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View Full Version : Heyward-Bey or Crabtree?


Donno
12-04-2011, 01:01 AM
Okay so maybe I'm bored but my friend is a 9ers fan and I bleed the ol silver and black so let's hear a non-bias view. Who would you take today?

Caulibflower
12-04-2011, 03:25 AM
Heyward-Bey. I'm encouraged by his progress this year, and will be interested to see what he'll be able to do after a full off-season with Carson Palmer. Palmer's really the first QB Oakland has had since Heyward-Bey's been there who is known as a deep passer, and that's what DHB was drafted for. On the other hand, Crabtree was drafted to be a West Coast wideout, a big, strong possession receiver who racked up the catches. He's had that kind of QB his whole career, but has been pretty unimpressive as an open-field runner, and that's not some thing likely to improve much over the rest of his career. DHB has still got his speed, and continues to develop as a receiver. So DHB seems like he still has some potential at this point, while I feel like we pretty much know what kind of player Crabtree is.

nobodyinparticular
12-04-2011, 03:41 AM
Heyward-Bey. I'm encouraged by his progress this year, and will be interested to see what he'll be able to do after a full off-season with Carson Palmer. Palmer's really the first QB Oakland has had since Heyward-Bey's been there who is known as a deep passer, and that's what DHB was drafted for. On the other hand, Crabtree was drafted to be a West Coast wideout, a big, strong possession receiver who racked up the catches. He's had that kind of QB his whole career, but has been pretty unimpressive as an open-field runner, and that's not some thing likely to improve much over the rest of his career. DHB has still got his speed, and continues to develop as a receiver. So DHB seems like he still has some potential at this point, while I feel like we pretty much know what kind of player Crabtree is.

I will say that you are right, Palmer is loads better than the other Raider QBs since DHB was drafted. However, let's be honest; the reason DHB looked bad in the past is because he was bad. He has grown as a receiver so much it's like night and day. Meanwhile Crabtree seems to have stagnated.

Ness
12-04-2011, 03:50 AM
I wonder why Darius Heyward-Bey has been taken out of the Raiders lineup this season. Now it seems like he's playing again, but a few weeks ago I don't think he was playing and it was really weird because there wasn't a report of an injury and I don't recall there being an explanation unless I missed it. He was producing pretty well and around the time they got Palmer he was just taken out of the game plan for guys like T.J. Houshmandzadeh apparently.

Razor
12-04-2011, 04:47 AM
I think if you just look at the big play ability you'd have to say DHB, but I don't see him being consistent enough to be someone the defense needs to scheme against. Crabtree hasn't developed into what most people thought when he first came into the league, but I do think he's a more complete receiver who doesn't have the same big play ability as DHB but is someone with a decent QB could most 80 rec 1200 yard seasons. So I have to go with Crabtree on this one although I think he has been very underwhelming so far.

Donno
12-04-2011, 05:26 AM
Heyward-Bey has been great as a WR run blocker, Idk how good crabtrees done at that but I see that as a big plus.

J-Mike88
12-04-2011, 06:58 AM
I took DHB.

I was just so glad in that draft, that Teddy Thompson wasn't suckered into taking Crabtree instead of BJ Raji.
Thank you KC for taking Tyson Jackson #3 overall.

shylo3716
12-04-2011, 09:21 AM
On Crabtree

I've seen him play once this year. I don't think you would want to give up on him too early in his career. I know this is the NFL, but he had shown at Tech he was capable of putting the team on his back before we found out he was a "Diva". He has a nice receiving supporting cast to not warrant any double-teams, which is a plus for him to dominate a 1 on 1 match up whenever he can.

Rosebud
12-04-2011, 09:25 AM
Hakeem Nicks...DHB the kid's progressing wihle Crabtree's development has been stagnant. If his head ever gets screwed on straight he could still end up better but DHB is pulling up fast and going to pass him as a player within the next the year and if Crabtree doesn't start progressing he'll just pull away.

Rabscuttle
12-04-2011, 09:54 AM
Heyward-Bey has been great as a WR run blocker, Idk how good crabtrees done at that but I see that as a big plus.

Crabtree bought in to the team aspect finally and is doing really well in his blocking assignments. He still drops some balls that shouldn't be dropped and seems close on breaking through. However, the Niners just don't throw the ball often and receivers won't put up the numbers they would with all but a couple teams in the league.

bucfan12
12-04-2011, 10:28 AM
This is the prime reason you can't judge players after a year or 2 in this league. Both Crabtree and DHB are developing and have been contributing this year. I'm anxious to see how they do in there 4th year.

Honestly, It's hard to compare these two right now. DHB has had like several different starting QBs and him and Palmer have not gone through a full offseason together to build that chemistry, so Crabtree has the advantage.

bigbluedefense
12-04-2011, 11:05 AM
Crabtree has been picking it up lately. I think he just needs a better qb. I don't think Crabs can ever become that dominant stud #1 he was made out to be, but I do think he can be much better than he's showing us thus far.

I'm going to take Crabtree, but it's not a lock.

ChiFan24
12-04-2011, 11:11 AM
I voted Crabtree....because he's better. Always has been, and nothing has really changed. I don't really have much more to say than that.

vidae
12-04-2011, 11:22 AM
Can I pick neither?

Don Vito
12-04-2011, 11:54 AM
Hakeem Nicks...DHB the kid's progressing wihle Crabtree's development has been stagnant. If his head ever gets screwed on straight he could still end up better but DHB is pulling up fast and going to pass him as a player within the next the year and if Crabtree doesn't start progressing he'll just pull away.

Mike Wallace...

AntoinCD
12-04-2011, 11:55 AM
Taylor Price...

cmarq83
12-04-2011, 12:00 PM
I'd still take Crabs. He does certain things at the WR position that are so underrated. I can see Heyward-Bey having a colossal year at some point in his career, but I think Crabtree will be more consistent, and if he can get in the right pass happy offense he can be a 100 catch 1300 yard type guy. He may not have the best deep speed, but I think he can certainly be a valuable contributor in an NFL offense.

Brodeur
12-04-2011, 12:02 PM
http://bossip.files.wordpress.com/2011/04/kenny-britt.jpg

Where is this option?

Abaddon
12-04-2011, 12:14 PM
Nicks, as it should have been all along.

phlysac
12-04-2011, 02:18 PM
Heyward-Bey has been great as a WR run blocker, Idk how good crabtrees done at that but I see that as a big plus.

49ers OC Greg Roman on blocking...

I challenge anybody to find any NFL receiving corps that blocks as hard and as well as our receivers. They have been phenomenal. They are inspiring with their effort.

Roman was asked if divas block downfield like Crabtree.

What is a diva anyway? I don't know what that is. All I can tell you is this: Our receivers are extremely physical in their blocking, and it's inspiring to everybody.

From PFW...

49ers WR Crabtree dazzles as blocker.

We've been hearing the following whispers from around the NFC:

• An unsung key to the Niners' surprising success up to now has been the team's tremendous across-the-board blocking. "And the guy that blocks the best is (WR Michael) Crabtree," said one daily team observer. "I mean, it's amazing the way he has been knocking guys down. I'll tell you what: Nobody is calling him a prima donna now."


In my opinion, Crabtree needs two things...

1. Stay Healthy -(he's never participated in a preseason, and has had 2 foot surgeries. He has been on the injury report up until last week, and you can really see it on the field. The Crabtree that started the 2009 season (healthy) and that is playing as we speak (healthy) is looking great. Revolving door at QB in 2010 stunted progression.

2. Consistency with hands. Drops easy ones, catches tough ones, so it's simply a focus issue.


Also, he's done nothing as a 49er to lead anyone to believe he's a "Diva." He's enigmatic, and reclusive, and can come across as aloof. That's not a "me-first diva."

robert pancake gallery
12-04-2011, 02:19 PM
Darrius Heyward-baneling Bust

Abaddon
12-04-2011, 03:24 PM
I wonder why Darius Heyward-Bey has been taken out of the Raiders lineup this season. Now it seems like he's playing again, but a few weeks ago I don't think he was playing and it was really weird because there wasn't a report of an injury and I don't recall there being an explanation unless I missed it. He was producing pretty well and around the time they got Palmer he was just taken out of the game plan for guys like T.J. Houshmandzadeh apparently.

Housh barely plays.

DHB lost snaps to Jacoby Ford and Denarius Moore, two players who are far better than DHB. It was the right decision. DHB is back as a starter due to injury.

DHB doesn't fight for contested passes. Moore and Ford do. With a guy like Palmer at QB, someone who will take some chances trying to give his WRs a chance to make a play, you want WRs out there who know when to play a little DB.

phlysac
12-04-2011, 03:35 PM
And Crabtree does it again.

Shows great route skills on a big first down and then shakes open in the redzone for a likely TD, but drops it.

It's what he's been doing.

shylo3716
12-04-2011, 06:58 PM
Crab looked good today.

nikkayeah
12-04-2011, 09:23 PM
Heyward-Bey has been great as a WR run blocker, Idk how good crabtrees done at that but I see that as a big plus.

crabtree has been destroying fools in the run game. dominant blocking wr

ATLDirtyBirds
12-04-2011, 09:44 PM
Crabtree, no dobut.

nikkayeah
12-04-2011, 09:46 PM
Crabtree, no dobut.

i love dobuts

gpngc
12-04-2011, 09:56 PM
Who the hell is voting for Heyward-Bey? wtf?

Flyboy
12-04-2011, 10:40 PM
crabtree has been destroying fools in the run game. dominant blocking wr

It was one of Crabtree's best attributes coming out of TTU.

PatrickWillis
12-04-2011, 10:47 PM
And Crabtree does it again.

Shows great route skills on a big first down and then shakes open in the redzone for a likely TD, but drops it.

It's what he's been doing.

The pass was a laser at his facemask. Alex still doesn't understand that its extremel;y difficult to react within a split second out of your break and catch a 85 mph football thats on its way towards your grill.

Not too mention all of the routes where Crabtree has beaten people vertically and not been thrown the ball in stride this year.

PatrickWillis
12-04-2011, 10:54 PM
Heyward-Bey. I'm encouraged by his progress this year, and will be interested to see what he'll be able to do after a full off-season with Carson Palmer. Palmer's really the first QB Oakland has had since Heyward-Bey's been there who is known as a deep passer, and that's what DHB was drafted for. On the other hand, Crabtree was drafted to be a West Coast wideout, a big, strong possession receiver who racked up the catches. He's had that kind of QB his whole career, but has been pretty unimpressive as an open-field runner, and that's not some thing likely to improve much over the rest of his career. DHB has still got his speed, and continues to develop as a receiver. So DHB seems like he still has some potential at this point, while I feel like we pretty much know what kind of player Crabtree is.

Horrible point. Run after the catch is his specialty. When he has been thrown passes in stride(ala vs Ari against patrick peterson) he has shown what he can do after the catch. You look at his highlight videos, and you will notice how sparingly he gets a pass thrown in stride.

XxXdragonXxX
12-04-2011, 11:03 PM
Wallace, Nicks, Britt, Harvin, Maclin, Knox, Crabtree, Bey.

PatrickWillis
12-04-2011, 11:24 PM
Wallace, Nicks, Britt, Harvin, Maclin, Knox, Crabtree, Bey.

Wallace- Plays with Ben Roethlisberger.

Nicks-Eli Manning

Britt-similar to Crab, been held back

Harvin-had Brett Favre, now has Ponder.

Maclin-Playing in a wide open eagle offense, with Michael Vick

Knox- Playing in a Mike Martz system. Guess who once produced in a Mike Martz offense? Mike Furrey. Is Mike Furrey better than Crabtree?

Crabtree- plays in a heavy run first offense with a QB who doesn't throw him the ball in stride. Cut the stats-whoring.

XxXdragonXxX
12-04-2011, 11:37 PM
So you're arguing that Crabtree is the best WR in his draft class, and those are the excuses you're using?

I'll give you Knox, and that's about it.

wogitalia
12-04-2011, 11:50 PM
Did I honestly just read those excuses and get to the end of it and still think you weren't pulling the piss?

Please just stop.

PatrickWillis
12-05-2011, 12:52 AM
So you're arguing that Crabtree is the best WR in his draft class, and those are the excuses you're using?

I'll give you Knox, and that's about it.

Maclin- Plays in a pass happy offense. I'd take Crabtree over him. Maclin slightly more of a vertical threat but he isnt close to what Crabtree is after the catch. Crabtree has better hands, hops, more suddenness in his breaks. Maclin is a nice #2 but in terms of overall talent, not stats-whoring, yes I would take Crabtree.

Wallace- I would give you Wallace. He is explosive and gives you a really good homerun threat. Then again, he plays with a QB whose strength is throwing the deep ball. So while I would take Wallace over Crabtree if I was building an offense, you put Wallace on the Niners and he's not doing sh**t.

Nicks- Pick your poison here, very similar. Both strong possession receivers with outstanding RAC ability. Hicks a tick faster, Crabtree slightly better hands. I'd probably take Nicks but it's pretty damn close for me.

Harvin- Had a good game today, but again, this guy played with Brett Favre and played "good football', not great football. He stretches the defense better than Crabtree. Doesn't have the hands that Crab does, not close to the blocker he is. Despite his TD numbers, Crabtree is a better red zone threat. I would also say Crabtree runs crisper routes. I'd take Crab.

Britt- Better jump ball threat than Crabtree, and that's an important trait in a receiver. He's similarly been held back by sub par quarterback play. I would guess that Britt has more deep speed but Crabtree is obviously much more fluid, both in his acceleration and patterns. I would say the hands are even, both are very good at plucking the ball. I would take Crabtree, but again, pretty close.

PatrickWillis
12-05-2011, 12:57 AM
For those of you who haven't watched all the 49er games this year and every play.....Crabtree has created separation vertically on about 6-7 plays that would be 40+ yard gains, but incomplete thanks to a throw from Alex Smith off target by a good 10 yards. Today was only the 2nd time that him and Smith have connected. The ball was in stride, and what do you know? Crabtree catches it and scores a TD. What a coincidence.

There's also been about 3 TD's in the red zone left out there on the table thanks to Alex.


Quarterback play is very contingent on a receiver's success. I thought you all knew that by now. How has Austin Collie done without Peyton Manning this year? Exactly.

whatadai
12-05-2011, 01:19 AM
^ and this is why SF will never be a great team even if they're having one great season. yes, alex smith sucks, but not everything is his fault. crabtree is a bum. the only wr he's better than in that class is dhb and at least dhb tries to learn and isn't a diva.

nikkayeah
12-05-2011, 01:51 AM
^ and this is why SF will never be a great team even if they're having one great season. yes, alex smith sucks, but not everything is his fault. crabtree is a bum. the only wr he's better than in that class is dhb and at least dhb tries to learn and isn't a diva.

crabtree is far from a diva