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Damix
12-12-2011, 08:49 AM
He's going to be a stud. To be fair though, he missed a # of blocks last night, but I'll chalk that up to growing pains.

Prince on the other hand.....he looks slow. I just don't see us getting any significant contributions from him this year. He looks stiff too.

Yea, he didn't look great last night. I'll give him a slight reprieve on that first long reception as I'm not sure whos fault it was (god damn zones). The 2nd one he was beat, but it shouldn't have been that long of a gain (we can't let romo have 9 seconds to throw). I was pleased he was able to track Robinson down though. That showed some speed.

He has impressed me as a tackler and his ball skills look pretty good, hopefully his coverage improves.

JBCX
12-12-2011, 08:53 AM
If you watched Prince in college, you could tell he was getting burned easily by the faster WRs, but he looked like an elite prospect because he played so physical and jammed WRs at the line of scrimmage.

I thought he was overrated as an *elite* prospect but could be a solid Cover-2 guy or slot corner, which would not really make him worth a first round pick, imho.

bigbluedefense
12-12-2011, 08:56 AM
Eli and JPP are amazing, that goes without saying. Credit to Jacobs for running tough for 2 weeks in a row too.

But guys, this defense is just awful. Absolutely awful. Front 7 is soft, we can't tackle, our LBs don't hit the hole, they wait for the RB to come to them, our secondary isn't willing to tackle, our safeties need to fill in gaps better, just a finesse, soft defense.

And Perry Fewell is absolutely horrible. He called basic Tampa or Cover 3 on 80% of our snaps. It was the most basic defense I've seen from us since Tim Lewis. It was awful.

This defense is too talented to play this bad. Tuck needs to go on IR, he's just out there, no effort from him. The scheme is horrible, and our back 7 is soft.

We need a new set of linebackers who are tough who can tackle and hit the gaps and stop the run. We didn't play an 8 man front ALL NIGHT. Even in obvious run situations. It was sad.

Just bad coordination, bad play, bad everything. Our defense is awful. There's no denying it. It starts with Fewell. 80% of it is Fewell, but there's still plays that need to be made on the field and guys aren't making them.

We need to revamp that entire LB core.

Damix
12-12-2011, 09:17 AM
Revamping the LB core starts with moving Kiwi back to DE. I understand the idea that you want your best players on the field, but the guy is a DE trying to fake OLB.

I don't see Osi back next year. There are plenty of snaps with Tuck-JPP-Kiwi-Tolly as our DEs. Boley is really our only LB, with Williams looking good in coverage. We still need a MLB and another OLB who can play the run. I think those 2 spots should be our focus this off season. Everything else kind of sorts itself out with players returning from injury.

bigbluedefense
12-12-2011, 09:31 AM
We need to sell out and get Luke Keuchly. Enough of sitting on our picks, Reese needs to actively and aggressively go after Luke this year.

We've ignored this need long enough and it's time to go fix this position.

Damix
12-12-2011, 09:33 AM
We need to sell out and get Luke Keuchly. Enough of sitting on our picks, Reese needs to actively and aggressively go after Luke this year.

We've ignored this need long enough and it's time to go fix this position.


Don't be ridiculous BBD, we'll draft whoever is highest on big board, grab a 4th round linebacker and sign a 1 yr veteran stop gap. Duh.


Anyway the only really needs I see are OL and LB, that should be our focus round 1-3.

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 09:58 AM
If Manningham catches that TD, we lose. How embarrassing is that.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 10:11 AM
Props to Jacobs for playing well! JPP and Eli carried this team! Great individual performance!!

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 10:12 AM
Props to Jacobs for playing well! JPP and Eli carried this team! Great individual performance!!

Did you hear Collingsworth say if he doesn't make the Pro Bowl there should be an investigation?

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 10:14 AM
Did you hear Collingsworth say if he doesn't make the Pro Bowl there should be an investigation?

Well start the investigation because JPP is not even on the ballot.

bigbluedefense
12-12-2011, 10:18 AM
It's a joke. The only chance we ever have of winning this whole season is if we have the ball down by a score with 2 minutes to go. We have to ask Eli to win us the game every week.

It's a joke.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 10:20 AM
It's a joke. The only chance we ever have of winning this whole season is if we have the ball down by a score with 2 minutes to go. We have to ask Eli to win us the game every week.

It's a joke.

Eli was frustrated by that. Watch the presser after the game. He said he is tired of coming back like that. It would be nice to hold a lead.


Telling words, I am sure it is talked about among the offensive players and even the offensive staff. The D stinks so bad, that it messes up what you want to call because they can't stop anyone!

bigbluedefense
12-12-2011, 10:33 AM
Eli was frustrated by that. Watch the presser after the game. He said he is tired of coming back like that. It would be nice to hold a lead.


Telling words, I am sure it is talked about among the offensive players and even the offensive staff. The D stinks so bad, that it messes up what you want to call because they can't stop anyone!

Eli has 6 game winning drives this season. We have 7 wins. So basically, if Eli doesn't have the ball with 2 minutes left, we lose.

It's sad.

Giantsfan1080
12-12-2011, 10:35 AM
This is the first time we've ever had 2 1,000 yard WR's in one year. I found that to be interesting.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 10:37 AM
Eli will have a career high in passing yards this season!

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 10:39 AM
Eli will have a career high in passing yards this season!

He's also on pace now with Brees, Brady, and Rodgers to break Marino's record.

Giantsfan1080
12-12-2011, 10:41 AM
With the last 3 games in the Meadowlands I can see that slowing down a little.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 10:49 AM
He's also on pace now with Brees, Brady, and Rodgers to break Marino's record.

It really is great stuff! That's how good our QB can be, and it only took a bad running game for his production and talent to be known outside the fan base. That's why I want a system change. Use our franchise QB, otherwise it's a waste. Let him get the stats like the other QBs do. We could have easily thrown in the red zone more. All the other systems have their Qbs do it.

That's why, in a way, I want a new system. We can be SOO much better offensively. Not prone to stalling out.

Damix
12-12-2011, 11:02 AM
Eli has 6 game winning drives this season. We have 7 wins. So basically, if Eli doesn't have the ball with 2 minutes left, we lose.

It's sad.


It does suck that I have no faith in our defense. At least we sold out blitz on that last play to Miles. Yup he was wide open, but guess what, Romo didn't hit him. If he has more time, I'm confident he makes that first down, even if we had dropped into coverage. Pressure means mistakes. I'd rather get burnt that way.

JBCX
12-12-2011, 11:03 AM
We need to sell out and get Luke Keuchly. Enough of sitting on our picks, Reese needs to actively and aggressively go after Luke this year.

We've ignored this need long enough and it's time to go fix this position.

Not happening. The Eagles will draft Kuechly before the Giants have an opportunity to do so.

bigbluedefense
12-12-2011, 11:08 AM
Nothing for nothing guys, but our run game has picked up dramaticly since Petrus and Diehl got in the lineup.

Makes me wonder how much of our running woes were the result of Beatty.

bigbluedefense
12-12-2011, 11:09 AM
Not happening. The Eagles will draft Kuechly before the Giants have an opportunity to do so.

You guys need a quarterback. This season is probably your best chance to get one.

Damix
12-12-2011, 11:12 AM
Nothing for nothing guys, but our run game has picked up dramaticly since Petrus and Diehl got in the lineup.

Makes me wonder how much of our running woes were the result of Beatty.

Eh, I'd say Petrus replacing Diehl at G has more to do it then Diehl replacing Beatty at T. Diehl looked lost at G. Other then the 1 play by Ratliff, Boothe held his own as well.

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 11:13 AM
Eh, I'd say Petrus replacing Diehl at G has more to do it then Diehl replacing Beatty at T. Diehl looked lost at G. Other then the 1 play by Ratliff, Boothe held his own as well.

Except he can't snap. It almost cost us.

JBCX
12-12-2011, 11:17 AM
You guys need a quarterback. This season is probably your best chance to get one.

Vick is perfectly capable of winning a Super Bowl. If the defense coordinator was even remotely competent and the LBers and safeties were NFL caliber starters, the team would probably be 9-3 right now.

Damix
12-12-2011, 11:26 AM
Except he can't snap. It almost cost us.

Yea that part kind of sucked, though only 1 was so bad that it could have killed us.

Giantsfan1080
12-12-2011, 11:26 AM
Diehl looking lost at G might have been because Beatty wasn't doing his job at LT.

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 11:27 AM
Yea that part kind of sucked, though only 1 was so bad that it could have killed us.


Yeah I just knew it was coming though. I was complaining about his snaps last week. They were all high, up at Eli's head.

Forenci
12-12-2011, 11:44 AM
Nothing for nothing guys, but our run game has picked up dramaticly since Petrus and Diehl got in the lineup.

Makes me wonder how much of our running woes were the result of Beatty.

I mean, for as ****** as Beatty was, it takes a lot more than one guy to run block. I think it's more due to Petrus being inserted into the lineup than anything else. He's a beast run blocker. That and the shuffling of our O-Line a bit.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 01:23 PM
Out of nowhere: Just watch, Pierre-Paul bound for stardom


April 21, 2010

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/13264220/out-of-nowhere-just-watch-pierrepaul-bound-for-stardom?tag=pageRow;pageContainer


Good in hindsight article by Prisco.

BaLLiN
12-12-2011, 02:19 PM
He's going to be a stud. To be fair though, he missed a # of blocks last night, but I'll chalk that up to growing pains.

Prince on the other hand.....he looks slow. I just don't see us getting any significant contributions from him this year. He looks stiff too.

i think he's injured again, he got it vs. Green Bay.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-12-2011, 02:19 PM
The Giants ruined my monday! I finally fell asleep at around midnight yesterday, couldn't sleep earlier because I was so anxious for the game. Woke up at 2:30 am just in time for kickoff in Dallas. Spent the following three hours watching the game and nervously biting my fingernails off almost entirely! Game's over at 5:30 am, but i'm too excited to sleep at all!!

Had to get through a monday at work with meetings and stuff on two hours sleep, loads of caffeine and pure joy! Totally worth it!!

Eli Manning is a total stud, and the other offensive skill position players are sexy as hell! O-line is blegh, except for Petrus and Snee.

Our defense sucks worse than ever, except for uberstud JPP, he makes me jizz all night long!

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 02:29 PM
Eli answers detractors, boosts status with season-saving performance

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/story/16420209/eli-manning-answers-detractors-elevates-status-with-seasonsaving-performance

"That name is both a blessing and a curse," one Giants defender said. "It means he might never get what he deserves in terms of recognition. And believe me, he's carrying us right now. Carrying us."


"Look at our offense," one Giants coach said. "We are down so many guys and he's just making it all work. He's been unreal this season."

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 02:36 PM
At least they know he is carrying them.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 02:41 PM
Coaches and players behind the scenes know these things. I been on a staff where the offense was slow, and got good. Meanwhile, the defense stunk like ours. Our HC was a DC too, so he told us score, be very aggressive, because we can't stop anyone.


So coaches know these things. Heck, even our offensive staff knew that it was on us because the defense was a mess. So coaches know what's up? Like any working situation, coaches can disagree with playcalling and talk about it alone behind closed doors.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-12-2011, 02:44 PM
If only we had a defense that could at least hold the best offenses in the league to around 25 points, I would say we had a real shot at another superbowl. Eli and the offense can seemingly put up 30 on any team this year!

unfortunately we are more likely to allow 55 points than 25 on defense this year. Rebuild defense with new coordinator and some new LBs, get healthy, and get more stability on O-line and we will be VERY dangerous next year at least.

Hate to say it, but we are probably going to be betrayed by our defense this season, either in the reg. season or playoffs.

Giantsfan1080
12-12-2011, 02:45 PM
If the problems are so easy to see even for us I don't understand why professional coaches don't make the correct adjustments. Would it really kill Perry to throw a gameplan out there one day that doesn't rely on so much zone. It boggles the mind.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 02:51 PM
Steve Smith (former Giant) on IR. So that's the end of that. Looks like the Giants doctors and their evaluation was dead on.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-12-2011, 02:53 PM
If the problems are so easy to see even for us I don't understand why professional coaches don't make the correct adjustments. Would it really kill Perry to throw a gameplan out there one day that doesn't rely on so much zone. It boggles the mind.

I really don't get it either. My best guess is that it's a philosophical principle of TC/PF, and that they revert back to the things they are most comfortable with when they lack the players to do a lot of different things scheme-wise. and unfortunately, that's tampa-2, a defensive style conflicting strongly with the strong suits of our healthy(and injured) players. It's just sad.

BaLLiN
12-12-2011, 03:29 PM
I think a lot of reason why the zones aren't working is because we aren't getting any interior pressure. outside zones are usually the hardest to throw into because they are the easiest to react to as a defender. Inside zones, especially with average at best linebackers, are hard to defend because less time in the air. With little to no push in the middle, it allows apposing QB's to step up into their throws and blast them to the middle.

Spags did run a lot of zone, but he didn't allow quarterbacks to easily throw where the openings were because of this interior pressure. What is killing us is that Canty and Joseph don't get enough push and pressure on the interior. We aren't using Boley as a blitzer as much, and Williams isn't making the best of his opportunities, because Fewell has been trying to get A gap pressure yesterday.

Next year, Marvin Austin is gunna be the guy to watch.

Big_Pete
12-12-2011, 04:07 PM
I think the main issues with the back seven. That must be our priority next year.

The nfl has become a passing league. We need better coverage.

I think we need to move Kiwanuka back to end and bring in a solid vet who can play OLB such as Dan Conner. That will give us two vet LBs for our passing situations with guys like Williams, Paysinger and co developing behind.

An upgrade at MLB would be nice and there are options in the draft and free agency. But if Goff is healthy he could be a good value option. The big need for our defense is better coverage from our OLBs and secondary.

With the passing offenses that are around, we need more speed at safety. I wouldn't mind seeing Prince move to an Ed Reed style FS role allowing Phillips and Rolle to play closer to the action. A group of Rolle, Phillips, Amukamara, Sash and possibly Jones is quite strong (remember Phillips enters a contract year in 2012).V

If Thomas is healthy, I like him being used in the Grant role (as originally envisioned this year). We do need to add corner depth though, I doubt Ross is back.

Jughead10
12-12-2011, 04:15 PM
I think the main issues with the back seven. That must be our priority next year.

The nfl has become a passing league. We need better coverage.

I think we need to move Kiwanuka back to end and bring in a solid vet who can play OLB such as Dan Conner. That will give us two vet LBs for our passing situations with guys like Williams, Paysinger and co developing behind.

An upgrade at MLB would be nice and there are options in the draft and free agency. But if Goff is healthy he could be a good value option. The big need for our defense is better coverage from our OLBs and secondary.

With the passing offenses that are around, we need more speed at safety. I wouldn't mind seeing Prince move to an Ed Reed style FS role allowing Phillips and Rolle to play closer to the action. A group of Rolle, Phillips, Amukamara, Sash and possibly Jones is quite strong (remember Phillips enters a contract year in 2012).V

If Thomas is healthy, I like him being used in the Grant role (as originally envisioned this year). We do need to add corner depth though, I doubt Ross is back.

I wouldn't be worried about developing Paysinger. He made the team because we had two injuries at the position before the season. Out of the 4 rookie LBers the only ones I would bring back are Herzlich and Williams. After reading the camp press, I am very upset with Jones' play.

Also have you seen Giants.com? They are having a poll about which Giants gave "an extra effort" and the results are 95% JPP, 4% Jacbos, and 1% Eli. Holy ****. I guess our fanbase still isn't giving Eli his due.

Giantsfan1080
12-12-2011, 04:42 PM
Well JPP plays like a mad man out there and Eli is the definition of calm so the question is dumb. If it was MVP of the game then it should be 60/40 Jpp/Eli.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 01:58 PM
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=112&f=1786&t=8423424&p=68


Dallas gameday thread! Good read!

From page 68 to the end. That's when Dez scores, and they think they have the game in hand!


damn miles

Romo has to make that throw

F word romo

banghead icon

ball game.............our d isn't going to hold here

WTF! Romo!@bangheadbangheadbangheadbangheadbangheadbang headbanghead

Damn romo

We r screwed.

It was there. Got to hit that pass. Money QB's make that pass.

Damn, would've put it away - quit smiling Romo/Austin.

if we lose this game.. that pass right there will be the end of us

If romo makes that throw, hes a legend....

Austin could have dived, but then again he was wide oen and if Tony is so elite he should of made that throw. im sick of these little **** ups from our team it has been going on for years

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 02:08 PM
I hope Washington isn't a trap game. The team is still on an emotional high from Dallas.

They gotta focus on Washington. I'm almost positive the team will play ugly football vs teh Skins on Sunday. I just hope we play well enough to win.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 02:13 PM
I hope Washington isn't a trap game. The team is still on an emotional high from Dallas.

They gotta focus on Washington. I'm almost positive the team will play ugly football vs teh Skins on Sunday. I just hope we play well enough to win.

Watch the offense go into the slump! We hit the highs of this system not watch the bust part of this system! lol. It will look like they never played football before together.

Giantsfan1080
12-13-2011, 02:14 PM
I hope Washington isn't a trap game. The team is still on an emotional high from Dallas.

They gotta focus on Washington. I'm almost positive the team will play ugly football vs teh Skins on Sunday. I just hope we play well enough to win.

I can easily see a 17-14 game this Sunday.

Damix
12-13-2011, 02:19 PM
No Trent Williams, and Brown didn't play last week, maybe he will be out again.

That'd be nice boost.

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 02:19 PM
I'm just tired of every qb looking like a superstar vs us. Usually, when we go against a bad qb, I like to think we'll beat him up pretty good. But with Fewell, I just expect Tim Lewis like results every week. It's really sad.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 02:19 PM
I can easily see a 17-14 game this Sunday.

Too low scoring! I expect the same # of blown coverages. They haven't fixed it yet. So I expect more home runs for both teams. At least we better, if we want to win this game.

BaLLiN
12-13-2011, 02:38 PM
Since we last saw them: Hightower got IR'ed. Landry is out, right? Fred Davis and Trent Williams are suspended. Rex Grossman is 64/113 comp to attempts, 787 yards, 4TD/4INT, 57% comp rate, 7 yds per attempt, 12 yards per completion in the last 3 games. Helu is doing very very well, Orakpo and Kerrigan are good passrushers, but their DL is average imo.

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 03:01 PM
We made Rex Grossman, TJax, Clipboard Jesus, Vince Young, and Alex Smith look like great qbs.

I don't care what the roster says. We'll make that offense look great on Sunday.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 03:27 PM
NYG just tweeted that Eli joins Dan Marino as only 2 QBs in history to record (3) 400 yard games in one season.

Great Stuff!

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 03:30 PM
Posted on BBI from somewhere.

It was black and white last night. Apples being compared to apples on national tv last night. Manning took a team with a decimated defense and made enough clutch plays as QB to beat a team widely reported as one of the healthiest in the league going in. Romo had a receiver that got himself WIDE open, and choked up and over threw a pass that he, Romo, the Dallas Cowboy quarterback COULD have won the game with, could have won the Division with most likely. And made a play as a qb that most eighth graders could have completed. Some qbs make their teammates have trust and make their teams better in crunch time. Romo, while putting up nice stats, always does the opposite.

Romo, Mr November, is the anti-December.

Romo is to Cowboy playoff runs what icebergs were to the Titanic itinerary.

The Giants defense was decimated by injuries. Their starting middle linebacker was sitting on his couch and not in the league the first 11 weeks of the season and Romo can't move our offense enough to hold on to a 12 point lead.

The game, and the Division title was there for the taking with Miles Austin wide open, and Romo choked up on a throw most eighth grade quarterbacks could have completed.

Wait a minute, blame the defense! OK, Jerry's latest coach he hired that the head coach shouldv'e hired seems to be failing.

No, blame it on the kicker! You mean the ROOKIE kicker we have because GM Jerry couldn't find and keep a competent one for about the last 14 years is having some ROOKIE growing pains?

Soooo, the qb that has a years long record of failing when pressure mounts again failed when pressure mounted. GM Jerry hiring assistants instead of letting his "headcoach" have the kind of cohesion all other top teams have in their coaching ranks is failing AGAIN? GM Jerry who fans have been screaming is a poor talent guy needs his rookie kicker to perform like an icy experienced veteran kicker to keep Jerry's team from once again folding like a cheap tent under December pressure?

GM Jerry's football choices again fail in December. The Jerry-centric chain of command has the team, offense, defense and special teams, again pulling apart under late season pressure.

Only the naive, the gullible, the fans who value putting heads in sand as team loyalist over being knowledgeable observant fans are the least bit surprised.

"Close eyes, shut up and cheer" fans only help Jerry keep satisfying his personal ego desire to play GM in the NFL.

And to the "he'll do it next time, just gotta give him more rope to get experienced enough to handle the pressure"... what do you say about Tim TeBow a rookie doing it game after game in his first year?

Some have the ability to play under pressure, and some are like practice qbs that can look great when there isn't real pressure but simply fail - repeatedly - when it there is pressure and it counts. NINE years and he's still having to make excuses for why he is losing in December.

HOW much time do you pollyanas want?

Jerry is a terrible eye for talent guy, but, absent a miracle tun around and playoff run, even Jerry is going to not be able to stay a pie in the sky pollyana about what Romo is, and isn't.

He isn't a guy you build a playoff team around. Tim Tebow and Manning were black and white contrasts yesterday between what kind of late season qb you need, and the kind you are a fool for keeping.

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 03:31 PM
The ******* Colts defense is ranked higher than the Giants. The ******* Colts.

We're the 30th ranked defense in the league. When you look at our talent on defense, do you see 30th ranked caliber talent on this team?

I want Perry Fewell fired so bad. I don't understand how his seat isn't hot. He's actually worse than Tim Lewis.

He's had more talent than Tim Lewis, and has managed to be worse than Tim ever was statistically. Think about that guys. Perry Fewell is worse than Tim Lewis. Lewis never had the 30th defense in the league, even with far less talent than Fewell has at his disposal.

How sad is this?

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 03:32 PM
The ******* Colts defense is ranked higher than the Giants. The ******* Colts.

We're the 30th ranked defense in the league. When you look at our talent on defense, do you see 30th ranked caliber talent on this team?

I want Perry Fewell fired so bad. I don't understand how his seat isn't hot. He's actually worse than Tim Lewis.

He's had more talent than Tim Lewis, and has managed to be worse than Tim ever was statistically. Think about that guys. Perry Fewell is worse than Tim Lewis. Lewis never had the 30th defense in the league, even with far less talent than Fewell has at his disposal.

How sad is this?


If Coughlin comes back, so does Fewell unless someone hires him as a HC.

Jughead10
12-13-2011, 03:32 PM
Romo is getting too much crap for this loss. Do I think he is as good as Eli? No. Do I think he is far behind? Also No.

He missed one throw. Sure we can say Eli makes that throw, and he probably does, but Romo did not have a bad game. Granted we made it easy for him, but he still played very well. The coaching staff isn't doing him any favors. For such a smart guy, Garrett really looks befuddled on the sideline often.

Jughead10
12-13-2011, 03:34 PM
The ******* Colts defense is ranked higher than the Giants. The ******* Colts.

We're the 30th ranked defense in the league. When you look at our talent on defense, do you see 30th ranked caliber talent on this team?

I want Perry Fewell fired so bad. I don't understand how his seat isn't hot. He's actually worse than Tim Lewis.

He's had more talent than Tim Lewis, and has managed to be worse than Tim ever was statistically. Think about that guys. Perry Fewell is worse than Tim Lewis. Lewis never had the 30th defense in the league, even with far less talent than Fewell has at his disposal.

How sad is this?

Our man crush is 32nd. And the Packers are 31. Although they make up for it with their obscene amount of takeaways.

The main difference is we are 27th in points per game. The only one that really matters. Where New England and GB are 14th and 15th.

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 03:36 PM
Our man crush is 32nd. And the Packers are 31. Although they make up for it with their obscene amount of takeaways.

The main difference is we are 27th in points per game. The only one that really matters. Where New England and GB are 14th and 15th.

The main point is, Perry Fewell is awful.

Our man crush wishes he had this much talent on his defense. He's playing WRs at CB. Perry Fewell is taking a talented group and making it bad.

Jughead10
12-13-2011, 03:38 PM
The main point is, Perry Fewell is awful.

Our man crush wishes he had this much talent on his defense. He's playing WRs at CB. Perry Fewell is taking a talented group and making it bad.

I agree. I just think it is interesting that despite more yardage against them, they give up less points. But a lot of that is garbage yardage. Where ours isn't garbage yardage.

They actually played in games where they had significant leads. We have not.

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 03:39 PM
Romo is getting too much crap for this loss. Do I think he is as good as Eli? No. Do I think he is far behind? Also No.

He missed one throw. Sure we can say Eli makes that throw, and he probably does, but Romo did not have a bad game. Granted we made it easy for him, but he still played very well. The coaching staff isn't doing him any favors. For such a smart guy, Garrett really looks befuddled on the sideline often.

I'm a fan of Romos. Have been for awhile. But this is a make or break year for him in my eyes.

Sure, he had a great game, but he still missed the most important throw of the game. And how many times must this guy buckle in the moment before we say enough is enough? Look back at this season as a whole, and the guy has multiple games where he just buckled at the worst possible moments. It's not just a 1 game thing, or even a 1 throw thing.

This week it was 1 bad throw. Last week it was not knowing he had a timeout and spiking the ball before the field goal. Vs Detroit it was back to back pick 6s. Vs the Jets it was a fumble when a FG ices the game, I can go on and on.

I really like Romo, but he's making it harder and harder for me to defend him.

Jughead10
12-13-2011, 03:42 PM
I really like Romo, but he's making it harder and harder for me to defend him.

I hear ya. It think he's a huge douche. But just not nearly as bad of a QB as most make him out to be. I got in a big argument this weekend (before our game) telling Ravens fans that Romo is better than Flacco. If you listened to some of them, you would think Romo is just trash.

bigbluedefense
12-13-2011, 03:47 PM
I hear ya. It think he's a huge douche. But just not nearly as bad of a QB as most make him out to be. I got in a big argument this weekend (before our game) telling Ravens fans that Romo is better than Flacco. If you listened to some of them, you would think Romo is just trash.

I'll take Romo over Flacco without hesitation. Romo is a very good qb. I'd say he's in that 3rd tier.

The first tier (excluding Peyton)

Rodgers, Brady

The 2nd tier is Ben, Brees, Eli

3rd tier is guys like Rivers, Romo, Cutler, Stafford

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 03:49 PM
Romo is getting too much crap for this loss. Do I think he is as good as Eli? No. Do I think he is far behind? Also No.

He missed one throw. Sure we can say Eli makes that throw, and he probably does, but Romo did not have a bad game. Granted we made it easy for him, but he still played very well. The coaching staff isn't doing him any favors. For such a smart guy, Garrett really looks befuddled on the sideline often.

He shouldn't be. It's on the defense, however he shouldn't get blamed for the throw. That throw wins the game, seals it, if it's completed. That's missing a gimme when your team needs you the most. He didn't have to make a perfect throw. Miles was a mile ahead of everyone.

He is not to be blamed for the loss. Ryan def. is, but you don't excuse that throw either. Elite QBs or damn good ones make those throws when needed. That's the part of being clutch.

Also, he plays for an owner that craves national attention. So guess what? When you do well, you get that attention, when you lose you get attention? Can't have it when you do well, and then not on you when you lose.

Just look how many times they showed fat Ryan on the sideline? You'd think he was the HC of the team. How many times did they show Fewell? Hardly ever and when they did, it was a shot of Coughlin with Fewell in the background.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 03:50 PM
JPP Named NFC Defensive Player of the Week

NY+Giants=NYG
12-13-2011, 04:18 PM
http://px9.funformobile.com/d/169/61/1fjdcjav7c/jppblock.gif

OSUGiants17
12-13-2011, 08:09 PM
I just pre'd looking at that gif

On another note, you think anyone on our team has a shot at winning any awards this year?
MVP/OPOY- If not for A-Rod, Eli
DPOY- JPP<3
Comeback Player Of The Year- Cruz and Kiwi both have a shot, hell maybe even Eli gets a vote or two.

Trogdor
12-14-2011, 06:48 AM
Just saw your posts on Romo. Miles Austin apologized to Romo and said that he lost it in the lights. Wasn't a perfect throw but Miles should of easily caught it. He just didn't react until the ball was practically on the ground. So I wouldn't be so quick to pin that exchange on him.

Giantsfan1080
12-14-2011, 08:02 AM
Naughty by Nature did a down with JPP Giants song. Better be good haha.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-14-2011, 12:43 PM
I am still not sold on Flacco. Not sure, how I feel about him. I still not need to see a lot more from him. Freeman needs to develop still, I think when rookies do well, and are considered "good", then it's like fans put them in the good category and if they do poorly, doesn't matter because first impression was good so that sticks.

I thought Freeman would take a step forward, but he is not having a good year.

Giantsfan1080
12-14-2011, 02:08 PM
Phillips back to practice already is a good sign.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-15-2011, 09:44 AM
http://px9.funformobile.com/d/169/61/1fjdcjav7c/jppsack.gif


http://d.yimg.com/a/p/sp/getty/27/fullj.fe105416a1bd58cb24cddab2cf0b8c67/fe105416a1bd58cb24cddab2cf0b8c67-getty-135528271.jpg

Giantsfan1080
12-15-2011, 01:44 PM
Tuck is going to be a game time decision it looks like.

BaLLiN
12-15-2011, 06:32 PM
Tuck is going to be a game time decision it looks like.

You could tell last game that he was injured. Kiwanuka should be moved to DE now.

BaLLiN
12-15-2011, 07:49 PM
Quick hits:

1- Eli 5th in QB pro bowl voting in the NFC; Stafford and Newton ahead.
Well this is complete ********, though everyone is enamored with Newton so I can believe it, I do not understand Stafford.

2- Baas and Rolle top 2 in safety voting in the NFC
Baas clearly does not deserve this, Rolle has played well but is he top two in the NFC?

3- With Del Rio and Spags fired, doubt Fewell comes back
TC and Del Rio have connections, Spags was adored by this team. Fewell? I don't see the same respect by either the players or TC. He did have games where I loved his style, but he is heading down a slippery slope. You can't motivate players with curse words, with yelling, with loudness. He needs to find something, one thing that makes him special. I hope he does with the threat of being fired.

4- TC probably stays as HC
Mara's are loyal, good, and kind owners that tend to give HC's and players too much leeway. I think Eli saved his job.

5- Our playoff predicted schedule is by far the best possible
ATL or DET or CHI in round 1. 3 teams that present some threats, but are very shaky and extremely beatable. DET and CHI have injuries to their runners, average defenses, and QB's that turn the ball over often. ATL is the biggest threat of all 3, but Ryan is not the QB that most thought he was and has shown some regression. Their two receivers are potentially very good, but Ryan has not been able to take advantage.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 09:44 AM
I still want to see where it says Eli is 5th. The link on BBI takes me to the ballot.

Also, Fewell's contract expires this year, so we can still keep TC and NOT extend Fewell.

Giantsfan1080
12-16-2011, 09:48 AM
Fans are idiots so who cares.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 10:15 AM
Newton is 3rd in the voting for NFC QBs. He is up over Eli by 190K

Jughead10
12-16-2011, 10:16 AM
It doesn't matter. Coaches and players are the other 66% and I think Eli is finally getting respect there.

Let's just make the playoffs.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 10:22 AM
It doesn't matter. Coaches and players are the other 66% and I think Eli is finally getting respect there.

Let's just make the playoffs.


I think he will still get shafted. Maybe not by the coaches, but I'd bet the players will vote Newton in. They should get rid of the fan voting, and just go with GMs/scouts, Players, and coaches.

Giantsfan1080
12-16-2011, 10:57 AM
I think he will still get shafted. Maybe not by the coaches, but I'd bet the players will vote Newton in. They should get rid of the fan voting, and just go with GMs/scouts, Players, and coaches.

It wouldn't be much better. Players are morons also.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 11:17 AM
It wouldn't be much better. Players are morons also.

It would be a shame if Eli, JPP and Cruz didn't make it.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 11:49 AM
So anyone know when Tuck's contract is up? Maybe we need to change the philosophy of pass rushers now. We loaded up on them, and 1 is not playing, the other is probably the most injury prone on the team, which leaves Kiwi and JPP, and Tolly.

I wonder what happens when Tuck contracts expires or gets close. His body is really breaking down. Neck, groin, and now a damn toe injury! Come on!

Giantsfan1080
12-16-2011, 12:19 PM
It would be a shame if Eli, JPP and Cruz didn't make it.

Don't forget the players voted on that top 100 list over the summer and they left Eli out.

Giantsfan1080
12-16-2011, 12:22 PM
So anyone know when Tuck's contract is up? Maybe we need to change the philosophy of pass rushers now. We loaded up on them, and 1 is not playing, the other is probably the most injury prone on the team, which leaves Kiwi and JPP, and Tolly.

I wonder what happens when Tuck contracts expires or gets close. His body is really breaking down. Neck, groin, and now a damn toe injury! Come on!

Tuck's deal ends in 2013. That's why we should draft another 1st round DE this year!!

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 01:42 PM
Tuck's deal ends in 2013. That's why we should draft another 1st round DE this year!!

Screw that! We can draft way in later rounds. I am tired of that "Cant have enough pass rushers" philosophy. It got us a superbowl but we had leaders on the team and it was with a great, aggressive DC. Now it's like we barely have any.

I'd rather draft other positions. Kiwi should be a DE not a LB. We have JPP, extend Tolly and perhaps draft or sign a FA or draft one later on.

Giantsfan1080
12-16-2011, 02:35 PM
Haha I was half joking just so I could see your response.

OSUGiants17
12-16-2011, 03:07 PM
Screw that! We can draft way in later rounds. I am tired of that "Cant have enough pass rushers" philosophy. It got us a superbowl but we had leaders on the team and it was with a great, aggressive DC. Now it's like we barely have any.

I'd rather draft other positions. Kiwi should be a DE not a LB. We have JPP, extend Tolly and perhaps draft or sign a FA or draft one later on.

Jake Bequette from Arkansas would be great and could be drafted in the 3rd. Dude is 6'5, 275, sub 4.6 speed, 21 career sacks(8 this year even though he missed 3 games, 7 last year and 5 as a sophmore). Too bad he's white though so I doubt it happens *sigh*

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 03:11 PM
Haha I was half joking just so I could see your response.

Haha, was it the way you expected?

bigbluedefense
12-16-2011, 04:43 PM
The philosophy we use when we draft is perfectly fine.

The philosophy we use with the Xs and Os on defense....not so much.

We have pass rushers and press man corners. We need Spags back in the worst way. Or bring Zimmer in. I want 1 of those 2 guys running our defense next year.

BaLLiN
12-16-2011, 05:29 PM
The philosophy we use when we draft is perfectly fine.

The philosophy we use with the Xs and Os on defense....not so much.

We have pass rushers and press man corners. We need Spags back in the worst way. Or bring Zimmer in. I want 1 of those 2 guys running our defense next year.

completely agree. we just need to change one thing, stop with the project LT's.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-17-2011, 09:19 AM
http://www.tmz.com/article_head.ftl?id=http://www.tmz.com/2011/12/17/michael-boley-child-abuse/

This is pretty disturbing news if there's any truth to the article...

BigBlueNorwegian
12-17-2011, 09:30 AM
http://www.tmz.com/2011/12/17/michael-boley-child-abuse/#.TuyzVdTbgkl

Here's a link that works.

Rosebud
12-17-2011, 09:54 AM
Sounds like ***** be gold diggin. But if true I'd be really disappointed in Boley. I like him a lot as a player but I can't be a fan of anyone who actually beats their 5 year old. That said, it doesn't really sound true since what kind of **** would actually let her child keep getting beaten for more money? Even gold diggers have morals...sometimes...

BigBlueNorwegian
12-17-2011, 12:30 PM
Sounds like ***** be gold diggin. But if true I'd be really disappointed in Boley. I like him a lot as a player but I can't be a fan of anyone who actually beats their 5 year old. That said, it doesn't really sound true since what kind of **** would actually let her child keep getting beaten for more money? Even gold diggers have morals...sometimes...

Yeah it sounds like she's a gold digger, with the statement about needing more money in child support. But if these allegations are true, I can never respect or root for Boley again. Which would be a shame, because he's a very good player.

bigbluedefense
12-17-2011, 02:57 PM
Meh. I think nowadays if you sneeze on a kid, someone wants to call you a child beater.

I got my butt whooped growing up. It's what daddies do. Nowadays if you spank a kid in public its such a big deal.

Unless Boley was straight beating down his kid, then that's obviously wrong and I'll lose a ton of respect for him. But nowadays you can spank a kid and get hit with child abuse. It's a joke.

Plus I'm pretty sure this is just a gold digger doin what gold diggers do.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-17-2011, 03:07 PM
Hehe! Screw that, I got hit by my mom AND dad. Maybe that's why I like strict coaches, like Coughlin. Hmm.. I cringe when I go out and see crazy kids running around like animals.

BaLLiN
12-17-2011, 04:44 PM
do not believe that its legit child abuse.TMZ? your telling me a journalism show that prides itself on making fun of people and is trying to get attention? NO WAY!

If I remember correctly Boley has had problems before with his family, and what was his suspension for a year or two ago?

Giantsfan1080
12-17-2011, 04:48 PM
I didn't read the article but believe it or not TMZ is usually 99% accurate.

BaLLiN
12-17-2011, 05:00 PM
I didn't read the article but believe it or not TMZ is usually 99% accurate.

accurate, but they do make things look a lot worse than they are occasionally.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-18-2011, 04:38 AM
If I remember correctly Boley has had problems before with his family, and what was his suspension for a year or two ago?

yeah, for beating his wife or something?

Rosebud
12-18-2011, 08:25 AM
I didn't read the article but believe it or not TMZ is usually 99% accurate.
Well they're just reporting what the woman is claiming, not the truth of her claims.

bigbluedefense
12-18-2011, 11:45 AM
Cold and windy. Advantage Washington.

CDCB14
12-18-2011, 01:35 PM
This start to the game probably makes you guys feel liek Cowboys fans lol. Worst possible luck that can happen. I doubt this continues though, Eli will pull it together.

singe_101
12-18-2011, 02:23 PM
3 points for the Giants with 11:15 to play? 3?

Their playoffs basically started, and this might bounce them. Down 20

BigBlueNorwegian
12-18-2011, 02:43 PM
This team is soft as hell, from top to bottom. We got swept by the Redskins. we are 0-2 against Rex Grossman. I'm done hoping this season can be good. I hope we don't have to see some team whooping our asses in the playoffs, because that means Coughlin and Fewell keeps their jobs. If that happens we have to endure another year with this misery. No way. No ******* way.

Big_Pete
12-18-2011, 04:05 PM
This team is way too soft. What happened to the physical style of play that the giants and Coughlin's teams are known for?

Sure we have issues in our secondary, but we still have talent there. Webster and four 1st round picks (Phillips, Rolle, Ross and Amukamara), why can't we cover anyone?

NY+Giants=NYG
12-18-2011, 04:09 PM
I love TC, but clean slate! Operation clean slate should be initiated!

Rosebud
12-18-2011, 04:43 PM
Does Nicks remind anyone else of Shockey? Good size, great strength and athleticism to go up and get the ball, really tough runner with the ball in his hands, just all around physical, but suffers brainfarts that lead to his drops and mis-reads. It's like he's all focused and then *click* he's zoned out for a second before remembering where he is. Still getting over this loss but that's just something that I'm curious whether anyone else thinks makes sense.

As for the game itself, I just want a DC who'll attack teams like Zimmer or Spags, Killdrive's routes hurt us this game but we shouldn't need to win shutouts every week. That's on Fewell and the defensive play calling.

I've even warmed up to the idea of Cowher since he somehow managed to convince LeBeau to spend an eternity as his DC and if he could do the same with Spags or someone like Zimmer I'd be eternally grateful. Sure getting one of those two as our HC would be the dream, but that's too much to ask for.

Rosebud
12-18-2011, 04:44 PM
3 points for the Giants with 11:15 to play? 3?

Their playoffs basically started, and this might bounce them. Down 20

Eh, not quite. If they win their last two games they're in. Now their playoffs have started and any loss ends our season.

BaLLiN
12-18-2011, 07:29 PM
If we lose these next two games we will probably pick around 15ish, maybe lower.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 09:34 AM
FIRE THEM ALL! I am tired of this act. This is coming from someone who really likes COughlin. But it's time for a change!

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 09:40 AM
I just want to see what we do with the last 2 games before I make up my mind. Going to be a good one on Saturday though with two teams fighting for their playoff lives.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 09:42 AM
I just want to see what we do with the last 2 games before I make up my mind. Going to be a good one on Saturday though with two teams fighting for their playoff lives.

It's going to be a mess... They will blitz us left and right, and I hate to see how our OL does. I have seen enough from this team. Up and Down, UP and Down, UP and Down. This defense seems like it will turn on each other.

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 09:43 AM
It's going to be a mess... They will blitz us left and right, and I hate to see how our OL does. I have seen enough from this team. Up and Down, UP and Down, UP and Down. This defense seems like it will turn on each other.

Offensively I'm not worried. If they blitz us left and right Eli will find the open men. I could see an ugly game for Cromartie. I'm just worried about making Sanchez look like John Elway.

That was really a freak game offensively. The only problem is, is that when the offense plays like that, we have 0% chance of winning. Nothing to fall back on.

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 09:48 AM
Offensively I'm not worried. If they blitz us left and right Eli will find the open men. I could see an ugly game for Cromartie. I'm just worried about making Sanchez look like John Elway.

That was really a freak game offensively. The only problem is, is that when the offense plays like that, we have 0% chance of winning. Nothing to fall back on.

Exactly. You would think the defense could step up against the likes of Grossman but nope. I think we match pretty well with the Jets though.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 09:50 AM
Offensively I'm not worried. If they blitz us left and right Eli will find the open men. I could see an ugly game for Cromartie. I'm just worried about making Sanchez look like John Elway.

That was really a freak game offensively. The only problem is, is that when the offense plays like that, we have 0% chance of winning. Nothing to fall back on.

We can't rely on that week after week. And I know we love to go deep, but don't we have short passes? Slants? Curls, comebacks? Everything is likle 40 yards downfield!

He will look like Elway with this defense. Keller will find the holes in this stupid scheme and zone.

I want a clean slate and finally put in a QB friendly system. It angers me that Eli gets us close, and then we decide to run the ball. Give him a TD! Meanwhile they pad Brees's stats and gets 5 tds! 55555555555555!!!!!

I hate our system, boom or bust nonsense, and finally it went BUST!

Mario is a pain in the nuts! Can you please run the right route? If not, let's see how he does in a new system where he doesn't have to use his brain!

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 09:53 AM
We can't rely on that week after week. And I know we love to go deep, but don't we have short passes? Slants? Curls, comebacks? Everything is likle 40 yards downfield!

He will look like Elway with this defense. Keller will find the holes in this stupid scheme and zone.

I want a clean slate and finally put in a QB friendly system. It angers me that Eli gets us close, and then we decide to run the ball. Give him a TD! Meanwhile they pad Brees's stats and gets 5 tds! 55555555555555!!!!!

I hate our system, boom or bust nonsense, and finally it went BUST!

Mario is a pain in the nuts! Can you please run the right route? If not, let's see how he does in a new system where he doesn't have to use his brain!

He probably won't be on the team next year. You'll have to see him in a different system on a new team.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 10:05 AM
He probably won't be on the team next year. You'll have to see him in a different system on a new team.

I liked him a lot, but I think I am done with him. Let him walk, insert Barden, get rid of Beckum, and let's find another TE.

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 10:13 AM
Bring Steve Smith back too.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 10:17 AM
Bring Steve Smith back too.

Not adverse to that option. However he has an uphill battle. I am more inclined to develop JJ or play barden than Smith.

If it is a clean slate, then this scheme and system is gone. So that absolute adv. he once had understanding this is now gone. If we install a system like everyone else where speed and getting seperation is key, then now he is just "another guy" in this system.

So let's see how it plays out.

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 10:18 AM
Not adverse to that option. However he has an uphill battle. I am more inclined to develop JJ or play barden than Smith.

If it is a clean slate, then this scheme and system is gone. So that absolute adv. he once had understanding this is now gone. If we install a system like everyone else where speed and getting seperation is key, then now he is just "another guy" in this system.

So let's see how it plays out.

Great point. The only reason to bring Smith back is if Gilbride is still OC.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 10:23 AM
Great point. The only reason to bring Smith back is if Gilbride is still OC.

Yes I said yes, and then I thought.. wait, why bring him back in another system? He was never a burner, not tall, and now if the system changes he won't be the first in line.

Barden has height... Nicks, Cruz, JJ, have size and/or speed. Smith is coming off an injury as well. Not sure if he would be useful in a new system. His niche was with ours system, where he would be where he needed to be, and understand the WR rules, specifically the sight adjustments. That's the selling point. That allowed 3rd down success. However, if the scheme changes, than what's the selling point?

scottyboy
12-19-2011, 10:25 AM
JJ is gonna be good. I can feel it. He looked more comfortable on the kick returns yesterday. I wanna see him and Eli really develop

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 10:29 AM
JJ is gonna be good. I can feel it. He looked more comfortable on the kick returns yesterday. I wanna see him and Eli really develop

I'd like to see him run slants, and see how fast he can be. God, I really want to see how guys can do in a different, Qb friendly scheme..Saints scheme would be great! They go OUT of their way to pad Brees's stats!

scottyboy
12-19-2011, 10:32 AM
I'd like to see him run slants, and see how fast he can be. God, I really want to see how guys can do in a different, Qb friendly scheme..

amen to that. this offense is so much more comfortable in the hurry up and Eli is smart enough and good enough to run it. Let JJ run some slants and quick outs, let's use Barden more. We've got the talent, we've got versatile WR's and a top 5 guy (when he's not dropping everything) in Nicks. And my god, Bradshaw is the best back on this team, get him more touches will you? Like come on.

but the D is just horrid. Really? that many points to that ******* offense? It's pathetic. No one outside of JPP, KP, Webster and Blackburn (shut up, I love him) are playing worth a damn out there.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 10:36 AM
Every week I like seeing the Saints offense. They go out of their way to make Brees the hero. 412 yards AND 5, yes 5 TDS... Yet no one is over 100 yards? Funny isn't it? Same with the 62 point game against the Colts. They make Brees throw those 1 yard TDs. We get close and it's a running play MOST if not ALL the time.

They pad the ever living stuff out of his stats. It really is amazing. Can we do that? Every time Eli throws it to the 1 or 2, we run. Let's pad his stats in a Qb friendly system!

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 10:38 AM
Every week I like seeing the Saints offense. They go out of their way to make Brees the hero. 412 yards AND 5, yes 5 TDS... Yet no one is over 100 yards? Funny isn't it? Same with the 62 point game against the Colts. They make Brees throw those 1 yard TDs. We get close and it's a running play MOST if not ALL the time.

They pad the ever living stuff out of his stats. It really is amazing. Can we do that? Every time Eli throws it to the 1 or 2, we run. Let's pad his stats in a Qb friendly system!

Who cares. As long as we get in. You need to get over padding stats. Let's worry about getting it down to the 1 or 2 first. We didn't do that yesterday.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 10:41 AM
Who cares. As long as we get in. You need to get over padding stats. Let's worry about getting it down to the 1 or 2 first. We didn't do that yesterday.

I do! Because then our Qb gets ripped. Make the system reflect our QB. He works so hard to move the offense, and we give the scoring chance to the damn Rbs. EVERYTIME!

Screw that, let Eli get some stats, ESPECIALLY in this system where you know the ints will go to him his fault or not. So help him out. 0 Tds and 3 ints looks bad.

We do get it down to the 1 or two. That's not the issue. It's getting it in, which is a chore. Well, blame Ware.. Useless person to begin with. Where was Bradshaw? Blame the OL for going backwards!

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 10:44 AM
I do! Because then our Qb gets ripped. Make the system reflect our QB. He works so hard to move the offense, and we give the scoring chance to the damn Rbs. EVERYTIME!

Screw that, let Eli get some stats, ESPECIALLY in this system where you know the ints will go to him his fault or not. So help him out. 0 Tds and 3 ints looks bad.

We do get it down to the 1 or two. That's not the issue. It's getting it in, which is a chore. Well, blame Ware.. Useless person to begin with. Where was Bradshaw? Blame the OL for going backwards!

We didn't get into their side of the field until the second half. And we only got it down there once. The game was already over. That's wasn't the problem yesterday. Yes our offense isn't built to score via the passing game inside the 5, but that issue was far from our problem yesterday.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-19-2011, 11:27 AM
We didn't get into their side of the field until the second half. And we only got it down there once. The game was already over. That's wasn't the problem yesterday. Yes our offense isn't built to score via the passing game inside the 5, but that issue was far from our problem yesterday.

Our issue is defense, which always has been our problem under TC. Spags was the only bright star. Other than that it's a mess under TC. Offensive isn't well off either. So that's why clean slate, and start this thing from step 1 and get a new regime.

Damix
12-19-2011, 03:07 PM
Rumors are Spags is out. COME HOME NOW

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 03:08 PM
Rumors are Spags is out. COME HOME NOW

Could he re-install his defense for this Saturday? Haha.

BaLLiN
12-19-2011, 03:12 PM
Could he re-install his defense for this Saturday? Haha.

I was thinking this a few weeks ago, but I do not think you are allowed to hire a coach during the season. I think you may be able to hire him as a "defensive consultant" but i doubt he can be allowed on the sideline.

LonghornsLegend
12-19-2011, 03:14 PM
I think everyone would shudder in the division if Spags come back to NY. Best thing is to give him a HC job and start fresh I think. Spags deserves another shot anyway, Rams really do lack talent across the board.

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 03:14 PM
I was thinking this a few weeks ago, but I do not think you are allowed to hire a coach during the season. I think you may be able to hire him as a "defensive consultant" but i doubt he can be allowed on the sideline.

I'm not sure about all those rules but I was just kidding anyway. There aren't enough guys who were on that team, who would pick it up quickly enough.

Jughead10
12-19-2011, 03:16 PM
I think everyone would shudder in the division if Spags come back to NY. Best thing is to give him a HC job and start fresh I think. Spags deserves another shot anyway, Rams really do lack talent across the board.

Very rarely does a first time head coach who failed so miserably (no matter if it was really his fault or not), get another shot right away. They all have to go back to coordinating a while before they get a chance again.

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 03:20 PM
Spags had such a weird run there going from a 1 win team to close to a playoff team with a rookie QB back to garbage this year. I don't think it's all his fault as the talent really is lacking there. Most people believe he wouldn't come back to NY to be DC but I don't see why not. Imagine what he would do with JPP!!

BigBlueNorwegian
12-19-2011, 03:30 PM
It would be the perfect Christmas present to us Giants fans! If the Rams fire him and he doesn't get another HC gig right away, then I see no place he would rather choose honestly. We have the players, and they obviously like him and will play hard for him. And even if Coughlin stays and we only offer a DC position, Coughlin's old and we could/would and definetly should tell him he's our HC of the future.

DO IT REESE!!

LTgiants
12-19-2011, 03:32 PM
What is to stop him from choosing Philly?

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 03:33 PM
The thing is I can't see Coughlin hanging them up if we start winning more consistently.

Big_Pete
12-19-2011, 03:41 PM
I think we need something of an overhaul in the front office.

Ideally I would like to see Reese fired and Coughlin promoted to GM. A reasonable number of our issues relate to the talent on the roster.
Coughlin knows about giants style of football and the physical brand of football we need.

That would let us bring in a quality head coach and still build upon the good things this team has.

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 03:43 PM
I think we need something of an overhaul in the front office.

Ideally I would like to see Reese fired and Coughlin promoted to GM. A reasonable number of our issues relate to the talent on the roster.
Coughlin knows about giants style of football and the physical brand of football we need.

That would let us bring in a quality head coach and still build upon the good things this team has.

What?? We probably have one of the most talented rosters in the NFL.

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 03:47 PM
Ballard is going to miss time with a PCL injury. Beckum on the field more certainly won't help anyone. The Jets are terrible at covering the TE though so maybe he does something productive.

BaLLiN
12-19-2011, 03:49 PM
What is to stop him from choosing Philly?

he won a superbowl with us, he is more familiar with our personnel, ny probably put a lasting impression on him.

secondly, the eagles are not making the playoffs. Dallas and New York will most likely be playing later than their scheduled 1 oclock game, eagles will be playing at 1 oclock definitely against the redskins.

1. If we win against the Jets, and Dallas wins against the eagles, the eagles don't make the playoffs.

2. If we win against the Jets, and Dallas loses against the eagles, the giants are 8-7 and eagles 7-8 entering the last game with the Cowboys being 8-7 as well.
a. Why would the Cowboys help on Philadelphia by playing? If they lose they likely better their draft position by a few places. There is no benefit to winning.

3. If we lose against the Jets, and Dallas wins against the eagles, the eagles are eliminated

4. If we lose against the Jets, and Dallas loses against the eagles, the Giants will be 7-8, Eagles 7-8, and Dallas 8-7.
a. Why would we help the Eagles by playing? Given our draft position we would probably land a pick 10-15 if we lost. Our intentions would also be to eliminate the team that has the most threat: the eagles. Because we don't want a team in our own division to win the superbowl obviously.

BaLLiN
12-19-2011, 03:50 PM
I think we need something of an overhaul in the front office.

Ideally I would like to see Reese fired and Coughlin promoted to GM. A reasonable number of our issues relate to the talent on the roster.
Coughlin knows about giants style of football and the physical brand of football we need.

That would let us bring in a quality head coach and still build upon the good things this team has.

Reese is going nowhere, especially after getting us JPP and Nicks. He's one of the best GM's in football.

LTgiants
12-19-2011, 03:54 PM
he won a superbowl with us, he is more familiar with our personnel, ny probably put a lasting impression on him.

secondly, the eagles are not making the playoffs. Dallas and New York will most likely be playing later than their scheduled 1 oclock game, eagles will be playing at 1 oclock definitely against the redskins.

1. If we win against the Jets, and Dallas wins against the eagles, the eagles don't make the playoffs.

2. If we win against the Jets, and Dallas loses against the eagles, the giants are 8-7 and eagles 7-8 entering the last game with the Cowboys being 8-7 as well.
a. Why would the Cowboys help on Philadelphia by playing? If they lose they likely better their draft position by a few places. There is no benefit to winning.

3. If we lose against the Jets, and Dallas wins against the eagles, the eagles are eliminated

4. If we lose against the Jets, and Dallas loses against the eagles, the Giants will be 7-8, Eagles 7-8, and Dallas 8-7.
a. Why would we help the Eagles by playing? Given our draft position we would probably land a pick 10-15 if we lost. Our intentions would also be to eliminate the team that has the most threat: the eagles. Because we don't want a team in our own division to win the superbowl obviously.


I was not going into a whole playoff thing. I was simply stating what would stop him from going to the Eagles? Its not like we are his only choice of team that he has history with.

If the Eagles offer him more money then we do he is not going to say no. Cause he loves NY. There have already been rumors of it already that they want him back in Philly.

BaLLiN
12-19-2011, 04:22 PM
I was not going into a whole playoff thing. I was simply stating what would stop him from going to the Eagles? Its not like we are his only choice of team that he has history with.

If the Eagles offer him more money then we do he is not going to say no. Cause he loves NY. There have already been rumors of it already that they want him back in Philly.

I know, I just didn't want to double post, i was trying to clarify that with beginning that with "secondly".

I have read the rumors too, I hope they aren't true, and that the Giants would do their best to get him here no matter DC or HC.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-19-2011, 04:30 PM
What is to stop him from choosing Philly?

He will choose to come to us, because if he goes to Philly i will commit suicide and blame him and Perry Fewell equally in my suicide note!!! He does not want to even be mentioned in the same sentence as Perry Fewell in any regard!!!

BaLLiN
12-19-2011, 04:45 PM
btw, if we lose these next two games we could get the 9th pick of the draft. Carolina and Washington would have to win both their games each, which is possible (carolina has tampa and the saints who are fighting for a first round bye but would lose a tie breaker to SF, and Washington has vikings and philadelphia who would be trying to make the playoffs)

9th overall pick sounds better than playoffs with the defense we have now, I don't mean to be a pessimist but we aren't going anywhere with the defense we have along with our coordinator.

Big_Pete
12-19-2011, 06:54 PM
What?? We probably have one of the most talented rosters in the NFL.

I don't agree. I think we have a solid roster, and we have been doing well with what we have.

A great example is LB where we have failed to bring in quality talent (outside of Boley), despite it becoming a pass happy league. You can't rely on late round picks and converted DEs

Giantsfan1080
12-19-2011, 07:24 PM
I don't agree. I think we have a solid roster, and we have been doing well with what we have.

A great example is LB where we have failed to bring in quality talent (outside of Boley), despite it becoming a pass happy league. You can't rely on late round picks and converted DEs

We are definitely lacking at LB but we have a deep secondary and D-Line.

LTgiants
12-19-2011, 07:27 PM
We are deep at DE. DT not so much.

stillma7ic
12-19-2011, 09:32 PM
Thoughts on Prince guys? Didn't focus on him during the skins game because it was too depressing.

BaLLiN
12-19-2011, 10:34 PM
Thoughts on Prince guys? Didn't focus on him during the skins game because it was too depressing.

He looks confused, scared, and out of place. Quite frankly I'm not surprised, he isn't being used to his abilities and without having much time to learn his assignments I feel that he is struggling to know what he needs to do. When you don't know what you need to do then how can you play at full speed? You can't. Give him a man, he will be fine, give him a zone or a read coverage, then you might be in trouble.

Look around the league, it's the same thing. If you simplify things for players, they can build up their confidence and play instinctively. Do you think that Cam Newton or Tim Teebow started off with the full playbook? absolutely not. It was simplified for them so they could learn progressively.

I've seen enough from Prince that I can tell that he will be fine. He has the size, speed, and fluidity to be a good corner in the league. He just has been having growing pains, and while a fan and teammate (Rolle and Grant) may voice their negative opinions of him, you have to understand that this is his preseason, he never had the learning period that other players have had, and this offseason was shortened quite a bit, he wasn't even allowed a playbook until the lockout ended.

Big_Pete
12-19-2011, 10:53 PM
I think prince will be fine, he just needs to learn and adjust to the NFL. Basically the lack off offseason combined with his late signing and injury hurt him.

Big_Pete
12-19-2011, 11:05 PM
We are definitely lacking at LB but we have a deep secondary and D-Line.

We've got depth at DE. DT and CB is reasonable.

I think you could probably argue that our DE production has been rather ordinary this year, so perhaps it isn't enough? Sure there have been injuries, but that's football. We are a team reliant on our pass rush. I don't understand why Kiwanuka hasnt been moved back to DE full time, other than our LBs are terrible.

I would call safety average. Sure Phillips and Rolle are decent but there isn't much behind them.

On offense I think we haven't done enough succession planning despite having aging guys like McKenzie, O'Hara, Seubert etc. We largely focused on having adequate backups rather than grooming talented future starters behind our starters. I really like the way we have groomed Petrus, pity we haven't done more of that.

Big_Pete
12-19-2011, 11:21 PM
Reese is going nowhere, especially after getting us JPP and Nicks. He's one of the best GM's in football.

There is also a lot he had missed. His failure to adequately address LB over his whole tenure is a good example.

I may be in the minority, but I think part of the issues are related to the talent we have on the roster.

I think the team needs a shake up, but we also have a good foundation,

For example, I'd rather see Coughlin as GM, maybe bring in Spagnuolo as head coach, let Gilbride operate the offense and maybe bring in Del Rio as defensive coordinator.

Forenci
12-20-2011, 12:53 AM
There is also a lot he had missed. His failure to adequately address LB over his whole tenure is a good example.

I may be in the minority, but I think part of the issues are related to the talent we have on the roster.

I think the team needs a shake up, but we also have a good foundation,

For example, I'd rather see Coughlin as GM, maybe bring in Spagnuolo as head coach, let Gilbride operate the offense and maybe bring in Del Rio as defensive coordinator.

Reese is one of the best GM's in the league. You don't fire one of the best GM's in the league. And he's done a pretty solid job of addressing LB's. He brought in Boley who overall has been very good in his time as a Giant. Goff was going to be a really solid player for us too. That and if you read about the speculation on draft day we've been looking to upgrade the LB position early in the draft for a while but the value has never lined up and Reese typically always goes BPA instead of reaching.

This roster is loaded with talent, which means the problem is directly correlates to a coaching problem - which makes the most sense. We're playing a defensive scheme that doesn't fit our players. Our offense is arguably the most complicated in the NFL which leads to issues across the board.

Sure, Reese has missed on some players, but even the best GM's are going to miss on players. At the end of the day he's stocked our roster with a lot of great young talent through the draft. If you have a GM who can build through the draft you can be a perennial great team. Most of our woes have come from poor play down the stretch (emphasizing the poor coaching issue) and an inability to play at a high level against inferior competition (again, another coaching issue). I like Tom Coughlin a lot but his choice of coordinators outside of Spags has been piss poor.

Give me Spags and Norv Turner this off-season. I'd be a very happy man if that occurred.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-20-2011, 09:10 AM
Norv Turner would be awesome! Please give me turner! Pleaseeeee!! Give me spags as the HC/DC if he can't be DC, then hire an experienced HC. Give me an older DC one like Wade Philips, who won't be HC for a while now, or ever. So at least we have stability on that side of the ball.

Big_Pete
12-20-2011, 03:47 PM
If Coughlin stays as head coach, My ideal coaching staff would be with Norv Turner as offensive coordinator and Romeo Crennel as defensive coordinator.

I think that's unlikely, after all with the season Manning is having, there is no way Gilbride gets fired. The only way I see him leaving is if he gets a head coaching gig (maybe Jacksonville?).

Fewell and Quinn are on the way out in my opinion.

Jughead10
12-20-2011, 03:48 PM
No way Romeo would be DC. First, because I hope he gets the KC head coach job. But he's also 64, I don't think he wants to wait 2+ years while we get the players to properly run a 3-4 defense.

Giantsfan1080
12-20-2011, 04:01 PM
I hope we stick with the 4-3. I don't want to transition to a 3-4 while wasting Eli's prime years.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-20-2011, 04:18 PM
I hope we stick with the 4-3. I don't want to transition to a 3-4 while wasting Eli's prime years.

I'd agree if we were tearing it up in 43 system. However, our 43 defense is pathetic! Right now, I am open to ANYTHING. We could stick to the 43 and have musical coordinators and mess up that way. So I am game for any change at this point.

Giantsfan1080
12-20-2011, 04:21 PM
I'd agree if we were tearing it up in 43 system. However, our 43 defense is pathetic! Right now, I am open to ANYTHING. We could stick to the 43 and have musical coordinators and mess up that way. So I am game for any change at this point.

We just need the right coaching. The talent is there.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-20-2011, 06:38 PM
We just need the right coaching. The talent is there.

Well that's been the case for a while. However, time and time again we showed we can mess up coordinator picks. So that's why at this point I am down for anything, even if that means a new coach AND system.

OSUGiants17
12-20-2011, 08:31 PM
I'd agree if we were tearing it up in 43 system. However, our 43 defense is pathetic! Right now, I am open to ANYTHING. We could stick to the 43 and have musical coordinators and mess up that way. So I am game for any change at this point.

Do we even run a true 4-3 anymore? I mean seriously, Perry has turned it into a 4-2-5 and it's awful. The 4-3 has worked for us, but we have used the 4-2-5 as our base a lot this year and when we go to that 3-3-5 or 3-2-6 on 3rd downs we suck even more. The 43 is not the problem, it's the coaching and loss of depth/key players due to injury. With our defense at full strength and Spags, we could easily be a top defense in this league.

Also, can someone find me a stat of our 3rd down conversion rate on O and D, like how often we convert and how often we let them? Cause my guess is we're in the bottom 5 for both.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-21-2011, 11:19 AM
Do we even run a true 4-3 anymore? I mean seriously, Perry has turned it into a 4-2-5 and it's awful. The 4-3 has worked for us, but we have used the 4-2-5 as our base a lot this year and when we go to that 3-3-5 or 3-2-6 on 3rd downs we suck even more. The 43 is not the problem, it's the coaching and loss of depth/key players due to injury. With our defense at full strength and Spags, we could easily be a top defense in this league.

Also, can someone find me a stat of our 3rd down conversion rate on O and D, like how often we convert and how often we let them? Cause my guess is we're in the bottom 5 for both.



God knows.. At this point I gave up! That's like Gilbride running the spread one week, zone option the other, and then smash mouth the next! HS football!

Lewis with the hybrid defense, Sheridan with the amoeba, standing around confused and then rush defense, and now god knows. So my point is aren't we wasting Eli's good years now with this? At this juncture, if it means clean sweep, install and implement a 34 I am down for it.

Anything and everything is an option.

bigbluedefense
12-21-2011, 01:37 PM
This team is a joke. Gutless, heartless, mentally weak, and just the definition of average.

The coaching staff is a joke, the leadership is a joke, everything's a joke. Justin Tuck does not deserve to be a captain on this team. It's an example of the team thinking it can make it's best player a captain. He's not a captain. Not even close. All he does is pout.

We need a lot on this team. The front 7 is soft. Go watch the games over again. You'll see 3 linebackers who wait for the RB to come to them instead of hitting the gaps with authority. We have soft crappy linebackers, thats why our front 7 is soft.

Bc our LBs are crap, we have poor tackling. Tackling from the LB core and secondary is pathetic. If you can't tackle, and you can't defend gaps, you're going to be a bad defense.

The scheme is horrible. You can't play zone defense with horrible linebackers. Linebackers patrol the middle of the field in zone, if you have no coverage in the middle of the field, how do you expect to stop anybody?

And surprise surprise guys, what have we been talking about for years now? THE MIDDLE OF THE FIELD IS WIDE OPEN AGAINST THE GIANTS.

This isn't something new. It's been a problem for 4 years running.

We need a new coaching staff, and we need linebackers. Linebackers linebackers linebackers.

Leadership generally comes from your LB core, tackling and physicality usually comes from your LB core, intermediate and middle coverage, and run stuffing comes from your LB core.

What are we lacking? Leadership, tackling, physicality, and run stuffing. And intermediate coverage.

WE NEED LINEBACKERS. Not 1, not 2, **** it, get 3 of em. WE NEED LINEBACKERS.

Jughead10
12-21-2011, 01:43 PM
The only ones I would keep are Boley and then Herzlich for depth. Also Williams if he can continue to develop as depth. I was actually decently impressed with Herzlich when he played. The little he did before he got hurt.

bigbluedefense
12-21-2011, 01:48 PM
Boley is a good linebacker who gives us speed and coverage, but he has his warts too.

He's a finesse linebacker, he's not going to fight in the phonebooth in the run game/screen game. He's not a great tackler. He's a lightweight.

There are other linebackers out there that can give us his coverage and some toughness on top of that. We need all around linebackers.

Boley is a glorified nickel LB. He's a good LB, and when healthy easily the best on our team, but I'm starting to think that we might be overrating him a bit too.

Do I want to get rid of him? Absolutely not. He's going to be a starter next year no question. But I definitely want 2 other LBs starting next to him. And high round picks. Impact linebackers.

We need 2 of them. Not just 1.

scottyboy
12-21-2011, 01:59 PM
We should keep Chase Blackburn too because he is ******* awesome.

But I agree, can we get a ******* smash mouth LB who's gonna talk **** and make the hit? I thought we had that in Greg Jones...but then he sucked :(

Giantsfan1080
12-21-2011, 01:59 PM
Kuechly is one I hope.

Jughead10
12-21-2011, 02:00 PM
We should keep Chase Blackburn too because he is ******* awesome.

But I agree, can we get a ******* smash mouth LB who's gonna talk **** and make the hit? I thought we had that in Greg Jones...but then he sucked :(

Yes he does. I thought Herzlich was significantly better.

Giantsfan1080
12-21-2011, 02:03 PM
Yes he does. I thought Herzlich was significantly better.

I agree. The further he gets away from the Chemo the more he can build his body nack up as well. That **** kills everything in you that's good so his mucles are still re-learning to build strength and other things like that in his body. Kuechly/Herzlich would be a nice duo.

scottyboy
12-21-2011, 02:06 PM
yeah, herzy looked good. Him and Luke would be BC white power boner tastic.

I've actually still been impressed with Kiwi for what it's worth. All things given, he's looked good as a converted DE to LB. No cover skills at all but like...he's a freaking DE. I love Kiwi, I just feel bad we keep shuffling him back and forth

bigbluedefense
12-21-2011, 04:05 PM
We can't take the risk of just assuming Herzlich will be the 3rd guy. We should actively go after 2 guys hard in the draft. I'm down with going after guys in both round 1 and 2.

**** everything else. Until we fix our LB problem, we won't go anywhere as a team. Every other need can wait. We can survive everywhere else. We clearly can't survive with this LB problem.

scottyboy
12-21-2011, 04:07 PM
well, let's just hope Boley-chase-Kiwi will be enough to try and make a run this season. Honestly, Chase is our best Mike. And he's awesome. Have I mentioned I like Chase? He might be our most complete LB'er at this point too. Stupid he wasn't on the team all season. so stupid

bigbluedefense
12-21-2011, 04:12 PM
I love Chase. He's one of my favorite players. And his contributions on special teams has been great since he came back.

But let's be honest. He's been awful at MIKE. Outside of 1 INT vs GB, show me 1 play he made since he came back. Just 1. There is none.

scottyboy
12-21-2011, 04:17 PM
SHUP UP BBD HE MAKES EVERY PLAY EVER
it's better than ******* jacquian williams.

Jughead10
12-21-2011, 04:18 PM
I agree about counting on Herzlich. But he's shown me enough to keep as a backup and special team guy. But let's be honest, we can't get 7 new linebackers so someone will be retained who isn't great.

OSUGiants17
12-21-2011, 04:31 PM
Move Kiwi to DE, trade Osi for a 2nd
Trade both 2nds for a 1st
Draft Kuechly and Burfict both in round 1
Boley-Taze-Kuechly with Williams, Herzy and Blackburn for depth

Giantsfan1080
12-21-2011, 04:51 PM
We're not getting a 2nd round pick for Osi.

OSUGiants17
12-21-2011, 04:54 PM
We're not getting a 2nd round pick for Osi.
I KNOW! *HUMPH* :( Let me dream

Forenci
12-21-2011, 05:57 PM
I'm actually not a huge Luke fan. I think he's a very good linebacker but I've never been a fan of spending a first rounder on a linebacker unless I feel like he has impact potential. I see Luke more as a really good, solid, and reliable LB for 8-10 years. If we spend a first on anyone, I want him to be a guy who as stud potential to blow up the OL and really impact the game on every down.

I wouldn't be upset if we drafted look, but I dunno, I just feel like if we're going to burn a first round pick on a LB he should have stud potential which I don't feel like Luke does.

OSUGiants17
12-21-2011, 06:16 PM
Yea he lacks the athleticism to be a true force, but we could definitely use his tackling skills and instincts since we don't have any sure tacklers in our LB or DB corps since TT went down. If there was anyway we could get him round 2, that'd be great but we cant. Vontaze isn't as reliable, but he is much more athletic and with the right coaching *cough*spags*cough* he could be a machine. Te'o would have been the ideal guy for us, but he is returning to school.

Giantsfan1080
12-21-2011, 06:29 PM
He reminds me of a better Chad Greenway. He'll be an impact player.

BaLLiN
12-21-2011, 06:37 PM
We should keep Chase Blackburn too because he is ******* awesome.

But I agree, can we get a ******* smash mouth LB who's gonna talk **** and make the hit? I thought we had that in Greg Jones...but then he sucked :(

You're describing Burfict basically.

Move Kiwi to DE, trade Osi for a 2nd
Trade both 2nds for a 1st
Draft Kuechly and Burfict both in round 1
Boley-Taze-Kuechly with Williams, Herzy and Blackburn for depth

Osi might be worth a late 2nd if he played the next two games and showed he was fine, but right now id say no. I would rather pick up a LB in FA than draft one in the first instead of an OL or DL.

BaLLiN
12-21-2011, 08:55 PM
I started posting on the Giants MB, started a thread, its a lot of reading but I hope you guys feel similarly.

Edit: there is a lot to read, but i think it is worth it

First off, I am a young college athlete and NOT a coach. I have no coaching experience, but I do have knowledge of the intricacies and techniques involved. I love the Giants, when the giants lose it ruins my week, when they win great all week, and when they win a super bowl (especially in the fashion of super bowl 42) I am eternally grateful.

I realize all (or most) of us fans are aggravated and upset, but you must realize that the wins are only great with losses to contrast. That win versus the Patriots will give me happiness for the next 40 years and then some.

This season was doomed at the start, we were ravaged by injuries, losses in FA (our leading receiver, our starting TE, our starting DT) , and were breaking in another new DC. Even when we had Spags, our defense took awhile to adapt to the schemes. To expect playoffs from that is asking for too much. Heck we've been starting free agent and late draft picks at linebacker from the start! We have a lot to be happy about.

Our offseason:
FA Losses: Steve Smith, Kevin Boss, Barry Coffield

INJ Losses: Terrell Thomas, Jonathan Goff, Clint Sintim, Marvin Austin, Bruce Johnson.

That's 5 starters (two pro bowlers), 2 Fringe starters, and one accomplished backup

INJ during the season:

Domenik Hixon, Justin Tryon, Michael Coe, Michael Clayton, Will Beatty, Stacy Andrews, Brian Witherspoon (All on IR)

….Prince Amukamara, David Baas, Ramses Barden, Travis Beckum, Ahmad Bradshaw, James Brewer, Mark Herzlich, Brandon Jacobs, Mario Manningham, Spencer Paysinger, Henry Hynoski, Aaron Ross, Devin Thomas, Justin Tuck, Osi Umenyiora (All missing multiple games)

… Hakeem Nicks, Kenny Phillips (Both Banged up constantly and missing a game each)

When you look through our roster, it is hard to find players that weren't injured during this season. Without a doubt, we were overwhelmed by these injuries which happened to everyone and especially to our best players.

If I were the Giant Front Office, I would consider this into my equation, but there is no way I don't fire Fewell. His schemes are terrible, especially for a team that lacks linebackers and lost many starters. Secondly, our medical staff and trainers must be one of the worst in the league with the amount of injuries we have every year.

Regarding Coaches, there are a number of head coaches that have been(or will be) fired this year that would make excellent coordinators. Norv Turner, Steve Spagnuolo, Todd Haley and Jack Del Rio come to mind. Norv Turner's offensive system would be incredible for us, reverting back to a run team with placation base pass plays. Spags is ideal for us, not only because he has been a coordinator before for us or that he is familiar with the personnel we have, but because he runs man press, cover 1 shells, A gap pressures, and runs a variety of different blitz packages. We have the firepower to blitz and play man to man press with larger corners. He is also a player's coach, he is very emotional and inspires his players with his competitive drive. Haley and Del Rio both had success as coordinators, but I wouldn't want them as much because of their schemes not fitting our personnel as well.

Eli Manning has graced us with a season deserving of an MVP under normal circumstances. He has been our offense, made up for the faults of the entire team, and entered the realm of the elite without a doubt. He is a bright spot on the team, and no longer a liability in the pocket. He moves very well in the pocket and has developed such a presence that rivals his brother's. He may not have the strongest arm, or any mobility, but he is extremely accurate and good at putting his teammates in a position to make a play by reading the defense. We have something now that not many other franchises have, this development is worth the losses and interceptions.

Victor Cruz replaced Steve Smith's production and then some. He is a threat in the open field, he runs creative routes and gets a lot of separation, he makes spectacular catches, and gave us miracles that other teams can only envy. We lost a pro bowl receiver, and gained another that is a threat to score on every play instead of just a possession receiver. Great body control, great hands, just needs more experience and to stop running before he catches. Eli now has two money receivers in Nicks and Cruz.

Jason Pierre-Paul became the monster that Jerry Reese thought he'd be. Despite what (site that ranks players due to stats) ranks him as, he is easily a top 10 DE. He hasn't even developed pass rush moves for god's sake! His raw talent has been put on spotlight, and with the right coaching (our DL coach, Osi, and Tuck) and playing, he should be a premiere DE in the league. Not many teams have this either, pass rushers don't come as often as we have had, and for that we should be thankful.

Jacquian Williams has a bright future. Despite some rookie mistakes and bad coordinating, Williams has been a good overall linebacker versus the run and the pass. This guy is going to start for us, and his speed, blitzing ability, and fluidity will be very useful once he gains some coaching. He is definitely physically gifted and has a high motor just like JPP, he just needs to be put in a position to utilize them in the right way.

Mitch Petrus was a steal. Many people don't watch the offensive line, but this guy has done a number on DL's in the run game. He was a walk-on at Arkansas (also a wrestler) and played TE, FB, G, and C. He isn't as inept at pass protection, but there is no reason to bet against this guy with the effort he puts forth. Guard of the future.

Jake Ballard impressed us all. He is basically an extra offensive lineman at 6-6 280ish, He is very slow, but he is good at route running due to his suddenness and hands (which have become inconsistent). Production-wise, he is better than Boss, but it is important to know that Boss did open up things for our receivers outside due to his speed which occupied the safeties.

Michael Boley is one of the best linebackers in the NFC. He neutralizes opponents TE's and RB's, he and Williams are similar and both are the reason why we didn't get killed by TE's and RB's all year. Previously quick RB's and TE's were our problem, but no more. Boley has always been a good coverage LB, but since joining us he has developed much more as a passrusher, and is above average versus the run.

Ramses Barden showed us another flash of his incredible potential. He isn't quick off the line, he doesn't run the best routes, but he sure as hell can use his body and long arms to snag balls away from DB's. I know it's early, but I think we've got another very good receiver here.

Mark Herzlich is a very good run defender and special teamer. He isn't washed up by any means, but he isn't 100% percent yet. The longer separated from cancer he is, the better he will be. To expect him or Greg Jones to pop up unexpectedly and fill the role of MLB especially with this offseason is ridiculous. But both have a fire that the Giants like, and whether they start or are special teamers, they will have an impact.

Da'Rell Scott is lightning in a bottle. How we don't play this kid more is beyond me, he is the only back we have that can take it all the way any given play. He has the speed, has some shake, but he needs to be more fluid in his cuts and more sudden. He hasn't displayed elusiveness despite the preseason, but we know its there at least.

Prince Amukamara is having growing pains and everyone shouldn't be quick to judge. When a player has an injury and misses camp there is a much bigger learning curve, couple this with the shortened offseason and not receiving the playbook until the lockout ended, there is no reason to hate on him. Looking at him out there you can tell that he is struggling to know his assignments. When you are struggling to know your assignments and have to remember and act on them in the seconds before a play. You aren't sure on your job, how do you do that with 100% effort? Apart from the results of his play recently, he played well man to man in his first two games. He has the size, speed, and fluidity to play corner, he just needs to adapt to the speed of the game.

Osi Umenyiora isn't worth starting anymore. He only goes for the QB by overshooting the LT. He is capable of using other passrush moves, but the sack fumble is the easiest way to get it, and he is all about himself now. I do not want him on this team based solely on that and his attitude in the offseason. He may be utilized better with other teams, but for now he is done in NY. Get rid of him, you might get a late 2nd, or 3rd, but its worth it now.

Brandon Jacobs has become a straight ahead runner only. He has hardly any change of direction despite weight loss, and now he can only use his speed and power to get yardage. Whatever happened that set him off in this stretch of productivity beats me, but I am still tired of the plays he had where he stopped at the line and did nothing. They became lost plays for Eli.

With this young talent, and Jerry Reese as our GM, we can be sure we will have a team with a bright future.

Right now, if we lose these next two games, we could wind up with a pick anywhere from 9-13ish which would be a significant improvement in draft position from 21 which would be a one and done in the playoffs. There is talent in this draft, specifically at linebacker, OL, and DL where we need some help.

If we make the playoffs there is a small chance that we do well, but it depends on our coordinator and Tuck. If Fewell runs these zone coverages and lets receivers run free we are doomed, its a free release and our personnel is not equipped to cover the middle lack of linebackers. Tuck being healthy is necessary because JPP cannot be the only person to generate a passrush, there is clearly something wrong with Tuck and either he plays through it and plays well or he shouldn't play at all.

All in all the major changes I want to see made are:
-Firing Fewell and Gilbride (gilbride should do so much better than he is)
-Firing the training and medical staff
-Hiring Spagnuolo as DC
-Hiring Norv Turner as OC (wishful thinking)
-Letting Jerry Reese do his thing in the draft
-Let our younger players play the rest of the year so we can see what we have
-Rebuilding our OL
-Trade Osi
-Trade or restructure Jacobs's deal, he is not worth that money

You sure said a mouthful young man. Overall, your analysis of players was very good. Let me nitpick. We are not breaking in another new DC. Fewell is in his second year.

The only off season loss that mattered was TT (technically that was during training camp).

Steve Smith was coming off IR and had to be let go. JR was proved right.

Ditto for Boss.

Cofield was just another DT, nothing special and therefore not a loss. We have to manage the salary cap and Cofield was a casualty.

Goff and Sintim were not losses. They are below average NFL talent.

Losing Hixon did hurt.

Losing Coe, Clayton, Beatty and Andrews didn't hurt. They were no better than backup NFL players despite the fact that Beatty found himself a starting job with the Giants.

Cruz was a steal and I love the guy but he needs to lost the drops.

Nice job with breaking it down.

You can say that Smith and Boss were meaningless now, but entering the season the general census was panic. Cruz and Ballard were nonfactors. We essentially had no TE and two WR's that hurt their QB with drops for interceptions. Boss and Smith were eli's safety valves, and although they were solid but not spectacular, they were very good players for us.

Smith's route running was second to none, he ran routes to pinpoint, and was able to get consistent separation, theres no wonder why he had over 100 receptions. I hope we resign him because Manningham will not be worth the money in all likelihood.

Boss had pretty good speed and caught balls and took hits (many gave us crucial first downs off of penalties) that had to make fans love him. He wasn't the greatest run blocker, never really set an edge, but his speed and height allowed our receivers to do work by occupying the safeties and we simply don't have that on our roster right now.

Technically, Spags wouldn't be new. He had a lot of these players on his defense, and his ability to play to his personnel's strength would alone be a dominating factor to picking Spags over Fewell. Zimmer is the only other DC I would want that could possibly be available, and he would most likely need to be signed as a HC.

As much as people like to hate on Goff, he was a leader and underrated by most people. I never really liked him because I wanted a freakishly athletic linebacker. But he was a monster against the run, great power and above average instincts. His pass coverage was average, but he wasn't as terrible as people want to believe, the backs that he was forced to cover gave Pierce fits in the past, and he did as well if not better than him.

Sintim was a sad coincidence. He never should've been playing as a 4-3 OLB. He simply didn't have the fluidity or agility to keep up in coverage. But man, he could rush the passer. If he wound up in a 3-4 i think it wouldve been an entirely different story, he played in a complex Al Groh system in virginia and racked up double digit sacks (mightve been the sack leader one year in the NCAA or pretty damn close). He had two bad injuries and was out of position, just bad luck.

Cofield was not just another DT for us. He got rush, we are severely missing interior rush this year. Him and Robbins were both well rounded DT's that were somewhat average in all aspects, but even having minimal rush mattered alot, now QB's can step up in the pocket and see over the line for easy throws in the middle. A gap pressure means a lot, it leads to alot of checkdowns and interceptions off of sideline throws (ball has to travel a longer distance) and sailed balls in the middle by not getting enough on a throw because the QB can't step up and plant. This is another reason why FEWELL SUCKS, no A gap pressure (spags loved to blitz the A gap).

Agree on Hixon, terrible field position off every kickoff and most punts.

Losing backup players still hurts, you cannot honestly say that it doesn't because you don't have full force of your roster. In a battle of fruition that the nfl has become, injuries to ANYONE matters. Coe and Clayton were also good special teamers, and with a special team like ours, we need all the help we can get.

Lol, Cruz was essentially a rookie this season, let him be! He's trying to do too much, running before he catches it, but its not like receivers don't do this. hakeem did this all the time, and has become a lot better. The drop nicks had was because of the sun, he needs to wear a visor.


http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d82529efb/Hakeem-Nicks-drops-a-potential-TD

he is clearly in the light, he probably could see the shadow of the ball, but not the ball itself. This is hard for a receiver because you cannot locate the tip and see the rotation. If you don't see either, you can't depend on using your hands which is why he was trying to catch it with his body. It's just an unfortunate thing that could've been avoided with a visor.

Completely agree on PF.

BallinNY.

Sorry for the late reply. As you said, that was a pretty long post, and took me some time to get through it all.

I don't agree with everything you've said, but that was a great post. Your opinions are clearly presented and supported with information or examples.

I'd love to see Spags return, but if the Eagles want to land him, I see them pulling Reese's pants down again in the offseason.

I'd like to see Del Rio as DC if Spags is not available. I think LB is a huge defensive need next season....it's should be Reese's number one concern.

I like your idea on Norv Turner, espeically with a guy as bright and gifted as Eli at QB.

At this stage of his career, Eli is capable of running the same sort of offense that Aikman ran under Turner.

The key is getting some new talent on the offensive line, and someone to replace Jacobs and Bradshaw next year.

Thank you, and thank you and the rest of you all for giving me legitimate responses instead of what other people do and give out immature comments or personal attacks.

I did hear rumors about eagles and spags, but we are at a point where we can't afford NOT to get him back. He is the ideal person for our defense. They need a kick in the ass and he does that, he knows how to motivate players. I would throw money, a future HC job, and keys to our personnel choices (to a certain degree like we did before).

As far as Del Rio, I am not as familiar with his schemes, but I know he likes to blitz so I have no problem with that. If you are not going to be aggressive then you are giving the offense free yardage and free first downs, prolonging a drive.

LB is really a huge need, I think we ignored it because we saw the transition to a passing league, but the problem is, you still need LB's who can line players up, who can diagnose a play or what the defense has to do to stay in position. Pierce was great at that, we need someone like that, a leader or quarterback of the defense. I like Vontaze Burfict, although he's a headcase, players feed off of him and he delivers difference making plays. He doesn't play controlled and sometimes gets himself out of position, but there is talent there that isn't in any other prospect i've seen this year.

Turner is ideal, he is a QB and WR friendly OC, and runs a system based on run. He and Spags both would fit us like gloves. I'm tired of Coughlin's Cover 2 coordinators, we aren't that kind of team, and i don't like the scheme itself because you are relying on quarterbacks trying to take too much. Its predictable and opposing OC's eat this up all day.

I agree with new offensive linemen too. McKenzie is done, he is average in all aspects now, even run blocking where he was very good two years ago. Diehl has taken a few steps back, Snee too. I think what would be best right now is to move Diehl to RT, keep Snee at RG. They already have a good relationship and work well together, so it won't be hard for them to gel next to eachother.

Next I would get rid of any hope I had for Beatty, he was sub par in all aspects this year, and I think he was alot of the reason why Diehl looked soo bad.

Petrus should be starting at LG, unless we decide to go out and sign a FA. Petrus is very good at run blocking and I don't think he will be a liability in pass blocking

Two prospects I really like are Peter Konz C from Wisconsin, and Riley Reiff from Iowa. Both could start early in their careers, both are great run blockers.

a starting line of:

Reiff-Petrus-Konz-Snee-Diehl

would create a much improved run blocking line. I don't like Baas, he is very average, and Seubert was much better than him for us IMO.

<P>a starting line of:

Reiff-Petrus-Konz-Snee-Diehl
.

Do you really want Diehl back next year? In my opinion he is awful. Watch him play this week and I think you'll change your mind.

Great write-up. I would love to see your opinion on the DB's ;-)

Diehl is fine, he has strayed from the pro caliber player we had a few years ago, he is definitely not a LT. He doesn't handle speed rushers well, and because of this he sometimes over compensates and gets knocked off balance by a bull rush. He is not a natural LT, but he would probably be very good at RT.

At RT he would most likely encounter slower passrushers, but better run defenders. This is an easier matchup for a former guard that is forced to take on DT's. Imo this would be even more ideal for us with the emergence of Petrus and so that the right side of the line along with a pulling left guard can be consistent for running yardage.

I will do DB's in a few I have to do something.

All in all, the DB's are being misused and because of the lack of A and B gap pressure (see my previous posts in this thread), they are having to cover crossing routes while the QB's are able to step into throws, which makes it very hard for them to undercut those routes for potential interceptions or a deflection.

Antrel Rolle, we spent a lot of money on him but we aren't getting the playmaking ability we have seen. The plays where he is lethal is when he is in single high safety, which we rarely are able to use him in because he needs to cover the slot (our linebackers definitely cannot do this) or the runningback. He is a ballhawk, i suggest we use him that way or in blitz packages where we did last year. He is much more talented than his performance this year, and i attribute most of that to him not being used as he should. If you remember correctly, he did a pretty good job against Wes Welker as a SAFETY! that means a lot, and should tell you he is very very good. Now he does miss tackles and gives up plays, but any DB does that, especially if we aren't getting enough pressure with the front 4. He isn't extremely fast, but is quick, has good ball skills, and is instinctive.

Kenny Phillips isn't what we thought he'd be, but he is a pretty damn good player nonetheless. Very good in run support, covers a lot of ground as a deep safety, but isn't as instinctive as we thought. He is still growing as a player, but he has that constant knee injury that hinders his play. He's the most humble of our DB's, a good guy, and I am rooting for the light bulb in his head to really click. He isn't as agile as Rolle, probably a little faster, less instinctive, but he is more consistent versus the run.

Corey Webster is a top corner in this league. Yes, he has let up plays and touchdowns, but a corner without a rush is in deep water. Webster has become a lot more fluid, making it possible for him to overcome not having elite speed or agility. He's very physical, but very smart. This is why we see him being able to play with receivers despite Fewell's *** defense, he has more experience and was able to develop his game mentally and physically.

Terrell Thomas was a key loss for us not only because he was a starting corner, but he was a major turnover magnet. Turnovers are what fuel the Cover 2 defense. You are allowing receivers to run free and waiting for the quarterback to make an arrant throw. Thomas was very good at reacting to the ball in the air, he isn't very fast, but his quickness and play recognition are what made him one of the best corners in the league last season in that aspect. He however is a liability versus man, which is why the idea of him being used as a pseudo linebacker (as grant is being used now) was presented so that we could use him in a way that would be best fitted for his skillset. I am afraid that the ACL injury will most likely ruin him because of the suddenness needed to make these plays will most likely be lost. We'll see, different people recover in different ways, some worse or better.

Aaron Ross confuses the hell out of me. He hasn't had major injuries, but a bunch of nagging smaller ones, and many hamstring injuries. He is probably best fit for press man, but he hasn't been as physical as we thought he would, he doesn't get sufficient jams off the line, at least on a consistent basis. He is quick, fast, rangy, but he isn't as fluid as thomas or webster. He isn't mentally the player they are, but he has the ability of being a very good starting corner in the league. He is actually ok in most coverages, but bites on double moves and allows alot of separation. He's 29 i think, probably not worth keeping unless he comes back for cheaper than starter pay.

Deon Grant saved us this year in the secondary as far as I'm concerned. He plays very disciplined, which hurts us sometimes against players like Vick, but he is not anything more than average in most categories. Classic veteran player, good signing and true giants imo. He should be our leader on defense, he speaks with thought and plays with emotion.

Prince Amukamara is not a failure, people who say otherwise are dumb. He has a skillset that we are seeing more and more in the NFL being highly touted. He has size, speed, and although he doesn't have great ball skills, he is what we call an all around corner. He is very impressive versus the run (as are Thomas and Webster) and shows great ability to mirror the receiver. Problems he has are flipping his hips, and that is just about the only problem i have with him. He is fluid, but not comfortable in the position just yet. You have to remember that he has only been playing cornerback for 3 years prior to now. Regarding his performances of recent, you should take them with a grain of salt. He is playing with receivers in mid-season form as a rookie corner in preseason form that missed a training camp, and did not have the playbook until the lockout ended. If you have read my previous posts, you see my argument that he probably doesn't know his assignments well. If any of you have played football, even at the highschool level, you know that it is hard to play 100% effort without having your assignments down pat. He has had many plays against very good receivers, and some not so good plays. the plays that you see that are positive you rarely remember or actually saw, but the bad you do because they are obvious. Judgement is not final on him.

Bruce Johnson was a big loss imo, very underrated. He had elite speed, good quickness, closing speed, not very physical, but he was developing well. I hope we sign him again, unfortunate injury.

Coe and Tryon aren't very good, but not THAT bad, but i do not anticipate either being legitimate starters or contributing to this team as more than nickel corners or special teamers.

We typically don't get premiere free agents, spending all that money on players holds up alot of our cap and makes it hard to resign our own talent. Our own talent is more crucial because getting a free agent means that we don't know if they will be able to translate their talents to our system. Free agents
Like I proposed in my first post, losing these two games could get us maybe even a top 10 pick. Give Jerry something to work with, making the playoffs with the coordinators, injuries, and attitude we have now is pointless. All it takes is one or two good drafts to return a team to a playoff powerhouse, especially with the players we have in place already.

Diehl and Grant are two players that have been very good for us, I don't think you can say that Grant has regressed, individually he is still as good as he was in past seasons. Diehl isn't showing the power in the run game as much as he used to, which is something that really alarms me. I do think that Beatty sucking had something to do with that, but you're right in saying that he hasn't performed as well. Next season i hope he's an RT

Giantsfan1080
12-21-2011, 09:00 PM
Baas is starting at C this week which is going to push Boothe back to LG and Petrus out. We should just keep Baas on the bench considering how much our line play has improved with Petrus in the lineup.

BaLLiN
12-23-2011, 05:02 PM
the media is contorting everything the giants are saying while the jets are actually personally attacking our players. They turned Hakeem Nicks's answer to the question if Revis was the best corner in the league into "he's decent" from his original response of "He's decent, he's a decent corner. He's a great player...." and Cruz is not wrong in saying that teams aren't as afraid of throwing on him, but the media already got Revis in defensive mode with the shortened Nicks comment and completely made this a war of words.

Giantsfan1080
12-23-2011, 05:05 PM
Meh who cares? Maybe we'll play inspired for the first time this year.

BaLLiN
12-23-2011, 05:17 PM
Meh who cares? Maybe we'll play inspired for the first time this year.

I'm just afraid that the media will fuel their fire more than ours.

Giantsfan1080
12-23-2011, 05:19 PM
I'm just afraid that the media will fuel their fire more than ours.

It's basically a playoff game tomorrow so if either side needs their fire to be fueled by the media then that's pitiful and both teams lack balls.

BaLLiN
12-24-2011, 03:43 PM
we need to find out what the hell refs have against the giants.

Damix
12-24-2011, 07:01 PM
Really the thing that annoyed me was the Kerley call, I just can't see any evidence that his elbow wasn't on the shoe of Rolle.

It was one of those calls that you stick with whatever was called on the field.

The other 2 reversals were just unfortunate circumstances to a fairly bad rule.

Damix
12-24-2011, 07:40 PM
Also....Fewell...see what happens when you bring pressure?

bigbluedefense
12-24-2011, 09:14 PM
So the players were begging Fewell all week to simplify the defense and to play more man and bring pressure.

The result? We play good defense.

Why is the solution always so ******* simple? WHY IS THIS SO DIFFICULT FOR EVERY DC WE HAD OTHER THAN SPAGS TO UNDERSTAND?

It's extremely frustrating.

bigbluedefense
12-24-2011, 10:18 PM
Some other quick thoughts:

-This game showed how much we miss Ballard. Not necessarily bc Ballard is great, he's good not great, but bc our other TEs blow. Pascoe is a FB, and Beckum, can we cut him already? When the ball bounced off his face today I was cursing at my TV. Why is this turd still wasting a roster spot?

-We also really missed Mario. Let's be real, Barden is what he is. He's not very good. He's 6 5" but he plays like he's 5 4". He's soft, he doesn't fight for position, he's slow off the line, he's just a mediocre player. He's a 4th WR on the depth chart at best.

If we lose Mario in the offseason, WR definitely becomes a need for us. I really like Cruz in the slot right now.

-Speaking of Cruz, he's our best WR right now. Nicks has had 2 horrible games in a row, and Cruz is just a stud. What a find. The guy is one of the better WRs in this league, and I think he's our best WR on the team.

-Our linebackers still suck. I want to see them hit the gaps hard, but they wait for the play to come to them. Jacquan Williams is much better in a simplified defense. He actually looks pretty damn good at OLB when we run a lot more man coverage and simplify his checks. He plays faster.

So maybe the only ingredient we need is a MIKE. With another year under his belt and maybe with a simplified approach (or Spags or Zimmer), Williams can hold down the other OLB spot, which means we just need an inside guy to clean up the middle.

-Prince barely saw the field, and when he did...he sucked. I'm starting to get nervous about Prince. Maybe he wasn't the player we thought he was. I know he's hurt, but still.

-JPP has potential to be a top 3 pass rusher in this league as early as next year. He's just a monster.

Damix
12-24-2011, 10:23 PM
I make no judgement on Prince till next year.

bigbluedefense
12-24-2011, 10:27 PM
I remember 3 snaps in particular with Prince. 1 was the play vs Plax where he got beat but Plax was dumb and pushed off when he didn't need to.

Another was when he was in press man vs Santonio (or was it Plax?) and got beat on a skinny post but Sanchez didn't see it.

The other was a play where KP was yelling at him before the snap, the play resulted in an incomplete, but Prince didn't see the field after that snap.


So yeah...I'm concerned. He's definitely not a zone defender, and he has some skills to play press man, but his short arms are haunting him a little, and I don't like how he sinks his hips or changes direction. He's a little stiff. He reminds me of Ross.

So yeah, I'm worried.

Hurricanes25
12-24-2011, 11:37 PM
Good game guys. Cruz is a monster and JPP is literally a freak.

Giantsfan1080
12-24-2011, 11:45 PM
Geez BBD besides the JPP thing I disagree with you on everything.

Forenci
12-25-2011, 12:14 AM
I remember 3 snaps in particular with Prince. 1 was the play vs Plax where he got beat but Plax was dumb and pushed off when he didn't need to.

Another was when he was in press man vs Santonio (or was it Plax?) and got beat on a skinny post but Sanchez didn't see it.

The other was a play where KP was yelling at him before the snap, the play resulted in an incomplete, but Prince didn't see the field after that snap.


So yeah...I'm concerned. He's definitely not a zone defender, and he has some skills to play press man, but his short arms are haunting him a little, and I don't like how he sinks his hips or changes direction. He's a little stiff. He reminds me of Ross.

So yeah, I'm worried.

Don't overreact so much, BBD, haha. He's a rookie who had no off-season and was hurt almost the entire season. That and he's been forced into an overly complex defensive scheme as a rookie. I have really high hopes for Prince and think he's going to be a stud.

I think you're judging him a little to harshly, all things considered. Also, Jernigan who you said was basically already Sinorice Moss and a bust has proven himself to be a pretty good kick returner and has seen a lot more action lately. He's coming along nicely considering he's a third round pick, and a rookie.

We judge rookies way too harshly at times. Most rookies take a couple years to fully reach their potential. Not everyone is Cam Newton or Joe Thomas. Not everyone steps in and looks like studs on day one. Lets give the rookies and youngsters a break.

scottyboy
12-25-2011, 09:03 AM
CHASE BLACKBURN WAS AWSEOME
except his dumb penalty

and tollefson played well too.

i love my white defenders

Rosebud
12-25-2011, 10:24 AM
http://troll.me/images/the-most-interesting-man-in-the-world/i-dont-alway-react-but-when-i-do-i-overreact-thumb.jpg

BaLLiN
12-25-2011, 02:31 PM
Posted this in another forum where jets fans were saying every call was right:

http://i39.tinypic.com/1z5s16o.png
http://oi41.tinypic.com/2i7whv9.jpg
http://oi43.tinypic.com/5wy2pl.jpg


http://oi40.tinypic.com/20r4cps.jpg
http://oi42.tinypic.com/2ceiwzn.jpg
http://oi44.tinypic.com/70hlsj.jpg

http://oi39.tinypic.com/21jy5g2.jpg
http://oi41.tinypic.com/23tldsy.jpg

Instead of not supporting any of your opinions, I have evidence to all of my assertions. First off, Revis got away with murder. He interfered with Nicks all game, Barden once by pulling his jersey to decrease the separation between them. This is pass interference, by the rule you are not allowed to alter or prohibit a receiver after 5 yards or when the ball is in the air. These pictures show that Nicks had his arms held back, much like Cruz had versus Kyle Wilson on a third down play that was even more blatantly clear than Revis's.

Then you see on the play of the interception that Revis hooked him and turned him, you are allowed to have one hand on a receiver, but you are not allowed to hook and turn, at that point it becomes pass interference because the receiver's route has been altered past 5 yards AND as the ball was in the air. Revis is a good player, but he has taken advantage of the refs not calling penalties on him to help his coverage.

Plaxico's penalty was a clear foul, not a call that doesn't get called by refs as many of you have said. He pushed off using his hand and arm while prince was in great coverage. Blatant offensive pass interference.

Probably the stupidest call was the overturn on the Kerley fumble. "his elbow was down" you say, well look at the pictures. The ball moves as the forearm hits the foot, so the point of the elbow, which cannot be clearly seen as touching the turf or still on Rolle's foot, doesn't matter at all. The fumble starts when the ball moves thats simple, right? If you say no look at both angles in synchronized time, the ball moves at the same time the forearm is on Rolles foot, just fractions of a second before the point comes even close to the ground. Ontop of that, was there irrefutable evidence that the elbow touched the ground? Absolutely not, it is not clear at all, and by the lack of evidence the call should stay as is. The reason why they didn't call it, imo, is that they didn't want this to determine the game.

The Sanchez fumble caused by JPP was a legitimate fumble, the throwing process was done, he didn't try to bring the ball to his body (as the rule states) and was keeping it out but with his wrist turned in a carrying position. Fumble, Tuck rule does not apply if the QB isn't trying to bring it to his body.

The second sanchez fumble looks like a fumble, its really close. At first I thought the refs were incredibly stupid because it looked like Sanchez was throwing. But at a second glance, the ball never leaves his hand going forward, not a forward pass. As Linval Joseph bats it out, regardless if its a pass, it is a backward pass because it is never making forward progress from the release point. Come to think of it, this same thing happened to me in madden and I challenged it and it was not overturned.

For the Green Bay fan that complains about people complaining: Look at the pictures in the NY daily news of Ballard's TD, look at Finley hold Williams on a 3rd and long that we got a sack on, look at Greg Jennings's feet as he gains "some" possession when Prince knocks it out (he only has one down during that duration). The only reason you beat the giants was the referees.

LonghornsLegend
12-25-2011, 02:42 PM
I thought they called the Plaxico interference when it happened?

Forenci
12-25-2011, 02:56 PM
They did. Also, those two fumbles were not fumbles according to the rules so I'm not sure what you're arguing, Ballin. The rule is stupid, but it is what it is. The only one that was an issue was the Kerley fumble. They should not have overturned it. You can't tell me it was 100% definitive that his arm hit the ground, so there was no reason to overturn it.

There were a lot of bad calls against the Giants, but that's fine. It's part of the game now. We've been the beneficiary of plenty of bad calls for opposing teams in other games, so it's not an excuse. We also made several dumb penalties and decisions that made the game closer than it had to be.

It was a good game. I'm excited. A win is a win, and I felt like we showed up and earned it. It's why I was so alarmed to see so many Giants fans being negative after the game. Lets be positive! We've got big momentum going forward into an absolutely huge game. We typically show up in huge games and it doesn't get much bigger than this.

I'm so pumped because I'll be going to the game next week. I can't wait!!

NY+Giants=NYG
12-25-2011, 07:51 PM
I am very happy! Even if we don't do much next game, I am content. We needed to come out and play for pride and shut the Jets up! I wished Jacobs would have decked Ryan! That would have been great.

Good win, it was tough, and we still have morons running wrong routes. I am SOO tired of that! Also, we had a chance to go 24-7, and we called Bush league plays.

I still want a clean state!

BaLLiN
12-25-2011, 11:38 PM
They did. Also, those two fumbles were not fumbles according to the rules so I'm not sure what you're arguing, Ballin. The rule is stupid, but it is what it is. The only one that was an issue was the Kerley fumble. They should not have overturned it. You can't tell me it was 100% definitive that his arm hit the ground, so there was no reason to overturn it.

There were a lot of bad calls against the Giants, but that's fine. It's part of the game now. We've been the beneficiary of plenty of bad calls for opposing teams in other games, so it's not an excuse. We also made several dumb penalties and decisions that made the game closer than it had to be.

It was a good game. I'm excited. A win is a win, and I felt like we showed up and earned it. It's why I was so alarmed to see so many Giants fans being negative after the game. Lets be positive! We've got big momentum going forward into an absolutely huge game. We typically show up in huge games and it doesn't get much bigger than this.

I'm so pumped because I'll be going to the game next week. I can't wait!!

The one that was overruled because of the Tuck rule was stupid because he really wasn't trying to draw it closer to his body, which is what the rule says. He was in the grasp, done with his throwing motion, and about to go down.

The second one i didn't have much of a problem with, but it is still controversial. The ball never leaves Sanchez's hand until LJ hits it, then its motion is completely backwards, would that not be a backwards pass? I know he's not intending it to go backward, but if they are ruling it an incomplete pass how is it possible when the ball never goes forward from the release point? Think about it.

One of my friends who is not a giants fan said this: In basketball the shot is not actually a shot until it leaves the guy's hands (it must be released before no time remaining for a basket to count). So In football shouldn't not be a pass unless the ball leaves the quarterback's hands?

Feel the same way on the Kerley pass.

Nicks has not been getting PI calls, and its not like they are barely a factor, they are blatant and pretty big PI's.

bigbluedefense
12-26-2011, 01:23 PM
Posted this in another forum where jets fans were saying every call was right:

http://i39.tinypic.com/1z5s16o.png
http://oi41.tinypic.com/2i7whv9.jpg
http://oi43.tinypic.com/5wy2pl.jpg


http://oi40.tinypic.com/20r4cps.jpg
http://oi42.tinypic.com/2ceiwzn.jpg
http://oi44.tinypic.com/70hlsj.jpg

http://oi39.tinypic.com/21jy5g2.jpg
http://oi41.tinypic.com/23tldsy.jpg

Instead of not supporting any of your opinions, I have evidence to all of my assertions. First off, Revis got away with murder. He interfered with Nicks all game, Barden once by pulling his jersey to decrease the separation between them. This is pass interference, by the rule you are not allowed to alter or prohibit a receiver after 5 yards or when the ball is in the air. These pictures show that Nicks had his arms held back, much like Cruz had versus Kyle Wilson on a third down play that was even more blatantly clear than Revis's.

Then you see on the play of the interception that Revis hooked him and turned him, you are allowed to have one hand on a receiver, but you are not allowed to hook and turn, at that point it becomes pass interference because the receiver's route has been altered past 5 yards AND as the ball was in the air. Revis is a good player, but he has taken advantage of the refs not calling penalties on him to help his coverage.

Plaxico's penalty was a clear foul, not a call that doesn't get called by refs as many of you have said. He pushed off using his hand and arm while prince was in great coverage. Blatant offensive pass interference.

Probably the stupidest call was the overturn on the Kerley fumble. "his elbow was down" you say, well look at the pictures. The ball moves as the forearm hits the foot, so the point of the elbow, which cannot be clearly seen as touching the turf or still on Rolle's foot, doesn't matter at all. The fumble starts when the ball moves thats simple, right? If you say no look at both angles in synchronized time, the ball moves at the same time the forearm is on Rolles foot, just fractions of a second before the point comes even close to the ground. Ontop of that, was there irrefutable evidence that the elbow touched the ground? Absolutely not, it is not clear at all, and by the lack of evidence the call should stay as is. The reason why they didn't call it, imo, is that they didn't want this to determine the game.

The Sanchez fumble caused by JPP was a legitimate fumble, the throwing process was done, he didn't try to bring the ball to his body (as the rule states) and was keeping it out but with his wrist turned in a carrying position. Fumble, Tuck rule does not apply if the QB isn't trying to bring it to his body.

The second sanchez fumble looks like a fumble, its really close. At first I thought the refs were incredibly stupid because it looked like Sanchez was throwing. But at a second glance, the ball never leaves his hand going forward, not a forward pass. As Linval Joseph bats it out, regardless if its a pass, it is a backward pass because it is never making forward progress from the release point. Come to think of it, this same thing happened to me in madden and I challenged it and it was not overturned.

For the Green Bay fan that complains about people complaining: Look at the pictures in the NY daily news of Ballard's TD, look at Finley hold Williams on a 3rd and long that we got a sack on, look at Greg Jennings's feet as he gains "some" possession when Prince knocks it out (he only has one down during that duration). The only reason you beat the giants was the referees.

Revis is smart. Every great CB (including Deion) grabbed a lot. Rex teaches his CBs to grab a lot. Bc refs aren't going to throw the flag every play. More often than not, they'll let you get away with it bc they don't want to turn a game into a flag fest.

But Revis is smart about how he does it. He's pretty slick about it. And within 5 yards, he'll rape you, which is what you should do as a defender.

And you're allowed to put your arm on a guy as long as you don't push off with it. He wraps around guys to get a feel for where their body is going to move. Your muscles clench and give away which direction you're going. It's why basketball defenders put their hands on your hip so they know where you're going.

And he does do a lot of illegal "touching" but the way he does it, it's hard to call. He's slick about it most of the time. It's just smart CB play. I love it.

BaLLiN
12-26-2011, 06:06 PM
Revis is smart. Every great CB (including Deion) grabbed a lot. Rex teaches his CBs to grab a lot. Bc refs aren't going to throw the flag every play. More often than not, they'll let you get away with it bc they don't want to turn a game into a flag fest.

But Revis is smart about how he does it. He's pretty slick about it. And within 5 yards, he'll rape you, which is what you should do as a defender.

And you're allowed to put your arm on a guy as long as you don't push off with it. He wraps around guys to get a feel for where their body is going to move. Your muscles clench and give away which direction you're going. It's why basketball defenders put their hands on your hip so they know where you're going.

And he does do a lot of illegal "touching" but the way he does it, it's hard to call. He's slick about it most of the time. It's just smart CB play. I love it.

yeah BBD, but those two plays on Nicks are legitimately PI. Revis went on air with Francesca to talk about the 100 yard interception return he had against the dolphins and couldn't dispute that he interfered with Marshall on the play.

You can't turn the WR, which he did on the pick (I show two pictures, one is with nicks on an angle and the other is nicks more straight due to Revis using Nicks to fling himself for the PD). Revis can't defy physics as good as he is, that play can only be made if you impede the receiver and use their body to fling yourself over their body.

The play on the endzone slant close, but it wasn't that close that you couldn't tell that he was being interfered with. Revis used one hand to pull Nick's left arm down and the other hand to secure a hit and pull nicks's body down.

I think he is a very good player no doubt, he is always near his receiver and in good coverage, but he uses PI to become superman. Against Barden he had a less obvious PI (holding onto his jersey and hip to prevent separation), which is just him being smart as you said.

anna dai
12-26-2011, 09:53 PM
Ndamukong Suh returns against Oakland Raiders

Suh, last year's Defensive Rookie of the Year, is back from a two-game suspension for stomping on Green Bay lineman Evan Dietrich-Smith on national television on Thanksgiving Day.

Carlisle was asked if he might try to antagonize a guy with a temper to knock him off his game.

&quot;I don't think so,&quot; he said, laughing. &quot;I don't think so.&quot;

What's no laughing matter is the importance of Sunday's game at the Coliseum for both Okaland Raiders (http://www.urbestjerseys.com/Oakland_Raiders_NFL_Jerseys--pc-509-1) (7-6) and Detroit (8-5), and both teams' playoff chances could hinge on how successfully the Raiders deal with the 6-foot-4, 307-pound Suh.

Suh had 10 sacks last year in making the Pro Bowl, but has only three this season as he has faced more double teams. Carlisle will surely get a hand from center Samson Satele, as the Raiders try to get their running game going after three subpar weeks.

Suh was not the only person to earn redemption Sunday.

Detroit Lions (http://www.urbestjerseys.com/Detroit_Lion_Nfl_Jerseys--pc-519-1) receiver Calvin Johnson had struggled statistically since the bye week (Nov. 6), but roared back with nine receptions for 214 yards and two touchdowns in the win. Oakland played man-to-man coverage on Johnson, and he made the Raiders pay.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 08:56 AM
I'm nervous about this game for several reasons.

1. It's asking an awful lot from the Giants to beat the Cowboys twice. It's never easy beating a division rival twice, especially one that is on par if not more talented than your team.

2. We suck at home this year. I actually rather play this game in Dallas. We own the Cowboys on their turf. At home, I believe they beat us more than we beat them.

3. The media is picking us. We always suck when we are the favorite. This team just doesn't know how to win unless we're in the underdog role.

4. We just came off an emotional win. The Giants ALWAYS follow that up with a poor game. Always.

5. We are so damn inconsistent, watch us lay a complete egg vs the Cowboys.

6. Perry Fewell

7. Kevin Gilbride

8. Our run defense

9. Our run offense

10. No Jake Ballard is a huge blow to our offense. Pascoe and Beckum are a joke.

I dunno guys, I just don't like this game at all. We know our team. It has all the ingredients of a typical Giant let down game.

Forenci
12-27-2011, 10:15 AM
This is arguably the biggest regular season game we've played in a LONG time. If we can't show up for this then I don't know what to say. I think the team will show up, though.

I'm feeling confident about this game. They have almost no running attack, Romo is dinged up, their secondary has issues, and we're playing at home. I think the Cowboys and Giants are very similar in terms of talent level so it would not surprise me to see them win but we have a lot of things going for us too.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 10:17 AM
That's what makes me nervous. The fact that we have so many things going our way heading into the game.

When was the last time this type of scenario actually worked out for us? We almost always lose when the stars align in our favor.

Forenci
12-27-2011, 10:20 AM
Eh, you're probably right to an extent but I've never been a big believer in curses or jinx's. Every game is different. Every year is different. If we were facing the Rams or some other awful team then I'd say sure, this is the perfect time for a let down game.

We're facing a division rival on national television in a win or go home scenario. They have to show up or Coughlin clearly isn't doing his job and should be fired regardless.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 10:23 AM
The major question to me is defensively, will we continue with a more simplified approach that doesn't use as much zone? Or will we go back to the infamous rush 3 cover 2?

And offensively, we desperately miss Ballard in the middle of the field, and it's obvious we don't have a 3rd WR who's dependable when Mario can't go. So will both be a go for Sunday? And if not, can we score enough to make up for it?

Forenci
12-27-2011, 10:28 AM
My biggest question is the defense too. I've really never understood why coaches can't see what they're doing isn't working, especially when there is a huge sample size of it not working, and they still do nothing to fix it.

Is it because they have huge egos? Are they just insane, doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result? I mean, if I'm a coordinator and I know I have good players and my defense is getting torched I'm going to at least TRY to make some changes, regardless of how small they are. I understand you can't overhaul the entire thing overnight, but there is no reason you can't mix it up.

It's not just Fewell, either. It's a lot of coaches on both sides of the ball.

scottyboy
12-27-2011, 10:53 AM
if fewell and this D don't come out fired up and attacking then head will roll. Tuck was an animal against the Jets and he already came out reminding us how much he hates the cowboys. a healthy (and fired up) Tuck is HUGE for us. Never thought I'd say this, but big mouth Antrel calling this team out may have been one of the best things for us. The D showed heart last week. It was against a **** Jets offense, but still

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 11:15 AM
Antrelle Rolle is more of a leader than Tuck is. Tuck is not a leader. At all.

Chewing on your mouth piece and sulking on the bench alone when your unit just got their teeth kicked in is not leadership. And Tuck does that all the time.

We need a vocal linebacker. Bc Rolle is a safety, he doesn't have enough bite to his bark. But Rolle is the most vocal leader we have on defense.

Forenci
12-27-2011, 11:33 AM
Haha, I'm listening to Rolle right now on WFAN. I love him. He doesn't BS at all. He even says he knows he can be a loud mouth and that any criticisms people make about him regarding his big mouth he brings on himself.

It's kind of refreshing for a guy not to just blame the media or being taken out of context for the stuff he says. He seems pretty cool.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 11:39 AM
I can't wait for the game either but I really have no feeling either way on it. I'm just goingo to enjoy the build up and yell my ass off when I'm there Sunday night.

Jughead10
12-27-2011, 11:48 AM
The fact that the opponent is the Cowboys makes me more confident. We never lay a complete egg against them. When we do lose, it is normally and a high scoring game for both teams. We don't ever overlook them. How could you in a situation like this?

Obviously not to look too forward, but I actually think the NFC playoff picture is as favorable as it could be in my opinion. Not that it is really favorable at all, but if we win and get in, we would potentially avoid going to New Orleans. But again I shouldn't be thinking these things.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 12:02 PM
It's going to be a close game so let's just hope we're on the correct side. We need Mario to play in this one because he always has his big games against the Cowboys. I hope that knee gets healthy this week.

Tuck being the most healthy he's been all year is coming at the perfect time also. If Tuck/Jpp can get to the QB with the 4 man rush it'll help negate Fewell's foolishness.

Damix
12-27-2011, 12:11 PM
I'm still pissed we got flexed to the night game. I'll be in New Orleans, likely finding anywhere with a TV.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 12:15 PM
I'm still pissed we got flexed to the night game. I'll be in New Orleans, likely finding anywhere with a TV.

Isn't it better we got flexed then? You can watch the national TV game anywhere as if we stayed at 1 or 4 it's possible the Saints game would have been on.

Forenci
12-27-2011, 12:27 PM
Haha, it's going to be a hassle. I'm going to this game and because it's flexed to 8:30 I probably won't be getting home to 3-4 in the morning.

It's going to be worth it though!

Damix
12-27-2011, 12:28 PM
Isn't it better we got flexed then? You can watch the national TV game anywhere as if we stayed at 1 or 4 it's possible the Saints game would have been on.

I would have found a bar to watch all the games at 1/4 (my group has fans of every team). This way I'll probably have to go somewhere myself since people will be back to partying/passed out after the early games.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 12:37 PM
I would have found a bar to watch all the games at 1/4 (my group has fans of every team). This way I'll probably have to go somewhere myself since people will be back to partying/passed out after the early games.

Got ya that does make sense.

Jughead10
12-27-2011, 12:42 PM
I'll have to pace myself as well. I slept through the first half of the last Giants/Cowboys game a few weeks ago. I was quite ashamed. It was the first game I've missed I think since the game we blew out Tampa in 2009.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 12:52 PM
I hope we don't screw ourselves out of Spagnuolo.

If we go to the playoffs, look competitive but lose and keep Fewell as a result and watch Spagnuolo go to Philly, you guys are going to have to keep me away from bridges for a little while.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 12:57 PM
I hope we don't screw ourselves out of Spagnuolo.

If we go to the playoffs, look competitive but lose and keep Fewell as a result and watch Spagnuolo go to Philly, you guys are going to have to keep me away from bridges for a little while.

We'd all be on a bridge together BBD. Anyway we might screw ourselves by just going to the playoffs. Spags might get the fired the first day after the season and with the Eagles knocked out now they'll be the first to call. Reese isn't going to contact Spags until we're out of it. Spags can get hired before we even have a shot at him.

Damix
12-27-2011, 12:59 PM
I hope we don't screw ourselves out of Spagnuolo.

If we go to the playoffs, look competitive but lose and keep Fewell as a result and watch Spagnuolo go to Philly, you guys are going to have to keep me away from bridges for a little while.

Citing league sources, the San Diego Union-Tribune reports that it is "all but certain" that Rams HC Steve Spagnuolo will take over as Eagles defensive coordinator in 2012.




NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Alright guys, I'm suggesting a group suicide. Who's with me!?

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 01:12 PM
Don't do this to me guys. Seriously. Don't do this to me.

Seriously. Please. Don't do this to me.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 01:13 PM
Why would the San Diego Union Tribune have a scoop on Spags going to the Eagles? Doesn't make much sense so I'm not buying it right now.

Jughead10
12-27-2011, 01:16 PM
Don't do this to me guys. Seriously. Don't do this to me.

Seriously. Please. Don't do this to me.

It makes sense for him. He'd have more expectations here. We'd expect another Super Bowl. But if somehow someway Spags took over for Andy and actually won that terrible franchise a Super Bowl, he'd be their Parcells.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 01:18 PM
Mike Zimmer or bust?

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 01:19 PM
Mike Zimmer or bust?

Why would Zimmer leave Cincy?

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 01:21 PM
It makes sense for him. He'd have more expectations here. We'd expect another Super Bowl. But if somehow someway Spags took over for Andy and actually won that terrible franchise a Super Bowl, he'd be their Parcells.

He should know better than anyone how Philly wil turn it's back on you.

Who wants that nasty taint on their bodies? Philly is a taint you can't get rid of. It's like a STD.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 01:21 PM
Why would Zimmer leave Cincy?

Only chance would be to bring him in as a HC, which probably won't happen anymore.

Jughead10
12-27-2011, 01:22 PM
He should know better than anyone how Philly wil turn it's back on you.

Who wants that nasty taint on their bodies? Philly is a taint you can't get rid of. It's like a STD.

Haha. That reminds me. My dad asked me what a STD was. I almost died. I tried starting a STD chant at the Jets cheerleaders.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-27-2011, 03:02 PM
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Alright guys, I'm suggesting a group suicide. Who's with me!?

Let me check for airplane tickets to NYC first, don't go without me and leave me all alone in here :(

BigBlueNorwegian
12-27-2011, 03:04 PM
Haha. That reminds me. My dad asked me what a STD was. I almost died. I tried starting a STD chant at the Jets cheerleaders.

LOL, that's hilarious (both the chant and your dad)!

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 04:40 PM
Sal Pal now reporting the Giants will aggresively pursue Spags and we are the favorites to land him.

BigBlueNorwegian
12-27-2011, 06:26 PM
Eli and JPP the only two probowlers we got this year. Cruz and Snee are second alternates. Sounds about right I think. Cruz should have been in there, but the competition at WR in the nfc is really tough. He'll be there next year though.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 06:38 PM
Cruz should 100% be there. BS that he didn't make. I'm shocked they got Eli and JPP right.

OSUGiants17
12-28-2011, 10:59 AM
Sal Pal now reporting the Giants will aggresively pursue Spags and we are the favorites to land him.

Saw that too, the one thing we having going for us we will offer him the future HC job. The Eagles can't promise that Reid will be gone anytime soon, but we know TC only has a few years left

BaLLiN
12-28-2011, 11:24 AM
Saw that too, the one thing we having going for us we will offer him the future HC job. The Eagles can't promise that Reid will be gone anytime soon, but we know TC only has a few years left

wait are we rumored to be offering him the future HC job?