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shylo3716
07-13-2011, 06:50 PM
Sooo this site has been dying down with topics since the lockout. I figure to make a thread since the Supplemental Draft will be coming up soon.

Anyone on this forum have any idea when this will take place?

phlysac
07-13-2011, 06:57 PM
Asfar as what I've been able to read, the NFL announced that it would likely happen in July, but an "official" date has never been announced.

shylo3716
07-13-2011, 07:55 PM
Asfar as what I've been able to read, the NFL announced that it would likely happen in July, but an "official" date has never been announced.

One source just tole me that it will not take place as long as the lockout is still going......I don't know how true it is but I hope someone can fill us in on that.

shylo3716
07-13-2011, 08:04 PM
Which big name prospects should we be on the lookout for besides Pryor & King?

phlysac
07-13-2011, 08:32 PM
One source just tole me that it will not take place as long as the lockout is still going......I don't know how true it is but I hope someone can fill us in on that.
The NFL confirmed that the Supplemental Draft would be held regardless of a new CBA or not. They announced that it wouldlikely take place in July, but that an official declaration was deemed unnecessary because (at that point) noone had registered for it. That has changed but the official date is still TBD.

Which big name prospects should we be on the lookout for besides Pryor & King?
Those are the only two players that have applied, to my knowledge. Therefore they are the only two eligible at this point. The only "big name" player with rumors attached to the Supplemental was former Florida CB Janoris Jenkins. He has since transfered to FCS North Alabama. Other rumors involved Pryor's fellow-suspended and former Buckeyes Mike Adams (OT), DeVier Posey (WR), and Daniel "Boom" Herron (RB).

LonghornsLegend
07-13-2011, 08:40 PM
Those are the only two players that have applied, to my knowledge. Therefore they are the only two eligible at this point.



Which is the case alot, some years they don't even get 2 players that are worth giving up a pick for. Which is why I don't know why people bringing up how many good players come from the Supplemental Draft like the list is long of how many guys even go.

Duffman57
07-13-2011, 09:04 PM
One source just tole me that it will not take place as long as the lockout is still going......I don't know how true it is but I hope someone can fill us in on that.

Well this is rather obvious. Because right now, there is no 2012 NFL draft, you cant draw picks from the 2012 draft.

Dam8610
07-13-2011, 09:09 PM
In the 2011 draft, picks as far out as the 2014 draft were allowed to be traded IIRC.

phlysac
07-13-2011, 09:42 PM
Well this is rather obvious. Because right now, there is no 2012 NFL draft, you cant draw picks from the 2012 draft.

As obvious as it sounds, it's not true. The 2011 Supplementsl Draft will take place whether a new CBA is reached or not.

Duffman57
07-13-2011, 09:46 PM
As obvious as it sounds, it's not true. The 2011 Supplementsl Draft will take place whether a new CBA is reached or not.

But how can you pull picks from a draft that doesn't exist. Please let me know how that works...

phlysac
07-13-2011, 09:48 PM
But how can you pull picks from a draft that doesn't exist. Please let me know how that works...

It's a presumptive business decision made by the NFL. They've already announced that the Supplemental Draft will take place. Does it make total sense? Not entirely, but it's their business and they decide what goes.

Duffman57
07-13-2011, 10:51 PM
It's a presumptive business decision made by the NFL. They've already announced that the Supplemental Draft will take place. Does it make total sense? Not entirely, but it's their business and they decide what goes.

So in the instance that there is no draft, then all the people who were drafted are just basically free agents who got forced into a team.

phlysac
07-14-2011, 12:28 AM
So in the instance that there is no draft, then all the people who were drafted are just basically free agents who got forced into a team.

That would be under the assumption that a new CBA wouldn't be drafted prior to the 2012 Draft, which is likely not a serious consideration of the NFL. However, if that were the case, I'm sure that criteria would be constructed that would simply ratify the draft selections a team has once a draft is once again conducted.

descendency
07-14-2011, 05:47 AM
I imagine right after a CBA is signed. Maybe during the no-free agency dead period (they get a week after the deal is signed to prep, or at least that was the plan)

K Train
07-14-2011, 08:17 AM
it would be so awesome if the supplemental draft was pryor, jenkins, posey, adams, herron, and floyd...it could be an epic sup draft

JoeJoeBrown
07-14-2011, 09:21 AM
it would be so awesome if the supplemental draft was pryor, jenkins, posey, adams, herron, and floyd...it could be an epic sup draft

That would be an absolutely terrible supplemental draft. Rotten.

Shane P. Hallam
07-14-2011, 11:20 AM
So in the instance that there is no draft, then all the people who were drafted are just basically free agents who got forced into a team.

Yeah, you make no sense here man. the 2012 draft DOES exist. There has been a draft every year. Under other CBAs, there have been future picks traded for drafts that weren't covered before, this is nothing new.

The supplemental draft in the current CBA is identified under a clause in the NFL Draft section, which is the last event of the CBA. Due to this, the supplemental draft can happen in the lockout and will. They NEVER set the date of it in advance. Sometimes a week, sometimes two days before do they set it. It is usually very late in July.

OSUGiants17
07-14-2011, 02:08 PM
Sooo this site has been dying down with topics since the lockout. I figure I will make one million threads in the 2011 NFL Draft Forum

fixed it for ya

DBNYDP
07-14-2011, 02:32 PM
I've been hearing a lot about Mike Adams entering the supplemental draft.
I don't know a lot about him, but I've heard that he is a first round tackle that could probably play LT In the NFL. Any info on him?

shylo3716
07-14-2011, 04:28 PM
fixed it for ya

EAT A D*CK! :)

prock
07-14-2011, 04:31 PM
So in the instance that there is no draft, then all the people who were drafted are just basically free agents who got forced into a team.

There will be a 2012 draft. Don't worry about it.

phlysac
07-14-2011, 05:31 PM
I've been hearing a lot about Mike Adams entering the supplemental draft.
I don't know a lot about him, but I've heard that he is a first round tackle that could probably play LT In the NFL. Any info on him?

Off-field questions aside, he was probably a top-5 OT prospect. 6"6"ish 310lbsish. Lombardi Watch list heading into 2012. 1st Team All-Big Ten (media and coaches.

I'd say he's a top-50 pick should he declare. So I'd assume a 2nd or 3rd in the Supp will get him.

PossibleCabbage
07-14-2011, 08:04 PM
Since the NFL abandoned a 12 round format in the 1993 NFL draft, fifteen players have been selected in the supplemental draft. That's an average of .88 players/year. On four different occasions in this era there have been two or more players selected in the supplemental draft: (1994: Tito Wooten and John Davis, 4th and 5th; 1998: Mike Wahle and Jamal Williams, both 2nds; 2007: Paul Oliver and Jared Gaither a 4th and a 5th; and 2010 Harvey Unga and Josh Price-Brent, both 7ths).

This is unlikely to be one of those "2 supplemental draft picks" years (Pryor will get drafted if eligible, nobody else probably will) and guys rarely declare for the supplemental draft unless they absolutely have to. "Being in the supplemental draft" is a pretty substantial red flag.

shylo3716
07-21-2011, 07:14 PM
No Pryor updates?

Shane P. Hallam
07-21-2011, 07:20 PM
Since the NFL abandoned a 12 round format in the 1993 NFL draft, fifteen players have been selected in the supplemental draft. That's an average of .88 players/year. On four different occasions in this era there have been two or more players selected in the supplemental draft: (1994: Tito Wooten and John Davis, 4th and 5th; 1998: Mike Wahle and Jamal Williams, both 2nds; 2007: Paul Oliver and Jared Gaither a 4th and a 5th; and 2010 Harvey Unga and Josh Price-Brent, both 7ths).

This is unlikely to be one of those "2 supplemental draft picks" years (Pryor will get drafted if eligible, nobody else probably will) and guys rarely declare for the supplemental draft unless they absolutely have to. "Being in the supplemental draft" is a pretty substantial red flag.

Why are we starting our statistics in 1993 again?

LonghornsLegend
07-21-2011, 08:51 PM
Who even cares about those stats. They are pointless to me. If a guy ends up in there and he's good give him a look, who cares how many players come out of the supp or what former odds were.


That said, JBP is a keeper. Guy is a cog in the middle of the 3-4 and a future starter.

phlysac
07-21-2011, 10:41 PM
No Pryor updates?

Will this do?

Pryor splitting time in Miami, Jeannette preparing for NFL

Terrelle Pryor's quest to play quarterback in the NFL is beginning to have a distinct Steelers flavor.

The former Jeannette High School standout, who left Ohio State in June amid allegations of NCAA violations, has spent time in Florida working out with Steelers receiver Antonio Brown, former receiver Plaxico Burress and retired quarterbacks coach Ken Anderson.

Bengals receiver Chad Ochocinco and Ravens receiver Donte' Stallworth also are regular route runners for Pryor.

"I'm being a sponge right now," Pryor told the Tribune-Review. "I'm trying to learn as much as I can. Coach Anderson is a brilliant guy who had a great NFL career. I'm glad I had a chance to work with him."

Still, Pryor relishes the opportunity to return home, where he is beloved by those young and old and idolized for his athletic achievements. In a school district rich in athletic tradition, Pryor stands out as arguably the Jayhawks' best athlete.

On Friday, he was working up a good sweat as he lifted weights with former high school teammates Davonte Shannon, Rob James, Jason Marquis, Nick Spino and Tyrone Baughman in the new weight room at McKee Stadium.

Afterward, he organized a workout on the stadium field, where he ran sprints and worked on his footwork, all in preparation for a possible NFL career.

"It's a relief to come back and work out with the guys," said Pryor, who has declared his intention to enter the NFL supplemental draft, which can't be held until the league's lockout ends. "It brings back some great memories being in the weight room and getting work done.

"The new facility is nice for the high school players and is something they deserve. It's a great facility, a lot different than Coach (Roy) Hall's garage. The garage, though, had character."

Pryor agreed to talk with the Tribune-Review on one condition: No questions about the allegations at Ohio State or his leaving the university.

Asked at one point if he felt he made mistakes, Pryor paused, then dismissed the question.

Pryor left Ohio State amid an NCAA investigation into improper benefits to Buckeyes players. The university suspended Pryor and four teammates for the first five games this fall for selling memorabilia for cash and tattoos. The NCAA also is investigating vehicle transactions involving Pryor and other Ohio State athletes and two Columbus, Ohio, car dealerships.

The ordeal led to coach Jim Tressel's resignation.

While appearing recently on an ESPN special with former Oakland Raiders and Tampa Bay Buccaneers coach Jon Gruden, Pryor admitted to making mistakes and regretting how he and Tressel left Ohio State.

On Friday, he raved about the opportunity to work with Gruden.

"Coach Gruden, he's my man," Pryor said. "He's a great guy, and it was a great opportunity for me, Cam (Newton), Blaine (Gabbert) and Jake (Locker) to work with him.

"You have to soak that in from a great quarterback coach and a guy who knows the quarterback position and learn as much as you can."

Pryor spends part of his time training at a Jewish community center in Miami.

Mostly, he's trying to refine his throwing technique, an area in which he said Anderson has been instrumental.

"Footwork and getting my hips right during my throwing motion is the biggest thing he's taught me," Pryor said. "Little things to make me a better quarterback."

He said he has not been frustrated by the NFL lockout, despite the uncertainty of his future.

"I'm getting a chance to work on things I didn't do well at Ohio State," Pryor said. "I have a chance to get better. I want to be the best quarterback I can possibly be.

"Whether I go as a first-round (supplemental) draft pick or a seventh-round draft pick, it doesn't matter. ... When I get in there, I'm going to work my butt off and compete."

Hall, who served as Pryor's quarterbacks coach at Jeannette before becoming head coach after Pryor graduated, said he sees a difference in Pryor.

"He eats right, and he's focused during his workouts," Hall said. "He's gotten better with his footwork and throwing motion, and he likes showing me what he's learned.

"For people to say Terrelle is not a hard worker or a good leader, then they are not seeing the person I'm seeing. Terrelle is always talking or showing the kids here what he has learned and sharing experiences with them."

Pryor knows people doubt that he will make it at quarterback in the NFL. He said all he can do is show them they are wrong.

"The time will come," he said, "when I show them that I can."
http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/steelers/s_747126.html

Shane P. Hallam
07-21-2011, 11:05 PM
Talked to an agent. Told me that it is looking likely the Supplemental Draft is cancelled and Pryor/King just become free agents in the UDFA pool.

Shane P. Hallam
07-21-2011, 11:37 PM
Not for Pryor. Being drafted would likely equal more money as he could command whatever players drafted in that round get.

Shane P. Hallam
07-21-2011, 11:49 PM
i think you're highly overestimating where he would've been drafted. instead of a 4th round salary (or whatever), he may be able to generate a bidding war, since everyone has equal access. i think he comes out with better than a 2nd round contract as a result.

Everyone I'm talking to is indicating that Pryor and Rosenhaus are not happy with this possibility. Not enough interest for a bidding war, but enough to get him drafted.

underscore
07-24-2011, 04:11 PM
So...what if Pryor isn't even eligible for the supplemental draft?

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/Former-Ohio-State-quarterback-Terrelle-Pryor-might-not-be-eligible-if-NFL-has-supplemental-draft--072411

SolidGold
07-24-2011, 04:35 PM
That would be great if Pryor was not declared eligible for the supplemental draft.

Shane P. Hallam
07-24-2011, 04:36 PM
If his coach leaving the University is not seen as making him eligible, it will get ugly. Caleb King qualifies anyway

FTRWRTR
07-25-2011, 11:47 AM
If his coach leaving the University is not seen as making him eligible, it will get ugly. I agree, his circumstances did change, not only did his coach leave but he was also most likely looking at being suspended for the entire year And that's only if the NCAA would've ruled him eligible, which wasn't a given considering all those different cars he was driving.

PossibleCabbage
07-25-2011, 02:30 PM
Why are we starting our statistics in 1993 again?

The 93 draft had 8 rounds, all subsequent drafts had 7 rounds. Before 1993 drafts were 12 round affairs. Obviously more people are going to get drafted in the supplemental draft if teams have more picks late picks to use.

Shane P. Hallam
07-25-2011, 02:59 PM
Okay, but can't you take the players drafted in just the first 7 of those rounds?

underscore
07-25-2011, 08:28 PM
Now that the CBA is signed, any word on the supplemental draft?

PossibleCabbage
07-25-2011, 11:51 PM
Now that the CBA is signed, any word on the supplemental draft?

Well, there should be one since there's at least one guy who qualifies (Caleb King). The internal discussion will be whether or not Pryor actually qualifies for the Supplemental Draft. Under the traditional criterion, he does not since he would not have been prevented from playing for this entire season at Ohio State or elsewhere (unless of course, other stuff came out.)

If Pryor is not allowed into the supplemental draft, he will likely sue a la Maurice Clarett (and lose, a la Maurice Clarett)... but I think Pryor's representation hopes that the hassle of a lawsuit will convince the NFL to bend the rules for their client.

The Supplemental Draft will probably happen after August 4th, since the NFL has final CBA details to work on until then.

underscore
07-26-2011, 08:35 PM
Sounds like the Ohio State powers that be are doing their best to make sure Pryor is eligible for the supplemental draft.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/6805747/ohio-state-bans-terrelle-pryor-five-years-says-play-11-season

K Train
07-28-2011, 02:48 PM
any news on this?

Shane P. Hallam
07-28-2011, 02:49 PM
I'm pretty sure it isn't happening.

K Train
07-28-2011, 02:55 PM
so pryor will try to go through the courts to be an UDFA?

weird

PossibleCabbage
07-28-2011, 07:20 PM
so pryor will try to go through the courts to be an UDFA?

weird

The NFL could conceivably just say "yeah, you guys are FAs... whatever" if they wanted to avoid the court fight. I don't think that Pryor would like that, to be honest. A team who spends a draft choice on him next year is going to place much more value on him than a team who just signs him for cheap as a FA.

underscore
07-28-2011, 07:30 PM
NFL doesn't seem like they have any problem going to court to uphold their rules.

Shane P. Hallam
07-28-2011, 08:41 PM
True, but the players have a case in this situation.

PossibleCabbage
07-28-2011, 09:19 PM
True, but the players have a case in this situation.

If they want to sue and win, they had better file suit before the NFLPA officially reconstitutes itself. Otherwise, the NFL has a slam dunk on the Clarett v. NFL precedent, don't they?

Shane P. Hallam
07-29-2011, 01:45 AM
How? Those guys weren't three years out of high school. VERY different case.

underscore
07-29-2011, 05:19 AM
It sounds like Ohio State is retroactively banning him from campus, seemingly to help Pryor's draft eligibility case.

YAYareaRB
07-29-2011, 09:44 AM
banning him from campus??? wtf did he do?

K Train
07-29-2011, 09:45 AM
banning him from campus??? wtf did he do?

i think they are just making it look like his "situation has changed" as per the NFL rules for entering the supplemental draft. i could be wrong, but i think its a move to help him not actually ban him

PossibleCabbage
07-29-2011, 10:46 AM
How? Those guys weren't three years out of high school. VERY different case.

Broadly speaking, the Clarett v. NFL decision cemented the NFL's right to decide who, when, and how a player is allowed to enter the league under the terms of a collective bargaining agreement. Once the ink on the CBA is dry, I sincerely doubt that Pryor has a case, since the non-statutory anti-trust exemption will be fully in force at that point.

Specifically relevant from the Appellate Court's decision on Clarett:

[Clarett's] lawsuit reflects simply a prospective employee’s disagreement with the criteria, established by the employer and the labor union, that he must meet in order to be considered for employment. Any remedies for such a claim are the province of labor law [and therefore not anti-trust law].

underscore
07-30-2011, 06:13 PM
Ohio State QB Terrelle Pryor is ineligible for the 2011 NFL Supplemental Draft because the NCAA and Ohio State have not formally ruled on his college eligibility.

Read more: http://www.kffl.com/hotw/NFL#ixzz1TdJX6HZp

Nalej
07-30-2011, 10:16 PM
Well, that's garbage. They need to hurry up and just call it what it is.
There's not way in hell he's eligible to play

PossibleCabbage
07-31-2011, 12:36 PM
Well, that's garbage. They need to hurry up and just call it what it is.
There's not way in hell he's eligible to play

If Pryor has to sit out the college football season and wait for the draft in April, is that honestly the worst thing that could possibly happen to him? I mean, Marvin Austin and Robert Quinn had to do it last year (and still got drafted fairly high.) The amount of harm that Pryor would suffer for having to go through the normal pre-draft process is hardly tremendous.

underscore
07-31-2011, 08:10 PM
Austin and Quinn had a lot more solid draft stock, so probably had a lot more "help" passing the time till the draft.

PossibleCabbage
08-01-2011, 12:24 AM
Austin and Quinn had a lot more solid draft stock, so probably had a lot more "help" passing the time till the draft.

But neither the federal courts nor the NFL have any reason to consider "how much is this player valued by NFL teams" when setting policy. Players can miss the college football season and still get drafted, it's not strictly necessary to make exceptions.

descendency
08-01-2011, 02:21 AM
Ohio State QB Terrelle Pryor is ineligible for the 2011 NFL Supplemental Draft because the NCAA and Ohio State have not formally ruled on his college eligibility.

Read more: http://www.kffl.com/hotw/NFL#ixzz1TdJX6HZp

Good. Make him admit taking money.

underscore
08-01-2011, 05:35 AM
But neither the federal courts nor the NFL have any reason to consider "how much is this player valued by NFL teams" when setting policy. Players can miss the college football season and still get drafted, it's not strictly necessary to make exceptions.

My point was that those two could afford to wait out the time, due to likely financial advances they'd get based on expected future earnings.

Pryor's situation is more dire since he wasn't a high draft pick before, and after a year, his draft stock won't improve....not many agents are going to foot him the money to hang out the next year

K Train
08-01-2011, 08:33 AM
i dont get why he cant just sign with a team as an UDFA. Im pretty sure if a team wanted to sign me they could, if pryor isnt with ohio state or the NCAA anymore whats the problem?

PossibleCabbage
08-01-2011, 01:08 PM
i dont get why he cant just sign with a team as an UDFA. Im pretty sure if a team wanted to sign me they could, if pryor isnt with ohio state or the NCAA anymore whats the problem?

Generally speaking, the draft is the gatekeeper between college football and NFL football. The rules are pretty much that you have to go through either the regular or supplemental draft in order to enter the league, and you only become a UDFA in case no team elects to select you in whichever draft you qualify for.

If players were allowed to simply pass on the draft, you be compromising the integrity of the draft as the whole point of the draft is that rookies don't get to pick where they play, so the bad teams still get good players.

That's not to say the NFL can't just declare Pryor a free agent, but I think they'd prefer not to do that.

Shane P. Hallam
08-01-2011, 01:25 PM
Generally speaking, the draft is the gatekeeper between college football and NFL football. The rules are pretty much that you have to go through either the regular or supplemental draft in order to enter the league, and you only become a UDFA in case no team elects to select you in whichever draft you qualify for.

If players were allowed to simply pass on the draft, you be compromising the integrity of the draft as the whole point of the draft is that rookies don't get to pick where they play, so the bad teams still get good players.

That's not to say the NFL can't just declare Pryor a free agent, but I think they'd prefer not to do that.

Yes and no. If the Steelers wanted to sign me, they could off the street. Antonio Gates never entered the NFL Draft.

PossibleCabbage
08-01-2011, 01:49 PM
Yes and no. If the Steelers wanted to sign me, they could off the street. Antonio Gates never entered the NFL Draft.

Technically isn't every adult who is at least 3 years out of high school with no amateur eligibility remaining eligible to be drafted in the NFL draft, teams just choose not to draft eligible people who express no interest in being drafted (like you and me, say)?

That was my understanding at least. The fact that I was not drafted when I finished school means that an NFL team could sign me as a UDFA if they wanted to (and they lost their minds, that part is important.)

JoeJoeBrown
08-01-2011, 02:14 PM
Good. Make him admit taking money.

LOL. I love the random OSU hate from internet dweebs. (I say this being an internet dweeb myself.)

PossibleCabbage
08-05-2011, 09:08 AM
Rob Rang, of CBS sports, is reporting that a league source is reporting that the league will make a decision on the supplemental draft sometime this weekend. Rang is speculating that the draft will indeed happen, but it won't be for a week or two.

PossibleCabbage
08-08-2011, 04:19 PM
The League has informed teams that the Supplemental Draft will take place on August 17th. No players have been identified as eligible at this point.

per ESPN.

BeerBaron
08-08-2011, 04:34 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/08/league-says-supplemental-draft-will-occur-on-august-17/

Apparently there is at least one eligible, as Greg Aiello said they would only schedule it if at least 1 player was eligible.

I'm guessing it's Pryor and I'm guessing that someone (Redskins?) takes a shot in the 4th round.

PossibleCabbage
08-08-2011, 04:36 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/08/league-says-supplemental-draft-will-occur-on-august-17/

Apparently there is at least one eligible, as Greg Aiello said they would only schedule it if at least 1 player was eligible.

I'm guessing it's Pryor and I'm guessing that someone (Redskins?) takes a shot in the 4th round.

Caleb King is definitely eligible for the supplemental draft. Pryor may or may not be.

FTRWRTR
08-09-2011, 11:07 AM
Caleb King is definitely eligible for the supplemental draft. Yeah, all the media attention is on pryor but Caleb king is already eligible which is why I thought the talk about their not being a supp. draft was just nonsense. I'd be surprised if pryor was ruled ineligible.

bucfan12
08-09-2011, 12:34 PM
I think the Skins, Dolphins, or Raiders will be the team to draft him.

I know Tampa has done some homework and film study on him as well, but they won't bid anything higher than a 7th. They're looking for a backup because Josh Johnson is not going to be around much longer and looking for an investment that could pay off.

My guess is, Pryor will a Raider with a 5th round bid.

Complex
08-09-2011, 02:30 PM
The Browns will attend Pryors pro-day.

link (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/09/report-browns-will-attend-pryors-workout/)

PossibleCabbage
08-09-2011, 04:36 PM
Courtesy of NFLN's Jason La Canfora on twitter:

NFL sent memo to all teams on eligible players for Supplemental Draft- Pryor from Ohio State is NOT on the list. Caleb King from Georgia is

http://twitter.com/#!/JasonLaCanfora/status/101041191260397568

Further tweets:

More on Pryor - he could still be ruled eligible at a later date but has not yet. The process is "rolling" according to the league, so ...

NFL could make a final determination on him later, according to to a league source. He was not among the 2 players ruled eligible today...

And the league is continuing to assess the situation as it may pertain to Pryor. So perhaps teams will get a later communication on him

So either the NFL isn't sure *yet* whether Pryor is eligible for the supplemental draft, or they're just trying to let him down easy.

niel89
08-09-2011, 04:41 PM
I know that he is going to be eligible in the end, but I selfishly want him to have to sit out the entire year and then try his luck again next draft.

Edit: who is the other player eligible? I know King is one.

bucfan12
08-09-2011, 04:44 PM
Even if Pryor is drafted in the Supplemental Draft, he won't see the field at all this year.

PossibleCabbage
08-09-2011, 04:45 PM
I think that "may be ruled eligible at a later date" is misleading. The Supplemental Draft is in eight days. How many later dates are there going to be? I'm pretty sure that if Pryor were going to be eligible he would have been told today.

BeerBaron
08-09-2011, 04:51 PM
He's already said on Twitter that he apparently thinks he is eligible. And isn't Rosenhaus his agent? I'm sure he would know for sure by now too.

keylime_5
08-09-2011, 04:54 PM
He'll be eligible eventually. He was suspended for the season, so he fills the requirements.

PossibleCabbage
08-09-2011, 05:07 PM
He'll be eligible eventually. He was suspended for the season, so he fills the requirements.

If he's not eligible for the supplemental draft in the next 7 days, he won't ever be eligible for the supplemental draft. So "eventually" is not the right word, I would say.

keylime_5
08-09-2011, 05:18 PM
eventually meaning in the next 7 days but not right now :)

PossibleCabbage
08-09-2011, 05:35 PM
Per Drew Rosenhaus on Twitter:

We spoke with the NFL today and were told that no decision has been made yet regarding Terrelle's eligibility for the supplemental draft

If the NFL hasn't decided yet, they're likely still debating internally whether risking opening Pandora's box for circumventing the conventional draft process is better than risking Pryor's lawsuit.

shylo3716
08-09-2011, 06:15 PM
Is Pryor officially screwed now?

BeerBaron
08-09-2011, 06:17 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/09/report-pryor-not-eligible-for-supplemental-draft/

Ostensibly, the NFL wants to avoid allowing players to become eligible for the supplemental draft by simply quitting school and hiring an agent, even though: (1) Pryor could have entered the April 2011 draft; (2) Pryor left school after his head coach resigned; and (3) Ohio State has since determined that Pryor would not have been eligible for any part of the 2011 season. It’s possible that the league simply wanted to throw a bone to the NCAA.

Do not piss off the free farm system basically.

PossibleCabbage
08-09-2011, 06:19 PM
Is Pryor officially screwed now?

I don't know, he might actually do better if he were to go play in the CFL this fall, then work out at the combine and go through the conventional process.

With the supplemental draft this year, he won't end up with a team until training camp is already over which pretty much makes him *at best* a #3 QB #5/#6 WR, which not only diminishes his value as a draft pick but also makes him pretty vulnerable to getting cut in case a team thinks they can sneak him onto their PS.

bucfan12
08-09-2011, 07:00 PM
If Ohio State deemed him ineligible for the entire 2011 season, then I don't see why he won't be eligible for the supplemental draft this year.

If he couldn't play college ball this season, he can enter this draft. I think the NFL is just further evaluating the situation, but will most likely be eligible.

BeerBaron
08-09-2011, 07:04 PM
If Ohio State deemed him ineligible for the entire 2011 season, then I don't see why he won't be eligible for the supplemental draft this year.

If he couldn't play college ball this season, he can enter this draft. I think the NFL is just further evaluating the situation, but will most likely be eligible.

This was a recent development. When he first quit school and hired an agent, he was only suspended for the first few games.

It's a gray area for the league for sure. They have to watch setting a precedent, and they don't want to piss off their free farm system in the NCAA, and they probably like their chances in court since they won the whole Clarrett/Mike Williams trial a few years back.

niel89
08-09-2011, 07:47 PM
Yeah he declared himself for the supplemental before he was declared ineligible for college. It was clearly just an attempt to make him eligible for the supp. draft after the fact.

DBNYDP
08-09-2011, 08:09 PM
But that doesn't change the fact that got declared ineligible which should make him eligible for the supplemental regardless.

Redskins or the Raiders is where I think he would land.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 02:04 AM
But that doesn't change the fact that got declared ineligible which should make him eligible for the supplemental regardless.

Redskins or the Raiders is where I think he would land.

The key issue though is that Pryor forfeited his eligibility for college football (by hiring an agent) before he was declared ineligible by his school or by the NCAA, which is the normal condition for eligibility for the Supplemental Draft.

By the time he was declared ineligible, he was already ineligible. Add to the fact that the supplemental draft is intended for players who had an unforseen change in circumstances after the regular draft, and absolutely nothing that happened to Pryor was unforseen at the time of the draft... he was already suspended for four games, and he already knew that he had committed violations that would result in his permanent ineligibility for NCAA football if they came to light, but he chose not to declare for the regular draft.

The NFL may view this as an attempt to bypass the normal draft for a player, and since eligibility is decided on a case-by-case basis (by Joel Bussert, the VP of player personnel/football operations) it's impossible to say which way it will go. If Bussert views Pryor as having known he would be declared ineligible if certain details were revealed, but decided to try to ride out his four game suspension and hoping none of that comes to light, but then changed his mind and tried to get out when things turned bad for him without actually tarnishing his name by going through the NCAA investigation, the NFL could view this as a "Pryor tried to circumvent the draft process" and deny him entry. Otherwise, they probably let him in. It's hard to say one way or the other.

Ultimately the NFL is forced to choose between risking a lawsuit and risking setting a very dangerous precedent. It's not cut and dry, it's ultimately "what one guy at the NFL decides is the better alternative between two poor options."

ElectricEye
08-10-2011, 12:40 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/09/report-pryor-not-eligible-for-supplemental-draft/



Do not piss off the free farm system basically.
That's so stupid. I'm not saying Pryor is the most deserving guy of a break in the world, but it's still dumb to just screw him over for stuff that has nothing to do with the NFL.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 01:06 PM
That's so stupid. I'm not saying Pryor is the most deserving guy of a break in the world, but it's still dumb to just screw him over for stuff that has nothing to do with the NFL.

Regardless of whether it's "fair" the NFL has to do what's in the best interest of the NFL, and setting a template for "you can dodge the draft process by quitting school and hiring an agent" is probably the not in the best interest of the NFL. I'm sure the NFL doesn't have anything against Pryor in particular, they're just protecting the shield.

I'm not sure that it's honestly in Pryor's best interest to be taken in the supplemental draft. He's probably a 5th, 6th, or 7th round pick, and he'll arrive after training camp is over. So he's pretty unlikely to actually make a roster, and he'll end up sitting on the practice squad where he won't make very much money at all. There aren't a lot of successful NFL QBs who make the transition from "practice quad" to "starter" after all.

descendency
08-10-2011, 01:18 PM
So he's pretty unlikely to actually make a roster, and he'll end up sitting on the practice squad where he won't make very much money at all.

So he'd make more at Ohio State?

just kidding...

Saints-Tigers
08-10-2011, 01:36 PM
So he'd make more at Ohio State?

just kidding...


He should have stayed at OSU, I know he would miss 4 games, but I don't think he was even going to be suspended without pay.

FTRWRTR
08-10-2011, 01:37 PM
I don't know, he might actually do better if he were to go play in the CFL this fall, then work out at the combine and go through the conventional process.
I agree, he'd not only get a chance to improve as a qb but to also make a team's roster since he'd have a full offseason to impress the coaches.

JoeJoeBrown
08-10-2011, 04:02 PM
to echo cabbage, i somehow doubt the nfl is out to get pryor, so much as they're out to get anyone/everyone who thinks they can duck through a loophole.

the more i think about it, the more shady and ****** pryor's handling of all of this has been. and osu should've had more integrity than to posthumously kick him out in an effort to further the dishonest way he's tried to handle the entire process.

To their credit, they did say he is persona non grata for five years. Which is a bit excessive. Guessing Rosenhaus sent a note to OSU begging for a letter and the AD said, sure here you go and then some.

The whole deal is shady, as is the way the NFL deals with players trying to get in the NFL. Completely ******** system they have going on, but that's what happens when lawyers are let out of their cages.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 04:09 PM
The whole deal is shady, as is the way the NFL deals with players trying to get in the NFL. Completely ******** system they have going on, but that's what happens when lawyers are let out of their cages.

What's wrong with the conventional process for players trying to get in the NFL? It seems to me like the whole "draft in April" process is pretty reasonable.

underscore
08-10-2011, 04:11 PM
To their credit, they did say he is persona non grata for five years. Which is a bit excessive.


Non grata to getting free tickets or using the athletic facilities. He's not banned from campus or attending classes.

BeerBaron
08-10-2011, 04:13 PM
What's wrong with the conventional process for players trying to get in the NFL? It seems to me like the whole "draft in April" process is pretty reasonable.

Keeps 18 year olds with too big of egos from muddying things up, keeps college football happy and more entertaining...

One douchy player trying to beat the system shouldn't change things.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 04:15 PM
Keeps 18 year olds with too big of egos from muddying things up, keeps college football happy and more entertaining...

One douchy player trying to beat the system shouldn't change things.

I think those are things that are good with the current system, not things that are wrong with it.

I personally think that "you have to be three-years out of high school" and "everybody has to be eligible for the draft at least once in order to enter the league" are good things. You could maybe quibble about how players on their first contracts are generally underpaid, but that's a problem that fixes itself. From some perspectives, it's hard to call football players "underpaid."

BeerBaron
08-10-2011, 04:20 PM
I also think they are good things. My post was praising the system for doing those things.

Malaka
08-10-2011, 04:42 PM
When it comes down to it though the NCAA is one big scam, and College football is just as much of a business as the NFL is. It sickens me that there are kids fighting to get into college to actually learn, and then there are guys who are just dumb as rocks getting into some pretty good academic schools to do nothing but cheat, party, and just cash out their junior year.

There should either be no scholarships and the players get paid, or people can simply go to the NFL right after high school: burnout and never be heard from again. That's life they want to go all in for the NFL go ahead, but if they bust and no one gives a **** about em' shits tough.

Maybe I am being harsh because a lot of athletes are good guys who work hard in school, and also leave their junior years. But there are just so many who simply don't deserve everything they get, and that's where those monstrous egos emerge.

JoeJoeBrown
08-10-2011, 05:20 PM
What's wrong with the conventional process for players trying to get in the NFL? It seems to me like the whole "draft in April" process is pretty reasonable.

The draft is ridiculous. I love watching it, but I'm a free market sort of guy.

To be able to restrict someone from being gainfully employed by a team because they aren't old enough, been out of high school long enough, didn't get kicked off of the team, etc... is un-American to me.

More importantly, there should be a free agency period for everyone that doesn't have a contract, not just veterans. I know it's sacrilegious to mention here, but the draft is stupid from a right to work standpoint (and I'm not getting into the legalities of it wrt the CBA and the NFLPA).

As long as there is a salary floor and a salary ceiling, competitive balance would still be just fine, if not better. Let the player and team find a better match, rather than forcing players to go one place and forcing teams to get the players that fall to them.

WRT the supplemental (and reality, I know they aren't kaboshing the draft) playing along with the NCAA is fine and dandy, but the NFL has the upper hand in that relationship. They can do whatever they want and why worry about players entering the NFL early? What does it matter if they piss of the NCAA?

JoeJoeBrown
08-10-2011, 05:27 PM
When it comes down to it though the NCAA is one big scam, and College football is just as much of a business as the NFL is. It sickens me that there are kids fighting to get into college to actually learn, and then there are guys who are just dumb as rocks getting into some pretty good academic schools to do nothing but cheat, party, and just cash out their junior year.

There should either be no scholarships and the players get paid, or people can simply go to the NFL right after high school: burnout and never be heard from again. That's life they want to go all in for the NFL go ahead, but if they bust and no one gives a **** about em' shits tough.

Maybe I am being harsh because a lot of athletes are good guys who work hard in school, and also leave their junior years. But there are just so many who simply don't deserve everything they get, and that's where those monstrous egos emerge.

WRT paying players, you should be able to either a) select a four year scholarship or b) Choose to get paid by boosters, agents, and/or sign marketing contracts.

The harsh realities of busting out as a youth in the NFL would steer a lot of kids from that route. It's not like the NBA.

I like that the NFL doesn't have guaranteed contracts. Not many people in the real world have guaranteed work contracts.

underscore
08-10-2011, 06:02 PM
NCAA isn't the one saying "You can't go pro till 3 years after high school"

underscore
08-10-2011, 06:05 PM
The draft is ridiculous. I love watching it, but I'm a free market sort of guy.

To be able to restrict someone from being gainfully employed by a team because they aren't old enough, been out of high school long enough, didn't get kicked off of the team, etc... is un-American to me.


Try that angle on your next job interview.

Malaka
08-10-2011, 06:05 PM
NCAA isn't the one saying "You can't go pro till 3 years after high school"

Yes its the NFL, but the way the NCAA is set up it almost encourages kids to come on board, and then jump ship as soon as possible.

Raiderz4Life
08-10-2011, 06:25 PM
Getting rid of the Draft is dumb imho. Keeps ppl like Dan Snyder from taking up all the good prospects by throwing money at them. Draft keeps parity. Also, a lot of these kids aren't ready to jump to the NFL mentally nor physically 95% of the time. Keeping them in school for 3 years is a good thing.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 06:55 PM
Honestly, I wouldn't be sad to see the NFL require 4 years out of high school to enter the draft.

But if we actually want to stay on topic, two more people were ruled eligible for the supplemental draft today (neither of them are Pryor)... does anybody know who they are?

ElectricEye
08-10-2011, 07:03 PM
Getting rid of the Draft is dumb imho. Keeps ppl like Dan Snyder from taking up all the good prospects by throwing money at them. Draft keeps parity. Also, a lot of these kids aren't ready to jump to the NFL mentally nor physically 95% of the time. Keeping them in school for 3 years is a good thing.
Do you really think that Dan Synder could identify 18 year olds that could play in the NFL? He's having a hard enough time putting an appropriate dollar figure on guys who have played the game for years.

This is a topic I feel very strongly about, so I want to be careful here before getting swept up into something elaborate and becoming unrealistic. But in general, I tend to agree with Malaka and Joe. The NFL is the only sport among the four where there isn't a viable alternative to the college process. It's also the most physically demanding and hardest for a kid straight out of high school to crack, but that's beside the point a bit. I don't think you could get rid of the draft entirely for balance reasons. That's a bit extreme. But honestly if you look at how these things work historically, drafts don't really do a real good job of spreading talent around. Not any better than sheer free market anarchy, anyway. If you allowed teams to just scout relentlessly and establish academies for youth football similar to the way things are set up in baseball and soccer, you would find talent and have it distributed accordingly. The owners would NEVER go for that in a million years given that it takes tons of control away from them in regards to contracts more specifically leverage, but you would still see small market teams like Jacksonville being competitive if they were smart about it. The only real problem with that is that a large chunk of the regions that produce exceptional football talent are not in major media markets and almost entirely away from the North East, which would put teams located in that region at a disadvantage, ultimately not being good for the health of the league.

But still, in general, I'm sick of the way the entire thing is handled. The vast majority of these big time football recruits aren't picking schools based on where they can get the best education. It's also a little ridiculous and unfair for these school to give tens of thousands of dollars to these kids in full ride scholarships simply because they make their schools millions. Not that either of the two parties is BAD for doing things the way they do. It's just a system based on outdated circumstances. Aside from that, it's just REALLY crappy for the pro game if you think about it. Out of the thousands of kids who play division one football, only a very small percentage of them actually have the ability to play in the NFL. A large part of the college game and the way guys are coached is finding ways to exploiting that. We've seen it plenty enough times by now to realize that it can end very poorly for both the player and teams.

But yeah, none of this is ever going to change, realistically. There's just no incentive on any side of this to change anything. Unless the NFL magically figures out that the millions the NCAA makes could be their millions...and it's even too late for that at this point really. College football is, for better or worse, such a large part of the general football culture we have in the NFL. Football is unique in that it failed to establish a successful professional league before the college game became big. The roots run very, very deep. That's not entirely a bad thing. I've attended quite a few college football games in my day and enjoy the hell out of watching it. I imagine it's quite a bit of fun to actually go to one of these big football factories too. I get that. But if you sit back and break the entire thing down logically, I just think the entire thing is an ineloquent solution to the problem.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 07:09 PM
The NFL isn't going to change if it doesn't have to, and the NFL doesn't have to change. All of their policies about the draft and keeping people from entering the NFL are entirely legal because they are collectively bargained (and the NFLPA has reason whatsoever to bargain on behalf of college kids.)

The only way the NFL will ever employ kids before 3-years out of high school, is if college football goes away and the NFL has to run its own farm league. The only way the NFL will ever do away with the draft is if the NFL loses a landmark antitrust case if the NFLPA goes the decertification route again (and even then they may just bring back the draft once the NFLPA recertifies.) None of this is going to change at any point in the next 10 years.

So we can rant and rave about it, but this will never change and it's just so much wasted breath and topic-derailment.

ElectricEye
08-10-2011, 07:12 PM
I find it interesting to talk about, personally. Given that it's been going on for half a page with more than one person, I'm inclined to say other people do as well. Really don't see the harm in talking about it, especially with the Pryor situation going on. Can't really think of a better occasion to examine it really....or the harm in doing so.

Raiderz4Life
08-10-2011, 07:13 PM
Well I for one like it. Maybe I'm just blissfully ignorant, and that probably is what it is tbh, but I'm OK with the way things are.

PossibleCabbage
08-10-2011, 07:24 PM
I find it interesting to talk about, personally. Given that it's been going on for half a page with more than one person, I'm inclined to say other people do as well. Really don't see the harm in talking about it, especially with the Pryor situation going on. Can't really think of a better occasion to examine it really....or the harm in doing so.

But ultimately, what is "fair" and what is "right" do not matter here. The NFL has the legal right codified in the CBA and further emphasized in the Clarett v. NFL decision to dictate the circumstances about where and how you are allowed to work for the NFL. (Specifically the Clarett v. NFL decision found that grievances about the conditions set by a prospective employer are a matter for labor law and not antitrust law, and in a situation where these conditions are collectively bargained between labor and management (like this one) labor law provides no recourse to a claimant.)

Saying "the NFL should let rookies come into the league as free agents and do away with the draft" is like saying "Starbucks should sell coffee for a nickel." It may be a defensible position based on what is "fair" and what "ought to be", but it's something that will never happen.

ElectricEye
08-10-2011, 07:31 PM
But ultimately, what is "fair" and what is "right" do not matter here. The NFL has the legal right codified in the CBA and further emphasized in the Clarett v. NFL decision to dictate the circumstances about where and how you are allowed to work for the NFL.

Saying "the NFL should let rookies come into the league as free agents and do away with the draft" is like saying "Starbucks should sell coffee for a nickel." It may be a defensible position, but it's something that will never happen.

Has anyone said anything to the contrary? I don't see how examining how the system works is any less of a productive discussion than going through every thread and saying "oh this guy will be a first round pick", which is pretty much all we have to do at this time of year. Don't see why it's such a touchy "oh no reason to talk about it" kind of thing either. I'm personally interested in seeing what people have to say about it. It's not a topic that gets brought up very often or something people give much thought to either, which makes it all the more interesting.

JoeJoeBrown
08-10-2011, 11:24 PM
Has anyone said anything to the contrary? I don't see how examining how the system works is any less of a productive discussion than going through every thread and saying "oh this guy will be a first round pick", which is pretty much all we have to do at this time of year. Don't see why it's such a touchy "oh no reason to talk about it" kind of thing either. I'm personally interested in seeing what people have to say about it. It's not a topic that gets brought up very often or something people give much thought to either, which makes it all the more interesting.

Exactly. I too have never once said I thought it was possible at this point because of the CBA.

I still think that a free for all would work just fine. Teams would be able to find a fit, the market would set the price. Great players get paid, good ones get less, and fringe guys get a shot.

The concerns about a team hoarding the best talent is unfounded. It doesn't happen with regular free agents. The best are simply too expensive to have too many. It would be the same with rookies.

Also, what's wrong with this tangental discussion, Possible? I said it sucked and was called upon by you to expound upon it. I gladly did.

I want football. This fills the void. Kinda. Notsomuch.

PossibleCabbage
08-11-2011, 04:59 PM
Jason La Canfora with our daily Supplemental Draft update (http://twitter.com/#!/JasonLaCanfora/status/101773408240545794):

Another player ruled eligible for Supplemental Draft today - was not Pryor. So 5 are eligible for now and Pryor still remains under review

We know Georgia RB Caleb King is in, UNC DE Mike McAdoo was ruled eligible today. Does anybody know who the other three candidates are?

If Pryor is not ruled eligible tomorrow, he almost certainly won't be ruled eligible over the weekend (since I'm pretty sure Bussert doesn't work weekends in the offseason) and Monday is the 15th, while the Supplemental Draft is the 17th. Doesn't really leave him time for a "Pro Day."

Shane P. Hallam
08-11-2011, 05:48 PM
Michael McAdoo has reportedly applied.

niel89
08-11-2011, 05:50 PM
The eligible players are former Georgia running back Caleb King, former Northern Illinois safety Tracy Wilson, former Western Carolina cornerback Torez Jones and former Lindenwood University defensive end Keenan Mace. The league could still expand the list before the draft.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82162077/article/exbuckeye-qb-pryor-not-yet-eligible-for-supplemental-draft?module=HP11_headline_stack

underscore
08-11-2011, 09:11 PM
Pryor postponed his "pro day"...apparently awaiting his eligibility.

PossibleCabbage
08-12-2011, 06:56 PM
Looks like no update today, the day's business at the NFL offices concluded hours ago and there's no update about the supplemental draft.

So Pryor will wait through the weekend. I have to wonder if the NFL would actually come out and say "you're not eligible" or they're just going to never rule on his eligibility, so he's ineligible by default.

JoeJoeBrown
08-12-2011, 10:00 PM
Looks like no update today, the day's business at the NFL offices concluded hours ago and there's no update about the supplemental draft.

So Pryor will wait through the weekend. I have to wonder if the NFL would actually come out and say "you're not eligible" or they're just going to never rule on his eligibility, so he's ineligible by default.

I'm guessing the latter since their lawyers are wimpy douchebags. Letting a kid dangle in the wind like that is just stupid. Give him a decision.

PossibleCabbage
08-12-2011, 11:49 PM
I'm guessing the latter since their lawyers are wimpy douchebags. Letting a kid dangle in the wind like that is just stupid. Give him a decision.

Well it is possible that they have privately communicated their decision to Pryor and Rosenhaus, they just decided not to announce it publicly. Knowing Rosenhaus though, this is probably unlikely but all sorts of things are possible.

SolidGold
08-13-2011, 09:24 AM
I want Pryor to be declared not eligible. He deserves some sort of punishment for breaking the rules. Withdrawing from Ohio St to avoid any punishment and automatically assuming that you are going to be eligible for the supplemental draft doesn't seem like a proper punishment.

PossibleCabbage
08-13-2011, 03:29 PM
I want Pryor to be declared not eligible. He deserves some sort of punishment for breaking the rules. Withdrawing from Ohio St to avoid any punishment and automatically assuming that you are going to be eligible for the supplemental draft doesn't seem like a proper punishment.

This is likely the NCAA's view, but it's not really the NFL's. The NFL doesn't really care whether or not you were appropriately punished for your NCAA violations (c.f. Reggie Bush, many, many others). The NFL only really cares about "our rules are actually enforced as rules, you don't get an exception because you're famous" and "we don't want to antagonize the NCAA since the alternative is 'paying to run your own farm system' and we very much prefer the free one."

BeerBaron
08-13-2011, 03:35 PM
This is likely the NCAA's view, but it's not really the NFL's. The NFL doesn't really care whether or not you were appropriately punished for your NCAA violations (c.f. Reggie Bush, many, many others). The NFL only really cares about "our rules are actually enforced as rules, you don't get an exception because you're famous" and "we don't want to antagonize the NCAA since the alternative is 'paying to run your own farm system' and we very much prefer the free one."

That right there makes it the NFL's view too.

PossibleCabbage
08-13-2011, 08:10 PM
That right there makes it the NFL's view too.

Well, the NFL has to pay lip service to what the NCAA wants (since it's in their best interest to do so) but they don't really need to believe it, they just need to behave in a way that keeps the NCAA friendly.

SolidGold
08-13-2011, 08:59 PM
I am not usually this against a prospect but I just think Pryor needs more than just a superficial slap on the wrist for what he did. Tressel went down for his part and I am sure more dominos will fall but it just would not seem right for him to be able to be eligible for the supp draft w/ out at least sitting out this year and just trying to get either drafted next year with a year away from the game.

Shane P. Hallam
08-13-2011, 09:27 PM
I am not usually this against a prospect but I just think Pryor needs more than just a superficial slap on the wrist for what he did. Tressel went down for his part and I am sure more dominos will fall but it just would not seem right for him to be able to be eligible for the supp draft w/ out at least sitting out this year and just trying to get either drafted next year with a year away from the game.

How does that have anything to do with the Supplemental Draft?

SolidGold
08-13-2011, 09:29 PM
How does that have anything to do with the Supplemental Draft?

If he is granted eligibility for the supp draft this year its like he avoids any punishment for what he did at OSU. Either way i guess its a non-issue since he will be nothing more than a late round pick looked at more as a WR than QB.

ElectricEye
08-13-2011, 09:30 PM
Again; why should the NFL care about what he did at OSU as long as it wasn't criminal?

SolidGold
08-13-2011, 09:37 PM
The NFL doesn't have to care, but doesn't the NCAA have to find him eligible for the supp draft?

underscore
08-13-2011, 09:53 PM
Again; why should the NFL care about what he did at OSU as long as it wasn't criminal?

Because he didn't follow the rules to become draft eligible.

ElectricEye
08-13-2011, 09:59 PM
Because he didn't follow the rules to become draft eligible.

The implication was that the NFL should somehow penalize him for the scandal that happened there. I can understand ******** technicalities, but there's no reason to take any of that into consideration.

SolidGold
08-13-2011, 10:05 PM
No I don't think the NFL should penalize him, it is not their job. Its more of me just hoping Pryor is not declared eligible for the draft by the NCAA for his violations in college.

Shane P. Hallam
08-13-2011, 11:12 PM
The NFL doesn't have to care, but doesn't the NCAA have to find him eligible for the supp draft?

NCAA has very little to do with the supplemental draft. The NFL decides. Now, in Pryor's case, the NFL want to make sure that Pryor would have missed the full season before declaring him eligible.

PossibleCabbage
08-13-2011, 11:45 PM
NCAA has very little to do with the supplemental draft. The NFL decides. Now, in Pryor's case, the NFL want to make sure that Pryor would have missed the full season before declaring him eligible.

Specifically I think the issue that the NFL is looking at is that did Pryor's circumstances change in an way he could not anticipate since the draft, and that this unanticipated change would prevent him from playing college football at the FBS or FCS level.

It's entirely plausible that they will just decide "Pryor should have seen this coming, he had already gotten caught by the time the draft rolled around" and just say "nope, sorry... see you at the combine." It's also possible that they will decide otherwise. The whole "let's appease the NCAA" issue is very tangential, it's why the NFL wants to be seen as seriously deliberating on this issue, rather than being flippant about it, but it doesn't actually effect what they decide. The NFL is probably more concerned that "the rules we set down are enforced as though they are rules, rather than guidelines" than anything else here.

I understand that there is moral outrage about Pryor, and a sentiment among some people that he should be held accountable for what he did. But the NFL is not the arbiter of justice. The NFL is that body that schedules professional football games. You can think that Pryor will have gotten off too easy if he's allowed in the supplemental draft, and that's a shame... but that has nothing to do with what will actually happen. What's "right" and what's "fair" don't actually matter here.

JoeJoeBrown
08-14-2011, 03:50 PM
Pryor Seeks Meeting with Goodell. (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/14/status-still-undecided-pryor-seeks-a-meeting-with-goodell/)

The NFL is pulling a BS maneuver here. Even PFT agrees (Florio is a lawyer as well).

The supplemental draft is scheduled to be held in only three days. And the NFL still hasn’t decided whether former Ohio State quarterback Terrelle Pryor will be included.

Per a source with knowledge of the situation, Pryor and his representatives hope to meet with Commissioner Roger Goodell on Monday or Tuesday in order to get an answer, and ultimately to get in.

It’s becoming more and more obvious that, with all due respect and deference, the NFL is jerking Pryor around. At this point, even if they let him in, he’ll be hard pressed to conduct a Pro Day workout before Wednesday.

We’ll have more details about Pryor’s case for inclusion later. Apparently, Pryor already has shown that he was kicked out of Ohio State before he announced that he was leaving. That fact, if true, would undercut the notion that he’s being excluded because the league doesn’t want players to be able to become eligible for the supplemental draft by quitting school and hiring an agent.

JoeJoeBrown
08-14-2011, 03:55 PM
Also, I find it laughable at some people's inability to separate logic and emotion.

Yeah, the kid screwed up a bunch and is kinda douchey. He paid the price by getting kicked out of school and banned from some parts of campus for 5 years.

The NFL is a completely different entity than OSU or the NCAA. Wanting the NFL to punish a person for non-illegal behavior in college definitely displays a toddler-like thought process. "HE BAD! HE NEED BE TO HURT!!! DON'T CARE WHO!!!"

SolidGold
08-14-2011, 04:07 PM
Also, I find it laughable at some people's inability to separate logic and emotion.

Yeah, the kid screwed up a bunch and is kinda douchey. He paid the price by getting kicked out of school and banned from some parts of campus for 5 years.

The NFL is a completely different entity than OSU or the NCAA. Wanting the NFL to punish a person for non-illegal behavior in college definitely displays a toddler-like thought process. "HE BAD! HE NEED BE TO HURT!!! DON'T CARE WHO!!!"

Yea i guess that is targeted at me. He won't be a factor in the NFL so I guess thats enough for me.

BeerBaron
08-14-2011, 04:08 PM
"Apparently, Pryor already has shown that he was kicked out of Ohio State before he announced that he was leaving. "

I want to see this evidence that he has. Everything else I've read is that when he quit school and hired an agent, he was still only suspended for the first 4 games, which isn't a reason to enter the Supplemental Draft per regular rules. And the NFL doesn't want to bend those rules for fear of upsetting the NCAA by allowing eligible players to avoid NCAA penalties by going to the Supplemental draft.

It's confusing...at this point, I say just let him in. If it's a fear of setting a precedent that future suspended players will use to jump to the NFL, so be it. Deal with them on a case by case basis.

Shane P. Hallam
08-14-2011, 04:45 PM
"Apparently, Pryor already has shown that he was kicked out of Ohio State before he announced that he was leaving. "

I want to see this evidence that he has. Everything else I've read is that when he quit school and hired an agent, he was still only suspended for the first 4 games, which isn't a reason to enter the Supplemental Draft per regular rules. And the NFL doesn't want to bend those rules for fear of upsetting the NCAA by allowing eligible players to avoid NCAA penalties by going to the Supplemental draft.

It's confusing...at this point, I say just let him in. If it's a fear of setting a precedent that future suspended players will use to jump to the NFL, so be it. Deal with them on a case by case basis.

Ohio State has suspended Pryor from campus for 5 years I believe, which is at least something and a change at this point.

I'm just not sure what the NFL loses by including him.

I'll say this, his draft stock would go up if he sits a year. But a year in an NFL camp is probably better for his development.

BeerBaron
08-14-2011, 04:48 PM
Ohio State has suspended Pryor from campus for 5 years I believe, which is at least something and a change at this point.

I'm just not sure what the NFL loses by including him.

I'll say this, his draft stock would go up if he sits a year. But a year in an NFL camp is probably better for his development.

This came out after he dropped out and hired an agent though, wasn't it? I think that is the gray area in all of this. When he first quit, unless the school told only him and it never leaked out, he was only suspended at that point. If he had been kicked out and banned for 5 years right away, this wouldn't be an issue, he'd be eligible. But because "his situation hadn't changed", aka, he was only suspended for a few games and not kicked out of school, the NFL is having a problem.

Shane P. Hallam
08-14-2011, 04:49 PM
This came out after he dropped out and hired an agent though, wasn't it? I think that is the gray area in all of this. When he first quit, unless the school told only him and it never leaked out, he was only suspended at that point. If he had been kicked out and banned for 5 years right away, this wouldn't be an issue, he'd be eligible. But because "his situation hadn't changed", aka, he was only suspended for a few games and not kicked out of school, the NFL is having a problem.

So, if Ohio State tells him this but it isn't released to the media until after he hires an agent he isn't eligible? Losing his coach is not a "change in his situation"? How is that?

BeerBaron
08-14-2011, 04:53 PM
So, if Ohio State tells him this but it isn't released to the media until after he hires an agent he isn't eligible? Losing his coach is not a "change in his situation"? How is that?

I don't know either, it's just what I think the NFL is thinking.

Also, the coaching change thing doesn't mean squat. Coaches come and go every year for lots of schools, but the players are stuck. It's something I think the NCAA should considering changing (one of the many, many, MANY things...) but they won't. I think if a player signs his letter of intent, then the coach that recruited him is fired or goes to another school, the kid should be able to pull out and decide again without having to sit out.

Shane P. Hallam
08-14-2011, 04:54 PM
I
Also, the coaching change thing doesn't mean squat. Coaches come and go every year for lots of schools, but the players are stuck. It's something I think the NCAA should considering changing (one of the many, many, MANY things...) but they won't. I think if a player signs his letter of intent, then the coach that recruited him is fired or goes to another school, the kid should be able to pull out and decide again without having to sit out.

Why are played stuck if coaches change? Why is this not a "change in situation"? How many coaches change after the declaration for the deadline, not many. What does that have to do with the NCAA?

niel89
08-14-2011, 04:57 PM
I also want to know more about this evidence. My knowledge is that he left and hired an agent while his punishment was still only at a suspension, and then later the school banned him around the time that his eligibility for the supplemental draft came into question.



I'll say this, his draft stock would go up if he sits a year. But a year in an NFL camp is probably better for his development.
I completely agree. He would be way better off sitting on the bench on an NFL team learning than trying to learn with some private trainer. Just watching film with the other NFL QBs daily would be a huge opportunity.

JoeJoeBrown
08-14-2011, 05:03 PM
Yea i guess that is targeted at me. He won't be a factor in the NFL so I guess thats enough for me.

It's not targeted at you specifically. It's true of a vast amount of people in the world wrt just about any given situation involving a perceived injustice. Emotions too often cloud judgement.

JoeJoeBrown
08-14-2011, 07:00 PM
seriously? so any guy who's coach gets fired is now eligible for the supplemental draft? sorry bond, but i don't think you're really being objective here.



the supplemental draft loses all meaning. the age limit loses all meaning. the nfl now has to fund it's own minor league. if they waive all of the standards that they supposedly have, they open themselves up to further litigation (for instance) for every future player who doesn't want to go through the standard process. perhaps you're of the opinion that high school kids should be eligible for the nfl draft, but i think that'd be a massive loss for football at all levels.

What the heck are you talking about? Why would college football go away or be seriously weakened if the NFL drafted Pryor? Funding it's own minor league? Huh? No idea where these giant leaps are coming from.

Even if the NFL was wide open to high school kids the game is nothing like basketball. Not many kids would make the leap. It's a mans game and the contracts aren't guaranteed.

Saints-Tigers
08-14-2011, 07:12 PM
Pryor was old enough, and eligible for the draft, how does him trying to enter the supplemental draft undo the age limit sanctions? lol.

JoeJoeBrown
08-14-2011, 08:22 PM
Pryor was old enough, and eligible for the draft, how does him trying to enter the supplemental draft undo the age limit sanctions? lol.

Exactly my point :)

Trogdor
08-15-2011, 11:53 AM
Coaching change isn't a valid reason to enter the supplemental draft. That's reaching at best.

If Pryor can DEFINITIVELY prove to the NFL he was ruled ineligible previous to him signing an agent and declaring he might have a case. If not he CHOSE to leave school while still eligible which means he cannot participate. The fact he wasn't ruled ineligible by OSU publicly until AFTER Pryor signed an agent and announced he was leaving casts serious doubt on his chances.

His case is flimsy at best and I don't see him getting in. If the excuse "He knew he was going to get kicked out" is used how about the "He knew his coach was going to get fired" or the "He knew his actions would cause him to miss his senior year" all of this points to the fact if he wanted to have a fool-proof chance at the NFL he should of declared for the draft rather than attempting to game the system.

JoeJoeBrown
08-15-2011, 01:33 PM
Coaching change isn't a valid reason to enter the supplemental draft. That's reaching at best.

If Pryor can DEFINITIVELY prove to the NFL he was ruled ineligible previous to him signing an agent and declaring he might have a case. If not he CHOSE to leave school while still eligible which means he cannot participate. The fact he wasn't ruled ineligible by OSU publicly until AFTER Pryor signed an agent and announced he was leaving casts serious doubt on his chances.

His case is flimsy at best and I don't see him getting in. If the excuse "He knew he was going to get kicked out" is used how about the "He knew his coach was going to get fired" or the "He knew his actions would cause him to miss his senior year" all of this points to the fact if he wanted to have a fool-proof chance at the NFL he should of declared for the draft rather than attempting to game the system.

I feel stronger that he's proven it. Florio's position is similar to mine. And regardless of the NFL's decision (whether you agree with the ruling or not either way), to have them dangle him in the wind right now is beyond douchey and may open them up for a lawsuit.

PFT (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/15/league-should-let-pryor-into-supplemental-draft-now/)

Terrelle Pryor’s future as an NFL quarterback isn’t clear. Far less clear is his present.

Two days away from the annual supplemental draft, the NFL has yet to give Pryor, shown working out in his hometown of Jeannette, Pennsylvania on Friday, an answer as to whether he’ll be eligible. Even if he gets in right now, he’ll be at a significant disadvantage, since he’ll have roughly 48 hours to organize and conduct a workout for teams who may be interested in him.

That fact alone puts the NFL squarely in the wrong for, by all appearances, tiptoeing on eggshells for the curators of the free farm system known as college football. The league seems to believe it has an obligation to assist the NCAA with its grossly selective and horribly inefficient enforcement system. In this specific case, the league can help the NCAA by keeping Pryor out of the NFL for 2011, giving teeth to the suspension that inevitably would have been imposed if he hadn’t left Ohio State.

But that’s not the league’s job, and it definitely doesn’t mesh with the concerns the NFL has been floating. The league seems to be searching for an excuse to keep Pryor out based not on the classic reasons for inclusion in the supplemental draft (i.e., loss of eligibility after the deadline for entering the April draft) by painting his decision to leave Ohio State as an effort to engineer his entry into the supplemental draft, when the evidence suggests otherwise.

As we’ve heard it, Pryor has proven to the league that, one way or the other, he wouldn’t have been playing college football in 2011. Either the NCAA would be suspending him, or Ohio State would be shutting him down on its own. And that quit-or-be-fired vibe emerged, we’re told, after Pryor met with the NCAA in May and answered questions in a way that significantly undermined his ongoing eligibility.

At that point, folks at Ohio State began to suggest that Pryor should leave. After Jim Tressel resigned and Luke Fickell was appointed to take over, we’re told that Fickell wouldn’t return Pryor’s calls.

But the NFL still seems to be trying to fit the square peg of reality into the round hole of the NCAA’s agenda. It’s wrong, and the fact that the NFL has yet to issue a decision suggests that the NFL knows it’s wrong.

The NFL needs to do the right thing right now, and let Pryor into the draft. If he’s good enough to get drafted, and if (as we’re hearing) Jon Gruden is privately expressing a belief that Pryor may be better than Cam Newton, then Pryor will get drafted, even without a Pro Day workout and with NFL teams trying to slap together a season on the fly.

Either way, the kid should have a chance to enter the NFL now. The league’s rules contemplate that outcome, even if the league’s politics don’t.

Trogdor
08-15-2011, 06:03 PM
I stopped reading when I saw Florio. The story you pointed to is nothing more than speculative journalism (see 'fiction') that hinges on personal opinion rather than facts.

And as I stated before. If he cannot beyond a reasonable doubt prove that he was notified of his expulsion prior to declaring for the supplemental draft he is ineligible. Your love for TP / Ohio State will not change that.

The NFL doesn't change it's rules to allow players into the draft simply because they are high-profile. Litigating the NFL doesn't help the cause either (see Maurice Clarett v. National Football League).

I'll leave it with two quotes.


As Greg Gabriel of the National Football Post has detailed multiple times over the last few months, unless the NFL suddenly changes the rules for entry into the supplemental draft, Pryor will not be eligible. As Gabriel detailed, loopholes players were using were closed after Bernie Kosar and Brian Bosworth entered the league more than 20 years ago.



Terrelle Pryor

I keep reading how Terrelle Pryor is preparing himself for the supplemental draft but as of now there hasn’t been a date set for the draft. Of course, there can’t be a date set because there isn’t a supplemental draft at this time! The supplemental draft has to be agreed upon in the new CBA. I have written about this before…under the rules of previous supplemental drafts, Pryor is not eligible. He still had eligibility to play college football when he hired an agent and he did not flunk out of school; he withdrew. If the league keeps the same set of rules in place, he won’t be eligible for a supplemental draft this year. The supplemental draft is in place to handle special circumstance situations. Pryor’s situation is not a special circumstance. He decided he didn’t want to play college football anymore and withdrew from school. If the league allows Pryor to be in a supplemental draft then they are in fact creating a situation where any player can leave school after the regular draft in April and enter the league. I do not feel the league will let this happen in part because they don’t want the supplemental draft to be used like Bernie Kosar and Brian Bosworth used it years ago. The present rules were put in place to avoid situations like those. No other professional sports league has a supplemental draft, why should the NFL?


So unless the new CBA has a new clause that allows anyone to join the supplemental draft for any reason I'd say the chances of TP gaining entry slim to none.

BeerBaron
08-15-2011, 07:01 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/15/report-supplemental-draft-could-be-delayed/

The draft could be pushed back "a day or two" while Goodell reevaluates Pryor's situation.

PossibleCabbage
08-15-2011, 07:29 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/08/15/report-supplemental-draft-could-be-delayed/

The draft could be pushed back "a day or two" while Goodell reevaluates Pryor's situation.

So pretty much we find out Pryor's fate tomorrow. If the draft isn't pushed back by the end of business Tuesday, we'll see him In April.

underscore
08-15-2011, 07:51 PM
I'd be pissed if I was declared eligible for the draft, and I had to wait a few more days (as training camp days elapse) while the NFL wastes its time with Pryor.

PossibleCabbage
08-15-2011, 09:11 PM
I'd be pissed if I was declared eligible for the draft, and I had to wait a few more days (as training camp days elapse) while the NFL wastes its time with Pryor.

Yeah, that's something that really requires balancing here. However strong Pryor's case is, delaying the supplemental draft for these 5 other guys (who honestly probably won't be drafted, but might sign on as UDFAs) seriously damages their chances of having any sort of NFL career whatsoever. I'm not sure if Pryor's case is strong enough to justify doing that to those other guys.

dannyz
08-15-2011, 10:16 PM
Who else is in this Draft?

Shane P. Hallam
08-15-2011, 10:27 PM
UNC - DE Michael McAdoo

Georgia - RB Caleb King

Northern Illinois - S Tracy Wilson

Western Carolina - CB Torez Jones

Lindenwood - DE Keenan Mace

dannyz
08-15-2011, 10:27 PM
Thank You
I some team might take Caleb King with a 7TH.

Shane P. Hallam
08-16-2011, 08:24 AM
seriously? so any guy who's coach gets fired is now eligible for the supplemental draft? sorry bond, but i don't think you're really being objective here.

If it happens after the underclassmen declaration deadline, I don't see why not. And I'm not saying anything new, I've been on record before saying the most fair is to let anyone declare for the NFL Draft out of HS or after however many of years of college. Though this is likely not great for college football, it should be up to the teams to decide if they are willing to take an 18 year old or not. This applies here. I don't see what the NFL loses by allowing teams to decide if they want Pryor or not. It's not like players will stop declaring for the actual draft if they rule Pryor eligible as being in the supplemental draft is still a huge disadvantage. You know as well as I do that the NFL could come up with a response that Pryor's situation has changed and halt others who apply later if need be,

FTRWRTR
08-16-2011, 01:47 PM
Also how many times have we seen a college get a new HC and he decides to go with a new qb.

K Train
08-16-2011, 03:35 PM
0, with draftable prospects, to my knowledge.

Michigan w/ Rodriguez and Mallet might count i suppose

ElectricEye
08-16-2011, 03:54 PM
Richrod wanted to work the system around Mallet if he could win the job(but he wasn't going to hand it to him. Supposedly he was close to Lloyd Carr as well, who told him to leave for a more pocket passer friendly offense. So it was probably a little on both sides.

K Train
08-16-2011, 03:56 PM
had rodriguez already decided to go with not-mallett? i thought mallett just said **** this, but i could be wrong.

i kinda think it was a combo of the 2...rich knew he was a terrible fit in that scheme but so did mallet. closest example i can think of though, it doesnt happen that often if ever really especially not at big schools.

espeically since if there were even a chance at this happening the QB would either transfer or declare for the draft rather than lose his job because of a new coach/scheme

JoeJoeBrown
08-16-2011, 04:19 PM
Richrod wanted to work the system around Mallet if he could win the job(but he wasn't going to hand it to him. Supposedly he was close to Lloyd Carr as well, who told him to leave for a more pocket passer friendly offense. So it was probably a little on both sides.

I heard he left because the cocaine was too expensive in Ann Arbor.

Splat
08-16-2011, 05:31 PM
http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/6868471/nfl-postpones-supplemental-draft-sources-say

The supplemental draft originally scheduled for Wednesday has been postponed, sources told ESPN.

The sources said that clubs will be advised of the new date as soon as it is determined.

niel89
08-16-2011, 06:09 PM
Sad to see the rest of the players getting a little screwed over.

PossibleCabbage
08-16-2011, 06:13 PM
Sad to see the rest of the players getting a little screwed over.

If they don't end up letting Pryor in after postponing the supplemental draft, I would be really very unhappy if I were Caleb King or one of the others. I'm probably not very happy if I'm one of those guys anyway, to be honest.

descendency
08-16-2011, 06:19 PM
All Pryor has to do is rat out tOSU. He'd instantly get into the Supplemental draft because he'd then have a reason to believe his situation had changed.

niel89
08-16-2011, 06:26 PM
If they don't end up letting Pryor in after postponing the supplemental draft, I would be really very unhappy if I were Caleb King or one of the others. I'm probably not very happy if I'm one of those guys anyway, to be honest.

These guys are roster fringe guys already. Getting into camp asap is going to be key for these guys. They only have a couple weeks and probably now 2 games to prove they are worth keeping around.

If eligible, Pryor will surely be on someones roster. Can't say that about the rest of these guys.

Matthew Jones
08-17-2011, 06:19 PM
Anyone else intrigued by Michael McAdoo? Supposedly around 6'6" 250 with some athleticism and burst. Could be an interesting pass rush prospect, and probably the best guy in the draft if Pryor is excluded.

ElectricEye
08-17-2011, 07:34 PM
Anyone else intrigued by Michael McAdoo? Supposedly around 6'6" 250 with some athleticism and burst. Could be an interesting pass rush prospect, and probably the best guy in the draft if Pryor is excluded.

I'm interested. The body of work isn't there at all, but the tools and intrigue around them might put him in a position to be drafted. I wouldn't mind taking a flier with a late round pick on him.

I really think this is going to be an interesting year for all these kids. A lot of them are going to have a hard time cracking the roster at this advance stage in the pre-season.

descendency
08-17-2011, 07:40 PM
One draft site thinks he may get a 4th round offer (michael mcadoo) as a highest offer.

draftguru151
08-18-2011, 08:24 AM
Pryor is eligible. Draft will be on Monday.

underscore
08-18-2011, 08:45 AM
Pryor is eligible, but can't practice or play for the first five weeks. Obviously he's not going to play, but not even being able to practice for 5 weeks can't help his draft stock.

K Train
08-18-2011, 08:51 AM
still think a 4th rounder

JoeJoeBrown
08-18-2011, 09:19 AM
I'm going bold: 3rd round. Washington Redskins.

SolidGold
08-18-2011, 09:38 AM
I'm going bold: 3rd round. Washington Redskins.

I hope not. I live in DC and don't want to see Pryor being constantly covered by the DC media.

JoeJoeBrown
08-18-2011, 09:46 AM
...

that just doesn't make sense to me. i can't hit most news sites from here, but has the nfl given a reason for why he's 'suspended' for 5 weeks?

Here's a blip from PFT:
Terrelle Pryor finally has an answer: He’s eligible for the NFL supplemental draft.

And with Pryor’s eligibility finally determined, the NFL has now scheduled the supplemental draft for Monday.

The NFL announced this morning that Pryor is eligible and set the date of the supplemental draft for Monday, August 22. The supplemental draft had previously been scheduled for Wednesday, but the NFL’s lengthy delay in determining whether Pryor would be eligible led to the whole thing being delayed, affecting not only Pryor but also the other players in this year’s supplemental draft: Western Carolina defensive back Torez Jones, Georgia running back Caleb King, Lindenwood defensive end Keenan Mace, North Carolina defensive end Mike McAdoo and Northern Illinois defensive back Tracy Wilson.

Pryor, who had been the top high school player in the nation, was Ohio State’s quarterback for three years. Late last season the NCAA began investigating Pryor and other Ohio State players for taking improper benefits, and Ohio State said Pryor would be suspended for the first five games of the 2011 season. Ohio State later said Pryor wouldn’t have been allowed to play at all in the 2011 season, and Ohio State coach Jim Tressel lost his job in the investigation.

In an odd twist on the NFL’s decision, Commissioner Roger Goodell determined that Pryor will be ineligible to practice or play in the first five weeks of the NFL regular season, although he will be allowed to play in what remains of the preseason. The NFL apparently wants Pryor to feel some pain for the problems he caused at Ohio State.

The NFL is making clear that it’s not exactly welcoming Pryor into the league with open arms, saying in its announcement that “Pryor made decisions that undermine the integrity of the eligibility rules for the NFL Draft.”

But despite all that, Pryor will be eligible on Monday for any team that wants to spend a 2012 draft pick to acquire him.

OSUGiants17
08-18-2011, 09:55 AM
Raiders 4th rounder(or maybe even the Dolphins)

JoeJoeBrown
08-18-2011, 09:58 AM
thanks for the blurb

*shakes head*

that's absolutely idiotic reasoning. either don't let him in because he broke the rules, or let him in like every other nfl player. this, 'we need to punish you for breaking rules that have nothing to do with us' is moronic. nice work, goodell.

Yeah, it's idiotic. Rule either way and it makes sense.

The word bouncing around is that the NFL and NCAA are working on a mutual punishment system for cases like Pryor's. I.e. if they have a 5 game suspension and declare late, they'll get in but be suspended for 5 games.

So the rumor goes.

ElectricEye
08-18-2011, 10:38 AM
Good for Pryor that he got in...but that doesn't make any sense about the suspension. As said before, the NFL shouldn't be an arbiter of justice for things that don't have anything to do with their organization, provided they weren't illegal.

Willing to bet he does get selected. Teams are too desperate for quarterbacks not to use a pick on him. It will probably be more in the 5th or 6th round category because of the suspension as well as doubts about him being able to play quarterback at the NFL level, but I can't see every team in the league passing.

FTRWRTR
08-18-2011, 10:49 AM
. As said before, the NFL shouldn't be an arbiter of justice for things that don't have anything to do with their organization, provided they weren't illegal.

The NCAA is their farm system so the NFL does have a legit concern as to what players do and don't do while in college.

Saints-Tigers
08-18-2011, 12:17 PM
This is pretty stupid.

Raiderz4Life
08-18-2011, 01:20 PM
I read the news earlier today. I agree with most and think its pretty stupid and idiotic the way it went down.

RaiderNation
08-18-2011, 01:32 PM
I think Miami, Buffalo, Oakland and Washington are the most likely places Pryor will go. If I had to bet I'd probably say Miami with a 4th.

ElectricEye
08-18-2011, 01:36 PM
The NCAA is their farm system so the NFL does have a legit concern as to what players do and don't do while in college.

I know Pryor isn't a fine, upstanding citizen. That's not the issue here. The issue is as to if the NFL has any obligation to protect the interests of the NCAA. What Pryor did was completely fine within the context of the law and the NFL player conduct policy(which doesn't even apply to him in the first place). Why should the NCAA be concerned about the NFL offering a former member of their association a job? If that's truly the case, this gets into the larger issue of the NCAA acting with commercial interests in mind rather than what they claim to be for tax purposes. The entire "free farm system" thing and the NCAA's ideal of amateurism vs. the reality of it in the midst of billions of dollars in TV money is really being stretched more and more by the day.

But yeah, I agree with njx, even though we have different conclusions. This is a total "don't upset anyone" move that ends up pleasing no one and just ends up making everything look worse.

As far as Pryor goes, I wouldn't want to touch him personally, for similar reasons that I would have preferred to avoid Cam Newton. He's obviously a very entitled individual with questionable off the field character in addition to some legitimate concerns as to how he holds up as an NFL quarterback.

phlysac
08-18-2011, 01:40 PM
Gotta love that Keenan Mace feels the NFL player he most resembles on the field is Ndamukong Suh.

Lulz

BeerBaron
08-18-2011, 01:42 PM
I had been saying Washington in the 4th, and I think I'll stick with that. Maybe with the suspension he doesn't go until the 5th, but he'll be drafted. And I say Washington because....c'mon....Rexy and John Beck? Blegh.....They NEED him. Plus he fits that Shanahan mold as a more mobile QB.

Miami is another intersting fit. And Oakland, because they're Oakland and he just seems like someone Al Davis would like (athletic,)

As for the other guys.....I don't see any of them being drafted. McAdoo probably has the best chance of someone taking a late round flier, because all teams can use more athletic pass rushers. But he wouldn't be anything earlier than a 7th I don't think.

Shane P. Hallam
08-18-2011, 02:23 PM
My guesses:

Michael McAdoo - 5th (Minnesota)

Terrelle Pryor - 6th (Miami)

Caleb King - 7th (iffy about this one, 40 time may mean a flyer for SF)

keylime_5
08-18-2011, 02:48 PM
Pryor to Miami makes too much sense. Of course never underestimate Al Davis' love affair with elite athletes. I actually think he'd be a good fit in either of those places. I think the O/U for him is 5th round.

Shane P. Hallam
08-18-2011, 02:58 PM
Pryor to Miami makes too much sense. Of course never underestimate Al Davis' love affair with elite athletes. I actually think he'd be a good fit in either of those places. I think the O/U for him is 5th round.

Those are the two teams I am hearing with an outside shot at Philly or Buffalo.

Raiderz4Life
08-18-2011, 03:15 PM
Plz don't let him come to Oakland. Plz...I will be totally against it...even though it doesnt mean anything to anyone haha

niel89
08-18-2011, 04:33 PM
Now that he is in, what do y'all think his chances that he becomes a successful player?

I dislike the 5 game suspension also. It feels like a cop out. Either say he is good to go or don't make him eligible. The 5 game suspension means absolutely nothing. He wasn't going to contribute this year anyways.

BeerBaron
08-18-2011, 04:37 PM
Now that he is in, what do y'all think his chances that he becomes a successful player?

I dislike the 5 game suspension also. It feels like a cop out. Either say he is good to go or don't make him eligible. The 5 game suspension means absolutely nothing. He wasn't going to contribute this year anyways.

Well, I don't think the 5 games really affect how he'll be overall. It's not like he would have played in them anyway....

Regardless, I don't like his odds at QB. He never seemed to have a feel for the position. The Wisconsin game last year was a perfect example...he'd take off running, but but instead of buying time to throw or running with a plan in mind...he'd take off. He lacks that feel for the position that is so crucial in QBs. His arm strength is also pretty "meh" and his accuracy can be pretty atrocious too.

If he ends up in a place like Philly, where he wouldn't have to even see the field and has a history of developing QBs successfully, he could be come something worthwhile someday. But I think he ends up not doing much in the pros.

PossibleCabbage
08-18-2011, 04:47 PM
Against the best 5 defenses Pryor faced last year (Iowa, Miami, Wisconsin, Illinois, Penn State) he only completed 55% of his passes for 6 TDs and 5 INTs. It was the cupcakier teams on his schedule that he ate up for gaudy stats. This doesn't actually project to be very promising as an NFL QB. Pryor will never face an NFL defense (even in preseason) that is not better than what Eastern Michigan fielded against the Buckeyes last year.

I think Pryor could succeed in the NFL at Wide Receiver, but I don't think he's an NFL QB.

phlysac
08-18-2011, 05:18 PM
Caleb King - 7th (iffy about this one, 40 time may mean a flyer for SF)

Why are you thinking/hearing SF are looking RB?

Shane P. Hallam
08-18-2011, 05:28 PM
Nothing special, just a feeling that will be wrong :) King may be better than Xavier Omon though.

phlysac
08-18-2011, 05:52 PM
Nothing special, just a feeling that will be wrong :) King may be better than Xavier Omon though.

I loved Oman at NWMS but I can't disagree. However, I doubt they'll keep more than 3. Using a draft pick would surprise me, but it wouldn't be the 1st time.

PossibleCabbage
08-18-2011, 06:24 PM
I loved Oman at NWMS but I can't disagree. However, I doubt they'll keep more than 3. Using a draft pick would surprise me, but it wouldn't be the 1st time.

If you like a guy in the supplemental draft at all, you might as well bid a 7th round pick on him. It's not like it's hard to acquire more of those on draft day, if you want to.

K Train
08-19-2011, 11:59 AM
id love for the steelers to throw a 4th in the mix for pryor...just to spice up my life a little bit.

is there a date set yet?

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 12:09 PM
id love for the steelers to throw a 4th in the mix for pryor...just to spice up my life a little bit.

is there a date set yet?

Aug 22nd.

Here's a statement that I'm going to regret next week: Pryor will be selected in the 4th round. At the lowest. He's a freak athlete and teams fall in love with fast, giant people.

K Train
08-19-2011, 12:16 PM
i could see a team throwing a second or a third really just to try and make sure they get him. imo theres zero reason for any team to not bid something and try to make pryor into a quality playe

Shane P. Hallam
08-19-2011, 12:45 PM
i could see a team throwing a second or a third really just to try and make sure they get him. imo theres zero reason for any team to not bid something and try to make pryor into a quality playe

Ummm, the reason would be to not give up a 2nd or 3rd on a developmental player?

49ersfan_87
08-19-2011, 12:58 PM
Nothing special, just a feeling that will be wrong :) King may be better than Xavier Omon though.

Whats King's game like? Quick and shifty, or more of a power runner, or a mix of both?

Shane P. Hallam
08-19-2011, 01:06 PM
Bigger guy who avoids contact. Really weak fundamentals, but some physical skills.

K Train
08-19-2011, 01:20 PM
Ummm, the reason would be to not give up a 2nd or 3rd on a developmental player?

i meant something, not a 2nd or 3rd even though i wouldnt be surprised if SOME team did....but throwing a 4th, 5th, 6th, or 7th just to throw your name in the hat wouldnt hurt.

jmo but i think he'll be a valuable player if the right team gets a hold of him

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 01:35 PM
i meant something, not a 2nd or 3rd even though i wouldnt be surprised if SOME team did....but throwing a 4th, 5th, 6th, or 7th just to throw your name in the hat wouldnt hurt.

jmo but i think he'll be a valuable player if the right team gets a hold of him

Totally agree. A franchise QB? Very doubtful, but still possible. A good hybrid player that will make plays all over the field if he's willing to do so? Very likely.

PossibleCabbage
08-19-2011, 01:43 PM
It only takes one team to pick him as high as he will go, but I suspect a number of teams' scouting departments are screaming up and down "not even as a UDFA" on Pryor.

I'm interested to see whether he will do any WR drills at his pro day, since I think that's his eventual NFL position if he has one.

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 01:48 PM
It only takes one team to pick him as high as he will go, but I suspect a number of teams' scouting departments are screaming up and down "not even as a UDFA" on Pryor.

I'm interested to see whether he will do any WR drills at his pro day, since I think that's his eventual NFL position if he has one.

If any team thinks that he is at the UDFA quality level then they are idiots.

K Train
08-19-2011, 01:52 PM
id love him as a 3rd QB and 2nd receiving TE behind heath miller. could be a nightmare mismatch. hes huge, fast and just an overall good ball carrier.

might take him a few years, but it took jermichael finley a few and hes a stud TE now in the mold of just a giant receiver.

might not be the role pryor envisioned himself, but he is a hard worker when it comes to athletics and good player, not exactly a dime a dozen athlete here...if he wanted stardom and spotlight he should have opted for basketball over QB, but situational QB (since that 3rd QB rule is gone now) and possible receiver he could make a career for himself in the NFL.

its funny, i never liked him as a pro prospect as a QB when he was being recruited and osu fans were all over his dick, and now i like him more than most and kinda feel bad for the guy....i think hes a pampered athlete little prick but overall not a bad person and a good developmental prospect at multiple positions....i would really like to hear his thoughts (will be uneducated spewing of garbage cause hes dumb as a rock) on a position change...to me he has to be willing, if hes not hes not draftable

PossibleCabbage
08-19-2011, 02:05 PM
If any team thinks that he is at the UDFA quality level then they are idiots.

I don't think you understand. Teams regularly have "undraftable" grades on guys that end up going in the first round. When a team says "we won't even sign him as UDFA" it's "we don't want any part of him" not "nobody should want any part of him."

Are you saying a team that's just not interested in Pryor at all is necessarily idiotic?

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 02:51 PM
I don't think you understand. Teams regularly have "undraftable" grades on guys that end up going in the first round. When a team says "we won't even sign him as UDFA" it's "we don't want any part of him" not "nobody should want any part of him."

Are you saying a team that's just not interested in Pryor at all is necessarily idiotic?

Yes. A 7th rounder on a guy that is a good football player and a freak athlete is a steal. You should be shot if you wouldn't take a flier on a guy that is 6'6" 235lbs and runs a 4.4ish 40.

PossibleCabbage
08-19-2011, 03:22 PM
Yes. A 7th rounder on a guy that is a good football player and a freak athlete is a steal. You should be shot if you wouldn't take a flier on a guy that is 6'6" 235lbs and runs a 4.4ish 40.

Pryor is a freak athlete, yes. Pryor is not a good football player. I wouldn't spend draft picks on freak athletes who aren't good football players and don't have clear NFL positions.

Especially if I'm happy with my group at every position that Pryor would play.

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 03:32 PM
Pryor is a freak athlete, yes. Pryor is not a good football player. I wouldn't spend draft picks on freak athletes who aren't good football players and don't have clear NFL positions.

Especially if I'm happy with my group at every position that Pryor would play.

You think that he is not a good football player? You are either stupid or insane. And from your posts here, I think you are pretty damn smart, so you must definitely be crazy.

I don't like him, and I'm glad he's gone from OSU. I've already critiqued him enough on this site. But he's most definitely a good football player.

I agree with your last point about a crowded position (i.e. stacked at WR and QB), but a scout wouldn't be screaming to stay away. The FO would do that.

K Train
08-19-2011, 03:48 PM
just because hes not a good passer and kind of a dick does not make him a bad football player, hes not just a workout warrior

Pat Sims 90
08-19-2011, 04:17 PM
The Bengals are intersted in Pryor. Does not surprise me seems like a Mike Brown type player.

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 04:27 PM
The Bengals are intersted in Pryor. Does not surprise me seems like a Mike Brown type player.

LOL @ The Bungles. My guess goes to a first round pick for Pryor from the Bungles after he has a good showing at his pro day.

Saints-Tigers
08-19-2011, 05:18 PM
IF the Saints pick him in the first round, do the patriots lose our pick next year?

I wish, haha.

PossibleCabbage
08-19-2011, 06:04 PM
IF the Saints pick him in the first round, do the patriots lose our pick next year?

I wish, haha.

Nope, you can't bid with picks that you do not have.

Pat Sims 90
08-19-2011, 07:10 PM
LOL @ The Bungles. My guess goes to a first round pick for Pryor from the Bungles after he has a good showing at his pro day.

The Bengals are not like the Raiders. If anybody spends a 1st on Pryor it will be the Raiders because Al will see his 40 time and get a boner from it.

Shane P. Hallam
08-19-2011, 09:37 PM
You can check out my Terrelle Pryor breakdown on the main page:

www.draftcountdown.com

JoeJoeBrown
08-19-2011, 09:46 PM
You can check out my Terrelle Pryor breakdown on the main page:

www.draftcountdown.com

Excellent writeup, man. I'm impressed.

Shane P. Hallam
08-19-2011, 09:47 PM
Thanks dude, thoroughly appreciate the compliment, probably my best work to date.

underscore
08-19-2011, 09:51 PM
I just don't see Pryor having the desire to give any effort outside of his reps at QB.

ElectricEye
08-19-2011, 09:54 PM
Very well thought out and fair take on the matter Shane. Can't really think of anyone better to write that than you. Not kissing ass either; legit, nice job. I'm not as sold on Pyror's arm strength as you seem to be though. I'm not where Pryor ends up position wise. Should be interesting.

M.O.T.H.
08-19-2011, 09:56 PM
I just hope Dallas stays away. JJ has gambled with some toys in the past ala Henson and Hutchinson. I just hope we dont even get involved in this situation. bleh. Dallas is believed to have some interest in the guy...but that would also mean keeping 4 Qbs, so it's highly unlikely. I just hope we keep our distance. lol.

Shane P. Hallam
08-19-2011, 10:43 PM
Very well thought out and fair take on the matter Shane. Can't really think of anyone better to write that than you. Not kissing ass either; legit, nice job. I'm not as sold on Pyror's arm strength as you seem to be though. I'm not where Pryor ends up position wise. Should be interesting.

He can get it down field, just not with the velocity needed to be effective in the NFL unfortunately. Was good enough for college though and a big part of the gameplan, see Miami game.

Duffman57
08-19-2011, 11:16 PM
Thanks dude, thoroughly appreciate the compliment, probably my best work to date.

Awesome write up. Just one thing, the reps at WR part, where there's supposed to be a link to some video of him playin WR, but it just sent me to a 404 error at the with the DC boardering.

redbills
08-19-2011, 11:21 PM
Any Michael McAdoo info? Would he fit a 34/43 hybrid D?

PossibleCabbage
08-20-2011, 12:06 AM
Any Michael McAdoo info? Would he fit a 34/43 hybrid D?

I think, before he can be anything to anybody, he'll have to spend at least one year on a PS or as a healthy scratch at the bottom of somebody's roster and an NFL offseason program. He could fill a variety of roles in a hybrid 3-4 or under front 4-3, because at 6-7 he's got amazing length. But at 250 lbs he really needs to fill out. It's not like we've actually seen him develop into a good football player, since he never started and he was suspended for the 2010 season before he lost his eligibility.

I think the team that drafts him will basically need to redshirt him. So he could go late (or not at all.)

Shane P. Hallam
08-20-2011, 12:45 AM
I think, before he can be anything to anybody, he'll have to spend at least one year on a PS or as a healthy scratch at the bottom of somebody's roster and an NFL offseason program. He could fill a variety of roles in a hybrid 3-4 or under front 4-3, because at 6-7 he's got amazing length. But at 250 lbs he really needs to fill out. It's not like we've actually seen him develop into a good football player, since he never started and he was suspended for the 2010 season before he lost his eligibility.

I think the team that drafts him will basically need to redshirt him. So he could go late (or not at all.)

He's getting talked up based on his athletic ability. I'd say 5th round. He could stand up in a 3-4, but a little to tall and not quite beefy enough for me to be a down lineman in a 3-4. We'll see.

BeerBaron
08-20-2011, 12:54 AM
So does Caleb King maybe appeal to the Cardinals a bit now with Williams' injury?

Shane P. Hallam
08-20-2011, 12:56 AM
I have to imagine there are better RBs out there, not a guy they'd keep long term, but could be worth a 7th round shot.

My guess is that they wait for cuts. A team like the Colts has 4 solid RBs on the roster, Cardinals could use one.

PossibleCabbage
08-20-2011, 01:03 AM
He's getting talked up based on his athletic ability. I'd say 5th round. He could stand up in a 3-4, but a little to tall and not quite beefy enough for me to be a down lineman in a 3-4. We'll see.

He's a good athlete, but the fact that he never really produced at the college level I think means that NFL teams won't be quite as high on him as you think they will be. He's not going to really play for you at all this year, so I would only bid as high as a fifth if I was really worried about not getting him. If I'm bidding, and I want him, I probably go with a 6.

But yeah, he won't be a down lineman in a 3-4 unless he adds 50 lbs. Honestly, he probably has to add at least 15-20 to play anywhere, but he has the frame to do it.

FTRWRTR
08-20-2011, 11:47 AM
I just don't see Pryor having the desire to give any effort outside of his reps at QB.Me neither.

PossibleCabbage
08-20-2011, 12:18 PM
Teams represented at Pryor's Pro Day: Colts, Steelers, Redskins, Saints, Bucs, Cowboys, Chargers, Browns, Lions, Chiefs, Eagles, Raiders, Dolphins, Bills, 49ers, Patriots, and Bengals. Slightly over half the NFL, some of the usual suspects that we think want Pryor and some teams that are probably just there since this is taking place basically in their backyard (Eagles, Colts, Steelers, notably.)

Saints-Tigers
08-20-2011, 01:14 PM
Saints taking Pryor as a developmental third QB would be cool with me. If he can't improve as a QB with our staff and QBs, no one can help him.

BeerBaron
08-20-2011, 07:24 PM
Al Davis popped an old man boner when he heard that Pryor ran a 4.41.

brasho
08-21-2011, 10:50 PM
There's no way McAdoo gets drafted unless he had a pro day with freaky numbers. He did almost nothing in college, didn't start a game, had a grand total of 3 sacks...20-something tackles... His best bet is a team gives him a tryout, he lands on the PS.. otherwise Canada will be his best option, unless the UFL is around for another year.

brasho
08-21-2011, 10:55 PM
I actually think the 5 game suspension for Pryor might work to his benefit. That would basically give his drafting team a 5 week roster exemption for him where he can learn the playbook, workout on his own, etc. Once the 5 weeks is up, the team can plug him in there (and they may get a longer roster exemption like other teams do with suspended players) and see what they have. Just because he can't officially practice with the team, doesn't mean he can't have contact with players and who's to say QB1 or WR5 doesn't come over to see him and help him get adjusted to the offense and his likely new position.

K Train
08-22-2011, 12:12 PM
no first round picks used...expected

no second rounders either

Damix
08-22-2011, 12:30 PM
What is your source?

SolidGold
08-22-2011, 12:31 PM
What is your source?

http://twitter.com/#!/AdamSchefter

K Train
08-22-2011, 12:32 PM
im excited to find out, this is a first lol

Shane P. Hallam
08-22-2011, 12:32 PM
Raiders take Pryor in the 3rd

SolidGold
08-22-2011, 12:33 PM
Raiders take Pryor...lol

Hines
08-22-2011, 12:33 PM
Same ole Raiders.

K Train
08-22-2011, 12:33 PM
lol damnit

RaiderNation
08-22-2011, 12:34 PM
Raiders take Pryor in 3rd according to Shefter

MidwayMonster31
08-22-2011, 12:35 PM
Not much of a surprise, but it is a good fit.