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bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 09:51 AM
I'm still on the Randy Moss bandwagon btw.

Damix
07-28-2011, 09:53 AM
I'm still on the Randy Moss bandwagon btw.


When I thought no chance on Plax, I thought it'd be some for Randy, but now....

Just kidding BBD, I just don't see the match.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 09:56 AM
I know. I'm just gonna go cry in a corner when he signs with the Jets, Pats, or Eagles.

SolidGold
07-28-2011, 10:03 AM
Will Boothe or Beatty be in the Giants o-line plans? Seems neither has really panned out as quality replacements.

Damix
07-28-2011, 10:12 AM
Will Boothe or Beatty be in the Giants o-line plans? Seems neither has really panned out as quality replacements.

Beatty at worst is the swing tackle, and I believe he'll be the starting LT this year.

BBD is pessismistic, but I think if he hadn't broken his foot last year he would have been starting by week 4 or 5.

Boothe is what he is, can play 3 positions on the line, is familiar with our system and hasn't made a fool of himself when needing to play.

LT: Beatty, Diehl
LG: Diehl, Petrus
C: Baas, Koets,
RG: Snee, Boothe
RT: McKenzie, Brewer

While Brewer is listed behind McKenzie, if it actually came to it, I'd say Diehl to LT and Beatty to RT. Brewer will get very little playing time this year.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 10:21 AM
If Beatty pans out at LT, I think our best starting 5 would be:

LT: Beatty
LG: Petrus
C: Baas
RG: Snee
RT: Diehl

If he's a dud, then I'd go with

LT: Diehl
LG: Petrus
C: Baas
RG: Snee
RT: McKenzie

If McKenzie is washed up and can't play, plus Beatty is a dud, we have to go

LT: Diehl
LG: Petrus
C: Baas
RG: Snee
RT: Brewer

But that's a scary thought. I think Brewer has to be redshirted. He's not ready.

But I think Beatty could play RT even if he sucks at LT. So we should still be fine.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 10:23 AM
Forgot about Boothe. Boothe would probably play before Brewer would. I'd be shocked if Brewer sees the field this year.

Only chance he has is if he blows everyone away in TC.

Damix
07-28-2011, 10:33 AM
According to the Bergen Record, the Giants have informed David Diehl that he's moving to left guard with Will Beatty moving into the starting lineup at left tackle.


There it is BBD :)

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 10:38 AM
There it is BBD :)

Let's not be overly excited about this though. Remember they did the same thing last year before camp, but Beatty sucked so hard they aborted the idea.

Let's see if Beatty can take advantage of it this year. If he does pan out, I seriously rather move Diehl to RT and Petrus to LG, but that's just me.

Damix
07-28-2011, 10:39 AM
Let's not be overly excited about this though. Remember they did the same thing last year before camp, but Beatty sucked so hard they aborted the idea.

Let's see if Beatty can take advantage of it this year. If he does pan out, I seriously rather move Diehl to RT and Petrus to LG, but that's just me.

I think you are overrating Petrus. I saw a decent prospect with some shine, but I'm taking the veterans over him every day, at least for the beginning of the season.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 10:51 AM
I think you are overrating Petrus. I saw a decent prospect with some shine, but I'm taking the veterans over him every day, at least for the beginning of the season.

Diehl is losing his athleticism. He's not the same David Diehl anymore, he's getting old too after all. If you go back and watch him play LG in our PS games, he actually wasn't that impressive, bc he can't swing out on sweeps like he used to.

Petrus is more athletic than him. He showed a lot in the run game, and was improving as a pass protector. I think we have a future PBer in the making with Petrus, he just needs reps to work on his craft.

I like Diehl at RT and Petrus at LG bc I think that puts our best starting 5 on the field. Diehl may have lost a step, but he's still better than McKenzie. And I think the Petrus/Diehl combo is better than the Diehl/McKenzie combo.

But to be fair, most are higher on McKenzie on here than I am.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 10:57 AM
I really don't like Beatty at LT but let's hope he proves us wrong. Petrus looked very good in limited action and I think he's the future LG.

Smith might start off on the PUP list BBD.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 11:09 AM
Let's not forget, Petrus was supposed to be a developmental guy. He was raw coming in. If he looked that good last year, just imagine how good he can be now with more reps and a year of NFL lifting under his belt?

If Smith is on PUP, that means he misses the first 6 games right?

Jughead10
07-28-2011, 11:11 AM
Let's not forget, Petrus was supposed to be a developmental guy. He was raw coming in. If he looked that good last year, just imagine how good he can be now with more reps and a year of NFL lifting under his belt?

If Smith is on PUP, that means he misses the first 6 games right?

Not always. You can pull someone off PUP earlier. However you have 6 games before you are forced to decide to activate him or end his season. It just buys you another roster spot.

Forenci
07-28-2011, 11:19 AM
Beatty at LT is pretty scary. If he can just find consistency I'm confident he could be a great LT, but that's the big key with him. Hopefully this year he comes in knowing what is expected of him and does well. We really need him to step in at LT and succeed.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 11:21 AM
If he didn't pack on weight this year, I'm gonna be very disappointed.

In fact, if I don't see a bigger Beatty in camp, I'm fully expecting him to be a dud again.

He needs to get bigger.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 11:21 AM
If we don't re-sign Smith and instead sign Plax I'm going to be livid.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 11:22 AM
Beatty needs to get bigger and he needs to play with that angriness that OL need. Beatty seems too finesse out there.

Forenci
07-28-2011, 11:23 AM
If we don't re-sign Smith and instead sign Plax I'm going to be livid.

Agreed. Plax never really knew the system well and was a constant malcontent. We need Steve Smith. He's the only guy Eli can have 100% certainty to be in the right spot at the right time.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 11:23 AM
There's less than a 1% chance that happens.

Smith is coming back 1 way or another. Either with a 1 year contract or a long term deal. He's not leaving the building, I'd bet the mortgage on that.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 11:26 AM
Beatty needs to get bigger and he needs to play with that angriness that OL need. Beatty seems too finesse out there.

That won't change. Beatty was always finesse. He was finesse in college. You can't change a leopard's stripes. To be fair though, he's not too finesse. He does have a little bit of a mean streak on him, just not as much as what we're used to, bc our oline has always been built on run blocking and he's a pass protector not a run blocker.

It's acceptable at LT as long as he can pass protect. But if he keeps getting bullrushed bc he's the size of a big TE, there's no point in continuing this project with him.


I'm concerned about Sintim too. I think this is a make or break year for him.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 11:35 AM
I loved the Sintim pick and I'm known as one of the patient ones around here but I totally agree. Sintim needs to show something this year otherwise I hope he becomes a cut.

LTgiants
07-28-2011, 11:42 AM
Am I the only one who thinks they could move Sintim to end and move Osi for another LB?

SolidGold
07-28-2011, 11:46 AM
Thoughts on Hysnoski making the team?

Forenci
07-28-2011, 11:49 AM
Thoughts on Hysnoski making the team?

Wasn't he the best blocking FB in the draft? If so, pretty good I'd say.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 11:51 AM
Should be a good competition between him Hedgecock, and Pascoe.

Jughead10
07-28-2011, 11:51 AM
Am I the only one who thinks they could move Sintim to end and move Osi for another LB?

Kind of. I think Sintim should just be a passing down DE at this point. As for Osi, I'm getting tired of his act like most. But it would still have to be the right deal. If any team was offering a 2nd rounder, I'd take it.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 11:51 AM
I can see us moving Sintim to DE, but I don't think we trade Osi for a LB.

Unless it was a Timmons for Osi type of trade, I'm not making it. I could see us trading Osi for a draft pick though.

I'd like for us to go after Stewart Bradley. The interest doesn't sound deep, so he might be a cheap add, and if he's healthy he's exactly what we need at MIKE.

Could be a low risk/high reward FA pickup.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 12:00 PM
Good news here from a Justin Tuck tweet:


JustinTuckNYG91 Justin Tuck
Kiwi is returning to the big blue. Yes sir

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 12:14 PM
Huge. I always wanted Kiwi back and this gives us insurance in case Osi is gone.

I think Kiwi is going to break out this year if he can stay healthy.

Damix
07-28-2011, 12:16 PM
Sounds like it is multi year too. JPP will never start :P

I wouldn't be surprised if Kiwi is used standing up again this year.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 12:17 PM
If it's a multi year deal, then you can probably say adios to Osi.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 12:20 PM
Yea BBD is right that might be a tip off that Osi is gone. I hope not.

Jughead10
07-28-2011, 12:47 PM
I think we could still be selling high on Osi. Maybe not in a lot of our opinion, but he is still really highly thought of across the league. Down here in Baltimore, Ravens fans want him. If they give a second, I'm good to go with that.

Damix
07-28-2011, 12:49 PM
The more I think of it, the happier I am Kiwi is back, I just couldn't see him in another uniform.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 01:41 PM
It's a 2 year contract, presumably with the 2nd year being an option. So it's not really a long term contract.

I'm just happy to have him back. If he can prove to be healthy and continue to grow, I rather keep him over Osi long term.

But now we at least have leverage over Osi. And insurance so a strength doesn't suddenly become a weakness before the games start.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 01:47 PM
I'd keep Osi for 1 more year to make the transition to JPP. JPP is not nearly ready yet and we still need depth at DE to do what we do best. After this year we can get rid of Osi. A 2nd round pick would be worth it but we are a win now team.

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 03:45 PM
I agree. I think we should keep Osi for another year then trade him next year, pending the development of JPP and Kiwi's health.

If Kiwi can stay healthy and beast it up, and if JPP continues to grow, then let Osi walk.

But if Kiwi gets hurt again and his career is basically over, and if JPP takes a step back, then we might have to consider paying Osi to keep him around.

We need a 3 DE rotation. That's our moneymaker on defense.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-28-2011, 04:35 PM
I hope we can re-sign Bradshaw. Looks like Miami got Bush so that leaves Bradshaw for us. I am not a fan of our current RB corps.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2011, 05:07 PM
I agree. I think we should keep Osi for another year then trade him next year, pending the development of JPP and Kiwi's health.

If Kiwi can stay healthy and beast it up, and if JPP continues to grow, then let Osi walk.

But if Kiwi gets hurt again and his career is basically over, and if JPP takes a step back, then we might have to consider paying Osi to keep him around.

We need a 3 DE rotation. That's our moneymaker on defense.

Plus it would be fun to watch all 4 of them this year wreak havoc.

LTgiants
07-28-2011, 05:07 PM
From Garafolo:

Heads up, Matt Dodge. Giants negotiating with Brad Maynard #nyg

bigbluedefense
07-28-2011, 05:14 PM
Maynard has been the punter I wanted all along. He's a inside the 20 specialist.

His leg isn't huge, but neither was Feagles.

I hope we land him.

LTgiants
07-28-2011, 06:36 PM
The Giants have cut Madison Hedgecock

Damix
07-29-2011, 09:25 AM
Leonard reups with the Bengals.

scotty, where are you, do we need to put you on suicide watch?

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 10:24 AM
I feel bad for Hedgecock. A degenerative back condition is such a horrible thing to have. Especially for a guy that's been playing FB for however many so years.

You hope the guy can walk when he's 50.


What's everyone's thoughts on Pat Williams? He'd come cheap, give us depth at DT, and he could be a mentor to Linval. We hope Linval can become Pat Williams one day, what better way to teach him than to have him split snaps with Pat for this year and learn under him?

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 11:01 AM
I'm good with bringing in Pat. He could occupy two guys to leave our DE's really free.

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 11:04 AM
Bringing in Pat wouldn't hurt Joseph's growth either. Pat can't play many snaps anymore, he would be splitting time with Joseph. And what a great mentor to have, I think Joseph is still a bit raw, throwing him into the fire this year might not be the best idea. If he can split with Pat this year, learn under him, and then take the reigns next year, I think that's better for his development.

Damix
07-29-2011, 11:09 AM
I'm ok with Pat too, but our team just doesn't seem to like the 1 year end their career guys.

We could have had Henderson last year or Rodgers earlier this offseason.

Forenci
07-29-2011, 11:47 AM
Pat will be a solid grab. I think BBD is right in that he could be a good mentor for Linval. Plus he could still be a solid player if his snaps are limited.

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 11:54 AM
We brought Jacobs back. I'm glad we did. I'm probably Jacob's biggest fan.

I didn't want to see him go.

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 12:26 PM
He was going to be here no matter what but I'm glad he restructured without giving a lot of lip.

OSUGiants17
07-29-2011, 12:48 PM
Full List Of The UDFA's We Signed (http://www.giants.com/news-and-blogs/article-1/Giants-sign-10-Undrafted-Free-Agents/f3372a71-dcf6-4299-be3e-40c9a1b651f9)

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 12:48 PM
My only concern is that his contract is incentive laden, so if/when he doesn't get many touches during the year, he's going to pout.

Hopefully we'll win which won't allow him to pout as much. Winning tends to sweep those issues under the rug.

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 12:57 PM
We signed all of our draft picks but Prince.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 01:52 PM
profootballtalk says #giants in five-team mix for vonta leach

Jughead10
07-29-2011, 01:55 PM
profootballtalk says #giants in five-team mix for vonta leach

Damn. We love this guy. Were in on him 3-4 years ago.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 02:05 PM
Damn. We love this guy. Were in on him 3-4 years ago.

Ya he was a rfa then and the Texans matched the offer.

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 02:10 PM
I really wouldn't spend "big" money on a FB.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 02:13 PM
How much is "big" FB money?

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 02:32 PM
Garafolo is reporting we're not really interested.

He's usually money, he has the best sources. I wouldn't mind Leach though, he's a beast. But we don't really need him. Sign our guys back first, then worry about Leach.

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 02:51 PM
Anything over the minimum is big FB money.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-29-2011, 02:52 PM
We brought Jacobs back. I'm glad we did. I'm probably Jacob's biggest fan.

I didn't want to see him go.

I can't wait until we turn the page on that chapter. Probably the most overrated Giant on the team.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 03:19 PM
Our New Punter is Steve Weatherford

@TheTitansGrp We are excited to announce Titan Client @Weatherford9 is staying in NY and has signed with the New York Giants

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 03:21 PM
Punting competition!!

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 03:25 PM
Who the hell is that? Anyone know anything about the guy?

I liked Maynard.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 03:25 PM
Who the hell is that? Anyone know anything about the guy?

I liked Maynard.

He was the punter for the Jets last year.

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 03:27 PM
He was the punter for the Jets last year.

I'd be lying to you if I told you I paid attention to their punter last year. Is he any good?

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 03:27 PM
He seemed fine to me when I watched the Jets games.

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 03:28 PM
I don't remember him sucking. That must be a good thing I guess.

I don't think he did too hot in the playoffs if I remember correctly though.

Jughead10
07-29-2011, 03:29 PM
I'd be lying to you if I told you I paid attention to their punter last year. Is he any good?

Yeah. He was really good at Illinois too. At one point he had some streak going on last year. Although I can't remember what it was. It might have been a ridiculous amount of punts downed inside the 20? I just remember him being a huge weapon in the Pats game for the Jets.

Haha. Although I just saw you remembered differently. I was drinking a lot during that playoff game. Either way, big improvement over Dodge. But again that's not saying much.

Giantsfan1080
07-29-2011, 03:29 PM
He also had that play where he tried to run for a first down on like 4th & 30 and came up 1 yard short.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 03:42 PM
Overall Rating: Weatherford, +13.4 (5th overall); Dodge -3.8 (30th overall)
Avg. Yards Per Kick: Weatherford, 42.9, Dodge 44.7
Percent of Kicks Returned: Weatherford 32.1 Percent, Dodge 50 Percent
Net Yards Average: Weatherford 37.9, Dodge 34.8
Kicks Inside The 20: Weatherford 42, Dodge 23
Kicks Fair Caught: Weatherford 27, Dodge 7
Return Yards Allowed: Weatherford 299, Dodge 536

Jughead10
07-29-2011, 03:43 PM
I think his streak was consecutive punts without a touchback.

scottyboy
07-29-2011, 03:45 PM
Leonard reups with the Bengals.

scotty, where are you, do we need to put you on suicide watch?

I haz a sad :(
I would have LOOOOOOVED him here. Him and Jacobs, use the cash to bring in another really good OL and just POWER POWER POWER (and leonard leaps!)

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 04:14 PM
Sounds like Dodge is a goner by the way this guy's stats shaped up last year.

Good. Even if Dodge showed significant improvement during the PS this year, I still wouldn't trust him in a big moment in the playoffs.

A clean break is probably what's best for both parties.

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 05:55 PM
The Eagles just got Nmandi. Now they have Nmandi, Asante and DRC.

Nmandi neutralizes Nicks completely. Asante owns Eli and shuts down Smith coming off his knee injury. DRC is overrated but he can take on Mario/Barden/washed up Plax.

So who the hell is Eli gonna throw to? Kevin Boss? Yes, fantastic, I love 5 yard dump passes.

Kevin Boss will take 8 seconds to go 20 yards down the field.

I want Randy Moss. We need to fight fire with fire. We need Randy Moss to stretch the field.

Forenci
07-29-2011, 06:19 PM
I'm not overly concerned. Eagles getting Nnamdi sucks but Asante is super overrated. DRC is also overrated. Nnmandi will shut down whoever he faces, but I think we can still do things on offense. Getting a threat at tight end would certainly be nice. Their safeties are still fairly inexperienced, so I think there are some ways to take advantage of that.

It sucks, but there other corners don't really scare me. Even with Asante's past success vs Eli.

Getting Moss won't do anything. Nmandi would shut him down without even trying. He's way too physical for Moss.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 06:21 PM
Zach Miller time?

bigbluedefense
07-29-2011, 06:23 PM
Getting Moss would mean Nicks on Asante. And I like that matchup.

Smith on Asante? Yeah I got money on Asante. Especially since he owns Eli. Eli is good for 1 INT to Asante every game.

Now we're asking him to throw away from Nmandi and TO Asante. Wonderful.

Meanwhile Kevin Boss's slow ass is still running his 20 yard post.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-29-2011, 06:28 PM
I think they are trying to trade Asante though, making it only Aso and DRC.

Jughead10
07-29-2011, 07:18 PM
Osi didn't report....

Forenci
07-29-2011, 07:20 PM
Maybe he's always concealed it well or I haven't noticed until the past few years but...Osi is kind of a douche.

LTgiants
07-29-2011, 07:43 PM
Prince has finally been signed.

BaLLiN
07-29-2011, 07:46 PM
I think you guys should look at the game we played against oakland and watch Nicks beat Nnamdi twice. Nnamdi is good, but unless theyre running pure man to man, steve smith vs Nnamdi is gunna win everytime.

If we can get plax now we're ok, bc Plax versus any of them im pretty confident with, even if he isnt the same he still has height and can run good enough routes.

bigbluedefense
07-30-2011, 01:18 PM
Let's not try to sugarcoat this. Nmandi is Nmandi. This absolutely hurts our chances of beating them.

And with news that Plax is most likely not signing with the Giants (Jets, Steelers, and Eagles in the mix), I think going after Randy Moss makes even more sense.

I know I'm alone in my Randy Moss crush, but I think we need to fight fire with fire. At first it was just a luxury, but now with Nmandi on the Eagles, I think it's a necessity.

We need a 3 WR set that can match their 3 CB set. Right now we have 2 good WRs, and an inconsistent 3rd option.

Fielding Moss would give us a 3 WR set that can battle their CBs. Nicks, Smith and Moss can definitely take on their Nmandi, Asante, and DRC.

Fight fire with fire. I think Moss should be a priority right now. Especially with Smith's injury concerns.

At least there was some good news yesterday. Coughlin said he was very pleased with Beatty's weight coming into camp this year, saying he's worked very hard.

I haven't seen any pictures (if anyone has, please post), but it's encouraging to hear at least.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2011, 01:29 PM
Didn't Nicks do really well on Nnamdi last year during the Raiders game? It makes the Eagles much better but I'm not overly concerned. We have a deep WR corps and the Eagles Dline and LB's are still pretty weak overall.

Forenci
07-30-2011, 01:38 PM
Didn't Nicks do really well on Nnamdi last year during the Raiders game? It makes the Eagles much better but I'm not overly concerned. We have a deep WR corps and the Eagles Dline and LB's are still pretty weak overall.

He did. He actually kind of owned Nnmandi that game. I don't know if it was a fluke or Nicks just outmatched him (I find it hard to believe considering how good Nnmandi is).

Also BBD, I really don't want Randy Moss at all. I think our WR's our fine. We don't need him and the guy is the silent malcontent type. When things are going well and he's earning money he's happy, but when there are bumps in the road or he thinks he's not making enough money he'll be annoying as hell.

Eli really doesn't need that ****. He had to deal with it when Shockey and Plax were here (and even Tiki to some extent). I say let's just go to battle with the WR's we have. They're good and young, and Nicks has indeed had past success against Nnmandi, even with the limited sample size.

The Eagles still have quite a few holes on defense, especially in coverage with their safeties. I'm not saying we can beat them straight up, but I think we have a good chance at the very least.

bigbluedefense
07-30-2011, 02:31 PM
Guys, Eli avoided Nmandi that whole game. The only time Nicks caught passes in that game were when the Raiders were being morons and ran zone.

We all remember Nicks beating Nmandi deep once and catching it out of bounds. Whoopidy doo. He was out of bounds. That doesn't count.

It's not even about Nmandi vs Nicks. I'm thinking about our #3 WR vs their #3 CB.

Right now they have the matchup won. By adding a guy like Moss to our core, I think we take that matchup. Strength in numbers. Right now they're winning the numbers game.

We can neutralize it by adding a WR like Moss.

cvv84
07-30-2011, 02:40 PM
Osi is reporting to camp

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 03:11 PM
Guys, Eli avoided Nmandi that whole game. The only time Nicks caught passes in that game were when the Raiders were being morons and ran zone.

We all remember Nicks beating Nmandi deep once and catching it out of bounds. Whoopidy doo. He was out of bounds. That doesn't count.

It's not even about Nmandi vs Nicks. I'm thinking about our #3 WR vs their #3 CB.

Right now they have the matchup won. By adding a guy like Moss to our core, I think we take that matchup. Strength in numbers. Right now they're winning the numbers game.

We can neutralize it by adding a WR like Moss.

If we get plax vs any of them and have nicks against anyone thats not Nnamdi, we win.

http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Oakland+Raiders+v+New+York+Giants+NATnea0vrQul.jpg

i think thats nnamdi trying to tackle nicks, and the errant pass by eli was the only reason that nicks didnt beat nnamdi inbounds

LTgiants
07-30-2011, 03:30 PM
The Eagles continue to stack up now they got Cullen Jenkins

bigbluedefense
07-30-2011, 04:37 PM
If we get plax vs any of them and have nicks against anyone thats not Nnamdi, we win.

http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Oakland+Raiders+v+New+York+Giants+NATnea0vrQul.jpg

i think thats nnamdi trying to tackle nicks, and the errant pass by eli was the only reason that nicks didnt beat nnamdi inbounds

You're giving Burress too much credit. This is 34 year old I've been in jail for 2 years Burress.

Not 2007 I'll break your ankles with broken ankles Burress.

And it doesn't sound like we're getting Burress anyway. Eli made it pretty clear he wants no part of Burress when he basically dissed him on Friday. I think Burress lands in Philly or the Jets.

Come on, we're now going off a picture? Look at Nmandi's resume. It speaks for itself.


Meanwhile, the Eagles trade Bunk and land Jenkins. Jenkins was a great move if he can stay healthy, but I think letting go of Bunk was a mistake. Very underrated run stuffer.

Meanwhile, the Giants are eating a sandwich. Pick up the phone and get Moss Reese. Unless you want the Eagles to have more than just chunky soup in their trophy case.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2011, 04:49 PM
BBD Moss is not the answer. You need to let it go.

Jughead10
07-30-2011, 04:55 PM
The Eagles can be run on.

I also think the chances of Vick repeating last season are slim. It didn't even last a whole season. He broke down at the end last year. And thats after limited playing time the first 2 games.

Finally the teams that "win" the offseason, never win the regular season. I'm just ready for games already.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2011, 05:00 PM
The Eagles can be run on.

I also think the chances of Vick repeating last season are slim. It didn't even last a whole season. He broke down at the end last year. And thats after limited playing time the first 2 games.

I agree but Young can probably guide the ship for a few games if he has to. Also, we have no idea what kind of defense the Eagles will be playing considering they have a new D coordinator who has never even coached a defense in his life.

bigbluedefense
07-30-2011, 05:24 PM
The Titans ran a Cover 2 man defense with blitzes coming from the DBs occasionally.

It's not a terrible system, after studying it I kind of liked it, if only they blitzed more.


I think the Eagles are going to run a dumbed down version of that defense. Castillo is the DC, but it's obvious Washburn is running the show. All the moves they've made is centered around Washburn and the kind of defense he was apart of in Tennessee.

Their dline is going to completely sell out to rush the passer. It's almost like they don't believe in gap discipline. Just create havoc up front and let the LBs clean up the mess.

I just look at the Eagles, and they are a more talented team than us starter for starter. That's what scares me.

I think we're deeper than them, in fact, I know we're a deeper team, but they have more firepower with their starters.

I think they have a better coaching staff too, pound for pound.

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 06:05 PM
Plax not only has height on these guys, he also was very smooth and good at plucking the ball out of the air and YAC. I know the YAC prob wont be there as much, and maybe even the smoothness, but he has the body control, reach, and height to go up and get it over these DB's.

DRC got exposed last year bc he bites too often, same with Asante. Nnamdi isn't great in zone and can get burnt, especially with the safeties that the eagles have. We have a good run game, and use playaction extremely well. You see where I'm going here?

If we had plax...

Nicks - Nnamdi
Manningham/Steve Smith - Asante
Plax - DRC

thats what Im guessing would happen, and I know that Asante would get burnt, DRC would prob beat out Plax but Nicks could beat Nnamdi. Nicks is gunna do well against Nnamdi, you're giving him too much credit BBD.

I admitt I feel that Plax is gunna transition well, and that might be too hopeful, but I know his stupidity gave him a chip on his shoulder and hunger to get back out there for himself, his reputation, and for his family.

JBCX
07-30-2011, 07:59 PM
You should get your facts straight if you're going to talk about players, just so you know.

Asante Samuel was the best cover cornerback in the NFL last year and rarely was "burnt":

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2011/best-cornerback-charting-stats-2010

"With four more pass targets, Samuel would rank as the top cornerback in both Success Rate and yards per pass. (He will in Football Outsiders Almanac 2011, since our ratings in the book generally waive the minimum for cornerbacks who had at least eight starts.)"

Samuel was targeted 36 times and allowed an extremely low 3.2 yds/pass, and 1.9 yards after catch.

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 08:23 PM
You should get your facts straight if you're going to talk about players, just so you know.

Asante Samuel was the best cover cornerback in the NFL last year and rarely was "burnt":

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stat-analysis/2011/best-cornerback-charting-stats-2010

"With four more pass targets, Samuel would rank as the top cornerback in both Success Rate and yards per pass. (He will in Football Outsiders Almanac 2011, since our ratings in the book generally waive the minimum for cornerbacks who had at least eight starts.)"

Samuel was targeted 36 times and allowed an extremely low 3.2 yds/pass, and 1.9 yards after catch.

http://www.profootballfocus.com/

use this

JBCX
07-30-2011, 08:29 PM
http://www.profootballfocus.com/

use this

Why would I want to use a site that subjectively grades players when instead I can show you actual, you know, statistics that describe a player's performance?

Did you not read what footballoutsiders posted? 3.2 yards per pass. That means he allowed fewer yards per pass than ANY other CB in football. He simply did not give up completions of any note last year. He was excellent in coverage. If you watched any Eagles games, you'd agree.

I don't even understand, how as a Giants fan you could possibly say Asante gets "burnt" because every time the Giants play the Eagles, the only time Eli ever throws to Asante's side anymore the football is usually coming back in the opposite direction and the Eagles offense takes over, right?

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 08:41 PM
Why would I want to use a site that subjectively grades players when instead I can show you actual, you know, statistics that describe a player's performance?

Did you not read what footballoutsiders posted? 3.2 yards per pass. That means he allowed fewer yards per pass than ANY other CB in football. He simply did not give up completions of any note last year. He was excellent in coverage. If you watched any Eagles games, you'd agree.

I don't even understand, how as a Giants fan you could possibly say Asante gets "burnt" because every time the Giants play the Eagles, the only time Eli ever throws to Asante's side anymore the football is usually coming back in the opposite direction and the Eagles offense takes over, right?

Um...dude first off, calm down. Second off, use the right part where it shows you the completion percentage per a certain yardage, gives them grades vs run and pass, and then grades them by those statistics in a much more detailed manner than your site.

Do you understand that, you know, 3.2 yards per pass is not a specific enough stat to tell me that he wasnt burnt. If I watched Eagles games Id understand he was rarely in man to man, but played zone and had MUCH LESS RESPONSIBILITY than most corners do.

I don't even understand, how as an Eagles fan you could possibly come in and troll on a conversation where I say in a matchup, that Asante WOULD get burnt, instead of your false statement that i said he DID get burnt.

Now, lets play some tape. I clearly recall Nicks making Asante look like stupid in his rookie season, so I'll relook some more film to see if there was anything else. Or you know, you can keep trolling and putting words in my mouth.

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 08:57 PM
yeah, watched the last two years, didnt see samuel play man once, good thing you guys are moving to a more man-style defense with DRC and Nnamdi where samuel will be out of place.

The 3.2 is soo misleading bc asante plays zone with little to no responsibility, basically playing curl to flat, maybe a little deeper (7-12 yards)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yL1o0TxAkCk

NY+Giants=NYG
07-30-2011, 08:58 PM
I hate those stat sites. They make football into a damn math class. Just watch film and the concepts being run. See the Xs and Os of the game, and break that down.

JBCX
07-30-2011, 09:00 PM
I hate those stat sites. They make football into a damn math class. Just watch film and the concepts being run. See the Xs and Os of the game, and break that down.

If you actually watched any Eagles games from 2010 then you'd agree with me. The only CBs that were burnt last year were whichever scrub they had playing opposite Samuel on any given day.

scottyboy
07-30-2011, 09:03 PM
wait, people are still trying to justify asante is a good CB? my lord, when will it stop? the dude can't tackle and has average man skills. as a zone corner and ball skills, he's top notch...but outside of that, he's rather pedestrian

LTgiants
07-30-2011, 09:05 PM
The Giants have signed OG/OC Chris L. White

Take that Eagles!!! LOL

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 09:08 PM
I hate those stat sites. They make football into a damn math class. Just watch film and the concepts being run. See the Xs and Os of the game, and break that down.

Well i did both, I hope that makes him go away. Bottom line, the way Asante has been used by both the eagles and new england is more like a QB spy than anything else. His responsibility is considerably less than a traditional corner's but they do this because it pays off.

Now moving to a new defense, if he's in this role then let's get some longer routes going bc their safeties are clearly a weakpoint, but if he is not and is forced into even off man, he's probably going to get burnt based off of his forty time (4.49 which he clearly trained for bc he ran a 5.4 as a sophmore in hs which is freakin slow) and now he's 30. So there, we'll see what happens.

BaLLiN
07-30-2011, 09:11 PM
If you actually watched any Eagles games from 2010 then you'd agree with me. The only CBs that were burnt last year were whichever scrub they had playing opposite Samuel on any given day.

But I didnt say he got burnt, i said he will in a man on man matchup with Manningham or Smith. So your argument has nothing to do with what i said.

JBCX
07-30-2011, 09:36 PM
But I didnt say he got burnt, i said he will in a man on man matchup with Manningham or Smith. So your argument has nothing to do with what i said.

Asante can shut down any of the Giants receivers in his sleep.

I think all of major yardage and points scored in the last two Eagles-Giants games by the Giants were all on running plays, completions to the TE, or completions to the left side of the field against Dimitri Patterson (especially in the last one). I don't remember any of the Giants WRs having good days in either game except when they were burning Dimitri Patterson, who is obviously not an NFL-caliber player.

In the first game especially, Eli was absolutely terrible and threw more picks than TDs, due to no small part the fact that Asante basically makes Eli his personal b**** in every Eagles-Giants game.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-30-2011, 10:28 PM
Well i did both, I hope that makes him go away. Bottom line, the way Asante has been used by both the eagles and new england is more like a QB spy than anything else. His responsibility is considerably less than a traditional corner's but they do this because it pays off.

Now moving to a new defense, if he's in this role then let's get some longer routes going bc their safeties are clearly a weakpoint, but if he is not and is forced into even off man, he's probably going to get burnt based off of his forty time (4.49 which he clearly trained for bc he ran a 5.4 as a sophmore in hs which is freakin slow) and now he's 30. So there, we'll see what happens.

I am just talking in general, no one specific. I see those stat sites mentioned on various boards, and it comes one big stat throwing contest between posters. Very annoying to watch. Pretty much it goes:

I have a football point... Throw those numbers and stats, as if the person worked in an accounting field, and then the other guy tosses it back, and molds it for his argument.

Stats are good, but at the end of the day, my advice is just watch the game. The eye in the sky doesn't lie.

JBCX
07-30-2011, 10:31 PM
I am just talking in general, no one specific. I see those stat sites mentioned on various boards, and it comes one big stat throwing contest between posters. Very annoying to watch. Pretty much it goes:

I have a football point... Throw those numbers and stats, as if the person worked in an accounting field, and then the other guy tosses it back, and molds it for his argument.

Stats are good, but at the end of the day, my advice is just watch the game. The eye in the sky doesn't lie.

Numbers don't lie either.

If the numbers say that a CB held opposing passers to 3.2 yards per attempt... what that means is that you take the yardage total for all passes attempted in his vicinity, and then you divide that number by the number of attempts made. Easy, right? If *any* long completions were made, or even multiple long completions, it would skew the final figure and inflate it to reflect that. The fact that his total yards per attempt given up is as low as 3.2 means that Samuel simply did not give up many, if any at all, long completions. And the fact that 3.2 yards per attempt is the lowest of *ALL* cornerbacks in the NFL means that he was, basically, the best cover cornerback in the entire NFL last year.

Why is it so hard to respect stats in this game? Either he gave up a bunch of completions, and it would show in that figure, or he didn't. Period. You don't need to watch every game to understand that statistic and what it means.

Forenci
07-30-2011, 11:45 PM
Numbers don't lie either.

If the numbers say that a CB held opposing passers to 3.2 yards per attempt... what that means is that you take the yardage total for all passes attempted in his vicinity, and then you divide that number by the number of attempts made. Easy, right? If *any* long completions were made, or even multiple long completions, it would skew the final figure and inflate it to reflect that. The fact that his total yards per attempt given up is as low as 3.2 means that Samuel simply did not give up many, if any at all, long completions. And the fact that 3.2 yards per attempt is the lowest of *ALL* cornerbacks in the NFL means that he was, basically, the best cover cornerback in the entire NFL last year.

Why is it so hard to respect stats in this game? Either he gave up a bunch of completions, and it would show in that figure, or he didn't. Period. You don't need to watch every game to understand that statistic and what it means.

Before I even discuss anything, I just want to point out that you're on the Giants team forum section. If we want to be massive homers it's well within our rights as fans. Coming here to cry (and troll, btw) because you didn't like what a Giants fan on a Giants fan board said about an Eagles player makes you appear belligerent and, quite frankly, foolish. If we say something regarding an Eagles player that you think is horse **** on the general forums, NFL forums, or anywhere else - feel free to share your opinion on how we are incorrect. Trying to do so in the comfort of our team forum is asinine, though.

In addition, I'd just like to point out the lunacy of trying to use pure statistics in the game of football. I'm the first person to support advanced statistics in other sports where they are applicable, such as baseball. I'm a huge fan of sabermetrics, and other forms of stats for baseball, but trying to judge the value of a corner back when schemes, style of defense, man coverage vs. zone coverage, as well as any number of variables, is laughable. I think we can all agree some statistics are invaluable in football, but the idea that the effectiveness of a corner can be judged purely by statisitics is silly.

Not to mention it's hilarious how you keep telling us to "OMG DOOD WATCH ALL THE GAMEZZZZ" and then have the urge to tell us about two games a year where Eli has been zomgpwnnneeeed by Samuels. Samuels is a ****** corner. Isn't that counter-intuitive to your argument? Tell us to watch all the games, and then focus primarily a small sample size of games?

But yeah, my transcending point is don't come onto a team specific forum and act like a tool. We don't mind Eagles, Cowboys or any other teams fans speaking here (you're certainly not prohibited from doing it by any means) but don't antagonize Giants fans with your Eagle homerism bull ****. You have your own forum to do that, and one that we typically don't jump onto in order to dispute any claims you may make about our players.

Anyways, I SAY GOOD DAY SIR!

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 09:07 AM
stats can be skewed, absolutely. Is YPC true of a runners ability, or a ****** OL? You can twist and turn most stats to your argument. Stats can also be quite telling as well, but they aren't the end all to every argument.
plus, if a player is "good" or not, can be quite subjective, and I've seen enough Asante Samuel over the past 4-5 years to safely say, as an all around corner, I find him to be quite pedestrian. He excels in zone coverage, baiting QB's and has superb ball skills, but his "tackling" is absolutely atrocious and his man skills are below average

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 09:21 AM
Plax is a Jet. I pretty much knew he wasn't coming here, especially after Eli pretty much dissed him.

Guess what that opens the door for guys? :)

Come onnnn, don't you wanna say "He got Moss'd."

Doesn't that roll off your tongue perfectly?


Well, anyway, looks like we're gonna have to hope Mario/Barden can consistently beat DRC. Mario runs the wrong route half the time and Barden is always hurt. Awesome.

Cruz did well in practice yesterday. I think we got something there fellas. If he tears it up this preseason, why not throw him in as our 3rd WR?

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 09:25 AM
I wasn't really aboard the Plax bandwagon to begin with. I think we've really got something with Jernigan. I'm a big fan of his. I think he could be a real explosive playmaker for us. I know he's just a rookie, but I'm excited about him.

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 09:31 AM
I didn't quite understand the Jerrigan pick, when Victor Cruz showed us so much as a potential slot WR last year plus we have Barden in the wings.

I figured Jerrigan to be a punt returner for the immediate future.

I don't think Hixon makes the team. I don't see how he does. Jerrigan will take over his kick/punt return duties, and we have Nicks, Smith, Mario, Barden, Jerrigan, Cruz, all most likely making the team. That's 6 right there.

I think Devin Thomas will make the 7th spot as a special teams ace.

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 09:35 AM
I didn't quite understand the Jerrigan pick, when Victor Cruz showed us so much as a potential slot WR last year plus we have Barden in the wings.

I figured Jerrigan to be a punt returner for the immediate future.

I don't think Hixon makes the team. I don't see how he does. Jerrigan will take over his kick/punt return duties, and we have Nicks, Smith, Mario, Barden, Jerrigan, Cruz, all most likely making the team. That's 6 right there.

I think Devin Thomas will make the 7th spot as a special teams ace.

well I have a feeling Mario may very well be gone after this year. Some team is going to throw big money at him and he's gonna bolt. Jernigan is the speedster that could replace him. And Cruz is nice and all, but I am really loving Jernigans playmaking ability and explosiveness. He's more explosive than Cruz. And I think we're going to have a very good punt returner for the first time...**** probably since Ron Dixon. (excluding Hixon). And I think we're realizing Barden just...isn't that good. He's a red zone threat and really poor, poor mans Plaxico.

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 10:07 AM
Barden needs to stay healthy. If he's hurt this season too, then maybe it's time to move on.

His biggest issue has been health. I can't remember the last time he was healthy.

Malaka
07-31-2011, 10:20 AM
Well this is Barden's third year, and that's usually make or break time for NFL receivers. I guess it's all up to what he shows us this year.

He wasn't bad when he played just got injured, but he can't have that happen to him again.

I loved this guy coming out, and was really happy we drafted him, but right now he's starting to get frustrating. I hope the best for him, and I pray he can develop into a mini-Plax.

Jughead10
07-31-2011, 10:38 AM
Relax guys that Foreskins fan said they signed a 10 plus sack guy in Barry Cofield. End of discussion.

Jughead10
07-31-2011, 10:39 AM
Barden needs to stay healthy. If he's hurt this season too, then maybe it's time to move on.

His biggest issue has been health. I can't remember the last time he was healthy.

I think I read he's already starting the season on PUP. So he won't count against the roster for a little bit. Don't know how long he is expected to miss though.

Rosebud
07-31-2011, 10:41 AM
Why would I want to use a site that subjectively grades players when instead I can show you actual, you know, statistics that describe a player's performance?

Did you not read what footballoutsiders posted? 3.2 yards per pass. That means he allowed fewer yards per pass than ANY other CB in football. He simply did not give up completions of any note last year. He was excellent in coverage. If you watched any Eagles games, you'd agree.

I don't even understand, how as a Giants fan you could possibly say Asante gets "burnt" because every time the Giants play the Eagles, the only time Eli ever throws to Asante's side anymore the football is usually coming back in the opposite direction and the Eagles offense takes over, right?

One year doesn't negate a career. Asante had a hugely productive year, but just because you didn't get burned biting on things doesn't mean you weren't making mistakes and Asante was just being Asante and it worked great last year, the years before, not so much. So if Eli's not throwing to confused receivers who don't know where they'll be I'm not as concerned about Asante as I am Aso. Nicks - Aso, Smith - Samuel and Mario/Barden - DRC is a match up I'm not too opposed to. Smith won't be stupid like many past giants receivers Asante has had to "cover", Nicks can get some work done against Aso and Mario/Barden can burn DRC if he's being over aggressive. I like the way we match up even with Asante coming off of one of the best years of his career.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-31-2011, 10:42 AM
Numbers don't lie either.

If the numbers say that a CB held opposing passers to 3.2 yards per attempt... what that means is that you take the yardage total for all passes attempted in his vicinity, and then you divide that number by the number of attempts made. Easy, right? If *any* long completions were made, or even multiple long completions, it would skew the final figure and inflate it to reflect that. The fact that his total yards per attempt given up is as low as 3.2 means that Samuel simply did not give up many, if any at all, long completions. And the fact that 3.2 yards per attempt is the lowest of *ALL* cornerbacks in the NFL means that he was, basically, the best cover cornerback in the entire NFL last year.

Why is it so hard to respect stats in this game? Either he gave up a bunch of completions, and it would show in that figure, or he didn't. Period. You don't need to watch every game to understand that statistic and what it means.




No. They don't lie, but they can be molded to fit any argument. Soon, people just focus on that. Like I said no one specific, I am just talking in general here. But you get guys who post who just use those damn sites as their mode of making cases. Just stats and stats alone. I am saying that I find annoying.

And if you are lucky enough, you may find 2 fans who use stats debating. I am telling you now that's stupid to watch. You need a forensic accountant to weed through the numbers.

Again, I didn't read what you two are talking about. I just saw those damn links, and it reminded me of a pet peeve about stats.

Malaka
07-31-2011, 11:01 AM
One year doesn't negate a career. Asante had a hugely productive year, but just because you didn't get burned biting on things doesn't mean you weren't making mistakes and Asante was just being Asante and it worked great last year, the years before, not so much. So if Eli's not throwing to confused receivers who don't know where they'll be I'm not as concerned about Asante as I am Aso. Nicks - Aso, Smith - Samuel and Mario/Barden - DRC is a match up I'm not too opposed to. Smith won't be stupid like many past giants receivers Asante has had to "cover", Nicks can get some work done against Aso and Mario/Barden can burn DRC if he's being over aggressive. I like the way we match up even with Asante coming off of one of the best years of his career.

And remember on the Raiders Aso did not shadow the #1 receiver he strictly played one side, we'll see if the Eagles continue to do this or not. If they continue to keep Aso on one side we can easily mix and match receivers along the field, and we have enough solid ones to keep the Eagles off-balance. If the Eagles decide to make Aso shadow most of the time we'll see if he is just as effective he was in Oakland.

One way or another, Aso will have the ball thrown at him much more this year, and though I expect him to perform very well, I don't think we see the dominance he displayed in Oakland.

But I am still a bit paranoid by him; Zach Miller would be the perfect kryptonite to that secondary. ;)

OSUGiants17
07-31-2011, 11:29 AM
I don't get why we went after Plax in the first place, I love the guy, but he's old and hasn't played in 2 years, we already have Nicks, Mario, Jernigan, Barden, Cruz, Hixon, Calhoun, Thomas and we wanna bring back Smith...were does he fit in all that?

Right now I think we just have too much of the same type of receiver and the pick or Jernigan only adds to the log jam. Smith, Mario, Cruz, Jernigan, Hixon, Calhoun. Do we really need all of them? Our WRs should look like this: Nicks, Smith, Mario, Barden, Cruz, Thomas(ST). That Jernigan pick is really starting to annoy me. I'm all for drafting value, but maybe we should make sure they will be able to see the field before we take them. I don't care if Cam Newton fell to us, you don't take him because you have Eli Manning. At least if your gonna take a WR, don't take a clone of what we already have.

If the FO was serious about going after Plax and feels we need another WR, why not go after Braylon Edwards? We went after him twice so far in his career and he wants to stay in NY. Braylon opposite of Nicks with Smith in the slot sounds damn fine to me, until I think of the others. Were does that leave Mario, Cruz, Barden, Jernigan and the others? I don't feel like our only reliable WR is Nicks, but adding another receiver only adds to the mess we have there right now.

/rant

Malaka
07-31-2011, 11:43 AM
Well I can't hate too much on the Jernigan pick. Hixon will probably be cut as a result, and bye-bye to Reynaud's 5 yard returns. I think Jernigan's value as a returner is what made Reese select him.

I feel right now our WRs will end up like this:

Hakeem, Manningham, Smith, Barden, Cruz, Jernigan, and Thomas (ST)

7 guys is a lot but that's what we are looking at this year. Hagan will have a chance its between him and Thomas in my opinion. Plaxico would have made this even worse, I am sort of glad we didn't sign him. Don't forget this position was absolutely decimated by injuries last year, and it seems like both Barden and Steve Smith aren't 100% so technically we will have 5 guys ready to go.

Giantsfan1080
07-31-2011, 12:02 PM
Jernigan was a very good pick. He automatically becomes our best return man and adds to an already deep WR corps.

OSUGiants17
07-31-2011, 12:15 PM
With the Titans signing Ruud to a one year deal, were does that leave Stephen Tulloch? Poz and Ruud are gone now. Manny and Tulloch are both still available and don't appear to be going back to their teams

LTgiants
07-31-2011, 12:16 PM
With the Titans signing Ruud to a one year deal, were does that leave Stephen Tulloch? Poz and Ruud are gone now. Manny and Tulloch are both still available and don't appear to be going back to their teams

Tulloch is a Detroit Lion.

Lofa Tatupu might be getting released though.

OSUGiants17
07-31-2011, 12:17 PM
Tulloch is a Detroit Lion.

Lofa Tatupu might be getting released though.

When did that happen? I have been looking to see if he was signed and found nothing. What about Lawson and McIntosh?

LTgiants
07-31-2011, 12:19 PM
When did that happen? I have been looking to see if he was signed and found nothing. What about Lawson and McIntosh?

He signed there today.

http://www.detnews.com/article/20110731/SPORTS0101/107310321/1361/Lions-sign-middle-linebacker-Stephen-Tulloch

Lawson and Mcintosh are still out there have not heard anything.

OSUGiants17
07-31-2011, 12:22 PM
Wow 1 year 3.25mil? I would have gladly paid that for Tulloch. Oh well it's whatever. I think bringing in Lawson, McIntosh or Leber(just a one year deal to see if he still has it) would be a smart move

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 12:26 PM
titans fans have been saying Tulloch blows, so I'm ok with Boley-Goff...and well idk who the hell we're gonna throw in that other slot.
but yea, I'm telling you now guys, Jernigan is gonna be a fan favorite soon. I really, really like what I've seen and read about this kid.

Giantsfan1080
07-31-2011, 12:28 PM
We need to sign Smith back already. I have 100% trust in Reese but it does seem like we're sleepwalking a little through this week.

OSUGiants17
07-31-2011, 12:29 PM
Any new news on Bradshaw, Boss or Smith? And is Kiwi officially signed?

Giantsfan1080
07-31-2011, 12:29 PM
Any new news on Bradshaw, Boss or Smith? And is Kiwi officially signed?

Kiwi is official. The other 3 I really haven't heard much.

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 12:30 PM
pretty sure Kiwi is official, just havent seen any numbers on it. and i've yet to hear anything on the afore mentioned 3. Apparently Reese sent them offers and it's in their court

LTgiants
07-31-2011, 12:32 PM
RT @ClaytonESPN: Osi would still like to go to Seattle in a trade

Osi for Aaron Curry?

Rosebud
07-31-2011, 12:34 PM
I don't get why we went after Plax in the first place, I love the guy, but he's old and hasn't played in 2 years, we already have Nicks, Mario, Jernigan, Barden, Cruz, Hixon, Calhoun, Thomas and we wanna bring back Smith...were does he fit in all that?

Right now I think we just have too much of the same type of receiver and the pick or Jernigan only adds to the log jam. Smith, Mario, Cruz, Jernigan, Hixon, Calhoun. Do we really need all of them? Our WRs should look like this: Nicks, Smith, Mario, Barden, Cruz, Thomas(ST). That Jernigan pick is really starting to annoy me. I'm all for drafting value, but maybe we should make sure they will be able to see the field before we take them. I don't care if Cam Newton fell to us, you don't take him because you have Eli Manning. At least if your gonna take a WR, don't take a clone of what we already have.

If the FO was serious about going after Plax and feels we need another WR, why not go after Braylon Edwards? We went after him twice so far in his career and he wants to stay in NY. Braylon opposite of Nicks with Smith in the slot sounds damn fine to me, until I think of the others. Were does that leave Mario, Cruz, Barden, Jernigan and the others? I don't feel like our only reliable WR is Nicks, but adding another receiver only adds to the mess we have there right now.

/rant

It's cause the giants are such a stand up organization. No one knew whether he would land with a team that actually needed a WR so we gave him an out, come play with us for a year, show people you're still plax and maybe give the youngins some tricks and confidence. Personally I'm kinda glad we didn't sign him. I do love our young receivers, we have a strong starting trio, Barden who flashed his talent and should be knocking on the door step, Curz who's shown flashes and Jernigan's explosiveness. That's depth that can challenge the Packers for deepest WR corps in a year.

Malaka
07-31-2011, 12:34 PM
RT @ClaytonESPN: Osi would still like to go to Seattle in a trade

Osi for Aaron Curry?

And a 2nd =D

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 12:34 PM
RT @ClaytonESPN: Osi would still like to go to Seattle in a trade

Osi for Aaron Curry?

just saw that. Actually i think i'd be fine osi for curry. I just dont know what to think of this whole osi situation, ugh

Rosebud
07-31-2011, 12:36 PM
RT @ClaytonESPN: Osi would still like to go to Seattle in a trade

Osi for Aaron Curry?

*shrug* Curry's just so mediocre, I might honestly prefer a 3rd.

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 12:39 PM
*shrug* Curry's just so mediocre, I might honestly prefer a 3rd.

at this point you'd have to take a risk. Curry's got the talent and perhaps the risk that he'll turn it around in a change of scenery. That and our glaring lack of talented linebackers...

BaLLiN
07-31-2011, 12:42 PM
Didn't Curry do poorly for Seattle? Im not so sure if Id do it but if Curry is as good as some of you think then Id still like him to be restructured if we dealt osi for him

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 12:43 PM
I don't want Curry. He sucks.

Lofa on the other hand, I think we should give him a look. I've been against FA LBs all offseason bc they were all so mediocre, but I had no idea Lofa would be on the market.

He can stuff the run, and has the athleticism to play the pass, I like Lofa. Very solid MIKE. I would love for us to take a look at him.

I have no idea what's going on with Osi. But if we are trading him to Seattle, I hope we get a 1st out of him.

Why not right? This is a franchise who gave away a 3rd for Clipboard Jesus, almost gave away a 1st for Kolb, and is starting TJax at qb.

They gotta be dumb enough to give us a 1st for Osi. Hell, I want a 1st and 3rd. Come on Seattle, pull the trigger.

I want Osi to stay, but if we get a 1st and 3rd out of him, I'd move him.

Then cross my fingers that Kiwi can stay healthy and JPP develops.

JBCX
07-31-2011, 02:33 PM
Question: What are the Giants going to do about the OL this year?

If I'm not mistaken half of the OL from last year was cut, and the other half is older and declining (Deihl/McKenzie)?

Are there a bunch of promising rookies waiting in the wings that I'm not aware of? Mitch Petrus?

Are they planning to bring back Andrews/O'Hara/Seubert on less expensive deals? Or are they maybe going to sign any OL in free agency or trade for one?

LTgiants
07-31-2011, 02:36 PM
Question: What are the Giants going to do about the OL this year?

If I'm not mistaken half of the OL from last year was cut, and the other half is older and declining (Deihl/McKenzie)?

Are there a bunch of promising rookies waiting in the wings that I'm not aware of? Mitch Petrus?

Are they planning to bring back Andrews/O'Hara/Seubert on less expensive deals? Or are they maybe going to sign any OL in free agency or trade for one?

Beatty is going to get a shot to be the starting LT. Diehl is going back to guard and Baas the Center they signed from the 49ers is the new starting center.

We have Petrus and we drafted James Brewer. Those are our young guys in the wings.

Seubert might get brought back but I don't think the other two will.

JBCX
07-31-2011, 02:43 PM
Beatty is going to get a shot to be the starting LT. Diehl is going back to guard and Baas the Center they signed from the 49ers is the new starting center.

We have Petrus and we drafted James Brewer. Those are our young guys in the wings.

Seubert might get brought back but I don't think the other two will.

Oh yeah, I forgot about the Baas signing.

Now that you lay it out that way, it really doesn't look nearly as bad on paper. It all depends on how well Beatty plays at LT, I guess.

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 02:45 PM
Koets is solid too. And Snee has been taking practice snaps at Center.

Our interior oline is fine. I'm a little concerned about our OT positions.

If Beatty pans out, I think our best lineup would be:

LT: Beatty
LG: Petrus
C: Baas
RG: Snee
RT: Diehl

Beatty could make or break our oline. If he pans out we could have a very good oline, if not, we could have a mediocre one.

scottyboy
07-31-2011, 02:46 PM
that's more for the future though BBD, McKenzie has been absolutely stellar. Best RT in football last year IMO

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 02:54 PM
I just think father time catches up to McKenzie this year. I love his run blocking, but the guy is an average pass protector and isn't getting any younger.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-31-2011, 02:56 PM
Well maybe our project pick next year will pan out, lol. Never fear friend! We will always go developmental pick.

LTgiants
07-31-2011, 03:11 PM
David Carr apparently might be coming back.

bigbluedefense
07-31-2011, 04:20 PM
I don't mind it. Once he got cut, I had a feeling we'd take a look at him. It was a mutually beneficial relationship. He was growing under our system, and we got a great scout team qb during practice.

Make him and Sage compete for the backup spot. Best man wins.

We're also looking at Ben Patrick. Could be legit interest, could also be a ploy to gain leverage on Boss in negotiations.

I am a little disturbed by the fact that Boss, Smith, Bradshaw, nor Prince has signed yet.

I guess all 4 of them are using the Aug. 5th leverage to their advantage with contract negotiations. Even if they sign now, they can't practice till the 5th so I guess they're all trying to buy as much time as they can to drive up their price.

LTgiants
07-31-2011, 05:29 PM
ClaytonESPN John Clayton
During the conversation between the Giants and Osi U, the team told him if they would shop him they would ask for a No. 1 pick

and

Jason Snelling possibly to the Giants

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/07/31/source-jason-snelling-to-giants-a-definite-possibility/

BaLLiN
07-31-2011, 10:21 PM
Well i could see the ravens possibly giving us a #1, but Seattle? They most likely wont make the playoffs.

If they do offer a first round pick, I take it and run. Thats easily a top 15 pick w/ them playing two strong divisions (AFC North and NFC EAST) and ATL and CHI.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 11:21 AM
The Giants told Osi's agent he can seek a trade. I really think it's a big mistake to let him go even though he's acting like a baby. The strength of our team is the D-Line and with Osi out and 1 injury to Tuck, Kiwi, or JPP we completely lose that.

BigBlueNorwegian
08-01-2011, 11:24 AM
If the Seahawks offer up a first, we need to take it without hesitation. They are probably going to be among the bottom five teams this season. But hopefully, we find a way to solve the situation and keep Osi without having to break the bank. He needs to understand that the Giants have a tough cap situation and still have important free agents to resign.

And we need to resign Smith, Boss and Bradshaw. We can't downgrade our skill positions on offense while the Eagles keep stacking up on defense.

EDIT: Damn, saw the news right after i posted. Well this means JPP better live up to his potential this season, or we're screwed. I don't think we can count on Kiwi with that type of injury(hope i'm wrong here)

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 11:42 AM
Fewell admitted to protecting Phillips last year after his knee injury and this year will be able to let him loose again. Sounds like he's a lot better a full year removed.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 11:54 AM
If we get rid of Osi we're going to need a new DE. Are there any good ones available still?

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 12:01 PM
If we get rid of Osi we're going to need a new DE. Are there any good ones available still?

I don't think we absolutely need another one. Especially if we scrap the Sintim LB project and just let him rush the passer as a 3rd down guy. There are a lot of other DEs on this roster I know nothing about. Maybe one of them shows enough to make the team and be a project.

BigBlueNorwegian
08-01-2011, 12:01 PM
Well, Andre Carter is still out there i Think. He's old, and failed in the 3-4 in washington last year. But I think he can still be a good situational player in a 4-3 defense.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 12:02 PM
I don't think we absolutely need another one. Especially if we scrap the Sintim LB project and just let him rush the passer as a 3rd down guy.

We have Kiwi and Tuck who are both hurt most of the time. If one of them goes down then the strength of our team goes to crap in a hurry.

Forenci
08-01-2011, 12:07 PM
Fewell admitted to protecting Phillips last year after his knee injury and this year will be able to let him loose again. Sounds like he's a lot better a full year removed.

A fully healthy Kenny Phillips (that is unleashed) would literally make me cry tears of joy.

KENNY!

Damix
08-01-2011, 12:20 PM
Makes me wish I got a KP jersey instead of JPP last year. Especially since the JPP got screwed up ha

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 12:37 PM
Phillips should beast again this year. Our secondary is very underrated especially when Prince or Ross is going to be our dime guy.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 12:38 PM
Randy Moss retired also so BBD can put that one to rest.

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 12:40 PM
I saw a report that said Bruce Johnson has impressed so far in camp. Although only a few practices. But it would be nice if he could bounce back a bit after a slower sophomore season. Especially if he's our fifth CB. Assuming we even have room on the roster for one.

BigBlueNorwegian
08-01-2011, 12:42 PM
BREAKING: RB Ahmad Bradshaw has agreed to terms with the Giants. #nyg

From Mike Garafolo's twitter account! Great to have him back. No word on contract terms yet.

OSUGiants17
08-01-2011, 12:45 PM
I would hate to see Osi go, but if he does here's how I would love for things to play out.

- Trade Osi to Seattle for a 1st
- Move Sintim to DE
- Sign Lawson or McIntosh to play opposite of Boley
- Re-Sign Bradshaw, Boss and Smith

2012:
- Draft Burfict, Kuechly, Te'o, or a franchise Lineman with Seattle's top 15 pick
- Draft Richardson with our pick in the 20-32 range
- Trade/Cut Jacobs

Malaka
08-01-2011, 12:45 PM
I saw a report that said Bruce Johnson has impressed so far in camp. Although only a few practices. But it would be nice if he could bounce back a bit after a slower sophomore season. Especially if he's our fifth CB. Assuming we even have room on the roster for one.

We definitely should Ross is probably gone next year, and so if Bruce impresses he can fill in for Ross as the dime guy.

Next years battle at corner will be really interesting. Prince v. Webster v. Thomas.

EDIT: Yeah, I agree, if we trade Osi I think we should definitely think about picking up a guy like Lawson and putting him at SLB.

BigBlueNorwegian
08-01-2011, 12:47 PM
I would hate to see Osi go, but if he does here's how I would love for things to play out.

- Trade Osi to Seattle for a 1st
- Move Sintim to DE
- Sign Lawson or McIntosh to play opposite of Boley
- Re-Sign Bradshaw, Boss and Smith

2012:
- Draft Burfict, Kuechly, Te'o, or a franchise Lineman with Seattle's top 15 pick
- Draft Richardson with our pick in the 20-32 range
- Trade/Cut Jacobs

That sounds awesome!!

OSUGiants17
08-01-2011, 12:47 PM
BREAKING: RB Ahmad Bradshaw has agreed to terms with the Giants. #nyg

From Mike Garafolo's twitter account! Great to have him back. No word on contract terms yet.

Thank God! Now I can finally buy my Bradshaw jersey. I was woried about it for the past year and a half that I would yet again buy a jersey only to have the player to switch teams(i.e Roy Williams Lions, Reggie Bush Saints, Chad Ochocinco Bengals, Plax Giants, Alfonso Soriano Yankees, my list goes on lol)

Forenci
08-01-2011, 12:47 PM
Woo! Bradshaw! Any details on the financials of it? Now we need to get Steve Smith locked up ASAP.

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 12:49 PM
Thank God! Now I can finally buy my Bradshaw jersey. I was woried about it for the past year and a half that I would yet again buy a jersey only to have the player to switch teams(i.e Roy Williams Lions, Reggie Bush Saints, Chad Ochocinco Bengals, Plax Giants, Alfonso Soriano Yankees, my list goes on lol)

Haha. I bought a Bradshaw jersey the day after we won the Super Bowl. Now I don't have to stop wearing it.

OSUGiants17
08-01-2011, 12:51 PM
Yea while debating over Bradshaw I got Nicks, Smith and Tuck so its whatever lol

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 12:52 PM
Smith next and I'll be happy. We should have made a bigger play for Zach Miller.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 12:53 PM
I am happy for Bradshaw but feel a little bad for Snelling to come in for a visit to a team only for that team to then go and sign another RB.

OSUGiants17
08-01-2011, 12:55 PM
Honestly Snelling talks were probably never serious and were just to make Bradshaw nervous and cave in and agree to our deal

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 01:04 PM
Honestly Snelling talks were probably never serious and were just to make Bradshaw nervous and cave in and agree to our deal

Ya hence why I feel bad for him. He is looking for a job with a team and that team and goes and use it as opportunity to sign someone else.

As a fan of the Giants I am happy that Bradshaw is back though.

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 02:18 PM
Sounds like both sides are digging in on the Osi situation. Sounds like Osi won't be playing for us this year one way or the other.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 02:20 PM
Sounds like both sides are digging in on the Osi situation. Sounds like Osi won't be playing for us this year one way or the other.

It's going to be a mistake on the field even if we get a relatively high draft pick from it. This hurts us now big time.

Rosebud
08-01-2011, 02:20 PM
Sounds like both sides are digging in on the Osi situation. Sounds like Osi won't be playing for us this year one way or the other.

Come on Seattle.

Malaka
08-01-2011, 03:05 PM
If we get a first I am perfectly fine with Osi leaving.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 03:29 PM
Giants deal w/ RB Ahmad Bradshaw is 4 four years, $18 million, $9 million of which is guaranteed.

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 03:33 PM
Giants deal w/ RB Ahmad Bradshaw is 4 four years, $18 million, $9 million of which is guaranteed.

Oh my god. That makes the DWill deal look even more terrible.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 03:42 PM
Giants deal w/ RB Ahmad Bradshaw is 4 four years, $18 million, $9 million of which is guaranteed.

we better pay him better next year, thats an awful deal for AB

Edit:

Baas got 5 yrs 26 mil... they should switch contracts

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 03:52 PM
Great job by Reese on that contract. I guess interest around the league for Bradshaw was very low which is kind of suprising.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 03:52 PM
Unless you are afraid Bradshaw is going to try and pull an Osi. I don't see what the big deal is right now. Just enjoy the fact that he is signed and under contract.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 03:58 PM
Giants got a new TE

Ben Patrick has agreed to a 1-yr deal with the Giants

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 04:04 PM
Giants got a new TE

Ben Patrick has agreed to a 1-yr deal with the Giants

I wonder what this mean for Boss.

Malaka
08-01-2011, 04:08 PM
I wonder what this mean for Boss.

Well both are average blockers, but I think Patrick has the potential to be a better receiver. I think he's a year younger, but injuries have slowed him down his entire career. It's kind of risky to assume he'll stay healthy for us, but I actually think Boss is headed downhill. After those concussions he's just not as sure-handed as he once was.

I think Boss is gone.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 04:09 PM
Unless you are afraid Bradshaw is going to try and pull an Osi. I don't see what the big deal is right now. Just enjoy the fact that he is signed and under contract.

I just think he deserved at least 4 yrs 20 mil with a little more guaranteed. Afterall he was pretty much our featureback last season and was heavily used the season previous yet had a very small contract.

Giants got a new TE

Ben Patrick has agreed to a 1-yr deal with the Giants

I dont get it, Patrick isnt the receiver Boss is really. Boss and Eli have chemistry and Boss also probably isnt being given alot of attention from other teams, so why arent we bringing him in?

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 04:10 PM
I think Boss and Patrick are going to be your 1 and 2 at TE and Beckum is going to be gone. Unless Hynoski really shows he is the starting FB then maybe Pascoe will be gone.

Malaka
08-01-2011, 04:11 PM
I am sure I am not the only who saw Boss getting beat up all year when he caught the ball. If you noticed, he also became a much more hesitant receiver. I think the front office realizes this, and doesn't think much of Boss anymore.

EDIT: That's just what I am feeling at the moment, because I can't explain why else Boss has yet to be signed. I could have this all wrong though.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 04:17 PM
Yeah I think this probably means Boss is a goner.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 04:17 PM
I am sure I am not the only who saw Boss getting beat up all year when he caught the ball. If you noticed, he also became a much more hesitant receiver. I think the front office realizes this, and doesn't think much of Boss anymore.

EDIT: That's just what I am feeling at the moment, because I can't explain why else Boss has yet to be signed. I could have this all wrong though.

I agree with you, Boss takes the worst hits on a consistent basis out of any player i've seen. I still want him, he has heart and makes big plays. Beckum hasn't done diddly so i think Patrick vs Beckum is indeed whats happening.

Pascoe is our blocking TE if not FB, we can't afford to get rid of him.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 04:19 PM
I agree with you, Boss takes the worst hits on a consistent basis out of any player i've seen. I still want him, he has heart and makes big plays. Beckum hasn't done diddly so i think Patrick vs Beckum is indeed whats happening.

Pascoe is our blocking TE if not FB, we can't afford to get rid of him.

If Hynoski shows he is ready to be the FB and the Giants dont want to cut Beckum. I think Patrick is a good enough blocker to make up for losing Pascoe.

I think Patrick signing is more of a worry of Beckum getting cut then Boss not coming back.

D-Unit
08-01-2011, 04:22 PM
Smith next and I'll be happy. We should have made a bigger play for Zach Miller.
I would've hated that.

So what's your FA haul like so far? Dallas' one is sickening.

Jughead10
08-01-2011, 04:24 PM
Apparently Boss wants to come back but his agent is holding out for more money. There doesn't seem to be much of a market out there for him. Reese has been playing hardball this entire week. I think Boss ends up coming back and on our terms.

Everyone seems they want to stay and are willing to make sacrifices to do so. Makes me hate Osi right now so much more.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 04:27 PM
I would've hated that.

So what's your FA haul like so far? Dallas' one is sickening.

Baas
Bradshaw( Resign)
Kiwi (Resign)
Steve Weatherford
Ben Patrick
David Carr
Chris White
Herman Johnson
Christian Hopkins
Brant Clouser

Edit: Thanks to Ballin plus these Undrafted Free Agents.

Jarriel King (OT, South Carolina)
Henry Hynoski (FB, Pitt)
Martin Parker (DL, Richmond)
Spencer Paysinger (LB, Oregon)
David Sims (S, Iowa State)
Mark Herzlich (LB, Boston College)
Harry Flaherty (TE/LS, Princeton)
Justin Trattou (DE, Florida)
Craig Marshall (DE, South Florida)
Jerrard Tarrant (S, Georgia Tech)

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 04:30 PM
Apparently Boss wants to come back but his agent is holding out for more money. There doesn't seem to be much of a market out there for him. Reese has been playing hardball this entire week. I think Boss ends up coming back and on our terms.

Everyone seems they want to stay and are willing to make sacrifices to do so. Makes me hate Osi right now so much more.

The Osi thing as a football move is going to hurt us so much even though I'm pissed as hell he's acting like a whiny little baby. I really don't want to see him get traded. With the Bradshaw deal being less than I thought I wouldn't mind if they gave Osi a little more money for the next 2 years so make him happy again.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 04:31 PM
I like what the Giants did bringing in Baas and Weatherford and keeping our guys like Bradshaw and Kiwi. I'd like to add some more D-Line depth though especially if Osi is traded.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 04:31 PM
Baas
Bradshaw( Resign)
Kiwi (Resign)
Steve Weatherford
Ben Patrick
David Carr
Chris White
Herman Johnson
Christian Hopkins
Brant Clouser

I am sure I have missed a few others

and...

Jarriel King (OT, South Carolina)
Henry Hynoski (FB, Pitt)
Martin Parker (DL, Richmond)
Spencer Paysinger (LB, Oregon)
David Sims (S, Iowa State)
Mark Herzlich (LB, Boston College)
Harry Flaherty (TE/LS, Princeton)
Justin Trattou (DE, Florida)
Craig Marshall (DE, South Florida)
Jerrard Tarrant (S, Georgia Tech)

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 04:32 PM
and...

Jarriel King (OT, South Carolina)
Henry Hynoski (FB, Pitt)
Martin Parker (DL, Richmond)
Spencer Paysinger (LB, Oregon)
David Sims (S, Iowa State)
Mark Herzlich (LB, Boston College)
Harry Flaherty (TE/LS, Princeton)
Justin Trattou (DE, Florida)
Craig Marshall (DE, South Florida)
Jerrard Tarrant (S, Georgia Tech)

I wasn't including undrafted free agents. I was just talking about Fa's. but ok I will add this to the list.

D-Unit
08-01-2011, 04:38 PM
Really liked the Baas signing for you guys. And your UDFA looks very promising too. The rest... meh.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 04:39 PM
The Osi thing as a football move is going to hurt us so much even though I'm pissed as hell he's acting like a whiny little baby. I really don't want to see him get traded. With the Bradshaw deal being less than I thought I wouldn't mind if they gave Osi a little more money for the next 2 years so make him happy again.

I dont mind either way right now, give him a bone or get a first. Osi's play has declined despite the stats and what other people say who dont understand football more than casually.

Osi's physicality and rushmoves, where the hell did they go? He cant hold up vs the run. Its true he gives us these great sack fumbles, but at the same time he hurts us. You guys know this, yet you want him back because we've grown to love him for those great plays and look over everything else. Well we dont need to deal with that, we have talent behind him, its time to move on.

All Osi does is shoot around the LT, basically just running around him. If he does this and doesn't get the QB, the entire left side is open. True that he forces the QB further up in the pocket, but with mobile QB's we will be dead bc thats all he does. Our LB's cant cover that ground well enough that we can afford this.

Bottom line is, we can wait a few years and watch him lose his spot to JPP or Kiwi, or we can trade him for a high draft pick and get a player in a year that will help us. He gets his money, a starting position, and we get a high pick with a chance at an unproven commodity.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 04:41 PM
Really liked the Baas signing for you guys. And your UDFA looks very promising too. The rest... meh.

I dont think much of the rest is going to make the team, maybe ben patrick and probably weatherford.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 04:44 PM
Osi isn't as good as was before the injury but he's still a top 4-3 DE in football. Like I've been saying we're a team built around the D-Line and losing our 2nd best player off that line is going to hurt no matter how you want to justify it.

BaLLiN
08-01-2011, 04:51 PM
Osi isn't as good as was before the injury but he's still a top 4-3 DE in football. Like I've been saying we're a team built around the D-Line and losing our 2nd best player off that line is going to hurt no matter how you want to justify it.

And what if the coaches think JPP or Kiwi is better? Personally I think JPP could be better than Osi (is at the moment not at his peak) as soon as this season.

Malaka
08-01-2011, 04:57 PM
I honestly think Kiwi should start every down over Osi, and Osi only comes in on pass rushing situations. But there's no way his ego would allow that plus it would drive his trade value way down. Honestly, I liked Osi but if we can get rid of him for some good value I am all for it. I trust Tuck, Kiwi, and JPP (even Tolly if he stays on as a 4th DE motor guy).

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 05:03 PM
Kiwi and Tuck are way too injury prone for my liking to rely on them for a full season. JPP showed flashes last year but he is not ready to be a full down player.

OSUGiants17
08-01-2011, 05:23 PM
If, now this is a huge if, Tuck and Kiwi are healthy, Osi is not a huge loss at all especially if we get a 1st from Seattle for him. Tuck-Joseph-Canty-Kiwi with JPP and Austin rotating in and potentially Sintim if we move him to DE and sign a guy like McIntosh or Lawson that's a very solid D

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 05:45 PM
When did we sign Ryan Perrilloux?

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 05:49 PM
Giants waived Chad Jones injured today BUT it's only a procedural move. Expected to remain with the team on non-football injury list #nyg

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 05:51 PM
When did we sign Ryan Perrilloux?

They signed him according to Google searches around January.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2011, 05:52 PM
They signed him according to Google searches around January.

Thanks. I definitely missed that during the year.

Big_Pete
08-01-2011, 07:34 PM
just saw that. Actually i think i'd be fine osi for curry. I just dont know what to think of this whole osi situation, ugh

I suggested an Osi for Curry trade as a possibility some time ago, it would be good for both sides.

another could be David Hawthorne and a second

but the most likely remains a first rounder



There is no reason to be upset with Osi, frankly he deserves his pay day.
He is scheduled to make what $7.1 over the next two years, and considering the contract Charles Johnson signed, Osi is worth around a 5 year $65 mil deal. He is 29 and this is his shot to get the money to set him up for life.
Unfortunately for the Giants we can't afford to pay him, thats life under the salary cap. I don't have anything against Osi.
Osi will get traded I think and we will get good value. The fact is we drafted JPP to replace Osi so it isn't unexpected.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 07:39 PM
What about making a deal for John Carlson if the Seahawks go through and sign Zach Miller?

I am not talking about a Osi for Carlson. Just Carlson in general.

bigbluedefense
08-01-2011, 07:46 PM
I want to keep Osi, and for some reason I have a feeling we do wind up keeping him.

A 1st is a steep price at this point in the season, plus whatever team signs him will need to pay him big bucks, so I don't know if it happens.

This is what I think happens:

-The Giants listen to Osi ***** and moan, then tell him he can seek a trade if he wants, knowing full well that if he does find that trade, we make out fine bc we get a 1st, but if he can't find a trade, then we get to keep him so win/win situation for the team.

-This makes Osi happy. He tells his agent to go looking around and he has no ill feelings towards the organization bc they held their end of the deal.

-Osi can't find a trade partner. Left scratching his head.

-The Giants come up to Osi and say hey look, we can't find a trade partner, so take this marginal bump in salary for the remainder of your contract and like it.

-Osi thinks about it.

-Osi accepts the offer.

-Osi talks about how he always wanted to stay with the Giants and how he's not a distraction or bad teammate and how he's going to go earn his next contract blah blah blah.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 07:57 PM
Back to the Ben Patrick thing for a moment

Coughlin also said that signing of Ben Patrick doesn't impact Kevin Boss. Just means more competition.

bigbluedefense
08-01-2011, 08:00 PM
I don't think it impacts Boss. If anything, it impacts Beckum. The guy is playing on the 3rd string in practice. That can't be good.

We'll keep 3 TEs this year.

Big_Pete
08-01-2011, 08:01 PM
Back to the Ben Patrick thing for a moment

Coughlin also said that signing of Ben Patrick doesn't impact Kevin Boss. Just means more competition.


Competition for Beckum and Pascoe.

I wouldn't completely rule out Snellings either, if he is cheap enough, he could complete for that 3rd RB spot, he is a better receiving threat than either Jacobs or Bradshaw.

LTgiants
08-01-2011, 08:02 PM
Competition for Beckum and Pascoe.

I wouldn't completely rule out Snellings either, if he is cheap enough, he could complete for that 3rd RB spot, he is a better receiving threat than either Jacobs or Bradshaw.

That's what I said but some people felt otherwise earlier today so I was posting it for them.

Big_Pete
08-02-2011, 12:11 AM
That's what I said but some people felt otherwise earlier today so I was posting it for them.

It would depend on how much Snellings would cost. But the bottom has dropped out of the RB free agency market, so Snellings might be available relatively cheaply.

Don't forget he comes from Toms River, NJ

NY+Giants=NYG
08-02-2011, 05:27 AM
It would depend on how much Snellings would cost. But the bottom has dropped out of the RB free agency market, so Snellings might be available relatively cheaply.

Don't forget he comes from Toms River, NJ

That's where I am from.

Damix
08-02-2011, 08:36 AM
Ross says he will not play safety at all anymore. Speculation that he could be traded at the end of the preseason.

I'd think detroit would be a fit, 3rd rounder?

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 09:33 AM
Are we just going to trade our depth away after watching how injuries have ravaged this team the last few years?

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 10:35 AM
It's a shame what happened with Ross. The guy had an unbelievable rookie season. You could make an argument that he actually outperformed Revis their rookie years.

But then he got depressed, lost his love for the game, got injured, and he's never been the same since. Even in practice this year, he's not exactly lighting the world on fire.

I'd keep him bc you won't find a better nickel/4th CB in the league than Ross, but it's just a little depressing to see what he is, and know what he could have been if he just had the desire to be great.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 11:11 AM
I don't think Beckum is making this team. I just don't see where he fits.

Not a WR, not a TE, not a FB. Not even a good STer. So what is he? I feel like he's wasting a roster spot right now.

I really want to see improvement from him this PS, it's year 3 now.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 11:14 AM
I think this will be a make or break training camp for Beatty, Beckum, and Sintim.

All 3 need to prove something. Beatty needs to prove he is more than a swing tackle, Beckum needs to prove he can play in this offense and deserves a roster spot, and Sintim needs to do the same for the defense.

I'll give Ramses 1 more year. Unless he's hurt all season again. Then maybe it's just time to move on.

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 11:23 AM
I'd cut Beckum. It was a terrible pick at the time because we're not creative to use him and it's played out exactly like we thought. I can't even blame him.

Damix
08-02-2011, 11:31 AM
By the way, where do you guys get your training camp updates?

I have like 9 million sites to get Yankee news, and only like 3 to get Giants news.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 11:43 AM
By the way, where do you guys get your training camp updates?

I have like 9 million sites to get Yankee news, and only like 3 to get Giants news.

i follow all the beatwriters on twitter. Mike Garafolo, Ralph Vacciano, Ohm Youngmusik, and I think someone else I'm forgetting.

Also check out bigblueinteractive.com

They pretty much link you to any relevant giants article there is. They're typically a day behind though.

I'd cut Beckum. It was a terrible pick at the time because we're not creative to use him and it's played out exactly like we thought. I can't even blame him.

It depends, let's see how his blocking looks this year. If he can't block, then cut him. That's pretty much what it comes down to. We all know he is a decent pass catching threat, probably better than Boss, but he's such a mediocre run blocker.

If that doesn't improve, I think you just gotta move on. There's no place on this roster for a TE who can't run block.

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 11:44 AM
At work I can't get on BBI so I just use Garafolo and Ohm.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 11:46 AM
At work I can't get on BBI so I just use Garafolo and Ohm.

Follow Ralph Vacciano too. He's the best of the 3 when it comes to responding to any questions you have.

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 11:52 AM
Ralph annoys me with his opinions sometimes.

Forenci
08-02-2011, 11:55 AM
Are any newspapers doing training camp reports? I use to read those all the time, but it doesn't seem like they're happening this year. Or is it just me?

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 12:00 PM
Eh, it's nice to hear something different sometimes.

Garafolo comes off as arrogant to me sometimes.

Forenci
08-02-2011, 12:05 PM
Haha yeah, as a journalist major I (for the most part) hate sports writers. They think because they deal with sports they can just inject their opinion into everything, which is almost always negative, without regard for who it affects.

I know it's just a game, but it would be nice if they took it seriously and showed some journalistic integrity or ethics.

/mini-rant

LTgiants
08-02-2011, 12:06 PM
Michael Clayton is back with the Giants.

Damix
08-02-2011, 12:09 PM
I've been following Ralph V and Garafolo. Forgot about Ohm, he used to work with Ralph, but I think he is at ESPN now.

I do agree GF, Ralph is a bit annoying sometimes. To be honest he annoys me more when he refuses to put his opinion on something, I remember asking him a few years ago who'd he like to see as our DC. It took like 10 msgs back and forth on twitter for him to basically say he'd like pepper johnson because of his ties with the giants.

I think the issue is more that he isn't really a football guy.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 12:11 PM
Him and Devon Thomas will likely battle for the final WR spot. I think Thomas wins it. He's looked good so far in camp, and he's a better ST player.

A familiar face in our WR core will be gone. I think it's Hixon.

Let's not forget either, Tolly and Chase are gone. Neither are coming back. So that frees up 2 roster spots as well.

I think Adrian Tracy will make the team. Don't know who replaces Tolly's roster spot.

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 12:16 PM
I'm upset about Chase. He was one of our best special team players.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 12:19 PM
I'm gonna miss Chase too. He was one of my favorite players.

It kind of upsets me that DeOssie still has a roster spot but Chase doesn't. DeOssie is worthless, he's just a long snapper.

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 12:29 PM
Long snapping is very important, let's not underestimate that. Also, Deossise gets down the field quick as well. We're just upset because we thought he had a lot more potential.

On a related note it sounds like Belichick's son has a good chance to be the long snapper for Rutgers this year.

bigbluedefense
08-02-2011, 12:32 PM
Come home Bellichick. Come home.

Wouldn't it be nice to see your son on local television? I'll pick you up at the airport.

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2011, 12:42 PM
Well he this kid is a 5th year. He played lacrosse for 4 years so I guess now he has 1 year of eligibility left. BB knows the importance of long snapping so that's why he wants his son doing it haha.

Damix
08-02-2011, 12:53 PM
Trying out Gabe Watson today. Remember how many people mocked him to us?

Jughead10
08-02-2011, 01:10 PM
Trying out Gabe Watson today. Remember how many people mocked him to us?

Yes. And we still haven't found that stud DT.