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bigbluedefense
06-01-2011, 06:17 PM
I guess it's about that time to start this up.

For me, I'm all about the linebackers or should I say potential linebacker class of this draft. We have some pretty interesting linebacker prospects to check out.

Vontaze Burfict
Luke Kuechly
Manti Teo
Travis Lewis

I think Manti Teo is my favorite inside backer as of right now. The guy is sound in his technique, instinctual, can wrap up, smart, strong and fast, can cover and stop the run, all around solid guy.

Kuechly is a tackling machine. Another solid guy. A lot like Manti.

Vontaze has a ton of potential, but I hate how wild he is. Reminds me of Rey Maluaga a lot, who I liked btw. I think he might slip like Rey did. He needs to learn to wrap up and reign in his freelancing.

Travis Lewis is a great WILL. If we go OLB, he might be the guy.

NY+Giants=NYG
06-01-2011, 06:34 PM
I guess it's about that time to start this up.

For me, I'm all about the linebackers or should I say potential linebacker class of this draft. We have some pretty interesting linebacker prospects to check out.

Vontaze Burfict
Luke Kuechly
Manti Teo
Travis Lewis

I think Manti Teo is my favorite inside backer as of right now. The guy is sound in his technique, instinctual, can wrap up, smart, strong and fast, can cover and stop the run, all around solid guy.

Kuechly is a tackling machine. Another solid guy. A lot like Manti.

Vontaze has a ton of potential, but I hate how wild he is. Reminds me of Rey Maluaga a lot, who I liked btw. I think he might slip like Rey did. He needs to learn to wrap up and reign in his freelancing.

Travis Lewis is a great WILL. If we go OLB, he might be the guy.

Boooooooooooooooo! Man it's boring now without football!

bigbluedefense
06-01-2011, 06:47 PM
We can talk about your mid round developmental olinemen prospects if you like ;)

OSUGiants17
06-01-2011, 07:59 PM
I love me some Luke Kuechly <3. The kid is a tackling machine like you said and is always in the right spot at the right time. Plus, he goes to BC so that increases his chances of coming here.

bigbluedefense
06-13-2011, 03:10 PM
I'm excited for this year's upcoming draft. I really hope all these linebackers declare, bc this could be a sick LB class which is just what the doctor ordered.

I want Manti Teo as of right now, but theres a group of LBs who if they all come out, could fit the bill. I really hope they all declare.

If we go Center, I'd LOVE Konz from Wisconsin. That dude is an absolute beast. He's got Nick Mangold potential. Flat out stud.

But I still much rather have one of the premier linebackers if one of them is available. Konz would be a great fallback option though.

For me it's either best available LB or Konz if the draft were tomorrow. Of course, a ton will change come April, but that's basically what I'm eying heading into the college football season.

Big_Pete
06-13-2011, 06:29 PM
I am not sure we will draft a LB in the opening round, not going to happen I think.

I do think there could be some excellent LB options in the second round such as Zach Brown, Nico Johnson, Nigel Bradham or Courtney Upshaw. Kenny Tate is also playing OLB and could be a decent option at WLB.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see a first round LB. There are three top shelf lbs next year, of the three I could see Luke Kuechly being available and he would be an ideal fit here.

I have to think DE will be on the radar in the first couple of rounds. If Kiwanuka is back this year, it is likely a one year deal at best. Osi is also off contract after the 2012 season and is going to want his big payday, at 31 that may be tough for the Giants to justify particularly if JPP comes on as expected.

I could easily see a first round DE in next year's draft.

OSUGiants17
06-14-2011, 05:29 AM
If we take another DE in the 1st next year I will murder someone

Giantsfan1080
06-14-2011, 11:21 AM
We might need another DE with Osi and Kiwi possibly gone.

Rosebud
06-14-2011, 11:43 AM
We might need another DE with Osi and Kiwi possibly gone.

We might, but I'm not sure we should spend a first on it if Tuck has a healthy season and JPP blows up like he can, which is probably what it would take for both Osi and Kiwi to be let go, that or Sintim moving to DE because of injuries and dominating which I don't think is likely.

bigbluedefense
06-14-2011, 11:45 AM
I wouldn't rule out DE, although I think we will retain either Osi or Kiwi long term. I honestly don't really know which one we wind up keeping.

Kiwi has packed on weight for 2 years in a row now (supposedly he's even bigger now at Eli's camp), and he was beasting it before he got hurt last year. If he can stay healthy and get even better...it's going to be a tough call.

It should be a good draft for our needs this coming year. At least how our needs are shaping up as of right now. Of course that will change.

I really want a linebacker though. It's the missing link on our team. If we stay healthy, and our young guys develop, we are a playmaking linebacker away from being a complete team.

Rosebud
06-14-2011, 11:55 AM
I wouldn't rule out DE, although I think we will retain either Osi or Kiwi long term. I honestly don't really know which one we wind up keeping.

Kiwi has packed on weight for 2 years in a row now (supposedly he's even bigger now at Eli's camp), and he was beasting it before he got hurt last year. If he can stay healthy and get even better...it's going to be a tough call.

It should be a good draft for our needs this coming year. At least how our needs are shaping up as of right now. Of course that will change.

I really want a linebacker though. It's the missing link on our team. If we stay healthy, and our young guys develop, we are a playmaking linebacker away from being a complete team.

I dunno, if Joseph becomes the ogre he looks like he's becoming I think we'll be able to keep Boley fresh for a whole season, and when he was fresh at the start of last season the dude was an animal. I would love another stud LB, but if the DL can hold up better than it did last year we do already have the talent at LB to win it all.

bigbluedefense
06-14-2011, 11:59 AM
I dunno, if Joseph becomes the ogre he looks like he's becoming I think we'll be able to keep Boley fresh for a whole season, and when he was fresh at the start of last season the dude was an animal. I would love another stud LB, but if the DL can hold up better than it did last year we do already have the talent at LB to win it all.

We still need a MIKE who can cover the deep middle. Until we get that MIKE, slot skinny post will always be open on us, the way it has been for the past 2 years.

Malaka
06-14-2011, 12:37 PM
I wouldn't rule out DE, although I think we will retain either Osi or Kiwi long term. I honestly don't really know which one we wind up keeping.

Kiwi has packed on weight for 2 years in a row now (supposedly he's even bigger now at Eli's camp), and he was beasting it before he got hurt last year. If he can stay healthy and get even better...it's going to be a tough call.

It should be a good draft for our needs this coming year. At least how our needs are shaping up as of right now. Of course that will change.

I really want a linebacker though. It's the missing link on our team. If we stay healthy, and our young guys develop, we are a playmaking linebacker away from being a complete team.

I love Kiwi, but that neck injury really scares me. After this year I'll be able to make a better judgement on who to lock up long-term. However, if I was forced to choose one right now I'd go with Osi he is the safer bet with better production as of right now.

I really hope Kiwi proves me wrong and lives up to his potential.

Giantsfan1080
06-14-2011, 12:58 PM
It would be nice if everyone stayed relatively healthy this year. I have a feeling it's going to be a shortened season as well.

OSUGiants17
06-14-2011, 02:34 PM
We might need another DE with Osi and Kiwi possibly gone.
Agreed, but if we go DE round 1 without Tuck or JPP getting seriously injured it would make no sense.

bigbluedefense
06-14-2011, 03:02 PM
I think for us to take a DE, a Robert Quinn'esque type of DE would have to be on the board.

Honestly guys, if Quinn was there at 19 I would have been tempted if I were the Giants.

I think though, with us securing our DE future with JPP last year and our CB future with Prince this year, we probably finally address our concerns at LB and possibly C if this crop of talent does indeed come out.

We didn't get those positions before bc the talent just didn't match up with the position we drafted. But I think this year, the stars should align for us.

bigbluedefense
06-14-2011, 03:07 PM
Besides, I don't care how many CBs and DEs we have, until we get a LB who can chase Vick, we're going to struggle defending the Eagles.

And right now, they've pretty much been the reason why we haven't made the playoffs for the past 2 years.

Can't win the division if we can't beat Philly. And we haven't beat Philly since 08.

Giantsfan1080
06-14-2011, 03:31 PM
Our sloppiness against the Eagles killed us last year. We could use a LB but we should have beat the Eagles both times last year.

bigbluedefense
06-14-2011, 03:36 PM
Our sloppiness against the Eagles killed us last year. We could use a LB but we should have beat the Eagles both times last year.

Yes and no.

Once Vick stopped being a pocket qb in the 4th quarter in the 2nd game and started playing backyard football, he realized he could just run into open space and beat our LBs to the sideline so he just started "Vicking" us to death.

That's the problem we have. Yes, we have CBs who can match up vs their WRs. Yes, we have a coverage LB who can cover their TE, as well as safeties who can do the same. Yes, we have versatile guys who can blitz from different angles and we can use multiple fronts for pressure and coverages.

But, one thing we don't have is 2 LBs who can spy a qb and cover the deep middle. So 2 things will remain the same:

1. We can't cover the deep post in the middle of the field
2. We can't chase Vick when a play breaks down

The only chance we have is if we hope our blitz gets to Vick all game. But you roll the dice with that gameplan.

Look at the Bears, they shut Vick down with a 4 man rush. How did they do it? They had 2 LBs in Briggs and Urlacher who absolutely patrol the middle of the field, and locked him up any time he tried to run.

That's what we're missing, and that's what we need. Can we beat them without that? Yes. But it's just going to be much harder.

That's why we need it, it's the one missing link to our defense.

Aaron Rodgers did the same thing to us later in the year. He just bought time and exposed our LBs.

The middle of the field is there for the taking against us. Has been for 2 years now, and it's bc we lack quality LBs.

Can we win without that? Yeah we can, it's just going to be more difficult.

Big_Pete
06-16-2011, 01:14 AM
I agree, we really need a pair of quality LBs. Though you could equally make a case that we need to upgrade all three spots.

I am a big fan of Luke Kuechly, I think he could play either Mike or Sam for us.

As far as the draft goes, we won't know our likely needs. I am still somewhat hopeful we will add a decent LB this year in free agency.

OSUGiants17
06-16-2011, 09:46 AM
We almost always go Defense round 1, if we don't go LB I would be shocked, it is our biggest defensive need and has been for years and it's time we realize that and draft a real 4-3 LB. I wish we needed a WR this year though because the WR class is just as stacked as the LB class. A lot of good Safeties as well and if KP doesn't fully recover we could go S in the top 2 rounds(2 very good Miami safeties).

Giantsfan1080
06-16-2011, 11:08 AM
It's way to early to have any clue at what position we might go. Who knows what is actually going to transpire during the year.

Giantsfan1080
06-16-2011, 11:13 AM
I just read this stuff about Osi and it looks like he's as good as gone so DE is still going to be a need possibly.

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/news/story?id=6667679

BaLLiN
06-17-2011, 11:21 PM
I just read this stuff about Osi and it looks like he's as good as gone so DE is still going to be a need possibly.

http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/nfl/news/story?id=6667679

well now we won't be getting a 2nd, maybe not even a 3rd.

OSUGiants17
06-18-2011, 09:46 AM
So resign Kiwi for a year and trade Osi or Re-structure Osi's contract?

Also, I think this will be Jacobs last year in NY unless he can return to the Jacobs of 2-3 years ago that we all miss, which I don't see happening. With that said I hope we take a RB next year in the top 3 rounds.

bigbluedefense
06-23-2011, 12:17 PM
If we really want to, we can just screw with Osi the way SD did with Jackson. At the end of the day, he's under contract and has no leverage.

But I think we need to find a way to keep Kiwi for at least a year anyway as insurance for Osi bc you never know what happens.

I kind of want to keep Kiwi long term. I have a feeling he's due to break out. He seemed poised to have a monster season last year, you saw it brewing. If he can stay healthy I think he's going to beast it this year.

bigbluedefense
06-23-2011, 12:28 PM
Question for the board:

Why is everyone in love with Kuechly but nobody mentions Teo? Kuechly reminds me of Laurinitis.

I'm under the impression that Manti Teo will be the best available LB in this draft. I think when the dust settles Kuechly will be a late 1st/early 2nd round pick.

Same with Burfict. Teo might be a guy taken in the 20s. All speculation of course.

Giantsfan1080
06-23-2011, 12:33 PM
Something is off with Teo but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. I'll be watching the LB's very close this year.

bigbluedefense
06-23-2011, 12:37 PM
I think if we're expecting Patrick Willis, then we'd be disappointed.

Teo, Burfict, and Kuechly, none are Willis. The one with potential is Burfict, but he's way too wild and has Asante Samuel like tackling technique.

Teo seems to me like a bigger version of Luke honestly. Great instincts, great form tackling, sound coverage, but nothing jumps out of the screen about him.

Malaka
06-23-2011, 09:13 PM
Really in the top 3 rounds next year I want an O-Lineman, a Linebacker, and a running-back in whichever order. Preferably the Running back in rounds 2 or 3 though.

I'd be ecstatic with either Konz or Kuechly/Teo in Round 1. I don't think Burficit fits in with out defense.

ellsy82
07-05-2011, 10:48 PM
Really in the top 3 rounds next year I want an O-Lineman, a Linebacker, and a running-back in whichever order. Preferably the Running back in rounds 2 or 3 though.

I'd be ecstatic with either Konz or Kuechly/Teo in Round 1. I don't think Burficit fits in with out defense.

Latest mock has you guys getting...

1. Zach Brown, OLB, North Carolina
2. Michael Brewster, C, Ohio State
3. Keith Zeitler, OG, Wisconsin
4. Doug Martin, RB, Boise State
5. Nigel Bradham, ILB, Florida State
6. Brandon Hardin, FS, Oregon State
7. Jarrett Boykin, WR, Virginia Tech

That might help get back to the NFCCG.

bigbluedefense
07-06-2011, 11:47 AM
If Brewster or Konz fell to us in the 2nd, I'd be estatic. I highly doubt it though. I think both wind up as first round picks. One will be a mid 1st, the other a late 1st.

The draft stock of Centers has really sky rocketed in recent years. 1, because of the growth of 3-4 defenses, but also bc they are such safe picks. When was the last time the first Center off the board was a bust?

Centers have been money for the past 4 years at least. And this Center class is very good with those 2 guys.

OSUGiants17
07-06-2011, 02:32 PM
If we got Bradham in any round after the 1st I would be happy, let alone round 5!

My board:
1. Kuechly
2. Te'o
3. K. Davis
4. Brewster
5. Konz
6. Egnew
7. Bradham
8. Carder
9. Tate
10. Thompson

Big_Pete
07-06-2011, 09:04 PM
Question for the board:

Why is everyone in love with Kuechly but nobody mentions Teo? Kuechly reminds me of Laurinitis.

I'm under the impression that Manti Teo will be the best available LB in this draft. I think when the dust settles Kuechly will be a late 1st/early 2nd round pick.

Same with Burfict. Teo might be a guy taken in the 20s. All speculation of course.

I think both Burfitt and Teo will be gone well before we pick.

But Teo would be a great fit as well, I like him much better than Burfitt

bigbluedefense
07-07-2011, 12:18 PM
Realistically, I don't see Luke coming out. Those BC boys tend to stay for 4 years.

Which leaves Teo and Vontaze as the 2 ILB prospects at the top. If we don't go ILB, there are some good OLB prospects as well.

My favorite as of right now is Travis Lewis at OLB. He's the type of speedy OLB we need to plug in at WILL. Move Boley to SAM, and our OLB situation is solved.

Giantsfan1080
07-07-2011, 12:28 PM
I say we go WR again and take Mo Sanu.

OSUGiants17
07-07-2011, 12:47 PM
I say we go WR again and take Mo Sanu.

If Sanu is there for us round 2 I would actually be down for this

Giantsfan1080
07-07-2011, 01:24 PM
That's just a homer pick for me obviously. I think he's going to play himself into the 1st though.

bigbluedefense
07-07-2011, 01:44 PM
I love me some Sanu. But there's no way in hell we're getting him.

I'm really eager to see how our young guns along the oline look during training camp and PS.

I'm hoping Petrus, Beatty, Koets, and Brewer can show us that they can be staples of our line in a year or two.

If Petrus, Koets, and Beatty can show us they are capable of starting this year, then we'll be set along the oline. Brewer developing would just be gravy on top, bc even if he doesn't develop, with those guys developing we can just throw Diehl at RT.

I like Petrus and Koets, I'm iffy on Beatty. Funny that I'm high on Koets now when this time last year I was killing him lol.

Giantsfan1080
07-07-2011, 01:51 PM
Yeah same thing with Barden also. You killed him forever and now you have him in line for a breakout year.

I feel the same way as you do though about those three. I love me some Petrus, I'm solid on Koets, and Beatty I don't know what to think.

bigbluedefense
07-07-2011, 01:57 PM
Yeah. With Barden it was frustration. You hear about him tearing it up in camp, he sounds like a training camp warrior, then once it was time to prove it he was always a no show. I started thinking he was Sinorice Moss all over again.

I just wanted to see him flash. And he did against Dallas before getting hurt. So now I feel better about him. Although injuries are starting to be a concern with that guy. He's always hurt.

As odd as it sounds, our season could hinge on Beatty. That's a scary thought. If he's a dud, that means Diehl is LT again. And Diehl's ability to play LT is deteriorating with each coming year. Then you have no backup plan to McKenzie who is old as dirt at RT if Diehl is forced to play LT, and we could have a serious bookend issue along our oline moving forward, not to mention potentially a weak Center.

When the 3 pressure points of the oline are weak (OT and C), you're in big trouble.

And if Beatty is a dud and Koets struggles recovering from that ACL...we could be in big trouble.

We need those 2 to shine more than anyone else.

Giantsfan1080
07-07-2011, 02:26 PM
I think Beatty is best suited for RT. Have since Day 1.

bigbluedefense
07-07-2011, 03:08 PM
He's too small though. He does better at RT than LT bc teams blitz less on the strong side so he doesn't get as confused with assignments.

I know he's too small regardless of whether he's a LT or RT, but his lack of size is even more concerning at RT since that's the strong side.

I'm hoping he put on some weight this offseason.

If he has no potential at LT, then we better hope Brewer does, bc we have no one else in house who can man the LT spot. Brewer is very raw though, and he was mediocre at RT at Indiana so to ask him to play LT in the NFL might be a stretch.

Big_Pete
07-08-2011, 12:07 AM
My early money for the 2012 NYG first round is currently on either of NC DEs Quinton Coples or Donte Paige-Moss.

There is a good chance that Umenyiora and/or Kiwanuka will be gone (or not far way from leaving), we know DEs are a premium and we have certainly drafted from NC lately.

It is still very early and we have to see how the draft board shakes up, but the LBs will make a big impact if they declare.

Remember this time last year Amukamara was a lock as a top 5, and DEs slipped a lot this year so anything is possible.

bigbluedefense
07-08-2011, 09:43 AM
Wouldn't surprise me at all if we go DE again.

I think all of the following positions will be on the table for consideration with our 1st round pick:

LT
C
MIKE
OLB
TE
RB
S
DE

Maybe DT, although we drafted 2 DTs the past 2 years so probably not.

But yeah, any of those positions could be a first rounder for us next year. None of those positions would surprise me.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-08-2011, 12:22 PM
Training camp moved to Timex Performance Center in E. R. , NJ now. No more Albany as per BBI.

Giantsfan1080
07-08-2011, 12:29 PM
Training camp moved to Timex Performance Center in E. R. , NJ now. No more Albany as per BBI.

Wow sucks for U of Albany. Better for me though since I can just go up and watch. They are going to pack that place. I bet Coughlin is mad also. He loved getting the players out there for a month away from everything.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-08-2011, 04:08 PM
Wow sucks for U of Albany. Better for me though since I can just go up and watch. They are going to pack that place. I bet Coughlin is mad also. He loved getting the players out there for a month away from everything.

I never went to Albany because it would be a pain to drive so far and then come back. But the stadium is 40-45 min away so now I can go and meet up with people. So personally, I am very happy.

Giantsfan1080
07-08-2011, 05:31 PM
Yea same distance for me. Maybe 5-10 mins closer based on traffic. I read it's only for a year because of the lockout but still cool.

bigbluedefense
07-08-2011, 07:02 PM
I'm definitely going to try to catch some practices. I'm excited about it being in Jersey for that reason.

What I don't like is there will be a billion people there, which could cause a distraction for the players. But for me individually, I'm excited.

NY+Giants=NYG
07-09-2011, 10:00 AM
I'm definitely going to try to catch some practices. I'm excited about it being in Jersey for that reason.

What I don't like is there will be a billion people there, which could cause a distraction for the players. But for me individually, I'm excited.

We should hang out man when things get up and going again. It would be cool to check out camp.

bigbluedefense
07-11-2011, 11:24 AM
We should hang out man when things get up and going again. It would be cool to check out camp.

Cool. I'm gonna see if I can take any time off from work to catch some of these practices. I'll let you know.

Big_Pete
07-13-2011, 07:11 PM
I think Beatty will be fine. He was in the mix and arguably the front runner for the LT spot until he got hurt and couldn't really make that lost time, you also have to remember we got off to a good start last year, so it is not always easy to change what works. He was also playing RT and TE later in the year, not LT where he had worked in the preseason.

I actually don't want to see us moving him around. Just leave him at LT and let him develop. We have good coaches and Beatty has the talent and the attitude, he just needs to bring it all together. If he can he will be a stud LT.

I see this as being similar to Webster before his breakout season, a lot of questions were asked, but when it finally came together it transformed the unit.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Beatty as out LT on opening day.

bigbluedefense
07-13-2011, 07:36 PM
If Beatty and Koets prove capable of starting this year, we are in great shape along the oline.

The only concern I have with Koets is his ACL. Beatty has a lot to work on.

Big_Pete
07-13-2011, 07:36 PM
If we got a quality MLB, could Goff play WLB? (at least on running downs)

I am just thinking because Kawika Mitchell was an ILB before we brought him here to play WLB and which he continued to play in Fewell's system at Buffalo with some success.

Goff has decent speed, range, athleticism and instincts.

If he could, then Boley and Sintim could split time at SLB.

bigbluedefense
07-13-2011, 07:38 PM
No way. Goff is a pure MIKE, he doesn't have the speed and hips to play WILL.

Kawika lost weight to play WILL for Fewell, and played OLB in the past as well. Goff has always been a MIKE.

Maybe Goff can play SAM, but no way can he play WILL.

Giantsfan1080
07-13-2011, 07:42 PM
Don't forget that we're only going to play 2 LB's most of the time.

bigbluedefense
07-13-2011, 07:46 PM
I think that depends on whether we bring Grant back or not. If we don't, we probably don't use the 3 safety set as much as we did last year.

In that 3 safety set now that I think about it, Goff pretty much played SAM anyway, bc Grant covered the deep middle. So I guess in that sense, yes, Goff can play SAM.

Giantsfan1080
07-13-2011, 07:47 PM
I think that depends on whether we bring Grant back or not. If we don't, we probably don't use the 3 safety set as much as we did last year.

In that 3 safety set now that I think about it, Goff pretty much played SAM anyway, bc Grant covered the deep middle. So I guess in that sense, yes, Goff can play SAM.

If we don't re-sign Grant I could see us throwing Sash in that role quickly. Also with the depth we have at CB I wouldn't be shocked if we use one of them most of the time.

bigbluedefense
07-13-2011, 07:52 PM
If we don't re-sign Grant I could see us throwing Sash in that role quickly. Also with the depth we have at CB I wouldn't be shocked if we use one of them most of the time.

Does Sash have the athleticism to pull it off though?

Honestly, I want us to bring Bulluck back this year. I think we should use him at WILL full time and Boley at SAM. And just ditch the 3 safety set.

Isn't it sad that Bulluck led the LB core with 2 INTs when he barely saw the field? I think he still has another year left in the tank, and he'd be cheap. I think we should bring him back.

Giantsfan1080
07-13-2011, 07:58 PM
Yeah I'm pretty sure Sash is an athletic guy. I remember when we drafted him thinking he's probably the replacement for Grant.

I'm for Bulluck coming back. He'd be cheap and he's a good vet to have. I also son't ever remember him on the field last year in a bad spot. I also don't remember him making any huge plays but that's not a suprise.

bigbluedefense
07-13-2011, 08:12 PM
The only problem with bringing Bulluck back is he said he won't come back as a situational player. He wants to start.

So if we do go with the 3 safety base again, I doubt we'll see Bulluck back. He'll probably go to Detroit.

I want him back though.

Big_Pete
07-13-2011, 08:39 PM
I think Tyler Sash (like Chad Jones last year) is a good fit for a Grant style of role.

I do like the idea of Goff and Sintim splitting time at SLB with Boley at WLB.

I do think we need a stud MLB, Tulloch would be the ideal fit. I just think we could go with a good option like Poslunzsy or Ruud.

I wouldn't mind a FA 2nd tier guy to compete with Boley (like Howard), but not sure it will happen.

Like a few here I think Boley may be more of the problem than Goff was last year, he just didn't make enough plays in my opinion.

bigbluedefense
09-12-2011, 02:48 PM
I watched a little bit of Manti Teo on Saturday.

I don't know if he's the answer. I like the guy, he's fundamentally sound, he takes good angles, he tackles well, he makes plays.

But he's just not a world beater athlete. I think we need an athlete, that's what's missing in our LB core. Teo isn't an athlete.

I know people are saying 1st round with him, but right now I view him as a 2nd round grade. Good solid player, but unless an ILB possesses elite athleticism, I don't see them as 1st round players.

He reminds me of Mason Foster. A guy who does everything well, nothing great. Foster went in the 3rd. You can't tell me that Teo is that much better than Foster that he is worth a 1st round pick.

To be fair, I need to see more. But right now, I have him pegged as a 2nd round talent.

BigBlueNorwegian
09-12-2011, 02:58 PM
If we have a real bad season, and go something like 6-10 or 5-11 (that's what i think our floor is), we should pick in the no. 6-10 range. In that case I want us to go WR-LB in the first two rounds.

Dream scenarios would be to get Burfict-Sanu in rounds one and two. An emotional leader on defense, and another reliable player at WR. Or maybe Alshon Jeffery-Travis Lewis?

touchdownmaker
09-20-2011, 10:42 PM
Yeah Burfict would be amazing. I saw some games of his last year but haven't been able to catch any this year. He is my pick and the way things are going, we should be able to grab him. The only thing is we would have to fight the temptation of grabbing a stud wr. I like Burfict in the first and Toon in the second. He seems to getting second round grades, but he has looked pretty damn good in every game I have seen. He was the main target in last year's Rose Bowl, and he played pretty damn good. Toon has a big body and runs crisps routes.

bigbluedefense
09-21-2011, 11:57 AM
Haven't seen Burfict yet this year. There's no way Sanu falls to the 2nd round. I'd be shocked if he does.

If he does, he won't go passed 4 spots in the 2nd round.

BigBlueNorwegian
09-21-2011, 12:41 PM
Haven't seen Burfict yet this year. There's no way Sanu falls to the 2nd round. I'd be shocked if he does.

If he does, he won't go passed 4 spots in the 2nd round.

With the way this season is shaping up, that will probably be right around our pick, or at least within the range of trading up for him :P

OSUGiants17
09-21-2011, 05:14 PM
Haven't seen Burfict yet this year. There's no way Sanu falls to the 2nd round. I'd be shocked if he does.

If he does, he won't go passed 4 spots in the 2nd round.

This is a very deep WR class, I could see Sanu going anywhere from late round 1 to mid round 2. Jeffery is a top 10 guy, Blackmon is round 1 but may drop due to character concerns(look at Dez Bryant). Broyles, Floyd and Fuller are all considered to be on or above Sanu's level. I know this board is high on Sanu, but he is not a round 1 talent just yet, by the end of the year I think he most likely will be, but having the talent to go round 1 doesn't mean you will.

Right now if we pick top 15 I want Burfict-Sanu or Fuller
or
Jeffery-Zach Brown

Either way I want a combo of an athletic LB and a WR.

bigbluedefense
09-22-2011, 03:40 PM
So far, this is my list of needs heading into next year:

Defense

MIKE
SAM
CB


Offense
WR
TE
Possibly RB (i want a rb who can be a legit threat in the passing game)

RB can be had in middle rounds. I'm putting a high premium on WR, TE, and both LB positions.

This is all subject to change of course. If we have a new coaching staff, who knows what happens. We could go to the 3-4 and that would completely cluster F our front 7 and open up a whole new set of needs.

Giantsfan1080
09-22-2011, 03:48 PM
I agree with everything. Those are by far the biggest needs right now.

bigbluedefense
09-22-2011, 03:58 PM
If you think about it, it's not a very big list of needs either. We can probably get 1 or 2 in free agency, and that leaves 5 for draft day. I'll take that.

Realistically, we'll address 3 of these positions with quality players. The other 3 needs will just have to wait, which is fine, it's almost impossible to have a complete team with no holes.

I think we have to address LB, WR, and TE in the first 3 rounds. In no particular order of course, the board will dictate the order, but we should address those 3 right away.

And get a RB who can catch dammit. Consistently catch. I want a guy who I know is catching the ball when Eli dumps it off. I'm tired of waiting for my RB to run and take 2 steps with the ball in his hands before I can exhale knowing he caught it.

Giantsfan1080
09-22-2011, 04:04 PM
If you think about it, it's not a very big list of needs either. We can probably get 1 or 2 in free agency, and that leaves 5 for draft day. I'll take that.

Realistically, we'll address 3 of these positions with quality players. The other 3 needs will just have to wait, which is fine, it's almost impossible to have a complete team with no holes.

I think we have to address LB, WR, and TE in the first 3 rounds. In no particular order of course, the board will dictate the order, but we should address those 3 right away.

And get a RB who can catch dammit. Consistently catch. I want a guy who I know is catching the ball when Eli dumps it off. I'm tired of waiting for my RB to run and take 2 steps with the ball in his hands before I can exhale knowing he caught it.

Well the troubling thing is that our "needs" list has been small the last 2 or 3 years but yet we haven't put it together on the field as well as we hoped since Plax shot himself.

bigbluedefense
09-22-2011, 04:09 PM
Well the troubling thing is that our "needs" list has been small the last 2 or 3 years but yet we haven't put it together on the field as well as we hoped since Plax shot himself.

Yeah, that's also largely bc I think we've been guilty of overrating some of young developing talent. Now a lot of these guys are in years 3 or 4, and we know what they are. Plus bad luck with injuries.

One thing is for sure, we're set on the dline, and our oline will be fine. So we're set at qb, and both lines. So that alone makes us competitive moving forward.

The back 7 on defense and skill positions on offense (minus Nicks) can be overhauled though and I wouldn't bat an eye. Depends on if we get a new staff and if they want to start fresh.

Giantsfan1080
09-22-2011, 04:16 PM
Yeah, that's also largely bc I think we've been guilty of overrating some of young developing talent. Now a lot of these guys are in years 3 or 4, and we know what they are. Plus bad luck with injuries.

One thing is for sure, we're set on the dline, and our oline will be fine. So we're set at qb, and both lines. So that alone makes us competitive moving forward.

The back 7 on defense and skill positions on offense (minus Nicks) can be overhauled though and I wouldn't bat an eye. Depends on if we get a new staff and if they want to start fresh.

Say we go 6-10 or 7-9 this year and fire Coughlin? Would you look back at Coughlin's tenure as successful because we won the SB or would it be dissapointing knowing we could have a better run considering the talent we had? I know the SB makes it auotmatically a good tenure but a part of me feels like we really could have done even more in the playoffs.

OSUGiants17
09-22-2011, 04:19 PM
Say we go 6-10 or 7-9 this year and fire Coughlin? Would you look back at Coughlin's tenure as successful because we won the SB or would it be dissapointing knowing we could have a better run considering the talent we had? I know the SB makes it auotmatically a good tenure but a part of me feels like we really could have done even more in the playoffs.

We had the talent with him to win more than 1. Not to mention all of the 1st round playoff exits

bigbluedefense
09-23-2011, 07:28 AM
Say we go 6-10 or 7-9 this year and fire Coughlin? Would you look back at Coughlin's tenure as successful because we won the SB or would it be dissapointing knowing we could have a better run considering the talent we had? I know the SB makes it auotmatically a good tenure but a part of me feels like we really could have done even more in the playoffs.

It's hard to say. Afterall, we did win a SB. Did we underachieve most of the time under him? I'd say yes. But at the same time, all those other years outside of 08, were we a SB caliber team?

I'd say no. So we got a SB, but another HC may have gotten 2 SBs and more playoffs wins, but how do we know that for sure?

Overall, I'd say the Coughlin era was a success bc you can't take away a SB from anybody. But I did expect more, I feel that Coughlin has held our offense (and Eli in particular) back with his dinasaur ways on offense, and his inability to find consistentcy on defense has been his demise. If you think about it, the only truly successful years we had under him were when we had Spags at DC.

But still, a SB is a SB. And the team plays hard for him. But I do feel that it's time for a change.

OSUGiants17
10-08-2011, 11:24 AM
Right now this is my dream draft:
1. Luke Kuechly, LB, Boston College
*Trade Osi if he keeps up this attitude for a 2nd and 6th*
2a. Mohamed Sanu, WR, Rutgers
2b. Devon Still, DT, Penn St
3. Colby Fleener, TE, Stanford
4. Best OL left
5. DE
6a. CB or LB
6b. CB or LB
7. Our usual 7th round BPA

NY+Giants=NYG
10-08-2011, 01:58 PM
It's hard to say. Afterall, we did win a SB. Did we underachieve most of the time under him? I'd say yes. But at the same time, all those other years outside of 08, were we a SB caliber team?

I'd say no. So we got a SB, but another HC may have gotten 2 SBs and more playoffs wins, but how do we know that for sure?

Overall, I'd say the Coughlin era was a success bc you can't take away a SB from anybody. But I did expect more, I feel that Coughlin has held our offense (and Eli in particular) back with his dinasaur ways on offense, and his inability to find consistentcy on defense has been his demise. If you think about it, the only truly successful years we had under him were when we had Spags at DC.

But still, a SB is a SB. And the team plays hard for him. But I do feel that it's time for a change.



Well maybe he gets to 2 SBs if Plax doesn't go all ghetto and bring a gat to a club. I think his choices for coordinator have held him back. But overall, I am happy with him. I liked him as a HC and think he did very well here. Even the media, NY media, likes him. They are not trying to oust him like they were before the superbowl.

Tuna and Bill B can be mean and arrogant to the media because they won superbowls. Coughlin was like that without the superbowl win, and the media hated that. Now he won, and he makes jokes to the media, and they seem to like him. No matter what he does when he comes back to NY here is a hero.

It's not that we just won a superbowl but how we won it and against who. That's what makes him a special coach to Giants fans.

Giantsfan1080
10-08-2011, 07:29 PM
Ummm Sanu and Kuechly would make me jizz multiple times.

Giantsfan1080
10-22-2011, 04:08 PM
Watch Fleener tonight BBD!!

bigbluedefense
10-22-2011, 04:17 PM
I'll try to make it to a sportsbar tonight. I may catch myself just staring at Luck the whole game tho.

Giantsfan1080
10-22-2011, 04:21 PM
I'll try to make it to a sportsbar tonight. I may catch myself just staring at Luck the whole game tho.

Well it's on ABC or ESPN if you wanted to stay at home. I stare at Luck also but that's what led me to Fleener.

Giantsfan1080
10-22-2011, 07:15 PM
Fleener is faster than I thought. The Gronk comparison seems spot on.

bigbluedefense
10-22-2011, 09:45 PM
I like this te. He seems like a good fit for us.

Giantsfan1080
10-22-2011, 10:04 PM
I like this te. He seems like a good fit for us.

Talking about Fleener?

bigbluedefense
10-22-2011, 10:08 PM
Talking about Fleener?

Yeah. Id like to see him put on 10 lbs though. I don't think he'll be there in round 3. Seems like a solid 2nd rounder. Reminds me of Zach Miller.

Giantsfan1080
10-22-2011, 10:12 PM
Yeah. Id like to see him put on 10 lbs though. I don't think he'll be there in round 3. Seems like a solid 2nd rounder. Reminds me of Zach Miller.

I knew you'd like him which is why I was pumping up this week. He's a perfect fit for us. I asked Shane about him earlier and he has a 2nd round grade on him but I'd be fine with that.

bigbluedefense
10-23-2011, 09:43 AM
I knew you'd like him which is why I was pumping up this week. He's a perfect fit for us. I asked Shane about him earlier and he has a 2nd round grade on him but I'd be fine with that.

Yeah, I definitely like him. The question is, will he be worth a 2nd rounder with other guys on the board. It depends really on what our needs shape up to be come draft day and who's on the board.

If we need a WR and a better WR is on the board, then I rather go that route. We'll see how our WR situation shapes up. If we can't re-sign Smith or just choose not to, plus Barden shows he's a dud, I think WR becomes an absolute need.

I don't want us re-signing Mario. I think he'll cost too much and won't be worth the contract he'll look for. Not in our system at least. He's a good but replaceable player.

If Blackmon falls in the 1st round, we have to take him. Can you imagine Blackmon and Nicks on the outside? Beast. There are a lot of good WRs this year. I love Blackmon, like Floyd, love Sanu obviously as well. There could be some depth at LB too.

This draft should be deep in the positions that we need the most. So let's cross our fingers and hope we get our guys.

Giantsfan1080
10-23-2011, 11:10 AM
If Blackmon is on the board when we pick then that's absolutely a choice we have to make. It always depends who is on the board of course.

OSUGiants17
10-23-2011, 01:05 PM
This draft has so many guys that I like that could be there in the first 2 rounds that it will be pretty hard for us to have a draft I dislike.

bigbluedefense
10-23-2011, 01:15 PM
I agree. There's a lot of guys I like in this draft. I didn't like last year's draft at all, it was the leftovers from the amazing 2010 draft, but this year is a nice bounceback year for talent in the draft.

OSUGiants17
10-23-2011, 05:46 PM
Yea there are plenty of LBs I would be happy with:
1. Kuechly
2. Burfict
3. Brown
4. Te'o
5. David
6. Cole
7. Kendricks
8. Spence
9. Bradham
10. Gallipo
11. Lewis
12. Tate
13. Carder
14. Acho
15. N. Williams

And I'm sure I missed a few. Plenty of WRs
1. Blackmon
2. Floyd
3. Sanu
4. Toon
5. Criner
6. Childs
7. Wright
8. Fuller

Also plenty of TEs
1. Allen
2. Fleener
3. Egnew
4. Charles
5. Stoneburner

A solid DT class as well
1. Werthy
2. Thompson
3. Crick
4. Harris
5. Still
6. Martin
7. Randall

Not to mention this is also a deep CB class. Reese must be drooling.

bigbluedefense
10-29-2011, 10:37 PM
I'd trade Eli and our 1st for Andrew Luck. Does that make me crazy?

Rosebud
10-29-2011, 11:05 PM
I'd trade Eli and our 1st for Andrew Luck. Does that make me crazy?

Yes. Yes it would.

BaLLiN
11-07-2011, 06:52 PM
Trade Osi for 2nd rounder

1. Vontaze Burfict LB
__An absolute tank, he is actually pretty quick and has good instincts, a bit of a headcase (i.e. stupid penalties, taking plays off) but he looks really special.

2. Mohamed Sanu WR
__Pick compensation for Osi, hope he is there, Hixon is as good as gone, Clayton should be cut, Devin Thomas has been disappointing, and Manningham will need to be resigned. Sanu reminds me a lot of Dwayne Bowe, plays big and has freakish athleticism.

2. Donte Paige-Moss DE
__Giants do what they do and transform athletic freaks into legitimate football players. DL rotation will continue to be scary and gain youth.

3. Jeff Demps RB
__Fast, quick, agile, homerun hitter. Something the giants dont have right now. He's small but averaging 7 ypc in the SEC gives you reassurance that he is battle tested.

4. Omar Bolden CB
__was originally a highly touted recruit, isn't as highly regarded now but has been tested often in the PAC 10, and has been doing pretty well as of late.

5. David Paulson TE
great hands, remember noticing him last year.

6 & 7. Jerry Reese's magic picks

Giantsfan1080
11-07-2011, 06:53 PM
Sanu won't be around in the 2nd.

BaLLiN
11-07-2011, 07:05 PM
1. Alshon Jeffrey
2. Justin Blackmon
3. Michael Floyd

There are 3 WR's that are most likely going ahead of him, Toon and Fuller are both around Sanu but i don't feel like they are on his level. Still, WR's tend to slip and it is really not that far out of question to think that Sanu wont be there early in the 2nd. I don't think we'll see a surprise in the 40 time, probably around a 4.5ish.

Giantsfan1080
11-07-2011, 08:34 PM
1. Alshon Jeffrey
2. Justin Blackmon
3. Michael Floyd

There are 3 WR's that are most likely going ahead of him, Toon and Fuller are both around Sanu but i don't feel like they are on his level. Still, WR's tend to slip and it is really not that far out of question to think that Sanu wont be there early in the 2nd. I don't think we'll see a surprise in the 40 time, probably around a 4.5ish.

I expect late first round for sure. Teams are going to fall in love with him and he's going to be a riser.

Rosebud
11-08-2011, 11:42 AM
So I have watched absolutely no college football so far this year, so can one of you guys who's watched a lot of the top LBs give me some updates on that top crew of Kuechly, Burflict, Teo'o and whoever else is playing their way into the discussion this year? Muchas graz

BaLLiN
11-08-2011, 06:09 PM
So I have watched absolutely no college football so far this year, so can one of you guys who's watched a lot of the top LBs give me some updates on that top crew of Kuechly, Burflict, Teo'o and whoever else is playing their way into the discussion this year? Muchas graz

I still like Burfict better, Kuechly looks slower this year and I haven't seen enough of Teo'o but of what I saw he doesn't wow you as much as Burfict does.

bigbluedefense
11-08-2011, 08:11 PM
We need offensive line help. Diehl has quietly become a mediocre player. He's not even a good LG anymore. Petrus should hopefully replace him in a year or 2.

But we need a LT. I think MIKE, LT, TE, WR, RB, possibly CB and DT.

My favorite WR is Justin Blackmon. What a beast.

Damix
11-09-2011, 08:34 AM
Nicks & Grubbs are FA this year I believe, I wouldn't mind a FA splash for LG. Draft a tackle to replace McKenzie and have pick + Brewer duke it out with Diehl backing up 4 spots on the line.

bigbluedefense
11-09-2011, 09:36 AM
I think we're fine at OG. Snee is a staple of our line, and Petrus will fill in nicely at LG eventually. And we have Boothe for depth. And Baas can play OG as well.

What we need is a backup C to give us some ability to mix and match on the inside, and we need some backup OTs.

Paying for FA olinemen is risky, bc you pay an arm and a leg for em. Look at Baas for example. We had to throw the bank at the guy, he got a sick contract from us bc we were desperate. From a finance perspective, that hurt us.

That's what sucks about FA. You always overpay. Look at Canty, Bernard, Baas, we overpaid for those guys. I'm not saying they're bad players, just that we overpaid for them.

And when you overpay guys, it bites you in the ass when you can't re-sign other guys you really want to bring back.

Giantsfan1080
11-09-2011, 10:24 AM
I thought we got Baas pretty cheap. I believe he's getting paid less than our 4 other OL except for Beatty. Also, we had the McKenzie, Pierce, and Plax FA signing all work out for us. Canty has been worth the money since his first injury plauged year as well. Rolle got a lot but he's been very good.

bigbluedefense
11-09-2011, 10:34 AM
I thought he got like 20 million (Baas)?

I'm not saying all our FA signings were bad. Heck, most if not all were good, it's just that when you do go the FA route, you typically overpay guys.

Take Canty for example, he's great for us, but the truth is, we overpaid for him. We gave him 40 million. We gave him pass rushing DT money. He's not that. He's a solid DT who stuffs the run and provides a decent push, but he's not a force inside. We paid him to be a force inside. We overpaid. Not saying he's not a great contributor, but we did overpay.

Giantsfan1080
11-09-2011, 11:12 AM
I thought he got like 20 million (Baas)?

I'm not saying all our FA signings were bad. Heck, most if not all were good, it's just that when you do go the FA route, you typically overpay guys.

Take Canty for example, he's great for us, but the truth is, we overpaid for him. We gave him 40 million. We gave him pass rushing DT money. He's not that. He's a solid DT who stuffs the run and provides a decent push, but he's not a force inside. We paid him to be a force inside. We overpaid. Not saying he's not a great contributor, but we did overpay.

So who cares if we overpaid anyway though? It's not your money and it hasn't stopped us from going out and signing someone who could help the team. The Smith issue was clearly a medical thing which is why they wanted to limit his dollars.

Baas got $25 million I believe but still only the 4th highest paid lineman on the team.

bigbluedefense
11-11-2011, 12:40 PM
So who cares if we overpaid anyway though? It's not your money and it hasn't stopped us from going out and signing someone who could help the team. The Smith issue was clearly a medical thing which is why they wanted to limit his dollars.

Baas got $25 million I believe but still only the 4th highest paid lineman on the team.

Overpaying is important bc it prevents us from re-signing other guys. Bad contracts gets you in cap hell. Like this offseason, we barely had any money to play around with.

We have some big contracts coming up, Tuck will want to get paid, Thomas, Nicks, we have to figure out something btw Kiwi and Osi, Corey's contract could come up, etc.

We need to really be smart with our money and how we spend it.

BaLLiN
11-14-2011, 07:55 PM
After that game I think we should be looking at RB's. I realize San Fran is one of the best run D's in the league right now, but there were holes and when a runningback gets the edge and goes to the second level, it should be more than a 10 yard run, you dont get alot of those opportunities.

Lamar Miller and Trent Richardson are two guys that I can see as primary runners, it would be nice to stumble upon a guy since we lost out on Murray last year that I know many giants fans were calling for.

D-Unit
11-14-2011, 08:32 PM
After that game I think we should be looking at RB's. I realize San Fran is one of the best run D's in the league right now, but there were holes and when a runningback gets the edge and goes to the second level, it should be more than a 10 yard run, you dont get alot of those opportunities.

Lamar Miller and Trent Richardson are two guys that I can see as primary runners, it would be nice to stumble upon a guy since we lost out on Murray last year that I know many giants fans were calling for.
I would be a sad panda today if Murray ended up on the Giants. Props to you guys for calling it. I know many Cowboys including me, were confused with the pick because of our other perceived greater needs.

If I were you guys... I would look at Doug Martin. I love his RB skills. He could probably be had in the 3rd round.

scottyboy
11-14-2011, 08:40 PM
we really just need more rutgers players. simple as that

LTgiants
11-14-2011, 08:41 PM
I am curious if I am the only one who thinks that Beatty would be better at RT then LT since we are going to need to replace Mckenzie soon. I just have not been impressed with him on the left side.

BaLLiN
11-14-2011, 08:56 PM
I am curious if I am the only one who thinks that Beatty would be better at RT then LT since we are going to need to replace Mckenzie soon. I just have not been impressed with him on the left side.

I feel like the only way that we will get an LT is if we overpay one in FA. Otherwise we've been terrible at developing OL, or at least developing them and keeping them to reap the benefits.

edit: And D-Unit although i like Martin's hard running, i just don't see him as anything more than a career backup or a FB

scottyboy
11-14-2011, 09:09 PM
I feel they want to see if Brewer can develop into K-Mac's future replacement. Again, if any good OL falls to our lap, we're not in a position to pass on one come draft day. Let's be honest, our only major hole right now is at LB. (and that's with wanting to upgrade over Goff or if he's not healthy). When healthy (yeah, obviously huge "if" scenario) we've got talent everywhere all across the board. We could use OL talent and youth. MAYBE a RB, but not early. Perhaps a DE if we deal Osi, but we'd still have 2 elite DE's and a servicable backup in my boy Tolly. Kiwi and Boley seem to really be having outstanding years on the outside spots, and our secondary, even with 2 major injuries, have looked pretty good. We're a team that right now can go with our board of course, but can really afford to take BPA anywhere except pretty much QB in the early rounds.

BaLLiN
11-24-2011, 02:34 PM
If Alshon Jeffrey is there in the first, which is probable, do we take him?

Giantsfan1080
11-25-2011, 06:41 AM
If Alshon Jeffrey is there in the first, which is probable, do we take him?

No, Reese doesn't like players with his type of work ethic.

scottyboy
11-25-2011, 08:51 AM
that and if we keep MM, we wont need a WR with him Nicks and Cruz. And even if we did lose him, we'd still have Barden and JJ, so I really don't see us taking a WR because we've got much bigger holes elsewhere

bigbluedefense
11-25-2011, 11:39 AM
I want a linebacker man. Watching the 49ers last night, and seeing Willis and Bowman out there, can we just have ONE guy like that please? I just want one.

We need a linebacker.

bigbluedefense
11-25-2011, 04:30 PM
I don't get to sit down and watch much college football. In fact, I rarely ever get to sit down and watch a prospect and really scout them. But I am getting a chance to scout this BC/Miami game, and I was watching Luke in particular, and here's what I get from this game:

Luke Keuchly:

Pros: Very instinctive, great form tackling, very good range, smart, can cover sideline to sideline, can play the deep middle (something we desperately need), has great instincts in the run game flowing to the ball carrier, and has great instincts in zone coverage, understanding passing concepts and picking up his guy and running with him. Doesn't over pursue, doesn't miss tackles.

Cons: Size. I'm not sure if he's the 6 3" he's listed as. Could be 6 1". Not sure how long his arms are, they look short, but can't confirm. Can't shed blocks from OGs as well as you'd like. He's a guy who knows how to flow to the RB, but if he has a OL run at him dead on, he lacks the thumping ability to slam into him, engage, and shed. More often than not, he'll lose that battle. Not sure how fast he is. He seems fast enough, but he's definitely not a blazer by any means. He looks like a 4.75 guy to me. So he lacks elite athleticism.

Overall: I think this guy is very good. How good? That will depend on how he tests at the combine. I'm very interested in his official size/speed numbers. He definitely passes the eyeball test, and would be a great addition to our defense. Where he falls in the draft will depend on those numbers. He can play. He reminds me of Sean Lee. I see his game translating to the NFL the same way Sean Lee's game did. So if you like what Sean Lee brings to Dallas, then you'll like Luke Keuchly. He has potential to be better than Lee bc he's just so instinctual.

My favorite part of his game is that he's a tackling machine. We miss way too many tackles as a defense, and tackling is such a lost art, it would go a long way in helping our unit out if we had a tackling machine in the middle like this guy. He may lack the athleticism of a Bowman or Willis, but he has all the intangibles you look for.

Before I hop on the bandwagon and start clamoring for us to move up and get this guy in the 1st however, I need to see his measurables. He has to be adequate in that department. I think he will be. And as of right now, he's the guy I want us to take in the 1st.

He reminds me of Curtis Lofton too.

bigbluedefense
11-25-2011, 04:35 PM
Also, #52 from Miami, Perryman, that guy is gonna be a good player. He has the body you look for, great speed, good instincts, good tackling, he seems like he'll be a guy we talk about 2 years from now as a 1st round pick. He's only a freshman! He's going to be a good one. He already looks the part. If he can stay healthy, develop, and keep his head on straight, I think that guy could be a special one.

And Chris Pantale, the TE from BC who's a junior, he's a potential TE to look at. He has the size, looks fast enough, he seems solid. I need to see more of him though.

bigbluedefense
11-25-2011, 04:38 PM
Pantale is long and rangy. Something I look for in TEs. I wanna see how he times. He seems like he has potential to be a very solid 2nd/3rd round TE for us. Can also hold his own as a blocker. Not a dominant blocker, but he has the tools to become one and he seems willing to block.

He's a junior though, so I'm not sure if he'll come out.

bigbluedefense
11-25-2011, 04:54 PM
Ok I officially love Luke Kuechly.

LonghornsLegend
11-26-2011, 01:22 AM
If Alshon Jeffrey is there in the first, which is probable, do we take him?

How many good WR's do you guys need ha. Nicks is a stud, Cruz is a stud that nobody talks about for some reason, Mario is serviceable and makes big plays in 3 WR sets. I guess I feel like if you have at least two very good WR's that crosses off WR in the 1st.


I wonder if Cruz continues to out produce Nicks this season, if it'll change anyone's minds. Not that it would mean he's better then Nicks, but if he cuts out the mistakes in his game he's been excellent this year.


I would like to see you guys get a Jimmy Graham/Jermichael Finley type of pass catching TE and an offense that utilizes him. I think having a guy like that even helps out a veteran QB like Eli, especially in the red zone or 3rd downs. That opens things up for the rest of the offense.

Giantsfan1080
11-26-2011, 10:25 AM
Ok I officially love Luke Kuechly.

Welcome to the bandwagon!!! The Sean Lee comparison is actually very good.

Giantsfan1080
11-26-2011, 10:27 AM
How many good WR's do you guys need ha. Nicks is a stud, Cruz is a stud that nobody talks about for some reason, Mario is serviceable and makes big plays in 3 WR sets. I guess I feel like if you have at least two very good WR's that crosses off WR in the 1st.


I wonder if Cruz continues to out produce Nicks this season, if it'll change anyone's minds. Not that it would mean he's better then Nicks, but if he cuts out the mistakes in his game he's been excellent this year.


I would like to see you guys get a Jimmy Graham/Jermichael Finley type of pass catching TE and an offense that utilizes him. I think having a guy like that even helps out a veteran QB like Eli, especially in the red zone or 3rd downs. That opens things up for the rest of the offense.

Good call about Cruz. I think we're all just "shocked" at how well he's doing and for some reason don't expect it to continue. He had some silly mistakes earlier in the year as well which cost us a game possibly. I think all in all we just have tempered enthusiasm about Cruz. A TE like that wouldn't do anything for us. We don't call exotic routes for our TE's and it's because we like them to block and run easy routes. A guy like Fleener would fit the best.

touchdownmaker
11-29-2011, 10:39 AM
I'm surprised we are flirting with BPA or LT in the first. It seems pretty clear that the missing piece is a Mike backer. There are some pretty good 4-3 guys to be had in the draft.

Keuchly seems to provide the most versatility. He looks so comfortable in space, his form is impecable, and his game IQ gives us a potential AP guy. We have a good mix of guys in our LB core, but we need that one piece at Mike that will tie it up all together.

Sadly, I haven't seen too many Sun Devil games, so I can't get a good read on Vontaze. His intensity is awesome. He can rush the passer, but his short choppy strides he take while running makes me wonder about the coverage aspect of his game. My gut wants us to draft him over Keuchly, but Keuchly might be the better LB.

Teo seems like the best athlete ofthe bunch, but his tackling, and coverage skills leave me wanting. It just seems that he isn't very comfortable in space. Teo would shine if he were drafted into the right coaching staff. The Ravens should look into bringing him in. Ray Lewis and teh Ravens coaching staff will have that kid balling out. I just don't have the confidence in our staff to coach him up. We need a polished product.

With a solid DL (Austin back off injury), Amukama plus TT, and Webster, good complimentary depth at LB (Williams, Jones, Herzlich) and Boley and Kiwi, a solid SS FS combo, all we need is that Mike. With a complete combo at CB and solid second level will allow Rolle to free lance a lot more going forward.

touchdownmaker
11-29-2011, 10:43 AM
Thoughts on WR. Would we have the money to sign a guy like Desean Jackson? I think he would be that x-factor that we have needed in our passing game. You add his deep threat to the mix, the passing game gets blown wide open for the Nicks, Cruz, and Barden.

I am sure we don't have the cap space, but I thought I would run it by you guys first.

Giantsfan1080
11-29-2011, 11:00 AM
Jackson is the exact opposite of what we look for in a player. No chance in hell they sign him.

LTgiants
11-29-2011, 12:15 PM
We do need to bring in that Desean type of speed though.

Giantsfan1080
11-29-2011, 12:29 PM
Mario is fast enough if we re-sign him.

LTgiants
11-29-2011, 12:30 PM
Mario is fast enough if we re-sign him.

No I mean even more speed. Not just at WR but the entire team.

bigbluedefense
11-29-2011, 01:06 PM
We definitely need more speed in the back 7 on defense.

Giantsfan1080
11-29-2011, 01:39 PM
Got ya. Yeah we could use some burners.

touchdownmaker
11-29-2011, 02:24 PM
No I mean even more speed. Not just at WR but the entire team.

Yes. I think that Reese realizes this. I think it explains his interest in Percy Harvin a few years back, the Jernigan pick, the Scott pick and the Jacqian Williams pick.

In this year's draft, I think that the speed will have to be addressed later in the darft.

First pick needs to be LB, unless we get another gift drop down to us. The second round I assume goes to OL unless a top back that Reese loves drops to us. Everyone says that we might go TE, but I just don't see it. Killdrive doesn't really go to the TE. I imagine Reese does draft a TE, but addresses the position for depth, not impact. I think improving the G/C situation goes lengths in improving the running game. I think they need to get a mauler in the second or third round.

Sadly, Jacobs is only effective once he reaches the second level. He can't create his own holes. Additionally, he give Scott a hole, he will be off to the races.

BaLLiN
11-29-2011, 02:40 PM
Coaching Change:
Coughlin remains HC
DC: Steve Spagnuolo
OC: Kevin Gilbride

FA COMP (2011 FA):

Lost:
Plaxico Burress
Steve Smith
Barry Cofield
Kevin Boss

Signed:
David Baas

Proj:
4th, 6th, 7th

Trade Osi, Trade/Release Jacobs
Theres no way we can afford to keep Osi, and Jacobs is nowhere near worth the money if we want to resign Mario and T2

2012 Draft

1. Riley Reiff OT Iowa
2(Osi).Peter Konz C Wisconsin
2. Vontaze Burfict LB Arizona State
3.(trade up using 4th) David Wilson RB Virginia Tech
4*. Sean Spence OLB/ST Miami
5. Case Keenum QB Houston
6. Omar Bolden CB/KR Arizona State
6*. Jeff Demps RB Florida
7. Greg Childs WR Arkansas
7*. David Paulson TE Oregon

2012 FA Signings:

Wesley Woodyard LB Denver
Geno Hayes OLB Tampa Bay
Ben Grubbs OG Ravens
Wallace Gilberry DE Kansas City
Steve Smith WR Philadelphia

2012 FA Lost:
Devin Thomas
Kareem McKenzie
Jonathan Goff
Brian Jackson
Aaron Ross

2012 FA Resignings:
Mario Manningham
Jake Ballard
Michael Coe
Terrell Thomas

Projected Lineup

QB: Manning, Carr, Keenum
RB: Bradshaw, Ware, Scott, Wilson
FB: Hynoski
TE: Ballard, Pascoe, Paulson
WR: Nicks, Cruz, Manningham, Smith, Barden, Jernigan
LT: Rieff*, Beatty
LG:Grubbs, Boothe
C: Konz, Baas
RG: Snee, Petrus
RT: Diehl, Brewer

RE: JPP, Kiwi, Gilberry, Trattou
UT:Canty, Austin, Bernard
NT:Joseph, Kennedy
LE: Tuck, Kiwi, Tollefson
SLB:Wesley Woodyard, Jacquain Williams, Spence
MLB: Vontaze Burfict, Herzlich, Jones
WLB: Boley, Hayes, Paysinger
CB: Webster, T2, Amukamara, Bruce Johnson, Bolden, Coe
FS: Rolle
SS: Phillips, Grant, Sash, Chad Jones

K: Tynes
P: Weatherford

BigBlueNorwegian
11-29-2011, 02:48 PM
FA COMP:


1. Riley Reiff OT Iowa
2(Osi).Peter Konz C Wisconsin
2. Vontaze Burfict LB Arizona State
3.(trade up using 4th) David Wilson RB Virginia Tech
4*. Sean Spence OLB/ST Miami
5. Case Keenum QB Houston
6. Omar Bolden CB/KR Arizona State
6*. Jeff Demps RB Florida
7. Greg Childs WR Arkansas
7*. David Paulson TE Oregon

This would make me Jizz all over Northern Europe. But as of now, I really doubt that Reiff or Burfict would be there where we're picking in the first and second round, respectively.

Love the David Wilson pick!

BaLLiN
11-29-2011, 03:24 PM
I definitely think that moving Diehl next to Snee will help, those two will feed off each other. Our line would be significantly better at run blocking.

Rosebud
12-10-2011, 01:50 AM
If come draft time it looks like there's little to no chance of Kuechly falling to our pick would you guys like the idea of us giving up a Julio Jones-esque package for Matt Kalil? Kalil-Petrus-Baas-Snee-Beatty/Diehl would certainly fix our running game, give Eli some time in the pocket and make us a much tougher and more exhausting offense to play against.

Does anyone else get the feeling that Boley might get moved to MIKE? Guy already is the brains of our LB corps, our best backer and the guy least likely to leave the field. If Williams can flash some more to close the season we would even already have the speedy WILL to step into Boley's spot in house. Just need to figure out what to do at the SAM so that Kiwi and Sintim can go back to playing with their hand in the dirt.

Rosebud
12-10-2011, 01:53 AM
PS Ballin I'm all for rebuilding the OL, but there's no way the team is going to go and spend the money it would take to bring Grubbs in and then draft a Center. With Snee and Baas already on board bringing in a third high price interior OL is just not realistic. I'm pretty sure that next season our interior OL will look like Petrus-Baas-Snee at some point.

Big_Pete
12-11-2011, 12:41 AM
PS Ballin I'm all for rebuilding the OL, but there's no way the team is going to go and spend the money it would take to bring Grubbs in and then draft a Center. With Snee and Baas already on board bringing in a third high price interior OL is just not realistic. I'm pretty sure that next season our interior OL will look like Petrus-Baas-Snee at some point.

I also think the interior is pretty set with a combination of Snee, Baas, Boothe and Petrus inside, although we will need to look for more depth to develop,

Offensive tackle is more interesting. Do we look to bring McKenzie back for a one year deal? Do we move Diehl to RT?

Is there enough seen in Beatty that we could expect him to step up?

I could see us looking at an OT in free agency like Demetrius Bell?
Heck do we look at a guy like Guy Whimper who could compete with Beatty for the starting spot?

Giantsfan1080
01-04-2012, 05:11 PM
More and more people saying Kuechly is staying at BC. We might have to find another man crush. Burfict brings the athleticism and physicality I love to see at LB but I'm worried he's going to piss a lot of guys off. I'm sure Reese and Ross will perform their due diligence on him though.

BaLLiN
01-11-2012, 04:09 AM
I dont know why but I just don't like Kuechly that much. Remember how everyone believed that Brandon Spikes would be basically as good as McClain? And no one wanted any of the PSU linebackers? I feel similarly about Kuechly.

I know Burfict is the sexier pick, has a lot more problems, but I just am a little turned off by Kuechly because I don't think he's worth it. Now I am willing to bet that Burfict will be there in the second, why not wait a round? I need convincing to do otherwise, but I stand strong on Burfict in the second.

With our first, I hope we can land Reiff. Doubt it, but then again Bulaga fell quite a bit too. I think center is out of the question now, despite how average Baas is. Boothe should be the starter with petrus at guard and diehl at RT (McKenzie is a FA this offseason).

Anyone like Lamar Miller? or is the standpoint still that RB's can be found anywhere, no need to draft one in the first. Id be more than fine with it, but upset if we ignored OL.

Giantsfan1080
01-11-2012, 08:01 AM
Baas has been very good since the 2nd half of the Jets game. In going back and watching the game on Sunday the only problem we have right now is RT.

Kuechly reminds me of a better more instinctive Chad Greenway. He's going to get plugged in and make 100 tackles every year without question. He'd a perfect fit for what we like to do as well.

I like Miller on the next level but not enough to spend a high pick on. We should never spend a high pick on a RB plus I'm going to hold out hope the Ravens don't re-sign or franchise Ray Rice and miraculously we get him.

I don't see Reiff or Kuechly falling to us though and I'm not sure if Reese ever really wants to trade up in the 1st unless he thinks there is a really special player out there.

bigbluedefense
01-11-2012, 12:59 PM
Has Luke declared?

I'm all aboard the Keuchly bandwagon. I think he's going to be great. He may not be a world beater athlete, but he's a tackling machine, he's smart, instinctual, and he's very good in coverage despite average athleticism. He can cover the deep middle, that's what we need.

Burfict, I'm 50/50 on him as of right now. From what I've seen, he has horrible tackling technique, freelances too much, overshoots gaps, and is too wild. He has more potential and could be a stud if coached up and controlled, but I don't know if that's possible. He's not a finished product.

There are a couple of players I really like. Keuchly is my favorite, I love DeCastro, love Konz, and one of my sleepers is a CB from Texas A&M, Coryell Judie. He's going to be a very good CB. And he can be had in round 3. Maybe round 4.

I saw Judie last year when I was scouting Von Miller, and I instantly gravitated towards Judie. Been keeping tabs on him since then and I think he has the athleticism and ability to be a very good CB in this league. I think he's going to be a mid round steal for somebody.

Giantsfan1080
01-11-2012, 01:08 PM
Kuechly has declared.

I like a lot of OL in this draft. From what I've seen so far all the top guys like DeCastro, Konz, Martin, and Reiff all look pretty good to me. I think this might a very strong year in that department where you can't go wrong if you get any of them.

bigbluedefense
01-11-2012, 01:10 PM
I have a bad feeling Luke is going to be an Eagle.

If we want him we're going to have to move up in the 1st and get him bc if he's on the board when the Eagles pick, they're taking him.

Unless Fat Andy falls in love with DeCastro or Konz, which is very plausible considering his love for trench players.

Giantsfan1080
01-11-2012, 01:19 PM
Yeah Luke won't be there for us anymore. I can see him in an Eagles uniform. Maybe they let D-Jack walk and draft a WR though.

bigbluedefense
01-11-2012, 01:22 PM
The only way we get Luke is if we finally move up in the 1st. It will probably require us to trade Osi for a 2nd this year (which will probably happen anyway), and use our 1st and 2nd to move up in the 1st to get Luke.

We are so desperate for a MIKE I think its a move that has to be done. We can't ignore this position any longer.

Giantsfan1080
01-11-2012, 01:27 PM
Naa we're not getting Osi for a 2nd. We couldn't get that much for him this year and we're certainly not going to get it now a year later.

bigbluedefense
01-11-2012, 01:32 PM
Naa we're not getting Osi for a 2nd. We couldn't get that much for him this year and we're certainly not going to get it now a year later.

NE and Baltimore both offered a late 2nd for him in the offseason. We'll get a mid 2nd for him. Pass rushers are hard to find and Osi is still a top tier pass rusher. Someone will bite and give up a 2nd for him.

Think about it, we got offered a late 2nd in the offseason after the draft and FA, when teams already used up all their resources for the season. Come this offseason when teams have a fresh new budget, we'll surely land better compensation for the guy.

Giantsfan1080
01-11-2012, 01:48 PM
I couldn't disagree more. He's a year older, had knee surgery, whined like a little girl for a few months, and still wants to get paid as a top 5 DE. All this is coming from probably the biggest Osi Giants fan here. He's worth a 3rd at best.

bigbluedefense
01-11-2012, 01:49 PM
Osi on 1 leg is better than Ray Edwards ever was in his life. If teams like ATL will pay for a mediocre DE talent like Edwards, someone will offer up that 2nd rounder for a guy like Osi.

Especially if he continues to play well in the playoffs.

bigbluedefense
01-11-2012, 01:59 PM
Did Chris Pantale declare? The TE from BC who's from north Jersey?

He's another guy on my radar. Love him. He's got a lot of Fleener in him.

OSUGiants17
01-11-2012, 03:47 PM
The only way we get Luke is if we finally move up in the 1st. It will probably require us to trade Osi for a 2nd this year (which will probably happen anyway), and use our 1st and 2nd to move up in the 1st to get Luke.

We are so desperate for a MIKE I think its a move that has to be done. We can't ignore this position any longer.

I would love that. Trade Osi/a 2nd rounder we get from him and our 1st for a 1st/LK. Have Kiwi with his hand in the dirt a lot more next year and role with Boley-Kuechly-Williams with Kiwi rotating from DE to LB throughout the game.

scottyboy
01-11-2012, 03:58 PM
if MM walks do we look at a WR? like Sanu. or...Sanu?

NY+Giants=NYG
01-11-2012, 04:07 PM
I would love Sanu on this team! Give me an offensive player, hopefully a trench player.

Giantsfan1080
01-11-2012, 04:45 PM
Sanu and Cruz every game? I'd lose my voice.

Big_Pete
01-11-2012, 04:52 PM
I have been thinking of S Mark Barron as a first round pick possibility.

A lot of people may disagree but safety is a possible need. We do use three safety sets and Grant likely won't be back, plus Phillips is off contract after the season. Even if Phillips is back, we use quite a lot of three safety sets.

We do have serious coverage issues (particularly deep), so upgrading the secondary needs to happen and Barron could be the best player available.

We can get a decent LB either in free agency or later rounds of the draft.

I expect we will be able to keep either Thomas or Ross.

BaLLiN
01-11-2012, 07:00 PM
I just don't think Kuechly is worth a first If we could get Burfict in the second. Yes he overshoots and doesn't wrap up sometimes, but some of the plays he makes just blow my mind. I am willing to take a risk with him.

As far as Osi, I could very easily see him netting a 2nd, but then I can also see us getting shafted and no one offering more than a 4th. He showed a lot these past few games, he didn't only arc using speed rushing, but he collapsed the pocket, he stunted, he showed a variety of things. If I don't get a mid 2nd offer, I'm keeping him. He's worth more to us than a 2nd when he is playing. Things to think about, he has 10 sacks (including postseason thus far). HE PLAYED 10 GAMES! I know numbers can be misleading, but its also misleading because he wasn't on the field that much and still got his numbers. He's ranked #2 as a passrusher on PFF, which tells you he's been pretty efficient for how much he's been on the field. He's shown up in a big way this year.

I dont know about you, but I think Eli needs to keep this receiving core. MM needs to be retained, he and Eli have a special chemistry, he just needs to stay healthy and catch with his hands and not his body all the time. He looks like he has T-Rex arms for christ's sake. Nicks, Cruz, and Manningham each bring something different to the table and are lethal sometimes.

One thing I'll give you all to think about, besides Ray Rice which will never happen, is Jermichael Finley. I feel like he doesn't want to be in Green Bay. He doesn't get the targets, he doesn't produce as much, and I think he is very discouraged by seeing all the other receivers around him go ham. We use TE's as jokers, we aren't as resourceful as Green Bay, but we've also never had an athlete like this at the TE position (shockey was pretty damn good though). Itd help us maintain this vertical passing game by keeping the safeties aware of him, and if they don't honor him he will get his.

BBD, as much as I love Konz and wish we could get rid of Baas for him, its never going to happen. Reiff is the only OL i like this year besides Konz and Zeitler to a degree. We're likely going to have to find a tackle in FA.

Big_Pete
01-11-2012, 07:56 PM
I just don't think Kuechly is worth a first If we could get Burfict in the second. Yes he overshoots and doesn't wrap up sometimes, but some of the plays he makes just blow my mind. I am willing to take a risk with him.

As far as Osi, I could very easily see him netting a 2nd, but then I can also see us getting shafted and no one offering more than a 4th. He showed a lot these past few games, he didn't only arc using speed rushing, but he collapsed the pocket, he stunted, he showed a variety of things. If I don't get a mid 2nd offer, I'm keeping him. He's worth more to us than a 2nd when he is playing. Things to think about, he has 10 sacks (including postseason thus far). HE PLAYED 10 GAMES! I know numbers can be misleading, but its also misleading because he wasn't on the field that much and still got his numbers. He's ranked #2 as a passrusher on PFF, which tells you he's been pretty efficient for how much he's been on the field. He's shown up in a big way this year.

I dont know about you, but I think Eli needs to keep this receiving core. MM needs to be retained, he and Eli have a special chemistry, he just needs to stay healthy and catch with his hands and not his body all the time. He looks like he has T-Rex arms for christ's sake. Nicks, Cruz, and Manningham each bring something different to the table and are lethal sometimes.

One thing I'll give you all to think about, besides Ray Rice which will never happen, is Jermichael Finley. I feel like he doesn't want to be in Green Bay. He doesn't get the targets, he doesn't produce as much, and I think he is very discouraged by seeing all the other receivers around him go ham. We use TE's as jokers, we aren't as resourceful as Green Bay, but we've also never had an athlete like this at the TE position (shockey was pretty damn good though). Itd help us maintain this vertical passing game by keeping the safeties aware of him, and if they don't honor him he will get his.

BBD, as much as I love Konz and wish we could get rid of Baas for him, its never going to happen. Reiff is the only OL i like this year besides Konz and Zeitler to a degree. We're likely going to have to find a tackle in FA.


I don't think Kuechly will either be available when we pick or considered the best player available on our board. I think the front office generally like our young LBs. The question will be do we resign Goff, bring in a vet or move Boley inside and upgrade WLB (either draft or free agency).

If we trade Osi (even if we don't), I think we look at a DE at some point,
(Maybe some like Arkansas DE Jake Bequette around the 3rd round)

Osi will be interesting. I think we likely trade him, but we could also just give him a reasonable extension. I think Kiwanuka will continue his hybrid role for us.
If we do trade Osi, I wonder if we could package our second round pick with Osi for a late first?

BaLLiN
01-12-2012, 01:31 AM
I don't think Kuechly will either be available when we pick or considered the best player available on our board. I think the front office generally like our young LBs. The question will be do we resign Goff, bring in a vet or move Boley inside and upgrade WLB (either draft or free agency).

If we trade Osi (even if we don't), I think we look at a DE at some point,
(Maybe some like Arkansas DE Jake Bequette around the 3rd round)

Osi will be interesting. I think we likely trade him, but we could also just give him a reasonable extension. I think Kiwanuka will continue his hybrid role for us.
If we do trade Osi, I wonder if we could package our second round pick with Osi for a late first?

I doubt he goes that much before pick 20, its not the greatest draft for elite talent, but he's not going to test incredibly well and right now his stock is most likely mid-first round anyway. I also do think our staff likes all of the linebackers we have, even Goff, but Goff shouldn't be resigned. A guy with an ACL injury with below average lateral agility? That doesn't sound too good to me.

I agree about DE, but If we draft a LB and trade Osi, Kiwi needs to moved back to DE full time. Kiwi is probably our best run defending DE from observation, yes Tuck is great but Kiwanuka has been phenomenal and stayed healthy. Let's be honest, Kiwi is an athlete, but he's nowhere near agile enough to play in space more than occasionally.

Id rather have the pick, I just am not as excited about these prospects so unless we have someone specific in mind, it makes no sense to only get one pick. I just don't see huge gaps in talent levels.

And GF, I just love his (Lamar Miller's) burst. He is extremely patient, elusive, but powerful. He is an all around back, and even though I do believe Scott could be something in the future, I feel like he's worth it because he is a sure thing.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 12:56 PM
Is it too early?

Let's be honest, we can draft 7 duds and still not be angry this year. But now that the season is over, we gotta focus on the offseason.

Luke Keuchly is a pipe dream, so basically I see 2 options for us with LB: Vontaze Burfict, or sign Curtis Lofton. I prefer signing Curtis Lofton, I'm a huge Lofton fan, but I'm not sure if the economics of it is plausible, nor am I sure if he leaves ATL to begin with.

We need a C and OT, potentially a WR, definitely a TE with Beckum tearing his ACL and Ballard hurting his knee, and I want some new RBs too.

Basically outside of MIKE, all our needs are on offense. I think MIKE is an absolute need, I would like to re-sign Ross for the right price, but even if we lose him and we re-sign TT to a incentive laden contract, we should be alright at CB, we're fine at safety, OLB is fine with Boley and Williams, although I wouldn't mind a OLB either, dline is set even if we lose Osi, although another DE never hurts.

But for the most part, I want us to focus on offense. We need to replenish the offense with some young talent. That's why I'm hoping we sign Lofton so we can focus on offense throughout the draft.

A guy I really want is Konz. I know it won't happen, but I think C is now the most important position along the oline (LT is overrated to me). Baas has been awful all season, he's as mediocre as they come, and I think Konz is the next Nick Mangold.

But reallstically, it's not happening. So we should look at some OTs, check out Burfict, look at TEs like Fleener, but if all else fails, just go BPA.

scottyboy
02-06-2012, 01:03 PM
honestly....I don't think we need a MIKE. Roll with Chase. I'm dead serious. Kiwi-Chase-Boley is fine with me. And I'm serious.

I want OL and TE. Those are my 2 main areas of concern. WR if we don't bring Manningham back. Also wouldn't mind a mid-round corner

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 01:06 PM
I love Chase as you know. But I rather have him as our primary backup. Even if we draft a MIKE, chances are he won't start right away, Chase will anyway. We always grandfather in our rookies.

A stud MIKE will take this defense to the next level. It's the only missing piece.

I say re-sign Chase, cut Jones, draft another MIKE or sign Lofton.

DI
02-06-2012, 01:15 PM
I'd like to go after Dan Connor. Hes been a 4th linebacker for a good portion of his career and I feel he could be great for us as our starting MIKE. I'd like to sign him, re-sign Chase, re-sign TT, let Ross walk, try and see if we can keep Osi here and then I'd like to see us maybe give Fleener a look at #32.

BigBlueNorwegian
02-06-2012, 01:16 PM
If Manningham walks in FA, I want Juron Criner to replace him. I don't really know all that much about his intangibles or his personality, but he played like a stud all week long at the senior bowl.

You guys have covered the other needs in the previous posts here. I would assume we go offense with our 1st round pick, maybe a TE? I Like Egnew and Fleener especially. People underrates Fleeners athleticism IMO.

OSUGiants17
02-06-2012, 03:34 PM
After the injuries to Beckum and Ballard last night, and PAscoe and Beckum being FA's I see us taking Fleener at 32.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 03:46 PM
After the injuries to Beckum and Ballard last night, and PAscoe and Beckum being FA's I see us taking Fleener at 32.

I'm still rooting for us to grab Kuechly, Burflict or one of the OTs.

touchdownmaker
02-06-2012, 03:50 PM
Scotty, I love your insight, but the thought of Chase starting at Mike made me throwup in my mouth a little. A Mike is the missing piece. Fleener would be perfect for what we ask our TE to do, however we find the TE's easily so no need to use a pick on the spot when we have more pressing issues. Mike OT/G/C needs to be addressed.

Now If we trade Osi and move Kiwi back to DE (he has some scheme versatility because he can drop back in cover) keep Boley at Mike and then bring in Zach Brown. I really love Brown's speed. He would give us so much flexibility, and you have Williams as well. Burfit would be perfect though. Boley and Williams at the flanks.

If Mario leaves, I think we can find replacements in what I think is a deep draft at WR. I like Tommy Streeter, and Brain Quick in the third round.

OSUGiants17
02-06-2012, 03:51 PM
I'm still rooting for us to grab Kuechly, Burflict or one of the OTs.

You know I love Luke and Taze, but they will most likely both be gone(and we can get Lofton in FA). When it comes to OT, Kalil, Reiff, Martin, Adams will all be gone, who else is worth a first rounder? Konz would be a good pick, if he is still there. Reese loves BPA though and Fleener is a great talent and would be a good value/need pick. Also, after seeing these two tight ends last night, maybe they realize we could use one.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 04:30 PM
You know I love Luke and Taze, but they will most likely both be gone(and we can get Lofton in FA). When it comes to OT, Kalil, Reiff, Martin, Adams will all be gone, who else is worth a first rounder? Konz would be a good pick, if he is still there. Reese loves BPA though and Fleener is a great talent and would be a good value/need pick. Also, after seeing these two tight ends last night, maybe they realize we could use one.

I think that Glenn and Osemele are also first round caliber RTs and would love to stick one of them next to Petrus-Baas-Snee. Yeah Diehl's not the best LT, but he's alright and a solid run blocker, let him battle with Beatty and Brewer for the spot over the summer and then go after an LT if we need on next year.

Konz on the otherhand I'm not in love with for us just because I don't see us cutting Baas any time soon and think that if he's healthy next year Baas will make us not want to replace him. Realistically I think we just sit tight and nab the best falling talent at any of the positions we value this year.

scottyboy
02-06-2012, 04:33 PM
Scotty, I love your insight, but the thought of Chase starting at Mike made me throwup in my mouth a little. A Mike is the missing piece. Fleener would be perfect for what we ask our TE to do, however we find the TE's easily so no need to use a pick on the spot when we have more pressing issues. Mike OT/G/C needs to be addressed.

Now If we trade Osi and move Kiwi back to DE (he has some scheme versatility because he can drop back in cover) keep Boley at Mike and then bring in Zach Brown. I really love Brown's speed. He would give us so much flexibility, and you have Williams as well. Burfit would be perfect though. Boley and Williams at the flanks.

If Mario leaves, I think we can find replacements in what I think is a deep draft at WR. I like Tommy Streeter, and Brain Quick in the third round.

I know, I over-react, I just love me some Chase. I also seriously feel that TE and OL tale precedent over replacing Chase. We can easily upgrade over him, yes, but I feel that if it plays out where we can upgrade at TE and OL, grab a quick CB and WR if MM leaves, or even keeping MM and it leaves us with Chase as our starting MIKE, i'd be perfectly fine with that

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 05:01 PM
The thing is, we have another year of Perry Fewell, and while I applaud him for changing towards the end of the season, he's still going to try to run more Tampa 2 next year. And if we're going to run more Tampa, we might as well get a linebacker who can actually cover that deep middle.

Or else we're going to have the SAME arguments over our defense AGAIN for the 4th straight year. I just want us to fix that so we can move on already. We've ignored it long enough.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 05:16 PM
The thing is, we have another year of Perry Fewell, and while I applaud him for changing towards the end of the season, he's still going to try to run more Tampa 2 next year. And if we're going to run more Tampa, we might as well get a linebacker who can actually cover that deep middle.

Or else we're going to have the SAME arguments over our defense AGAIN for the 4th straight year. I just want us to fix that so we can move on already. We've ignored it long enough.

Agreed. Especially since we've got a pretty solid LB corps now. With Boley and Jacquain as great coverage guys and Kiwi for the base package our OLB are in a pretty good place. We've even got some solid depth and youngins we're developing we just need that fast and fluid MIKE to make it all fit. If we add Lofton, Kuechly or Burflict to what we have right now we'll have a strong LB corps.

Leaving OT, RB and whatever massive gaping hole appears next season as our biggest needs.

D-Unit
02-06-2012, 05:39 PM
I heard on the radio and I totally agree.... Colin Cowherd said if you guys had a TE like a Jimmy Graham you'd be unstoppable. Scary thought.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 05:42 PM
I heard on the radio and I totally agree.... Colin Cowherd said if you guys had a TE like a Jimmy Graham you'd be unstoppable. Scary thought.

We all would love a TE like that, but it just doesn't seem to be part of this system. The TE will never be a big part of this system, even though I'd kill to have a TE like that bc it would open up our WRs soooo much.

Gronk is actually a perfect TE for our system bc he's a 2 way guy, but there's only 1 Gronk in the league. Fleener seems to be the closest thing to that, but I need to scout him more.

I really liked the TE from BC, but he didn't declare.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-06-2012, 06:15 PM
I hope we can draft a TE. Are we content with Bear and Ballard. Ballard's knee I hope can heal and be fine. Beckum's injury is troublesome, and not sure if he will be ready now since the injury happened so late. I'd hope we can get a TE that can certainly help us and make us even better on offense!

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 06:16 PM
Shock of the century. NYG wants us to draft offense lol.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-06-2012, 06:28 PM
Shock of the century. NYG wants us to draft offense lol.

Well I been saying it, and we have gone defense. When we did with Nicks I was very happy. Again, if the best player, like this past year with prince drops and we can't pass then defense is obviously fine.

However, we can get OL help which is key. At some point RB or TE would be nice to address as well.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 06:32 PM
Well I been saying it, and we have gone defense. When we did with Nicks I was very happy. Again, if the best player, like this past year with prince drops and we can't pass then defense is obviously fine.

However, we can get OL help which is key. At some point RB or TE would be nice to address as well.

This year, I actually agree with you. I want us to retool the offense with a lot of young talent.

However, I still feel that MIKE is our biggest need and if the right one is available in FA or in the 1st round of the draft, I think we have to pull the trigger.

But other than that, as long as we can re-sign our core guys defensively, I think this has to be a offense heavy draft.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-06-2012, 06:40 PM
This year, I actually agree with you. I want us to retool the offense with a lot of young talent.

However, I still feel that MIKE is our biggest need and if the right one is available in FA or in the 1st round of the draft, I think we have to pull the trigger.

But other than that, as long as we can re-sign our core guys defensively, I think this has to be a offense heavy draft.

I just don't want us to be complacent. I don't want the mentality, hey it's ok everything is fine, Eli will make things better when in reality. We may lose MM, so we need another home run threat.

- TE is a big need who can create mismatches especially now that Beckum is hurt big time.

- RB is a need because not sure what's going to happen with Jacobs, Bradshaw is good but injury prone, and Ward is Mr. Concussion.

- Our OL is going to be HUGE issue. Our tackles and guard could use an upgrade. If we want balanced we can't be LAST yet again.

We have some things we def. need to upgrade. That's my side of the ball, and I want it upgraded. Maybe someone who can be that speedy kick returner. I doubt Hixon is coming back. Steve Smith can for cheap, and come in as a 3rd round guy. But I wouldn't replace him for MM, we still need a home run threat if MM goes.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 06:43 PM
I just don't want us to be complacent. I don't want the mentality, hey it's ok everything is fine, Eli will make things better when in reality. We may lose MM, so we need another home run threat.

- TE is a big need who can create mismatches especially now that Beckum is hurt big time.

- RB is a need because not sure what's going to happen with Jacobs, Bradshaw is good but injury prone, and Ward is Mr. Concussion.

- Our OL is going to be HUGE issue. Our tackles and guard could use an upgrade. If we want balanced we can't be LAST yet again.

We have some things we def. need to upgrade. That's my side of the ball, and I want it upgraded. Maybe someone who can be that speedy kick returner. I doubt Hixon is coming back. Steve Smith can for cheap, and come in as a 3rd round guy. But I wouldn't replace him for MM, we still need a home run threat if MM goes.

Which is EXACTLY why we need a MIKE. We have absolutely no one at MIKE right now. Just bc we won a SB with Chase Blackburn at MIKE doesn't mean it can happen again.

I trust Eli to make the offense work no matter who is out there. But we absolutely cannot go into next year with just Chase Blackburn at MIKE. I love Chase, I want him back on the roster, but I don't want him starting next year. He's a great backup/STer who can step in at any moment. But we need a MIKE.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 06:45 PM
And let's be real, Beckum is NOT a loss. He sucks. We wanted him cut. Losing him to an ACL isn't the end of the world. We can draft a guy in the 4th round as a replacement.

We need RBs, but RBs can be found anywhere anytime. We need a WR if Mario leaves, but with so many FA Wrs on the market, I'm hoping we can re-sign him for a reasonable contract.

So really, if we can't land that MIKE we need, we can go either Fleener in the 1st or best available olinemen early on. Bc we need oline help.

But MIKE is still our biggest need.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-06-2012, 07:08 PM
Which is EXACTLY why we need a MIKE. We have absolutely no one at MIKE right now. Just bc we won a SB with Chase Blackburn at MIKE doesn't mean it can happen again.

I trust Eli to make the offense work no matter who is out there. But we absolutely cannot go into next year with just Chase Blackburn at MIKE. I love Chase, I want him back on the roster, but I don't want him starting next year. He's a great backup/STer who can step in at any moment. But we need a MIKE.

We have Jones, Mark H and JG and Chase. Not sure if Chase is going to come back, but what we need is to develop our players. Now if there is a Mike we can get him later on in the draft. Eventually we need to develop our LBs. It would be nice to keep one system, and not change DCs, I believe that impacted us on that side of the ball.

I still don't like how we blow coverages, so I am not sure about Fewell. I think we got healthy and simplified things, but I am still unsure about him. I think specifically he relies on the 4 man rush WAY to much. If the rush doesn't get there we are toast! You can't keep expecting the rush to control the game each and every game. Tim Lewis did that and that didn't end well.

But it's hard for us to develop players with flux among our coaches on the defensive side of the ball. If a MIKE is there later on fine, I am down with drafting one, but let's develop the collection we have as well.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-06-2012, 07:12 PM
And let's be real, Beckum is NOT a loss. He sucks. We wanted him cut. Losing him to an ACL isn't the end of the world. We can draft a guy in the 4th round as a replacement.

We need RBs, but RBs can be found anywhere anytime. We need a WR if Mario leaves, but with so many FA Wrs on the market, I'm hoping we can re-sign him for a reasonable contract.

So really, if we can't land that MIKE we need, we can go either Fleener in the 1st or best available olinemen early on. Bc we need oline help.

But MIKE is still our biggest need.

He does suck, but we were starting to use him in the post season. He was a tendency breaker used in the post season which did interest me if he can take that step. Now with an ACL screw that experiment, I don't want him or Hixon back. TT is a question mark as well messing up the same knee. So I am not keen on bringing back damaged goods.

I think OL is our biggest need. Our tackles, especially KM is a concern, and he is a free agent. Boothe def. can be upgraded, and I still want to see more of Baas. He needs to stay healthy for a season too! But we have a QB in his prime in a system where we have a lot of 5 and 7 step drops. So we need time for Eli to throw the ball.

Also, we want balanced so we need to be able to run the ball especially SHORT YARDAGE which has been a mess! OL to be is a huge need, especially if we don't want to be last in running the ball.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 07:14 PM
We have Jones, Mark H and JG and Chase. Not sure if Chase is going to come back, but what we need is to develop our players. Now if there is a Mike we can get him later on in the draft. Eventually we need to develop our LBs. It would be nice to keep one system, and not change DCs, I believe that impacted us on that side of the ball.

I still don't like how we blow coverages, so I am not sure about Fewell. I think we got healthy and simplified things, but I am still unsure about him. I think specifically he relies on the 4 man rush WAY to much. If the rush doesn't get there we are toast! You can't keep expecting the rush to control the game each and every game. Tim Lewis did that and that didn't end well.

But it's hard for us to develop players with flux among our coaches on the defensive side of the ball. If a MIKE is there later on fine, I am down with drafting one, but let's develop the collection we have as well.

Those linebackers are the definition of mediocre. Jones will be cut next year, Herzlich will get 1 more year to get healthy, Chase is going to be our primary backup and Goff is a FA coming off an ACL.

None of those guys are starting caliber, and none of them ever will be. We need a MIKE. In a perfect world we sign Curtis Lofton and go offense the whole draft, but it's probably unrealistic.

OSUGiants17
02-06-2012, 07:17 PM
Right now here a realistic draft for us that I would love:
1. Fleener
2. Adcock
3. Joe Adams
4. Kheeston Randall
5. Moe Petrus
6. Justin Francis
7. BPA

Sign Lofton, resign TT, Ballard, Blackburn, Tolly, Tryon, Weatherford, Thomas, and McKenzie

NY+Giants=NYG
02-06-2012, 07:23 PM
Those linebackers are the definition of mediocre. Jones will be cut next year, Herzlich will get 1 more year to get healthy, Chase is going to be our primary backup and Goff is a FA coming off an ACL.

None of those guys are starting caliber, and none of them ever will be. We need a MIKE. In a perfect world we sign Curtis Lofton and go offense the whole draft, but it's probably unrealistic.

If that's the case and it unfolds like you say, then it becomes a priority. But let's see what happens. FA starts in March 13 I think, so let's see how it unfolds.

Honestly, we can have Willis or every All pro but this fool starts going with 3 man rushes and messed up communication or teachings in the secondary, we still will blow coverages. I think we have nearly every game, but somehow managed to win them all, which is great, but also alarming.

I am very interested in what we do with our free agents. What happens with osi and jacobs? That's important, and what if JPP wants his pay day? Do we rip up his contract and once again front load his pay day? Take the hit early, so as he gets older, it helps us out?

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 10:15 AM
If that's the case and it unfolds like you say, then it becomes a priority. But let's see what happens. FA starts in March 13 I think, so let's see how it unfolds.

Honestly, we can have Willis or every All pro but this fool starts going with 3 man rushes and messed up communication or teachings in the secondary, we still will blow coverages. I think we have nearly every game, but somehow managed to win them all, which is great, but also alarming.

I am very interested in what we do with our free agents. What happens with osi and jacobs? That's important, and what if JPP wants his pay day? Do we rip up his contract and once again front load his pay day? Take the hit early, so as he gets older, it helps us out?

What do we have to wait and see for? Even if Jones is retained he wasn't good this season, Herzlich's the definition of massive question mark and Goff is coming off of an ACL tear that could easily limit his play immensely. Those guys just don't have the athleticism and fluidity to be much better than Chase, unless Herzlich gets back to where he was before the cancer. MIKE is a concern heading into this offseason.

As for RB is anyone else excited to see what Scott can do next year? If we can find a godo young bruiser in the draft I think our RBs would be pretty set with Bradshaw and Scott to go alongside a new big guy. Especially if Baas stays healthy, Petrus takes over at LG and we draft or sign a good OT.

That's why my realistic dream draft has us getting a first round OT, either one who falls to us or more exclusively RT guy like Glenn or Osemele. TE or DL in the second and third and then snag a big runner on day 3.

BaLLiN
02-07-2012, 10:24 AM
I do think we need a TE, badly. It isn't necessary essential with Eli's progression, but it will open up a lot of space in the deep middle as well as the space underneath the safeties.

Kevin Boss had some speed and more importantly some height. He drew the safety which opened up space deep for our receivers. The TE is becoming prominent for a reason, it is hard to matchup to athletic tightends.

Instead of drafting Fleener, why not take a look at Finley? He will cost some money, but he is beginning to be severely undervalued. He is the proven commodity, a vet, and will only be 25 next season. His drops are concerning, but a lot of times, Rodgers is making catches tougher on him it seems, this was especially apparent in our game vs. the packers in the playoffs.

Another thing is, I am not so sure I would trade Osi, kindof on the fence. He overshot Brady a lot, but his first step is incredible and is definitely in the QB's head. On Tuck's sack on the Pat's final drive, Osi collapsed the pocket and pushed the OT in causing Brady to begin to move for a clean pocket, right into Tuck. Then again, Osi isn't going to be a full time player on our team and his contract is only one more year. He will be 31 next season as well.

Looking at potential trading partners:

St. Louis (2-14)
Indianapolis (2-14)
Minnesota (3-13)
Tampa Bay (4-12)
Cleveland (4-12)
Jacksonville (5-11)
Washington (5-11)
Carolina (6-10)
Buffalo (6-10)
Miami (6-10)
Seattle (7-9)
Kansas City (7-9)
Dallas (8-8)
Philadelphia (8-8)
New York Jets (8-8)
New England - from Oakland (8-8)
San Diego (8-8)
Chicago (8-8)
Philadelphia - from Arizona (8-8)
Tennessee (9-7)
Cincinnati* (9-7)
Detroit* (10-6)
Atlanta* (10-6)
Pittsburgh* (12-4)
Denver* (8-8)
Houston* (10-6)
New Orleans* (13-3)
Green Bay* (15-1)
Baltimore* (12-4)
San Francisco* (13-3)
New England* (13-3)
New York Giants*(9-7)

Of the Bolded, I think we eliminate all NFC teams. If Jason Taylor retires Miami could be a landing point, and also the Bills who have went from 3-4 to back to a 4-3 again, it was apparent they were in dire need of a passrusher. The Bills are the team i would try to trade to because Osi would probably have his best chance to start and make an impact on a team that should've made the playoffs.

I also don't think we keep Jacobs, I am not sure what happens but he has really shown his age and wear. I like him as a person outside of the game where he is entirely too confrontational.

McKenzie probably retires, great way to go out 2x Superbowl champ.

1. Lamar Miller RB Miami
2*. Vontaze Burfict LB Arizona St.
2(trade up using 3rd). Kelechi Osemele OT Iowa St.
4. Marcus Forston DT Miami U
4(comp). Coryell Judie CB Texas A&M
5. Donte Paige-Moss DE UNC
6. Stephen Hill WR Georgia Tech
6(comp). OL/DL
7. Dan Persa QB North Western

If you add Finley to that I think we're really in business.

QB-Eli, Carr, Persa
RB-Bradshaw, Miller, Ware, Scott
FB- Hynocerus
WR-Nicks, Cruz, Ham, Thomas, Barden, Jernigan, Hill
TE- Finley, Ballard, Pascoe

LT- Diehl, Beatty
LG- Boothe, Petrus
C- Baas,
RG- Snee
RT- Osmele, Brewer

DE-JPP, Paige-Moss,
DT- Canty, Bernard, Forston
DT- Joseph, Austin
DE-Tuck, Kiwi*, Tolly

LB-Kiwi*,Williams, Herzlich
LB- Blackburn, Burfit, Jones
LB-Boley, Williams, Paysinger

CB- Webster, Thomas, Tryon
S- KP, Rolle, Grant, Sash, Martin
CB- Amukamara, Bruce Johnson, Coryell Judie

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 10:26 AM
Considering I'd happily take either of those second round guys in the first, that's of course a great draft.

bigbluedefense
02-07-2012, 10:41 AM
I don't want Finley. Too many drops. And too much money.

BaLLiN
02-07-2012, 10:51 AM
I don't want Finley. Too many drops. And too much money.

I really don't think he'll demand that much money even though the TE position has revolutionized. He has that offense, Rodgers, and drops (that I feel are misleading because Rodgers made off throws) going against him.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-07-2012, 11:02 AM
I don't want Finley. Too many drops. And too much money.

Well money is key! However, I have faith in Coach Pope to work with JF if that's the case. If the money can work out, please by all means get him!

Damix
02-07-2012, 11:06 AM
Honestly if we resign Mario I have no problem with Ballard + rookie (Beckum on PUP) at TE. No need to spend big when they'll be the #4 receiving option.

BaLLiN
02-07-2012, 11:25 AM
Honestly if we resign Mario I have no problem with Ballard + rookie (Beckum on PUP) at TE. No need to spend big when they'll be the #4 receiving option.

I see it like this:

Every one of our receivers has their own skillset which is important for certain situations. Nicks has his physicality, hands, and ability to beat man. Cruz has his quickness, run after catch, and can break zone or man. Mario has his ability to use space on the field to his advantage with his quickness and separation while the ball is in the air. None of them have height, and Finley has not only height but has very good speed and physicality as well as a bigger body.

The redzone is where our offense stalls, adding a TE who could be used as a joker and actually produce (Beckum didn't until late) would give us an elite redzone threat other than using a goalline fade or slant. We leave a lot of points on the field when we stall in the redzone.

Also when you look at our division, none of them have the safeties to cover a TE consistently. And when they start paying more attention to him, the deep middle of the field will open up, which are throws we weren't able to use as much. When you maximize what your offense can do, you have great success. We were able to do a lot with three very good receivers, but add an athletic TE and I think it pays dividends.

D-Unit
02-07-2012, 02:46 PM
We all would love a TE like that, but it just doesn't seem to be part of this system. The TE will never be a big part of this system, even though I'd kill to have a TE like that bc it would open up our WRs soooo much.

Gronk is actually a perfect TE for our system bc he's a 2 way guy, but there's only 1 Gronk in the league. Fleener seems to be the closest thing to that, but I need to scout him more.

I really liked the TE from BC, but he didn't declare.
But the fact that you drafted Beckum makes me think you had an interest in a TE that makes plays as a receiver. Shockey was exactly that.

I think it might be a misinterpretation on your part assuming that there is no role for a playmaking TE in your system. Just because they haven't found the solution, doesn't necessarily mean there are no plays in the system for a player like that. There is often give and take in finding players that fit your system and then fitting your system to the players you get. Or maybe it's simply that the team decided to use it's resources elsewhere to fill more immediate needs. With less holes to fill this offseason, maybe this is the year to fill luxury.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-07-2012, 03:42 PM
So Beckum has an ACL and Ballard has a PCl in one knee AND an ACL in the OTHER knee! So we have basically one function TE right now. We def. need to fill that in the passing game AND running game too.

Damix
02-07-2012, 04:51 PM
That sucks about Ballard, but I still wouldn't put that as a first round need.

If we do end up trading Osi for a 2nd rounder, I'd like to see some sort of combination LB, OL, DE in the first two rounds (preferably DE with #64), with TE and OL/LB/RB in the 3rd or 4th.

Sign a vet to compete with the rookie/fill in till Ballard and Beckum are healthy. I haven't even looked at the TE FA list yet.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-07-2012, 05:02 PM
No it's not a need, but if the grade is there, and this player is sitting as the highest or what not where he fits a need and value I'd draft him. We need this position in the passing game AND running game. So the value at that position increases because of the duel role.

D-Unit
02-07-2012, 08:14 PM
No it's not a need, but if the grade is there, and this player is sitting as the highest or what not where he fits a need and value I'd draft him. We need this position in the passing game AND running game. So the value at that position increases because of the duel role.
I just hope you don't draft Dwayne Allen. That won't be fun seeing you guys have a TE like that.

bigbluedefense
02-08-2012, 07:42 AM
Damn, I really wanted to avoid TE until round 3, but with both our TEs tearing their ACLs, we might have no choice but to reach for Fleener in round 1.

We'll see how this goes, but TE is definitely a need now. I know we can get away with a mid round guy, but when that guy is your first option, that's a big risk.

D-Unit
02-09-2012, 02:44 PM
Damn, I really wanted to avoid TE until round 3, but with both our TEs tearing their ACLs, we might have no choice but to reach for Fleener in round 1.

We'll see how this goes, but TE is definitely a need now. I know we can get away with a mid round guy, but when that guy is your first option, that's a big risk.
meh. Jason Garrett thought an UDFA in year 2 who didn't play a down in his rookie year could start at Center with a 7th round rookie Guard next to him. Worked like a charm! ^_^

I'm sure a mid round TE won't hurt too much.

Giantsfan1080
02-09-2012, 02:57 PM
I still don't think we need a TE early. We sign someone cheap and draft a guy in the 3rd or 4th and we'll be fine.

touchdownmaker
02-10-2012, 10:16 AM
I still don't think we need a TE early. We sign someone cheap and draft a guy in the 3rd or 4th and we'll be fine.

Could not agree more. I mean Jake Ballard was our starting TE who was undrafted in 2010. Bear Pascoe was decent too in our system, yes Bear Pascoe him and his 6 flat 40(just a joke, but he is pretty slow). Travis Beckham after three years finally made good on his 3rd round draft position. I think we could be ok with a FA and a 3rd rounder. A TE is very valuable, but far from an impact position in our system.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 01:05 PM
Here's the problem guys, Ballard didn't thrive for us until his 2nd year with the team. Ditto for Bear. We don't need to discuss how complicated the offense is, we all know that already.

So when you get a middle round guy in his rookie year as your primary starter, you're really rolling the dice. Don't forget, even Boss in his rookie year didn't see the field until the playoffs basically. So he had a whole season to sit and learn the offense.

This rookie is going to step into the starting lineup from week 1. That's scary.

So you can chance it, but you're rolling the dice. A guy like a Fleener gives you more assurance that you'll probably get a better chance of immediate impact bc he's a higher quality player.

Giantsfan1080
02-10-2012, 01:08 PM
That's why I'm all for re-signing Shaincoe plus drafting someone. He already has a familiarity with the offense and is also a great blocker. He's not a huge name TE but in our offense he'd be a great fit. It makes to much sense to me.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 01:10 PM
Having that said, I still want a LB in round 1.

I've been looking at Vontaze Burfict, and maaaaan, he looks like the real deal. He's got size, speed, great instincts, he's got a mean streak that I want in a linebacker, he'll give us everything we need.

Only 2 things worry me:

1. He needs to wrap up more. Too many times he goes for the hit instead of wrapping up.

2. He's gotta learn how to contain some of that aggression.

If he can do those 2 things, he'll be a great pro. I'd take the chance on this guy with the 32nd pick. Also I hope we do a lot of hw on his character. That's something us armchair scouts are unable to do. He needs to pass the character test.

Also, FA is shaping up to our benefit. It's a deep WR class which should hopefully make Mario more affordable, plus give us options in case Mario leaves, plus now the CB market got deeper with Routt, which would make Thomas more affordable as well.

It's a deep CB market, Routt just made it deeper. I'll be surprised at this point if the Giants don't retain Thomas.

I wouldn't mind keeping Ross for the right price too. Let's be fair to the guy, he had a great season. He was always so much better as an outside CB who defended the opposition's #2. He looked like a stud his rookie year when we put him in that role, and he looked great this year in the same role.

He's not a slot CB. He can't play nickel. He doesn't have the hips for it. That's why he was looking poor the 2 years before this one. That and injuries hurt him.

But as an outside CB, I think Ross is very serviceable. For the right price, I would love to keep him. You can never have too much CB depth.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 01:13 PM
That's why I'm all for re-signing Shaincoe plus drafting someone. He already has a familiarity with the offense and is also a great blocker. He's not a huge name TE but in our offense he'd be a great fit. It makes to much sense to me.

The price has to be right. Can't overpay for him. But yeah, I'm down with that plan. And since he's old, you don't have to give him a long contract.

Which still gives us the leverage to go out and get a real TE in the draft in the coming years if we want to. I like the idea a lot.

Giantsfan1080
02-10-2012, 01:17 PM
Draft wise it all depends on what we do in FA. I can see us drafting pretty much any position besides a QB.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 01:19 PM
Unless we land Curtis Lofton in FA, I want us to draft a LB in round 1.

If Luke and Burfict are both gone, then maybe we take a hard look at Brown. I have to scout Brown some. His measurables intrigue me.

I love Jacquan Williams, but it couldn't hurt getting another speed OLB if the right one is available for us.

Giantsfan1080
02-10-2012, 01:26 PM
I still don't think LB is a pressing need even though I wouldn't care if we went that way in the 1st. I just like taking the most talented player at pick 32. If Osi leaves and we don't sign Mario Williams then DE might be an option also if we have a high grade on someone.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 01:29 PM
Yeah I'm all for BPA as well, but I'm telling you, if we don't address LB in some sort of way this offseason, we're going to have the SAME exact anger rants next year about our defense.

We need a MIKE who can defend the deep middle. We just do. It's been a problem for 4 years now. It won't just magically disappear on it's own.

If we get that MIKE we've been looking for for the past 4 years, this defense can reach the next level. It will be a complete defense. We need that missing piece bad.

Giantsfan1080
02-10-2012, 01:47 PM
I agree we do need that but I'm not sure Burfict is even that guy. He seems like he'd be a monster in the run game but might be more of a liability covering. Boley and Williams did an excellent job the last 10 games of shutting down TE's. The Davis TD's were on the secondary both times and besides that not much else was accomplished versus us.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 01:50 PM
I'm not concerned so much about our nickel defense. But our ability to defend the middle of the field on 1st and 2nd down is a problem. A problem the Saints have routinely exposed for 4 years now.

Just go back and watch the last 3 times we've played the Saints. See how they attacked us. We have to defend that.

Burfict has shown me he has the speed and the hips to cover. He's an athlete, he can cover. He's known more for his blitzing and his ability to clean up the run game, but the guy is more than enough in coverage. He's no worse than Luke, and we all know I love me some Luke Keuchly.

Giantsfan1080
02-10-2012, 02:30 PM
Didn't Burfict really dissapear on the field this year also? I don't know he just doesn't seem like a Giants player to me with his attitude problems. You know the kind of players that Reese/Ross like to take.

bigbluedefense
02-10-2012, 02:32 PM
Yeah I'm still in the process of scouting these guys. My opinion can change. I haven't paid any attention to his character issues yet, so I'm unaware of them.

I think I'll get a better idea of who I like when the combine is over. But so far, just from peaking, I like Burfict's potential.

touchdownmaker
02-10-2012, 03:45 PM
-Vishanthe Schiancoe
-Bo Scaife (my fantasy football nightmares)
-Randy McMichael
-Mike Leach

If you must have a pass first TE how about these:
-Mercedes Lewis (he is actually too good to be on this list)
-John Carlson
-Greg Olsen
-Chase Coffman

touchdownmaker
02-10-2012, 03:56 PM
By the way..
Zach Brown would take care of any RB/TE match-up problems. The only thing is that that would give us three Wills. With that small of a LB core, you would have to subs situationally more than you would like. We have thumpers (Jones and Herzlich) but they can't stay on the field on passing downs.The DTs would really have to play well too. Our pass coverage would be real strong though with three Wills, and with a full line-up in the third level would allow Antrelle to roam around and ball hawk more. In a passing NFL it might be a good move. Hell, Brown might be able to play the Mike too. Derrick Brooks 6,0 235 lbs and a Hall of Fame Cover 2 Mike. Zach Brown 6,2 230 lbs, we run a variation of the Cover 2.

scottyboy
02-11-2012, 10:00 AM
Here's the problem guys, Ballard didn't thrive for us until his 2nd year with the team. Ditto for Bear. We don't need to discuss how complicated the offense is, we all know that already.

So when you get a middle round guy in his rookie year as your primary starter, you're really rolling the dice. Don't forget, even Boss in his rookie year didn't see the field until the playoffs basically. So he had a whole season to sit and learn the offense.

This rookie is going to step into the starting lineup from week 1. That's scary.

So you can chance it, but you're rolling the dice. A guy like a Fleener gives you more assurance that you'll probably get a better chance of immediate impact bc he's a higher quality player.

but with Ballard remember, we didn't have an off-season. So at least a rookie or new guy will have an offseason to work with eli...but it's also going to be:
1) Block
2) run over the middle and Eli will throw it up there for you to get (we all love Eli but he's got a tendency to leave his TE's to dry sometimes)
3) Run in the flats to pick up that 3rd and 3.
4) block

so while a weapon would be AWESOME and I wanna bring someone in, it's not too pressing.

again, we have needs, but none, I feel, are GLARING must fill needs. We can make obvious upgrades, but aren't really forced to grab a certain position at a certain time/price tag

OSUGiants17
02-11-2012, 10:58 AM
I wouldn't mind keeping Ross for the right price too. Let's be fair to the guy, he had a great season. He was always so much better as an outside CB who defended the opposition's #2. He looked like a stud his rookie year when we put him in that role, and he looked great this year in the same role.

He's not a slot CB. He can't play nickel. He doesn't have the hips for it. That's why he was looking poor the 2 years before this one. That and injuries hurt him.

But as an outside CB, I think Ross is very serviceable. For the right price, I would love to keep him. You can never have too much CB depth.

If we can sign Ross to a cheap 1 year deal I'm all for it. I don't trust a young Prince or recovering Thomas opposite Webster.

OSUGiants17
02-11-2012, 11:17 AM
The more I think about it, **** TE, we can get this guy next year:
http://lh3.ggpht.com/-6nurBAbyFTA/SqqKbY3DObI/AAAAAAAAG6Y/O8ot2orVrK0/dwilliams09_ncaafb-5251.JPG
I know scotty will aprove

or this guy:
http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTLd2A_XJ9XymsjUDdTPnbswK7yK-FKcYqGG3WJnSlr2wFoqUiv3TvasKzA

Joseph Fauria
kid is 6'8, 252lbs... WOW!

<===3
02-11-2012, 12:26 PM
Linebacker? Really? The Giants play the big nickel a ton. That means 3 safeties and 2 linebackers. The Giants had 3 safeties on the field in all but one defensive snap in the Superbowl. Jacquian Williams and Mathias Kiwanuka stood around on the sideline for most of the game. Michael Boley is a three down linebacker and will be one of the two linebackers in the big nickel. You're telling me that between Jacquian Williams, Chase Blackburn, Mathias Kiwanuka and Jonathon Goff, we can't find the second one and have to draft one in the first round? I think we're fine at linebacker.

OL, TE, RB, S, CB are all bigger needs IMO. But what do I know? I like to hump trees.

OSUGiants17
02-11-2012, 12:40 PM
We used that package because we don't have a suitable MIKE.

<===3
02-11-2012, 12:46 PM
We used that package because we don't have a suitable MIKE.
That doesn't make sense. Chase Blackburn is a MLB, and he saw a ton of playing time. The 3rd safety replaced an OLB.

This is a defense Fewell likes to run. He ran it with the Bills too. I honestly think the Giants should be more concerned with Grant slowing down, and who could possibly replace him. I don't think Sash can.

Rosebud
02-11-2012, 12:48 PM
That doesn't make sense. Chase Blackburn is a MLB, and he saw a ton of playing time. The 3rd safety replaced an OLB.

This is a defense Fewell likes to run. He ran it with the Bills too. I honestly think the Giants should be more concerned with Grant slowing down, and who could possibly replace him. I don't think Sash can.

Chase being more of a thumping MIKE made up for the let down against the run we suffered sticking an extra safety out there to make up for Chase's coverage issues. With a better MIKE who could carry more coverage responsibility we wouldn't have to turn to the big nickel.

BaLLiN
02-11-2012, 08:48 PM
Prospects I'm interested in:
-Vontaze Burfict
-Peter Konz
-Dre Kirkpatrick
-Janoris Jenkins
-Dontari Poe
-Alshon Jeffery
-Michael Floyd
-Llamar Miller
-Cordy Glenn(RT)
-Zac Brown
-Coby Fleener
-Devon Still
-Johnathan Massoquoi
-Ronnie Hillman
-Ryan Broyles
-Mohammed Sanu
-Isaiah Pead
-Coryell Judie
-Danny Trevathan
-Donte Paige-Moss
-Jeff Demps
-Marcus Forston
-Juron Criner
-Omar Bolden
-Stephen Hill
-Greg Childs
-Cliff Harris (FS)
-Dan Persa
-David Paulson

Giantsfan1080
02-12-2012, 12:07 PM
No Sanu = :-(

OSUGiants17
02-12-2012, 12:50 PM
Saw this mock the other day that had us ending up with the following:
1st: Vontaze Burficit LB ASU
2nd: Kelechi Osemele OT/G ISU
3rd: Michael Egnew TE Mizzou
4th: Chris Polk RB Wash
5th: Cliff Harris CB Ore
6th: AJ Jenkins WR Ill
7th: Travian Robertson DT South Car

That would make me so happy.

BaLLiN
02-12-2012, 01:00 PM
No Sanu = :-(

I added him, but for our offense i don't particularly like his skillset.

Giantsfan1080
02-12-2012, 01:01 PM
I added him, but for our offense i don't particularly like his skillset.

He'd be a perfect compliment to what Nicks and Cruz bring to the table. He's a more explosive Steve Smith.

BaLLiN
02-12-2012, 01:08 PM
He'd be a perfect compliment to what Nicks and Cruz bring to the table. He's a more explosive Steve Smith.

I feel like he is more of a natural receiver with very good intagibles, a lot like Nicks, but doesn't have the refined route running that Nicks has or the elusiveness. I would love to have him on this team, but the pick we would have to use for a guy that (imo) wouldn't be optimized in our offense.

Jernigan is someone that I really feel could do well, but he needs to do the little things right. He needs to use his speed and agility to get separation and maintain that separation unless he sees a window to sit in. Against the Jets he was getting good separation on Darrelle Revis, one of the best corners in the league, and when eli looked his way he was running into coverage or he was throttling too much so that Revis caught up. He needs to gain a sense of the coverage around him, but if he does I think we have another good receiver in the wings.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 01:45 PM
Jernigan sucks. I want to keep Cruz in the slot, I think Cruz is arguably the best slot WR in the league, and if we can't re-sign Mario, I want a stretch WR who can work the sidelines.

Its imperative in our offense to have 3 WRs who can go vertical. It makes our offense that much more potent. Cruz in the slot is the engine that makes our offense go, we should keep him there. Get that 3rd WR who can stretch the sidelines and we'll be potent.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 02:23 PM
I hope we develop JJ. We better not let him waste away being inactive. He better be able to fit in this system.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 02:35 PM
Jernigan is too small. I'm ok with 1 smaller WR, and that guy being Cruz in the slot, but I don't want our WR core to be littered with midgets.

I want a stretch guy on the outside who has decent height to him. The taller the better of course, but he's gotta have decent height.

Ideally, I hope this offseason we concentrate on running the ball again and becoming a running team. I want us to shorten the game. Improve the run game this offseason. Keep our 3 WRs in tact, get a LB, and the rest of our offseason should be moves focused on improving the run game.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 02:44 PM
Hahah! You're funny BBD. I agree I'd rather keep Cruz as F/H and Z. I want MM replaced with an equal or better talent who is consistent in his route running. I don't want MM to be replaced by JJ or even Steve Smith. I'd like to see JJ developed though. Barden I have lost all faith in.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 02:46 PM
To me that means getting a blocking TE, starting Petrus at LG, hope and pray Baas doesn't suck after an offseason to heal and a TC to gel, getting a RT to replace Uncle Phil, and some new blood at RB.

Bradshaw isn't who he used to be. He dances way too buch. He used to be 1 cut and run, now he's constantly dancing in the backfield, routinely missing the hole and cutting back to try to hit the home run instead of getting 5 solid yards, he's just not who he used to be.

And I love Jacobs, but he's done. We need new blood at RB.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 02:50 PM
Ideally, I hope this offseason we concentrate on running the ball again and becoming a running team. I want us to shorten the game. Improve the run game this offseason. Keep our 3 WRs in tact, get a LB, and the rest of our offseason should be moves focused on improving the run game.

I think balanced or running the ball is good. But hell no, on being a running team! Do you know how long I have waited for the skirt to come off this offense? I am NOT ready to see the girdle and skirt come back on, like the Steelers are doing with there offense. We may not have to be a throwing team, but now in Eli's prime, let him get his. He already has 2 super bowls, and MVPs, so now let him do his thing.

We already call a bush league red zone play calling with that god damn draw! I 100% do not want a running team label or play calling. F that! I waited so long for this season, I am not going back to training wheel on our QB and offensive football and play calling.

Let the Steelers do that with haley and saying he'd welcome running 63 times. I am not welcoming that non sense!

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 02:54 PM
I think balanced or running the ball is good. But hell no, on being a running team! Do you know how long I have waited for the skirt to come off this offense? I am NOT ready to see the girdle and skirt come back on, like the Steelers are doing with there offense. We may not have to be a throwing team, but now in Eli's prime, let him get his. He already has 2 super bowls, and MVPs, so now let him do his thing.

We already call a bush league red zone play calling with that god damn draw! I 100% do not want a running team label or play calling. F that! I waited so long for this season, I am not going back to training wheel on our QB and offensive football and play calling.

Let the Steelers do that with haley and saying he'd welcome running 63 times. I am not welcoming that non sense!

We don't have to run it 60% of the time. But with how awful our run game was this year, we cannot sustain success with that same formula. We need better production out of the run game. Even if we can use it as a compliment, I'm ok with that as long as we drastically increase our YPC. Way too many 3rd and longs this year bc our run game was awful.

I want to shorten the game. I feel that if we can keep our 3 WRs in tact, we will score enough on offense to win games. Now I want us to improve the run game so we can shorten the game and keep our defense off the field.

I could care less about Eli's stats. Get me rings. That's all I care about. Eli can throw for 22 TDs and I could care less if it means we're winning games. Let other teams have their stats, it doesn't mean ****.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 03:02 PM
We don't have to run it 60% of the time. But with how awful our run game was this year, we cannot sustain success with that same formula. We need better production out of the run game. Even if we can use it as a compliment, I'm ok with that as long as we drastically increase our YPC. Way too many 3rd and longs this year bc our run game was awful.

I want to shorten the game. I feel that if we can keep our 3 WRs in tact, we will score enough on offense to win games. Now I want us to improve the run game so we can shorten the game and keep our defense off the field.

I could care less about Eli's stats. Get me rings. That's all I care about. Eli can throw for 22 TDs and I could care less if it means we're winning games. Let other teams have their stats, it doesn't mean ****.

Well you need balance at least that's true. We don't need Eli to throw 589 times. But then again, we have Qbs and teams now in this passing era throwing 663 times or over 600 like Brees.

We don't have to go that high, but we can establish a running game and let it be! I care about rings, but Eli has shown he can do both. He is a sick Qb who can be counted on to throw to victory. We can establish a running game especially for short yardage, and for balance, but let him cut it loose now.

31 year old QB doesn't need to be babied. This comes fro the fact he proved he can WIN and get his stats at the same time. It's not like this year's offense was an all time epic failure. He proved we can win with his arm! So we have that going for us, and we can get the running game back for balance and especially for short yardage situations which we suck at.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 03:19 PM
Running the ball shortens the game, gives our defense more rest which means less injuries, gives opponents less tape of our passing concepts, protects our qb from unnecessary hits, and makes our team harder to beat.

My ideal offense is our 08 offense. Before Plax shot himself of course. Use our WRs to keep guys out of the box, and punish them on the ground against those 7 man fronts. Throw to win. Don't need to get all fancy on them, just throw to win.

Teams will spend all offseason breaking down our passing attack. We need to run the ball to counter those adjustments.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 03:24 PM
Again, that doesn't necessarily mean we do much in the offseason to upgrade our run blocking, other than getting a blocking TE. It just means making a stronger commitment in TC to running drills, more emphasis on run blocking, and getting RBs who can run with power.

I guarantee you that this offseason, when the coaching staff is asked what they want to improve on this training camp, to a man, they're going to say the run game. It will be emphasized in camp. I'm almost positive on that.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 03:30 PM
Yeah I agree, that the running game has to get better man. We were dead last, that's not too much of a stretch for a stat guy like Coughlin. We def. need to get that running game better AND the short yardage situations much more efficient.

I hated that stupid offense when Plax got shot. Keep what we have now and add perhaps more balance to it. Let Eli cut lose and throw the ball more now with our home run hitters!

Plax was a red zone threat but I wouldn't call him a home run hitter. Toomer was old and Mr. side line or come back and curl passes. Steve Smith was our 3rd down guy. Hixon helped too, but our offense was purely a Earth, Wind and fire running offense that used play action.

Quite frankly, with Eli's play that offense is a waste of his skill. We don't need a great Qb like Eli to run a useless system like that. Plus I doubt we get an OL as productive as those years. Our RBs are all injury prone AND our TEs are all hurt. So we have an up hill battle to get back to that offense.

We can sign or draft the offensive players needed to bring some sort of balance back, but I don't mind if we stick to Eli's arm and shredding defenses.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 03:35 PM
Thats why I want a blocking TE and some fresh running backs. That's pretty much all you can do to improve the run game. You just gotta hope our OL gels and improves this offseason. Diehl should stay at LT, he's reliable there. Petrus dramatically improved our run game when he was in at LG this year, he should start at LG. You just gotta hope Baas improves since we're stuck with him, nothing else you can do there. Hope we can squeeze another productive year out of Snee, who's best years are behind him. And hope we can find a suitable replacement for McKenzie.

And just practice running concepts over and over and over again in camp with some new hungry RBs who can run with power. Hopefully that will be enough.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 03:50 PM
Thats why I want a blocking TE and some fresh running backs. That's pretty much all you can do to improve the run game. You just gotta hope our OL gels and improves this offseason. Diehl should stay at LT, he's reliable there. Petrus dramatically improved our run game when he was in at LG this year, he should start at LG. You just gotta hope Baas improves since we're stuck with him, nothing else you can do there. Hope we can squeeze another productive year out of Snee, who's best years are behind him. And hope we can find a suitable replacement for McKenzie.

And just practice running concepts over and over and over again in camp with some new hungry RBs who can run with power. Hopefully that will be enough.


I want David D challenged. Reliable isn't going to cut it, let him fight for his job. I want to see Petrus be useful now and be a starter if he can beat out Boothe. Drafting a guard would be ideal if possible. Baas has to be able to play a whole season and progress as well. Snee should be able to play better, and RT right now is the hole.

I want to see Brown, Scott, bradshaw, and I want to draft an RB if the value is there. Time to get new healthy blood who can do some things. I am very interested in seeing scott play and develop. If he can be a home run hitter, that would make me very happy! That UM RB intrigues me. I want to know more about him.

More I read about Fleener the more I like him. That Stanford guard is someone on my list as well. So let's see how things shake out.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 03:55 PM
I wouldn't mind drafting a LT and moving Diehl to RT. I'm ok with Diehl, I don't feel he's a weak link on the line. If we keep him at LT bc there are no better options, I'm fine with that. If we can draft a LT and move him to RT, even better.

Id love a C, and find a way to get rid of Baas, but that's not going to happen. I have faith in Petrus, he's going to be a stud.

I'll be intrigued if Trent Richardson is on the board at 32. Very intrigued. It probably won't happen though. Brown is a life long PSer, he won't amount to anything. Ware is mediocre, he should only stay bc he's familiar with the offense but if Scott can progress, cut Ware. Draft another RB and see where he fits in the puzzle.

I want a back who can run with speed and power. And who can catch out of the backfield. I like power running.

NY+Giants=NYG
02-12-2012, 04:29 PM
I wouldn't mind drafting a LT and moving Diehl to RT. I'm ok with Diehl, I don't feel he's a weak link on the line. If we keep him at LT bc there are no better options, I'm fine with that. If we can draft a LT and move him to RT, even better.

Id love a C, and find a way to get rid of Baas, but that's not going to happen. I have faith in Petrus, he's going to be a stud.

I'll be intrigued if Trent Richardson is on the board at 32. Very intrigued. It probably won't happen though. Brown is a life long PSer, he won't amount to anything. Ware is mediocre, he should only stay bc he's familiar with the offense but if Scott can progress, cut Ware. Draft another RB and see where he fits in the puzzle.

I want a back who can run with speed and power. And who can catch out of the backfield. I like power running.

Give me a complete RB. I wasn't a fan of Jacobs, but give me a back who is complete or at least good vision and great agility.

I want to see if we can get a upgrade to David D. Petrus is fine, and I agree with Baas if Kontz is available. RT we need in my opinion.

I want to see Brown now that he is healthy. Let's see what happens. Ware is Mr. Concussion and don't want him and his 1 screen pass anymore.

Trent R would be cool if he is available at that spot. Is he a first round talent though?

OSUGiants17
02-12-2012, 04:55 PM
Did you just ask if Trent Richardson is a first round talent?
http://i.qkme.me/1t0m.jpg

Also, if Trent is somehow MAGICALLY there at 32(which he won't be) we better take him. I was pissed this year when we passed on Ingram even though I like the Prince pick. If Thomas didn't get hurt this year I would have much preferred Ingram, but now I like the Prince pick a helluva lot more.

Big_Pete
02-12-2012, 08:35 PM
That is a good point about the lack of offseason impacting the running game.

The oline needs to play as a unit. We had 40% turn over with Ohara and Beatty stepped in at LT. What we really needed was a good offseason for these guys to gel as a unit and for our younger guys to develop.

Our line got better as the season progressed.

bigbluedefense
02-12-2012, 08:54 PM
It just struck me that JPP didn't even have a training camp to improve his technique. Which makes his sick season even that much more impressive.

As long as he doesn't get complacent, the sky is the limit for JPP. Hopefully health and hunger stays with him, bc if it does, he's going to be a very special player.