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TACKLE
10-27-2011, 12:20 AM
After Monday night's fiasco, I think we're all kinda evaluating areas the team could improve on. Plus, it seems like the right time to get this thread going anyway.



IN OZZIE WE TRUST.

TACKLE
10-27-2011, 12:47 AM
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Vontaze+Burfict+USC+v+Arizona+State+b5BAoW2KRdql.j pg


This guy is the undisputed #1 player on my wishlist. Not that McClain hasn't improved but there wouldn't be a better situation in the NFL for this Taze to thrive. He'd be perfect learning and growing next to Ray and I think ILB in a 34 is his best scheme fit.

America
10-27-2011, 10:04 AM
http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Vontaze+Burfict+USC+v+Arizona+State+b5BAoW2KRdql.j pg


This guy is the undisputed #1 player on my wishlist. Not that McClain hasn't improved but there wouldn't be a better situation in the NFL for this Taze to thrive. He'd be perfect learning and growing next to Ray and I think ILB in a 34 is his best scheme fit.

100% Agree. Burfict would dominate.

BmoreBlackByrdz
10-27-2011, 03:28 PM
Isn't a Burfict a top 15 pick? or are his character issues hurting his stock?

niel89
10-27-2011, 04:15 PM
I really want either Burfict or Te'o. Either could be their around our pick because MLB slip. I think we need to get another dominant ILB that can learn from Ray and take over once he leaves. Ray could really teach the next guy how to be a pro.

thegreatone
10-27-2011, 04:19 PM
While ILB is a big need, I think a LT is even bigger.

TACKLE
10-27-2011, 05:17 PM
I really don't know what to do about the OT situation. As someone who loved Jah Reid coming out and was impressed with what I saw with him in the preseason, I still have a lot of confidence that he can be a very good RT. Problem is, we're now stuck with two young RT's and no LT. Do we draft a LT early and give up on Jah or Oher? It's a tough predicament. Though I would think we probably won't draft our future LT early simply because this draft is very weak early at OT. Still, a tricky problem moving forward.

niel89
10-27-2011, 09:09 PM
I don't think we are going to be in a position to get a good LT or get one while still getting any value. I think the team is probably going to go forward with McKinney for another year or they are going to move Oher back to LT. Best hope is that Oher develops positively and Reid becomes a solid RT.

thegreatone
10-27-2011, 09:59 PM
Maybe we could pick up a true LT in FA.

One guy I really like is Demetrius Bell. He isn't an all-pro by any means, but hes a more than solid playing on the left side. And with him only being 26, he still has time to get better.

Next year will be Flacco's last before we'll have to make the decision of re-signing him or not. We can't afford to get anything but a sure thing at LT for his final year.

TACKLE
10-27-2011, 11:51 PM
You know who we could really use....

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/images/sports/photos/2011/08/11/sp-584gaither.jpg

:(

niel89
10-27-2011, 11:54 PM
He will be free agent...

TACKLE
10-27-2011, 11:56 PM
He will be free agent...

I know. I seriously think that would be something to look into.

TACKLE
10-28-2011, 01:19 AM
Other than C and ILB, what other positions could being addressed in the 1st round?

coordinator0
10-28-2011, 03:32 PM
Other than C and ILB, what other positions could being addressed in the 1st round?

I'd say that LT and LG could be pretty high on the list, although it doesn't look like there will be a T worth the pick at this point. I'm not optimistic that Grubbs will be back and the state of the OL after this season really worries me. It has been one of the weakest units on the team for the past couple of seasons and I think it's time to address it. I mentioned on another forum that moving Oher to LG if he continues to struggle at RT the rest of this season could be an option and then we could see what Reid could do as a starter in the process.

Other than those positions nothing else really stands out in terms of immediate need (not that Ozzie drafts strictly by need of course). I could see arguments being made for a CB and WR that wouldn't be totally off-base.

One position I do think we'll stay away from is OLB, if/when we bring Johnson back there doesn't seem to be many snaps available for anybody else with both Kruger and Kindle waiting in the wings. Pagano has been a godsend and the pass-rush looks great this year so I don't think it's a big issue.

Sloopy
10-28-2011, 03:47 PM
One of the ILB prospects dropping to us is my main hope (crossing my fingers for Taze just like everyone else).

However, at the moment Scott has guys like Alfonzo Denard falling to the bottom of round one. Before the season started, people were projecting him a possibly being a better prospect than Amukamara, his stock may have fallen but he still has potential to be a great man to man corner. I know we just took Jimmy Smith in last years draft but the only thing better than finally giving us a true #1 cover corner, is to give us a guy to play on the other side of him, thus solidifying our secondary for years to come.

Another cover guy who might fall to us due to character concerns could be Janoris Jenkins if teams really aren't sold on his character.

Of course I have to give my boy Michael Brewster (center) some hype here. I don't think he will break into the first round but he is definitely a guy I hope we end up with. He managed to neutralize the likes of Jarred Crick and Jerel Worthy, both of whom may go in the first round as well as a solid pro talent in Marcus Forston. Would be a solid replacement for Birk when he hangs them up

thegreatone
10-28-2011, 09:42 PM
With how early #1 Centers are going recently, we'd be lucky to see him fall to us in the 1st.

Sloopy
10-28-2011, 11:01 PM
I haven't seen any mocks with him in the 1st yet, his stock may move up come draft day and he could sneak into the first. He is definitely worth a 1st in my opinion although I tend to rank guys out of THE Ohio State University lower than I think they should go to fight my natural bias.

TACKLE
11-01-2011, 08:31 PM
Of course I have to give my boy Michael Brewster (center) some hype here. I don't think he will break into the first round but he is definitely a guy I hope we end up with. He managed to neutralize the likes of Jarred Crick and Jerel Worthy, both of whom may go in the first round as well as a solid pro talent in Marcus Forston. Would be a solid replacement for Birk when he hangs them up

Konz >>>> Brewster

A Perfect Score
11-07-2011, 08:12 AM
Konz >>>> Brewster

This mean speaks the truth. Konz would be a great pick for us at the end of the first. I'm going to come out and say it though, I want this guy to be a Raven

http://bluedevilnation.net/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/luke-kuechly-p1.jpg

Such a smart, instinctive and awesome player. He'd be a perfect candidate to take over the defense once Ray retires.

Sloopy
11-07-2011, 08:44 AM
Konz >>>> Brewster

I'd venture to say that Brewster has overshadowed Konz for his entire short career (Konz only has started for two seasons iirc while Brewster has started all 4 years with minimal time out) with Konz having yet to play an entire season thus far due to injury (We really can't afford any more of our linemen going down to injury).

Brewster has taken the first team all big ten over Konz every year that Konz has started and Brewster has been considered for the Rimington twice in his career and might take it this year.

Konz is slightly more athletic and has slightly better triangle #s but throughout their careers and this season Brewster has outplayed Konz. Both have had stellar games against Jerel Worthy and Jared Crick, however Konz struggled (as well as the Badgers running game) against THE Ohio State University.

Both aren't that far off from each other and I guess in the end it kind of comes down to opinion (go ahead and call me biased :P ) but I'd say Brewster's body of work out speaks Konz's without question. Plus I like Brewster's awesome ability to make line calls, I'm not aware of how well Konz makes these calls but from some of the scouting reports I've read, this is one of his weaknesses.

Such a smart, instinctive and awesome player. He'd be a perfect candidate to take over the defense once Ray retires.

You don't think that he is a bit undersized? I mean I love him as a player and I'm not saying that it couldn't work but I just have always thought of him as a 4-3 LB

TACKLE
11-07-2011, 06:39 PM
I'd venture to say that Brewster has overshadowed Konz for his entire short career (Konz only has started for two seasons iirc while Brewster has started all 4 years with minimal time out) with Konz having yet to play an entire season thus far due to injury (We really can't afford any more of our linemen going down to injury).

Brewster has taken the first team all big ten over Konz every year that Konz has started and Brewster has been considered for the Rimington twice in his career and might take it this year.

Konz is slightly more athletic and has slightly better triangle #s but throughout their careers and this season Brewster has outplayed Konz. Both have had stellar games against Jerel Worthy and Jared Crick, however Konz struggled (as well as the Badgers running game) against THE Ohio State University.

Both aren't that far off from each other and I guess in the end it kind of comes down to opinion (go ahead and call me biased :P ) but I'd say Brewster's body of work out speaks Konz's without question. Plus I like Brewster's awesome ability to make line calls, I'm not aware of how well Konz makes these calls but from some of the scouting reports I've read, this is one of his weaknesses.

I get the feeling that your opinion on this matter has a certain 'slant'. I've broken down both extensively, including the game two weeks ago in which their teams faced off, and I get the clear impression that Konz is the better player. He's bigger, stronger, more physical, has a better base, plays with better leverage and gets more consistent movement on DT's. I've spoken with numerous Buckeye fans on here who agree that Konz is the superior player and prospect. I actually feel that Brewster played better as a junior than he has this year. If Konz declares, which given the history of Badger O-Lineman may be unlikely, I see him more as a mid-late first rounder where as I think Brewster is more of a mid 2nd.

Sloopy
11-07-2011, 09:17 PM
I get the feeling that your opinion on this matter has a certain 'slant'. I've broken down both extensively, including the game two weeks ago in which their teams faced off, and I get the clear impression that Konz is the better player. He's bigger, stronger, more physical, has a better base, plays with better leverage and gets more consistent movement on DT's. I've spoken with numerous Buckeye fans on here who agree that Konz is the superior player and prospect. I actually feel that Brewster played better as a junior than he has this year. If Konz declares, which given the history of Badger O-Lineman may be unlikely, I see him more as a mid-late first rounder where as I think Brewster is more of a mid 2nd.

I agreed that both are good and by no means am I trying to say that Konz isn't good. I am saying that they are fairly close and it may be a matter of preference. Konz may go first come draft day but I don't feel that anyone will be losing out by getting Brewster.

I myself prefer Brewster and may indeed be biased as you say, but I don't think his body of work should be ignored. He may have had a better season as a junior but look at what has gone on around him this year. Furthermore its not like Brewster has been abused by any of the same DTs that Konz has faced.

fo4Ct96jlEc

Konz doesn't necessarily get blown up here but the only time I really see him getting consistent movement on DTs is when he is double teaming with a guard. There are times that he looks lost. On some of the pulling plays (one of the areas he is supposed excel over Brewster) he clearly gets beat by defenders ending in the run amounting to almost no yards. Definitely has excellent leverage at times I'll give you that.

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Brewster's performance isn't dominant over Konz but he creates some excellent seals for the run game and provides excellent protection in the pass game. He seems to do a better job of aiding his guards with chips then moving on to another defender. Definitely has some trouble hitting moving targets in the open field and at times lacks proper leverage.

Again, one is not clearly better but I wouldn't say that Konz is far and away better

coordinator0
11-07-2011, 09:32 PM
I don't have a preference either way, just as long as we get somebody to replace Birk With. Ben Jones would work for me as well.

TACKLE
11-07-2011, 09:46 PM
I'm not trying to slight Brewster. He's a very solid prospect in his own right. Just more so thinking of who I would prefer if we were to spend our 1st on a center.

Sloopy
11-07-2011, 09:58 PM
I'm not trying to slight Brewster. He's a very solid prospect in his own right. Just more so thinking of who I would prefer if we were to spend our 1st on a center.

Fair enough :) we agree to disagree.

TACKLE
11-08-2011, 04:24 AM
Although I certainly wouldn't be opposed to drafting Burfict, Te'o, Kuelchy or even Ronnell Lewis in the 1st round to play ILB....I must say, Jameel McClain has shown noticeable improvement and really seems have progressed this year.

Just something to consider.

coordinator0
11-08-2011, 09:31 AM
He's been better, but I still don't think he's anything more than average. I'd still say that ILB is the biggest need on the team after the OL.

Sloopy
11-08-2011, 11:20 AM
Although I certainly wouldn't be opposed to drafting Burfict, Te'o, Kuelchy or even Ronnell Lewis in the 1st round to play ILB....I must say, Jameel McClain has shown noticeable improvement and really seems have progressed this year.

Just something to consider.

I agree that he has progressed, and certainley he has lessened the idea of "need" at ILB. However, even in the best scenario of him becoming great, Ray leaving will still leave that whole in the middle. So I certainly wouldn't see taking an ILB as a bad pick in the first.

If we can get our hands on one of the top 3 LB maybe even only the top 2, we should probably take one. If we can't we should turn our eyes elsewear.

The good news is that if indeed there is a run on LBs in the first round (history makes this seem unlikely) then it would probably leave room for a top OL or CB to fall to us.

Ravens1991
11-10-2011, 06:52 PM
Say we have a stud top 15 CB drop to us in the late first much like Jimmy Smith did this past year. while all the LBs and OLs would be considered average value or a reach. Would you go for a CB? Honestly I would, Williams is good but isnt lights out. But Smith and the new guy, along w/ Webb in the nickel would be lights out

Sloopy
11-10-2011, 07:05 PM
Say we have a stud top 15 CB drop to us in the late first much like Jimmy Smith did this past year. while all the LBs and OLs would be considered average value or a reach. Would you go for a CB? Honestly I would, Williams is good but isnt lights out. But Smith and the new guy, along w/ Webb in the nickel would be lights out

I have been saying this for awhile now. It's not our greatest need but we could turn what has recently been a weakness into a strength. Similar to what TB and DET has done with their defensive lines.

Having a top notch cornerback corp. with Ed Reed over the top for the near future would indeed be lights out as you stated and when it comes time for him to hang 'em up we will not lose what is essentially our entire secondary.

thegreatone
11-10-2011, 07:09 PM
I don't know why you guys are hating on Carry Williams.

Hes only started in 8 games, and has looked pretty good. Give him time. I think he'd be an excellent #2 CB behind Smith.

Sloopy
11-10-2011, 07:24 PM
I'm not hating, I'm saying all of this under the scenario that there isn't a viable ILB or OL available come our turn to draft.

As I said before, If there is a run on two of the positions of need one of the others will likely fall to us. The worst case scenario is that there is a run on ILB and OL leaving us with the option of probably selecting a Janoris Jenkins (just an example)

TACKLE
11-10-2011, 07:27 PM
If we're going to with a value pick in the 1st, I'd rather it be a pass rusher than a CB.

thegreatone
11-10-2011, 07:35 PM
I'm not hating, I'm saying all of this under the scenario that there isn't a viable ILB or OL available come our turn to draft.

As I said before, If there is a run on two of the positions of need one of the others will likely fall to us. The worst case scenario is that there is a run on ILB and OL leaving us with the option of probably selecting a Janoris Jenkins (just an example)
The only CB I'd take in the 1st would be the kid from LSU.

Other than that, I'd take Floyd, ILB, C, or LT. And if there aren't any good options, I'd just trade down.

thegreatone
11-10-2011, 07:35 PM
If we're going to with a value pick in the 1st, I'd rather it be a pass rusher than a CB.
I agree with this.

You could never have enough pass-rushers.

TACKLE
11-10-2011, 07:39 PM
I agree with this.

You could never have enough pass-rushers.

lol but same could be said about CB's.

niel89
11-10-2011, 07:43 PM
If CB is BPA then I'm all for it. I continually just want to add more talent at the best value. Hopefully a player will just fall to us or we trade back and stock up some picks.

I would love to add another pass rusher but I'm sure we are gonna stick with what we have for now. We have Kindle and Kruger who have potential. Although we probably are going to let JJ walk after this season. It can never hurt to have a stock of good pass rushers though.

thegreatone
11-10-2011, 10:11 PM
lol but same could be said about CB's.
True. But we have many, don't you think?

CB:
Smith, Webb, Williams, Carr, Brown

Ravens1991
11-10-2011, 10:44 PM
I agree with the "never have too many pass rushers theory". But we are as close as you can get when we cant even dress a talented guy like Sergio Kindle.


Also I like williams but having a guy who can be a solid starter as your #4 CB would be a very nice luxury. I like Chykie brown too but it would be asinine to pass up a potential pro bowler because of a 5th round pick who hasnt played all season.

thegreatone
11-10-2011, 10:50 PM
I guess its just that I don't really love anyone other Morris Claiborne in the 1st.

Sloopy
11-11-2011, 08:12 AM
True. But we have many, don't you think?

CB:
Smith, Webb, Williams, Carr, Brown

With the exception of smith (potentially) most of these guys are nickle/dime types on other teams. Ed Reed really does make this secondary and if we have an option to have (possibly) a solid #1 #2 combo at corner, losing him to retirement won't hurt so bad.

Same reason we wan't to draft an ILB

As far as pass rushers: We can't even dress all the ones we have, not to mention the lack of top 3-4 Jack LB's in this class and the ones that are out there will probably be gone by the time we select.

TACKLE
11-14-2011, 02:56 PM
On the ever changing, realistic Ravens big board that exists only in my head, TJ McDonald is now right near the top. A lot of people around SC are saying he's the best DB prospect they've had since Troy. The more I see of him, the more I read about him and the more I listen to him, the more I think he's capable of being a big time safety in this league.

I know big, hard hitting safeties are kind of taboo now, but I don't see him as a yoked up, tight hipped athlete who can only come downhill. I see a long, rangy athlete who can cover a lot ground and can play comfortably in space. Yes he can be the big, physical in the box strong safety; but he can also be that rangy deep FS, that guy who gives up nothing matched up TE's and has shown he can hold his own lined up in the slot. I like his ball skills too. He's shown the ability to go up and play the ball like a WR. Athletically, he seems like a guy who is just a very natural athlete who could thrive in any sport if he wanted.

The knocks on him would be, like all tall safeties and most tall athlete's, he's a long strider and isn't overly quick and will have to work on his change of direction. He's not a liability in the slot but he's not Earl Thomas out there either. But in our defense, I don't think he needs to be. Also, you'd like to see him get his hands on the ball a little more too (5 int's and 5 pbu's in the last two season). He's also gotten numerous flags, some valid, some not, for laying down huge (which now means illegal) hits.

All in all, he's not a finished product but I think McDonald's potential is immense. Lately, I've just kind of fallen in love with his upside and his attitude. He has the type of ability to change the stigma about big safeties. He has NFL pedigree to - his dad was 12 year pro, 6 time pro bowler Tim McDonald. From everything I've read, TJ's a team captain and the undisputed leader on that Trojans defense. For us, he can come in and compete at strong safety right away but could also work a bit at FS, eventually taking over for Reed there. Above all else, the way he plays and the way he carries himself, he just seems like a Raven.

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2010 Highlights/Lowlights
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Playing mostly FS
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coordinator0
11-14-2011, 07:02 PM
Do we really need a SS though? I get that he could eventually switch over to FS when Reed retires but does McDonald help us that much in the meantime?
I can't help but feel that there will be similarily rated prospects at positions of higher need left on the board as well. I like McDonald as a prospect though. Free agency is going to be interesting to see how we deal with our other needs.

TACKLE
11-14-2011, 07:14 PM
Do we really need a SS though? I get that he could eventually switch over to FS when Reed retires but does McDonald help us that much in the meantime?
I can't help but feel that there will be similarily rated prospects at positions of higher need left on the board as well. I like McDonald as a prospect though. Free agency is going to be interesting to see how we deal with our other needs.

At this point, do we really have any glaring needs other the center or left tackle, both of which don't look like they'll offer much value in the late 1st. Safety is every bit as big of a need as ILB for the exact same reasons. Old vet with a questionable long term future at one spot, younger player exceeding expectations but is still upgradeable at the other spot with questionable depth behind them.

....which leads me to believe with the way things are looking now, we probably should/will trade back.

coordinator0
11-14-2011, 07:26 PM
I actually think that ILB is a bigger need than S because I really don't want to see McClain starting. We could use a heir and a partner for Lewis at this point in my opinion. But I do agree that trading back could be a more likely option this year.

Sloopy
11-14-2011, 09:51 PM
Depending on how it plays out (if there isn't any value really come our time to pick) I would almost rather trade back and be able to get 2-3 2nd rounders, I love Ozzie's ability to find value later in the draft and 2-3 2nd rounders for us could become 2-3 solid starters down the road, maybe pick up an ILB, S, and OL.

TACKLE
11-14-2011, 10:03 PM
Depending on how it plays out (if there isn't any value really come our time to pick) I would almost rather trade back and be able to get 2-3 2nd rounders, I love Ozzie's ability to find value later in the draft and 2-3 2nd rounders for us could become 2-3 solid starters down the road, maybe pick up an ILB, S, and OL.

Perhaps trade back into the 2nd and take Brewster? :D

Sloopy
11-15-2011, 07:42 AM
Perhaps trade back into the 2nd and take Brewster? :D

Awww you do care :)

Sloopy
11-15-2011, 08:22 AM
On the ever changing, realistic Ravens big board that exists only in my head, TJ McDonald is now ranked #2. A lot of people around SC are saying he's the best DB prospect they've had since Troy. The more I see of him, the more I read about him and the more I listen to him, the more I think he's capable of being a big time safety in this league.

I know big, hard hitting safeties are kind of taboo now, but I don't see him as a yoked up, tight hipped athlete who can only come downhill. I see a long, rangy athlete who can cover a lot ground and can play comfortably in space. Yes he can be the big, physical in the box strong safety; but he can also be that rangy deep FS, that guy who gives up nothing matched up TE's and has shown he can hold his own lined up in the slot. I like his ball skills too. He's shown the ability to go up and play the ball like a WR. Athletically, he seems like a guy who is just a very natural athlete who could thrive in any sport if he wanted.

The knocks on him would be, like all tall safeties and most tall athlete's, he's a long strider and isn't overly quick and will have to work on his change of direction. He's not a liability in the slot but he's not Earl Thomas out there either. But in our defense, I don't think he needs to be. Also, you'd like to see him get his hands on the ball a little more too (5 int's and 5 pbu's in the last two season). He's also gotten numerous flags, some valid, some not, for laying down huge (which now means illegal) hits.

All in all, he's not a finished product but I think McDonald's potential is immense. Lately, I've just kind of fallen in love with his upside and his attitude. He has the type of ability to change the stigma about big safeties. He has NFL pedigree to - his dad was 12 year pro, 6 time pro bowler Tim McDonald. From everything I've read, TJ's a team captain and the undisputed leader on that Trojans defense. For us, he can come in and compete at strong safety right away but could also work a bit at FS, eventually taking over for Reed there. Above all else, the way he plays and the way he carries himself, he just seems like a Raven.

Been meaning to get back to you on this one just didn't have the time to watch the tape...

start out simple: I like him.

If we were going to take a safety in this draft I would want it to be him.

I like that he can bring the lumber, however he can also break down in space and make the tackle. Would like to see him improve his tackling form a little bit but that can be worked on and the guys on this D would help discipline him in that respect.

Definitely athletic and makes a good break on the ball when its in the air. Dude has hands to be assured, not the stone handed guy who only breaks up passes. Seems like he gets caught out of position at times, but at other times he ends up exactly where he needs to be, could definitely prosper under Ed Reed's tutelage.

I hope he doesn't measure any taller than hsi listed 6'3" at the combine but even so it doesn't seem to affect him that much.

Could put up some nice number's at the combine and shoot up boards, might even end up being the first safety taken.

TACKLE
11-15-2011, 04:43 PM
Just bouncing an idea of you guys.....

Let's say there's a scenario in which we're picking between 26 and 32, the value on areas of need suck and we can't trade out of that spot...

Lamar Miller?

Sloopy
11-15-2011, 06:12 PM
Just bouncing an idea of you guys.....

Let's say there's a scenario in which we're picking between 26 and 32, the value on areas of need suck and we can't trade out of that spot...

Lamar Miller?

Haha, no offense to your sig but if that were the only worthy option I would rather trade down.

I'm not really a fan of drafting RB's in the first and since we already have an awesome, young RB. I would be opposed to drafting a back up RB in the first. Even if he took over as the starter, we don't need two starting caliber RB's and Rice isn't doing poorly. We could use the pick for other things or at least trade back and gain more picks

coordinator0
11-15-2011, 09:12 PM
Just bouncing an idea of you guys.....

Let's say there's a scenario in which we're picking between 26 and 32, the value on areas of need suck and we can't trade out of that spot...

Lamar Miller?

There's a point where you can have too much talent at a position. We're not using Rice enough as it is, at least consistently, so I don't want to bring in another guy that we would have to play and take snaps away from Ray. A change of coordinator could fix this issue but would adding Miller actually improve our team that much? I don't think so, and I'd much rather look for a compliment to Rice later in the draft rather than investing too much at the position.

TACKLE
11-15-2011, 09:31 PM
There's a point where you can have too much talent at a position. We're not using Rice enough as it is, at least consistently, so I don't want to bring in another guy that we would have to play and take snaps away from Ray. A change of coordinator could fix this issue but would adding Miller actually improve our team that much? I don't think so, and I'd much rather look for a compliment to Rice later in the draft rather than investing too much at the position.

Well I'm talking about a worst case scenario. I'm not saying I'd be a big advocate of the pick but I wouldn't necessarily rule it out. I love Ricky but he's but our depth at RB is paper thin. Lamar could be integrated into the offense in a change of pace role and as a returner early on. It never hurts to add an explosive home run hitter to your team. I love what Ray Rice brings to this team and he's hands down our best offensive player. But I was just thinking, of any position, we probably have the least amount of depth at RB (center is close but again, value). It's foreseeable that Lamar could be graded out as a mid 1st rounder (not trying to be homer but I've seen a lot of reputable sites put him in that range). And if the value sucks at positions of need, I think we're in a place where we could afford a luxury pick at the very end of the first.....then again, I'm hoping Miller isn't even in this draft.

Sloopy
11-15-2011, 10:21 PM
Well I'm talking about a worst case scenario. I'm not saying I'd be a big advocate of the pick but I wouldn't necessarily rule it out. I love Ricky but he's but our depth at RB is paper thin. Lamar could be integrated into the offense in a change of pace role and as a returner early on. It never hurts to add an explosive home run hitter to your team. I love what Ray Rice brings to this team and he's hands down our best offensive player. But I was just thinking, of any position, we probably have the least amount of depth at RB (center is close but again, value). It's foreseeable that Lamar could be graded out as a mid 1st rounder (not trying to be homer but I've seen a lot of reputable sites put him in that range). And if the value sucks at positions of need, I think we're in a place where we could afford a luxury pick at the very end of the first.....then again, I'm hoping Miller isn't even in this draft.

I mean I don't think he would be bad for our team. I just wouldn't want to use our first rounder on a back up considering some of our needs, I would almost rather trade back. If we could get him in the second it wouldn't be so bad.

Sloopy
11-17-2011, 10:12 AM
Depending on what we do in the first, it might be tough to find value in the 2nd round, what would you guys think about taking a receiver in round 2?

I know we have some good players at the position now but both Lee Evans and Boldin are over 30. We could probably stand to add some young depth at the position.

All this assuming that we can't address a more serious need with the pick either due to lack of quality depth at positions of need in the draft or the only quality position remaining already having been addressed in round one (I could see this happening if we get a LB in round one)

coordinator0
11-17-2011, 10:34 AM
Well I'm talking about a worst case scenario. I'm not saying I'd be a big advocate of the pick but I wouldn't necessarily rule it out. I love Ricky but he's but our depth at RB is paper thin. Lamar could be integrated into the offense in a change of pace role and as a returner early on. It never hurts to add an explosive home run hitter to your team. I love what Ray Rice brings to this team and he's hands down our best offensive player. But I was just thinking, of any position, we probably have the least amount of depth at RB (center is close but again, value). It's foreseeable that Lamar could be graded out as a mid 1st rounder (not trying to be homer but I've seen a lot of reputable sites put him in that range). And if the value sucks at positions of need, I think we're in a place where we could afford a luxury pick at the very end of the first.....then again, I'm hoping Miller isn't even in this draft.

I agree with your points, I just don't think that adding Miller (or just about any RB) would add enough to the team to warrant using a first round pick at the position when we already have a great RB on the team.

Depending on what we do in the first, it might be tough to find value in the 2nd round, what would you guys think about taking a receiver in round 2?

I know we have some good players at the position now but both Lee Evans and Boldin are over 30. We could probably stand to add some young depth at the position.

All this assuming that we can't address a more serious need with the pick either due to lack of quality depth at positions of need in the draft or the only quality position remaining already having been addressed in round one (I could see this happening if we get a LB in round one)

Ehh depends on who's available. Both Evans and Boldin are right at 30 so I don't think their age is too concerning, but if we could find a nice value then maybe. I'd still like to see if Doss can add anything to the WR corp but it doesn't look like we will find out this year. This draft doesn't seem too strong so our BPA approach could be even more obvious come April.

coordinator0
11-26-2011, 05:19 PM
How do you rank the ILB prospects for the Ravens at this time? There might be four of them in the draft that we could consider taking with our first round pick and it's definitley a position of need. I'm really only talking about Te'o, Burfict, Hightower, and Keuchly but some think Cole could sneak in there as well. Unfortunately the top four prospects are all underclassmen. I hope they all declare though, it gives us a better chance of landing one of them :D.

Anyways, if you had your pick who would you take and why?

TACKLE
11-26-2011, 05:48 PM
I have Burfict, Te'o and Kuelchy ranked very closely and would be thrilled with any of them. Te'o is just no naturally powerful and has great range. Kuelchy's instincts are as good as I've ever seen and there isn't a tackle he can't make. Taze is a freak and has that X factor about him. I'm having a hard time separating them but I guess I'd lean slightly towards Taze because he has the highest upside of the three and out of any situation in the league, his best chance of succeeding would be with us.

Outside of those guys, I do like Audie Cole a lot. Big, athletic, versatile and is an effective blitzer too. I want to love Hightower because he's so big and so violent but he's just so slow and can't really play in space. I'd rather draft Upshaw and move him inside. Another conversion guy who I'm very intrigued by is Ronnell Lewis. I'm not sold on his edge rush ability on the next level but his skill set suits the 34 ILB position perfectly.

TACKLE
11-26-2011, 06:09 PM
Also on that note, I know I was kind of exploring the non-ILB options, but as of right now, I'm 100% on board taking an ILB in the 1st. And unless Konz is there or the ILB value really off (which seems unlikely considering how deep this LB class is), there isn't another position I'd want to take in the first. I know it's a bit of a 180 (k maybe more of a 90 degree turn) from where I was before but I just love the young talent on this team and another stud ILB can be the final piece to the puzzle.

Sloopy
11-26-2011, 08:04 PM
Also on that note, I know I was kind of exploring the non-ILB options, but as of right now, I'm 100% on board taking an ILB in the 1st. And unless Konz is there or the ILB value really off (which seems unlikely considering how deep this LB class is), there isn't another position I'd want to take in the first. I know it's a bit of a 180 (k maybe more of a 90 degree turn) from where I was before but I just love the young talent on this team and another stud ILB can be the final piece to the puzzle.

Exactly Konz or maybe even a LT but for the most part I really want an ILB.

coordinator0
11-27-2011, 03:26 PM
I have Burfict, Te'o and Kuelchy ranked very closely and would be thrilled with any of them. Te'o is just no naturally powerful and has great range. Kuelchy's instincts are as good as I've ever seen and there isn't a tackle he can't make. Taze is a freak and has that X factor about him. I'm having a hard time separating them but I guess I'd lean slightly towards Taze because he has the highest upside of the three and out of any situation in the league, his best chance of succeeding would be with us.

Outside of those guys, I do like Audie Cole a lot. Big, athletic, versatile and is an effective blitzer too. I want to love Hightower because he's so big and so violent but he's just so slow and can't really play in space. I'd rather draft Upshaw and move him inside. Another conversion guy who I'm very intrigued by is Ronnell Lewis. I'm not sold on his edge rush ability on the next level but his skill set suits the 34 ILB position perfectly.

That's my big concern with Hightower too. He's a monster around the LOS whether it's taking on blockers or suhing the passer but anything beyond that I wouldn't trust him. Our ILBs need to be able to match up in coverage and that's a weakness our current group has as well. I think I may be leaning towards Te'o as my top target because he might be a safer pick than Burfict while still be a damn good prospect himself.

TACKLE
11-27-2011, 09:36 PM
I don't think we need to be picky about the top 3 because chances are, best case scenario only one falls to us.

Another guy to check out is Kevin Reddick from UNC. He's been a guy McShay has been hyping (#31 on scouts inc board) so immediately I'm skeptical but in the limited amount I've seen of him, I must say he looks impressive. His athleticism and the way he attacks really stands out. Here's a vid of him vs. GT. Although it doesn't really show anything in the coverage department, no team is more challenging to play against vs. the run.

Ci7831eRpno

TACKLE
11-28-2011, 06:33 AM
Just a few 4am draft related ramblings....

-Unless we can get a bonafide LT in the first ie. Adams or Reiff, I don't think we take an OT early. We'll ride the McKinnie experiment as along as we can and hope that Oher hope he progresses as a pass blocker to the point where they can comfortably play him at LT again.

- Given the history of Wisconsin O-Lineman, I think Konz goes back to school.

- With that being the case, all I want for Christmas is a shiny new stud ILB. He doesn't have to take over immediately for McClain but at very least he'd provided some instant depth. With Ray out and Ellerbe injured, it made me realize how thin we are without Ray when we have McClellan and Ayanbadejo getting significant playing time with the starters. And as much support as a lot of us have for Ellerbe, it's pretty clear the staff doesn't feel the same way. There really isn't a top LB prospect in this draft I wouldn't want (Hightower to some extent). I'd even be in favor of moving up to get one of the big three.

- The long term plans of the position is unsure and there will be times where Pollard is a liability in coverage, but for now, I really like what he brings the table.

- I don't know how the staff feels about Damien Berry or Anthony Allen, but I support taking a running back in rounds 2 or 3. I've always been a big Ricky Williams fan and I trust him more to get the tough yards than I trusted Willis. However, if Ray Rice goes down, were pretty screwed. I don't care if it's a power back, a speed back or whatever. I just wanted another talented back in the mix so if Raymell does go down, this offense won't fall apart.

- We need to identify an interior lineman who fits our system and we need to go get him. If Grubbs leaves in FA this will be an even more pressing need. Even if he stays, we still need a young center behind Birk and someone who can be depth at guard as well. It would be ideal if we could draft someone who can play any of the interior O-Line positions. That's something we must get in this draft. Lucas Nix, Kevin Zeitler (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S1wiViy1il0) and Ben Jones (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVZnW1bkv54) are three guys who I like outside the first round.

- I'd like to add a returner through the draft. I don't really trust Reed anymore and he was never all that effective as a punter returner. Maybe start looking for someone in the 5th round on. Travis Benjamin from The U and a very underrated guy by the name of Devon Wylie (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faqfXBtF50I) from Fresno are both guys who are very dangerous with the ball in their hands and can score from anywhere on the field. I can tell you as a Canes fan that like Reed, Benjamin isn't immune to bonehead plays but he's also been one of the most effective and dangerous return men in CFB over the course of his career.

Sloopy
11-28-2011, 08:13 AM
Just a few 4am draft related ramblings....

-Unless we can get a bonafide LT in the first ie. Adams or Reiff, I don't think we take an OT early. We'll ride the McKinnie experiment as along as we can and hope that Oher hope he progresses as a pass blocker to the point where they can comfortably play him at LT again.

Yes, as much as it is always nice to sure up your future at LT, and as much as I like guys like Zebrie, I wouldn't want to take anyone other than the top tier guys.

- Given the history of Wisconsin O-Lineman, I think Konz goes back to school.

Unfortunately yes

- With that being the case, all I want for Christmas is a shiny new stud ILB. He doesn't have to take over immediately for McClain but at very least he'd provided some instant depth. With Ray out and Ellerbe injured, it made me realize how thin we are without Ray when we have McClellan and Ayanbadejo getting significant playing time with the starters. And as much support as a lot of us have for Ellerbe, it's pretty clear the staff doesn't feel the same way. There really isn't a top LB prospect in this draft I wouldn't want (Hightower to some extent). I'd even be in favor of moving up to get one of the big three.

I would take the top 3 and I wouldn't be mad if we took Hightower, I just don't know if he becomes a star at the next level.

- The long term plans of the position is unsure and there will be times where Pollard is a liability in coverage, but for now, I really like what he brings the table.

It certainly pushes our need down.

- I don't know how the staff feels about Damien Berry or Anthony Allen, but I support taking a running back in rounds 2 or 3. I've always been a big Ricky Williams fan and I trust him more to get the tough yards than I trusted Willis. However, if Ray Rice goes down, were pretty screwed. I don't care if it's a power back, a speed back or whatever. I just wanted another talented back in the mix so if Raymell does go down, this offense won't fall apart

As long as it isn't Lamichael James, I'm for it. Maybe Chris Polk in the second? doubt we will see David Wilson fall to us

- We need to identify an interior lineman who fits our system and we need to go get him. If Grubbs leaves in FA this will be an even more pressing need. Even if he stays, we still need a young center behind Birk and someone who can be depth at guard as well. It would be ideal if we could draft someone who can play any of the interior O-Line positions. That's something we must get in this draft. Lucas Nix, Kevin Zeitler and Ben Jones are three guys who I like outside the first round.

Zeitler in the second would be ideal, but if would prefer to just resign Grubbs if at all possible

- I'd like to add a returner through the draft. I don't really trust Reed anymore and he was never all that effective as a punter returner. Maybe start looking for someone in the 5th round on. Travis Benjamin from The U and a very underrated guy by the name of Devon Wylie from Fresno are both guys who are very dangerous with the ball in their hands and can score from anywhere on the field. I can tell you as a Canes fan that like Reed, Benjamin isn't immune to bonehead plays but he's also been one of the most effective and dangerous return men in CFB over the course of his career.


Agreed, I just really don't ever feel comfortable with our return game, I don't care if we fair catch every damn one just don't drop my damn football. Maybe T.Y. Hilton in the 3rd?

Sloopy
11-28-2011, 02:30 PM
Interesting thought:

Worst case scenario and we lose out on all 3 of the top backers OTs etc.

Do we go Hightower or Upshaw? Some have speculated that he could play inside or outside in the 3-4.

I also know Tack thinks that Lewis could make the move from DE to ILB.

So who do we take in the worst case scenario?

coordinator0
11-28-2011, 02:47 PM
Yeah I just commented on a mock that had us in this situation. I would be fine with Hightower in that situation, assuming Konz is off the board as well. Dennard wouldn't be a bad pick either in my opinion. I'm not a big fan of taking Upshaw or Lewis with the intent of moving them inside, just doesn't seem like it would ever be the best option available.

I'm starting to wonder if we would be interested in Jeffery if he was available. It seems like he's starting to slide and is definitely behind Floyd and Blackmon at this point. If he's available and the top ILB/OL are gone I wouldn't mind us taking him either.

TACKLE
11-28-2011, 03:21 PM
I'm starting to wonder if we would be interested in Jeffery if he was available. It seems like he's starting to slide and is definitely behind Floyd and Blackmon at this point. If he's available and the top ILB/OL are gone I wouldn't mind us taking him either.

I can't say that I haven't entertained this idea. He could be Boldin's replacement. Q is getting old and probably only has one of two more productive years left in him. Alshon could be brought a long slowly and gradually integrated into the offense kind of like what KC is doing with Baldwin. The WR core of the future could be Alshon taking over for Q as the possession WR, Torrey as the deep threat on the other side with Doss or LaQuan or whoever in the slot. Hmmmm.....the more I think about it, the more I like it. I'll put it this way, it wouldn't be the worst, worst case scenario I could think of.

Sloopy
11-28-2011, 08:25 PM
I have to say that for the most part I just always love Ozzie picks, whenever you go BPA, even if it wasn't your biggest need, you can't help but be a little giddy at the idea of player X being a part of your team :)

The Jefferys idea is a prime example; not a huge need, but I'd take it and roll with it

thegreatone
11-28-2011, 10:15 PM
c'mon man.

Anquan Boldin is only 31. He should give us at least 3 or 4 really good years.

I think with a new OC, who could utilize him properly, he could get back to his Arizona form.

TACKLE
11-28-2011, 10:30 PM
c'mon man.

Anquan Boldin is only 31. He should give us at least 3 or 4 really good years.

I think with a new OC, who could utilize him properly, he could get back to his Arizona form.

You think Boldin will still be having a 'really good year' at age 35??? I would love for that to be true but it just seems unlikely.

Sloopy
11-28-2011, 10:32 PM
c'mon man.

Anquan Boldin is only 31. He should give us at least 3 or 4 really good years.

I think with a new OC, who could utilize him properly, he could get back to his Arizona form.

I don't know, I think a large part of his Zona form was the fact that he had Fitz on the other side, not taking anything away from him though. I just don't see him improving in his 30's

coordinator0
11-29-2011, 10:30 AM
I can't say that I haven't entertained this idea. He could be Boldin's replacement. Q is getting old and probably only has one of two more productive years left in him. Alshon could be brought a long slowly and gradually integrated into the offense kind of like what KC is doing with Baldwin. The WR core of the future could be Alshon taking over for Q as the possession WR, Torrey as the deep threat on the other side with Doss or LaQuan or whoever in the slot. Hmmmm.....the more I think about it, the more I like it. I'll put it this way, it wouldn't be the worst, worst case scenario I could think of.

Actually I think he would be a good fit now as well, not just a replacement for Boldin. I loved the Evans addition but his ability to help the team is still questionable at this point. Having Jeffery would allow us to really focus on using Boldin in the slot and he's the kind of receiver we're missing right now. I know people say we have Dickson and Pitta for bigger receivers and I do agree with that, but neither of them play on the outside and I think that's where having a big receiver helps you the most.

thegreatone
11-29-2011, 01:20 PM
You think Boldin will still be having a 'really good year' at age 35??? I would love for that to be true but it just seems unlikely.
Why is it unlikely? Its not like hes a RB.

WR's with Boldin's talent usually have long careers.

thegreatone
11-29-2011, 01:24 PM
I don't know, I think a large part of his Zona form was the fact that he had Fitz on the other side, not taking anything away from him though. I just don't see him improving in his 30's
Boldin had a great year his first year(without Fitz).

I think a lot of you guys are forgetting just how good Boldin was in Arizona. Fitz helped no doubt. But this guy was an absolute monster in his own right.

I see him going back to his old form with a good OC. I think a lot of you just don't realize how poorly Cam utilizes Boldin.

coordinator0
11-29-2011, 02:20 PM
Boldin had a great year his first year(without Fitz).

I think a lot of you guys are forgetting just how good Boldin was in Arizona. Fitz helped no doubt. But this guy was an absolute monster in his own right.

I see him going back to his old form with a good OC. I think a lot of you just don't realize how poorly Cam utilizes Boldin.

That's not an issue for me :D. I think it's easy to see that we're not using Boldin the way he was used in Arizona. Even if we did get a new OC that knows how to use Boldin it wouldn't affect my preference of taking Jeffery or not. Like I said it's not about replacing Boldin it's about upgrading the receiving corp.

thegreatone
11-29-2011, 04:00 PM
That's not an issue for me :D. I think it's easy to see that we're not using Boldin the way he was used in Arizona. Even if we did get a new OC that knows how to use Boldin it wouldn't affect my preference of taking Jeffery or not. Like I said it's not about replacing Boldin it's about upgrading the receiving corp.
Agreed there.

It goes without saying, but I don't think there would a point in drafting a WR as long Cam Cameron is the OC.

Jeffery's fatness does scare me though. I would snatch Floyd in a second if dropped though.

Sloopy
11-29-2011, 08:27 PM
Agreed there.

It goes without saying, but I don't think there would a point in drafting a WR as long Cam Cameron is the OC.

Jeffery's fatness does scare me though. I would snatch Floyd in a second if dropped though.

His weight scares me but then again so did Cody's and look how he has turned out. This team just has a tendency to get the most out of guys despite any issues they might have coming out of college.

I wouldn't want him if there were better options out there, I just wouldn't mind if there weren't any top ILB or Tackles left on the board. Just as I wouldn't mind any # of other guys if we went BPA.

I just commented on a mock that gave us Crick with all the top OT and ILB off the board... If this was the case, and we were going to get a DL. I really like an idea Tack had awhile ago in drafting Poe to play a Ngata like role and eventually take over for him down the road if we ever lost him to retirement or FA (I know he just signed a contract extension but still)

Imagine a line with Ngata Cody and Poe with McPhee mixed in randomly :P

coordinator0
11-29-2011, 08:57 PM
Agreed there.

It goes without saying, but I don't think there would a point in drafting a WR as long Cam Cameron is the OC.

Jeffery's fatness does scare me though. I would snatch Floyd in a second if dropped though.

Yeah that's definitely not something you want to see in a WR prospect. I wouldn't compare it to Cody's situation either, it's quite a bit different in my opinion.

Sloopy
11-29-2011, 09:01 PM
Yeah that's definitely not something you want to see in a WR prospect. I wouldn't compare it to Cody's situation either, it's quite a bit different in my opinion.

Yes admittedly, out of shape receiver is much different than out of shape DL. I was just referring to the fact that we truly get the most out of some of these guys with concerns coming into the draft

TACKLE
12-03-2011, 06:00 PM
I'm watching Baylor played right now and I really think he should look at Terrance Ganaway in the middle rounds. He's a big downhill back and a deceptively good athlete. He reminds a bit of Michael Bush.

TACKLE
12-03-2011, 06:53 PM
For anyone watching the B1G 10 Championship, keep an eye out for Wisconsin RG Kevin Zeitler. He's one of the better interior lineman in college football and would be a guy I'd love to take in the 2nd round.

coordinator0
12-03-2011, 08:59 PM
If we want a return man I want Keshawn Martin from Michigan State. It might be slightly homer of me but I've watched him for 4 years and he got a lot of explosiveness. The best part is he knows what to do with it. I would compare him to Antonio Brown, another guy I got to watch quite a bit of when he was at Central Michigan. Martin is useful on offense as well, he's a good slot option in my opinion.

Sloopy
12-03-2011, 09:22 PM
I had to work 10 to 10 today... so pissed that I missed essentially all of the conference championship games

coordinator0
12-05-2011, 03:36 PM
Just commented on a mock that has us taking Zevrie Sanders in the late first round. I wouldn't mind it since he had pretty much all of the guys we've discussed gone before our pick (or not coming out) with the exception of Hightower. Thoughts?

TACKLE
12-05-2011, 03:45 PM
I'm not a big Zebrie Sanders fan anyway. To be honest, I'd rather have Oher starting at LT.

If we were to reach on an O-Lineman, if he can play center, I'd rather it be on Kevin Zietler from Wisconsin. I went back and watched him on every play vs. MSU and I think he might be the best run blocking guard in this draft. He consistently gets push even against the conferences best DT's. It wouldn't surprise me if he was the Logan Mankins/Eric Wood/Danny Watkins of this draft as in an interior O-Lineman who makes a late push and surprisingly sneaks into the end of round 1.

A Perfect Score
12-05-2011, 07:04 PM
I'm not a big Zebrie Sanders fan anyway. To be honest, I'd rather have Oher starting at LT.

If we were to reach on an O-Lineman, if he can play center, I'd rather it be on Kevin Zietler from Wisconsin. I went back and watched him on every play vs. MSU and I think he might be the best run blocking guard in this draft. He consistently gets push even against the conferences best DT's. It wouldn't surprise me if he was the Logan Mankins/Eric Wood/Danny Watkins of this draft as in an interior O-Lineman who makes a late push and surprisingly sneaks into the end of round 1.

Zeitler is an absolute animal. I'd absolutely love him as a Raven, although I wouldn't want him at the end of Round 1. Round 2, for sure...The guy is a monster.

drd23
12-05-2011, 08:39 PM
If Zebrie Sanders is the best LT or ILB left at the end of the first round, I hope that we either trade down or just pick BPA

TACKLE
12-08-2011, 06:06 PM
I would love to get this guy in the 3rd round.

eifDKZKw60k
HHVbBOPM7h4

Sloopy
12-08-2011, 10:42 PM
I don't know his measurables but he reminds me of how Rice ran at Rutgers,maybe a little faster

TACKLE
12-09-2011, 05:44 PM
Lately, I'm really warming up to the idea of adding as many weapons to the offense - ie. drafting a WR in the first three rounds. I'd rather it be a big physical outside presence like Alshon or a dirty little weapon in the slot like a Joe Adams rather than just an all-around solid guy. Getting some interior depth on the O-Line is priority #1 offensively but getting as many playmakers as we can and making the offense as 'Flacco-friendly' as possible doesn't seem like a bad idea to me.

coordinator0
12-11-2011, 09:41 PM
Looks like Te'o is staying at Notre Dame. Not completely surprising but he was one of my favorite targets for us in this draft. :(

Ravens1991
12-11-2011, 09:44 PM
Tackle I tihnk we have a lot of young guys at WR. So I would only add like 1 or 2 more. Not too many. I want us to add on Oline and get a playmaker. I really hope we can get a defensive beast "that plays like a raven" to keep the sick D going. But with the way the NFL is going we have to look at Offense.

Sloopy
12-11-2011, 10:01 PM
Looks like Te'o is staying at Notre Dame. Not completely surprising but he was one of my favorite targets for us in this draft. :(

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7343456/notre-dame-fighting-irish-manti-teo-return-senior-season

Yes this makes it seemingly more difficult to envision a scenario where a top guy falls to us :(

TACKLE
12-11-2011, 10:11 PM
damn. 101010

Sloopy
12-12-2011, 12:37 PM
So where do we go from here boys? I doubt at this point that we see a top ILB fall to us.

BPA is an obvious choice but with guys like Mike Adams now being projected to be available late in the round/early round two.

I would really like to take him if he is available... his main issues are his knee bending but the guy still has good feet and is amazingly strong.

Or do we stay with the mold of finding an ILB? Upshaw could move inside and Hightower would still be available... not to high on Hightower and I think that Upshaw playing at ILB would just be playing him at the wrong position for him at the pro level

niel89
12-12-2011, 05:02 PM
I think that we have to go straight BPA now. I thought that one of those ILB would be available and would be a nice balance of BPA and fit but without Teo I don't think that its gonna happen now. My new dream is that if we let Grubbs go then we find a way to get DeCastro. I just watch him every week and I would love to get that guy on our line.

Truthfully, were just gonna either sit tight and grab a talent that slides, or trade back.

TACKLE
12-12-2011, 08:10 PM
What is everybody's realistic (assuming we're drafting in the 29-32 range) 1st round big board at this point?

Sloopy
12-12-2011, 08:45 PM
1.Mike Adams: I think that he is worth a high first round pick, but if he is really faring as far as some have him... I say all the better for us.

2. Konz: If he declares, could be BPA if he's still around

3. Janoris Jenkins: if teams aren't sold on him and he falls

4. Courtney Upshaw: I know we don't need a pass rusher but could be BPA and would most likely present an upgrade especially if JJ leaves.

5. Alshon: Meh, wouldn't be upset.

Ill also say in the odd chance that Burfict falls... obviously him

coordinator0
12-15-2011, 03:48 PM
The Kendall Wright thread in the main draft forum has me intrigued. He's not the kind of receiver I think we should be targeting, but a team can never have enough speed. Possible pick for the Ravens? Of course things would have to fall so that we aren't in a position to get a ILB or OL (our only two pressing needs in my opinion, OL especially) but that could be a very real possibility.

A Perfect Score
12-15-2011, 04:58 PM
What is everybody's realistic (assuming we're drafting in the 29-32 range) 1st round big board at this point?

1) Burfict
2) Konz
3) Adams
4) Alshon

Sloopy
12-15-2011, 06:55 PM
1) Burfict
2) Konz
3) Adams
4) Alshon

Yea I would take Konz over Adams, I have him at 2 but it's only because I really don't think that he declares

TACKLE
12-16-2011, 03:20 PM
Brandon Washington, Guard from The U declared for the draft. We should seriously consider drafting him in the 1st round (depends on the board I know, I know). That is all.

coordinator0
12-16-2011, 03:47 PM
Only if Grubbs leaves in free agency. If not I don't see any way we draft a G high, unless we plan on moving Yanda to C.

TACKLE
12-16-2011, 04:01 PM
I'm kind of preparing myself for that possibility. Rice and Flacco are going to want to get paid and I suspect Grubbs could get more money somewhere else. Hopefully it gets worked out and guard isn't a need for us come draft day.

coordinator0
12-16-2011, 04:11 PM
A lot of this depends on fre agency. Ozzie is pretty good at bringing in competent vets in at positions of need so we don't have to draft specficially for need. I agree with preparing for Grubbs to leave though, Rice is going to get a lot of money whether we re-sign him or give him the franchise tag. Flacco has one more year left after this so I don't really expect a new deal for him until next offseason, Ozzie usually waits until the rookie contracts are up until he hands out new deals. Then we've got Johnson and Redding to consider as well as a few other guys who were RFAs this past offseason.

So while we're on the topic of drafting guards, would anybody be upset with Cordy Glenn in the first round? Like TACKLE said it depends on the board but LG could be a glaring need if we don't re-sign Grubbs and don't sign anybody in FA. DeCastro would obviously be the best pick but I doubt he will be available when we draft. I'm not too familiar with Washington.

Sloopy
12-16-2011, 08:46 PM
I would almost rather resign the guys we have, we probably have the most dominant pair of guards in the game, why change it.

TACKLE
12-16-2011, 09:37 PM
So while we're on the topic of drafting guards, would anybody be upset with Cordy Glenn in the first round?

Yes I would.

Sloopy
12-16-2011, 10:17 PM
Yea to be honest I really dislike Glenn as a prospect. I would almost rather draft any other guard and I'm not even for drafting a guard. Zeitler will most likely be available if Glenn still is (despite the fact that Zeitler is the better player) and I would rather take a reach on him if we went that route

coordinator0
12-16-2011, 11:31 PM
I would almost rather resign the guys we have, we probably have the most dominant pair of guards in the game, why change it.

That might not be possible though. Grubbs is probably going to get a nice contract and we might not be able to afford that with Rice and our other free agents. That and we just gave Yanda a new contract, it's not common to see teams tie a lot of money up in the G position.

Sloopy
12-16-2011, 11:33 PM
That might not be possible though. Grubbs is probably going to get a nice contract and we might not be able to afford that with Rice and our other free agents. That and we just gave Yanda a new contract, it's not common to see teams tie a lot of money up in the G position.

True especially with other team needs about, I just hate the idea of losing Grubbs :(

Ravens1991
12-18-2011, 09:17 PM
I still have a CB high on our draft board. If Janoris Jenkins falls to us we should jump all over him.

Sloopy
12-19-2011, 12:06 PM
I still have a CB high on our draft board. If Janoris Jenkins falls to us we should jump all over him.

I've been saying this for awhile now. I like Smith and he will improve but having another guy on the other side would be great, this would allow us to keep Webb at nick where I think he can dominate.

TACKLE
12-27-2011, 04:07 AM
A little different but I really like what all these guys bring to the table. I've watched as much of Silatolu as I could find and all I can say is the guy is a beast. He has a ton of upside as a guard and expect him to be a similar level prospect to Will Rackley, maybe better.

1. Alshon Jeffery (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DV0VbLqNLrU), WR, South Carolina
2. Amini Silatolu (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rPH62vxL0TI&feature=player_detailpage#t=362s) (#57), G, Midwestern State
3. Jeff Demps (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bW4X664GRt0), RB, Florida
5. Omar Bolden (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0DcSvFtjXQ), CB, Arizona State
6. Demario Davis (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=insE7hE_Czs), LB, Arkansas State (make sure you watch the play at 1:24)
7. Travis Benjamin (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAs139pLqsY&feature=related), WR, Miami

Ravens1991
12-27-2011, 12:57 PM
I think Donta Hightower will be the pick if he is at our position. Ozzie loves players from his alma mater and Hightower is a versatile LB with good attitude.

TACKLE
12-27-2011, 01:06 PM
I think Donta Hightower will be the pick if he is at our position. Ozzie loves players from his alma mater and Hightower is a versatile LB with good attitude.

If we take him in the first, I'll be pissed. I like the guy and I like how he plays but he's just soooo slow.

Ravens1991
12-27-2011, 01:17 PM
I havent seen enough of him but from what I read he has the "play like a Raven" player. How do you think he would fit into our defense?

TACKLE
12-27-2011, 01:27 PM
I havent seen enough of him but from what I read he has the "play like a Raven" player. How do you think he would fit into our defense?

I would agree that he 'plays like a Raven'. I guess he'd be a thumper LB who struggles in space but we already have 3 of those. However, Saban does use him as a DE in nickel situations and he thrives there. If JJ leaves in FA, I would be a lot more supportive of the pick if we played him at SLB because personally, I think SLB in a 34 is his best fit.

With that being said, it wouldn't surprise me one bit if we did take him.

But check him out for yourself. This was one of his best of the year.

2KevyJyNu8U

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 02:25 PM
If we take Donta Hightower in the first I'll be ******* livid. I'd take him as a thumper at the end of the second, but I'll be damned if we choose him as the heir to Ray. Hightower is going to get TORCHED in coverage against the uberathletic TE's that run show on the NFL nowadays. I'm already crying inside picturing Hightower trying to cover Gresham down the seam.

Sloopy
12-27-2011, 11:49 PM
The dude just has no speed or burst whatsoever. He has been affective as a DE but I don't know how well that will translate to the NFL (him lining up as a DE, I know guys like Suggs do it, I just don't see HIM doing it).

We already have 2 other guys with his skill set on our team we need to add a guy to compliment those two for the future.

I think Taze may fall to us and if not then we may have to wait a year to get our guy, maybe target T'eo next year. Although I wasn't that high on him this year over the other two, I wouldn't mind him next year.

If I could have my pick of likely scenarios:

Round 1: Taze (Mike Adams back up pick)
Round 2: Devier Posey (Back up pick Chris Polk)
Round 3: Ben Jones (Back up pick Sean Spence)

TACKLE
12-30-2011, 03:49 PM
I really have no interest in taking an OT outside of the top 4 guys. I'm far more comfortable with Oher moving back to LT than I am replacing McKinnie with one of those next tier guys from this awful senior OT group.

coordinator0
01-01-2012, 06:19 PM
I want a LB or two that can cover. Get it done Ozzie.

Sloopy
01-01-2012, 10:29 PM
I want a LB or two that can cover. Get it done Ozzie.

It's weird but I would almost rather have Kuechly fall to us than Taze and I love me some Taze.

Sloopy
01-09-2012, 10:12 PM
While the chances that Burfict falls to us have certainly been increased, it is still unlikely we see him on the board come our pick (especially the deeper we get into the playoffs :) ). Guys like Mike Adams and Konz are obviously great consolation prizes, but lets say they don't make it to us either.

Trying to find a guy who may be around at the bottom of round one, I am falling more and more in love with the idea of taking Upshaw as a BPA.

He certainly could play outside and pass rush, but I like his versatility and the fact that he has the ability to move inside. Whether he plays outside for most plays and base packages and only switches inside for pass rush situations when we bring in Krug, or if he just permanently stays inside, I like the idea of adding another versatile, impact player to this defense.

Thoughts?

America
01-15-2012, 08:17 PM
With Birk likely to retire, Konz is getting higher on my list. I think Gurode is on a 2 year deal so he could start next year but I think Konz could be a decade long starter.

coordinator0
01-15-2012, 08:30 PM
Birk was a FA after this season anyways so Konz doesn't really move up my board, where he was pretty high anyways. Besides the report came from Casserly and Birk has already disputed that report:

Aaron Wilson

Matt Birk on whether he'll retire: "No, I haven't made that decision yet and I don't know Charley Casserly. I don't even know who he is, I don't know him, he didn't talk to me. I don't think it's unique for someone in my situation to contemplate it. I'm just focused on the moment. After the season, there will be pleny of time to figure out what I'm going to do next year.

Konz in the first round or Brewster/Jones in the second sounds good to me regardless.

SeanTaylorRIP
01-15-2012, 08:43 PM
I'm a big Kendall Wright fan, unlike Torrey who is simply a deep ball guy Wright's explosiveness and athleticism translates to the full route tree. Having two explosive guys like him and Smith with Boldin/Pitta/Dickson/Doss working the inside, Joe Flacco would have no more excuses.

coordinator0
01-16-2012, 04:44 PM
Wright is a first round pick I wouldn't mind. I would prefer getting a receiver with size since we lack that big threat on the outside but Wright is good prospect. Of course we actually already have two guys with explosive speed, just one of them was hurt for the first half of the season and Flacco doesn't seem to have chemistry with him at all now. Evans is under contract for another year though so maybe he does something next season.

I want to bring back the RB debate. In my opinion we shouldn't spend a high pick on the position since we're already going to be investing quite a bit in Rice this offseason and we have other holes that are more important to fill with a 1st-3rd round pick. I don't envision a 1st round scenario at all where a RB would be the best pick and even in the 2nd round it would be tough to justify from my point of view. There's a few guys projected in the 3rd round that seem to be good values at this point but still I would rather look somewhere else. Of course this all depends on what the situation is when we pick but I really want us to focus on another position. Especially if Cameron is back...

drd23
01-16-2012, 11:16 PM
The Ravens are looking likely to get a 4th round compensation pick for Dawan Landry. Maybe we use that pick on a guy like Isaiah Pead?

TACKLE
01-17-2012, 01:45 AM
I want to bring back the RB debate. In my opinion we shouldn't spend a high pick on the position since we're already going to be investing quite a bit in Rice this offseason and we have other holes that are more important to fill with a 1st-3rd round pick. I don't envision a 1st round scenario at all where a RB would be the best pick and even in the 2nd round it would be tough to justify from my point of view. There's a few guys projected in the 3rd round that seem to be good values at this point but still I would rather look somewhere else. Of course this all depends on what the situation is when we pick but I really want us to focus on another position. Especially if Cameron is back...

Given that our offense rides one player as much as anyone in the league, I think it's pretty important to have someone behind him who can step in a continue to play at a high level. I actually really like Ricky's contribution this year. He doesn't have the ability to rip off random big runs like Willis did but he's very reliable and you can count on him getting four-five yards every time he touches the ball. Still, I'm not sure anyone really sees him as a long term solution. If Ray goes down, it's hard to see the offense taking a big step back. On a team that is clearly run first, you gotta think it's pretty key to have a talented #2 back long term.

Now coordinatior, where should we draft one? I'd be fine with a RB anywhere outside of round 1 but like you said, it really comes down to value. If we can get a better value in the 4th round, I'd be on board with passing on one early. But if the value with there in the 2nd round, I'd support that as well.

Sloopy
01-17-2012, 09:30 AM
Given that our offense rides one player as much as anyone in the league, I think it's pretty important to have someone behind him who can step in a continue to play at a high level. I actually really like Ricky's contribution this year. He doesn't have the ability to rip off random big runs like Willis did but he's very reliable and you can count on him getting four-five yards every time he touches the ball. Still, I'm not sure anyone really sees him as a long term solution. If Ray goes down, it's hard to see the offense taking a big step back. On a team that is clearly run first, you gotta think it's pretty key to have a talented #2 back long term.

Now coordinatior, where should we draft one? I'd be fine with a RB anywhere outside of round 1 but like you said, it really comes down to value. If we can get a better value in the 4th round, I'd be on board with passing on one early. But if the value with there in the 2nd round, I'd support that as well.

It's true that we probably need another guy who can step up and run the ball should Ray go down.

I personally feel that a top 100 pick is too high for a running back that your going to sit on the bench but if the value is there and certain other players are off the board, then I guess I wouldn't mind it so much.

My issue is when people mock us one with a talented player at a position of need is on the board.

A Perfect Score
01-17-2012, 09:31 AM
It's true that we probably need another guy who can step up and run the ball should Ray go down.

I personally feel that a top 100 pick is too high for a running back that your going to sit on the bench but if the value is there and certain other players are off the board, then I guess I wouldn't mind it so much.

My issue is when people mock us one with a talented player at a position of need is on the board.

I'd be very alright with Chris Polk in the 2nd for Baltimore.

coordinator0
01-17-2012, 09:45 AM
Given that our offense rides one player as much as anyone in the league, I think it's pretty important to have someone behind him who can step in a continue to play at a high level. I actually really like Ricky's contribution this year. He doesn't have the ability to rip off random big runs like Willis did but he's very reliable and you can count on him getting four-five yards every time he touches the ball. Still, I'm not sure anyone really sees him as a long term solution. If Ray goes down, it's hard to see the offense taking a big step back. On a team that is clearly run first, you gotta think it's pretty key to have a talented #2 back long term.

Now coordinatior, where should we draft one? I'd be fine with a RB anywhere outside of round 1 but like you said, it really comes down to value. If we can get a better value in the 4th round, I'd be on board with passing on one early. But if the value with there in the 2nd round, I'd support that as well.

That's just the thing, do we really need to draft one? Williams still has a year left after this season and I don't think we'll be cutting him this offseason. Of course he's not a long-term option but for another year he's fine. I'd rather pick through the cheap free agents for a backup RB than waste a draft pick on one, especially a high pick. Sure if Rice went down we'd be in trouble but I don't think that's a particularly strong argument since it could be made for any position.

Sloopy
01-17-2012, 09:48 AM
I'd be very alright with Chris Polk in the 2nd for Baltimore.

Would you be with an Audie Cole or Mike Brewster still on the board?

GoRavens
01-20-2012, 12:07 AM
31-27
This is it boys.
I see this game being one to remember.
Obviously, the team is hard at work in preperation to not only stop New Englands passing game, but attack it as well.
Known for stuffing any running game, Baltimores defense will shy away from loading the box, instead relying on a tight inside pass rush and mostly nickle packages.
#1 Problem is Gronk. If he's doing deep, surely Reed will shadow, but underneath look for Pollard to deliver the hit.
Wes Welker is tough to handle in space, so tackling will be essential.
Our D must;
- Be physical at the line; jam the recievers and be relentless.
- Mixed up inside stunt blitzes to force Brady outside the pocket.
- Communicate and play nasty.
----
I see the Ravens D coming out strong in the first half.
Ray Rice will get his chances and capitalize.
Ravens fluster Brady and eliminate Welker at the line.
31-27 RAVENS

coordinator0
01-20-2012, 06:44 PM
I really hope we end up with one of the top 4 centers. The free agent class is pretty uninspiring and I'd rather not bring back Birk or Gurode. Right now I'd say our targets should be LT, C, ILB, WR, S, DE, and CB in that order. Throw in OLB before WR if Johnson leaves.

TACKLE
01-22-2012, 11:18 PM
We gotta get faster and more athletic at linebacker.

coordinator0
01-22-2012, 11:40 PM
We gotta get faster and more athletic at linebacker.

AKA just say no to Hightower.

Ravens1991
01-22-2012, 11:42 PM
If we have Ray coming back next season we MUST Get Taze!!!!!!

TACKLE
01-22-2012, 11:56 PM
You guys know how much I love Taze but if for some reason that doesn't work out, I would be totally on board with Zach Brown from UNC even if he isn't the best fit in a 34.

Ravens1991
01-23-2012, 12:03 AM
True i could live with a 43 of McClain/Lewis/Brown at LB if we get him.

TACKLE
01-23-2012, 02:33 AM
True i could live with a 43 of McClain/Lewis/Brown at LB if we get him.

I didn't mean move to a 43, I meant play him inside next to Ray.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 09:07 PM
I would like to know your thoughts on.....

Pick #29 CB Janoris Jenkins which moves CB Jimmy Smith over to FS Eddie Reed's replacement

Ravens1991
01-23-2012, 09:14 PM
I would keep Smith at CB he is too talented to not be a CB. I will be fine w/ Jenkins,Webb,Smith. That would be a sick ass trio

Sloopy
01-23-2012, 09:19 PM
I didn't mean move to a 43, I meant play him inside next to Ray.

I have often thought about this as a BPA move.

I think he could put on a few pounds to help as well... I'm not completely opposed to it and it's growing on me as an option if Taze Kuechly Konz and Mike Adams are off the board.

He's kind of right there with Alshon Jeffery and Courtney Upshaw for me

Sloopy
01-23-2012, 09:20 PM
I would like to know your thoughts on.....

Pick #29 CB Janoris Jenkins which moves CB Jimmy Smith over to FS Eddie Reed's replacement

I might be a bit opposed after he measured up to 5'9" today, if he could be a #1/#2 type I would be okay with it but I'm just not as sure anymore with his height.

I know that these triangle #s aren't the end all be all, but being 5'9" makes it tough.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 09:29 PM
I might be a bit opposed after he measured up to 5'9" today, if he could be a #1/#2 type I would be okay with it but I'm just not as sure anymore with his height.

I know that these triangle #s aren't the end all be all, but being 5'9" makes it tough.

Not implying he is the same exact guy, but Finnegan has been a terror with his size & in all actuality Jenkins is the #1 CB off the board this year if it weren't for the off the field issues.

thegreatone
01-23-2012, 09:36 PM
I hope you guys have finally realized we don't need to draft a CB in the 1st.

Ravens1991
01-23-2012, 09:38 PM
yea but when do you ever draft for need. There is a legit chance that Jenkins is the BPA at our pick. Its not like Cary WIlliams is a stud

Sloopy
01-23-2012, 09:41 PM
I hope you guys have finally realized we don't need to draft a CB in the 1st.

I would only be for it in a last case scenario type deal but I will say that the best way to eventually replace Reed might be to have a solid CB corps.

If Jimmy Smith becomes the #1 guy we hope he will be, it would be nice to get a guy who would push Webb down into the nickel position where we can really utilize his blitzing ability and he is generally flat out dominant.


Not implying he is the same exact guy, but Finnegan has been a terror with his size & in all actuality Jenkins is the #1 CB off the board this year if it weren't for the off the field issues.

The odds are against him and to be honest I would still probably take Claiborne first

coordinator0
01-23-2012, 09:43 PM
I would like to know your thoughts on.....

Pick #29 CB Janoris Jenkins which moves CB Jimmy Smith over to FS Eddie Reed's replacement

That's an absolutely terrible idea. One of Smith's biggest advantages is his size for the CB position and since he can turn in man coverage very well there's no reason to turn him into a S. We bb would be far more likely to be moved there since that's where he actually played in college but I'd rather keep him at CB too since he's another guy that can stick in man coverage. My god that's just a bad idea.

SeanTaylorRIP
01-23-2012, 09:44 PM
I think the Ravens are going to stack for a super bowl maybe not best move for the future and getting depth but I think a bold move in the draft should be made , if you can land one big impact player to this team I think they would have succeeded. I think a trade up for an impact player who falls a bit would be a nice move, If Blackmon starts falling move up for him, maybe even a move up for Kendall Wright in the mid 15's range, or trading up for a starer like Reily Reiff or Jonathan Martin.

Sloopy
01-23-2012, 09:45 PM
That's an absolutely terrible idea. One of Smith's biggest advantages is his size for the CB position and since he can turn in man coverage very well there's no reason to turn him into a S. We bb would be far more likely to be moved there since that's where he actually played in college but I'd rather keep him at CB too since he's another guy that can stick in man coverage. My god that's just a bad idea.

Yea I completely didn't see that he wanted to move Jimmy to safety... I'm totally against that

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 09:56 PM
After all quite a few of you thought Jimmy would be a headcase due to his history while in college.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 09:59 PM
Yea I completely didn't see that he wanted to move Jimmy to safety... I'm totally against that

I never said anyone in your camp suggested he move. I just feel it would be valid to make him Eddie's replacement since he has the range to cover ground which he displayed Sunday off the tip drill.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 10:00 PM
I would only be for it in a last case scenario type deal but I will say that the best way to eventually replace Reed might be to have a solid CB corps.

If Jimmy Smith becomes the #1 guy we hope he will be, it would be nice to get a guy who would push Webb down into the nickel position where we can really utilize his blitzing ability and he is generally flat out dominant.




The odds are against him and to be honest I would still probably take Claiborne first

Please tell me how are you going to go about doing so.........

Sloopy
01-23-2012, 10:05 PM
Please tell me how are you going to go about doing so.........

I didn't say we would.

You said that he was probably the 1st CB off the board if it weren't for the off the field issues. I disagree.

If I had my choice of the two, I'd take Claiborne.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 10:10 PM
I didn't say we would.

You said that he was probably the 1st CB off the board if it weren't for the off the field issues. I disagree.

If I had my choice of the two, I'd take Claiborne.

I was hypothetically speaking...Everyone "knew" he would be the #1 guy coming in if he were still at UF. Now for him to be dethroned, that would have been up to him facing the same exact WRs Claiborne would face.

coordinator0
01-23-2012, 10:36 PM
After all quite a few of you thought Jimmy would be a headcase due to his history while in college.

Please, show me where "we" said that "we" said that. Pretty much all of the Ravens fans that I remember backed the pick since Smith really hadn't done anything the last 2 years in his college career and didn't do anything to show he would be a headcase this year.

Using one play to say he should move to safety... dear lord that's bad.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 10:43 PM
Please, show me where "we" said that "we" said that. Pretty much all of the Ravens fans that I remember backed the pick since Smith really hadn't done anything the last 2 years in his college career and didn't do anything to show he would be a headcase this year.

Using one play to say he should move to safety... dear lord that's bad.

Not specifically saying you Ravens, just speaking in general and yes some viewed Jimmy as a potential Safety during the draft process.

America
01-23-2012, 11:38 PM
Taze, Konz, or Mike Adams are my top guys at this point. I'd be very happy with either but Taze would be perfect.

coordinator0
01-24-2012, 12:18 AM
Not specifically saying you Ravens, just speaking in general and yes some viewed Jimmy as a potential Safety during the draft process.

That's great, he's still shown nothing that suggests he should be moved to S. People viewed him switching to that position only because they looked at his size and assumed he wouldn't be able to stick with receivers in the NFL. It's not the case and moving him to S is a bad idea.

TACKLE
01-24-2012, 05:13 AM
I think the Ravens are going to stack for a super bowl maybe not best move for the future and getting depth but I think a bold move in the draft should be made , if you can land one big impact player to this team I think they would have succeeded. I think a trade up for an impact player who falls a bit would be a nice move, If Blackmon starts falling move up for him, maybe even a move up for Kendall Wright in the mid 15's range, or trading up for a starer like Reily Reiff or Jonathan Martin.

Good point STRIP. I'm all in for going all in this year. With the exception of some O-Line questions, were pretty set across the board and have no real glaring needs. I'd be all for moving up if it meant getting a instant difference maker with a someone like Kendall, Alshon, Mike Adams, maybe Kuechly, maybe DeCastro or hell, if he slips through the cracks and gets into the teens...maybe even Trent Richardson. I'd much rather trade up and get a bonafide stud and work on re-signing the guys we have than go out and spend any money in FA.


And shylo, your Janoris-Jimmy Smith idea sucks. Just drop it.

A Perfect Score
01-24-2012, 08:46 AM
Yeah Shylo, GTFO our forum until you know what you're talking about. 99% of the Ravens fans around here were huge fans of both Jimmy Smith and his fit on the Ravens. We supported the pick and the player, still do. His INT in the endzone of the AFC championship signified good things to come...Dear god was that beautiful. Really looking forward to see what he can do with a full offseason under his belt.

As far as stacking this offseason, I'm all for it. You know who I'd like us to take a look at? Someone like Vincent Jackson. I know Q makes alot of money, but if we strengthen the offensive line through the draft and really splurge on a playmaker on offense, I think we could make a huge run next season. This FA class has absolutely insane talent at the WR position...

Or hell guys, how about this idea...Mario Williams?

TACKLE
01-24-2012, 09:47 AM
As far as stacking this offseason, I'm all for it. You know who I'd like us to take a look at? Someone like Vincent Jackson. I know Q makes alot of money, but if we strengthen the offensive line through the draft and really splurge on a playmaker on offense, I think we could make a huge run next season. This FA class has absolutely insane talent at the WR position...

Or hell guys, how about this idea...Mario Williams?

Plain and simple, no. Flacco, Rice, Grubbs, Webb, JJ, Redding and Birk all need new deals. We will open up some money by cutting Foxworth, Carr and possibly McKinnie/Evans but that money needs to be spent on securing the young talent we do have - the first four names I listed in particular.

GoRavens
01-24-2012, 09:59 AM
TOP 10 MOST LIKELY TO BE RAVENS DRAFT PROSPECTS OF 2012

1) OLB Courtney Upshaw, Alabama.
2) LT, Jonathan Martin, Stanford.
3) DE, Melvin Ingram, South Carolina.
4) OG/C, David DeCastro, Stanford.
5) WR, Michael Floyd, Notre Dame.
6) ILB, Vontaze Burfict, Arizona State.
7) DE, Jared Crick, Nebraska
8) OT, Mike Adams, Ohio State.
9) WR, Alshon Jeffrey, South Carolina
10) DE, Devon Still, Penn State
- I guarantee you 1 of these guys will be a Raven next year.

Sloopy
01-24-2012, 10:09 AM
TOP 10 MOST LIKELY TO BE RAVENS DRAFT PROSPECTS OF 2012

1) OLB Courtney Upshaw, Alabama.2) LT, Jonathan Martin, Stanford.
3) DE, Melvin Ingram, South Carolina.
4) OG/C, David DeCastro, Stanford.5) WR, Michael Floyd, Notre Dame.
6) ILB, Vontaze Burfict, Arizona State.
7) DE, Jared Crick, Nebraska
8) OT, Mike Adams, Ohio State.
9) WR, Alshon Jeffrey, South Carolina
10) DE, Devon Still, Penn State
- I guarantee you 1 of these guys will be a Raven next year.

Highlighted are the guys that I would want to look at in the first round. I would throw Konz into the mix though and I am starting to like Tac's idea about Zach Brown if none of the others fell to us.

I would like Crick if he fell to us in 2nd round (depending on who else is available) or the 3rd as a straight up value pick.

Not a fan of still and his inconsistencies. He seems like a fat albert type who played well this season to get payed. Just not a huge fan, probably gone before we pick anyway.

Not a fan of Ingram in the first. I feel there are other positions which could be addressed.

Sloopy
01-24-2012, 10:12 AM
As far as stacking this offseason, I'm all for it. You know who I'd like us to take a look at? Someone like Vincent Jackson. I know Q makes alot of money, but if we strengthen the offensive line through the draft and really splurge on a playmaker on offense, I think we could make a huge run next season. This FA class has absolutely insane talent at the WR position...

Or hell guys, how about this idea...Mario Williams?

I would be okay with this if we get our guys signed first. I feel like big money will need to be shelled out to Rice and Webb and if there is a big purse left over we NEED to sign Grubbs. After that maybe Birk if he doesn't retire.

I would just hate to give up Grubbs so we could sign a V-Jax or a Mario Williams. This team was a legit SB contender this year and I while adding to it is nice, I would not wish to do so at the cost of subtraction in other areas.

niel89
01-24-2012, 05:49 PM
Taze, Konz, or Mike Adams are my top guys at this point. I'd be very happy with either but Taze would be perfect.

I'm completetly with you on these guys. I love Taze from a pure talent point of view. I think we could keep him in line with a real strong locker room. Konz would be great to play at guard for a year and then kick him over to C after Birk retires. I would also love to grab Mike Adams if he is still there. I'm worried that some of these guys are going to be gone before our pick. I'm sure that some talent will fall though.

Ravens1991
01-24-2012, 06:20 PM
About the people we need to resign, I dont think we should re-sign redding, birk or JJ. I like them but we have Jones/McPhee so that money can go for a big time play making WR to make a run for. I love JJ too but he offers nothing as a pass rusher and the chances of the Jets over paying for him are about 1000000000000 to one. Also I can bullrush Birk the dude is done.

drd23
01-25-2012, 07:23 AM
I wouldnt be getting your hopes up thinking about signing big name FAs.

We are projected to have about $6-7m in cap space after tendering ERFAs and RFAs. Cutting Foxworth saves $5.6m. Cutting Carr doesnt save much because he just got a new contract, so there will be a significant amount of guaranteed money that would need to be accelerated into the 2012 cap

We will be doing something similar to last off-season (i.e. small signings, picking up cast-offs from other teams that we think we can rejuvenate etc)

thegreatone
01-25-2012, 11:58 AM
I think one sleeper FA would be Steve Smith.

I don't know why he went to Philly in the first place, but he looked healthy for the most part. Just buried in the depth chart.

After his year off, I don't see why he couldn't get back in to NYG form. The guy is exactly what we need. Neither Boldin or Smith are dependable route runners, so Smith fills in to that void perfectly.

Basically a low risk high reward signing.

Fdmstng99
01-26-2012, 09:15 AM
Would like the Ravens to pick Konz, Birk is just done. What Wilfork did to him just sealed his fate that he needs to retire. Maybe if they can resign Gurode and put him back a C then draft one of the top ILB. Maybe Burfict or Hightower.

America
01-26-2012, 11:26 AM
I think Gurode would be a nice, relatively cheap signing if Birk hangs 'em up. He'd be able to fill in admirably at center and allow us to target some bigger holes should we lose some key guys.

Sloopy
01-26-2012, 12:16 PM
Would like the Ravens to pick Konz, Birk is just done. What Wilfork did to him just sealed his fate that he needs to retire. Maybe if they can resign Gurode and put him back a C then draft one of the top ILB. Maybe Burfict or Hightower.

Hightower would be a terrible pick. Just does not fit our system IMO. We already have two slow guys who can't really cover at the position.

I would like to hear what everyone else thinks about the Zach Brown option. I know Tack brought it up and I posted my opinions but was wondering how the rest of you guys felt.

I think that he could put on a little bit of weight, even 10 lbs and be solid for us at the position, possible top 10 talent that might fall into the bottom of round one or early round 2.

All this in the event that Burfict or others don't fall to us of course. Then again; maybe even as a straight up second option to Burfict.

I'm not really sure how I feel about it. If Mike Adams was there I'd have a hard time passing him up but Zach Brown might present a BPA option that Ozzie loves and certainly has the intelligence/athleticism to take over for Ray when he is done.

As I said, he would probably need to add a few pounds to help him not be so soft in the tackle but with the guys we have up front occupying blockers, I don't think it would be too much of a problem if he could hit say, 240? He looks like he could even put on more than that but he might start to loose some of his speed/agility at that point.

The more I think about him the more I like him as an option if Burfict isn't there and even if we got Adams in the first, and he was available in the middle of round two (doubt that happens) I'd be all for trading up and nabbing him.

thegreatone
01-28-2012, 10:18 AM
I would absolutely love Zach Brown.

He really don't even need to add weight. Just look at Timmons. They share a very similar skill-set. He would give us some much needed speed at LB position, not to mention hes a good pass-rusher as well.

A Perfect Score
01-28-2012, 10:19 AM
I don't think Brown makes it to us. He's a fast riser, and teams like the Eagles and Lions really need those type of LBs.

drd23
01-28-2012, 05:12 PM
Mike Adams has played his way out of our range in the draft in the Senior Bowl

Maybe Martin might slips to us now though?

A Perfect Score
01-28-2012, 05:41 PM
Mike Adams has played his way out of our range in the draft in the Senior Bowl

Maybe Martin might slips to us now though?

Except Martin is horrendously overrated and I wouldn't take him at our 1st rounder.

coordinator0
01-28-2012, 09:29 PM
We're getting Burfict at 29, that's all there is to it.

thegreatone
01-28-2012, 11:15 PM
We're getting Burfict at 29, that's all there is to it.
Fine with me.

Sloopy
01-29-2012, 09:33 AM
I don't think Brown makes it to us. He's a fast riser, and teams like the Eagles and Lions really need those type of LBs.

If Taze goes off the board and Adams is too high, then I would be willing to trade up and get this guy.

Although, I think he may slip as 4-3 teams will likely not be looking at him in the first round and I doubt many 3-4 teams would.

The Eagles probably nab either Taze or Kuechly the Lions probably at least try to address that OL.

4-3 OLB just tend to fall, I know this guy is a special talent but teams just tend to not value the position in the first round.

Also, while they aren't the same player, I'm sure that Curry has hurt his stock a little.

TACKLE
02-02-2012, 04:50 AM
I saw you guys discussing something in a mock draft that coincides with something I've been thinking about for a while. I really like Dont'a Hightower as an SOLB in a 34 - possibly even more so than Upshaw. I always loved it when Saban kicked him down to DE in nickel situations and let him pass rush off the edge. They actually did this a fair it. He's explosive out of his stance, obviously he's strong and powerful but also has some natural bend and finesse off the edge. He plays with heavy hands and excels and at stacking and shedding blocks which is just what you need from a guy who can set the edge on the strong side. We all know about his issues in coverage but his coverage would be better than most DE conversion guys coming out of college. If we took him for that role, I could easily see myself getting on board with that pick (if he's moved to OLB only).

This would obviously be only JJ doesn't return. I would rather keep Kruger as a pass rushing DE because that's what he is and that's what he does best. I don't really see him as someone I want playing opposite of our primary pass rusher though I would have no problem if his role as a pass rusher was a expanded.

....it's a damn shame Sergio sucks.

5NsR3WOpteg

Sloopy
02-02-2012, 07:37 AM
I'd be willing to take him in the second if he was still available and depending on who is still on the board

TACKLE
02-03-2012, 04:25 PM
1(30) Mike Adams, OT, Ohio State
2(62) Shea McClellin, LB, Boise State
3(94) Joe Adams, WR, Arkansas
5(163) Jerry Franklin, ILB, Arkansas
6(205) Jonas Gray, RB, Notre Dame
6(208) Jaye Howard, DT, Florida
7(246) Mike Harris, CB, FSU
7(250) Keshawn Martin, WR, Michigan State
7(251) Kyle Wilber, DE/OLB, Wake Forest
7(254) Chase Ford, TE, The U


APS and I just finished the forum mock and looking at the class now, I must say I think we got some pretty excellent value and value was our #1 priority.

Our first 3 picks were all made before Senior Bowl started and all guys drew rave reviews and boosted their stock big time with outstanding performances in Mobile. Not to mention Jaye Howard who looked very impressive, has a ton of athleticism and seems like a great depth piece at either the 3 or the 5 tech. Mike Adams at 30 and Joe Adams at 94...are you kidding me!?! Those got to be two of the biggest steals in the draft. I think Howard goes in the 3rd round in real life so getting him at the end of the 6th was highway robbery.

Jerry Franklin isn't a flashy pick but he's a strong instinctive MLB with nice range and allegedly has 4.60 speed. He's been the leader and stud in the middle of Arkansas's D for the last two year.

Jonas Gray is a big back with a well rounded skillset. He was having a great year for the Irish before he hurt his knee. Not quite sure when he gets back fully healthy but he has a lot of upside as a complimentary power back.

Mike Harris is regarded by a lot of FSU fans as their best CB despite being the name that gets mentioned the most. Tough savy player with a ton of experience inside, looks like a long time player as a #3/#4 CB.

Coordinator0 turned me onto Keshawn and think he could legitimately compete for the #4/#5 spot on this team and brings more speed to the offense.

Kyle Wilber is a project but a very talented athlete with a lot of upside as a potential edge rusher who should go a couple rounds earlier .

Chase Ford had an excellent Shrine week and as moved up and is the #6 TE on National Football Post's board. Very little production but a guy with some big time physical ability that was well worth a flyer at the end of the 7th.

Only thing that's unfortunate is that we didn't get a center but after the first bunch, the value really dropped off and we didn't want to reach. Presumably we could some some JAG in free agency who would be just as good as a guy in the 5th/6th round.

All in all, I'm very pleased with the amount of highly talented and versatile athletes we brought in.


Thoughts?

A Perfect Score
02-03-2012, 04:45 PM
I felt like we did a really great job, as per our usual M.O. It is unfortunate that we couldn't snag an interior OL that we liked, but the value was way too depleted at the end of the 2nd and it got gutted through the 4th, where we didn't have a pick.

The late round legwork was mostly done by TACKLE, I'm behind this year. He pretty much offered up some thoughts on players we could approach in Round 4-7. I think Jaye Howard and Jonas Gray would be steals where we got them, and the first 3 guys are all great value.

coordinator0
02-03-2012, 05:52 PM
We got Martin? A+ draft. No I'm not biased...

Seriously, that looks pretty good. Adams probably won't last that long in mocks anymore but it would be a great pick. Not so sure McClellin is a great fit across from Suggs. Adams is another guy that seems to be rising but would also be a good addition. I'm not really familiar with most of the other picks. But yay Keshawn Martin! Instant solution to our returner holes and he could be a pretty effective slot guy. Still throwing out the Antonio Brown comparison for him.

Sloopy
02-06-2012, 09:08 PM
So I know I've been pushing Brewster in the second for us as well as Ben Jones as an option...

but I would really like to consider Amini Silatolu OL Midwestern State.

Guy weighs in at 6'3" 324 Lbs, played LT in college but obviously moves to guard at the next level.

Athletic (reported 5.35-5.5 fourty) for a guard and plays with a nasty demeanor. By all accounts has a nasty initial punch and is dominant in the run game.

I know it's tough to tell with division two prospects but the guy seems pretty legit and is starting to shoot up on the scouting radar.

ChefMike
02-07-2012, 07:48 AM
I know I'll get crucified for saying this but why go after a lineman in the 1st rd? Our Team Speed on Defense is lacking and we need that infusion of youth on that side of the ball. Ozzie always seems to put together a group of talented people for the OL every year. Everyone complained about that talent at the OL this past off season and every game they came up big in someway when we needed it. I'm not saying don't address it.. just don't address it in the 1st rd.

Sloopy
02-07-2012, 08:29 PM
I know I'll get crucified for saying this but why go after a lineman in the 1st rd? Our Team Speed on Defense is lacking and we need that infusion of youth on that side of the ball. Ozzie always seems to put together a group of talented people for the OL every year. Everyone complained about that talent at the OL this past off season and every game they came up big in someway when we needed it. I'm not saying don't address it.. just don't address it in the 1st rd.

I don't know why you think you'd get crucified... there are few linemen in this draft that I'd be willing to take in the first round. Pretty much Mike Adams or De'Castro, maybe Konz.

ChefMike
02-07-2012, 11:27 PM
Mainly because in the past if you speak your mind or have a legit idea to bounce around you get flamed for three days before you see someone have an intelligent comment about your statement or question! That's most of the reason I haven't been on in months... but with the draft back in less than 90 days I couldn't stay away long!

Sloopy I'm glad you agree on some level about the OL situation...

Sloopy
02-08-2012, 06:56 AM
Sloopy I'm glad you agree on some level about the OL situation...

Yea, I think that for the most part I have my eyes set on addressing ILB in the first, maybe a WR.

I would like to take a look at Amini Silatolu in the second or maybe third depending on where he ends up on most GMs boards but I think he could be an amazing replacement for Grubbs.

Other options in the second that I would consider would be Hightower so that we could move him outside.

I think a LB corps of Suggs-Brown/Taze-Lewis-Hightower would be pretty sick

coordinator0
02-08-2012, 07:20 PM
I know I'll get crucified for saying this but why go after a lineman in the 1st rd? Our Team Speed on Defense is lacking and we need that infusion of youth on that side of the ball. Ozzie always seems to put together a group of talented people for the OL every year. Everyone complained about that talent at the OL this past off season and every game they came up big in someway when we needed it. I'm not saying don't address it.. just don't address it in the 1st rd.

The only OL I realistically see us having a shot at is Konz. Adams isn't going to fall to us now and I hope Martin doesn't either. Anybody else would be a reach at this point.

I disagree with bold the part though. The offensive line is easily as big of a weakness as any other area on the team in my opinion. If Grubbs leaves we have 3 legitimate needs along the OL. McKinnie will still be on the team and will probably be the starter but I count LT as a need since McKinnie is terrible. The OL was bad this year, there's no way around it. Sure they didn't flounder every snap but it was bad overall that we need a change. If we had the opportunity to improve it with a 1st round pick I would do it without hesitation.

Our team speed on defense needs to be improved, but all that really comes down to is the LB unit. Our secondary is plenty fast and deep (at least at CB) and we're not going to spend a 1st round pick there anyways. Dennard doesn't seem to be a great pick in the first anymore and I'm not sure that Jenkins would be a good pick either. Just don't think we really need a CB anymore, a rotation of Webb-Smith-Williams is pretty good. Carr isn't as bad as he was this season either.

With the way our scheme uses DL speed isn't a huge factor so I'm not seeing anything improving there. Not that I wouldn't mind taking a DE high, I don't think Redding will be back and we need another guy at the position. Preferably I would take somebody that would allow Jones and McPhee to remain in similar roles that they have now but getting another rotational player doesn't seem like a terrible idea anymore either.

So that comes down to the LBs. To improve our team speed there with a first round pick there's only two realistic options - Burfict and Brown. I'm on-board with either of them at 29 and they are two of my top options for our pick. I'm not sure who I would prefer if Konz and Burfict were both available though. Burfict seems like a great option to take over for Lewis at MLB (not necessarily lead the defense) but he's such a risky prospect. On the other hand Konz seems pretty close to a sure thing but the positional value might not be as high. I guess you could consider Upshaw as an upgrade to our speed at LB but I don't think he would add much in that area. I still think he would be a good replacement/upgrade for Johnson.

TACKLE
02-08-2012, 08:44 PM
So I know I've been pushing Brewster in the second for us as well as Ben Jones as an option...

but I would really like to consider Amini Silatolu OL Midwestern State.

Guy weighs in at 6'3" 324 Lbs, played LT in college but obviously moves to guard at the next level.

Athletic (reported 5.35-5.5 fourty) for a guard and plays with a nasty demeanor. By all accounts has a nasty initial punch and is dominant in the run game.

I know it's tough to tell with division two prospects but the guy seems pretty legit and is starting to shoot up on the scouting radar.


If you remember, I had us taking him in the 2nd round of a little 7 round mock projection I did a while back. I'm a big fan of his. Violent on contact, natural bender, very good athlete. Obviously coming from a small school he'll need a little more time to develop but in the little bit I've seen of him, he has a lot of ability.

America
02-08-2012, 08:48 PM
Has anyone watched a lot of film on Bruce Irvin (OLB from WVU)?

Sloopy
02-08-2012, 09:15 PM
If you remember, I had us taking him in the 2nd round of a little 7 round mock projection I did a while back. I'm a big fan of his. Violent on contact, natural bender, very good athlete. Obviously coming from a small school he'll need a little more time to develop but in the little bit I've seen of him, he has a lot of ability.

I really hope we target this guy in round 2. We are in a perfect position to take him at the top of his range and I REALLY want him.

coordinator0
02-09-2012, 07:21 PM
I really hope we target this guy in round 2. We are in a perfect position to take him at the top of his range and I REALLY want him.

Provided we don't bring Grubbs back of course. I'm starting to think there's a good chance we're able to retain him but it's hard to say what kind of contract he's going to want. Cutting Foxworth and restructuring/extending Reed would open up a lot of cap space. If Flacco gets a new deal I don't think it would affect much since he has about a $8 mil. cap hit this year and any extension wouldn't affect our cap room until next season. If Webb gets a big offer as a RFA that could screw things up. Honestly I'm fine with letting Johnson and Redding go at this point. Redding more so than Johnson but I'm starting to hope we change things up schematically just a bit. Nothing to substantiate that hope though. :(

Sloopy
02-09-2012, 07:46 PM
Yea I would obviously prefer to keep Grubbs if we can (if it ain't broke don't fix it) but if not, I can't see a better (realistic for our spot) replacement option in this draft

A Perfect Score
02-09-2012, 07:49 PM
Has anyone watched a lot of film on Bruce Irvin (OLB from WVU)?

I have. I'm a huge fan. I think he's got the potential to be one of the best pass rushers from this class and an impact guy at the next level. Personally, I'd have no problem with him at 26, but he does alot of stuff very similar to Sergio Kindle, so I don't know if we'd take him there (all depending on how the coaching staff feels about him, obviously).

GoRavens
02-09-2012, 11:36 PM
Bobby Wagner and Bruce Irvin are two interesting names.
Wagner is arguably the best (definite top 3) ILBs and will be gone before round 3.
Irvin has a fantastic burst off the edge and could be a nice pickup in the 4th.

A Perfect Score
02-10-2012, 09:52 AM
Bobby Wagner and Bruce Irvin are two interesting names.
Wagner is arguably the best (definite top 3) ILBs and will be gone before round 3.
Irvin has a fantastic burst off the edge and could be a nice pickup in the 4th.

The 4th...who the hell are you? Irvin is going in the Top 40 picks.

Sloopy
02-10-2012, 11:08 AM
Yea he will most likely be gone at the bottom of the 2nd round or the top of the first.

I like him as a prospect but he isn't one of the guys I'm targeting for us.

We might be able to nab him with our 2nd rounder but I would like to get an OL at that spot.

GoRavens
02-10-2012, 11:36 AM
The 4th...who the hell are you? Irvin is going in the Top 40 picks.

I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.

Sloopy
02-10-2012, 12:02 PM
I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.

First of all calm down.

2nd of all: I agree with your assessment of the kid. However, his athleticism, motor and speed will get him picked up earlier than his skill set would allow because it does give him such upside.

In a weak pass rusher class the kid probably goes in the top of the third but someone in desperate need may take him as early as a late 2nd.

Skill wise with upside I'd actually have to probably retract my statement above and give him an early-mid third range, but like I said, someone may reach on him

coordinator0
02-10-2012, 12:52 PM
I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.

He played DE on a 3-man line this year. Still put up pretty decent numbers. I'm not sure if he goes in the top 40 but he isn't lasting any later than the 2nd round either.

A Perfect Score
02-10-2012, 01:44 PM
I strongly disagree with you, so sit back and learn something dickhole.
Irvin may be a great athlete as a passrusher, he's also got great speed and a relentless motor, I'll give it to you.
But what Irvin doesn't have is size, and not just is he extremely undersized for the position but he doesn't have any experience in coverage for a 3-4 scheme. Put that together with offering pretty much nothing as far as run support, and you have a very raw unpredictable pass rusher.
But an ignorant know it all like you might know that pass rusher is one of, if not the hardest position to translate to the NFL.
Especially for undersized/athletic type guys, We've seen it happen so many times before.
On top of all that, did you watch any WVU games this year? As a full time starter he declined big time from his breakout year 2 years ago. He's weak at the point of attack, gets lost in space, and will only offer a situational pass rush at best in the NFL. I like the guy, but its the truth.
I'd bet you 500 dollars right now he won't go in the top 40.

You know who else has zero experience in coverage as a prospect? Aldon Smith. How did his rookie year go? How about Brooks Reed? Neither had any experience in coverage and both played excellently this season. There are many, many prospects playing OLB in a 3-4 who didnt do it whatsoever in college. Ryan Kerrigan is another one, just from last year.

Extremely undersized? I'll buy that he's smaller, but he's far extremely undersized. Von Miller is 6'3 245, same as Irvin. Aaron Maybin was 6'4 245, and he was taken 11th overall for his pass rush ability, the same thing that will elevate Irvin's stock. You're an absolute moron if you think he'll be available in the fourth.

GoRavens
02-10-2012, 02:17 PM
Cliff Avril - 3rd round
Elvis Dumervil - 4th round
Mark Anderson - 5th round

- Elvis Dumervil fell to the 4th round and the same thing will happen to Irvin. You might ask, why did Dumervil fall so far after such a productive college career?
Same exact issues Irvin has.. Size, run support, consistency, strength.
If you're comparing Kerrigan, Aldon Smith and Brooks Reed to Bruce Irvin you're a fool.
All 3 of those players are so much more physical and stronger than Irvin it's not even funny.
If you're so sure, let's get a written agreement, if Bruce Irvin goes in the first 40 picks I will pay you 500 dollars, put your money where your mouth is boy

coordinator0
02-10-2012, 03:59 PM
He wasn't comparing them as prospects so much as he was comparing the lack of experience they had in coverage coming out of college. The transition from NCAA 4-3 DE to NFL 3-4 OLB is pretty common. Guys who played DE aren't going to have any/much experience in coverage.

Now comparing Irvin to Avril is interesting. Irvin had more production coming out of WVU than Avril did at Purdue but they're similar types of pass-rushers.

coordinator0
02-17-2012, 02:18 PM
Alright lets say Konz, Burfict, and Floyd are all available when we pick. Who do you go with? I don't think all 3 of those guys will be available when we pick, Floyd least of all, but I'm trying to come up with different situations we could be in come April. That and the activity around here has been lacking lately.

A Perfect Score
02-17-2012, 02:21 PM
Floyd, definitely. He's a Top 15 talent.

niel89
02-17-2012, 02:29 PM
I'd go Floyd > Konz > Burfict. Floyd just is too talented to fall to us. Konz is a need and a good value. Burfict could work our and be great but the other two are just safer and still good value.

coordinator0
02-17-2012, 02:49 PM
I'd go Floyd > Konz > Burfict. Floyd just is too talented to fall to us. Konz is a need and a good value. Burfict could work our and be great but the other two are just safer and still good value.

That's where I'm at right now. Like I said before I don't actually think Floyd will fall to us but there seems to be a lot of dissent on the top WR prospects. Floyd would definitely be my choice out of the three. I think Cameron would actually be able to use Boldin, Smith, and Floyd effectively at the same time and with Rice and Dickson/Pitta also on the field that makes a dangerous passing game on paper. Of course the OL would have to hold up long enough to let Flacco stand in the pocket.

A Perfect Score
02-17-2012, 04:50 PM
That's where I'm at right now. Like I said before I don't actually think Floyd will fall to us but there seems to be a lot of dissent on the top WR prospects. Floyd would definitely be my choice out of the three. I think Cameron's replacement in 2013 would actually be able to use Boldin, Smith, and Floyd effectively at the same time and with Rice and Dickson/Pitta also on the field that makes a dangerous passing game on paper. Of course the OL would have to hold up long enough to let Flacco stand in the pocket.

Fixed it for you.

coordinator0
02-18-2012, 12:38 PM
Fixed it for you.

We can only hope. I have faith in the front office but not Harbaugh's personnel decisions. :(

Sloopy
02-18-2012, 06:58 PM
I think that Floyd is obviously an intriguing prospect should he fall to us but since I sincerely doubt he does in any realistic situation, it's hard to put him in rank order with anyone else.

I guess the best way to put this is to actually rank by position what I would like to address.

1. ILB
2. OL
3. WR
4. OLB

If a viable 1st round ILB falls to us, I would really like to pick him up, flat out. Addressing this position in the first and the OL in the 2nd would be ideal. The only OL I would be okay taking in the first OVER an ILB would be Adams, Reiff, DeCastro, and Kalil but I doubt any of them fall to us.

Interestingly enough though, I have had a shift in my philosophy about ILB.

I seriously think that Zach Brown should be our #1 target in this draft. I love Taze and would not be disappointed to pick him up. However, Brown seems to be an elite prospect that people are letting slip down boards.

Reportedly weighing in at 237 now, the guy is clearly putting on weight to fit the NFL LB mold. Furthermore, he is expected to run about a 4.3 40.

He won't bring the hard hitting tenacity of Taze but he may be a safer prospect and have just as much upside at this point.

The combine should be huge for Brown and I imagine he will shoot up boards after the fact, just like every other prospect we decide that we want :P

Still want to target Silatolu in the 2nd and is another guy I am hoping doesn't end up rising past our pick but I'm starting to fear that he will :(

Ravens1991
02-18-2012, 07:20 PM
I agree im starting to consider we need a guy who can at least somewhat cover all these freak TEs. and with Browns speed he has the potential too

Sloopy
02-18-2012, 08:58 PM
I agree im starting to consider we need a guy who can at least somewhat cover all these freak TEs. and with Browns speed he has the potential too

If he can run a 4.3 forty at 240ish lbs I think there is no doubt he should be our #1 guy.

GoRavens
02-21-2012, 04:54 PM
I've reworked the latest mock draft most suited to address all of the Ravens major needs. Tell me what you guys think..

1st) C, Peter Konz.

2nd) OLB, Vinny Curry.

3rd) ILB, Audie Cole.

4th) WR, Jordan White.

5th) LT, Nate Potter.

6th) RB, Brandon Bolden.

7th) NT, Dominique Hamilton.

Sloopy
02-22-2012, 05:34 AM
Still wouldn't be psyched about an OL in the first. I've watched Konz throughout his career and while I think he will be a solid starter, I don't see him being overly special.

Meanwhile, we could address ILB with a top guy.

In that case I would want to address OL in the 2nd were there is some real value to be had and I see some real stud interior OL prospects.

3rd round would obviously change in that case.

Rest of the draft looks good, not sure is Potter makes it to the bottom of the 5th though.

coordinator0
02-25-2012, 11:25 AM
I keep going back and forth on what kind of OLB we should be looking for to replace Johnson if he leaves. Should we be looking for somebody in the same mold, basically a SLB where pass-rushing isn't the most important skill or are we looking for a pass-rusher first? I would prefer a slight scheme change where we send both OLBs at the QB consistently but I don't think we've done that since Thomas was here (and from what I remember he wasn't used as a traditional 3-4 OLB either). The reason I ask is because I see prospects like Perry, Mercilus, Branch, Curry, etc. mocked to us/around our pick and while I like the potential for a better pass-rush none of those guys seem to fit well in the role that Johnson has now.

Sloopy
02-25-2012, 02:53 PM
Zach Brown:

6'1 and 244 lbs 33 1/4 arm length and 9 1/2 hands

I know I said that we probably won't draft this guy as few will think of him as an inside guy but I WANT him so bad.

Talk about a Ray Lewis mold... pretty much the exact size that he came in at, athletic and plays well in pass coverage.

And the guy still probably puts up a freakish 40 time

As far as your comment Co:

I really don't know what we do with that OLB spot, I imagine it evolves based on who we put there.

I wouldn't be okay taking a pure pass rush artist as we could just plug Kruger in there if we are only going to have position rushing the QB.

coordinator0
02-25-2012, 03:25 PM
I have this bad feeling that we're going to end up with Hightower in the 1st round. We drafted the last player I preached so thoroughly against and he did play pretty well for us last year, but in my defense I was convinced we were going to switch to a base 4-3 defense and he didn't fit what we need for that very well. Anybody remember who it is? :D

Sloopy
02-25-2012, 04:19 PM
Silatolu looked pretty awesome at the combine today. Definitely only had me falling harder for the kid

A Perfect Score
02-25-2012, 04:25 PM
Zach Brown:

6'1 and 244 lbs 33 1/4 arm length and 9 1/2 hands

I know I said that we probably won't draft this guy as few will think of him as an inside guy but I WANT him so bad.

Talk about a Ray Lewis mold... pretty much the exact size that he came in at, athletic and plays well in pass coverage.

And the guy still probably puts up a freakish 40 time

As far as your comment Co:

I really don't know what we do with that OLB spot, I imagine it evolves based on who we put there.

I wouldn't be okay taking a pure pass rush artist as we could just plug Kruger in there if we are only going to have position rushing the QB.

TACKLE and I just drafted Brown in the Forum Mock.

Ravens1991
02-25-2012, 06:46 PM
It would be cool to get the MD local here. He was in my region for wrestling and boy the guy was a freak. Won MD state track title as a senior and jogged the last part of the sprint. I would like him.


But I agree I got a feeling we will take a hard look at Hightower. Hightower seems like a JJ kind of player. Can stuff the run, blitz, even put his hand in the dirt but will just be embarassed if asked to cover these freak TEs who keep popping up

Ravens1991
02-25-2012, 06:54 PM
Also if Brown didnt lose any speed while bulking up to 245 he will be a top 20 pick at worst. We would have to traade up for him. His scouting report is the same that Ray had back in his day. Hopefully he becomes half as good as Ray.

Sloopy
02-25-2012, 06:57 PM
TACKLE and I just drafted Brown in the Forum Mock.

Yea I have been high on him for a bit now but started to doubt that anyone is looking at him as an ILB in the 34.

Him running a nice 40 at that weight might put him above us. Then again, 4-3 OLB rarely get drafted high even though they might be a great prospect

Ravens1991
02-25-2012, 07:00 PM
He is getting compared to lawrence timmons and timmons was a top 25 pick. I think we will be too far back to grab him

Sloopy
02-25-2012, 07:13 PM
We need to stop talking him up because when we don't select him I'm'a be'a so'a sad :(

Heck, maybe if we stop talking about him and Silatolu, their stock won't rocket up higher than our pick like everyone else we talk up.

coordinator0
02-26-2012, 12:35 AM
It would be cool to get the MD local here. He was in my region for wrestling and boy the guy was a freak. Won MD state track title as a senior and jogged the last part of the sprint. I would like him.


But I agree I got a feeling we will take a hard look at Hightower. Hightower seems like a JJ kind of player. Can stuff the run, blitz, even put his hand in the dirt but will just be embarassed if asked to cover these freak TEs who keep popping up

If we used him in Johnson's role I would have no problem with taking him, but I'm worried that we would plug him in at ILB. I wouldn't value him in the 1st round though.

Sloopy
02-26-2012, 08:26 AM
If we used him in Johnson's role I would have no problem with taking him, but I'm worried that we would plug him in at ILB. I wouldn't value him in the 1st round though.

It would be a waist of his coverage skills to put him in JJ's spot.

Also, with his weigh in and possible 40 time, he probably shoots up boards and will be valued in the first

coordinator0
02-26-2012, 09:13 AM
It would be a waist of his coverage skills to put him in JJ's spot.

Also, with his weigh in and possible 40 time, he probably shoots up boards and will be valued in the first

Hightower's coverage skills? ;)

EDIT - I was referring to the second part of his post and everything I wrote was about Hightower. Brown would definitely be an ILB in our system and worth a first round pick.

TACKLE
02-26-2012, 09:14 AM
Stephen Hill?

coordinator0
02-26-2012, 10:33 AM
Doesn't really seem like our kind of pick. I can't remember the last time we took one of the guys who significantly increased his stock postseason with one of our high picks.

Sloopy
02-26-2012, 11:05 AM
Stephen Hill?

I'd take him in the third depending on who is available and what we have already locked up.

If we resign Grubbs and get an ILB and C with the first two I'd be ecstatic.

If we have to burn one of the first two on a guard to replace Grubbs, I might be more interested in who is still available at C. Obviously if we can't get a value at C with the 3rd pick I would be okay with it.

TACKLE
02-26-2012, 11:08 AM
I'd take him in the third depending on who is available and what we have already locked up.

good luck with that. he's a top 45 pick.

TACKLE
02-26-2012, 11:19 AM
Kendall Wright's disappointing forty isn't bad news....for us. :D

Sloopy
02-26-2012, 11:20 AM
good luck with that. he's a top 45 pick.

I still think he is a bit raw though. Everyone knew he was going to come in and blaze at the combine but it's a question of his hands and route running ability.

A team might become enamored with him and take him in round two (If Al was still around and they had a 2nd round pick I'd have him as all but a lock to the Raiders) but I still see him as a mid to late third kind of guy.

coordinator0
02-26-2012, 03:07 PM
Kendall Wright's disappointing forty isn't bad news....for us. :D

I'm not sure about his first run but I saw the second one and it looked like he stumbled a bit right at the start. I doubt he falls to us, he should light it up at his pro day.

TACKLE
02-26-2012, 03:08 PM
I'm not sure about his first run but I saw the second one and it looked like he stumbled a bit right at the start. I doubt he falls to us, he should light it up at his pro day.

Yeah his starts looked off on both his runs. I hold a very high opinion of him as a football player but 5'10 WR's who run 4.61 don't tend to go early.

TACKLE
02-26-2012, 03:24 PM
Sure he's probably been coached up a little but he actually doesn't interview too poorly at all. I liked how he was willing to speak candidly. This is actually the first press conference or filmed interview had since he first arrived at ASU.

http://www.baltimoreravens.com/media_library/Videos/2012/02/Burfict_Im_The_Best_Linebacker_In_The_Draft.aspx?i d=03f21616e80d4c07945d2752a77f3bfb

TACKLE
02-27-2012, 01:08 PM
Dont'a Hightower with a 4.62. I don't know if he plays to that speed but it certainly makes him a more appealing option.

coordinator0
02-27-2012, 01:13 PM
Dont'a Hightower with a 4.62. I don't know if he plays to that speed but it certainly makes him a more appealing option.

While Burfict runs a 4.93 and 5.10. The tape shows the opposite for these two guys but now you really have to wonder. Can't wait to see the drills.

TACKLE
02-27-2012, 01:15 PM
While Burfict runs a 4.93 and 5.10. The tape shows the opposite for these two guys but now you really have to wonder. Can't wait to see the drills.

It's pretty bizarre that the one guy plays faster than the other yet runs 5 TENTHS slower.

Ravens1991
02-27-2012, 03:40 PM
Watching that Burfict interview it screams please draft me Ravens. I think we can get him in the late rounds with those 40 times. I would take him there.

A Perfect Score
02-27-2012, 03:55 PM
I don't care that he ran a 4.62, Donta Hightower is still slow as all hell on tape.

drd23
02-27-2012, 05:13 PM
While Burfict runs a 4.93 and 5.10. The tape shows the opposite for these two guys but now you really have to wonder. Can't wait to see the drills.

His other measurements weren't much better

- Didn't bench
- 30" Vert (worst of all LBs)
- 8"8'Broad (2nd worst of all LBs)

Plus, you add on the fact that is was supposedly terrible in interviews and his poor 2011 game film, and that all add up to a mid-late round pick at best

niel89
02-27-2012, 07:01 PM
I don't really want any part of Burfict in the first half of the draft.

Ravens1991
02-27-2012, 09:48 PM
Anyone else tihnk we should consider Janoris Jenkins at 29? Him Webb and Smith would be ridiculous. Having them we can get as crazy as we want with our pass rush because they will be able to handle the quick routes.

coordinator0
02-27-2012, 09:55 PM
Anyone else tihnk we should consider Janoris Jenkins at 29? Him Webb and Smith would be ridiculous. Having them we can get as crazy as we want with our pass rush because they will be able to handle the quick routes.

I don't think we really need him. With Webb, Smith, and Williams we've got a very nice group at CB and I highly doubt Jenkins would start over either Webb or Smith. Carr, Gorrer, and Brown makes it a pretty deep position for us as well. Now if we lose Webb and/or Williams since both are RFAs this off-season that would change my mind a bit but I'm not sold on Jenkins either. To improve our pass-rush we should focus on getting guys that are talented at getting to the QB instead of having to rely on manufacturing pressure with scheme/calls. I'm still not sure what direction the defense will be going with now that Pees is the DC. A replacement for Johnson that can get to the QB would also change the dynamic of our defense.

Ravens1991
02-27-2012, 10:13 PM
If Pees is really a greg mattison clone then we will need elite CBs for a successful D. Getting Jenkins gives us elite CB talent. Jenkins talent is far better then a pass rushers talent we can get at 29. Jenkins can be a impact pro bowl CB, IDK if we can get that at 29 with pass rushers