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View Full Version : Predict Your Team's Draft Picks Who Fail


Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 04:20 PM
Every year, every team drafts players who fail, or simply don't meet expectations. Who do you think they'll be for your team, and why?

For the Steelers:

3rd round LB Sean Spence, Miami

I like his instincts and the energy with which he plays, but he's very small and struggles with shedding blocks. I think he's not a perfect fit for the 3-4, and if they stick him besides Timmons at some point, it will just be bad. I think he's a good ST player and solid depth at best, but I expect more from a 3rd rounder, since we've gotten some good picks there in recent years (most notably Mike Wallace).

7th round OT Kelvin Beachum, SMU

He's a good kid from what I've read, a good guy, but he's small and not very powerful, even downright soft at times. Will probably have to kick inside to guard, but with the other guys we acquired (DeCastro in the first, Mike Adams moves Willie Colon inside too) he probably won't have a roster spot and will make the practice squad for a year, before being released. I know it's a seventh rounder, but I expect next to nothing from him, another off-season body for us.

vidae
04-29-2012, 04:21 PM
I guess I'll go with 7th round pick Jerome Long. Not because I think he'll necessarily be bad, but because I don't see him sticking with the team. We're pretty deep at 5tech as it stands right now.

SuperPacker
04-29-2012, 04:29 PM
The part of the draft no fan will accept although it happens every year. I love it!

I'm not saying these players will bust, but im not blinded of the fact that they could:

Nick Perry - I love the pick, but its still to be seen how he transitions to the 3-4. He has stiff hips which needs to be fixed and right now weighs 270 pounds.

Andrew Datko - He could be so injury prone he never sees the field. Thats why he went 7th round, not 2nd.

Rosebud
04-29-2012, 04:49 PM
At least one of McCants or Mosley, and Randle in that he never actually becomes a deep threat the way we need when Cruz moves into the slot.

The Alex
04-29-2012, 04:51 PM
Coty Sensabaugh. I just don't think he'll be anything more than a 4th corner.

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 04:54 PM
The part of the draft no fan will accept although it happens every year. I love it!

Haha, indeed! 50% of first rounders will bust, let alone from all the other rounds.

Just for the sake of discussion, here are the first round busts from 2007-2009, since I think 10 and 11 are too close to call.

2007
1. QB JaMarcus Russell, Oakland
4. DE Gaines Adams, Tampa Bay
5. OT Levi Brown, Arizona
8. DE Jamal Anderson, Atlanta
9. WR Ted Ginn, Jr., Miami
10. DT Amobi Okoye, Houston
13. DT Adam Carriker, St. Louis
16. DT Justin Harrell, Green Bay
17. DE Jarvis Moss, Denver
21. S Reggie Nelson, Jacksonville
22. QB Brady Quinn, Cleveland
24. S Brandon Meriweather, New England
30. WR Craig Davis, San Diego
32. WR Anthony Gonzalez, Indianapolis

2008
6. DE Vernon Gholston, New York Jets
7. DT Sedrick Ellis, New Orleans
8. DE Derrick Harvey, Jacksonville
9. LB Keith Rivers, Cincinnati
11. CB Leodis McKelvin, Buffalo
13. OT Chris Williams, Chicago
17. OT Gosder Cherilus, Detroit
21. OT Sam Baker, Atlanta
25. CB Mike Jenkins, Dallas
27. CB Antoine Cason, San Diego
28. DE Lawrence Jackson, Seattle
29. DT Kentwan Balmer, San Francisco

2009 - I'm being generous with some guys here, could include more
2. OT Jason Smith, St. Louis
4. LB Aaron Curry, Seattle
11. DE Aaron Maybin, Buffalo
12. RB Knowshon Moreno, Denver
16. DE Larry English, San Diego
18. DE Robert Ayers, Denver
24. DT Peria Jerry, Atlanta
26. RB Donald Brown, Indianapolis

So who will they be this year?

SuperPacker
04-29-2012, 05:04 PM
Im not saying all these guys will bust, but assuming the 50% thing, i've got 14 guys.

2012
4. Matt Kalil
8. Ryan Tannehill
9. Luke Kuechly
10. Stephon Gilmore
11. Dontari Poe
12. Fletcher Cox
16. Quinton Coples
18. Melvin Ingram
19. Shea McCellin
20. Kendall Wright
21. Chandler Jones
22. Brandon Weeden
28. Nick Perry
32. David Wilson

Lil Quip
04-29-2012, 05:08 PM
For the Pats:

Chandler Jones/Bequette

Both turning out would be awesome, but I have to hedge my bets. I think at least one turns in to that olb/de pass rusher we really need.

Tavon Wilson

Who the heck knows with this pick. Reminds me of the safety pick by the raiders a couple years back. At least we had a nice first instead of DHB.

I can't put anyone past the fourth as a 'bust.' These guys work or don't, but never bust.

I would be infinitely surprised if Hightower busts. He may not ever make a PB, but he screams worthwhile contributor for a long time.

The Alex
04-29-2012, 05:39 PM
Haha, indeed! 50% of first rounders will bust, let alone from all the other rounds.

Just for the sake of discussion, here are the first round busts from 2007-2009, since I think 10 and 11 are too close to call.

2007
9. WR Ted Ginn, Jr., Miami
21. S Reggie Nelson, Jacksonville
24. S Brandon Meriweather, New England

2008
7. DT Sedrick Ellis, New Orleans
9. LB Keith Rivers, Cincinnati
11. CB Leodis McKelvin, Buffalo
21. OT Sam Baker, Atlanta
27. CB Antoine Cason, San Diego

2009
24. DT Peria Jerry, Atlanta


I disagree with all of these to some extent. None of them are spectacular but they've had decent season or two thus far. In Jerry's case, I think he's a victim of injury from his rookie season. I know Ginn is a garbage receiver but he's easily one of the top return guys in the league.

SuperPacker
04-29-2012, 05:43 PM
I disagree with all of these to some extent. None of them are spectacular but they've had decent season or two thus far. In Jerry's case, I think he's a victim of injury from his rookie season. I know Ginn is a garbage receiver but he's easily one of the top return guys in the league.

Are you serious? When you pick a guy in the first round you expect them to be a solid starter for 10 years. If you're picking top 10 you want him to be a pro bowler.

All of these guys have been busts.

vidae
04-29-2012, 05:48 PM
Im not saying all these guys will bust, but assuming the 50% thing, i've got 14 guys.

2012
4. Matt Kalil
8. Ryan Tannehill
9. Luke Kuechly
10. Stephon Gilmore
11. Dontari Poe
12. Fletcher Cox
16. Quinton Coples
18. Melvin Ingram
19. Shea McCellin
20. Kendall Wright
21. Chandler Jones
22. Brandon Weeden
28. Nick Perry
32. David Wilson

I will end you.

The Alex
04-29-2012, 05:49 PM
I think you can find bigger busts from those years than the guys listed. They might have not been picked as high but they never did a damn thing. I'm talking about bums like this guy:

http://prod.static.titans.clubs.nfl.com/assets/images/imported/TEN/photos/player-dcr-photos/henry_chris_ci.jpg

50th overall pick, 34 career carries.

I'd much rather have Brandon Meriweather than that piece of trash.

Timbathia
04-29-2012, 05:49 PM
Are you serious? When you pick a guy in the first round you expect them to be a solid starter for 10 years. If you're picking top 10 you want him to be a pro bowler.

All of these guys have been busts.

I dont count Robert Ayers as a bust. He is a solid player taken at #18. Jarvis Moss, now he is a bust (and we traded up to get him as well). **** me.

armageddon
04-29-2012, 05:55 PM
Haha, indeed! 50% of first rounders will bust, let alone from all the other rounds.

Just for the sake of discussion, here are the first round busts from 2007-2009, since I think 10 and 11 are too close to call.

2007
1. QB JaMarcus Russell, Oakland
4. DE Gaines Adams, Tampa Bay
5. OT Levi Brown, Arizona
8. DE Jamal Anderson, Atlanta
9. WR Ted Ginn, Jr., Miami
10. DT Amobi Okoye, Houston
13. DT Adam Carriker, St. Louis
16. DT Justin Harrell, Green Bay
17. DE Jarvis Moss, Denver
21. S Reggie Nelson, Jacksonville
22. QB Brady Quinn, Cleveland
24. S Brandon Meriweather, New England
30. WR Craig Davis, San Diego
32. WR Anthony Gonzalez, Indianapolis

2008
6. DE Vernon Gholston, New York Jets
7. DT Sedrick Ellis, New Orleans
8. DE Derrick Harvey, Jacksonville
9. LB Keith Rivers, Cincinnati
11. CB Leodis McKelvin, Buffalo
13. OT Chris Williams, Chicago
17. OT Gosder Cherilus, Detroit
21. OT Sam Baker, Atlanta
25. CB Mike Jenkins, Dallas
27. CB Antoine Cason, San Diego
28. DE Lawrence Jackson, Seattle
29. DT Kentwan Balmer, San Francisco

2009 - I'm being generous with some guys here, could include more
2. OT Jason Smith, St. Louis
4. LB Aaron Curry, Seattle
11. DE Aaron Maybin, Buffalo
12. RB Knowshon Moreno, Denver
16. DE Larry English, San Diego
18. DE Robert Ayers, Denver
24. DT Peria Jerry, Atlanta
26. RB Donald Brown, Indianapolis

So who will they be this year?



Not yet. They say he's healthy and looks good. The Rams new o-line coach said it was his poor technique that was hindering him too. He said Smith would try to punish the defender on each play, instead of just trying to block him. He said he can fix Smith's flaws and Smith will be a really good RT.

FrankGore
04-29-2012, 06:21 PM
Not yet. They say he's healthy and looks good. The Rams new o-line coach said it was his poor technique that was hindering him too. He said Smith would try to punish the defender on each play, instead of just trying to block him. He said he can fix Smith's flaws and Smith will be a really good RT.

Well I'm glad he cleared all that up for us, lol.

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 06:24 PM
I disagree with all of these to some extent. None of them are spectacular but they've had decent season or two thus far. In Jerry's case, I think he's a victim of injury from his rookie season. I know Ginn is a garbage receiver but he's easily one of the top return guys in the league.

I agree that some of them have had salvageable seasons, but that is unacceptable for a first rounder. First rounders are expected to be solid starters, at worst.

2007
9. WR Ted Ginn, Jr., Miami Good returner, yes, terrible at everything else. There is absolutely no way of justifying drafting a returner top 10, even if he is Devin Hester.
21. S Reggie Nelson, Jacksonville He plays better than he is, if that makes any sense. The Bengals' system helps hide some of his weaknesses, and he was traded away after 4 years.
24. S Brandon Meriweather, New England Had some good games at times, but he was cut after 4 years, and I think he'll be out of the league in 2.

2008
7. DT Sedrick Ellis, New Orleans Probably one of the better players on the list. Still, he has not come close to live up to the billing of being the seventh overall pick.
9. LB Keith Rivers, Cincinnati Traded away for a fifth this year and injuries have prevented him from being consistently good.
11. CB Leodis McKelvin, Buffalo He hasn't amounted to absolutely anything. Bills have drafted CBs with early picks in consecutive years, Aaron Williams and Stephon Gilmore.
21. OT Sam Baker, Atlanta He's bad. People remember him from USC and being a first rounder, but he's bad, and his continually dinged up back doesn't help him.
27. CB Antoine Cason, San Diego

2009
24. DT Peria Jerry, Atlanta knee injury as a rookie absolutely destroyed him

Brent
04-29-2012, 06:24 PM
expectations vs. predicted results? LaMichael James.

ATLDirtyBirds
04-29-2012, 06:29 PM
I'm not sure how you define late rounds picks "failing". None of the Falcons late round picks are going to be anything more than depth, or a below average starting FB. But I'd be pretty surprised if Lamar Holmes is in the NFL in a few years, awful, awful pick.

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 06:33 PM
Not yet. They say he's healthy and looks good. The Rams new o-line coach said it was his poor technique that was hindering him too. He said Smith would try to punish the defender on each play, instead of just trying to block him. He said he can fix Smith's flaws and Smith will be a really good RT.

I'd say he's clearly a bust right now, but he could turn it around I guess. Compared to other tackles (or other players, for that matter) taken Top 5 in previous years, he hasn't done anything noteworthy.

He's also probably one of the worst tackles out of all the ones selected in the first two rounds in 2009. Eugene Monroe, Michael Oher, Phil Loadholt, Sebastian Vollmer, give me any of those guys before Smith. Maybe even Andre Smith too.

He's been injured, so you could call him an Injury Bust, but the fact of the matter is that he hasn't lived up to the expectations of a second overall pick.

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 06:34 PM
I'm not sure how you define late rounds picks "failing". None of the Falcons late round picks are going to be anything more than depth, or a below average starting FB. But I'd be pretty surprised if Lamar Holmes is in the NFL in a few years, awful, awful pick.

Yeah, that's what I was thinking for guys from later rounds. Players who won't make the roster or contribute anything of note, even as depth/situational guys.

Sportsfan486
04-29-2012, 06:59 PM
Casey Hayward for the Packers.

I like him but his lack of straight-line speed and the fact we'll probably make him practice some as a safety, increasing the difficulty of an already brutal transition, could wipe him out.

He's also known more for zone coverage than man and we're primarily a man team with our corners.

As for some first rounders..

Dontari Poe is going to show up to camp out of shape big team and will be a huge bust.

Justin Blackmon will max out as a poor man's Michael Crabtree (which isn't a good thing.)

Mark Barron will get burnt deep.. a lot.

Shea McClellin will do absolutely nothing.

Quinton Coples may put a shotgun round in his head as he gets stuck as a non-playmaking 3-4 DE.

Andrew Luck will max out as a 4,000 25/15 guy aka Matt Schaub.

armageddon
04-29-2012, 07:03 PM
I'd say he's clearly a bust right now, but he could turn it around I guess. Compared to other tackles (or other players, for that matter) taken Top 5 in previous years, he hasn't done anything noteworthy.

He's also probably one of the worst tackles out of all the ones selected in the first two rounds in 2009. Eugene Monroe, Michael Oher, Phil Loadholt, Sebastian Vollmer, give me any of those guys before Smith. Maybe even Andre Smith too.

He's been injured, so you could call him an Injury Bust, but the fact of the matter is that he hasn't lived up to the expectations of a second overall pick.





Smith has also had one of the worst o-line coaches in history.

Saints-Tigers
04-29-2012, 07:05 PM
I'll say Nick Toon. The Saints seem to only hit on guys that go to schools I've never heard of (We picked a guy from Vagina in the 3rd round apparently).

Pat Sims 90
04-29-2012, 07:10 PM
Dan Herron is the only draft pick the Bengals made that i see having a hard time making the team.

Cbrunn
04-29-2012, 07:11 PM
Every year, every team drafts players who fail, or simply don't meet expectations. Who do you think they'll be for your team, and why?

For the Steelers:

3rd round LB Sean Spence, Miami

I like his instincts and the energy with which he plays, but he's very small and struggles with shedding blocks. I think he's not a perfect fit for the 3-4, and if they stick him besides Timmons at some point, it will just be bad. I think he's a good ST player and solid depth at best, but I expect more from a 3rd rounder, since we've gotten some good picks there in recent years (most notably Mike Wallace).

7th round OT Kelvin Beachum, SMU

He's a good kid from what I've read, a good guy, but he's small and not very powerful, even downright soft at times. Will probably have to kick inside to guard, but with the other guys we acquired (DeCastro in the first, Mike Adams moves Willie Colon inside too) he probably won't have a roster spot and will make the practice squad for a year, before being released. I know it's a seventh rounder, but I expect next to nothing from him, another off-season body for us.

They say Beachum can Long Snap ... so he'll take the long snapper roster spot... but be able to provide oline help IF needed... that's at least what i read

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 07:18 PM
They say Beachum can Long Snap ... so he'll take the long snapper roster spot... but be able to provide oline help IF needed... that's at least what i read

Hmm, interesting. I dunno how well a 300 lbs. guy can run down the field, but I guess it could happen. I still think he's a PS player though.

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 07:19 PM
I'll say Nick Toon. The Saints seem to only hit on guys that go to schools I've never heard of (We picked a guy from Vagina in the 3rd round apparently).

All players come from Vagina ;)

Caddy
04-29-2012, 07:23 PM
I guess I'll go with 7th round pick Jerome Long. Not because I think he'll necessarily be bad, but because I don't see him sticking with the team. We're pretty deep at 5tech as it stands right now.

Way to take a risk vidae. In that case, I'll take my teams crappy 7th round pick Drake Dunsmore.

vidae
04-29-2012, 07:28 PM
Way to take a risk vidae. In that case, I'll take my teams crappy 7th round pick Drake Dunsmore.

Most of our guys are going to be depth so it'll be hard for them to "succeed" in the first place. Only Poe and Allen are going to be starters in the near future and I'm high on them for obvious reasons.

Come at me you jerk.

SuperPacker
04-29-2012, 07:30 PM
Poe is going to bust :evil_laugh:

Mr. Goosemahn
04-29-2012, 07:30 PM
Most of our guys are going to be depth so it'll be hard for them to "succeed" in the first place. Only Poe and Allen are going to be starters in the near future and I'm high on them for obvious reasons.

Come at me you jerk.

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/64/tumblr_l9ld1vxPAl1qzvuiv.gif

Caddy
04-29-2012, 07:30 PM
Most of our guys are going to be depth so it'll be hard for them to "succeed" in the first place. Only Poe and Allen are going to be starters in the near future and I'm high on them for obvious reasons.

Come at me you jerk.

;)

Should've just picked Poe. He has a high bust rate. :wave:

proshoota25
04-29-2012, 07:46 PM
for the pats, everyone after round 1 for me will bust, except i can see dennard sticking around for a little while

robert pancake gallery
04-29-2012, 08:37 PM
Are you serious? When you pick a guy in the first round you expect them to be a solid starter for 10 years. If you're picking top 10 you want him to be a pro bowler.

All of these guys have been busts.

i'm glad everything has to be black and white regarding the NFL draft and bust status

nepg
04-29-2012, 09:13 PM
;)

Should've just picked Poe. He has a high bust rate. :wave:
There's really not much grounds for that... Can't think of any first round 3-4 NTs that haven't worked out well.

Off the top of my head, the only ones I can even think of that have been drafted in the first round are Casey Hampton, Ted Washington, Vince Wilfork, Haloti Ngata, and BJ Raji.

Caddy
04-29-2012, 09:17 PM
There's really not much grounds for that... Can't think of any first round 3-4 NTs that haven't worked out well.

Off the top of my head, the only ones I can even think of that have been drafted in the first round are Casey Hampton, Ted Washington, Vince Wilfork, Haloti Ngata, and BJ Raji.

You don't think Poe has a high bust rate? Poe is easily one of the biggest boom/bust players in this draft. He has huge potential, but just because others have succeeded, doesn't mean he will.

Halsey
04-29-2012, 09:39 PM
Fail is a relative term. Many fans seem to think that any player who isn't above average, whatever average is, is a failure. I believe you have to take into account the investment made by the team. A 7th rounder who becomes an average starter should not be judged the same way as a 1st rounder who becomes an average starter.

That being said, many fans won't be happy unless Lamar Holmes becomes an above average starting tackle. He seems most likely among the Falcons Draft picks to be perceived as a fail.

vidae
04-29-2012, 10:18 PM
You don't think Poe has a high bust rate? Poe is easily one of the biggest boom/bust players in this draft. He has huge potential, but just because others have succeeded, doesn't mean he will.

Poe had three different defensive coordinators in three years at Memphis. He is boom or bust, but he has never had proper coaching in his life. And you can't teach the measurables.

I'm betting on RAC on this one. But of course I would, so shut up Caddy! :D

ChiFan24
04-29-2012, 11:06 PM
If I had to bet, I'd probably bet against Alshon Jeffery and Brandon Hardin becoming productive starters. But we'll see.

TonyGfortheTD
04-29-2012, 11:13 PM
If I had to take a guess, it'll be WR Devon Wylie.

Small, skinny WR that already has injury concerns? Sounds like an easy bet to me.

jth1331
04-30-2012, 09:16 AM
Ah, I remember everyone on here commenting how Aaron Curry would be a sure fire lock, and now look at him.

StripedWalrus
04-30-2012, 09:53 AM
I'd say he's clearly a bust right now, but he could turn it around I guess. Compared to other tackles (or other players, for that matter) taken Top 5 in previous years, he hasn't done anything noteworthy.

He's also probably one of the worst tackles out of all the ones selected in the first two rounds in 2009. Eugene Monroe, Michael Oher, Phil Loadholt, Sebastian Vollmer, give me any of those guys before Smith. Maybe even Andre Smith too.

He's been injured, so you could call him an Injury Bust, but the fact of the matter is that he hasn't lived up to the expectations of a second overall pick.

I would def take Andre Smith over him right now. Andre Smith has been a solid Right tackle after his injuries.

LonghornsLegend
04-30-2012, 10:24 AM
Not yet. They say he's healthy and looks good. The Rams new o-line coach said it was his poor technique that was hindering him too. He said Smith would try to punish the defender on each play, instead of just trying to block him. He said he can fix Smith's flaws and Smith will be a really good RT.


You Rams fans are starting to get as bad as Bucs fans around here. Every pick was a projected 1st rounder in some form or fashion and the crappy players on your team are only crappy because of bad coaching, injuries, or no talent around them. Everyone is a really good player deep down.


Did I miss anything?

Blackluck
04-30-2012, 10:29 AM
for the pats, everyone after round 1 for me will bust, except i can see dennard sticking around for a little while

I agree with this except Dennard. He'll also bust.

bigbluedefense
04-30-2012, 10:34 AM
All of em. Our entire draft was really boom or bust. We went with a lot of project players.

ElectricEye
04-30-2012, 10:34 AM
Tavon Wilson is as safe of a bet as they come for that one. We've been developing a large portfolio of defensive backs who don't stick with the team for very long with second and third round picks. After the pick, I did some real preliminary work on him on him and I just don't see it. Combining that with our track record on defensive backs and that we likely could have had him three rounds later(to be conservative), it just doesn't smell good to me.

NorrinRadd12
04-30-2012, 10:35 AM
Lavonte David. He'll get blocked pretty easily in the NFL.

coordinator0
04-30-2012, 03:52 PM
I hate to go with such a late pick, but it would have to be Tommy Streeter for the Ravens. He doesn't play special teams and he's a bit of a project, although what he can do right now (run vertical/deep routes) fits in well with Cameron's system. Osemele would be next on my list. He has all the physical tools to be a nice guard but his technique needs a lot of refinement. Other than Upshaw the rest of the picks were depth/special teams players so it's kind of hard seeing them not living up to that expectation.

JPF
04-30-2012, 06:03 PM
Frank Alexander for the Panthers. History tells us that players Marty Hurney trades a future draft pick to get the past few years (Jeff Otah, Everette Brown, Armanti Edwards) haven't panned out.

armageddon
04-30-2012, 07:07 PM
You Rams fans are starting to get as bad as Bucs fans around here. Every pick was a projected 1st rounder in some form or fashion and the crappy players on your team are only crappy because of bad coaching, injuries, or no talent around them. Everyone is a really good player deep down.


Did I miss anything?



I was just repeating what the Rams new o-line coach said about Smith.

thetedginnshow
04-30-2012, 07:36 PM
Coples. Definitely Coples. The rest will all be amazing.

Da-Phins
05-01-2012, 08:29 AM
Im gonna go with Olivier Vernon. Dont really see why Vernon is getting some hype. Sure he has "potential" to become a decent pass rusher in the NFL, but he really didnt do much in college in terms of getting to the QB. I think he had like 8 sacks or somewhere close to that.

Chargerfn909
05-01-2012, 10:50 AM
A LITTLE worried about Ingram, but I think he will excel if Pagano knows what he is doing.

I think Brandon Taylor will be out of the league within 2 years. Did not like this pick at all.

Bobo
05-01-2012, 04:23 PM
Coty Sensabaugh. I just don't think he'll be anything more than a 4th corner.

Maybe. I wish I could have seen more film of the guy to give my opinion. Seems many others did not think of him as anything more than a late rounder, so that's a bit worrisome.

Zach Brown worries me a bit. He seemed to not do all that well in zone coverage and the instincts were questionable along with taking some bad angles. He has the skillset to play Will and be in for sub packages though, and Gray talked about him being a better player when he's asked to play a more limited role basically. But what will that role be?

bigbuc
05-01-2012, 07:53 PM
Coples. Definitely Coples. The rest will all be amazing.

See i don't think so... Coples the 4-3 DE would fail, but Coples the 3-4 DE I think will be good. His tape was so much better when he was playing inside on the D Line.