn't have to use his footwork. He does read defenses pretty well, but his arm strength is average and his accuracy in terms of ball placement is a little spotty in my opinion. He's not asked to throw the ball down the field like Flacco is and his receivers make most of the plays for him. Seen a lot of him lately and I expected to see so much more.

If you're taking a quarterback in the FCS as high as the second round, you expect them to be a bit more dominant than Devlin was. Not a bad guy to take in the second day, but I'm just not seeing the top three rounds like some people are. Mostly hype and people looking to find the next Flacco.

Pretty spot on.....i wasnt all that impressed.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 01:12 PM
"Lies, damn lies, and statistics."

Efficiency and completion percentage have very little to do with ball placement and down the field accuracy when you get that inflated by throwing underneath a lot. In the Villanova game earlier in the year, I saw him put the ball to the wrong shoulder multiple times. Had he thrown it to the right spot, the receiver catches and runs for extra yardage. Saw a bit of that the other day as well, although not as much.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-08-2011, 01:14 PM
he looks like a back up at best to me

not that that's a bad thing. he just doesn't have the tools to be a starter imo

JPP90
01-08-2011, 01:16 PM
Pretty spot on.....i wasnt all that impressed.

Nobodys impressed by anything but a Qb running for 100 yards a game. People love Terrelle Pryor, Tyrod Taylor and Cam Newton...hate Pat Devlin. Jump on the bandwagon when he makes it, that's all. He's not exciting but look around at what works a t the next level...the Pats, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Falcons....none of them are "exciting". They're smart, efficient and well-disciplined.

FUNBUNCHER
01-08-2011, 01:19 PM
Except that Brady improved his arm strength in the NFL to the point I'd call it 'strong'.

Arm strength can be overrated in QBs, like 40 times for RBs. But a QB with a marginal pro arm has ZERO margin for error when he throws the football.

Big armed QBs don't have to be perfect with their reads or limited to swing passes/screens/10 yard comebacks or shallow crossing routes.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 01:22 PM
Nobodys impressed by anything but a Qb running for 100 yards a game. People love Terrelle Pryor, Tyrod Taylor and Cam Newton...hate Pat Devlin. Jump on the bandwagon when he makes it, that's all. He's not exciting but look around at what works a t the next level...the Pats, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Falcons....none of them are "exciting". They're smart, efficient and well-disciplined.

This is quite possibly the worst response to legitimate criticism of a prospect ever. No one is grilling him for his legs or because he's "not exciting". Prospects like Devlin make it all the time and at a much greater frequency than running quarterbacks do and everyone knows that. No one cares about excitement. Just objectivity. Notice how everyone had Andrew Luck as their top quarterback prospect this year for the same reasons you listed.

If you don't like people disagreeing with you, start a blog.

Except that Brady improved his arm strength in the NFL to the point I'd call it 'strong'.

Upper echelon, even. He's added 30+ pounds since coming into the NFL. Not a gun like Cutler of those types of guys, but it's probably the strongest out of the top five quarterbacks even.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 01:24 PM
Ok, but he isn't necessarily struggling in these areas. LikeI said, his arm looked fine to me. Amd he is similar in build to Brady so you could argue he has every bit a chance to get stronger at the next level.

FUNBUNCHER
01-08-2011, 01:24 PM
Nobodys impressed by anything but a Qb running for 100 yards a game. People love Terrelle Pryor, Tyrod Taylor and Cam Newton...hate Pat Devlin. Jump on the bandwagon when he makes it, that's all. He's not exciting but look around at what works a t the next level...the Pats, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Falcons....none of them are "exciting". They're smart, efficient and well-disciplined.

I'd be impressed if Devlin was throwing the football for 350 yards and 4 TDs. Forget scrambling.

Again, who said they 'hate' Devlin??

And the Pats, Steelers, Ravens, Saints and Falcons all start QBs who don't play the game or look remotely similar to Devlin.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 01:25 PM
Ok, but he isn't necessarily struggling in these areas. LikeI said, his arm looked fine to me. Amd he is similar in build to Brady so you could argue he has every bit a chance to get stronger at the next level.

That's rare. You really don't see that all that often. Brady is sort of an extreme example in that regard just as Brees is for short quarterbacks. It could certainly happen, but it's fairly unlikely.

ThePudge
01-08-2011, 02:53 PM
Not a big fan of Devlin. I don't see much about him that screams NFL to me. Lots of underneath stuff, doesn't have to use his footwork. He does read defenses pretty well, but his arm strength is average and his accuracy in terms of ball placement is a little spotty in my opinion. He's not asked to throw the ball down the field like Flacco is and his receivers make most of the plays for him. Seen a lot of him lately and I expected to see so much more.

If you're taking a quarterback in the FCS as high as the second round, you expect them to be a bit more dominant than Devlin was. Not a bad guy to take in the second day, but I'm just not seeing the top three rounds like some people are. Mostly hype and people looking to find the next Flacco.

This. People see a couple tools (adequate size, good mechanics, and accuracy) and they want to make the guy into a stellar prospect. I still think he possesses a fairly slight frame, lacks an NFL arm, and has the same system concerns as many QBs in this draft (notably Newton & Mallett.) Unlike those two guys, however, Devlin is playing well at the FCS level, not against the highest competition in college football. People want to believe he was a special player at Penn State but he could not have been more ordinary. This is a guy I believe is just that, a guy.

ThePudge
01-08-2011, 03:07 PM
Nobodys impressed by anything but a Qb running for 100 yards a game. People love Terrelle Pryor, Tyrod Taylor and Cam Newton...hate Pat Devlin. Jump on the bandwagon when he makes it, that's all. He's not exciting but look around at what works a t the next level...the Pats, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Falcons....none of them are "exciting". They're smart, efficient and well-disciplined.

Yea, because Andrew Luck was such the scrambler. He was the consensus #1 player in the draft without people considering him a threat to run for big yardage in the NFL.

Also, the big Cameron Newton fans you'll see on this board will tell you that his running ability is far from his most attractive quality. He has incredible upside as a pocket passer at 6'5 240 who can make things happen when plays break down around him. His size, mobility, and ability to throw the ball is what turns heads. I don't care if he ever gets close to 80-100 yards rushing in a game at the NFL level. I don't want my franchise Quarterback trying to truck people & putting himself in a position to get injured. I expect more of an Aaron Rodgers/Josh Freeman type impact as a runner than a Michael Vick.

Terrelle Pryor and Tyrod Taylor are good college players but they're marginal pro prospects that don't deserve to be drafted before the 5th Round as QBs. I wouldn't be shocked if neither took a snap at Quarterback during an NFL game. Taylor is between Pat White and Troy Smith as a pro prospect, but I don't think any gimmicky offense will take the early shot they did on White.

You should just let it go. There are going to be people that think gifted athletes like Tyrod/Pryor would make good QBs in the NFL, just as there are people that think ordinary accurate pocket passers from the FCS will be good NFL QBs.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 03:58 PM
This is quite possibly the worst response to legitimate criticism of a prospect ever. No one is grilling him for his legs or because he's "not exciting". Prospects like Devlin make it all the time and at a much greater frequency than running quarterbacks do and everyone knows that. No one cares about excitement. Just objectivity. Notice how everyone had Andrew Luck as their top quarterback prospect this year for the same reasons you listed.

If you don't like people disagreeing with you, start a blog.



Upper echelon, even. He's added 30+ pounds since coming into the NFL. Not a gun like Cutler of those types of guys, but it's probably the strongest out of the top five quarterbacks even.

Lol...what?? Brady weighed in at the Combine at 211 lbs. His listed weight today is 225. Is it outlandish to think a guy could gain 10-15 pounds over 10 years?

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 04:02 PM
Lol...what?? Brady weight in at the Combine at 211 lbs. His listed weight today is 225. Is I outlandish to think a guy could gain 10-15 pounds over 10 years?

http://thesportshernia.typepad.com/blog/images/2008/02/28/tom_brady_nfl_draft_combine_2000.jpg

Wasn't a good 211 and it looks like he gained some weight to get up to it. Realistically, he's gained 25 pounds of muscle since entering the NFL and it's translated to additional arm strength. Name another quarterback who has doen that recently. Not just a guy who has gained weight, but who has transfered it into having a significantly stronger arm. I'm sure there's a few guys, but it's certainly the exception.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 04:07 PM
Oh christ, whatever. Yeah he ate a steak before weigh-ins and didn't look good with his shirt off. Must have really been 200. Whatever you say bud...

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 04:13 PM
Oh christ, whatever. Yeah he ate a steak before weigh-ins and didn't look good with his shirt off. Must have really been 200. Whatever you say bud...

Couldn't find anything?

SickwithIt1010
01-08-2011, 04:22 PM
Nobodys impressed by anything but a Qb running for 100 yards a game. People love Terrelle Pryor, Tyrod Taylor and Cam Newton...hate Pat Devlin. Jump on the bandwagon when he makes it, that's all. He's not exciting but look around at what works a t the next level...the Pats, Steelers, Ravens, Saints, Falcons....none of them are "exciting". They're smart, efficient and well-disciplined.

I hate Terrelle Pryor, I hate Tyrod Taylor, I hated Vince Young and Im not as high on Newton as most, but i do like his potential as a passer. The only scrambler ive been very fond of is Vick due to his ability to throw the ball, and his speed was elite.

Dont put words in my mouth. What in the world did you see that would make you think Devlin is capable of starting in this league? There had to have been a reason he wasnt the main guy at Penn State right? And like PSU, i didnt see anything that would make me think hes anything special. Hes a good FCS quarterback....and he wont be anything more than a back up.

Dont put words in my mouth. Im much more of a Andrew Luck/Matt Barkley and i guess Pat Devlin type QB fan, than a scrambler. I just dont see it in Devlin.

Hurricanes25
01-08-2011, 04:32 PM
I think Devlin could be successful in the NFL in the West Coast offense. Otherwise, I think he's just a backup. He just doesn't seem to have "it".

JPP90
01-08-2011, 04:44 PM
Couldn't find anything?

I said "whatever you say bud". I'm not answering a wild claim with a wild claim. I gave you his Combine weight and his 2010 listed weight ( which could fluctuate with a burger or a nice healthy dump, true) and you come back and say " nah, he had to have gained some weight before the Combine...he didn't look good". Thanks for presenting all the facts...when you find the proof that he gained weight to make 211, come find me.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 04:53 PM
I said "whatever you say bud". I'm not answering a wild claim with a wild claim. I gave you his Combine weight and his 2010 listed weight ( which could fluctuate with a burger or a nice healthy dump, true) and you come back and say " nah, he had to have gained some weight before the Combine...he didn't look good". Thanks for presenting all the facts...when you find the proof that he gained weight to make 211, come find me.

Nearly every prospect in the history of the NFL Draft has tried to put on weight in time for the combine/get in better shape. If Brady wasn't on some sort of conditioning program to get ready, he likely deserved the 6th round grade.

But does it really matter? The point is that he did not have an NFL body and got it after a redshirt year. Continued to improve as he went along too, and that translated into a significant boost in arm strength. That's not common. So if you're expecting that for Devlin, you're really reaching for straws and will likely come away disappointed.

RaiderNation
01-08-2011, 05:16 PM
He doesnt look like a NFL QB to me. Spread offence QB who is asked to hit WR's on short routes. Looks smaller than listed to me, probably is 6'3 or 6'2 215lbs. 3rd-5th round guy

ericzedwards
01-08-2011, 05:39 PM
I think I'd rather draft Bo Levi Mitchell.

CameronCropper
01-08-2011, 05:46 PM
http://thesportshernia.typepad.com/blog/images/2008/02/28/tom_brady_nfl_draft_combine_2000.jpg

Wasn't a good 211 and it looks like he gained some weight to get up to it. Realistically, he's gained 25 pounds of muscle since entering the NFL and it's translated to additional arm strength. Name another quarterback who has doen that recently. Not just a guy who has gained weight, but who has transfered it into having a significantly stronger arm. I'm sure there's a few guys, but it's certainly the exception.

I was always under the impression that Brady's increase in arm strength came through a chance in mechanics? Maybe I'm wrong, but I've never really heard of there being a direct correlation between actual strength and arm strength.

After all, if that were the case then Brady Quinn would be gunning it 75 yards through the air on a regular basis.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 05:50 PM
I was always under the impression that Brady's increase in arm strength came through a chance in mechanics? Maybe I'm wrong, but I've never really heard of there being a direct correlation between actual strength and arm strength.

After all, if that were the case then Brady Quinn would be gunning it 75 yards through the air on a regular basis.

I think it was a bit of both. Brady has gotten a lot bigger since he got here while his mechanics have mostly remained the same.

Most of the time, you don't see rail thin guys throwing bullets. Increase in physical strength certainly doesn't hurt.

Brent
01-08-2011, 05:58 PM
Increase in physical strength certainly doesn't hurt.
it's all in the hips

FUNBUNCHER
01-08-2011, 06:19 PM
Mike Vick has always credited Va Tech's strength and conditioning program with boosting his arm strength after graduation from HS.

I suppose if you get stronger through the hips and your base, you can increase the zip on your passes.

Chidi29
01-08-2011, 06:21 PM
And I think Devlin is too content with throwing underneath when he should be airing it out because of Delaware's offense.

I remember one 3rd and 10 where he had a low/high read against a three man rush. He checked it down almost immediately and they were obviously well short of a first down.

The Flacco to Devlin comparisons are totally invalid, as you guys are saying.

Brent
01-08-2011, 06:23 PM
Delvin compares well to Rhett Bomar, if you ask me.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 07:58 PM
Nearly every prospect in the history of the NFL Draft has tried to put on weight in time for the combine/get in better shape. If Brady wasn't on some sort of conditioning program to get ready, he likely deserved the 6th round grade.

But does it really matter? The point is that he did not have an NFL body and got it after a redshirt year. Continued to improve as he went along too, and that translated into a significant boost in arm strength. That's not common. So if you're expecting that for Devlin, you're really reaching for straws and will likely come away disappointed.

You're trying to manipulate Tom Brady's weight after being given the real numbers, and you're trying to say I'm grasping at straws? Good one.

ElectricEye
01-08-2011, 08:15 PM
You're trying to manipulate Tom Brady's weight after being given the real numbers, and you're trying to say I'm grasping at straws? Good one.

I'm not trying to do anything. Number is largely irrelevant, although still useful.

JPP90
01-08-2011, 11:02 PM
I'm not trying to do anything. Number is largely irrelevant, although still useful.

You said he gained 30 pounds in the NFL. Unless you can prove that he did, the numbers don't support it. Its that simple. Please don't take this to mean I think that he is the next Tom Brady. I simply mean he has characteristics that remind me of Brady. Smart with the ball, accurate, picks at a defense in the short passing game and he has that build and presence. The things people are nit-picking him for...he missed a read. Has any good QB ever done that? You can watch any QB and find flaws. Even Brady.

Matthew Jones
01-10-2011, 10:33 AM
You said he gained 30 pounds in the NFL. Unless you can prove that he did, the numbers don't support it. Its that simple. Please don't take this to mean I think that he is the next Tom Brady. I simply mean he has characteristics that remind me of Brady. Smart with the ball, accurate, picks at a defense in the short passing game and he has that build and presence. The things people are nit-picking him for...he missed a read. Has any good QB ever done that? You can watch any QB and find flaws. Even Brady.

Brady has significantly improved his overall strength and arm strength while here. He's ripped now where he was a little bit pudgy at the combine. Specifically how much is irrelevant, I'd say he was probably around 205 in college and weighs in at around 225 in the NFL. I'd say it directly relates to his improved arm strength.

I'm a fan of Devlin though, watched some of the championship game and he made some nice throws. Definitely a better prospect than some are giving him credit for. He went through some progressions and made accurate throws in the short to intermediate passing game. I'd have liked to see him run some more plays from under center but I'd say he would be a solid value in the third round.

Clarkw267
01-11-2011, 09:31 PM
Devlin looks like a draftable mid round prospect. I think he's a backup type, with the chance to become a starter down the line.

Anyone expecting him to gain arm strength like Brady is unrealistic though.

I watched Brady at Michigan, and his arm was not in the same area code that it is now. It's really amazing how much stronger it has gotten since he's been in the NFL.

will99890
01-12-2011, 12:27 AM
Anyone saying physical "weight room strength" is directly related to throwing velocity is wrong IMO. Plyometrics can have a minor effect, but lifting does not. Adding muscle really is for the purpose of withstanding the wear and tear throughout the season.

After a certain level of fitness/strength it comes down to tendon strength/elasticity, flexibility, and general coordination. The arm muscles have to work in perfect harmony with your legs, core, back, and shoulders. If anything, excessive muscle only gets in the way, preventing full range of motion in the shoulder.

I've never lifted in my life, don't throw regularly, and haven't played baseball since I was 14 and I can still touch 85 on a radar gun because of my shoulder flexibility and natural coordination (I'm 6'2" 205 and pretty out of shape btw.)

As far as Devlin, I haven't seen him play so I will wait to form my own opinion of him.

FUNBUNCHER
01-12-2011, 02:19 AM
You can lift specifically to increase explosion through the hips,(power cleans), and improve complimentary strength in the shoulders and back.

Track and field athletes do it all the time, specifically those who throw implements like the discus and javelin.

The key is maintaining flexibility, (speed/quickness through the range of your throwing motion) as you improve your strength. Improving overall strength and explosion affects the velocity and raw power you can put behind a throw.

Again, some people are born with the natural bio-mechanics to throw a ball hard and far, but targeted, specific weight training can improve the distance and velocity you can put on a throw.

IMO lifting weights won't turn you into an Elway or Favre, guys who probably had near elite arms as 18 year olds, but there are several examples of guys in the NFL who have seen their arm strength improve through weight lifting.