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shylo3716
07-06-2011, 10:39 AM
Who do you choose?

Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

niel89
07-06-2011, 10:51 AM
all of these are 9 page arguments except:

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Patrick Willis vs James Harrison (apples to oranges)
Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Crazy_Chris
07-06-2011, 10:55 AM
Who do you choose?

Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Don't encourage them, thats not a path we need to go down for the 10,000th time.

shylo3716
07-06-2011, 10:58 AM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

K Train
07-06-2011, 11:01 AM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
Manning

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
Peterson and its not close

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
Calvin, just cause i <3 him

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Dez in a blowout

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Suh every single time...suh v ngata would be better

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
Mario

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
Willis

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
Ware in a blowout

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
Nnamdi

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
Reed

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson
Jackson obviously

DoughBoy
07-06-2011, 11:13 AM
Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
Peterson and its not close

wanna explain that one?

K Train
07-06-2011, 11:19 AM
i just think peterson is the best RB in the league, theres not a runner i would take over him.

chris johnson is good, but i cant see him ever touching peterson as being the more complete RB, i cant see him getting around 2000 again AND the titans winning many games, im sure he could if they went out of their way for him to get it again. I think peterson is built better to hold up long term, and when its all said and done i think peterson will have a better overall career

jrdrylie
07-06-2011, 11:26 AM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
Manning and this discussion has been had a million times on this site.

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
Johnson by a little bit.

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
CJ because I think you put him on a stable team, he would have the best numbers in the league. It could happen in 2011.

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Not even close. Dez Bryant.

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Tony Gonzalez for the career. gates today.

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Suh, not even close.

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
Mario Williams. I think Jared Allen is one of the most overrated players in the league.

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
Willis

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
Nnamdi

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
Bailey because I think he has a little bit more left in the tank than Woodson.

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
Can I say neither. A lot of Baltimore fans think Reed is going to retire after this season. And Polamalu is extremely overrated. Give me Reed if I have to choose.

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson
Hester.

DoughBoy
07-06-2011, 11:35 AM
i just think peterson is the best RB in the league, theres not a runner i would take over him.

chris johnson is good, but i cant see him ever touching peterson as being the more complete RB, i cant see him getting around 2000 again AND the titans winning many games, im sure he could if they went out of their way for him to get it again. I think peterson is built better to hold up long term, and when its all said and done i think peterson will have a better overall career

I have no problem with someone taking Adrian over CJ2K, but when I ask people why they say "Adrian Peterson and its not even close" they always give the same anwser "he will never rush for 2000 yards again and Adrian Peterson will have a better career! *roflcopter". So your basically telling me that if he can't rush for 2000 yards twice he isn't very good (even though no RB has ever done it) and that you can see into the future. What signs have there been that Adrian will have a better carrer than CJ? How will his body hold up better? I can make a case that smaller quicker backs last a hell of a lot longer than big backs like AP (and it doesn't help that he runs upright). Like I said, I don't mind anyone taking AP or CJ ahead of each other because its a matter of personal preference, but to say either is leaps and bounds better than the other is unfounded.

K Train
07-06-2011, 11:38 AM
I have no problem with someone taking Adrian over CJ2K, but when I ask people why they say "Adrian Peterson and its not even close" they always give the same anwser "he will never rush for 2000 yards again and Adrian Peterson will have a better career! *roflcopter". So your basically telling me that if he can't rush for 2000 yards twice he isn't very good (even though no RB has ever done it) and that you can see into the future. What signs have there been that Adrian will have a better carrer than CJ? How will his body hold up better? I can make a case that smaller quicker backs last a hell of a lot longer than big backs like AP (and it doesn't help that he runs upright). Like I said, I don't mind anyone taking AP or CJ ahead of each other because its a matter of personal preference, but to say either is leaps and bounds better than the other is unfounded.

i mean they are close talent wise, but between the 2 im taking peterson every single time. im not gonna bash someone for liking johnson more, but i like peterson by a lot more. Johnson would be #2 to me, but peterson is the clear cut #1

Complex
07-06-2011, 12:23 PM
i just think peterson is the best RB in the league, theres not a runner i would take over him.

chris johnson is good, but i cant see him ever touching peterson as being the more complete RB, i cant see him getting around 2000 again AND the titans winning many games, im sure he could if they went out of their way for him to get it again. I think peterson is built better to hold up long term, and when its all said and done i think peterson will have a better overall career

How is AD a better overall RB? CJ is a better receiver and better blocker than Peterson. The only thing that AD has done better than CJ is score goal line TDs and that is because we had Lendale White getting those carries.

A Perfect Score
07-06-2011, 12:31 PM
How is AD a better overall RB? CJ is a better receiver and better blocker than Peterson. The only thing that AD has done better than CJ is score goal line TDs and that is because we had Lendale White getting those carries.

Beyond ridiculous. The only thing AD does better is score goal line TDs huh? How about being a far more violent and physical runner in every sense of the words? Better stiff arm? Better leg drive? I don't mind people saying one is better then the other, but pretending they aren't comparable talents is so god damned stupid. CJ is a weapon, no doubt about it. And I like that he's tough for a little guy, I really do. But there is no way in hell that he's capable of dishing out anywhere NEAR the punishment AD hands out every single time he touches the ball. Peterson is out to hurt people when he's running, CJ is more concerned with breaking that huge play. Both are incredible talents and we're lucky to be able to watch both of them...Which one you'd take is rooted almost entirely in personal preference since they run so very differently. Personally, Ill take AD because Im a huge fan of that running style and Ive been all over his jock since his freshman year at Oklahoma.


EDIT: Also, Devin Hester over Desean Jackson? ARE YOU ******* KIDDING ME? I understand that this board has devolved in recent months, but there is absolutely no way to justify taking Hester over Jackson. There isn't a single thing he does better except return kicks, and even factoring the special teams in, Jackson is a more explosive player. And thats coming from a huge fan of Devin Hester as a special teams weapon. Ive long expressed my adoration for his abilities and lamented that the Ravens don't have a similar weapon, but come on...D-Jax is just in a different class.

gpngc
07-06-2011, 12:42 PM
^LOL

Those two aren't even close.

Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams - tough

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson - not close.

Ravens1991
07-06-2011, 12:44 PM
Im pretty sure Adrian Peterson yards per carry increase as the games go on while CJ yards decrease. I would take Peterson over CJ.


also another one that has been bugging me is this steelers fan from school got very upset with me because I said Boldin>>Hines ward and called me the most bitter and biased fan he has ever seen. Who would u rather have Boldin or Ward?

Splat
07-06-2011, 12:47 PM
Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Jamaal Charles...

Shahin
07-06-2011, 12:55 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Hurricanes25
07-06-2011, 12:58 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
I was always a Manning guy in these debates but I think Brady is now #1.

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
That's easy.

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
Andre is probably the best WR in the league. I would love to see what Cj could do with more consistent Qb play. Maybe we'll find out this year.

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Dez is more of a complete WR.

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Both are Hall of Famers but Gates is younger and has more left in the tank.

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Suh had a great rookie season and he'll only get better.

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
Mario is a beast. You could make an argument for Allen, though.

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
They play different positions so this is tough. I'll take Willis, though.

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
Clay is great but I'll take Ware every single time.

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
You can't go wrong with either.

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
Woodson is better at this point in their careers.

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
Troy is a bit overrated and I always prefer a ballhawk saftey.

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson
Not even close.

King Carls 5 Year Plan
07-06-2011, 01:00 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
i'm not going here again

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
i prefer a more physical RB. i grew up watching Okoye, Word and Marcus Allen for the Chiefs

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
Andre. all day every day without hesitation

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
as far as what, the bigger waste of space? Crabtree is very disappointing as a prospect, but Bryant may become the bigger waste of talent. hopefully he keeps it together.

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
today? Gates. for their career and even 2 years ago, Gonzo

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Suh!

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
Mario

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
i'd rather have Willis than Harrison on my team, but comparing the 2 is nearly impossible. 2 very different positions and players

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
maybe i'm in the minority so far, but give me Matthews.

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
Revis.

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
Woodson for today. Bailey had a more consistant career

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
i guess it would be Reed. both are great, but both have injury issues and are nearing the twilight of their careers

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson
DJax everyday and twice on Sundays

jrdrylie
07-06-2011, 01:04 PM
EDIT: Also, Devin Hester over Desean Jackson? ARE YOU ******* KIDDING ME? I understand that this board has devolved in recent months, but there is absolutely no way to justify taking Hester over Jackson. There isn't a single thing he does better except return kicks, and even factoring the special teams in, Jackson is a more explosive player. And thats coming from a huge fan of Devin Hester as a special teams weapon. Ive long expressed my adoration for his abilities and lamented that the Ravens don't have a similar weapon, but come on...D-Jax is just in a different class.

Jackson isn't that great of a receiver. All he is good at is running fly routes. Hester is able to run a wider variety of routes, has better hands (Jackson led the league in drop percentage last year), he's bigger, just as fast, and is still the best returner in the league.

I can see how many people might say that Jackson is a better player. But to say he is in a different class altogether... that is just ignoring facts.

Crazy_Chris
07-06-2011, 01:07 PM
How is AD a better overall RB? CJ is a better receiver and better blocker than Peterson. The only thing that AD has done better than CJ is score goal line TDs and that is because we had Lendale White getting those carries.


Peterson isn't a rookie anymore he can hold up just fine blocking, aswell as at receiving out of the backfield. It's about time people stop instantly suggesting (insert their RB here) is better in both categorys due to an outdated issue from Petersons first couple of years.

As to who is better there really is no way to judge who exactly is the better blocker or reciever unless you have access to the game film for both guys.

A Perfect Score
07-06-2011, 01:11 PM
Jackson isn't that great of a receiver. All he is good at is running fly routes. Hester is able to run a wider variety of routes, has better hands (Jackson led the league in drop percentage last year), he's bigger, just as fast, and is still the best returner in the league.

I can see how many people might say that Jackson is a better player. But to say he is in a different class altogether... that is just ignoring facts.

As fast as he is, Devin Hester is not just as fast as Desean Jackson. If we're talking pure speed, I think Jackson and CJ2K are in a class of their own. Hester certainly isn't a polished route runner by any means, Ill give them a push in that category as it seems like you're overrating Hester and underrating Jackson. Hester's a special teams weapon, but based on his limited showings, Id venture to say Jackson would be nearly as effective if given the same number of consistent opportunities. Hester just isn't the electrifying player Jackson is on offense. For example, over their respective careers, Jackson has averaged 5.1 more yards per catch then Hester has and Jackson actually has 4 more career receptions, so it isn't from a lesser sample base.

K Train
07-06-2011, 01:14 PM
Im pretty sure Adrian Peterson yards per carry increase as the games go on while CJ yards decrease. I would take Peterson over CJ.


also another one that has been bugging me is this steelers fan from school got very upset with me because I said Boldin>>Hines ward and called me the most bitter and biased fan he has ever seen. Who would u rather have Boldin or Ward?

definitely boldin

Ravens1991
07-06-2011, 01:18 PM
yea I have my Raven bias but I love how Boldin has YAC potential. Both are good blockers and willing to go over the middle. Its unfortanete that Cameron doesnt run him properly

K Train
07-06-2011, 01:25 PM
boldin in AZ was more dangerous than ward ever was or will be. For a while boldin vs fitz was a legit debate and i liked boldins style so much.

SativaDominant
07-06-2011, 01:30 PM
Better list:

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

K Train
07-06-2011, 01:39 PM
Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford
STafford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy
Charles

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice
Mcfadden...tough one

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace
Nicks...another tough one

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin
Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez
Gronk

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey
Raji

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis
Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole
Tuck

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris
Timmons

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley
Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers
Flowers

SativaDominant
07-06-2011, 01:41 PM
Better list:

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Trapped. Figures. Adding a couple more:

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Splat
07-06-2011, 01:48 PM
Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

This isn't even a debate.

BJ Raji v. Glenn DorseyThese two play different positions.

Ravens1991
07-06-2011, 01:48 PM
boldin in AZ was more dangerous than ward ever was or will be. For a while boldin vs fitz was a legit debate and i liked boldins style so much.

What ppl dont know about boldin is in his time at Arizona he averaged more yards per game then anyone in NFL history. He came to baltimore and he slipped to 7th all time after one season. But still impressive. Also he was the quickest player in NFL history to get to 600 catches

SativaDominant
07-06-2011, 01:54 PM
This isn't even a debate.

I know Chiefs fans hang by Charles' left nut, but their career progression is almost identical. Factor in that Philly plays in a far more pass-centric offense, and it's closer than you'd think.

These two play different positions.

Neither do Terrance Knighton and Sedrick Ellis. Although, Raji did play end as a rookie and plays end in their 2-4-5 alignment. He only plays nose in their base alignment, which they use 25% of the time - at most.

K Train
07-06-2011, 01:57 PM
Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas
Grimes...SHIPPENSBURG

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel
Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth
Saffold

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold
Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Long in a blowout

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady
Clady

TACKLE
07-06-2011, 01:58 PM
I know Chiefs fans hang by Charles' left nut, but their career progression is almost identical. Factor in that Philly plays in a far more pass-centric offense, and it's closer than you'd think.

It may be closer than he thinks, but it's still not close.

Splat
07-06-2011, 01:59 PM
I know Chiefs fans hang by Charles' left nut, but their career progression is almost identical. Factor in that Philly plays in a far more pass-centric offense, and it's closer than you'd think.

Charles is a top five RB in the NFL there is no way what so ever any one in their right mind would rather have McCoy.

SativaDominant
07-06-2011, 02:14 PM
It may be closer than he thinks, but it's still not close.

Meh...I suppose I'm undervaluing what Charles did last year (6.4 YPC is absolutely ridiculous) because I was mainly comparing their first two seasons - which are virtually identical. Charles had a slightly better YPC, but McCoy was far more involved in the passing game. Once again, though, that's likely more a function of their respective offensive schemes.

I think McCoy is going to be a really, really special player in this league - the guy who Reggie Bush was supposed to be. Not to say he's better right now, because he's clearly not, but I don't think that this is Charles in a blowout going forward, either.

phlysac
07-06-2011, 03:07 PM
Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Dez in a blowout
Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Not even close. Dez Bryant.

I have no problem with anyonne prefering Bryant. I'd consider voting him myself. But the "dominance" isn't understandeable to me.

Let's compare Bryant's rookie season with Crabtree's rookie season (which was statistically inferior to his 2nd season.)

D.Bryant - 12 Games | 45 Receptions | 561 Yards | 12.5 YPC | 6td
Crabtree - 11 Games | 48 Receptions | 625 Yards | 13.0 YPC | 2td

Considering the offensive DINOSAUR that was Singletary/Raye, I'd say Crabtree has actually been pretty decent.

The trend of 49ers fans has been to pile on hatred for Crabtree. This attitude has trickled into the media and influenced many peope's perception of his performance thus far.

K Train
07-06-2011, 03:12 PM
i think dez will be a top 3 guy in a few years, id expect crabtree to get better and be an effective player but i think dez will end up being great.

lol at "offensive DINOSAUR"

phlysac
07-06-2011, 03:12 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin McCourtey

Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie vs Antonio Cromartie

Joe Flacco vs. Josh Freeman

Maurice Jones-Drew vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

Desean Jackson vs Mike Wallace

Ben Roethlisberger vs Matt Ryan

LeGarrette Blount vs Jonathan Stewart

Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson

A Perfect Score
07-06-2011, 03:17 PM
Also, since the list got much longer and much better, I'll chime in

Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel (Neither, they both suck)

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

K Train
07-06-2011, 03:38 PM
Few more:


Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin Mccourtey

DRC vs Antonio Cromartie

OSUGiants17
07-06-2011, 04:19 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin Mccourtey

DRC vs Antonio Cromartie

DoughBoy
07-06-2011, 04:31 PM
Got some

Flacco vs. Freeman

MJD vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

cmarq83
07-06-2011, 04:47 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
Brady and I'll say nothing more on the subject ;)

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
Peterson because he is such a load to bring down. Loves the game and plays 100% every down.

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
Calvin's talent is undeniable. If he can ever get enough stability in Detroit I'd think he'd do historically incredible things.

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
I'm probably the only non-9ers fan who would take Crabtree. He is just so freaking fluid as a wide receiver and his hands are so strong. If he ever decides to put the time in (huge if), and gets some stability at QB I think he could put in some Marvin Harrison type 140 reception seasons. Bryant I feel like has a Aqib Talib type moment in his future though I liked the way he played in his rookie season.

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Please lol

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
Williams, Allen is colossally overrated

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
Willis, but apples to oranges

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
Ware is a better run defender than Matthews, so I'll take him.

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
I think Revis is better than Nnamdi. I think teams can't throw on Revis whereas Nnamdi they just didn't because he was on the Raiders.

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
Bailey

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
Reed

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson
Jackson

cmarq83
07-06-2011, 04:48 PM
Flacco vs. Freeman
Freeman

MJD vs. Ray Rice
MJD

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace
Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten
Davis

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long
Thomas

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers
Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton
Williams

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake
Suggs

cmarq83
07-06-2011, 04:52 PM
Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford
Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy
Charles

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice
Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace
Nicks

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin
Maclin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez
Gronk by a huuuuuuuuuuuuge margin

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey
Raji

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis
Knighton

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole
Cole is so underrated in this league

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris
Timmons is way more versatile

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley
Orakpo

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers
Flowers is more physical that is why I like him better.

ATLDirtyBirds
07-06-2011, 11:08 PM
Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

By far the toughest for me. Loved Stafford coming out, was very meh on Bradford. I also feel as if Bradford's year was overrated. However, I'm going to go with him because I feel like he can dominate the world with McDaniels. But you have to love Stafford's cast, but those injuries... Can't decide right now.

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

As stated, maybe not a huge difference, but I think Jamaal is definitely better.

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

I've been a huge fan of Run DMC for a while. Actually thought he was pretty close with Adrian as a prospect.

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Wallace is just scary. Complete and utter game changer.

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Tough, because Maclin looked amazing last year, and the Michael Vick factor. But I just can't helping loving Percy. So dynamic.

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

I think you can almost consider Hernandez a WR at this point. Gronk gets it for being able to do it all.


BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Thought this was pretty easy, even as a Dorsey fan.

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Need more consistency from Pot Roast, but I'm just very meh on Ellis.

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Does not get enough credit. He does not stop. Ever. Underrated against the run especially.

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Much more of an athlete.

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Every fiber wants to say Orakpo because of what a freak he is, but Woodley is just so much more efficient.

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers
Always been a big fan of Flowers, but Tramon was just too good last year. More versatile, more of a playmaker.

ellsy82
07-07-2011, 12:13 AM
I think between all those guys, Desean Jackson vs Mike Wallace would be a good battle.

At QB...Big Ben vs Matty Ice.

RB...Blount vs J-Stew.

Bengalsrocket
07-07-2011, 03:20 AM
boldin in AZ was more dangerous than ward ever was or will be. For a while boldin vs fitz was a legit debate and i liked boldins style so much.

I agree that Boldin is more talented as a pure receiver than Ward, but Ward seems like a really good leader and a great locker room guy. He seems like a really great guy to have on your team from a coach's perspective, which is worth something to me.

I could be wrong about all that, but I still think Ward is an under appreciated monster. I honestly am having a hard time deciding who I like better. I think Boldin is the better of the two, but only by a small bit for me.

igglefanz
07-07-2011, 06:26 AM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady
Very Very close could go either way.

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson
Peterson is to me a more complete runner.

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson
Calvin just scares me as of talent. If consistant QB play happens in Detroit may get the stats to match the talent.

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant
Dez has tons of ability just a 2 cent brain. But to me more upside and can possibly become one of the greats.

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates
Gates because Tony is far over the hill.

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis
Really do i even need to say anything

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams
This baffles me how everyone is calling Jared Allen overrated but comparing possibly the second most disruptive front seven player in Allen in the last 5 years to a player I can make a case for ((and will in the next post)) that isn't even top 5 in his position as a 4-3 DE?

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison
Kinda an apples to oranges comparison.

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware
Matthews is a monster but Ware to me best front 7 player in the NFL right now.

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
Just has done just as much as Revis with worse team. Its close both are amazing

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson
I think champ has a good season or 2 left in him.

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu
Coverage skills not as good as Reed but injuries have taken their toll on Reed.

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson
Jackson is just as good of a return man and 1k a year receiver.

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford
When healthy.

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy
I am not a homer Charles is just more complete and wont kid myself.

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice
Very close wash to me.

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace
Nicks has been hurt a bit by the system they run in NY as of learning it but is getting it down and numbers and production will only improve. Great player in the making.

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin
Maclin is the better pure receiver but Harvin is better overall, more versatile.

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez
With that name how could you go wrong?? LOL just kidding

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey
Another apples to oranges comparison

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis
Knighton I think has more upside but has yet to really show it.


Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole
This one just tears me up having to admit it its close but I think Tuck is a smidge better. Cole is more consistent and better against the run and more sacks but biggest gripe is he plays flatfooted and doesn't go for the ball. (Lack of FF and Passes deflected)

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris
Close again but Timmons is more of a game changer/disruptive.

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley
Woodley is amazing but i feel if you put Orakpo in his spot he would excel even more. Its close though. Its hard to assume what someone would do in a better situation.

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers
Williams is very underrated when it comes to talking about the best db's

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas
Its pretty easy

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel
Samuel is a better corner although Talib is more physical.

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth
Part of a great young line in STL

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold
Is a wash both are amazing

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson
Another close one. Ferguson I have just seen take games over a bit more at the tackle spot.

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady
Monroe is going to be good not sure yet on how great though

Joe Haden vs Devin Mccourtey
Haden will be the better of the 2 when all is said and done.

DRC vs Antonio Cromartie
There is a reason San Deigo didn't keep Antonio

igglefanz
07-07-2011, 06:56 AM
/rant on

Can someone please explain this Mario Williams love. Is it just because he plays in Houston and everyone thinks he would do better elsewhere because I have yet to see how he is being compared to Peppers and Allen in this thread?

In the last 5 years not only has Allen and Peppers outperformed him but so has Justin tuck, Trent Cole, Dwight Freeny, John Abraham, Osi and Robert Mathis. Really to me from what i have seen Mario Williams is the overrated one. He is like White truffle oil in cooking. Its glamorous and cute but when you get back and really look at it all it is is expensive , a trend and really not that good.

And for those wondering just a comparative stat between Allen and Williams last 5 Years.

Williams 48 sacks, 182 tackles, 10 forced fumbles, 9 passes deflected, 0 int

Allen 63 sacks, 249 tackles, 15 forced fumbles, 33 passes deflected, 4int

Is one reason that people feel Jared Allen is overrated because he has a bad start to the 2010 season? 1 sack his first 7 games isnt great but yet he still had a better season then Williams did. I guess I just don't get it.

/rant off

TitanHope
07-07-2011, 07:01 AM
Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson


>:D

K Train
07-07-2011, 08:05 AM
I agree that Boldin is more talented as a pure receiver than Ward, but Ward seems like a really good leader and a great locker room guy. He seems like a really great guy to have on your team from a coach's perspective, which is worth something to me.

I could be wrong about all that, but I still think Ward is an under appreciated monster. I honestly am having a hard time deciding who I like better. I think Boldin is the better of the two, but only by a small bit for me.

ward is just as much of a baby as boldin was about his contract as boldin was in AZ when fitz got paid out. He held out, he cried when plax was drafted, he cried when santonio was drafted, he cried when ben asked for a tall WR....and hes made top dollar for a WR for a good portion of his career when he wasnt cranking out anywhere near to top dollar production.

i never really been a ward fan, love what he brings to the table in physicality and as a 3rd down reciever...but right now hes a mini TE/slot reciever and he can do well in that role, but id hate for him to keep guys like sanders and brown on the bench just cause hes hines ward

ellsy82
07-07-2011, 08:38 AM
/rant on

Can someone please explain this Mario Williams love. Is it just because he plays in Houston and everyone thinks he would do better elsewhere because I have yet to see how he is being compared to Peppers and Allen in this thread?

In the last 5 years not only has Allen and Peppers outperformed him but so has Justin tuck, Trent Cole, Dwight Freeny, John Abraham, Osi and Robert Mathis. Really to me from what i have seen Mario Williams is the overrated one. He is like White truffle oil in cooking. Its glamorous and cute but when you get back and really look at it all it is is expensive , a trend and really not that good.

And for those wondering just a comparative stat between Allen and Williams last 5 Years.

Williams 48 sacks, 182 tackles, 10 forced fumbles, 9 passes deflected, 0 int

Allen 63 sacks, 249 tackles, 15 forced fumbles, 33 passes deflected, 4int

Is one reason that people feel Jared Allen is overrated because he has a bad start to the 2010 season? 1 sack his first 7 games isnt great but yet he still had a better season then Williams did. I guess I just don't get it.

/rant off

I'm not defending Williams here...but in their second year the stats are kind negligible.

Williams 14 sacks, 53 tackles, 2 forced fumbles, 1 pass deflected, 0 ints

Allen 11 sacks, 55 tackles, 7 forced fumbles, 5 passes defended, 0 ints

I think Allen has put together a better resume, but he's also played with a much better cast. I think this is another apples to oranges debate. Either way, I think Allen is the better defensive end overall, but he's also had more help.

K Train
07-07-2011, 08:41 AM
allen didnt really have much in KC and he was still pretty good.

allen just has a non stop motor and just simply never quits, i love mario though hes so gifted and its not just all measurables hes a terror against the run and a good pass rusher on a pretty terrible defense

Nalej
07-07-2011, 10:41 AM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha
-Ugh, I can't

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin McCourtey

Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie vs Antonio Cromartie

Joe Flacco vs. Josh Freeman

Maurice Jones-Drew vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

Desean Jackson vs Mike Wallace

Ben Roethlisberger vs Matt Ryan

LeGarrette Blount vs Jonathan Stewart

Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson

__________________

cmarq83
07-07-2011, 02:45 PM
/rant on

Can someone please explain this Mario Williams love. Is it just because he plays in Houston and everyone thinks he would do better elsewhere because I have yet to see how he is being compared to Peppers and Allen in this thread?

In the last 5 years not only has Allen and Peppers outperformed him but so has Justin tuck, Trent Cole, Dwight Freeny, John Abraham, Osi and Robert Mathis. Really to me from what i have seen Mario Williams is the overrated one. He is like White truffle oil in cooking. Its glamorous and cute but when you get back and really look at it all it is is expensive , a trend and really not that good.

And for those wondering just a comparative stat between Allen and Williams last 5 Years.

Williams 48 sacks, 182 tackles, 10 forced fumbles, 9 passes deflected, 0 int

Allen 63 sacks, 249 tackles, 15 forced fumbles, 33 passes deflected, 4int

Is one reason that people feel Jared Allen is overrated because he has a bad start to the 2010 season? 1 sack his first 7 games isnt great but yet he still had a better season then Williams did. I guess I just don't get it.

/rant off

I'm kind of shocked at how everyone has forgotten just how putrid of a run defender Allen is. If you ever really take the time to watch him play the game, he is allotted so much freedom in rushing the passer that he simply takes himself out of way to many plays in the run game. I feel like there is a huge misconception that has been made since he moved from KC to Minnesota in thinking that Allen is somehow now an ok run defender. Before he was traded he was mentioned commonly in league circles as one of the worst run defenders in the NFL. Now just because he's played next to the Williams wall and had Henderson/Greenway to back him up doesn't mean that he is suddenly good against the run. He has no sense of gap control, and gets a ton of pressure because he is allowed to stunt more than 95% of defensive ends in the NFL.

He makes a lot of splash plays and certainly has value because of the nature of today's NFL, but give me a 2 way player who gets 10 sacks per year rather than a 14 sack a year guy who contributes nothing in half of defensive plays. Plus, he ran very hot and cold last year and when he is cold you get nothing out of him as a football player.

molenguinurtle
07-09-2011, 12:26 AM
What ppl dont know about boldin is in his time at Arizona he averaged more yards per game then anyone in NFL history. He came to baltimore and he slipped to 7th all time after one season. But still impressive. Also he was the quickest player in NFL history to get to 600 catches

Sidenote: Do we think Boldin gets in the HOF?

Ravens1991
07-09-2011, 12:30 AM
honestly I dont see it. Off the top of my head the WRs in his era that are better then him are Moss,TO,Harrison,Fitz,Johnson. And no guy who is at best the 6th best player at his position should get into the HOF.

AntoinCD
07-14-2011, 07:01 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin McCourty

Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie vs Antonio Cromartie

Joe Flacco vs. Josh Freeman

Maurice Jones-Drew vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

Desean Jackson vs Mike Wallace

Ben Roethlisberger vs Matt Ryan

LeGarrette Blount vs Jonathan Stewart

Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson

AntoinCD
07-14-2011, 07:03 PM
Sidenote: Do we think Boldin gets in the HOF?

Definitely not. As good as he was(possibly still is) and for all the numbers you can bring up he was never the main guy on his team, never considered the best, or even top 3, in the league and hasn't had an overall impact on the league that others have. I would have him behind Ocho Cinco and Reggie Wayne as well and I don't see either of them getting near the Hall

gpngc
07-14-2011, 07:13 PM
/rant on

Can someone please explain this Mario Williams love. Is it just because he plays in Houston and everyone thinks he would do better elsewhere because I have yet to see how he is being compared to Peppers and Allen in this thread?

In the last 5 years not only has Allen and Peppers outperformed him but so has Justin tuck, Trent Cole, Dwight Freeny, John Abraham, Osi and Robert Mathis. Really to me from what i have seen Mario Williams is the overrated one. He is like White truffle oil in cooking. Its glamorous and cute but when you get back and really look at it all it is is expensive , a trend and really not that good.

And for those wondering just a comparative stat between Allen and Williams last 5 Years.

Williams 48 sacks, 182 tackles, 10 forced fumbles, 9 passes deflected, 0 int

Allen 63 sacks, 249 tackles, 15 forced fumbles, 33 passes deflected, 4int

Is one reason that people feel Jared Allen is overrated because he has a bad start to the 2010 season? 1 sack his first 7 games isnt great but yet he still had a better season then Williams did. I guess I just don't get it.

/rant off

I think you may be right that Jared Allen is the better player but allow me to make some excuses for Williams.

- He's definitely better against the run than Allen.

- Williams had a down year last season for two reasons: 1) played hurt. 2) the defense around him (including scheme and personnel) was atrocious.

Finally, 48 sacks in 5 years (including last year's injury-plagued season) is almost 10 sacks per year which is damn good. And that's as the focal point of the blocking scheme. Allen did have great years in KC but when he put up monster #s in Minny he was arguably the second focus after Kevin Williams and Ray Edwards received attention as well.

gpngc
07-14-2011, 07:14 PM
I'm kind of shocked at how everyone has forgotten just how putrid of a run defender Allen is. If you ever really take the time to watch him play the game, he is allotted so much freedom in rushing the passer that he simply takes himself out of way to many plays in the run game. I feel like there is a huge misconception that has been made since he moved from KC to Minnesota in thinking that Allen is somehow now an ok run defender. Before he was traded he was mentioned commonly in league circles as one of the worst run defenders in the NFL. Now just because he's played next to the Williams wall and had Henderson/Greenway to back him up doesn't mean that he is suddenly good against the run. He has no sense of gap control, and gets a ton of pressure because he is allowed to stunt more than 95% of defensive ends in the NFL.

He makes a lot of splash plays and certainly has value because of the nature of today's NFL, but give me a 2 way player who gets 10 sacks per year rather than a 14 sack a year guy who contributes nothing in half of defensive plays. Plus, he ran very hot and cold last year and when he is cold you get nothing out of him as a football player.

Didn't see this. Good post.

OSUGiants17
07-14-2011, 07:31 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin Mccourtey

DRC vs Antonio Cromartie

Flacco vs. Freeman

MJD vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson

PackerLegend
07-14-2011, 07:34 PM
Who do you choose?

Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady - Draw

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson - Draw

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson - Andre

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant - Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates - Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis - Suh

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams - Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison - Draw

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware - Matthews cant not pick him :D

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha - Draw

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson - Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu - Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson - Jackson

my thoughts.

yo123
07-14-2011, 07:51 PM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin McCourtey

Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie vs Antonio Cromartie

Joe Flacco vs. Josh Freeman

Maurice Jones-Drew vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

Desean Jackson vs Mike Wallace

Ben Roethlisberger vs Matt Ryan

LeGarrette Blount vs Jonathan Stewart

Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson

gpngc
07-14-2011, 09:43 PM
great interview! Thanks for the news.
___________________________
Tera Gold (http://www.teragoldbox.com/)RS Gold (http://www.4rsgold.com/)Tera Item (http://www.gobuytera.com/Tera.items)

You're welcome Romeo!

igglefanz
07-15-2011, 02:21 AM
I think you may be right that Jared Allen is the better player but allow me to make some excuses for Williams.

- He's definitely better against the run than Allen.

- Williams had a down year last season for two reasons: 1) played hurt. 2) the defense around him (including scheme and personnel) was atrocious.

Finally, 48 sacks in 5 years (including last year's injury-plagued season) is almost 10 sacks per year which is damn good. And that's as the focal point of the blocking scheme. Allen did have great years in KC but when he put up monster #s in Minny he was arguably the second focus after Kevin Williams and Ray Edwards received attention as well.

Now yes I do agree that you can give the run defense to Williams but Jared does make tackles and plays against the run but its not just sacks that I am looking at. This is a pass first league and there is other factors I was looking at.

Jared Allen has over 3 times more passes deflected then Williams. 33 passes deflected vs 9 over the last 5 years. That usually leads to incomplete passes or ints. Jared averages .4125 passes deflected per game so about once every other game. In a pass first league offensive coordinators and qb have to worry about passing lanes on his half of the field

Jared forces 50% more fumbles then Williams over the last 5 years and does have 4 ints vs none for Williams. Also 3 safeties (( albeit it was one where the Lions qb was ran out of the back of the endzone)) vs none for Williams. He does alot more then just sack the qb.

In a 4-3 defense you NEED to have a disruptive force in the DE spot you can get great run support from other places but unless you have a freak like Suh at DT the DE has to be able to put constant pressure on the QB. As i said in my other post I don't think Williams is the best at DE. Top 10 yes but I would rather have a few other DE's over him.

I also think that the first half of the 2010 season there was something wrong with Allen either physically or mentally. If it was an injury which i think he had just didn't have that burst at the start of the season, getting married/cutting his hair ((lol kidding)) or zoned out due to childress coaching. Even if minny looses Edwards I think Jared Will have another 14 sack 45 tackle year. In fact I think he will have a career year this year for being looked over by others in the league and being ranked so low in the top 100 players. he has alot to prove and I think he will do it this year.

yo123
07-15-2011, 08:02 AM
Huh? Why are we talking as if Jared Allen isn't good against the run? How the hell is Mario clearly better than him against the run?

TheBoyWonder22
07-15-2011, 08:23 AM
Peyton Manning vs Tom Brady

Chris Johnson vs Adrian Peterson

Andre Johnson vs Calvin Johnson

Michael Crabtree vs Dez Bryant

Tony Gonzalez vs Antonio Gates

Ndamukong Suh vs Sedrick Ellis

Jared Allen vs Mario Williams

Patrick Willis vs James Harrison

Clay Matthews vs DeMarcus Ware

Darrelle Revis vs Nnamdi Asomugha

Champ Bailey vs Charles Woodson

Ed Reed vs Troy Polamalu

Devin Hester vs Desean Jackson

Matt Stafford v. Sam Bradford

Jamaal Charles v. LeSean McCoy

Darren McFadden v. Ray Rice

Hakeem Nicks v. Mike Wallace

Jeremy Maclin v. Percy Harvin

Rob Gronkowski v. Aaron Hernandez

BJ Raji v. Glenn Dorsey

Terrance Knighton v. Sedrick Ellis

Justin Tuck v. Trent Cole

Lawrence Timmons v. David Harris

Brian Orakpo v. LaMarr Woodley

Tramon Williams v. Brandon Flowers

Brent Grimes v. Terrell Thomas

Aquib Talib v. Asante Samuel

Roger Saffold v. Andrew Whitworth

Jahri Evans v. Nick Mangold

Jake Long v. D'Brickashaw Ferguson

Eugene Monroe v. Ryan Clady

Jared Velheer vs Branden Albert

Alex Mack vs Maurkice Pouncey

Jermaine Gresham vs Brandon Pettigrew

Joe Haden vs Devin McCourtey

Dominique Rodgers-Cromartie vs Antonio Cromartie

Joe Flacco vs. Josh Freeman

Maurice Jones-Drew vs. Ray Rice

Santonio Holmes vs Mike Wallace

Vernon Davis vs Jason Witten

Joe Thomas vs Jake Long

Mario Williams vs Julius Peppers

Kyle Williams vs Casey Hampton

Terrell Suggs vs Cameron Wake

Desean Jackson vs Mike Wallace

Ben Roethlisberger vs Matt Ryan

LeGarrette Blount vs Jonathan Stewart

Peyton Hillis vs LeGarrette Blount

Arian Foster vs Jamaal Charles vs DeAngelo Williams

Maurice Jones-Drew vs Steven Jackson

Tony Romo vs Michael Vick

Cortland Finnegan vs Brandon Flowers

Eric Berry vs Troy Polamalu

Patrick Chung vs Michael Griffin

Michael Roos vs Jason Peters

Jared Gaither vs Michael Oher PUSH

Jon Beason vs Lawrence Timmons

John Abraham vs Dwight Freeney

Tamba Hali vs Cameron Wake

Isreal Idonije vs Jason Jones

Kyle Williams vs Albert Haynesworth

Haloti Ngata vs Ndamukong Suh

Larry Fitzgerald vs Andre Johnson

SickwithIt1010
07-15-2011, 01:51 PM
Huh? Why are we talking as if Jared Allen isn't good against the run? How the hell is Mario clearly better than him against the run?

How is he not?