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JJJ888
03-24-2007, 08:35 PM
Per a request from Thule, here is a thread about cornerbacks. Let's save the discussion for whether we need a cornerback for another thread.

So, assuming Leon Hall is not available, which cornerback would you prefer to draft at 22?

Personally, I like Revis and Ross about equally, with Revis getting a little edge right now.

D-Unit
03-24-2007, 08:45 PM
Well, my favorite cornerback is Daymeion Hughes... but this discussion sounds like who the favorite CB at 22 would be.

In that case, purely for CB, I like Chris Houston.

Paul
03-24-2007, 08:56 PM
If we do go CB, I don't think you can go wrong with either Houston or Revis. I believe they both have more upside then Ross, and both had good combines. Revis is my favorite at the moment, seeing that he has the prototypical size and speed for a CB, plus he plays physical. But Houston has the resume when it comes to competition. D. Hughes wouldn't be bad either in the 2nd or 3rd. He fell alittle bit, but he was very productive this past season and you can't ignore that. McCauley could possibly be another option in the 2nd.

LSUALUM99
03-24-2007, 09:01 PM
I like Ross because of his ability in the return game. He's had better success than any other CB prospect.

JJJ888
03-24-2007, 09:12 PM
Ok let's approach this both ways:

1. Favorite cornerback at 22
2. Favorite cornerback anywhere in terms of value.

D-Unit
03-24-2007, 09:34 PM
What about who you would predict at 22 if we went CB? lol.

There's really not a lot that separates them and I could live with any of them. They all have different strengths and weaknesses.

Wade likes to bump and run with his cornerbacks, so if you're trying to predict who will be selected, I would keep that in mind. Revis fits that mold best.

TNewFan41
03-24-2007, 09:43 PM
Were not drafting one at 22, so does it matter?

If anything, Jonathan Wade in the 3rd would be good.

Staubach12
03-24-2007, 09:45 PM
I think we could find a quality CB in the 2nd or 3rd that would fill our need quite well. I'm (as many know) very high on Jonathan Wade. We could also problably get Josh Wilson in the 2nd.

jetBLACK08
03-24-2007, 09:59 PM
1Chris Houston
2Marcus McCauley
3Aaron Ross
4Eric Wright
5Josh Wilson

neko4
03-24-2007, 10:04 PM
Im not a boys fan, but Josh Wilson=Tye Hill

Modano
03-25-2007, 04:55 AM
I really like Chris Houston

TNewFan41
03-25-2007, 07:07 AM
There you go staubach, Jonathan Wade baby.

Anyway, if I have to, I would take Houston. He has the most upside out of any of them, and is a fiesty little ballhawk. Revis is slow, I don't care about that 4.39, if you have ever seen him play he is SLOW AS HELL. I remember his INT return he was so slow it wasn't even funny. And ross is 25, I know we got lucky with Newman, but I don't want an old person again. Oh and if Leon Hall is there, pass. He is just average in my mind.

LSUALUM99
03-25-2007, 09:26 AM
There you go staubach, Jonathan Wade baby.

Anyway, if I have to, I would take Houston. He has the most upside out of any of them, and is a fiesty little ballhawk. Revis is slow, I don't care about that 4.39, if you have ever seen him play he is SLOW AS HELL. I remember his INT return he was so slow it wasn't even funny. And ross is 25, I know we got lucky with Newman, but I don't want an old person again. Oh and if Leon Hall is there, pass. He is just average in my mind.


Aren't you the one that says that we're good at CB for at least 5-6 years. So by that logic a CB can be good until they are 35 or so based on Henry being 31 now and Tnew being 29. If that is the case then drafting a player like Ross would mean he coule play for 10 years.

Your inability to use logic is uncanny. I hope your parents have money, because I fear you'll be unable to actually make it in the real world relying on your own intelligence.

Macarthur
03-25-2007, 10:52 AM
I really haven't watched much film on these guys.

I personally would rather not take a CB in the 1st, but for the sake of the discussion, I would lean towards Houston because he has played against top notch talent on a regular basis.

TNewFan41
03-25-2007, 11:36 AM
Aren't you the one that says that we're good at CB for at least 5-6 years. So by that logic a CB can be good until they are 35 or so based on Henry being 31 now and Tnew being 29. If that is the case then drafting a player like Ross would mean he coule play for 10 years.

Your inability to use logic is uncanny. I hope your parents have money, because I fear you'll be unable to actually make it in the real world relying on your own intelligence.

Actually I get straight A's in school, but thanks for trying. What I am saying is that by the time Ross fully develops he will be 28-29. I want someone to be developed when they are 24-25. Wouldn't you?

bigmac076
03-25-2007, 11:55 AM
Aaron Ross, and dont bore me with the "he's too old" speech

TNewFan41
03-25-2007, 01:01 PM
He is old though. I would like a player that is fully developed in the NFL at like 25, not 28.

jetBLACK08
03-25-2007, 01:21 PM
What age did Newman get drafted?

LSUALUM99
03-25-2007, 01:49 PM
Actually I get straight A's in school, but thanks for trying. What I am saying is that by the time Ross fully develops he will be 28-29. I want someone to be developed when they are 24-25. Wouldn't you?

First off, it's high school. High school is about as easy as it gets.

Secondly, if you somehow think that your grades in school dictate your intelligence you're in for a rude awakening when you get into the real world.

Lastly, and you should pay particular attention to this, people judge you on your ability to form thoughts and logically explain those thoughts. They don't plop down an quiz for you to do before they judge you. This all happens in basically 30 seconds or less. If you don't learn to articulate your points with better reasoning, you'll be thought of as a fool your entire life.

As for being 'fully developed'. It's well regarded that CB is one of the positions that relys on physical skills more than most other positions. Since that is the case, it's also follows that CB is one of the positions that players can come in and 'be fully developed' in year 2 or less. Your lack of information is more amazing everyday.

thule
03-25-2007, 03:10 PM
This CB class is really a jem...I mean it is deep..but still top heavy with talent.

If I had to make a order right now it'd be.

Hall
Revis
Ross
Houston

Later Today I'll break down all four guys from what I've seen of them.

thule
03-25-2007, 03:10 PM
Chris Houston

I'm surprised to see everyone so high on Houston around the boards. I agree from a upside prospective he might have a notch above the other three. But he really isn't close to the same as the other three in the mental part of the game. When watching Houston play I couldn't help but notice he was constantly locking on to WR's and running with them. This isn't a huge problem...but I would have liked to see him read and react more rather then just use his raw talent to cover. If he is gonna turn and run with WR's in the NFL you are gonna see plenty of illegal contact and pass interference called.

But this isn't his only knock...he always seemed to shy away from the RB when they swept to his side. He doesn't shed blocks...which isn't a huge knock...but running around them and putting his head down when diving at a backs feet is. When beat he seems to give up...we all know he has the speed to recover...but he just doesn't seem to be consistant in the aspect...I also will knock his backpedal. Houston has great straightline speed. So great that he will use it at every chance he gets. Which means he breaks out of his backpedal to early from time to time to turn and run with the wr...rather then sitting down and his backpedal waiting for a WR to break. Some of this might have to do with his lack of anticipation...its hard to tell. But from a NFL ready standpoint I think his is 2nd tier to the other top 3 guys.

thule
03-25-2007, 03:18 PM
Leon Hall

He is number one on my CB list for a reason. First of all I'm not sure how many saw him at the combine...but he had the body of a NFL player...really crisp looking stature. Hall really has something the other 3 don't have. The ability to process information at the snap of his fingures. It's almost like he has Peyton Manning eyes...he is always in control on the field and always seems to know what is going on around him...great eyes. I don't by any means think he is slow...but I would be in the group that says he is more quick than fast. But his quickness is only increased when you factor in his ability to process information...it was almost like he knew what route the WR was running before they even snapped the ball. Halls intensity on the field really shows...he knows how to get his teammates involved and is a good leader on the field...something that isn't a known quality in many cb's it seems. One of my favorite things about hall is how he sits on the LOS. Hall was played a lot like newman. He wouldn't exactly line up against the best WR...he would line up on his side of the field. Almost always playing no further then 5 yards off the ball. This is great when evaluating a corner. Now that we are running Wades defense there will be a lot in common. Corners have to sit with the slower WR's and be able to redirect the less physical WR's...and Hall seems to do this to perfection...I never saw him open his hips early to try to use raw ability to cover a WR. Always poised and keeping his composure.

Hall is the most fluid corner in this draft...and has the best anticipation out of this class. You'll see some corners bog down when they open up their hips...Hall doesn't have this problem. Revis is a guy that seems to sometimes take false steps when breaking out of his backpedal...however Hall is crisp. Hall has a good vert...with long arms and soft hands. Really a top prospect imo. He is also a good punt fielder...he might not have the lateral quickness to be a to tier returner...but I would say he would be an upgrade over Crayton back deep. Another underrated part of his game is his run defense. Hall is very good at working the blocker downhill then shedding and taking the correct angle at the runner or shutting down a runners cutback lane. He has great zone recognition. Like I said...he can read a qb's eye's and disect a route as he pleases...this might be where he is at his best...although he wouldn't get to use his athletic ability as much as he should.

I don't think you can get a more NFL ready corner than Leon Hall...which is why he is #1 on my list.

OK, now i've hyped him up to be the next champ bailey...but he really isn't in that class. Like I said more quick than fast....he has the speed to stick with a wr...but wouldn't succeed over the course of a game with guys like Santana Moss or Steve Smith. I said I love how he played up close to the LOS...but he isn't exactly great at jamming the WR. He doesn't get a good punch..and although this is teachable...you would expect more out of him at this point...with as much experience as he has. Since he is great at playing the ball...and anticipating...it also turns to show his lack of straight up man to man skills. I don't buy into this being as big of a deal as some people...I mean I want my corner playing the ball/qb not the WR...but he doesn't have what it takes to match up one on one and say beat me...he relies on his anticipation to do the work for him on most occasions.

I think with Leon Hall you get what you see. A top of the line corner...that may have occasional troubles with elite WR's but will be able to hold the fort down on the other 95% of WRs. Hall is the perfect compliment to our boy Newman...and if he falls out of the top 10 a team will be getting a steal.

Paul
03-25-2007, 03:18 PM
Chris Houston

I'm surprised to see everyone so high on Houston around the boards. I agree from a upside prospective he might have a notch above the other three. But he really isn't close to the same as the other three in the mental part of the game. When watching Houston play I couldn't help but notice he was constantly locking on to WR's and running with them. This isn't a huge problem...but I would have liked to see him read and react more rather then just use his raw talent to cover. If he is gonna turn and run with WR's in the NFL you are gonna see plenty of illegal contact and pass interference called.

But this isn't his only knock...he always seemed to shy away from the RB when they swept to his side. He doesn't shed blocks...which isn't a huge knock...but running around them and putting his head down when diving at a backs feet is. When beat he seems to give up...we all know he has the speed to recover...but he just doesn't seem to be consistant in the aspect...I also will knock his backpedal. Houston has great straightline speed. So great that he will use it at every chance he gets. Which means he breaks out of his backpedal to early from time to time to turn and run with the wr...rather then sitting down and his backpedal waiting for a WR to break. Some of this might have to do with his lack of anticipation...its hard to tell. But from a NFL ready standpoint I think his is 2nd tier to the other top 3 guys.

That's what you call a good indepth analysis. Have any for the other CB candidates we've been talkin about?

thule
03-25-2007, 03:19 PM
That's what you call a good indepth analysis. Have any for the other CB candidates we've been talkin about?

I'll do the big four...just don't have time to do big write up right now. Maybe later today or tomorrow.

Phrost
03-25-2007, 03:23 PM
Darrent Williams was my favorite no lie. I remember every time I started a franchise I would draft him and he would become the best in the league after 2 years.

Well now I would say Juran Bolden, he never ceases to amaze me every time he gets burnt.

Staubach12
03-25-2007, 03:33 PM
Darrent Williams was my favorite no lie. I remember every time I started a franchise I would draft him and he would become the best in the league after 2 years.

Well now I would say Juran Bolden, he never ceases to amaze me every time he gets burnt.

Well, this isn't exactly Madden...

Paul
03-25-2007, 03:43 PM
Darrent Williams was my favorite no lie. I remember every time I started a franchise I would draft him and he would become the best in the league after 2 years.

Well now I would say Juran Bolden, he never ceases to amaze me every time he gets burnt.

WTF are you talking about?

TNewFan41
03-25-2007, 04:21 PM
He is talking about Madden.

etk
03-25-2007, 04:26 PM
About the only way the Cowboys justify passing on a receiver in the first round is if they trade down for Texas offensive lineman Justin Blalock, whom they love, love, love. What they cannot do is neglect offense in the first round.
-- Fort Worth Star-Telegram

No mention of drafting a CB there, I think the 'Boys will draft Blalock, no matter what Jerry Jones says about taking an OG early.

jetBLACK08
03-25-2007, 04:29 PM
About the only way the Cowboys justify passing on a receiver in the first round is if they trade down for Texas offensive lineman Justin Blalock, whom they love, love, love. What they cannot do is neglect offense in the first round.
-- Fort Worth Star-Telegram

No mention of drafting a CB there, I think the 'Boys will draft Blalock, no matter what Jerry Jones says about taking an OG early.

I would love Blalock
He can play Guard and OT

TNewFan41
03-25-2007, 05:25 PM
Hell yea! O-Line BABY!!!!

No CB, that a boy Jerry.

Go Cowboys
03-25-2007, 09:00 PM
assuming Hall is gone then I would have to say in this order. Ross, Revis, Wright, Houston, Bennett

Ward
03-25-2007, 09:15 PM
Ross and Houston.

KILLERSANTA
03-25-2007, 09:18 PM
Revis.....

bigmac076
03-26-2007, 11:05 AM
Hall
Ross
Houston
Revis

mtmock
03-26-2007, 12:51 PM
houston, revis....maybe wright but not in r.1

etk
03-26-2007, 12:53 PM
assuming Hall is gone then I would have to say in this order. Ross, Revis, Wright, Houston, Bennett

I think Eric Wright will be the best Corner from the draft, but Houston has a lot of potential as well.

thule
03-26-2007, 01:12 PM
Upped my Hall review back on page one..check it out.

Burns336
03-26-2007, 02:22 PM
Upped my Hall review back on page one..check it out.


Im interested to see your review on Ross

thule
03-26-2007, 04:18 PM
Im interested to see your review on Ross

I'll get it up here in the next 15 mins.

thule
03-26-2007, 04:37 PM
Aaron Ross

So many things to like about Ross. My personal favorite is his swagger He presents himself like a top corner...from the way he walks to the way he plays on the field...got to love that about the kid. As a returner he really showed it on the field. I really think he could give us a game breaker in the return game. He would be better then Newman in the aspect. Like Hall he also has a great sense of balance and smooth hips. I think he might have the best backpedal of all the cornerbacks...always has his butt to the ground...great drive out of it and effortless swivel to get out and run. However he is lacking more in the mental part of the game. I love Ross in the press...however he tends to lunge to get off his initial punch which is a huge nono. When caught out of position like this he is forced to turn and play the WR...rather then man up and play the ball. He does this more then the other 3 corners which gets me worrisome. I love hall because of his great instincts. Well this is something that Ross does not have. No whether its time in the film room or just mental lapses I don't know...however it is clear when he plays he doesn't have good route recognition which again leads to him trailing the WR rather then playing the ball. Big killer for penalties in the NFL. Ross probably has the best recovery ability of all the corners in this draft which is what makes up for his mental lapses....unlike Houston...Ross seems to love to shift it into high gear and make a play on the ball.

Ross doesn't have a NFL body at this point...he could stand to put on 5-10lbs and really strengthen up his core. He really needs to hit the film room...route and zone recognition are really lacking...which is why he was burned on double moves more than the other 3. His first year in the NFL could be rough. He doesn't seem to have the mindset or mental capabilities to understand some things...or maybe he just hasn't put forth the effort. When he is asked to just go out and play he might be the best of the bunch....but put him in a zone or give a QB time...flags and td's will be thrown. A bit of a risk...but if he had time to sit and digest information...and ease himself onto the field he has a chance to be the best of the bunch.

thule
03-26-2007, 04:51 PM
Darrelle Revis

Revis is the oddball of the bunch for me. With Houston you have top intangibles...with Ross you have a great athlete...with Hall you have great instincts...Revis looks to be a mold of all of them into one.

Revis has played both CB positions...so versatility is not a problem with him. Understands zone coverages as well as man-to-man, trial, off coverage, and bump and run coverages. Great at redirecting the WR with over the top help..Has a great body stature. Really looks fully developed which is rare in a rookie. Good instincts allow him for good reaction time...I don't think he is as good with route recognition as Hall but he has above average NFL recognition. Rarely see a WR get separation from him which is nice to see since his knock is speed. Perhaps his best asset is in the running game. Revis can stick you. He gets good downhill movement with great shedding technique almost looks like a LB when engaged with a WR. Revis has the best hands of the bunch. He can knock a WR off their feet if they aren't ready, or he can sit back in off coverage and break on a quick out...like I said...great reaction time. Most people don't realize it...but Revis is actually a good punt returner...Ross really gets the knack for being the big returner...but Revis only averaged a yard less per return...and actually had more TD's in his career. Revis is above average for the position with the ball in his hand.

My biggest fear with Revis is that backpedal. It almost looks like a flexibilty issue in the back of his legs. He keeps a nice low backpedal but seems to waddle rather then drive his leg backwards. He has a effortless hip turn...but just one on one with a backpedal is dangerous...really needs a little technique help from what it looks like. Like I said earlier people knock his game speed...but he seems to be able to stick to WR's like glue so thats not a big concern for me. His 4.05 20 yard shuttle answers his speed questions. He also is knocked for not being a wrap up tackler...but he is far superior in the run game so I really don't think it affects his status too much.

TNewFan41
03-26-2007, 06:00 PM
Not to bad.

Burns336
03-26-2007, 06:10 PM
great posts thule

D-Unit
03-26-2007, 07:02 PM
great posts thule
thule just "get's it". ...is really one of the few who does.

RGVBadBoy
03-27-2007, 09:13 PM
Eric Weddle is my favorite Corner, the kid just gets the job done. He's not as flashy as Revis, Ross or Hall and will probably ONLY play Safety, but he will probably be a standout S, other than him, I think Revis will do pretty well.

UTPATS
03-27-2007, 10:17 PM
Although he might not have as high of ceiling as Ross, he has more experience and has better technique. Tarell Brown could be a very solid corner in the NFL. He has matched up with some of the better WRs throughout the Big 12 and in non-conference games over the past four years. He started ahead of Ross for three years before this one. He could be a good corner for Dallas to target later if they choose not to take a corner with the 22 pick. Just a guy to think about.

I know he has some character issues, but I think those problems have been left behind. Only time can tell.

LonghornsLegend
03-30-2007, 01:11 AM
oh id love blalock, right outta plano east, i saw alot of his high school games and he was always top notch talent...ill never argue o line picks, and if we could find a way to go defense first, then land him in the 2nd id be very happy, but we would probably have to take him at 22 or trade up, as i see him no later then early 2nd...but it would be a great pick, and i wouldnt argue it at all, our O line would dramatically change, and romo would have alot of time to spread the ball around

therock6000
03-30-2007, 10:13 AM
Rossvis




10 character

mtmock
03-30-2007, 06:57 PM
Eric Weddle is my favorite Corner, the kid just gets the job done. He's not as flashy as Revis, Ross or Hall and will probably ONLY play Safety, but he will probably be a standout S, other than him, I think Revis will do pretty well.

hes only a safety. isnt a corner.

JJJ888
03-30-2007, 07:09 PM
hes only a safety. isnt a corner.

A lot of guys consider him either a safety or a corner, Scott included.