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View Full Version : It's time to rank the QBs again


killxswitch
02-06-2012, 02:07 PM
I do think some things changed this year. Previously the top guys were pretty clear cut, but I think there has been some changeover here and there. Who are your top NFL QBs RIGHT NOW? As in "this is the order of QBs that I would want to lead my team next year", not factoring in salary cap hit or personal bias for/against, etc.

Elite Tier:

Rogers - Probably solidifies himself as the #1 QB in the NFL next year. Many probably already think that.

Brees - Serious offensive powerhouse. Flawed and benefits from Payton's offense a bit, but still quite elite.

Brady - I think Cap'n Dinkydunk here is overrated, and maybe that is bias. But I admit he's developed into an elite QB. Too bad (for him) the rest of his team sucks now.


Tier 2:

E Manning - If the question was "which guy would you want to head into the playoffs with?" the answer would be Eli. But that isn't the question.

Rivers - this season took him out of the top-tier conversation IMO. He may climb back up next year.

Rapeburger - I wonder how he'll do without Arians. I also wonder what he'd do if he had a good OL.

Stafford - yeah he is young and yeah he has CJ and yeah he's had problems staying healthy. He still threw for 5000 yards, 41 TDs to 16 INTs, with a 97.2 rating. He proved himself this year IMO. I don't need another year to decide.

Tony Romo - I think he has a bad rep and is a good QB. It is hard to succeed in Dallas.

Tier 3:

Cam Newton - I expect him to jump into the next tier next year. Hard to put him too high after one season, even though I was very impressed with him.

Matt Schaub - I think he's underrated, and if he and Andre Johnson can stay healthy next season he'll put up huge numbers, they'll win the South again, and people will start talking about him as a top QB.

Matt Ryan - Steady improvement the last two years but he's still just a "really good" QB. Not "great" and a long way from elite.

Joe Flacco - He had a solid postseason, and he probably is hurt some by a lack of a deep threat. Torrey Smith may turn out to be that guy.

Michael Vick - Yes, he has the potential in any game to be the most dominant football player in the league. However, his age, fragility, and inconsistency scare me. I think the Eagles will regret the contract they gave him.

Jay Cutler - Almost forgot him. I think if Denver had kept him, Marshall, and Shanny he'd be a Tier 2 guy by now easily. What a mess that has turned out to be.

Tier 4:

Matt Flynn - Exciting prospect, but largely unproven. I am looking forward to seeing where he goes and how he does.

Andy Dalton - Surprising first year, hopefully he builds on that and makes the AFCN a 3 team division.

Ryan Fitzpatrick - The Bills faltered in 2011, to put it mildly. But I think with a full offseason and some more roster tweaking Fitzy can be a good NFL QB. Gailey has a good system to build on.

Matt Cassell - I actually think he's a little underrated but we'll see how he does next year.

Carson Palmer - Not sure about this one at all but maybe with a full offseason and a clear vision going forward (without Davis) Palmer will be able to resurrect his career.

Sam Bradford - Still plenty of potential here and kind of a bad situation in STL. Hopefully with some stability and weapons he will improve.


Tier 5:

Mark Sanchez - I think if he'd gone somewhere less flashy he'd be doing better. I think he has talent. But I think he's in a really bad situation and I don't think he's handling it well. I doubt he stays in NY once his rookie contract is up.

Josh Freeman - He showed some talent earlier but had a terrible year in a terrible situation. Bad ownership, bad coaching, questionable talent around him.

Christian Ponder - Showed some promise, not enough to develop much of an opinion yet and I don't have a lot of confidence in Frazier or his staff.

Alex Smith - Sorry, but he is a complete Jim Harbaugh creation. He did well this season. But he is a cog in the wheel.

Kevin Kolb - Maybe he'll do something next year. Or maybe he'll suck. AZ paid a lot for him so I decided to rank him.

fear the elf
02-06-2012, 02:16 PM
Generally, when using a tiered system you aren't ranking guys in order within the tiers, but it kind of looks like you did.

If there is supposed to be an order, Cutler is too low, Cam too high, and Flacco should be at the bottom of tier 3. I also think you're too low on Alex Smith.

Also, I know you're a Brady hater (I usually fall on the Manning side of that debate, too), but your commentary on him is a pretty absurd. Not sure if srs...

Punisher
02-06-2012, 02:19 PM
Where does Tebow rank on a list of throwing fullbacks?

BigBanger
02-06-2012, 02:21 PM
That's some serious disrespect to Alex smith. He's better than ponder. A lot better. To have them in the same group is ridiculous.

I think I would have to put Eli in the top tier with guys like brees and brady. I mean he's beat brady twice in the biggest game possible. Eli is at the very least on Brady's level. He's proven that much.

I'd also put roethlisberger in the elite level as well. Rodgers is the gold standard. And will be for a long time. But Eli had the most to gain from this post season and with how he won... hes as clutch as it gets.

Thunder&Lightning
02-06-2012, 02:24 PM
its like beating a dead horse with this topic

bucfan12
02-06-2012, 02:24 PM
I;m sorry, but what has Sam Bradford done in order to be ranked ahead of Josh Freeman and Mark Sanchez? Freeman had a bad year, but he showed what he's capable of and the talent is there. To put Bradford ahead of him in the tier 4 and Freeman in 5 is off. Same with Matt Flynn and Matt Cassell.

Honestly, Eli Manning has beaten Brady Twice, when it counted on the big stage. How is he NOT in the top tier?

Bulldogs
02-06-2012, 02:31 PM
Not ranked, just thrown into tiers.

ELITE

Aaron Rodgers
Drew Brees
Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Eli Manning

My five elite quarterbacks. I know people won't like me throwing Peyton in here, but I think think he comes back, and I think he comes back strong. He's going to play with a vengeance in 2012. Eli solidified his spot in the top five and as an elite QB with his recent Superbowl win.

Tier 2:

Philip Rivers
Matt Ryan
Tony Romo
Ben Roethlisberger
Matthew Stafford

I feel fairly comfortable with these guys as the next five, some may argue for Ben Roethlisberger to be in the elite group of guys, I like him but I don't think he's quite there. Philip Rivers had a down year, but he's still a baller. Romo plays just as well as anybody but with the tough label as a Dallas QB. Stafford is pushing hard to be ranked up a tier, and if he continues his success from last year it shouldn't be too long. I'll probably get called a homer for throwing Matt Ryan in here but he's played just as well as anybody the past two seasons. Should be interesting to see him with a new offensive coordinator.

Tier 3:

Matt Schaub
Cam Newton
Michael Vick
Jay Cutler

I considered also putting Flacco in here but I don't quite think he's on the level on these two QBs. Schaub always flys under the radar. Cam Newton had a top five rookie season of all time. Vick is inconsistent but when he's on, as evidenced last year, he's damn near impossible to stop. BeerBaron will kill me for not putting Cutler in the next tier, he's play extremely well given the situation he's put in. Cutler is another guy to keep an eye on, his new OC will apparently roll him out like Cutler did so well in Denver.

Tier 4:

Mark Sanchez
Josh Freeman
Andy Dalton
Joe Flacco
Alex Smith

This is kind of what I consider the game manager tier. I struggled putting Sanchez in here, sure he's shown flashes, but this season will be telling as there will be no more blame to put on Schottenheimer. Freeman has the potential to but much higher than this but is coming off a dreadful season. He's now had one great year, and two very poor ones. Dalton is another guy who could be much higher in the future, he had a surprisingly good rookie season, time to see if he can build off of it. Flacco and Alex Smith are both pretty solid game managers, although I'm sure neither of their fans would like to hear it.

Tier 5:

Matt Cassell
Sam Bradford
Ryan Fitzpatrick
Carson Palmer
Matt Flynn

These are guys who are alright/mediocre QBs in my mind. Kind of tough to throw Matt Flynn in here because of his limited tape but damnit I wanted to put him somewhere on my list.

Hall of Fame Lock QB:

Tim Tebow

Timmy needed to be here somewhere. The legs of Walter Payton and the arm of Dan Marino. Only current QB who is worth this spot.

killxswitch
02-06-2012, 02:32 PM
Generally, when using a tiered system you aren't ranking guys in order within the tiers, but it kind of looks like you did.

If there is supposed to be an order, Cutler is too low, Cam too high, and Flacco should be at the bottom of tier 3. I also think you're too low on Alex Smith.

Also, I know you're a Brady hater (I usually fall on the Manning side of that debate, too), but your commentary on him is a pretty absurd. Not sure if srs...

I did put them in order within the tier, where I had an opinion. But overall, yes, the tiers are what matter to me more.

Both Cutler and Vick would probably be a tier above if they'd stayed healthy all season long.

I find it pretty difficult to be objective about Brady, even when I'm trying to give him credit.

Jvig43
02-06-2012, 02:36 PM
Yeah captain dinky dunky is going to be throwing bombs to Branch and Welker. Give me a ******* break, lets see someone have a deep game with those two as your starting Wrs.

fear the elf
02-06-2012, 02:38 PM
I did put them in order within the tier, where I had an opinion. But overall, yes, the tiers are what matter to me more.

Both Cutler and Vick would probably be a tier above if they'd stayed healthy all season long.

I find it pretty difficult to be objective about Brady, even when I'm trying to give him credit.

Lol, I give you credit for being honest.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 02:54 PM
If you'd rather have Eli than any of the other QBs going into the playoffs why wouldn't you want him as your QB going into the season? Did he not just drag a largely useless squad to the playoffs where the defense finally got its **** together to give him some help?

Not saying I think he's number just something that struck as odd about your reasoning.

And IMO Cutler just re-inforced that he's in that second tier of QBs. The bears where well on their way to a second straight playoff season with an offense based entirely on him and Forte. Most QBs other than the elites would've gotten killed much quicker than Cutler and wouldn't be able to scratch out of that offense what he was able to scratch out of that unit.

zachsaints52
02-06-2012, 02:58 PM
Please tell me how Brees is flawed when his last year in San Diego he had 64.6 completion percentage, 3500 yards, and 24 TDs when his starting WRs was Keenan McCardell and Eric Parker.

And Matt Flynn is a exciting prospect? The dude had one good game, and your basing his prospectness off of that and have him over Andy Dalton, who proved himself to be decent in the toughest division QB wise?

bucfan12
02-06-2012, 03:00 PM
+: Stock up. Has talent to go upward - : Down; hasn't improved nor shown much potential. = : steady.

ELITE

Aaron Rodgers
Drew Brees
Tom Brady
Peyton Manning -: I'm not sure if he'll be at the same level, or if he even returns.
Eli Manning

Tier 2:

Philip Rivers ^: Should get back into the conversation as he once was considered elite prior to the season.

Matt Ryan: = This one is tough. He's got a lot to prove to get into the top tier. Getting blown out the last 2 playoff games is tough.

Tony Romo: = : Hasn't won any "Big " games. Hasn't shown the clutch factor.

Ben Roethlisberger: +: He's been there before and yes has 2 rings. He's clutch when needed.

Matthew Stafford: + He's working his way up the ladder. Strong arm and dynamite weapons. Could be in the conversation in the next 2 years.

Matt Schaub: = He needs to stay on the field. I still think the Texans could have made some noise in the post season if he was healthy, and I believe they were the top seed in the AFC right before he went down.

Jay Cutler: +He has great potential to move up. He's as tough as they come and means so much to that Bears team. Talent is there as well.



Tier 3:

Joe Flacco: + : Flacco might be the perfect example of Jeckyl and Hyde type of player. One day he plays like a top 10 QB, next he's bottom 5 in terms of performance. He's got potential to move into the next tier, but has always been backed by a great defense and running game.
Cam Newton: + : Sky is the limit for this kid. If he develops more as a passer, then He'll be up there in no time.

Michael Vick: + : He can get back into the tier 2 conversation, but he needs to be a better passer.

Josh Freeman: + : People forget that 2010 season. Yes, he had an off year, but there was a lot going on in Tampa that people are just starting to find out now. The talent, smarts, and potential is there to get back into the 2nd tier.

Alex Smith: = Finally Smith has broke through and Harbaugh was a huge help. However, he hasn't and I don't think will live up to his draft status.

Andy Dalton: +: Kid has a lot of potential and is very smart and accurate. I wasn't high on him when he was drafted, but his development will be key this offseason.

Matt Cassell: = He's in the category of Alex Smith in terms of an Average QB that can get by with a good overall team. Reached his potential in my opinion.

Tier 4:

Mark Sanchez: = : Having a career year of 75 QB rating is nothing to rave about.

Ryan Fitpatrick : = Ever since he signed that extension, he was awful.

Matt Flynn: + Unproven but not unknown. Smart and accurate but needs a starting job to move up.

Sam Bradford: + This year will be revealing and telling. If he gets weapons but doesn't capitalize, then he'll never move up and be a bust. But until then, he's a wait and see.

Matt Hasselback: - : Downside of his career.

Tier 5: Unkowns:

- Mallet
- Luck (rookie)
- Griffen (rookie)
- Locker

Halsey
02-06-2012, 03:38 PM
I get that Cam Newton is talented and has a lot of potential, but he's also a turnover machine that only led his team to wins vs. the likes of Tampa, Indy, Jacksonville and Washington. The only win the Panthers had vs a contender was the Texans. People are crowning him a little early.

bearfan
02-06-2012, 03:49 PM
Plz respect the Cutler. I think the fact that the Bears went 7-3 with him and finished 8-8 without him says a lot, especially playing with Knox-Roy Williams-Hester-Bennett-Kellen Davis.

I can see him Tier 2, probably mid to low end.

DraftSavant
02-06-2012, 04:06 PM
Not ranking between tiers - really, really subjective and highly variable at that point.

TIER ONE - ELITE/TRANSCENDENT LEVEL
Drew Brees - The best pairing of coach, player, and system in the league.
Aaron Rogers - No limitations. A rhythm and timing passer with a power arm (incredibly rare).
Tom Brady - "Clutch" play has been forgotten; he's essentially become Peyton Manning - an transcendant player carrying a pretty mediocre team.
Eli Manning - Complete command of his offense, most cold-blooded player in the league. Amnesia from snap to snap (in a good way).
Ben Roethlisberger - Best pure physical talent of this group. All he does is make plays, but he needs to learn protections better.

TIER TWO - FOUNDATION PLAYER
Jay Cutler - Carries his team. Worst situation of any top QB the last few years in terms of scheme, pass-catching weapons.
Matt Stafford - QUIETEST 40 TOUCHDOWN SEASON ******* EVER.
Cam Newton - Kill me if you want - he's going to change the way we judge QBs.

TIER 3 - QUALITY STARTER/PRO BOWLER
Philip Rivers - Overrated because of fantasy football. Mediocre postseason player.
Mike Vick - Biggest "week-to-week" player in the league.
Matt Ryan - Can he be the foundation of an offense? Still a major question. Playoff performances have been abysmal.
Joe Flacco - Underrated IMO. Depending on what BAL does in the offseason, my early money is on him to jump a tier next year. Constantly trying to make throws into tiny windows because of lack of separation at WR.
Matt Schaub - Epitomizes this tier, IMO. Still waiting for a signature win.
Tony Romo - Similar to Vick. Week-to-week player. Frustratingly inconsistent.

TIER 4 - BASELINE STARTER
Alex Smith
Ryan Fitzpatrick
Andy Dalton
Kyle Orton
Sam Bradford (maybe?! I go back and forth with him)

Obviously, there's room for guys to go up or down a tier (like every single year). And I really tried to make clear cutoffs. The hardest one is where ELITE/TRANSCENDENT meets FOUNDATION.

After that, it's pretty bleh. You have guys who I'd feel really good about as backups, but hate as starters (like Sanchez, Cassel, Palmer, Kolb, etc).

I have no idea wtf to make of Freeman. Or Matt Moore. Or Peyton, for that matter.








And way down here is Blaine Gabbert.

gpngc
02-06-2012, 04:07 PM
01. Aaron Rodgers
02. Peyton Mannning
03. Drew Brees
04. Tom Brady
05. Eli Manning
06. Ben Roethlisberger
07. Philip Rivers
08. Jay Cutler
09. Matt Stafford
10. Michael Vick
11. Tony Romo
12. Cam Newton
13. Matt Schaub
14. Matt Ryan
15. Joe Flacco
16. Andy Dalton
17. Josh Freeman
18. Ryan Fitzpatrick
19. Mark Sanchez
20. Carson Palmer
21. Alex Smith
22. Matt Cassel
23. Matt Flynn
24. Sam Bradford
25. Matt Hasselbeck
26. Kevin Kolb
26. Matt Moore
27. Tim Tebow
28. Tarvaris Jackson
29. Jake Locker
30. Christian Ponder
31. Colt McCoy
32. Blaine Gabbert

tjsunstein
02-06-2012, 04:09 PM
And Matt Flynn is a exciting prospect? The dude had one good game, and your basing his prospectness off of that and have him over Andy Dalton, who proved himself to be decent in the toughest division QB wise?

But you have no problem to using dude's 'one good game' to try to bring down Rodgers' MVP season. Thank Flynn for those two votes Brees got.

DiG
02-06-2012, 04:10 PM
blaine over rexy?!!??!

Ness
02-06-2012, 04:13 PM
I do think some things changed this year. Previously the top guys were pretty clear cut, but I think there has been some changeover here and there. Who are your top NFL QBs RIGHT NOW? As in "this is the order of QBs that I would want to lead my team next year", not factoring in salary cap hit or personal bias for/against, etc.

Elite Tier:

Rogers - Probably solidifies himself as the #1 QB in the NFL next year. Many probably already think that.

Brees - Serious offensive powerhouse. Flawed and benefits from Payton's offense a bit, but still quite elite.

Brady - I think Cap'n Dinkydunk here is overrated, and maybe that is bias. But I admit he's developed into an elite QB. Too bad (for him) the rest of his team sucks now.


Tier 2:

E Manning - If the question was "which guy would you want to head into the playoffs with?" the answer would be Eli. But that isn't the question.

Rivers - this season took him out of the top-tier conversation IMO. He may climb back up next year.

Rapeburger - I wonder how he'll do without Arians. I also wonder what he'd do if he had a good OL.

Stafford - yeah he is young and yeah he has CJ and yeah he's had problems staying healthy. He still threw for 5000 yards, 41 TDs to 16 INTs, with a 97.2 rating. He proved himself this year IMO. I don't need another year to decide.

Tony Romo - I think he has a bad rep and is a good QB. It is hard to succeed in Dallas.

Tier 3:

Cam Newton - I expect him to jump into the next tier next year. Hard to put him too high after one season, even though I was very impressed with him.

Matt Schaub - I think he's underrated, and if he and Andre Johnson can stay healthy next season he'll put up huge numbers, they'll win the South again, and people will start talking about him as a top QB.

Matt Ryan - Steady improvement the last two years but he's still just a "really good" QB. Not "great" and a long way from elite.

Joe Flacco - He had a solid postseason, and he probably is hurt some by a lack of a deep threat. Torrey Smith may turn out to be that guy.

Michael Vick - Yes, he has the potential in any game to be the most dominant football player in the league. However, his age, fragility, and inconsistency scare me. I think the Eagles will regret the contract they gave him.

Jay Cutler - Almost forgot him. I think if Denver had kept him, Marshall, and Shanny he'd be a Tier 2 guy by now easily. What a mess that has turned out to be.

Tier 4:

Matt Flynn - Exciting prospect, but largely unproven. I am looking forward to seeing where he goes and how he does.

Andy Dalton - Surprising first year, hopefully he builds on that and makes the AFCN a 3 team division.

Ryan Fitzpatrick - The Bills faltered in 2011, to put it mildly. But I think with a full offseason and some more roster tweaking Fitzy can be a good NFL QB. Gailey has a good system to build on.

Matt Cassell - I actually think he's a little underrated but we'll see how he does next year.

Carson Palmer - Not sure about this one at all but maybe with a full offseason and a clear vision going forward (without Davis) Palmer will be able to resurrect his career.

Sam Bradford - Still plenty of potential here and kind of a bad situation in STL. Hopefully with some stability and weapons he will improve.


Tier 5:

Mark Sanchez - I think if he'd gone somewhere less flashy he'd be doing better. I think he has talent. But I think he's in a really bad situation and I don't think he's handling it well. I doubt he stays in NY once his rookie contract is up.

Josh Freeman - He showed some talent earlier but had a terrible year in a terrible situation. Bad ownership, bad coaching, questionable talent around him.

Christian Ponder - Showed some promise, not enough to develop much of an opinion yet and I don't have a lot of confidence in Frazier or his staff.

Alex Smith - Sorry, but he is a complete Jim Harbaugh creation. He did well this season. But he is a cog in the wheel.

Kevin Kolb - Maybe he'll do something next year. Or maybe he'll suck. AZ paid a lot for him so I decided to rank him.

I don't see how Bradford has improved his stock. He's done nothing to this point. Plenty of potential is pointless. As for nothing having enough weapons around him and being in a bad situation, virtually the same thing can be said about Smith. Also, I don't think Flynn should be in your ranking system. He's done nothing and not even a starter. He's played two good games in spot duty, but that still isn't an indication long term. And he'll probably be playing on another team next year.

JRTPlaya21
02-06-2012, 04:22 PM
blaine over rexy?!!??!

Yeah I'm appalled.

RaiderNation
02-06-2012, 04:28 PM
Here is my top 32, didn't include Matt Flynn since he doesn't have enough games to be considered IMO.

1 Aaron Rodgers- Has had an amazing 2 years, still the best player in the NFL

2 Drew Brees- Awesome season stat wise that will likely get him a monster contract.

3 Eli Manning- You can't spell elite without Eli, and Manning is the most clutch QB in the NFL.

4 Tom Brady- Brady struggled the last 2 games against strong defenses, and I'm a believer that he need a Moss and much better defense to win another ring.

5 Peyton Manning- Yup, I still think if Peyton comes back he will play at a top 5 level, but right now I don't see it happening next year.

6 Matthew Stafford- Stafford had a great season with the much improved Lion team, and if he and Megatron stay healthy he will be a top 5 QB in the NFL.

7 Ben Roethlisberger- Big Ben didn't have the best statistical season, but when healthy he and the Steelers will be Super Bowl contenders.

8 Phillip Rivers- Rivers really struggled at times this year, but with better oline play he should bounce back.

9 Tony Romo- Romo may not have the intangibles of a Rodgers/Brady/Manning/Brees, but I think on a pure arm talent level he can be compared with them.

10 Jay Cutler- Similarly to Romo, Cutler isn't a true leader at QB, but he can still throw the ball with the best of them.

11 Mike Vick- I doubt Vick will ever play 16 full games in a season, and they will hurt his ranking and the Eagles a lot heading into the future.

12 Matt Ryan- I really thought Ryan would step up this year, but he and that Falcon offense still have the talent to put up points.

13 Joe Flacco- Flacco can be bad at times, but I'd take him in a playoff games over many other QB's.

14 Carson Palmer- Call me a homer, but if you don't just look at the stats I actually think Palmer had a good season and could play much better with a full offseason to workout.

15 Alex Smith- Smith is a very solid starting QB, and can win you playoffs games(potentially a Super Bowl if they defense can have a Ravens 2000 season).

16 Cam Newton- I love Cam and I'm praying he can stay healthy for a few seasons in a row to really showcase his talents.

17 Tim Tebow- I think defense's will start to figure out Tebow and the offense similarly to the WildCat a few seasons ago, but if he can improve his accuracy he can keep winning games.

18 Matt Schaub- If Schaub didn't get hurt, it wouldn't be far fetched to stay the Texans could have been the AFC team in the Super Bowl.

19 Andy Dalton- Dalton will still need a season or 2 before he really becomes a franchise type QB, and if the Bengals can keep surrounding him with young talent he will do that.

20 Ryan Fitzpatrick- Fitzpatrick wasn't worth the contract he was given, and I don't expect more than may a wildcard appearance or 2 if he stays as the starting QB.

21 Josh Freeman- Freeman looked bad and could benefit a lot if the Bucs try and give him top talent like Blackmon/Richardson to use in the offense.

22 Mark Sanchez- Sanchez could be on the hot seat if the Jets don't make the playoffs this season, and I'm starting to think Rex Ryan could be shown the door too.

23 Matt Hasselbeck- Solid veteran QB that will likely start 4-8 games next year until Locker is ready.

24 Matt Moore- Moore is a nice QB to have as a back up if you can afford it, but I don't see him winning many games in the NFL.

25 Sam Bradford- I wasn't a huge Bradford fan coming out, and I'm not sure Fisher and the rest of the staff can get things fixed in St. Louis.

26 Christian Ponder- Ponder had some good moments with the Vikings last season, and is a much better QB to have heading forward when compared to Blaine Gabbert.

27 Kyle Orton- Orton doesn't offer much as a leader and in the locker room, and is on the downside of his career.

28 Matt Cassel- Cassel isn't a starting NFL QB, and I can't see him leading the Chiefs into the playoffs(Orton either if he returns).

29 Jason Campbell- Campbell will get a shot next season with yet another OC, and could help ease a rookie QB into the NFL, also a good locker room guy.

30 Colt McCoy- McCoy looks scared at times out there, and I just don't think he has the arm and size to make it in the NFL.

31 Kevin Kolb- Kolb's anther small weak armed QB that will struggle if he doesn't have elite weapons to throw at.

32 Blaine Gabbert- On paper Gabbert looks like potential top 10 QB, but it's obvious to most everybody that he is going to struggle in the next few seasons.

Mufasa
02-06-2012, 04:58 PM
1. Aaron Rodgers
2. Tom Brady
3. Drew Brees
4. Ben Roethlisberger
5. Matthew Stafford
6. Eli Manning
7. Philip Rivers
8. Tony Romo
9. Jay Cutler
10. Michael Vick

Bulldogs
02-06-2012, 05:06 PM
1. Aaron Rodgers
2. Tom Brady
3. Drew Brees
4. Ben Roethlisberger
5. Matthew Stafford
6. Eli Manning
7. Philip Rivers
8. Tony Romo
9. Jay Cutler
10. Michael Vick

Love Stafford, but I'm not ready to name him a top 5 QB.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 05:06 PM
Rodgers
Brady
Brees
Eli
Peyton*
Big Ben

These are the guys who will be hall of famers if they're play doesn't collapse completely next year.

Rivers
Cutler
Romo
Stafford

These are the guys who have the talent and production to be in that top tier but have yet to take their teams on the deep runs that earn a QB the Accolades those top guys have earned. Each is a franchise QB who could be a probowler any season. I was going to talk about how these guys are all reliable standouts but each of these guys is either coming off of a banged up season or has recently had an injured impaired season. Weird.

Vick
Schaub
Newton*

Two guys that when playing at their best are just as good as the guys in the tier above them and at their very best can even go toe to toe with those top tier guys, unfortunately injuries are a big concern for both of these guys as well as a lot of inconsistency and questions about their reliability in big games as Vick has thrown away as many as he has stolen and Schaub just hasn't gotten to be in enough big games to really get an accurate assessment of him.

I put Newton with these guys despite being a rookie who played zero meaningful games because of how amazing his flashes were. If he keeps learning and studying hard so that he can consistently play at or near his best, he'll be an elite QB and one day win a ring or rings. He's really more on par with this next tier because of what he still has to prove.

Ryan
Flacco
Dalton
Hasselback

All guys who can take you to the playoffs and with a good enough team even win you some games once you get there. These are the guys who you don't want to plan on relying on to win you games regularly, but are effective and if a team ignores them can do that for you. Hasselback is always an injury concern at this point, but if he's healthy he's still a smart and precise QB who can take advantage of mistakes. And that's really what these guys are, guys who can be shut down when focused on but can abuse a teams mistakes if they make it easy for them.

Freeman
Fitzpatrick
Tebow
Smith
Palmer
Bradford

Freeman's a big question mark but the good Freeman has been so good that he still will get a shot to prove that this years performance was the result of a HC who was in over his head and lost control. If he bounces back he joins Cam Newton on the brink of that tier of guys who can be elite...sometimes...

Fitzy threw a lot of picks but IMO isn't much worse of a QB than the guys in the tier above him. Like Alex Smith I think next year they can establish themselves as good solid mistake-advantage-takers.

Tebow is just too good of a football player for me to let how bad of a QB he is cast doubt on his desire to win. This is a big offseason for Timmy.

Palmer I just have no clue what to expect. He's looked like the sex cannon this season but with no offseason or chemistry that's not completely surprising. He's another guy who could push himself up a tier or even two next season.

Finally Bradford is a kid I just feel for, he's looked pretty solid when he's been upright. If the Rams can utilize Kroenke's big bucks on a receiver like VJax, snag Kalil and keep working on that D I think Bradford is a guy who'll one day find himself in that "Not quite elite but franchise QB" range.


Cassel
Locker
Flynn
Ponder
Sanchez
Campbell
Moore
Kolb


These are guys who can win you some regular season games and so aren't terrible but either just aren't good enough to do so enough to carry a team through to the playoffs or just still have too much too prove.

tjsunstein
02-06-2012, 05:07 PM
1. Rodgers
2. Brees
3. Brady
4. Eli
5. Big Ben
6. Cutler
7. Stafford
8. Rivers
9. Ryan
10. Romo

Not including Peyton.

Newton and Schaub round out the Top 12.

Mufasa
02-06-2012, 05:14 PM
Love Stafford, but I'm not ready to name him a top 5 QB.

I was kind of torn on Manning, but I'd take him over the others no question. He just had his first full NFL season and he put up 5000 yards and 41 TDs. Of the current QBs, only Rodgers, Brees, and Brady have ever had a better season than that. The kid is good, by the end of next season he'll be a lock in everyone's top 5.

And just as a side note, I bet if we did this after the end of the regular season most people(myself included) would have had Eli at around 8.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 05:23 PM
I was kind of torn on Manning, but I'd take him over the others no question. He just had his first full NFL season and he put up 5000 yards and 41 TDs. Of the current QBs, only Rodgers, Brees, and Brady have ever had a better season than that. The kid is good, by the end of next season he'll be a lock in everyone's top 5.

And just as a side note, I bet if we did this after the end of the regular season most people(myself included) would have had Eli at around 8.

I think staying healthy is an important aspect of these rankings, I mean that and inconsistent are what drop Vick out of the top 10. Additionally Stafford's own inconsistencies were worrisome since Stafford's one of those kid's who's absolutely brutal when he's off. He's so young that all of those issues should be set at ease in time, but for now they still bother me when ranking him that highly.

And I would've vehemently disagreed with anyone who had Eli outside of their top 6 after the regular season as he carried this giants team to the playoffs while playing absolutely phenomenal football and being once again the clutchest QB in the NFL.

Mufasa
02-06-2012, 05:27 PM
I hard a hard with which order for Stafford, Manning and Roethlisberger. They should be 4, 5, 6, but who's where is more open.

tjsunstein
02-06-2012, 05:29 PM
I hard a hard with which order for Stafford, Manning and Roethlisberger. They should be 4, 5, 6, but who's where is more open.
I have Cutler in that mix, but any combination of the 4 starting with Eli I'm comfortable with.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 05:32 PM
1. Rodgers
2. Brees
3. Brady
4. Eli
5. Big Ben
6. Cutler
7. Stafford
8. Rivers
9. Ryan
10. Romo

Not including Peyton.

Newton and Schaub round out the Top 12.

I like this list. The only change I'd make is I'd flip Brees and Brady. Actually I'd put Brady #1, and Rodgers 2 and Brees 3.

I gotta give Brady that 1 spot still. The guy went to 5 super bowls. That's ridiculous. He had no business playing in this last one too. He carried this year's Patriots.

Bulldogs
02-06-2012, 05:34 PM
I like this list. The only change I'd make is I'd flip Brees and Brady. Actually I'd put Brady #1, and Rodgers 2 and Brees 3.

I gotta give Brady that 1 spot still. The guy went to 5 super bowls. That's ridiculous. He had no business playing in this last one too. He carried this year's Patriots.

I think somebody already mentioned it, but Brady this year was pretty much Peyton Manning. No semblance of a defense for the majority of the year, and carried an otherwise mediocre team. It's funny how Brady's role changed.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 05:36 PM
I think somebody already mentioned it, but Brady this year was pretty much Peyton Manning. No semblance of a defense for the majority of the year, and carried an otherwise mediocre team. It's funny how Brady's role changed.

Yeah, the Patriots have become the Colts in many ways. Bellichick needs to build around defense again. I feel that if he goes back to the studly defense with Brady making chicken salad out of chicken **** approach, he might win another SB.

If he did that from the get go, he'd probably already have his 4th SB by now.

killxswitch
02-06-2012, 05:43 PM
Yeah, the Patriots have become the Colts in many ways. Bellichick needs to build around defense again. I feel that if he goes back to the studly defense with Brady making chicken salad out of chicken **** approach, he might win another SB.

If he did that from the get go, he'd probably already have his 4th SB by now.

Hard to do when your QB takes up so much cap space. Believe me, I know.

DraftSavant
02-06-2012, 05:46 PM
Hard to do when your QB takes up so much cap space. Believe me, I know.

Really, the place where they ****** up was with not wanting to pay Seymour.

I don't think they should pay Welker what he'll command, either, but that could just be me.

TACKLE
02-06-2012, 05:49 PM
Not ranking between tiers - really, really subjective and highly variable at that point.

TIER ONE - ELITE/TRANSCENDENT LEVEL
Drew Brees - The best pairing of coach, player, and system in the league.
Aaron Rogers - No limitations. A rhythm and timing passer with a power arm (incredibly rare).
Tom Brady - "Clutch" play has been forgotten; he's essentially become Peyton Manning - an transcendant player carrying a pretty mediocre team.
Eli Manning - Complete command of his offense, most cold-blooded player in the league. Amnesia from snap to snap (in a good way).
Ben Roethlisberger - Best pure physical talent of this group. All he does is make plays, but he needs to learn protections better.

TIER TWO - FOUNDATION PLAYER
Jay Cutler - Carries his team. Worst situation of any top QB the last few years in terms of scheme, pass-catching weapons.
Matt Stafford - QUIETEST 40 TOUCHDOWN SEASON ******* EVER.
Cam Newton - Kill me if you want - he's going to change the way we judge QBs.

TIER 3 - QUALITY STARTER/PRO BOWLER
Philip Rivers - Overrated because of fantasy football. Mediocre postseason player.
Mike Vick - Biggest "week-to-week" player in the league.
Matt Ryan - Can he be the foundation of an offense? Still a major question. Playoff performances have been abysmal.
Joe Flacco - Underrated IMO. Depending on what BAL does in the offseason, my early money is on him to jump a tier next year. Constantly trying to make throws into tiny windows because of lack of separation at WR.
Matt Schaub - Epitomizes this tier, IMO. Still waiting for a signature win.
Tony Romo - Similar to Vick. Week-to-week player. Frustratingly inconsistent.

TIER 4 - BASELINE STARTER
Alex Smith
Ryan Fitzpatrick
Andy Dalton
Kyle Orton
Sam Bradford (maybe?! I go back and forth with him)

Obviously, there's room for guys to go up or down a tier (like every single year). And I really tried to make clear cutoffs. The hardest one is where ELITE/TRANSCENDENT meets FOUNDATION.

After that, it's pretty bleh. You have guys who I'd feel really good about as backups, but hate as starters (like Sanchez, Cassel, Palmer, Kolb, etc).

I have no idea wtf to make of Freeman. Or Matt Moore. Or Peyton, for that matter.








And way down here is Blaine Gabbert.


This list looks just about right to me.

Jvig43
02-06-2012, 05:51 PM
Really, the place where they ****** up was with not wanting to pay Seymour.

I don't think they should pay Welker what he'll command, either, but that could just be me.

I think despite how awesome Welker has been for us all these years, Pats fans are having trouble with the notion of paying him like a top WR when he doesn't make the plays a top WR would make. You ass hole Welker.

I was ok with getting a first rounder for a thirty year old Seymour at the time. Unfortunately we just have continued to use our firsts to trade down and acquire more mid rounders.

bigbluedefense
02-06-2012, 05:53 PM
DraftSavant pretty much nailed it too. I agree with his assessment of Cam Newton, I think he has potential to completely flip our definition of qb upside down in the coming years.

cmarq83
02-06-2012, 06:35 PM
Hard to do when your QB takes up so much cap space. Believe me, I know.

Meh the Pats have cap space, they've just managed it terribly the past few years. They overpayed Mayo and are going to have about 13 million in dead money this year from the Ocho, Bodden, Warren, and Banta Cain contracts. The team has made so many errors the past few years they'd be an absolute juggernaut if they hadn't drafted poorly and signed the wrong guys.

Brothgar
02-06-2012, 06:52 PM
Elite

To me Elite means you are perennially in the MVP conversation year in and year out. These three players are the only ones who have been in that conversation for at least three years.

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Drew Brees

Near Elite

Well on their way to the Elite category they need to sustain the success that they've shown this season to grow into the elite category.

Eli Manning
Aaron Rodgers
Ben Rothelsburger

Tier 2

Second Tier Upper

Second Tier Upper players have a ton of talent all the ability to make their way into the near elite category in the next season. Players in this category should be considered the starter for the team for the foreseeable future and be considered an above average starter.

Matt Stafford
Cam Newton
Matt Schawb
Phillip Rivers
Mike Vick
Jay Cutler
Matt Ryan

Tier 2 Lower

These players are still relatively safe are likely going to be the long term solution for their teams but are IMO average starters.

Sam Bradford
Joe Flacco
Andy Dalton
Christian Ponder
Josh Freeman

Tier 3

This Tier is the type of QB who could realistically lose their starting position with a bad season next year. Or backups who will gain a starting position next year

Alex Smith
Matt Hasselbeck
Jake Locker
Matt Flynn
Tony Romo
Matt Cassel
Kyle Orton

Tier 4

QBs who could (or should) realistically lose their jobs to a rookie/backup /free agent and better backups (NOT NAMED Peyton Manning)

Carson Palmer
Jason Campbell
Mark Sanchez
Chad Henne
Rex Grossman
Joe Webb
Shaun Hill

Tier 5

Those QBs who shouldn't have been starting in the first place

Tavaris Jackson
Colt McCoy
Kevin Kolb

Tier 6

Tim Tebow

Tim Tebow
Blaine Gabbert

Nalej
02-06-2012, 06:58 PM
lol @ Capt DinkandDunk

keylime_5
02-06-2012, 06:59 PM
Tier One:

1A-Aaron Rodgers
1B-Tom Brady
1C-Peyton Manning (could drop if he's not the same player after the surgeries)
1D-Drew Brees
5-Eli Manning
6A-Ben Roethlisberger
6B-Philip Rivers

Tier Two:

8-Matthew Stafford (closing in on tier 1)
9-Matt Ryan
10-Tony Romo
11-Jay Cutler
12-Mike Vick


Then I think these guys are very close to Tier Two:

Cam Newton
Andy Dalton
Matt Schaub

and these guys are in make or break years I think:

Mark Sanchez
Joe Flacco

everyone else is either no good, washed up, or too young and not yet reaching their potential.

Geason Noceur
02-06-2012, 07:31 PM
Elite

To me Elite means you are perennially in the MVP conversation year in and year out. These three players are the only ones who have been in that conversation for at least three years.

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Drew Brees

Near Elite

Well on their way to the Elite category they need to sustain the success that they've shown this season to grow into the elite category.

Eli Manning
Aaron Rodgers
Ben Rothelsburger

Tier 2

Second Tier Upper

Second Tier Upper players have a ton of talent all the ability to make their way into the near elite category in the next season. Players in this category should be considered the starter for the team for the foreseeable future and be considered an above average starter.

Matt Stafford
Cam Newton
Matt Schawb
Phillip Rivers
Mike Vick
Jay Cutler
Matt Ryan

Tier 2 Lower

These players are still relatively safe are likely going to be the long term solution for their teams but are IMO average starters.

Sam Bradford
Joe Flacco
Andy Dalton
Christian Ponder
Josh Freeman

Tier 3

This Tier is the type of QB who could realistically lose their starting position with a bad season next year. Or backups who will gain a starting position next year

Alex Smith
Matt Hasselbeck
Jake Locker
Matt Flynn


Tier 4

QBs who could (or should) realistically lose their jobs to a rookie/backup /free agent and better backups (NOT NAMED Peyton Manning)

Carson Palmer
Jason Campbell
Mark Sanchez
Chad Henne
Rex Grossman
Joe Webb
Shaun Hill

Tier 5

Those QBs who shouldn't have been starting in the first place

Tavaris Jackson
Colt McCoy


Tier 6

Tim Tebow

Tim Tebow

I like these tiers. I don't know why, but Eli could win multiple SB and I still wouldn't put him in the Elite category. There's just something about the guy that doesn't fit in that category.

San Diego Chicken
02-06-2012, 08:20 PM
Poor Rivers. If he doesn't drop the stinkin ball in KC I'm guessing he'd be much higher on these lists.

After Gaither joined the team he was back to being his old elite self.

Rosebud
02-06-2012, 10:03 PM
I like these tiers. I don't know why, but Eli could win multiple SB and I still wouldn't put him in the Elite category. There's just something about the guy that doesn't fit in that category.

It's his #s and more specifically how they compare to his big brother's. If you just watched him and didn't look up his numbers or know who his brother was, you'd easily see why so many people consider him elite.

Brothgar
02-06-2012, 11:21 PM
It's his #s and more specifically how they compare to his big brother's. If you just watched him and didn't look up his numbers or know who his brother was, you'd easily see why so many people consider him elite.

Not really it is about how he compares to the top tier players at the position. There is a noticeable gap between how well those three players play and the next set of guys. Brees Brady and Manning the Elder play at a higher level for longer than Eli. Period.

killxswitch
02-06-2012, 11:23 PM
Not really it is about how he compares to the top tier players at the position. There is a noticeable gap between how well those three players play and the next set of guys. Brees Brady and Manning the Elder play at a higher level for longer than Eli. Period.

I think people in this thread are having different discussions, or using different parameters anyway. No doubt Eli has fewer career accomplishments than guys like big bro Manning, Brees, or Brady. But if you are looking at who is the best going into 2012, lil Manning has to be ranked up there. I don't usually buy into the whole "clutch" argument but it's hard to argue against it with him.

Brothgar
02-06-2012, 11:35 PM
I think people in this thread are having different discussions, or using different parameters anyway. No doubt Eli has fewer career accomplishments than guys like big bro Manning, Brees, or Brady. But if you are looking at who is the best going into 2012, lil Manning has to be ranked up there. I don't usually buy into the whole "clutch" argument but it's hard to argue against it with him.

Ok lets look at it another way. Lets say that the NFL was found to be a front for the Taliban and must be dismantled the new league has a draft to determine the new teams. Would Eli be a serious candidate for #1 overall? If you say no then there must be a sizable gap between those who are in consideration and Eli. Thus he isn't elite.

Nalej
02-06-2012, 11:40 PM
Any list with Tebow not at No. 1 is just plain laughable.

vidae
02-06-2012, 11:40 PM
God I hate QB rankings. Why do I have to have Cassel. Why. :(

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 08:42 AM
God I hate QB rankings. Why do I have to have Cassel. Why. :(

Because Scott Pioli runs your team and Cassel was at one time a Patriot.

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 08:44 AM
Ok lets look at it another way. Lets say that the NFL was found to be a front for the Taliban and must be dismantled the new league has a draft to determine the new teams. Would Eli be a serious candidate for #1 overall? If you say no then there must be a sizable gap between those who are in consideration and Eli. Thus he isn't elite.

I don't think anybody would pick Peyton over Eli right now.

Bulldogs
02-07-2012, 08:46 AM
I don't think anybody would pick Peyton over Eli right now.

I think it depends. If he's in 2010 form I would. If he isn't then no. Almost impossible to say given we don't really know the situation.

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 08:49 AM
I think it depends. If he's in 2010 form I would. If he isn't then no. Almost impossible to say given we don't really know the situation.

Well, we kind of do. His neck is fine, but the nerves that control his tricep haven't regenerated, so he can't throw like he used to. They might regenerate, or they might not. There's no timeframe for when it will happen and no guarantee it will happen.

So, right now, I'm 100% positive no team would pick Peyton over Eli.

Bulldogs
02-07-2012, 08:58 AM
Well, we kind of do. His neck is fine, but the nerves that control his tricep haven't regenerated, so he can't throw like he used to. They might regenerate, or they might not. There's no timeframe for when it will happen and no guarantee it will happen.

So, right now, I'm 100% positive no team would pick Peyton over Eli.

For the future I would agree. It would be too much of a risk.

Matthew Jones
02-07-2012, 09:02 AM
Top 10:

1. Tom Brady

2. Aaron Rodgers

3. Drew Brees

4. Peyton Manning

5. Eli Manning

6. Ben Roethlisberger

7. Philip Rivers

8. Michael Vick

9. Matthew Stafford

10. Tony Romo

Peyton will probably move up again after showing he can successfully return.

Brothgar
02-07-2012, 09:04 AM
Well, we kind of do. His neck is fine, but the nerves that control his tricep haven't regenerated, so he can't throw like he used to. They might regenerate, or they might not. There's no timeframe for when it will happen and no guarantee it will happen.

So, right now, I'm 100% positive no team would pick Peyton over Eli.

Ok so forget Peyton for a moment. Because that isn't exactly the question is it? It isn't Peyton vs Eli it is weather or not Eli is an Elite QB. Would Eli be considered with a #1 overall pick if the league was blown up and we were building teams all over again. The answer is no, no team would really give it consideration. The debate would go for Brees Brady or maybe discount double check.

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 09:07 AM
Ok so forget Peyton for a moment. Because that isn't exactly the question is it? It isn't Peyton vs Eli it is weather or not Eli is an Elite QB. Would Eli be considered with a #1 overall pick if the league was blown up and we were building teams all over again. The answer is no, no team would really give it consideration. The debate would go for Brees Brady or maybe discount double check.

I agree with that. In my initial rankings I put Eli in the tier just below elite. Some people might be impressed with Eli enough to put him on par with the top 3 right now but I'm not there yet with him.

abaddon41_80
02-07-2012, 09:13 AM
Ridiculous disrespect to Alex Smith, in this topic. The man has 32 touchdowns to 7 interceptions with a 17-5 record since he was booed against the Eagles last year. Ten of those touchdowns, along with only two interceptions and a 3-1 record, came last season so that completely disproves the idea that Harbaugh made him look good.

He is the only QB ever to throw for 5+ touchdowns with no interceptions in his first two playoff games. He carried his team to a playoff win against the best offense in the NFL and the team many people expected to win the Super Bowl.

Anyone who has Smith outside of their top 15 is a hater. For him to be below anyone of the players on OP's Tier 4 is ridiculous when at worst he is just as good as Flacco

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 09:59 AM
Ok so forget Peyton for a moment. Because that isn't exactly the question is it? It isn't Peyton vs Eli it is weather or not Eli is an Elite QB. Would Eli be considered with a #1 overall pick if the league was blown up and we were building teams all over again. The answer is no, no team would really give it consideration. The debate would go for Brees Brady or maybe discount double check.

By that logic Brees and Brady aren't elite because no one would pick either of those old men over discount double check. His age + talent would make him the #1 pick with Stafford the likely #2. Does that make those two the only elite QBs in the NFL?

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 10:19 AM
i find it hilarious that gabbert made your list, but tebow doesn't.

Not a QB. He's a Trolling Jesusback.

ATLDirtyBirds
02-07-2012, 10:27 AM
Hmm. Not including Peyton at this point.

1. Rodgers
2. Brady
3. Drew Brees
4. Ben
5. Eli
6. Rivers
7. Stafford
8. Cutler
9. Romo

I feel really good about that as of this moment. I think Stafford can move up, but I'm happy with his positioning for now.

However, this where I'm struggling to accurately rank 10, 11, 12. Schaub, Ryan, Newton, Vick. (With Flacco coming in at 14).

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
02-07-2012, 11:02 AM
If we go by how they did against the best defense in the NFL, Tebow is a clear #1. Of course, the Steelers didn't play a lot of the top guys, but they did play Tom Brady, who most people have in the top 3. Based on the transitive property, Tebow is at the very least one spot above Brady and therefore a top 3 QB.

Brothgar
02-07-2012, 12:07 PM
By that logic Brees and Brady aren't elite because no one would pick either of those old men over discount double check. His age + talent would make him the #1 pick with Stafford the likely #2. Does that make those two the only elite QBs in the NFL?

So you're honestly saying that if you were a GM with the #1 overall pick in a new league draft that you wouldn't even consider taking Brady or Brees?? Then you sir are the worst GM on the planet.

jackalope
02-07-2012, 12:09 PM
Ok lets look at it another way. Lets say that the NFL was found to be a front for the Taliban and must be dismantled the new league has a draft to determine the new teams. Would Eli be a serious candidate for #1 overall? If you say no then there must be a sizable gap between those who are in consideration and Eli. Thus he isn't elite.

So, if you're going by this, how did you possibly not put Aaron Rodgers in the elite category?

If you're using a criteria that doesn't put Rodgers in the elite category, you're using a bad criteria.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
02-07-2012, 12:32 PM
Honestly if I had the #1 pick in that situation, I take a much longer look at Cam Newton than I do at Brees or Brady. Brady will be 35 before week 1 of next year, Brees is and will be 33. You're looking at, at the very most, 5 years of effective play from them. So why even consider passing on a guy who is already as good as(and IMO, better than) those two, and is also only 28 years old?? It makes no sense. Newton would be the guy I'd look second closest at, and that's only because of his mind-blowing potential and very young age. That said though, at pick 2, with Rodgers out of the picture, Brees is likely going to be picked.

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 12:33 PM
So you're honestly saying that if you were a GM with the #1 overall pick in a new league draft that you wouldn't even consider taking Brady or Brees?? Then you sir are the worst GM on the planet.

With Aaron Rodgers in the NFL? Of course I wouldn't pick them over him. Why limited my window to compete for a championship with QBs that aren't clearly better? That's just stupid. I'd consider Brady and Brees, just like I'd consider taking Eli, Stafford or Cam Newton as well, but ultimately picking anyone other Aaron Rodgers would make one the worst GM on the planet.

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 12:35 PM
Honestly if I had the #1 pick in that situation, I take a much longer look at Cam Newton than I do at Brees or Brady. Brady will be 35 before week 1 of next year, Brees is and will be 33. You're looking at, at the very most, 5 years of effective play from them. So why even consider passing on a guy who is already as good as(and IMO, better than) those two, and is also only 28 years old?? It makes no sense. Newton would be the guy I'd look second closest at, and that's only because of his mind-blowing potential and very young age. That said though, at pick 2, with Rodgers out of the picture, Brees is likely going to be picked.

Stafford. In that hypothetical Rodgers, Stafford and then Newton would be the first 3 picks. And Eli and Big Ben would be the one's battling Brees for that #4 spot.

Brothgar
02-07-2012, 01:04 PM
So, if you're going by this, how did you possibly not put Aaron Rodgers in the elite category?

If you're using a criteria that doesn't put Rodgers in the elite category, you're using a bad criteria.

I figured someone was going to jump on me for not putting Rodgers into the Elite category. I require three years of elite production. Rodgers has 2 years of elite production. As I said in my post to be elite you must be in the year in and year out conversation for MVP you don't have to win it (although Rodgers did). I will be the first to admit that he has played to an elite level for the past two seasons.

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 01:11 PM
I figured someone was going to jump on me for not putting Rodgers into the Elite category. I require three years of elite production. Rodgers has 2 years of elite production. As I said in my post to be elite you must be in the year in and year out conversation for MVP you don't have to win it (although Rodgers did). I will be the first to admit that he has played to an elite level for the past two seasons.

Would Rodgers be considered with a #1 overall pick if the league was blown up and we were building teams all over again? The answer's yes. So of course he's elite, in fact he's the only elite QB in the NFL.

AntoinCD
02-07-2012, 01:11 PM
I figured someone was going to jump on me for not putting Rodgers into the Elite category. I require three years of elite production. Rodgers has 2 years of elite production. As I said in my post to be elite you must be in the year in and year out conversation for MVP you don't have to win it (although Rodgers did). I will be the first to admit that he has played to an elite level for the past two seasons.

I'm definitely putting Rodgers as an elite QB but I really, really prefer your definition of elite over John Clayotn of ESPN. He has something like 13 QBs as elite including Joe Flacco.

Elite is the very best. Rodgers, Brady, Brees and Eli are elite at the minute. A few guys have the potential. Rivers needs a better cast round him. Stafford is close. Big Ben needs to stay healthy. Peyton obviously if he can come back to his regular play(if he ever does). I feel bad for saying there is 4 and potentially 8 elite guys at the minute.

Guys like Romo may never be elite but at any point could be a top 5 guy. He just struggles with consistency. Then you have younger guys like Newton coming through.

Saints-Tigers
02-07-2012, 01:18 PM
Rodgers isn't the only one that is elite. Age doesn't decide whether you're elite or not.

The #1 pick choice is easy though. Of the 3 elite QBs in the league at the moment, only one is fairly young.

Complex
02-07-2012, 01:29 PM
sorry to cherrypick, but if the excuse is 'talent around him', he's not an elite tier qb.

Then Peyton isn't a elite QB? remember last year when he struggled for a couple games because Collie and Dallas Clark were injured.The excuses were he is losing his top TE and one of his top WR's.

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 01:42 PM
i don't buy for a second that that was a valid argument for most of peyton's career. further, even if i were to, struggling for a couple of games is massively different than struggling for an entire season after getting one of your best weapons back, and having your best offensive threat play in more games than he did the season before.

I thought Rivers was hurt most of the season?

AntoinCD
02-07-2012, 01:47 PM
sorry to cherrypick, but if the excuse is 'talent around him', he's not an elite tier qb.

I think it's a tough situation to look at. Take Aaron Rodgers this year. Pretty much everyone will agree he was lights out and the rightful MVP. But he is about 5 or 6 deep with quality WRs. Yet when Jennings got hurt and the offensive line got hurt his play dropped significantly. Rivers played with a sucky offensive line and a hobbled Gates all year.

I'm not putting Rivers into the elite category, but before this year almost everyone had him as well as Rodgers as the guys who were going to take the next step.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
02-07-2012, 01:50 PM
Rivers has been just about to take that next step to best of the best status for about 4 years now....

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 01:51 PM
Rivers has been just about to take that next step to best of the best status for about 4 years now....

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
OMG THIS

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 01:52 PM
Rivers has been just about to take that next step to best of the best status for about 4 years now....

How much of a difference do you think a better HC would make?

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 01:53 PM
How much of a difference do you think a better HC would make?

How much difference would a lack of fantasy football make?

Brothgar
02-07-2012, 01:53 PM
Would Rodgers be considered with a #1 overall pick if the league was blown up and we were building teams all over again? The answer's yes. So of course he's elite, in fact he's the only elite QB in the NFL.

-_- great way to take a logical point and blow it way past its desired intent. Of course we are talking about players who are elite right now not those who are elite prospects. Honestly yeah Aaron Rodgers would get consideration as that top pick for teams that were looking to win year 1. As would Brady, Brees, and a healthy Manning the Elder. I may be stringent on my rules but it is to prevent having people fall out of elite status like Philip Rivers apparently did this year.

killxswitch
02-07-2012, 01:55 PM
How much difference would a lack of fantasy football make?

Not defending him. I don't like Rivers. But I do think if they'd kept Schottenheimer we'd view Rivers differently right now.

AntoinCD
02-07-2012, 02:03 PM
Rivers has been just about to take that next step to best of the best status for about 4 years now....

It's a down side to the position but QBs are judged more than any player on postseason success.

It's not his fault the Chargers are one of the most indisciplined teams in the NFL. The Chargers postseason runs from the middle of the last decade are filled with missed field goals, giving up return TDs, to defenders fumbling after getting an INT.

The Chargers have screwed themselves out of so many chances and it doesn't fall on Rivers most of the time. Marlon McCree and Nate Kaeding will go down in imphamy for the screw ups

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 02:06 PM
It's a down side to the position but QBs are judged more than any player on postseason success.

It's not his fault the Chargers are one of the most indisciplined teams in the NFL. The Chargers postseason runs from the middle of the last decade are filled with missed field goals, giving up return TDs, to defenders fumbling after getting an INT.

The Chargers have screwed themselves out of so many chances and it doesn't fall on Rivers most of the time. Marlon McCree and Nate Kaeding will go down in imphamy for the screw ups

Rivers: 7 playoff games, 1820 yards, 58%, 8 TDs, 9 INTs, 79 rating.

He plays just as ****** as everyone else on his team in the playoffs.

Sidenote: 2 of the Chargers' 3 postseason wins have come against the Colts - another poor postseason team. The 3rd was another "meh" AFCS team in Tennessee.

AntoinCD
02-07-2012, 02:17 PM
Rivers: 7 playoff games, 1820 yards, 58%, 8 TDs, 9 INTs, 79 rating.

He plays just as ****** as everyone else on his team in the playoffs.

Sidenote: 2 of the Chargers' 3 postseason wins have come against the Colts - another poor postseason team. The 3rd was another "meh" AFCS team in Tennessee.

Maybe so but 2006 AFCDG against the Patriots, Marlon McCree gets what appears to be the game sealing INT and gets it stripped. If they win that game they then play the Colts who as you mentioned they have a pretty good record against. Then the Bears in the Superbowl.

In 2007 AFCCG the Pats beat them again but only after stopping Michael Turner at the goal line and going and scoring a TD afterwards. Then the Giants in the Superbowl.

Even with those stats you gave, and say they lose to the Giants, if Rivers has one superbowl win and two appearances by 2007 he is definitely considered elite.

vidae
02-07-2012, 02:33 PM
I've been saying this about Rivers for god knows how long. He's the trendy pick to be the next elite QB and he never delivers. It's the same as the entire Chargers team. Every year they're SB locks and fail to make it. I just saw someone on NFLN (I know, look at the source) say that the Chargers are the team to beat in the AFC next year. The ****?

AntoinCD
02-07-2012, 02:43 PM
I've been saying this about Rivers for god knows how long. He's the trendy pick to be the next elite QB and he never delivers. It's the same as the entire Chargers team. Every year they're SB locks and fail to make it. I just saw someone on NFLN (I know, look at the source) say that the Chargers are the team to beat in the AFC next year. The ****?

It was like the Texans for about 5 years to make the playoffs.

I'm not trying to throw lots of love at Rivers but after finding themselves in an absolute perfect situation with the whole Eli Manning thing they have probably been the worst run organisation in football.

They went from being the most talented team in the NFL to being below average in like 3 years.

AJ Smith is a joke of a GM.
Norv Turner is a joke of a head coach.

I don't see the Chargers being back in the hunt for a while. They are maybe the least talented team in their division. The only thing they have is their QB is better than anything else in the division.

Look at the last few years. Instead of trading Vincent Jackson and getting picks AJ Smith plays stubborn and they get nothing after his holdout.

They draft Larry English who is trash.
They move up to draft Ryan Mathews at 12. He's ok when he's healthy.
They draft Corey Liuget who has done very little.

Their offensive line has become old and injured. Gates is always hurting. They lost Merriman, Jamal Williams, Olshansky, Casillas, Cromartie etc.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
02-07-2012, 02:45 PM
I've been saying this about Rivers for god knows how long. He's the trendy pick to be the next elite QB and he never delivers. It's the same as the entire Chargers team. Every year they're SB locks and fail to make it. I just saw someone on NFLN (I know, look at the source) say that the Chargers are the team to beat in the AFC next year. The ****?

Especially when you consider how ****** our division is.... other than the Chargers twice, we've had no dominant teams since Rivers came into the league. We've had no dominant defenses besides the time the Chargers were #1. Rivers has been EASILY the best QB in the division for his entire starting career, and the only one who was even good other than him was Cutler. Actually, since he's been drafted, he's been the best QB in the AFC West, while the second best in that timeframe was on his team...

There's just something about him. I think he's a great QB, but he's never gonna hit that absolutely elite level. His teams almost always underachieve, and I think some of that has to fall back onto him. With the groups he's had, he should have at least a SB appearance to his name.

jackalope
02-07-2012, 02:47 PM
I figured someone was going to jump on me for not putting Rodgers into the Elite category. I require three years of elite production. Rodgers has 2 years of elite production. As I said in my post to be elite you must be in the year in and year out conversation for MVP you don't have to win it (although Rodgers did). I will be the first to admit that he has played to an elite level for the past two seasons.

I think that's a foolish way of ranking them, since we're concerned with who is elite now. Also, three years ago, Rodgers threw for 4,434 yards with a QB rating of 103.2.

Complex
02-07-2012, 02:48 PM
Phillip Rivers is a great a QB. People forget last season when Gates was injured, Jackson was holding out and he was throwing to his 4th and 5th string WR's because his 2nd and 3rd WR's were injured. I think they lost like 3 or 4 games because there special teams sucked balls.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
02-07-2012, 02:49 PM
I don't see the Chargers being back in the hunt for a while. They are maybe the least talented team in their division. The only thing they have is their QB is better than anything else in the division.



Have you seen the rest of the division recently?

Mufasa
02-07-2012, 02:50 PM
I figured someone was going to jump on me for not putting Rodgers into the Elite category. I require three years of elite production. Rodgers has 2 years of elite production. As I said in my post to be elite you must be in the year in and year out conversation for MVP you don't have to win it (although Rodgers did). I will be the first to admit that he has played to an elite level for the past two seasons.

Why do you choose to ignore 2009 then?

2010: 3,992 yards, 28 TDs, 11 INT, 65.7% completion, 101.2 QB rating, in 15 games

2009: 4,434 yards, 30 TDs, 7 INT, 64.7% completion, 103.2 QB rating

I would say that from watching him, he did play slightly better in 2010 than 2009, but he still had a great year in 2009. And even 2008 he was very good. I think the 4 years he's had is plenty of a track record. And it's not like he won't do it again next year.

AntoinCD
02-07-2012, 02:51 PM
Phillip Rivers is a great a QB. People forget last season when Gates was injured, Jackson was holding out and he was throwing to his 4th and 5th string WR's because his 2nd and 3rd WR's were injured. I think they lost like 3 or 4 games because there special teams sucked balls.

The Pats beat them last year because their special teams is balls and one of those 4th or 5th string WRs made a nice catch, got up and left the ball on the ground and the Pats recovered it. Also there was a pass in the flat that Rivers made, the RB dropped it and all the Chargers stopped as though it was incomplete, despite the fact it was clearly like two yards backwards and therefore a fumble. The Chargers often have to play their opponents and their own incompetence at the same time.

Stupidity, ill-discipline and not being prepared enough comes down to coaching.

Brothgar
02-07-2012, 03:39 PM
Why do you choose to ignore 2009 then?

2010: 3,992 yards, 28 TDs, 11 INT, 65.7% completion, 101.2 QB rating, in 15 games

2009: 4,434 yards, 30 TDs, 7 INT, 64.7% completion, 103.2 QB rating

I would say that from watching him, he did play slightly better in 2010 than 2009, but he still had a great year in 2009. And even 2008 he was very good. I think the 4 years he's had is plenty of a track record. And it's not like he won't do it again next year.

-____- 2009 was my final year of grad school many things are forgotten about 2009. But I guess you guys are right.

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 03:42 PM
Maybe so but 2006 AFCDG against the Patriots, Marlon McCree gets what appears to be the game sealing INT and gets it stripped. If they win that game they then play the Colts who as you mentioned they have a pretty good record against. Then the Bears in the Superbowl.

In 2007 AFCCG the Pats beat them again but only after stopping Michael Turner at the goal line and going and scoring a TD afterwards. Then the Giants in the Superbowl.

Even with those stats you gave, and say they lose to the Giants, if Rivers has one superbowl win and two appearances by 2007 he is definitely considered elite.

Can't we do this with every team, evar?

yo123
02-07-2012, 03:44 PM
Can't we do this with every team, evar?

If the Patriots didn't not win the Super Bowl they would have won the Super Bowl! I can't stand these arguments.

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 03:47 PM
If the Patriots didn't not win the Super Bowl they would have won the Super Bowl! I can't stand these arguments.

If the 1999 Jaguars had played anybody besides the Titans, they would have gone 18-0 and played vs the Rams in a game that would have been even more exciting than the ******** Titans/Rams Superbowl.

Or if the refs would have just done their job, and thrown a ******* flag on the ******* illegal Music City Cunticle.

And then Mark Brunell would be a HOF QB.

bantx
02-07-2012, 03:58 PM
So much Rivers hate lol

River's was a monster playing with 4th, 5th, and 6th string receivers making some amazing throws. This year he had no time to throw at all we had one of the worst Offensive linemen play this season for us ever. We moved 2 practice squad OL to start on our OL. Up until we signed Gaithers was when our OL started playing some what decent. Rivers has one bad season and the band of River bashers unite.

RaiderNation
02-07-2012, 04:39 PM
So much Rivers hate lol

River's was a monster playing with 4th, 5th, and 6th string receivers making some amazing throws. This year he had no time to throw at all we had one of the worst Offensive linemen play this season for us ever. We moved 2 practice squad OL to start on our OL. Up until we signed Gaithers was when our OL started playing some what decent. Rivers has one bad season and the band of River bashers unite.

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1217.snc4/156897_524902150459_73801435_30863811_713697_n.jpg

Lol but really though Rivers is a top 10 QB in the NFL no doubt even with a poor season last year. He must get better pass protection and keep Vincent Jackson to have a better season statistically.

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 04:40 PM
Rodgers isn't the only one that is elite. Age doesn't decide whether you're elite or not.

The #1 pick choice is easy though. Of the 3 elite QBs in the league at the moment, only one is fairly young.

Well Broth used the to be elite a player would need to get consideration for the #1 pick in a hypothetical fantasy draft criteria. And by that criteria Rodgers, and maybe Stafford and Newton are the only potential elite QBs.

Rosebud
02-07-2012, 04:46 PM
-_- great way to take a logical point and blow it way past its desired intent. Of course we are talking about players who are elite right now not those who are elite prospects. Honestly yeah Aaron Rodgers would get consideration as that top pick for teams that were looking to win year 1. As would Brady, Brees, and a healthy Manning the Elder. I may be stringent on my rules but it is to prevent having people fall out of elite status like Philip Rivers apparently did this year.

A team looking to win year 1 would also consider Eli, so that criteria either includes Eli or excludes everyone other than Rodgers.

San Diego Chicken
02-07-2012, 04:54 PM
So much Rivers hate lol

River's was a monster playing with 4th, 5th, and 6th string receivers making some amazing throws. This year he had no time to throw at all we had one of the worst Offensive linemen play this season for us ever. We moved 2 practice squad OL to start on our OL. Up until we signed Gaithers was when our OL started playing some what decent. Rivers has one bad season and the band of River bashers unite.

It's because people here are fickle and tend to remember the most recent thing that you accomplished. All it takes is one good postseason run to change the perception.

When Eli Manning went 1 and done in 2008 and missed the playoffs for two straight years (throwing 25 picks in 2010) he wasn't being called elite either.

But all it takes is one good postseason run, and therein lies the problem... football is of course a team sport, and perhaps if the Chargers were able to trot out as impressive a defensive line as the Giants have maybe they'd have two Super Bowl wins too. Hell, if Rivers doesn't tear his ACL in the playoffs a few years ago...

Plus, you know a player is good, when even in a "bad season" he has a passer rating of 88+ and throws for 4600 yards and 27 touchdowns.

Wouldn't worry about it too much.

J-Mike88
02-07-2012, 04:55 PM
its like beating a dead horse with this topic
Well, it looks like we have a lot of pony drummers then because there's been a lot of discussion in the thread.

Still amazes me when someone doesn't like a topic someone else created, they still take the time to chime in and complain.

Like my wife.

TACKLE
02-07-2012, 04:59 PM
Can't we do this with every team, evar?

If Lee Evans just....... :(

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
02-07-2012, 05:00 PM
I still think Rivers is easily top 10 and would be fine slotting him anywhere after #4. I think there are a few guys there that are pretty much interchangeable. I don't think the discussion is "is Rivers a great QB?" because he clearly is, I think the discussion is, is Rivers in *that* group. I merely pointed out that for the past 4 years, everyone has said that this is the year Rivers and the Chargers take that step.

San Diego Chicken
02-07-2012, 05:08 PM
I still think Rivers is easily top 10 and would be fine slotting him anywhere after #4. I think there are a few guys there that are pretty much interchangeable. I don't think the discussion is "is Rivers a great QB?" because he clearly is, I think the discussion is, is Rivers in *that* group. I merely pointed out that for the past 4 years, everyone has said that this is the year Rivers and the Chargers take that step.

The problem is the rest of the team, namely the defense, hasn't taken that "step".

If you want to isolate Rivers, he elevated his game to "elite" back in 2008 when he had his finest season. From 08-10 name me a QB who played better... he took a step back last year with some costly mistakes and turnovers, but the OL for the middle six weeks of last year was the worst in the NFL easily. PFF stated that Brandyn Dombrowski was the worst left tackle they had EVER graded during that stretch.

Even when the Charger defense plays well in spurts, weird stuff happens (i.e. special teams ridiculousness)

ChiFan24
02-07-2012, 05:16 PM
I'm not reading through this thread, but somebody go back and find all of the posts that disrespect Cutty so I can neg rep the **** out of them. I don't care what the stats say, Cutler shits all over Stafford as a QB.

Here's my list. I'm starting an expansion team in a neutral, open air climate (like San Fran) and can sign a QB to a 1 year contract (all cost the same). My order of preference, with last year in parentheses:

1. Aaron Rodgers (5)
2. Tom Brady (2)
3. Drew Brees (4)
4. Eli Manning (8)
5. Ben Roethlisberger (3)
6. Jay Cutler (9)
7. Peyton Manning (1)
8. Phillip Rivers (6)
9. Tony Romo (10)
10. Michael Vick (7)
11. Matthew Stafford
12. Cam Newton
13. Matt Ryan
14. Matt Schaub
15. Joe Flacco

Nobody else worth mentioning.

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 05:23 PM
The problem is the rest of the team, namely the defense, hasn't taken that "step".

If you want to isolate Rivers, he elevated his game to "elite" back in 2008 when he had his finest season. From 08-10 name me a QB who played better... he took a step back last year with some costly mistakes and turnovers, but the OL for the middle six weeks of last year was the worst in the NFL easily. PFF stated that Brandyn Dombrowski was the worst left tackle they had EVER graded during that stretch.

Even when the Charger defense plays well in spurts, weird stuff happens (i.e. special teams ridiculousness)

How does that make him different from, say, Tony Romo or Matt Schaub in recent years?

J-Mike88
02-07-2012, 05:28 PM
Big Brandon doesn't seem to rank Brady too high:

Giants running back Brandon Jacobs appears to have more respect for Packers QB Aaron Rodgers and Saints QB Drew Brees in that type of game-winning situation.

“I respect Tom Brady and the New England Patriots,” Jacobs told the Associated Press. “He does a great job with the guys he has. But if that was Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers on the other side, with those big play outfits, 57 seconds would have been plenty enough time for those guys.”

Jacobs said the Patriots struggled to move the ball down the field.

“They needed a helluva lot more than 57 seconds to be able to win the football game,” Jacobs said. “So I wasn’t worried at all.”

DraftSavant
02-07-2012, 05:29 PM
Big Brandon doesn't seem to rank Brady too high:

Giants running back Brandon Jacobs appears to have more respect for Packers QB Aaron Rodgers and Saints QB Drew Brees in that type of game-winning situation.

“I respect Tom Brady and the New England Patriots,” Jacobs told the Associated Press. “He does a great job with the guys he has. But if that was Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers on the other side, with those big play outfits, 57 seconds would have been plenty enough time for those guys.”

Jacobs said the Patriots struggled to move the ball down the field.

“They needed a helluva lot more than 57 seconds to be able to win the football game,” Jacobs said. “So I wasn’t worried at all.”

Is he disrespecting Brady or the supporting cast? Depends on what you want to be true, I guess.

San Diego Chicken
02-07-2012, 05:31 PM
How does that make him different from, say, Tony Romo or Matt Schaub in recent years?

Romo is a bit unfairly scrutinized. He's another guy who is scrutinized for notable mistakes and playoff failures. When he's on, he's effective. But he really hasn't had that MVP caliber season yet so that holds him out of elite status.

Schaub is a good QB but more in the realm of game manager. How confident would you be that he could carry an offense, which Rivers has proven he can?

Is this a snap judgement because of this year or have you always felt this way (not familiar with you as a poster)

Scotty D
02-07-2012, 07:34 PM
I'm not reading through this thread, but somebody go back and find all of the posts that disrespect Cutty so I can neg rep the **** out of them. I don't care what the stats say, Cutler shits all over Stafford as a QB.

\

http://i.imgur.com/Xi6Do.gif

FUNBUNCHER
02-07-2012, 08:48 PM
Is that a midget or a fatso middle schooler???

Jvig43
02-07-2012, 09:02 PM
Big Brandon doesn't seem to rank Brady too high:

Giants running back Brandon Jacobs appears to have more respect for Packers QB Aaron Rodgers and Saints QB Drew Brees in that type of game-winning situation.

“I respect Tom Brady and the New England Patriots,” Jacobs told the Associated Press. “He does a great job with the guys he has. But if that was Drew Brees or Aaron Rodgers on the other side, with those big play outfits, 57 seconds would have been plenty enough time for those guys.”

Jacobs said the Patriots struggled to move the ball down the field.

“They needed a helluva lot more than 57 seconds to be able to win the football game,” Jacobs said. “So I wasn’t worried at all.”

Who cares about anything Bradon Jacobs has to say on QB play.......

bigbluedefense
02-08-2012, 07:30 AM
I've said this before, I think Phillip Rivers is this generation's Dan Fouts. He's a great statistical qb who's just falling short in the playoffs.

Nothing for nothing, Dan Fouts is a HOFer, so it's not a knock. But that just seems to be what Phillip Rivers is. I think his perception is different than Fouts bc in today's NFL, statistics for qbs are weighed more bc of fantasy football's influence on our perception of offensive players.

jsagan77
02-16-2012, 09:45 AM
1. Brady
2. Rodgers
3. Brees
4. P. Manning
5. Rivers
6. E. Manning
7. Stafford
8. Roth
9. Cutler
10. Romo

If I was starting a team today and I wanted a QB for the next 10 years:

1. Rodgers
2. Stafford
3. Ryan
4. Newton
5. Luck

killxswitch
02-16-2012, 10:53 AM
1. Brady
2. Rodgers
3. Brees
4. P. Manning
5. Rivers
6. E. Manning
7. Stafford
8. Roth
9. Cutler
10. Romo

If I was starting a team today and I wanted a QB for the next 10 years:

1. Rodgers
2. Stafford
3. Ryan
4. Newton
5. Luck

If you're going to do something stupid like rank P Manning 4th when he hasn't played football in a year and probably won't ever play again, then just don't rank him.

DraftSavant
02-16-2012, 10:54 AM
If you're going to do something stupid like rank P Manning 4th when he hasn't played football in a year and probably won't ever play again, then just don't rank him.

Is it really that crazy, though? You could make the argument that he was sitting at around #4 after the 2010 season.

killxswitch
02-16-2012, 10:58 AM
Is it really that crazy, though? You could make the argument that he was sitting at around #4 after the 2010 season.

But why would we be ranking QBs from that time? Who else has done that in this thread?

DraftSavant
02-16-2012, 10:59 AM
But why would we be ranking QBs from that time? Who else has done that in this thread?

We aren't, but if you already had him there, on what basis can you move him up higher?

killxswitch
02-16-2012, 11:02 AM
We aren't, but if you already had him there, on what basis can you move him up higher?

On what basis can you rank him at all? You can't, because he can't throw the ball. So he is realistically probably the worst QB "in the NFL" right now. Should we rank him at the bottom? It just makes no sense to rank him anywhere at all to me, and to rank him 4th seems like pushing an agenda.

DraftSavant
02-16-2012, 11:06 AM
On what basis can you rank him at all? You can't, because he can't throw the ball. So he is realistically probably the worst QB "in the NFL" right now. Should we rank him at the bottom? It just makes no sense to rank him anywhere at all to me, and to rank him 4th seems like pushing an agenda.

GETTING MAD ABOUT HIM RANKED AT 4 IS WHERE THE AGENDA IS BEING PUSHED
;)

Bulldogs
02-16-2012, 11:07 AM
On what basis can you rank him at all? You can't, because he can't throw the ball. So he is realistically probably the worst QB "in the NFL" right now. Should we rank him at the bottom? It just makes no sense to rank him anywhere at all to me, and to rank him 4th seems like pushing an agenda.

My rationale had to do with body of work and what I feel he will accomplish in 2012.

jrdrylie
02-16-2012, 04:22 PM
On what basis can you rank him at all? You can't, because he can't throw the ball. So he is realistically probably the worst QB "in the NFL" right now. Should we rank him at the bottom? It just makes no sense to rank him anywhere at all to me, and to rank him 4th seems like pushing an agenda.

I'd still take a Manning who can't throw over Blaine Gabbert.