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49erNation85
01-23-2012, 12:48 PM
Well, since our season is over, lets look ahead at the NFL draft in April. Who are the big targets for us in the first round? Also, what players do you guys see us drafting in the later rounds for o-line, defensive back or wideout?



EDIT: Let's just go ahead and make this the 2012 49ers Draft Thread

Ness
01-24-2012, 11:10 PM
Alshon Jeffery. Wide receiver from South Carolina. The 49ers need receiving threats.

Menardo75
01-24-2012, 11:37 PM
I like Sanu and Dwight Jones a lot as far as WR's go.

Ness
01-24-2012, 11:50 PM
I just hope our scouting department does it's job and find some good players in the later rounds.

VAfy-ya
01-27-2012, 10:31 PM
I just hope our scouting department does it's job and find some good players in the later rounds.

Which Baalke has done the past two drafts. No worries....

phlysac
01-28-2012, 10:46 AM
One guy I really want...

http://www.shotbycassie.com/blog/images/stories/brandon1_675.jpg

Borat
01-28-2012, 05:04 PM
Depending on how FA works out, we may be going best player available. Especially, if the team thinks that Kilgore is ready and they land one of the No. 1 WRs on the market.

Not a bad position to be in.

Brent
01-28-2012, 06:41 PM
after watching him all year, due to regional broadcasts, I've fallen for:

http://thegazette.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/6852218-WIR-Iowa-St-Baylor-Football-10_08_2011-20.07.27.jpg

phlysac
01-28-2012, 07:37 PM
and so have the 29 teams drafting in front of us ;)

Ness
01-29-2012, 12:34 AM
Apparently Marvin Jones left the Senior Bowl with a knee injury.

Madirishman
01-29-2012, 01:08 AM
Apparently Marvin Jones left the Senior Bowl with a knee injury.

Now he'll fall to the right team! :)

EvrythingPOLO
01-29-2012, 01:31 AM
Sanu, Wright, would fit really well IMO. Broyles is a good player, hope his injury does't effect him too much. Not sure he's the best fit. Marvin Jones and Juron Criner are very good players, but maybe not the sudden impact player we're looking for. It will be a priority to get more pass catchers, not necessarily WR's... Fleener is somebody we have our eye on surely. If FA goes one way and we lose someone in the secondary or Ahmad Brooks, it could be CB and OLB the first two picks.

Isiah Pead looked very good in the Senior Bowl tonight, enough make me want to go back and watch him some more. Another RB is a possibility, but whoever may replace Dixon would have to beat him out at RB and on Special Teams to earn a spot. We had 2 FB's on the roster, Moran isn't coming back; Do we get another FB? Depending on Kilgore and Person's development, Chilo Rachal's replacement may come via FA. Meanwhile, Anthony Davis's play was remarkably impacted by who was beside him. If Synder can be beaten in a competion for that spot our O-line can really start to dominate. A backup at safety may be a priority; Reggie Smith is leaving, (Did Madieu Williams get a 1 year deal?) Colin Jones was exclusive to special teams however good, and got more snaps at WR than S in terms of practice.

I could see us trading up or down really. Obviously depending on FA, but if we sign a majority of players back we can trade picks to move up for a specific player or move down and create opportunities for the next draft. I think Baalke/Harbaugh will really start to move around the draft as the Patriots do. Is it April 26th yet?

EvrythingPOLO
01-29-2012, 01:33 AM
Sanu, Wright, would fit really well IMO. Broyles is a good player, hope his injury does't effect him too much. Not sure he's the best fit. Marvin Jones and Juron Criner are very good players, but maybe not the sudden impact player we're looking for. It will be a priority to get more pass catchers, not necessarily WR's... Fleener is somebody we have our eye on surely. If FA goes one way and we lose someone in the secondary or Ahmad Brooks, it could be CB and OLB the first two days.

Isiah Pead looked very good in the Senior Bowl tonight, enough make me want to go back and watch him some more. Another RB is a possibility, but whoever may replace Dixon would have to beat him out at RB and on Special Teams to earn a spot. We had 2 FB's on the roster, Moran isn't coming back; Do we get another FB? Depending on Kilgore and Person's development, Chilo Rachal's replacement may come via FA. Meanwhile, Anthony Davis' play was remarkably impacted by who was beside him. If Synder can be beaten in a competion for that spot our O-line can really start to dominate. A backup at safety may be a priority; Reggie Smith is leaving, (Did Madieu Williams get a 1 year deal?) Colin Jones was exclusive to special teams however good, and got more snaps at WR than S in terms of practice.

I could see us trading up or down really. Obviously depending on FA, but if we sign a majority of players back we can trade picks to move up for a specific player or move down and create opportunities for the next draft. I think Baalke/Harbaugh will really start to move around the draft as the Patriots do. Is it April 26th yet?

49erNation85
01-29-2012, 03:18 AM
douge martin pleaseeee..

edgrenade
01-29-2012, 05:07 AM
As much as I LOVE Sanu, I don't like his 10 ypc, but it could just be a product of the system. My favorite part about him is his HUGE blocks that he lays down field, absolutely blowing UP guys. I also like how he goes after the ball and his burst. But all I know about him, I've learned from Youtube and I haven't watched him live in a game...

Criner is also another solid player, but after watching him in the game today he doesn't get many yards after catch. We are in desperate need of a big play threat at WR, and VD is the only big play threat at the moment.

I would love get someone like Joe Adams or Chris Rainey; someone with mind blowing speed that is always a threat. Someone like a Sproles or Mike Wallace type of player.

It's almost certain that we get a WR through FA as well as draft one. My philosophy is to have one be a big-body player and the other a deep threat. Either way, WR is the #1 need on this team by FAR. It's nice that it is one of the deepest positions in the draft.

VAfy-ya
01-29-2012, 09:33 AM
As much as I LOVE Sanu, I don't like his 10 ypc, but it could just be a product of the system. My favorite part about him is his HUGE blocks that he lays down field, absolutely blowing UP guys. I also like how he goes after the ball and his burst. But all I know about him, I've learned from Youtube and I haven't watched him live in a game...

Criner is also another solid player, but after watching him in the game today he doesn't get many yards after catch. We are in desperate need of a big play threat at WR, and VD is the only big play threat at the moment.

I would love get someone like Joe Adams or Chris Rainey; someone with mind blowing speed that is always a threat. Someone like a Sproles or Mike Wallace type of player.

It's almost certain that we get a WR through FA as well as draft one. My philosophy is to have one be a big-body player and the other a deep threat. Either way, WR is the #1 need on this team by FAR. It's nice that it is one of the deepest positions in the draft.

Its more than likely we're taking at least 2 WRs in the draft. One probably a tall, red zone target. A guy like Criner or my fav sleeper WR, Tommy Streeter. And we'll probably draft a zone buster, speedy, shifty guy. I pray its Joe Adams. I've been wishing for him in a Niner uni since very early in the season. We'll also add at least one WR via free agency and who knows how many through the UDFA route. So basically, I expect our WR corps to look totally different come the start of the 2012 season.

EvrythingPOLO
01-29-2012, 02:10 PM
Agree with 49erNation85, Doug Martin for sure. No doubt in my mind our staff likes his game. After the combine where will his stock be? 2nd/3rd I'm guessing.

phlysac
01-29-2012, 03:11 PM
I think a speedy RAC guy, as well as deep-speed that is under the radar is T.J. Graham.

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/716/tjgraham.jpg

VAfy-ya
01-29-2012, 06:15 PM
I think a speedy RAC guy, as well as deep-speed that is under the radar is T.J. Graham.

http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/716/tjgraham.jpg

He has lapses in concentration and drops are an issue. But he does have that game-breaking potential. I wouldnt mind him late if we look at other positions during the middle of the draft. Graham, Travis Benjamin from Miami, Kashif Moore from UConn, Devon Wylie of Fresno State and Jarius Wright from Arkansas are guys all I lumped togther in that group of slot-type/speed WRs after likes of Kendall Wright, Joe Adams, Chris Rainey, and T.Y. Hilton

thediggler3030
01-29-2012, 11:24 PM
1. WR Mohamed Sanu, Rutgers
Love Sanu. He reminds me some of Kenny Britt with less deep speed. I think Sanu goes in the first half of the first round if Rutgers had a better QB this year.

2. CB Leonard Johnson, Iowa St.
Loved Johnson when I watched him cover Sanu this year. Excellent in both run support and coverage, Johnson could easily develop into a number one cover man. I don't see the Niners resigning Rodgers due to cap issues, Johnson competes for the Nickle role this year.

3. OG Brandon Washington, Miami
Played really well last season on the inside and was moved over to LT this year where he struggled. He is very powerful and moves well enough to pull. Washington would compete this year with Kilgore and ideally take over in the longterm.

4. RB Vic Ballard, Mississippi St.
Ballard is a physical, down hill runner, who hits the hole hard. Gore is still an effective runner, but should be limited to 15-20 touches a game and Hunter is not effective in all situations. Honestly I love Dixon, but mainly because of his hair... Ballard should give another RB option. I could see the Niners looking at RB as early as Round 2.

5. OLB Miles Burris, San Diego St.
The Niners were one OLB injury away from having an average (at best) passrush. This mock assumes Brooks is resigned, but even if that's the case, you can never have too many good passrushers (cough, giants, cough). Burris is an undersized passrusher, who is a bit undersized. The Niners have the depth to develop someone with passrushing skills who needs to add some weight.

6. WR/RS Keyshawn Martin, Michigan St.
Martin has some receiving skills and will also help in the return game, specifically on punts. In reality this pick reminds me a bit of the Kyle Williams pick lol.

7. NT Hebron Fangupo, BYU
A very raw NT specimen. I think the Niners have some interesting pieces on the Dline, but adding some competition couldn't hurt.

7. TE DC Jefferson, Rutgers
I won't assume Nate Byham will be 100 % back to normal. I was okay with the cute TE personal games Harbaugh played at first, but after a while it became predictable.

Thoughts?

VAfy-ya
01-30-2012, 07:59 AM
I am not sold on Sanu. I know everyone has a hard on for him but when I saw him play, I didnt see the speed nor the explosievness everyone else has been raving about. He had really good hands and his blocking is impressive for a WR but he looks me to be a glorified possesion WR at the next level. And he doesn't look 6'2, so I'll wait for the Combine to clarify that one. He reminds me alot of Josh Morgan when he was at Tech. Very solid but I don't see the "wow" factor everyone else does.

And I really dont want a WR at 30th. We've had the worst luck with drafting WR in the first round. Now if some guy falls through the cracks, that's one thing. Im not sure which direction I want us to go right now at #30. I know I want Baalke to continue doing what he's been doing in recent drafts and that's finding guys who fit our scheme, and jumping on them regardless of where 'experts' think they should have gone. Just that this WR class is so deep, I'd rather pounce on a pass-rusher or a CB who falls into our lap.

49ersfan_87
01-30-2012, 01:26 PM
Instead of bringing in a tall WR for redzone help, how about a TE? We could have a lethal 2 TE offense if we get the right guy. What do you guys think of Dwayne Allen or Coby Fleener?

thediggler3030
01-30-2012, 02:04 PM
I am not sold on Sanu. I know everyone has a hard on for him but when I saw him play, I didnt see the speed nor the explosievness everyone else has been raving about. He had really good hands and his blocking is impressive for a WR but he looks me to be a glorified possesion WR at the next level. And he doesn't look 6'2, so I'll wait for the Combine to clarify that one. He reminds me alot of Josh Morgan when he was at Tech. Very solid but I don't see the "wow" factor everyone else does.

And I really dont want a WR at 30th. We've had the worst luck with drafting WR in the first round. Now if some guy falls through the cracks, that's one thing. Im not sure which direction I want us to go right now at #30. I know I want Baalke to continue doing what he's been doing in recent drafts and that's finding guys who fit our scheme, and jumping on them regardless of where 'experts' think they should have gone. Just that this WR class is so deep, I'd rather pounce on a pass-rusher or a CB who falls into our lap.

Sanu has deceptive speed, especially coming off the LOS. He breaks the jam extremely well and can get deep if needed.

There are a few reasons I like Sanu, but before we get into them, I want to point out that he isn't comparable to Blackmon or Wright, and that is the reason he will be available in the later portion of the first round.

1. Dangerous with the ball in his hands. He has great size and and decent enough speed. Sanu is terrific with the ball in his hands as he RUSHED for 653 yards and 9 TDs over the last two years. Even though he isn't the fastest receiver, he has shown the ability to break and rip free of tackles. He is very reminiscent of Anquan Boldin when running with the ball. He runs with the ball tightly secured and will quickly secure it after the catch. He also can play as a wildcat, which is nice to have at times.

2. Route Running. Sanu can and has lined up all over the field. He has the ability to run any route, as he has enough acceleration off the line to break through the jam and get deep, but also is willing to go over the middle. On top of all this, his routes are very precise and tend to create a lot of separation.

3. EXCELLENT hands. Sanu has tremendous hands and does an especially great job extending towards the ball while in traffic. He uses his long arms as an extra advantage, and also has terrific hand-eye coordination. He is a terrific jump ball type receiver because of those arms and his ability and excellent leaping skills.

4. Tremendous blocker. First off, watch this (specifically from the :55 second mark, though the hole video is awesome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE2bWR0uRxg
He also just clearly loves to block and has decent for for a WR.

Sanu is just a great player that has good character and just listening to Shiano talk about him leaving Rutgers makes me realize that he is a good teammate and leader and could easily be a number 1 WR in the league.

thediggler3030
01-30-2012, 02:05 PM
Instead of bringing in a tall WR for redzone help, how about a TE? We could have a lethal 2 TE offense if we get the right guy. What do you guys think of Dwayne Allen or Coby Fleener?

Personally, I think we already have a lethal 2 TE offense...

phlysac
01-30-2012, 04:16 PM
3. OG Brandon Washington, Miami
Played really well last season on the inside and was moved over to LT this year where he struggled. He is very powerful and moves well enough to pull. Washington would compete this year with Kilgore and ideally take over in the longterm.

Drafting a middle round G when they just traded two picks to move up and pick a middle round G last year would really bother me.

I'm hoping Kilgore is really coming along and that they won't have to spend anything other than a late pick to backup Kilgore and Snyder.

Drafting a stud interior O-Lineman in the 1st, is a different story.

Menardo75
01-30-2012, 04:44 PM
Drafting a middle round G when they just traded two picks to move up and pick a middle round G last year would really bother me.

I'm hoping Kilgore is really coming along and that they won't have to spend anything other than a late pick to backup Kilgore and Snyder.

Drafting a stud interior O-Lineman in the 1st, is a different story.

The only offensive lineman I want the Niners taking early are either Decastro or Konz.

VAfy-ya
01-30-2012, 05:17 PM
Sanu has deceptive speed, especially coming off the LOS. He breaks the jam extremely well and can get deep if needed.

There are a few reasons I like Sanu, but before we get into them, I want to point out that he isn't comparable to Blackmon or Wright, and that is the reason he will be available in the later portion of the first round.

1. Dangerous with the ball in his hands. He has great size and and decent enough speed. Sanu is terrific with the ball in his hands as he RUSHED for 653 yards and 9 TDs over the last two years. Even though he isn't the fastest receiver, he has shown the ability to break and rip free of tackles. He is very reminiscent of Anquan Boldin when running with the ball. He runs with the ball tightly secured and will quickly secure it after the catch. He also can play as a wildcat, which is nice to have at times.

2. Route Running. Sanu can and has lined up all over the field. He has the ability to run any route, as he has enough acceleration off the line to break through the jam and get deep, but also is willing to go over the middle. On top of all this, his routes are very precise and tend to create a lot of separation.

3. EXCELLENT hands. Sanu has tremendous hands and does an especially great job extending towards the ball while in traffic. He uses his long arms as an extra advantage, and also has terrific hand-eye coordination. He is a terrific jump ball type receiver because of those arms and his ability and excellent leaping skills.

4. Tremendous blocker. First off, watch this (specifically from the :55 second mark, though the hole video is awesome: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WE2bWR0uRxg
He also just clearly loves to block and has decent for for a WR.

Sanu is just a great player that has good character and just listening to Shiano talk about him leaving Rutgers makes me realize that he is a good teammate and leader and could easily be a number 1 WR in the league.

Its not about Blackmon or Wright. Its about what I saw when I watched him play. Sure his highlight reel looks impressive. But when I actually watched him play, I didn't see all this burst and explosiveness. He looked solid, but nothing that made me say this is a 1st or 2nd round talent at WR. I was more impressed with guys that most people have ranked lower than him. I defintely would be disappointed if we took him at 30th. I just don't see first round talent there....but to each his own.

thediggler3030
01-30-2012, 10:29 PM
Drafting a middle round G when they just traded two picks to move up and pick a middle round G last year would really bother me.

I'm hoping Kilgore is really coming along and that they won't have to spend anything other than a late pick to backup Kilgore and Snyder.

Drafting a stud interior O-Lineman in the 1st, is a different story.

Keep in mind this is all before FA. I would rather give Kilgore the spot after he earned it over another quality player. I just don't think the Niners have the cap space to resign key players and add an interior lineman in FA. I think resigning Smith, Brooks, Goldson and a few other cheap players is about all they can do.

IMO, the only way we can give Kilgore any decent competition is by drafting someone early on. I don't think grabbing an interior lineman in the 3rd round is too early, IMO you can never have too many good offensive linemen anyway.

I also don't think a team that gave up 44 sacks and ranked 19th in ypc (4.1) should scoff at drafting a OG in the first three rounds...

thediggler3030
01-30-2012, 10:39 PM
Its not about Blackmon or Wright. Its about what I saw when I watched him play. Sure his highlight reel looks impressive. But when I actually watched him play, I didn't see all this burst and explosiveness. He looked solid, but nothing that made me say this is a 1st or 2nd round talent at WR. I was more impressed with guys that most people have ranked lower than him. I defintely would be disappointed if we took him at 30th. I just don't see first round talent there....but to each his own.

I have him as the 5th ranked WR behind Blackmon, Wright, Floyd and Jeffery. Sanu is just such a complete WR. I've watched him play quite a few games and was especially impressed with him against Louisville. The Rutgers QB were so BAD this year and Sanu produced, even though they just weren't able to hit him down field. He just runs such good short area routes.

I guess you don't have a specific issue with him but would rather Randle or Jeffery?

VAfy-ya
01-31-2012, 01:34 AM
Keep in mind this is all before FA. I would rather give Kilgore the spot after he earned it over another quality player. I just don't think the Niners have the cap space to resign key players and add an interior lineman in FA. I think resigning Smith, Brooks, Goldson and a few other cheap players is about all they can do.

IMO, the only way we can give Kilgore any decent competition is by drafting someone early on. I don't think grabbing an interior lineman in the 3rd round is too early, IMO you can never have too many good offensive linemen anyway.

I also don't think a team that gave up 44 sacks and ranked 19th in ypc (4.1) should scoff at drafting a OG in the first three rounds...

I think we do have the cap space to sign a guy who isnt a big name that's a upgrade over Synder. I've been campaigning for Roberto Garza from the Bears for awhile now. Big guy with great feet. Athletic but still much more of the mauler we need at the position. Im not a Synder fan. I hope they let him walk. Too much of a finesse OG. Need a guy who can drive block on those power plays, not get tossed into the backfield. Goodwin needs to be upgraded as well but you can't do everything in one year. I know Baalke sees it and he'll sign someone more in tuned with they physicality Jimbaugh wants upfront. And like most of his signings, it won't be a guy that's gonna turn heads.

But your absolutely right, we will jump on any OG who falls through the cracks and lands to us. That's right up Baalke's alley of drafting. I don't think he will bypass a player he really likes just because he drafted the same position last year. I trust him to make the right call. But also think he and the rest of the staff really like Kilgore and will give him every opportunity to make an impression this off-season. I think its Person's spot who's in jepoardy if we draft another O-Lineman or bring a guy in through free agency.

VAfy-ya
01-31-2012, 01:51 AM
I have him as the 5th ranked WR behind Blackmon, Wright, Floyd and Jeffery. Sanu is just such a complete WR. I've watched him play quite a few games and was especially impressed with him against Louisville. The Rutgers QB were so BAD this year and Sanu produced, even though they just weren't able to hit him down field. He just runs such good short area routes.

I guess you don't have a specific issue with him but would rather Randle or Jeffery?

Jefferey is not falling to us and I have some reservations about him as well at the next level. I do like Randle but Im concerned about his speed and quickness and will wait for the Combine to answer some of those, like I will with Sanu. I really like guys like Marvin Jones, Dwight Jones, Gerrell Robinson and Brian Quick over a guy like Sanu at this point. Like I said, its not that I see him as a awful prospect, just not a guy worth taking where you have him slotted. But I know alot ppl like him so it is what it is. I wouldnt be totally against him later. I just really think there isnt a first round talent outside of the conseus top 3-4 guys. I think Dwight Jones has first round talent. I saw him when Rutgers played UNC and while Sanu had a great game statiscally, and a nice little one-handed grab of a TD in the back of the end-zone, I came away more impressed with Jones.

thediggler3030
01-31-2012, 09:00 AM
I think we do have the cap space to sign a guy who isnt a big name that's a upgrade over Synder. I've been campaigning for Roberto Garza from the Bears for awhile now. Big guy with great feet. Athletic but still much more of the mauler we need at the position. Im not a Synder fan. I hope they let him walk. Too much of a finesse OG. Need a guy who can drive block on those power plays, not get tossed into the backfield. Goodwin needs to be upgraded as well but you can't do everything in one year. I know Baalke sees it and he'll sign someone more in tuned with they physicality Jimbaugh wants upfront. And like most of his signings, it won't be a guy that's gonna turn heads.

But your absolutely right, we will jump on any OG who falls through the cracks and lands to us. That's right up Baalke's alley of drafting. I don't think he will bypass a player he really likes just because he drafted the same position last year. I trust him to make the right call. But also think he and the rest of the staff really like Kilgore and will give him every opportunity to make an impression this off-season. I think its Person's spot who's in jepoardy if we draft another O-Lineman or bring a guy in through free agency.

Based on my research, the Niners are going to have around $16 million in cap space and are looking to resign:
Dashon Goldson - about $6 million at the cheapest next year.
Alex Smith - Around $7 million.
Ahmad Brooks - $5 million at the cheapest.
Carlos Rodgers - Probably near $8 million on the cheap end.

Then I expect them to look to bring Joshua Morgan and Ted Ginn back, who should each make around 2-3 million. Then bringing back Blake Costanzo and Larry Grant will cost a bit as well.

I expect the Niners to bring in some cheap FA's towards the end of the period, but I think its worth noting that there is no possible way the team is able to bring back all their important expiring contracts, meaning that I have little faith they're able to find a new starting OG that is acceptable outside of the draft.

Also, keep in mind that the team has always preferred to build through the draft.

Either way, I see nothing wrong with the Niners adding an offensive lineman early in the draft. I would be surprised if they didn't to say the truth. I would also be fine with signing a veteran, I just am not sure its super realistic that they bring in a starting caliber OG.

thediggler3030
01-31-2012, 09:07 AM
Jefferey is not falling to us and I have some reservations about him as well at the next level. I do like Randle but Im concerned about his speed and quickness and will wait for the Combine to answer some of those, like I will with Sanu. I really like guys like Marvin Jones, Dwight Jones, Gerrell Robinson and Brian Quick over a guy like Sanu at this point. Like I said, its not that I see him as a awful prospect, just not a guy worth taking where you have him slotted. But I know alot ppl like him so it is what it is. I wouldnt be totally against him later. I just really think there isnt a first round talent outside of the conseus top 3-4 guys. I think Dwight Jones has first round talent. I saw him when Rutgers played UNC and while Sanu had a great game statiscally, and a nice little one-handed grab of a TD in the back of the end-zone, I came away more impressed with Jones.

I think Sanu is a really complete WR. I just see no weakness in his game. I also think he has a huge ceiling. If he stayed at Rutgers and didn't come out, I think he would be going in the top 15. He has been severely limited to poor QB play and is one of those players that should play better in the NFL than in college.

That's just my perspective though, I would be fine with other WRs as well.

VAfy-ya
01-31-2012, 03:01 PM
Based on my research, the Niners are going to have around $16 million in cap space and are looking to resign:
Dashon Goldson - about $6 million at the cheapest next year.
Alex Smith - Around $7 million.
Ahmad Brooks - $5 million at the cheapest.
Carlos Rodgers - Probably near $8 million on the cheap end.

Then I expect them to look to bring Joshua Morgan and Ted Ginn back, who should each make around 2-3 million. Then bringing back Blake Costanzo and Larry Grant will cost a bit as well.

I expect the Niners to bring in some cheap FA's towards the end of the period, but I think its worth noting that there is no possible way the team is able to bring back all their important expiring contracts, meaning that I have little faith they're able to find a new starting OG that is acceptable outside of the draft.

Also, keep in mind that the team has always preferred to build through the draft.

Either way, I see nothing wrong with the Niners adding an offensive lineman early in the draft. I would be surprised if they didn't to say the truth. I would also be fine with signing a veteran, I just am not sure its super realistic that they bring in a starting caliber OG.

The Niners are 16 million under as this season comes to a close. Once the new league year begins and free agency starts, free agents like Edwards, Rogers, Goldson, etc come off the books. So I expect that number to go up to around 20-22 million. Now that's with the cap whereit was this previous season, $120 million. Most people expect the cap to increase to 130 million in 2012. We'll have to wait in see, but if it does indeed happen, that's over 30 million cap space.

I expect the Niners to offer Goldson a 5 year deal, at around 6 mil a year. If he doesn't take it, he'll be franchised. I think Brooks will be offered a deal similar to what we gave McDonald. I dont see Rogers coming back. I expect us to go younger and cheaper. Alex will get his deal done. I think that leaves more than enough to go after a good WR, and a guy like Garza. Morgan will be back for chump change. Not sure Ginn will be back, as they may rely on the draft to find a return guy and let whoever battle Culliver/Williams for the role. That's how I see things playing out.

thediggler3030
01-31-2012, 03:47 PM
The Niners are 16 million under as this season comes to a close. Once the new league year begins and free agency starts, free agents like Edwards, Rogers, Goldson, etc come off the books. So I expect that number to go up to around 20-22 million. Now that's with the cap whereit was this previous season, $120 million. Most people expect the cap to increase to 130 million in 2012. We'll have to wait in see, but if it does indeed happen, that's over 30 million cap space.

Mmmm that's a good point. Well in that case, free agency just became 10 times more interesting.

I still would be totally happy drafting a lineman in the first three rounds though. I think its one of the Niners top three needs.

VAfy-ya
01-31-2012, 05:10 PM
Mmmm that's a good point. Well in that case, free agency just became 10 times more interesting.

I still would be totally happy drafting a lineman in the first three rounds though. I think its one of the Niners top three needs.

I agree. And one of the advantages of picking later in each round is we get to see who falls through the cracks. But I expect Baalke to do his fair share of wheeling and dealing as always to get the guys he likes. Baalke last two hauls were impressive. In two drafts, he's drafted a All-Pro, 2 Pro Bowl players(one an alternate but hey...) and a rookie pass-rusher who tied for 5th in the league for sacks and was in heavy consideration for rookie of the year. Pretty impressive. Im interested in seeing what he does not having the luxury of picking in the front half of each round. Not too many comp picks this year, if at all so should be interesting.

Larry
02-01-2012, 12:53 PM
I want Marvin McNutt. I actually think he'll be better than Sanu especially in the redzone with his leaping ability.

Goon61
02-01-2012, 04:05 PM
I'm not a fan of Sanu either and after watching Dwight Jones lowlights in their Missouri bowl game of him dropping a few passes including one that sat on his back for a second I don't want Jones either.

The recievers I'm looking at right now are (I've recently become enamored with Randle):
Rueben Randle: I have only seen a little bit but he looks like a smart athletic player, just not too sure about his hands.
Criner
M. Jones
J Adams and J Wright
McNutt
I'm wondering if we should take a talented guy like Randle in the first even though it may take him a year to develop or draft a more experienced wr like McNutt later in the draft.

I also think Criner is going to get taken in the 2nd round now so it is unlikely we get him.

edgrenade
02-01-2012, 04:56 PM
How about OLBs? I'm liking Andre Branch so far.

VAfy-ya
02-01-2012, 05:37 PM
How about OLBs? I'm liking Andre Branch so far.

I'll take any of the following, no particular order...

Bruce Irwin
Nic Perry
Brandon Lindsey
Adrian Hamilton
Jacquies Smith
Johnathan Massaquoi
Frank Alexander
Darius Flemming
Adrian Robinson
Shea McClellin
Jake Bequette
Brian McNally

Goon61
02-01-2012, 07:09 PM
what about vinny curry or bruce irvin if they happen to fall in the 2nd

VAfy-ya
02-01-2012, 07:23 PM
what about vinny curry or bruce irvin if they happen to fall in the 2nd

Wasnt impressed as much as I thought I would be by Curry at the Senior Bowl. Plus I dont thin he makes it to the bottom of the 1st. If he fell, he would probably be good value but idk...not really high on him as most. Looks very stiff laterally and think playing in space could be problem. But then again, I thought the same thing about All-Done so who knows. Not thrilled about his short arms either.

Defintely forgot about Irwin, will add him to the list, ASAP. And still some guys Im mulling over like Chandler Jones and that kid from OU....forgets his name....think its Lewis.

phlysac
02-01-2012, 08:20 PM
I'd LOVE Chandler Jones, because Arthur is pretty good and Jon is THE MAN, but I think Chandler is underwhelming. He might be solid, but not a sack artist.

Goon61
02-01-2012, 10:40 PM
Wasnt impressed as much as I thought I would be by Curry at the Senior Bowl. Plus I dont thin he makes it to the bottom of the 1st. If he fell, he would probably be good value but idk...not really high on him as most. Looks very stiff laterally and think playing in space could be problem. But then again, I thought the same thing about All-Done so who knows. Not thrilled about his short arms either.

Defintely forgot about Irwin, will add him to the list, ASAP. And still some guys Im mulling over like Chandler Jones and that kid from OU....forgets his name....think its Lewis.

I think you mean Frank Alexander, and yeh I like him too. I remember Rieff having problems with him in their bowl game.

[edit] Oh wait you mean Ronnel lewis, I don't know anything about him

edgrenade
02-02-2012, 05:17 AM
I'd LOVE Chandler Jones, because Arthur is pretty good and Jon is THE MAN, but I think Chandler is underwhelming. He might be solid, but not a sack artist.

Yeah, I just like him because his brother John Bones Jones, otherwise there isn't really anything that stands out in his game.

VAfy-ya
02-02-2012, 09:56 PM
I think you mean Frank Alexander, and yeh I like him too. I remember Rieff having problems with him in their bowl game.

[edit] Oh wait you mean Ronnel lewis, I don't know anything about him

I didnt think Alexander was a senior? Did he declare?


**EDIT** Just saw, Alexander is a senior. Have to add him to the list also.

Menardo75
02-03-2012, 12:52 PM
The niners need an edge rusher to complement all of their power rushers. Bruce Irvin, and Ronnell Lewis are two guys that would fit that nicely.

chapo123
02-07-2012, 09:46 AM
my mock draft:

1. kendall wright - wr

2. jayron hosley - cb

3. derek wolfe - de

4. lonnie edwards - g

5. delano howell - fs

6. jermaine kearse - wr

7. adrien cole - ilb

Goon61
02-07-2012, 12:06 PM
my mock draft:

1. kendall wright - wr

2. jayron hosley - cb

3. derek wolfe - de

4. lonnie edwards - g

5. delano howell - fs

6. jermaine kearse - wr

7. adrien cole - ilb

I highly doubt Wright is available where we pick in the first round. I never heard of lonnie edwards and there is no way Audie Cole falls to the 7th round, unless adrien cole is another person I never heard of.

If you put a G or C in the 3rd and Wolfe in the 4th I would like it better.

Hosely is an interesting prospect, but Scott has him listed at 171lbs which is too small IMO. Looking forward to see what he really weighs at the combine.

Prowler
02-07-2012, 12:25 PM
I never heard of lonnie edwards and there is no way Audie Cole falls to the 7th round, unless adrien cole is another person I never heard of.


http://thetshirtconspiracy.com/images/1289352807497-95179208.jpeg

Wright being there depends on the combine results.

phlysac
02-08-2012, 12:22 AM
How about OLBs? I'm liking Andre Branch so far.

He has the best measureables of anyone around the 30 range.

This is a pretty poor year for tall-rangy 3-4 OLB prospects.

chapo123
02-08-2012, 11:26 AM
I highly doubt Wright is available where we pick in the first round. I never heard of lonnie edwards and there is no way Audie Cole falls to the 7th round, unless adrien cole is another person I never heard of.

If you put a G or C in the 3rd and Wolfe in the 4th I would like it better.

Hosely is an interesting prospect, but Scott has him listed at 171lbs which is too small IMO. Looking forward to see what he really weighs at the combine.

adrien cole is from lousina tech. most sites have hime anywhere from 5-7. he seems like a sleeper player...very larry grant like.

c - g in the 3rd would make sense too. i put a de there due to justin smith's age and needing some depth. would make sense to have another good young pass rusher.

i like hosley. i think if he adds muscle during the off season and eats he should be ok right about 185 moving forward.

kendall wright could be there. i mean i have seen some random pics happen before...hayward-bay, tim tebow way higher than expected so it's possible he slips. if he doesn't i can see alshon jeffrey slip too if he doesn't get some high 40 times.

edgrenade
02-10-2012, 05:24 AM
So I'm looking forward to seeing some of the WRs at the combine. Guys like Streeter, and how fast the little guys run.

phlysac
02-10-2012, 09:17 AM
So I'm looking forward to seeing some of the WRs at the combine. Guys like Streeter, and how fast the little guys run.

I'm more interested in seeing how fast the taller receivers run ;P

edgrenade
02-10-2012, 06:47 PM
I'm more interested in seeing how fast the taller receivers run ;P

Well I was really just referring to Adams and Rainey mostly; if they run in the 4.2 range

AS11toFG21
02-10-2012, 08:06 PM
If Goldson leaves via FA, who are the better coverage safeties that would be available in the first few rounds?

phlysac
02-10-2012, 11:30 PM
If Goldson leaves via FA, who are the better coverage safeties that would be available in the first few rounds?

There really aren't any obvious Free Safeties in this draft at all.

If a "coverage safety" is on Baalke's wish-list, I'd expect a corner conversion.

phlysac
02-10-2012, 11:33 PM
http://i.i.com.com/cnwk.1d/i/ne/pg/fd_2009/090331_facebook_gideon_yu.jpg

Say hello to the 49ers' new Team President.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gideon_Yu

dan77733
02-10-2012, 11:46 PM
^^^ And co-owner.

chapo123
02-12-2012, 01:40 PM
i still feel the draft balke and harbaugh had this last season was very underrated and wasn't spoken about as much.

aldon smith, chris culliver, and kendall hunter did more for this team than what i thought they would as rookies.

personally if we have another draft where 3-4 guys out of the 7 can have a similar impact as these 3 guys did than i will continue to trust they will continue to make smart executive decisions.

chapo123
02-12-2012, 01:59 PM
some prospects i like to see are:

brian quick - wr
joe adams - wr

doug martin - rb
vick ballard - rb
marc tyler - rb

zebrie sanders - ot
mitchell schwartz - ot
nate potter - ot

billy winn - de
derek wolfe - de

jayron hosley - cb
dequan menzie - cb
keith tandy - cb

trumaine johnson - fs
brandon taylor - fs
blake giddeon - fs

jarret lee - qb
brock osweisler - qb

AS11toFG21
02-12-2012, 07:55 PM
There really aren't any obvious Free Safeties in this draft at all.

If a "coverage safety" is on Baalke's wish-list, I'd expect a corner conversion.

That's disappointing. I really wasn't impressed with Goldson's play in coverage this year, in spite of his interception total. Maybe there will be an alternative in free agency.

Borat
02-12-2012, 08:01 PM
That's disappointing. I really wasn't impressed with Goldson's play in coverage this year, in spite of his interception total. Maybe there will be an alternative in free agency.

Goldson isn't going anywhere. If no deal is reached, SF is going to tag him.

phlysac
02-12-2012, 10:54 PM
That's disappointing. I really wasn't impressed with Goldson's play in coverage this year, in spite of his interception total. Maybe there will be an alternative in free agency.

He still gave up fewer plays in coverage than nearly every other FS in the NFL.

VAfy-ya
02-13-2012, 12:57 AM
If Goldson leaves via FA, who are the better coverage safeties that would be available in the first few rounds?

Goldson will be in a Niner uniform next year, make no mistake about that. Bad year for safeties. Actually the past two years have been bad for safties. But we're losing alot of depth at saftey so I wouldnt be surprised to see us grab one. One of my sleepers is Brandon Hardin of Oregon St. Missed all but one game of his senior year due to a shoulder injury that required surgrey. Played CB at OSU, but I think he's a safety at the next level. Dont know if he's been invited to the Combine or not but he will have to show well there or at a Pro Day. Played in the Shrine Game but he wasn't impressive. Could have been rust but I think alot of it is he played at CB. Likely will have to go the UDFA route but I think he has potential as a either a FS or a SS. I like he's measurables and he plays the game with alot of physicality. Reminds me some of Goldson when he was was a Huskie.

phlysac
02-13-2012, 10:18 AM
zebrie sanders - ot
mitchell schwartz - ot
nate potter - ot

You think OT needs to be targeted? I don't at all.

edgrenade
02-13-2012, 05:49 PM
You think OT needs to be targeted? I don't at all.

I think the only OTs that are targeted are guys who can move inside.

chapo123
02-13-2012, 05:50 PM
You think OT needs to be targeted? I don't at all.

depends on the targets and if snyder is retained. there isn't much depth. davis isn't the key and i am not sure i am sold on snyder holding the spot as a starter. i'm not saying let's go spend a top 30 pick on a ot but i would be safe to say that drafting one should not cause a surprise to anyone.

phlysac
02-13-2012, 06:42 PM
depends on the targets and if snyder is retained. there isn't much depth. davis isn't the key and i am not sure i am sold on snyder holding the spot as a starter. i'm not saying let's go spend a top 30 pick on a ot but i would be safe to say that drafting one should not cause a surprise to anyone.

No depth?

Alex Boone and Mike Person? Not many teams carry more than 4. And if Snyder returns that would be 5 players capable of playing OT.

C and G need to be targeted far before OT.

Menardo75
02-13-2012, 06:48 PM
No depth?

Alex Boone and Mike Person? Not many teams carry more than 4. And if Snyder returns that would be 5 players capable of playing OT.

C and G need to be targeted far before OT.

I wonder if they will address that or if they are confident in Chase Beeler, and Dan Kilgore. I guess it will depend on how the OTA's go.

dan77733
02-13-2012, 06:50 PM
No depth?

Alex Boone and Mike Person? Not many teams carry more than 4. And if Snyder returns that would be 5 players capable of playing OT.

C and G need to be targeted far before OT.

OG - Iupati, Snyder, Kilgore
OT - Staley, Davis, Boone and Person
C - Goodwin

Hmmm, who's the backup center? I'm hoping that Rachal is allowed to walk as an UFA because he sucks. I'm also hoping that we re-sign Snyder while Kilgore develops so we can keep our starting OL intact. Drafting a center to replace Goodwin should be the team's number one priority in regards to backup linemen.

Can definitely see us drafting an OG and/or C but not in round one and would be surprised if we draft an OT.

dan77733
02-13-2012, 06:51 PM
Is Beeler the backup center? If so, forget what I said. LOL.

Verloren
02-13-2012, 07:11 PM
C depth chart
Goodwin
Snyder
Beeler
Kilgore

Not having seen much of Beeler/Kilgore, I'd say they're pretty much interchangeable at this point.

phlysac
02-13-2012, 07:36 PM
C depth chart
Goodwin
Snyder
Beeler
Kilgore

Not having seen much of Beeler/Kilgore, I'd say they're pretty much interchangeable at this point.

Kilgore was an OT kicking inside to guard. I believe they hoped he'd pick up both positions while Person would pick up both T and G.

VAfy-ya
02-14-2012, 11:13 AM
Kilgore was an OT kicking inside to guard. I believe they hoped he'd pick up both positions while Person would pick up both T and G.

Kilgore was drafted to play the interior. I think the days of him playing tackle are over. Wouldnt surprise me to see him gets some snaps at Center in the off-season. If we dont bring in another interior lineman via free agency, we'll need someone to back-up both OG and Center. Kilgore seems like a guy capable of pulling it off.

When I look at things, I look at them from a 53 perspective. We kept Kilgore and Person on the 53 last year because we liked their potential and didnt want to risk them being exposed on the PS. That speaks to how much they obviously like each of them. So last year we kept 9 O-Lineman. Rachal is leaving. So that opens up one spot for a potential draft pick or free agent. Is Synder rerurning? That will be a ? that wont be answered until free agency roles around. So as I see it, we have one, potentially two spots for a draft pick to come in and earn a spot. Or if they really 'wow' the staff, they could possibly knock Person or Kilgore futher down the dpeth chart.

One thing I learned from Baalke last year is that he puts a price tag on each player and he doesn't budge off that number. So all our free agents pretty much have a value already assigned to them. A price that we feel they are worth. And if they dont return, we already have a plan in place to address it. Now being that last year, the draft was before free agency, we drafted for needs almost exclusively. Every year we have needs but this year, I see us looking at the draft not so much for starters as much as providing depth at places we' re currently thin or losing depth via free agency. Only position we might be looking at opening day contributions is WR. Maybe OLB, depending if Brooks is retained. But all other positions we pretty much either have a starter in waiting or a guy there pretty much entrenched as the starter.

chapo123
02-14-2012, 06:18 PM
No depth?

Alex Boone and Mike Person? Not many teams carry more than 4. And if Snyder returns that would be 5 players capable of playing OT.

C and G need to be targeted far before OT.

who's to say those 3 guys come back? my perception was that kilgore would be playing guard and sf goes after a inexpensive center or a rookie free agent. rachael is as good as gone. so yes a tackle would be something sf should consider in the upcoming draft along with a center and guard. i wouldnt be shocked to see them go after 2 of those positions.

unlike other teams in the league sf doesn't need much....

phlysac
02-14-2012, 06:52 PM
who's to say those 3 guys come back? my perception was that kilgore would be playing guard and sf goes after a inexpensive center or a rookie free agent. rachael is as good as gone. so yes a tackle would be something sf should consider in the upcoming draft along with a center and guard. i wouldnt be shocked to see them go after 2 of those positions.

unlike other teams in the league sf doesn't need much....

I don't understand your argument.

Boone and Person are under contract for several years. That gives them 4 OTs. If Snyder returns he's a swing at ALL-FIVE OL positions. If he doesn't, a C/G needs to be drafted to in competion with Goodwin, Kilgore, and Beeler.

edgrenade
02-16-2012, 12:20 AM
My new WR I'm crushing on is Rueben Randle of LSU. They have put out some good WRs the last few years, and think that Randle is the next great one. He's a big physical guy who gets good yac yards. He probably would've had better stats if Jordan Jefferson wasn't throwing him the ball...

Menardo75
02-16-2012, 01:42 PM
My new WR I'm crushing on is Rueben Randle of LSU. They have put out some good WRs the last few years, and think that Randle is the next great one. He's a big physical guy who gets good yac yards. He probably would've had better stats if Jordan Jefferson wasn't throwing him the ball...

I like him too the numbers he put up with the worst college QB play i've ever seen is amazing.

Brent
02-16-2012, 02:06 PM
he reminds me too much of Crabtree: zero seperation.

VAfy-ya
02-16-2012, 05:17 PM
he reminds me too much of Crabtree: zero seperation.

Crabs seperates, but it has alot to do with how he's used. They keep him outside too much. He nees to be in slot more, so he has more space to operate underneath, using his short-area quickness to seperate. Problem is we usually put VD in the slot, so Crabs is stuck outside where he's limited because he doesnt have the deep speed to keep DBs guessing. If you watch the Ravens, they do this sucessfully with Boldin. They usually have in the slot on third downs, and he's the chain mover. Thats ideally how you would like to see Crabs used. Its one of the things I noticed when I re-watched the NFCCG. Crabs always seemed to be on the outside on third downs. Call me crazy, but I dont think thats a wise use of his skill-set.

A kid who hasn't really been talked about but is a WR I feel has a ton of upside is Stephen Hill. He's pretty raw, as you expect coming from a offense that asks him to run basically two routes. But for his size, he seems to have outstanding short area quickness and he has that sneaky speed where it doesn't look like he's moving real fast, but he's leaving his defender every time. He could be a gem for some team who coaches him up right.

Ness
02-16-2012, 05:33 PM
I thought Crabtree was going to be the receiver that could be used everywhere and anywhere. And you don't have to be a burner to get separation. Josh Morgan does this well. Having Crabtree in the slot a lot of the time just speaks volumes about how he might not be a complete receiver. Sad.

dan77733
02-16-2012, 08:03 PM
What's everyone's thoughts on drafting TE Coby Fleener with our second round draft pick?

AS11toFG21
02-16-2012, 08:43 PM
What's everyone's thoughts on drafting TE Coby Fleener with our second round draft pick?

He won't be there. He's a possible, though unlikely, first round pick and likely to be taken before the Niners pick in the second.

Matt Barrows has an interesting article up discussing the possibility of drafting him in the first. Not sure I'd be thrilled with that but he could create massive problems for opponents who already have to account for Davis.

http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/q-should-the-49ers-consider-fleener-a.html

VAfy-ya
02-17-2012, 01:28 AM
I thought Crabtree was going to be the receiver that could be used everywhere and anywhere. And you don't have to be a burner to get separation. Josh Morgan does this well. Having Crabtree in the slot a lot of the time just speaks volumes about how he might not be a complete receiver. Sad.

Morgan does have decent speed though.....4.47 I believe he was timed coming out of college. But Morgan has had his problems creating seperation on the outside as well, against press coverage. If you see any of our WRs getting open on the outside, its usually against a zone. But Morgan has enough speed to get a step on a decent CB. Crabs doesn't have the foot speed.....it is what it is.

edgrenade
02-17-2012, 04:21 AM
Stephen hill is a guy that intrigues me, but it's impossible to find any video of him playing. Plus because of the triple-option, his sample size is VERY small. I would say he is more raw than Aldon was last year

But given the success of Calvin Johnson and Demarius Thomas (somewhat) he has to be looked at

chapo123
02-18-2012, 02:57 PM
updated mock:

1. kendall wright / malcom floyd - wr/ all depends on who is there

2. desmond trufant/jayron hosley - cb

3. william valchos - c

4. brandon taylor - fs

5. brett roy - 3/4 de

6. chris rainy - wr/rb/pr/kr

7. tashaun gibson - cb

phlysac
02-18-2012, 08:32 PM
updated mock:

1. kendall wright / malcom floyd - wr/ all depends on who is there

2. desmond trufant/jayron hosley - cb

3. william valchos - c

4. brandon taylor - fs

5. brett roy - 3/4 de

6. chris rainy - wr/rb/pr/kr

7. tashaun gibson - cb

It's Michael Floyd... easy mistake.

I'm confident Harbaalke will add an OLB. I can't imagine them spending big FA money or entering the year with only three (two if Brooks walks) on the roster.

VAfy-ya
02-19-2012, 11:18 AM
I could see us signing a under-the-radar OLB in free agency. Brooks is the best OLB on the market IMO, and he should be a priority but outside of him, I could see us signing a couple of depth guys for OTAs/TC and see if anyone stands out.

But yeah, we're defintely drafting another OLB. The question at this point is where excatly in the draft will it be.

edgrenade
02-19-2012, 04:59 PM
I feel that Brooks is more important to re-sign than Rogers. Keeping this ELITE front seven in place is crucial. Plus, he's still relatively new to the position so he is only going to get better.

But yes, I agree that they will definitely be drafting an OLB at some point.

Borat
02-19-2012, 05:02 PM
I feel that Brooks is more important to re-sign than Rogers. Keeping this ELITE front seven in place is crucial.

Definitely. Watching that front 7 destroy offensive lines and pound QBs was so gratifying after so many years of getting owned in those departments.

YAYareaRB
02-19-2012, 07:10 PM
1. Reuben Randle WR, LSU
2. Chase Minnifield CB, Virginia
3. Amini Silatolu OG, Northwestern St. D2
4. Ronnell Lewis OLB/DE, Oklahoma

not too sure about rounds 5-7.

FA:
1. Re-sign our own. Carlos Rogers, Ahmad Brooks, and Josh Morgan
2. Sign a proven solid productive WR
3. Replace the players that we lose, if any.

phlysac
02-19-2012, 10:35 PM
WR is so deep in this draft that I get the feeling that unless the guy Baalke has targeted is there, another position might be likely.

dan77733
02-19-2012, 10:43 PM
I agree with you guys in regards to Brooks. Re-signing him should be our second priority after Alex. Goldson is third and not much of a concern because he'll be franchised if not re-signed. Keeping Brooks is a must in my opinion and yeah, $8m or so a yeah is probably high for him but its worth it because having him re-signed and continue to start along with Aldon Smith who is expected to start in 2012 would be far better than Haralson and Smith starting. Sending Haralson to the bench actually makes our starting LB core stronger and makes our backup depth at OLB stronger too.

I definitely see us signing/drafting an OLB in the fourth round to be 4th on the depth chart and play special teams. Of course, that changes if we lose Brooks. Hopefully, that wont happen. If it was up to me, Brooks wouldnt even hit the open market. Also see us drafting an ILB if we lose Grant.

As for Grant, while I would love to see him retained and extended, I know thats probably not going to happen. If we can get a second rounder for him, that would be great because with that extra second round draft pick, I send #30 to PIT for WR Mike Wallace and then trade a 2nd and our 3rd to move into the late first round to draft TE Coby Fleener.

Imagine....Wallace, Crabtree, Davis, Fleener, Williams and Walker. Of course, if they were to draft Fleener, I would try to trade Walker because there's two reasons I draft Fleener. One is to add a Jimmy Graham size type TE to the offense, second is because it allows us to let Walker leave in 2013 or trade him this off-season to get something for him.

In 2013, we only have five players who are UFA's. 2014 will be a different story but since we have a one or two year window in which our core remains intact, the team needs to add more offensive weapons for Smith because if we can score an extra TD a game to what we averaged this year, we would be just over 30 ppg and with our defense and running game, it will be extremely tough for any team to beat us.

Back to 2013, the five players are TE Delanie Walker, NT Isaac Sopoaga, NT Ricky Jean-Francois, CB Shawntae Spencer and P Andy Lee. Spencer will be gone before or during FA so he's eliminated. Re-signing Lee is a guarantee and Francois too. Sopoaga depends on his contract demands, how he plays in 2012 and how Francois and Ian Williams do. Walker will be a priority if we dont get a Fleener or Fleener type player in the draft. If we can get Fleener and trade Walker, having only three UFA's in 2013 will be great. And yes, I know that this year's RFA's will be UFA's next year but im not counting them just yet.

And according to ninercaphell.com, the 49ers rolled over their remaining cap room from 2011 which was $16.87m which should give them over $38m in cap room once all our UFA's come off the books. Quite honestly, we have plenty of cap room to re-sign Smith, Brooks, Goldson and our backups/special teamers, draft picks and get a number one WR in FA. We could probably also add veterans DE Adam Carriker and DB Jason Allen for depth too.

Cant wait for Free Agency and the Draft!!! :)

Borat
02-20-2012, 12:45 AM
Good post Dan. Although I just don't see any team giving us a 2nd rounder for Grant. I think you way overrate him.

edgrenade
02-20-2012, 06:33 AM
Good post Dan. Although I just don't see any team giving us a 2nd rounder for Grant. I think you way overrate him.

I could see a team like the cowboys or steelers trading to get him. Any 3-4 team could get good value, in Grant, for a 2nd round pick

dan77733
02-20-2012, 09:39 AM
Good post Dan. Although I just don't see any team giving us a 2nd rounder for Grant. I think you way overrate him.

I could see a team like the cowboys or steelers trading to get him. Any 3-4 team could get good value, in Grant, for a 2nd round pick

I dont think that im overrating Grant because he played for Willis and the front seven didnt miss a beat and I saw those games. Rarely was he ever out of position and did good overall. He's only just turned 27 a few days ago and since he has very little wear and tear on his body, he could easily play another 5 plus years.

A team like the Cowboys could easily give up a 2nd for him. Hell, my friend Joey (Cowboys) wants to sign Brooks, trade/sign Grant, sign Goldson and Rogers. He knows that Brooks would be an upgrade over Spencer and that Grant would be an upgrade over James/Brooking. Rogers would be an upgrade over Newman even though he wouldnt want to overpay him because of his age. Goldson improves his secondary. Granted, they may need time to fit their schemed but I do see a team like DAL going after Grant. And also, no way in hell would I tender Grant at his original draft pick round. That would be stupid.

Menardo75
02-20-2012, 10:31 AM
I really think Adam Carriker would be a solid signing to come in and compete. He has talent and I'm sure Tomsula could get the most out of him.

YAYareaRB
02-20-2012, 10:53 AM
Alot of mocks have us taking Coby Fleener in the 2nd. Making a WR?

VAfy-ya
02-20-2012, 03:04 PM
I really think Adam Carriker would be a solid signing to come in and compete. He has talent and I'm sure Tomsula could get the most out of him.

I agree but we have a solid back-up in RJF, who can play anywhere, along the line, as well as two young guys the staff obviously likes in Dobbs and Tukuafu. Just would not make sense to add a player to a area where we already have sure-fired established studs(J. Smith, Ray Mac), solid depth, and young talent.

VAfy-ya
02-20-2012, 03:11 PM
I still say the likelihood of a team forking over a draft pick to sign Grant is slim to none. Now Im not sure of the ramifications under the new CBA and how a team is compensated but under the old one, RFAs didnt move very often. Its not beneficial for any team to not only take a cap hit signing a RFA, but to also lose a draft pick in the process. I think Grant is safe as a Niner for another year at least.

49ersfan_87
02-20-2012, 03:45 PM
I agree but we have a solid back-up in RJF, who can play anywhere, along the line, as well as two young guys the staff obviously likes in Dobbs and Tukuafu. Just would not make sense to add a player to a area where we already have sure-fired established studs(J. Smith, Ray Mac), solid depth, and young talent.

I'd like to see how Dobbs and Ian Williams in particular develop. They're promising but didn't do much this year. Then again, guys like RJF and even Ray McDonald have taken years to develop but they've proven their worth to this team.

I still say the likelihood of a team forking over a draft pick to sign Grant is slim to none. Now Im not sure of the ramifications under the new CBA and how a team is compensated but under the old one, RFAs didnt move very often. Its not beneficial for any team to not only take a cap hit signing a RFA, but to also lose a draft pick in the process. I think Grant is safe as a Niner for another year at least.

I'd like to put a 4th round tender on him. If a team matches, we get a solid midround pick to use on a position of need. If not, we have solid depth for at least 1 more year. Anything higher and i don't think teams will match...anything lower and its not worth it losing him.

Ness
02-20-2012, 05:03 PM
I really think Adam Carriker would be a solid signing to come in and compete. He has talent and I'm sure Tomsula could get the most out of him.

I'll take my chances with Dobbs and Francois.

dan77733
02-20-2012, 05:23 PM
I still say the likelihood of a team forking over a draft pick to sign Grant is slim to none. Now Im not sure of the ramifications under the new CBA and how a team is compensated but under the old one, RFAs didnt move very often. Its not beneficial for any team to not only take a cap hit signing a RFA, but to also lose a draft pick in the process. I think Grant is safe as a Niner for another year at least.

I'd like to put a 4th round tender on him. If a team matches, we get a solid midround pick to use on a position of need. If not, we have solid depth for at least 1 more year. Anything higher and i don't think teams will match...anything lower and its not worth it losing him.

Why would the team take a cap hit from a non-guaranteed contract with no signing bonus? And how would the team giving up a draft pick also take a cap hit when the player isnt under contract to the team giving up the draft pick?

I dont know what the tenders are but I would put a second rounder on Grant. He's more valuable than a 4th rounder. And I do think a team that runs the 3-4 will be willing to sign him to an offer sheet and for a second rounder, it would be as a starter and Grant would be gone. Rather keep him than get a 4th rounder.

VAfy-ya
02-20-2012, 05:34 PM
Why would the team take a cap hit from a non-guaranteed contract with no signing bonus? And how would the team giving up a draft pick also take a cap hit when the player isnt under contract to the team giving up the draft pick?

I dont know what the tenders are but I would put a second rounder on Grant. He's more valuable than a 4th rounder. And I do think a team that runs the 3-4 will be willing to sign him to an offer sheet and for a second rounder, it would be as a starter and Grant would be gone. Rather keep him than get a 4th rounder.

If you signing any player to a deal, it hits your cap.....thats what I was referring to. So you sign Grant, and have to fork over a draft pick. And if your going to give up a draft pick for a guy, might as well sign him long term, so that means a even bigger hit to your cap. It would make no sense to bring Grant in and them give him a one year deal and lose your pick in the process.

dan77733
02-20-2012, 05:38 PM
If you signing any player to a deal, it hits your cap.....thats what I was referring to. So you sign Grant, and have to fork over a draft pick. And if your going to give up a draft pick for a guy, might as well sign him long term, so that means a even bigger hit to your cap. It would make no sense to bring Grant in and them give him a one year deal and lose your pick in the process.

I never said anything about a one year deal. Its usually a long term deal thats hard for the current team to match.

So, if DAL signs Grant to an offer sheet for four years and the 49ers dont match, the 49ers take a cap hit or the Cowboys?

edgrenade
02-20-2012, 07:03 PM
I still say the likelihood of a team forking over a draft pick to sign Grant is slim to none. Now Im not sure of the ramifications under the new CBA and how a team is compensated but under the old one, RFAs didnt move very often. Its not beneficial for any team to not only take a cap hit signing a RFA, but to also lose a draft pick in the process. I think Grant is safe as a Niner for another year at least.

The new CBA actually makes it easier to sign RFAs because you can't put as high of a price tag (draft picks) on them anymore.

edgrenade
02-20-2012, 07:07 PM
I never said anything about a one year deal. Its usually a long term deal thats hard for the current team to match.

So, if DAL signs Grant to an offer sheet for four years and the 49ers dont match, the 49ers take a cap hit or the Cowboys?

The Niners would not receive a cap hit because he would not be under contract with the team, unless they decided to match the offer and sign him to the same contract.

If the Cowboys DO sign him, the Niners would receive a draft pick according to what level they tendered him.

VAfy-ya
02-20-2012, 07:57 PM
I never said anything about a one year deal. Its usually a long term deal thats hard for the current team to match.

So, if DAL signs Grant to an offer sheet for four years and the 49ers dont match, the 49ers take a cap hit or the Cowboys?

No, no, no.......I was talking about the team that signs him.

49ersfan_87
02-21-2012, 06:10 PM
Barrows on getting Wallace

Wallace was a third-round pick in 2009. This year's draft, meanwhile, is deep
with wide receivers.GM Trent Baalke (http://topics.sacbee.com/GM+Trent+Baalke/) is bursting with
confidence after his 2011 draft, and my guess is that the 49ers would rather
keep all of their picks and select the next Mike Wallace. Going after
Wallace makes more sense for the Patriots or Ravens or even the Bengals because
they'd also be maligning a dangerous conference and/or division opponent. The
49ers don't have that extra incentive.

http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/should-the-49ers-go-after-wr-mike-wallace.html

Any rookie WR's that fit that Mike Wallace mold?

Read more here: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/should-the

-49ers-go-after-wr-mike-wallace.html#storylink=cpy

dan77733
02-21-2012, 06:38 PM
Difference is that no WR at 30 will start and make an impact like Wallace would. Also, if you look at our free agents for 2013 on ninercaphell.com, I would say that we have a two year window before the majority of our core is gone. To me, Wallace is worth the risk. After all, if a player like Colston, Bowe and Vincent Jackson who are at least three or more years older are worth the risk of a long term contact then so is Wallace. And im hoping that we tender Grant at the second round level. A 4th would be so damn crappy because you just know if that happens, he'll be a steal for the team that gets him.

Justone2
02-21-2012, 06:39 PM
Dan is your real name actually Mike Wallace. All your posts are about how good he is and how we need him.

VAfy-ya
02-24-2012, 12:46 PM
Barrows on getting Wallace



http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/should-the-49ers-go-after-wr-mike-wallace.html

Any rookie WR's that fit that Mike Wallace mold?

Read more here: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/should-the

-49ers-go-after-wr-mike-wallace.html#storylink=cpy


Sure are....my personal favorite is Joe Adams. Also like Devon Wylie alot. There are a bunch of guys who can bring that vertical element to our offense. Jarius Wright, Travis Benjamin, Kashif Moore, Chris Rainey, TJ Graham, just to name a few.

Ness
02-24-2012, 03:35 PM
Barrows on getting Wallace



http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/should-the-49ers-go-after-wr-mike-wallace.html

Any rookie WR's that fit that Mike Wallace mold?

Read more here: http://blogs.sacbee.com/49ers/archives/2012/02/should-the

-49ers-go-after-wr-mike-wallace.html#storylink=cpy


This part summed it up for me:

In the end, the 49ers would not only give up the first-round pick but also some of the cap space earmarked for free agents. Wallace is good. But is he better than two players -- say Pierre Garcon and Mohamed Sanu, or perhaps Janoris Jenkins and Vincent Jackson or Rueben Randle and Marques Colston -- the 49ers could add this offseason?

I'd rather have us go after another big name, one who we wouldn't have to give up two draft picks for, and then draft a promising receiver in the early rounds. That would be a more satisfying scenario in my opinion.

Rabscuttle
02-24-2012, 03:56 PM
You don't use free agency in place of the draft if you want long-term success and that is what giving up a late first in addition to paying top dollar for a guy like Wallace represents.

Maybe once in a blue moon a quarterback comes available that may make this a good move. It would be a pretty rare player at any other position that should ever tempt a gm to make this type of move.

A guy like Vincent Jackson could be what is needed to open things up for Vernon over the middle, provide a big redzone target and pull a guy out of the box to let Gore operate. He seems to have put his issues behind him...

Finding a way to get Fleener without taking him at 30 would be a bonus.

Larry
02-24-2012, 07:25 PM
This Wr class is so deep it's ridiculous. Part of me really hopes Baalke trades our 30th pick for more picks in the 2nd and 3rd rounds. That's where the real value is going to be at (Criner, D.Jones, Streeter, Hill, McNutt) in this draft.

dan77733
02-24-2012, 07:30 PM
This part summed it up for me:

In the end, the 49ers would not only give up the first-round pick but also some of the cap space earmarked for free agents. Wallace is good. But is he better than two players -- say Pierre Garcon and Mohamed Sanu, or perhaps Janoris Jenkins and Vincent Jackson or Rueben Randle and Marques Colston -- the 49ers could add this offseason?

I'd rather have us go after another big name, one who we wouldn't have to give up two draft picks for, and then draft a promising receiver in the early rounds. That would be a more satisfying scenario in my opinion.

First, how are we giving up two draft picks for Wallace? As an RFA, only a first round draft pick would be required. Second, none of those rookies are going to have the impact that Wallace would have. And you guys are the ones who always say that it takes three years for a WR to fully develop. Do you really want to wait three years? I dont. Garcon isnt a number one receiver, he's a solid number two receiver. I think that Jackson will be franchised and even if he's not, him and Colston are going to want at least $10m a season and neither one are worth that much because of their age. To me, it makes a lot more sense to pay Wallace instead of those three guys and sorry, another average WR isnt going to do anything to help us. Plus, if HarBaalke were smart, they would let Rogers walk, sign a veteran DB like Jason Allen to replace him and then go after Wallace which at 5 years younger is worth the money over Rogers. Third, you say another big name but yet every top tier FA WR is going demand around the same amount of money and if its within a $2m or so difference, I rather trade for Wallace because you can sign him to a five year deal and he's young enough with more potential and upside than any of those 28+ year old receivers are.

Promising receiver? We have one - Kyle Williams. He's promising and better in the slot. We need a playmaker. And if the Cardinals sign Manning and Wayne, we're going to need a playmaking WR, not some rookie who's not going to help us now.

Menardo75
02-24-2012, 09:01 PM
First, how are we giving up two draft picks for Wallace? As an RFA, only a first round draft pick would be required. Second, none of those rookies are going to have the impact that Wallace would have. And you guys are the ones who always say that it takes three years for a WR to fully develop. Do you really want to wait three years? I dont. Garcon isnt a number one receiver, he's a solid number two receiver. I think that Jackson will be franchised and even if he's not, him and Colston are going to want at least $10m a season and neither one are worth that much because of their age. To me, it makes a lot more sense to pay Wallace instead of those three guys and sorry, another average WR isnt going to do anything to help us. Plus, if HarBaalke were smart, they would let Rogers walk, sign a veteran DB like Jason Allen to replace him and then go after Wallace which at 5 years younger is worth the money over Rogers. Third, you say another big name but yet every top tier FA WR is going demand around the same amount of money and if its within a $2m or so difference, I rather trade for Wallace because you can sign him to a five year deal and he's young enough with more potential and upside than any of those 28+ year old receivers are.

Promising receiver? We have one - Kyle Williams. He's promising and better in the slot. We need a playmaker. And if the Cardinals sign Manning and Wayne, we're going to need a playmaking WR, not some rookie who's not going to help us now.

Jackson is going to be a free agent. If he is franchised it counts 15 mil against the cap there is no way they do that.

Borat
02-24-2012, 09:13 PM
Sure are....my personal favorite is Joe Adams. Also like Devon Wylie alot. There are a bunch of guys who can bring that vertical element to our offense. Jarius Wright, Travis Benjamin, Kashif Moore, Chris Rainey, TJ Graham, just to name a few.

I don't know about the fit for Devon Wiley in SF. I've seen him play more than any other player in this draft. I've come to appreciate what he brings to the table. But he's more of a Julian Edelman type of player. Small but quick. He would be a KR on the 9ers and would probably be a very good one though. But I think he's a little redundant to what we already have in Kyle Williams.

edgrenade
02-25-2012, 01:00 AM
If you take a look at last years draft as a blueprint for this year, you see that Baalke selected guys that were "raw" or were going to take time to develop; such as Aldon, Kaep, and Culliver.

So going by that philosophy, from a WR standpoint, I see him targeting guys like Hill and Streeter.

Another thing is that NO ONE predicted us taking Aldon, so that has me thinking we go elsewhere in the 1st round.

VAfy-ya
02-25-2012, 04:24 AM
If you take a look at last years draft as a blueprint for this year, you see that Baalke selected guys that were "raw" or were going to take time to develop; such as Aldon, Kaep, and Culliver.

So going by that philosophy, from a WR standpoint, I see him targeting guys like Hill and Streeter.

Another thing is that NO ONE predicted us taking Aldon, so that has me thinking we go elsewhere in the 1st round.

Well most had us taking a pass-rusher early in the process. It wasn't neceassrily the fact it was a pass-rusher but who it was, especially with Robert Quinn still on the board. Before Von Miller stock soared after the Combine, most had us taking him. And who knows what would have happen had Peterson had fallen to us. Hindsight is always 20/20 but most really wanted Peterson had he been there.

So I wouldnt be surprise to see a WR@30. What might surprise ppl is just who that WR is. I believe Baalke likes potential in players with certain athletic qualities he covets. Some may see them as a project but Baalke sees something right away that they can bring to the table. Remember that scouts worked out Bruce Miller at his Pro Day. And Cully out came out to team headquarters and did some drill work with Fangio. We're also doing the legwork for Baalke to base these decisions off of, let's not forget that. So I wouldn't say he's more interested in guys like Hill or Streeter. For all we know, he may hate those guys for whatever reason.

Rabscuttle
02-25-2012, 12:21 PM
Didn't think Egnew was going to measure in at 6'5" and a bit. I wouldn't mind him, but his numbers should help keep Fleener available for us. Some of these tight ends are flying today.

*I might have Egnew confused with someone else. A little behind again this year.

Borat
02-25-2012, 02:07 PM
I have a DeCastro boner.

49ersfan_87
02-25-2012, 02:19 PM
You don't use free agency in place of the draft if you want long-term success and that is what giving up a late first in addition to paying top dollar for a guy like Wallace represents.

Maybe once in a blue moon a quarterback comes available that may make this a good move. It would be a pretty rare player at any other position that should ever tempt a gm to make this type of move.

A guy like Vincent Jackson could be what is needed to open things up for Vernon over the middle, provide a big redzone target and pull a guy out of the box to let Gore operate. He seems to have put his issues behind him...

Finding a way to get Fleener without taking him at 30 would be a bonus.

The only FA i want to break the bank for is Mario Williams. How often do guys like him come around? But that would mean we definitely didn't re-sign Brooks and probably didn't re-sign Rogers either. Other than that i hope we keep the same philosophy as last year, except maybe have a few more multi-year deals instead of 1 year deals.

dan77733
02-25-2012, 02:51 PM
I have a DeCastro boner.

Hmmmm, too much info there Borat. LOL.

The only FA i want to break the bank for is Mario Williams. How often do guys like him come around? But that would mean we definitely didn't re-sign Brooks and probably didn't re-sign Rogers either. Other than that i hope we keep the same philosophy as last year, except maybe have a few more multi-year deals instead of 1 year deals.

I still think that Williams will be signing with a 4-3 base defense team. Falcons anyone? Just a guess.

CJSchneider
02-25-2012, 05:05 PM
As I am acting as the GM of the 49ers in the forum mock, I would invite any 49er fans to look into what I have done through free-agency and the draft thus far to tell me what you think.

Borat
02-25-2012, 05:09 PM
Post your offseason here CJ.

dan77733
02-25-2012, 05:23 PM
I agree with Borat. I just checked that topic. Its over 90 pages. No one is going to go through all that.

Menardo75
02-25-2012, 06:32 PM
Well most had us taking a pass-rusher early in the process. It wasn't neceassrily the fact it was a pass-rusher but who it was, especially with Robert Quinn still on the board. Before Von Miller stock soared after the Combine, most had us taking him. And who knows what would have happen had Peterson had fallen to us. Hindsight is always 20/20 but most really wanted Peterson had he been there.

So I wouldnt be surprise to see a WR@30. What might surprise ppl is just who that WR is. I believe Baalke likes potential in players with certain athletic qualities he covets. Some may see them as a project but Baalke sees something right away that they can bring to the table. Remember that scouts worked out Bruce Miller at his Pro Day. And Cully out came out to team headquarters and did some drill work with Fangio. We're also doing the legwork for Baalke to base these decisions off of, let's not forget that. So I wouldn't say he's more interested in guys like Hill or Streeter. For all we know, he may hate those guys for whatever reason.

I totally agree with you I keep thinking either Tommy Streeter, or Stephen Hill are wearing Niner uniforms next year.

Ness
02-25-2012, 09:36 PM
First, how are we giving up two draft picks for Wallace? As an RFA, only a first round draft pick would be required. Second, none of those rookies are going to have the impact that Wallace would have. And you guys are the ones who always say that it takes three years for a WR to fully develop. Do you really want to wait three years? I dont. Garcon isnt a number one receiver, he's a solid number two receiver. I think that Jackson will be franchised and even if he's not, him and Colston are going to want at least $10m a season and neither one are worth that much because of their age. To me, it makes a lot more sense to pay Wallace instead of those three guys and sorry, another average WR isnt going to do anything to help us. Plus, if HarBaalke were smart, they would let Rogers walk, sign a veteran DB like Jason Allen to replace him and then go after Wallace which at 5 years younger is worth the money over Rogers. Third, you say another big name but yet every top tier FA WR is going demand around the same amount of money and if its within a $2m or so difference, I rather trade for Wallace because you can sign him to a five year deal and he's young enough with more potential and upside than any of those 28+ year old receivers are.

Promising receiver? We have one - Kyle Williams. He's promising and better in the slot. We need a playmaker. And if the Cardinals sign Manning and Wayne, we're going to need a playmaking WR, not some rookie who's not going to help us now.


No. I'd rather have a guy like Garcon (who can be a number on receiver, look what he did with what he had this past season), Colston, Vincent Jackson, or even Stevie Johnson if I get to keep that first round draft selection. Not only are you giving that pick up, but you are also paying big money to get Wallace, because you'd have to extend his contract. Even if you have to pay a big contract to another one of the free agent receivers, at least you get your number one draft selection you can use on a promising young receiver or another position of need if you want....and then you aren't picking until almost the third round instead without it.

As for receivers taking at least three seasons to develop, I'd say that is up in the air. Regardless, that doesn't mean they can't be a big impact for you as rookies. Look at AJ Green and Julio Jones this past season.

dan77733
02-25-2012, 09:50 PM
No. I'd rather have a guy like Garcon (who can be a number on receiver, look what he did with what he had this past season), Colston, Vincent Jackson, or even Stevie Johnson if I get to keep that first round draft selection. Not only are you giving that pick up, but you are also paying big money to get Wallace, because you'd have to extend his contract. Even if you have to pay a big contract to another one of the free agent receivers, at least you get your number one draft selection you can use on a promising young receiver or another position of need if you want....and then you aren't picking until almost the third round instead without it.

As for receivers taking at least three seasons to develop, I'd say that is up in the air. Regardless, that doesn't mean they can't be a big impact for you as rookies. Look at AJ Green and Julio Jones this past season.

I understand what you're saying and hey, if we can get a number one WR and still have our draft pick, great but I dont see that happening because the majority of the potential FA WR's will either be franchised, re-signed or asking for more money than Baalke will be willing to pay them. With that said, I do see Garcon as a better chance of being a 49er than Bowe, Colston or either Jackson.

Look at where Green and Jones were drafted. Do you really think that we would get a starting caliber from day one WR at 30? I dont.

Borat
02-25-2012, 10:22 PM
I agree with Borat. I just checked that topic. Its over 90 pages. No one is going to go through all that.

Guess he wasn't too interested in our feedback lol.

phlysac
02-25-2012, 11:01 PM
He traded our #1 pick and Larry Grant to the Eagles for DeSean Jackson and the Eagles 4th rounder.

He then made these selections...

62. San Francisco 49ers - CB Alfonzo Dennard, Nebraska
94. San Francisco 49ers - OG Ryan Miller, Colorado
117. San Francisco 49ers (from PHI) - S Winston Guy Jr, Kentucky
128. San Francisco 49ers - OLB Nigel Bradham, Florida State

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:22 AM
He traded our #1 pick and Larry Grant to the Eagles for DeSean Jackson and the Eagles 4th rounder.

He then made these selections...

62. San Francisco 49ers - CB Alfonzo Dennard, Nebraska
94. San Francisco 49ers - OG Ryan Miller, Colorado
117. San Francisco 49ers (from PHI) - S Winston Guy Jr, Kentucky
128. San Francisco 49ers - OLB Nigel Bradham, Florida State

No comment on the draft picks since I honestly dont know anything about them but the positions that were drafted are pretty good.

Hmmmmm, now, onto that trade. No ******* way is Grant only worth a 4th round draft pick. No way. I wont be surprised if the Jets go after him if they release Bart Scott. And yeah, I still think that Grant should be tendered at the 2nd round level. As for trading #30 for Jackson, I would rather have Wallace. I would only go after Jackson if he isnt franchised. But whatever.

Ness
02-26-2012, 12:32 AM
I understand what you're saying and hey, if we can get a number one WR and still have our draft pick, great but I dont see that happening because the majority of the potential FA WR's will either be franchised, re-signed or asking for more money than Baalke will be willing to pay them. With that said, I do see Garcon as a better chance of being a 49er than Bowe, Colston or either Jackson.

Look at where Green and Jones were drafted. Do you really think that we would get a starting caliber from day one WR at 30? I dont.

And look at where Crabtree was drafted. Look where Hakeem Nicks was drafted in that same year. As long as you do your scouting homework you can walk away with a good receiver in the 1st round.

If any of the big name receivers are going to be asking for a huge amount of money, you'd get the same thing from Wallace if you match the offer the Steelers offer him and you'd have to shell out more money to sign him to a long term deal. Oh and there goes your draft pick. If the 49ers have to pay big money to someone, I'd rather it be another FA receiver you don't have to give a 1st round pick for. Even if a receiver is in his late twenties, that doesn't mean he can't have 5+ years of solid production.

dan77733
02-26-2012, 01:25 AM
The difference is that with Wallace, you can make him an offer and if he's not interested in signing the offer sheet, you just move on. Basically, the team is in more control.

Ness
02-26-2012, 02:54 AM
The difference is that with Wallace, you can make him an offer and if he's not interested in signing the offer sheet, you just move on. Basically, the team is in more control.

How is that any different in the 49ers offering a free agent a deal and them saying no?

How are the 49ers not in control in whatever player they decide to sign or not to sign this offseason?

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 07:37 AM
The only FA i want to break the bank for is Mario Williams. How often do guys like him come around? But that would mean we definitely didn't re-sign Brooks and probably didn't re-sign Rogers either. Other than that i hope we keep the same philosophy as last year, except maybe have a few more multi-year deals instead of 1 year deals.


You know, I was actually comptemplating that same move. Do we make a run at Mario Williams? I mean think about the ramifications his signing would have. You bring in a athletic freak, pass rushing monster like him into this defense and its almost unfair. With the way our LBs cover ground, our front seven would have a field day. No more double teams for Cowboy and Ray Mac, now you have two monsters on the outside to worry about. I know it goes against conventional wisdom but how often to you get grab a All-Pro cailber freak of nature prospect in the prime of his career? And Im not even suggesting we should do it. But man, if we did do it, I think we would have a chance to be one of the greatest defenses of all time. And according to Mario, he's not looking for a big payday. He said he's already made loads of money, being a #1 overall pick. Now he looking for the best fit and a place for him to win. And he will defintely hit the market. Texans are only 3 mil under the cap and the franchise tag for Mario would be 23 million for this year....OUCH! Very tempting sceniro if Im Baalke. Means you wave bye bye to Brooks, and Rogers, and thats the delemia.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 09:52 AM
You know, I was actually comptemplating that same move. Do we make a run at Mario Williams? I mean think about the ramifications his signing would have. You bring in a athletic freak, pass rushing monster like him into this defense and its almost unfair. With the way our LBs cover ground, our front seven would have a field day. No more double teams for Cowboy and Ray Mac, now you have two monsters on the outside to worry about. I know it goes against conventional wisdom but how often to you get grab a All-Pro cailber freak of nature prospect in the prime of his career? And Im not even suggesting we should do it. But man, if we did do it, I think we would have a chance to be one of the greatest defenses of all time. And according to Mario, he's not looking for a big payday. He said he's already made loads of money, being a #1 overall pick. Now he looking for the best fit and a place for him to win. And he will defintely hit the market. Texans are only 3 mil under the cap and the franchise tag for Mario would be 23 million for this year....OUCH! Very tempting sceniro if Im Baalke. Means you wave bye bye to Brooks, and Rogers, and thats the delemia.

Same thought crossed my mind. It would remind me of when the Packers signed Reggie White to put them over the top. It would be nuts to run a 4 man line of Super Mario, McDonald, Cowboy, and Aldon Smith out on 3rd down. I thought I heard Matt Barrows say on the radio that the 49ers felt that Rogers good season was due more to the pass rush than his pass rush. I would go with Culliver as a starter and give up Brooks and Rogers to get Mario Williams.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 09:53 AM
Holy smokes, what a 40 time posted by Stephen Hill:
http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/niners-talk/post/Georgia-Tech-WR-Hill-provides-peak-perfo?blockID=658380&feedID=5884
Pretty soon he is going to have his own Transformers nickname.

chapo123
02-26-2012, 10:49 AM
updated mock:

1. kendall wright - wr
2. casey hayward - cb
3. bruce irvin - olb
4. brandon taylor - s
5. derek moye - wr
6. ben bojicic - c
7. ryan nassib - qb

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 11:03 AM
updated mock:

1. kendall wright - wr
2. casey hayward - cb
3. bruce irvin - olb
4. brandon taylor - s
5. derek moye - wr
6. ben bojicic - c
7. ryan nassib - qb

Only way SF lands Wright is if they trade up into the top 15.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 11:08 AM
Holy smokes, what a 40 time posted by Stephen Hill:
http://www.csnbayarea.com/blog/niners-talk/post/Georgia-Tech-WR-Hill-provides-peak-perfo?blockID=658380&feedID=5884
Pretty soon he is going to have his own Transformers nickname.

Stephen Hill just made the Combine his personal *****. I knew he would time better than I expected but he just went super siyan on his 40. And he looked so smooth in the guadlet. Im saying it now, Hill@30. I understand its just the Combine but Baalke loves guys with physical tools that the coaching staff can mold. Hill is a guy I've always liked but now he brings elite physical tools to the equation that were a big question before. I still like guys like Streeter, Adams, and a host of others later on. But I would not be shocked at all to see Baalke run to the podium himself to select Stephen Hill.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 11:16 AM
Rueben Randle's 40 times: 4.50, 4.56 seconds

I was expecting him to crack the low 4.4's but still solid times for a guy his size.

Mohamed Sanu's 40 times: 4.65, 4.65 seconds

Both WR's interviewed with the 49ers according to Matt Maiocco.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 11:26 AM
And Streeter witha 4.34.....damn, all me sleepers are showing out. Wylie with a 4.37. Just waiting on the agility drills for some of these. And I knew Sanu wasnt that explosive. I just never saw that when I watched him and now those 40 times tie it all together. And Floyd running faster than Wright? Been a interesting day so far.....

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 11:48 AM
RG3 said he interviewed with the 49ers......I can dream can't I?

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 11:55 AM
RG3 said he interviewed with the 49ers......I can dream can't I?

Honestly, team interviews means very little, IMO. Its all smoke and mirrors. But yes, feel free to dream. I'd love to have him. If I could Photoshop, I would for you, lol. But Im too busy dreaming of Hill and Wylie in Niner unis......and Streeter......and Doug Martin.....and Egnew.

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:01 PM
How is that any different in the 49ers offering a free agent a deal and them saying no?

How are the 49ers not in control in whatever player they decide to sign or not to sign this offseason?

Because with UFA's, they may go back and forth in offers where as with an RFA, the RFA has no leverage. He either accepts the offer sheet or he doesnt.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 12:04 PM
Honestly, team interviews means very little, IMO. Its all smoke and mirrors. But yes, feel free to dream. I'd love to have him. If I could Photoshop, I would for you, lol. But Im too busy dreaming of Hill and Wylie in Niner unis......and Streeter......and Doug Martin.....and Egnew.

Yeah was kidding around. Rams would trade rape SF for that pick. We would probably have to give up future Super Bowl revenue shares just to get in talks with them haha.
RT @mercbrownie: In NFLN interview, RG3 said he had fun meeting w/ Harbaugh, sensed #49ers were looking for info on Baylor WR Kendall Wright

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:05 PM
You know, I was actually comptemplating that same move. Do we make a run at Mario Williams? I mean think about the ramifications his signing would have. You bring in a athletic freak, pass rushing monster like him into this defense and its almost unfair. With the way our LBs cover ground, our front seven would have a field day. No more double teams for Cowboy and Ray Mac, now you have two monsters on the outside to worry about. I know it goes against conventional wisdom but how often to you get grab a All-Pro cailber freak of nature prospect in the prime of his career? And Im not even suggesting we should do it. But man, if we did do it, I think we would have a chance to be one of the greatest defenses of all time. And according to Mario, he's not looking for a big payday. He said he's already made loads of money, being a #1 overall pick. Now he looking for the best fit and a place for him to win. And he will defintely hit the market. Texans are only 3 mil under the cap and the franchise tag for Mario would be 23 million for this year....OUCH! Very tempting sceniro if Im Baalke. Means you wave bye bye to Brooks, and Rogers, and thats the delemia.

Same thought crossed my mind. It would remind me of when the Packers signed Reggie White to put them over the top. It would be nuts to run a 4 man line of Super Mario, McDonald, Cowboy, and Aldon Smith out on 3rd down. I thought I heard Matt Barrows say on the radio that the 49ers felt that Rogers good season was due more to the pass rush than his pass rush. I would go with Culliver as a starter and give up Brooks and Rogers to get Mario Williams.

Soooo...giving up a MONSTER contract to Williams who quite honestly is better suited as a DE in the 4-3 is okay but giving up a good contract and a first rounder is TOO MUCH???

Honestly, no thanks to Williams. We dont need him. What the 49ers need is to re-sign Brooks, let Rogers walk and get a ******* speed playmaking receiver on the outside. We already have the best defense but guess what, we need more offensive firepower to score more points. Pass on Williams.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 12:08 PM
Soooo...giving up a MONSTER contract to Williams who quite honestly is better suited as a DE in the 4-3 is okay but giving up a good contract and a first rounder is TOO MUCH???

Honestly, no thanks to Williams. We dont need him. What the 49ers need is to re-sign Brooks, let Rogers walk and get a ******* speed playmaking receiver on the outside. We already have the best defense but guess what, we need more offensive firepower to score more points. Pass on Williams.

Dan we are giving a monster contract to a top 5 pass rusher. A lot more valuable of position compared to WR. Mario did a very good job transitioning to OLB last season. He had 5 sacks in 5 games before his season ending injury. Plus with how much the 49ers run 4 lineman sets it wouldn't be much of a problem since he would line up at end like Aldon, which seemed to work out well for him.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 12:11 PM
Wylie is making himself some money today. Looked very fluid in the deep ball drill tracking the ball and keeping stride. Really liking Kashif Moore. Marvin Jones only being 6'1 was kind of a bummer, but still a solid guy. Sanu is having a awful Combine though....

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 12:15 PM
Wylie is making himself some money today. Looked very fluid in the deep ball drill tracking the ball and keeping stride. Really liking Kashif Moore. Marvin Jones only being 6'1 was kind of a bummer, but still a solid guy. Sanu is having a awful Combine though....

I don't think Sanu is having an awful combine. We knew coming in he would post a high 40 time. He had good measurables but he just isn't a good fit in this offense that is missing a vertical threat. Ravens could use a player like Sanu.

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:22 PM
Dan we are giving a monster contract to a top 5 pass rusher. A lot more valuable of position compared to WR. Mario did a very good job transitioning to OLB last season. He had 5 sacks in 5 games before his season ending injury. Plus with how much the 49ers run 4 lineman sets it wouldn't be much of a problem since he would line up at end like Aldon, which seemed to work out well for him.

The Texans defense played and did BETTER without him plus who knows how he's going to come back from the pectoral muscle injury. I'm sorry and hell yeah, I would love Williams, Nicks and others all gift wrapped for us fans but thats not going to happen.

More valuable than WR? Hmmm, were we both watching the same Giants playoff game? Were we watching the same offense all season? Because I dont see how Williams or any defensive player is going to help us score points on offense. With that money, we could re-sign Brooks, get a playmaking WR and still add a quality DB like Jason Allen.

Williams is a top five pass rusher but I dont see how that solves our greatest need. What happens if next season, our defense does better but our offense does the same or worse? Sorry, the 49ers number one priority after re-signing their top free agents should be to acquire a top tier young franchise WR. Any other position as their number one need makes no sense to me whatsoever.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 12:28 PM
Dan we are giving a monster contract to a top 5 pass rusher. A lot more valuable of position compared to WR. Mario did a very good job transitioning to OLB last season. He had 5 sacks in 5 games before his season ending injury. Plus with how much the 49ers run 4 lineman sets it wouldn't be much of a problem since he would line up at end like Aldon, which seemed to work out well for him.

He's easily in the top 5 at his position. And physical nigtmare to deal with. Physiaclly, one of the most impressive players the league has ever seen.You add him to this front seven, its almost too scary to imagine. Comparing him to a one trick pony WR is comparing apples to oranges. If Im going to go out and splurge in free agency, its going to be on a difference maker and player who is a physicsl mis-match everytime he steps on the field. Williams is a terror against the run, a living nightmare as a pass-rusher, and his presence frees up everbody else along the line. We wouldnt even need the secondary to be as stout, as any QB trying to pass on us 40 times a game would get killed. Like I said, Im not even suggesting we do it, but going after Williams makes alot sense on alot of levels if we did go that route.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 12:35 PM
The Texans defense played and did BETTER without him plus who knows how he's going to come back from the pectoral muscle injury. I'm sorry and hell yeah, I would love Williams, Nicks and others all gift wrapped for us fans but thats not going to happen.

More valuable than WR? Hmmm, were we both watching the same Giants playoff game? Were we watching the same offense all season? Because I dont see how Williams or any defensive player is going to help us score points on offense. With that money, we could re-sign Brooks, get a playmaking WR and still add a quality DB like Jason Allen.

Williams is a top five pass rusher but I dont see how that solves our greatest need. What happens if next season, our defense does better but our offense does the same or worse? Sorry, the 49ers number one priority after re-signing their top free agents should be to acquire a top tier young franchise WR. Any other position as their number one need makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Yes with Brooks as a FA OLB would be considered a high need for this team. I have no problem investing money into bolstering the pass rush. Plus the team seems to feel comfortable with Culliver as a starter so we would be looking at lower tier FA CB to fill the nickel/dime packages.

49ers would still have all their draft picks intacted to fill the need at WR and CB. Signing Mario Williams would not deter the 49ers from being able to get a WR in the draft and I am really liking the WRs at pick 30.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 12:36 PM
I don't think Sanu is having an awful combine. We knew coming in he would post a high 40 time. He had good measurables but he just isn't a good fit in this offense that is missing a vertical threat. Ravens could use a player like Sanu.

Ok maybe awful is too strong a word but I dont think anyone was thinking he would run 4.65 twice. And he hasnt look very impressive outside the 40 either.

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:37 PM
He's easily in the top 5 at his position. And physical nigtmare to deal with. Physiaclly, one of the most impressive players the league has ever seen.You add him to this front seven, its almost too scary to imagine. Comparing him to a one trick pony WR is comparing apples to oranges. If Im going to go out and splurge in free agency, its going to be on a difference maker and player who is a physicsl mis-match everytime he steps on the field. Williams is a terror against the run, a living nightmare as a pass-rusher, and his presence frees up everbody else along the line. We wouldnt even need the secondary to be as stout, as any QB trying to pass on us 40 times a game would get killed. Like I said, Im not even suggesting we do it, but going after Williams makes alot sense on alot of levels if we did go that route.

To me....spending money on Williams would be a waste. You already have the best rushing defense and a top three defense without Williams. Seriously, how much better can you get than that? Adding Williams does nothing for our offense and greatest need so if we end up in the same situation again next year, will it really be worth it? I dont. Team needs to go after what they need the most and thats a playmaking WR unless of course, you just prefer FG's on every possession inside the 20 or even outside the 20.

A top tier playmaking receiver, re-signing Brooks and signing a DB like Jason Allen > Mario Williams.

Borat
02-26-2012, 12:41 PM
I'm drooling over the Mario Williams talk. A LB group of Mario, Aldon, Willis and Bowman could be one of the greatest of all time.

I'm bummed Streeter ran so well. I think he's borderline first round now. Was hoping he would go late second at best. Not anymore.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 12:43 PM
You can never have enough pass rushers especially when your depth at the postion is literally just Haralson.

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:43 PM
Yes with Brooks as a FA OLB would be considered a high need for this team. I have no problem investing money into bolstering the pass rush. Plus the team seems to feel comfortable with Culliver as a starter so we would be looking at lower tier FA CB to fill the nickel/dime packages.

49ers would still have all their draft picks intacted to fill the need at WR and CB. Signing Mario Williams would not deter the 49ers from being able to get a WR in the draft and I am really liking the WRs at pick 30.

The difference is that the team doesnt NEED to invest in OLB when they could re-sign Brooks, keep the front seven intact and spend less money doing so. I'm fine with letting Rogers leave and have Brown/Culliver start, in fact thats what im hoping for.

Even if Brooks leaves, OLB still isnt a huge need because their plans are to start Smith opposite Haralson if Brooks leaves. We have no offensive playmakers except for Davis yet we have a bunch on defense so how is OLB (with or without Brooks) a greater need?

And everyone keeps saying that a rookie WR can come in and dominate. Sorry, I dont see that happening. People talk about Nicks, Julio Jones but forget who their QB is and who else is on their offense.

Smith needs a playmaking WR on the outside with speed which would also allow Harbaugh to be more aggressive instead of this pansy play-calling crap. But whatever, everyone has their own opinions. I just dont see how adding a Mario Williams helps the area that we need the most help - WR/offense.

dan77733
02-26-2012, 12:46 PM
Pass rushers are great but when you look at the Giants, Packers and other teams over the last decade, it was more about offense and having receivers that the QB can get the ball too instead of pass rushers.

And yeah, Giants pass rush is awesome but if you switch their receivers with ours, they lose and we win so thus, its not all about pass rushers because no matter how great your defense is, unless they're scoring TD's on int/fumble returns every possession, its all about scoring points in an offensive league. You would think that the playoff games would show that but I guess not.

49ersfan_87
02-26-2012, 12:55 PM
You know, I was actually comptemplating that same move. Do we make a run at Mario Williams? I mean think about the ramifications his signing would have. You bring in a athletic freak, pass rushing monster like him into this defense and its almost unfair. With the way our LBs cover ground, our front seven would have a field day. No more double teams for Cowboy and Ray Mac, now you have two monsters on the outside to worry about. I know it goes against conventional wisdom but how often to you get grab a All-Pro cailber freak of nature prospect in the prime of his career? And Im not even suggesting we should do it. But man, if we did do it, I think we would have a chance to be one of the greatest defenses of all time. And according to Mario, he's not looking for a big payday. He said he's already made loads of money, being a #1 overall pick. Now he looking for the best fit and a place for him to win. And he will defintely hit the market. Texans are only 3 mil under the cap and the franchise tag for Mario would be 23 million for this year....OUCH! Very tempting sceniro if Im Baalke. Means you wave bye bye to Brooks, and Rogers, and thats the delemia.

Same thought crossed my mind. It would remind me of when the Packers signed Reggie White to put them over the top. It would be nuts to run a 4 man line of Super Mario, McDonald, Cowboy, and Aldon Smith out on 3rd down. I thought I heard Matt Barrows say on the radio that the 49ers felt that Rogers good season was due more to the pass rush than his pass rush. I would go with Culliver as a starter and give up Brooks and Rogers to get Mario Williams.

That would be great if we could get Williams at a contender discount. And i think Brooks is asking for $8 million a year anyway. If we could get Williams for say, 10-11 instead of Brooks for 8 i would do that deal for Williams in a heartbeat. Only issue with Williams is he's missed some time to injury lately. But our strength and conditioning staff have been top notch and outside of Gore, we haven't had many injury prone players lately.

That's also an interesting tidbit about Rogers, from Barrows. If Barrows indeed said that the 49ers believe Rogers season was a result of the pass rush, then i can't see them spending big on a CB. Donatell is one of the best in the biz so while i want Rogers back, i'm confident we can let him go and sign a 2nd tier CB and coach him up. Brown was never a starter and Culliver was a raw rookie and Donatell coached them both up. Some interesting 2nd tier corners if we're not spending big money on Rogers or other FA's are Terrell Thomas, Eric Wright, or Tracy Porter. I could see us signing one of those CB's on a Donte Whitner type teal (3 years, 10/11 million)

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 01:18 PM
Pass rushers are great but when you look at the Giants, Packers and other teams over the last decade, it was more about offense and having receivers that the QB can get the ball too instead of pass rushers.

And yeah, Giants pass rush is awesome but if you switch their receivers with ours, they lose and we win so thus, its not all about pass rushers because no matter how great your defense is, unless they're scoring TD's on int/fumble returns every possession, its all about scoring points in an offensive league. You would think that the playoff games would show that but I guess not.


I wouldn't say it was more about offense than defense for the Giants. The Giants beat an offense in the '08 Super Bowl that had statstically one of the greatest seasons of all-time mainly due to how dominant their front 4 was.

Dan how much money did Green Bay and New York invest into their WR position the past few years?

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 01:24 PM
The difference is that the team doesnt NEED to invest in OLB when they could re-sign Brooks, keep the front seven intact and spend less money doing so. I'm fine with letting Rogers leave and have Brown/Culliver start, in fact thats what im hoping for.

Even if Brooks leaves, OLB still isnt a huge need because their plans are to start Smith opposite Haralson if Brooks leaves. We have no offensive playmakers except for Davis yet we have a bunch on defense so how is OLB (with or without Brooks) a greater need?

And everyone keeps saying that a rookie WR can come in and dominate. Sorry, I dont see that happening. People talk about Nicks, Julio Jones but forget who their QB is and who else is on their offense.

Smith needs a playmaking WR on the outside with speed which would also allow Harbaugh to be more aggressive instead of this pansy play-calling crap. But whatever, everyone has their own opinions. I just dont see how adding a Mario Williams helps the area that we need the most help - WR/offense.

And you fail to understand our coach and our offensive philosphy. Jimbaugh had the best QB in college football.....and he threw the ball less than most other offenses and relied on a steady ground game and good defense to win. That is Harbaugh. Doesn't matter who the QB is, doesnt matter who the WRs are. If you think that us signing Wallace means that all of a sudden we're passing the ball 40-50 times a game, you are going to be disappointed. Harbaugh will always be a ball-control coach. No personel moves will change who is. You think by bringing in a WR who's only real asset is catching deep balls and pluging him into a offense that will only look his way a few times a game is smart? And that's not even taking into account his QB. Let me ask you this, what is one of the biggest weakness of Alex, as a QB? His deep ball. So your pairing a WR who's strength doesn't necessarily mesh with our QB. Thats why guys would rather have dudes like V. Jackson. Because he has a much bigger catch radius and he has the physical ability to make unbelievable catches and help out a QB who has accuracy issues. I've seen him bail out Phillip Rivers lame duck passes too many times to count. But I actually would pass on V. Jackson. But guys like him are why alot of us here are clamoring for guys like Streeter and Hill....because they posess those same traits. That's why I dont want Wallace. I dont feel he'll mesh with this offense. He needs to be on a team that has a more vertical passing attack....like Arians ran. I dont feel this WCO is the best fit for him. If he were a more complete WR, maybe I could see him adjusting to this offense, but I dont see him dramatically changing this offense. The only player that controls how this offense evloves is the QB, not a WR. If Alex makes the necessary improvement going in to next season, we'll be fine as long as we add someone on the outside with speed. Doesn't have to necessarily be Wallace.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 01:32 PM
That would be great if we could get Williams at a contender discount. And i think Brooks is asking for $8 million a year anyway. If we could get Williams for say, 10-11 instead of Brooks for 8 i would do that deal for Williams in a heartbeat. Only issue with Williams is he's missed some time to injury lately. But our strength and conditioning staff have been top notch and outside of Gore, we haven't had many injury prone players lately.

That's also an interesting tidbit about Rogers, from Barrows. If Barrows indeed said that the 49ers believe Rogers season was a result of the pass rush, then i can't see them spending big on a CB. Donatell is one of the best in the biz so while i want Rogers back, i'm confident we can let him go and sign a 2nd tier CB and coach him up. Brown was never a starter and Culliver was a raw rookie and Donatell coached them both up. Some interesting 2nd tier corners if we're not spending big money on Rogers or other FA's are Terrell Thomas, Eric Wright, or Tracy Porter. I could see us signing one of those CB's on a Donte Whitner type teal (3 years, 10/11 million)

If Brooks is really looking for 8 millon a year, I dont think he'll be back. He's going to have to come off that number. I love the guy but for a guy who has never posted double digit sacks, that's a little steep. I personally feel it would probably take around 12 mil a year to get Williams. Maybe if he met with the staff and really liked Jimbaugh, maybe we can bring that down to 11. But 12 is number I think he and his agent could live with. The question is would Baalke feel he would be worth it at that price?

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 01:32 PM
I actually don't think Alex's deep ball is the biggest weakness to his game. He dropped some dimes at the end of the year to Vernon (Saints/Giants game) and Crabtree (big time throw vs Seahawks). He just needs to have a comfort level with his targets or be trailing late in the game to make those type of throws. He is far to concerned of turning over the ball which is why, IMO, we get a lot of over throws from him.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 01:36 PM
I actually don't think Alex's deep ball is the biggest weakness to his game. He dropped some dimes at the end of the year to Vernon (Saints/Giants game) and Crabtree (big time throw vs Seahawks). He just needs to have a comfort level with his targets or be trailing late in the game to make those type of throws. He is far to concerned of turning over the ball which is why, IMO, we get a lot of over throws from him.

Most of those throws to VD weren't really deep balls. Most were sideline patterns where he just threw the ball up and let VD's speed run under it. When I say deep ball, I mean passes where he has to have velocity to drive it, as well as a good arch and touch to drop it over the defender. Those throws he struggles mightily to complete.

edgrenade
02-26-2012, 01:41 PM
I don't want to sound like a square, but can we keep the FA talk out of the draft thread?

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 01:47 PM
Hill, 40" vert and 11'1" in the broad....talk about explosive athlete. I dont care how raw he is, you can't teach those numbers. Its hard not to drool over this guy, really.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 01:54 PM
Hill, 40" vert and 11'1" in the broad....talk about explosive athlete. I dont care how raw he is, you can't teach those numbers. Its hard not to drool over this guy, really.

I'm jumping on the Hill bandwagon as well. A lot of untapped potential there. Also good pedigree of WR's from Georgia Tech the past couple of years with Megatron and Thomas.

Kendall Wright posted a 4.61 "official" 40 time? Chapo's mock may not be that far off, lol.

Brent
02-26-2012, 02:00 PM
Who gives a **** about a 40 time? Look at game speed.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 02:02 PM
And Doug Martin with the 4.47 40 and 28 reps on the bench....MAKE IT HAPPEN BAALKE!

And really thought Rainey would be faster...

As far as Wright, he just didnt look good out of his stance on his runs. Him and Joe Adams are guys I believe are absolutelty faster than their times today. Kinda like the year Hester ran a 4.5. Most knew he was much faster than that. I dont think it will change Wright's stock all that much....but maybe Floyd has jumped ahead of him for some. The top 2-3 guys have all been interchangable for me really.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 02:07 PM
Who gives a **** about a 40 time? Look at game speed.

Hey it's Feburary and free agency is more than two weeks away. We need something to over evaluate. Let me be Skip Bayless.

I do find the 40 times/measurables interesting for guys like Randle and Hill who were stuck in offenses that didn't utilize their skill sets enough. But it isn't the end all be all for my opinion on a player.

phlysac
02-26-2012, 02:28 PM
Yeah it's interesting to see names that have hardly ever been mentioned now being labeled as players people "love" and "need" on the team. Relax. It's the combine.

As for Doug Martin. He would be a great option to be in the rotation but does anyone think it's a smart investment to use pick #30 on RB3?

Surely Martin won't be available at #60.

Brent
02-26-2012, 02:43 PM
Surely Martin won't be available at #60.
RBs always go much later than they're valued.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 03:00 PM
Yeah it's interesting to see names that have hardly ever been mentioned now being labeled as players people "love" and "need" on the team. Relax. It's the combine.

As for Doug Martin. He would be a great option to be in the rotation but does anyone think it's a smart investment to use pick #30 on RB3?

Surely Martin won't be available at #60.

I never said pick 30, but I would love Martin in the second or beyond. The draft never goes according to plan. Guys fall through the cracks every year. And I mentioned Stephen Hill a few weeks ago in this very thread so yes, I knew who he was and just how much ppl were sleeping on his physical ability. I think you need to take your own advice and relax. I look foward to the Combine to answer alot of questions about guys physical ability in some instances. No reason not to get excited to see a guy you think has potential to be a good player, surprise you by just how impressive their physical tools are. I love alot players after every Combine. But I know we cant draft them all...

Menardo75
02-26-2012, 03:33 PM
Yeah it's interesting to see names that have hardly ever been mentioned now being labeled as players people "love" and "need" on the team. Relax. It's the combine.

As for Doug Martin. He would be a great option to be in the rotation but does anyone think it's a smart investment to use pick #30 on RB3?

Surely Martin won't be available at #60.

He probably will be and don't call me Surley.

Larry
02-26-2012, 03:50 PM
Never was impressed with Sanu, not surprised about his 40 time.

Ness
02-26-2012, 03:59 PM
Marvin Jones was a top performer in the three cone drill and had a decent 40 time of 4.46.

hawkeye123
02-26-2012, 04:07 PM
I'm lovin' the RB's in this class.

Turbin, Polk, Pierce, and Demps are my favorites.

Kendal Wright only ran a 4.61, that could help him drop to #30.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 04:27 PM
Marvin Jones was a top performer in the three cone drill and had a decent 40 time of 4.46.

Still very much on the Marvin Jones bandwagon.....did he measured a legit 6'2?

Ness
02-26-2012, 04:29 PM
Still very much on the Marvin Jones bandwagon.....did he measured a legit 6'2?

Yes. He measured out to 6'2'' exactly.

Here is his player profile page from NFL.com.

http://i.imgur.com/P9wug.jpg

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 04:45 PM
I'll take that. I saw somewhere where he was listed at only 6'1. Every inch counts, IMO.

And I still dont see Wright making it to 30. I think his tape speaks for itself. So what's everyone's take on Blackmon and Jeffrey? I'm not found of guys who are healthy but choose not to work out at the Combine. Thats a major red flag for me. The Combine is a equal playing field for all participants and promotes competiton. To have major questions about your physical abilities and for you to just shun it, just doesn't sit well with me.

Ness
02-26-2012, 04:49 PM
I'll take that. I saw somewhere where he was listed at only 6'1. Every inch counts, IMO.

And I still dont see Wright making it to 30. I think his tape speaks for itself. So what's everyone's take on Blackmon and Jeffrey? I'm not found of guys who are healthy but chose not to work out at the Combine. Thats a major red flag for me. The Combine is a equal playing field for all participants and promotes competiton. To have major questions about your physical abilities and for you to just shun it, just doesn't sit well with me.

Well those players might be getting advice from their agents so that they'll put themselves in the best position to be drafted. Which of course changes how much money you can make as a rookie. Or rather, what kind of initial deal you'll get. Better safe than sorry is their approach I guess. The same reason why quarterbacks don't throw the ball at the combine. Honestly I could see why players do it. I don't want to come off like money is everything, but the NFL is a business and the NFL is cut-throat. All these players are are just valuable commodities. Nothing more. Sometimes I think organizations forget these are people.

Justone2
02-26-2012, 04:55 PM
Blackmon only didn't do the jumps en timed parts because he had a sore hamstring. At least he did get on the field for the catching drills. Strange enough Weeden had de same thing.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 05:08 PM
Blackmon only didn't do the jumps en timed parts because he had a sore hamstring. At least he did get on the field for the catching drills. Strange enough Weeden had de same thing.

Interesting....didnt kniw about the hammy and I didnt see him in any drills. How did he look?

Justone2
02-26-2012, 05:10 PM
Looked good in the Gauntlet. Haven't seen much of the routes so cant judge on that.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 05:16 PM
Well those players might be getting advice from their agents so that they'll put themselves in the best position to be drafted. Which of course changes how much money you can make as a rookie. Or rather, what kind of initial deal you'll get. Better safe than sorry is their approach I guess. The same reason why quarterbacks don't throw the ball at the combine. Honestly I could see why players do it. I don't want to come off like money is everything, but the NFL is a business and the NFL is cut-throat. All these players are are just valuable commodities. Nothing more. Sometimes I think organizations forget these are people.


I understand your point. And QBs are a whole different ball game when it comes to the Combine. But these guys had like what, 7 weeks before their last game to get ready for this? I dont understand if your healthy, why you wouldnt stand toe to toe with the best at your respective position and compete. I dont know that saving it for your Pro-Day helps you earn more money. I think a coach like Jimbaugh might frown upon a prospect who ducked out from competing. Me personally, I just feel it does more to hurt your rep than improve your showing at your Pro-Day.

Ness
02-26-2012, 05:23 PM
I understand your point. And QBs are a whole different ball game when it comes to the Combine. But these guys had like what, 7 weeks before their last game to get ready for this? I dont understand if your healthy, why you wouldnt stand toe to toe with the best at your respective position and compete. I dont know that saving it for your Pro-Day helps you earn more money. I think a coach like Jimbaugh might frown upon a prospect who ducked out from competing. Me personally, I just feel it does more to hurt your rep than improve your showing at your Pro-Day.
Curious, did Alex Smith throw at the combine? I don't remember. I know he and Aaron Rodgers threw at some point, but I think it was a pro day.

That being said, I suppose all player feel like they have some sort of advantage at their own school's pro day, instead of the NFL combine.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 05:44 PM
I understand your point. And QBs are a whole different ball game when it comes to the Combine. But these guys had like what, 7 weeks before their last game to get ready for this? I dont understand if your healthy, why you wouldnt stand toe to toe with the best at your respective position and compete. I dont know that saving it for your Pro-Day helps you earn more money. I think a coach like Jimbaugh might frown upon a prospect who ducked out from competing. Me personally, I just feel it does more to hurt your rep than improve your showing at your Pro-Day.

Cam got killed by draftniks for his throwing performance at the combine last year. He still went number 1, but you don't have a lot to gain throwing to WR's that you are unfamiliar with. He had a lot of WR's cutting routes shorter than he expected on his drops. Player's pro days are much better scripted and are designed to highlight throws players can make or have been working on.

Justone2
02-26-2012, 05:51 PM
For a QB i can understand why he won't throw altough i believe that most scouts more look at how they throw. For a receiver its just good to show how good you run the routes and if you can change it at the end.

VAfy-ya
02-26-2012, 06:00 PM
Cam got killed by draftniks for his throwing performance at the combine last year. He still went number 1, but you don't have a lot to gain throwing to WR's that you are unfamiliar with. He had a lot of WR's cutting routes shorter than he expected on his drops. Player's pro days are much better scripted and are designed to highlight throws players can make or have been working on.

Im not talking about QBs though. I understand why they dont throw....for the reasons you just stated. Im talking all other positions, specifically the guys I mentioned.

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-26-2012, 06:12 PM
Im not talking about QBs though. I understand why they dont throw....for the reasons you just stated. Im talking all other positions, specifically the guys I mentioned.

I can understand Blackmon not running the 40 but for a guy with a ton of question marks like Jeffery I don't think it is a good decision. Then again prospect pro day numbers are usually faster compared to the combine. I remember Scott McCloughan was a bigger fan of the off field stuff at the combine like interviews and collecting medical information on a player compared to the on field events.

Ness
02-26-2012, 06:41 PM
Im not talking about QBs though. I understand why they dont throw....for the reasons you just stated. Im talking all other positions, specifically the guys I mentioned.

Players could have an injury they don't want to be revealed too. If you are going to do two workouts (combine and pro day), it might make sense just to do one where you may have an upper hand at anyways. Not to mention, the risk of injuring yourself before the draft goes down as well. You'd feel pretty dumb if you hurt yourself at the combine in a drill you didn't have to participate in.

If you are a highly touted player, you are still going to get drafted high even if you don't do much work at the combine. But if are a highly touted player and you don't have a great performance, you could have your stock fall.

That being said, every situation is different for every player.

Verloren
02-26-2012, 08:41 PM
Blackmon and Hill killed in the Gauntlet. Blackmon had 2 throws that were low and into the body, and had no trouble. Hill had a fingertip grab on a ball that was slightly overthrown on a go route.

Didn't get to see much of the crossing routes or 9 routes because I had to go to sleep and the NFLN was showing player highlights/spending time on the commentators.

VAfy-ya
02-27-2012, 07:39 AM
I think Hill has moved himself into top 25 conversation. He's created that VD/Clay Matthews/Matt Jones type of buzz now and I doubt a guy with that much physical talent and upside makes it to 30. Though I sure hope so. Alot has yet to be determine. One or two of the CBs could have a similar type of showing and put the spotlight on them. But with so many teams needed WR help in front of us, Im not going to get my hopes up.

So who is the next guy you like after the first round guys? I still like Streeter. Im starting to like McNutt a little more. Still think Quick is a big sleeper. Still like D. Jones and Adams. But the one guy I would love to have and the guy who keeps proving himself at every turn since bowl season is Marvin Jones. And with guys like Hill and Streeter getting all the pub after their workouts, he's quietly creeping under the radar. So my question is would you be opposed to Jones at 30? Not saying it should happen or will happen. But do you believe Jones posesses first round talent? Do you believe he is in the same class of athlete as other first round WRs?

Justone2
02-27-2012, 08:13 AM
I think Hill will be there at 30 and if he is i see us picking him. When he isn't there i believe we should go with an DE/OLB or a guy like Fleener. This WR-class is pretty deep so i believe we can pick up one in the 2nd or 3rd instead of reaching for someone like Jones, Streeter, Quick or Adams.

VAfy-ya
02-27-2012, 08:49 AM
I think Hill will be there at 30 and if he is i see us picking him. When he isn't there i believe we should go with an DE/OLB or a guy like Fleener. This WR-class is pretty deep so i believe we can pick up one in the 2nd or 3rd instead of reaching for someone like Jones, Streeter, Quick or Adams.

I agree with you to some extent. The reason I asked the question is because I think Jones has first round talent. I believe he's a poor man's version of Floyd. And I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to him at 30. Sure I like the other WRs as well.....but not as much as I like Hill and Jones at this point. And I dont think Jones makes it to our second round pick. I just dont see him flying under the radar too much longer. A guy with that good of a all-around skill-set as him, teams are going notice once they bring him in for workouts. I see him as a tie for the best(Hill being the other) of the second tier group. I know its a deep draft and if its not Hill or MJones it will be somebody, but I'm trying to gauge just how everyone feels about the second tier guys and if one of them really stands out for them, over the other guys.

Justone2
02-27-2012, 09:06 AM
Must say i liked Junior Hemingway yesterday(don't know how his game-tape is) and altough he had those concussion Chris Owusu is a nice receiver for in the later rounds.

VAfy-ya
02-27-2012, 09:21 AM
Must say i liked Junior Hemingway yesterday(don't know how his game-tape is) and altough he had those concussion Chris Owusu is a nice receiver for in the later rounds.

Funny you mentioned Hemingway, I was trying to figure out could he make the Delaine Walker conversion as a H-Back type. He's a short, thick WR with some wiggle. His short shuttle was 3.98s, thats insane for a guy at 230 lbs. To put into perspective, Mike Wallace's short shuttle was 4.27s. Good numbers in the vert and broad as well so he has some explosion as a athlete. Im very much intrigued by he's skillset.

Menardo75
02-27-2012, 10:27 AM
Wasn't Hemingway a rb at Michigan before Rich Rod?

Larry
02-27-2012, 12:08 PM
Loved what I saw from Andre Branch today.

AS11toFG21
02-27-2012, 03:11 PM
Hope I'm not too late to hop on the Stephen Hill bandwagon.

edgrenade
02-27-2012, 07:34 PM
Loved what I saw from Andre Branch today.

He's been my top 3-4 LB all along, and would love to grab him if he's there at 30

edgrenade
02-27-2012, 07:44 PM
Also, everyone is putting WAYYY to much emphasis on Hill's 40 and overall performance. A good 40 will not raise a player 2-3 rounds. I still think that he could be grabbed at the end of the 2nd

Larry
02-27-2012, 07:59 PM
You can probably get Hill in the second round, but late in the second after his combine? Probably not.

I also wouldn't mind Branch at 30 as it seems Brooks is on the way out.

AS11toFG21
02-27-2012, 08:05 PM
Also, everyone is putting WAYYY to much emphasis on Hill's 40 and overall performance. A good 40 will not raise a player 2-3 rounds. I still think that he could be grabbed at the end of the 2nd

It wasn't just the 40. He also had a 40 inch vert and an 11 foot broad jump.

But beyond that, I was most impressed by his drills. He looked surprisingly smooth and quick in and out of his cuts. He also made some really nice catches, including that sprawling, finger-tip grab on the go route.

I saw some of his game tape and didn't see superstar, but I think it had a little to do with the fact that he was only getting targeted a few times a game. I think, with the motivation of being a featured receiver, could develop into a star with some coaching and more effort.

VAfy-ya
02-27-2012, 08:13 PM
Also, everyone is putting WAYYY to much emphasis on Hill's 40 and overall performance. A good 40 will not raise a player 2-3 rounds. I still think that he could be grabbed at the end of the 2nd

Matt Jones says hello.....

All jokes aside, the thing is Hill was being talked about as being a sleeper already. People knew he was a talented kid with great physical ability, but raw. But I don't think anyone thought he had that Megatron-like physical ability. I mean 6'4 kids with speed and explosion don't grow on trees. Of course, looking at his game film, the kid is probably not going to hit the ground running. But its not like the kid didnt make plays and came out of nowhere. He avg freaking 28 yards a catch and had over 800 yards receiving. All that in offense that barely threw the ball 10 times a game. One thing you know coming from that offense is the kid can block, something Jimbaugh and most coaches would covet. And the emergence of Thomas in Denver makes Hill's upside that much more likeable because he's virtually the same player Thomas was at this stage, but with better triangle numbers. I know alot can happen between now and the draft but as of now, Im saying Hill doesn't make it out of the first. No way.

VAfy-ya
02-27-2012, 08:26 PM
But beyond that, I was most impressed by his drills. He looked surprisingly smooth and quick in and out of his cuts. He also made some really nice catches, including that sprawling, finger-tip grab on the go route.


Thats the other thing I forgot to mention. He looked so smooth in the drills. He said he's been working out with former NFLer Terrance Mathis on improving his route running and it showed. Still has a little hiccup coming out his break but those are things that can be 'coached up'. But he caught the ball with ease and along with Floyd, made the guadlet look like child's play. You tie that together with the solid numbers across the board(even the 6.88s, 3-Cone is impressive for such a long-legged guy) and yes, it can bump you up a couple rounds. Streeter also bumped himself up a couple of rounds to a solid 3rd rounder....maybe even late 2nd depending on who you talk to.

edgrenade
02-27-2012, 10:00 PM
I saw some of his game tape and didn't see superstar, but I think it had a little to do with the fact that he was only getting targeted a few times a game. I think, with the motivation of being a featured receiver, could develop into a star with some coaching and more effort.

Yeah, the little game tape that I saw only had him mostly running go routes, and the defense also blew their coverages each time.

I thought he looked really good in the drills too. Maybe teams already knew he was a top pick, and we are just finding out...

WhatWouldBillyBajemaDo?
02-27-2012, 11:09 PM
Evan Silva of rotoworld went back and watched two of his games last night:
Watched 2 Stephen Hill games last night (UNC, CLEM). Baller. Stands out as best player on field when involved. Way better RAC than expected.

Hill catches everything w/ his hands. Growing up to do but freak length, catch radius, speed, high effort. Plays fast. 1st rd within reach.

I'll be digging around ESPN 3 and see if they have an archive of those 2 games mentioned above.

Mike Mayock's breakdown of Stephen Hill's workout:
On Georgia Tech wide receiver Stephen Hill: “Stephen Hill killed it. I had a bunch of scouts tell me before the combine this kid might blow the roof off of it and he did. The tough thing with Stephen Hill is coming out of that option offense, he’s hard to evaluate…From a football perspective, every team in the league has a lot of homework to do. He’s a hard guy to figure out, just like Demaryius Thomas was because you don’t see real routes; all you see are verticals, crosses and play-action and jump balls. You have to do your homework on this kid and he’s kind of pushed himself right up in the forefront of this wide receivers class.”

Also Mayock's opinion on the TE class:
“The tight end class is a bad class. That’s not good given [Rob] Gronkowski and [Aaron] Hernandez, and what we’ve seen in the NFL – everybody is looking for that next guy. I don’t have a first-round grade in the tight end class, I have three second-round grades and then I have kind of an abyss. The tight end class is a rough one.”

If 49ers sign a big name FA WR should Fleener be a candidate for pick 30/trade back?
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2012/02/27/49ers-could-be-feeling-some-fleener/

Would it be a luxury pick? I do think it would be a long shot but we know how much Harbaugh loves tight ends in his offense. An offense of Crabtree, Colston?, Davis and Fleener would be potent.

phlysac
02-27-2012, 11:32 PM
Matt Jones says hello.....

All jokes aside, the thing is Hill was being talked about as being a sleeper already. People knew he was a talented kid with great physical ability, but raw.

Yeah. Several people I read had Stephen Hill as a top-5 WR prior to the end of bowl season. He's not an "out-of-nowhere" prospect.

chapo123
02-28-2012, 09:56 AM
opted to redo my mock draft:

1. alfonzo denard - cb
2. andre branch olb/de
3. marvin mcnutt - wr
4. brandon taylor - s
5. marquis maze - wr/kr
6. ben bojicic - c
7. marc tyler - rb

stephen hill " may not " be there @ 30...beyond him or kendall wright not sure i'd spend a 1st round pick on any other wr. not sold on jeffrey / sanu / floyd just yet.

phlysac
02-28-2012, 10:33 AM
opted to redo my mock draft:

1. alfonzo denard - cb
2. andre branch olb/de
3. marvin mcnutt - wr
4. brandon taylor - s
5. marquis maze - wr/kr
6. ben bojicic - c
7. marc tyler - rb

stephen hill " may not " be there @ 30...beyond him or kendall wright not sure i'd spend a 1st round pick on any other wr. not sold on jeffrey / sanu / floyd just yet.

You're not sold on Michael Floyd at #30???

Ok then.

chapo123
02-28-2012, 10:38 AM
You're not sold on Michael Floyd at #30???

Ok then.

prob' won't be there either...seems like anyone that isn't blackmon-wright-hill-alshon is a reach.

phlysac
02-28-2012, 10:54 AM
prob' won't be there either...seems like anyone that isn't blackmon-wright-hill-alshon is a reach.

Michael Floyd could very well be the #2 WR taken.

dan77733
02-28-2012, 01:49 PM
Rather have Fleener at 30 and a FA WR.

edgrenade
02-28-2012, 02:48 PM
Dennard isn't that great, and Branch is going in the first

VAfy-ya
02-28-2012, 03:45 PM
Yea, I dont know why everybody is so high on Dennard. He really regressed this year. Honestly not very impressed with this CB class.

AS11toFG21
02-28-2012, 03:54 PM
I was very happy to see Cliff Harris measure in at 5'11. Will he get to pick #62?

Justone2
02-28-2012, 05:43 PM
i dont really see why we should draft a CB. With Brock, Culliver and Brown we have 3 young CB's that still can grow a lot and even if we lose Rogers i would prefer a guy with more experience and maybe pick-up a project-player in the later rounds.

edgrenade
02-28-2012, 10:36 PM
Now that Brooks is signed, who's a mid to late round guy we can draft to play OLB?

A guy who caught my eye this week was Oliver Vernon of Miami. I don't know where he is expected to go, but he could be a guy to look at.

phlysac
02-28-2012, 11:01 PM
Now that Brooks is signed, who's a mid to late round guy we can draft to play OLB?

A guy who caught my eye this week was Oliver Vernon of Miami. I don't know where he is expected to go, but he could be a guy to look at.

Vernon reminds me alot of Haralson actually. Relies almost entirely on an inconsistent bullrush.


One of the reasons I was so happy they prioritized Brooks is because IMO the FA crop and draft crop of 3-4 OLB prospects SUCKS for the most part.

AS11toFG21
02-29-2012, 12:12 AM
i dont really see why we should draft a CB. With Brock, Culliver and Brown we have 3 young CB's that still can grow a lot and even if we lose Rogers i would prefer a guy with more experience and maybe pick-up a project-player in the later rounds.

I can understand that. I just really like Harris.

VAfy-ya
02-29-2012, 12:59 AM
Vernon reminds me alot of Haralson actually. Relies almost entirely on an inconsistent bullrush.


One of the reasons I was so happy they prioritized Brooks is because IMO the FA crop and draft crop of 3-4 OLB prospects SUCKS for the most part.

Very much so. I still like Adrian Hamilton of Prarie View St. Not sure where he's slotted to go but he reminds me of a more athletic Dummervil. But like you said, this class is subpar for the most part.

binary
02-29-2012, 03:40 AM
I like Stephen Hill, our coaches will mold that guy.

edgrenade
02-29-2012, 04:47 AM
I like Stephen Hill, our coaches will mold that guy.

The question is where do you take him?

VAfy-ya
02-29-2012, 07:33 AM
The question is where do you take him?

As soon as you can, lol. Seriously though, if he makes it to 30, he's the guy whose name I want to hear called.....unless someone falls who shouldnt be there.

Justone2
02-29-2012, 08:19 AM
Stephen Hill is one of the only guys i would take at 30 as a WR because he is so physically gifted and have a lot of growth in him. In the case he is of the board is would prefer us to go BPA or trade down like 10 spots to pick up an extra pick and choose a guy like Fleener(if he is there).

VAfy-ya
02-29-2012, 09:57 AM
I would be kinda of bummed if we took Fleener at 30. Not that he isnt a great prospect but alot of our problems on offense stem from not having a real threat outside the hashes. Someone a CB cant just squat on or a guy who will make that safety take a few more steps to the sideline rather than key in on the middle of the field, trying to take away the slot and our TEs. I mean we do have two of the more dynamic TEs in the league and even they get handcuffed by the lack of playmakers on the outside.

Justone2
02-29-2012, 11:06 AM
Thats true but thats why i say trade back. And imagine 3 te-sets with Walker-Fleener-Davis thats really a huge problem for almost every defense and since we al know how Harbaugh likes to play the game where its all about bal-control a real deep threat isn't of the most important. And in my opninion guys like Williams and Ginn(is he resigns) can go deep altough both aren't going to draw double teams.

dan77733
02-29-2012, 01:18 PM
I would be kinda of bummed if we took Fleener at 30. Not that he isnt a great prospect but alot of our problems on offense stem from not having a real threat outside the hashes. Someone a CB cant just squat on or a guy who will make that safety take a few more steps to the sideline rather than key in on the middle of the field, trying to take away the slot and our TEs. I mean we do have two of the more dynamic TEs in the league and even they get handcuffed by the lack of playmakers on the outside.

Hmmmm, in regards to having a real threat outside the hashes, isnt that what I have been saying for weeks??? WTF???

With that said, im hoping for a top tier FA WR and Fleener at 30. Then, trade Walker during the same draft.

VAfy-ya
02-29-2012, 01:34 PM
Hmmmm, in regards to having a real threat outside the hashes, isnt that what I have been saying for weeks??? WTF???

With that said, im hoping for a top tier FA WR and Fleener at 30. Then, trade Walker during the same draft.

Dan, no one was arguing the need for a playmaker on the outside. The argument has ALWAYS been about whether it should be the guy we ALL know you want.

dan77733
02-29-2012, 01:57 PM
Dan, no one was arguing the need for a playmaker on the outside. The argument has ALWAYS been about whether it should be the guy we ALL know you want.

Fair enough but I think that a speed deep threat is more important than a Colston/Jackson type. Dont get me wrong, if we get either of them, I wont complain but I prefer speed on the outside over power. Of course, I dont think that we'll even go after Wallace so it doesnt matter. Personally, I think that the Bengals should go after him (and Arian Foster) if either/or both arent franchised.

Oh well, a few more days to go and we'll all know who's franchised and who's not.

VAfy-ya
02-29-2012, 02:27 PM
Thats true but thats why i say trade back. And imagine 3 te-sets with Walker-Fleener-Davis thats really a huge problem for almost every defense and since we al know how Harbaugh likes to play the game where its all about bal-control a real deep threat isn't of the most important. And in my opninion guys like Williams and Ginn(is he resigns) can go deep altough both aren't going to draw double teams.

But if we trade back, Fleener wont be there by our 2nd round pick. I'd be shocked if he makes it past the Giants pick in the first.

The problem with running primarily a 3 TE set is it still compacts the field on passing plays. I mean you can't go 3 TEs on 3rd and 13. Well I mean you could but the problem is, most teams are going to play our 3-TE set with nickel coverage. The point of running that set is to catch teams in their "big" package.....which means your limited to what down and distance that you can run those type of things. Because you have to have the element that the defense doesn't know if its a run or pass....thats when that package comes in handy....2nd and 5, 2nd and short, 3rd and short. I just dont believe you can run 3 TE sets all the way down the field, and not run into problems. You need those deep curls or deep-ins run. And I dont think TEs can be as efficent with those routes, on the outside, as a WR could. A guy like Hill makes the middle of the field less compressed. He draws the FS off of focusing on VD. He allows Crabs to work underneath more, which I think can help move the chains. And most importantly, he is a big target with good ball skills, so if all else fails, you can throw it up and he and his "40 vertical can out-jump smaller CBs, when he's not running by them. A kid like that allows more options in terms how you approach 3rd down because you know a good DC is going to either role coverage to him or VD, or give one safety help.....so you can manipulate that to your own advatage in other areas of the field. Adding Fleener means your just putting another guy in the fold who works best from the middle, out towards the sideline. The only way that 3 TE could work is if one of those guys had WR ability, as far as route running and ball skills. VD isn't a natural pass-catcher. Walker has issues with drops and concentration lapses. Fleener probably is the more natural pass-catcher of the 3 but I dont know if he has thos Witten/Gates like qualities to split outside and manuveur against NFL caliber CBs like a possesion WR. Guys like Gates and Witten, are almost like WRs on 3rd downs because they're fluid route-runners and understand the nuiances of timing/anticipation when running deep and finding space in a zone. IMO, guys like Walker and VD aren't fluid pass-catchers. Plenty athletic but not as crafty with their positioning of their body, how to come out of routes , chop their steps and drive off a defender on their hip....things of that nature.

phlysac
02-29-2012, 02:53 PM
Great post vafy-ya!

And with Byham, the team will still be able to run 3-TE sets. He is a very underrated receiver.

But the 3-TE set will only be attractive and successful if you can supplement that with a receiver that can stratch the fieldconsistently.

Justone2
02-29-2012, 04:46 PM
But if we trade back, Fleener wont be there by our 2nd round pick. I'd be shocked if he makes it past the Giants pick in the first.

The problem with running primarily a 3 TE set is it still compacts the field on passing plays. I mean you can't go 3 TEs on 3rd and 13. Well I mean you could but the problem is, most teams are going to play our 3-TE set with nickel coverage. The point of running that set is to catch teams in their "big" package.....which means your limited to what down and distance that you can run those type of things. Because you have to have the element that the defense doesn't know if its a run or pass....thats when that package comes in handy....2nd and 5, 2nd and short, 3rd and short. I just dont believe you can run 3 TE sets all the way down the field, and not run into problems. You need those deep curls or deep-ins run. And I dont think TEs can be as efficent with those routes, on the outside, as a WR could. A guy like Hill makes the middle of the field less compressed. He draws the FS off of focusing on VD. He allows Crabs to work underneath more, which I think can help move the chains. And most importantly, he is a big target with good ball skills, so if all else fails, you can throw it up and he and his "40 vertical can out-jump smaller CBs, when he's not running by them. A kid like that allows more options in terms how you approach 3rd down because you know a good DC is going to either role coverage to him or VD, or give one safety help.....so you can manipulate that to your own advatage in other areas of the field. Adding Fleener means your just putting another guy in the fold who works best from the middle, out towards the sideline. The only way that 3 TE could work is if one of those guys had WR ability, as far as route running and ball skills. VD isn't a natural pass-catcher. Walker has issues with drops and concentration lapses. Fleener probably is the more natural pass-catcher of the 3 but I dont know if he has thos Witten/Gates like qualities to split outside and manuveur against NFL caliber CBs like a possesion WR. Guys like Gates and Witten, are almost like WRs on 3rd downs because they're fluid route-runners and understand the nuiances of timing/anticipation when running deep and finding space in a zone. IMO, guys like Walker and VD aren't fluid pass-catchers. Plenty athletic but not as crafty with their positioning of their body, how to come out of routes , chop their steps and drive off a defender on their hip....things of that nature.

Agree with you and i really think that if Hill is available on 30 we should make the call. He has de speed and physical atributes that i think Harbaugh and Baalke really like and even though he didnt have an amazing college-carreer(Guess most because of their playing style) he would be a guy that has a lot of upside. Its more that if he isn't available at 30 i would like to see us BPA(unless its a position that is really stacked with talent) or trade down some picks to pick up another second and a late pick. Fleener may not be the perfect guy but he is a guy that fits great in what we are doing i think so it may be personal preference.

49erNation85
03-01-2012, 05:46 PM
So How is offe season coming along guys?Did any Wide outs stand out in the combine ?The pro days have started , who are the 49ers looking at for big targets to get down field and have speed also good hands?Still two months away from the draft and FA around the corner.. Also wondering who we might target in FA for a Wide out or possible o line maybe defense as well?

hawkeye123
03-02-2012, 12:41 PM
A prospect i really like is Arizona State corner Omar Bolden.

http://i.imgur.com/zaRIN.jpg

I've had the privilege to watch him in person over the last couple years at ASU and i think he is a special player. I thought he would be a 2nd round pick before he hurt his knee during spring practice. He also is a fantastic kick returner. It's no coincidence that Arizona State's defense fell apart without him this past year. He was their emotional leader.

M0DcSvFtjXQ

Ness
03-02-2012, 04:05 PM
So How is offe season coming along guys?Did any Wide outs stand out in the combine ?The pro days have started , who are the 49ers looking at for big targets to get down field and have speed also good hands?Still two months away from the draft and FA around the corner.. Also wondering who we might target in FA for a Wide out or possible o line maybe defense as well?

Marvin Jones. We need to draft this guy.

VAfy-ya
03-03-2012, 03:04 AM
Is he fully healthy hawkeye? Will he be ready to workout by the ASU Pro Day?

hawkeye123
03-03-2012, 02:14 PM
Is he fully healthy hawkeye? Will he be ready to workout by the ASU Pro Day?

Yes he said he was fully healthy at the combine, but still didn't run the 40 which is a concern. He said he'll definitely run on his pro day (March 16).

I think we could get him in 5th-6th round area.

phlysac
03-03-2012, 04:20 PM
Yes he said he was fully healthy at the combine, but still didn't run the 40 which is a concern. He said he'll definitely run on his pro day (March 16).

I think we could get him in 5th-6th round area.

I still see him earlier than that. 3-4 or higher barring a bad medical.

VAfy-ya
03-03-2012, 04:29 PM
I had forgot him.....probably because he didnt play this year. So what happened to the knee? If it was a major injury and he still didnt run at the Combine, might drop him to a late rounder. Though Im sure he was there to go through the medical so teams could have full disclosure about the injury, if its something like Ray McDonald had, where it was known he had to have at least one or more procedures to it.

Madirishman
03-04-2012, 07:44 AM
I still see him earlier than that. 3-4 or higher barring a bad medical.

Agree. A great potential value pick in the 4th if the knee checks out.

Menardo75
03-05-2012, 04:35 PM
I was thinking last year we saw the Niners take a lot of very athletically talented guys, yet very raw. Who are some of the guys this year that you guys feel fit that mold?

Here are some off the top of my head -

Stephen Hill
Tommy Streeter
Trumaine Johnson
Dontari Poe - probably won't be able to get him without a trade
Dre Kirkpatrick
Bruce Irvin
Coty Sensabaugh

edgrenade
03-06-2012, 12:30 PM
I would not be opposed at all to trading back and taking Stephen Hill in the early second. This would give us another mid round pick this year, or a high pick next year.

Even after his combine, I still don't see Hill going in the first. When Bruce Campbell destroyed the combine, everyone had him going to the Raiders in the first, but he ended up going a lot later in the draft. I'm not saying they're the same, but it is just an example of using the combine to dictate a player's stock.

VAfy-ya
03-06-2012, 02:39 PM
Poe is a guy, although not a position of need, just screams draft me. A guy that big, with that kind of strength, athletic ability are very rare. Nagta was the last guy of that caliber. Virtually impossible to get him where we are but he's a guy who you'd love to add to any defense. But especially to middle of our front, no question. He and Hill are my 1A and 1B draft crush.

Justone2
03-06-2012, 03:47 PM
If we would pick Stephen Hill with the first i would be happy also. He is a good blocker(must be for that triple-option ****) and he has de size and speed we need. Its not only that he had a great combine its more that because of the offense he was in he had some things to prove and he could do that on the combine. He is raw but i am sure he will become a great player.