View Full Version : What is worse, or ROLB or DE?

02-19-2012, 04:01 PM
Obviously, the ROLB spot sucked as far as getting any pressure on QBs.
It killed us.
But the loss of Jenkins, and Neal's worthlessness also was a killer.
The DL was atrocious. Nobody could sniff a QB.

WHICH IS WORSE, must be upgraded if we are to go forward as a defense?


Here is the Football Outsiders breakdown:

“Green Bay’s defense isn’t quite as bad as raw yardage would have you believe (the Packers checked in at 24th by DVOA) (Defense-adjusted Value Over Average), but that is damning with faint praise. The steep decline in play from the hybrid 3-4/4-3 line affected the linebacking corps by not soaking up blocks; Clay Matthews saw his sack total fall from 13.5 in 2010 to 6 in 2011. Because the pass rush wasn’t getting to the passer, quarterbacks made fewer mistakes, and the team’s interception total dropped from 31 to 24.”

“In fact, the Packers were near the bottom of the league in sacks despite the fact that Green Bay’s high-octane offense caused its defense to face more passes than any other team in the league. The Packers’ defense was last in ASR, 1.9 percent below the league average.”

“The rushing defense didn’t have the same precipitous fall from grace as the passing defense but nonetheless fell from relatively average to near the bottom of the league in every single category aside from open-field yards, where the aging but still talented secondary, led by Charles Woodson, was able to bail out the rest of the defense. In fact, of Green Bay’s top five tacklers, four (Morgan Burnett, Charlie Peprah, Woodson and Tramon Williams) were defensive backs. That is always a bad sign.”

“Assigning blame among a line is never easy, but the team is secure with Pro Bowler B.J. Raji, who regularly draws double-teams on running and passing downs. End/three-technique tackle Ryan Pickett also played well when he was actually on the field, which was infrequently. The rest of the assembled squad was extremely unimpressive, particularly second-year end C.J. Wilson, who fits the physical profile of an end/linebacker hybrid but, in two years attempting to replace Aaron Kampman, has displayed none of his talent.”

“Another youngster, Jarius Wynn, had similar struggles and was a complete liability in the running game, contributing greatly to the league-worst ALY (Adjusted Line Yards) on runs to the offensive left end. The good news for cheeseheads is that Green Bay’s defensive scheme is possibly the most flexible in the league, so, when the draft comes around — and general manager Ted Thompson is a strong believer in building through the draft rather than free agency — the front office should be able to find a few orphaned players other teams cannot find roles for.”

02-19-2012, 04:47 PM
Well at DT we have BJ Raji and Ryan Pickett. They are two good starters.

At OLB we have Brad Jones/Frank Zombo/Erik Walden. They are not good starters.

Outside linebacker is a bigger issue.

02-19-2012, 05:08 PM
Disagree, the lack of interior pass rush and coverage in the secondary were by far bigger issues than the linebackers. We got pressure on the outside (mostly all Clay but still), but the QB was able to either get the ball off to an open receiver or simply step up into the pocket and elude the edge rushers cause there was no pressure up the middle to prevent that. Getting another great OLB would be a nice luxury, but upgrading the interior pass rush and improving our coverage are both a necessity.

02-22-2012, 08:19 AM
I went with OLB, here's why:

The Steelers, as long as they have had Harrison & Woodley, get pass rush.
The DE's don't get sacks... they basically occupy their blockers... same with in Dallas with their DE's being nobodies (Jason Hatcher), but Ware getting around past his guy.

If we had another great OLB, that would benefit the pass defense, the DBs so much.

The DEs are more just guys.
There are very few Justin Smiths.

Great OLBs like Matthews, Ware, Merriman in his day, Harrison, Wake, Derrick Thomas, Von Miller, LT, Alden Smith, Orakpo are a DB's best friend.

That being said, I want to add Adam Carriker who is one of the few guys who can get to the QB in a 34 DE, as seen last year in Washington's 34. His combine numbers were outstanding for that position, but the Rams played him out of position, and made it look like he was a 2-year bust, injury flameout.

02-22-2012, 08:59 AM
I agree. OLB is where the pass rush should be coming from in the 3-4. Getting pressure from the DE position is a bonus but shouldn't be the expectation. Like you said there are only a handful of 3-4 DEs that provide that kind of pass rush and they end up costing a lot of money.

02-22-2012, 10:22 AM
I'm on board with Carriker as long as it a reasonable deal. He'd be a productive player, but I don't think you break the bank for him. And then you could look more to the mid-late rounds to get another guy to develop instead of an early pick.

Same deal with Hughes. If Thompson could get him cheap and see what he could do in a different scheme I'd be fine with that. Problem with Hughes is that Indy is now likely switching to a 3-4, so they'll surely give him a look at OLB. If they give him a change at OLB and it doesn't work out then I see no reason for Thompson to think he'd turn it around here.

03-31-2012, 11:01 AM
It doesn't matter which position he finds a guy at as long as he can get to the quarterback and hold the point of attack against the run.

04-28-2012, 01:55 AM
TT must have seen this poll and addressed both areas. 3-4 DE with Worthy and OLB with Perry.

Might not be new, but this up from tjsunstein: Nick Perry and Clay Matthews are two Trojans that will soon be penetrating NFL protection... Toss in Worthy and there's going to be even more penetration and Heyward looks to be another ball hawking press corner. Good stuff this weekend!