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PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 12:35 AM
I wanted to see what everyone else thought, those without the 49er red and gold goggles. Ranking every QB in the league and how many you would take over Alex Smith. The reason for this is that some awfully moronic 49er fans seem to think he is a top 10 QB and that we should absolutely re-sign him.

Also, try not to ***** stats.



1) Rodgers
2) Brady
3)Brees
4)Peyton Manning
5)Roethlisberger
6) Eli
7)Romo
8)Rivers
9) Schaub
10) Vick
11) Stafford
12) Cutler
13) Cam Newton
14) Flacco
15) Freeman
16) Dalton
17) Ponder
18) Hasslebeck

Guys that are on par with him

Bradford
Kolb
Fitzpatrick
Palmer
Cassell
Tarvaris Jackson



p.s. All I want for christmas is a new QB

vidae
12-12-2011, 12:38 AM
Cassel is not on par with Alex Smith. Alex Smith is better.

MetSox17
12-12-2011, 12:43 AM
They see me trollin'. They hatin', patrollin' they tryna catch me riding dirty.

niel89
12-12-2011, 12:49 AM
13) Cam Newton

15) Freeman
16) Dalton
17) Ponder
18) Hasslebeck

Guys that are on par with him

Bradford
Kolb
Fitzpatrick
Palmer
Cassell
Tarvaris Jackson



p.s. All I want for christmas is a new QB

I have him better than these guys. At least this year. Why not sign him on for 2-3 years and see if Kap pans out?

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 12:49 AM
I'm a big Ponder supporter....but he got benched for Joe Webb. He's not better than Alex Smith. Tarvaris Jackson and Kevin Kolb aren't on par with him either. The rest of the guys you listed have an argument, I guess.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 12:51 AM
I'm a big Ponder supporter....but he got benched for Joe Webb. He's not better than Alex Smith. Tarvaris Jackson and Kevin Kolb aren't on par with him either. The rest of the guys you listed have an argument, I guess.

Ponder in his rookie season threw for 375+ on a good Denver defense WITHOUT Adrian peterson.



Alex Smith is in his 7th year...and thrown for 300 yards...twice. Twice. lmao.

BaLLiN
12-12-2011, 12:53 AM
I do not think Smith is better than Dalton, Newton, Bradford, or Fitzpatrick. He is taking what is given on high percentage throws, I don't feel like he is doing anything special but that's just my opinion. Convince me otherwise.

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 12:54 AM
Ponder in his rookie season threw for 375+ on a good Denver defense WITHOUT Adrian peterson.



Alex Smith is in his 7th year...and thrown for 300 yards...twice. Twice. lmao.

Right. Well you're a biased 49ers fan that's pissed off his team lost today. I don't think you have a very reliable opinion.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 12:55 AM
Cassel is not on par with Alex Smith. Alex Smith is better.

I think they're pretty similar, both have low career comp. pct's and YPA. Cassell has a better TD/INT ratio. Both are system/game manager QB's in my estimation with flaws in their deep ball, pocket presence, and both have an annoying tendency to check down too often.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 12:55 AM
Right. Well you're a biased 49ers fan that's pissed off his team lost today. I don't think you have a very reliable opinion.

What does today's game have to do with anything. Before today's game he still has thrown for 300 yards a paltry 2 times in his 6+ year career.

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 12:58 AM
What does today's game have to do with anything. Before today's game he still has thrown for 300 yards a paltry 2 times in his 6+ year career.

Because that has nothing to do with what you're asking. You want to know who the better QBs are right now, not over the last 6 years. And yards aren't the only way to determine a QB's worth anyway.

fenikz
12-12-2011, 12:59 AM
John Skelton

boosh!

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 01:01 AM
Because that has nothing to do with what you're asking. You want to know who the better QBs are right now, not over the last 6 years. And yards aren't the only way to determine a QB's worth anyway.

Yeah and right now, other than an under utlized Percy harvin, Ponder really doesn't have too many weapons, especially with AP hurt.


Meanwhile, Alex Smith has deep threat 2 TE's that can run 4.4's, a fairly decent starting RB, a slot receiver named Kyle Williams who is very underrated, and a guy like Michael Crabtree that would be tearing it up if he didnt get overthrown or underthrown 3+ times a game.

Who is the Vikes 2nd receiver? Aromashadu? Lmao. The TE Rudolph seems average.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 01:02 AM
John Skelton

boosh!

Well he is more accurate on deep throws, no doubt about that.

MetSox17
12-12-2011, 01:09 AM
John Skelton

boosh!

And yet you traded a second round pick, a good corner and gave a bunch of money, for the wrong one.

fenikz
12-12-2011, 01:12 AM
it was a joke, John Skelton is terrible, & Kolb got Fitz to resign well worth it

MetSox17
12-12-2011, 01:15 AM
Well, Skelton just winz. So i'm not sure it wouldn't be a stretch to say he's better than Corn on the Kolb

TitansCJftw
12-12-2011, 01:18 AM
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/30/fail_thread.jpg

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 01:21 AM
I do not think Smith is better than Dalton, Newton, Bradford, or Fitzpatrick. He is taking what is given on high percentage throws, I don't feel like he is doing anything special but that's just my opinion. Convince me otherwise.

High percentage is correct. He also misses a lot of deep throws that would be huge gainers.


The main thing Harbaugh and Roman have done for Alex is scheme these "rub reads" for Alex. Route design to get players open, rather than throwing receivers open (which is what the elite ones do). I have yet to see Alex Smith look off a safety to create a 1 on 1 downfield. I have yet to see him throw the backshoulder with any consistency. And I have yet to see him throw the ball before the receiver breaks to create maximum separation.

The only thing Alex Smith is good at is protecting the football.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 01:21 AM
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/30/fail_thread.jpg

oh boy. Really got me with that used up picture man. Total pwnage, broooooo.

wogitalia
12-12-2011, 01:56 AM
I'd say based on your list he slots in at right about 13.

I'm sick of people penalising QBs for not turning the ball over and being safe with the ball. You know the difference between the Vikings in 2009 and 2010? Brett Favre throwing 4 billion picks, pretty much summed up the difference between a team that almost made a Superbowl and a team that didn't get close to the playoffs.

Smith has been solid, he has done what is needed. I'd take him over Flacco who keeps trying to do too much because Smith knows what he has and plays to it.

He isn't a franchise guy, unless you have a Ravens like franchise, and he probably isn't the long term answer, he is also basically in his first real season after being pissed around for half a decade by an inept front office. Let me tell you, there are far worse options out there than Smith.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 02:01 AM
I'd say based on your list he slots in at right about 13.

I'm sick of people penalising QBs for not turning the ball over and being safe with the ball. You know the difference between the Vikings in 2009 and 2010? Brett Favre throwing 4 billion picks, pretty much summed up the difference between a team that almost made a Superbowl and a team that didn't get close to the playoffs.

Smith has been solid, he has done what is needed. I'd take him over Flacco who keeps trying to do too much because Smith knows what he has and plays to it.

He isn't a franchise guy, unless you have a Ravens like franchise, and he probably isn't the long term answer, he is also basically in his first real season after being pissed around for half a decade by an inept front office. Let me tell you, there are far worse options out there than Smith.

Smith hasn't been solid. We're ranked 30th in passing offense for a reason. He holds the scheme back. The talent back. and the offense as a whole back. Any one of the QB's I listed I am positive would be doing a better job with this offense than Smith has.

yo123
12-12-2011, 02:03 AM
Ponder hasn't done anything to prove he's better than Smith at the moment. Smith has shown the ability to be a caretaker, and Ponder has made some mindblowingly bad decisions.

He's definitely shown plenty of flashes, but as of now Smith>Ponder pretty clearly.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 02:05 AM
Ponder hasn't done anything to prove he's better than Smith at the moment. Smith has shown the ability to be a caretaker, and Ponder has made some mindblowingly bad decisions.

He's definitely shown plenty of flashes, but as of now Smith>Ponder pretty clearly.

Ponder has far less weapons. Ponder threw for 375+ against a good denver D. Again, Smith was drafted in 05', and it took him til freakin 2009 to hit the 300 yard milestone. And he's only hit it ONCE since.

You MIGHT be able to argue that Smith is a safer option than Ponder right now. No way in hell you can tell me Smith is more talented than Ponder and a better bet for the future.

MetSox17
12-12-2011, 02:07 AM
moar yards please

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 02:11 AM
Ponder has far less weapons. Ponder threw for 375+ against a good denver D. Again, Smith was drafted in 05', and it took him til freakin 2009 to hit the 300 yard milestone. And he's only hit it ONCE since.

You MIGHT be able to argue that Smith is a safer option than Ponder right now. No way in hell you can tell me Smith is more talented than Ponder and a better bet for the future.

Will you stop changing your argument? Do you want to know the best QB right now, or the best one in the future? Right now, Alex Smith is a better QB. The supporting cast is a little better, but not by that much. You're overrating SF's skill players and underrating Minnesota's because or your obvious bias.

Saints-Tigers
12-12-2011, 02:13 AM
Almost all of them. Ever.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 02:14 AM
I wanted to see what everyone else thought, those without the 49er red and gold goggles. Ranking every QB in the league and how many you would take over Alex Smith. The reason for this is that some awfully moronic 49er fans seem to think he is a top 10 QB and that we should absolutely re-sign him.

Also, try not to ***** stats.



1) Rodgers
2) Brady
3)Brees
4)Peyton Manning
5)Roethlisberger
6) Eli

Add Rivers to the above group and I think there isn't a whole lot of difference between Smith and all the rest. Smith will win somewhere around 12 games this season and we'll have to see how this young team responds in the playoffs, so next year, when the team has experience winning, Smith may carry them even farther in the playoffs. I think you are being way too hard on him.

7)Romo - not an elite QB
8)Rivers - having a bad year but the organization is shoddy.
9) Schaub - about what you have in Smith, maybe a notch below
10) Vick - best years are behind him.
11) Stafford - best years are still to come
12) Cutler - possibly elite with better supporting cast
13) Cam Newton - best years are ahead of him
14) Flacco - about what you have in Smith
15) Freeman - need more time to assess
16) Dalton - ditto
17) Ponder - way too early to judge, doesn't belong in this group just yet
18) Hasslebeck - best years are behind him

Right now I would put Ryan right there with Romo and a good match for Smith.

Guys that are on par with him

Bradford - next season will have a new HC and we'll see what he becomes
Kolb - probably needed a season to adjust, we'll see next season
Fitzpatrick - Buffalo is a poorly owned team so it is hard to tell where they are headed next year.
Palmer - best years are behind him but next year, with more time with the team, may return to top tier
Cassell - certainly not a star but I think over time, he will prove to be a solid NFL QB
Tarvaris Jackson - Is there a category below this group because he doesn't belong on this list



p.s. All I want for christmas is a new QB

Will you still say that if San Fran goes far in the playoffs this year or next? Maybe, he'll get a season ending injury and you'll get your wish.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 02:16 AM
Will you stop changing your argument? Do you want to know the best QB right now, or the best one in the future? Right now, Alex Smith is a better QB. The supporting cast is a little better, but not by that much. You're overrating SF's skill players and underrating Minnesota's because or your obvious bias.

Overrating? Tell me, what team in football that has 2 EXCELLENT blocking TE's that have 4.4 speed? Tell me, how on EARTH is Toby gerhart even close to what Frank Gore is? And please tell me how Aromashadu is so much better than braylon Edwards, kyle williams, Ted Ginn, etc.....Please explain all that. The one I'll give you is Harvin over Crab...though that's closer than you think.

And I didn't change my argument. Key word: might. Personally I would still take Ponder over Alex RIGHT NOW. Though I conceded a case COULD be made for Alex being more valuable right now. That's like me saying "well it's not such a god awful football opinion like usual, so it has a chance of being correct".

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 02:17 AM
Will you still say that if San Fran goes far in the playoffs this year or next? Maybe, he'll get a season ending injury and you'll get your wish.

If we go far in the playoffs its thanks to very good defense, decent running game, and an elite special teams unit. I don't judge QB's by wins.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 02:41 AM
Will you still say that if San Fran goes far in the playoffs this year or next? Maybe, he'll get a season ending injury and you'll get your wish.


Romo is elite. Anyone who thinks otherwise is clueless when it comes to football.


And Smith is on Schaub's level? Reallly dumb right there.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 02:44 AM
If we go far in the playoffs its thanks to very good defense, decent running game, and an elite special teams unit. I don't judge QB's by wins.

Man, you must have a weird system for judging elite QB's. For me, it is all about wins especially in the playoffs. You can have the other 3 elements but without a solid QB, you can forget about winning much more than 9 games a season.
I think you are just stuck in the past and cannot bring yourself to believe that Smith may actually be better than you thought and have a great deal to do with San Fran winning games. Time will tell, I guess.

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 03:05 AM
Overrating? Tell me, what team in football that has 2 EXCELLENT blocking TE's that have 4.4 speed? Tell me, how on EARTH is Toby gerhart even close to what Frank Gore is? And please tell me how Aromashadu is so much better than braylon Edwards, kyle williams, Ted Ginn, etc.....Please explain all that. The one I'll give you is Harvin over Crab...though that's closer than you think.

And I didn't change my argument. Key word: might. Personally I would still take Ponder over Alex RIGHT NOW. Though I conceded a case COULD be made for Alex being more valuable right now. That's like me saying "well it's not such a god awful football opinion like usual, so it has a chance of being correct".

San Fran definitely has a bit more talent....but both of Minnesota's tight ends are better than Delanie Walker. Adrian Peterson is better than Frank Gore. Harvin is probably a little better than Crabtree. The rest for both teams ranges from average to crap. It's close enough that you shouldn't be acting like Ponder has nothing and Smith has everything.

Ness
12-12-2011, 03:12 AM
Funny how this poster doesn't show up most of the time when the 49ers have won games. But the one time Alex finally has a bad performance he's gung-ho, making threads in the 49ers forum and the main forum and bitching about everything while taking issue with the posters instead of the actual post.

I'm not a big fan of Alex either, but at the same time I don't have an agenda and act like it's Christmas once he finally has a really bad game throwing around the "I told you so" card.

Ness
12-12-2011, 03:14 AM
http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/30/fail_thread.jpg

LOL. Hilarious.

Ness
12-12-2011, 03:15 AM
Ponder has far less weapons. Ponder threw for 375+ against a good denver D. Again, Smith was drafted in 05', and it took him til freakin 2009 to hit the 300 yard milestone. And he's only hit it ONCE since.

You MIGHT be able to argue that Smith is a safer option than Ponder right now. No way in hell you can tell me Smith is more talented than Ponder and a better bet for the future.

OMG he hasn't thrown for 300+ yards.

Dude, shut the **** up.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 03:22 AM
Funny how this poster doesn't show up most of the time when the 49ers have won games. But the one time Alex finally has a bad performance he's gung-ho, making threads in the 49ers forum and the main forum and bitching about everything while taking issue with the posters instead of the actual post.

I'm not a big fan of Alex either, but at the same time I don't have an agenda and act like it's Christmas once he finally has a really bad game throwing around the "I told you so" card.

OMG he hasn't thrown for 300+ yards.

Dude, shut the **** up.


Actually sensitive one, I called him out after the Cards game at home a few weeks back. And also the Raven game. I dont always post here, lmao @ you acting like I need to be here 24/7. Irrelevant.

As for 300+ yards. Yes. Yards are important. Our passing offense is what, 30th? Maybe lower after this game? And it is largely because of his limitations. There are backups on other teams who could be doing what he's doing right now. 7th year in the league. 2 300+ passing yard games. And a career completion percentage under 60. I should be slurping his jizz as we speak.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 03:24 AM
San Fran definitely has a bit more talent....but both of Minnesota's tight ends are better than Delanie Walker. Adrian Peterson is better than Frank Gore. Harvin is probably a little better than Crabtree. The rest for both teams ranges from average to crap. It's close enough that you shouldn't be acting like Ponder has nothing and Smith has everything.

You obviously haven't seen Delanie Walker play. He's an excellent blocker with 4.4 speed, and very good after the catch in the open field for a man his size. hands aren't great but not horrible. He'd start on quite a few teams, trust me.


And yes Peterson is better than Gore. Ponder manned up for 370 against a legit Denver D. WITHOUT PETERSON. That was my point, kthx.

Ness
12-12-2011, 03:28 AM
Actually sensitive one, I called him out after the Cards game at home a few weeks back. And also the Raven game. I dont always post here, lmao @ you acting like I need to be here 24/7. Irrelevant.

As for 300+ yards. Yes. Yards are important. Our passing offense is what, 30th? Maybe lower after this game? And it is largely because of his limitations. There are backups on other teams who could be doing what he's doing right now. 7th year in the league. 2 300+ passing yard games. And a career completion percentage under 60. LMFAO!

Yeah I know you don't always post here. Especially during this season because you'd sound stupid like the dumbass you are posting after every victory we've had this year. Yet the one year Alex has his worst game during the season you go buckwild on the board. Yeah I'm sure that's a coincidence.

Yes yards are sure important. The 49ers haven't trailed that often in games this season. If the 49ers were constantly behind you'd probably see more 300 yard plus games. If that is what you really want. Alex isn't Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers. He's not going to put up monster stats. But until the 49ers get a better quarterback probably in the next two years I'm guessing, there is nothing that can be done. So bitching about it constantly is pretty useless. This season could be so much worse. At least the 49ers are in the damn tournament for the first time since 2002. Seriously, you're acting like it's the end of the world. Again, shut the **** up idiot.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 03:39 AM
Yeah I know you don't always post here. Especially during this season because you'd sound stupid like the dumbass you are posting after every victory we've had this year. Yet the one year Alex has his worst game during the season you go buckwild on the board. Yeah I'm sure that's a coincidence.

Yes yards are sure important. The 49ers haven't trailed that often in games this season. If the 49ers were constantly behind you'd probably see more 300 yard plus games. If that is what you really want. Alex isn't Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers. He's not going to put up monster stats. But until the 49ers get a better quarterback probably in the next two years I'm guessing, there is nothing that can be done. So bitching about it constantly is pretty useless. This season could be so much worse. At least the 49ers are in the damn tournament for the first time since 2002. Seriously, you're acting like it's the end of the world. Again, shut the **** up idiot.


At least the 49ers are in the damn tournament for the first time since 2002. Seriously, you're acting like it's the end of the world. Again, shut the **** up idiot.

I don't believe I have mentioned the state of the 49ers, have I? Wouldn't this be one of those "generalizations" Binary speaks of? Learn to read. Teams have bad losses. Ravens lost to the Jags for chrissake. I still believe we're the 3rd best team in the NFC after the Pack and Saints. The offense is not a reason for that. The defense and special teams is. So when I criticize Alex Smith, I am not criticizing the 9ers or acting like our season is over, dipsh**t. Pay attention next time.


Yeah I know you don't always post here. Especially during this season because you'd sound stupid like the dumbass you are posting after every victory we've had this year. Yet the one year Alex has his worst game during the season you go buckwild on the board. Yeah I'm sure that's a coincidence.

Lots of "personal attacks". Isn't that what you whined to me about? More hypocrisy, laughable. Really digging yourself a whole here in terms of credibility. Can dish it out but can't take it, typical. I have been here when I felt like it. I don't cater to your time schedule. If I see Alex have a "great game" though, just for you and your poor itty bitty feewings, I'll make a few posts sucking his **ck.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 03:45 AM
Man, you must have a weird system for judging elite QB's. For me, it is all about wins especially in the playoffs. You can have the other 3 elements but without a solid QB, you can forget about winning much more than 9 games a season.
I think you are just stuck in the past and cannot bring yourself to believe that Smith may actually be better than you thought and have a great deal to do with San Fran winning games. Time will tell, I guess.

Wins are a team stat. You wanna tell me Mark Sanchez is at Tom Brady's level cause he beat him in a playoff game? Lmao.

Ness
12-12-2011, 03:47 AM
I don't believe I have mentioned the state of the 49ers, have I? Wouldn't this be one of those "generalizations" Binary speaks of? Learn to read. Teams have bad losses. Ravens lost to the Jags for chrissake. I still believe we're the 3rd best team in the NFC after the Pack and Saints. The offense is not a reason for that. The defense and special teams is. So when I criticize Alex Smith, I am not criticizing the 9ers or acting like our season is over, dipsh**t. Pay attention next time.

No, I obviously am mentioning the state of the team dumb **** LOL. I don't read what Binary speaks of most of the time. Way to bring something irrelevant into the picture moron. I'm talking of the bigger issue here, that's what I'm schooling your ass as to what's more important and that's this current season, not worry about the quarterback situation to point where I'm ******** a brick like you about something that can't currently be fixed. You don't see me going around making threads and bitching like a dumbass.


Lots of "personal attacks". Isn't that what you whined to me about? More hypocrisy, laughable. Really digging yourself a whole here in terms of credibility. Can dish it out but can't take it, typical. I have been here when I felt like it. I don't cater to your time schedule. If I see Alex have a "great game" though, just for you and your poor itty bitty feewings, I'll make a few posts sucking his **ck.

What are you getting your feelings hurt now dipshit? It's the internet, stop being such a *****.

Yeah SURRRRRRRREEEEE you've been here when you've felt like it. Yeah okay buddy. LOL post fail. My goodness you can't out lie a bed. Your garbage posts are so awful you should get the ******* electric chair. Get the **** outta here.

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 04:14 AM
You obviously haven't seen Delanie Walker play. He's an excellent blocker with 4.4 speed, and very good after the catch in the open field for a man his size. hands aren't great but not horrible. He'd start on quite a few teams, trust me.


And yes Peterson is better than Gore. Ponder manned up for 370 against a legit Denver D. WITHOUT PETERSON. That was my point, kthx.

I've seen him play many times. I have Directv and a lot of free time. You are completely overrating him. He's an acceptable blocker with a tiny frame. He would be raped by a DE. He has impressive athleticism and straight line speed that can create mismatches with linebackers, but can be neutralized by a safety. A nice backup tight end that would be the #1 on a couple teams. Nothing worth talking about.

As for the other part.....you obviously don't know how to evaluate QB's, so I'm going to stop talking to you.

wogitalia
12-12-2011, 04:57 AM
You're overrating SF's skill players and underrating Minnesota's because or your obvious bias.

He is probably overrating SF but he certainly isn't underrating Minnesota. Our support cast around Ponder is awful, he hasn't mentioned the worst part of it all as well.

ChiFan24
12-12-2011, 05:37 AM
He is probably overrating SF but he certainly isn't underrating Minnesota. Our support cast around Ponder is awful, he hasn't mentioned the worst part of it all as well.

I'm not saying they're good. But Peterson is great, Harvin is good and Shiancoe and Rudolph are worthy of being on an NFL football field. He makes them sound like the group the Bears had yesterday.

Also.....not the PFF is the authority on anything, but I saw that they rated the Vikings offensive line highly overall; pretty good in run blocking and not totally inept in pass blocking. Particularly high grade for John Sullivan. Thought that was interesting.

abaddon41_80
12-12-2011, 06:00 AM
Please not feed the troll, guys. Every thing this guy ever posts is about how much Alex Smith sucks and, like Ness said, he doesn't even show up unless Smith plays poorly, which is why he hasn't been around much this year.

DraftSavant
12-12-2011, 10:51 AM
I always think it's silly when these types of threads pop up.

You wanna know who will tell you exactly what they think about a quarterback? His coach.

The 49ers are protecting Smith and minimizing his impact on the game, not unlike Sanchez in NY. They are, in essence, HIDING him. That tells you everything you need to know.

abaddon41_80
12-12-2011, 12:33 PM
I always think it's silly when these types of threads pop up.

You wanna know who will tell you exactly what they think about a quarterback? His coach.

The 49ers are protecting Smith and minimizing his impact on the game, not unlike Sanchez in NY. They are, in essence, HIDING him. That tells you everything you need to know.

What? The 49ers have passed the ball more than they have run it in every game they have played against a team with a winning record this year. They aren't hiding him, they just don't bother passing in games they don't have to.

Bulldogs
12-12-2011, 12:39 PM
No Matt Ryan on your list. I hate you.

diabsoule
12-12-2011, 12:42 PM
No T.J. Yates? Fail.

49ersfan_87
12-12-2011, 02:14 PM
QB's i'd take over Alex right now at this moment are (in no particular order)

-Brady
-Roethlisberger
-Flacco
-P Manning
-Schaub
-Rivers
-Brees
-Newton
-Ryan
-Rodgers
-Stafford
-Cutler
-Romo
-E Manning
-Vick

That's 15 QB's ahead of him. That would place him squarely at 16th out of 32, or right at the league average. I'd say he's in the same tier as guys like Sanchez, Palmer, Fitzpatrick, maybe Dalton.

SuperPacker
12-12-2011, 02:18 PM
I could play QB for the 49ers and look good!

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 02:45 PM
Romo is elite. Anyone who thinks otherwise is clueless when it comes to football.

Yeah, he's so elite that his December record of wins and loses is just horrendous, but wait, elite QBs actually win when the big games come along and not go into the tank. So what is your definition of an elite QB, oh wait, you told me, wins don't count, now it makes sense at least to you????


And Smith is on Schaub's level? Reallly dumb right there.

Actually, I'd put Smith ahead of Schaub if his play this year is any indication.

BaLLiN
12-12-2011, 02:54 PM
High percentage is correct. He also misses a lot of deep throws that would be huge gainers.


The main thing Harbaugh and Roman have done for Alex is scheme these "rub reads" for Alex. Route design to get players open, rather than throwing receivers open (which is what the elite ones do). I have yet to see Alex Smith look off a safety to create a 1 on 1 downfield. I have yet to see him throw the backshoulder with any consistency. And I have yet to see him throw the ball before the receiver breaks to create maximum separation.

The only thing Alex Smith is good at is protecting the football.

I agree with this. I think Harbaugh and Roman are the real reason why he's done so well. The rub reads are designed a lot for Walker and Davis, two bigger bodies that are quicker and faster than the linebackers covering them usually.

He doesn't make those throws that seem effortless for the receiver, or ones where there is good/great coverage yet he gives the receiver a way to make a play anyway.

Sure Dalton and Newton seem to just be gunning it downfield, but they are threading the needle, getting the ball to their playmakers, and throwing the ball to space so the receiver can make a play. By no means are they elite or great players yet, they are very good starters. Smith doesn't carry his team, but he is serviceable. You can put him even with those two players, but there is no way I am saying that he is better than either.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 02:56 PM
Wins are a team stat. You wanna tell me Mark Sanchez is at Tom Brady's level cause he beat him in a playoff game? Lmao.

Yeah, wins is a team stat, tell that to NE with the worst defense in the NFL or Indy without Peyton, QB's have little to do with wins, sure, a genius in your own mind.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 03:02 PM
I agree with this. I think Harbaugh and Roman are the real reason why he's done so well. The rub reads are designed a lot for Walker and Davis, two bigger bodies that are quicker and faster than the linebackers covering them usually.

He doesn't make those throws that seem effortless for the receiver, or ones where there is good/great coverage yet he gives the receiver a way to make a play anyway.

Sure Dalton and Newton seem to just be gunning it downfield, but they are threading the needle, getting the ball to their playmakers, and throwing the ball to space so the receiver can make a play. By no means are they elite or great players yet, they are very good starters. Smith doesn't carry his team, but he is serviceable. You can put him even with those two players, but there is no way I am saying that he is better than either.

Well, Kurt Warner who ranks QB's on NFL Network has consistently put Alex Smith among his top 5 QB's in the NFL after examining film of each of his games. That's right, top 5, but what does he know about playing the position????
He and a # of people on the NFL Network actually think the 49ers are winning games because of Alex's good performances and that he is far more than just a game manager.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-12-2011, 03:05 PM
I hope Smith sticks and can finally be developed without musical OCs. See what happens in the same system when he doesn't have to worry about OCs changing.

abaddon41_80
12-12-2011, 03:35 PM
I agree with this. I think Harbaugh and Roman are the real reason why he's done so well.

Didn't you see my thread a few weeks ago? Smith actually but up better numbers after the "We want Carr" chants last year than he has this year.

- 96/167(57.5%)
- 1240 yards
- 7.4 Y/A
- 10 TD
- 6.0 TD %
- 2 INT
- 1.2 INT %
- 95.9 QB rating

vs.

- 221/358 (61.7%)
- 2565 yards
- 7.2 Y/A
- 15 TD
- 4.2 TD %
- 5 INT
- 1.4 INT %
- 91.5 QB rating

And, for the record, Davis has been mediocre this year. He has dropped about one in every five passes thrown his way. The 49ers, as a team, lead the league in drop % (passes dropped/pass attempts), and have allowed the 5th most sacks in the league. Smith is somehow still top ten in completion percentage and QB rating with a 3:1 TD:INT ratio.

It is a complete myth that the coaching change and better team around him has brought about Smith's improvement.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 04:14 PM
Actually, I'd put Smith ahead of Schaub if his play this year is any indication.

The same Matt Schaub that had a YPA of 8.5 before he got hurt. Yeah. Smith is TOTALLY BETTER DOOOD.


Yeah, he's so elite that his December record of wins and loses is just horrendous, but wait, elite QBs actually win when the big games come along and not go into the tank. So what is your definition of an elite QB, oh wait, you told me, wins don't count, now it makes sense at least to you????

So let me ask you this...Since Mark Sanchez has won games late in the year and in the playoffs...are you going to tell me you would rather have Mark Sanchez leading your team with Tony Romo? Stop the BS. You put Romo on the Jets and they would be a 14-2 team heading to play GB in the superbowl.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 04:15 PM
Well, Kurt Warner who ranks QB's on NFL Network has consistently put Alex Smith among his top 5 QB's in the NFL after examining film of each of his games. That's right, top 5, but what does he know about playing the position????
He and a # of people on the NFL Network actually think the 49ers are winning games because of Alex's good performances and that he is far more than just a game manager.

Kurt Warner, the same guy who has put Matt Moore in his top 5 a few times as well. I guess Matt Moore is really good, right?

TimmG6376
12-12-2011, 04:22 PM
Kurt Warner, the same guy who has put Matt Moore in his top 5 a few times as well. I guess Matt Moore is really good, right?

To be fair, that segment is deceiving. In order to make the list the QB has to have played the previous week. The week Matt Moore made the list I think at least 2 top QBs were on bye. And Moore was coming of his best game. So he kind of made the list by default.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 04:31 PM
The same Matt Schaub that had a YPA of 8.5 before he got hurt. Yeah. Smith is TOTALLY BETTER DOOOD.

I'd say slightly better and more consistent than Shaub. I'd rather be counting on Alex in a tight situation than Shaub, just my opinion for this year.


So let me ask you this...Since Mark Sanchez has won games late in the year and in the playoffs...are you going to tell me you would rather have Mark Sanchez leading your team with Tony Romo? Stop the BS. You put Romo on the Jets and they would be a 14-2 team heading to play GB in the superbowl.

Only in your mind, certainly not in mine. Romo simply finds ways to lose big games and has done so on a consistent basis since he has been a starting NFL QB. His December record as I previously said, is horrendous. great QB's come up big in games that really count and Romo just hasn't done it.
Put Romo at QB for the Jets, and IMO, they wouldn't make the playoffs.
Sanchez has always been a December QB that is why his HC loves him and believes in him.
The Jets have a weak running attack this year, their defense isn't dominating yet they are on a playoff run late in the season while the Cowboys are going in the opposite direction????

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 04:31 PM
To be fair, that segment is deceiving. In order to make the list the QB has to have played the previous week. The week Matt Moore made the list I think at least 2 top QBs were on bye. And Moore was coming of his best game. So he kind of made the list by default.

And how many times did Alex receive this "prestigious" award when a top QB had a bye?

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 04:33 PM
Only in your mind, certainly not in mine. Romo simply finds ways to lose big games and has done so on a consistent basis since he has been a starting NFL QB. His December record as I previously said, is horrendous. great QB's come up big in games that really count and Romo just hasn't done it.
Put Romo at QB for the Jets, and IMO, they wouldn't make the playoffs.
Sanchez has always been a December QB that is why his HC loves him and believes in him.
The Jets have a weak running attack this year, their defense isn't dominating yet they are on a playoff run late in the season while the Cowboys are going in the opposite direction????

Okay, we're done. You just said Sanchez was better than Romo. Congratulations, your input on quarterbacks is officially worthless.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 04:33 PM
To be fair, that segment is deceiving. In order to make the list the QB has to have played the previous week. The week Matt Moore made the list I think at least 2 top QBs were on bye. And Moore was coming of his best game. So he kind of made the list by default.

He's not interested in facts just his own beliefs. He knows more than anybody and you had better agree with him.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 04:38 PM
He's not interested in facts just his own beliefs. He knows more than anybody and you had better agree with him.

It's not about agreeing, it's about common sense. You said you would take Sanchez over Romo. Cringe-worthy statement.

And as for your whole "QB's have to win big games" schtick....Tell me, how many big games has Alex Smith won in his career? Bueller? Bueller?

TimmG6376
12-12-2011, 04:40 PM
And how many times did Alex receive this "prestigious" award when a top QB had a bye?

Once that I can find. The point is that list is constantly in flux and pretty knee jerk in nature. Alex Smith may have had a good week but 5 other QBs had a better week. Warner having Moore on the list doesn't necessarily mean he thinks Moore is a better QB than Smith, just that Moore had a more impressive performance that week.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 04:41 PM
Once that I can find. The point is that list is constantly in flux and pretty knee jerk in nature. Alex Smith may have had a good week but 5 other QBs had a better week. Warner having Moore on the list doesn't necessarily mean he thinks Moore is a better QB than Smith, just that Moore had a more impressive performance that week.

Exactly, so isn't it possible that Alex Smith happened to have a good game in Warner's eyes ONE WEEK and that is why he was on the list?

Bulldogs
12-12-2011, 04:42 PM
Blah, I hate Kurt Warner's list. It's usually fairly garbage, and just a way for the NFL Network to generate discussion and interest. I wouldn't put too much stock into it.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 04:54 PM
It's alright. This is how he feels about this forum's opinion anyways...

A quote from his account on a 49ers' forum...


Shut the **** up. I see your ass posting on draftcountdown with all the other retards who inhabit that ****** forum. You post there to "get away" from people "like us," so you can speak with more "rational" and "logical" people. Well guess what? You're a ******* idiot. You're not smart. You're a ******* piece of **** pseudo-intellectual. And any thoughts of you thinking Smith is good can in no way be logical or rational, considering what he's been the past 7 years.

You add nothing to this forum or earth. You're a waste of sperm. Get the **** out.


He's clearly a mature adult.

Iamcanadian
12-12-2011, 04:58 PM
Exactly, so isn't it possible that Alex Smith happened to have a good game in Warner's eyes ONE WEEK and that is why he was on the list?

Actually, he was on the list pretty consistently, certainly not ahead of Rodgers, Brady, Brees or Rothlisberger but right after them.
The question presented was where would I place Smith right now, I don't know how he will perform the rest of December or in the playoffs, if he flops, he'll certainly take a quantum drop, if he has partial success, he'll stay about where I have him, and if San Fran goes far in the playoffs, he'll likely move up. Judging him from previous seasons is a total waste of time, you have to look at him now that he has finally had a breakout season.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:02 PM
It's alright. This is how he feels about this forum's opinion anyways...

A quote from his account on a 49ers' forum...



He's clearly a mature adult.

That's not me, that's vault. We're not the same person. Figures you would whine about that though. Hurt your feewings I'm sure.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:05 PM
Actually, he was on the list pretty consistently, certainly not ahead of Rodgers, Brady, Brees or Rothlisberger but right after them.
The question presented was where would I place Smith right now, I don't know how he will perform the rest of December or in the playoffs, if he flops, he'll certainly take a quantum drop, if he has partial success, he'll stay about where I have him, and if San Fran goes far in the playoffs, he'll likely move up. Judging him from previous seasons is a total waste of time, you have to look at him now that he has finally had a breakout season.

Breakout season when he averages 190 yards per game. Oooooh boy. Breakout season doooooood.

Ness
12-12-2011, 05:07 PM
It's alright. This is how he feels about this forum's opinion anyways...

A quote from his account on a 49ers' forum...



He's clearly a mature adult.

Wow. Hmmm....

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:09 PM
Wow. Hmmm....

Wow. Hmmmm. The poster has who made that post has a different name. And certainly a different IP address...So where is the proof that was me? Seems like a sensitive guy like Phlysac got his feewings hurt on another forum and decided to take it out on the guy who happens to post here.

Ness
12-12-2011, 05:10 PM
Wow. Hmmmm. The poster has who made that post has a different name. And certainly a different IP address...So where is the proof that was me? Seems like a sensitive guy like Phlysac got his feewings hurt on another forum and decided to take it out on the guy who happens to post here.

I didn't say it was or wasn't you. Stop freaking the **** out.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:12 PM
I didn't say it was or wasn't you. Stop freaking the **** out.

freaking the **** out? No, I don't do that. It's the internet and I don't take things seriously. Poeple like you freak the **** out when someone "personally attacks" you because you're insecure and very sensitive.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 05:15 PM
BurningBridges, GoreOffense, BJones84, v-ault, v-ault2...

I don't care if it's you or you AND your stealth buddy. You share the same words, the same immaturity, and the same conduct that gets you banned everywhere.

If you're not v-ault2 then where are all of his posts on this forum that he knows so much about?

Hate me all you want, by I'm accountable for my actions both in life and on the internet. Continue doing what you do best.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:19 PM
BurningBridges, GoreOffense, BJones84, v-ault, v-ault2...

I don't care if it's you or you AND your stealth buddy. You share the same words, the same immaturity, and the same conduct that gets you banned everywhere.

If you're not v-ault2 then where are all of his posts on this forum that he knows so much about?

Hate me all you want, by I'm accountable for my actions both in life and on the internet. Continue doing what you do best.

BurningBridges was me. I didn't do anything bad with that account though. All I did was link to the video where Alex missed Delanie for a touchdown. Goreoffense was me, and has been banned for quite awhile. The others are vault.

He's not really my buddy. I talk to him on AIM and we share the same views on Alex Smith. I showed him the thread where you, binary, and abbaddon were washing his balls to the point where it was disturbing. That's what he meant when he mentioned draft countdown. I don't control other people's behavior, sorry.

And we don't share the same words. That's laziness on your part. trying to pin something on me because your feewings got hurt. Especially bringing up drama from another board that has nothing to do with me...Hysterical. You're reaching.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:21 PM
Okay MAYBE it wasn't you....But you and this guy are the same person! Waaaaaaah!


Lighten up, Francis.

Ness
12-12-2011, 05:25 PM
freaking the **** out? No, I don't do that. It's the internet and I don't take things seriously. Poeple like you freak the **** out when someone "personally attacks" you because you're insecure and very sensitive.

Your excuses for continually violating the rules of this message board are awful. I already told you it has nothing to do with me being sensitive. More so you just being an asshole and having to use insults and taking issue with the post instead of the poster. Here is a good example. You were in a debate with another poster just yesterday and decided to post something completely irrelevant just to get your point across as if you were desperate because for some reason you feel that insulting others to get your point across is a good tactic in winning a debate:

I exaggerate in sarcastic fashion laughing at your own stupidity. Sorry if you can't differentiate a debate point and sarcasm. Thats your mothers fault for smoking crack while you were in the womb, thus resulting in an IQ that is far too low to debate football on the internet.

What the hell does that have to do with the topic at hand? That's completely unnecessary and like what I said earlier it's taking issue with the poster instead of the actual post. When you have to result to insulting someone (especially when it has nothing to do with the topic) you've already lost the debate. And didn't you tell Borat you would already cut out the nonsense? And claiming others are being too sensitive is besides the point. It's a violation of the rules regardless what you think. You sound like you've had way too many beers when you come off like that trying to be an internet badass.

Oh and before you accuse me of doing the same thing yesterday in this thread, I was actually just egging you on and seeing if you would take the bait. And you followed suit. Yes I was that bored while I was reformatting my hard drive. Obviously I don't usually talk in that fashion.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:28 PM
Your excuses for continually violating the rules of this message board are awful. I already told you it has nothing to do with me being sensitive. More so you just being an asshole and having to use insults and taking issue with the post instead of the poster. Here is a good example. You were in a debate with another poster just yesterday and decided to post something completely irrelevant just to get your point across as if you were desperate because for some reason you feel that insulting others to get your point across is a good tactic in winning a debate:



What the hell does that have to do with the topic at hand? That's completely unnecessary and like what I said earlier it's taking issue with the poster instead of the actual post. When you have to result to insulting someone (especially when it has nothing to do with the topic) you've already lost the debate. And didn't you tell Borat you would already cut out the nonsense? And claiming others are being too sensitive is besides the point. It's a violation of the rules regardless what you think. You sound like you've had way too many beers when you come off like that trying to be an internet badass.

Oh and before you accuse me of doing the same thing yesterday in this thread, I was actually just egging you on and seeing if you would take the bait. And you followed suit. Yes I was that bored while I was reformatting my hard drive. Obviously I don't usually talk in that fashion.

Unnecessary yo. Gotta show da class on the internet. It's serious business.

Also love the excuse for why you did the same thing.

"I was bored! That means it's okay for me, not for you!"


Hahahahaha. Still digging yourself a hole buddy boy.


And I could give a flying **** about the rules. Rules about cussing and personal attacks were MADE because people are sensitive. If it looks like an idiot, smells like an idiot, posts like an idiot....By golly, it's an idiot.

Bulldogs
12-12-2011, 05:33 PM
On the topic of Alex Smith, he's a game manager at best. You better believe they are constantly working on Colin Kaepernick, preparing him for his oppurtunity. Kaepernick has a ton of potential, and will probably get his shot 1-2 years down the road. Before abaddon goes and pulls out some stats on me, sometimes they don't tell the whole story. Not I'm not saying Smith is a bad QB, but I just don't think he ever made that leap, and he is masked by a great running game and defense.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:33 PM
I also find it funny Phlysac goes to the moderators to whine about my behavior. Man you really are a ball-less f**cking pusscake.


And yeah yeah....I'll probably get banned for posting this. End of the world, yo. Lmao.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:38 PM
On the topic of Alex Smith, he's a game manager at best. You better believe they are constantly working on Colin Kaepernick, preparing him for his oppurtunity. Kaepernick has a ton of potential, and will probably get his shot 1-2 years down the road. Before abaddon goes and pulls out some stats on me, sometimes they don't tell the whole story. Not I'm not saying Smith is a bad QB, but I just don't think he ever made that leap, and he is masked by a great running game and defense.

Abaddon will tell you that our receivers are the worst in football, our o-line is horrible and the coaches don't call the correct plays. I also think he will try and tell you that the ballboy and groundscrew aren't doing their jobs correctly either.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:40 PM
And to the mods, before I get banned...Take note of my posts in this thread before phlysac had his period and decided to bring up irrelevant stuff from another board. I talked nothing but football and Alex smith, which is the topic at hand. Just a note for ya.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 05:41 PM
I also find it funny Phlysac goes to the moderators to whine about my behavior. Man you really are a ball-less f**cking pusscake.


And yeah yeah....I'll probably get banned for posting this. End of the world, yo. Lmao.

Where did I go to mods? Make stuff up much?

Several weeks ago when you went off like this I simply IMed those you were arguing with that you'd been banned from other sites.

I'm not whining at all. I'm a counselor in a secure facility for juvenile offenders. I get threatened everyday by people that have killed people. I don't whine, and I'm far from a ball-less f**cking pusscake.

But feel free to continue doing what you do best.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 05:42 PM
And to the mods, before I get banned...Take note of my posts in this thread before phlysac had his period and decided to bring up irrelevant stuff from another board. I talked nothing but football and Alex smith, which is the topic at hand. Just a note for ya.

Or they'd do their own dilligence (not listen to you, me, or any other poster) and simply look at your post history.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:43 PM
Where did I go to mods? Make stuff up much?

Several weeks ago when you went off like this I simply IMed those you were arguing with that you'd been banned from other sites.

I'm not whining at all. I'm a counselor in a secure facility for juvenile offenders. I get threatened everyday by people that have killed people. I don't whine, and I'm far from a

But feel free to continue doing what you do best.

Make up stuff much? How about you making stuff up that I'm the one who posted that on another board? The double standard continues.

Also note my posts before you had your period in this thread. Did I talk Alex Smith? Wasn't I talking football? The only thing bad I did in this thread was tell the canadien guy that his football opinion was worthless.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:44 PM
Or they'd do their own dilligence (not listen to you, me, or any other poster) and simply look at your post history.

But I'm sure they will give you a pass for going off topic and bringing up drama from another board because you had your period. Isn't that against the rules as well?

phlysac
12-12-2011, 05:46 PM
Continue doing what you do best

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:47 PM
Where did I go to mods? Make stuff up much?

Several weeks ago when you went off like this I simply IMed those you were arguing with that you'd been banned from other sites.

I'm not whining at all. I'm a counselor in a secure facility for juvenile offenders. I get threatened everyday by people that have killed people. I don't whine, and I'm far from a

But feel free to continue doing what you do best.

And no....You are the definition of a ball-less p**scake. Who the hell decides to bring up stuff from another board? Who the hell IM's other posters to tell them about how bad someone is? I'll tell you...A ball-less f**cking p**scake.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:48 PM
Continue doing what you do best

No comment huh? So it's NOT against the rules to go off topic and bring up irrelevant stuff from another board? Amazing you can't answer this. Rofl.

Rosebud
12-12-2011, 05:52 PM
This thread is finally getting interesting...

phlysac
12-12-2011, 05:52 PM
I don't need to answer the question. My post record and your post record speak for themselves. Like I said before, I'm accountable for my words and actions. If a moderator has issue with me they will do their diligence and address it with me if they deem it appropriate.

Ness
12-12-2011, 05:54 PM
Unnecessary yo. Gotta show da class on the internet. It's serious business.

Also love the excuse for why you did the same thing.

"I was bored! That means it's okay for me, not for you!"


Hahahahaha. Still digging yourself a hole buddy boy.


And I could give a flying **** about the rules. Rules about cussing and personal attacks were MADE because people are sensitive. If it looks like an idiot, smells like an idiot, posts like an idiot....By golly, it's an idiot.

I don't see how I could be digging myself in a hole when you were the one that fell into one. You fell for the trap. Never said anything about whether it was okay or not for me to do it. Thing is, I'm not the guy trying to make a name for myself insulting others because I'm incapable of holding a debate without having having to resort to doing that. Really, it's irrelevant to the discussion. Perhaps it makes you feel like you have an upper hand.

True, you'd probably just try and make another account once you got the boot. The rules were made because personal attacks aren't warranted by everyone, regardless of how you feel about others being too sensitive or not. How would you feel if someone killed your mother or someone close to you and everyone around you said you were being too sensitive about it? Or you ended up blind the following day? Obviously different situation, but the same logic applies. You aren't in any position to judge anyone's psyche. Nothing makes you better than the next person, especially insulting them for no reason other than just to believe you've gained leverage in a football debate on the internet. Is it to much to ask to show some class instead of constantly not being able to hold your composure? I'm willing to bet you don't randomly insult people in reality when they simply disagree with a viewpoint of yours.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 05:55 PM
I don't need to answer the question. My post record and your post record speak for themselves. Like I said before, I'm accountable for my words and actions. If a moderator has issue with me they will do their diligence and address it with me if they deem it appropriate.

Correction: You don't WANT to answer the question because you know you got caught in your own hypocrisy.

Ness
12-12-2011, 05:57 PM
I also find it funny Phlysac goes to the moderators to whine about my behavior. Man you really are a ball-less f**cking pusscake.


And yeah yeah....I'll probably get banned for posting this. End of the world, yo. Lmao.

How do you know Phlysac went to the moderators?

Ness
12-12-2011, 05:59 PM
This thread is finally getting interesting...

I hope Alex never has a bad game again.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 05:59 PM
Correction: You don't WANT to answer the question because you know you got caught in your own hypocrisy.

I'm not a hypocrite. I posted thoughts relevant to this forum and the opinion of the people involved in the discussion. I've done it entirely without using profanity, insulting other posters, and otherwise being verbally aggressive. As I've said before, my track record on this website, all other websites, and in life, speaks for itself.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 06:00 PM
How do you know Phlysac went to the moderators?

He doesn't because I didn't.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:00 PM
I don't see how I could be digging myself in a hole when you were the one that fell into one. You fell for the trap. Never said anything about whether it was okay or not for me to do it. Thing is, I'm not the guy trying to make a name for myself insulting others because I'm incapable of holding a debate without having having to resort to doing that. Really, it's irrelevant to the discussion. Perhaps it makes you feel like you have an upper hand.

True, you'd probably just try and make another account once you got the boot. The rules were made because personal attacks aren't warranted by everyone, regardless of how you feel about others being too sensitive or not. How would you feel if someone killed your mother or someone close to you and everyone around you said you were being too sensitive about it? Obviously different situation, but the same logic applies. You aren't in any position to judge anyone's psyche. Nothing makes you better than the next person, especially insulting them for no reason other than just to believe you've gained leverage in a football debate on the internet. Is it to much to ask to show some class instead of constantly not being able to hold your composure? I'm willing to bet you don't randomly insult people in reality when they simply disagree with a viewpoint of yours.



I don't see how I could be digging myself in a hole when you were the one that fell into one. You fell for the trap. Never said anything about whether it was okay or not for me to do it

So when you do it, it's okay, because you were setting up a trap......Got it.

Thing is, I'm not the guy trying to make a name for myself insulting others because I'm incapable of holding a debate without having having to resort to doing that.

Make a name for myself? Hahahahaha. Hardly. And if you look at this thread before Phlysac had his period, you will notice no personal attacks. So your point that I "can't debate without insults" is weak. I choose to insult people when they are being an idiot....If that's against the rules, so be it. I don't care about rules. As i said, rules were made for sensitive people who take the internet too seriously.


How would you feel if someone killed your mother or someone close to you and everyone around you said you were being too sensitive about it? Obviously different situation, but the same logic applies

You're right, it's not the same thing.

1) this is a football board. my mother's death would never get brought up here.

2) That is personal stuff. I don't talk about my personal life here, and I don't think anyone else does either. All of my "horrible, tasteless" insults are said after someone is being a complete idiot on a football point. So really, horrible example.

Is it to much to ask to show some class instead of constantly not being able to hold your composure? I'm willing to bet you don't randomly insult people in reality when they simply disagree with a viewpoint of yours.

There it is. Class. On the internet. Because this is soooooo serious. Hahahaha. You must have hated Terrell owens, didn't you? Totally classless player.

Bulldogs
12-12-2011, 06:01 PM
Watch as the 49er board takes on one another!

Ness
12-12-2011, 06:01 PM
He doesn't because I didn't.

http://epguides.com/UnsolvedMysteries/cast.jpg

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:01 PM
He doesn't because I didn't.

Actually, I got an infraction thanks to you. But nice try.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:04 PM
I'm not a hypocrite. I posted thoughts relevant to this forum and the opinion of the people involved in the discussion. I've done it entirely without using profanity, insulting other posters, and otherwise being verbally aggressive. As I've said before, my track record on this website, all other websites, and in life, speaks for itself.

Those thoughts were relevant to this topic? Relevant to Alex Smith's play among other QB's in this league? really? No.


You broke the rules. Personally I don't care, but since everyone here is such a tightwad and cares soooooooo much about the rules, it's only fair you get an infraction as well for breaking them.


And really...You sound fairly pompous with the whole "my track record speaks for itself"...get off the high horse already.

J-Mike88
12-12-2011, 06:04 PM
Jeez, what's up with the 49er b*tchfest here?
Despite the inexcusable loss to Red Skelton yesterday, and the AFC Champion Steelers coming to town this week, this is the best the Niners have done in a long time.

Why so mad?

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:06 PM
Jeez, what's up with the 49er b*tchfest here?
Despite the inexcusable loss to Red Skelton yesterday, and the AFC Champion Steelers coming to town this week, this is the best the Niners have done in a long time.

Why so mad?

Phlysac had his period because some other person on the internet hurt his feewings on another forum. He tried to pin it on me because I guess I insulted him awhile back on the 9er board. He's a bit sensitive, as most Alex Smith fans are. Probably got picked on in high school I'm guessing.

J-Mike88
12-12-2011, 06:08 PM
Alex Smith is a game-manager and nothing more.
But again, Trent Dilfer & Brad Johnson were too, and they won a ring.

Troy Aikman, another former 1st pick overall, also basically was a game-manager. He never racked up lofty stats, because he didn't have to. But he came through in the clutch and was part of 3 rings.

Alex pulls off just one of those and he's validated.

Rosebud
12-12-2011, 06:10 PM
Watch as the 49er board takes on one another!

This infighting could tear the team apart. Watch them spiral even further after losing to the Cards. The 9ers will be lucky to win another game all year if things continue in this direction...

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:10 PM
Alex Smith is a game-manager and nothing more.
But again, Trent Dilfer & Brad Johnson were too, and they won a ring.

Troy Aikman, another former 1st pick overall, also basically was a game-manager. He never racked up lofty stats, because he didn't have to. But he came through in the clutch and was part of 3 rings.

Alex pulls off just one of those and he's validated.

Yes. They all won rings and no disagreements with your thoughts n any of those players. I don't understand though why if he wins a ring he's "validated". I mean like you said, Dilfer won a ring, but he was still a massive bust for his production after being the 6th pick. It's a team sport and I don't think average at best quarterbacks should deserve credit for the team winning. Just like it wasn't all Alex's fault for all the losing before this season. It goes both ways.

Ness
12-12-2011, 06:11 PM
So when you do it, it's okay, because you were setting up a trap......Got it.

Where did I say it was okay? I played a joke, but I'm willing to pay the price for any punishment I receive on this forum. I knew that before deciding to toy with you.

Make a name for myself? Hahahahaha. Hardly. And if you look at this thread before Phlysac had his period, you will notice no personal attacks. So your point that I "can't debate without insults" is weak. I choose to insult people when they are being an idiot....If that's against the rules, so be it. I don't care about rules. As i said, rules were made for sensitive people who take the internet too seriously.

And what if other people are more sensitive? That still doesn't make it okay throw insults around because you believe it is. You need to take other people's feelings into consideration just like you would in reality when you are talking to someone. Just because it's over the internet and you can hide instead of talking face to face doesn't change things. Even if you think your words aren't hurtful to others, people may not share the same nonchalant attitude. And that shouldn't be their fault because they don't agree with how you perceive to go about things.


You're right, it's not the same thing.

1) this is a football board. my mother's death would never get brought up here.

2) That is personal stuff. I don't talk about my personal life here, and I don't think anyone else does either. All of my "horrible, tasteless" insults are said after someone is being a complete idiot on a football point. So really, horrible example.

No, you insult people when they merely disagree with you. Being a genius or an idiot in terms of debating football, a topic that is so subjective with all of the variables involved, is always going to slide more towards opinions than facts on most matters. Even so, disagreeing on football matters doesn't warrant a personal insult towards someone's family regardless of how much you disagree with someone. Why is it even necessary to take issue with the poster instead of the post?


There it is. Class. On the internet. Because this is soooooo serious. Hahahaha. You must have hated Terrell owens, didn't you? Totally classless player.

No it's not serious, which is why the need for serious insults, or any insults for that matter, aren't necessary when talking about football.

Terrell Owens doesn't have anything to do with what were talking about. If you want to know though after a while he did appear to be kind of jerk a lot of people's minds. I don't know the guy, so I can't say that much about him in terms of everything that has happened. I've heard the very good and the very grim.

Ness
12-12-2011, 06:13 PM
Actually, I got an infraction thanks to you. But nice try.

You knew it was him? How so?

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:16 PM
Where did I say it was okay? I played a joke, but I'm willing to pay the price for any punishment I receive on this forum. I knew that before deciding to toy with you.



And what if other people are more sensitive? That still doesn't make it okay throw insults around because you believe it is. You need to take other people's feelings into consideration just like you would in reality when you are talking to someone. Just because it's over the internet and you can hide instead of talking face to face doesn't change things. Even if you think your words aren't hurtful to others, people may not share the same nonchalant attitude. And that shouldn't be their fault because they don't agree with how you perceive to go about things.




No, you insult people when they merely disagree with you. Being a genius or an idiot in terms of debating football, a topic that is so subjective with all of the variables involved, is always going to slide more towards opinions than facts on most matters. Even so, disagreeing on football matters doesn't warrant a personal insult towards someone's family regardless of how much you disagree with someone. Why is it even necessary to take issue with the poster instead of the post?




No it's not serious, which is why the need for serious insults, or any insults for that matter, aren't necessary when talking about football.

Terrell Owens doesn't have anything to do with what were talking about. If you want to know though after a while he did appear to be kind of jerk a lot of people's minds. I don't know the guy, so I can't say that much about him in terms of everything that has happened. I've heard the very good and the very grim.


And what if other people are more sensitive? That still doesn't make it okay throw insults around because you believe it is. You need to take other people's feelings into consideration just like you would in reality when you are talking to someone. Just because it's over the internet and you can hide instead of talking face to face doesn't change things. Even if you think your words aren't hurtful to others, people may not share the same nonchalant attitude. And that shouldn't be their fault because they don't agree with how you perceive to go about things.

If you get upset about insults over the internet, you are sensitive. period end of story. Lmao.

No, you insult people when they merely disagree with you. Being a genius or an idiot in terms of debating football, a topic that is so subjective with all of the variables involved, is always going to slide more towards opinions than facts on most matters. Even so, disagreeing on football matters doesn't warrant a personal insult towards someone's family regardless of how much you disagree with someone. Why is it even necessary to take issue with the poster instead of the post?

Go ahead and show me where I insulted someone's family...If you are talking about the crack mom thing, I would have thought it was obvious that was in joking manner as i obviously have never met binary's mother. But again...sensitivity. Lmao.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:17 PM
You knew it was him? How so?

I'll answer that once Phlysac proves how he knows it was me who insulted him on another board.

vidae
12-12-2011, 06:19 PM
Actually, I got an infraction thanks to you. But nice try.

You got an infraction because of what you've been posting and your general attitude towards the other members of the board.

phlysac had nothing to do with it.

phlysac
12-12-2011, 06:21 PM
I'll answer that once Phlysac proves how he knows it was me who insulted him on another board.

I can prove it was you as easily as you can prove it wasn't. Especially when you have admitted to being several different SNs.

In your story, we're supposed to believe a guy who doesn't post on this forum would have that strong of an opinion against it.

It also seems ironic that the post made by the guy who "isn't you" was made a whopping 11 minutes after you started this thread.


And I don't care about an IP address argument. IP addresses don't mean anything if you're actually TRYING to be sneaky.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:28 PM
I can prove it was you as easily as you can prove it wasn't. Especially when you have admitted to being several different SNs.

In your story, we're supposed to believe a guy who doesn't post on this forum would have that strong of an opinion against it.

It also seems ironic that the post made by the guy who "isn't you" was made a whopping 11 minutes after you started this thread.


And I don't care about an IP address argument. IP addresses don't mean anything if you're actually TRYING to be sneaky.

Right, I already explained that. Me and vault were discussing the clowns on the 9er board here on AIM, which is why he posted that on News at a similar time.

The irony here is that you're allowed to make an accusation about me disrupting a thread about Alex Smith with no evidence, but when I make a similar accusation about you, there is a double standard.


Irony ftw.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:29 PM
You got an infraction because of what you've been posting and your general attitude towards the other members of the board.

phlysac had nothing to do with it.

I know that. I(like ness was, apparently) Made that up to see how an accusation with no evidence would get handled as opposed to phlysac doing the same thing. And I found out the answer. Lmao.

PatrickWillis
12-12-2011, 06:33 PM
Just to let everyone know....It's okay for phlysac to disrupt threads with accusations that have no evidence. But when I do the same thing, it gets shot down.


Mods, cut the hypocrisy.

abaddon41_80
12-12-2011, 06:41 PM
On the topic of Alex Smith, he's a game manager at best. You better believe they are constantly working on Colin Kaepernick, preparing him for his oppurtunity. Kaepernick has a ton of potential, and will probably get his shot 1-2 years down the road. Before abaddon goes and pulls out some stats on me, sometimes they don't tell the whole story. Not I'm not saying Smith is a bad QB, but I just don't think he ever made that leap, and he is masked by a great running game and defense.

Except last year they didn't have a great running game or defense and he was arguably better. In games this year when the running game hasn't shown up at all Smith has still been good, except for yesterday which every 49er fan will admit was a bad game for him.

Ness
12-12-2011, 07:25 PM
Except last year they didn't have a great running game or defense and he was arguably better. In games this year when the running game hasn't shown up at all Smith has still been good, except for yesterday which every 49er fan will admit was a bad game for him.

It will be interesting to see if Smith improves next year after being in a full offseason in the system. I doubt we'd get a megastar quarterback that can play at a high level between now and next season, so Alex is most likely going to start come opening day next year.

Ness
12-12-2011, 07:28 PM
EDIT: Nevermind.

CC.SD
12-12-2011, 07:50 PM
This thread is a disaster. Who even cares about Alex Smith anyway...

Saints-Tigers
12-12-2011, 08:00 PM
This thread is a disaster. Who even cares about Alex Smith anyway...

I do. Sometimes I worry about the 49ers doing damage in the playoffs, the I remember they have Alex Smith.

abaddon41_80
12-12-2011, 08:56 PM
I do. Sometimes I worry about the 49ers doing damage in the playoffs, the I remember they have Alex Smith.

You do realize that the Saints had to get incredibly lucky to beat the 49ers last year, right? I am not saying that the 49ers can beat them this year but the 49ers at their best can hang with the Saints.

Ness
12-12-2011, 09:30 PM
You do realize that the Saints had to get incredibly lucky to beat the 49ers last year, right? I am not saying that the 49ers can beat them this year but the 49ers at their best can hang with the Saints.

At Candlestick. Not at the Superdome.

And unfortunately I wouldn't call the victory against the 49ers luck last season. Drew Brees drove them down the field for the winning score. Good quarterbacks do that for their team.

descendency
12-12-2011, 09:35 PM
http://www.midwestsportsfans.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/tj-yates-houston-texans.jpg

Just FYI.

Ness
12-13-2011, 02:11 AM
http://www.midwestsportsfans.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/tj-yates-houston-texans.jpg

Just FYI.

Wouldn't be surprised. Throwing for 300 yards in your second start as a third string quarterback while winning the game in the closing seconds is a good way to get the ball rolling.

XxXdragonXxX
12-13-2011, 02:25 AM
Wouldn't be surprised. Throwing for 300 yards in your second start as a third string quarterback while winning the game in the closing seconds is a good way to get the ball rolling.

Without Andre Johnson.

You guys think the Texans will trade a QB this offseason?

Ness
12-13-2011, 02:48 AM
Without Andre Johnson.

You guys think the Texans will trade a QB this offseason?

I think it depends how far they go. I'd be shocked if Schaub doesn't come back as the starter. Honestly, Yates could end up being the next Todd Collins. He's having a good streak right now, but the league could figure him out, he could fall back to Earth, etc. You have a franchise quarterback in Matt Schaub. I just don't see it happening. Unless Yates wins the Super Bowl or something and plays like Kurt Warner, I think they'll both be on the same roster next season with Schaub being the starter. Yates will continue to sit and gain experience and I'm sure some teams will be inquiring about him if he becomes available. I'd be surprised if any team after this season decides to offer Houston a deal they can't refuse for him.

Yates is also on a good team. I get the feeling he's really thriving in this system, but if he's taken out and expected to work miracles somewhere else, he might falter. He's still really young and inexperienced.

binary
12-13-2011, 03:46 AM
you guys have to understand that there are some people who have been driven a bit insane by the Alex Smith situation. Let this be a lesson, if you draft a QB early, surround him with good coaching and a good system right away....DO NOT wait until year 7 or the fans will do stupid things like chant for David Carr and lose any semblance of tact after a bad game.

Also, just to clarify, no one on here has said Alex's value IS a top 10-12 QB, just that he's played at a top 10 level this season or that he's playing like a top 10 guy RIGHT NOW...which was an incredibly easy argument to make last week, before the debacle in Arizona. So yeah, keep arguing vehemently over nothing, whatever...basic reading comprehension.

abaddon41_80
12-13-2011, 07:03 AM
At Candlestick. Not at the Superdome.

And unfortunately I wouldn't call the victory against the 49ers luck last season. Drew Brees drove them down the field for the winning score. Good quarterbacks do that for their team.

Alex Smith drove them down the field for the game-tying touchdown and two-point conversion, going 82 yards in only 53 seconds. But it was pretty lucky, or maybe fluky is a better word, the Saints won.

- A snap went like eight yards over Smith's head for a safety, spotting the Saints two points
- This led directly to a touchdown on a drive that started in 49ers territory
- The 49ers turned the ball over three times inside the Saints 30
- The 49ers muffed a punt deep in their own territory, leading to a Saints field goal

Any one of those things doesn't happen and the 49ers likely win that game.

mellojello
12-16-2011, 12:51 AM
This thread is a disaster. Who even cares about Alex Smith anyway...I do, I have him on my fantasy football team and I'm in the playoffs. Besides that, there's some really funny posts in here.

Ok, so I have Yates, Alex Smith, and Matt Moore & I can start 2 QB's. I don't like the Alex Smith vs. Pitt D at all, so I'm going with the other two right now. Does anyone think I should put Smith ahead of the other two this week?

Ness
12-16-2011, 04:42 AM
Alex Smith drove them down the field for the game-tying touchdown and two-point conversion, going 82 yards in only 53 seconds. But it was pretty lucky, or maybe fluky is a better word, the Saints won.

- A snap went like eight yards over Smith's head for a safety, spotting the Saints two points
- This led directly to a touchdown on a drive that started in 49ers territory
- The 49ers turned the ball over three times inside the Saints 30
- The 49ers muffed a punt deep in their own territory, leading to a Saints field goal

Any one of those things doesn't happen and the 49ers likely win that game.

And if Alex Smith plays like Joe Montana the 49ers overcome those mistakes or don't commit them at all. If I remember correctly one of those turnovers was an Alex Smith interception he threw that bounced off Frank Gore's hands because he rocketed the throw when Gore was five yard's away from him.

So you can take that angle if you want to play that game. It's too much of a coincidence that the good quarterbacks consistently win these kinds of games and the terrible ones don't. Some guys are just good and others aren't.

Ness
12-16-2011, 04:49 AM
you guys have to understand that there are some people who have been driven a bit insane by the Alex Smith situation. Let this be a lesson, if you draft a QB early, surround him with good coaching and a good system right away....DO NOT wait until year 7 or the fans will do stupid things like chant for David Carr and lose any semblance of tact after a bad game.

Also, just to clarify, no one on here has said Alex's value IS a top 10-12 QB, just that he's played at a top 10 level this season or that he's playing like a top 10 guy RIGHT NOW...which was an incredibly easy argument to make last week, before the debacle in Arizona. So yeah, keep arguing vehemently over nothing, whatever...basic reading comprehension.
Even throughout this season has Alex played well enough to make him a top ten guy?

1. Rodgers.
2. Brees.
3. Brady.
4. Manning.
5. Roethlisberger.
6. Romo.
7. Ryan.
8. Stafford.
9. Flacco.
10. Cutler.

For me, you need to have at least one decent season to be considered a top ten kind of guy. Either that, or pulling a Kurt Warner during the season before you are well known, and Alex isn't doing that. He's being a super game manager right now.

ChiFan24
12-16-2011, 05:19 AM
You have a franchise quarterback in Matt Schaub. I just don't see it happening.

It's official. The term "franchise QB" has jumped the shark. Matt Schaub is where I draw the line.

Ness
12-16-2011, 09:40 AM
It's official. The term "franchise QB" has jumped the shark. Matt Schaub is where I draw the line.

Schaub is a franchise quarterback. He's a passing threat. That's why everyone counted out Houston when he got hurt. And that's the only issue with Schaub. He gets hurt. I will say he's not as clutch as other guys like Eli Manning or Drew Brees. He's still a good quarterback though.

Fico
12-16-2011, 10:42 AM
Schuab was on pace for just under 4000 yards, his third season in a row at or above 4k.

He was on pace for 30td - 12in season. All of this with missing Foster for a couple games, and missing Johnson for a couple more.

The dude can play. Yes he is slower than a grandma stuck in molasses and he tends to sack himself, but the guy is definitely in the second tier of QBs in the league.

Now if TJ takes this team to the Super Bowl, and especially if he wins it the Texans will have to make a tough decision. TJ would have basically gone(assuming they win out) 9-0 as a rookie without Andre for an extended period of time. He will have the city's first playoff victory in 18 years, plus a AFC championship, super bowl appearance, and possibly a win. He would have accomplished all this as a player who was leading his team, not necessarily being the "game manager."

Add all that to the fact that 2012 is Schuab's last year of his contract and the amount of teams that need QBs with the fact that Schuab would be far and above the best one available. The Texans could probably get a 1 and 3 or more.

Roll with Yates as your starter, Lienart as your backup and continue to rely on Foster/Tate and the run game with some Andre sprinkled on top. It is a very interesting scenario to think about.

Also consider with the lisfranc surgery Schuab may not even be ready for camp or the start of the season. Plus he is already pretty damn immobile, while TJ offers escpability..... which led directly to us beating a playoff caliber team last week.

The more Yates continues to win the more interesting it becomes..... plus Mario is FA next year and Foster is RFA..... interesting times.

jrdrylie
12-16-2011, 10:48 AM
Honestly, Yates could end up being the next Todd Collins.

You mean the QB with the worst stat line of all time. 6-16, 32 yards, 4 interceptions. Yates may not end up being as good as he looks right now, but nobody is as bad as Todd Collins.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-16-2011, 10:48 AM
Schuab was on pace for just under 4000 yards, his third season in a row at or above 4k.

He was on pace for 30td - 12in season. All of this with missing Foster for a couple games, and missing Johnson for a couple more.

The dude can play. Yes he is slower than a grandma stuck in molasses and he tends to sack himself, but the guy is definitely in the second tier of QBs in the league.

Now if TJ takes this team to the Super Bowl, and especially if he wins it the Texans will have to make a tough decision. TJ would have basically gone(assuming they win out) 9-0 as a rookie without Andre for an extended period of time. He will have the city's first playoff victory in 18 years, plus a AFC championship, super bowl appearance, and possibly a win. He would have accomplished all this as a player who was leading his team, not necessarily being the "game manager."

Add all that to the fact that 2012 is Schuab's last year of his contract and the amount of teams that need QBs with the fact that Schuab would be far and above the best one available. The Texans could probably get a 1 and 3 or more.

Roll with Yates as your starter, Lienart as your backup and continue to rely on Foster/Tate and the run game with some Andre sprinkled on top. It is a very interesting scenario to think about.

Also consider with the lisfranc surgery Schuab may not even be ready for camp or the start of the season. Plus he is already pretty damn immobile, while TJ offers escpability..... which led directly to us beating a playoff caliber team last week.

The more Yates continues to win the more interesting it becomes..... plus Mario is FA next year and Foster is RFA..... interesting times.


I am interested in how Yates does. I am rooting for him!

mellojello
12-16-2011, 10:17 PM
I do, I have him on my fantasy football team and I'm in the playoffs. Besides that, there's some really funny posts in here.

Ok, so I have Yates, Alex Smith, and Matt Moore & I can start 2 QB's. I don't like the Alex Smith vs. Pitt D at all, so I'm going with the other two right now. Does anyone think I should put Smith ahead of the other two this week?Surprised with all of the experts, nobody chimed in here.

binary
12-17-2011, 01:01 AM
Even throughout this season has Alex played well enough to make him a top ten guy?

1. Rodgers.
2. Brees.
3. Brady.
4. Manning.
5. Roethlisberger.
6. Romo.
7. Ryan.
8. Stafford.
9. Flacco.
10. Cutler.

For me, you need to have at least one decent season to be considered a top ten kind of guy. Either that, or pulling a Kurt Warner during the season before you are well known, and Alex isn't doing that. He's being a super game manager right now.

SMH, come on Ness. I just said that "playing at" does not = "he IS". He was PLAYING AT a top 10 level before the Cardinals game (backed up by just about every meaningful stat)...that's all that was said. Alex would need to play at that level for a couple years to BE atop 10 guy. Dude still has a long way to go.

Ness
12-17-2011, 02:22 AM
I was literally drunk the other night when I typed that. So I wouldn't put much stock into that post.

Anyways, I still just don't see it in Alex. I think next year will be the telling tale. Or what he does this season in the playoffs. The 49ers offensive lines need to take some blame, but Alex just has inconsistent accuracy and it seems excuses are always being made for him.

Not expecting a good game against the Steelers this Monday. The 49ers have struggled passing the ball against 3-4 defenses. I think 29 sacks of the 39 Alex has taken this season have come all against the 3-4 defenses we've faced. Although Alex did play well against Arizona the first time. But the Ravens exposed them and Arizona seemed to follow their lead the second time we faced them. The Steelers run a similar defense and are probably going to be bringing a bunch of zone blitzes.

Of course the 49ers could silence a critics for at least a week if they prove they can pass the rock. I'm not optimistic though, even at home. It would be nice so that Ron Jaworski can eat some crow.

dunagan15
12-17-2011, 03:32 AM
Just to let everyone know....It's okay for phlysac to disrupt threads with accusations that have no evidence. But when I do the same thing, it gets shot down.


Mods, cut the hypocrisy.

Serious question. Are you older than 18? And also do you find it difficult to spell feelings correctly, or do you just like to sound like an idiot?

Caulibflower
12-17-2011, 03:58 AM
If Houston goes on a deep playoff run with Yates playing well... is Matt Schaub this decade's Drew Bledsoe? How committed is Houston to him?

Way too early to say Yates is anything, but he did look pretty damn good last week.

Timbathia
12-17-2011, 03:59 AM
I cant belive there is a thread about QBs with everyone questioning each others sanity and Tebow isnt even part of it.

By the way, Tebow is better than Alex Smith. When was the last time Alex Smith trucked anyone? Bueller, Bueller?

Rosebud
12-17-2011, 08:10 AM
Schuab was on pace for just under 4000 yards, his third season in a row at or above 4k.

He was on pace for 30td - 12in season. All of this with missing Foster for a couple games, and missing Johnson for a couple more.

The dude can play. Yes he is slower than a grandma stuck in molasses and he tends to sack himself, but the guy is definitely in the second tier of QBs in the league.

Now if TJ takes this team to the Super Bowl, and especially if he wins it the Texans will have to make a tough decision. TJ would have basically gone(assuming they win out) 9-0 as a rookie without Andre for an extended period of time. He will have the city's first playoff victory in 18 years, plus a AFC championship, super bowl appearance, and possibly a win. He would have accomplished all this as a player who was leading his team, not necessarily being the "game manager."

Add all that to the fact that 2012 is Schuab's last year of his contract and the amount of teams that need QBs with the fact that Schuab would be far and above the best one available. The Texans could probably get a 1 and 3 or more.

Roll with Yates as your starter, Lienart as your backup and continue to rely on Foster/Tate and the run game with some Andre sprinkled on top. It is a very interesting scenario to think about.

Also consider with the lisfranc surgery Schuab may not even be ready for camp or the start of the season. Plus he is already pretty damn immobile, while TJ offers escpability..... which led directly to us beating a playoff caliber team last week.

The more Yates continues to win the more interesting it becomes..... plus Mario is FA next year and Foster is RFA..... interesting times.

I'd put him in the third tier behind Big Ben, Eli, Cutler and Rivers since he's yet to show he can lead his team in the playoffs the way each of those guys has.

phlysac
12-17-2011, 11:46 AM
Surprised with all of the experts, nobody chimed in here.

Wrong forum.

But how in the world are you in the playoffs with Alex Smith, TJ Yates, and Matt Moore as your QBs????

Might be a FA available who has a more favorable matchup.

Vox Populi
12-17-2011, 12:44 PM
I'd put him in the third tier behind Big Ben, Eli, Cutler and Rivers since he's yet to show he can lead his team in the playoffs the way each of those guys has.

I can get on board with the idea, but not with the logic. Cutler only played his first two playoff games last year. Philip Rivers is insanely inconsistent in the Playoffs. The only true good game I can give Philip Rivers in the playoffs is against Tennessee in 2007. Outside of that, Billy Volek was the only Chargers QB that was on the field in the 4th quarter against Indianapolis in 2007 when they won that game going into the 4th quarter down 21-24 and the defense forced two 4th down turnovers late in the game to win it. The lost game to Pittsburgh in 2008 he played well, but half of his offensive output came in the 4th quarter when they were down 28-10. I'm pretty sure this was the game where the Chargers had only one play in the entire 3rd quarter because Rivers tossed a pick and the Steelers offense just ran the ball and got small chunks all the way down the field on both of their drives. Top it off with the Chargers not having playoff appearances for the past two years.

Both of those guys still have a lot to prove as winning QB's before I give them the same credit as Roethlisberger and Eli.

Rosebud
12-17-2011, 01:06 PM
I can get on board with the idea, but not with the logic. Cutler only played his first two playoff games last year. Philip Rivers is insanely inconsistent in the Playoffs. The only true good game I can give Philip Rivers in the playoffs is against Tennessee in 2007. Outside of that, Billy Volek was the only Chargers QB that was on the field in the 4th quarter against Indianapolis in 2007 when they won that game going into the 4th quarter down 21-24 and the defense forced two 4th down turnovers late in the game to win it. The lost game to Pittsburgh in 2008 he played well, but half of his offensive output came in the 4th quarter when they were down 28-10. I'm pretty sure this was the game where the Chargers had only one play in the entire 3rd quarter because Rivers tossed a pick and the Steelers offense just ran the ball and got small chunks all the way down the field on both of their drives. Top it off with the Chargers not having playoff appearances for the past two years.

Both of those guys still have a lot to prove as winning QB's before I give them the same credit as Roethlisberger and Eli.

I have a lot of respect for what Rivers did in 2007, he impressed me against the Tits and Pats and did well given his injury before bowing out. Showing that something like a serious knee injury wouldn't cause him to crumble under playoff pressure and get his team to a win and even a close loss to an undefeat team in the AFCCG is impressive.

As for Cutler I have a lot of respect for what he did with those bears last season. That O is terrible without Forte and Cutler and I think Cutler's the much more important of the two. Plus he carried winless Detroit caliber defenses to 8-8 in Denver, which gives him points. They're guys I trust with a superbowl caliber squad to get it done and not crumble, although I may be being premature on that.

Guys like Schaub who haven't been to the playoffs ever or Romo who's been a part of more big moment collapses than success, etc. are a notch below those guys for me.

Ness
12-17-2011, 02:16 PM
I'd put him in the third tier behind Big Ben, Eli, Cutler and Rivers since he's yet to show he can lead his team in the playoffs the way each of those guys has.

Well those guys you've listed have had decent to good defenses in a lot of their years. This is the first season ever the Texans have had a legitimate defense. Especially in the secondary.

The Alex
12-17-2011, 02:22 PM
http://i312.photobucket.com/albums/ll356/luke_luke_luke_11/GIFS/AlexSmith.gif

Remember this?

NY+Giants=NYG
12-17-2011, 02:35 PM
Well those guys you've listed have had decent to good defenses in a lot of their years. This is the first season ever the Texans have had a legitimate defense. Especially in the secondary.

Well, I can only talk in regards to our team. But under Spags, yes, but over all in Coughlin's tenure it's been a mess and that's putting it nicely.


Original staff 2004: Coughlin- Hufangel-Lewis

Since: Coughlin - Hufangel/Gilbride (current) - Lewis/Spags/Sheridan/Fewell (Current)

And Fewell is terrible and I think we don't re sign or extend him. So we pretty much play American Idol: Defensive Coordinator Edition. If you are a defensive mind, please try out and interview! We are not afraid of hiring coaches with NO coordinator experience! See Hufangel, Sheridan, and Spags for that. We are 1/3 when we do that.

Rosebud
12-17-2011, 04:35 PM
Well those guys you've listed have had decent to good defenses in a lot of their years. This is the first season ever the Texans have had a legitimate defense. Especially in the secondary.

Which is why it really sucks for him that he got hurt the first chance he really got to prove himself.