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tjsunstein
05-01-2012, 06:13 PM
The 2012 draft class was weak but this draft is so much stronger. These aren't my rankings by any means, just meant for general discussion.

Defensive Ends:
1. William Gholston, Michigan State
2. Jackson Jeffcoat, Texas
3. Bjoern Werner, Florida State
4. Alex Okafor, Texas
5. Michael Buchanan, Illinois
6. Corey Lemonier, Auburn
7. John Simon, Ohio State
8. Devin Taylor, South Carolina
9. Dion Jordan, Oregon
10. Tank Carradine, Florida State
11. Ronald Powell, Florida

Outside Linebackers:
1. Jarvis Jones, Georgia
2. Barkevious Mingo, LSU
3. Brandon Jenkins, Florida State
4. Sam Montgomery, LSU
5. Sean Porter, Texas A&M
6. Chase Thomas, Stanford

Discussion, notes, facts, stats encouraged.

TuckNole
05-01-2012, 06:17 PM
FSU has 3. Add Tank Carradine. He will go before Werner and Jenkins IMO.

Matthew Jones
05-01-2012, 06:19 PM
I really like Devin Taylor. Tall, long-limbed, powerful, and has dropped into coverage regularly.

JRTPlaya21
05-01-2012, 06:49 PM
RoPo tore his ACL in the offseason so his status for the season is kind of a toss up.

Master Exploder
05-01-2012, 06:50 PM
Do you think Jarvis Jones's injury history will bump him down?

Don Vito
05-01-2012, 07:01 PM
The thought of Sam Montgomery on the other side of Chandler Jones with a combo of Mayo, Spikes, and Hightower in the middle makes me happy in the pants.

I really like a lot of these guys and I would like to see us cash in on at least one other front 7 player next April. Too much talent to pass up on.

OSUGiants17
05-01-2012, 07:06 PM
I love the combo of DEs at Texas this year, both of them have huge potential. I think Jarvis Jones, Barkevious Mingo, Jelani Jenkins, Brandon Jenkins, and Sean Porter will all be fantastic 3-4 OLBs. I am iffy on if Gholston can be a 3-4 OLB or not.

Duffman57
05-01-2012, 07:11 PM
I love the combo of DEs at Texas this year, both of them have huge potential. I think Jarvis Jones, Barkevious Mingo, Jelani Jenkins, Brandon Jenkins, and Sean Porter will all be fantastic 3-4 OLBs. I am iffy on if Gholston can be a 3-4 OLB or not.

Dont be iffy, he cant, plain and simple...

Jelani Jenkins i thought was more of a ILB in a 34? He's REAL small for a pass rusher at only 6' and like 235 if that.

Jones and Mingo are my favorites in this class.

Just a guy to add in...and this is coming from someone who has watched every one of his games for the last 2 years...and has a friend coaching him at Oregon...Dion Jordan is a FREAK, and a freaking MONSTER. 6'7" great burst, and EXTREMELY agile, already plays OLB, and sometimes they lined him up on the outside receiver (yeah, like on the sidelines) and had him bump the receiver to help out our young CB's. He's going to be a special player.

draftguru151
05-01-2012, 07:16 PM
Dominique Easley is the best everything. Jarvis Jones definitely looks like the top edge guy, hopefully he bulks up a bit though.

dannyz
05-01-2012, 07:21 PM
I Love the next couple of years for pass rushers. I saw nothing Special with any of the 2012 guys at all and don't think any of them will be Great but with this 2013 Class guys like Montgomery, Mingo, Werner, Gholston, Jeffcoat could all be Top 15 Picks or higher. I know the 2012 Draft just got over but I like Jadeveon Clowney and Aaron Lynch better than everybody in the 2012 Class as well.

keylime_5
05-01-2012, 07:43 PM
Simon is kinda like Melvin Ingram. I think he'll play linebacker - maybe ILB in a 2 gap system - when he gets to the NFL. 'Tweener in a negative way, but his work ethic is unreal and he is a player who can get in the backfield and make plays. Urban Meyer said the only one other player with his work ethic he's seen is Tim Tebow.

dannyz is right though, I can't wait for 2014 when we get Aaron Lynch and Jadeveon Clowney at DE (not to mention Sammy Watkins and Marquise Lee at WR).

mightytitan9
05-01-2012, 08:28 PM
lets not get too far ahead of ourselves, I mean last year people were saying Donte' Paige-Moss was a potential first rounder

P-L
05-01-2012, 08:58 PM
I love this class of pass rushers. KeKe Mingo is my favorite draft prospect this year. 6'5" 240 with a sub-4.50 40? Yes, please. At that weight he'll probably have to play in a 3-4, but he can flat out get to the quarterback. It's also impressive that 7/8 sacks and 9/11 hurries came against SEC competition.

RaiderNation
05-01-2012, 09:03 PM
Jones and Mingo have to be the top guys heading into the 2013 draft, both are physical freaks ready to break out in the SEC like many of the prospects before them.

Just like the last 2 years, there hasn't been a clear top DT prospect at the start of the draft process. Hopefully a sack artist can emerge like Fairley did as a one year wonder. Jesse Williams from 'Bama is someone to watch.

ElectricEye
05-01-2012, 09:09 PM
Yeah, Mingo's speed and acceleration when he turns the corner is absolutely bonkers. Jarvis Jones had an amazing season last year and has a chance to be even better this season. Big fan of those two as outside linebackers. Both have the potential to be elite level pass rushers in the NFL.

The class as a whole is very good too. Big fan of Bjoern Werner as a 4-3 guy. He's still learning the game, but his natural strength really makes him shine both as a pass rusher and against the run.

asdf1223
05-01-2012, 09:31 PM
Love both LSU DE's and Jarvis Jones. I think all 3 of them make great 3-4 OLBs.

holt_bruce81
05-01-2012, 09:38 PM
Can Mingo play DE in a 43?

ElectricEye
05-01-2012, 11:15 PM
Can Mingo play DE in a 43?

He would have to add at least 25 pounds. He has the frame to do it, but that's a lot of weight and it's not an ideal fit. I'm more interested in seeing the type of player he develops into without trying to mess with too much.

TuckNole
05-01-2012, 11:19 PM
Can Mingo play DE in a 43?

I'm iffy on that. But I actually think that Montgomery could. Despite playing at 245, he held the POA against pretty much everyone he faced. He is crazy strong, and plays really low. Just based on film, I like Montgomery better than Mingo, but that's just me.

SenorGato
05-02-2012, 08:21 AM
I'm iffy on that. But I actually think that Montgomery could. Despite playing at 245, he held the POA against pretty much everyone he faced. He is crazy strong, and plays really low. Just based on film, I like Montgomery better than Mingo, but that's just me.

I like Montgomery more as well.

Both Texas DEs are pretty nasty, especially Okafor.

killxswitch
05-02-2012, 08:41 AM
I read Bjoern Werner and was intrigued. I Googled him hoping to find this:

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20111223034736/elderscrolls/images/c/ca/Dovahkiin.png

but instead I found this:

http://a.espncdn.com/media/motion/2010/0203/Com_100203ESPNU_BJORNWERNER.jpg

Razor
05-02-2012, 08:56 AM
I think that Jarvis Jones and Mingo are overrated at this point tbh. I like Montgomery, Gholston and Lemonier much more at this point.

$0.02

cajuncorey
05-02-2012, 10:37 AM
i had a linebacker and his name was... mingo!

cmarq83
05-02-2012, 10:55 AM
I just don't like the chances of anybody named Bjoern making it in the NFL.

TuckNole
05-02-2012, 11:35 AM
I just don't like the chances of anybody named Bjoern making it in the NFL.

Oh come on, he's perfect for Chris Berman:

"...and Bjoern-to-do-this Werner gets the sack"

tjsunstein
05-02-2012, 05:15 PM
Looking at early 2013 draft info and such, McShay has Michael Buchanan, DE Illinois mocked into the first round.

prock
05-02-2012, 05:23 PM
Oh come on, he's perfect for Chris Berman:

"...and Bjoern-to-do-this Werner gets the sack"

Bjoern-to-run Werner.

Vikes99ej
05-02-2012, 05:24 PM
I just don't like the chances of anybody named Bjoern making it in the NFL.

And Barkevious is any better?

ElectricEye
05-02-2012, 05:37 PM
Looking at early 2013 draft info and such, McShay has Michael Buchanan, DE Illinois mocked into the first round.

That's a good name to bring up, I had forgotten about him a little bit. He really stood out when I fist started initially looking Mercilus. More so than Mercilus, even. He still needs to add weight and get stronger, but he wins more battles at the point of attack than you would expect from a guy that lanky. Tackles can completely lock him out if they win the initial battle, but he gets a really good initial get off to counter that. That plays well with his length, something that NFL teams are always looking for in pass rushers. He doesn't seem to have a wide array of pass rush moves, but that's not something I usually concern myself too much with.

Looks he he could have some value as an OLB in a 3-4 as well.

SenorGato
05-02-2012, 05:53 PM
Looking at early 2013 draft info and such, McShay has Michael Buchanan, DE Illinois mocked into the first round.

Don't know about that because there's plenty of time, but he could be seen all over the field. Seemed like a savvy mover and he's got good length.

Not my favorite pass rusher but an interesting player.

Ozzy
05-03-2012, 10:04 PM
Outside of the guys already talked about here are a few more.

Jamie Collins Southern Miss- Kid is elite, had a sick game against Houston, fast as can be off the edge and is your true speed rusher around the corner.

Prince Shembo Notre Dame JR- very good prospect with a ton of ability.


Damontre Moore Texas A&M JR- solid year last season in place of Von Miller being gone.

D.T. Shackelford Ole Miss- coming off an injury, could be an elite pass rushing on the outside in a 3/4 if he comes back healthy.




Players with a lot of talent but not much production so far in their career, kind of under preformed but all match the big tall rangy outside linebacker prospect potentially in a 3/4.

Craig Roh Michigan
Sean Fisher Nebraska
Cornelius Washington Georgia



A few others...

Walter Stewart Cincinnati - always loved his athletic ability, has never really put it all together, but is a great talent with tons of experience ever since he was a redshirt freshman.

Earl Okine Florida- ideal size for any 4/3 DE, just a freak size wise, if he has production he will be a pretty high pick.

Malliciah Goodman Clemson- should have a breakout year for the Tigers.





Not wildy productive but all have pass rushing potential and could have break out years. I know Miles Nash was moved to a different position but hopefully they put him back on D.

Gerald Rivers Ole Miss
Taylor Wyndham Kentucky
Colton Miles-Nash Arkansas





Good conversation topic, especially with this years draft, almost every single speed rusher, regardless of strength got pick just because of their speed rushing and pass rushing abilities. Good trait to have I guess and is becoming even more valuable with the expansion of the 3/4 defense using multiple options at OLB, not just the past standard player there.


But to be honest Jadeveon Clowney as a pass rush prospect is better than all of these players potentially, not in next years draft though.

P-L
05-04-2012, 09:03 AM
Roh has bulked up significantly and will be playing the 5-tech this season at Michigan. He's coming into the season at 6'6" 270 and still might have more room to grow. He never really developed his pass rush moves (spent most of his second year as a linebacker in the 3-3-5), but is very solid against the run. I think he's going to be a 5-tech at the next level, if he can continue to add weight.

bruschis4all
05-04-2012, 11:11 AM
I see a lot of lists with Jarvis Jones on it. He didn't pass USC's physical. All they had to do was give him a scholie. He may not pass a lot of teams physical. The other Georgia de - Cornelius Washington 6'4" 270lb supposedly ran a 4.4 last summer. Georgia moving him from olb in 3-4 to de. Keep an eye out for him if he's that fast.

http://www.dawgbark.net/blog.aspx?blog=450

Ozzy
05-04-2012, 08:38 PM
bruschis4all I see a lot of lists with Jarvis Jones on it. He didn't pass USC's physical. All they had to do was give him a scholie. He may not pass a lot of teams physical. The other Georgia de - Cornelius Washington 6'4" 270lb supposedly ran a 4.4 last summer. Georgia moving him from olb in 3-4 to de. Keep an eye out for him if he's that fast.


Ummmmmmm

Jarvis Jones was a First team All American and started all 14 games, had 70 tackles including 19.5 TFL and 13.5 sacks to go along with two forced fumbles, two PBUs and 49 QBPs.

Ummm I think he is just fine


Washington did not half even half of the numbers Jones did last year, and to me Jones is clearly the better of the two players.

TuckNole
05-05-2012, 04:16 PM
Ummmmmmm

Jarvis Jones was a First team All American and started all 14 games, had 70 tackles including 19.5 TFL and 13.5 sacks to go along with two forced fumbles, two PBUs and 49 QBPs.

Ummm I think he is just fine


Washington did not half even half of the numbers Jones did last year, and to me Jones is clearly the better of the two players.

Still, you have to wonder why USC wouldn't clear him.

Raiderz4Life
05-05-2012, 04:30 PM
Gholston Okafor and Jordan are gonna be on my watch list.

TACKLE
05-08-2012, 10:30 PM
Dion Jordan is my favorite pass rush prospect at the moment. Phenomenal athlete. He's super long and lanky (he'll need to put on weight and I assume he will) but at the same time he's very explosive, can play physical at the point (he's played some end in a 30 front), really knows how to use his hands, can bend around the corner and plays hard every snap. Often we see these lanky guys who are kinda soft at the point and still are kinda uncoordinated/awkward but Jordan possess that toughness and fluidity.

SenorGato
05-09-2012, 12:00 AM
Jordan is definitely interesting.

Duffman57
05-09-2012, 12:42 AM
Dion Jordan is my favorite pass rush prospect at the moment. Phenomenal athlete. He's super long and lanky (he'll need to put on weight and I assume he will) but at the same time he's very explosive, can play physical at the point (he's played some end in a 30 front), really knows how to use his hands, can bend around the corner and plays hard every snap. Often we see these lanky guys who are kinda soft at the point and still are kinda uncoordinated/awkward but Jordan possess that toughness and fluidity.

As an Oregon student, i've been pimpin Jordan's name since early this season. He's so freakishly fluid that he basically lines up as a Cover 2 CB on a solid amount of snaps for us to help us with our young CB's. Pressed the outside WR and dropped into playing the flats...how many 6'7" 245 guys u know that can do that...lol. But he's a freakish athlete. He's also one of the most physical players on the D.

I also am really liking what i've seen out of Alex Okafor. Extremely athletic and is one of those pass rushers that gets by off pure burst and strength. Very Orakpo esque.

SenorGato
05-09-2012, 01:45 AM
I hope Okafor blows up production wise like Orakpo, but I do think he's a little more fluid.

Duffman57
05-09-2012, 01:56 AM
I hope Okafor blows up production wise like Orakpo, but I do think he's a little more fluid.

Yah, he looks it.

By the way, my dislike for Brandon Jenkins still stands. He still plays small, gets driven back, doesn't look to have even functional strength, and honestly, once he's locked onto an OL, he's screwed, no hand use to get around the OT and not enough strength to just pure bull rush him.

SenorGato
05-09-2012, 10:28 AM
^^ I just don't trust FSU. I really thought Brown would be a stud but not so much.

villagewarrior
05-09-2012, 07:17 PM
So I've been watching Mingo and Montgomery the last couple days and right now I'm leaning into the Mingo camp. I think he is a smoother athlete. Biggest knock on Monty I've seen is he has many false steps coming out of a 3 point stance. Maybe if you stand him up the false steps will disappear, but if his coach can fix his technique he will gain another step on his opponent, and he is already so explosive it'll make him even more dangerous.

TACKLE
05-09-2012, 07:25 PM
So I've been watching Mingo and Montgomery the last couple days and right now I'm leaning into the Mingo camp. I think he is a smoother athlete. Biggest knock on Monty I've seen is he has many false steps coming out of a 3 point stance. Maybe if you stand him up the false steps will disappear, but if his coach can fix his technique he will gain another step on his opponent, and he is already so explosive it'll make him even more dangerous.

It's his stance. He gets in that stance where he's so low to the ground and so overextended that he has to pop up and take a couple extra steps just to get his feet under him.

villagewarrior
05-09-2012, 08:24 PM
It's his stance. He gets in that stance where he's so low to the ground and so overextended that he has to pop up and take a couple extra steps just to get his feet under him.

Exactly, I hope they aren't teaching him that stance. If he can shorten up I think his game will go to a whole new level.

ATLDirtyBirds
05-09-2012, 08:42 PM
I've watched a good amount of Jackson Jeffcoat tape. Really smart player. Plays the run well. Not tremendously explosive, but knows how to use his hands and has a power element to his game.

Duffman57
05-10-2012, 02:22 AM
I've watched a good amount of Jackson Jeffcoat tape. Really smart player. Plays the run well. Not tremendously explosive, but knows how to use his hands and has a power element to his game.

Agreed. Seems like more of a hustle rusher with a lot of strength. Plays bigger than his listed 249 (or whatever it is). Okafor is clearly the better pass rusher, and a more explosive player in general IMO. I think they can both be real good though.

Pontus
05-10-2012, 03:22 AM
Bjoern-to-run Werner.

Björn-to-rush is even better ;)

villagewarrior
05-10-2012, 08:49 AM
I've watched a good amount of Jackson Jeffcoat tape. Really smart player. Plays the run well. Not tremendously explosive, but knows how to use his hands and has a power element to his game.

He's going to have to turn it on a bit to impress me. Haven't studied him to extensively I've just not seen him flash when I watch Texas.

ATLDirtyBirds
05-10-2012, 11:05 AM
He's going to have to turn it on a bit to impress me. Haven't studied him to extensively I've just not seen him flash when I watch Texas.


He's the only one I've seen like 3-4 tapes on thus far. Definitely doesn't look like a "freak" or anything like that, but he looks like a real solid football player.

ATLDirtyBirds
05-10-2012, 11:16 AM
Dion Jordan is the person I've seen the second most. First game I watched was against Washington, and he really didn't look very physical. Good hand usage a nice little rip move, and impressive flexibility for his size. I thought he just ate up a slow footed right tackle, and wasn't overly impressed.

But if you can, (I don't know if it is on YouTube, I got it from another draft site) watch his game against Arizona. So impressive. Extremely active hands, variety of moves, knew how to disengage, etc. Needs to bulk up and stay lower in the run game, but I'm extremely impressed with this kid.

TuckNole
05-10-2012, 04:49 PM
Yah, he looks it.

By the way, my dislike for Brandon Jenkins still stands. He still plays small, gets driven back, doesn't look to have even functional strength, and honestly, once he's locked onto an OL, he's screwed, no hand use to get around the OT and not enough strength to just pure bull rush him.

You must have watched 2010 tape. Vastly improved in all those area in 2011. Still, I like Carradine and Werner's upsides more.

TuckNole
05-10-2012, 04:52 PM
^^ I just don't trust FSU. I really thought Brown would be a stud but not so much.

That makes no sense considering it is an entirely different coaching regime, S&C program, player development plan etc.

Everette Brown had zero coaching his entire career at school (his position coach was a Bowden family friend who was fired with Bowden and has not found employment in coaching since then to give you a sense). That is not the case with FSU's players now.

Duffman57
05-10-2012, 05:41 PM
You must have watched 2010 tape. Vastly improved in all those area in 2011. Still, I like Carradine and Werner's upsides more.

Watched a couple of his games this year. He improved in those areas a bit, but still was not good at it at all.

And it seems like their SC coach still sucks, because their prospects consistantly have lacked even functional playing strength, whether it be OL, DL or LB, they all just look like they can't hang in even college games.

SenorGato
05-10-2012, 06:59 PM
That makes no sense considering it is an entirely different coaching regime, S&C program, player development plan etc.

Everette Brown had zero coaching his entire career at school (his position coach was a Bowden family friend who was fired with Bowden and has not found employment in coaching since then to give you a sense). That is not the case with FSU's players now.

Makes some sense considering they haven't pumped out anything of significance yet.

It'll be great if things turn arouns next year because Jenkins and that JC DE are interesting.

TuckNole
05-13-2012, 01:40 AM
Watched a couple of his games this year. He improved in those areas a bit, but still was not good at it at all.

And it seems like their SC coach still sucks, because their prospects consistantly have lacked even functional playing strength, whether it be OL, DL or LB, they all just look like they can't hang in even college games.

FSU had a dominating defense this year, that very easily imposed its will on other teams offensive lines, including OU, Miami, UF, and ND, all teams who had future NFL players on their lines. Go read Shakin the Southland, the Clemson blog, where they talk about how jealous they are of FSU's new S&C program.

In terms of prospects, Jimbo has been the HC for 2 years. The first kids who benefited from the new player development plans haven't even entered the draft yet.

TuckNole
05-13-2012, 01:44 AM
Makes some sense considering they haven't pumped out anything of significance yet.

The regime change just happened 2 years ago and there are barely any seniors the last 2 years. What exactly would be expecting?

ATLDirtyBirds
05-14-2012, 07:16 AM
I've seen 3 tapes so far. Jarvis Jones needs a few other moves. If he could bulk up a bit, and add a little more to his arsenal, he'd be a terror.

SenorGato
05-14-2012, 08:15 AM
The regime change just happened 2 years ago and there are barely any seniors the last 2 years. What exactly would be expecting?

That's convenient.