PDA

View Full Version : Week 17 - Packers vs. Lions


princefielder28
01-01-2012, 12:34 PM
shaky start with Pat Lee returning kicks

one thing I don't understand is why guys like Jermichael, BJ and Bishop are seeing so much action early on and why they aren't kinda clumped in with the inactive guys as people you wanna keep on the sidelines...hopefully it's just to get them some reps and they'll be pulled later on

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 01:09 PM
Morgan Burnett has had a strong game so far

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 01:19 PM
Ryan Grant has shown far more burst in the second half of the season

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 03:40 PM
Matt Flynn...

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 03:48 PM
it was like watching a video game

BloodBrother
01-01-2012, 03:58 PM
but, but the media said that when the weather gets cold in GB they wouldn't be able to throw the ball around like they have all year? It was cold, snowy and very windy today and neither QB had trouble throwing it

does this mean...the media was WRONG? Say it ain't so


haha that game was fun to watch.

PackerLegend
01-01-2012, 04:00 PM
game was amazing! Matt ******* Flynn baby. I cant wait to see him get his shot elsewhere. I have high hopes he wont be another Cassell.

So happy to beat those punk Lions. keep that streak n lambeau alive.

BloodBrother
01-01-2012, 04:07 PM
he can go and become another cassel, I don't care. I just hope the packers tag him and trade him for something good in return. We saw what the Cards gave up for Kolb's crappy ass

J-Mike88
01-01-2012, 04:41 PM
Holy Matt ******* Flynn!

Now, how do we cash him in like Atlanta did for Schaub and Philly for Korn on the Kolb?

Flynn has shown as much as those 2 guys have!
Today was ALL-TIME RECORD-SETTING. Outdoors.

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 05:39 PM
If we did franchise Flynn how much could we get for him? A second or is that too high?

J-Mike88
01-01-2012, 05:55 PM
We need 2 teams to want Flynn, which is REALISTIC.

We know about what contract terms those teams might be willing to give him, so we should sign him to that.... and then trade him for the team offering us the most. Is it not that simple?

How about either of these:
Flynn & Hawk for Brian Orakpo?
Flynn for Dumervil?
Flynn for Cleveland's 2nd rounder and 3rd next year?

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:03 PM
We need 2 teams to want Flynn, which is REALISTIC.

We know about what contract terms those teams might be willing to give him, so we should sign him to that.... and then trade him for the team offering us the most. Is it not that simple?

How about either of these:
Flynn & Hawk for Brian Orakpo?
Flynn for Dumervil?
Flynn for Cleveland's 2nd rounder and 3rd next year?

sign and trades don't happen in the NFL; it's not like the NBA where a player's current team has the ability to offer them more money...Flynn will hit the free agent market and he will go to the place where he gets the most money...and we're not gonna franchise him, that'll go to Finley

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 06:07 PM
sign and trades don't happen in the NFL; it's not like the NBA where a player's current team has the ability to offer them more money...Flynn will hit the free agent market and he will go to the place where he gets the most money...and we're not gonna franchise him, that'll go to Finley

1st round pick or 2nd round pick+ is worth a lot more than a year of Finley

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:15 PM
1st round pick or 2nd round pick+ is worth a lot more than a year of Finley

what leverage do the Packers have? pay 15 million dollars for a backup? if teams can't get Matt Flynn on the free agent market they will probably invest a pick on a quarterback or wait a year and build up the team if they really have that much interest in him

given the dollars and potential picks required I just don't see many teams willing to jump in on that

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 06:19 PM
Same could be said about Matt Cassel. And Matt Schuab and Kevin Kolb for that matter, even though they weren't franchised

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 06:22 PM
We need 2 teams to want Flynn, which is REALISTIC.

We know about what contract terms those teams might be willing to give him, so we should sign him to that.... and then trade him for the team offering us the most. Is it not that simple?

How about either of these:
Flynn & Hawk for Brian Orakpo?
Flynn for Dumervil?
Flynn for Cleveland's 2nd rounder and 3rd next year?

I would think trading for draft picks would be more likely. I could see a deal with the Redskins because they have a lot of picks. Other teams i think could be interested in Flynn would be:

Browns
Dolphins
Seahawks
Chiefs
Jets?
Broncos

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:24 PM
Same could be said about Matt Cassel. And Matt Schuab and Kevin Kolb for that matter, even though they weren't franchised

and how have those situations played out for those teams??? Schaub would be the only case deemed a success but it took a handful of years before they sniffed success and now he's out...and don't tell me Cassel has worked out because there's a good chance he's cut after this season

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 06:25 PM
what leverage do the Packers have? pay 15 million dollars for a backup? if teams can't get Matt Flynn on the free agent market they will probably invest a pick on a quarterback or wait a year and build up the team if they really have that much interest in him

given the dollars and potential picks required I just don't see many teams willing to jump in on that

But if more than one team wants him they would be in competition so would have to offer more than the other to get Flynn. This would drive his price up meaning i think we could get a 2nd round pick for him.

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 06:26 PM
and how have those situations played out for those teams??? Schaub would be the only case deemed a success but it took a handful of years before they sniffed success and now he's out...and don't tell me Cassel has worked out because there's a good chance he's cut after this season

Why does it matter how those situations have played out? Matt Flynn isnt Matt Cassel or Kevin Kolb is he?

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:26 PM
But if more than one team wants him they would be in competition so would have to offer more than the other to get Flynn. This would drive his price up meaning i think we could get a 2nd round pick for him.

so then I ask is a 2nd round pick (an unproven commodity) worth more to us than Jermichael Finley and assuring we have him???

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:28 PM
Why does it matter how those situations have played out? Matt Flynn isnt Matt Cassel or Kevin Kolb is he?

teams look at precedent...how often does investing a ton of money and high picks in a backup QB work out??

and the potential teams he'll go to have nowhere near the arsenal of talent at their disposal and that has to be taken into consideration too; how much does the talent on the Packers offense increase his productivity?

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 06:31 PM
and how have those situations played out for those teams??? Schaub would be the only case deemed a success but it took a handful of years before they sniffed success and now he's out...and don't tell me Cassel has worked out because there's a good chance he's cut after this season

Nothing you said here has any significance what so ever. It doesn't matter how it played out for them, that's irrelevant.

The point is, there's always going to be a team willing to give up a lot for a QB with potential.

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 06:38 PM
The point is, there's always going to be a team willing to give up a lot for a QB with potential.

^^^^^^^^^^^

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 06:41 PM
so then I ask is a 2nd round pick (an unproven commodity) worth more to us than Jermichael Finley and assuring we have him???
Yes. And it'd probably be more than just a 2nd round pick. Cassel got a 2nd round pick and a pro bowl DE. Kolb got a 2nd and a pro bowl CB. Schaub, the most similar situation got 2 seconds and a swap of the 10th pick to 8th overall. One year of Finley is not worth that.
teams look at precedent...how often does investing a ton of money and high picks in a backup QB work out??

and the potential teams he'll go to have nowhere near the arsenal of talent at their disposal and that has to be taken into consideration too; how much does the talent on the Packers offense increase his productivity?
The Cardinals did it just last year, so don't give me that crap. It doesn't matter.

And your last sentence is another irrelevant note. Any team that'd trade for him isn't just looking at his stats. They're going to watch a lot of film on him and scout him. He can make the throws and run an offense. That's more important than his productivity.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:42 PM
nevermind it was replied to

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:48 PM
Yes. And it'd probably be more than just a 2nd round pick. Cassel got a 2nd round pick and a pro bowl DE. Kolb got a 2nd and a pro bowl CB. Schaub, the most similar situation got 2 seconds and a swap of the 10th pick to 8th overall. One year of Finley is not worth that.

The Cardinals did it just last year, so don't give me that crap. It doesn't matter.

And your last sentence is another irrelevant note. Any team that'd trade for him isn't just looking at his stats. They're going to watch a lot of film on him and scout him. He can make the throws and run an offense. That's more important than his productivity.

And everybody but the Cardinals thought they were insane on what they gave up

and it does matter the personnel around a QB and should be taken into consideration...Flynn is playing with the best supporting cast in football!

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 06:49 PM
I will not deny that teams take chances on QBs with "potential" but from the Packers perspective is it worth trying to get something for Matt Flynn and letting Jermichael Finley walk???

Why cant we resign Finley? And anyway i'd say yes! This is apparently 'YOTTO 2.0', well if in 2 years of 'taking over' all he can do is drop ball after ball and moan about not getting it then quite frankly, i dont want him here.

BloodBrother
01-01-2012, 06:51 PM
Cassel was tagged with the understanding he would be traded. His contract was setup before the trade was finalized, hence not signing the tender.

There is a lot of work behind the scenes before it goes down. It isn't just "let's tag him" and hope it all works out.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:53 PM
Why cant we resign Finley? And anyway i'd say yes! This is apparently 'YOTTO 2.0', well if in 2 years of 'taking over' all he can do is drop ball after ball and moan about not getting it then quite frankly, i dont want him here.

Finley is going to look to get paid BIG and he's gonna wanna find out his market value, making franchise tag the only way to assure he returns next year

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 06:55 PM
And everybody but the Cardinals thought they were insane on what they gave up

and it does matter the personnel around a QB and should be taken into consideration...Flynn is playing with the best supporting cast in football!

All it takes is one team, and as I said earlier, there's always going to be a team willing to give up a lot for a QB with potential. And you have no idea what other teams were interested. Maybe everyone you know thought they were insane, but I'm pretty sure you don't know every GM. I bet there were multiple teams interested in Kolb, the Cardinals were just willing to give up more than the others.


And again, irrelevant. I already told you why.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 06:57 PM
All it takes is one team, and as I said earlier, there's always going to be a team willing to give up a lot for a QB with potential. And you have no idea what other teams were interested. Maybe everyone you know thought they were insane, but I'm pretty sure you don't know every GM. I bet there were multiple teams interested in Kolb, the Cardinals were just willing to give up more than the others.


And again, irrelevant. I already told you why.

How is it irrelevant who the quarterback's supporting cast is???

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 06:57 PM
Cassel was tagged with the understanding he would be traded. His contract was setup before the trade was finalized, hence not signing the tender.

There is a lot of work behind the scenes before it goes down. It isn't just "let's tag him" and hope it all works out.

Didn't you guys do the same thing with Corey Williams a few years back? I'm sure Ted Thompson is capable of getting it done.

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 07:00 PM
Finley is going to look to get paid BIG and he's gonna wanna find out his market value, making franchise tag the only way to assure he returns next year

We are the Green Bay Packers. We are not going to get bossed around by some big-headed, underachieving tight end.

We'll go into the meeting, offer Finley the maximum we want to pay him and then if he says no then let the f***** leave. No player is bigger than the franchise, Finley should be great full hes getting the chance to play for the Packers!

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 07:10 PM
How is it irrelevant who the quarterback's supporting cast is???
I already told you why.

But in case you missed it, here it is again.

And your last sentence is another irrelevant note. Any team that'd trade for him isn't just looking at his stats. They're going to watch a lot of film on him and scout him. He can make the throws and run an offense. That's more important than his productivity.

How is it relevant? If you take him off the Packers and put him on the Browns, yes, he'd be less productive. If you take Aaron Rodgers off the Packers and put him on the Browns he'd be less productive too. Irrelevant.

You're just harping on this note, because you're wrong and have nothing else to stand on.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 07:17 PM
But in case you missed it, here it is again.



How is it relevant? If you take him off the Packers and put him on the Browns, yes, he'd be less productive. If you take Aaron Rodgers off the Packers and put him on the Browns he'd be less productive too. Irrelevant.

You're just harping on this note, because you're wrong and have nothing else to stand on.

I'm not necessarily talking the numbers...is Matt Flynn a QB that makes the players around him better or is he the product of a system that is equipped with a plethora of options? Or to phrase it another way, is a team trading for a franchise quarterback? I don't know how you can say they are and that's what teams are looking for if they're going to invest as much in him as you suggest

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 07:22 PM
I'm not necessarily talking the numbers...is Matt Flynn a QB that makes the players around him better or is he the product of a system that is equipped with a plethora of options? Or to phrase it another way, is a team trading for a franchise quarterback? I don't know how you can say they are and that's what teams are looking for if they're going to invest as much in him as you suggest

If you're picking a QB in the draft during the second round you wont be drafting a 'franchise quarterback'. Who would you rather have, Colin Kaepernick or Matt Flynn? Ovbiously Matt Flynn which would mean Flynn is worth more than a early second round pick.

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 07:23 PM
Matt Cassel played in a damn good offense. That didn't prevent him from being traded for a nice haul. And again, say what you want about how he turned out, doesn't matter.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 07:41 PM
If you're picking a QB in the draft during the second round you wont be drafting a 'franchise quarterback'. Who would you rather have, Colin Kaepernick or Matt Flynn? Ovbiously Matt Flynn which would mean Flynn is worth more than a early second round pick.

If you draft a quarterback or invest a Top 40 pick in the position then you're hedging your bets that that guy will be a franchise caliber player for you

with your reasoning would you rather have Matt Flynn or Christian Ponder? most people would say Flynn but that doesn't mean he's worth the 12th pick

PackerLegend
01-01-2012, 07:41 PM
Everybody is high on Flynn. They were last year after that NE game and knew he was going to be a FA after this year. This Lions game only helped that cause and increased his value.

I dont get your point PF28. Nobody is saying anything about Flynn having great WRs which is the only reason why hes done well. Teams will jump all over this guy they have already been anticipating him being a FA. If the Packers do tag him they can trade him for a good haul. Not saying they will but TTs a smart man and he knows how to do stuff.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 07:44 PM
Everybody is high on Flynn. They were last year after that NE game and knew he was going to be a FA after this year. This Lions game only helped that cause and increased his value.

I dont get your point PF28. Nobody is saying anything about Flynn having great WRs which is the only reason why hes done well. Teams will jump all over this guy they have already been anticipating him being a FA. If the Packers do tag him they can trade him for a good haul. Not saying they will but TTs a smart man and he knows how to do stuff.

Flynn is ridiculously overrated at this point...he's nothing more than an average quarterback in this league much like the Matt Cassel and Kevin Kolbs of the world

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 07:55 PM
Flynn is ridiculously overrated at this point...he's nothing more than an average quarterback in this league much like the Matt Cassel and Kevin Kolbs of the world

What brings you to this assumption? Hes had two starts, nearly beat the Patriots and beat the Lions whilst throwing for 6 touchdowns. Im not saying hes going to be a franchise QB, but I dont understand what you see that makes you certain he will be an average quarterback at best.

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 07:55 PM
Flynn is ridiculously overrated at this point...he's nothing more than an average quarterback in this league much like the Matt Cassel and Kevin Kolbs of the world

Well I've already shown you what the Matt Cassels and Kevin Kolbs of the world fetch in a trade.

PackerLegend
01-01-2012, 08:01 PM
Flynn is ridiculously overrated at this point...he's nothing more than an average quarterback in this league much like the Matt Cassel and Kevin Kolbs of the world

You dont even know that for sure. Besides that has nothing to do with what the Packers could potentially get.

princefielder28
01-01-2012, 08:07 PM
What brings you to this assumption? Hes had two starts, nearly beat the Patriots and beat the Lions whilst throwing for 6 touchdowns. Im not saying hes going to be a franchise QB, but I dont understand what you see that makes you certain he will be an average quarterback at best.

he's got marginal tools while being a smart kid and he's gone up against two horrendous secondaries...i've already mentioned how he's also a beneficiary of a very talented offense as well

Well I've already shown you what the Matt Cassels and Kevin Kolbs of the world fetch in a trade.

we shall see...those two also had far more game experience than Flynn

SuperPacker
01-01-2012, 08:14 PM
he's got marginal tools while being a smart kid and he's gone up against two horrendous secondaries...i've already mentioned how he's also a beneficiary of a very talented offense as well

Maybe that would be relevant if he had thrown for, say 250 yards and 2 touchdowns against the Lions. But he threw for 480 yards and 6 touchdowns. I dont care how 'horrendous' the defense is because i didnt see Drew Brees throwing for 6 touchdowns against them and i didnt see Rodgers throw for 6 touchdowns against them (in the comforts of a dome, without horrible snowy, windy weather).

I repeat, im not saying Flynn is better than Rodgers or Brees, but throwing for 6 touchdowns in a game is not something an 'average quarterback' does.

J-Mike88
01-01-2012, 11:35 PM
Tom Silverstein reported back in practices before the season started, that Flynn was looking sharper than Rodgers was.
I remember LMAO at those reports. But I re-read them today, and it's pretty interesting.

He talked then, August, about how if some NFL scouts were there at the practices, they'd be phoning home to their GMs.

I never really liked Flynn, ever since I got into a twitter back-&-forth with him over him following the Kardashian ho's, LOL, but he's better than at least 12 starting QBs today.

BloodBrother
01-02-2012, 02:14 AM
At least Flynn shows that he can complete passes 15 yards downfield. Kolb is checkdown city.

he may be an average QB on some other team, but we really don't know. Point is he has played well when given the chance and has gotten better each year(going by his preseason performances) that is more than you can say for quite a few of these current "starters" in the league

IF they tag him, we'll know that they already most likely have a deal in place

PackerLegend
01-02-2012, 12:39 PM
I never really liked Flynn, ever since I got into a twitter back-&-forth with him over him following the Kardashian ho's, LOL

wait what? you serious.

J-Mike88
01-02-2012, 01:39 PM
wait what? you serious.
Jokes.... I used to tease him on twitter for following all the Karashians.... back in 08 or 09.....

But think back to that 2008 Draft.
What do you think Brian Brohm was thinking last night after seeing what Flynn did?