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JBCX
09-06-2011, 02:30 PM
After today's release of David Garrard, I got to thinking: how many organizations in the NFL this year, seeing that they have no chance to be Super Bowl contenders in the near future with their current QB situations, are either blatantly or subtly trying to tank their seasons in hopes of picking #1 in 2012 and selecting the next great QB prospect (Andrew Luck)?

- The Jaguars' most recent move could be construed as such. Starting Luke McKnown (sp)? They will obviously end up with one of the worst records this year. Do they want to select Andrew Luck or are they hoping to maybe ransom off the #1 overall pick if they obtain it, and rebuild their roster with Gabbert as the QB of the future?

- The Colts' seeming complacency with the Peyton Manning situation (all the way down to Jim Irsay joking about it in tweets) and their decision to go with either Curtis Painter or Kerry Collins, either of whom will likely win fewer than 5 games combined for the Colts if forced to start the entire season...

- The Seahawks' decision to start the historically inept Tarvaris Jackson at QB. Such a move on a talent-poor team can only mean that that team will be in the running for the #1 overall pick in 2012. Can starting Tarvaris Jackson as your QB signal an intent to tank the season? I think so.

- The Redskins' decision to name Rex Grossman as the starting QB. Grossman has historically been an inept turnover-machine, but maybe Shanahan thinks he can turn Grossman into a modern day Jake Plummer. Or maybe he just wants to tank the season to get Luck?

Who else has made moves this offseason that make you wonder if they are trying to "Suck for Luck"?

SolidGold
09-06-2011, 02:40 PM
Take Jacksonville off the list...they are not going to draft Luck. They moved up in this year's draft to get Gabbert.

jrdrylie
09-06-2011, 02:43 PM
After today's release of David Garrard, I got to thinking: how many organizations in the NFL this year, seeing that they have no chance to be Super Bowl contenders in the near future with their current QB situations, are either blatantly or subtly trying to tank their seasons in hopes of picking #1 in 2012 and selecting the next great QB prospect (Andrew Luck)?

- The Jaguars' most recent move could be construed as such. Starting Luke McKnown (sp)? They will obviously end up with one of the worst records this year. Do they want to select Andrew Luck or are they hoping to maybe ransom off the #1 overall pick if they obtain it, and rebuild their roster with Gabbert as the QB of the future?

- The Colts' seeming complacency with the Peyton Manning situation (all the way down to Jim Irsay joking about it in tweets) and their decision to go with either Curtis Painter or Kerry Collins, either of whom will likely win fewer than 5 games combined for the Colts if forced to start the entire season...

- The Seahawks' decision to start the historically inept Tarvaris Jackson at QB. Such a move on a talent-poor team can only mean that that team will be in the running for the #1 overall pick in 2012. Can starting Tarvaris Jackson as your QB signal an intent to tank the season? I think so.

- The Redskins' decision to name Rex Grossman as the starting QB. Grossman has historically been an inept turnover-machine, but maybe Shanahan thinks he can turn Grossman into a modern day Jake Plummer. Or maybe he just wants to tank the season to get Luck?

Who else has made moves this offseason that make you wonder if they are trying to "Suck for Luck"?

You are wrong on a bunch of counts. Manning is going to play some this year, so they will not be in the running. Plus, I think they win 6 games even if Manning doesn't start a game so I doubt they would be in the running either way. You called Grossman a historically inept turnover-machine. He is 20-14 as a starter. He has a 40-40 TD:INT ratio. Neither of those numbers is great, but he is not as inept as many think.

Where are the Bengals? They are a mess and will have a tough time winning 4 games. How about Miami? Tony Sparano is a lame duck coach who was almost fired last season. The same scenario played out last year with the Panthers.

bucfan12
09-06-2011, 02:43 PM
After today's release of David Garrard, I got to thinking: how many organizations in the NFL this year, seeing that they have no chance to be Super Bowl contenders in the near future with their current QB situations, are either blatantly or subtly trying to tank their seasons in hopes of picking #1 in 2012 and selecting the next great QB prospect (Andrew Luck)?

- The Jaguars' most recent move could be construed as such. Starting Luke McKnown (sp)? They will obviously end up with one of the worst records this year. Do they want to select Andrew Luck or are they hoping to maybe ransom off the #1 overall pick if they obtain it, and rebuild their roster with Gabbert as the QB of the future?

- The Colts' seeming complacency with the Peyton Manning situation (all the way down to Jim Irsay joking about it in tweets) and their decision to go with either Curtis Painter or Kerry Collins, either of whom will likely win fewer than 5 games combined for the Colts if forced to start the entire season...

- The Seahawks' decision to start the historically inept Tarvaris Jackson at QB. Such a move on a talent-poor team can only mean that that team will be in the running for the #1 overall pick in 2012. Can starting Tarvaris Jackson as your QB signal an intent to tank the season? I think so.

- The Redskins' decision to name Rex Grossman as the starting QB. Grossman has historically been an inept turnover-machine, but maybe Shanahan thinks he can turn Grossman into a modern day Jake Plummer. Or maybe he just wants to tank the season to get Luck?

Who else has made moves this offseason that make you wonder if they are trying to "Suck for Luck"?

Eh, It's hard to predict at this point. The Jaguars didn't make this move to put them in position to draft Luck. They took Gabbert at 10th overall last year. Don't give up on him after a year. They'd take a pass rusher or WR with a top 3 pick.

As much as you hate Rex Grossman, I definately think he can put Washington in a position to with 3-5 games this year. They have a deep running game, decent 0-line and decent defense as well.

I know Bengals fans hate me for saying this, especially PatSims 90, but I see the Bengals being the worst team in the league, along with Carolina and maybe Jacksonville or Tennesee. Benson can't stay out of jail and Dalton is being asked to do too much as being a rookie starter who had no preperation and was probably overdrafted due to need.

My opinion on the top teams being in position to draft Luck (1 being the worst finishing record):
1. Cincinatti
2. Seattle
3. Jacksonville (although they won't take Luck)
4. Tennessee
5. Washington
6. Miami

Ness
09-06-2011, 02:54 PM
It would be really sad to hear if any organization decides to just tank the season. And I'm sure word of that would probably get out. Really, these players work too hard to play for a team that is just going to give up. I don't think anyone would want to be apart of that. Especially the players who are putting their bodies on the line.

JBCX
09-06-2011, 03:16 PM
Take Jacksonville off the list...they are not going to draft Luck. They moved up in this year's draft to get Gabbert.

They might still be angling to hold the "rights", so to speak, to draft Luck. If they get the #1 pick, they can extort a king's ransom from another team for that pick. Think Julio Jones this past year, but even more.

Hurricanes25
09-06-2011, 03:21 PM
Nobody tanks the season. Too much money and jobs on the line.

And the Jags just drafted Gabbert in the first. They will not be taking Luck.

bucfan12
09-06-2011, 03:23 PM
They might still be angling to hold the "rights", so to speak, to draft Luck. If they get the #1 pick, they can extort a king's ransom from another team for that pick. Think Julio Jones this past year, but even more.

When that opportunity comes, then sure, they could do that. But I highly doubt they are thinking of tanking the season. That would be the dumbest and most irresponsible thing to do if your running an professional team. I understand it's a business, and it was the correct move to cut Garrard, but you're honestly telling me Garrard was that good enough to the point they were a playoff contender? Honestly, I see the same Jags team with McCown running the show.

Ness
09-06-2011, 03:37 PM
IMk5sMHj58I

FUNBUNCHER
09-06-2011, 04:39 PM
I don't think the Skins are deliberately tanking the season, but having Grossman/Beck as your top two QBs tells me Shanny isn't doing everything he can possibly do to win.

Jags like Gabbert. Cutting Gerrard eliminates any QB controversy once Blaine is named the starter.
If Dalton doesn't improve in nearly every single game, the Bengals will take Luck if he's there when they pick IMO. Similar situation to when the Bolts drafted Rivers with Brees already on the roster.

I don't think the Colts are purposefully attempting to put themselves in a position to draft Luck, but that team hasn't had a credible backup to Peyton for years.
The Colts are still my darkhorse to finish with the worst record in the league.
I don't see the Titans taking luck with Locker looking like he could be the guy there in a couple of years.

The Seahawks ARE tanking the season. Tavarris Jackson is your Day One starter? Riiiiight. Pete Carroll isn't fooling anyone.

tjsunstein
09-06-2011, 04:42 PM
No team will tank the season for Luck. That means the HC has to go out there for 16 games and lose. What HC is going to lose his job for the better of a franchise? Completely counterproductive and will never happen.

RaiderNation
09-06-2011, 04:43 PM
I just don't see the Redskins being the worst team in football, despite their situation at QB. They will end up with Barkely/Jones. But my top 4 likely to get "Luck-y" are the Bengals, 49ers, Broncos and Miami. All have bad teams and QB situations and would likely tank the last few games of the year to ensure they can get Luck.

Pat Sims 90
09-06-2011, 04:46 PM
Why would a team tank the season when they don't even though if Luck will be there or not. He is still a JR and could pull a Jake Locker or Matt Leinart.

bucfan12
09-06-2011, 04:53 PM
Why would a team tank the season when they don't even though if Luck will be there or not. He is still a JR and could pull a Jake Locker or Matt Leinart.

He's a red shirt Junior. Meaning, academically, he's graduating after this year. He always said he wants his degree. He's as good as gone and will most likely enter the 2012 draft.

Pat Sims 90
09-06-2011, 04:54 PM
He's a red shirt Junior. Meaning, academically, he's graduating after this year. He always said he wants his degree. He's as good as gone and will most likely enter the 2012 draft.

I would not say he is as good as gone. He could want to come back and try and win a NC with Stanford. He also might not like the team picking #1 overall and rather come back then play for them.

bucfan12
09-06-2011, 04:57 PM
He also did say he wouldn't enter the draft until he got his degree, which he will get this year. Plus, this could be his only year at the NAT'l Championship as well

CashmoneyDrew
09-06-2011, 05:00 PM
Not gonna lie. I wanted the Titans to do it.

tjsunstein
09-06-2011, 05:06 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if the top 4 this year consists of the same teams as last year.

Carolina, Denver, Buffalo, Cincinnati

Brown Leader
09-06-2011, 05:12 PM
With their moves so far, it's clear Seattle and San Fran have already entered the Luck sweepstakes.

phlysac
09-06-2011, 05:19 PM
With their moves so far, it's clear Seattle and San Fran have already entered the Luck sweepstakes.

What moves make it clear the 49ers want Luck?

Brown Leader
09-06-2011, 05:27 PM
What moves make it clear the 49ers want Luck?

It's lack of moves really. Sticking with A.Smith and going with an extremely raw rookie back up.

bucfan12
09-06-2011, 05:29 PM
I hope cutting Nate Clements for 15 million isn't a move you're talking about? Because that was a good move in my opinion. San Fransisco is improved, simply by just adding Harbaugh and his staff. Alex Smith is not a horrible option as well. He's been good under good coaching, when Norv Turner was his OC. Plus, the offense and team responds to him and respects him.

Pat Sims 90
09-06-2011, 05:35 PM
I hope cutting Nate Clements for 15 million isn't a move you're talking about? Because that was a good move in my opinion. San Fransisco is improved, simply by just adding Harbaugh and his staff. Alex Smith is not a horrible option as well. He's been good under good coaching, when Norv Turner was his OC. Plus, the offense and team responds to him and respects him.

You can't base Harbaugh college career on how he will do in the NFL. Usually College Coachs struggle from the switch and don't make it in the NFL. I would not say that he was a good coach till you see his team in action in the regular season.

Raiderz4Life
09-06-2011, 05:40 PM
It's lack of moves really. Sticking with A.Smith and going with an extremely raw rookie back up.

I'm thinking they would like to try Kaepernick as their QB first.

Pat Sims 90
09-06-2011, 05:41 PM
I'm thinking they would like to try Kaepernick as their QB first.

That is even worse then Alex Smith. Kaepernick is way to raw to start right now.

wordofi
09-06-2011, 05:44 PM
The only reason that Tarvaris Jackson gets a chance in the NFL is because he was picked in the second round back in 2006.

Raiderz4Life
09-06-2011, 05:48 PM
That is even worse then Alex Smith. Kaepernick is way to raw to start right now.

I didn't mean right now. I meant down the road. I think they want to look at Kaepernick as the future QB before completely dumping him.

SolidGold
09-06-2011, 05:57 PM
If Alex Smith gets injured and Kapernick plays I could see him getting Clausened next year if San Fran finds itself with the number one overall pick.

Brown Leader
09-06-2011, 05:57 PM
I didn't mean right now. I meant down the road. I think they want to look at Kaepernick as the future QB before completely dumping him.

Maby so, but even if Capn gets on the field this year, you don't really think they would pass up Luck in order to develop Kaep, right?

The Alex
09-06-2011, 06:37 PM
Not gonna lie. I wanted the Titans to do it.

Even with Locker, I'm still for it. If it gets late in the year and the Titans are flirting with the number one pick, I will be rooting for them to lose and trade Locker during the offseason for more picks. Andrew Luck is just unreal. I'm willing to say he's the best draft prospect since John Elway.

bucfan12
09-06-2011, 08:29 PM
Even with Locker, I'm still for it. If it gets late in the year and the Titans are flirting with the number one pick, I will be rooting for them to lose and trade Locker during the offseason for more picks. Andrew Luck is just unreal. I'm willing to say he's the best draft prospect since John Elway.

They might have a tough time trading Locker for a 1st round pick. Not a lot of teams had a high grade for this guy coming into the 2011 draft and I think Tennessee jumped the gun on him. Let's put it this way, you don't draft a QB in the 1st round after taking 1 in the top 10 the previous year.

ATLDirtyBirds
09-06-2011, 09:34 PM
As far as some of the teams who took QBs...Don't see Jax or Tenn making the move for Luck even if they could. However, the 49ers certainly would/should (coming from a Kaepernick fan) and I think the Bengals would move on from Dalton.

holt_bruce81
09-06-2011, 10:14 PM
Seattle Seahawks or Washington Redskins

Saints-Tigers
09-06-2011, 10:36 PM
What's all this "don't take a QB if you already have one" stuff?

If you think you can upgrade at the spot, you do it. If you think one is good, and Luck will be even better, you take Luck.

niel89
09-06-2011, 10:51 PM
I would take him anyways. Luck is an outstanding prospect and it really couldn't hurt if they both worked out.

wordofi
09-06-2011, 11:17 PM
I would take him anyways. Luck is an outstanding prospect and it really couldn't hurt if they both worked out.

I'm going with the Colts. Something tells me the Colts are keeping Manning's condition a secret, and that they know more than they are letting on. They probably know that he will miss a significant amount of time (at least 8 games).

ellsy82
09-06-2011, 11:38 PM
I've gotta flat out say the Seahags or the Deadskins. Those options at QB are horrid and they don't have much on defense either. Can't imagine there being a worse football team out there than those two.

tjsunstein
09-06-2011, 11:39 PM
I'm going with the Colts. Something tells me the Colts are keeping Manning's condition a secret, and that they know more than they are letting on. They probably know that he will miss a significant amount of time (at least 8 games).
They'll still win more than Cincy, Buffalo, Denver, and Carolina. You have to be insanely bad to get the first overall pick. I think people are underrating how bad of a team you have to be.

M.O.T.H.
09-07-2011, 12:18 AM
I dont see Kaepernick as being safe either. If they can get Luck, that's a no brainer.

Also, even a guy like Josh Johnson may end up at the helm of the Niners, pushing Kaepernick aside. He's Harbaugh's guy and a FA to be. An open competition between Kaep and Johnson wouldnt be surprising at all.

And the Titans wont trade Locker in favor of Luck. That's just a little outlandish.

bucfan12
09-07-2011, 12:35 AM
Agreed with the 49ers and Bengals moving on from there current 2nd round QB picks. If they both have the chance at Luck, they'll definately take him. Dalton, I see more as a back up quality QB and definately was overdrafted due to the Bengals panicking for a QB. Kaepernick is raw, but I like his potential down the road.

I think the Bengals have the best shot at getting Luck.

Complex
09-07-2011, 01:06 AM
The titans aren't tanking the season or drafting Luck. I want Vontaze or Alshon or Xavier Rhodes(even though I think we are really solid there).

Bengalsrocket
09-07-2011, 02:03 AM
I agree that if Cincy has a chance to get Luck, they would be down right foolish to pass on him. And they're definitely in the running for first overall.

Also, I bet Luck gets over analyzed and not considered the same prospect that he is currently. I'm not saying he won't be the first overall pick, because he plays the position for it and I don't see any other college QB's becoming better than him by the end of this season. But even so, I don't think he'll turn out to be the "Can't miss-superman-best prospect ever" QB that everyone thinks he's going to be.

I know Shaw is a quarterback coach as well, but I have to think that Harbaugh was a big reason for Luck's success. Even just a break in the continuity of head coaches could set him back a bit. Guess we'll see what happens this season!

FUNBUNCHER
09-21-2011, 07:47 AM
I'm hearing bad things about Peyton Manning's neck injury on my home forum.
Guys who supposedly have medical contacts with the Colts organization - this is all rumor-licious so take it FWIW - is not progressing in is recovery and may never be healthy enough to play football again.

It's the type of injury that if it doesn't heal properly, the next bad hit Manning takes to his neck could paralyze him.

Let's see if he comes back this season, but don't be surprised if he doesn't.
Or retires.

Ngatachance92
09-21-2011, 08:09 AM
Your mom sucks for luck...

FUNBUNCHER
09-21-2011, 08:14 AM
.....for you to poop on.

Rob S
09-21-2011, 08:19 AM
It would be funny if he stayed in school again.

vidae
09-21-2011, 11:18 AM
If the first two games are any indication of how we'll play the season, no one is going to be close to the Chiefs as the worst team in the NFL.

Scoring one offensive touchdown and giving up 89 points in two games? Not to mention three important players, including our best offensive and defensive guys are on IR now.. this is like a bad nightmare. Plus, there are only two QBs under 70 passer rating.. Cassel and Luke McCown. I just don't see things getting better for this team. Ugh.

killxswitch
09-21-2011, 11:29 AM
If the first two games are any indication of how we'll play the season, no one is going to be close to the Chiefs as the worst team in the NFL.

Scoring one offensive touchdown and giving up 89 points in two games? Not to mention three important players, including our best offensive and defensive guys are on IR now.. this is like a bad nightmare. Plus, there are only two QBs under 70 passer rating.. Cassel and Luke McCown. I just don't see things getting better for this team. Ugh.

If Kerry Collins goes out with an injury, Curtis Painter will play significant NFL minutes, which means the Colts will become the default worst team in the NFL.

vidae
09-21-2011, 11:31 AM
If Kerry Collins goes out with an injury, Curtis Painter will play significant NFL minutes, which means the Colts will become the default worst team in the NFL.

Hey, you have some continuity with the coordinators and Painter has been in the system. He will shred our D in week 5.

FUNBUNCHER
09-21-2011, 12:41 PM
I like Luck to the Chiefs.
Don't know why Cassel's game has regressed so much, but KC still has a lot of talent on both sides of the football. I'm hearing rumors that HC Todd Haley's job could be on the line if the team totally craters this season.

Bill Cowher IMO would LOVE to coach a team like the Chiefs with a rookie Andrew Luck taking the snaps.

bucfan12
09-21-2011, 12:43 PM
Could the Colts vs. Cheifs be the game where we see loser gets the chance to draft Andrew Luck?

killxswitch
09-21-2011, 01:26 PM
Could the Colts vs. Cheifs be the game where we see loser gets the chance to draft Andrew Luck?

Nah the Seahawks are still in that conversation too.

falloutboy14
09-21-2011, 01:38 PM
I'm hearing bad things about Peyton Manning's neck injury on my home forum.
Guys who supposedly have medical contacts with the Colts organization - this is all rumor-licious so take it FWIW - is not progressing in is recovery and may never be healthy enough to play football again.

It's the type of injury that if it doesn't heal properly, the next bad hit Manning takes to his neck could paralyze him.

Didn't Cooper Manning (the older brother) have a football ending neck injury in college?

Regarding the Seahawks, I got a feeling that they'll get enough wins by playing in the NFC west.

killxswitch
09-21-2011, 01:44 PM
Regarding the Seahawks, I got a feeling that they'll get enough wins by playing in the NFC west.

Everyone says that but the Cards and 49ers at least are both going to sweep them. I don't have a feel for the Rams yet.

Babylon
09-21-2011, 02:23 PM
Everyone says that but the Cards and 49ers at least are both going to sweep them. I don't have a feel for the Rams yet.

Seattle hosts the Cards this weekend and if they lose that one i dont see a win for some time. They play Zona and the Niners again at the end of the season so at that point they may have already started printing Luck jerseys.

Breed
09-21-2011, 02:39 PM
Rams better not pass up on Andrew Luck.

bantx
09-21-2011, 02:42 PM
Rams better not pass up on Andrew Luck.

Really.....the more I see you post the more I can't take you seriously.

gpngc
09-21-2011, 02:58 PM
I have a bad feeling the Seahawks are going to come out fired up and kill Arizona in their home opener.

sbh15
09-21-2011, 03:00 PM
idk if it's been brought up, but what happens if manning is ready to come back and indy is something like 0-6? they have to be perfect the rest of the way just to be in the playoff conversation, so do they just shut manning down for the season or does he play and try to lead them in?

Breed
09-21-2011, 03:08 PM
Really.....the more I see you post the more I can't take you seriously.

You remember when every one hated on the Lions for drafting Calvin Johnson?

Just because you have a good player at a position doesn't mean you shouldn't draft another.

Pat Sims 90
09-21-2011, 03:13 PM
You remember when every one hated on the Lions for drafting Calvin Johnson?

Just because you have a good player at a position doesn't mean you shouldn't draft another.

Yea but you can only really have 1 QB on the field at a time. Luck won't be any more productive for the Rams then Bradford. If the Rams end up with the 1st overall pick they are better off trading it and getting Alshon Jeffery or Justin Blackmon.

jrdrylie
09-21-2011, 03:17 PM
Rams better not pass up on Andrew Luck.

The Rams are not nearly bad enough to end up with the first pick.

soybean
09-21-2011, 03:24 PM
You remember when every one hated on the Lions for drafting Calvin Johnson?

Just because you have a good player at a position doesn't mean you shouldn't draft another.

You are wrong. I remember that draft pretty accurately, lions fans despite having drafted all those other wrs liked the pick.

Breed
09-21-2011, 03:25 PM
Yea but you can only really have 1 QB on the field at a time. Luck won't be any more productive for the Rams then Bradford. If the Rams end up with the 1st overall pick they are better off trading it and getting Alshon Jeffery or Justin Blackmon.

Very good point.
The Rams are not nearly bad enough to end up with the first pick.
Their record say otherwise. Then again they did polay the NFC East, so who knows...
You are wrong. I remember that draft pretty accurately, lions fans despite having drafted all those other wrs liked the pick.
I wasn't referring to their fan base. I was talking about the media in genral talking about"WOW, REALLY ANOTHER wr IN THE FIRST?"

mqtirishfan
09-21-2011, 03:26 PM
You remember when every one hated on the Lions for drafting Calvin Johnson?

Just because you have a good player at a position doesn't mean you shouldn't draft another.

Who hated on that? If anything, it was the Raiders passing on him that was more hated on.

J-Mike88
09-21-2011, 03:30 PM
Andrew Luck is just unreal. I'm willing to say he's the best draft prospect since John Elway.
You're not the first person I've heard say that, but still I'm not buying that.

Manning was a "can't miss" franchise stud, complete with the bloodlines.
1998
http://cdn.gunaxin.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/Peyton-Manning-1998-Draft.jpg

Vick was pretty electrifying as well, a guy with ability never seen before.
I can't remember, but wasn't he traded for the picks that became LaDainian Tomlinson & Drew Brees?
2001
http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/08/15/gal_michael_vick_10.jpg

bantx
09-21-2011, 03:30 PM
You remember when every one hated on the Lions for drafting Calvin Johnson?

Just because you have a good player at a position doesn't mean you shouldn't draft another.

No I don't remember that, did you mean yourself?

Okay so who cares that they have a good young quarterback let's draft 2 franchise quarterbacks and pay them both big money because 2 is always better than 1. Wait why stop there? Let's play them both at the same time.

Raiderz4Life
09-21-2011, 03:32 PM
Who hated on that? If anything, it was the Raiders passing on him that was more hated on.

This!! I was so ******* pissed when we took that fat sack of **** JaMarcus. I wanted Calvin soooooooo bad. Had him in my sig in a Raiders uni and everything.

jrdrylie
09-21-2011, 03:35 PM
Vick was pretty electrifying as well, a guy with ability never seen before.
I can't remember, but wasn't he traded for the picks that became LaDainian Tomlinson & Drew Brees?
2001
http://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2009/08/15/gal_michael_vick_10.jpg

Yes and No. He was traded for the pick that became Tomlinson. But the Chargers used their own second round pick on Brees.

J-Mike88
09-21-2011, 03:35 PM
This!! I was so ******* pissed when we took that fat sack of **** JaMarcus. I wanted Calvin soooooooo bad. Had him in my sig in a Raiders uni and everything.
I believe you and I feel for you.
So often, teams go with size at QB at the top, instead of evaluating their passing ability.
Alex Smith instead of Rodgers in 2005.
Dan McGwire instead of Favre in 1991.
Kenny O'Brien & Todd Blackledge & Tony Eason before Marino in 1984.
Megatron (& Adrian Peterson) were clearly far superior football players, and most Raidah fans wanted one of those guys.

Russell simply wowed the scouts and scientists and lovers because of his huge size and huge arm, even though all his passes at LSU came with all day to throw and with WRs wide open.

Raiderz4Life
09-21-2011, 04:02 PM
I believe you and I feel for you.
So often, teams go with size at QB at the top, instead of evaluating their passing ability.
Alex Smith instead of Rodgers in 2005.
Dan McGwire instead of Favre in 1991.
Kenny O'Brien & Todd Blackledge & Tony Eason before Marino in 1984.
Megatron (& Adrian Peterson) were clearly far superior football players, and most Raidah fans wanted one of those guys.

Russell simply wowed the scouts and scientists and lovers because of his huge size and huge arm, even though all his passes at LSU came with all day to throw and with WRs wide open.

I had been hoping to go Megatron 1st overall and take Trent Edwards in the 2nd or 3rd. I was real high on Edwards during that time.

Vox Populi
09-21-2011, 04:10 PM
I believe you and I feel for you.
So often, teams go with size at QB at the top, instead of evaluating their passing ability.
Alex Smith instead of Rodgers in 2005.
Dan McGwire instead of Favre in 1991.
Kenny O'Brien & Todd Blackledge & Tony Eason before Marino in 1984.
Megatron (& Adrian Peterson) were clearly far superior football players, and most Raidah fans wanted one of those guys.

Russell simply wowed the scouts and scientists and lovers because of his huge size and huge arm, even though all his passes at LSU came with all day to throw and with WRs wide open.

What does size have to do with any of those examples? The only one that was actually like OMG SIZE was McGwire and he was the first QB picked all the way down at 16th overall and all the other guys are practically the same size, Marino was the same size and heavier than both of those guys and size was hardly the reason Rodgers slid.

MetSox17
09-21-2011, 04:15 PM
I had been hoping to go Megatron 1st overall and take Trent Edwards in the 2nd or 3rd. I was real high on Edwards during that time.

Trent Edwards might have turned out differently if he didn't go to that dog **** team in Buffalo.

tjsunstein
09-21-2011, 06:04 PM
Rams better not pass up on Andrew Luck.
Do you say things just for the shock value? Rams will never be in position to grab Luck, and if they were, they would be in heaven with the ransom they'd get in return for that pick and actually build a more complete team starting with a legit #1 WR.

You remember when every one hated on the Lions for drafting Calvin Johnson?

Just because you have a good player at a position doesn't mean you shouldn't draft another.
This is completely irrelevant to drafting another QB while you already have a franchise QB. Any other position you can make the case, even RB these days.

I feel like I'm trolling the troll.

SuperMcGee
09-21-2011, 07:08 PM
Trent Edwards might have turned out differently if he didn't go to that dog **** team in Buffalo.

Or he might have been a second day quarterback that never did much of anything in the league. Buffalo was probably the easiest place for him to gain a starting job and actually had a pretty good line for him to transition behind. I can see what you're saying because he had **** coaching and weapons for much of the time, but when I look at the stark contrast in our offense and success as a team between his and Fitzpatrick's play in the previous two seasons, I really don't know how he could ever lead an offense.

LonghornsLegend
09-21-2011, 07:24 PM
I'm hearing bad things about Peyton Manning's neck injury on my home forum.
Guys who supposedly have medical contacts with the Colts organization - this is all rumor-licious so take it FWIW - is not progressing in is recovery and may never be healthy enough to play football again.

It's the type of injury that if it doesn't heal properly, the next bad hit Manning takes to his neck could paralyze him.

Let's see if he comes back this season, but don't be surprised if he doesn't.
Or retires.


Can't say this sounds off base listening to some of the comments out of their camp. Sounds they are open about scouting a QB to take in the top 10 who may have to play alot sooner then they originally thought. Weird how this neck injury just came out of nowhere it seems. There are still alot of things that rookie QB is gonna need.


A future #1 WR and TE, not sure how the tackles are going to end up but the line would have been an issue for any QB not named Peyton Manning. This team has a bunch of system players on it, but they have gotten away with average drafts relying on Peyton so much. They are going to really need to hit a homerun next year no matter what.

Raiderz4Life
09-21-2011, 07:28 PM
^^^ In regards to it coming out of nowhere, Didn't he suffer a previous neck injury? Could it be its just aggravated?

Rosebud
09-21-2011, 08:33 PM
Trent Edwards might have turned out differently if he didn't go to that dog **** team in Buffalo.

Trent Edwards would've turned out differently if he didn't lose his balls while concussed and then fail to ever find them again.

fenikz
09-21-2011, 08:36 PM
one of the hardest hits ive ever seen and i still say it was clean

yjpANEVexhY

Caulibflower
09-21-2011, 08:39 PM
This thread title is really crude. I don't think anyone here thinks about Andrew that way.

falloutboy14
09-22-2011, 12:17 AM
^^^ In regards to it coming out of nowhere, Didn't he suffer a previous neck injury? Could it be its just aggravated?

Dungy said that he originally hurt it in '06, and he's had surgeries for it previously obviously. Just this time it's not healing as expected/it should.

ViperVisor
09-22-2011, 05:44 AM
Team #1 Pick Top 3 Pick 0-16 1-15
KC 24.4% 52.8% 0.3% 2.1%
SEA 14.4% 37.4% 0.1% 1.1%
CAR 12.9% 34.7% 0.1% 1.0%
STL 11.6% 32.5% 0.1% 0.7%
IND 10.7% 30.7% 0.1% 0.6%

Da-Phins
09-22-2011, 10:20 AM
He sure is gonna look sexy wearing a Dolphins uniform. He'll look *** wearing any other.

SolidGold
09-25-2011, 11:14 PM
So looks like the Chiefs/Colts played a little more competently today but are both winless. I still think the Seahawks are the worst of these teams and still my favorite in the suck for luck sweepstakes.

jayceheathman
09-25-2011, 11:23 PM
Can't say this sounds off base listening to some of the comments out of their camp. Sounds they are open about scouting a QB to take in the top 10 who may have to play alot sooner then they originally thought. Weird how this neck injury just came out of nowhere it seems. There are still alot of things that rookie QB is gonna need.


A future #1 WR and TE, not sure how the tackles are going to end up but the line would have been an issue for any QB not named Peyton Manning. This team has a bunch of system players on it, but they have gotten away with average drafts relying on Peyton so much. They are going to really need to hit a homerun next year no matter what.

But they have the boy with the golden locks waiting to take over! I didn't think his injury would be this bad either. I drafted him in just about all of my ESPN drafts thinking that at the most he would be out is 2 weeks.

killxswitch
09-26-2011, 12:52 AM
I said a few weeks ago that if Painter ever has to start that the Colts automatically become the worst team in the NFL. Now I wonder if Painter might not be a better option than Collins.

Couldn't believe Seattle got a win.

descendency
09-26-2011, 01:19 AM
Curtis Painter looked almost as good as Peyton Manning. I mean, his jersey wasn't wrinkled to start the game at all.

descendency
09-26-2011, 01:20 AM
Team #1 Pick Top 3 Pick 0-16 1-15
KC 24.4% 52.8% 0.3% 2.1%
SEA 14.4% 37.4% 0.1% 1.1%
CAR 12.9% 34.7% 0.1% 1.0%
STL 11.6% 32.5% 0.1% 0.7%
IND 10.7% 30.7% 0.1% 0.6%

Where is that coming from? Because there is no way St Louis is a top 3 pick or a worse team than Indy is.

edit: Miami could be swapped with St Louis.

descendency
09-26-2011, 01:30 AM
one of the hardest hits ive ever seen and i still say it was clean

I agree. I don't see what else you could do except run slower.

I'm hearing bad things about Peyton Manning's neck injury on my home forum.
Guys who supposedly have medical contacts with the Colts organization - this is all rumor-licious so take it FWIW - is not progressing in is recovery and may never be healthy enough to play football again.

It's the type of injury that if it doesn't heal properly, the next bad hit Manning takes to his neck could paralyze him.

Let's see if he comes back this season, but don't be surprised if he doesn't.
Or retires.

I am completely talking out of my ass and I don't have any medical knowledge to really back it up (outside of a few random people I've known with bad neck issues), but I really thought the Colts should have had their doctors evaluate the situation immediately and if they determined that there was a decent chance of him missing part of the season (more than 4 games), they should have immediately placed him on IR and told him he was going to sit out the year. Taking the decision out of Manning's hands was the best thing for everyone involved.

He needs to take the best and safest road to recover and not the fastest.

Another detail is that most contracts for rookies have ways to effectively cut them after one year and not owe them a dime. Basically, when Sam Bradford got his guaranteed 50 million, it was contingent on him being a Ram on the first day of the league year of his second year. I wonder if a similar thing might be in Peyton's contract. . . doubtful since they didn't even make him pass a physical.

falloutboy14
09-26-2011, 02:26 AM
Manning had something like this put into his contract to protect the Colts, knowing his health was up in the air. As I understand it, if the Colts release him sometime in March, they're completely off the hook financially.

Splat
09-26-2011, 08:29 AM
To the land of BBQ.

LonghornsLegend
09-26-2011, 08:53 AM
Indy isn't gonna win more then 1 game this year, even the Chiefs are alot better with Cassel and Bowe. That team is pathetic. Addai was already an average back who lived off of defenses keying on Peyton, you can't expect him to carry the team. The line can't block for the run or pass, and only Peyton makes them look good when they do.


They are probably, no actually they should have the worst QB starting in every 1 of their games remaining no matter who they face, thus a huge underdog to win everytime.



KC
Cincy
Jax x2
Carolina



This is the only place I see any wins coming out of this season. Most I can give them is 2 out of these 5 because there are some rookie QB's here who Freeney could wreck havoc on. Still, when your rolling with Curtis Painter, not sure I'd expect them to win many of these games either.

BeerBaron
09-26-2011, 09:02 AM
Freeney and Mathis nearly willed the Colts to a win last night. They'll cause a team or two to slip up in the future...still might not be enough to lose them Luck though.

Oh, and:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/26/irsay-peyton-manning-will-miss-the-season/

Manning is ruled out for the season. So he won't be coming back at the end of the year for a garbage victory or two.

jrdrylie
09-26-2011, 09:05 AM
Indy isn't gonna win more then 1 game this year, even the Chiefs are alot better with Cassel and Bowe. That team is pathetic. Addai was already an average back who lived off of defenses keying on Peyton, you can't expect him to carry the team. The line can't block for the run or pass, and only Peyton makes them look good when they do.


They are probably, no actually they should have the worst QB starting in every 1 of their games remaining no matter who they face, thus a huge underdog to win everytime.



KC
Cincy
Jax x2
Carolina



This is the only place I see any wins coming out of this season. Most I can give them is 2 out of these 5 because there are some rookie QB's here who Freeney could wreck havoc on. Still, when your rolling with Curtis Painter, not sure I'd expect them to win many of these games either.

I think the Colts win more than one game. Kansas City, Jacksonville, Carolina, and Tennessee are all possible wins.

prock
09-26-2011, 09:07 AM
SportsCenter SportsCenter
Breaking News: #Colts owner @JimIrsay says Peyton Manning not expected to play this season


Two minutes ago. Indy might have it locked up.

SolidGold
09-26-2011, 09:27 AM
That sucks about Peyton. I hope he can bounce back next year, I would like to see him have a 2-3 more good seasons. Just imagine though being able to go from Manning to Luck.

jrdrylie
09-26-2011, 09:51 AM
Irsay is now saying that Manning might not be out for the season. He is remaining on the Active Roster. There is an outside chance of a December return.

killxswitch
09-26-2011, 10:01 AM
Irsay is now saying that Manning might not be out for the season. He is remaining on the Active Roster. There is an outside chance of a December return.

Which would be the dumbest move possible. If you have Luck locked up in December, why bring back Manning? Let the man rest and recover!

jrdrylie
09-26-2011, 10:13 AM
Which would be the dumbest move possible. If you have Luck locked up in December, why bring back Manning? Let the man rest and recover!

Very dumb, unless they are somehow in the playoff race, they should not bring Manning back.

vidae
09-26-2011, 10:15 AM
Bill Polian doesn't strike me as having an overabundance of brains.

And I wouldn't count the Chiefs out yet! We're still pretty gd bad!

killxswitch
09-26-2011, 10:27 AM
Bill Polian doesn't strike me as having an overabundance of brains.

And I wouldn't count the Chiefs out yet! We're still pretty gd bad!

Good chance the "loser" of the Colts/Chiefs game will win the right to draft Luck. I think the Vikings and Dolphins will find a way to win a couple games.

BeerBaron
09-26-2011, 10:30 AM
Good chance the "loser" of the Colts/Chiefs game will win the right to draft Luck. I think the Vikings and Dolphins will find a way to win a couple games.

The Vikings are a little 4th quarter defense away from being 3-0. Seriously.

Plus, they just drafted Ponder. As long as they kept Frazier at HC, they'd stick with him. I know it seems odd, because we all love Luck, but no team spends a high first rounder on a QB just to take another one a year later.

vidae
09-26-2011, 10:30 AM
Good chance the "loser" of the Colts/Chiefs game will win the right to draft Luck. I think the Vikings and Dolphins will find a way to win a couple games.

Not looking forward to Freeney and Mathis against our OL. Going to be a long day for Cassel.. as if it wasn't going to be already.

FuzzyGopher
09-26-2011, 10:34 AM
Unless Peterson goes down or something the Vikings don't have a shot. We have played like a playoff team in the first half of games and a suck for luck contender in the second half, if they figure things out an become more consistent then they will probably win 6 games or so. We still have KC, Carolina, Denver on the schedule and they will win a division game or two.

killxswitch
09-26-2011, 10:37 AM
Not looking forward to Freeney and Mathis against our OL. Going to be a long day for Cassel.. as if it wasn't going to be already.

What's the story on Hali this year? After his year last year I thought he'd be making headlines. I see he has 18 tackles and 2 sacks, not bad. Is he not getting help? Wow I just looked at the Chiefs defensive depth chart. Andy Studebaker? Jon McGraw? Ugh.

Seems like your offense should be better though. Bowe and Breaston are good receivers, your OL SHOULD be good with all the names I recognize, Cassel has shown talent in the past. Thomas Jones is solid, McCluster is dangerous. Why aren't they better?

I think they'll put it together and beat the Colts. I mean c'mon. Curtis Painter.

Splat
09-26-2011, 10:42 AM
Hali is one of few players that has showed up. He was in the back field all day yesterday.

Actually the Chiefs D as whole was getting good pressure in the game they just couldn't cover anyone.

vidae
09-26-2011, 10:45 AM
What's the story on Hali this year? After his year last year I thought he'd be making headlines. I see he has 18 tackles and 2 sacks, not bad. Is he not getting help? Wow I just looked at the Chiefs defensive depth chart. Andy Studebaker? Jon McGraw? Ugh.

Seems like your offense should be better though. Bowe and Breaston are good receivers, your OL SHOULD be good with all the names I recognize, Cassel has shown talent in the past. Thomas Jones is solid, McCluster is dangerous. Why aren't they better?

I think they'll put it together and beat the Colts. I mean c'mon. Curtis Painter.

Justin Houston is starting opposite Tamba now, but yeah, losing Berry really hurts this defense all over. And Brandon Flowers went down with an ankle injury yesterday and no one knows how serious it is.

As for the offense, Thomas Jones is far from solid and McCluster isn't a threat like Charles is. The OL has played really well through 3 weeks, but Cassel hasn't. He has been pretty shoddy. The playcalling has been bad, but it's hard to open things up when Cassel can't make proper reads or throws.

Once Charles went down our offense went with him. Cassel had a few nice throws yesterday, but he also had a lot of really bad decisions too. I expect a Colts win and I don't think it'll be close.

Sloopy
09-26-2011, 01:55 PM
The Vikings are a little 4th quarter defense away from being 3-0. Seriously.

Plus, they just drafted Ponder. As long as they kept Frazier at HC, they'd stick with him. I know it seems odd, because we all love Luck, but no team spends a high first rounder on a QB just to take another one a year later.

It does beg an interesting question though, I for one, while liking Luck, do not think that whoever lands him is suddenly going to go from a suck for luck team to a playoff contender in one offseason like others seemingly believe.

However, do you turn down a -->probable<-- though not definite franchise QB despite picking a top signal caller the year before? The Panthers have recently either wasted a 2nd round pick two years ago or a first round pick this past draft (although its looking like the former at this moment) Seemingly proving that front offices are not opposed to such a similar situation, and the fact that teams would be in this situation proves how bad their front office may be.

So again I beg the question: If by some strange fate the Vikings end up with the first pick, Do they take Luck in spite of Ponder? Having two good options at QB wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, and you can always trade the worse of the two for a pro-bowler and a 2nd round pick :P

stephenson86
09-26-2011, 02:03 PM
Well it depends on how you see the QB you took. If you see Luck and think "Damn he is the player I need to get my team a championship, more so that who I drafted in the first last year." then you take him.

Babylon
09-26-2011, 02:04 PM
Don't sleep on Seattle, they get a win against a lousy Arizona team and i dont really see anymore than 1 more for the rest of the season.

It would be just like Pete Carroll to bust his ass to get a couple of meaningless wins down the line and just miss out on Luck. Pete can tell us how important getting those 3 or 4 wins was.

Splat
09-26-2011, 02:05 PM
Luck? Cassel? Luck? Cassel?

Hmmm...

tjsunstein
09-26-2011, 02:49 PM
Cassel isn't going to take the Chiefs to the Super Bowl, that's a known.

Timbathia
09-26-2011, 03:45 PM
Dont sleep on the Broncos just yet. While they have one win already, the only realistic winnable games left are the vikings and Dolphins (both on the road), and then the Chiefs (twice).

jrdrylie
09-26-2011, 03:55 PM
Dont sleep on the Broncos just yet. While they have one win already, the only realistic winnable games left are the vikings and Dolphins (both on the road), and then the Chiefs (twice).

I have to think eventually (maybe when they are 1-5 coming out of the bye) they are going to go with Tebow. I think he can get them a few more wins than Kyle Orton will.

CC.SD
09-26-2011, 04:06 PM
Don't sleep on Seattle, they get a win against a lousy Arizona team and i dont really see anymore than 1 more for the rest of the season.

It would be just like Pete Carroll to bust his ass to get a couple of meaningless wins down the line and just miss out on Luck. Pete can tell us how important getting those 3 or 4 wins was.

Carroll would draft Barkley anyway, you know this to be true.

keylime_5
09-26-2011, 04:10 PM
just like he drafted Mays and all those other USC guys that he didn't draft?

CC.SD
09-26-2011, 04:15 PM
just like he drafted Mays and all those other USC guys that he didn't draft?

More like how he brought in freaking Mike Williams, Anthony McCoy, Malcolm Smith, restructured Lofa so he could come back... :)

Besides his love for Barkley goes deeper than anything else.

Raiderz4Life
09-26-2011, 04:43 PM
Also Barkley is pretty much a lock for top-5 barring a disaster and he's >>> any other USC player.

Rosebud
09-26-2011, 05:22 PM
It does beg an interesting question though, I for one, while liking Luck, do not think that whoever lands him is suddenly going to go from a suck for luck team to a playoff contender in one offseason like others seemingly believe.

However, do you turn down a -->probable<-- though not definite franchise QB despite picking a top signal caller the year before? The Panthers have recently either wasted a 2nd round pick two years ago or a first round pick this past draft (although its looking like the former at this moment) Seemingly proving that front offices are not opposed to such a similar situation, and the fact that teams would be in this situation proves how bad their front office may be.

So again I beg the question: If by some strange fate the Vikings end up with the first pick, Do they take Luck in spite of Ponder? Having two good options at QB wouldn't be the worst thing in the world, and you can always trade the worse of the two for a pro-bowler and a 2nd round pick :P

Clausen's a much smaller investment than Ponder.

Babylon
09-26-2011, 06:00 PM
More like how he brought in freaking Mike Williams, Anthony McCoy, Malcolm Smith, restructured Lofa so he could come back... :)

Besides his love for Barkley goes deeper than anything else.

I wouldnt mind Barkely if Luck is gone and for some reason i see a bright future for Landry Jones, who reminds me a little of a young Tom Brady. (without the babes of course)

MidwayMonster31
09-26-2011, 06:30 PM
The Vikings had leads of 2+ possessions, so they'll have to hang on and win soon enough. They could probably win 5 or 6. The Colts actually played like they had a pair yesterday so they could win later in the season. The Chiefs can run into some divisional wins.

TonyGfortheTD
09-26-2011, 07:01 PM
The Chiefs can run into some divisional wins.

lol I'd like to know where those "wins" would come from. It's not going to be Denver, as they barely beat them once last year.

vidae
09-26-2011, 07:50 PM
lol I'd like to know where those "wins" would come from. It's not going to be Denver, as they barely beat them once last year.

Yeah, we lost to the Chargers once already and the Raiders look like they might be for real (UGH :() so I don't see where divisional win(s) will come from. Maybe Denver at Arrowhead, but even then I'm not too optimistic.

dannyz
09-26-2011, 08:02 PM
What about Miami? They will have a New Coach and will be picking Top 5-ish maybe one. Luck already having a Future LT,WR,RB's would be pretty good for a Rookie QB.

Hurricanes25
09-26-2011, 08:05 PM
What about Miami? They will have a New Coach and will be picking Top 5-ish maybe one. Luck already having a Future LT,WR,RB's would be pretty good for a Rookie QB.

Miami is a realistic possibility for Luck but I think there is enough talent on that team preventing from getting the #1 pick.

XxXdragonXxX
09-26-2011, 08:13 PM
Unfortunately the Seahawks will be probably a 5 win team.

Raiderz4Life
09-26-2011, 08:24 PM
you'll certainly beat denver at least once. and both of those games will be some of the most painful football anyone will watch all season.

You watch Pitt vs Indie last night? Can't get much worse than that.

descendency
09-26-2011, 08:27 PM
you'll certainly beat denver at least once. and both of those games will be some of the most painful football anyone will watch all season.

Is that before or after the Colts play the Chiefs?

vidae
09-26-2011, 08:50 PM
I'll bring the popcorn njx.. it'll be like mst3k, football edition!

killxswitch
09-26-2011, 11:00 PM
What is up with Jared Gaither?

LonghornsLegend
09-26-2011, 11:09 PM
What is up with Jared Gaither?

I'm curious also. I know he has serious back issues, but his contract was fairly cheap from what I remember.

descendency
09-26-2011, 11:50 PM
Unfortunately the Seahawks will be probably a 5 win team.

The Bills will make the playoffs the year of the draft with the biggest QB talents of maybe this decade (I mean 2002-12).

vidae
09-27-2011, 12:02 AM
What is up with Jared Gaither?

I'm curious also. I know he has serious back issues, but his contract was fairly cheap from what I remember.

As far as I know he's getting back into football shape. Was in the game a few times on Sunday and graded out well when it came to pass blocking, but was just ok when it came to run blocking.

I have a feeling, as long as he stays healthy, that he'll be starting at LT for us next year with Albert either moving to RT to take over for Richardson (who is a hot plate of dog poop) or moving to LG.

nepg
09-27-2011, 12:59 AM
Gaither got a couple flags for False Starts. Might take a little longer to get him worked into the offense. He's going to be used quite a bit now that the Chiefs only have 1 healthy TE on the roster. They used Gaither a decent bit in normal 2 TE sets after Becht went down.

I like that they're easing into him. I think that strategy will work out well in the long-run. Plus, at this point he can't beat out Richardson anyway. We'll probably see a lot of changes during the BYE week after the Colts game.

I'm excited for the Vikings game. The Chiefs showed up Sunday and made a lot of adjustments for the better. They have some obvious areas that I think will be vastly improved very quickly, but they looked like the team from last year with a better pass rush. At home and hungry against a team that's definitely beatable... The Vikings are a team that can't really take advantage of the Chiefs' temporary injuries (Flowers), and I've got the Chiefs winning the next two games and having a lot of momentum and things to work on going into the BYE week.

Can't see the Chiefs being in the running for Luck at this point. They've got their **** together now and should only get better as they get Baldwin back and Cassel starts finding Breaston more.

Halsey
09-27-2011, 01:08 AM
Should the NFL really be advertising a college player while he's still playing in college?

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2012

nepg
09-27-2011, 01:13 AM
Nope. Absolutely not. Especially not an underclassman.

nepg
09-27-2011, 01:18 AM
... i'm assuming you think there's some reason why they shouldn't.
It's a massive ethics issue, and it should be a legal issue, but the NCAA would never step up to that plate. They're encouraging a player to forfeit eligibility and leave school early to become a part of the NFL... I really wouldn't have much of a problem with it if it wasn't for the eligibility. It still wouldn't sit right with me, but it wouldn't be so sour.

Rosebud
09-27-2011, 03:27 AM
You watch Pitt vs Indie last night? Can't get much worse than that.

Challenge...accepted!...

The Bills will make the playoffs the year of the draft with the biggest QB talents of maybe this decade (I mean 2002-12).

Well that's because it's better to be fitzy than lucky...

It's a massive ethics issue, and it should be a legal issue, but the NCAA would never step up to that plate. They're encouraging a player to forfeit eligibility and leave school early to become a part of the NFL... I really wouldn't have much of a problem with it if it wasn't for the eligibility. It still wouldn't sit right with me, but it wouldn't be so sour.

And the NFL cares why?

killxswitch
09-27-2011, 08:16 AM
I can't think of an issue I care less about then whether or not NFL.com has an Andrew Luck promotion. Seriously, who cares?

tjsunstein
09-27-2011, 08:29 AM
It's not the first or last time it's going to happen.
Let me know if Luck doesn't declare then I might shrug at this or something.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
09-27-2011, 09:27 AM
I'll bring the popcorn njx.. it'll be like mst3k, football edition!

I'll bring the booze. Only one rule to this game:

Drink every time you die a little inside.

scottyboy
09-27-2011, 10:03 AM
there's a strong chance none of us will survive the afternoon at that rate.

the afternoon? i give us all til halftime before the alcohol poisoning sets in

vidae
09-27-2011, 10:07 AM
At least I wouldn't have to watch the Chiefs play any more football games! Lets do it!

killxswitch
09-27-2011, 11:20 AM
At least I wouldn't have to watch the Chiefs play any more football games! Lets do it!

If this is to be done over skype forget it. njx's mic is all the way downstairs.

Halsey
09-27-2011, 11:27 AM
I don't have a problem with the NFL using its minor league prospects to advertise the Draft. I just wonder if they get paid for it while still in school.

tjsunstein
09-27-2011, 11:32 AM
I don't have a problem with the NFL using its minor league prospects to advertise the Draft. I just wonder if they get paid for it while still in school.
I look at college football being a paid internship for the NFL. Free education (most of the time), and national exposure can pretty much compensate for their picture being used for a website, right?

Sloopy
09-27-2011, 11:35 AM
This is less of an ethical issue than the schools themselves profiting off of their students images (i.e. showing them playing in commercials, selling their jersey's etc.)

diabsoule
09-27-2011, 11:43 AM
According to the Indianapolis Star the Colts are working out Dan Orlovsky and Brodie Croyle. Too bad the Chiefs and Colts don't play each other this year.

tjsunstein
09-27-2011, 11:43 AM
This is less of an ethical issue than the schools themselves profiting off of their students images (i.e. showing them playing in commercials, selling their jersey's etc.)
I would argue that the players profit as much off the schools as individual student-athletes as much as the schools do the players as a whole.

tjsunstein
09-27-2011, 11:44 AM
According to the Indianapolis Star the Colts are working out Dan Orlovsky and Brodie Croyle. Too bad the Chiefs and Colts don't play each other this year.
No, but they do...
Week 5.
But something tells me you knew that.

BeerBaron
09-27-2011, 12:08 PM
"Orlovsky’s career record as a starter is 0-7, and Croyle’s career record as a starter is 0-10."

Pick of the litter right there....

T-RICH49
09-27-2011, 12:09 PM
Gaither got a couple flags for False Starts. Might take a little longer to get him worked into the offense. He's going to be used quite a bit now that the Chiefs only have 1 healthy TE on the roster. They used Gaither a decent bit in normal 2 TE sets after Becht went down.

I like that they're easing into him. I think that strategy will work out well in the long-run. Plus, at this point he can't beat out Richardson anyway. We'll probably see a lot of changes during the BYE week after the Colts game.

I'm excited for the Vikings game. The Chiefs showed up Sunday and made a lot of adjustments for the better. They have some obvious areas that I think will be vastly improved very quickly, but they looked like the team from last year with a better pass rush. At home and hungry against a team that's definitely beatable... The Vikings are a team that can't really take advantage of the Chiefs' temporary injuries (Flowers), and I've got the Chiefs winning the next two games and having a lot of momentum and things to work on going into the BYE week.

Can't see the Chiefs being in the running for Luck at this point. They've got their **** together now and should only get better as they get Baldwin back and Cassel starts finding Breaston more.

you mean they can't hand off to AP and have him run all over us?

killxswitch
09-27-2011, 12:20 PM
"Orlovsky’s career record as a starter is 0-7, and Croyle’s career record as a starter is 0-10."

Pick of the litter right there....

This year they'll fit right in with the Colts.

diabsoule
09-27-2011, 12:22 PM
This year they'll fit right in with the Colts.

Curtis Painter, Dan Orlovsky, Brodie Croyle. Need one more for the Mt. Rushmore of suck.

killxswitch
09-27-2011, 12:30 PM
Curtis Painter, Dan Orlovsky, Brodie Croyle. Need one more for the Mt. Rushmore of suck.

Collins hasn't been cut yet.

Raiderz4Life
09-27-2011, 01:00 PM
you mean they can't hand off to AP and have him run all over us?

Haven't you seen their last few games? No they can't lol

diabsoule
09-27-2011, 01:18 PM
5 teams remain that are 0-3:

Miami
Kansas City
St Louis
Indianapolis
Minnesota

Here's an interesting schedule:

Week 4: Minnesota @ Kansas City
Week 5: Indianapolis @ Kansas City
Week 9: Miami @ Kansas City

St. Louis doesn't play any of the winless teams.

PoopSandwich
09-27-2011, 01:20 PM
Colts should trade for Derek Anderson and Brady Quinn and let them duke it out.

nepg
09-27-2011, 01:24 PM
Colts should trade for Derek Anderson and Brady Quinn and let them duke it out.
For the Colts fans: :[

BeerBaron
09-27-2011, 01:24 PM
Colts should trade for Derek Anderson and Brady Quinn and let them duke it out.

Or better yet, screw that and trade for Jimmy Clausen. If you ever want to see a guy play QB who has no business on a football field, it's Clausen.

nepg
09-27-2011, 01:25 PM
Brian Hoyer for a first round pick...

EDIT: well, if they want to win games.

diabsoule
09-27-2011, 01:37 PM
Or better yet, screw that and trade for Jimmy Clausen. If you ever want to see a guy play QB who has no business on a football field, it's Clausen.

Trade for Troy Smith!

Raiderz4Life
09-27-2011, 01:50 PM
They can have Pryor

niel89
09-27-2011, 01:54 PM
Trade for Troy Smith!

Do you think that Omaha would even give him up? lol

tjsunstein
09-27-2011, 01:57 PM
I'm a little bit surprised that none of these teams have contacted the Packers about Matt Flynn to be honest.

BeerBaron
09-27-2011, 01:59 PM
Trade for Troy Smith!

Clausen makes Troy Smith look like Warren Moon.

diabsoule
09-27-2011, 02:10 PM
I'm a little bit surprised that none of these teams have contacted the Packers about Matt Flynn to be honest.

I'm pretty surprised about that as well.

diabsoule
09-27-2011, 02:12 PM
Clausen makes Troy Smith look like Warren Moon.

Colt Brennan is available

J-Mike88
09-27-2011, 03:30 PM
Colt Brennan is available
Where is Timmy Chang?

Whoever is coaching these guys in the 2nd half seems to want Luck very badly.
http://i759.photobucket.com/albums/xx231/littleelmsports12/sigs%20and%20avatars/VikingsHalves.png

descendency
09-27-2011, 03:46 PM
Curtis Painter, Dan Orlovsky, Brodie Croyle. Need one more for the Mt. Rushmore of suck.

Just call it the Mt. Russell.

scottyboy
09-27-2011, 04:09 PM
Just call it the Mt. Russell.

I thought we already called him that?

get it, because he's fat!

bucfan12
09-27-2011, 04:48 PM
Question to Cheifs fans:

Is it true that when Matt Cassell signed that mega contract, the Cheifs can opt him oout of the deal and cut him without losing much against the cap after this season? I thought I heard that somewhere. The only reason is the way they look, they could be in prime position to take Luck or Barkley.

descendency
09-27-2011, 05:05 PM
I thought we already called him that?

get it, because he's fat!

If we could get him to tattoo Orlovsky's, Painter's, Croyle's, and Clausen's faces to his stomach... it would be the best thing ever.

vidae
09-27-2011, 05:11 PM
Question to Cheifs fans:

Is it true that when Matt Cassell signed that mega contract, the Cheifs can opt him oout of the deal and cut him without losing much against the cap after this season? I thought I heard that somewhere. The only reason is the way they look, they could be in prime position to take Luck or Barkley.

I believe he is already done getting his guaranteed money, but someone can correct me on that.

BeerBaron
09-27-2011, 05:18 PM
Just call it the Mt. Russell.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/BeerBaron/MtRussellmore.jpg

Raiderz4Life
09-27-2011, 05:26 PM
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v613/BeerBaron/MtRussellmore.jpg

You forgot the actual mountain

BeerBaron
09-27-2011, 05:27 PM
You forgot the actual mountain

When the Colts sign/work him out, he'll be added.

How strange would that be?

cmarq83
09-27-2011, 05:55 PM
I thought we already called him that?

get it, because he's fat!

How about the Colts sign Russell and the Chiefs get Lorenzen. First one to have a heart attack wins Luck.

Splat
09-27-2011, 06:05 PM
I believe he is already done getting his guaranteed money, but someone can correct me on that.

I was under the impression that if the Chiefs wanted to unload Cassel it would be best to do so after the 3rd year of the deal.

That said I'm pretty sure I heard that from the local radio so take it for what it's worth.

TonyGfortheTD
09-28-2011, 03:06 AM
I believe he is already done getting his guaranteed money, but someone can correct me on that.

There may be some guaranteed $$$ left on his deal, but if there is....not much. His contract was definitely front-loaded like crazy.

BeerBaron
09-28-2011, 03:29 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/28/colts-place-brackett-bullitt-on-injured-reserve/

Angerer is the best Colts linebacker in the Peyton Manning era, so they shouldn't have put Brackett back in even if healthy.

But still...can Peyton really be far behind? The Colts are in the drivers seat for Luck and a move like this is them working some ass grooves into that seat for comfort...they'll be in it for a while.

T-RICH49
09-28-2011, 03:59 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/28/colts-place-brackett-bullitt-on-injured-reserve/

Angerer is the best Colts linebacker in the Peyton Manning era, so they shouldn't have put Brackett back in even if healthy.

But still...can Peyton really be far behind? The Colts are in the drivers seat for Luck and a move like this is them working some ass grooves into that seat for comfort...they'll be in it for a while.

oh no they're not

BeerBaron
09-28-2011, 04:15 PM
oh no they're not

Yeah, yeah they are. We'll see for sure in what, 2 weeks?

Raiderz4Life
09-28-2011, 04:18 PM
Man its gonna be so much ******** if the Colts end up with Luck.

T-RICH49
09-28-2011, 04:28 PM
Yeah, yeah they are. We'll see for sure in what, 2 weeks?

we are minus Charles, Berry, Moeaki for the year and Flowers for who knows how long

bored of education
09-28-2011, 10:51 PM
Someone sig this, if the Chiefs have less than five wins and do not end up with either Barkley, Kalil or Luck then I will become a fan of SWDC's choosen via a poll sometime after the draft in 2012.

TheBoyWonder22
09-28-2011, 11:17 PM
Someone sig this, if the Chiefs have less than five wins and do not end up with either Barkley, Kalil or Luck then I will become a fan of SWDC's choosen via a poll sometime after the draft in 2012.May as well start now. Ravens yo!

killxswitch
09-28-2011, 11:35 PM
The Colts are now missing their starting SS, MLB, QB, and RG to injury. SS and MLB are on IR, QB probably should be. Also, Bill Polian is our head coach now. I don't see how we win any games this year. We will get Luck. Hopefully then Bill gets hit by a bus so someone else can step in and actually run the team with a plan and desire to win.

descendency
09-28-2011, 11:38 PM
The Colts still have to face the Chiefs.

Raiderz4Life
09-28-2011, 11:40 PM
The Colts are now missing their starting SS, MLB, QB, and RG to injury. SS and MLB are on IR, QB probably should be. Also, Bill Polian is our head coach now. I don't see how we win any games this year. We will get Luck. Hopefully then Bill gets hit by a bus so someone else can step in and actually run the team with a plan and desire to win.

To be fair...Brackett's loss isn't that impactful...Angerer > Brackett.

killxswitch
09-29-2011, 12:03 AM
To be fair...Brackett's loss isn't that impactful...Angerer > Brackett.

He was still captain of the defense. I agree Angerer is the better player. We will see if he is the better leader.

vidae
09-29-2011, 01:27 AM
We lost our starting RB, SS, TE and one of our corners, plus our QB sucks. I think we're even.

TACKLE
09-29-2011, 01:33 AM
We lost our starting RB, SS, TE and one of our corners, plus our QB sucks. I think we're even.

You forgot your starting ILB.
sorry :(

MidwayMonster31
09-29-2011, 01:40 AM
Someone sig this, if the Chiefs have less than five wins and do not end up with either Barkley, Kalil or Luck then I will become a fan of SWDC's choosen via a poll sometime after the draft in 2012.Done.
What happens if they all get hurt?

vidae
09-29-2011, 02:57 AM
You forgot your starting ILB.
sorry :(

Ehh, he wasn't starting yet but I think he probably could have beaten out Belcher so I'll give you that one too.

brb, hibernating until April. :(

prock
09-29-2011, 05:08 AM
Teh Chiefs have injuriezzz

killxswitch
09-29-2011, 08:23 AM
We lost our starting RB, SS, TE and one of our corners, plus our QB sucks. I think we're even.

Your QB at least has a history of some success. He still has Bowe, and if he comes back he will have the rookie receiver. He could still pull out of it. Without Manning the Colts obviously have no chance to win anything.

BeerBaron
09-29-2011, 08:55 AM
Your QB at least has a history of some success. He still has Bowe, and if he comes back he will have the rookie receiver. He could still pull out of it. Without Manning the Colts obviously have no chance to win anything.

The one thing the Colts have are Freeney and Mathis. But even against the Steelers, who were down to 4 healthy offensive lineman (Roethlisberger said after the game they were preparing a defensive lineman to go in before Gilbert went back in) they couldn't win it themselves. They gave it their all though and made a show out of it...

Let's put it this way, the loser of the Colts/Chiefs game is in that driver's seat.

killxswitch
09-29-2011, 09:29 AM
The one thing the Colts have are Freeney and Mathis. But even against the Steelers, who were down to 4 healthy offensive lineman (Roethlisberger said after the game they were preparing a defensive lineman to go in before Gilbert went back in) they couldn't win it themselves. They gave it their all though and made a show out of it...

Let's put it this way, the loser of the Colts/Chiefs game is in that driver's seat.

I'm concerned that the Steelers decimated OL made the Colts front 7 look a lot better than they are. I know the KC OL is not all-world but I expect they're better than the 3rd stringers and Pouncey that were playing for the Steelers.

Sloopy
09-29-2011, 09:52 AM
We lost our starting RB, SS, TE and one of our corners, plus our QB sucks. I think we're even.

Least you had a RB and SS to start with :P

NotRickJames
09-30-2011, 02:05 AM
The Hawks actually managed to win last Sunday, but I'm still picking them with Indy as a close second.

Praying, literally down on my knees, Luck doesn't go to Indy.

descendency
10-02-2011, 03:02 PM
Ut Oh. Chiefs won... ouch.

Vikings, Dolphins, Colts, and Rams have 0 wins now.

Obviously, the Rams are probably not in the Suck for Luck sweepstakes.

vidae
10-02-2011, 03:08 PM
Damnit. 1-3. Boo.

Basileus777
10-02-2011, 03:16 PM
Chiefs fans should forget about Luck. This team isn't quite bad enough to get the #1 pick. They'll probably end up winning 4 or 5 games.

killxswitch
10-02-2011, 03:18 PM
Chiefs fans should forget about Luck. This team isn't quite bad enough to get the #1 pick. They'll probably end up winning 4 or 5 games.

Agreed. Bad start but there's enough talent on the team to win some games.

vidae
10-02-2011, 03:29 PM
Maybe we can still get Barkley or RG3!

falloutboy14
10-02-2011, 05:34 PM
Think the Rams might be in this more then we earlier thought.

Rosebud
10-02-2011, 05:37 PM
Think the Rams might be in this more then we earlier thought.

There schedule is really tough for a young team early this year, but it ends super easy. They can still get 6 wins and the NFC west title out of this season...

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 05:48 PM
Think the Rams might be in this more then we earlier thought.

Do you not realize they spent an overall number 1 draft pick on Sam Bradford in 2010?

stephenson86
10-02-2011, 05:55 PM
Do you not realize they spent an overall number 1 draft pick on Sam Bradford in 2010?

Do you realise that LUCKZZZZ MEANZZZZZZ CHAMPIONSHIPZZZZZZZ?

Heisman
10-02-2011, 05:55 PM
Watch, the Vikings will win the #1 overall pick and take Ryan Kalil because we blatantly reached for Ponder last year and want to give him a chance. We will then be the Miami Dolphins for the next 3 years.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 05:57 PM
Do you realise that LUCKZZZZ MEANZZZZZZ CHAMPIONSHIPZZZZZZZ?

Yup_____________

stephenson86
10-02-2011, 05:58 PM
Watch, the Vikings will win the #1 overall pick and take Ryan Kalil because we blatantly reached for Ponder last year and want to give him a chance. We will then be the Miami Dolphins for the next 3 years.

Sack that, draft Luck and trade his rights.

falloutboy14
10-02-2011, 05:59 PM
Do you not realize they spent an overall number 1 draft pick on Sam Bradford in 2010?

Meant moreso for obtaining the 1st overall pick due to their record. Not drafting Luck.

Rosebud
10-02-2011, 06:00 PM
Do you realise that LUCKZZZZ MEANZZZZZZ CHAMPIONSHIPZZZZZZZ?

PICKZZZZZ > CHAMPIONSHIPZZZZZ

Trade Luck for a decade of first round picks.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 06:02 PM
PICKZZZZZ > CHAMPIONSHIPZZZZZ

Trade Luck for a decade of first round picks.

I could see the Redskins doing something like that.

Rosebud
10-02-2011, 06:12 PM
I could see the Redskins doing something like that.

Especially if the reason they fade this season is because the Rex Cannon turns back into bad Rexy...

shylo3716
10-02-2011, 06:15 PM
NBC's Football Night in America crew just made it public that teams are about to start tanking for Luck.

Basileus777
10-02-2011, 06:23 PM
NBC's Football Night in America crew just made it public that teams are about to start tanking for Luck.

Like Pete Carroll going for a 61 yard FG?

shylo3716
10-02-2011, 06:26 PM
Like Pete Carroll going for a 61 yard FG?

Carroll does not have Sebastian Janikowski LOL

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 06:31 PM
Do you not realize they spent an overall number 1 draft pick on Sam Bradford in 2010?

The same Sam Bradford who, since week 13 of last season, is 2-7, (0-4 this season,) and has thrown 7 interceptions to only 4 TDs?

I'd call it a sophomore slump but it started last year...

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 06:36 PM
because the record of a rookie qb on a bad team is like, TOTALLY indicative of his play. i can't imagine he was forcing throws trying to win games, either. deceptive and misleading stats were used deceptively and inaccurately.

Alright, so far this season he's 0-4 in the most important statistical category of all.

I don't think they'll be in a position to draft Luck regardless, but Bradford was somewhat overrated coming into this year and things have gone quickly downhill.

Babylon
10-02-2011, 06:37 PM
Like Pete Carroll going for a 61 yard FG?

I think you're giving Carroll way too much credit to be able to think like that, which coaches never do.

Saints-Tigers
10-02-2011, 06:37 PM
because the record of a rookie qb on a bad team is like, TOTALLY indicative of his play. i can't imagine he was forcing throws trying to win games, either. deceptive and misleading stats were used deceptively and inaccurately.


LMao, trust me, Sam Bradford has never forced anything other than forcing teams to cover the flats and 5-10 yard routes.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 06:39 PM
The same Sam Bradford who, since week 13 of last season, is 2-7, (0-4 this season,) and has thrown 7 interceptions to only 4 TDs?

I'd call it a sophomore slump but it started last year...

Yup that's the one.

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 06:42 PM
oh stop it. it's as ridiculous as saying that cam newton is a hall of famer as of today.

if only he were vince young... i mean, he just won games. best qb of all time.

Saying that a QB who is struggling IS struggling isn't ridiculous at all.

Yes or no, is Sam Bradford struggling right now?

Complex
10-02-2011, 06:43 PM
The same Sam Bradford who, since week 13 of last season, is 2-7, (0-4 this season,) and has thrown 7 interceptions to only 4 TDs?

I'd call it a sophomore slump but it started last year...

Yeah cause it was Bradfords fault that his WRs dropped 7 balls( I think) and at least one TD maybe 2 Tds.

Rams Offensive line sucks, Rodger Saffold has regressed and Jason Smith still sucks.

Babylon
10-02-2011, 06:44 PM
On a sidenote i'm not sure that Andrew Luck would be winning any games with that Rams team so far this year.

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 06:53 PM
your argument centered around his win-loss record, which is my argument. i haven't watched more than a few series of the rams this year, so i couldn't actually begin to tell you. i'm assuming then, that you've watched most of their games?

I watched the entire Giants game and portions of others. I usually have one game on my TV and switch between feeds online of others.

Without a doubt some of his struggles are the o-line and lack of WRs, but good QBs always improve the guys around them. Either it's the worst supporting cast in the league, or he's struggling too.

And since I know how much you love stats, his YPA today was a whopping 3.81. Yikes...

Saints-Tigers
10-02-2011, 06:56 PM
I wasn't aware that you don't draft a QB unless you will automatically win the Superbowl.

Bradford looks like crap, if they think he's on his way to being an elite QB, fine, but if they don't, and they think Luck is, then take him.

It's just ridiculous, if they don't think Luck will be that much better, that's one thing, but if you are passing on a great prospect and you're unsure about your QB, you need to get your brain checked.

Is the argument that they should trade the pick? Why not trade Bradford if they think Luck is better? Because of guaranteed money?

Luck might not make them any better right now, but if Luck becomes an elite QB, and Bradford doesn't, that's a big difference in wins every year. It doesn't guarantee you a superbowl,but having an elite QB gives you a chance every year.

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 06:58 PM
The Rams will pick up a few wins eventually and it will be a moot point. They do play in the worst division in professional sports afterall.

But still, my entire point is that Bradford is struggling right now. And he is.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 07:10 PM
How much of Bradford's struggles can be attributed to the terrible pass protection ? Both the tackles are garbage.

ATLDirtyBirds
10-02-2011, 07:11 PM
Bradford's definitely struggling, but unless things get Jimmy Claussen ugly, you can't really justify taking Luck. And this is coming from someone who wasn't a big fan of Bradford during the draft. (Although I did think he'd put up some real nice numbers with McDaniels)

asdf1223
10-02-2011, 07:18 PM
Bradford's receivers and O-line arent doing him any favors but he does hold on to the ball way too long for me. Their crummy second half schedule means that they'll win atleast 6 games in my opinion especially with 6 divisional games, the Bengals at home and a game against Cleveland.

nrk
10-02-2011, 08:09 PM
I watched the entire Giants game and portions of others. I usually have one game on my TV and switch between feeds online of others.

Without a doubt some of his struggles are the o-line and lack of WRs, but good QBs always improve the guys around them. Either it's the worst supporting cast in the league, or he's struggling too.

And since I know how much you love stats, his YPA today was a whopping 3.81. Yikes...

That is a really bad YPA, so was Steven Jackson's 2.6 average YPC. There is no doubt that Bradford is struggling, but that whole Rams team is. Their defense improved by allowing under 20 points scored, but you're not going to play against Rex Grossman every game.

Also, at least Bradford wasn't the worst QB in that game. That's not saying much though.

I also wasn't aware if your QB doesn't perform on a pro-bowl level his first year or two that you immediately draft another QB. Such an easy position to play, too.

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 09:08 PM
That is a really bad YPA, so was Steven Jackson's 2.6 average YPC. There is no doubt that Bradford is struggling, but that whole Rams team is. Their defense improved by allowing under 20 points scored, but you're not going to play against Rex Grossman every game.

Also, at least Bradford wasn't the worst QB in that game. That's not saying much though.

I also wasn't aware if your QB doesn't perform on a pro-bowl level his first year or two that you immediately draft another QB. Such an easy position to play, too.

I've said multiple times that the Rams will win enough games to make it a moot point.

But everyone is giving Bradford some kind of pass...the guy hasn't been good since 2/3 of the way through last season. The entire offense is struggling, including him.

mqtirishfan
10-02-2011, 09:26 PM
Alright, so far this season he's 0-4 in the most important statistical category of all.


Really? A team's record is based entirely on the QB?

Saints-Tigers
10-02-2011, 09:31 PM
IT seems that the Rams record only counts for Bradford if they win.

dannyz
10-02-2011, 09:38 PM
Why is no one talking about Miami or Minnesota? They are both Win less, I know the Vikings took Ponder but if they think Luck is the Next Peyton Manning or Tom Brady they would have to take him. The Dolphins QB just got injured and he was not that good anyways and they play in a Very Strong Division.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 09:41 PM
Miami is a definite possibility along with KC, Seattle and Indy. Minnesota reached for Ponder this year, I think they stick with him and try to build the team up around him.

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 09:43 PM
Miami is a definite possibility along with KC, Seattle and Indy. Minnesota reached for Ponder this year, I think they stick with him and try to build the team up around him.

They need to start Ponder asap. See if he can show anything. If not, and they are in position for Luck, take him.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 09:55 PM
They need to start Ponder asap. See if he can show anything. If not, and they are in position for Luck, take him.

It doesn't sound like Frazier is ready to turn the page on McNabb. They need O-Line help, I think their front office will be looking to upgrade the o-line and build around Ponder.

BeerBaron
10-02-2011, 09:56 PM
It doesn't sound like Frazier is ready to turn the page on McNabb. They need O-Line help, I think their front office will be looking to upgrade the o-line and build around Ponder.

McNabb is worthless and if Frazier truly thinks that, he may find himself out of a job.

nrk
10-02-2011, 09:56 PM
I've said multiple times that the Rams will win enough games to make it a moot point.

But everyone is giving Bradford some kind of pass...the guy hasn't been good since 2/3 of the way through last season. The entire offense is struggling, including him.

Maybe he is getting too much of a pass from some. I know I give him a bit of a pass, but I've admitted to his struggles.

You're saying he hasn't been good since the end of his rookie season. I don't think I need to iterate ROOKIE season again, but I will. It's 1/4th of the way of his sophomore season now, often another hard season for young qbs.

Do you want to see more out of him at this point? Sure you do. It's also early and he plays on an abysmal offense , not including Steven Jackson of course. The Rams didn't get the #1 pick by being good.

SolidGold
10-02-2011, 10:07 PM
McNabb is worthless and if Frazier truly thinks that, he may find himself out of a job.

Well he said it today. I still don't think teams draft QBs in the first round in consecutive years.

mqtirishfan
10-03-2011, 12:09 AM
Miami is a definite possibility along with KC, Seattle and Indy. Minnesota reached for Ponder this year, I think they stick with him and try to build the team up around him.

Minnesota would be well served to take the King's Ransom if they can get anything out of Ponder this year. I doubt they keep this up, though.

wogitalia
10-03-2011, 01:15 AM
They need to start Ponder asap. See if he can show anything. If not, and they are in position for Luck, take him.

Not worth the risk for mine. With how insanely horrible our OL and receivers are you would just be Jimmy Clausening him. If he doesn't play then we have a highly drafted backup with trade value. If he plays and sucks then we have an overdrafted guy with no value.

He is worth more as an unknown(see Kolb, Clausen or Whitehurst) than he would be after playing unless he is able to turn **** into gold whilst being smashed to pieces.

It doesn't matter who we start, we will be awful, teams without OL, WR or secondaries generally are, we may as well get Luck out of being awful and realistically McNabb gives us a better chance of that because we are more likely to try and pass with him there and really running is our only chance of winning games so the more we pass the better. Especially given that when we do pass we don't even aim for Harvin or have him out there most of the time.

So yeah... it could be worse I guess, we could have Cutler back there with his big fat hateable head, although I guess it would be fun to watch him get crushed behind our line(not that the Bears line doesn't do an outstanding job at it also).

Why did I pick the Vikings as a team again?

wogitalia
10-03-2011, 01:17 AM
Minnesota would be well served to take the King's Ransom if they can get anything out of Ponder this year. I doubt they keep this up, though.

Love to know what makes you think that we are likely to turn it around. We have arguably the worst OL, coaching, WR and secondaries in the league and just lost to a Chiefs team missing half their good players...

bucfan12
10-03-2011, 07:04 AM
I still don't get the love/pass for Sam Bradford? Sure, his weapons aren't great, but honestly, the Rams had the chance to add through Free Agency.

I was happy the Rams took him #1 in 2010 so the Bucs could take McCoy, but that's a different story. Bradford to me was overrated as a QB prospect. If he was that good, the Rams wouldn't be 0-4.

The Rams, even if they pick #1, won't take Luck. They got what, 55 million invested in Bradford? I still say the Colts are the worst team and Kansas City won today. I still say the loser of the KC/INDY game wins the Luck sweepstakes.

BeerBaron
10-03-2011, 07:51 AM
Not worth the risk for mine. With how insanely horrible our OL and receivers are you would just be Jimmy Clausening him. If he doesn't play then we have a highly drafted backup with trade value. If he plays and sucks then we have an overdrafted guy with no value.

He is worth more as an unknown(see Kolb, Clausen or Whitehurst) than he would be after playing unless he is able to turn **** into gold whilst being smashed to pieces.

It doesn't matter who we start, we will be awful, teams without OL, WR or secondaries generally are, we may as well get Luck out of being awful and realistically McNabb gives us a better chance of that because we are more likely to try and pass with him there and really running is our only chance of winning games so the more we pass the better. Especially given that when we do pass we don't even aim for Harvin or have him out there most of the time.

So yeah... it could be worse I guess, we could have Cutler back there with his big fat hateable head, although I guess it would be fun to watch him get crushed behind our line(not that the Bears line doesn't do an outstanding job at it also).

Why did I pick the Vikings as a team again?

You don't "Jimmy Clausen" someone. Only Jimmy Clausen can be as bad as Jimmy Clausen. The guy legitimately looked like a fish out of water crossed with a chicken with it's head cut off. He had no business being anywhere near an NFL field.

Additionally, if a guy can be mentally damaged that easily, then he's never going to be a franchise QB.

They need to see what you have in Ponder. The thing about a rookie QB isn't whether or not he can come in and be consistently great, because few can. But will he show flashes? Can he make one great throw? Then can he string a few of those together? Then can he string together a few drives like that? etc etc etc...

Even if he came in and only won 2 games the rest of the year, if he at least showed some flashes of being decent, he'd be worth keeping around and giving another shot to.

If not, and he's terrible, then it's probably a bigger issue than just the supporting cast and you'll know that, if in position to draft Luck, you should.