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Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 03:50 PM
Rosters will be announced at 7 tonight. I think the only players on the Giants who are really deserving are Eli Manning, Victor Cruz, and Jason Pierre Paul. I have a feeling none of them make it though and our representatives are Rolle and Snee.

ChiFan24
12-27-2011, 03:54 PM
Lance Briggs tweeted that he made it.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 03:57 PM
I'm curious to see if the 3rd AFC QB is Tebow.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 03:57 PM
Lance Briggs tweeted that he made it.

Lance might be the only Bear. Urlacher and Peppers will probably get some votes for name recognition. Neither had bad years, but there are probably more deserving guys at both positions.

bigbluedefense
12-27-2011, 03:57 PM
Rolle probably deserves it too. Name 3 other safeties in the NFC this year better than Rolle?

Earl Thomas
Malcolm Jenkins

That's about it. There were a lot of injuries to safeties this year. Rolle is probably the 3rd guy in the NFC this year bc a lot of other guys got hurt.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 03:58 PM
I'm curious to see if the 3rd AFC QB is Tebow.

It'll probably be:

Brady
Ben
...Tebow

And even if it's not, one of Brady or Ben is probably going to the Superbowl, so he'll be out, and the other will claim injury or something to not play. So Tebow will get in eventually.

Meaningless stupid Pro Bowl.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 04:00 PM
You can make an argument both Seahawks safeties were better than Rolle. He was out of position all year and he had some really good games but as you know our secondary got shredded pretty much the whole year. I think Webster is close also but there is no way he gets in with the numbers against our defense as high as they are.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 04:00 PM
It'll probably be:

Brady
Ben
...Tebow

And even if it's not, one of Brady or Ben is probably going to the Superbowl, so he'll be out, and the other will claim injury or something to not play. So Tebow will get in eventually.

Meaningless stupid Pro Bowl.

The Ravens will have something to say about Brady or Ben in the SB. It's Flacco's time! Speaking of the Ravens...

Ray Rice (Deserved)
Vonta Leach (Deserved)
Mike Oher (Not Deserved)
Haloti Ngata (Deserved)
Terrell Suggs (Deserved)
Ray Lewis (Not Deserved)
Ed Reed (Not Deserved)
Brendan Ayenbadejo (Ehhh....Whatever, its special teams)

I expect all of those guys to make it.

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 04:01 PM
It better be Dalton over Tebow.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 04:02 PM
The Ravens will have something to say about Brady or Ben in the SB. It's Flacco's time! Speaking of the Ravens...

Ray Rice (Deserved)
Vonta Leach (Deserved)
Mike Oher (Not Deserved)
Haloti Ngata (Deserved)
Terrell Suggs (Deserved)
Ray Lewis (Not Deserved)
Ed Reed (Not Deserved)
Brendan Ayenbadejo (Ehhh....Whatever, its special teams)

I expect all of those guys to make it.

When Cam Cameron loses his **** and has Flacco throw 53 times in a one score game, we'll see if it's really Flacco time.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 04:02 PM
When Cam Cameron loses his **** and has Flacco throw 53 times in a one score game, we'll see if it's really Flacco time.

...I hate you.

Jughead10
12-27-2011, 04:03 PM
Rolle probably deserves it too. Name 3 other safeties in the NFC this year better than Rolle?

Earl Thomas
Malcolm Jenkins

That's about it. There were a lot of injuries to safeties this year. Rolle is probably the 3rd guy in the NFC this year bc a lot of other guys got hurt.

Rolle has barely even played as a real safety this year so it's really hard to say. I'd vote for San Fran's safety Goodson. He always seems to be making plays.

TimmG6376
12-27-2011, 04:06 PM
Rodgers obviously.

Scott Wells has had a good season so I think he deserves consideration.

Woodson, despite having a seemingly off year, does actually have 7 INTs and a couple of sacks.

Maybe one of the WRs (Jordy or Jennings).

Beyond that no one else has really stood out. Strange for a 14-1 team.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 04:08 PM
Rodgers obviously.

Scott Wells has had a good season so I think he deserves consideration.

Woodson, despite having a seemingly off year, does actually have 7 INTs and a couple of sacks.

Maybe one of the WRs (Jordy or Jennings).

Beyond that no one else has really stood out. Strange for a 14-1 team.

A few years back, I remember the Titans being a top seed in the AFC but had NO pro bowlers.

It's odd, but it happens. The Packers are apparently a popular enough team nationally to get that Cowboy/Steeler effect going where just about everyone becomes a pro bowler.

ChiFan24
12-27-2011, 04:13 PM
Lance might be the only Bear. Urlacher and Peppers will probably get some votes for name recognition. Neither had bad years, but there are probably more deserving guys at both positions.

I honestly don't see why Urlacher shouldn't make it, but it will be tough for Peppers with some of the gaudy sack numbers in the NFC.

Hester should make it too. Though I guess PP could have a case....

ShutDwn
12-27-2011, 04:15 PM
Chris Gamble better make it.

Jughead10
12-27-2011, 04:16 PM
I honestly don't see why Urlacher shouldn't make it, but it will be tough for Peppers with some of the gaudy sack numbers in the NFC.

Hester should make it too. Though I guess PP could have a case....

The only other players who should get consideration are both San Fran mikes and London Fletcher.

M.O.T.H.
12-27-2011, 04:18 PM
Romo, Witten, maybe Tyron Smith, Sean Lee, Ware, Bailey all have a shot.

I'd just like to note that Mike Jenkins was magnificent this year...but he in no way would qualify because of all the time he missed.

jth1331
12-27-2011, 04:20 PM
Champ Bailey and Von Miller are the only ones really deserving.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 04:30 PM
I honestly don't see why Urlacher shouldn't make it, but it will be tough for Peppers with some of the gaudy sack numbers in the NFC.

Hester should make it too. Though I guess PP could have a case....

Yeah, Hester too, forgot about him. Wasn't thinking about the special teams.

As for Urlacher, I just think that the NFC will produce 2 other guys at MLB. Sean Lee will get the Cowboys bump for instance, likely pushing him in. (Not saying he doesn't deserve it, but Cowboys players get a nice bump in the voting.) Everyone talks up London Fletcher and how he's never been voted into one, so he's a possibility. You have Lofton and Vilma who might have shots. Willis and Bowman in San Fran could each make a case too.

Urlacher's name recognition and good season may get him in. It wasn't a dominant season though so I could easily see two of the above mentioned guys making it in over him.

TimmG6376
12-27-2011, 04:39 PM
A few years back, I remember the Titans being a top seed in the AFC but had NO pro bowlers.

It's odd, but it happens. The Packers are apparently a popular enough team nationally to get that Cowboy/Steeler effect going where just about everyone becomes a pro bowler.

Yeah, Woodson is leading the NFC in INTs and if you factor in how much reputation weighs in Pro Bowl voting, he'll probably make it.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 04:49 PM
Kam Chancellor better get in. He's had a borderline All-Pro year, but because he plays for the Seahawks, he doesn't get talked about. Really, the Seahawks ought to have a couple defenders selected to the Pro Bowl, but probably won't because the team had a mediocre season overall and doesn't get much media exposure. Brandon Browner had a terrific first year in the NFL after playing in the CFL for the last few years - Leads the league in pass breakups, 6 interceptions returned for 220 yards and 2 TDs, and at 6'4" 220 he's been a good tackler, too. The Seahawk's defensive backs have really exceeded expectations this year and I'd say Browner, Thomas and Chancellor at the very least warrant serious consideration. Rookie Richard Sherman has been really solid all year too, and I'd argue he ought to be on the All-Rookie team. Led all rookies in pass breakups and interceptions.

Offensively, if you watched Seattle play all year the way I did you know Marshawn Lynch earned a trip to Hawaii. He was our only consistent offensive player, and after a slowish start to the season, he's been as good as anyone through the last 3 months or so. We've lost our three most talented linemen and Tarvaris Jackson is Tarvaris Jackson, yet Marshawn's getting it done every week. "Only" averaging 4.1 yards a carry, but rarely gets tackled for negative yardage and is always making more yards than he's initially given. I think LeSean McCoy is probably a shoo-in because of his stats, but Marshawn Lynch is absolutely deserving of one of the other two spots.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 04:50 PM
I would put Beast Mode into the Pro Bowl for sure. He's been outstanding this year.

yo123
12-27-2011, 05:17 PM
Other than Jared Allen no one else even deserves consideration from the Vikings. Greenway has gotten snubbed a couple times over the last few years but even he has taken a step back this year.

Clarkpba
12-27-2011, 05:25 PM
As a Bengal fan I can be biased but yet realistic as well. I feel Geno Atkins should be on the team but will probably get left off just because he hasn't been around long enough to get noticed but the fact is he has more sacks then any other Defensive Tackle in the entire NFL. If that stat alone isn't telling enough how much of a beast this guy has been this year I don't know what does. He plays along side another really good DT in Dometa Peko who doesn't get the props he deserves either.

I also think AJ Green just may be deserving. I don't know if he has the credentials yet but even if he doesn't make it this year I have a feeling he will earn more then a few trips to the pro bowl.

T-RICH49
12-27-2011, 05:27 PM
If Derrick Johnson does not make it I will go on a Yoda like rant.Tamba has a shot as well

49erNation85
12-27-2011, 05:29 PM
Aldon Smith , Patrick WIllis , Frank Gore , Vernon Davis , Justin Smith Whitner all should be going from SF... Any one else ?

Miaoww
12-27-2011, 05:43 PM
Chris Gamble better make it.

Gamble, Newton and Smith realistically deserve it. They won't make it though.

Shane P. Hallam
12-27-2011, 05:45 PM
QBs throwing toward Gamble have the lowest QB rating in the league. Revis is #2.

ChiFan24
12-27-2011, 05:49 PM
Charles Tillman made it. Up until Vincent Jackson owned him, he 100% deserved it. Now it's a bit questionable, but taking his career into account, it's about God damn time he got in.....

Nalej
12-27-2011, 06:04 PM
Aldon Smith , Patrick WIllis , Frank Gore , Vernon Davis , Justin Smith Whitner all should be going from SF... Any one else ?

The other ILB?

Matthew Jones
12-27-2011, 06:05 PM
Most deserving Patriots:

QB Tom Brady

WR Wes Welker

TE Rob Gronkowski

OG Brian Waters

NT Vince Wilfork

NY+Giants=NYG
12-27-2011, 06:08 PM
No Cruz? What the hell is that about?

Nalej
12-27-2011, 06:09 PM
http://www.nfl.com/probowl/story/09000d5d82578253/article/2012-pro-bowl-rosters?module=HP11_breaking_news

Rosters released.


Call me a homer but Hernandez > Gates for Pro Bowl this year

T-RICH49
12-27-2011, 06:09 PM
YES DJ GOT IN!!!!!!Totally deserved

Breed
12-27-2011, 06:16 PM
How did Larry Fitzgerald get in, pro bowl is total BS.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 06:17 PM
No Cruz? What the hell is that about?

Heard he wasn't even on the fan ballot or some ****. Same with JPP at some point, because he wasn't listed as a starter or something? I don't know. The fan voting is total BS, and everyone knows this. I don't know why they don't at least let you vote for whoever you want if they're going to count the fans' votes.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 06:19 PM
Adrian Wilson over Kam Chancellor is a travesty. ********. Oh, and what the holy hell is Dwight Freeney doing in the Pro Bowl again? Starting, no less? I can't even care any more. This is horseshit. It's just a fan-turnout competition. Who shouts the loudest.

T-RICH49
12-27-2011, 06:19 PM
first time 2 Chiefs LB's made Pro Bowl since Bobby Bell and Willie Lanier.First Chiefs LB to make it since DT

Miaoww
12-27-2011, 06:23 PM
No Newton or Gamble. H'ok, that makes sense...

XxXdragonXxX
12-27-2011, 06:27 PM
Earl Thomas is the starting FS. Kam, Michael Robinson, Beast Mode, Browner and Jon ryan are all alternates.

Browner should be a starter but he didn't really start to get hot till the last 6 weeks or so. Beast Mode also had a slow start but went off the last 10 weeks. I think their slow starts really hurt the fan vote but they finished strong and got the player and media vote.

Kam was amazing all year, better than Earl. Should have been the top voted safety.


We got more than I thought we would though.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-27-2011, 06:28 PM
Heard he wasn't even on the fan ballot or some ****. Same with JPP at some point, because he wasn't listed as a starter or something? I don't know. The fan voting is total BS, and everyone knows this. I don't know why they don't at least let you vote for whoever you want if they're going to count the fans' votes.

Yeah but JPP made it though.. Fan vote is 1/3.. That's complete BS!

He is 3rd in the NFL AND 2nd in the NFC and still doesn't get in! WTF!?

T-RICH49
12-27-2011, 06:38 PM
Most deserving Patriots:

QB Tom Brady

WR Wes Welker

TE Rob Gronkowski

OG Brian Waters

NT Vince Wilfork

yeahhh cutting him is even more stupid now then before

Complex
12-27-2011, 06:38 PM
No Cortland Finnegan? meh w/e I don't watch the pro bowl anyway.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 06:40 PM
Ravens with 6 starters. Damn.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 06:42 PM
Ravens with 6 starters. Damn.

Because all their fans are convinced they don't get any media respect and so turn out for the Pro Bowl voting en masse to compensate.

When really they just have a very mediocre QB, a defense that isn't as good as its reputation and a tendency to play down to their opponents.

General Zod
12-27-2011, 06:43 PM
Im sorta thinking Andrew Whitworth over Ferguson for OT.

And Brian Crushing and D'Qwell Jackson could be argued over Ray Lewis. IMO

Id also make a case for Aldon Smith to be in the LB group as well.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 06:44 PM
Because all their fans are convinced they don't get any media respect and so turn out for the Pro Bowl voting en masse to compensate.

When really they just have a very mediocre QB, a defense that isn't as good as its reputation and a tendency to play down to their opponents.

Just when I thought we were starting to become friends :(

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 06:45 PM
Im sorta thinking Andrew Whitworth over Ferguson for OT.

And Brian Crushing and D'Qwell Jackson could be argued over Ray Lewis. IMO

Id also make a case for Aldon Smith to be in the LB group as well.

Ray Lewis shouldn't be in the Pro Bowl. Neither should Ed Reed. Unfortunately, this is the way the world works and as both are HoF players who have had fairly good (not great) seasons, they will find their way in there.

I am happy to see Ray Rice starting, as far as I'm concerned he's a legitimate MVP candidate.

PackerLegend
12-27-2011, 06:45 PM
Pats, 49ers got 8
Packers, Ravens got 7

Everyone else had alot less. Heres to hoping that 0 Packers will have to show up at the pro bowl again this year.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 06:46 PM
Just when I thought we were starting to become friends :(

Haha. No, I'm just eating sour grapes because I thought Kam Chancellor would get in for sure. Kinda pissed about that.

Ngata, Reed, Rice and Leach are legit. I want to say Lewis and Suggs got in on rep, but they've got the stats. Whatever. AFC roster, so I don't care.

I do think the Ravens play down to their opponents, though.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-27-2011, 06:47 PM
No Spoon and/or Lofton is a damn shame. Just a terrible list all around. As usual.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 06:49 PM
Yes! Corey Graham totally deserved the special teamer nod. Tillman is a little bit of a surprise but he's not a bad pick. Briggs I figured, Urlacher see my earlier thoughts, and I doubt Forte plays.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 06:50 PM
Haha. No, I'm just eating sour grapes because I thought Kam Chancellor would get in for sure. Kinda pissed about that.

Ngata, Reed, Rice and Leach are legit. Think Lewis and Suggs probably got in on rep.

Uhhh Lewis yes, Suggs no. Terrell Suggs is my Defensive Player of the Year, and it isn't all that close. He's been nothing short of incredible all year, especially when Ray was out.

64 TKL, 13.0 sacks, 6 FF, 2 INT

Suggs has been terrific all year.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-27-2011, 06:50 PM
I think if any Raven got in on rep (outside of Ray, which is just obvious) it would be Ngata. Hadn't played as well this year as compared to years past, and how do you not get Geno Atkins in?

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 06:51 PM
Uhhh Lewis yes, Suggs no. Terrell Suggs is my Defensive Player of the Year, and it isn't all that close. He's been nothing short of incredible all year, especially when Ray was out.

64 TKL, 13.0 sacks, 6 FF, 2 INT

Suggs has been terrific all year.

My bad. I haven't watched enough Ravens games. Conceded.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 06:53 PM
No Spoon and/or Lofton is a damn shame. Just a terrible list all around. As usual.

I LOVE Sean Weatherspoon. I've seen 5 or 6 Falcons games this year and I think he's well on his way to becoming a premier 4-3 OLB in this league. I was a giant fan of his as a prospect, I wanted him on the Ravens something terrible. He can do everything. Strong in the running game, as good as anyone in coverage, and he's showing blitz ability that I didn't think he had. I've been extremely impressed with him this season. Reminds me a little of early DJ Williams, back when he was awesome and not awful.

A Perfect Score
12-27-2011, 06:55 PM
I think if any Raven got in on rep (outside of Ray, which is just obvious) it would be Ngata. Hadn't played as well this year as compared to years past, and how do you not get Geno Atkins in?

Again, not sure what you're talking about here. Ngata has tailed off a little as the season has winded down, but he was absolutely stellar to start the year. He was unstoppable in both games vs Pittsburgh. He's got 60 tackles, 5 sacks and 2 FF this season, but he's just so dominant on the LoS.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-27-2011, 06:55 PM
I LOVE Sean Weatherspoon. I've seen 5 or 6 Falcons games this year and I think he's well on his way to becoming a premier 4-3 OLB in this league. I was a giant fan of his as a prospect, I wanted him on the Ravens something terrible. He can do everything. Strong in the running game, as good as anyone in coverage, and he's showing blitz ability that I didn't think he had. I've been extremely impressed with him this season. Reminds me a little of early DJ Williams, back when he was awesome and not awful.


He showed flashes last year, but was mostly hurt and struggled in coverage due to this. This year he has just been a complete stud. Very bright future for him and Lofton.

Go_Eagles77
12-27-2011, 06:58 PM
All the kickers and punters are from the Bay area. Interesting.

vidae
12-27-2011, 06:59 PM
DJ TOTALLY deserved to make the pro bowl. I'm not sure there is another ILB playing at a higher level right now. I'm glad Tamba made it too, he deserved it. I wanted Flowers to go, but I guess I can sort of see the reasoning behind the AFC corners. Revis is Revis and JJ has been great, but meh on Champ.

No one from our offense deserves to even watch the Pro Bowl, let alone make it.

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 07:00 PM
DJ TOTALLY deserved to make the pro bowl. I'm not sure there is another ILB playing at a higher level right now. I'm glad Tamba made it too, he deserved it. I wanted Flowers to go, but I guess I can sort of see the reasoning behind the AFC corners. Revis is Revis and JJ has been great, but meh on Champ.

No one from our offense deserves to even watch the Pro Bowl, let alone make it.

I picture you making them sit on a chair facing the corner while saying "NO! You're being punished! You were BAD!"

49erNation85
12-27-2011, 07:01 PM
Why the **** is Rivers on the roster , really people ? He had a up and down season not even worth a pro bowl type QB. Just so wrong . Where is Tebow ?

BeerBaron
12-27-2011, 07:02 PM
Why the **** is Rivers on the roster , really people ? He had a up and down season not even worth a pro bowl type QB. Just so wrong . Where is Tebow ?

Because player and coach voting makes up 2/3 and they're not ******** like the fans.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-27-2011, 07:03 PM
Again, not sure what you're talking about here. Ngata has tailed off a little as the season has winded down, but he was absolutely stellar to start the year. He was unstoppable in both games vs Pittsburgh. He's got 60 tackles, 5 sacks and 2 FF this season, but he's just so dominant on the LoS.

I'm not saying he's had a bad year, but he hasn't played up to his usual standards. And Geno was just monstrous this year.

TheFinisher
12-27-2011, 07:04 PM
I have no idea how Jay Ratliff continues to get voted into the Pro Bowl, he's gotta be the most overrated player in the NFL.

ATLDirtyBirds
12-27-2011, 07:04 PM
Why the **** is Rivers on the roster , really people ? He had a up and down season not even worth a pro bowl type QB. Just so wrong . Where is Tebow ?


I'm not sure what's more annoying/worse. You constantly bringing up Tebow where his name doesn't belong, or you constantly bringing up Kellen Moore where his name doesn't belong.

TACKLE
12-27-2011, 07:06 PM
I'm really glad to see Yanda get voted in. Very deserving.

Bucs_Rule
12-27-2011, 07:07 PM
Why the **** is Rivers on the roster , really people ? He had a up and down season not even worth a pro bowl type QB. Just so wrong . Where is Tebow ?

No one deserved that last slot in the AFC. Matt Schaub would have if he didn't get injured.

vidae
12-27-2011, 07:09 PM
I picture you making them sit on a chair facing the corner while saying "NO! You're being punished! You were BAD!"

They're in a time out until they can consistently convert 3rd downs as far as I'm concerned. And no dessert!

JBCX
12-27-2011, 07:10 PM
Good to see Jason Peters finally get some recognition. Last year, all I ever saw people say about Peters was that he was the most overrated OT in the league and that he was a Pro Bowler "in name only".

Despite the fact that he might be one of the top 5 OTs in the entire NFL.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 07:11 PM
No one deserved that last slot in the AFC. Matt Schaub would have if he didn't get injured.

Yeah, this. Someone had to get it, and Rivers and Tebow are about on par with each other. Who else is there? Dalton? Sanchez? If you were picking one to quarterback your team, I have to think at least 75% people would want Rivers, and that's what you see in the voting. Tebow's had a more dramatic season, but he's not better than Rivers by any stretch of the imagination.

Brodeur
12-27-2011, 07:12 PM
Eli over Stafford...

http://img859.imageshack.us/img859/6440/wwerandyortoncommentsin.jpg

asdf1223
12-27-2011, 07:12 PM
3/4 of the NFC secondary will be from the NFC West. Wow. Also, I want a Yoda rant on why there was no Chris Long selection.

DeepThreat
12-27-2011, 07:16 PM
I am happy to see Ray Rice starting, as far as I'm concerned he's a legitimate MVP candidate.

haha

JT once again deserved to make it. Ahtyba Rubin, D'Qwell Jackson and Joe Haden were also worthy.

TimmG6376
12-27-2011, 07:16 PM
Didn't see Raji or Clay making it. Clay has had a better season than the statistics reflect but that usually doesn't matter in Pro Bowl voting. Raji hasn't played to the same level as last season, so that is another surprise.

Kuhn as FB caught me off guard too, but honestly there aren't a lot of FBs in the league. I'd say Bruce Miller might have a case for being snubbed on that one.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 07:17 PM
You know what I would really like to see? The results minus the fan voting. Anyone know if that's available anywhere?

VernonLawson89
12-27-2011, 07:17 PM
Why the **** is Rivers on the roster , really people ? He had a up and down season not even worth a pro bowl type QB. Just so wrong . Where is Tebow ?

Tell me how Tebow deserves a spot on the PB?

49erNation85
12-27-2011, 07:20 PM
Tell me how Tebow deserves a spot on the PB?


He had a better winning percentage then Rivers not numbers for sure. But really why is Rivers on the rosters ?

Hurricanes25
12-27-2011, 07:25 PM
He had a better winning percentage then Rivers not numbers for sure. But really why is Rivers on the rosters ?

Winning percentage, really? Really?

Brodeur
12-27-2011, 07:27 PM
He had a better winning percentage then Rivers not numbers for sure. But really why is Rivers on the rosters ?

http://i.qkme.me/1t0m.jpg

TimmG6376
12-27-2011, 07:29 PM
Matt Moore & Andy Dalton deserve it more than Tebow and maybe Rivers. But seriously we all know that reputation has a hell of a lot to do with the Pro Bowl. That is why Rivers made it. Well that and Schaub is injured.

ChiFan24
12-27-2011, 07:31 PM
Joe Haden's the biggest snub.

Flyboy
12-27-2011, 07:42 PM
Saints that probably should have made it in my opinion:

Roman Harper and Jabari Greer. Greer continues to be one of the most upper echelon CBs in the league and yet lacks a lot of recognition for his fantastic play. Also, a case could be made for Malcolm Jenkins too.

keylime_5
12-27-2011, 07:43 PM
Haden and Malcolm Jenkins got snubbed. It's a shame that there wasn't room for Victor Cruz either, but can't really argue him over the guys they put on there.

If this were baseball's all-star voting procedure then a lot of deserving guys like Charles Tillman and Derrick Johnson and Justin Smith wouldn't have made it. Tip of the hat to the NFL for having an excellent pro bowl voting process.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-27-2011, 07:48 PM
It's a shame that there wasn't room for Victor Cruz either, but can't really argue him over the guys they put on there.


Of course you can. He is # 3 in the NFL in yards, # 2 in the NFC. He showed this year he is one of the most big play WRs in the NFL. He 100% should have made it.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 07:59 PM
Of course you can. He is # 3 in the NFL in yards, # 2 in the NFC. He showed this year he is one of the most big play WRs in the NFL. He 100% should have made it.

Yeah, as the Pro Bowl is a yearly award... Victor Cruz should've gotten in over Greg Jennings. Take your pick for who you want on your team, but Cruz made huge plays all year, bigger plays than Jennings, and should've gotten in over him.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-27-2011, 08:02 PM
Yeah, as the Pro Bowl is a yearly award... Victor Cruz should've gotten in over Greg Jennings. Take your pick for who you want on your team, but Cruz made huge plays all year, bigger plays than Jennings, and should've gotten in over him.

He made every play! He made us forget about Steve Smith. Plus he put up these numbers with 2 less games. He didn't play game 1 and came in when Hixon got hurt.

It's actually a no brainer. The guy is # 2 in the NFC behind Megatron. He is not a famous pick or anything like that, but he deserved to make this year.

Splat
12-27-2011, 08:03 PM
Everyone that said Tamba Hali was a one year wonder and got overpaid can suck it now...

Saints-Tigers
12-27-2011, 08:05 PM
Malcolm Jenkins would have probably made it easy if he didn't drop so many picks.

All the talk and credit people give to Brees' "weapons", but we got our first "weapon" into a pro bowl since Brees has been here (Jimmy Graham).

That means, if you give Brees a pro bowl skill position player, you get the most passing yards, and record breaking completions and completion %, and 40+ touchdowns....

Just kidding, kinda! :D

Scotty D
12-27-2011, 08:05 PM
Stafford got robbed and I hear that Newton is the first alternate.

phlysac
12-27-2011, 08:07 PM
I don't know if it will ever sink in that 18 49ers were voted to the roster or as alternates.


Starters

OT - JoeStaley
DE - Justin Smith
ILB - Patrick Willis
CB - Carlos Rogers
K - David Akers
P - Andy Lee

Reserves

RB - Frank Gore
FS - Dashon Goldson

Alternates

FB - Bruce Miller
TE - Vernon Davis
G - Mike Iupati
C - Jonathan Goodwin
DE - Ray McDonald
OLB - Ahmad Brooks
ILB - NaVorro Bowman
SS - Donte Whitner
RS - Ted Ginn, Jr.
ST - Blake Castonzo

Wow

DoughBoy
12-27-2011, 08:07 PM
Cortland deserved to go :(

Just another of the 5 thousand reasons not to watch the Pro bowl.

Saints-Tigers
12-27-2011, 08:10 PM
Has goodwin been that good? Because De La Puente is probably the best C we've had here since LeCharles Bentley, and has way outperformed Goodwin and Kreutz.

keylime_5
12-27-2011, 08:12 PM
Yeah, as the Pro Bowl is a yearly award... Victor Cruz should've gotten in over Greg Jennings. Take your pick for who you want on your team, but Cruz made huge plays all year, bigger plays than Jennings, and should've gotten in over him.

i guess i put that the wrong way. i meant that you can't say the three who got on there didn't deserve it. i think cruz deserved it as well, as did Jordyzzz.

phlysac
12-27-2011, 08:12 PM
Has goodwin been that good? Because De La Puente is probably the best C we've had here since LeCharles Bentley, and has way outperformed Goodwin and Kreutz.

He's had spells of inconsistency but I can't complain about his solid play.

keylime_5
12-27-2011, 08:13 PM
I stand by the theory that the offensive linemen on the Pats, Colts, and Saints who get their accolades who not be in pro bowls if they didn't have Brady, Manning, and Brees making them look better than they really are. They would not be in pro bowls if they had David Carr at QB. I suppose you could argue that for any WR as well who has a pro bowl QB throwing to him.

Flyboy
12-27-2011, 08:17 PM
He's had spells of inconsistency but I can't complain about his solid play.

He's solid for sure, but I've seen his play very closely when he was in NOLA and for safely say that Brian De La Puente is a MUCH better player than Goodwin was...

phlysac
12-27-2011, 08:17 PM
I'm not going to complain (considering way too many 49ers got accolades) but Aldon Smith is 5th in the entire NFL in sacks and didn't even get an alternate nod.

Voting for this is so weird.

Flyboy
12-27-2011, 08:18 PM
Malcolm Jenkins would have probably made it easy if he didn't drop so many picks.

All the talk and credit people give to Brees' "weapons", but we got our first "weapon" into a pro bowl since Brees has been here (Jimmy Graham).

That means, if you give Brees a pro bowl skill position player, you get the most passing yards, and record breaking completions and completion %, and 40+ touchdowns....

Just kidding, kinda! :D


Ehhh.. to me, Marques Colston has been a stub in the past few years of the Pro Bowl. Not this year, but definitely years past.

Caddy
12-27-2011, 08:23 PM
Glad Davin Joseph made it for the Bucs. The team has been garbage, but Joseph has been pretty dominant and is the only player on the roster deserving of a pro bowl nod.

SuperMcGee
12-27-2011, 08:25 PM
The only chance we had was a safety getting in over Weddle, and that was not to be. Had one healthy player left that would have been deserving besides them. Oh well.

Love the returners. Antonio and PP!

ChiFan24
12-27-2011, 08:27 PM
Haden and Malcolm Jenkins got snubbed. It's a shame that there wasn't room for Victor Cruz either, but can't really argue him over the guys they put on there.

If this were baseball's all-star voting procedure then a lot of deserving guys like Charles Tillman and Derrick Johnson and Justin Smith wouldn't have made it. Tip of the hat to the NFL for having an excellent pro bowl voting process.

Agreed. I think you're all complaining too much. These rosters seem good enough to me. Just because you think your team's player has been really good doesn't necessarily mean he deserved to make the pro bowl over the players that did.

I do think the roster structure needs to be changed. It's pretty ridiculous to me that DeMarcus Ware and Lance Briggs are thought to play the same position.

Saints-Tigers
12-27-2011, 08:28 PM
I stand by the theory that the offensive linemen on the Pats, Colts, and Saints who get their accolades who not be in pro bowls if they didn't have Brady, Manning, and Brees making them look better than they really are. They would not be in pro bowls if they had David Carr at QB. I suppose you could argue that for any WR as well who has a pro bowl QB throwing to him.

Bushrod is a real head scratcher. He's decent, but we put help on his side a LOT, and if Brees wasn't so elusive, he'd have given up a good bit of sacks.

Nicks and Evans are absolutely deserving though.

Bucs147
12-27-2011, 08:30 PM
Glad Davin Joseph made it for the Bucs. The team has been garbage, but Joseph has been pretty dominant and is the only player on the roster deserving of a pro bowl nod.

You forgot our team MVP, Barth Vador !

vidae
12-27-2011, 08:48 PM
Everyone that said Tamba Hali was a one year wonder and got overpaid can suck it now...

Amen to that brother. Tamba is a flat out beast.

BigBanger
12-27-2011, 09:05 PM
Joe Haden's the biggest snub.

I'd say Haden is up there, maybe even top 5. He's as close to Revis as it gets (Flowers is up there (my person favorite), but he was so bad at the start of the season I just can't ignore that. Dude did it turn it on after the first 5 or 6 games though).

Peyton Manning is the third most deserving QB in the AFC. That is not a joke.

You gotta scrape through dogshit to pick from the QBs out of the AFC. The talent level in general (WR and DE are also glaring weaknesses) is just so weak compared to the NFC. Brady and Big Ben are the only two that are even close to deserving, and both are great players and locks. After those two ... Manning easily made the greatest impact on his team.

Matt Stafford has thrown for 36 ******* TDs. On a Lions team that throws the ball 40 times a game because their running game is so atrocious. Their offensive line stinks and their defense sucks too. It's the Lions!!!! They'd have 5 wins without him... max. He along with Megatron are the only reason why they're going to the playoffs. That's it.

Stafford's NFL ranks: 2nd in attempts, 5th in yards, 5th in completion %, t-3rd in TDs (36), 5th in Passer Rating (96.6, discounting 10 game Schaub).

Eli is, however, very deserving because his play in the 4th QT this year has been phenomenal. Rodgers, Brees, Stafford, Eli and Romo should all be invited. And Cam Newton's 34 TDs and 6 wins would easily be the 3rd most deserving if he was in the AFC.

8 49ers make it and their 3rd or 4th best player, Bowman, doesn't make it? Name recognition.

Andrew Whitworth. He's been one of the best tackles in football and had a better start to the season than Jake Long (still deserving to go to the Pro Bowl), but Whitworth should be a starter.

ADRIAN PETERSON!!!! He is the best RB in football and no one is even close. I don't care about his stats. I don't care that he's only played 3/4 of the season. That's enough when you're that much better than everyone else at your position. He's one of the best players in game. In the entire game. He is a Pro Bowler. Plain and simple. I don't need to make a case for him. He just is.


Guys who made it on name recognition ...

Clay Matthews took a spot away from much better OLBs: Weatherspoon and Greenway.

Champ Bailey. We get it. He's a Hall of Famer. Enough.

Jay Ratliff, BJ Raji ... I'd almost rather see Suh make it even though he didn't deserve it either. AFC side is picture perfect, NFC side is just awful.

Steve Smith ...

Jordy Nelson and Victor Cruz are more deserving despite Smith's terrific year. But these two guys have been better down the stretch and have had huge impacts on their team. Nelson has 6 more TDs and an 18.7 YPC. Cruz has more yards, TDs and catches. And he's been huge for the Giants. Cruz is a major reason why they even have a chance at the playoffs right now. Jennings is a better WR than Nelson (maybe? barely? he's getting that good), but Nelson has been there are year long. And the TDs ... I just can't ignore that (2nd in the NFC).


Bushrod? Because he plays for the Saints? The player is mediocre.

jsagan77
12-27-2011, 09:21 PM
The probowl is a joke. No London Fletcher = epick ******* fial

ShutDwn
12-27-2011, 09:44 PM
QBs throwing at Gamble had a rating of 48.4, second only to Revis' 45.4.

Of course, most of the time QBs didn't need to throw at Gamble, but the dude gave up hardly anything all year. I don't see how Tillman could have had a better year, but he is a good players so at least he deserves it from a career perspective.

Caulibflower
12-27-2011, 09:55 PM
OK. After my initial, annual disgusted reaction has worn off somewhat, the only snub I'll maintain is a serious error is Adrian Wilson over Kam Chancellor. Chancellor has way more tackles, 6 forced turnovers to Wilson's 2, (INTs and FFs), and a sack. They're similar types of players, in that they're both huge, hard-hitting (Kam hits harder) strong safeties who can make plays in coverage. No disrespect to Adrian Wilson, but Kam had a better year. He had a better year than Polamalu, for that matter. Kam might've been the best strong safety in the NFL this year. And I don't think I'll keep posting about this, but as someone who watched the Seahawks play every week I can with a lot of confidence say that Kam Chancellor was playing at an elite level this season on a good defense, and by pretty much any criteria you can think of looks like a headliner snub to me.

FWIW, I'd be happier if he'd made it instead of Earl Thomas; not just being grumpy because more Seahawks didn't make it. Kam deserved a starting NFC spot.

keylime_5
12-27-2011, 10:06 PM
yeah i forgot about Gamble too. definitely a major snub. he had an outstanding year.

BaLLiN
12-27-2011, 10:19 PM
Saints that probably should have made it in my opinion:

Roman Harper and Jabari Greer. Greer continues to be one of the most upper echelon CBs in the league and yet lacks a lot of recognition for his fantastic play. Also, a case could be made for Malcolm Jenkins too.

Harper seemed to be everywhere, doesn't he have a ridiculous number of sacks? I didn't really pay attention to Greer. Malcolm Jenkins definitely deserves at least an alternate.

Haden and Malcolm Jenkins got snubbed. It's a shame that there wasn't room for Victor Cruz either, but can't really argue him over the guys they put on there.

If this were baseball's all-star voting procedure then a lot of deserving guys like Charles Tillman and Derrick Johnson and Justin Smith wouldn't have made it. Tip of the hat to the NFL for having an excellent pro bowl voting process.

Victor Cruz should have made it. Is he an alternate? anyone know?

Giantsfan1080
12-27-2011, 10:38 PM
Harper seemed to be everywhere, doesn't he have a ridiculous number of sacks? I didn't really pay attention to Greer. Malcolm Jenkins definitely deserves at least an alternate.



Victor Cruz should have made it. Is he an alternate? anyone know?

2nd alternate.

XxXdragonXxX
12-27-2011, 11:04 PM
OK. After my initial, annual disgusted reaction has worn off somewhat, the only snub I'll maintain is a serious error is Adrian Wilson over Kam Chancellor. Chancellor has way more tackles, 6 forced turnovers to Wilson's 2, (INTs and FFs), and a sack. They're similar types of players, in that they're both huge, hard-hitting (Kam hits harder) strong safeties who can make plays in coverage. No disrespect to Adrian Wilson, but Kam had a better year. He had a better year than Polamalu, for that matter. Kam might've been the best strong safety in the NFL this year. And I don't think I'll keep posting about this, but as someone who watched the Seahawks play every week I can with a lot of confidence say that Kam Chancellor was playing at an elite level this season on a good defense, and by pretty much any criteria you can think of looks like a headliner snub to me.

FWIW, I'd be happier if he'd made it instead of Earl Thomas; not just being grumpy because more Seahawks didn't make it. Kam deserved a starting NFC spot.

Yeah, I think Kam deserves it more than Ealr (Earl was very good but Kam was everywhere.) However they separate FS from SS so, Kam wouldn't be able to replace him.

But according to Mike Florio in this article, here (http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/12/27/seahawks-have-five-pro-bowl-alternates/), it looks lime Browner and Lynch are going to be playing in the pro-bowl, and Michael Robinson will also if the Packers go to the Superbowl. Kam needs Wilson to sit out. Jon Ryan is a 3rd alternate as well.

LonghornsLegend
12-27-2011, 11:34 PM
I hope Stafford throws for 400 yards and 5 TD's this week. Just so it would be the most ridiculous season ever that didn't make the Pro Bowl.

Hines
12-27-2011, 11:38 PM
Ben and Wallace are deserving guys to go. I have no gripes about that.

Pouncey hasn't played as well as he did last year, but with some many ******* injuries on the OL, it is expected that he doesn't play better than last year.

Troy made it based on being Troy. As long as he and Reed are in the NFL, no one else is going to start at safety.

I'm glad that Antonio Brown got some love as a returner. Dude is so explosive.


Ryan Clark, LaMarr Woodley, James Harrison, and Ike Taylor were all guys who would have been good options too.


Woodley and/or Harrison would probably be certain if they were never hurt IMO.

Ness
12-28-2011, 12:53 AM
Why the **** is Rivers on the roster , really people ? He had a up and down season not even worth a pro bowl type QB. Just so wrong . Where is Tebow ?

Why would Tebow be at the Pro Bowl? He's a terrible quarterback.

bearsfan_51
12-28-2011, 12:55 AM
5 players is too many for the Bears, but nobody got it that really didn't deserve it. It's nice that Tillman finally made one. He's had a nice career and deserved it at some point.

noondog
12-28-2011, 07:27 AM
Stafford's snub is a ******* travesty. That is all.

Edit: I sit corrected...that isn't all. Stafford didn't even make it as 1st alternate. THAT is a joke. What does dude have to do?

Rant now complete.

K Train
12-28-2011, 08:15 AM
Ben and Wallace are deserving guys to go. I have no gripes about that.

Pouncey hasn't played as well as he did last year, but with some many ******* injuries on the OL, it is expected that he doesn't play better than last year.

Troy made it based on being Troy. As long as he and Reed are in the NFL, no one else is going to start at safety.

I'm glad that Antonio Brown got some love as a returner. Dude is so explosive.


Ryan Clark, LaMarr Woodley, James Harrison, and Ike Taylor were all guys who would have been good options too.


Woodley and/or Harrison would probably be certain if they were never hurt IMO.

ryan clark? lol


brown getting in was awesome, he deserves it....pouncey played great all year with what hes had to work with to his left and right.

Larry
12-28-2011, 08:43 AM
Surprised London fletcher didn't get in behind Willis.

Nalej
12-28-2011, 08:46 AM
I thought McKnight would make it in as KR.
Wasn't he avg'ing over 40 YPR? I haven't seen his updated stats.
Maybe he's declined, I guess.

jth1331
12-28-2011, 08:47 AM
Guys who made it on name recognition ...

Champ Bailey. We get it. He's a Hall of Famer. Enough.


Champ was excellent this year, give me a break he wasn't deserving.

Hines
12-28-2011, 09:08 AM
ryan clark? lol


brown getting in was awesome, he deserves it....pouncey played great all year with what hes had to work with to his left and right.

Clark has been very solid IMO. I believe he should be replaced very quickly by a young FA, Cortez Allen, or a rookie, but he's had a good season IMO.

K Train
12-28-2011, 09:12 AM
clark has been losing a lot of time to allen already....which is a good thing, in any N/D packages we are seeing more and more of allen.

clark hasnt been awful, but hes a FAR cry from a pro bowler. ike kinda got snubbed though

Hines
12-28-2011, 09:16 AM
clark has been losing a lot of time to allen already....which is a good thing, in any N/D packages we are seeing more and more of allen.

clark hasnt been awful, but hes a FAR cry from a pro bowler. ike kinda got snubbed though

Ike should have been to a lot of Pro Bowl's in his career. If he were able to catch the damn ball, he'd in Hawaii a lot.

JBCX
12-28-2011, 09:58 AM
Profootballfocus just put up an excellent article on who they feel are the undeserving Pro Bowlers this year:

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/12/28/pro-bowl-the-undeserving/

Tops on their list are Maurkice Pouncey (who isn't even the best Pouncey), John Kuhn, and Davin Joseph (who has a negative grade from PFF), and BJ Raji (who is one of the worst rated 3-4 NTs in the league this year).

Interesting take on this stuff.

CDCB14
12-28-2011, 10:03 AM
Charles Woodson is borderline awful, but has 7 picks and a big name. It makes me sick that he is in the pro-bowl. Go ahead and neg rep me packers fans, but he is a top 5 overrated player in the league and it's unarguable.

I'll beat him deep in 1 on 1 coverage. I'd be surprised if his 40 time was under 5 right now. He's so slow lol

AntoinCD
12-28-2011, 11:09 AM
Profootballfocus just put up an excellent article on who they feel are the undeserving Pro Bowlers this year:

http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/12/28/pro-bowl-the-undeserving/

Tops on their list are Maurkice Pouncey (who isn't even the best Pouncey), John Kuhn, and Davin Joseph (who has a negative grade from PFF), and BJ Raji (who is one of the worst rated 3-4 NTs in the league this year).

Interesting take on this stuff.

I am in no way the biggest fan of PFF but you have to recognise the work they put in. However when they stated Vince Wilfork wasn't deserving I nearly punched my computer. Wilfork for my money has had his best year ever. He is the one player on the Pats defense who has to be accounted for by more than one player on every snap. Plus he has also made more big plays this year than he ever has.

Not only is he still a dominant run defender but he has started to collapse the pocket as well and as some QBs have found, you just can't throw on him. Shutdown NT!!!

keylime_5
12-28-2011, 11:26 AM
I don't think any of those Packers defenders deserved a berth this year, they got in on name alone pretty much. but that's how the pro bowls have always been.

I'm surprised that no Texan OLinemen got into the pro bowl. They had pretty obviously the best offensive line play this season.

K Train
12-28-2011, 12:47 PM
Tops on their list are Maurkice Pouncey (who isn't even the best Pouncey)

so wrong it makes me sick....after a brilliant year in 2010 pouncey still played great minus colon, starks, and flozell on the oline. kemoeatu is pathetic at LG, just absolutely terrible (he used to be marginally serviceable) but the roation of jonathan scott, trai essex, doug legursky, and ramon foster makes me wonder how the hell the steelers are a playoff team.

pouncey is a shining star of sexual magic right smack in the middle of pure **** (except gilbert, but he hasnt played all year)

georgiafan
12-28-2011, 12:50 PM
Stafford not making it is a real snub hopefully he gets in before its all over with.

LonghornsLegend
12-28-2011, 12:54 PM
Stafford's snub is a ******* travesty. That is all.

Edit: I sit corrected...that isn't all. Stafford didn't even make it as 1st alternate. THAT is a joke. What does dude have to do?

Rant now complete.

May very well be the only time ever a QB throws 40 TD's and doesn't sniff the Pro Bowl.

Ness
12-28-2011, 01:02 PM
Too bad Bowman didn't make it. He was having a great season along with Patrick Willis.

CDCB14
12-28-2011, 01:17 PM
I really think they need to expand the pro-bowl roster. 43 guys? A real team roster is 53, and so many more guys are deserving. Not to mention the fan voting is held from weeks 6-14, which is one of the dumbest concepts possible. It's a terrible system.

Raiderz4Life
12-28-2011, 02:38 PM
I know i'm late but...Rivers?? Seriously??? Rivers has been **** this year.

K Train
12-28-2011, 02:42 PM
Too bad Bowman didn't make it. He was having a great season along with Patrick Willis.

you could pretty much say ___insert MLB__ was having a great season along with Patrick Willis

i cant believe brooks got in over smith though

Halsey
12-28-2011, 02:42 PM
Matt Ryan and Stafford both can be argued as more deserving than Eli. Playing in New York and having the credibility of a Super Bowl ring is what got Eli in.

Raiderz4Life
12-28-2011, 02:47 PM
I wouldn't put Ryan over Eli....Stafford maybe.

Giantsfan1080
12-28-2011, 02:53 PM
Why playing in New York? Eli finished 5th in fan voting for NFC QB's. The players and coaches got him in which has nothing to do with NY. Good try though.

Halsey
12-28-2011, 02:57 PM
Ryan has more wins, more TDs and fewer INTs than Eli. Ryan also doesn't have any complete disaster games like Eli had vs Washington a couple of weeks ago.

Brodeur
12-28-2011, 02:57 PM
Matt Ryan and Stafford both can be argued as more deserving than Eli. Playing in New York and having the credibility of a Super Bowl ring is what got Eli in.

Matt Ryan is not arguably more deserving than Eli.

Shane P. Hallam
12-28-2011, 02:57 PM
I know i'm late but...Rivers?? Seriously??? Rivers has been **** this year.

Tell me who you'd put over him and I'll take it, but Rivers is the 3rd best QB in the AFC and has had the 3rd best year looking from an unbias perspective. He has been more efficient than Dalton and thrown for 1,200 yards more. Despite the hype, Tebow doesn't hold a candle to Rivers. No one else.

Halsey
12-28-2011, 03:00 PM
Matt Ryan is not arguably more deserving than Eli.

Ryan has more wins, more TDs and fewer INTs than Eli. Ryan also doesn't have any complete disaster games like Eli had vs Washington a couple of weeks ago.

Seems like an argument to me. Arguing Eli over Ryan is based on reputation, not on field performance.

Brodeur
12-28-2011, 03:03 PM
Seems like an argument to me. Arguing Eli over Ryan is based on reputation, not on field performance.

Wins are completely irrelevant, their TDs are virtually the same so it's pointless to argue on that merit, and the 4 INTs aren't that big of a deal. Matt Ryan played a horrific game against the Texans, so I'm pretty sure that counts as a disaster game.

The massive difference in yards and yards per attempt pretty much cancel out everything else between Ryan and Eli, because it's pretty marginal otherwise. I still think Stafford should make it over both, but whatever.

Saints-Tigers
12-28-2011, 03:04 PM
Doesn't matter, because Stafford was light years better than Ryan. Ryan isn't in the discussion.

Halsey
12-28-2011, 03:08 PM
Wins are completely irrelevant.

lol...no. So if a QB for an 0-16 team had great stats, you'd vote him in?

Doesn't matter, because Stafford was light years better than Ryan. Ryan isn't in the discussion.

He wasn't light years better when they faced each other.

PackerLegend
12-28-2011, 03:10 PM
Charles Woodson is borderline awful, but has 7 picks and a big name. It makes me sick that he is in the pro-bowl. Go ahead and neg rep me packers fans, but he is a top 5 overrated player in the league and it's unarguable.

I'll beat him deep in 1 on 1 coverage. I'd be surprised if his 40 time was under 5 right now. He's so slow lol

Wait what.... Boderline awful? You have got to be kidding me. Yea he isnt the same shutdown corner anymore but at 35 what do you expect. The dude still makes tons of plays. For being borderline awful I think myself and most Packer fans would agree losing him on D would be a huge blow.

Saints-Tigers
12-28-2011, 03:14 PM
lol...no. So if a QB for an 0-16 team had great stats, you'd vote him in?



He wasn't light years better when they faced each other.

Well, since Matt Ryan's man defense was on display that game, I guess we'll give him the nod.

prock
12-28-2011, 03:18 PM
He wasn't light years better when they faced each other.

They played each other? Did Ryan play defense? Did Stafford? How they played against each other has no more meaning than any other game. I don't understand how head-to-head for quarterbacks is relevant.

Brodeur
12-28-2011, 03:21 PM
lol...no. So if a QB for an 0-16 team had great stats, you'd vote him in?



He wasn't light years better when they faced each other.

Comparing an 8-7 QB to a 9-6 QB is extremely pointless in terms of wins. And neither had a good game when they faced each other, so who gives a ****.

Raiderz4Life
12-28-2011, 03:23 PM
Tell me who you'd put over him and I'll take it, but Rivers is the 3rd best QB in the AFC and has had the 3rd best year looking from an unbias perspective. He has been more efficient than Dalton and thrown for 1,200 yards more. Despite the hype, Tebow doesn't hold a candle to Rivers. No one else.

Meh guess you're right. I think he's just lucky Schaub got hurt.

Ryan has more wins, more TDs and fewer INTs than Eli. Ryan also doesn't have any complete disaster games like Eli had vs Washington a couple of weeks ago.

Did you miss the first half of the season? Ryan had a few disaster games.

Saints-Tigers
12-28-2011, 03:24 PM
Matt Ryan's name even being discussed is laughable at this point with Stafford left out.

Halsey
12-28-2011, 03:24 PM
Stop trying to steer me into an argument of Stafford vs Ryan. That debate will be resolved in the NFC Championship Game.

Saints-Tigers
12-28-2011, 03:25 PM
This isn't an argument, Stafford was way better...stop pretending it's a choice.

Halsey
12-28-2011, 03:26 PM
[QUOTE=raiderz4life;2803100
Did you miss the first half of the season? Ryan had a few disaster games.[/QUOTE]

Name them.

georgiafan
12-28-2011, 03:38 PM
I'm a big fan of Stafford and Ryan both for obvious reasons and Stafford should be in the pro bowl over Ryan.

Raiderz4Life
12-28-2011, 03:40 PM
Name them.

Week 1, 3, and 5 were very very poor showings by Ryan.

Halsey
12-28-2011, 03:43 PM
Week 1, 3, and 5 were very very poor showings by Ryan.

None of those were great games, but they weren't on the level of the stinker Eli had vs Washington.

Bulldogs
12-28-2011, 03:52 PM
This isn't an argument, Stafford was way better...stop pretending it's a choice.

Honest question. Will you ever give Matt Ryan props for his play? I understand you are a rival fan, but regardless of how well he plays it's not good enough for you apparently. I've never heard you say one positive thing about him.

As for the pro bowl, the only Falcon snub IMO but Sean Weatherspoon. Brent Grimes would have had an argument had he stayed healthy, and Matt Ryan played fantastic but there was great competition at QB in the NFC. Had we been an AFC team, Matt Ryan would unquestionably get the 3rd spot this year over Rivers. I think Stafford earned the 3rd spot in the NFC this year, but I don't think it's as far ahead of Manning, Ryan, and Romo in deserving that spot as some people think.

LonghornsLegend
12-28-2011, 03:52 PM
Matt Ryan's name even being discussed is laughable at this point with Stafford left out.

Yea, that's like a waste of space at this point. Let's be serious here.

Saints-Tigers
12-28-2011, 04:22 PM
Honest question. Will you ever give Matt Ryan props for his play? I understand you are a rival fan, but regardless of how well he plays it's not good enough for you apparently. I've never heard you say one positive thing about him.

As for the pro bowl, the only Falcon snub IMO but Sean Weatherspoon. Brent Grimes would have had an argument had he stayed healthy, and Matt Ryan played fantastic but there was great competition at QB in the NFC. Had we been an AFC team, Matt Ryan would unquestionably get the 3rd spot this year over Rivers. I think Stafford earned the 3rd spot in the NFC this year, but I don't think it's as far ahead of Manning, Ryan, and Romo in deserving that spot as some people think.


What is there to say? As long as Ryan keeps getting compared to vastly superior QBs, there is nothing for me good to say. Why would I say he deserves to be compared to guys he doesn't? He's not an elite QB, has never played like one, and really has 0 excuses for that.

If Ryan ever elevated his game to the level of his media hype, then he'd get the props he deserves.

I could lie to you and tell you that I think he's a great QB, or that he "just wins" or whatever, but he puts 0 fear into me as a rival fan, and gets way more credit than he deserves, and has been way over hyped basically since day 1.

You can make this a "rival" thing, but that's a cop out. Roddy White is a rival, and a moronic douchebag.... but I'd love to have him, and he plays at an elite level.

Ness
12-28-2011, 04:34 PM
you could pretty much say ___insert MLB__ was having a great season along with Patrick Willis

i cant believe brooks got in over smith though

Brooks? Who are you talking about?

Ness
12-28-2011, 04:35 PM
Peter King brought up an interesting point. No one from the Houston Texans offensive line was selected to the Pro Bowl. Personally I think they have the best offensive line in the NFL. Very surprised that not one guy was selected.

K Train
12-28-2011, 04:38 PM
Brooks? Who are you talking about?

ahmad brooks was named an alternate, over aldon smith?

K Train
12-28-2011, 04:39 PM
Peter King brought up an interesting point. No one from the Houston Texans offensive line was selected to the Pro Bowl. Personally I think they have the best offensive line in the NFL. Very surprised that not one guy was selected.

they have the best unit i would agree...far cry from where they were 5 years ago, but who would you select? its not like any of them are super studs.

Ness
12-28-2011, 04:48 PM
ahmad brooks was named an alternate, over aldon smith?

He was? I didn't see that earlier. Or rather, the other day. Interesting. He's kind of slowed down on the sacks as of late though. Still gets a good amount of pressure.

Shane P. Hallam
12-28-2011, 04:48 PM
they have the best unit i would agree...far cry from where they were 5 years ago, but who would you select? its not like any of them are super studs.

Duane Brown hasn't allowed a sack all year and Chris Myers had the best season for a center. I'd take those two.

Ness
12-28-2011, 04:49 PM
they have the best unit i would agree...far cry from where they were 5 years ago, but who would you select? its not like any of them are super studs.

I think Eric Winston should have been considered at least. Or Duane Brown and Chris Myers.

K Train
12-28-2011, 04:52 PM
Duane Brown hasn't allowed a sack all year and Chris Myers had the best season for a center. I'd take those two.

damn, once upon a time duane brown was a huge reach and a rotational LT cause he couldnt play a full game, then he was a serviceable starter, and now hes not allowing sacks....who woulda thought

J-Mike88
12-28-2011, 05:12 PM
Stafford is clearly the 3rd most deserving QB in the NFC for this season. It's not even close.

The debate is for the #4 position between Romo & Eli.
Then the #6 spot between a bunch of guys. Newton, Ryan, and Smith.
Interesting to speculate where Cutler would have been had he stayed healthy because he was on a roll.

I think with the east coast bias from the media voters, Eli would get the #3 anyway though.

Giantsfan1080
12-28-2011, 05:24 PM
Stafford is clearly the 3rd most deserving QB in the NFC for this season. It's not even close.

The debate is for the #4 position between Romo & Eli.
Then the #6 spot between a bunch of guys. Newton, Ryan, and Smith.
Interesting to speculate where Cutler would have been had he stayed healthy because he was on a roll.

I think with the east coast bias from the media voters, Eli would get the #3 anyway though.

Again the fans voted Eli 5th among NFC QB's so it was the players and coaches vote that got Eli in.

jth1331
12-28-2011, 08:08 PM
I think Stafford earned the 3rd spot in the NFC this year, but I don't think it's as far ahead of Manning, Ryan, and Romo in deserving that spot as some people think.


A QB who very well could end up with 40 TD's and 4800 yards with a 64% completion percentage is way far ahead of someone who's thrown less yards, less TD's and with an inferior completion percentage. Point blank.

Bulldogs
12-28-2011, 08:10 PM
A QB who very well could end up with 40 TD's and 4800 yards with a 64% completion percentage is way far ahead of someone who's thrown less yards, less TD's and with an inferior completion percentage. Point blank.

Let's not get into hypotheticals yet. Again, I agree Stafford is ahead of them and should have been the choice for the 3rd spot, let alone the Alternate.

J-Mike88
12-28-2011, 09:14 PM
Again the fans voted Eli 5th among NFC QB's so it was the players and coaches vote that got Eli in.
That's right. That's why I said the EC Bias from the MEDIA voters.
The fans were more accurate, unbiased.

Giantsfan1080
12-28-2011, 09:15 PM
That's right. That's why I said the EC Bias from the MEDIA voters.
The fans were more accurate, unbiased.

The media doesn't vote so I don't know what you're talking about. 1/3 fans, 1/3 players, and 1/3 coaches.

J-Mike88
12-28-2011, 09:35 PM
The media doesn't vote so I don't know what you're talking about. 1/3 fans, 1/3 players, and 1/3 coaches.
The fans got it right with him in 5th.... players and coaches were apparently swayed by the ESPN bandwagon moreso than the fans.

Good job us. Bad job coaches and players. I know the players hate Romo and think he's the most overrated player. Eli beat Romo with a great comeback, but their bodies of work favor Romo. But I can live with either.

Stafford clearly has been superior to them both this year. A shame. Who got 1st alternate because Brees or Rodgers should be busy and skipping the Pro Bowl "game".

Brodeur
12-28-2011, 09:38 PM
The fans got it right with him in 5th.... players and coaches were apparently swayed by the ESPN bandwagon moreso than the fans.

Good job us. Bad job coaches and players. I know the players hate Romo and think he's the most overrated player. Eli beat Romo with a great comeback, but their bodies of work favor Romo. But I can live with either.

Stafford clearly has been superior to them both this year. A shame. Who got 1st alternate because Brees or Rodgers should be busy and skipping the Pro Bowl "game".

Cam Newton is the first alternate, Romo is the second, and Stafford is the third. I don't know why or how, but whatever.

Smooth Criminal
12-30-2011, 08:22 AM
The Pro bowl doesnt matter. Chris Kemoeatu, steelers guard who was benched this year for being terrible, is an alternate. I highly doubt he even makes the team next year.

BloodBrother
12-30-2011, 08:38 AM
Cam Newton is the first alternate, Romo is the second, and Stafford is the third. I don't know why or how, but whatever.

haha 3rd alternate? God the Pro bowl is dumb(like pretty much every other all-star game for every other major sport)

J-Mike88
12-30-2011, 08:47 AM
Cam Newton is the first alternate, Romo is the second, and Stafford is the third. I don't know why or how, but whatever.
LMFAO.... wow. Reminds me of the days the safety Roy Williams was being named to the Pro Bowl.

LonghornsLegend
12-30-2011, 10:16 AM
Not only has Stafford performed better then Eli, Romo, & Newton, his team is in a better position then any of the others. Not like we can blame Detroit sucking for nobody knowing who he is. I thought he was firmly #3, but it's tough your first breakout year to get noticed the way you should. It's always been this way. Still makes no sense, but w/e.


I'm actually upset Cam & Stafford didn't make it, I like to see young guys get recognized for great seasons.

Caulibflower
12-30-2011, 02:16 PM
3rd spot should've gone to Cam or Stafford, I think. I don't mind Cam being over Stafford, but both of them should've been over Eli and Romo. That's just straight-up big market bias right there. I was thinning about that last night - the fact that the NFC East is pretty much the glamour division of the NFL. You're talking Dallas, Philadelphia, The Capitol and New York City. Any good quarterback playing well in those places is going to get overexposed and a ton of Pro Bowl votes.

Hurricanes25
12-30-2011, 02:19 PM
3rd spot should've gone to Cam or Stafford, I think. I don't mind Cam being over Stafford, but both of them should've been over Eli and Romo. That's just straight-up big market bias right there. I was thinning about that last night - the fact that the NFC East is pretty much the glamour division of the NFL. You're talking Dallas, Philadelphia, The Capitol and New York City. Any good quarterback playing well in those places is going to get overexposed and a ton of Pro Bowl votes.

There is no bias. Again, Eli was 5th in fan voting. The players and coaches had a lot to do with him getting in.

Caulibflower
12-30-2011, 02:43 PM
There is no bias. Again, Eli was 5th in fan voting. The players and coaches had a lot to do with him getting in.

oh, really? I missed that. I suppose that just says a lot about the difference in having to prepare for young players versus veteran players, and probably less about who's had more spectacular plays. Stafford and Newton have certainly been more fun to watch.

A Perfect Score
12-30-2011, 02:54 PM
Eli deserved to be in over Cam, but there's no way I'd put him in over Stafford personally. He's been stellar in the fourth quarter, but Stafford has outperformed him significantly in nearly every peripheral stat.

Stafford - 385/604, 63.7%, 4518 yds, 7.48 ypa, 36 TDs, 14 INTs 96.6 QBR
Eli - 335/556, 60.3%, 4580 yds, 8.25 ypa, 26 TDs, 16 INTs, 90.3 QBR

10 more TDs for Stafford, less INTs, team already in the playoffs...Boom.

Go_Eagles77
12-30-2011, 03:01 PM
Eli deserved to be in over Cam, but there's no way I'd put him in over Stafford personally. He's been stellar in the fourth quarter, but Stafford has outperformed him significantly in nearly every peripheral stat.

Stafford - 385/604, 63.7%, 4518 yds, 7.48 ypa, 36 TDs, 14 INTs 96.6 QBR
Eli - 335/556, 60.3%, 4580 yds, 8.25 ypa, 26 TDs, 16 INTs, 90.3 QBR

10 more TDs for Stafford, less INTs, team already in the playoffs...Boom.

I really have no idea how this is even a discussion. Eli has impressed me at times this season, but Stafford just deserves it more.

LonghornsLegend
12-30-2011, 03:05 PM
3rd spot should've gone to Cam or Stafford, I think. I don't mind Cam being over Stafford, but both of them should've been over Eli and Romo. That's just straight-up big market bias right there. I was thinning about that last night - the fact that the NFC East is pretty much the glamour division of the NFL. You're talking Dallas, Philadelphia, The Capitol and New York City. Any good quarterback playing well in those places is going to get overexposed and a ton of Pro Bowl votes.


With all that said, let's not act like it was a travesty here. Eli does have a team who has a chance to win the division, and he may still throw for more yards then Stafford. The TD difference is huge sure, some of that is Calvin who can get 15 by himself, and alot of it is Stafford has thrown the ball nearly 60 times more then Eli.


Granted it's a give and take, because 60 more throws means more INT chances, lower completion percentage, etc, but he'd also have a good shot at 5k yards. Eli had a great year, he'll only finish a few hundred yards behind the *old* Marino passing record.


Sorry but that's not big market bias, I have already said no way Stafford shouldn't have gotten in but let's not make it into something it's not. There was some really good NFC QB play this year, not so much in the AFC. Just the way it ended up. Romo, Cam, & Stafford could have and likely would have been the 2nd and 3rd QB's in the AFC and 1st alternate. Everyone can't go man.

Giantsfan1080
12-30-2011, 03:22 PM
As a Giants fan I would have had no problem with Stafford in over Eli. After that I would have took Eli over the others though like Ryan, Romo, and Newton.

NY+Giants=NYG
12-31-2011, 10:44 AM
With all that said, let's not act like it was a travesty here. Eli does have a team who has a chance to win the division, and he may still throw for more yards then Stafford. The TD difference is huge sure, some of that is Calvin who can get 15 by himself, and alot of it is Stafford has thrown the ball nearly 60 times more then Eli.


Granted it's a give and take, because 60 more throws means more INT chances, lower completion percentage, etc, but he'd also have a good shot at 5k yards. Eli had a great year, he'll only finish a few hundred yards behind the *old* Marino passing record.


Sorry but that's not big market bias, I have already said no way Stafford shouldn't have gotten in but let's not make it into something it's not. There was some really good NFC QB play this year, not so much in the AFC. Just the way it ended up. Romo, Cam, & Stafford could have and likely would have been the 2nd and 3rd QB's in the AFC and 1st alternate. Everyone can't go man.




Well said. Big market bias is utter non sense! Eli was 5th in the NFC in fan voting! Meaning the 2/3 from coaches and players got him in. So the people in the industry voted him in! He did a lot with very little this year. Injuries and no running game what so ever, which is a big deal since we are a running team who controls the TOP.

I am glad people in the industry gave Eli his props this year.

jsagan77
12-31-2011, 05:43 PM
Manning got in because his last name is Manning. No way should he be in over Stafford no matter how you spin it.

Ness
12-31-2011, 06:01 PM
Manning in over Stafford isn't that big of a deal like everyone is trying to make it. At least up to this point. If Stafford has another lights out game and Manning has another poor one, then maybe it tilts a little more in his favor, but it's not that big of a deal. Manning has also had a great season especially in the fourth quarter and that Giants team is nothing without him. I think a lot of folks are looking at the touchdowns that Stafford has thrown and having a knee jerk reaction. Manning does have a high YPA with fewer attempts overall. Not to mention 6 game winning drives this season. Not saying that Stafford doesn't deserve to go to the Pro Bowl, but it's not a travesty that Eli is going instead of him. And all of this "it's not even close" mantra folks are trying to spin here is absurd.

Nalej
12-31-2011, 06:51 PM
If any of the AFC QBs bail out, Stafford should get first dibs over the rest of the other AFC QBs.
It's only fair.

jsagan77
01-01-2012, 03:55 PM
Stafford now has over 5000 yards and 41 TD's and is an alternate to the Pro Bowl? What a joke. I live in Honolulu and I may just boycot going...

NY+Giants=NYG
01-01-2012, 03:56 PM
Manning in over Stafford isn't that big of a deal like everyone is trying to make it. At least up to this point. If Stafford has another lights out game and Manning has another poor one, then maybe it tilts a little more in his favor, but it's not that big of a deal. Manning has also had a great season especially in the fourth quarter and that Giants team is nothing without him. I think a lot of folks are looking at the touchdowns that Stafford has thrown and having a knee jerk reaction. Manning does have a high YPA with fewer attempts overall. Not to mention 6 game winning drives this season. Not saying that Stafford doesn't deserve to go to the Pro Bowl, but it's not a travesty that Eli is going instead of him. And all of this "it's not even close" mantra folks are trying to spin here is absurd.

Exactly! It's not like We, the fans, in NY voted him in. Eli was 5th in fan voting in the NFC! Players and coaches have more respect for manning and what he is doing than with Stafford.

We have no superstars on offense, and still manage to do ok. People seem to forget we are a running team! RUNNING TEAM who can't run the ball. We are dead LAST!

I am glad Eli got his props for once. Let the kid pay his dues!

If you want to be mad, be mad that the fans voted Cam ahead of Stafford! Be mad that Cruz got shafted and didn't make it.

Leon Sandcastle
01-01-2012, 04:02 PM
Stafford finishes with 41 TD's, 16 INT's and over 5000 yards passing. WOW!

CJSchneider
01-01-2012, 04:05 PM
Since when did Tampa Bay start wearing these?



http://allinio.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/dnr.jpg

jsagan77
01-01-2012, 04:07 PM
Exactly! It's not like We, the fans, in NY voted him in. Eli was 5th in fan voting in the NFC! Players and coaches have more respect for manning and what he is doing than with Stafford.

We have no superstars on offense, and still manage to do ok. People seem to forget we are a running team! RUNNING TEAM who can't run the ball. We are dead LAST!

I am glad Eli got his props for once. Let the kid pay his dues!

If you want to be mad, be mad that the fans voted Cam ahead of Stafford! Be mad that Cruz got shafted and didn't make it.

You don't think Nicks is a superstar? Cruz was also pretty good.

CashmoneyDrew
01-01-2012, 04:11 PM
Stafford now has over 5000 yards and 41 TD's and is an alternate to the Pro Bowl? What a joke. I live in Honolulu and I may just boycot going...

/humblebrag

NY+Giants=NYG
01-01-2012, 04:17 PM
You don't think Nicks is a superstar? Cruz was also pretty good.

Nicks a superstar?! LOL. In what sport is this? Does he play another sport I am aware of? Have you seen Nicks play? He is a good player who is inconsistent! Dude has brain farts where he drops passes where he is WIDE open!

Cruz was a 2nd year player who was undrafted. With Eli helping him, he became VERY productive. Same with our TE Ballard!

Notice something.. Players come and go, we have 1 QB, and still we are productive. I'd love a MEGATRON! Give me a Roddy White or Julio Jones with the greatest TE ever to play! Then let's see what happens. We are a running team which is something I hate. We don't run up the score, when at the goal line we run the ball.

Notice this..

Burress, Toomer, Shockey, Boss, Smith.... ALL GONE!

Ballard, Nicks, Mario M, and Cruz, and still we produce. That's because Eli raises the game of EVERYONE around him, which is why Accorsi had a hard on for him when he scouted him. That's in his book. He loved how he raised the game of avg people and made them better.

Our running game is dead last, and our OL stinks!

I respect what Stafford has done. But again, we didn't vote him in. Players and coaches did, and obviously they thought how I did. Stafford will get in the pro bowl in his career. Megatron will continue to develop and they will be special.

For us, players on offense come and go. Maybe one day we can get a new system where we can throw 1 yard TDs and pad our stats.

Hines
01-01-2012, 05:47 PM
The Pro bowl doesnt matter. Chris Kemoeatu, steelers guard who was benched this year for being terrible, is an alternate. I highly doubt he even makes the team next year.

He won't have the chance to make the team next year.

jsagan77
01-01-2012, 06:02 PM
Nicks was a first round pick and Manningham was highly regarded in college and could have been a higher pick if he didn't have injury concerns. Cruz was a nice find by your scouting team. Just because you guys think you all are a running team doesn't mean you are. I'd say ya'll run a balanced offense. You can win games either way. I'm not trying to take away anything from Eli, he's had a good year, but Stafford threw for over 5000 yards and 41 TD's. Come on man...

Nicks a superstar?! LOL. In what sport is this? Does he play another sport I am aware of? Have you seen Nicks play? He is a good player who is inconsistent! Dude has brain farts where he drops passes where he is WIDE open!

Cruz was a 2nd year player who was undrafted. With Eli helping him, he became VERY productive. Same with our TE Ballard!

Notice something.. Players come and go, we have 1 QB, and still we are productive. I'd love a MEGATRON! Give me a Roddy White or Julio Jones with the greatest TE ever to play! Then let's see what happens. We are a running team which is something I hate. We don't run up the score, when at the goal line we run the ball.

Notice this..

Burress, Toomer, Shockey, Boss, Smith.... ALL GONE!

Ballard, Nicks, Mario M, and Cruz, and still we produce. That's because Eli raises the game of EVERYONE around him, which is why Accorsi had a hard on for him when he scouted him. That's in his book. He loved how he raised the game of avg people and made them better.

Our running game is dead last, and our OL stinks!

I respect what Stafford has done. But again, we didn't vote him in. Players and coaches did, and obviously they thought how I did. Stafford will get in the pro bowl in his career. Megatron will continue to develop and they will be special.

For us, players on offense come and go. Maybe one day we can get a new system where we can throw 1 yard TDs and pad our stats.

Caulibflower
01-01-2012, 08:34 PM
Greg Jennings should just volunteer his spot to Victor Cruz. And he should tip his hat.

BaLLiN
01-02-2012, 02:45 AM
Greg Jennings should just volunteer his spot to Victor Cruz. And he should tip his hat.

Cruz deserves it, I understand that maybe Jennings deserves credit for being a dominant player/very good player, but Cruz's season is very special. You don't have the highlights that he has created every year, maybe not even in your whole career. And he is without a doubt doing this while the defense is focusing on him, so its not like he is playing second fiddle to Nicks (who does usually draw the double coverage).

I am sorry if it homerish, but I feel Cruz deserves it more, heck Nelson deserves it more than Jennings too.