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View Full Version : Indianapolis Colts Are Now On the Clock


TBBucs621
01-01-2012, 02:53 PM
they just secured the 1st pick of the 2012 draft.

Andrew Luck or trade?

TACKLE
01-01-2012, 03:06 PM
QB is their biggest strength so why would they take one? They have to fill their needs and will take a strong zone CB like Dre Kirkpatrick #1.
i'm a liar.

JRTPlaya21
01-01-2012, 03:07 PM
Trade it to the Redskins bc you know Snyder will give an entire draft for Luck and maybe more.

jared3
01-01-2012, 03:10 PM
Yes, Colts have first overall pick!

If Manning is not 100 percent, draft Luck.

If Manning is 100 percent, then trade the pick and get several draft picks.

Razor
01-01-2012, 03:23 PM
Cowher says that the Colts will cut Manning if he's not willing to restructure. I'd suggest that they trade him instad. But yeah, Luck should, and probably will be, the pick for Indy.

Flyboy
01-01-2012, 03:31 PM
I think it's a done deal that it's Luck to Indy regardless of what happens with Manning.

TBBucs621
01-01-2012, 03:35 PM
Rumors have the Jets wanting Manning. NFL Network show on Fantasy for next season talked about it this morning when talking about 2012 busts.

ChiFan24
01-01-2012, 03:42 PM
Didn't Polian already say he'll take a QB? It's pretty much a done deal. It's a shame too, because I would have rooted for Luck if he'd landed on any other team.

Leon Sandcastle
01-01-2012, 04:01 PM
I thought I read something that said this year's #1 pick will garner 6 future #1's. That's tempting.

Phins827
01-01-2012, 04:05 PM
I thought I read something that said this year's #1 pick will garner 6 future #1's. That's tempting.

It is VERY tempting. 6 picks is alot. But, someone else pointed out something to think about. If you look at ANY 6 1st round picks the Colts have taken in the past 15 years, Im sure they would trade all of them to get Manning as a rookie again. There really isnt a price I wouldnt pay to get a franchise QB

FUNBUNCHER
01-01-2012, 05:59 PM
Good for the Colts for throwing the game against the Jags.
It's going to be a cluster **** in Indy regardless. Peyton is done, his arm is going resemble Chad Pennington at his worst when he comes back.

Luck is going demand a trade during the draft OR threaten to sit out the season if the Colts draft him AND keep Manning.

Can't wait.

TBBucs621
01-01-2012, 06:06 PM
I can't see Andrew Luck sitting out because they keep Manning for a season to help develop the rookie and disrespect Manning that way. He would get killed and beat up worse than David Carr did in Houston.

descendency
01-01-2012, 06:06 PM
QB is their biggest strength so why would they take one? They have to fill their needs and will take a strong zone CB like Dre Kirkpatrick #1.

Trent Richardson, #1 overall. Trust me.

TBBucs621
01-01-2012, 06:10 PM
BUT the talks of all the teams trying to stay away from RB in the top few picks makes it hard to think they would select RB 1st overall.

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
01-01-2012, 06:40 PM
Cowher says that the Colts will cut Manning if he's not willing to restructure. I'd suggest that they trade him instad. But yeah, Luck should, and probably will be, the pick for Indy.
It has already been shown we cant cut him
Trent Richardson, #1 overall. Trust me.

Ehhh...Justin Blackmon..

DBNYDP
01-01-2012, 06:41 PM
Even if Peyton is healthy can you honestly pass up a player that has a pretty good shot of making sure your franchise is relevant for the next 10-15 years? We've seen time and time again that the great play of a QB can keep an otherwise mediocre team in the spotlight and in the contention. The chance to get another guy to do that would be awesome, and they would still be able to do something with Peyton, say maybe let Peyton start next year and then do a trade or just trade him right now for a king's ransom as well. Honestly I don't think the short term benefit of getting that other great talent is worth more than getting a guy who I think is going to be phenomenal in the long term and make your team a threat for the future instead of making your team more of a threat right now.

Pat Sims 90
01-01-2012, 06:44 PM
Damn was hopeing Rams got it. I wanted that drama of how many draft picks Luck is worth or should the Rams take Luck and trade Bradford.

BaLLiN
01-01-2012, 06:46 PM
Cowher says that the Colts will cut Manning if he's not willing to restructure. I'd suggest that they trade him instad. But yeah, Luck should, and probably will be, the pick for Indy.

no one will trade for him unless he restructures...

Pat Sims 90
01-01-2012, 06:46 PM
no one will trade for him unless he restructures...

The Raiders would.

descendency
01-01-2012, 06:50 PM
It has already been shown we cant cut him


Ehhh...Justin Blackmon..

Maybe Mark Barron? This is a weak safety class, so if you don't get the best one, you may have to really settle.

I'm starting to wonder if people are missing the sarcasm

descendency
01-01-2012, 06:51 PM
Cowher says that the Colts will cut Manning if he's not willing to restructure. I'd suggest that they trade him instad. But yeah, Luck should, and probably will be, the pick for Indy.

It's in his better to restructure to be traded. However, he should hold fast and get traded where he wants.

Shane P. Hallam
01-01-2012, 06:52 PM
It has already been shown we cant cut him

Show me that. You could let him go before the big roster bonus was due.

niel89
01-01-2012, 07:22 PM
There is only one option here. Take Luck and just work through the other junk.

Flyboy
01-01-2012, 07:25 PM
There is only one option here. Take Luck and just work through the other junk.

Ding, ding, ding. The NFL draft really begins at the Rams pick. Do they take Matt Kalil or hold the #2 pick hostage for RGIII if a team is willing to trade up for him?

armageddon
01-01-2012, 07:29 PM
Ding, ding, ding. The NFL draft really begins at the Rams pick. Do they take Matt Kalil or hold the #2 pick hostage for RGIII if a team is willing to trade up for him?



If they can move Bradford, they should take RG3.

holt_bruce81
01-01-2012, 07:38 PM
If they can move Bradford, they should take RG3.

Dumbest thing I've ever heard. Bradford looked just as good if not better than RG3 in college, what in 2 years if RG3 doesn't reach your expectations are you going to want the Rams to trade him also?

Bradford has had a better first 2 seasons than both Troy Aikman and Drew Brees. Not saying he'll end up better than theem, Just saying all these Rams fans already giving up on Bradford is mind-boggling.

bigbuc
01-01-2012, 07:40 PM
You take a Luck and you sit him for one maybe two seasons... Done and Done

holt_bruce81
01-01-2012, 07:44 PM
You take a Luck and you sit him for one maybe two seasons... Done and Done

That would be the best thing to do and with no more paying rookies a weenerload of cash, it's deffinetly more do able now than in years past. But is Luck going to do that?

SchizophrenicBatman
01-01-2012, 07:49 PM
This is just a bad situation all around. If I'm the Colts I'd trade the pick for a ransom. But before I'd do anything I'd fire Bill Polian

Shane P. Hallam
01-01-2012, 07:51 PM
If they can move Bradford, they should take RG3.

Wouldn't bet on it. I'd guess Rams go Kalil and don't move down. Move Saffold to RT and Smith inside to guard.

niel89
01-01-2012, 07:53 PM
Luck isn't a guy who will ***** and whine about sitting for a year or so. He would probably love the opportunity to learn from Manning.

You have to remember in addition to the new rookies deals a back up QB isn't going to hit any incentives. I remember Matt Leinart being pretty cheap when he was behind Warner.

4U2NV
01-01-2012, 08:08 PM
I don't care who the incumbent is, how much he makes or what his legacy will be...Manning is 35 years old! We're not talking about a St. Louis situation with Bradford should they have ended up with the pick, we're talking about a horrible team with lots of rebuilding to do and a 35 year QB whose best years are behind him. Luck is the pick and Manning is just keeping the seat warm.

armageddon
01-01-2012, 08:18 PM
Wouldn't bet on it. I'd guess Rams go Kalil and don't move down. Move Saffold to RT and Smith inside to guard.



Not sure about moving Smith inside. The dude gets concussed so much on the outside, I would hate to see what happens inside. Plus, for all we know, he may retire after this last one. What a waste of a #2 pick. But, i do like Kalil at LT and Saffold moving to RT. They should try to auction off RG3 first and foremost.

holt_bruce81
01-01-2012, 08:20 PM
Wouldn't bet on it. I'd guess Rams go Kalil and don't move down. Move Saffold to RT and Smith inside to guard.

If I'm the Rams and can't trade down I take Claiborne or Blackmon. While I understand the concern with Jason Smith, I think Saffold is a good Left Tackle and if they choose to move Smith I think we can find a Right tackle later on in the draft, where as I don't think we can find that potential beast #1 Wideout later on, unless we want to go the route last year and just take two mid draft (Pettis, Salas) and cross our fingers that one pans out.

armageddon
01-01-2012, 08:41 PM
Dumbest thing I've ever heard. Bradford looked just as good if not better than RG3 in college, what in 2 years if RG3 doesn't reach your expectations are you going to want the Rams to trade him also?

Bradford has had a better first 2 seasons than both Troy Aikman and Drew Brees. Not saying he'll end up better than theem, Just saying all these Rams fans already giving up on Bradford is mind-boggling.



Bradford had all day to throw in college behind that awesome o-line. The Rams need to either bolster their line or get a QB that can scramble. People wanting to keep Bradford and draft a playmaker are clueless. He will never succeed playing behind that current line.

Mufasa
01-01-2012, 08:44 PM
It's a shame too, because I would have rooted for Luck if he'd landed on any other team.

Vikings....? I'd much rather have him in Indy

holt_bruce81
01-01-2012, 08:53 PM
Bradford had all day to throw in college behind that awesome o-line. The Rams need to either bolster their line or get a QB that can scramble. People wanting to keep Bradford and draft a playmaker are clueless. He will never succeed playing behind that current line.

You do know there's more than one round in the draft right? Why not take Blackmon and a Right Tackle later on in the draft?

Saffold is a good left tackle, the one thing he struggles with is bullrushers, but with some Weightlifting and good coaching He could be a stud left tackle.

But in your world if you struggle for 3 games you can kiss your career goodbye.

armageddon
01-01-2012, 08:59 PM
You do know there's more than one round in the draft right? Why not take Blackmon and a Right Tackle later on in the draft?

Saffold is a good left tackle, the one thing he struggles with is bullrushers, but with some Weightlifting and good coaching He could be a stud left tackle.

But in your world if you struggle for 3 games you can kiss your career goodbye.


I just don't see Saffold as that good of a LT. I would rather either take Kalil at #2 or trade down a few picks and take either Reiff or Martin, who are both better than Saffold.

Cigaro
01-01-2012, 09:44 PM
Luck Luck Luck Luck Luck.

You don't pass up a franchise quarterback, once-in-a-decade type prospect so your current legend can play two or three more years at the most. The colts have to weigh the choice between keeping a great for a few more seasons, or drafting a great for an entire decade. I think that alone should settle all matters.

Scotty D
01-01-2012, 09:51 PM
Like others have posted I think the smart thing to do is pick up the option on Manning and still draft Luck. If Manning can stay healthy he can win with the roster next year but Luck will struggle. I don't see Luck making a big fuss if he doesn't start right away. Let Luck sit, learn the system, get used to the NFL, and get two training camps under his belt. The next season when Manning's cap hit is gone they can use that money to shore up other positions and have one more draft class before Luck hits the field. Costanzo and Ijalana will also be more developed.

Sloopy
01-01-2012, 10:18 PM
Can we stop making an insane amount of threads about this? There have been way to many over the span of the season... with people bumping old one starting new ones etc. it just makes it hard to have a good conversation in any one and results in people repeating themselves... anything a mod could do about this would be great...

anyway I'll just quote myself from another thread here I guess as I don't know which one people will ride for the next week until someone makes a new one...

I am not trying to hate on Luck but I have been a main proponent of trading this pick for a long time now.

I know that they can move seamlessly from one franchise QB to another blah blah blah...

As you point out, this team has one SB with arguably the best QB of the last decade. What makes you think that Luck will be better than Peyton and thus anymore likely to bring this team to multiple SB championships?

Even if Luck lives up to the unreal expectations of being the next (insert all time great here) at best he helps this team continue to limp into the playoffs as Manning did and end up with a late round draft pick, thus perpetuating their current situation.

If you trade the pick for a queens ransom and build a solid foundation of a team over the next few years (including possibly another franchise type QB this year or next) I think you have a better shot than outright drafting Luck.

It's crazy but it's possible that if Luck is as good as advertised, he could be the worst thing that happens to the team that drafts him. Whether that be a team giving up their future to trade up and draft one guy or a team with a bad history of late round picks drafting him and perpetuating their current circumstances.

stlouisfan37
01-01-2012, 11:38 PM
I am really hoping that Manning is not done and that he will make a full recovery and be playing again next season. No one knows whether or not this will happen; and I agree with the philosophy that his team should make preparations in the event that he never plays again.

What has me baffled is the suggestion that the Colts should draft Luck and if Manning gets back on the field again, Luck could just sit for a year or two and then take over.

Peyton Manning is as tough of a competitor as the NFL has ever seen, even though he carries himself with a cool demeanor. He will either be back or he won't; this remains to be seen. If he never plays again then drafting Luck is the best move possible. However, if Manning comes back, the team will be his and there will be no question about that. There is no way he is going to just roll over and let another QB take over his team.

I believe that if Manning does come back, it will end up being an ugly situation similar to the Montana/Young controversy in San Francisco. Manning will likely get traded down the road and finish his career elsewhere.

Personally, if it were my decision to make, I think I would make the trade and take the picks, which would be monumental for rebuilding a team that is aging and has holes across the board. Trading the pick for a bundle of picks, including several early rounders, from either Miami or Washington, would allow the Colts to load their roster with a core of talent, as well as likely bringing a franchise QB down the road. Andrew Luck alone isn't going to make the Dolphins or Redskins a contender immediately. The 2013 1st rounder from either of those teams that almost certainly would be part of any trade package could easily become a very high pick that could bring in a franchise QB next year. I am of the belief that the team that gets a bundle of picks usually is better off than the team getting the one star player.

Spectre
01-02-2012, 12:05 AM
I know that there's some who think it's a sure thing the Colts take Luck but there's WAY too much stuff coming out of Indy for me to believe they aren't trying to drive the price up to consider a possible trade if the right offer comes along.

I mean for Pete's sake, the question of the Colts getting #2 instead was out there for a whole week and instantly there was a report saying that they're totally comfortable with RGIII (the 2nd most attractive tradebait in the draft) and would take him if they got #2. Seriously? No other team is getting this much "intel" put out there about them... which screams intentional front office leaks to me, especially with Polian involved.

Sure, they could easily end up taking Luck and that may be the likely scenario but between having Peyton and the kind of conflict that could arise with 2 QBs on the roster wanting to play, I think it's far from the guarantee it's being made out to be by some.

Wrathman
01-02-2012, 01:07 AM
In my opinion, Luck and Kalil go to start things off and then the Vikings take offers from everyone who needs a QB but didn't sign Matt Flynn to decide what they can get and how far down they are willing to move to take that bounty.

The Colts are stuck in a staring contest with Peyton if he doesn't want to restructure as his payday comes prior to when they can deal him, so they would either need to bite the bullet (pay him) or cut him and get nothing for him though I favor a third option. I think they should work on a restructure plan and then deal him as option No. 1. Option No. 2 is cut him with their final option being pay him and keep him. Paying him and then dealing him is not an option from a financial perspective, so it's not worth discussing.

boknows34
01-02-2012, 05:13 AM
Its simply not prudent for the Colts to keep both QBs, or even trade Luck for that matter. Then there's also the double whammy of not giving themselves the cap room to re-sign some of their own free agents. Having said that I think the likes of Wayne will be allowed to walk regardless and they'll spend their WR money on Garcon. If Irsay gets all sentimental about a player that may never be 100% healthy again, and may only have another 2-3 seasons left anyway under a best-case scenario, I fear it could really set the franchise back badly.

1. Cut Manning and draft Luck
Colts save $6.6m in cap space, and $35m+ in cash on Manning.
Dead Cap space: $10m
Money would be there to re-sign FAs and start the rebuilding process around Luck. If Manning is released before the deadline, Manning's cap hit would drop from $17 million (with $35.4 million actually paid out to him in cash) should he stay, down to $10.4 million if he's cut before the deadline.

2. Keep Manning and trade Luck.
Colts spend $35m in cash on Manning (bonus plus salary)
$17m would be Manning's cap number
No QB for the future unless they trade Luck on draft day to a team that already holds the draft rights to RG3. Or wait to use a pick lower down in Rd 1 or Rd 2 on the 2nd tier of QBs.

3. Trade Manning in March 2012 and keep Luck
Colts spend $28m in roster bonus just to let Manning walk away to another team.
Dead Cap space: $38.8m
Little or no money to sign free agents.
Draft picks in 2012/13 draft to rebuild team around Luck.

4. Trade Manning in March 2013 and keep Luck
Colts pay $35m+ in cash for one season of Manning.
Dead cap space: $28m
Draft picks in 2013/14 to rebuild team around Luck.

5. Keep Manning for 2012 and 2013 while Luck sits.
Colts pay nearly $45m in cash to Manning and whatever Luck earns in two seasons to ride the bench. (Newton got $22m over 4 years with a $14.5m signing bonus).
$21m in cap space on Manning/Luck in 2012. Not sure about 2013.

Option 6 would be the Colts agreeing to trade Manning if he agrees to restructure his contract with his new team and thus minimise the impact on the Colts' salary cap. http://blogs.nfl.com/2011/12/07/lombardi-ways-to-trade-peyton-manning-exist/?campaign=Twitter_blogs

nepg
01-02-2012, 05:53 AM
You draft Luck and keep Manning (and keep paying Manning because Luck is probably cheaper than Painter or Orlovsky anyway with the new rookie deals). Even if Manning plays another 5 years, do you think they'll find a guy even close to Luck or be in position to have their pick of a QB class at any point in that time period?

Do you really dump the face of the franchise who isn't playing like crap as Favre was before the Packers finally got tired of him jerking them around every off-season? No. you keep him because he gives you the best chance to win and because it's the right thing to do.

You draft him and if he sits for 5 years, so what? This ****'s a no-brainer for the Colts, imo. People complicate it because of their desire to see Luck play in the NFL sooner rather than have to wait who knows how long...

Leon Sandcastle
01-02-2012, 06:26 AM
It is VERY tempting. 6 picks is alot. But, someone else pointed out something to think about. If you look at ANY 6 1st round picks the Colts have taken in the past 15 years, Im sure they would trade all of them to get Manning as a rookie again. There really isnt a price I wouldnt pay to get a franchise QB

Very true especially if you're a Bills fan like myself. At the same time I'd be pretty disappointed to have Peyton Manning as my QB for 10+ years and then let him go because some new kid on the block.

Could you imagine if this was Michael Jordan, John Elway, Wayne Gretzky, Derek Jeter. I know it's a business but don't you owe it to Manning to surround him with the best of talent for the last 3 years of his career?

He deserves that much. The dude built your stadium.

Leon Sandcastle
01-02-2012, 06:30 AM
Luck Luck Luck Luck Luck.

You don't pass up a franchise quarterback, once-in-a-decade type prospect so your current legend can play two or three more years at the most. The colts have to weigh the choice between keeping a great for a few more seasons, or drafting a great for an entire decade. I think that alone should settle all matters.

But you make it seem like Manning has diminishing talent. He's still one of the 4 best QB's in the game.

Why not get as much as you can for Luck and make a 2-3 year run with Manning. The guy is the only reason the Colts have been relevant for the past decade. He built the RCA Dome himself.

I don't think it's as clear cut as you're making it to be.

TitanHope
01-02-2012, 07:25 AM
Draft Luck.

Peyton Manning is left with one choice. He must perform seppuku.

It's the only way to keep his honor.

descendency
01-02-2012, 08:02 AM
Bradford has had a better first 2 seasons than both Troy Aikman and Drew Brees.

Look at the NFL today. Before Brees hit 5k, Dan Marino was the only QB who had 5k+. Now 4 seasons of 5k+ have been turned in in the last 3 years. Now look at the fact that Bradford is among the worst in the NFL in every passing category. Two years in a row.

This is a new NFL. Plus, Brees was **** until he left SD (could be something to that).

descendency
01-02-2012, 08:06 AM
3. Trade Manning in March 2012 and keep Luck
Colts spend $28m in roster bonus just to let Manning walk away to another team.
Dead Cap space: $38.8m
Little or no money to sign free agents.
Draft picks in 2012/13 draft to rebuild team around Luck.

4. Trade Manning in March 2013 and keep Luck
Colts pay $35m+ in cash for one season of Manning.
Dead cap space: $28m
Draft picks in 2013/14 to rebuild team around Luck.

The Colts would be forced to restructure Manning's deal.

Manning will get to give them a list of teams he wants to play for and the Colts could auction his services off.

That's the only way a trade makes sense, and that's the only way to prevent massive dead cap space.

villagewarrior
01-02-2012, 10:35 AM
Don't see why the Colts wouldn't keep Manning and draft Luck. Then they are settled at quarterback for the next decade at least with extremely high draft picks throughout the rest of 2012.

Rams are in a great spot to move down, I don't see the Vikings or the Browns passing up on RG3 so if a team wants him they'll need to deal with the Rams.

WCH
01-02-2012, 10:40 AM
Don't see why the Colts wouldn't keep Manning and draft Luck. Then they are settled at quarterback for the next decade at least with extremely high draft picks throughout the rest of 2012.

If I were the Colts owner, I'd keep both guys and tell Archie Manning to ****. But that doesn't seem to be how the NFL does things.

bruschis4all
01-02-2012, 10:46 AM
I think the Colts don't pick up the option on Peyton. Thank him for the memories and move on. SF traded Joe Montana when he was still pretty good. If they pick up Peyton's option, can they keep Wayne and Mathis? I don't know their cap numbers. Peyton would be returning to an aging team and losing his favorite target. It really is in the best interest of both parties to move on.

I'm guessing Peyton takes his talents to South Beach. Unless Dan Snyders gets him on his private jet and won't let him off without a contract. Miami's a playoff team with Manning. Has weapons in Marshall and Bush. Good LT in Jake Long. A top 10 pick to add another weapon or RT.

Shane P. Hallam
01-02-2012, 10:54 AM
Reports that the Polians may be out in Indianapolis. That could really change everything here. No real loyalty from the new GM to Peyton perhaps?

scottyboy
01-02-2012, 11:08 AM
Reports that the Polians may be out in Indianapolis. That could really change everything here. No real loyalty from the new GM to Peyton perhaps?

even still, do you then just throw Andrew Luck out to the wolves with that team and risk David Carr syndrome? How long is Peyton's option? Is it a one year thing? If so, pick it up, go with Peyton for a year, Luck sits and learns and you go from there

Shane P. Hallam
01-02-2012, 11:14 AM
even still, do you then just throw Andrew Luck out to the wolves with that team and risk David Carr syndrome?

The offensive line isn't completely awful, especially at the tackle positions. This isn't the old Houston O-line and the team has decent enough weapons. It's not as bad as it looks, just needs some running game which could happen depending on the new coaching staff.

Sloopy
01-02-2012, 12:11 PM
Reports that the Polians may be out in Indianapolis. That could really change everything here. No real loyalty from the new GM to Peyton perhaps?

This would be the greatest off season addition that they could make...

I am a huge Luck fan but I really just want someone to explain to me how (even if he is the next Manning) he will lead this team to a superbowl with the current personnel?

This team needs to rebuild and it may be hard to pass on a guy like Luck but making the same mistake over again and expecting different results is insanity.

Spectre
01-02-2012, 12:24 PM
Reports that the Polians may be out in Indianapolis. That could really change everything here. No real loyalty from the new GM to Peyton perhaps?

The loyalty comes from Irsay and if he wants Peyton around, he's not going to hire someone who doesn't. If anything, I think Polian and Peyton have a shaky relationship right now based on all the leaks Peyton didn't want out there. Should be really interesting depending on how things go down.

Spectre
01-02-2012, 12:28 PM
The Colts would be forced to restructure Manning's deal.

Manning will get to give them a list of teams he wants to play for and the Colts could auction his services off.

That's the only way a trade makes sense, and that's the only way to prevent massive dead cap space.

If that's truly the avenue the Colts pursue, why exactly would Peyton be showing that kind of loyalty to a team about to cut him down? If anything, I think the restructure will be only if he chooses to stick around. Otherwise, why narrow your list of possibilities and deprive your future team of assets when you can just tell the Colts to shove it and cut you outright, enabling you to go anywhere?

descendency
01-02-2012, 01:55 PM
If that's truly the avenue the Colts pursue, why exactly would Peyton be showing that kind of loyalty to a team about to cut him down? If anything, I think the restructure will be only if he chooses to stick around. Otherwise, why narrow your list of possibilities and deprive your future team of assets when you can just tell the Colts to shove it and cut you outright, enabling you to go anywhere?

Because the Colts could just eat your contract and hold onto you for 2 years while prepping for Andrew Luck.

It's in the best interest for everyone to cooperate.

Flyboy
01-02-2012, 02:11 PM
Because the Colts could just eat your contract and hold onto you for 2 years while prepping for Andrew Luck.

It's in the best interest for everyone to cooperate.

I honestly think that's the best scenario, not to mention the most logical.

Matthew Jones
01-02-2012, 02:28 PM
News of the Polians being fired made my day; does that mean Bill is finally kicked off of the competition committee? Rule changes have been killing the NFL for years.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-02-2012, 02:38 PM
I'm not sure why Pats fans are so happy about Polian going down. They realize the best RB they've had in their current run is Antowain Smith, right?

nepg
01-02-2012, 02:43 PM
I'm not sure why Pats fans are so happy about Polian going down. They realize the best RB they've had in their current run is Antowain Smith, right?
The Pats? Corey Dillon? The best RB in the NFL in 2004?

Shane P. Hallam
01-02-2012, 02:46 PM
This would be the greatest off season addition that they could make...

I am a huge Luck fan but I really just want someone to explain to me how (even if he is the next Manning) he will lead this team to a superbowl with the current personnel?

Errr, no one does. It is why you have more than one pick, more than one year, and more than just the draft to build a team. With a solid GM, they may build the team the right way instead of neglecting needs in midrounds.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-02-2012, 02:49 PM
You know what, fair enough. I remembered Dillon was on the Pats but wrote him off because I remember the one big year being very mercernary-ish and then thinking he was done after that. But he still put up double digits TDs the next couple years and 04 was a lot better than I remember

Sloopy
01-02-2012, 02:52 PM
Errr, no one does. It is why you have more than one pick, more than one year, and more than just the draft to build a team. With a solid GM, they may build the team the right way instead of neglecting needs in midrounds.

I just see a team that really needs to rebuild and should take advantage of this situation to add a ton of premium picks to hasten that rebuilding process.

I wouldn't call drafting Luck the wrong answer, I just a chance to rebuild faster than a 5 year plan

Shane P. Hallam
01-02-2012, 02:53 PM
I just see a team that really needs to rebuild and should take advantage of this situation to add a ton of premium picks to hasten that rebuilding process.

I wouldn't call drafting Luck the wrong answer, I just a chance to rebuild faster than a 5 year plan

But it won't get done in 2, which could be Peyton's limit.

The loyalty comes from Irsay and if he wants Peyton around, he's not going to hire someone who doesn't.

So, the loyalty comes from the guy who has already said they are drafting Andrew Luck?

dhp318
01-02-2012, 03:02 PM
So, the loyalty comes from the guy who has already said they are drafting Andrew Luck?

What's your point? It's the same guy who said that if Peyton ever plays again, it will be in a Colts uniform.

Shane P. Hallam
01-02-2012, 03:04 PM
What's your point? It's the same guy who said that if Peyton ever plays again, it will be in a Colts uniform.

My point is there is no loyalty from owner to play, it's a business.

TBBucs621
01-02-2012, 05:42 PM
The more I think about it if I am the Colts I would trade Manning to the Bucs since they have a billion dollars under the cap and then sign a few more pieces we need. Hire Tony Dungy and go from there. Allow Josh Freeman to be a backup and re-learn the QB position and learn from the best QB and HC.

keylime_5
01-02-2012, 05:47 PM
News of the Polians being fired made my day; does that mean Bill is finally kicked off of the competition committee? Rule changes have been killing the NFL for years.

yes! great point. The new rules in the NFL from the past ten years have totally made the sport way worse. Unfortunately I don't think Polian leaving would change much. Goodell is the commish and he is hellbent on making the NFL a league for pansies.

Sloopy
01-02-2012, 06:11 PM
[QUOTE=Shane P. Hallam;2808605]But it won't get done in 2, which could be Peyton's limit./QUOTE]

You can still use one of those picks to get a QB of the future not named Luck as well as gain a number of picks with which to get a jump start on your rebuilding process.

I'm not trying to argue that taking Luck would be a bad move, simply that another move MIGHT be a better one.

ellsy82
01-02-2012, 09:53 PM
even still, do you then just throw Andrew Luck out to the wolves with that team and risk David Carr syndrome? How long is Peyton's option? Is it a one year thing? If so, pick it up, go with Peyton for a year, Luck sits and learns and you go from there

Sound logic.

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
01-02-2012, 11:00 PM
How are Luck's leadership skills? Every time i hear him talk i come away with the vibe he is a total dork. Obviously his play speaks for itself but still he seems so damn dorky to me.

SchizophrenicBatman
01-02-2012, 11:16 PM
How are Luck's leadership skills? Every time i hear him talk i come away with the vibe he is a total dork. Obviously his play speaks for itself but still he seems so damn dorky to me.

his charisma does seem lacking in some ways but he talked his way out of one of those BS delay of game penalties where they forget to reset the 25 second clock earlier today and i've literally never seen that actually work before

FUNBUNCHER
01-02-2012, 11:28 PM
Eli is a dork. Romo is a dork. Flacco is a dork. Dalton is a dork. Bradford is a dork. Josh Freeman is kind of a dork.

Rex Grossman thinks he's cooler than ice.

Being socially graceful out of pads is overrated in sports.
It's okay to be dorky, which isn't the same as being a punk.

Luck is no punk or a chump. Dude will get in people's faces on the football field.

Strictly in pads, Luck is a 25 year old Hugh Hefner.

nepg
01-03-2012, 01:28 AM
You guys realize we're looking at Luck, Locker, and Gabbert in the same division? That's nuts. It's been a little bit since a young group of QBs like that have been in the same division.

CashmoneyDrew
01-03-2012, 01:35 AM
You guys realize we're looking at Luck, Locker, and Gabbert in the same division? That's nuts. It's been a little bit since a young group of QBs like that have been in the same division.

Why would you include Gabbert with those other two sexy beasts?

nepg
01-03-2012, 05:06 AM
Why would you include Gabbert with those other two sexy beasts?
Gabbert could get up there with them. The phantom pass rush issue bothers me a ton, but that's really the one thing holding him back aside from a couple receivers. But, no, I've never really had him anywhere close to Locker or Luck, but he is a very promising young QB with all the tools, so that's why he gets lumped in there.

dannyz
01-03-2012, 05:39 AM
Gabbert could get up there with them. The phantom pass rush issue bothers me a ton, but that's really the one thing holding him back aside from a couple receivers. But, no, I've never really had him anywhere close to Locker or Luck, but he is a very promising young QB with all the tools, so that's why he gets lumped in there.

Could you Imagine if the Jaguars Suck and get the 1ST Pick Next Year? Barkley,Luck,Locker. Pac-12 Rivalry.

nepg
01-03-2012, 05:48 AM
Locker never played in the Pac-12 :|

Iamcanadian
01-03-2012, 07:59 AM
With Polian being fired, my guess is that the Colts rebuild starting with Luck, cut Manning and his 38 million and use the money to sign 8 top FA's over the next 2 years to completely revamp the team.
Overnight, this team could be right back totally dominating the AFC South for the next decade.
IMO, Manning is totally untradable due to his contract and any team willing to take the risk on him, will simply wait till the Colts cut him so they can sign him to a totally new contract in line with his age and health issues.

FUNBUNCHER
01-03-2012, 08:39 AM
Peyton wants to retire a Colt.
Polian was fired because Jim Irsay was still invested in the totality of Peyton's career, however IMO Polian was not.

I think Polian got into Irsay's ear one too many times about dealing Peyton and Irsay had enough.

Why do you think Jim Caldwell hasn't been fired??
Because Peyton still wants him to be his HC.

I think it's shaping up that the Colts are going to trade the top pick for a treasure chest of picks.

Beware when your best player is friends with the owner, because said player ONLY leaves a franchise on his own terms, not the other way around.

dannyz
01-03-2012, 04:05 PM
Locker never played in the Pac-12 :|

I knew someone would say that. Pac-10 Then. I like the Idea of cutting Manning and using the Money you saved from it by getting a few top FA's.

indyfan1985
01-03-2012, 09:47 PM
With Polian being fired, my guess is that the Colts rebuild starting with Luck, cut Manning and his 38 million and use the money to sign 8 top FA's over the next 2 years to completely revamp the team.
Overnight, this team could be right back totally dominating the AFC South for the next decade.
IMO, Manning is totally untradable due to his contract and any team willing to take the risk on him, will simply wait till the Colts cut him so they can sign him to a totally new contract in line with his age and health issues.

Yeah thats what I was thinking too. The Colts will have TONS of cap space if they cut Peyton and dont pay his huge bonus, plus Im sure they will restructure Freeney and Clark's deals so we're looking at over 40 mil possibly in cap room. They could sign some serious players this offseason and next to revamp this team around Luck.

indyfan1985
01-03-2012, 09:50 PM
Peyton wants to retire a Colt.
Polian was fired because Jim Irsay was still invested in the totality of Peyton's career, however IMO Polian was not.

I think Polian got into Irsay's ear one too many times about dealing Peyton and Irsay had enough.

Why do you think Jim Caldwell hasn't been fired??
Because Peyton still wants him to be his HC.

I think it's shaping up that the Colts are going to trade the top pick for treasure chest of picks.

Beware when your best player is friends with the owner, because said player ONLY leaves a franchise on his own terms, not the other way around.

That still totally depends on Peyton's health. And I still think Caldwell gets canned since the new GM will want a new HC. I could see Peyton's health being only 60 or 70 percent good to go, in which case they would have to take Luck as insurance.

ViperVisor
01-03-2012, 10:02 PM
Peyton wants to retire a Colt.
Polian was fired because Jim Irsay was still invested in the totality of Peyton's career, however IMO Polian was not.

I think Polian got into Irsay's ear one too many times about dealing Peyton and Irsay had enough.

Why do you think Jim Caldwell hasn't been fired??
Because Peyton still wants him to be his HC.

I think it's shaping up that the Colts are going to trade the top pick for a treasure chest of picks.

Beware when your best player is friends with the owner, because said player ONLY leaves a franchise on his own terms, not the other way around.

This was my thinking with my brother the Colts fan. But tweaked.

I said Irsay doesn't have the guts or has a heart and won't cut Manning. But also not stupid and will draft Luck and deal with that problem in 2 years. Maybe some team gives up a huge gift bag of players and picks for the #1 pick.

nepg
01-04-2012, 12:17 AM
The Colts really aren't this giant overhaul situation that some are making it out to be. And drafting Luck doesn't mean Peyton goes...and keeping Peyton doesn't mean they deal the #1 pick.

Draft Luck. He's an affordable backup, and not someone you pass on. Spend the rest of your efforts building quality depth behind older important players and fixing the defense.

I think they'll pretty much always run the offensive they've been running, especially with Peyton there to continue it and teach it to Luck. It's too big of an advantage in the warm weather and domes they spend most of their season in.

I think you make Jeff Fisher the #1 target. He's familiar with the division and can install an effective version of his defense quickly without screwing with the offensive side of the ball too much. Unless Garrett gets canned, Fisher's two prime destinations aren't going to be available.

This is a good draft class to find DTs that fit what Fisher likes to do, and the rest of the work is probably in the secondary.

gpngc
01-04-2012, 12:26 AM
What I keep thinking:

If Manning is healthy enough to play QB in the NFL next season, why would anyone assume that Luck, as a back-up, with both of them on the roster in 2012, would take the starting job in 1-2 years? Manning has shown no signs of decline and mobility isn't a part of his game at all. IF he regains his arm strength (and if he doesn't - this is all moot, you take Luck, dump Manning and move on), why the hell wouldn't he keep playing at a high level for the next 4-5 years - or more (which I think we can all agree would be WAY too long for a player of Luck's caliber to sit and watch)?

Basically, to those who just say 'keep both' - you think Peyton Manning is only going to play 2 more years? Why? He's shown no signs of decline in terms of performance...

I guess the only thing I can think of is that you just keep Luck on the roster, and then when/if Peyton's injury pops up again, you make the switch. But if that doesn't happen, Luck's not going to happy if a healthy Manning plays well into his 40s (which I don't know why we aren't all assuming he will...)

keylime_5
01-04-2012, 01:17 AM
because, like Favre in Green Bay, the Colts would acknowledge than Luck is the future and they won't want to wait anymore to put him in the lineup and will get rid of Peyton Manning who will be 38 or older by then. The window for the Manning era Colts success is closing with Wayne, Clarke, Freeney, Mathis, Addai, and Saturday all likely either being past their primes or out of contract years pretty soon. They'll have to rebuild the rest of the team and if you are gonna rebuild you might as well develop your young future star QB.

nepg
01-04-2012, 02:18 AM
I don't see Manning playing too much longer, especially since he's had a few major surgeries lately. But it really doesn't matter how long Manning plays (and he actually had been showing signs of decline prior to getting hurt). You can't base your decision to or not to draft Luck on theoreticals concerning Manning's longevity.

Cam Newton got $22m/4y. That's a solid price for a backup QB. If Luck has a similar deal to Newton, his contract will be up the same time as Manning's and they probably will have decided what to do with them both by then. I don't see Luck's value declining in that time frame.

Nothing wrong with putting a great QB on layaway.

lod01
01-04-2012, 12:15 PM
because, like Favre in Green Bay, the Colts would acknowledge than Luck is the future and they won't want to wait anymore to put him in the lineup and will get rid of Peyton Manning who will be 38 or older by then. The window for the Manning era Colts success is closing with Wayne, Clarke, Freeney, Mathis, Addai, and Saturday all likely either being past their primes or out of contract years pretty soon. They'll have to rebuild the rest of the team and if you are gonna rebuild you might as well develop your young future star QB.

That's the way I see it.
The Colts are drafting Luck, guaranteed. The Colts cut Manning (who secretly requests it as he knows the next few years in Indy are a waste of his time if he wants to win another SB) before the $28 million is due in March. Manning signs with SF (who instantly becomes a legitimate top 3 NFC team. Also cut and signed by SF is Wayne.

I'm not buying the Harbaugh, 'we are signing Smith for 2012'. Once they get beat by a powerhouse offense in the next couple of weeks, he will hold out on Smith and see if the above takes place.

lacotomo
01-04-2012, 01:19 PM
It's Luck, no brainer. He is the best since sliced bread, and sliced bread is in the hall of fame. You mean to tell me that Luck won't be happy sitting behind possibly the best QB of this era for a year or so? He is already a can't miss, then add a year or so of knowledge from the best in the game at his position? This gives Manning a year or two to go out on his terms, as a Colt and transition Luck into the fold as they start rebuilding....

Saints-Tigers
01-04-2012, 02:54 PM
Keeping Peyton for 1-2 years isn't about him being "done" after those years IMO. It just allows Luck to learn, and allows the team to be a real threat.... if Peyton is still good in 2 years or so... even better, trade him for a gold mine, and build around your 23 year old elite QB who is now 100% ready to go.

tldr version: If you hang on to both, you might get the best of competing now and rebuilding.

Roddoliver
01-04-2012, 03:01 PM
With the 1st overall pick in the 2012 draft, the Indianapolis Colts select... Robert Griffin, QB, Baylor.

bigbuc
01-04-2012, 03:12 PM
It's funny everyone on Espn is saying to draft Luck and cut Manning. Now I understand why you would do it 50 Million to two QB's is way too much money. But my thinking if you cut Maniing you have to blow this whole team up. Get as many picks for the old Players you can, clean up your salary cap and draft young offensive players to help out Luck.

Complex
01-04-2012, 03:54 PM
Keeping Peyton for 1-2 years isn't about him being "done" after those years IMO. It just allows Luck to learn, and allows the team to be a real threat.... if Peyton is still good in 2 years or so... even better, trade him for a gold mine, and build around your 23 year old elite QB who is now 100% ready to go.

tldr version: If you hang on to both, you might get the best of competing now and rebuilding.

I doubt teams will trade a gold mine for a 38-39 year Peyton. Maybe a late 1st but that is as high as it gets IMHO.

SRK85
01-04-2012, 04:12 PM
Easy the colts trade the 1st pick to the Redskins for their 2012 1st round pick, 2013 1st round pick, and 2013 3rd round pick.

boknows34
01-04-2012, 04:30 PM
Easy the colts trade the 1st pick to the Redskins for their 2012 1st round pick, 2013 1st round pick, and 2013 3rd round pick.

The Redskins would be laughing if they pulled that off. It will take at least two number 1s and two number 2s to get the top pick.

nepg
01-04-2012, 04:41 PM
Keeping Peyton for 1-2 years isn't about him being "done" after those years IMO. It just allows Luck to learn, and allows the team to be a real threat.... if Peyton is still good in 2 years or so... even better, trade him for a gold mine, and build around your 23 year old elite QB who is now 100% ready to go.

tldr version: If you hang on to both, you might get the best of competing now and rebuilding.
Yeah, keeping both is the way to go. And the last two years of Manning's contract are cake anyway. His contract is SOOOO front-loaded. He's getting like $69m of the $90m in the first 3 years. So the last two, are like $10.5m/y and this will be after the salary cap will have skyrocketed from the new TV deal going into effect.

So he's extremely easy to trade if he doesn't want to retire or just stick around for the beginning of Luck's run.

49erNation85
01-04-2012, 04:43 PM
Manning can come on down to Sf and help us win a few more super bowls... Not like that would happen but it would be nice.

49ers1984
01-04-2012, 06:22 PM
Manning can come on down to Sf and help us win a few more super bowls... Not like that would happen but it would be nice.

I was thinking the same thing.It would probably shatter Alex Smith's confidence but it may be worth it.

49ers1984
01-04-2012, 06:24 PM
Luck Luck Luck Luck Luck.

You don't pass up a franchise quarterback, once-in-a-decade type prospect so your current legend can play two or three more years at the most. The colts have to weigh the choice between keeping a great for a few more seasons, or drafting a great for an entire decade. I think that alone should settle all matters.

Luck will probably be a good-great player but I am not sure how people can say he is a once in a decade player. I thought for a while Luck was underrated but now it seems he is being overrated.

Caulibflower
01-04-2012, 07:06 PM
I was thinking the same thing.It would probably shatter Alex Smith's confidence but it may be worth it.

If they bring in Manning, they're done with Smith. But Manning's a machine. If his neck doesn't stop him, I have no problem seeing him go another 5 years.

49erNation85
01-04-2012, 07:09 PM
If they bring in Manning, they're done with Smith. But Manning's a machine. If his neck doesn't stop him, I have no problem seeing him go another 5 years.


That would be the idea point there. We are not going any where in the play offs until I see more passing yards and more points per game for SF...

Caulibflower
01-04-2012, 07:14 PM
That would be the idea point there. We are not going any where in the play offs until I see more passing yards and more points per game for SF...

I kinda like the idea of Manning taking over at QB for a defensive, run-based team and just being really efficient and making precise throws when he needs to, instead of all the gesticulating herky-jerky he does in Indy. Just kind of a player-coach who is really aware of what the defense is doing and makes sure his offense is running the right plays, but not having to make them all himself. He could do that in SF. It'd almost be like a semi-retirement.

"Yeah, I'm just doing a little work down in San Fran now. It's nice."

49erNation85
01-04-2012, 07:27 PM
I kinda like the idea of Manning taking over at QB for a defensive, run-based team and just being really efficient and making precise throws when he needs to, instead of all the gesticulating herky-jerky he does in Indy. Just kind of a player-coach who is really aware of what the defense is doing and makes sure his offense is running the right plays, but not having to make them all himself. He could do that in SF. It'd almost be like a semi-retirement.

"Yeah, I'm just doing a little work down in San Fran now. It's nice."

If he became trad-able .I just don't think Jim or the staff would pull the trigger though. But it would be a nice addition though having him would almost be like the Montana trade the chiefs did back in the day.

Sloopy
01-04-2012, 07:29 PM
I kinda like the idea of Manning taking over at QB for a defensive, run-based team and just being really efficient and making precise throws when he needs to, instead of all the gesticulating herky-jerky he does in Indy. Just kind of a player-coach who is really aware of what the defense is doing and makes sure his offense is running the right plays, but not having to make them all himself. He could do that in SF. It'd almost be like a semi-retirement.

"Yeah, I'm just doing a little work down in San Fran now. It's nice."

In this unrealistic scenario... :P I think the problem would be that Manning WOULD know what the D was doing and would audible to a pass play that would exploit it more often than not.

Caulibflower
01-04-2012, 07:36 PM
In this unrealistic scenario... :P I think the problem would be that Manning WOULD know what the D was doing and would audible to a pass play that would exploit it more often than not.

Yeah, I too have a hard time imagining him audibling to run plays with any regularity. He'd want to make the play himself. Definitely a control freak, so I don't know if he'd even want to go to an offense that didn't want him to throw 30+ times a game. It's just that San Francisco really wouldn't need him to; they've already got a solid offense with Alex Smith in there, Peyton would just be an improvement. If they were to go to a "Peyton-style" offense they'd have to change a few things. I have the feeling Harbaugh likes how well his team controls the clock and field position, though. He's a no-BS coach, and I honestly don't think he'd give a **** if his QB was throwing for another 1000 yards a season.

falloutboy14
01-04-2012, 09:18 PM
Back in the day, Peyton would audible to runs a ton. But when the play call goes ...

1st & 10 Pass
2nd & 1 Run
3rd & 2 Run
4th & 4 Punt

... you tend to call passing plays. That's happened some many times the past few years. The collapse of the run game put Peyton in so many awful spots, but he didn't have a choice if he wanted to score points.

lod01
01-05-2012, 10:46 AM
Manning can come on down to Sf and help us win a few more super bowls... Not like that would happen but it would be nice.

I think it is the #1 scenario if Manning is not paid the roster bonus in March. Manning is no dummy and SF is poised to make a strong run if they had him at QB.