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BeerBaron
03-05-2012, 08:25 PM
He just wants a draft order.

draftguru151
03-05-2012, 08:56 PM
Wtf everyone was so pumped for the 2013 draft and I get 4 votes all day!

fenikz
03-05-2012, 09:06 PM
And BB is holding me back from a Super Bowl title

Grizzlegom
03-05-2012, 09:18 PM
I sent my draft order for next year to DG.

Brothgar
03-05-2012, 10:21 PM
It is a little hard with some teams not having a depth chart posted.

fenikz
03-05-2012, 10:23 PM
Ya 4 1/2 teams missing with KC only having a 35 man roster

Caddy
03-05-2012, 10:25 PM
Lolz Jets having Sean Jones as a FS

Hurricanes25
03-05-2012, 10:30 PM
Lolz Jets having Sean Jones as a FS

Hey, he's an upgrade from Eric Smith.

Edit: Actually he should be at SS and Deon Grant at FS.

ChiFan24
03-05-2012, 10:38 PM
Sent my order. Docked a couple wins from those without depth charts because it's hard to win games without players.

Caddy
03-05-2012, 10:41 PM
Hey, he's an upgrade from Eric Smith.

Edit: Actually he should be at SS and Deon Grant at FS.

Still hilarious. Sean Jones is horrendous.

DeepThreat
03-05-2012, 10:43 PM
Still hilarious. Sean Jones is horrendous.

I second this opinion.

scottyboy
03-05-2012, 10:44 PM
and grant should not be starting. 'specially at FS

Hurricanes25
03-05-2012, 10:47 PM
and grant should not be starting. 'specially at FS

He played FS plenty last year when Rolle was in the slot and looked pretty damn good to me.

Grant and Jones is an upgrade from Eric Smith and Jim Leonhard who is coming off of 2 straight season ending injuries. We really didn't have many options.

Caddy
03-05-2012, 10:53 PM
Jones isn't an upgrade over anyone in the entire league!

Go_Eagles77
03-05-2012, 11:03 PM
Just submitted my predictions to DG.

Unbiased
03-05-2012, 11:05 PM
Everyone hates their team's former safeties and labels them as the worst in the league. We get it.

Caddy
03-05-2012, 11:21 PM
Everyone hates their team's former safeties and labels them as the worst in the league. We get it.

I don't think you understand the seriousness of the situation. SEAN JONES.

redbills
03-05-2012, 11:21 PM
Tebow to Plaxico. ugh.

ChiFan24
03-05-2012, 11:30 PM
Everyone hates their team's former safeties and labels them as the worst in the league. We get it.

This. Jones might actually be the worst, but I don't think anyone seems to realize that being a good safety is really, really hard in today's game.

ChiFan24
03-05-2012, 11:34 PM
Oh and I picked the Broncos to win that division. The rest of the AFC West looks pretty soft. The Chiefs are the only other team I don't hate.

TheBoyWonder22
03-06-2012, 12:59 AM
Tebow to Plaxico. ugh.Ha can you elaborate? I think he'd be good in terms of development. I tried very hard to give him targets that would provide a safety net in Plax, Carlson and Jones. Tebow undoubtedly needs them.

ChiFan24
03-06-2012, 01:02 AM
Broth, my picks are eerily similar to yours so far. Only one difference, I think.

Oh, also, I think this round of picks should only be used to pick playoff teams. Then we vote on the playoff matchups. Might take some time, but I think it would be cool.

fenikz
03-06-2012, 02:12 AM
I think that's what we're doing

Matthew Jones
03-06-2012, 01:56 PM
I'm feeling especially good about my receivers now that Moss reportedly still has his athleticism and Welker is fine with the franchise tag.

draftguru151
03-06-2012, 02:36 PM
I think that's what we're doing

Considering the lack of interest so far I was just gonna do the whole thing based off these votes. I'm at 10 votes atm.

redbills
03-06-2012, 02:38 PM
Will send in mine by 2night if that k.

BeerBaron
03-06-2012, 02:40 PM
Someone is on their phone.

SuperPacker
03-06-2012, 03:51 PM
Someone is on their phone.

Im on my phone half of the time and i dont type like a ****** lol.

ChiFan24
03-06-2012, 03:52 PM
I'm feeling especially good about my receivers now that Moss reportedly still has his athleticism and Welker is fine with the franchise tag.

Yeah, I picked you guys to win your division handily because I still have total faith in Moss. That was a really solid offseason.

Glad my Bears are getting love. If everyone stays healthy I'd feel pretty good about our Super Bowl chances. I really hope that Osi deal happens in real life.

BeerBaron
03-06-2012, 03:57 PM
Yeah, I picked you guys to win your division handily because I still have total faith in Moss. That was a really solid offseason.

Glad my Bears are getting love. If everyone stays healthy I'd feel pretty good about our Super Bowl chances. I really hope that Osi deal happens in real life.

IRL, replace Bowe with VJax, make the Osi trade and go BPA in first round of the draft and we'd be in great shape. Really great shape. We'd still need a corner opposite Tillman but anything above bringing Jennings back would be an upgrade, and even if we had to bring him back, it wouldn't be the worst thing ever. He's serviceable.

As for the Patriots...if that news of Moss looking good in workouts came before I sent mine in, I might have bumped you up a win or two. I just do not have much faith in him.

Matthew Jones
03-06-2012, 04:22 PM
IRL, replace Bowe with VJax, make the Osi trade and go BPA in first round of the draft and we'd be in great shape. Really great shape. We'd still need a corner opposite Tillman but anything above bringing Jennings back would be an upgrade, and even if we had to bring him back, it wouldn't be the worst thing ever. He's serviceable.

As for the Patriots...if that news of Moss looking good in workouts came before I sent mine in, I might have bumped you up a win or two. I just do not have much faith in him.

Ultimately I feel like the Patriots should be able to win 13 or so games this season regardless of what they do at wide receiver; bringing in a top free agent would just push the passing attack from "elite" to "unstoppable" because they have Tom Brady and three outstanding weapons already.

Looking at the Patriots' schedule, San Francisco and Houston are the only winning teams from 2011 who they face at home, and Baltimore and the Titans are the only winning teams they play on the road. The rest of New England's opponents are:

Home: Broncos, Jets, Cardinals, Dolphins, Bills, Colts

Away: Jets, Seahawks, Dolphins, Bills, Jaguars, Rams

The Pats should be favored in every game this season with the possible exceptions of San Francisco and Baltimore, and hosting the 49ers rather than traveling to the west coast will be a great help. New England's road schedule is cake for the whole season aside from the Ravens game and they usually take care of business at home (Brady has a 69-12 career record.)

I just don't see any chance they lose six of those games barring something completely unforeseen.

Matthew Jones
03-06-2012, 04:29 PM
The significant player replacements are as follows:

QB Brian Hoyer -> Ryan Mallett

WR Chad Ochocinco -> Randy Moss

OT Matt Light -> Nate Solder

C Dan Connolly* -> Peter Konz

DT Ron Brace -> Josh Chapman

DE Andre Carter -> Matt Roth

DE Brandon Deaderick* -> Marcus Spears

DE Shaun Ellis -> Kendall Langford

LB Gary Guyton -> Manny Lawson

CB Antwaun Molden -> Ras-I Dowling (I.R.)

CB Sterling Moore* -> Brandon Boykin

S James Ihedigbo -> Michael Griffin

S Josh Barrett -> Harrison Smith

* denotes a player still on roster

Massive upgrades all around with the possible exception of Carter for Roth, although Roth is a great fit in the defense and Carter will be 33 and coming off of a season-ending injury.

TACKLE
03-06-2012, 04:35 PM
"Massive upgrade" is overstating it on more than a few. Don't know why you're replacing Sterling Moore either. He's the best DB on your roster.

BeerBaron
03-06-2012, 04:43 PM
Yeah, no. You got lucky last year. Griffin is by far, by FAR the only upgrade I'd consider "significant."

IRL, rolling with the status quo plus Randy Moss would not be good for your offense. Welker and the TEs just do not compliment eachother well. Teams can just jam pack the middle of the field and make you earn every pickup as they did last year.

An elite deep threat would make your offense unstoppable. Without someone who can do that consistently, you'll be limited in how much of the field you can use since no one is there taking the safeties off the top.

Matthew Jones
03-06-2012, 05:13 PM
"Massive upgrade" is overstating it on more than a few. Don't know why you're replacing Sterling Moore either. He's the best DB on your roster.

Yeah, no. You got lucky last year. Griffin is by far, by FAR the only upgrade I'd consider "significant."

IRL, rolling with the status quo plus Randy Moss would not be good for your offense. Welker and the TEs just do not compliment eachother well. Teams can just jam pack the middle of the field and make you earn every pickup as they did last year.

An elite deep threat would make your offense unstoppable. Without someone who can do that consistently, you'll be limited in how much of the field you can use since no one is there taking the safeties off the top.

Ochocinco, Brace, Ellis, Guyton, and Ihedigbo were all liabilities last season, Molden had a QBR against of 107 or so, and Barrett's constantly injured. The DBs may be back next season as reserves if the Patriots can't bring in anyone, but it seems unlikely. Ochocinco and Ellis looked completely cooked, and Gary Guyton was benched for Tracy White shortly through the season. Ron Brace made it on the field for only 90 snaps or so. Hoyer deserves a shot but wouldn't ever get one in New England, and Light played well but Solder is significantly more athletic and ready to step into the starting lineup.

The Patriots didn't have an elite deep threat last year and were able to pass for over 5,000 yards with the same three primary options, averaging over 32 points per game. I'm not really sure how a team that went 15-3 overall and won their conference can be described as "lucky." I know the Patriots are easy to hate but failing to recognize the steps forward is either biased or oblivious.

ChiFan24
03-06-2012, 05:46 PM
IRL, replace Bowe with VJax, make the Osi trade and go BPA in first round of the draft and we'd be in great shape. Really great shape. We'd still need a corner opposite Tillman but anything above bringing Jennings back would be an upgrade, and even if we had to bring him back, it wouldn't be the worst thing ever. He's serviceable.

As for the Patriots...if that news of Moss looking good in workouts came before I sent mine in, I might have bumped you up a win or two. I just do not have much faith in him.

Yeah, the first round of my draft was a disaster and it was compounded by Adams having a terrible workout. If I could do it again I'd just stay at 22 and take Konz. I fully expect Jennings back at CB, which isn't the worst thing in the world. Besides a couple rough games he's been shockingly solid.

marshallb
03-07-2012, 10:14 AM
As long as DG is still taking predictions, I will try to get mine in sometime today. I've been insanely busy the past few days with midterms and work, but will try to get it done.

Unbiased
03-07-2012, 12:54 PM
hhhmmm, i guess Jeremy Mincey and Whitney Mercilus were wastes.

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 01:05 PM
Jones is playing LB where ever he goes anyway. And Fluker is the third best OL on his own team. Bleh at Woods first overall, wouldn't be shocked if Allen ends up higher next year.

I'm gonna cut off voting at 5et (in 3 hours) today. Would you guys prefer just the playoff teams or do the whole order today? I'd prefer to just do it all now so we can move to the 2013 mock. I'm gonna post playoff match ups and winners though.

BeerBaron
03-07-2012, 01:06 PM
I submitted my whole order already. No real interest in changing it up.

SuperPacker
03-07-2012, 01:07 PM
Jones is playing LB where ever he goes anyway. And Fluker is the third best OL on his own team. Bleh at Woods first overall, wouldn't be shocked if Allen ends up higher next year.

I'm gonna cut off voting at 5et (in 3 hours) today. Would you guys prefer just the playoff teams or do the whole order today? I'd prefer to just do it all now so we can move to the 2013 mock. I'm gonna post playoff match ups and winners though.

Yeah just do it all now!

Shane P. Hallam
03-07-2012, 01:08 PM
Is the draft just going to be a free for all underclassman wise?

BeerBaron
03-07-2012, 01:09 PM
I for one don't feel like making an underclassmen list. Since we're only doing the first round, why not. Guys typically come out when they're expected to be first round picks.

TACKLE
03-07-2012, 01:21 PM
Why did I have to trade my 2013 1st rounder? :(

I thought it would be inconsequential! I would have taken Nico Johnson over Zach for sure.

Shane P. Hallam
03-07-2012, 01:23 PM
Why did I have to trade my 2013 1st rounder? :(

I thought it would be inconsequential! I would have taken Nico Johnson over Zach for sure.

:lol::whistle:

TACKLE
03-07-2012, 01:28 PM
:lol::whistle:

What a clever retort.

Shane P. Hallam
03-07-2012, 01:32 PM
What a clever retort.

I know, I'm so clever

OSUGiants17
03-07-2012, 01:37 PM
How will we be deciding on the 2013 draft class? I can help if you'd like, I know a decent amount about the Juniors and Sophomores from this year

BeerBaron
03-07-2012, 01:39 PM
How will we be deciding on the 2013 draft class? I can help if you'd like, I know a decent amount about the Juniors and Sophomores from this year

Five. Five posts up.

I for one don't feel like making an underclassmen list. Since we're only doing the first round, why not. Guys typically come out when they're expected to be first round picks.

OSUGiants17
03-07-2012, 01:56 PM
Sorry BB lol. So is it just gonna be they all declare and take one if you want?

SuperPacker
03-07-2012, 03:19 PM
Sorry BB lol. So is it just gonna be they all declare and take one if you want?

Yes. (10char)

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 06:55 PM
Top 20 of the draft order is posted, as well as the playoff brackets. Probably won't get through the playoffs tonight unless someone wants to write so game reviews for them (PM me if you're interested, just need a few lines for the game and I'll tell you the winner).

ChiFan24
03-07-2012, 06:56 PM
My Bears would mercilessly rape those Falcons, and similarly rape the Cardinals. That's all I have to say on the matter.

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 07:03 PM
Damn, I didn't get to send mine in. My Internet just came back on! Oh well, since the whole Tebow thing failed, I want to get one of Barkley, Wilson or Bray.

DeepThreat
03-07-2012, 07:05 PM
Damn, I didn't get to send mine in. My Internet just came back on! Oh well, since the whole Tebow thing failed, I want to get one of Barkley, Wilson or Bray.

Good luck with that.

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 07:08 PM
You can have Landry Jones.

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 07:11 PM
Good luck with that.
I never said it would be easy. I should have signed Manning!

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 07:11 PM
You can have Landry Jones.
Ewww, no thank you.

Go_Eagles77
03-07-2012, 07:16 PM
So are we actually doing playoff voting?

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 07:18 PM
No, I'm just gonna do it game by game. If we could get a roll call for who is still paying attention that would be nice.

redbills
03-07-2012, 07:21 PM
Wow so the Bills didnt get any better, okay. Wasnt expecting playoffs but okay.

redbills
03-07-2012, 07:23 PM
CIN BAL and PIT made playoffs. Has that ever happened? 3 out of the 4 teams in div. Make playoffs.

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 07:24 PM
Wow so the Bills didnt get any better, okay. Wasnt expecting playoffs but okay.
At least you didn't get worse after getting Williams and McFadden. You guys are silly.
^this season.......

redbills
03-07-2012, 07:25 PM
At least you didn't get worse after getting Williams and McFadden. You guys are silly.

I had you winning your div.

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 07:26 PM
Bills had a pretty odd range, 6 votes below 10 and 4 at 18 and up.

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 07:27 PM
CIN BAL and PIT made playoffs. Has that ever happened? 3 out of the 4 teams in div. Make playoffs.

Those 3 made it this past year.

redbills
03-07-2012, 07:28 PM
Bills had a pretty odd range, 6 votes below 10 and 4 at 18 and up.

To the 6. I just don't see how Finley, Avril, Tulloch, Upsahw plus keeping Stevie Stylez and Bell make this team no better.


Owell I m over it.

redbills
03-07-2012, 07:29 PM
Those 3 made it this past year.

Really? Okay I was wrong just didn't look right.

Brothgar
03-07-2012, 07:30 PM
I'm paying attention I'm shocked that the Bills didn't get in.

OSUGiants17
03-07-2012, 07:35 PM
I'm paying attention I'm shocked that the Bills didn't get in.

Same, they should have made it over the Steelers

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 07:36 PM
Bills had a pretty odd range, 6 votes below 10 and 4 at 18 and up.
I imagine I had a few at the top, maybe one last place and mostly middle. Is that accurate?

marshallb
03-07-2012, 07:39 PM
I'm paying attention. Just got back, and was about to start doing my predictions, but I see I'm too late. Oh, well, looks like the Vikings should get a stud at 4 to help continue the rebuilding and would have 2 seconds thanks to trading down with the Skins.

Unbiased
03-07-2012, 07:44 PM
Wow so the Bills didnt get any better, okay. Wasnt expecting playoffs but okay.

That's not at all what that means. Of course your team got better. That doesn't mean every other team stayed exactly the same. They got better, too.

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 07:47 PM
I imagine I had a few at the top, maybe one last place and mostly middle. Is that accurate?

Yep, I'll post all the votes after but you had a high of 25 and a low of 3 with a bunch of 9 to 12s.

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 07:52 PM
Yep, I'll post all the votes after but you had a high of 25 and a low of 3 with a bunch of 9 to 12s.
Holy ****, a three?! It's not like my schedule's as hard as it looks outside of a few teams, but it's whatever at this point.

redbills
03-07-2012, 07:57 PM
That's not at all what that means. Of course your team got better. That doesn't mean every other team stayed exactly the same. They got better, too.

I am not going to get into it. No point.

Grizzlegom
03-07-2012, 08:10 PM
Wooo! Texans got number one seed! Probably has more to do with the weak division though haha

Grizzlegom
03-07-2012, 08:12 PM
The Bills still have Fitzpatrick at QB and the Broncos are still rocking Tebow. That in itself should hold those two teams back IMO. I expect both to take major steps backwards this year as teams will have a full season of gametape to gameplan against them now.

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 08:15 PM
The Bills still have Fitzpatrick at QB and the Broncos are still rocking Tebow. That in itself should hold those two teams back IMO. I expect both to take major steps backwards this year as teams will have a full season of gametape to gameplan against them now.
If he plays badly consistently, Hoyer would go in no later than game 5 on my team. Id like to think Hoyer is a competent starter.

OSUGiants17
03-07-2012, 08:21 PM
If he plays badly consistently, Hoyer would go in no later than game 5 on my team. Id like to think Hoyer is a competent starter.

Hoyer with that Defense would be similar to Alex Smith and the hers this year. I just don't see why you started Tebow in this on the depth chart. Don't wait for him to fail and then put in Hoyer, go with your best option from day 1. This isn't real life where Tebow-maniacs will kill you for sitting him.

redbills
03-07-2012, 08:26 PM
The Bills still have Fitzpatrick at QB and the Broncos are still rocking Tebow. That in itself should hold those two teams back IMO. I expect both to take major steps backwards this year as teams will have a full season of gametape to gameplan against them now.

Fitz has played a lot so his makes no sense
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7426/career;_ylt=AuOsP87hmB_C9N37v4_8FGP.uLYF

Also he played last yr with broken ribs since Week 8.
http://www.rotoworld.com/recent/nfl/3240/ryan-fitzpatrick
"Sources tell the Buffalo News that Ryan Fitzpatrick's midseason injury in 2011 included four cracked ribs and an injured sternum."

Is he a top 10 QB no but he ain't **** either.

With Fred and Spiller at RB Fitz wont have to sling it and with a lot better D we won't be down 2 Tds all the time and having him throw it 50 times.

draftguru151
03-07-2012, 08:30 PM
I'd have voted the Broncos lower if Hoyer started.

TheBoyWonder22
03-07-2012, 08:40 PM
I would have done this, but I wanted it to be realistic. I needed Hoyer at that value and he will be a decent guy for me to play through the transition.

Grizzlegom
03-07-2012, 08:58 PM
Fitz has played a lot so his makes no sense
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/players/7426/career;_ylt=AuOsP87hmB_C9N37v4_8FGP.uLYF

Also he played last yr with broken ribs since Week 8.
http://www.rotoworld.com/recent/nfl/3240/ryan-fitzpatrick
"Sources tell the Buffalo News that Ryan Fitzpatrick's midseason injury in 2011 included four cracked ribs and an injured sternum."

Is he a top 10 QB no but he ain't **** either.

With Fred and Spiller at RB Fitz wont have to sling it and with a lot better D we won't be down 2 Tds all the time and having him throw it 50 times.

Yea, the full season thing was more for Tebow than Fitz but I still think Fitz is nothing special at QB and won't be leading any team into the playoffs. He's been consistently middle of the road whenever he's played and I don't expect that to change. Avril is the only major defensive upgrade I see. Really don't like Upshaw in Wannstache's defense. I suppose Tulloch at MLB is alright with Sheppard playing SLB but I'm not overly high on that configuration. Wanny likes fast, instinctive linebackers not big guys and I don't see Tulloch and Sheppard as great fits in his defense either, someone like Lavonte David would have been a better third LB IMO. At the end of the day, I don't see that roster being a major improvement off last year's while I think Miami got better and I think the Jets are still marginally better despite Sanchez being the worst QB in the division.

As for the Hoyer comment, I like Hoyer a lot actually but he'd be essentially a rookie and I don't love his ability to come in and really turn the season around should they start poorly with Tebow.

Shane P. Hallam
03-07-2012, 10:01 PM
I love how people are complaining (or want to complain) about getting a high pick. Hell, I'll trade you. I'll take #3, you can fictionally make the playoffs, lol.

BeerBaron
03-07-2012, 10:09 PM
Well, my "trade up for Matt Barkley at all costs" strategy for the Raiders has pretty much failed....I even bumped the other QB needy teams up a few slots in my draft order to get them out of my way. Alas...

redbills
03-07-2012, 10:43 PM
Yea, the full season thing was more for Tebow than Fitz but I still think Fitz is nothing special at QB and won't be leading any team into the playoffs. He's been consistently middle of the road whenever he's played and I don't expect that to change. Avril is the only major defensive upgrade I see. Really don't like Upshaw in Wannstache's defense. I suppose Tulloch at MLB is alright with Sheppard playing SLB but I'm not overly high on that configuration. Wanny likes fast, instinctive linebackers not big guys and I don't see Tulloch and Sheppard as great fits in his defense either, someone like Lavonte David would have been a better third LB IMO. At the end of the day, I don't see that roster being a major improvement off last year's while I think Miami got better and I think the Jets are still marginally better despite Sanchez being the worst QB in the division.

As for the Hoyer comment, I like Hoyer a lot actually but he'd be essentially a rookie and I don't love his ability to come in and really turn the season around should they start poorly with Tebow.

Lol. No comment

ChiFan24
03-08-2012, 02:33 AM
I love how people are complaining (or want to complain) about getting a high pick. Hell, I'll trade you. I'll take #3, you can fictionally make the playoffs, lol.

For the life of me, I can't understand how it's a good thing to have a high 2013 draft pick. We just spent 4 weeks trying to improve our team for 2012, and now we're hoping to get early picks so we can take guys that none of us have bothered scouting so far. I get that this is a draft forum....but you all like the draft way too much, apparently.

fenikz
03-08-2012, 03:12 AM
we most certainly do

RaiderNation
03-08-2012, 03:24 AM
Will there be 1 more epic forum mock like this before the draft, this one was bad timing for me at work but I really want to participate if another is made. (NBA trade deadline forum mock would be great as well...)

Shane P. Hallam
03-08-2012, 06:31 AM
For the life of me, I can't understand how it's a good thing to have a high 2013 draft pick. We just spent 4 weeks trying to improve our team for 2012, and now we're hoping to get early picks so we can take guys that none of us have bothered scouting so far. I get that this is a draft forum....but you all like the draft way too much, apparently.

Because it is just people's opinion of how you did? The fun is going back 3 years later. I may even do a retrospective on some of the old Forum Mocks this summer.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 07:09 AM
Will there be 1 more epic forum mock like this before the draft, this one was bad timing for me at work but I really want to participate if another is made. (NBA trade deadline forum mock would be great as well...)

If no one else does it, I'll run another draft-only (since FA would have already happened) before the actual draft. Maybe in the two weeks leading up to it. Just power through 2 rounds and get one final draft in the books.

Grizzlegom
03-08-2012, 08:24 AM
Lol. No comment

Aside from Finley and Avril, I don't see any real upgrades on your roster. Your offensive line and secondary, two weaknesses, remained unchanged. I already covered how I don't feel Upshaw and Tulloch are big upgrades given their mediocre fit in Wanny's defense. What other changes did you make? Are we supposed to be excited about JJ replacing TT? Hightower as the number 3 back that likely won't see the field? The fact that you got one starter out of your draft and everyone else is either deep depth or on the PS? I understand you are proud of what you've done and think you upgraded your roster, I'm just giving my honest opinion, god forbid I disagree with you.

Matthew Jones
03-08-2012, 08:44 AM
Tulloch is actually a pretty substantial upgrade as one of the top 4-3 middle linebackers in the league last year. I breathed a sigh of relief after realizing that Manny Lawson was now a Patriot when the Bills landed Finley. The world may never know how Lawson failed to develop into a pass rusher, but he is outstanding in coverage. You can never have enough 6'5" cover linebackers who run a 4.4 with a 40" vertical in this TE-happy league.

TACKLE
03-08-2012, 09:08 AM
Matthew Jones, you should trade me my 2013 pick back for Zach Brown who's easily an upgrade for you at OLB in your 43 and can be a do-it-all rover in your sub packages. Do it! :D

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 09:09 AM
Matthew Jones, you should trade me my 2013 pick back for Zach Brown who's easily an upgrade for you at OLB in your 43 and can be a do-it-all rover in your sub packages. Do it! :D

Just trade your 2014-2020 first round picks. Those are irrelevant, right?

TACKLE
03-08-2012, 09:15 AM
Just trade your 2014-2020 first round picks. Those are irrelevant, right?

You tell me. :P

I assumed last time and made an ASS out of U and ME. (well not you so much, or me even for that matter, well ok maybe just a little bit)

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:06 PM
So it just hit me...

We have the draft order. Why aren't we doing the draft yet? Is there something we're waiting on that I've forgotten?

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 12:09 PM
So it just hit me...

We have the draft order. Why aren't we doing the draft yet? Is there something we're waiting on that I've forgotten?

start it now? Im skipping school tomorrw so now is the best time!

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:12 PM
I realized we didn't do anything with the playoff teams yet. Are we just going to put them in order of seeding or do we want to talk each matchup? I don't feel like taking the time to vote again. I don't want interest to fade any.

We could just post the matchups here and talk through them. If we can come to a pretty general consensus, that team will move on. If not...I'll just break the tie or something.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 12:15 PM
I realized we didn't do anything with the playoff teams yet. Are we just going to put them in order of seeding or do we want to talk each matchup? I don't feel like taking the time to vote again. I don't want interest to fade any.

We could just post the matchups here and talk through them. If we can come to a pretty general consensus, that team will move on. If not...I'll just break the tie or something.

we can still start the draft and then do the order in a bit. we wont get through 20 teams in a night.

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 12:15 PM
That's fine with me. We probably don't have to have an official vote.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:17 PM
I'll get a draft thread up with the top 20 teams then...we'll hold off for right this second but we can probably start later this afternoon or tonight. In the meantime, I'll post the wildcard matchups in here and we can talk through them. If we get a handful of people who like one team more than the other, that team will move on.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 12:17 PM
I'll get a draft thread up with the top 20 teams then...we'll hold off for right this second but we can probably start later this afternoon or tonight. In the meantime, I'll post the wildcard matchups in here and we can talk through them. If we get a handful of people who like one team more than the other, that team will move on.

yeah sounds good

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:21 PM
Alright, just discuss who you think would win. Consensus wins. If we're deadlocked, I'll just break the damn thing.

WILDCARD ROUND MATCHUPS

AFC
6. Pittsburgh Steelers at 3. Baltimore Ravens
5. Cincinnati Bengals at 4. San Diego Chargers

NFC
6. Chicago Bears at 3. Atlanta Falcons
5. San Francisco 49ers at 4 Philadelphia Eagles

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 12:24 PM
Ravens
Chargers

Bears
Eagles

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:26 PM
Steelers at Ravens - Ravens win 21-17
- This matchup is always a brutal one and is usually a great game. I have the Ravens in a close one, taking it at home.

Bengals at Chargers - Bengals win 27-21
- Another decent game, but the Bengals win. Norv Turner and the Chargers in the playoffs isn't likely to succeed. The Bengals offensive triplets of Dalton-Richardson-Green proves to be a really good group, with Laurent Robinson and Gresham contributing. And with Freeney added to that defense, I think it puts them over the top. They're simply more talented than the Chargers.

Bears at Falcons - Bears win 24-17
If the Bears make the playoffs, it means their offense got back to clicking with everyone healthy, plus Bowe. Defensively, I don't think the Falcons can handle Peppers and Osi. I think this plays out close to how our season opener last year did.

49ers at Eagles - 49ers win 30-17 - Worst possible matchup for the Eagles who I otherwise like. Even with the additions at LB, the 49ers committing to the run will eat that wide 9 front right up. And I just don't trust Vick to step it up in a big game against such a tough defense.

fenikz
03-08-2012, 12:28 PM
Ravens
Bengals

Bears
49ers

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 12:34 PM
WILDCARD ROUND MATCHUPS

AFC
6. Pittsburgh Steelers at 3. Baltimore Ravens
5. Cincinnati Bengals at 4. San Diego Chargers

NFC
6. Chicago Bears at 3. Atlanta Falcons
5. San Francisco 49ers at 4 Philadelphia Eagles

jrdrylie
03-08-2012, 12:38 PM
6. Pittsburgh at 3. Baltimore Ravens: I'm going with Baltimore in this one. The first reason is that the Ravens have one at least one playoff game each of the last four years. I expect that trend to continue. Baltimore was better than Pittsburgh this year and I don't really think Pittsburgh got much better. In fact, with the loss of Mendenhall, they may actually be worse. Baltimore added another receiver and upgraded the outside linebacker spot opposite of Suggs.

5. Cincinnati Bengals at San Diego Chargers: I think I'll go with Cincinnati. I'm not as adamant on this one as I am on Pitt vs. Balt. I just think Cincinnati got a little bit better this offseason. They added another receiver and upgraded their pass rush with Freeney. It's a close one, but I think the Bengals pull it out.

6. Chicago Bears at 3. Atlanta Falcons: big surprise, but I'm going with Chicago here. If you look back at last year, Chicago was the hottest team outside of Green Bay before Cutler and Forte went down. They finally got a number one receiver (Bowe) and got two pass catching tight ends. The offensive line still stinks, but they can't be any worse than they were last year and it won't be as big a deal with Martz now gone.

5. San Francisco 49ers at 3. Philadelphia Eagles: Well, I don't even have the Eagles making the playoffs, so I'm going San Francisco. I don't trust Michael Vick to win diddly dick. I don't love the 49ers this year, but I like them slightly more than the Eagles.

Grizzlegom
03-08-2012, 12:38 PM
Ravens over Steelers: Yet again, these two hated rivals match up. After clawing into the playoffs as the six seed, the Steelers' lack of running game, coupled with the still aging defense to see them knocked out of the playoffs in the first round for the second consecutive year.

Bengals over Chargers: The Chargers are once again knocked out of the playoffs early as Marvin Lewis and his staff completely outcoach Norv Turner, dominating them in all phases.

Bears over Falcons: The Bears underachieved only managing the 6th seed but they came into the playoffs hot and destroy the Falcons, who just didn't have the defensive means to stop the Bears suddenly high-powered offense. Matt Ryan continues his playoff ineptitude.

Eagles over 49ers: The dream team comes to play a year late. An improved LB corps helps the Eagles contain the 49ers' running game and Alex Smith is forced to try to win the game with his arm, only this time Vernon Davis is being covered by DRC and can't get open consistently. Smith has a few turnovers and Maclin exposes the secondary as Jackson draws Rogers.

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 12:39 PM
I can just post the winners if you want considering I have everyones votes. I thought lt was gonna post the first round write ups last night but I guess not.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:41 PM
Ravens over Steelers: Yet again, these two hated rivals match up. After clawing into the playoffs as the six seed, the Steelers' lack of running game, coupled with the still aging defense to see them knocked out of the playoffs in the first round for the second consecutive year.
Bengals over Chargers: The Chargers are once again knocked out of the playoffs early as Marvin Lewis and his staff completely outcoach Norv Turner, dominating them in all phases.


Not often would I expect to hear the statement "Marvin Lewis outoaches..." uttered.

ChiFan24
03-08-2012, 12:42 PM
Ravens 20 Steelers 17
Bengals 27 Chargers 20
Bears 27 Falcons 10
49ers 24 Eagles 21

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:44 PM
I can just post the winners if you want considering I have everyones votes. I thought lt was gonna post the first round write ups last night but I guess not.

I think people are having fun with it this way. We'll blow through it in no time hopefully.

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 12:44 PM
I ordered the teams in a way that the voting matched up with what round the got knocked out in, not the seeding they got voted in, I'm not sure how much you guys care about the constancy of everything though.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 12:47 PM
I think people are having fun with it this way. We'll blow through it in no time hopefully.

yeah lets just keep on doing this. hopefully we can move on to the divisional round soon.

Grizzlegom
03-08-2012, 12:47 PM
Not often would I expect to hear the statement "Marvin Lewis outoaches..." uttered.

Hahaha, its not often he gets to coach against Norv Turner either though : P

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 12:47 PM
I think people are having fun with it this way. We'll blow through it in no time hopefully.

I figured people would post predictions when I put up the match ups but whatever, the seeding is just messed up but it doesn't really matter.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:48 PM
I'll see if we can get a few more votes since the 49ers and Eagles seems to be close. Bears/Ravens have been unanimous, and the Bengals have won all but once I think.

Shane P. Hallam
03-08-2012, 12:50 PM
If I claim to have fired Norv Turner and hired a bag of poo as my coach, how much closer is the match-up? :D

But I'd probably go with the Bengals there, though I wouldn't have put them in the playoffs per say.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:51 PM
I think the Bengals were more likely to make it than, say, the Steelers. They made it last year plus you add Richardson, Freeney and Robinson?

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 12:54 PM
Bengals, Ravens, Bears, Eagles for me.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 12:57 PM
Bengals, Ravens, Bears, Eagles for me.

you are a wise man.

Shane P. Hallam
03-08-2012, 12:58 PM
I think the Bengals were more likely to make it than, say, the Steelers. They made it last year plus you add Richardson, Freeney and Robinson?

Has that stopped the Bengals from making the playoffs one year and blowing it the next year? Haha.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 12:59 PM
Has that stopped the Bengals from making the playoffs one year and blowing it the next year? Haha.

Maybe if you pay off Kimo to take out Dalton's knees, it'll happen again.

Shane P. Hallam
03-08-2012, 01:02 PM
Maybe if you pay off Kimo to take out Dalton's knees, it'll happen again.

Eh, I think Brett Keisel can do just fine in that realm. His beard will whip out and Dalton's knee will be done like dinner.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 01:44 PM
Alright, the Ravens, Bengals and Bears all move on.

The Eagles/49ers is really close, but I think I'll go with my initial pick and have the 49ers move on.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 01:50 PM
DIVISIONAL ROUND

AFC:
Bengals at Texans - Texans win 34-14
Rematch from last year's playoffs. With a healthy Schaub, one of the best o-line's in the game, and in year 2 of Wade Phillips' defense, the Texans dominate the youthful Bengals.

Ravens at Patriots - Patriots win 28-20
Another rematch from last year. This one doesn't quite hinge on a missed FG however, as the Pats shut down the Ravens run game causing Cam Cameron to go pass-wacky and Flacco fails to deliver against an improved secondary sporting Michael Griffin.

NFC:

Bears at Cardinals -
My...programming won't allow me to pick against the Bears. so I'll just explain why I think they could win and leave it to everyone else's vote. The offense must be clicking pretty well for them to have made the playoffs, and I think the Bears pass rush with Peppers and Osi could cause problems for the Cardinals starting tackles, Light and Backus. It wouldn't be easy, but I think the Bears could win this game.

49ers at Packers -
Again...I simply couldn't pick the Packers. It's not in my nature. So, I'll just say why the 49ers could win. They've added Desean Jackson plus another year of development for Crabtree and Davis, and you know they can and will run the ball. The Packers didn't improve their pass defense much, and the 49ers have a really solid defense.

fenikz
03-08-2012, 01:55 PM
Texans
Ravens
Cardinals
Packers

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 01:55 PM
Divisional Round

Bengals @ Texans
Ravens @ Patriots
Bears @ Cardinals
49ers @ Packers

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 01:56 PM
fyi the packers only defensive problem last year was pass rush and i imprvoved that by drafting nick perry and kendall reyes.

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 02:03 PM
Texans
Ravens

Cardinals
Packers

DiG
03-08-2012, 02:06 PM
texans, pats, cards, pack

fenikz
03-08-2012, 02:09 PM
fyi the packers only defensive problem last year was pass rush and i imprvoved that by drafting nick perry and kendall reyes.

Perry helps but Reyes had 11 sacks in 4 years

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 02:11 PM
Perry helps but Reyes had 11 sacks in 4 years

Hes there to eat up blocks for the outside guys. That will help the pass rush.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 02:38 PM
The fact that Charles Woodson started to suck doesn't mean anything? Or that Sam Shields regressed?

You don't end up with the worst defense in the league solely because of pass rush, and adding one rookie will be be making the transition to OLB isn't going to help all that much at first.

Brothgar
03-08-2012, 02:43 PM
texans, pats, cards, 49ers

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 02:44 PM
Looks pretty solid for the Texans, Cards and Pack.

Could use a few more votes to swing Ravens/Pats though.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 02:46 PM
The fact that Charles Woodson started to suck doesn't mean anything? Or that Sam Shields regressed?

You don't end up with the worst defense in the league solely because of pass rush, and adding one rookie will be be making the transition to OLB isn't going to help all that much at first.

But i'd say that they regressed because of the amount of time the opponent QB had to throw. Seriously, the lack of pass rush last year was disgusting at times. Most cornerbacks would struggle.

Also im getting Nick Collins back and have better protection for Rodgers.

Grizzlegom
03-08-2012, 02:46 PM
Texans, Ravens, Cardinals, Packers for me

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 02:47 PM
Collins damn near suffered a career ending injury and will probably take some time to get back up to speed.

And while you're correct in that an improved pass rush helps the secondary, I don't think that Perry alone drastically improves it. As I said, he'll be a rookie college DE making the transition to stand up linebacker in the pros.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 02:49 PM
Collins damn near suffered a career ending injury and will probably take some time to get back up to speed.

And while you're correct in that an improved pass rush helps the secondary, I don't think that Perry alone drastically improves it. As I said, he'll be a rookie college DE making the transition to stand up linebacker in the pros.

Trust me, Nick Perry is a drastic improvement over anyone we had at ROLB last year.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 02:49 PM
Trust me, Nick Perry is a drastic improvement over anyone we had at ROLB last year.

That doesn't say a whole lot. Smartest kid on the short bus situation.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 02:51 PM
That doesn't say a whole lot. Smartest kid on the short bus situation.

Exactly thats my point. We had useless players at ROLB last year so Nick Perry will be a big improvement to our pass rush.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 02:52 PM
So maybe you'll go from the 32nd defense to the 27th.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 02:54 PM
So maybe you'll go from the 32nd defense to the 27th.

yeah that'll do. with a-rod and the 27th best defense thats superbowl every year.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 03:00 PM
I'm just going to call it for the Pats and keep my "Ravens will never win a Superbowl with Cam Cameron" prediction alive.

So now,

Championship Round:

AFC:

Patriots at Texans - Texans win 35-24
Healthy Matt Schaub, what may be the best o-line in the NFL, Arian Foster being a boss, Andre Johnson and Owen Daniels to throw to...I don't think that Pats defense can match up. And with the Texans playing good defense under Wade Phillips, I think they slow Brady and crew down enough to win. First Superbowl in franchise history coming up.

Packers at Cardinals - Cardinals win 31-24
Manning throwing to Fitz, Wayne and Meachem will tear that 32nd ranked pass defense apart. And if the Cards could handle Peppers and Osi against the Bears, they'll handle the Packers pass rush too.

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 03:01 PM
Texans

Cardinals

fenikz
03-08-2012, 03:04 PM
Texans
Cardinals

Grizzlegom
03-08-2012, 03:05 PM
Texans and Cardinals sounds good to me!

jrdrylie
03-08-2012, 03:05 PM
Bengals at Texans: Even without Mario Williams, the Texans defense will give the Bengals offense fits. If the offense is healthy, it will be close to unstoppable. Houston 34 Cincinnati 14

Baltimore at New England: I'm picking the Ravens to go to the playoffs. Hey, they were only a dropped pass away from it this year. With Wes Welker supposedly holding out, I think the offense will have issues all year and those will continue into the playoffs, even after Welker returns. Baltimore 27 New England 24

Chicago at Arizona: The pass rush of the Bears will give the mediocre Arizona offensive line fits. This would be a heck of the game, and Manning would keep it close, but Chicago 31 Arizona 28

San Francisco at Green Bay: I would pick San Francisco. I think they did a little bit more to get better than the Packers did. But with the game being in Green Bay, I'll give them the edge. Green Bay 24 San Francisco 20.

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 03:08 PM
Packers and Texans!

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 04:17 PM
Ravens were higher on 9 of the 12 ballots than the Patriots, and lost the vote here. :/

That's the only game so far that didn't match up with the rest of the votes.

Texans and Cardinals for the Super Bowl.

ChiFan24
03-08-2012, 04:23 PM
I hate you all for picking the Cardinals over the Bears.

I'll go Pats - Cards.

Shane P. Hallam
03-08-2012, 04:25 PM
Texans FTW!

ATLDirtyBirds
03-08-2012, 04:39 PM
Woah, woah, woah. The Falcons lost in the first round? Hell, who am I kidding, that's exactly what will go down.

Brothgar
03-08-2012, 05:04 PM
Texans FTW!

this Texans win baby

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 05:21 PM
So, Super Bowl picks?

Cardinals vs Texans

I vote Cardinals

SuperPacker
03-08-2012, 05:26 PM
texans....

Grizzlegom
03-08-2012, 05:38 PM
Gotta go with the Texans!!!

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 05:47 PM
Texans. . . .

fenikz
03-08-2012, 05:58 PM
id love to see them cover anyone

Cardinals

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 06:02 PM
Cardinals.

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 06:06 PM
3-3 so far. First to five wins?

TACKLE
03-08-2012, 06:06 PM
Cardinals.

vidae
03-08-2012, 06:44 PM
Cardinals.

DiG
03-08-2012, 07:06 PM
TEXANS!!!!!!

OSUGiants17
03-08-2012, 07:28 PM
Texans > Cardinals

fenikz
03-08-2012, 07:39 PM
five to five

Go_Eagles77
03-08-2012, 07:45 PM
I originally had texans going further than cardinals, but I don't like that matchup for the texans. I'll go Cardinals.

marshallb
03-08-2012, 07:56 PM
My vote goes to the Texans.

ncst8fan83
03-08-2012, 08:02 PM
Not sure I have a dog in the hunt, but I'd choose the Texans

fenikz
03-08-2012, 08:02 PM
sure ya don't buddy

ChiFan24
03-08-2012, 08:19 PM
Peyton Mannings

ncst8fan83
03-08-2012, 08:25 PM
sure ya don't buddy


Sorry, should have tried to sabotage the Cardinals from the start of voting. My bad.

Shane P. Hallam
03-08-2012, 08:25 PM
Texans!!!!!

TheBoyWonder22
03-08-2012, 08:56 PM
Cardinals mayne!

ATLDirtyBirds
03-08-2012, 09:35 PM
Texans, yo.

BeerBaron
03-08-2012, 10:06 PM
Someone call it. This Superbowl is headed to an epic overtime.

Unbiased
03-08-2012, 10:12 PM
Matt Schaub is a donkey.

jrdrylie
03-08-2012, 10:21 PM
Cardinals.

fenikz
03-08-2012, 11:11 PM
9-8 Cardinals

call this thing!

:)

draftguru151
03-08-2012, 11:22 PM
Might as well get it to 10!

TheBoyWonder22
03-09-2012, 12:11 AM
By the way, the Broncos would love to move up, someone in the top 5 hit me up now, or I'll pm you later.

redbills
03-09-2012, 02:59 AM
HOU over ARZ

redbills
03-09-2012, 03:07 AM
Aside from Finley and Avril, I don't see any real upgrades on your roster. Your offensive line and secondary, two weaknesses, remained unchanged. I already covered how I don't feel Upshaw and Tulloch are big upgrades given their mediocre fit in Wanny's defense. What other changes did you make? Are we supposed to be excited about JJ replacing TT? Hightower as the number 3 back that likely won't see the field? The fact that you got one starter out of your draft and everyone else is either deep depth or on the PS? I understand you are proud of what you've done and think you upgraded your roster, I'm just giving my honest opinion, god forbid I disagree with you.

:lol:

Yea only gave up 22 sacks, Fred was an MVP before he got hurt and then spiller came in and blew **** up. Lol. Upshaw and Tulloch not upgrades is ******* funny as hell.

Mia adds a decent QB an old ass WR, coples (I like but who knows when he'll feel like playing) yet they get 8 spots better while buf makes 0% improvement, yeah, I'll have what ur smoking please.

Also I picked tru in round 2 at cb. Aaron Williams will be in yr 2. Wilson and Bryd at S, they are a great combo. Now with the pass rush via Avril and Upshaw they don't have to cover for the 20 sec they did last year.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 03:09 AM
I agree that the Bills should be much higher. I had them in the playoffs. That is a major improvement to their team. Probably second to only the Bengals.

redbills
03-09-2012, 03:17 AM
I agree that the Bills should be much higher. I had them in the playoffs. That is a major improvement to their team. Probably second to only the Bengals.

No no no. Fitz sucks, SJ13 is overrated, Finley is crap with out Rogers, the online sucks, Upshaw doesn't fit, Tulloch doesn't fit, shep doesn't fit, the DBS suck and Chan Gailey is the second coming of Hitler.

I am not saying we should have been in the SB, but really no improvement.

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 05:57 AM
Cards and Texans just keep trading blows...it's what, 10-9 now?

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 06:00 AM
Cards and Texans just keep trading blows...it's what, 10-9 now?

first to 11?

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 06:02 AM
Gotta win by 2, like volleyball.

Grizzlegom
03-09-2012, 07:14 AM
Yea only gave up 22 sacks, Fred was an MVP before he got hurt and then spiller came in and blew **** up. Lol. Upshaw and Tulloch not upgrades is ******* funny as hell.

Mia adds a decent QB an old ass WR, coples (I like but who knows when he'll feel like playing) yet they get 8 spots better while buf makes 0% improvement, yeah, I'll have what ur smoking please.

Also I picked tru in round 2 at cb. Aaron Williams will be in yr 2. Wilson and Bryd at S, they are a great combo. Now with the pass rush via Avril and Upshaw they don't have to cover for the 20 sec they did last year.

I went back and looked into Tulloch more after Matt said what he did, my perception on him was definitely wrong and I concede him as a big-time upgrade. For some reason I thought that he was a big, thumper type and had him at 250 pounds when he plays closer to 235-240. You'll never convince me that Upshaw is a good fit as a 4-3 DE. When he came from a down stance at Alabama, he very rarely won, he really struggles to get off blocks due to his lack of length, something that coming from an up stance helped him mitigate. You also need to do some research on Wanny's scheme if you think a short-limbed player that stands in at 6'1" and weighs 272 pounds is a good fit. I think Upshaw-Bills is one of the worst fits out there among all the mock drafts and more and more people are coming to realize it and are no longer mocking it. As I said, you nailed it with Avril, he should be paired with someone like Andre Branch or Whitney Mercilus though as they are real fits in his defense. Hell, I would argue you'd probably be better of starting Kelsay over Upshaw.

As for the Miami comment, they have the better overall team and just needed a QB, if you believe Flynn is an upgrade to Matt Moore, then there's no reason to believe they wouldn't be significantly better. Remember, Miami finished the season strong, winning 6 of their last 9, Buffalo faltered horribly down the stretch, losing 8 of their last 9. Those kinds of things typically carry over into the next season regardless of the changes made.

I'm not high on Tru either and I considered that a reach. He's very raw and I don't see him as a contributor early. Williams should improve and the safeties are solid but number 2 and 3 receivers will eat your other corners alive IMO.

Looking at your schedule, I see five definite wins, St. Louis, Jacksonville, Kansas City, Jets, and Colts and five definite losses to New England, San Francisco, Houston, Arizona, and Miami. That leaves six toss-up games, it's not like I'm sitting here saying you are gonna go 2-14, I just don't see any better than 8-8 assuming good health and a few things falling in the Bills direction. You had a mediocre team last year and I think with the improvements you made, you'll have a mediocre team this year.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 07:17 AM
definite loss? i didnt know there was such thing as a definite loss.

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 07:25 AM
Well, 21 votes....I guess we'll just settle this...

Grizzlegom
03-09-2012, 07:28 AM
definite loss? i didnt know there was such thing as a definite loss.

In real football there isn't. Good thing this is a fantasy offseason forum mock where you are projecting your own opinions on how the games will go so when you look at the schedule you are allowed to decide the outcome!

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 07:34 AM
Well, 21 votes....I guess we'll just settle this...

so have we got a draft order?

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 07:46 AM
2013 Draft Started

No time limit today, just easy going.

Two hour clock will start Saturday at noon eastern and last until midnight eastern. Same for Sunday. Through the week, it will start at 8am and end at 10pm.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 07:59 AM
i'll have to get looking at some prospects then.

jrdrylie
03-09-2012, 08:17 AM
Man, I have to take issue with the Cowboys picking 12th. That corresponds with a 6-10 record usually. Outside of the season Romo got hurt and Jon Kitna nine games and Stephen McGee started two more, they always win at least eight games.

The receiving trio of Miles Austin, Dez Bryant, and Jason Witten is still top-five in the NFL. They still have the same solid running game. The offensive line was vastly improved. All three spots on the defensive line improved. I added a bunch of guys in the secondary. The only spot that is not really improved at all is linebacker.

Unbiased
03-09-2012, 08:18 AM
It's impossible to not look like a whiny little baby when you take issue with your draft slot.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 08:22 AM
wtf is Jones89 doing?

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 08:23 AM
I forget exactly where they were in the draft order, but I think I had both the Cowboys and the Bills in the late teens.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 08:27 AM
The Cowboys have hardly improved slightly and everyone else has improved more. Thats why.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 08:34 AM
we should of done a 2013 offseason.

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 08:35 AM
we should of done a 2013 offseason.

Absolutely no way.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 08:36 AM
Absolutely no way.

:lol: didnt think you'd feel the same way.

btw the colts should trade up for robert woods!

draftguru151
03-09-2012, 09:02 AM
Here are all the votes, with the draft order on the right.

http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/8445/2013order.jpg

Shane P. Hallam
03-09-2012, 09:14 AM
Guess I'm the only one who feels the Colts will bounce back, haha

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 09:20 AM
Guess I'm the only one who feels the Colts will bounce back, haha

You had them making the playoffs? That's toooooo far bouncing back I think.

Shane P. Hallam
03-09-2012, 09:22 AM
You had them making the playoffs? That's toooooo far bouncing back I think.

People would have said that about the Broncos last year!

Some team has to go from worst in the division to first. I had the Chiefs as that team, but you never know...

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 09:23 AM
People would have said that about the Broncos last year!

Some team has to go from worst in the division to first. I had the Chiefs as that team, but you never know...

Well, they don't HAVE to. It just usually seems to happen.

~50% of the playoff teams from one year don't make it the following year too. We changed out one team from the AFC and 2 from the NFC here...so 25%.

Go_Eagles77
03-09-2012, 09:26 AM
Eagles with the most super bowl winning votes. That makes me happy.

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 09:28 AM
Eagles with the most super bowl winning votes. That makes me happy.

And they got knocked out in the first round when we voted here...Ha. Well...

Crazy **** happens. I look at the votes more like "expectations" which, as everyone knows, get constantly tossed to the side in the post season.

Getting the 49ers as a matchup was the worst the Eagles could have gotten though.

Shane P. Hallam
03-09-2012, 09:29 AM
Well, they don't HAVE to. It just usually seems to happen.

~50% of the playoff teams from one year don't make it the following year too. We changed out one team from the AFC and 2 from the NFC here...so 25%.

Yeah, I only replaced 4 of 12 teams on mine. Probably should have switched PHI and NYG to match up with the stats.

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 09:31 AM
Actually it was 3 from the NFC: Bears, Cardinals and Eagles. Forgot about the Eagles. So we got our 50% there. And from the looks of things, the last teams to miss the playoff cut were mostly NFC too, like the Giants and Saints.

Very little AFC turnover. Exact same wildcard teams, just flipped seeding.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 09:55 AM
i dont even know which column is mine. i had the chiefs and bills in the playoffs but i had the browns picking 1st. dont think mine is there.

draftguru151
03-09-2012, 10:10 AM
I never got a PM from you.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 10:10 AM
1. Browns
2. Rams
3. Jags
4. Seahawks
5. Vikings
6. Raiders
7. Colts
8. Panthers
9. Jets
10. Bucs
11. Chargers
12. Cowboys
13. Titans
14. Falcons
15. Dolphins
16. Steelers
17. Redskins
18. Giants
19. Lions
20. Broncos
21. Bills
22. Saints
23. Bears
24. 49ers
25. Ravens
26. Bengals
27. Packers
28. Patriots
29. Eagles
31. Chiefs
32. Cardinals

thats my prediction sheet

it was in my PM sent messages.

Unbiased
03-09-2012, 10:39 AM
He probably erased it from his memory when he saw you predicted the Chiefs to go to the Super Bowl.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 10:40 AM
He probably erased it from his memory when he saw you predicted the Chiefs to go to the Super Bowl.

:lol:

hahaha! they are, trust me!

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 02:37 PM
I traded up for Bray because A.) I like Bray and B.) I didn't want to get laughed at for taking Wilson at 5.

So Wilson can just go at 3...whatevs.

Justone2
03-09-2012, 02:38 PM
3 Qbs with the first 3 picks looks a bit strange:P

TACKLE
03-09-2012, 02:39 PM
Wilson >> RG3

princefielder28
03-09-2012, 02:40 PM
Wilson >> RG3

you are correct sir

fenikz
03-09-2012, 02:42 PM
Bray > Wilson > Barkley

DeepThreat
03-09-2012, 02:42 PM
I wanted Bray, but I have no problems with Wilson at No. 3.

Sorry for holding everything up; I had no idea it had started.

ATLDirtyBirds
03-09-2012, 02:44 PM
Bray > Wilson > Barkley

^^^^^^^^^^This.

TheBoyWonder22
03-09-2012, 02:44 PM
Alright, since I couldn't trade with Deep I have no clue at who to look at as prospects, especially at QB :(

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 02:46 PM
Alright, since I couldn't trade with Deep I have no clue at who to look at as prospects, especially at QB :(

Landry Jones! Hell, you can just take him out in the red zone and stick Tebow back in. Just like Oklahoma does now.

zachsaints52
03-09-2012, 02:48 PM
BB im here still lurking. This horrific offseason made me not care about my place in the standings because I know it was worse. Ill make my pick when Im up, and thanks for running this.

redbills
03-09-2012, 02:49 PM
We gonna have another vote thing after the '13 draft?

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 02:50 PM
BB im here still lurking. This horrific offseason made me not care about my place in the standings because I know it was worse. Ill make my pick when Im up, and thanks for running this.

You can thank me for letting you keep it. I don't know that Goodell will be so generous.

We gonna have another vote thing after the '13 draft?

Once this draft is done, I'm going to go take a nap away from DC.

TheBoyWonder22
03-09-2012, 02:53 PM
Landry Jones! Hell, you can just take him out in the red zone and stick Tebow back in. Just like Oklahoma does now.
I don't think he'll make it to 14. And apparently if Tebow's on the field, everything goes to complete ****.

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 02:55 PM
I don't think he'll make it to 14. And apparently if Tebow's on the field, everything goes to complete ****.

He SHOULD make it to 14...and beyond.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 02:55 PM
I don't think he'll make it to 14. And apparently if Tebow's on the field, everything goes to complete ****.

He's messing with you! Landry Jones is a terrible prospect who shouldnt be going in the first round.

TheBoyWonder22
03-09-2012, 02:57 PM
My point is I think he'll be reached on and I'll never get a QB. I'm just mad at this threesome of my top need being selected.

SuperPacker
03-09-2012, 03:06 PM
My point is I think he'll be reached on and I'll never get a QB. I'm just mad at this threesome of my top need being selected.

Tebow > Landry Jones

zachsaints52
03-09-2012, 03:06 PM
You can thank me for letting you keep it. I don't know that Goodell will be so generous.

Shoot we so screwed with this offseason I think Goodell would understand.

OSUGiants17
03-09-2012, 04:32 PM
Alright, since I couldn't trade with Deep I have no clue at who to look at as prospects, especially at QB :(

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2013/qb
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2014/qb

My advice:
http://www.onlinesportshandicapping.com/files/imagecache/article/articles/aj-mccarron-alabama-crimson-tide.jpg
Soooooooooo Dreamy :love:

BeerBaron
03-09-2012, 06:41 PM
AJ McCarron. NFL First round pick.

No. Not yet anyway.

OSUGiants17
03-09-2012, 07:18 PM
AJ McCarron. NFL First round pick.

No. Not yet anyway.

But he's so dreamy

fenikz
03-09-2012, 08:12 PM
http://www3.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Aaron+Murray+Georgia+v+South+Carolina+oKReq9B-ekYl.jpg

would be the 4th QB on my board

OSUGiants17
03-09-2012, 08:57 PM
But he's short. What about Geno Smith, Mark Glennon and Collin Klein? Were do they rank? I think outside of those first 3, no one knows yet and that's why doing this so early is tough.

princefielder28
03-09-2012, 09:00 PM
For me the 4th best quarterback prospect for 2013 is Logan Thomas with Aaron Murray rounding out the top 5

OSUGiants17
03-09-2012, 09:07 PM
Really? Logan Thomas over Geno Smith?

princefielder28
03-09-2012, 09:15 PM
Really? Logan Thomas over Geno Smith?

yeah but it's not by much...Thomas, Murray and Smith are all really close for me

Docta
03-09-2012, 09:23 PM
Should I be trying to replace Dalton? Thought I would at least end up ahead of the Ravens.

fenikz
03-09-2012, 09:38 PM
I had Ravens as the #1 team but you were top 5, deleted my PMs so I'm not exactly sure where

something like

Ravens
Packers
Cardinals
Eagles
Bengals

marshallb
03-10-2012, 01:27 AM
Sorry if I held this up. I was last on early this afternoon and wasn't up yet, and then I was out with some friends, and just got a chance to check back in.