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Brown Leader
01-23-2012, 06:14 PM
4/2

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State

Running Back

1. Trent Richardson, Alabama
2. Doug Martin, Boise State
3. David Wilson, Virginia Tech
4. Lamar Miller, Miami (Fla.)
5. LaMichael James, Oregon

Wide Receiver

1. Justin Blackmon, Oklahoma State
2. Michael Floyd, Notre Dame
3. Kendall Wright, Baylor
4. Stephen Hill, Georgia Tech
5. Alshon Jeffery, South Carolina

Tight End

1. Coby Fleener, Stanford
2. Dwayne Allen, Clemson
3. Orson Charles, Georgia
4. Ladarius Green, Louisiana-Lafayette
5. James Hanna, Oklahoma

Offensive Tackle

1. Matt Kalil, USC
2. Riley Reiff, Iowa
3. Mike Adams, Ohio State
4. Jonathan Martin, Stanford
5. Cordy Glenn, Georgia

Rise: Adams (4)
Fall: Martin (3)

Guard

1. David DeCastro, Stanford
2. Kevin Zeitler, Wisconsin
3. Amini Silatolu, Midwestern State
4. Kelechi Osemele, Iowa State
5. Brandon Brooks, Miami (Ohio)

Center

1. Peter Konz, Wisconsin
2. Philip Blake, Baylor
3. Ben Jones, Georgia
4. David Molk, Michigan
5. Michael Brewster, Ohio State

Defensive End

1. Quinton Coples, North Carolina
2. Courtney Upshaw, Alabama
3. Nick Perry, USC
4. Chandler Jones, Syracuse
5. Vinny Curry, Marshall

New Entry: Jones
Out: Jared Crick, Nebraska (5)
Fall: Curry (4)

Defensive Tackle

1. Fletcher Cox, Mississippi State
2. Jerel Worthy, Michigan State
3. Michael Brockers, LSU
4. Dontari Poe, Memphis
T-5. Kendall Reyes, Connecticut
T-5. Devon Still, Penn St.

Rise: Cox (2), Worthy (4)
Fall: Poe (1)

Outside Linebacker

1. Melvin Ingram, South Carolina
2. Shea McClellin, Boise State
3. Whitney Mercilus, Illinois
4. Andre Branch, Clemson
5. Ronnell Lewis, Oklahoma

Rise: McClellin (5)
Fall: Mercilus (2), Branch (3), Lewis (4)

Inside Linebacker

1. Luke Kuechly, Boston College
2. Dont'a Hightower, Alabama
3. Mychal Kendricks, California
4. Keenan Robinson, Texas
5. Sean Spence, Miami

Cornerback

1. Morris Claiborne, LSU
2. Stephon Gilmore, South Carolina
3. Dre Kirkpatrick, Alabama
4. Janoris Jenkins, North Alabama
5. Josh Robinson, Central Florida

Safety

1. Mark Barron, Alabama
2. Harrison Smith, Notre Dame
3. Brandon Taylor, LSU
4. DeQuan Menzie, Alabama
5. Phillip Thomas, Syracuse
______________________________________

3/5

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State

Running Back

1. Trent Richardson, Alabama
2. Doug Martin, Boise State
3. David Wilson, Virginia Tech
4. Lamar Miller, Miami (Fla.)
5. LaMichael James, Oregon

Rise: Martin
Fall: Miller, Wilson

Wide Receiver

1. Justin Blackmon, Oklahoma State
3. Michael Floyd, Notre Dame
2. Kendall Wright, Baylor
4. Stephen Hill, Georgia Tech
5. Alshon Jeffery, South Carolina

Rise: Floyd
Fall: Wright
New entry: Hill
Out: LSU's Rueben Randle

Tight End

1. Orson Charles, Georgia
2. Coby Fleener, Stanford
3. Dwayne Allen, Clemson
4. Deangelo Peterson, LSU
5. Ladarius Green, Louisiana-Lafayette


Offensive Tackle

1. Matt Kalil, USC
2. Riley Reiff, Iowa
3. Jonathan Martin, Stanford
4. Mike Adams, Ohio State
5. Cordy Glenn, Georgia

Guard

1. David DeCastro, Stanford
2. Kevin Zeitler, Wisconsin
3. Amini Silatolu, Midwestern State
4. Kelechi Osemele, Iowa State
5. Brandon Brooks, Miami (Ohio)

Center

1. Peter Konz, Wisconsin
2. Philip Blake, Baylor
3. Ben Jones, Georgia
4. David Molk, Michigan
5. Michael Brewster, Ohio State

Defensive End

1. Quinton Coples, North Carolina
2. Courtney Upshaw, Alabama
3. Nick Perry, USC
4. Vinny Curry, Marshall
5. Jared Crick, Nebraska

Rise: Coples, Perry, Curry, Crick
New entry: Crick, Upshaw (formerly listed as linebacker)
Out: Clemson's Andre Branch, Illinois' Whitney Mercilus (now listed as outside linebacker), South Carolina's Melvin Ingram (now listed as outside linebacker)

Defensive Tackle

1. Dontari Poe, Memphis
2. Fletcher Cox, Mississippi State
3. Michael Brockers, LSU
4. Jerel Worthy, Michigan State
5. Kendall Reyes, Connecticut

Rise: Poe, Cox
Fall: Brockers, Worthy
Out: Penn State's Devon Still, Clemson's Brandon Thompson

Outside Linebacker

1. Melvin Ingram, South Carolina
2. Whitney Mercilus, Illinois
3. Andre Branch, Clemson
4. Ronnell Lewis, Oklahoma
5. Shea McClellin, Boise State

Out: Alabama's Courtney Upshaw (now listed at defensive end)

Inside Linebacker

1. Luke Kuechly, Boston College
2. Dont'a Hightower, Alabama
3. Mychal Kendricks, California
4. Keenan Robinson, Texas
5. Sean Spence, Miami

Cornerback

1. Morris Claiborne, LSU
2. Dre Kirkpatrick, Alabama
3. Janoris Jenkins, North Alabama
4. Josh Robinson, Central Florida
5. Stephon Gilmore, South Carolina

New entry: Robinson, Gilore
Out: Montana's Trumaine Johnson, Iowa State's Leonard Johnson

Safety

1. Mark Barron, Alabama
2. Harrison Smith, Notre Dame
3. Brandon Taylor, LSU
4. DeQuan Menzie, Alabama
5. Phillip Thomas, Syracuse

New entry: Menzie, Taylor
Out: Boise State's George Iloka, Oklahoma State's Markelle Martin

Complex
01-23-2012, 06:37 PM
Riley Reiff #1 tackle, Que?

Interesting he has Hightower that high along with Chris Givens at WR.

PossibleCabbage
01-23-2012, 06:43 PM
Riley Reiff #1 tackle, Que?

Reiff's a really good LT prospect, and probably underrated by most amateur internet draftniks, but it's hard to justify putting him ahead of Kalil except to be contrarian.

I give Reiff an edge as an athlete, and in terms of pad level and consistency, but Kalil pushes or wins most of the other categories.

FUNBUNCHER
01-23-2012, 06:46 PM
There's no way Dennard is a better pro prospect than Dre.
Mayock does this for a living, but that doesn't mean he's that good at it.

cmarq83
01-23-2012, 06:48 PM
There's no way Dennard is a better pro prospect than Dre.
Mayock does this for a living, but that doesn't mean he's that good at it.

The one thing the man is good at is scouting secondary players. I'm not crazy about Kirkpatrick but that does seem like a bit of a stretch.

DraftSavant
01-23-2012, 06:48 PM
There's no way Dennard is a better pro prospect than Dre.
Mayock does this for a living, but that doesn't mean he's that good at it.

If there is one position I've learned not to question with Mayock, it's DBs. When he says something that's not "consensus" with defensive backs, you'd better ******* pay attention.

I've got a weird feeling that Mayock saw Kirkpatrick get his top blown off by Andre Debose, and that really stuck with him. Just a gut feeling.

FUNBUNCHER
01-23-2012, 06:52 PM
Is anyone that impressed with Dennard???
I thought Amukamara was better, and even he doesn't appear that special a cover guy in the pros.

(Full disclosure; for some reason I get Mayock and McShay confused without a pic. I still think he's overrating Dennard and underrating Kirpatrick.)

A Perfect Score
01-23-2012, 06:54 PM
If there is one position I've learned not to question with Mayock, it's DBs. When he says something that's not "consensus" with defensive backs, you'd better ******* pay attention.

I've got a weird feeling that Mayock saw Kirkpatrick get his top blown off by Andre Debose, and that really stuck with him. Just a gut feeling.

It makes sense though. Kirkpatrick has never really played as well as expectations coming out of high school would lead some people to believe. I said two months ago he wouldn't go Top 10, I'll stick to it now. He is going to have some nice combine numbers I'd imagine though.

Reiff over Kalil is really interesting. I don't agree with it, but I guess I could see why someone might have that opinion. I've got Kalil as an elite talent though.

I trust Mayock more then any other media draftnik, for the record. He makes ESPN his *****.

DraftSavant
01-23-2012, 06:58 PM
Yeah, I'm waiting for his reasoning on Kalil, too.

I've said before that Kalil has a tendency to play lazy and disinterested. He'll make his initial pop, then will turn and watch the play like a spectator. He's not a finisher and needs an NFL OL coach to kick him in the ass. Also has a tendency to get beat inside when he's not focusing.

Still my #1 tackle, though. Dude's got all-world ability, and his quickset is ridiculously good. Just needs to play with better effort snap to snap.

PossibleCabbage
01-23-2012, 06:59 PM
I trust Mayock more then any other media draftnik, for the record.

I do too, but you have to be aware that he does have a major blind spot. There's almost nobody in the media who is less of a "numbers guy" than Mayock. At times he seems offended that people put stock into that which you measure with the combine.

Specifically, if you're short and slow, but you look good on tape then Mayock is going to like you more than other people will.

DraftSavant
01-23-2012, 07:01 PM
I would also say that OL/DL evaluation is his biggest weakness as an evaluator.

DBs/WRs - money. Closer you get to the ball, the worse he is (QB being the exception). Makes sense, dude was a safety.

HeavyLeggedWaistBender
01-23-2012, 07:05 PM
I do too, but you have to be aware that he does have a major blind spot. There's almost nobody in the media who is less of a "numbers guy" than Mayock. At times he seems offended that people put stock into that which you measure with the combine.

Specifically, if you're short and slow, but you look good on tape then Mayock is going to like you more than other people will.

See: Ahmad Black

CDCB14
01-23-2012, 07:12 PM
After watching Dennard today look like a high schooler, if he's better than Kirkpatrick than Kirkpatrick is on of the most overrated players in the draft. He can't be any less fluid than Dennard, and he's 4 inches taller. Mayock usually is money with DB's, but I don't get that one.

gpngc
01-23-2012, 07:16 PM
Don't like David Wilson over Lamar Miller at all.

And Chandler Jones has very little production. Anyone?

Bulldogs
01-23-2012, 07:25 PM
I love Mike Mayock. Best there is out there as a scout. Keep in mind he's been multiple GM jobs and turned them down (rumoured), this isn't McShay or Kiper we're talking about here.

Iamcanadian
01-23-2012, 07:25 PM
Mayock would be the first to tell you that he hasn't done much if any film work on the junior class. This list will change significantly as the process goes on but it is probably a good read on the senior class. As for Kilpatrick, a failed drug test may well be the reason he is so far down the list.
Honestly, I doubt the NFL scouts and GM's have done a whole lot of film work on the junior class. They all wait till they declare before spending a huge amount of time on juniors.

Iamcanadian
01-23-2012, 07:28 PM
After watching Dennard today look like a high schooler, if he's better than Kirkpatrick than Kirkpatrick is on of the most overrated players in the draft. He can't be any less fluid than Dennard, and he's 4 inches taller. Mayock usually is money with DB's, but I don't get that one.

I wouldn't put too much into a drill designed for the offense this early in the week. These players are rusty but will pick up their game as the week progresses.

TACKLE
01-23-2012, 07:37 PM
Remember, Mayock's initial rankings always have underclassmen ranked lower than most because he really focuses on seniors up until guys start declaring.

Grizzlegom
01-23-2012, 07:41 PM
Don't like David Wilson over Lamar Miller at all.

And Chandler Jones has very little production. Anyone?

I heard a rumor that Lamar Miller needs shoulder surgery but is holding off until after the draft and that's scaring some teams off.

Chandler Jones:

Really raw but REALLY athletic.
Should test extremely well (like JPP well).
Great height and length.
Can probably play DE in a 4-3 or OLB in a 34
Extremely fast off the ball.
Showed flashes of dominance at times, had big games against WV and Pitt.
Brother, Arthur, plays for the Ravens, other brother (can't remember his name...) is a UFC fighter.

Gets by on athleticism, lacks a pass rushing repertoire
Lack of sack production (although he's got a good number of TFL)
Missed five games this year with a knee injury
Can be run at, not overly physical

Overall he's your standard raw, athletic DE/OLB tweener. 2nd/3rd round grade but with this weak DE/OLB class, he has as much potential/upside as anyone.

Brown Leader
01-23-2012, 07:52 PM
On Reiff over Kalil, it's not the first I've heard it. Greg Gabriel had a really good write up comparing the two:


Riley Reiff

Reiff is a fourth-year junior and a three-year starter on the Iowa line. He is from Parkston, South Dakota, and played tight end and defensive end in high school. Coming out of high school both Rivals and Scout had him rated as a 3-star defensive end and was mainly a regional recruit having been offered by Iowa, Minnesota and Nebraska. He redshirted his freshman year as an offensive lineman and then cracked the starting lineup in 2009 as a redshirt freshman. That year he had starts at both left and right tackle as well as left guard. In 2010 and 2011 he played only left tackle. Last year when I was watching tape on Ricky Stanzi, Reiff jumped out at me so I was anxious to see how he played this year.

Reiff plays from both from a 2-point and 3-point stance and shows excellent snap reaction and initial quickness. Though he is a tall guy at about 6-6 and 305, he has an even cut body with good arm length and is a natural knee bender. He is very athletic, shows some speed and can play in space. He plays with good strength and power. In the run game he comes off the ball low and is explosive on contact to generate movement. He keeps his feet moving and he is a consistent finisher. He takes good angles to the second level and on the few plays that he pulls he shows that he can adjust on the move to make a productive block. In pass protection, he can set quickly and is very patient. He does an excellent job keeping his hands inside and shows a strong punch and can quickly recoil. He has excellent lateral agility and recovery allowing him to mirror speedy defensive ends and linebackers. You seldom see him get beat by a counter move. With his natural bend he shows a consistent anchor and doesn’t give ground to bull rushers. He has excellent awareness and easily picks up stunts and blitzes. Overall, Reiff has the talent to be a rookie starter in the league. He has the athletic traits to play left tackle and be a very good one. Assuming he has no medical issues he will be a high first-round pick.

Matt Kalil

Kalil has a little different background then Reiff. He played his high school football in the strong leagues of Southern California. His dad was a draft choice of the Buffalo Bills and his older brother Ryan is a Pro Bowl center for Carolina. While Reiff was a 3-star player, Kalil was a 5-star athlete and recruited by all the top programs in the country. Like Reiff, he was redshirted in 2008. He played as a backup in 2009 and has been a starter at left tackle the last two seasons.

Physically, Kalil is a high-cut player with long arms. While he shows he can bend he has a tendency to play tall. His upper body strength is excellent but he still needs to develop his lower strength. Comparing him as an athlete to his former USC teammate from a year ago Tyron Smith, it isn’t close. Smith is a far superior athlete and may be the most athletic tackle in the NFL. While Smith is a better athlete, Kalil is more physical and plays with a nasty disposition.

The first game I watched on Kalil was against Notre Dame and in the first half he struggled some versus Notre Dame defensive end Kapron Lewis-Moore. In the run game, Kalil’s legs buckled a few times and he fell off the block and Lewis-Moore was able to beat him with both a counter move and an outside move to get pressure on the quarterback. In the other games viewed Kalil was much better (Stanford, Washington and Cal)
His overall play in the run game is solid. While he has a tendency to get tall, he still gets movement because of his upper strength and nasty attitude. When he can put his opponent on his back he will do it. He can be a bit inconsistent getting to the second level because he doesn’t consistently break down and adjust to a quick move. I saw him whiff a few times in space. In pass protection he has a very strong punch that he uses to jolt his opponent. Except for the Notre Dame game, I didn’t see him get beat by counter moves and his overall mirror skills were good. Because he gets tall he sometimes has to reset his feet so he won’t give ground versus a bull rush but still his anchor ability is good. Like Reiff he is a very alert and aware player. He has an added benefit of being an excellent Field Goal/Pat blocker. He has had a number of blocked kicks in his career.

Overall, Kalil will be a high pick. Because he has a tendency to play tall, I would want to work him out to see just how good his lower body flexibility is. Though there are lesser athletes playing left tackle in the NFL, his best position may be on the right side where he could become a dominant player. If I had to choose today without the knowledge of the combine, medical exams and a workout I would choose Reiff over Kalil. Reiff may not be as nasty but he is a better athlete with a stronger and more consistent overall game. Both will become excellent NFL players and start early in their careers.

Mayock would be the first to tell you that he hasn't done much if any film work on the junior class. This list will change significantly as the process goes on but it is probably a good read on the senior class. As for Kilpatrick, a failed drug test may well be the reason he is so far down the list.
Honestly, I doubt the NFL scouts and GM's have done a whole lot of film work on the junior class. They all wait till they declare before spending a huge amount of time on juniors.
Past QBs, I don't think he factors in the off field stuff. He just goes with what he sees on tape with the skill guys.

Iamcanadian
01-23-2012, 07:59 PM
Past QBs, I don't think he factors in the off field stuff. He just goes with what he sees on tape with the skill guys.

You may be right, we'll get a better idea by the time the Combine rolls around.

St.Pack
01-23-2012, 08:05 PM
I heard a rumor that Lamar Miller needs shoulder surgery but is holding off until after the draft and that's scaring some teams off.

Chandler Jones:

Really raw but REALLY athletic.
Should test extremely well (like JPP well).
Great height and length.
Can probably play DE in a 4-3 or OLB in a 34
Extremely fast off the ball.
Showed flashes of dominance at times, had big games against WV and Pitt.
Brother, Arthur, plays for the Ravens, other brother (can't remember his name...) is a UFC fighter.

Gets by on athleticism, lacks a pass rushing repertoire
Lack of sack production (although he's got a good number of TFL)
Missed five games this year with a knee injury
Can be run at, not overly physical

Overall he's your standard raw, athletic DE/OLB tweener. 2nd/3rd round grade but with this weak DE/OLB class, he has as much potential/upside as anyone.

I agree with this assessment of C. Jones but many people forget the difference between College Football and Pro Football...in college the coaches often try to put a square peg into a round whole when it comes to their schemes...Syracuse just didn't have the talent to free up Jones to make the big play sacks like say LSU or Alabama's Defenses. There are very few NFL players that ARE the total package...many are effective because of the scheme they're in. I think this is the case with Jones...if he lands on a team that is scheme friendly look for him to develop into a big time player.

JRTPlaya21
01-23-2012, 08:24 PM
I heard a rumor that Lamar Miller needs shoulder surgery but is holding off until after the draft and that's scaring some teams off.

Chandler Jones:

Really raw but REALLY athletic.
Should test extremely well (like JPP well).
Great height and length.
Can probably play DE in a 4-3 or OLB in a 34
Extremely fast off the ball.
Showed flashes of dominance at times, had big games against WV and Pitt.
Brother, Arthur, plays for the Ravens, other brother (can't remember his name...) is a UFC fighter.

Gets by on athleticism, lacks a pass rushing repertoire
Lack of sack production (although he's got a good number of TFL)
Missed five games this year with a knee injury
Can be run at, not overly physical

Overall he's your standard raw, athletic DE/OLB tweener. 2nd/3rd round grade but with this weak DE/OLB class, he has as much potential/upside as anyone.

Uhhh Jon Jones current LHW champ and maybe the best fighter on their roster outside of St. Pierre & Silva......jeeze that family has some crazy talents.

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 08:42 PM
I'm surprised no one's posted Mayock's initial rankings. Some interesting things. It's just Mayock's take but I must say I feel a little vindicated concerning Kirkpatrick, who I thought was getting pretty overrated with all the top ten projections.

RB
1. Trent Richardson
2. David Wilson
3. Lamar Miller
4. Doug Martin
5. LaMichael James
CB
1. Mo Claiborne
2. Janoris Jenkins
3. Alfonzo Dennard
4. Leonard Johnson
5. Dre Kirkpatrick


On what grounds Wilson is rated higher then Miller?

Straight up disrespect for Kirkpatrick. If that was the case he be rated 5th, Mayock might as well slid him over to the Safety rankings as #2.

Sloopy
01-23-2012, 08:51 PM
I know some people will just say that I'm an OSU homer but I have Mike Adams ranked higher than Martin, and he is certainly better than Sanders and Brown IMO.

Also Hightower over Taze is a joke and no mention of Cole whom I would also put over Hightower

I would also put Poe a bit higher (IMO one of the best potential players at the position in the draft) and I don't know if LaMichael James should be in anyones top 5 RBs, I'm still not 100% sure of his ability to hold up in the NFL

K Train
01-23-2012, 08:52 PM
i like the corner rankings...dre would be my #1 safety tho

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 09:12 PM
i like the corner rankings...dre would be my #1 safety tho

Agreeable! I was just giving the benefit of doubt saying #2

DiG
01-23-2012, 10:09 PM
nice to see someone other than ROP and I that aren't crazy high on Kalil as an elite top 5 tackle.

fenikz
01-23-2012, 10:15 PM
Mayock has been fairly terrible in recent years imo

fischbowl
01-23-2012, 10:20 PM
Hate to sound ********, but who is #4 OT James Brown?

K Train
01-23-2012, 10:26 PM
from troy? dont know much about him though.


brandon washington not being on the list is ******* criminal

shylo3716
01-23-2012, 10:46 PM
Mayock has been fairly terrible in recent years imo


He proved that with Kirkpatrick being the 5th rated CB.

ElectricEye
01-23-2012, 11:12 PM
Interesting how high he is on Givens. Not sure I would slot him that high, but he's a guy I want to go back and look at some more for sure, especially now.

lowlife
01-23-2012, 11:15 PM
Meh, just the first rankings. Reiff over Kalil makes my Iowa wiener stiff.

Good seeing Janoris Jenkins and Harrison Smith being rated highly.

No mention of Mike Adams is a little criminal.

Also Janzen Jackson as #3 S?

holt_bruce81
01-23-2012, 11:38 PM
I'm not as high on Ladarius Green as some people are. I think his hands are questionable, he's not that physical and he plays like he's 6'1 not 6'6 if that makes sense. He doesn't use his size to his advantage.

I think Alshon Jeffery is the 2nd best receiver in this draft, I think he is going to have a very inpressive combine.

SenorGato
01-24-2012, 12:15 AM
Anything more on Chandler Jones? Definitely a name I just glossed over all the time...No clue when the heck Syracuse would be on the picture box either.

WT01
01-24-2012, 02:22 AM
He proved that with Kirkpatrick being the 5th rated CB.

Really? Calling him terrible at his job because he had Kirkpatrick lower and Dennard higher than you do? That makes sense. I've seen others who also believe that Kirkpatrick is pretty bad at actually covering receivers and is currently ranking high on draftniks' ratings because of reputation.

RaiderNation
01-24-2012, 02:27 AM
Anything more on Chandler Jones? Definitely a name I just glossed over all the time...No clue when the heck Syracuse would be on the picture box either.

Some have said he could be the next Aldon Smith type prospect. Similar size and position, if Jones tests well he will most likely go early. I don't think he's a 1st rounder right now but could be by April. I'd say a 3rd round rating is solid for now....

shylo3716
01-24-2012, 04:49 AM
Really? Calling him terrible at his job because he had Kirkpatrick lower and Dennard higher than you do? That makes sense. I've seen others who also believe that Kirkpatrick is pretty bad at actually covering receivers and is currently ranking high on draftniks' ratings because of reputation.

We can go back and forth all day on this, but I choose not to. YOU WIN!

ZRO
01-24-2012, 04:53 AM
If there is one position I've learned not to question with Mayock, it's DBs. When he says something that's not "consensus" with defensive backs, you'd better ******* pay attention.

I've got a weird feeling that Mayock saw Kirkpatrick get his top blown off by Andre Debose, and that really stuck with him. Just a gut feeling.

It's funny how Mayock has garnered this reputation as a master expert on DB's when it simply isn't true. My lasting memory of him is back in 2007 trumpeting Chris Houston as the best CB in the draft. Pretty sure he was the only guy that had Houston ranked above Darelle Revis (and Leon Hall, for that matter). He was really pumping up Taylor Mays a few years back too.

I find when looking back through his history that he's been wrong far more than he's been right.

descendency
01-24-2012, 05:23 AM
I give Reiff an edge as an athlete, and in terms of pad level and consistency, but Kalil pushes or wins most of the other categories.

Reiff comes from a program that has major success in producing OT. USC, however, has had some big time recent flops.

No mention of Mike Adams is a little criminal.

Also Janzen Jackson as #3 S?

Mike Adams is debatable. His play on the field is questionable. He definitely looks the part of an NFL OT.

Janzen Jackson has elite safety talent. He's just a nutcase. (he quit his team, so he will be off numerous NFL teams' big boards)

WT01
01-24-2012, 06:00 AM
It's funny how Mayock has garnered this reputation as a master expert on DB's when it simply isn't true. My lasting memory of him is back in 2007 trumpeting Chris Houston as the best CB in the draft. Pretty sure he was the only guy that had Houston ranked above Darelle Revis (and Leon Hall, for that matter). He was really pumping up Taylor Mays a few years back too.

I find when looking back through his history that he's been wrong far more than he's been right.

I don't think anyone is arguing that he's perfect. But I much prefer Mayock to many of these other so called major draft "experts" such as Kiper and McShay.

fenikz
01-24-2012, 06:34 AM
Thing sticking in my mind is how much he loved Gabbert when it seemed so obvious to most of us on this board who watched any film on him that he was god awful.

Bulldogs
01-24-2012, 07:47 AM
Thing sticking in my mind is how much he loved Gabbert when it seemed so obvious to most of us on this board who watched any film on him that he was god awful.

He's great at scouting some positions, and not so great at others. Anyways, I wouldn't put much weight into these rankings, Mayock himself will admit he hasn't watched much of the juniors yet. Don't see how you could hate on Mayock though, he's still as great as ever.

the_dark_knight
01-24-2012, 08:19 AM
For sure, it's early in the draft season, I expect many many changes to these lists. Kirkpatrick being #5 is no great injustice imo. I like him, but I like corners that are physical and strong, a lot of teams don't, and the truth of the matter is, if he can't get his hands on you then it's likely you've won the route as the WR. That's true with a lot of big physical guys, but it holds true here, and I could see him having some Brandon Browner in him.

I like his skillset personally, but it would be a scheme fit, I do think he could do the Malcom Jenkins thing and move to FS and be a very very good Safety.

K Train
01-24-2012, 09:50 AM
It's funny how Mayock has garnered this reputation as a master expert on DB's when it simply isn't true. My lasting memory of him is back in 2007 trumpeting Chris Houston as the best CB in the draft. Pretty sure he was the only guy that had Houston ranked above Darelle Revis (and Leon Hall, for that matter). He was really pumping up Taylor Mays a few years back too.

I find when looking back through his history that he's been wrong far more than he's been right.

he was way more pro-earl thomas than mays (and berry for that matter lol)

Sloopy
01-24-2012, 10:43 AM
Mike Adams is debatable. His play on the field is questionable. He definitely looks the part of an NFL OT.

He struggles with some technique at times (knee bending etc.) but he has the feet and athleticism to play LT and his strength is unreal.

Definitely going to take some work but I think could end up being the #2 #3 OT out of this draft down the road. Some team will pounce on him if he falls and I wouldn't bat an eye if a team fell in love with him over Martin and took him ahead of Martin.

DraftSavant
01-24-2012, 10:46 AM
Thing sticking in my mind is how much he loved Gabbert when it seemed so obvious to most of us on this board who watched any film on him that he was god awful.

EVERYONE was pumping up Gabbert because they were terrified of going with Cam.

Narrative scouting.

katnip
01-24-2012, 10:49 AM
Mayock maybe rated Dre lower then most here expect because of the "Off field issues/pot?"

And it didn't help Brandon Washington moved around the o-line so much.

brat316
01-24-2012, 10:57 AM
Does anyone have his last year rankings?

descendency
01-24-2012, 11:02 AM
Does anyone have his last year rankings?

Quarterbacks
Blaine Gabbert, Missouri
Jake Locker, Washington
Cam Newton, Auburn
Ryan Mallett, Arkansas
Andy Dalton, TCU

Running Backs
Mark Ingram, Alabama
Mikel Leshoure, Illinois
Daniel Thomas, Kansas State
Ryan Williams, Virginia Tech
Jacquizz Rodgers, Oregon State

Wide Receivers
A.J. Green, Georgia
Julio Jones, Alabama
Titus Young, Boise State
Jonathan Baldwin, Pittsburgh
Torrey Smith, Maryland

Tight Ends
Kyle Rudolph, Notre Dame
Lance Kendricks, Wisconsin
Luke Stocker, Tennessee
D.J. Williams, Arkansas
Virgil Green, Nevada

Interior Offensive Line
Mike Pouncey, Florida
Danny Watkins, Baylor
Clint Boling, Georgia
John Moffitt, Wisconsin
Rodney Hudson, Florida State

Offensive Tackles
Anthony Castonzo, Boston College
Nate Solder, Colorado
Tyron Smith, USC
Gabe Carimi, Wisconsin
(tie) Ben Ijalana, Villanova; Derek Sherrod, Mississippi State

Defensive Ends
Da'Quan Bowers, Clemson
J.J. Watt, Wisconsin
Adrian Clayborn, Iowa
Cameron Jordan, California
Robert Quinn, North Carolina

Defensive Tackle
Marcell Dareus, Alabama
Nick Fairley, Auburn
Corey Liuget, Illinois
Stephen Paea, Oregon State
Jurrell Casey, USC

Outside Linebacker
Von Miller, Texas A&M
Akeem Ayers, UCLA
Justin Houston, Georgia
Bruce Carter, North Carolina
Chris Carter, Fresno State

Inside Linebackers
Martez Wilson, Illinois
Colin McCarthy, Miami (FL)
Quan Sturdivant, North Carolina
Casey Matthews, Oregon
Kelvin Sheppard, LSU

corner
Patrick Peterson, LSU
Prince Amukamara, Nebraska
Aaron Williams, Texas
Jimmy Smith, Colorado
Brandon Harris, Miami (FL)

safety
Rahim Moore, UCLA
Ahmad Black, Florida
Marcus Gilchrist, Clemson
Quinton Carter, Oklahoma
Deunta Williams, North Carolina

K Train
01-24-2012, 11:10 AM
he ended up moving cam to the top i believe

brat316
01-24-2012, 11:15 AM
Mike Mayock's top prospects by position for the 2009 NFL Draft
Rank Player School Comment
Quarterbacks
1*Mark Sanchez USC Tremendous skills, 16 college starts
2*Matthew Stafford Georgia Elite arm, inconsistent in pocket
3*Josh Freeman Kansas State Tremendous arm/athletic, speed-up process
4Pat White West Virginia Excellent arm/accuracy, the new 'slash'?
5Stephen McGee Texas A&M Physical/athletic, injured as a senior

Running backs
1*Knowshon Moreno Georgia Lateral quickness, love his finish
2*Chris "Beanie" Wells Ohio State Downhill runner, inconsistent durability
3*Donald Brown Connecticut Great quickness, makes people miss, patient
4*LeSean McCoy Pittsburgh Vision and cutback ability, questionable long speed
5*Shonn Greene North Carolina State Fast riser, durability issues

Fullback
1Tony Fiammetta Syracuase Old-school blocker, robotic-but-able receiver
2Quinn Johnson LSU Lead blocker/special teams, 5 career catches
3Brannan Southerland Georgia Versatile blocker and receiver, durability issues

Wide receivers
1*Michael Crabtree Texas Tech Great ball skills/competitor, questionable long speed
2*Percy Harvin Florida Big-play ability, durability/usage
3*Jeremy Maclin Missouri Explosive R.A.C., production/added value RS
4*Darrius Heyward-Bey Maryland H-W-S specimen, inconsistent hands
5*Brian Robiskie Ohio State Best route-runner, great value

Tight ends
1 Brandon Pettigrew Oklahoma State Old-school TE like Jason Witten, not a blazer
2 Cornelius Ingram Florida Gifted athlete, missed '08 (torn ACL)
3 Shawn Nelson Southern Miss Gifted vertical receiver, willing blocker
4 Jared Cook South Carolina Tremendous measurables, vertical threat
5 *James Casey Rice Natural ball skills, not a blocker

Centers
1 Max Unger Oregon 4-position OL, will struggle with speed
2 Eric Wood Louisville Tough guy/finishes well, struggles to redirect feet
3 Alex Mack California Intelligent/great technique, on ground too much
4 A.Q. Shipley Penn State Short arms/good player, understands technique/leverage

5 Antoine Caldwell Alabama Can play all 3 interior OL spots, tough guy
Guards
1 Andy Levitre Oregon State Former LT, must kick inside
2 Duke Robinson Oklahoma Massive brawler, will struggle with speed
3 Kraig Urbik Wisconsin 4-position OL, solid technician/long career
4 Tyronne Green Auburn Tremendous Senior Bowl week, great initial pop/must sustain
5 Herman Johnson LSU Largest baby in La. history, scheme-specific player

Offensive tackles
1 Eugene Monroe Virginia Kept Branden Albert at guard, gifted pass protector
2 Jason Smith Baylor Think Ryan Clady, needs run-game improvement
3 *Andre Smith Alabama Surprisingly nimble feet, beware weight fluctuation
4 Michael Oher Mississippi Naturally gifted LT, highly inconsistent
5 *Eben Britton Arizona Solid technician, needs more sand in pants

Defensive ends
Rk Player School Comment
1 Robert Ayers Tennessee Great burst at Senior Bowl, one-year wonder?
2 Tyson Jackson LSU Scheme diverse, might kick inside
3 Everette Brown Florida State Right DE or rush LB, significant upside
4 Paul Kruger Utah Great motor/stacks edge, not an elite edge burst
5 Michael Johnson Georgia Tech Physical specimen, Too much bad tape

Defensive tackles
1 B.J. Raji Boston College Run stuffer can push pocket, stay at 328 pounds!!!
2 Peria Jerry Mississippi 1-gap penetrator, must stay healthy
3 Evander "Ziggy" Hood Missouri Energizer Bunny, scheme will be crucial
4 Ron Brace Boston College Gifted run defender, limited pass-rush ability
5 Fili Moala USC Physical specimen, must be more consistent

Inside linebackers
1 Rey Maualuga USC Explosive point of attack, can struggle in space
2 James Laurinaitis Ohio State Consistent technician, clean off the field
3 Jasper Brinkley South Carolina No comment
4 Darry Beckwith LSU Athletic and solid tackler, engulfed by big bodies
5 Jason Phillips TCU Productive/hard-nosed, had postseason knee surgery

Outside linebackers
1 Aaron Curry Wake Forest Scheme diverse/high-level performer, safest pick in draft
2 Brian Orakpo Texas Talented conversion guy, explosive off edge
3 Brian Cushing USC Love attitude/passion, 4-3 SAM/3-4 ILB?
4 Clay Matthews USC Special talent, Nickel OLB
T-5th Larry English Northern Illinois Can run the arc, level of competition
T-5th Aaron Maybin Penn State Can he sustain 250 pounds or stop the run?

Cornerbacks
1 Malcolm Jenkins Ohio State Great length/very physical, CB or FS?
2 Vontae Davis Illinois Highly gifted skill-set, inconsistent on/off field
3 Darius Butler Connecticut Best feet/C.O.D. at Senior Bowl, must tackle consistently
4 Alphonso Smith Wake Forest Great instincts/ball skills, size/speed questions
5 *Jairus Byrd Vanderbilt Quick feet/thin frame, loves to compete
Safeties
1 Louis Delmas Western Michigan Aggressive vs. run/good tackler, average in man-to-man
2 Patrick Chung Oregon Very solid box safety, likes press/dislikes off-man
3 William Moore Missouri Jekyll or Hyde, physically gifted
4 Rashad Johnson Alabama Made 11 INTs in two years, CB body
5 Chip Vaugn Wake Forest Good size/speed, special teams gunner

K Train
01-24-2012, 11:17 AM
his oline rankings were **** that year lol

brat316
01-24-2012, 11:19 AM
And another ranking

http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d81796801/article/tebow-continues-steady-climb-surpasses-mccoy-in-latest-rankings

ElectricEye
01-24-2012, 12:33 PM
Darius Butler....****. We got burned on that one bad.

PossibleCabbage
01-24-2012, 12:54 PM
Darius Butler....****. We got burned on that one bad.

Which is weird, because he's not the classic "short and slow" (4103, 4.41) prospect that Mayock consistently whiffs on.

I mean, he's not tall and fast either, he's just kind of average.

SenorGato
01-24-2012, 01:10 PM
Many any of those three '09 safeties would be cool on the Jets...How'd we miss them? Oh yeah they all went pretty high and we were busy chasing the Sanchez.

Babylon
01-24-2012, 01:31 PM
EVERYONE was pumping up Gabbert because they were terrified of going with Cam.

Narrative scouting.

The guys at NFLN didnt like Newton so they had to go with someone as the top QB. Mayock liked Locker quite a bit but that would mean going against what the establishment there was saying was crazy. I think Gabbert was the default number 1 and he ended up being the 3rd guy taken at that position. To me they lost a lot of their credibility during that whole process.

As for the Kalil below Reiff debate i honesly didnt see as much of Iowa this year as i did the year before but i like Reiff a lot. My preferance though would be Kalil. He has great footwork and hands and has a bit of a mean streak.

WT01
01-24-2012, 01:32 PM
his oline rankings were **** that year lol

As were everyone's. That 2009 draft was baaaad.

San Diego Chicken
01-24-2012, 01:58 PM
Mayock's been a lot busier lately so his rankings have slid down in my opinion from where he once was. Kiper's solidly ahead of him in the last few drafts.

ChiFan24
01-24-2012, 02:17 PM
Am I the only one completely baffled by James Brown? That's gotta be a mistake, right? He probably meant Mike Adams.

ChiFan24
01-24-2012, 02:19 PM
edit: Or maybe not. Apparently I just don't watch enough Sun Belt.

Bulldogs
01-24-2012, 02:19 PM
Am I the only one completely baffled by James Brown? That's gotta be a mistake, right? He probably meant Mike Adams.

On the actual NFL Network when I was watching it he had Mike Adams as 4 so yes, that must be a mistake.

ChiFan24
01-24-2012, 02:19 PM
On the actual NFL Network when I was watching it he had Mike Adams as 4 so yes, that must be a mistake.

Oh, okay. That makes a lot more sense.

descendency
01-24-2012, 02:43 PM
Which is weird, because he's not the classic "short and slow" (4103, 4.41) prospect that Mayock consistently whiffs on.

I mean, he's not tall and fast either, he's just kind of average.
At 4 feet 10 3/8th inches I have to disagree... he's short.

(yeah, I know it's a typo... that's 5103)

PossibleCabbage
01-24-2012, 03:01 PM
At 4 feet 10 3/8th inches I have to disagree... he's short.

(yeah, I know it's a typo... that's 5103)

Lol... in my defense, 5 is next to 4 on the keyboard.

Jakey
01-24-2012, 03:15 PM
Lol... in my defense, 5 is next to 4 on the keyboard.

DefiniteCabbage.

Sloopy
01-24-2012, 07:57 PM
Running backs
1*Knowshon Moreno Georgia Lateral quickness, love his finish
2*Chris "Beanie" Wells Ohio State Downhill runner, inconsistent durability
3*Donald Brown Connecticut Great quickness, makes people miss, patient
4*LeSean McCoy Pittsburgh Vision and cutback ability, questionable long speed
5*Shonn Greene North Carolina State Fast riser, durability issues


Interesting because Shonn Greene went to Iowa

SchizophrenicBatman
01-24-2012, 10:38 PM
Did I miss something or did he leave Aldon Smith off his rankings last year?

Roddoliver
01-24-2012, 11:12 PM
Did I miss something or did he leave Aldon Smith off his rankings last year?

And Ryan Kerrigan too.

Complex
01-24-2012, 11:15 PM
I thought he had Aldon Smith in his ranking and Cam Newton as his #1 QB.

WT01
01-25-2012, 02:33 AM
Did I miss something or did he leave Aldon Smith off his rankings last year?

And Ryan Kerrigan too.

Those have to be an older version of his rankings. I specifically remember Mayock being a huge fan of Kerrigan (pretty easy to remember him talking about Kerrigan with the thick Northeastern accent of his). Dunno about Smith though.

descendency
01-25-2012, 05:15 AM
Here's one posted a few days before the draft. No sign of Kerrigan though.

Quarterbacks
1. Blaine Gabbert, Missouri
2. Cam Newton, Auburn
3. Jake Locker, Washington
4. Ryan Mallett, Arkansas
T-5. Andy Dalton, TCU
T-5. Christian Ponder

Running Back
1. Mark Ingram, Alabama
2. Ryan Williams, Virginia Tech
3. Daniel Thomas, Kansas State
4. Mikel Leshoure, Illinois
5. Kendall Hunter, Okie St.

Wide Receivers
1. A.J. Green, Georgia
2. Julio Jones, Alabama
3. Titus Young, Boise St.
4. Jonathan Baldwin, Pittsburgh
T-5. Torrey Smith, Maryland
T-5. Randall Cobb

Tight Ends
1. Kyle Rudolph, Notre Dame
2. Lance Kendricks, Wisconsin
3. Luke Stocker, Tennessee
4. D.J. Williams, Arkansas
5. Virgil Green, Nevada

Interior Offensive Line
1. Mike Pouncey, Florida
2. Danny Watkins, Baylor
3. Rodney Hudson, Florida State
4. Marcus Cannon, TCU
5. Clint Boling, Georgia

Offensive Tackles
1. Anthony Castonzo, Boston College
2. Tyron Smith, USC
3. Gabe Carimi, Wisconsin
4. Nate Solder, Colorado
T-5. Ben Ijalana, Villanova
T-5. Derek Sherrod, Mississippi State

Defensive Ends
1. Robert Quinn, North Carolina
2. Cameron Jordan, California
3. J.J. Watt, Wisconsin
4. Aldon Smith, Missouri
5. Da’Quan Bowers, Clemson

Defensive Tackle
1. Marcell Dareus, Alabama
2. Nick Fairley, Auburn
3. Corey Liuget, Illinois
4. Marvin Austin, North Carolina
5. Muhammad Wilkerson, Temple

Outside Linebacker
1. Von Miller, Texas A&M
2. Akeem Ayers, UCLA
3. Bruce Carter, North Carolina
4. Dontay Moch, Nevada
5. Justin Houston, Georgia

Inside Linebackers
1. Martez Wilson, Illinois
2. Casey Matthews, Oregon
3. Colin McCarthy, Miami (FL)
4. Kelvin Sheppard, LSU
5. Akeem Dent, Georgia

Cornerbacks
1. Patrick Peterson, LSU
2. Prince Amukamara, Nebraska
3. Jimmy Smith, Colorado
4. Ras-I Dowling, Virginia
5. Brandon Harris, Miami (FL)

Safeties
1. Aaron Williams, Texas
2. Rahim Moore, UCLA
3. Marcus Gilchrist, Clemson
4. Ahmad Black, Florida
5. Quinton Carter, Oklahoma

PossibleCabbage
01-25-2012, 10:20 AM
Here's one posted a few days before the draft. No sign of Kerrigan though.

*snip*

Defensive Ends
1. Robert Quinn, North Carolina
2. Cameron Jordan, California
3. J.J. Watt, Wisconsin
4. Aldon Smith, Missouri
5. Da’Quan Bowers, Clemson

*snip*

Outside Linebacker
1. Von Miller, Texas A&M
2. Akeem Ayers, UCLA
3. Bruce Carter, North Carolina
4. Dontay Moch, Nevada
5. Justin Houston, Georgia

At a guess, Mayock was thinking of Kerrigan as a DE not an OLB, being skeptical of his ability to play in space (as many were), and wasn't making a distinction between the guys he rated high as 5-techs (Watt, Jordan) and the guys who project as more traditional ends in an even front.

Brown Leader
02-14-2012, 09:18 PM
QB
1. Andrew Luck
2. Robert Griffin
3. Ryan Tannehill
RB
1. Trent Richardson
2. David Wilson
3. Lamar Miller
4. Doug Martin
5. LaMichael James
WR
1. Justin Blackmon
2. Michael Floyd
3. Kendall Wright
4. Alshon Jeffrey
5. Chris Givens
TE
1. Dwayne Allen
2. Coby Fleener
3. Orson Charles
4. Ladarius Green
5. Micheal Egnew
OT
1. Riley Reiff
2. Matt Kalil
3. Jon Martin
4. Mike Adams
5. James Brown
5. Zebrie Sanders
OG/OC
1. David DeCastro
2. Peter Konz
3. Kevin Zeitler
4. Cordy Glenn
5. Kelechi Osemele
DE
1. Quinton Coples
2. Melvin Ingram
3. Whitney Mericlus
4. Nick Perry
5. Chandler Jones
5. Andre Branch
DT
1. Devon Still
2. Jerel Worthy
3. Mike Brockers
4. Brandon Thompson
5. Fletcher Cox
5. Dontari Poe
LB
1. Courtney Upshaw
2. Luke Keuchly
3. Donta Hightower
4. Zach Brown
5. Vontaze Burfict
CB
1. Mo Claiborne
2. Janoris Jenkins
3. Alfonzo Dennard
4. Leonard Johnson
5. Dre Kirkpatrick
S
1. Mike Barron
2. Harrison Smith
3. George Iloka
4. Markelle Martin
5. Janzen Jackson
5. Antonio Allen


Updated 2/14

QB
1. Andrew Luck
2. Robert Griffin
3. Ryan Tannehill
4. Brandon Weeden
5. Nick Foles
RB
1. Trent Richardson
2. David Wilson
3. Lamar Miller
4. Doug Martin
5. LaMichael James
WR
1. Justin Blackmon
2. Kendall Wright
3. Michael Floyd
4. Reuben Randle
5. Alshon Jeffrey
TE
1. Orson Charles
2. Coby Fleener
3. Dwayne Allen
4. Deangelo Peterson
5. Ladarius Green
OT
1. Matt Kalil
2. Riley Reiff
3. Jonathan Martin
4. Mike Adams
5. Cordy Glenn
OG/OC
1. David DeCastro
2. Peter Konz
3. Kevin Zeitler
4. Amini Silatolu
5. Kelechi Osemele
DE
1. Melvin Ingram
2. Quinton Coples
3. Andre Branch
4. Whitney Mercilus
5. Nick Perry
5.Vinnie Curry
DT
1. Mike Brockers
2. Jerel Worthy
3. Dontari Poe
4. Devon Still
5. Fletcher Cox
5. Kendell Reyes
5. Brandon Thompson
LB
1. Courtney Upshaw
2. Luke Keuchly
3. Donta Hightower
4. Ronnell Lewis
5. Sean Spence
CB
1. Mo Claiborne
2. Dre Kirkpatrick
3. Janoris Jenkins
4. Trumaine Johnson
5. Leonard Johnson
S
1. Mike Barron
2. Harrison Smith
3. George Iloka
4. Markelle Martin
5. Phillip Thomas

descendency
02-15-2012, 12:06 AM
Updated 2/14
S
1. Mike Barron
2. Harrison Smith
3. George Iloka
4. Markelle Martin
5. Phillip Thomas

I'd love to hear Mike Mayock talk about this safety class, because I don't really feel that the top 3 or even 4 are separated by that much.

I've really become a George Iloka fan after seeing a few games of Boise State. I personally think he's the kind of guy you need to cover bigger slot receivers and TEs. He's got LB and CB skills that mesh well to create what looks like a very good safety. I'd be utterly shocked if he made it passed NE's first second rounder (48 from Oakland). He's a perfect complement to Patrick Chung.

Harrison Smith reminds me of a strong safety too much. He's very instinctive which can cover up for a lack of speed, but I'm just not sure how he will handle NFL speed.

Dan_Steele
02-15-2012, 12:17 AM
Very surprised to see Foles over Osweiler or Cousins at that #5 QB spot.

SenorGato
02-15-2012, 12:39 AM
I'd love to hear Mike Mayock talk about this safety class, because I don't really feel that the top 3 or even 4 are separated by that much.

I've really become a George Iloka fan after seeing a few games of Boise State. I personally think he's the kind of guy you need to cover bigger slot receivers and TEs. He's got LB and CB skills that mesh well to create what looks like a very good safety. I'd be utterly shocked if he made it passed NE's first second rounder (48 from Oakland). He's a perfect complement to Patrick Chung.

Harrison Smith reminds me of a strong safety too much. He's very instinctive which can cover up for a lack of speed, but I'm just not sure how he will handle NFL speed.

+1

Agreed on your opinion of both him and Harrison Smith...that said I think Barron is a far superior prospect to Smith and there's a healthy gap between him and Iloka. I do like Iloka alot though...he's really the only other safety I really want to see the Jets draft this year besides Barron.

duesouth
02-15-2012, 04:41 AM
I like Markelle Martin more than Smith - just looks a bit quicker getting downhill. I also think Martin offers a little more in terms of versatility projecting him forward - could also play safety in a Cover-2 for example - whereas Smith is just an in the box safety.

I do remember Mayock saying he'd only seen one OSU game so far - not sure if that's made it tough for him to rate Martin? I think most draftniks will have seen more games than Mayock - he's been too busy with the NFL.

Iloka's move to CB late in the year was a real plus for him. I didn't think he always stood out at safety for Boise - but a safety who can cover = a high pick. He's a bigger Marcus Gilchrist who was pick 50 last year.

Bulldogs
02-15-2012, 06:47 AM
Remember when everybody had their panties in a bunch when Mayock didn't have Kalil as his top guy or Kirkpatrick pretty low? Mayock didn't get to his juniors yet, not that he has, his rankings have been adjusted accordingly.

MURPHMAN
02-15-2012, 11:55 AM
Cordy Glenn dropping out of the top 5? Wonder if his stock really is slipping.

edit: oh, has him as OT now.

JohnCandy
02-15-2012, 03:10 PM
Cordy Glenn as an OT is interesting.

Ruben Randle in the top 5 and carrying what appears to be a 1st round grade is really interesting.

http://www.nfl.com/combine/story/09000d5d826f9cd9/article/precombine-position-rankings-for-2012-nfl-draft?module=HP11_content_stream

DraftSavant
02-15-2012, 03:34 PM
@evansilva: Mayock doesn't believe #Iowa LT Riley Reiff is a top-10 talent in the draft, but very well could be due to the "value of the position."

So, IamCanadian, will you now agree that the position has become devalued? MAYOCK SAID IT!

K Train
02-15-2012, 03:42 PM
no taze in his top 5 linebackers? mayock is dead to me

San Diego Chicken
02-15-2012, 04:02 PM
no taze in his top 5 linebackers? mayock is dead to me

Can't blame him too much there.

PossibleCabbage
02-15-2012, 04:25 PM
no taze in his top 5 linebackers? mayock is dead to me

I think about half of NFL teams just aren't going to have him on their draft boards.

The other half should have him reasonably high, though.

ATLDirtyBirds
02-15-2012, 04:27 PM
I've really become a George Iloka fan after seeing a few games of Boise State. I personally think he's the kind of guy you need to cover bigger slot receivers and TEs. He's got LB and CB skills that mesh well to create what looks like a very good safety. I'd be utterly shocked if he made it passed NE's first second rounder (48 from Oakland). He's a perfect complement to Patrick Chung.



I'm a huge Iloka fan. He's Kam Chancellor.


Mayock also did something with his rankings that I've been feeling lately. Orson Charles as the #1 TE.

K Train
02-15-2012, 06:20 PM
Can't blame him too much there.

i just cant see the rationality, maybe i just have a soft spot for psychotic head hunting middle linebackers. penalties are a concern, but i wouldnt say hes a bad person and he can flat out play linebacker. not making the top 5 is just a smack to the face

descendency
02-15-2012, 06:26 PM
i just cant see the rationality

The past season, Vontaze was below average.

SolidGold
02-15-2012, 06:56 PM
i just cant see the rationality, maybe i just have a soft spot for psychotic head hunting middle linebackers. penalties are a concern, but i wouldnt say hes a bad person and he can flat out play linebacker. not making the top 5 is just a smack to the face

Here is what Mayock says about Burfict:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/15/mayock-vontaze-burfict-is-not-a-first-round-player-at-all/

SuperPacker
02-15-2012, 07:00 PM
Here is what Mayock says about Burfict:

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/15/mayock-vontaze-burfict-is-not-a-first-round-player-at-all/

All the Ravens fans desperately wanting Burfict in the first round need to take a read of that! He's never going first round...

K Train
02-15-2012, 07:12 PM
i disagree. sure im expecting him to regain his form from a year ago but i still think he could and will be great. hes my number 1 still this year...combine is gonna be important for him, hightower, and kuechly all in their own ways.

i think hes better than mcclain was, but not a patrick willis type prospect by any means. top 15 talent imo, even if he has a 4th round brain

TACKLE
02-15-2012, 07:23 PM
All the Ravens fans desperately wanting Burfict in the first round need to take a read of that! He's never going first round...

cool, thanks.

coordinator0
02-15-2012, 07:25 PM
All the Ravens fans desperately wanting Burfict in the first round need to take a read of that! He's never going first round...

Scott likes him there.

A Perfect Score
02-15-2012, 07:27 PM
All the Ravens fans desperately wanting Burfict in the first round need to take a read of that! He's never going first round...

I'll still take him over Hightower every day of the week.

Brown Leader
03-06-2012, 03:41 PM
Mayock's new update:

3/5

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State

Running Back

1. Trent Richardson, Alabama
2. Doug Martin, Boise State
3. David Wilson, Virginia Tech
4. Lamar Miller, Miami (Fla.)
5. LaMichael James, Oregon

Rise: Martin
Fall: Miller, Wilson

Wide Receiver

1. Justin Blackmon, Oklahoma State
3. Michael Floyd, Notre Dame
2. Kendall Wright, Baylor
4. Stephen Hill, Georgia Tech
5. Alshon Jeffery, South Carolina

Rise: Floyd
Fall: Wright
New entry: Hill
Out: LSU's Rueben Randle

Tight End

1. Orson Charles, Georgia
2. Coby Fleener, Stanford
3. Dwayne Allen, Clemson
4. Deangelo Peterson, LSU
5. Ladarius Green, Louisiana-Lafayette


Offensive Tackle

1. Matt Kalil, USC
2. Riley Reiff, Iowa
3. Jonathan Martin, Stanford
4. Mike Adams, Ohio State
5. Cordy Glenn, Georgia

Guard

1. David DeCastro, Stanford
2. Kevin Zeitler, Wisconsin
3. Amini Silatolu, Midwestern State
4. Kelechi Osemele, Iowa State
5. Brandon Brooks, Miami (Ohio)

Center

1. Peter Konz, Wisconsin
2. Philip Blake, Baylor
3. Ben Jones, Georgia
4. David Molk, Michigan
5. Michael Brewster, Ohio State

Defensive End

1. Quinton Coples, North Carolina
2. Courtney Upshaw, Alabama
3. Nick Perry, USC
4. Vinny Curry, Marshall
5. Jared Crick, Nebraska

Rise: Coples, Perry, Curry, Crick
New entry: Crick, Upshaw (formerly listed as linebacker)
Out: Clemson's Andre Branch, Illinois' Whitney Mercilus (now listed as outside linebacker), South Carolina's Melvin Ingram (now listed as outside linebacker)

Defensive Tackle

1. Dontari Poe, Memphis
2. Fletcher Cox, Mississippi State
3. Michael Brockers, LSU
4. Jerel Worthy, Michigan State
5. Kendall Reyes, Connecticut

Rise: Poe, Cox
Fall: Brockers, Worthy
Out: Penn State's Devon Still, Clemson's Brandon Thompson

Outside Linebacker

1. Melvin Ingram, South Carolina
2. Whitney Mercilus, Illinois
3. Andre Branch, Clemson
4. Ronnell Lewis, Oklahoma
5. Shea McClellin, Boise State

Out: Alabama's Courtney Upshaw (now listed at defensive end)

Inside Linebacker

1. Luke Kuechly, Boston College
2. Dont'a Hightower, Alabama
3. Mychal Kendricks, California
4. Keenan Robinson, Texas
5. Sean Spence, Miami

Cornerback

1. Morris Claiborne, LSU
2. Dre Kirkpatrick, Alabama
3. Janoris Jenkins, North Alabama
4. Josh Robinson, Central Florida
5. Stephon Gilmore, South Carolina

New entry: Robinson, Gilmore
Out: Montana's Trumaine Johnson, Iowa State's Leonard Johnson

Safety

1. Mark Barron, Alabama
2. Harrison Smith, Notre Dame
3. Brandon Taylor, LSU
4. DeQuan Menzie, Alabama
5. Phillip Thomas, Syracuse

New entry: Menzie, Taylor
Out: Boise State's George Iloka, Oklahoma State's Markelle Martin

Menzie's interesting at S. A little surprised Trumaine Johnson isn't in there instead of him. Feeling validated over here seeing Keenan Robinson at ILB. I'm not sure I agree with Upshaw at DE over Perry but it's not shocking at all. I just figured as a DE instead of a OLB he would fall a little farther. And I have Fleener, even without the combine, as the top TE now. Charles was cracking me up looking like Kevin Hart running his drills at the combine.

gpngc
03-06-2012, 03:55 PM
Mychal Kendricks. Mychal Kendricks.

Iamcanadian
03-07-2012, 03:17 PM
Well, Mayock's has now had the Senior Bowl and Combine to look over prospects and has put in a lot of film work on the junior class, his last rankings seem to reflect these facts.

He seems to be counting on Kendall Wright to have an excellent pro day along with many Alabama players.

He has his bias's, namely TE's who can block, RB's who are physical and who can take punishment, and in the past, Senior QB's although, he seems to be coming to the realization, that the better QB's now in the draft, will be juniors.
He also has a soft spot for prospects who get by with their football instincts rather than rely on their athletic prowess and seems to have the ability to spot those kinds of athletes. He doesn't ignore physical abilities but he also looks for football know how.

I believe he also has a slight bias against one year wonders similar to how he feels about junior QB's.

49erNation85
03-08-2012, 12:46 AM
Dang it I feel the need if SF wants a big time WR they are going to have to trade up into the teens everyone > Jefferson IMO. Sucks that we are drafting so far at the end ...

Complex
03-08-2012, 01:38 AM
Alshon still in his top 5 interesting. Sean Spence as a MLB?

Iamcanadian
03-08-2012, 12:18 PM
Alshon still in his top 5 interesting. Sean Spence as a MLB?

Alshon is still on the cusp awaiting his 40 time.

Mayock loves Spence's natural instinct for the position but was really disappointed in his bench press. He is very quick to diagnose a play and moves quickly to fill a hole which Mayock loves about him.

Brown Leader
04-02-2012, 06:30 PM
4/2

Quarterback

1. Andrew Luck, Stanford
2. Robert Griffin III, Baylor
3. Ryan Tannehill, Texas A&M
4. Brandon Weeden, Oklahoma State
5. Kirk Cousins, Michigan State

Running Back

1. Trent Richardson, Alabama
2. Doug Martin, Boise State
3. David Wilson, Virginia Tech
4. Lamar Miller, Miami (Fla.)
5. LaMichael James, Oregon

Wide Receiver

1. Justin Blackmon, Oklahoma State
2. Michael Floyd, Notre Dame
3. Kendall Wright, Baylor
4. Stephen Hill, Georgia Tech
5. Alshon Jeffery, South Carolina

Tight End

1. Coby Fleener, Stanford
2. Dwayne Allen, Clemson
3. Orson Charles, Georgia
4. Ladarius Green, Louisiana-Lafayette
5. James Hanna, Oklahoma

Offensive Tackle

1. Matt Kalil, USC
2. Riley Reiff, Iowa
3. Mike Adams, Ohio State
4. Jonathan Martin, Stanford
5. Cordy Glenn, Georgia

Rise: Adams (4)
Fall: Martin (3)

Guard

1. David DeCastro, Stanford
2. Kevin Zeitler, Wisconsin
3. Amini Silatolu, Midwestern State
4. Kelechi Osemele, Iowa State
5. Brandon Brooks, Miami (Ohio)

Center

1. Peter Konz, Wisconsin
2. Philip Blake, Baylor
3. Ben Jones, Georgia
4. David Molk, Michigan
5. Michael Brewster, Ohio State

Defensive End

1. Quinton Coples, North Carolina
2. Courtney Upshaw, Alabama
3. Nick Perry, USC
4. Chandler Jones, Syracuse
5. Vinny Curry, Marshall

New Entry: Jones
Out: Jared Crick, Nebraska (5)
Fall: Curry (4)

Defensive Tackle

1. Fletcher Cox, Mississippi State
2. Jerel Worthy, Michigan State
3. Michael Brockers, LSU
4. Dontari Poe, Memphis
T-5. Kendall Reyes, Connecticut
T-5. Devon Still, Penn St.

Rise: Cox (2), Worthy (4)
Fall: Poe (1)

Outside Linebacker

1. Melvin Ingram, South Carolina
2. Shea McClellin, Boise State
3. Whitney Mercilus, Illinois
4. Andre Branch, Clemson
5. Ronnell Lewis, Oklahoma

Rise: McClellin (5)
Fall: Mercilus (2), Branch (3), Lewis (4)

Inside Linebacker

1. Luke Kuechly, Boston College
2. Dont'a Hightower, Alabama
3. Mychal Kendricks, California
4. Keenan Robinson, Texas
5. Sean Spence, Miami

Cornerback

1. Morris Claiborne, LSU
2. Stephon Gilmore, South Carolina
3. Dre Kirkpatrick, Alabama
4. Janoris Jenkins, North Alabama
5. Josh Robinson, Central Florida

Safety

1. Mark Barron, Alabama
2. Harrison Smith, Notre Dame
3. Brandon Taylor, LSU
4. DeQuan Menzie, Alabama
5. Phillip Thomas, Syracuse

Bout time on Fletcher Cox. McClellin love. Poe fall predictable. Chandler Jones rise is interesting.

Pat Sims 90
04-02-2012, 06:37 PM
I still think he is underrating Rueban Randle.

Goon61
04-02-2012, 10:18 PM
Finally some Jerel worthy love from Mayock

Dangermouse
04-03-2012, 05:44 AM
Good to see Shea McClellin getting some love.

Dangermouse
04-03-2012, 06:36 AM
By the way where is his latest mock draft?

TheFinisher
04-03-2012, 07:38 AM
Finally some Jerel worthy love from Mayock

He had him in that #2 slot early on but dropped him after the combine, glad to see he came back to his senses.

Although I'm a little surprised that Brandon Thompson is absent from his DT rankings, I would have easily put him over Poe and Reyes.

I'd have them:

1. Michael Brockers
2. Jerel Worthy
3. Devon Still
4. Brandon Thompson
5. Fletcher Cox

steelersrock151
04-03-2012, 08:41 AM
This may suck for Steelers fans. What to do if Poe, Martin, Glenn, and Hightower are all there at 24? Choices, choices.

scottyboy
04-03-2012, 08:43 AM
glad to see he's high on gilmore as I have been for a while and Mayock is usually spot on with his DB rankings

Asteinebach
04-03-2012, 08:50 AM
...other brother (can't remember his name...) is a UFC fighter.

UFC Light-Heavyweight Champion Jon "Bones" Jones. One of the most athletic and explosive fighters in the history of the UFC. Sounds like Chandler Jones has good blood.

lowlife
04-03-2012, 10:43 AM
Seeing Taylor and Menzie in the top 5 S rankings is new to me.

Sean Spence at Mike makes no sense though

Iamcanadian
04-03-2012, 11:10 AM
Seeing Taylor and Menzie in the top 5 S rankings is new to me.

Sean Spence at Mike makes no sense though

The Safety class after Barron and Smith is very weak and making the top 5 still leaves you in round 3 or 4 at best.

Sean Spence has the best instincts for the position after Kuechly but needs a lot of work on his body but the talent is there if he will put in the time.

Brown Leader
04-03-2012, 02:13 PM
By the way where is his latest mock draft?

He hates doing mocks. He does just one the day before the draft.

Rosebud
04-03-2012, 04:23 PM
Alshon still in his top 5 interesting. Sean Spence as a MLB?

Think Jon Beason as his upside. Spence can play inside or out in the 4-3, especially if he's on a team with some big DTs.

Rosebud
04-03-2012, 04:26 PM
This may suck for Steelers fans. What to do if Poe, Martin, Glenn, and Hightower are all there at 24? Choices, choices.

You take Hightower or Poe and let Glenn and Martin, but mostly Glenn, keep falling so the giants cna get them.

SenorGato
04-03-2012, 05:14 PM
He had him in that #2 slot early on but dropped him after the combine, glad to see he came back to his senses.

Although I'm a little surprised that Brandon Thompson is absent from his DT rankings, I would have easily put him over Poe and Reyes.

I'd have them:

1. Michael Brockers
2. Jerel Worthy
3. Devon Still
4. Brandon Thompson
5. Fletcher Cox

Cox 5th? /ten

onejayhawk
04-04-2012, 07:00 AM
Very surprised to see Foles over Osweiler or Cousins at that #5 QB spot.

Foles will eventually be starting grade IMO. I have strong doubts about the other two. Oesweiler could, but the will to do the needed work is at issue. I do not see Cousins as being physically able.

J

K Train
04-04-2012, 08:39 AM
This may suck for Steelers fans. What to do if Poe, Martin, Glenn, and Hightower are all there at 24? Choices, choices.
Id go:

Poe - to stop the ravens from getting him and creating a monster dline of our own
Glenn- instanly makes everyone on the line better, except probably the bum we have at the other guard spot (if we took glenn id be so down to take brooks or washington in 2)
Hightower- i like him a lot and i think he will be the pick, but thats because i dont think those 2 will be there


Martin- i just hate him lol

Matthew Jones
04-04-2012, 09:11 AM
The safety rankings are very different than most; Taylor has been rumored to be moving up boards but Menzie and Thomas probably don't deserve to be ranked that high after running in the 4.7s. Antonio Allen, George Iloka, or Markelle Martin would be possible replacements there.

JohnCandy
04-04-2012, 03:45 PM
I am intrigued by Stephen Hill remaining at 4, especially considering what seems to be an internet backlash against him on sites like this.

There must be something that Mayock seems to keep Hill at 4 over Jeffery, Randle and others that have done well at their Pro Days?

holt_bruce81
04-04-2012, 03:48 PM
I would take Jenkins over Gilmore, probably Kirkpatrick as well. Gilmore is a late 1st-early 2nd round talent, but man his footwork is atrocious.

Rosebud
04-04-2012, 03:53 PM
I am intrigued by Stephen Hill remaining at 4, especially considering what seems to be an internet backlash against him on sites like this.

There must be something that Mayock seems to keep Hill at 4 over Jeffery, Randle and others that have done well at their Pro Days?

Insane potential, a good head on his shoulders and enough flashes of the greatness he's capable of to justify spending a premium pick on him? Hill has a lot in common with JPP coming out, if he similar lands in a great situation we could be talking about the hands down best Receivers from this draft class and a guy who's in the top conversation for receivers league wide.

Iamcanadian
04-04-2012, 04:06 PM
Insane potential, a good head on his shoulders and enough flashes of the greatness he's capable of to justify spending a premium pick on him? Hill has a lot in common with JPP coming out, if he similar lands in a great situation we could be talking about the hands down best Receivers from this draft class and a guy who's in the top conversation for receivers league wide.

I agree, prospects like Hill are definitely worth the risk. The bust potential in Jeffery and even Wright, is far higher than Hill's and the reward potential of Hill may even be higher than Floyd's or Blackmon's. You cannot teach 6'4", 214lbs. with 4.36 40 speed. The place where he is particularly raw, is catching a ball among a crowd, there he has very little experience because of his college system but worst case scenario, he is a constant deep threat like Torrey Smith of Baltimore and I think he has more upside than Torrey.