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View Full Version : Gunnin' for #1 QB Spot in Class of 2013


shylo3716
12-21-2011, 08:29 PM
I'm going to list potential 2013 QB prospects who will fight for the #1 spot come next year. Keep in mind a few guys from the projected 2012 class may return.

Order varies for the moment. I will officially update this after the underclassmen deadline.

Matt Barkley USC
Aaron Murray UGA
Tyler Bray Tennessee
Landry Jones Oklahoma*
Tyler Wilson ArkansasHonorable mention

Mike Glennon NC State
E.J. Manuel FSU
Geno Smith West Virginia
A.J. McCarron Alabama
Tajh Boyd Clemson
Logan Thomas Virginia Tech

Sloopy
12-21-2011, 08:32 PM
It will be either Matt Barkley or Tyler Wilson

SickwithIt1010
12-21-2011, 08:34 PM
Landry Jones would be dumb to come back, he will lose the job to Bell at the rate hes going.

Aaron Murray is tiny, I like him and I think he could be good but I dont see anyone taking him number 1 by any means.

I really like Bray, and hope he has a good year next season. Think hes got some potential.

shylo3716
12-21-2011, 08:36 PM
It will be either Matt Barkley or Tyler Wilson
Right now I have Barkley coming out. I really do believe if any QB returns from that class it would be Jones, which would make the 2013 class wide open.

Raiderz4Life
12-21-2011, 08:36 PM
Yea I think Barkley comes back..if he does idk if anyone will take #1 from him.

ElectricEye
12-21-2011, 08:41 PM
1. Tyler Wilson
2. Tyler Bray
3. Landry Jones
4. Brock Osweiler
5. Casey Pachall


The first three are surefire first rounders as things stand now, even though I don't personally like Landry Jones much. Tyler Bray has the chance to be the best out of the bunch, even though he's proven a little less than those other guys. Still, when I watch him throw the football I come away seeing a guy who well could be a franchise quarterback in the NFL.

shylo3716
12-21-2011, 08:41 PM
Landry Jones would be dumb to come back, he will lose the job to Bell at the rate hes going.

Aaron Murray is tiny, I like him and I think he could be good but I dont see anyone taking him number 1 by any means.

I really like Bray, and hope he has a good year next season. Think hes got some potential.

Remember Matt Ryan went #3 overall? So keep in mind, he can be the #1 QB off the board, just not the #1 overall pick.

Paul
12-21-2011, 09:03 PM
Well Matt Ryan is 3 Inches taller then Murray.

shylo3716
12-21-2011, 09:11 PM
Well Matt Ryan is 3 Inches taller then Murray.

I realized this. If you happened to come across the 2013 Mock posted in that forum you would see I pointed that out.

Paul
12-21-2011, 09:16 PM
Ahh okay. I'll make a point of taking notice of every post you make from now on. Sorry about that.

shylo3716
12-21-2011, 09:28 PM
Ahh okay. I'll make a point of taking notice of every post you make from now on. Sorry about that.

My arguement is not him being the #1 QB. I'm just stating the obvious of what will be brought up, so I used the Ryan reference to give a clear visual of what may come about.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-21-2011, 10:15 PM
Anyone from the Virginia area.

keylime_5
12-21-2011, 10:19 PM
let's wait and see which junior QBs declare before we worry about ranking next year's QBs. Barkley especially will be a big factor, there is a pretty decent chance he stays in school.

sbh15
12-21-2011, 10:37 PM
Anyone from the Virginia area.

specifically dat 7-5-7 my ***** bc he rep dat **** all day

RaiderNation
12-21-2011, 11:06 PM
I'm thinking Wilson or Barkley depending of if Barkley goes pro this year. Wilson is set to have a awesome year next season at Arkansas

OSUGiants17
12-21-2011, 11:19 PM
Here's how I think it will end up:
1. Matt Barkley
2. Tyler Bray
3. Tyler Wilson
4. Brock Osweiler
5. Aaron Murray
6. Collin Klein
7. Tajh Boyd
8. Mike Glennon
9. Geno Smith
10. EJ Manuel

I like next years potential A LOT more than This years. This year has Luck, RG3, Landry(who I don't even like, all he has is the measureables, he'll bust if he has to start day 1), and Tannenhill(idk if I spelt it right, sorry)

WT01
12-21-2011, 11:57 PM
Keith Price. There, I said it. In my eyes, the guy's not a bad prospect. He doesn't have elite arm strength but it's "good" at least and likely above average. He has good athleticism and generally makes good decisions. He already plays in a pro-style system and completed 67% of his passes even in a system that utilizes a more downfield passing game. Like Murray, he's not very big (listed as 6'1" and 195 pounds), but he's got a frame that will allow him to gain some weight and despite his height, he doesn't have a ton of balls batted down. I think he could potentially have a Robert Griffin-esque rise from obscurity to be a higher pick.

FUNBUNCHER
12-22-2011, 12:43 AM
Tyler Wilson, Mike Glennon and Geno Smith will be the top rated pro prospects at the end of the 2012 season. Brock Osweiler is my darkhorse.

ElectricEye
12-22-2011, 12:53 AM
Keith Price. There, I said it. In my eyes, the guy's not a bad prospect. He doesn't have elite arm strength but it's "good" at least and likely above average. He has good athleticism and generally makes good decisions. He already plays in a pro-style system and completed 67% of his passes even in a system that utilizes a more downfield passing game. Like Murray, he's not very big (listed as 6'1" and 195 pounds), but he's got a frame that will allow him to gain some weight and despite his height, he doesn't have a ton of balls batted down. I think he could potentially have a Robert Griffin-esque rise from obscurity to be a higher pick.

I like Price, but size will be as solid of a knock as they come on him. He's got a very quick release and throws a good ball down the field though, so we'll have to see. Can't see a quarterback who will likely measure at 6'0 on the nose nose(Locker and Mason Foster ended up being an inch shorter than their listed heights) going in the first few rounds though. Don't see Robert Griffin type ability there either, even with the size. Regardless of his pro prospects he should be a damn good player for Washington next year.

CashmoneyDrew
12-22-2011, 01:16 AM
I hope Braysus stays for his senior year...

MassNole
12-22-2011, 07:50 AM
It will be interesting to see what happens if E.J. Manuel has even a competent OL in front of him. He also needs to lose that video game glitch spin move he has when leaving the pocket.

princefielder28
12-22-2011, 08:28 AM
1. Tyler Wilson - Arkansas
2. Tyler Bray - Tennessee*
3. Aaron Murray - Georgia*
4. Logan Thomas - Virginia Tech*
5. Geno Smith - West Virginia

That's how I see the Top 5 eligible QBs right now...whether Landry returns or not he wouldn't make my list

If Barkley is back I'd throw him between Bray and Murray

Shane P. Hallam
12-22-2011, 08:32 AM
May be Barkley when all is said and done. Logan Thomas a nice sleeper that I like as well.

shylo3716
12-22-2011, 09:07 AM
Anyone from the Virginia area.

specifically dat 7-5-7 my ***** bc he rep dat **** all day

Not 1 757 prospect is in my top 5 BTW Glennon is listed where he should be.

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
12-22-2011, 09:45 AM
Landry Jones being number 1
http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2011/4/6/2340b39e-ec44-4337-a87f-cd4d9ac260b5.jpg

DraftSavant
12-22-2011, 10:20 AM
Mark my words, it'll be Bray. He'll be a Stafford-level prospect when he comes out.

georgiafan
12-22-2011, 10:23 AM
I wouldnt take Aaron Murray in the first round. He did submit his name to the NFL board this year to see his stock even though he is just a sophmore. He said he wasnt coming out this year but next year it could happen.

ElectricEye
12-22-2011, 10:55 AM
Mark my words, it'll be Bray. He'll be a Stafford-level prospect when he comes out.

With a good year and some protein shakes, that's the type of guy he can be. He's poised for a huge season next year if Justin Hunter can come back and Da'Rick Rogers continues progressing.

Grizzlegom
12-22-2011, 11:10 AM
twitterverse blowing up saying RGIII, Barkley, and Jones are all leaning towards staying.

ElectricEye
12-22-2011, 11:14 AM
twitterverse blowing up saying RGIII, Barkley, and Jones are all leaning towards staying.

That could make for absolute chaos next year(and this year as well) and well could end up hurting their stock, even if they have great years. It would be a great class next year....but all of them could potentially be pushed down as there's only so many slots for quarterbacks in the first round. Tyler Wilson should be putting his papers in right this second if that's true though.

DraftSavant
12-22-2011, 11:34 AM
That could make for absolute chaos next year(and this year as well) and well could end up hurting their stock, even if they have great years. It would be a great class next year....but all of them could potentially be pushed down as there's only so many slots for quarterbacks in the first round. Tyler Wilson should be putting his papers in right this second if that's true though.

Absolutely agree with this.

shylo3716
12-22-2011, 11:55 AM
twitterverse blowing up saying RGIII, Barkley, and Jones are all leaning towards staying.

I may be wrong but I doubt it.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-22-2011, 12:18 PM
With a good year and some protein shakes


Seriously. I like the kid, but he needs to be locked in the weight room.

keylime_5
12-22-2011, 12:25 PM
Seriously. I like the kid, but he needs to be locked in the weight room.

that or a buffet room.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-22-2011, 12:31 PM
that or a buffet room.


I guess he can be let out for the multiple meals a day he should be eating.

ElectricEye
12-22-2011, 12:34 PM
He's listed at 210 right now. With his frame and if that's accurate, he should be able to get up to 230 pretty quickly. He's a lean guy, which is going to be a bit of a concern regardless of what he ends up checking in at....but on paper, that's actually pretty good. Rivers is a little smaller than that, even. But yeah, he looks like a tooth pick.

TACKLE
12-22-2011, 12:37 PM
He's no thinner than Bradford was as a sophomore and Bradford got up to 236 at the combine after his junior year. I don't expect size to be any kind of issue for Bray in the big picture.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-22-2011, 12:38 PM
He's listed at 210 right now. With his frame and if that's accurate, he should be able to get up to 230 pretty quickly. He's a lean guy, which is going to be a bit of a concern regardless of what he ends up checking in at....but on paper, that's actually pretty good. Rivers is a little smaller than that, even. But yeah, he looks like a tooth pick.


I know he's tall, but I have a really hard time buying 210.

shylo3716
12-22-2011, 12:38 PM
He's listed at 210 right now. With his frame and if that's accurate, he should be able to get up to 230 pretty quickly. He's a lean guy, which is going to be a bit of a concern regardless of what he ends up checking in at....but on paper, that's actually pretty good. Rivers is a little smaller than that, even. But yeah, he looks like a tooth pick.

True! But at the same time it would be a very bad move on his behalf to put it all on in 1 spring/summer offseason. He would have to work on his endurance & most important footwork, because it could end up making him look really lazy ala Flacco.

shylo3716
12-22-2011, 12:41 PM
I know he's tall, but I have a really hard time buying 210.

I don't know why unless you think he is in the 190 range. 210 seems about right for him to be 6'6''. Keep in mind Jacory Harris was listed at 6'4'' 195 and by all means I really thought he was 170 soaking wet.

ElectricEye
12-22-2011, 12:48 PM
I know he's tall, but I have a really hard time buying 210.

Certainly doesn't look it... but looking at some of the guys Tennessee has had drafted lately, they've been right on the money with heights and weights, aside from the obligatory rounding up an inch. Eric Berry had similar concerns levied at him and he showed up to the combine bigger than his college weight, even. So I'm not super concerned about it personally. Even still, he certainly needs to add at least 20 pounds. Ideally 30.

CashmoneyDrew
12-22-2011, 12:55 PM
Certainly doesn't look it... but looking at some of the guys Tennessee has had drafted lately, they've been right on the money with heights and weights, aside from the obligatory rounding up an inch. Eric Berry had similar concerns levied at him and he showed up to the combine bigger than his college weight, even. So I'm not super concerned about it personally. Even still, he certainly needs to add at least 20 pounds. Ideally 30.

Finally someone besides TH and I that has realized this. I remember fighting off all of the savages that were convinced Eric Berry would measure in at 5'9". The only guy I remember in recent years coming out of UT that was nowhere near his listed size was Demonte Bolden, and yeah... he wasn't really even a good prospect.

Ozzy
12-22-2011, 02:33 PM
At this point I would have it like this, Jones I am not a huge fan of and I like Wilson's toughness a lot. And guys like Glennon, Thomas or Bray could go over Jones if they have really big seasons like this should next year.


Tyler Wilson Arkansas
Aaron Murray Georgia JR
Landry Jones Oklahoma
Mike Glennon NC State
Logan Thomas Virginia Tech JR
Tyler Bray Tennessee JR
Brock Osweiler Arizona State
EJ Manuel Florida State
Brandon Mitchell Arkansas JR
Danny O'Brien Maryland JR
Geno Smith West Virginia
Tajh Boyd Clemson JR
Jordan Rodgers Vanderbilt

keylime_5
12-22-2011, 02:44 PM
I'm amazed that everyone is assuming Barkley is not gonna be in the 2013 draft. I thought for months now that it was more likely he stays than leaves. I guess we'll find out for sure in a little bit here, but including Wilson and Jones in next year's draft but not Barkley doesn't make sense when ranking the QBs.

1-Barkley
2-Bray
3-Jones
4-Murray
5-Osweiler
6-Thomas
7-Manuel
8-Glennon

right now Jordan Rodgers has a long long way to go both as a passer and physically before we can even talk about him as ever playing a snap in the NFL. Danny O'Brien? Didn't he get benched like a few games into the season.

boknows34
12-22-2011, 03:06 PM
Barkley has officially announced he's returning to USC.

Raiderz4Life
12-22-2011, 04:13 PM
There's your #1. Barkley.

DraftSavant
12-22-2011, 04:17 PM
There's your #1. Barkley.

I think he might go lower next year than he would have this year. Bray and Wilson are coming for that ass.

Raiderz4Life
12-22-2011, 04:20 PM
Neither one of them will knock off Barkley. Barkley is 2nd only to Luck and he's coming back making Barkley #1.

ElectricEye
12-22-2011, 04:23 PM
The Tyler's well could go before Barkley. Especially Wilson. If they were to both come out, it would be a lot closer than people realize. Barkley is the clear cut number one now that he's coming back obviously...but yeah, really see that as something that could change.

shylo3716
12-22-2011, 04:26 PM
Hope Landry does not follow Barkley now

shylo3716
12-22-2011, 04:59 PM
Some thoughts on Barkley's decision:

* From a draft position and financial perspective it was a mistake. It will be very difficult for Barkley to have a better season than he just had. Just look at his stats and the way USC closed out their season. The fact that some were even debating whether Barkley was a better prospect than Andrew Luck, which is ludicrous, speaks volumes about how his stock plateaued.

* Let's say for arguments sake that Barkley would have been the #5 overall pick in the 2012 NFL Draft. If he goes #1 overall in the 2013 NFL Draft it will net him an extra $2.5 million. However, if he slips to #10 overall it will cost him $7.5 million. Also, Barkley is wasting a year of earning potential and it's not like football players get to play for decades (unless you are Brett Favre).

* Barkley's game is ripe to be picked apart and overanalyzed. People are going to point out his lack of top physical tools and say he is a product of all the talent around him (best set of wideouts in the country, etc). Could be a Matt Leinart situation.

* Barkley isn't going to have the buzz a year from now. A was a big reason why Mark Sanchez was selected as early as he was. Sanchez struck while the iron was hot, Barkley did not.

* I know Robert Griffin III wants to return to school, but this is going to be too good of an opportunity to pass up in my opinion. Landry Jones may have to re-think his decision as well. This could also be huge for Ryan Tannehill.

* Fans of the Redskins, Dolphins, Browns and Seahawks should be very concerned.
All I have to say is Barkley better not slip in performance, because this will only help Murray's case especially with both being measured around 6'1"-6'2"ish

FUNBUNCHER
12-22-2011, 05:46 PM
What a wimp that Barkley kid is! ;)

descendency
12-22-2011, 06:04 PM
If RGIII, Jones, and Barkley return... that's insane.

RGIIIs stock will not go higher and his team is average at best, no matter how good he is.

Landry Jones will lose snaps to Blake Bell and could ultimately end up being Tebow'd (Florida style). Plus there are tons of dirty rumors around OU that this team is fractured as hell. I hope he enjoys the 5th round.

Barkley is the only one that has any potential reason to return. Granted, I agree with Scott, there is some big risk to it... but he's the only one there with no major reason to be worried about his job or his team.

Ozzy
12-22-2011, 08:26 PM
Wow what the heck if Barkley doing, he is making a mistake I feel, he would almost be a lock to be a top 5 pick. I see no reason why he wants to return unless he wants to go after a National title.

But like others have said, cannot get much better than he played this year...

FUNBUNCHER
01-04-2012, 09:58 PM
Geno Smith and WVU are committing mass felonies in the Orange Bowl tonight.

I think Smith works his way into first round discussion in 2013, the REAL 'quarterback' draft.

ElectricEye
01-04-2012, 10:09 PM
Yup, next year is loaded. Until next year, when 2014 becomes the 'real' class.

Brown Leader
01-04-2012, 10:18 PM
Why is Aaron Murray in anyone's top 5?

BamaFalcon59
01-05-2012, 12:01 AM
With his tools and the rate he is progressing, Logan Thomas will be a high pick for somebody.

Slim chance Murray goes ahead of him. Or Wilson, but I've not been too impressed with him.

deepthoughtlife
01-05-2012, 05:15 AM
Why is Aaron Murray in anyone's top 5?

Presumably because good quarterbacks tend top have their fans, no matter the confounding factors that often go into ranking for the draft, and Aaron Murray is a good college quarterback. Very few people have actually scouted him for the NFL at this point. I know I haven't. Also, it would hardly be unusual for someone who is a sophomore to legitimately get bigger.

DiG
01-05-2012, 10:07 AM
No love for Keith Price in here? He arguably was one of the most impressive QBs in NCAA this year. I know his size will be questioned but if he is able to bulk up a little and continue to progress as a qb then he most definitely will be right up in the top of the qb conversation next year. His throwing motion is superb and in his first year starting he was incredible successful this year.

Babylon
01-05-2012, 11:08 AM
No love for Keith Price in here? He arguably was one of the most impressive QBs in NCAA this year. I know his size will be questioned but if he is able to bulk up a little and continue to progress as a qb then he most definitely will be right up in the top of the qb conversation next year. His throwing motion is superb and in his first year starting he was incredible successful this year.

Keith's been great and will probably stay till his senior year so he'll have another year beyond next year. Somewhat limited from a tools standpoint but he could sneak into that top tier at some point. Really starting to remind me of Charlie Ward at the college level.

Brown Leader
01-19-2012, 02:34 AM
1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Logan Thomas*
4. Tyler Bray*
5. Landry Jones
6. James Franklin*
7. E.J. Manuel
8. Mike Glennon
9. Keith Price*
10. Aaron Murray*

I can wait a season.

descendency
01-19-2012, 02:39 AM
1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Logan Thomas*
4. Tyler Bray*
5. Landry Jones
6. James Franklin*
7. E.J. Manuel
8. Mike Glennon
9. Keith Price*
10. Aaron Murray*

I can wait a season.

EJ Manual over Mike Glennon? :'(

ThePudge
01-19-2012, 03:30 AM
As of now, I'd go...

1. Matt Barkley - USC
2. Tyler Bray - Tennessee*
3. Logan Thomas - Virginia Tech*
4. Geno Smith - West Virginia
5. Tyler Wilson - Arkansas
6. Aaron Murray - Georgia*
7. Landry Jones - Oklahoma
8. Keith Price - Washington*
9. Bryn Renner - North Carolina*
10. E.J. Manuel - Florida State

There's no question that Barkley is the best as of now. If he had come out this year it would be a heck of a race for the #2 spot behind Andrew Luck. In my opinion: Barkley is the real deal and the favorite to go first overall despite a lack of elite measurables.

If anyone stands in his way, it's Tyler Bray. It appears as if he has the highest upside as an NFL prospect if he continues to improve and puts on a little weight.

Wilson is losing three of his top receivers, so we'll see if he hangs in the discussion next season. My gut tells me he won't be a first round pick in 2013.

Geno Smith is the real darkhorse. I don't think a lot of you guys realize how good he is. Has a good head on his shoulders, is accurate, and can make all the throws. Additionally, he gets back both of his explosive, 1000+ yard WRs next season.

Brown Leader
01-19-2012, 11:33 AM
As of now, I'd go...

1. Matt Barkley - USC
2. Tyler Bray - Tennessee*
3. Logan Thomas - Virginia Tech*
4. Geno Smith - West Virginia
5. Tyler Wilson - Arkansas
6. Aaron Murray - Georgia*
7. Landry Jones - Oklahoma
8. Keith Price - Washington*
9. Bryn Renner - North Carolina*
10. E.J. Manuel - Florida State

There's no question that Barkley is the best as of now. If he had come out this year it would be a heck of a race for the #2 spot behind Andrew Luck. In my opinion: Barkley is the real deal and the favorite to go first overall despite a lack of elite measurables.

If anyone stands in his way, it's Tyler Bray. It appears as if he has the highest upside as an NFL prospect if he continues to improve and puts on a little weight.

Wilson is losing three of his top receivers, so we'll see if he hangs in the discussion next season. My gut tells me he won't be a first round pick in 2013.

Geno Smith is the real darkhorse. I don't think a lot of you guys realize how good he is. Has a good head on his shoulders, is accurate, and can make all the throws. Additionally, he gets back both of his explosive, 1000+ yard WRs next season.

Well, certainly Barkley and G.Smith are going to put up gaudy stats next year barring injury but their supporting cast and offenses should be accounted for. I've got Wilson at the top because of the mobility and toughness he showed this past season to go along with his arm. Even if his numbers don't come up, if he does that again (if he survives), I think he's #1. I took Mizzou's Franklin as a darkhorse. What do you think of him?

ThePudge
01-19-2012, 12:38 PM
Well, certainly Barkley and G.Smith are going to put up gaudy stats next year barring injury but their supporting cast and offenses should be accounted for. I've got Wilson at the top because of the mobility and toughness he showed this past season to go along with his arm. Even if his numbers don't come up, if he does that again (if he survives), I think he's #1. I took Mizzou's Franklin as a darkhorse. What do you think of him?

So big numbers and good supporting casts ought to downgrade a prospect now? I've watched enough tape on Barkley this past season (he was among my favorites to watch) and I concluded the guy is nothing like Jimmy Clausen, which I initially feared. Besides, nobody had a deeper supporting cast on offense than Tyler Wilson (Wright, Adams, Hamilton, Childs, D. Johnson, etc.)

Malcolm Lee and Robert Woods are both excellent receivers, but more often than not it is Barkley throwing them open. He has a remarkable amount of trust in his WRs, much more than you typically see at the college level. He has the intelligence/awareness to recognize his receivers' talent and put balls in the air where only his guy can come down with it. Barkley throws downfield with incredible touch & accuracy at times, and to me, he was every bit as good a player this season for USC as his counterpart Andrew Luck was at Stanford.

Below I include my brief notes on Matt Barkley from this past season:

Matt Barkley - Southern Cal
Displays a very natural feel for the game
Shows a great understanding of anticipation and timing in the passing game
Excellent command; can make difficult touch throws or drive the ball into tight windows
Has the arm strength to make any throw
Very confident; Poised and a natural leader
Good decision maker; knows where his receivers are on the field, reads-and-reacts, & gets rid of the ball quickly
Solid footwork and mobility, but must learn to use his feet better when escaping pressure
Occasionally he will overthrow passes across the middle; rarely guilty of under-throwing receivers
Height may be a concern to some (roughly 62)


... Also: on Geno Smith. I'll never forget what I heard after the loss against LSU. CBSSports writer Bruce Feldman, closing up shop for the night, was walking out of the stadium and back to his hotel. On his way, he was passed by Geno Smith, who was re-entering the facility to watch film on the loss. It was 1 in the morning.

While that story doesn't make Geno a better player, it speaks volumes about his work ethic and his drive to be great. The fact that he's already committing himself to the game like a pro always impressed me. Expect Smith to continue improving and to go down as the best passer in West Virginia history. It won't surprise me if we're talking about him as a first round pick next April.

Brown Leader
01-19-2012, 02:30 PM
So big numbers and good supporting casts ought to downgrade a prospect now?
C'mon. I like Barkley. A lot. I have him #2. I just happen to like Wilson more right now because of his mobility and the ability to still produce while taking a beating for the whole season.

... Also: on Geno Smith. I'll never forget what I heard after the loss against LSU. CBSSports writer Bruce Feldman, closing up shop for the night, was walking out of the stadium and back to his hotel. On his way, he was passed by Geno Smith, who was re-entering the facility to watch film on the loss. It was 1 in the morning.

While that story doesn't make Geno a better player, it speaks volumes about his work ethic and his drive to be great. The fact that he's already committing himself to the game like a pro always impressed me. Expect Smith to continue improving and to go down as the best passer in West Virginia history. It won't surprise me if we're talking about him as a first round pick next April.
That is impressive-we'll see.

DrAbaddon
01-19-2012, 03:00 PM
I'd like to go out on a limb and bring up a name I haven't seen mentioned yet (for good reason, he hasn't played), Brett Nottingham. He won the back-up job to Luck last year as a Redshirt Freshman over a couple of decent upperclassmen after being a big-time recruit the year before.

His scouting reports out of high school read like a future H.O.Fer with the caveat that he doesn't quite have the arm strength of the top level guys...well, in mop-up duty last year he played well and in-fact does have enough arm, and it's hard to not project a 6'4" (6'3 3/8" at a combine as a 17 year old) kid with crisp mechanics not improving his arm, if anyone remembers, Bradford had an absolute noodle for an arm his Freshman and Sophomore years.

I know it's just H.S. numbers, but he completed 70% of his passes...that's pretty damn rare. It's just after seeing everything the internet has to offer on the kid, I'm on the bandwagon a la RGIII after his freshman year. There was even an interview a year ago where Zach Ertz (Backup TE who played with Nottingham in H.S.) was asked about Luck leaving and he just blew it off and pretty much said Nottingham will be able to step in right away, take that with a grain of salt, I know...but still.

I guess more than anything, I'm just bookmarking the "I told you so" rights for 2013 or 2014. haha

ElectricEye
01-19-2012, 03:57 PM
... Also: on Geno Smith. I'll never forget what I heard after the loss against LSU. CBSSports writer Bruce Feldman, closing up shop for the night, was walking out of the stadium and back to his hotel. On his way, he was passed by Geno Smith, who was re-entering the facility to watch film on the loss. It was 1 in the morning.

While that story doesn't make Geno a better player, it speaks volumes about his work ethic and his drive to be great. The fact that he's already committing himself to the game like a pro always impressed me. Expect Smith to continue improving and to go down as the best passer in West Virginia history. It won't surprise me if we're talking about him as a first round pick next April.

I'm not even going to lie, that bumps up Geno a bit in my book even if it shouldn't. I love to hear stuff like that about guys, especially quarterbacks. That's the difference between just making it to the NFL an succeeding most of the time.

Jack203
01-19-2012, 04:11 PM
I like Geno Smith as well

Brown Leader
05-01-2012, 05:54 PM
bump in the night

ATLDirtyBirds
05-01-2012, 05:55 PM
Tyler Bray is that dude. Just don't let him out of the gym/cafeteria.

shylo3716
05-08-2012, 02:03 PM
This thread should be oh so popular now.

Dangermouse
05-08-2012, 04:56 PM
Going into the season my top 5:

1. Matt Barkley - USC
2. Logan Thomas - Virginia Tech*
3. Tyler Bray - Tennessee*
4. Tyler Wilson - Arkansas
5. Landry Jones - Oklahoma


I have four first round grades. Barkley, Thomas and Bray in the top 5 overall and Wilson in the late first.

IMO, it will end up being similar to the 2011 class


You have Barkley playing the role of Luck
Tyler Bray is your Barkley, he goes back to school.
Thomas is RG3.
Then Tyler is your Tannehill and he gets pushed into the top 10.
Landry Jones is Brandon Weeden.


Teams likely to take a QB

Bills
Chiefs
Raiders

May take QB depending on development of current starter

Browns
Jets
Pats - depending on how much Brady has left in the tank
Jaguars
Vikings
49ers
Cardinals
Saints - see Pats

My projection

Browns have the first pick, Holmgren, Heckert and Shurmur get fired and the knew front office move on from Weeden, they take Barkley.

Miami at number 2 pull a Rams like trade with the Chiefs. Chiefs take Thomas.

Raiders panic and reach on Tyler Wilson.


And my surprise pick, Landry Jones goes to the Pats at the back end of the first after they trade Ryan Mallett for a high second.

Brown Leader
05-08-2012, 05:22 PM
Tyler Wilson showed more in one season then Tannehill ever will. If he even comes close to the season he just had he's easily top ten.

Brown Leader
11-13-2012, 11:00 AM
This thread's an interesting reread. My top 10 now:

1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Geno Smith
4. E.J. Manuel
5. Tyler Bray*
6. Logan Thomas*
7. Colin Klein
8. Mike Glennon
9. Aaron Murray*
10 Ryan Nassib

Wilson, Barkley and Smith have all taken a step back-Wilson predictably so and Smith after taking giants steps forward but has shown some accuracy issues in their skid. James Franklin's been a disappointment to me. He changed his mechanics to a flat footed stance before he throws-it's ugly. Thomas taken a few steps back but that Hokie team is pretty bad overall and he's got no weapons this year. The real riser has been Manuel. I wonder if #1 overall isn't out of the question with him.

vidae
11-13-2012, 01:10 PM
1. Tyler Wilson
2. Geno Smith
3. Matt Barkley
4. EJ Manuel
5. Tyler Bray

y.f.s.
11-13-2012, 01:39 PM
This thread's an interesting reread. My top 10 now:

1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Geno Smith
4. E.J. Manuel
5. Tyler Bray*
6. Logan Thomas*
7. Colin Klein
8. Mike Glennon
9. Aaron Murray*
10 Ryan Nassib

Wilson, Barkley and Smith have all taken a step back-Wilson predictably so and Smith after taking giants steps forward but has shown some accuracy issues in their skid. James Franklin's been a disappointment to me. He changed his mechanics to a flat footed stance before he throws-it's ugly. Thomas taken a few steps back but that Hokie team is pretty bad overall and he's got no weapons this year. The real riser has been Manuel. I wonder if #1 overall isn't out of the question with him.

I like EJ way more than most, but that's just excessive.

MassNole
11-13-2012, 02:07 PM
This thread's an interesting reread. My top 10 now:

1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Geno Smith
4. E.J. Manuel
5. Tyler Bray*
6. Logan Thomas*
7. Colin Klein
8. Mike Glennon
9. Aaron Murray*
10 Ryan Nassib

Wilson, Barkley and Smith have all taken a step back-Wilson predictably so and Smith after taking giants steps forward but has shown some accuracy issues in their skid. James Franklin's been a disappointment to me. He changed his mechanics to a flat footed stance before he throws-it's ugly. Thomas taken a few steps back but that Hokie team is pretty bad overall and he's got no weapons this year. The real riser has been Manuel. I wonder if #1 overall isn't out of the question with him.

Here's the thing with E.J., when it comes to the Combine he will have all of the measurables that teams drool over. When it comes to interviewing, he will again be absolutely stellar and wow teams. Then it comes time to look at the film where one game he can look like a more intelligent version of Cam Newton, then another game where he makes Vince Young's decision making look All Pro. Hell he can do that inside an individual game, look at VT for a prime example. Early on he drastically under threw a sure TD pass to Greg Dent (who had to make an amazing play to catch the ball) then threw a bad interception 3 plays later costing them at least 3 points (even if O'Leary caught the ball it wasn't a TD). Then came the 2 minute drives where he looked absolutely fantastic in leading FSU to a come from behind victory in one of the most hostile environments in the country.

He has tremendous accuracy short to mid-range, and barring a major collapse the next 4 games he will graduate with the highest completion percentage in ACC history (besting Matt Schaub and Philip Rivers). On deep balls he can make one throw that drops your jaw (see the TD pass to Rodney Smith vs. Clemson), then the next deep ball throws a duck. He has really cut down on his mistakes, of the 5 INTs he has thrown this season, 3 hit receivers in the hands and should have been caught, only 1 of those 3 was a bad decision. The INT vs. N.C. State was easily the worst mistake he has made this season, and the one vs. BC came when FSU was already up big and he was just being greedy (Fisher's words).

His biggest flaw is his stubbornness to use his legs when the pocket breaks down or even worse the E.J. spin where he tries spinning away from a defender and loses another 5 yards. What is strange about this is his first 2 years it was not the case, he would use his legs and get out of the pocket and pick up big yards with his legs. He did this vs. Clemson this year, but other than that it is hard to say why he does it.

Ultimately, if Chip Kelly goes to the NFL, Manuel would probably be the most desirable QB for his offense out of this crop of rookies. That could be a scenario where he comes a First Rounder, possibly even the first QB taken. Or some team just falls in love with him at the Combine and believes they can fix the things Jimbo Fisher could not (that would take one helluva coaching job).

SolidGold
11-13-2012, 02:09 PM
Here is how I would rank them as of today:

1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Mike Glennon
4. Landry Jones
5. Geno Smith
6. Zac Dysert
7. Collin Klein
8. E.J. Manuel
9. Sean Renfree

As other have said and I agree with Wilson is more or less having issues due to a team in great disarray. That whole team is a wreck and they lost 3 WRs to the NFL last year. He has done pretty well all things considered. Put on his junior tape and he looks very good. He has all the physical ability, high character and is a team guy - he will get rave reviews during the pre-draft process.

Matt Barkley is a guy I seem to like more than most here. He is a victim of overexposure. I like the fact he actually throws the ball down field - i think he throws a good deep ball and his arm strength is more than serviceable. He is a smart, experienced 4 year starter in a pro-style offense.

Mike Glennon is probably the biggest boom-bust guy. Physically he has it all in terms of what you want in the QB position. He has the size and arm strength. The streaky accuracy leaves something to be desired but some of that can be attributed to the supporting cast dropping passes. I think he is worth a 1st round pick if he can take some time to develop and polish the weaker aspects of his game.

Landry Jones seems really like a forgotten player. He has all the physical tools and owns all of Oklahoma's passing records. He reminds me of Matt Schaub - a good QB who can be a cog in an offense but will never reach elite status.

Geno Smith - I am probably his biggest critic. He does show accuracy and touch on passes when he has time. Once he is rattled or the system he plays in experiences adversity the wheels seem to come off. He struggles against good defenses and to me just screams system QB. I honestly don't see much difference between him and Brandon Weeden.

Just random thoughts on the other ones - If Colin Kaepernick can be a second round pick I see no reason Klein could not be picked int he 3rd/4th round range. Klein is a very similar player but his mechanics while flawed are much better than Kapernick's. Manuel I do not like at all - he benefits from being on a good team and playing in a weak conference. Sean Renfree would be a good developmental guy - he has the size and arm strength and has been under the tutelage of the same coach that once coached both Manning's.

FUNBUNCHER
11-13-2012, 02:16 PM
Since many if not most of these prospects won't be drafted to teams expecting them to start as rookies, it could benefit them long term as far as development and sticking in the NFL.

This class as a group could turn out to be more successful than they look right now.

y.f.s.
11-13-2012, 02:29 PM
Here is how I would rank them as of today:

1. Tyler Wilson
2. Matt Barkley
3. Mike Glennon
4. Landry Jones
5. Geno Smith
6. Zac Dysert
7. Collin Klein
8. E.J. Manuel
9. Sean Renfree

As other have said and I agree with Wilson is more or less having issues due to a team in great disarray. That whole team is a wreck and they lost 3 WRs to the NFL last year. He has done pretty well all things considered. Put on his junior tape and he looks very good. He has all the physical ability, high character and is a team guy - he will get rave reviews during the pre-draft process.

Matt Barkley is a guy I seem to like more than most here. He is a victim of overexposure. I like the fact he actually throws the ball down field - i think he throws a good deep ball and his arm strength is more than serviceable. He is a smart, experienced 4 year starter in a pro-style offense.

Mike Glennon is probably the biggest boom-bust guy. Physically he has it all in terms of what you want in the QB position. He has the size and arm strength. The streaky accuracy leaves something to be desired but some of that can be attributed to the supporting cast dropping passes. I think he is worth a 1st round pick if he can take some time to develop and polish the weaker aspects of his game.

Landry Jones seems really like a forgotten player. He has all the physical tools and owns all of Oklahoma's passing records. He reminds me of Matt Schaub - a good QB who can be a cog in an offense but will never reach elite status.

Geno Smith - I am probably his biggest critic. He does show accuracy and touch on passes when he has time. Once he is rattled or the system he plays in experiences adversity the wheels seem to come off. He struggles against good defenses and to me just screams system QB. I honestly don't see much difference between him and Brandon Weeden.

Just random thoughts on the other ones - If Colin Kaepernick can be a second round pick I see no reason Klein could not be picked int he 3rd/4th round range. Klein is a very similar player but his mechanics while flawed are much better than Kapernick's. Manuel I do not like at all - he benefits from being on a good team and playing in a weak conference. Sean Renfree would be a good developmental guy - he has the size and arm strength and has been under the tutelage of the same coach that once coached both Manning's.

Explain these terms, please.

Also, why is Geno Smith a system QB, but Landry Jones is not? Systems are incredibly similar. They're both Leach derivatives.

gpngc
11-13-2012, 02:31 PM
SolidGold, Renfree is a nice college player, but he doesn't have the prerequisite pro arm strength.

Although I thought the same thing about Dalton...

Cardinal96
11-13-2012, 02:46 PM
Looking at this year's QB class makes you realize why Washington sacrificed what they did to move up to number 2 overall last year.

SolidGold
11-13-2012, 02:46 PM
Explain these terms, please.

Also, why is Geno Smith a system QB, but Landry Jones is not? Systems are incredibly similar. They're both Leach derivatives.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offensive_philosophy_%28American_football%29

Here ya go...

I feel the Oklahoma offense has more balance to it than WVUs which seems like more of an air it out offense.

y.f.s.
11-13-2012, 02:48 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Offensive_philosophy_%28American_football%29

Here ya go...


If I wanted to read a Wikipedia entry, I would have looked it up myself. YOU used the terms, YOU seem adamant about making it the basis of your argument, so YOU define it. When I hear/read the terms "pro style offense" or "system QB", I usually just assume the person is speaking in cliches and scouting by narrative.

I feel the Oklahoma offense has more balance to it than WVUs which seems like more of an air it out offense.

Okay, so now I know you're just talking in cliches.

JHL6719
11-13-2012, 03:15 PM
The term "pro style" is typically just used to describe any offense where the QB takes snaps from under center, and utilizes 21-personnel. Although that has changed over the years as offenses are using more 3 and 4 WR sets, and the percentage of time a lot of QB's spend in the shotgun now approaches 65% of the time or more even in the NFL.

It has nothing to do with literally running a "professional" offense. There's no such thing as a "professional" offense.... football evolves through innovation. Every offense in the CFL is a "professional" offense, because they're professionals... but it's more "gimmicky" than almost anything you'll see in college due to the extremely wide splits by the WR's and playing 3 down football.

The offenses being run in college football nowdays prepare these kids more for throwing the football at the next level more than it ever has in any point in history. Mainly due to throwing the football all over the place. It even starts at the high school level where offenses are allowing QB's to throw the ball all over the place. It wasn't always that way.

SolidGold
11-13-2012, 09:15 PM
If I wanted to read a Wikipedia entry, I would have looked it up myself. YOU used the terms, YOU seem adamant about making it the basis of your argument, so YOU define it. When I hear/read the terms "pro style offense" or "system QB", I usually just assume the person is speaking in cliches and scouting by narrative.



Okay, so now I know you're just talking in cliches.

Yep just talking cliches. I just go by what I see.

KCStud
11-14-2012, 03:20 AM
Just don't see how Matt Barkley is not the #1 QB. He's going to blow away GM's at the combine in the interviews. His arm is not a bee bee gun like some have claimed. He can make all the throws.

Barkley has really sold me on his leadership skills. I think he has everything you could want there. His work ethic is amazing and he will get guys to buy in with his people skills.

I think Barkley is bust-proof honestly. He's by far the best QB USC has ever had and he hasn't had the luxury of having a loaded roster this year like some of the other guys, but yet he still gets it done.

I pray to God Kansas City gets this kid, but he's exactly what we need.

ChiefMojo
11-14-2012, 10:33 AM
Personally my top three with QB's right now are....

1) Matt Barkley
2) Tyler Wilson
3) Geno Smith

y.f.s.
11-14-2012, 12:11 PM
Yep just talking cliches. I just go by what I see.

Then explain the real differences in the structure of the offense. I've asked you to explain what a "system QB" is in more than one thread. It's the drum YOU keep beating. JHL even gave you a head start. Jesus.

I'm not trying to pick on you or tell you that your conclusion is necessarily incorrect. I'm not trying to belittle you and tell you your opinion doesn't matter, or is stupid. I'm just pointing out that your methods and explanations are very, very shallow and cliche-driven.

A good starting point would be to start learning (in-depth) about different offensive systems, what the difference is between offensive STRUCTURE and the SYSTEMS themselves. Again, not trying to pick on your or be patronizing, I'm just going off of what you yourself have written on here.

AntoinCD
11-14-2012, 12:41 PM
Just don't see how Matt Barkley is not the #1 QB. He's going to blow away GM's at the combine in the interviews. His arm is not a bee bee gun like some have claimed. He can make all the throws.

Barkley has really sold me on his leadership skills. I think he has everything you could want there. His work ethic is amazing and he will get guys to buy in with his people skills.

I think Barkley is bust-proof honestly. He's by far the best QB USC has ever had and he hasn't had the luxury of having a loaded roster this year like some of the other guys, but yet he still gets it done.

I pray to God Kansas City gets this kid, but he's exactly what we need.

I'm not a big fan of what I see from Barkley but he will get points for his leadership in interviews.

However I gotta disagree with your statement that he doesn't have the loaded roster. He may not have a top notch defense, however he is playing with a guy who has been described as USC's best ever WR in Lee and another likely first round pick at WR in Woods. It's not as if he's playing with a bunch of walk ons

scottyboy
11-14-2012, 01:55 PM
i'm lukewarm on Barkley

I also really love Tyler Wilson. Like everything about him

Babylon
11-14-2012, 02:53 PM
Since many if not most of these prospects won't be drafted to teams expecting them to start as rookies, it could benefit them long term as far as development and sticking in the NFL.

This class as a group could turn out to be more successful than they look right now.

I could see starters right away in Kansas City, Buffalo and Arizona. Personally i don't go for rookies starting from day one but it is a trend.

Iamcanadian
11-14-2012, 03:57 PM
I'm sold on Geo Smith as possibly the #1 overall pick, he goes through his progressions but sometimes holds the ball too long. Probably easily correctable by good coaching at the next level. Top 5 for sure.
Matt Barkley will be a 1st rounder but will have problems getting picked in the top 10. Definitely a top 15-20 guy. Reminds me of Matt Ryan.
Glennon is the other sure fire 1st rounder but likely a late one.
Possibly one other QB will slip into round 1, possibly E.J. Manuel.

As for Tyler Wilson, I still hold Petrino QB's with some suspicion. Was it the coach or the QB????

Not sure which junior QB's will declare.

SolidGold
11-14-2012, 04:34 PM
Then explain the real differences in the structure of the offense. I've asked you to explain what a "system QB" is in more than one thread. It's the drum YOU keep beating. JHL even gave you a head start. Jesus.

I'm not trying to pick on you or tell you that your conclusion is necessarily incorrect. I'm not trying to belittle you and tell you your opinion doesn't matter, or is stupid. I'm just pointing out that your methods and explanations are very, very shallow and cliche-driven.

A good starting point would be to start learning (in-depth) about different offensive systems, what the difference is between offensive STRUCTURE and the SYSTEMS themselves. Again, not trying to pick on your or be patronizing, I'm just going off of what you yourself have written on here.

Pro-Style - QB lines up and takes snaps from under center/usually makes all the requisite 3/5/7 step drop throws as well as throws out of shotgun. This gives the QB more experience in the fundamentals of playing the position and theoretically should give them better mechanics when preparing them for the game at the pro level. When I think pro-style it is basically a well balanced offense. Offense will have a single back or two backs in the backfield and TE is a more valued target in the passing game. More emphasis on the traditional power running game.

Spread - QB in in shotgun almost all the time, running plays are primary of the option/draw variety, typically have 3 or more WRs on the field running patterns. Most patterns run are of the short to intermediate variety and are high percentage passes. This offense is dictated by tempo and keeping the defense on its heels. Mismatches are created by making plays in space.

DcmRulz
11-15-2012, 10:02 AM
This QB battle between Wilson, Barkley, Smith, Glennon and Manuel will be decided most likely in senior bowl practices.

SolidGold
11-15-2012, 11:38 AM
Don't forget the combine - that is how Sanchez got that bump to be picked 4th overall.

Iamcanadian
11-15-2012, 03:37 PM
While it is true that Senior Bowl practices and the Combine establish the final rankings for most prospects, I guess I should throw in Pro Days as well, some players have already established themselves in the elite area, so they can only disappoint.

I think right now Geo Smith is head and shoulders ahead of the others and would have to stink up the post season before anybody passes him. Smith and Barkley get blamed for a lot of their team woes, but face it, it's their team's defense that stinks.

Caulibflower
11-15-2012, 04:09 PM
The real riser has been Manuel. I wonder if #1 overall isn't out of the question with him.

There's people dinging you for this comment, but I was watching tape of him last night and thinking exactly the same thing. I hadn't put a lot of time into watching him before then, and I was seeing all kinds of similarities to Cam Newton. He's not the runner Cam was, but the way he plays in the passing game is really similar. If I'm the Chiefs, I'm taking a really long look at him. Geno Smith is no shoo-in for the no. 1 spot, and I think right now I've got Manuel ahead of Tyler Wilson and Matt Barkley. I think those two are closer to their ceilings already, and Manuel has got some amazing physical tools. What I'm going to have to do now is really try to get a feel for his decision-making. He had a couple of errant throws in what I watched, but you can also see a major arm talent in addition to fantastic size and athleticism. Hangs pretty tough in the pocket, too, and definitely gives you a real element of escapability.

trappeshot
11-17-2012, 03:18 PM
I'm an arkansas fan so I say this with a grain of salt, but at the same time, I didn't give this much praise to Mallett.. but I really, really love Tyler Wilson.

and it's not even his arm or his accuracy. he just has it. he's a natural born leader. there is no situation where he's going to be a failure on the next level. he works too hard, he's too determined, he takes full responsibility for everything around him.. he holds himself to a higher standard. he's the guy that i want to be the face of my franchise for 10-12 years.

I would sit him a year.. he's been beat up bad this last 2 years, but he will be a very good one.

TACKLE
11-17-2012, 03:42 PM
I'm an arkansas fan so I say this with a grain of salt, but at the same time, I didn't give this much praise to Mallett.. but I really, really love Tyler Wilson.

and it's not even his arm or his accuracy. he just has it. he's a natural born leader. there is no situation where he's going to be a failure on the next level. he works too hard, he's too determined, he takes full responsibility for everything around him.. he holds himself to a higher standard. he's the guy that i want to be the face of my franchise for 10-12 years.

I would sit him a year.. he's been beat up bad this last 2 years, but he will be a very good one.

Yeah I think Wilson is far and away the best QB in this draft. He's just such a gifted passer. I'll expound it on more later.


Also, I'm starting to get a feeling that the Chiefs will take Glennon. We'll see.

vidae
11-17-2012, 04:17 PM
Yeah I think Wilson is far and away the best QB in this draft. He's just such a gifted passer. I'll expound it on more later.


Also, I'm starting to get a feeling that the Chiefs will take Glennon. We'll see.

Sad face. I have to hope that Tyler the Creator has a great offseason/senior bowl/pro day/combine. Ugh. Just say no to Glennon.

TACKLE
11-17-2012, 04:21 PM
Ugh. Just say no to Glennon.

What does that even mean?!? Who is supposed to say NO?

vidae
11-17-2012, 04:43 PM
What does that even mean?!? Who is supposed to say NO?

Everyone! EVERYONE!

FUNBUNCHER
11-17-2012, 05:25 PM
What does Tajh Boyd have to do to get invited to this party??
IMO he's the best QB in the ACC.

Is he a RS junior??

descendency
11-17-2012, 06:44 PM
What does Tajh Boyd have to do to get invited to this party??

Not be a typical Clemson system QB.

FUNBUNCHER
11-17-2012, 07:08 PM
Not be a typical Clemson system QB.
Yeah but Tajh a has a boom arm, is mobile and he's 225#.

When is the last time a Clemson QB has come close to the level of production of Boyd?? I think never.

That program isn't known for churning out huge statistical numbers for their QBs. Matter of fact, there's really no such thing a Clemson system QB.

SchizophrenicBatman
11-17-2012, 09:18 PM
http://gif.mocksession.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/CLEMSONDERP.gif

Honestly, Boyd isn't very good. If you're attracted to him, just hire Chad Morris as your OC instead

vidae
11-17-2012, 10:40 PM
Geno looked pretty good against a good D in Oklahoma.

FUNBUNCHER
11-17-2012, 11:05 PM
Landry Jones is looking more like a top 15 pick.
THis class may not have a consensus #1, but IMO it's beginning to look like it has depth.

Cigaro
11-17-2012, 11:10 PM
Yeah but Tajh a has a boom arm, is mobile and he's 225#.

When is the last time a Clemson QB has come close to the level of production of Boyd?? I think never.

That program isn't known for churning out huge statistical numbers for their QBs. Matter of fact, there's really no such thing a Clemson system QB.

Eh, a lot of it has to do with the system, as Morris' offense is much different from the previous run heavy offenses they had been using.

That being said, Clemson has had guys like Kyle Parker and Charlie Whitehurst who looked good(at least initially) and then went on to amount to nothing.

descendency
11-17-2012, 11:13 PM
Geno looked pretty good against a good D in Oklahoma.

Except when he has that look on his face like someone just ran over his dog when he misses a pass on 3rd down.

soybean
11-17-2012, 11:28 PM
Landry Jones is looking more like a top 15 pick.
THis class may not have a consensus #1, but IMO it's beginning to look like it has depth.

I would take him late first. He should be a Texan

TACKLE
11-17-2012, 11:30 PM
Except when he has that look on his face like someone just ran over his dog when he misses a pass on 3rd down.

Is this a joke post or are you one of those people who comments on Jay Cutler's facial expressions in the PFT comment section?

descendency
11-17-2012, 11:49 PM
Is this a joke post or are you one of those people who comments on Jay Cutler's facial expressions in the PFT comment section?

Is that a trick question? Because Cutler doesn't have facial expressions...

TACKLE
11-18-2012, 12:15 AM
Is that a trick question? Because Cutler doesn't have facial expressions...

Sorry, I'm just a little cranky and this recent trend of ridiculous over-analysis of QB body language is kind of a pet peeve of mine.

SolidGold
11-18-2012, 10:19 AM
Finally some Landry Jones recognition.

scottyboy
11-18-2012, 10:20 AM
Sorry, I'm just a little cranky and this recent trend of ridiculous over-analysis of QB body language is kind of a pet peeve of mine.

Eli Manning shrugs his shoulders a lot and looks like he has downs and doesn't yell at guys a lot. Too emotionless. He's also not Peyton. 2/10. Would not draft.

trappeshot
11-23-2012, 05:28 PM
i dont' see how anyone doesn't look at today's lsu game and say that's the QB i want running my franchise. kid has it. no doubt about it best QB in the class IMHO. not top pick in the draft, but should be without question the first QB off the board

bigbluedefense
11-24-2012, 02:04 PM
I like Tyler Wilson. I think he can be a good NFL quarterback. Reminds me of Tannehill in some ways.

REDiculous
11-24-2012, 05:24 PM
I like Wilson as the top QB in this class, but then again, I like Bray and Murray as well.

TACKLE
12-04-2012, 03:46 PM
Tyler Wilson just signed with CAA. Expect him to start getting the hype he deserves.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-04-2012, 04:23 PM
Tom Condon, you sly son of a *****.

bigbluedefense
12-04-2012, 04:25 PM
I haven't evaluated all the quarterbacks this year, but I like Wilson.

Caulibflower
12-07-2012, 05:23 AM
some impressions:


GENO SMITH

Happy feet.
Little bounces, constantly resetting nervously, unnecessarily. Doesn't look scared, almost more impatient.

Does not look off of his primary read.

Erratic throws.

Poor awareness of pressure.

Poor awareness of escape lanes.

When he sets, his throws are accurate and sharp.

Can make plays under heavy pressure. Constantly shifting feet are not a sign that he chokes, but rather a technical complaint.

Stats definitely benefit from the YAC ability of his receivers.

Tipped passes.

Can make some off-balance throws.

Is always waiting for his receivers to get open. You'll see him in the pocket, waiting for the best moment to throw the guy he's decided he wants to throw to.

Throws some nice deep balls.

Has ok speed, but is definitely not a scrambler. I'd say less of a scrambling threat than Alex Smith. Closer to Sam Bradford.

EJ MANUEL

Decisive as a runner. Knows he's big. Runs like Cam Newton.

Amazing athlete. Can really run with it. Can escape pressure and make a play. Very agile and has balance.

Lacks accuracy on his deep ball.

Good touch on intermediate throws; screens and crossing routes are effective. FSU calls a lot of short passes. Not many NFL throws.

Looks like he can make deep throws, but is not consistent.

Serious accuracy issues. FSU's offense masks his flaws. Similar to Terrelle Pryor.

MIKE GLENNON

Tall with a good build. Moves well, but not a scrambler by any means. Almost reminds me of Eli Manning.

Throws ropes.

Will stand in and take hits to make throws. Will also force throws into double and triple coverage. Does this a lot. Has a lot for passes contested.

Does a good job of hitting receivers in stride on crossing routes so that they don't lose speed - important when defenders are trailing. Good accuracy overall on crossing routes at different levels.

Reads the field. Will look to his right, then to his left, and back to his right. Finds the open receiver.

converted a 4th and 2 with less than 2:00 remaining down 6 to #3 FSU

then a poor decision.

then a 4th and 10 conversion.

Then a TD on 4th and goal.

I was thinking earlier in the game his tipped passes and interceptions reminded me of the way Matt Ryan would throw them, trying too hard to put a football in places most college quarterbacks can't, but he can often enough that he's willing to test that boundary frequently - in pressure situations, that means he's already accustomed to just throwing it in there.

Think Glennon's the no. 1 quarterback I've seen so far this year.

Iamcanadian
12-07-2012, 11:36 AM
some impressions:


GENO SMITH

Happy feet.
Little bounces, constantly resetting nervously, unnecessarily. Doesn't look scared, almost more impatient.

Does not look off of his primary read.

Erratic throws.

Poor awareness of pressure.

Poor awareness of escape lanes.

When he sets, his throws are accurate and sharp.

Can make plays under heavy pressure. Constantly shifting feet are not a sign that he chokes, but rather a technical complaint.

Stats definitely benefit from the YAC ability of his receivers.

Tipped passes.

Can make some off-balance throws.

Is always waiting for his receivers to get open. You'll see him in the pocket, waiting for the best moment to throw the guy he's decided he wants to throw to.

Throws some nice deep balls.

Has ok speed, but is definitely not a scrambler. I'd say less of a scrambling threat than Alex Smith. Closer to Sam Bradford.

EJ MANUEL

Decisive as a runner. Knows he's big. Runs like Cam Newton.

Amazing athlete. Can really run with it. Can escape pressure and make a play. Very agile and has balance.

Lacks accuracy on his deep ball.

Good touch on intermediate throws; screens and crossing routes are effective. FSU calls a lot of short passes. Not many NFL throws.

Looks like he can make deep throws, but is not consistent.

Serious accuracy issues. FSU's offense masks his flaws. Similar to Terrelle Pryor.

MIKE GLENNON

Tall with a good build. Moves well, but not a scrambler by any means. Almost reminds me of Eli Manning.

Throws ropes.

Will stand in and take hits to make throws. Will also force throws into double and triple coverage. Does this a lot. Has a lot for passes contested.

Does a good job of hitting receivers in stride on crossing routes so that they don't lose speed - important when defenders are trailing. Good accuracy overall on crossing routes at different levels.

Reads the field. Will look to his right, then to his left, and back to his right. Finds the open receiver.

converted a 4th and 2 with less than 2:00 remaining down 6 to #3 FSU

then a poor decision.

then a 4th and 10 conversion.

Then a TD on 4th and goal.

I was thinking earlier in the game his tipped passes and interceptions reminded me of the way Matt Ryan would throw them, trying too hard to put a football in places most college quarterbacks can't, but he can often enough that he's willing to test that boundary frequently - in pressure situations, that means he's already accustomed to just throwing it in there.

Think Glennon's the no. 1 quarterback I've seen so far this year.


I've bold-ed the areas where I agree:
Geo Smith's main problem in my opinion, is he holds on to the ball way too long looking for the perfect pass, if he can learn at the next level, to just take his shot earlier, he could be a real star. Very decent arm strength with real accuracy and a solid leader.

E.J. Manual is an intriguing prospect, certainly has the size for the position and a pretty decent arm. Very mobile, with questionable accuracy and leadership skills. It will be boom or bust for him IMO.

Mike Glennon has a rope for an arm, very strong thrower. Sure, with an arm like his, he'll try to thread the needle too often on occasions. His only question will be his mobility at the next level.

All three will have their fate decided either at The Senior Bowl, Combine or a Pro Day.

I don't think you can leave Matt Barkley totally out of round 1 talk. Sure, his team collapsed especially on defense even though he consistently put up big #'s. He's a Matt Ryan clone with a shot to be that good. His season saw Woods, his #1 receiver play injured all year reducing his effectiveness quite a bit.

Nice analysis.

WCH
12-07-2012, 07:44 PM
Manuel is really growing on me. Aside from his physical skillset, I think he's being underrated in the mental aspects. He seems to be a smart kid with good spatial awareness.

I won't be projecting him to the Chiefs at #1, but I think we've seen worse prospects go in the first round.

SchizophrenicBatman
12-07-2012, 10:28 PM
Manuel is awful.

Most of his value at the college level is tied up in his running ability which I believe will be nothing special at the next level.

Caulibflower
12-08-2012, 12:31 AM
Manuel is really growing on me. Aside from his physical skillset, I think he's being underrated in the mental aspects. He seems to be a smart kid with good spatial awareness.

I won't be projecting him to the Chiefs at #1, but I think we've seen worse prospects go in the first round.

I too think he has good awareness - the trouble is that he throws some terrible deep passes. It's like he just heaves it and hopes it works out for him. He's not a precision passer on short routes, either, but he can get it there. When he doesn't have a clear visual in front of him and is trying to throw it over the top of defenders, he just doesn't have much placement ability, and that's a big problem. I've been impressed in some games, but there's a theme throughout of inconsistent accuracy. He's impressive in most other categories, but that's one of the most important ones and I just don't trust his accuracy at all.

brat316
12-08-2012, 10:19 PM
What happened to Landry Jones? Did he really fall that far out of the first round talk?

Shane P. Hallam
12-08-2012, 10:28 PM
What happened to Landry Jones? Did he really fall that far out of the first round talk?

He may have fallen out of first two days talk.

brat316
12-08-2012, 10:31 PM
He may have fallen out of first two days talk.

Wow that's terrible.

FUNBUNCHER
12-08-2012, 10:39 PM
I think Landry Jones had a bounce back season this year, for me at least.
He looks more like a first rounder now IMO than he did at the end of the 2011 season.

Tons of experience and maybe a bit better decision maker.

TACKLE
12-08-2012, 10:46 PM
I think by now Landry Jones 'is what is he'. Big QB with a big arm who can look good in streaks but has consistently struggled all throughout his career whenever he's pressured or things breaks down.

SolidGold
12-08-2012, 11:40 PM
I would still take Landry Jones before Manuel - don't understand why Manuel is getting hype while Jones is getting pushed down draft boards.

Caulibflower
12-08-2012, 11:49 PM
I think by know Landry Jones 'is what is he'. Big QB with a big arm who can look great in streaks but consistently struggles all throughout his career whenever he's pressure or things breaks down.

I just watched a bunch of Landry Jones, and I completely agree. It's that simple. That's it in a nutshell.

KLima878
12-10-2012, 02:43 PM
What round is Glennon projected to go in? I'd liie to see the jags get him in round 2 or 3

Caulibflower
12-10-2012, 04:10 PM
What round is Glennon projected to go in? I'd liie to see the jags get him in round 2 or 3

I think the Jags would (should) be ecstatic if they could get him in the second. I think the question is which QB-needy teams like which QBs; there's going to be QBs falling who really aren't much separated form the QBs who will go over them; the difference between a first round QB and a second round QB is going to be almost nonexistent this upcoming draft, whereas the difference between Luck and Griffin, and even Tannehill, and, say, Brock Osweiler is enormous.

TACKLE
12-10-2012, 05:06 PM
What round is Glennon projected to go in? I'd liie to see the jags get him in round 2 or 3

When it's all said and done, I don't expect him to get out of the first.

Diehard
12-10-2012, 05:22 PM
I think by now Landry Jones 'is what is he'. Big QB with a big arm who can look good in streaks but has consistently struggled all throughout his career whenever he's pressured or things breaks down.

That's like the kiss of death at the next level.

holt_bruce81
12-10-2012, 07:54 PM
I've been impressed with Ryan Nassib this season. I think he'll eventually be a 2nd round selection.

KaneMarko
12-10-2012, 08:10 PM
When it's all said and done, I don't expect him to get out of the first.

Everyone seems to totally focus on Geno, Barkley and Wilson. If I had to predict right now, I'd say Glennon may very well be the best of this class.

I've really liked what I've seen out of Ryan Nassib too.

But Glennon, when I factor in his ability and production with what he has around him at NCST versus what Geno, Barkley, Smith, etc have around them and their abilities and production, Glennon has been the most impressive. And I wouldn't be shocked at all if he performs well in the post-season game and pre-draft workouts that he ends up in the top 15. Maybe even higher.

And I think Nassib is going to end up going much higher than he's projected right now too.

TACKLE
12-10-2012, 08:22 PM
Can any of you Nassib fans out there explain the love? I just don't see it personally. Will he even be one of the six senior QB's invited to Senior Bowl? He has a good arm and is a pretty good athlete, he just seems stiff and unnatural with the way he throws the ball. Maybe I need to go back and watch him again.

princefielder28
12-10-2012, 08:28 PM
Can any of you Nassib fans out there explain the love? I just don't see it personally. Will he even be one of the six senior QB's invited to Senior Bowl? He has a good arm and is a pretty good athlete, he just seems stiff and unnatural with the way he throws the ball. Maybe I need to go back and watch him again.

I don't see the fascination with Nassib either and I see the same concerns that you mentioned. He's a career backup type, not great tools, and minimal upside.

Docta
12-10-2012, 08:32 PM
Can any of you Nassib fans out there explain the love? I just don't see it personally. Will he even be one of the six senior QB's invited to Senior Bowl? He has a good arm and is a pretty good athlete, he just seems stiff and unnatural with the way he throws the ball. Maybe I need to go back and watch him again.
There are 8 senior QBs. Smith, Barkley, Jones, Manuel, Dysert, Glennon, Nassib, and Wilson.

SolidGold
12-10-2012, 09:10 PM
There are 8 senior QBs. Smith, Barkley, Jones, Manuel, Dysert, Glennon, Nassib, and Wilson.

Only 6 get invites to the senior bowl though.

Docta
12-10-2012, 09:18 PM
Only 6 get invites to the senior bowl though.
Ah, my bad. Well, Barkley and Geno probably aren't going to want to go. Barkley might be still injured, and Geno's just cocky.

SolidGold
12-10-2012, 10:05 PM
Ah, my bad. Well, Barkley and Geno probably aren't going to want to go. Barkley might be still injured, and Geno's just cocky.

No worries - guys are definitely going to opt out either due to injury or advice. Even if Smith and Barkley opted out - Glennon, Wilson, Dysert, Jones, Nassib and Manuel would be an intriguing 6 QBs.

SchizophrenicBatman
12-11-2012, 11:46 AM
SC_DougFarrar ‏@SC_DougFarrar
Conf. call. Kiper says that Mike Glennon could be the first QB off the board.


I have a feeling he's about to go from decent back end round 1 prospect to Christian Ponder/Gabbert/Tannehill level overdrafted.

descendency
12-11-2012, 12:06 PM
SC_DougFarrar ‏@SC_DougFarrar
Conf. call. Kiper says that Mike Glennon could be the first QB off the board.


I have a feeling he's about to go from decent back end round 1 prospect to Christian Ponder/Gabbert/Tannehill level overdrafted.

Glennon gets a lot of disrespect, but if he were at a major university where talent gets reloaded instead of rebuilt - I believe he would have had the best year of any QB in the nation. Some of "his" struggles were due to drops and poor line play.

He played in an NFL type system. He has the prototypical size and a big arm. Great character. When scouts and GMs get to evaluating him, they're going to see a much better player than the national (fan) perception of him is right now.

I wouldn't put him in as a favorite, but I think he's a dark horse to go to #1.

Leon Sandcastle
12-13-2012, 01:08 PM
Haven't watched a lot of Dysert or Nassib this year. Someone who has give me the scoop.

y.f.s.
12-13-2012, 01:13 PM
Glennon gets a lot of disrespect, but if he were at a major university where talent gets reloaded instead of rebuilt - I believe he would have had the best year of any QB in the nation. Some of "his" struggles were due to drops and poor line play.

He played in an NFL type system. He has the prototypical size and a big arm. Great character. When scouts and GMs get to evaluating him, they're going to see a much better player than the national (fan) perception of him is right now.

I wouldn't put him in as a favorite, but I think he's a dark horse to go to #1.

I tend to agree with this.

He's got certain traits and talents that will make NFL teams gaga - most notably his ability to slide and reset in the pocket and/or get rid of the ball from awkward release platforms. Super important trait that not a lot of guys have.

I'm not crazy about him (personally), but I can see definitely see why others/NFL teams are.

vidae
12-13-2012, 01:16 PM
I tend to agree with this.

He's got certain traits and talents that will make NFL teams gaga - most notably his ability to slide and reset in the pocket and/or get rid of the ball from awkward release platforms. Super important trait that not a lot of guys have.

I'm not crazy about him (personally), but I can see definitely see why others/NFL teams are.

Geno to KC, Glennon to Jax.

pls go yfs. pls go.

bruschis4all
12-14-2012, 10:59 AM
I know it's frustrating when you don't have a qb. But, picking the top qb is not very smart if he's not going to be a good NFL starter. Let's look back at the 3 qb's taken after Cam Newton in 2011. Each team could have had an all-pro or near all-pro lineman and gotten just as good a qb in Round 2; Dalton, Kaepernick or Mallett.

Jax - Blaine Gabbert - Boy, JJ Watt would sure help.
Tenn - Jake Locker - - I'd like to have Ryan Kerrigan chasing down qb's.
Minny - Christian Ponder - Pouncey, Solder, Quinn or Fairley. Take your pick

Have any of these teams solved their qb problems? Not yet. How does it look going forward? I'd say pretty bleak. How does it look for Kaepernick and Dalton? Not sure things. Better than the first rounders IMO. Mallett hasn't gotten a chance yet. Who knows what he can do.

KC, Arizona and Buffalo will be making the same mistake this year. There are plenty of good linemen out there. Take one. If you like one of the qb's, trade up into late Round 1 for him. Don't take him with a Top 10 pick. They're not that good. None of them.

y.f.s.
12-14-2012, 11:01 AM
I know it's frustrating when you don't have a qb. But, picking the top qb is not very smart if he's not going to be a good NFL starter. Let's look back at the 3 qb's taken after Cam Newton in 2011. Each team could have had an all-pro or near all-pro lineman and gotten just as good a qb in Round 2; Dalton, Kaepernick or Mallett.

Jax - Blaine Gabbert - Boy, JJ Watt would sure help.
Tenn - Jake Locker - - I'd like to have Ryan Kerrigan chasing down qb's.
Minny - Christian Ponder - Pouncey, Solder, Quinn or Fairley. Take your pick

Have any of these teams solved their qb problems? Not yet. How does it look going forward? I'd say pretty bleak. How does it look for Kaepernick and Dalton? Not sure things. Better than the first rounders IMO. Mallett hasn't gotten a chance yet. Who knows what he can do.

KC, Arizona and Buffalo will be making the same mistake this year. There are plenty of good linemen out there. Take one. If you like one of the qb's, trade up into late Round 1 for him. Don't take him with a Top 10 pick. They're not that good. None of them.

Eh, Jake Long and Mario Williams didn't really do **** for Miami and Buffalo, either. And they're All-Pros.

Take a QB. You'd just better take the right one.

Leon Sandcastle
12-14-2012, 11:05 AM
I know it's frustrating when you don't have a qb. But, picking the top qb is not very smart if he's not going to be a good NFL starter. Let's look back at the 3 qb's taken after Cam Newton in 2011. Each team could have had an all-pro or near all-pro lineman and gotten just as good a qb in Round 2; Dalton, Kaepernick or Mallett.

Jax - Blaine Gabbert - Boy, JJ Watt would sure help.
Tenn - Jake Locker - - I'd like to have Ryan Kerrigan chasing down qb's.
Minny - Christian Ponder - Pouncey, Solder, Quinn or Fairley. Take your pick

Have any of these teams solved their qb problems? Not yet. How does it look going forward? I'd say pretty bleak. How does it look for Kaepernick and Dalton? Not sure things. Better than the first rounders IMO. Mallett hasn't gotten a chance yet. Who knows what he can do.

KC, Arizona and Buffalo will be making the same mistake this year. There are plenty of good linemen out there. Take one. If you like one of the qb's, trade up into late Round 1 for him. Don't take him with a Top 10 pick. They're not that good. None of them.

You think JJ Watt transforms the Jaguars into a good team??? The Bills at least under Nix don't reach for QB's. They wanted Newton he wasn't there. There were rumors he wanted Ponder in the 2nd but he was snatched up with the 12th pick.

They probably go BPA with their Top 10 pick(Werner, Mosley, Milliner, Montgomery, Mingo, Jordan) then wait till the 2nd to take Glennon, Dysert, Nassib.

FUNBUNCHER
12-14-2012, 11:16 AM
I love Kerrigan and he's been a decent to solid OLB for the SKins, but he's not a world beater. Teams don't have to gameplan around him.
Locker is still developing.
If things work out for him the way they could, he's going to be 10x more valuable to the Titans than Kerrigan would be.

vidae
12-14-2012, 11:22 AM
QB is just more valuable than any other position in this day and age. There is no way around it. And when you're trotting out Matt Cassel and Brady Quinn as your QBs, there is no other position you can possibly go to get a bigger upgrade.

bruschis4all
12-14-2012, 11:50 AM
Eh, Jake Long and Mario Williams didn't really do **** for Miami and Buffalo, either. And they're All-Pros.

Take a QB. You'd just better take the right one.

Jake Long didn't do anything for Miami? They went from 1-15 to 11-5 and won the division his rookie year. I didn't watch the Texans too much when Mario was there. But, they were an expansion team lacking in talent and went from 2-14 to 6, 8, 8 and 9 win seasons.

And, every one of you guys conveniently forgets my 2nd point. I never said don't draft a qb. I even suggested trading up from early 2nd into the first for one. Had Miami done that with Joe Flacco in the Long draft how do you they'd be right now? None of these qb's are anywhere close to the prospect Matt Ryan was coming out of BC.

SuperMcGee
12-14-2012, 11:53 AM
Eh, Jake Long and Mario Williams didn't really do **** for Miami and Buffalo, either. And they're All-Pros.

Take a QB. You'd just better take the right one.

Week 5 called, it wants its opinion of Mario Williams back.
*If you meant Houston, then whatever. I don't fault them for the pick.

But I agree that the Bills should go for a QB this year. So does our GM.

gpngc
12-27-2012, 03:05 PM
Add David Fales to this discussion. SJSU Jr.

SilentJaguar
12-27-2012, 04:16 PM
He declared?

bucfan12
12-27-2012, 04:37 PM
Still can't believe Bray declared. Understandibly, yes it's a weak QB class. But that doesn't gurantee he'll be selected in the 1st 3 rounds. Attitude/character issues forr Bray is something that isn't good. Add in inconistency, erratic play, and poor decision making, and extremely raw. Also, biggest red flag: Very little to no improvement over the past 3 years. Just has big frame and huge arm.

TACKLE
12-27-2012, 04:42 PM
Still can't believe Bray declared. Understandibly, yes it's a weak QB class. But that doesn't gurantee he'll be selected in the 1st 3 rounds. Attitude/character issues forr Bray is something that isn't good. Add in inconistency, erratic play, and poor decision making, and extremely raw. Also, biggest red flag: Very little to no improvement over the past 3 years. Just has big frame and huge arm.

If he's improved very little over 3 years, what would be the benefit of going back to school for another year to 'develop'. Even though he might not have maximized his draft stock, he's going to progress FAR more in one year sitting on the bench in the pros than he ever would have going back to UT.

bucfan12
12-27-2012, 04:59 PM
If he's improved very little over 3 years, what would be the benefit of going back to school for another year to 'develop'. Even though he might not have maximized his draft stock, he's going to progress FAR more in one year sitting on the bench in the pros than he ever would have going back to UT.

Yeah, but not if he goes undrafted. Going back to school for that final season can help prove scouts wrong. He didn't want to do that.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-27-2012, 05:56 PM
Brock Osweiler was drafted in Round 2.

bucfan12
12-27-2012, 06:06 PM
Brock Osweiler was drafted in Round 2.

Physically, do they compare, yes. Mentally? Character? Two different prospects.

CashmoneyDrew
12-27-2012, 06:10 PM
Bray just didn't like school and was ready to move on. Can't fault him for that.

SuperPacker
12-27-2012, 06:16 PM
Brock Osweiler was drafted in Round 2.

It's funny cause Osweiler is absolutely terrible.

SolidGold
12-27-2012, 07:47 PM
Bray just didn't like school and was ready to move on. Can't fault him for that.

I am sure most teams at the combine will fault him for it though. He is going to get picked apart.

I do understand his moving on from a logical standpoint - he would be in a new system (Butch Jones doesn't seem to like pocket passers) and all his weapons would be gone. I hope he gets his head on straight because he has a huge arm and physical skill set and would be fun to see at the next level. I think if he went to a place with a really good QB guru and sit him for a couple years he has the potential to develop.

SolidGold
12-27-2012, 07:49 PM
Add David Fales to this discussion. SJSU Jr.

This guy totally intrigues me now. If he stays I am going to say he is the number 1 QB prospect in 2014. Right now he is a one year starter so I think it would benefit him to stick around for his senior season.

Brown Leader
12-27-2012, 10:52 PM
Do you really want a QB named Fales?

MaxV
12-27-2012, 10:59 PM
Perhaps I have seen enough NC State games, but the ones I saw, he looked closer to a 2nd rounder then to top 10 pick.

Cigaro
12-27-2012, 11:18 PM
Perhaps I have seen enough NC State games, but the ones I saw, he looked closer to a 2nd rounder then to top 10 pick.

I don't think anyone who rates him so highly does so because of his game tape. Its the physical tools that they like.

Roddoliver
12-28-2012, 02:59 PM
Tyler Bray is the best QB in this class and no one else comes close to his arm talent. Bray did not win because his defense was a joke. The Tennessee offense clearly was not the problem. His attitude and immaturity are the red flag that must be investigated by NFL teams.

Caulibflower
12-28-2012, 03:43 PM
This guy totally intrigues me now. If he stays I am going to say he is the number 1 QB prospect in 2014. Right now he is a one year starter so I think it would benefit him to stick around for his senior season.

Man, Fales is just not that good. He doesn't have a strong enough arm to be a number one prospect in any year. His arm is weaker than Chad Pennington's. The guy is the definition of a noodle arm. He's got poise, he's accurate, he makes his reads, but he's not very athletic and has a very, very weak arm. I'm sorry, I just can't see him being a number one quarterback any year. For all he does well, he's got one of the weakest arms I've ever seen in college QBs who've been suggested as top prospects. Christian Ponder has a stronger arm and is at least a good overall athlete, and he's still pretty terrible.

theMadStork
12-28-2012, 05:10 PM
Man, Fales is just not that good. He doesn't have a strong enough arm to be a number one prospect in any year. His arm is weaker than Chad Pennington's. The guy is the definition of a noodle arm. He's got poise, he's accurate, he makes his reads, but he's not very athletic and has a very, very weak arm. I'm sorry, I just can't see him being a number one quarterback any year. For all he does well, he's got one of the weakest arms I've ever seen in college QBs who've been suggested as top prospects. Christian Ponder has a stronger arm and is at least a good overall athlete, and he's still pretty terrible.
As an SJSU alum, I fully endorse your evaluation. Thank you.

Jack203
12-29-2012, 09:49 AM
Ouch, hope you guys are wrong.

BuddyCHRIST
12-29-2012, 12:19 PM
Tyler Bray is the best QB in this class and no one else comes close to his arm talent. Bray did not win because his defense was a joke. The Tennessee offense clearly was not the problem. His attitude and immaturity are the red flag that must be investigated by NFL teams.

Good luck with that, he has a lot of throwing talent but there is a lot more to playing in the NFL. He doesn't handle pressure well and struggles to move in the pocket, he has gone into full tard mode against good teams so many times its not funny. Does not seem to have the intangibles of an NFL QB whatsoever, he's a poor man's Jamarcus Russell.

Caulibflower
12-29-2012, 12:27 PM
Ouch, hope you guys are wrong.

I've got nothing personal against Fales at all, he just has no zip on his throws. He's actually got kind of amazing timing, but I've seen a lot of throws on his tape that would absolutely be interceptions in the NFL because the defenders he'll be facing have greater closing speed. You see him throwing hitches and stuff that just barely get to his receiver with a DB screaming towards it, thinking he's going to get a pick-6. In some ways, I get the feeling that Fales knows how strong his arm is (or isn't), because his college INT numbers have remained pretty low despite regularly almost-throwing picks (in my eyes). I look at him and see a guy I'd expect to be holding onto the ball too long in the pros because he doesn't want to throw it up for grabs. If you can get him in an offense that gets the ball out of his hands very quickly on a lot of short timing routes, I think he could have some success - at least, I think he could run that style of offense competently.

But as in San Francisco, where a perfectly competent starter was replaced by another player with more physical talent and a bigger arm, NFL teams want to have as many passing options as possible, and I think Fales' inability to drive the ball hard will really hinder a team. Thus, I can see him in a backup role, a la Colt McCoy or Kellen Moore or someone like that, guys who had a lot of collegiate success and have a good head on their shoulders, but don't have what it takes to be the main cog in an NFL offense.

Roddoliver
12-29-2012, 11:06 PM
The #1 QB will be Mike Glennon. He will be compared to Matt Ryan. Coached by Tom O'Brien, pro-style offense, clean off the field. Like Ryan, Glennon is the prototypical pocket passer, and his arm strength does not impress me - it is just "okay". Ryan also completed less than 60% of his passes in his final season and his YPA was very similar.

The Chiefs' new GM will look back at the 2008 Draft when the Dolphins passed on Matt Ryan and went with the safe pick, while the Falcons chose the QB over Glenn Dorsey. If Glennon can sell his football IQ and passion for the game, I think he will be drafted before Geno Smith.

I still think Tyler Bray is the best QB in this class if he does not waste his opportunity in the NFL with poor work ethic and bad attitude.


Good luck with that, he has a lot of throwing talent but there is a lot more to playing in the NFL.

In this class, I think his throwing talent is unmatched. If he is an immature party boy, it's a shame. There are the stories about car vandalism, failed drug tests, the boat incident... Maybe he will grow up.

BuddyCHRIST
12-29-2012, 11:16 PM
Lets be serious, would anyone bet 5 dollars on a QB from this class to become a franchise guy? Because I wouldn't, they are all just so underwhelming.

If there is a guy from this class, I'm thinking it will be an under the radar guy who develops.

Obviously some QBs will get pushed up, but I wouldn't rate any of them as a first rounder.

MidwayMonster31
12-29-2012, 11:35 PM
I think Glennon is the only one who even has a shot of becoming a franchise guy, but he won't be a top-tier guy. Joe Flacco (without the rocket arm) might be his best case.
Bray might be the most talented, but he could go undrafted with his issues.
Barkley will have to play in a dink and dunk offense, but he doesn't look like someone who can carry a team.
Smith can also be a solid, but not spectacular guy. He has the accuracy, but is not consistent enough and doesn't show the command that great quarterbacks have, and he played in a wide open offense.
Edit: Hell, Dysert might be the best quarterback in this draft class after all is said and done.

SolidGold
12-29-2012, 11:42 PM
Glennon has a huge arm - his arm strength is probably his best asset.

Cigaro
12-30-2012, 12:45 AM
I think Glennon is the only one who even has a shot of becoming a franchise guy, but he won't be a top-tier guy. Joe Flacco (without the rocket arm) might be his best case.
Bray might be the most talented, but he could go undrafted with his issues.
Barkley will have to play in a dink and dunk offense, but he doesn't look like someone who can carry a team.
Smith can also be a solid, but not spectacular guy. He has the accuracy, but is not consistent enough and doesn't show the command that great quarterbacks have, and he played in a wide open offense.
Edit: Hell, Dysert might be the best quarterback in this draft class after all is said and done.

Bray won't go undrafted. He's no Logan Thomas. He's shown a lot of negatives on and off the field, but he's also played impressively for stretches. His pick won't reflect his natural talent, but he'll definitely get drafted, I could easily see him getting taken in the second.

T SHARE 18
12-30-2012, 09:46 AM
Glennon is the real deal. His completion % would be alot higher if it wasnt for Underwood. Numbers dont always tell the whole story. What would Genos numbers be if you took away that little flip foward jet sweep pass? As a Jaguars fan that has had to sit there and watch my team trade up for Blaine Gabbert then watch him run the team into the ground in just under two seasons, I now look to make sure I dont see the same thing in QBs that I seen in Gabbert such as his poor eye level,his poor footwork,and what I believe is his worst trait his willingness to just checkdown after his first read is not there. 3rd and 9 lets check read 1 and check it down to the FB for a 2 yard gain. My point is I dont see any of that with Glennon. He attacks all levels of the field and he is at his best when hes in the hurry up or obvious passing situations. I really dont see too much not to like about him other then how he holds the ball down by his stomach but I can live with that. If Im the Chiefs or Jaguars I take Glennon 1 or 2 overall.

marks01234
12-30-2012, 10:11 AM
If Mike Glennon can have a good bowl game tomorrow, I think you'll see him become #1 on everybody's board and a candidate for number one overall.

Positives on Mike are his rocket arm, football IQ, ability to make all of the throws, solid pocket presence, solid release time and some ability to throw on the run. Negatives include a lack of mobility, slightly low release point and a some accurary issues.

His completion percentage shouldn't bother anybody. Tom O'Brien's offense at NC State and Boston College forced the QB to throw down the field often and didn't offer much in terms of screens and dump-offs. If you look at Russell Wilson's freshman to junior completition percentage and then compare to his senior year percentage at Wisconsin you'll get a good representative of how much a type of offense can affect that number. You can also see Matt Ryan's BC stats, where he posted similar numbers.

I don't think he's an elite prospect but certainly believe he can be a top ten QB in the league and the franchise guy for the Chiefs. With the rookie cap structure, I expect the Chiefs to roll the dice on a QB even if he isn't a Luck/RG3 type prospect.

Roddoliver
12-30-2012, 01:14 PM
Albert Breer just reported that Pioli will be retained by the Chiefs. Mike Glennon 1st overall. The Jags are on the clock.

T SHARE 18
12-30-2012, 01:25 PM
Albert Breer just reported that Pioli will be retained by the Chiefs. Mike Glennon 1st overall. The Jags are on the clock.

Why do you say that?

Roddoliver
12-30-2012, 01:38 PM
Why do you say that?

There is a rumor that Pioli really likes Glennon, and it's a known fact Pioli already went to NC State to take a closer look at the QB.

https://twitter.com/Jason_Madson/statuses/266519214142152704

Scott Pioli was out at NC State yesterday per 610 Sports. Mike Glennon and David Amerson in KC would be alright with me.

If Pioli keeps his job, it certainly won't be with the option of keeping Matt Cassel or Brady Quinn as the starter. Even if the Chiefs hire a new GM, I think Glennon will be compared to Matt Ryan, people will like his intangibles, and Glennon will be the 1st overall pick because he is a clean, prototypical QB with experience in a pro-style offense. Tom O'Brien only has to say how much he likes Glennon and how he can be as good as Ryan in the NFL.

descendency
12-30-2012, 02:17 PM
Tyler Bray is the best QB in this class and no one else comes close to his arm talent. Bray did not win because his defense was a joke. The Tennessee offense clearly was not the problem. His attitude and immaturity are the red flag that must be investigated by NFL teams.

I wouldn't touch him. He reeks of Ryan Leaf type personality. If I made a board, I wouldn't have him on it at all.

I'm scared of Geno, but not anywhere near enough to take him off the board. He's still a top 15 player to me.

vidae
12-30-2012, 02:26 PM
Albert Breer just reported that Pioli will be retained by the Chiefs. Mike Glennon 1st overall. The Jags are on the clock.

Oh well hey, if ALBERT BREER reported it, it must be true! :njx:

edit:

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

If Pioli gets another chance in KC, it could be w/the coach he wanted all along - Kirk Ferentz. Again, nothing completely certain there yet.

Roddoliver
12-30-2012, 02:37 PM
Oh well hey, if ALBERT BREER reported it, it must be true! :njx:


My bad, it was not Breer, it was Steve Wyche:

"Citing a source briefed on the situation, NFL.com's Steve Wyche reports that the Chiefs have decided to retain GM Scott Pioli for the 2013 season."

vidae
12-30-2012, 02:47 PM
A few other people have said that citing sources, Pioli would be let go.

No one knows. At all. And no one knows who Pioli will draft. I can't wait until this is over.

marks01234
12-31-2012, 06:58 PM
I wouldn't touch him. He reeks of Ryan Leaf type personality. If I made a board, I wouldn't have him on it at all.

I'm scared of Geno, but not anywhere near enough to take him off the board. He's still a top 15 player to me.

Care to explain the comparsion?

Glennon is reportedly a hard worker, intelligent and a team leader. I can understand being critical of his lack of mobility, lower release point and accuracy issues. Can't see much beyond that though.

I think he falls somewhere between Flaco and Matt Ryan. He's going to have be surround with some talent (which he isn't at NC State) by I think he'll be a ten-twelve year starter in the league.

P-L
12-31-2012, 07:19 PM
Oh well hey, if ALBERT BREER reported it, it must be true! :njx:

edit:

Albert Breer ‏@AlbertBreer

If Pioli gets another chance in KC, it could be w/the coach he wanted all along - Kirk Ferentz. Again, nothing completely certain there yet.
Pioli and Ferentz. That would be the worst nightmare ever for KC fans.

vidae
12-31-2012, 07:21 PM
Pioli and Ferentz. That would be the worst nightmare ever for KC fans.

I honestly think it's just a matter of time before Pioli is fired. Clark Hunt did a few interviews today and it sounds really bad for Pioli. Which is fine with me.

TonyGfortheTD
12-31-2012, 07:39 PM
Pioli and Ferentz. That would be the worst nightmare ever for KC fans.

Peter King has already shot it down and Pioli will not be involved in hiring the next coach.

TACKLE
12-31-2012, 10:20 PM
Tajh Boyd, I see you.

SAGA45
12-31-2012, 11:09 PM
If Mike Glennon can have a good bowl game tomorrow, I think you'll see him become #1 on everybody's board and a candidate for number one overall.

So much for that

vidae
01-01-2013, 12:13 AM
Tajh Boyd, I see you.

That was.. interesting to say the least. I wonder if he declares.

descendency
01-01-2013, 12:46 AM
Care to explain the comparsion?

There's just a lot of crap that is rumored about him that makes him sound like the kind of person you want to avoid. He basically "took the blame" for throwing beer bottles at cars at his hotel - but it really sounded like he was blaming the people there. He's got his name tattooed to his back like he's some kind of star... (which in itself isn't bad, but I get the feeling he's a bit of a prima dona)

It just goes on and on. I've just started to pay more attention to that kind of stuff after Leinart, Clausen, and the like have burned me badly.

His talent is vastly over-rated. He has terrible mechanics (Leftwhich/Tebow level bad). Decision making is so-so.

His gameplay is very shaky, like he doesn't give a care. He reminds me of Jimmy Clausen in that respect. I ignored it when Clausen was doing it because I felt he would clean it up - but I'm really not making that mistake twice.

FUNBUNCHER
01-01-2013, 01:05 AM
The #1 QB will be Mike Glennon. He will be compared to Matt Ryan. Coached by Tom O'Brien, pro-style offense, clean off the field. Like Ryan, Glennon is the prototypical pocket passer, and his arm strength does not impress me - it is just "okay". Ryan also completed less than 60% of his passes in his final season and his YPA was very similar.

The Chiefs' new GM will look back at the 2008 Draft when the Dolphins passed on Matt Ryan and went with the safe pick, while the Falcons chose the QB over Glenn Dorsey. If Glennon can sell his football IQ and passion for the game, I think he will be drafted before Geno Smith.

I still think Tyler Bray is the best QB in this class if he does not waste his opportunity in the NFL with poor work ethic and bad attitude.




In this class, I think his throwing talent is unmatched. If he is an immature party boy, it's a shame. There are the stories about car vandalism, failed drug tests, the boat incident... Maybe he will grow up.

You're way off about Glennon's arm strength. Even O'Brien says it's the one real difference between Glennon and Ryan. Glennon has a gun.

Physically Mike Glennon IS Flacco, but I think Flacco is more mobile on the run.

marks01234
01-01-2013, 10:39 AM
There's just a lot of crap that is rumored about him that makes him sound like the kind of person you want to avoid. He basically "took the blame" for throwing beer bottles at cars at his hotel - but it really sounded like he was blaming the people there. He's got his name tattooed to his back like he's some kind of star... (which in itself isn't bad, but I get the feeling he's a bit of a prima dona)

It just goes on and on. I've just started to pay more attention to that kind of stuff after Leinart, Clausen, and the like have burned me badly.

His talent is vastly over-rated. He has terrible mechanics (Leftwhich/Tebow level bad). Decision making is so-so.

His gameplay is very shaky, like he doesn't give a care. He reminds me of Jimmy Clausen in that respect. I ignored it when Clausen was doing it because I felt he would clean it up - but I'm really not making that mistake twice.

Nevermind. Sorry thought you were making a Ryan Leaf/Mike Glennon comparsion not Tyler Bray/Ryan Leaf.

Carry on - good points

NIN1984
01-01-2013, 10:49 AM
If I had to compare Glennon to another QB it would be Andrew Walter. Glennon has the arm and size and some serious accuracy issues, very similar to Walter.

nepg
01-01-2013, 11:20 AM
My favorite QBs in this class are Bray and Glennon. The entire class is such a crap-shoot, though. I'd hate to be a team that is relying on this draft to produce a starting QB in 0-2 years.

Every QB in this class has a red flag.

Glennon is a poor man's Matt Ryan and might have the best overall skill-set in the class. The problem is that he has a bit of Blaine Gabbert in him.

Bray seems to be the mentally toughest on the field, but at the same time he's definitely a prima donna. Kind of like Jay Cutler or Philip Rivers. It's a legit red flag.

Barkley and Wilson are almost identical. Both seem to have hit the ceiling way too early. Both have had bothersome injuries. Both are less-than-ideal physically (and also seem to both be maxed out in this category).

Geno just gives off a terrible vibe. Him being at the top of the class reminds me of (even though I was a fan) Tim Couch being the #1 guy in the 1999 draft. People are just kind of like "well...I guess he's the best...right? maybe?"

BamaFalcon59
01-01-2013, 12:33 PM
Glennon and Matt Ryan are not similar at all. Terrible comparison by all those using it. That's akin to saying Flacco and Ryan are similar.

SolidGold
01-01-2013, 12:55 PM
Glennon and Matt Ryan are not similar at all. Terrible comparison by all those using it. That's akin to saying Flacco and Ryan are similar.

Yea have to agree with that. I think Ryan only played one year under O'Brien as the starter. Ryan I would argue is the better leader, Glennon has huge question marks in that area. Ryan is physically talented but Glennon just has one of those huge arms.

After yesterday's game Glennon really hurt his chances since he did not perform well. Much can be made of his supporting cast and to an extent I agree with that. When comparing Smith to Glennon I would argue Smith's excellent supporting cast with two of the best playmakers in college football made him a better QB than he is. Glennon was able to play well with a less than stellar cast in a more vertical offense which bodes well for him IMO.

I have never seen Glennon get really rattled though and has always maintained his composure unlike Smith. Both these guys have huge question marks moving forward.

Wilson and Barkley may have benefited by not playing in bowl games. Barkley since USC really stunk it up without him illustrating how important he was to his team and Wilson's last performance was a gritty one going against LSU with a crap team around him - he didn't embarrass himself.

Gio94
01-01-2013, 12:59 PM
I dont think that Tyler Wilson is physically less than ideal.. Yes, maybe on a height standpoint he is, but talking about arm strenght and athleticism i think he is well above average...

And i wouldnt draft Glennon in the first round, he looks too risky; as someone else before me said, he can became a Flacco, but at the same time he can be the next Skelton (and personally i would bet on the latter)

fishspinners
01-01-2013, 01:19 PM
I think Ryan Mallet was a better prospect than Mike Glennon is.

nepg
01-01-2013, 02:13 PM
I think Ryan Mallet was a better prospect than Mike Glennon is.
Mallet was a better prospect than anyone in this draft by a large margin.

vidae
01-01-2013, 02:27 PM
Mallet was a better prospect than anyone in this draft by a large margin.

I wouldn't go that far.

FUNBUNCHER
01-01-2013, 02:28 PM
O'Brien compares Glennon to Ryan in terms of their physical stature and playing style. I don't think I've ever read where he talked about their intangibles.
Both are tall, pro style dropback QBs who played for the same HC and in the same offense in college. There are points of comparison, but no one is saying Glennon is Ryan.

If Ryan Mallett didn't have off the field issues, he would have been a top 10 pick in 2011.
There were HCs who were fired Monday because they passed on Mallett IMO.

A great college QB is supposed to be able to elevate the level of performance of the skill position players around him. Glennon has average college talent around him, but it's not pathetic. It's no better or worse than the the WRs Ryan or Russell Wilson had at BC or NC State.

bucfan12
01-01-2013, 04:26 PM
Aaron Murray.

brasho
01-01-2013, 06:24 PM
Aaron Murray.

Seriously? His stats may have been fairly impressive, but he surely wasn't. Even on the long first half throw to King, it was a terrible throw... it was also made me wonder about King and why he didn't highpoint that ball. It really should have been picked off.

You're constantly railing against Josh Freeman because he can't light up the good defenses, that he is inconsistent, spotty decisions and accuracy... I see all of that in Murray only Murray has nothing close to Freeman's skillset. Considering Murray finally won and looked decent in a big game, his record in bowl games and championship games coming into the game was 0-4, plus he's never not gotten the crap kicked out of him by South Carolina, he did beat Florida twice, but it was more in spite of him, than because of him. His resume is not very impressive, especially considering the stat padding he's done against extremely poor competition.

Here's his stat lines from bowl games and conference championship games:

Against UCF in 2010 bowl game
21 of 38 2 ints 198 yards 0 TDs-lost 6-10
Against LSU in 2011 SEC Championship Game
16 of 41 2 ints 163 yards 1 TD-lost 10-42
Against Michigan St. in 2011 bowl game
20 of 32 2 ints 288 yards 2 TDS-lost 30-33
Against Alabama in 2012 SEC Championship Game
18 of 33 1 int 265 1 TD (and trust me, his stats were way better than his play)
Then the game today against Nebraska where he tried his best to give the game away with poor throws (2 INTs in the first half alone) and several errant tosses to wide open recdeivers.

Here's the funny stat lines...
Against South Carolina in 2010
14 of 21 0 ints 192 yards 0 TDs-lost 6-17
Against Florida in 2010
18 of 37 3 ints 313 yards 3 TDs-lost 30-33
Against Miss St. inj 20111
13 of 25 3 ints 160 yards 2 Tds- won 24-10
Against South Carolina in 2012
11 of 31 1 int 109 yards 0 TDs
Against Florida 2012
12 of 24 3 ints 150 yards 1 TD-won 17-9

And it isn't like Murray was playing on a bad team that if he didn't play phenomenally well, his team would lose. Georgia's best weapon is Gurley and the running game. This isn't Roethlisberger's Miami (OH) going against Iowa here, Georgia is among the most talented teams in the country with excellent other weapons around Murray.

Frankly, I would be shocked iif Murray came out this season. He's a good college QB but as a pro prosect, he does not have it. I see him more of a mix between Cade McNown and Major Applewhite than the Drew Brees that people like to throw around.

He's short, his arm is okay, his accuracy is spotty, his athleticism is decent. If he were stupid enough to come out this season, he would be lucky to find himself picked as high as round 2 because the Kevin Kolbs, Eric Zeiers, and other QBs with similar skillsets and deficiencies never proved themselves on the NFL level.

brasho
01-01-2013, 06:26 PM
I think Ryan Mallet was a better prospect than Mike Glennon is.

Yes, but that was who he reminds me of most as well. Tall, big arm, good athlete but painfully slow (a Mallett, Brady, P. Manning quality if you know what I mean).

brasho
01-01-2013, 06:32 PM
I can't imagine a more bare class of QBs than this one. I mean, even the Druckenmiller class had Jake Plummer selected in round 2. I think Jon Kitna and Jake Delhomme were undrafted that year as well. I think Danny Wuerffel was in there as well... yikes!

bucfan12
01-01-2013, 07:29 PM
This QB class, is more unknown than weak. I really do see a lot of starter upside in most of the QBs. Just that, nothing really screams "Elite". The only prospect I'd say can be elite is Tyler Wilson. The others? All have the tools and intangibles to start. I really like Mike Glennon, but question is: Is he inconsistant because he lost his main WR Targets from last year or is that who is actually is?

Geno Smith? Upside is there. Smart kid, live arm, good accuracy, but his inconsistancy against good teams and question of whether or not his playmakers Sted Bailey and Tavon Austin made him better than he actually is? Character came into question having a tantrum in some bad losses as well.

Landry Jones? This is a kid I think can be a steal in the middle rounds. At worst, he's a great back up to have and develop. But he's got very good intangibles and is very accurate and smart with a very good arm. Lacked some conisistancy and makes some bad decisions when pressured. Has all the tools physcially and mentally. Better pocket presence and athleticism than given credit for.

Matt Barkely? I think he can be an Andy Dalton type QB. Will he be elite? No. He can make the throws, solid accuracy. Seemed to be under a lot of scrutiny, but in a good situation, he can take a team to the play offs.

Ryan Nassib, quick release, very good intangibles, improved accuracy, strong arm. Lacks touch on deep balls and corner routes. Will throw with too much velocity when it's not needed. Can leave the pocket when it's unnecceassay. Has raw ability, but in the right situation, has starter ability.

nepg
01-01-2013, 07:37 PM
O'Brien compares Glennon to Ryan in terms of their physical stature and playing style. I don't think I've ever read where he talked about their intangibles.
Both are tall, pro style dropback QBs who played for the same HC and in the same offense in college. There are points of comparison, but no one is saying Glennon is Ryan.

The big difference between the two is the intangibles. Stats are similar, situations they played in are similar, same conference, same size, same athletic ability, recruited by the same coach... They're very similar players. People saying it's a terrible comparison are just playing devil's advocate, imo.

The issue with Glennon is that while he does have mediocre talent around him (questionable whether it's as bad as what Ryan worked with, WR-wise), he exhibits some Blaine Gabbert-like behavior that may not be fixable at the next level.

Matt Ryan threw a lot of interceptions because he just absolutely HAD to throw the ball into coverage. More of Glennon's are just from bad decision-making.

DcmRulz
01-01-2013, 09:59 PM
Manuel's not in the top QB discussion anymore, right? He's really not having a very good bowl game here, his receivers are open nearly every play and he puts them in awful spots.

FUNBUNCHER
01-01-2013, 10:01 PM
Manuel's not in the top QB discussion anymore, right? He's really not having a very good bowl game here, his receivers are open nearly every play and he puts them in awful spots.

It's damning IMO that Manuel has had a pristine pocket on nearly every passing down and he still can't get off on NIU's secondary.

I still say this dude is a backup in the NFL.

descendency
01-01-2013, 11:47 PM
Yes, but that was who he reminds me of most as well. Tall, big arm, good athlete but painfully slow (a Mallett, Brady, P. Manning quality if you know what I mean).

Manning is a better athlete than he's given credit for. He had a decent time for a QB at the combine. I believe it was in the 4.75 range.

I think Ryan Mallet was a better prospect than Mike Glennon is.

I just don't like comparing Petrino's offense (and the products of it) to other offenses. It's part of the reason why I struggle with evaluating Tyler Wilson. I see the talent, but I wonder how it will look in a different offense. That's true of a lot of places, but Tedford and Petrino are notorious for it. (Petrino is notorious for other stuff too...)

bucfan12
01-02-2013, 05:45 AM
Aaron Murray is extremely underrated. Guy makes all the throws necessary. Bc he's 6'1 he won't be mentioned amongst the best. If he were 6'3 he'd be a top 5 pick

BuddyCHRIST
01-03-2013, 06:31 PM
Aaron Murray is extremely underrated. Guy makes all the throws necessary. Bc he's 6'1 he won't be mentioned amongst the best. If he were 6'3 he'd be a top 5 pick

He's just not that good, he has really looked poor against good defenses. Its not like he's playing with a sub par surrounding cast like Cutler or anything.

Even his numbers against Nebraska (which is a terrible defense) are inflated due to some short throws with big YAC.

brasho
01-03-2013, 06:46 PM
He's got his name tattooed to his back like he's some kind of star... (which in itself isn't bad, but I get the feeling he's a bit of a prima dona)

.

Who doesn't have their name tattooed on their back? Only somebody that isn't badass, that's who! Plus, if he ever gets into a game of shirts vs. skins, everybody will know who their favorite player is... BRAY effers! That's right! I think he should get his number tattoed on his back and front, too. And whatever team drafts him, he should force all of his offensive linemen to get his initials tattoed on their ankles, to show their undying dedication to him.

Also, as far as the throwing mechanics are concerned, that should be easy. The next time he's out throwing beer bottles at cars, he just needs somebody to work with him then. If you can learn something when you're drunk, you'll know it forever...and you'll forever be a badass.






I think the Ryan Mallett comparison is even truer after having read your post.

y.f.s.
01-03-2013, 06:54 PM
Mallett was so much better than Bray it's not even funny.

gpngc
01-03-2013, 08:57 PM
I think Tajh Boyd might need to be in this discussion...

DcmRulz
01-04-2013, 01:19 AM
I think Tajh Boyd might need to be in this discussion...

A) Hasn't declared yet, and don't think he will, given the depth at QB in 2013 and the shot at the Heisman/Nat'l Champ Clemson can get next year.

B)If he did come out, I'd put him in the discussion, but I'd probably put him at #4/5 in this crop. (I'd take Geno, Barkley, Glennon, and might go with Wilson over him, though I'd go Boyd over the likes of Dysert, Jones, Nassib and those other 2nd tier guys)

bruschis4all
01-04-2013, 08:33 AM
Kiper was on Mike and Mike this morning. He said that he thinks Glennon will be the first qb picked. In the 10-15 range. Don't shoot the messenger.

LonghornsLegend
01-04-2013, 08:59 AM
If Ryan Mallett didn't have off the field issues, he would have been a top 10 pick in 2011..

I have been hearing this way too much and I'm just not buying it. Just because he had a big arm doesn't mean he was a top 10 pick. If he was truly a top 10 talent at QB there is no way he would have lasted that long.

bruschis4all
01-04-2013, 10:50 AM
I have been hearing this way too much and I'm just not buying it. Just because he had a big arm doesn't mean he was a top 10 pick. If he was truly a top 10 talent at QB there is no way he would have lasted that long.

He wasn't a top 10 talent. But, neither were Gabbert, Locker or Ponder. I would argue he was as good, if not better than those three.

BuddyCHRIST
01-04-2013, 11:28 AM
I have been hearing this way too much and I'm just not buying it. Just because he had a big arm doesn't mean he was a top 10 pick. If he was truly a top 10 talent at QB there is no way he would have lasted that long.

This is not true, he had major on field problems as well. Most notably being his inability to deal with a pass rush, move his feet and throw down field. He looked pretty poor in the Sugar Bowl against Ohio State.

He would be the best QB in this class, because this is the worst QB class I can remember. But it's not like his class was particularly strong either and he still fell that far.

That said he's gotten to sit and learn from Tom Brady for 2 years (who is great at sliding and throwing, despite being slow as crap), so maybe he's picked something up by now.

Roddoliver
01-04-2013, 01:42 PM
He would be the best QB in this class, because this is the worst QB class I can remember.

This class is better than 2007 and it has some depth, especially if Boyd and Murray decide to enter the draft. After Luck and Griffin, it's not a surprise that people are complain about the next class of QBs. I don't think it's that bad, and nowadays these QBs are arriving more and more ready with better maturity and football IQ. The trick is to look at all these players and find the right guy with the brain, besides the arm, to excel in the pros. The answer just is not as obvious this year, and that's the difference to me. It will take a better scouting process to make the right move.

cmarq83
01-04-2013, 01:45 PM
This is not true, he had major on field problems as well. Most notably being his inability to deal with a pass rush, move his feet and throw down field. He looked pretty poor in the Sugar Bowl against Ohio State.


He looked pretty good in the Sugar Bowl actually. He had 3 TD passes dropped, was constantly pressured by Cameron Heyward, and still almost won the game.

AntoinCD
01-04-2013, 02:01 PM
I have been hearing this way too much and I'm just not buying it. Just because he had a big arm doesn't mean he was a top 10 pick. If he was truly a top 10 talent at QB there is no way he would have lasted that long.

If Mallett was squeaky clean I think he absolutely could have been a top 10 pick. If guys like Locker, Gabbert and Ponder can all go in that sort of range then Mallett could too.

But intangibles are a huge part of being a QB. The thing with Mallett was he kinda had an attitude that put people off. He isn't well spoken, some questioned his intelligence and he had a coke issue. How many guys with those kind of major red flags, along with some on field questions (ie - slow footed, doesn't react well to pressure, only throws fastballs) go even in the third round?

Mallett was a major, major talent. Just didn't have it all between the ears

FUNBUNCHER
01-04-2013, 02:39 PM
Ryan Mallet shredded the SEC for two consecutive seasons. He would absolutely have been a top 5-10 pick, but teams were afraid he had MAJOR off the field character issues.

THere were even people who criticized Belichick for selecting him because of the supposed 'risk' factor.
As far as pure QB talent, not one of these QBs in this draft is comparable to Mallet.

I can't believe people actually believe that Mallett was an inferior pro prospect compared to Ponder/Gabbert/Locker/Dalton/Kaepernick.

In D.C. they had sports shows comparing the guy to Ryan Leaf.

cmarq83
01-04-2013, 02:46 PM
Ukt3Y64EktY

There are big time throws in there, and you still see some of them in the preseason. If you give this guy a clean pocket, and some guys who can get a step on DB's down the field then this guy can do plenty of damage in the NFL.

In terms of the ability to simply make throws he's only behind Luck in the past few draft classes. Look at 0:35, 1:40, 2:45, 3:20, 3:35, 5:30, 5:45, 5:55, 7:00, 7:45, 8:40, and 10:55. How many QB's in this class can make any of those?

AntoinCD
01-04-2013, 02:53 PM
There are big time throws in there, and you still see some of them in the preseason. If you give this guy a clean pocket, and some guys who can get a step on DB's down the field then this guy can do plenty of damage in the NFL.

In terms of the ability to simply make throws he's only behind Luck in the past few draft classes.

I think Mallett can make throws Luck simply can't. The major difference is Luck will hit big time throws on a way more consistent basis. Mallett probably has the best arm since Stafford (possibly even better) but he needs to throw from a set base on every throw or else his accuracy suffers.

FUNBUNCHER
01-04-2013, 03:07 PM
I think Mallett has the best arm in the NFL. Just in terms of pure velocity and arm strength, Ryan makes 60-65 yard throws look easy.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-04-2013, 03:28 PM
Mallett's is not just that he's immobile, it's that he can't shed defenders and make throws. Any time he has someone on his body/at his feet the play is over.

LonghornsLegend
01-04-2013, 03:58 PM
I think Mallett has the best arm in the NFL. Just in terms of pure velocity and arm strength, Ryan makes 60-65 yard throws look easy.

I wasn't grading Mallett simply by arm strength, or how he can throw the football. Because if we stopped just there Jamarcus Russell would be everybodies favorite prospect. I know he can throw the football with the best of them, but in terms of manueverability, decision making, pocket presence, and mental make-up(intangibles) I didn't see it. He was lacking in a lot more areas to me then he needed to be for a top 5 pick.



Now if we are going off of Ponder, Gabbert, and Locker, point made. But I didn't think those guys were top 10 picks and I didn't about Mallett either. What is the worst off the field issue Mallett had? It's not like he got kicked off the team, or failed repeated drug test, went to a IAA school, failed a combine drug test, etc.


Now yea, his off the field character concerns were legit sure. But the example people always bring up is Dan Marino and you had reports that he used to smoke pot before games and that was hardly the only drug he was connected to. So sure, if you fall to the Andy Dalton/Kaepernick range maybe I buy it, but there were a lot more questions about Mallett and his overall ability to play QB then I think people are admitting. It wasn't just about how well he can throw.

y.f.s.
01-04-2013, 04:08 PM
Mallett's is not just that he's immobile, it's that he can't shed defenders and make throws. Any time he has someone on his body/at his feet the play is over.

JMO from the preseason games this year, but I think he's better (from a mechanics and accuracy standpoint) when he's got bodies around him and/or has to move and reset. When the pocket is clean, he overstrides, locks his front knee and gets off balance and that's when his accuracy goes to complete hell.

FUNBUNCHER
01-04-2013, 04:14 PM
Mallett allegedly told teams at the combine he'd 'tried' cocaine. His honesty blew a hole in his draft stock.

It doesn't make sense that an NFL HC could look at Mallett's college film and not see a guy who's a potential pro bowl QB.

People criticize Mallett's decision making because a few ill timed passes late in games. So he's not perfect. But in an NFL where all QB prospects are overdrafted, Mallett with less red flags would have been taken 70 picks higher than he was.

The kid was dominant at Arkansas. I just didn't see this prospect on the field with major holes in his game.

descendency
01-04-2013, 05:23 PM
This is not true, he had major on field problems as well. Most notably being his inability to deal with a pass rush, move his feet and throw down field. He looked pretty poor in the Sugar Bowl against Ohio State.

He also struggled with the intermediate throws. He'd gun it 5 yards over his receivers heads.

I thought Mallett was a definite first rounder but obviously most NFL GMs did not.

Dangermouse
01-04-2013, 06:24 PM
Back to the point, from watching some of the top guys in action I have a feeling Andy Reid will take Tyler Wilson over Geno Smith. Also, I love Matt Barkley but from his 2012 evidence it wouldn't surprise me if he drops to the 4th round. It would be even further, but I reckon teams will know from his tape as an underclassman that he has the potential to be a starting QB, maybe take a punt in the 4th with the idea that he had a down year.

SuperPacker
01-04-2013, 10:19 PM
Mallett was the truth. He was a definite top 10 pick without the off the field issues, IMO.

If I was a QB needy team without a high draft pick or the chance of getting one soon eg. Cowboys, i'd definitely try to get him.

Hopefully his 2 years under BB and Tom Brady have helped sort him out.

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
01-04-2013, 10:21 PM
Mallett was the truth. He was a definite top 10 pick without the off the field issues, IMO.

If I was a QB needy team without a high draft pick or the chance of getting one soon eg. Cowboys, i'd definitely try to get him.

Hopefully his 2 years under BB and Tom Brady have helped sort him out.

He hasn't been in the news so hes managed to keep his nose clean.

ChiefMojo
01-14-2013, 09:22 AM
I think at this moment the Chiefs will take Smith because he fits Reid's WCO very well.