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JBCX
11-28-2011, 11:31 PM
What is the state of the New York Giants going forward?

At 6-5, with a likely loss to the Green Bay Packers looming on the horizon, and a likely return to .500, will this team miss the playoffs for the third straight year? Or will the team squeak into the playoffs like they did in 2007 and make a playoff run?

If it's the former, is a major housecleaning in order for this franchise? A new head coach?

Other than the 2007 season, Tom Coughlin's squad has been terrible in the latter half of the season after starting hot early in the season. Is this a coaching issue?

Raiderz4Life
11-28-2011, 11:43 PM
It really is starting to look bleak for the Giants. Assuming they lose to the Packers they'd have to run the last 4 games beat the Boys twice and hope Dallas falls one more game. Its going to be tough but its possible, but they really do need to clean the house. Gilbride and Fewell are horrible coordinators.

Thecollegedropout
11-28-2011, 11:57 PM
NYG Gets.....

vs Green Bay
@ Dallas
vs Washington
@ New York Jets
vs Dallas

I see them splitting with Dallas and beating Washington. Jets game is a legit tossup but that game could be one of those games that could nail the coffin on Coughlin as the Jets will make sure to not let up in that game due to the inner city rival and all.

So I see a 2-3 finish to the year and putting the GMen at 8-8 with the losses to Washington and Seattle looking more and more terrible.

Raiderz4Life
11-29-2011, 12:11 AM
Anything under a 4-1 end pretty much seals them missing the playoffs...Dallas would have to just implode massively to miss out.

vidae
11-29-2011, 12:39 AM
It IS Dallas though, so anything is possible.

D-Unit
11-29-2011, 01:13 AM
There's NO WAY the Giants are out of it. Don't be surprised if they beat Green Bay either.

Dallas in December is full of fail. Cowboys Nation is overly confident about how good this team is but I KNOW deep down, both Jason Garrett and Tony Romo will fail this team. If I'm wrong, I'll be thrilled... but as the saying goes... Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me twice (in this case 3, 4, 5...) shame on me. Romo is prone to making bad decisions and Garrett can be an atrocious play caller.

I'm not saying Dallas can't win the division, but this team has a way of imploding. ...especially in December. They have many doubters for a reason. I just saw the movie True Grit... and you what? Dallas has yet to show me True Grit. Funny, but I sit here and my entire hopes are pinned on DeMarco Murray. He's the one and only guy who can take this team on his back. He can make Romo better, force the defense to focus on him resulting in more open looks in the passing game, and make the defense better by keeping them fresh.

gpngc
11-29-2011, 01:14 AM
Answer: It's actually New Jersey.

Saints-Tigers
11-29-2011, 01:23 AM
If anyone is going to put a blemish on the Packers season, I just think it would be the Giants...

Raiderz4Life
11-29-2011, 01:26 AM
There's NO WAY the Giants are out of it. Don't be surprised if they beat Green Bay either.

Dallas in December is full of fail. Cowboys Nation is overly confident about how good this team is but I KNOW deep down, both Jason Garrett and Tony Romo will fail this team. If I'm wrong, I'll be thrilled... but as the saying goes... Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me twice (in this case 3, 4, 5...) shame on me. Romo is prone to making bad decisions and Garrett can be an atrocious play caller.

I'm not saying Dallas can't win the division, but this team has a way of imploding. ...especially in December. They have many doubters for a reason. I just saw the movie True Grit... and you what? Dallas has yet to show me True Grit. Funny, but I sit here and my entire hopes are pinned on DeMarco Murray. He's the one and only guy who can take this team on his back. He can make Romo better, force the defense to focus on him resulting in more open looks in the passing game, and make the defense better by keeping them fresh.
This is my thinking as well but...man...I just don't really want to believe the Cowboys could totally blow it. Seems like you have to try and blow it, but you're right you just never know with the cowboys.

I was remembering the do-or-die game with the eagles a couple years ago and they totally got dominated. So, its anyone's call....if NYG can sweep Dallas and beat Washington they're in decent shape I would think. That week 17 matchup is going to be vital.

Rosebud
11-29-2011, 01:59 AM
*shrug* if this game gets Fewell's head out of his ass and marks a turning point for the OL I could definitely see us going 4-1 the rest of the way...if...guess we'll see next week, whether we keep it close against GB or get blown out will probably tell you the answer.

Halsey
11-29-2011, 02:01 AM
Answer: It's actually New Jersey.

Damnit, you stole my idea!

whatadai
11-29-2011, 02:42 AM
If anyone is going to put a blemish on the Packers season, I just think it would be the Giants...

It all depends on Manning. He has the defense to keep him in the game and the WRs to stretch the field and he'll need to use them effectively to beat Rodgers and his high-scoring passing game.

Ness
11-29-2011, 02:48 AM
It all depends on Manning. He has the defense to keep him in the game and the WRs to stretch the field and he'll need to use them effectively to beat Rodgers and his high-scoring passing game.

The Giants have a defense? Not really. Well, it didn't stop the Saints. They're banged up and allowed over 500 yards of offense tonight. Manning will perform well against the Packers like he did against the Saints. But that defense needs to give him and the offense a break.

whatadai
11-29-2011, 02:57 AM
The Giants have a defense? Not really. Well, it didn't stop the Saints. They're banged up and allowed over 500 yards of offense tonight. Manning will perform well against the Packers like he did against the Saints. But that defense needs to give him and the offense a break.

Give them a break, there are a lot of big injuries on that team. So many that Herzlich was starting and got injured...I really didn't think Herzlich would start a game this year. Manning played well today, but wasn't "elite" like he likes to call himself. That defense has been carrying him for years, he needs to win games by himself sometimes too to be elite. And no I don't think his Superbowl win was a game he won by himself...it should have never gone down to that pass.

ChiFan24
11-29-2011, 02:57 AM
I demand a thread like this for all 31 other teams. Nay, I demand an entire board for all 32 teams.

D-Unit
11-29-2011, 03:05 AM
I demand a thread like this for all 31 other teams. Nay, I demand an entire board for all 32 teams.
The Bears one would be short.

No Cutler, No Playoffs.

Ness
11-29-2011, 03:10 AM
Give them a break, there are a lot of big injuries on that team. So many that Herzlich was starting and got injured...I really didn't think Herzlich would start a game this year. Manning played well today, but wasn't "elite" like he likes to call himself. That defense has been carrying him for years, he needs to win games by himself sometimes too to be elite. And no I don't think his Superbowl win was a game he won by himself...it should have never gone down to that pass.
They aren't stopping anyone. That's the bottom line. Eli Manning played a great game tonight yet again. That defense couldn't even slow down New Orleans. He's a championship-type of quarterback. That doesn't mean he has to throw for 400 yards like Brees or Brady to bail the Giants defense out every game. He's not going to do that for them. But he shouldn't have to. No quarterback should. Not to mention that running game has been awful a good amount of the year. Eli is basically the offense right now. Let's not forget football is a team sport. If it wasn't for Eli the Giants wouldn't even have six wins at this point. They'd be lucky to have three. The Giants defense lost this game tonight.

sbh15
11-29-2011, 03:13 AM
if the giants beat dallas in dallas, their chances actually look pretty good, even with a loss to green bay. they can still make it even with a loss in dallas, as long as dallas loses to one of arizona/tampa bay AND philadelphia. that would pull them even in their records against the division (a tiebreaker) and it would make week 17 a one game playoff, provided the giants beat the jets.

Iamcanadian
11-29-2011, 04:26 AM
I think the Giants are done. For me they need a new HC. Not that Coughlin is terrible or anything and they have a very tough schedule, however, I just don't think the players respond well to their HC anymore. They just need a change to motivate them. They just seem to be going through the motions for the last couple of years.
Eli's game has stagnated, there is no urgency to his play and he just seems to me to be going through the motions. Just my opinion and I really have nothing but observation to base it on.

prock
11-29-2011, 04:41 AM
I agree that the Giants need to clean house this year. Coughlin was very good for them, but it is about time for a change. Same with Philly for me. Two really good coaches who will get shots elsewhere if they want, but it's just time for a change.

Jughead10
11-29-2011, 08:13 AM
Give them a break, there are a lot of big injuries on that team. So many that Herzlich was starting and got injured...I really didn't think Herzlich would start a game this year. Manning played well today, but wasn't "elite" like he likes to call himself. That defense has been carrying him for years, he needs to win games by himself sometimes too to be elite. And no I don't think his Superbowl win was a game he won by himself...it should have never gone down to that pass.

We would be with the Colts battling for the first pick if Eli didn't play this year.

And I agree, we would need to win out after a loss to GB to have a chance. It is possible, but unlikely.

diabsoule
11-29-2011, 08:33 AM
There's NO WAY the Giants are out of it. Don't be surprised if they beat Green Bay either.

Dallas in December is full of fail. Cowboys Nation is overly confident about how good this team is but I KNOW deep down, both Jason Garrett and Tony Romo will fail this team. If I'm wrong, I'll be thrilled... but as the saying goes... Fool me once, shame on you... Fool me twice (in this case 3, 4, 5...) shame on me. Romo is prone to making bad decisions and Garrett can be an atrocious play caller.

I'm not saying Dallas can't win the division, but this team has a way of imploding. ...especially in December. They have many doubters for a reason. I just saw the movie True Grit... and you what? Dallas has yet to show me True Grit. Funny, but I sit here and my entire hopes are pinned on DeMarco Murray. He's the one and only guy who can take this team on his back. He can make Romo better, force the defense to focus on him resulting in more open looks in the passing game, and make the defense better by keeping them fresh.

HAHAHAHAHA!!! The Giants beating Green Bay? I'm ready to start my day after the hearty laugh I had after reading that. After seeing what the Saints did to the Giants last night there's no way the Packers will keep it close with them with Aaron Rodgers leading that offense that runs similar to the Saints.

NY+Giants=NYG
11-29-2011, 09:17 AM
I said it before. We were floating through the water with big time issues, mainly injuries and a piss poor coordinator for a DC. Now against high powered offenses, we are very close to a TKO. I think... no, I am very sure, GB will lay more wood for the TKO. You can't win if your DC insists on rushing 3 and dropping 8 in coverage! We don't have 5 CBs, AND on top of that the fool wants to put no pressure on opposing CBs. Excellent game plan! We did that with Vince Young too. Let him have his sweet old time back there.

I love Coughlin, but I hate his hires for coordinators! If that means cleaning house, then so be it. Get rid of them all!

It's pretty much Eli, JPP, and Cruz, and the rest who seem to have lost faith in Fewell. It's like Bill Sheridan all over again!

tjsunstein
11-29-2011, 09:43 AM
I only watched the first half of last night's game for obvious reasons but I still think the Giants are the toughest game left on the Packers schedule. I'm definitely nervous about it especially since it's going to be a playoff atmosphere in that stadium on Sunday.

Jughead10
11-29-2011, 09:46 AM
I only watched the first half of last night's game for obvious reasons but I still think the Giants are the toughest game left on the Packers schedule. I'm definitely nervous about it especially since it's going to be a playoff atmosphere in that stadium on Sunday.

Doubtful. The Giants will be booed when they come out and if you guys score the first TD, it will get quiet really quickly. The only hope I have for a good crowd is the fact that it is a 4:15 game.

prock
11-29-2011, 09:48 AM
HAHAHAHAHA!!! The Giants beating Green Bay? I'm ready to start my day after the hearty laugh I had after reading that. After seeing what the Saints did to the Giants last night there's no way the Packers will keep it close with them with Aaron Rodgers leading that offense that runs similar to the Saints.

Well I guess we should just call the game then, no need to play it.

DraftSavant
11-29-2011, 11:24 AM
What's the deal with the Giant's training/medical staff? I know injuries happen in the NFL, and I can't quantify this, but they seem to annually be one of the most injured teams in the league.

Damix
11-29-2011, 11:38 AM
What's the deal with the Giant's training/medical staff? I know injuries happen in the NFL, and I can't quantify this, but they seem to annually be one of the most injured teams in the league.


It is awful, and they say Steve Smith won't be able to play till week 9. Of course hes active week 1 for the eagles.

Granted hes clearly not full speed, but still, thats a major mistake there.

nrk
11-29-2011, 11:49 AM
The Giants defensive line has to play better than they did last night (from what I saw, I didn't get to catch all of it).

The Cowboys don't have too tough of a schedule left, so unless the Cowboys falter like we all know they can, the Giants have to play their best ball and hope for a Cowboys collapse.

Well I guess we should just call the game then, no need to play it.

Now if you want to crown them, then crown their ass!

Jughead10
11-29-2011, 11:52 AM
The Giants defensive line has to play better than they did last night (from what I saw, I didn't get to catch all of it).

The Cowboys don't have too tough of a schedule left, so unless the Cowboys falter like we all know they can, the Giants have to play their best ball and hope for a Cowboys collapse.

Technically it doesn't even have to be a collapse. Assuming the Giants lose to GB, if they win their last 4 games, they win the division because they would have beaten the Cowboys twice. The Cowboys can still win every other game as long as they lose to us twice.

Granted all of it is a long shot, but even if/when the Giants lose to GB, they would technically still control their own destiny with games against the Jets, Skins, and Cowboys twice.

Bucs147
11-29-2011, 11:58 AM
HAHAHAHAHA!!! The Giants beating Green Bay? I'm ready to start my day after the hearty laugh I had after reading that. After seeing what the Saints did to the Giants last night there's no way the Packers will keep it close with them with Aaron Rodgers leading that offense that runs similar to the Saints.

Any Given Sunday.

If it wasn't for K2 stupidly dropping a 2-points conversion in the 4th quarter, the freaking Bucs had a pretty good shot at beating these Packers at Lambeau a week after being destroyed by the Texans in Tampa. So I failed to see why it is stupid to think that the Giants *might* beat the Packers in New Jersey.

nrk
11-29-2011, 12:01 PM
Technically it doesn't even have to be a collapse. Assuming the Giants lose to GB, if they win their last 4 games, they win the division because they would have beaten the Cowboys twice. The Cowboys can still win every other game as long as they lose to us twice.

Granted all of it is a long shot, but even if/when the Giants lose to GB, they would technically still control their own destiny with games against the Jets, Skins, and Cowboys twice.

Collapse may not have been the best word choice. The Cowboys should be favorites in their remaining games except possibly @NYG to end the season depending on how the Giants do in the next few weeks. So if they have a bad game and get upset is more what I was referring to.

Jughead10
11-29-2011, 12:03 PM
Collapse may not have been the best word choice. The Cowboys should be favorites in their remaining games except possibly @NYG to end the season depending on how the Giants do in the next few weeks. So if they have a bad game and get upset is more what I was referring to.

Knowing us we will beat them in Dallas only to lose to the Redskins or something like that.

D-Unit
11-29-2011, 12:10 PM
HAHAHAHAHA!!! The Giants beating Green Bay? I'm ready to start my day after the hearty laugh I had after reading that. After seeing what the Saints did to the Giants last night there's no way the Packers will keep it close with them with Aaron Rodgers leading that offense that runs similar to the Saints.
Calm down just because your team beat them yesterday, you don't need to climb that high horse.

Your logic is not sound. Just because the Saints beat the Giants in New Orleans doesn't mean the Giants can't win at home versus the Packers.

Did you have a hearty laugh after your Saints lost to the Bucs and Rams?

D-Unit
11-29-2011, 12:16 PM
I said this before, but I think that both the Cowboys and the Giants will make the playoffs.

Cowboys should win the division. Giants should get the wildcard over the Bears or Lions... with the Falcons getting the other one.

I don't like the Bears chances without Cutler and I don't think Detroit has been playing good football against a good team since they lost Best. Now Stafford has a hand injury affecting his accuracy and Suh is on a 2 game suspension.

Rosebud
11-29-2011, 02:05 PM
What's the deal with the Giant's training/medical staff? I know injuries happen in the NFL, and I can't quantify this, but they seem to annually be one of the most injured teams in the league.

Something about NY/NJ, Buffalo is also cursed with injuries. It just sucks seeing a position get decimated because we lost a starter and then the have every backup have a banged up season. Add to that some injury prone players like Tuck, Nicks and Bradshaw and it's just amazingly frustrating.

Brent
11-29-2011, 03:22 PM
Did you have a hearty laugh after your Saints lost to the Bucs and Rams?
haha, well done.

ChiFan24
11-29-2011, 11:52 PM
The Bears one would be short.

No Cutler, No Playoffs.

Please, they still have a shot to win 3-4 more games and grab the 5 seed. In which case a certain team would be embarrassed in their own billion dollar house.

Ness
11-30-2011, 01:45 AM
HAHAHAHAHA!!! The Giants beating Green Bay? I'm ready to start my day after the hearty laugh I had after reading that. After seeing what the Saints did to the Giants last night there's no way the Packers will keep it close with them with Aaron Rodgers leading that offense that runs similar to the Saints.

You do know that the Saints lost to the Rams right? Anyone could beat anyone in this league. The Giants can certainly beat the Packers in their own house. They almost lost to the Buccaneers on their own turf, who actually beat the Saints this season.

scottyboy
11-30-2011, 01:54 AM
we suck chodeeeeee

D-Unit
11-30-2011, 02:27 AM
Please, they still have a shot to win 3-4 more games and grab the 5 seed. In which case a certain team would be embarrassed in their own billion dollar house.
That's true. I stand corrected. I should've looked at that cupcake schedule first.

CDCB14
11-30-2011, 09:06 AM
Please, they still have a shot to win 3-4 more games and grab the 5 seed. In which case a certain team would be embarrassed in their own billion dollar house.

I saw a post before where you said you wished you played the cowboys in the 1st round? I don't get why? You believe in that cowboys choke crap?

I'm not trying to say the bears aren't good, or that they couldn't win, but I'd take the cowboys in that game the majority of the time. Rob Ryan's defense is perfect for QB's like jay cutler, but I admit forte would pose a problem. But our offense on your defense with a healthy Austin... probably wouldn't be fun for the bears. And please don't bring up week two last year, that game means nothing now. But I digress.

As for the saints fan who said the giants have no chance because of what the saints offense just did to the giants, tell me, when does the NFL ever happen the way you think it does? People are probably predicting rodgers to go off because of what the saints just did, but the game is probably going to be something like 17-14.

It's just the way the NFL works. It's never the way it seems.

ChiFan24
12-01-2011, 01:32 AM
I saw a post before where you said you wished you played the cowboys in the 1st round? I don't get why? You believe in that cowboys choke crap?

I'm not trying to say the bears aren't good, or that they couldn't win, but I'd take the cowboys in that game the majority of the time. Rob Ryan's defense is perfect for QB's like jay cutler, but I admit forte would pose a problem. But our offense on your defense with a healthy Austin... probably wouldn't be fun for the bears. And please don't bring up week two last year, that game means nothing now. But I digress..

I mean I haven't really looked that much into it. I just don't think the Cowboys are very good, and I think the Bears with Cutler are. The Bears feast on mistakes, and Dallas makes them constantly.

JBCX
12-01-2011, 12:42 PM
The Cowboys would make a MESS of that Bears offensive line. Rob Ryan's confusing schemes would send those offensive linemen running around like chickens with severed heads.

I don't doubt that the Bears defense could keep the Cowboys offense reasonably in check, but I am confident that if the Bears were to play against the Cowboys in the playoffs, even with Cutler, the Cowboys defense would keep the Bears offense from scoring more than, say, 17 points at most.

soybean
12-01-2011, 01:23 PM
but the game is probably going to be something like 17-14.It's just the way the NFL works. It's never the way it seems.

yeah... no.

CDCB14
12-01-2011, 05:22 PM
I mean I haven't really looked that much into it. I just don't think the Cowboys are very good, and I think the Bears with Cutler are. The Bears feast on mistakes, and Dallas makes them constantly.

Sounds like all you do is watch cowboys haters on ESPN, but I guess your entitled to your opinion.

If there is one team in the NFC playoff hunt that I would want to play besides maybe the Falcons, it would probably be the bears. Just from a match-up standpoint, I think the cowboys hold an advantage.

ChiFan24
12-01-2011, 07:51 PM
Sounds like all you do is watch cowboys haters on ESPN, but I guess your entitled to your opinion.

If there is one team in the NFC playoff hunt that I would want to play besides maybe the Falcons, it would probably be the bears. Just from a match-up standpoint, I think the cowboys hold an advantage.

Cowboys haters? What are you talking about? Even if there were any on ESPN, nothing I said is hate. The Cowboys do make a ton of mistakes. They're penalized a lot and Romo can be reckless. Defensively, they have only one player that I would classify as worthy of extra attention. The Bears hung 38 on Rex Ryan's Jets last year, and they're pretty much a better version of what Dallas has now. It's not the most pertinent comparison, but it illustrates that the offense won't be completely shut down because the defense throws some cute blitzes at them.

More importantly, I don't really feel like breaking it down because it probably won't happen anyway. But the Bears have a better team than Dallas. That's what I think.

CDCB14
12-01-2011, 08:05 PM
Cowboys haters? What are you talking about? Even if there were any on ESPN, nothing I said is hate. The Cowboys do make a ton of mistakes. They're penalized a lot and Romo can be reckless. Defensively, they have only one player that I would classify as worthy of extra attention. The Bears hung 38 on Rex Ryan's Jets last year, and they're pretty much a better version of what Dallas has now. It's not the most pertinent comparison, but it illustrates that the offense won't be completely shut down because the defense throws some cute blitzes at them.

More importantly, I don't really feel like breaking it down because it probably won't happen anyway. But the Bears have a better team than Dallas. That's what I think.

We can agree to disagree then. I don't really respect the Bears at all. Cutler isn't prone to make mistakes either?

And whose scary on your defense? Peppers? The "bears defense" has been living on rep for a while now. Urlacher? please. Sean Lee is three times the player he is right now. People can keep thinking all the cowboys have on defense is D-Ware, fine by me. Urlacher and DeMarco Murray in the open field wouldn't be good for the bears.

And with a healthy Miles Austin, I'd love to see that cover 2 shell stop Dallas' offense.

But your right, it probably isn't happening, so I digress.

ChiFan24
12-01-2011, 08:47 PM
We can agree to disagree then. I don't really respect the Bears at all. Cutler isn't prone to make mistakes either?

And whose scary on your defense? Peppers? The "bears defense" has been living on rep for a while now. Urlacher? please. Sean Lee is three times the player he is right now. People can keep thinking all the cowboys have on defense is D-Ware, fine by me. Urlacher and DeMarco Murray in the open field wouldn't be good for the bears.

And with a healthy Miles Austin, I'd love to see that cover 2 shell stop Dallas' offense.

But your right, it probably isn't happening, so I digress.

It's okay to admit that you don't watch the Bears. I mean, there really isn't a single part of this post that is correct. Why are you asking me if Peppers is scary? Do you really not know? Do you actually want to make the claim that Sean Lee is a three times better than Brian Urlacher? The same guy that couldn't play over Keith Brooking on early downs last year? I get that he's been very good and made a few plays before he got hurt but Jesus Christ......is Urlacher really that underrated where people think Sean ******* Lee is a better player?

Anyway, I can see that you're trying to play the disrespect card with the Dallas ******* Cowboys of all teams, and if that's the case we're just not going to see eye to eye. But I am going to continue to pray for a playoff matchup with Dallas.

CDCB14
12-01-2011, 08:53 PM
It's okay to admit that you don't watch the Bears. I mean, there really isn't a single part of this post that is correct. Why are you asking me if Peppers is scary? Do you really not know? Do you actually want to make the claim that Sean Lee is a three times better than Brian Urlacher? The same guy that couldn't play over Keith Brooking on early downs last year? I get that he's been very good and made a few plays before he got hurt but Jesus Christ......is Urlacher really that underrated where people think Sean ******* Lee is a better player?

Anyway, I can see that you're trying to play the disrespect card with the Dallas ******* Cowboys of all teams, and if that's the case we're just not going to see eye to eye. But I am going to continue to pray for a playoff matchup with Dallas.

I don't watch the Bears. I'll admit that.

As for Lee vs. Urlacher, i'm pretty sure most people at this point in their careers would pick Sean Lee. Didn't play over brooking last year on early downs? really? Well the same thing can be said for you that you don't watch the cowboys. He was a rookie battling injury. Sean Lee has been balling.

I doubt they end up playing each other, but I think you may end up regretting that prayer if it comes true....

ChiFan24
12-01-2011, 09:46 PM
I absolutely watched the Cowboys because they're on TV so damn often. I'm not sure what you're scoffing at. I saw Lee in some nickel situations, but he wasn't on the field nearly as much as Brooking.

Urlacher vs Lee is an absolutely ridiculous argument. I don't know what more to say about that. Anybody that has seen Urlacher play, and seen what happens to the Bears defense when he doesn't play, would agree. And I fully understand how good Sean Lee was before he got hurt.

SickwithIt1010
12-01-2011, 09:52 PM
I absolutely watched the Cowboys because they're on TV so damn often. I'm not sure what you're scoffing at. I saw Lee in some nickel situations, but he wasn't on the field nearly as much as Brooking.

Urlacher vs Lee is an absolutely ridiculous argument. I don't know what more to say about that. Anybody that has seen Urlacher play, and seen what happens to the Bears defense when he doesn't play, would agree. And I fully understand how good Sean Lee was before he got hurt.

Its alright man, this guy cant see through the homer goggles. Hes still convinced that Romo is the guy thats going to lead his cowboys to the super bowl...

He also tried to convince me that the Colts have had an elite offensive line recently and the players around him were more than enough and that Peyton was the reason they werent winning super bowls.

CDCB14
12-02-2011, 12:37 AM
Its alright man, this guy cant see through the homer goggles. Hes still convinced that Romo is the guy thats going to lead his cowboys to the super bowl...

He also tried to convince me that the Colts have had an elite offensive line recently and the players around him were more than enough and that Peyton was the reason they werent winning super bowls.

Your wrong, plain and simple. Don't go neg repping me and giantsfan because we are right and you can't handle that the eagles are bad.

Romo is better than Vick. He wins more, and plays better. End of story.

As for the colts, they won the superbowl in 2006. They did have one of the better o-lines in football and he had dallas clark, reggie wayne, and a good running game behind him.

Just stop lol. Your wrong. It's ok. Vick isn't as good as you wanted, it's not the end of the world.

JBCX
12-03-2011, 02:44 PM
I absolutely watched the Cowboys because they're on TV so damn often. I'm not sure what you're scoffing at. I saw Lee in some nickel situations, but he wasn't on the field nearly as much as Brooking.

Urlacher vs Lee is an absolutely ridiculous argument. I don't know what more to say about that. Anybody that has seen Urlacher play, and seen what happens to the Bears defense when he doesn't play, would agree. And I fully understand how good Sean Lee was before he got hurt.

Urlacher is an older, descending player. Lee is a younger, ascending player. That's the key difference. As soon as next year, Lee might be heads and shoulders above Urlacher. Right now, Urlacher probably still has the edge but how much longer does that 30+ year old body play in the NFL? Lee is in his second year and has a whole career of Pro Bowl-level play ahead of him.

Ness
12-03-2011, 03:07 PM
Urlacher is an older, descending player. Lee is a younger, ascending player. That's the key difference. As soon as next year, Lee might be heads and shoulders above Urlacher. Right now, Urlacher probably still has the edge but how much longer does that 30+ year old body play in the NFL? Lee is in his second year and has a whole career of Pro Bowl-level play ahead of him.

Urlacher is only 33. That's not that old for a middle linebacker. Especially when you have guys like Ray Lewis and London Fletcher playing into their late thirties.

Raiderz4Life
12-03-2011, 03:20 PM
LMAO did someone really say Sean Lee is 3Xs better than Urlacher? wow that's a gem.

whatadai
12-04-2011, 12:00 AM
Urlacher is only 33. That's not that old for a middle linebacker. Especially when you have guys like Ray Lewis and London Fletcher playing into their late thirties.

While I don't agree that Lee is better than Urlacher...I don't see Urlacher playing at a high level past 35. Age and injuries have really sapped his play-making ability for the past 4 seasons.

Rosebud
12-04-2011, 12:06 AM
While I don't agree that Lee is better than Urlacher...I don't see Urlacher playing at a high level past 35. Age and injuries have really sapped his play-making ability for the past 4 seasons.

A few years back I would've agreed but he's held up pretty well these last couple seasons and avoided the big injury that could end his career.

Mr.Regular
12-04-2011, 12:09 AM
Urlachers still a monster, but he has lost a step. IIRC they even use Briggs in the middle a bit now when they play Tampa 2, and push Urlacher outside, since he can't cover like he used to.

Rosebud
12-04-2011, 12:13 AM
Urlachers still a monster, but he has lost a step. IIRC they even use Briggs in the middle a bit now when they play Tampa 2, and push Urlacher outside, since he can't cover like he used to.

To be fair there aren't many LBs out there that can cover like Lance Briggs. Dude's been the best 4-3 OLB of the 2000's.

ChiFan24
12-04-2011, 09:57 AM
Urlachers still a monster, but he has lost a step. IIRC they even use Briggs in the middle a bit now when they play Tampa 2, and push Urlacher outside, since he can't cover like he used to.

I know Briggs will cover the deep middle from time to time but I think it has more to do with giving the QB a different look. To me, it seems like Urlacher is still an elite cover LB.

As for how much he has left.....I don't know. Probably about as much as you'd expect a typical 33 year old future Hall of Famer to have left. But I still consider him an elite player, not quite what he was 5-6 years ago, but a lot better than Sean Lee.

LonghornsLegend
12-04-2011, 10:10 AM
The typical Giants will beat GB. GB isn't just 11-0 or whatever this season, they have won like 17 straight going to last year and IMO if they don't get a loss out of the way before the playoffs they won't win the SB. I know Rodgers is good but 25 straight wins? That's a bit excessive.


None the less, if NY loses this game, it puts them in a tough spot but certainly not out of it. They just have to win out, and they get a chance to play us twice. Just no telling how that ends up.


If they miss the playoffs you have to fire Coughlin. He's gotten alot of passes due to the SB win which I guess he should, but your wasting alot of good Eli Manning years not in the playoffs. Sucks because he's played very well this year, this is the very first year I've ever been really impressed with Eli.

bigbluedefense
12-04-2011, 11:02 AM
I'm just ready for a change. I think it's time for a change. I really want Mike Zimmer. He's really a perfect fit for what I want on the Giants.

He's a DC, a 4-3 guy, he's aggressive, plays man coverage and cooks up some good blitzes, he's a Parcells disciple, he's NFC East battle tested, he's put in a lot of years in this league, he's not some young up and comer, he's battle tested, he's a disciplinarian, tough mentality, he just seems perfect for what we need.

Every time I see Perry Fewell dial up Cover 2 or Cover 3 with a 3 man rush I want to throw up in my mouth. It's time for a change. We need a guy we can trust year in year out on defense to hold us down for the foreseeable future.

Eli can run the offense by himself. We need a defensive presence in the worst way.

bigbluedefense
12-04-2011, 11:17 AM
One of my favorite pressure packages in the league is the 46 look that Zimmer often does with the Bengals.

He lines up his 4 man line with a wide space in front of the C and G, and he puts both his ILBs in that A gap in a blitzing stance. He puts his SS on the line in the 9 across the LT. Has his FS playing single high, and his CBs line up in press man.

From that formation, he throws a bunch of different scenarios at you. He can drop out of it and play man across the board and 4 man rush, he can bring all sorts of pressure packages with man coverage behind it, he can zone blitz out of it, he can play straight zone with a 4 man rush, etc.

It's his bread and butter, and my favorite part about it is the 46 base formation of it.

He emphasizes A gap pressure, which was a staple of the 46. He's just perfect for what we need on defense. We're built to play 46 defense. We're supposed to be a pressure based, man coverage defense in a 43 shell. He's perfect. Him and Spagnuolo, but I doubt Spags gets fired.

Zimmer is just what we need. I really hope we get him.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-04-2011, 11:19 AM
Make the next HC a DC as well. Finding an aggressive DC is all well and good, but if he actually has success some other team will hire him. Then we are back to musical DCs!

bigbluedefense
12-04-2011, 11:27 AM
Make the next HC a DC as well. Finding an aggressive DC is all well and good, but if he actually has success some other team will hire him. Then we are back to musical DCs!

Exactly. And I'm tired of it. We've had 2 good DCs in the past 17 years or so, Fox and Spags. I'm tired of it.

We don't need an offensive coach. We have Eli, we'll always have a good offense as long as we have Eli, regardless of scheme. But the defense needs stability. The only way to have that stability is with a defensive coach.

Our HC has been an offensive guy since 1993! 1993! Enough already. Let's get back to defense. I'm tired of it.

Tired of this ****.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-04-2011, 11:30 AM
Exactly. And I'm tired of it. We've had 2 good DCs in the past 17 years or so, Fox and Spags. I'm tired of it.

We don't need an offensive coach. We have Eli, we'll always have a good offense as long as we have Eli, regardless of scheme. But the defense needs stability. The only way to have that stability is with a defensive coach.

Our HC has been an offensive guy since 1993! 1993! Enough already. Let's get back to defense. I'm tired of it.

Tired of this ****.

I agree! Only difference is get rid of this offensive system too. I am tired of guys running the wrong routes. Get me an offensive staff that will get these damn dropped and tipped balls under control. This year we had no tipped balls but once again perfect throws, and these fools drop the ball! I want Turner if he shakes lose. Get rid of this PHd system!

And give me a HC who will also be DC too. So this way, if he is good no one will hire him away.

bigbluedefense
12-04-2011, 11:33 AM
HC: Mike Zimmer
DC: Zimmer or whoever he wants to bring with him
OC: Norv Turner

That would be my dream coaching staff, but chances of this happening are 2%.

I don't want Cowher. But he's probably the front runner if Coughlin gets fired.

Rosebud
12-04-2011, 12:53 PM
OC doesn't matter if he doesn't get in Eli's way. Anyone really surprised that the Giants are by far at their best when Eli's the one making the calls?

I'm all for bringing Zimmer in as HC if Spags doesn't get fired. I love both guys although I'd prefer spags so Zim can stay in Cincy for another season, I love the way they play D.

JBCX
12-18-2011, 11:46 PM
Sucky offensive line that generates little push in the running game and allows copious pressure on Eli Manning... Check.

Confused and overmatched secondary that is often torched for long pass plays... Check.

Absolute scrubs at LB who are susceptible to speedy runners on the edge and TEs up the seam... Check.

Two WRs (Cruz and Nicks) and a TE (Ballard) that are quite good but suffer from a case of the dropsies at the most inopportune moments... Check.

Solid defensive line that can dominate at times but also can disappear for stretches of a game or even entire games... Check.

QB that either looks like Dan Marino or a rookie scrub, depending on the game... Check.

hockey619
12-18-2011, 11:54 PM
Sucky offensive line that generates little push in the running game and allows copious pressure on Eli Manning... Check.

Confused and overmatched secondary that is often torched for long pass plays... Check.

Absolute scrubs at LB who are susceptible to speedy runners on the edge and TEs up the seam... Check.

Two WRs (Cruz and Nicks) and a TE (Ballard) that are quite good but suffer from a case of the dropsies at the most inopportune moments... Check.

Solid defensive line that can dominate at times but also can disappear for stretches of a game or even entire games... Check.

QB that either looks like Dan Marino or a rookie scrub, depending on the game... Check.


I agree on all points but the last two. The Dline has looked good and Eli has largely been a boss. The rest is 100% true though.



Is there any team that is more a Dr Jekyll/Mr Hyde than the Giants?

we were 6-2 after beating the freaking pats, after squeaking out a few against some eh teams (bills, dolphins). we were talked about as being one of the best nfc teams. Then the saints stomped us. The pack just slipped by. and we had it taken to us by.......the redskins. how?

Job Reborn
12-19-2011, 12:10 AM
Is there any team that is more a Dr Jekyll/Mr Hyde than the Giants?


The other new york team. The **** is wrong with this town?

Vox Populi
12-19-2011, 01:58 AM
The other new york team. The **** is wrong with this town?

Its because they play in Jersey. They are liars. Its not even the same State.