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Scotty D
05-11-2012, 04:54 AM
4-3

DE
1.Jared Allen
2.Julius Peppers
3.Jason Pierre Paul
4.Jason Babin
5.Trent Cole

DT
1.Ndamukong Suh
2.Kevin Williams
3.Geno Atkins
4.Richard Seymour
5.Henry Melton / Karl Klug / Jurrell Casey (tie)

OLB
1.Von Miller
2.Lance Briggs
3.Sean Weatherspoon
4.Chad Greenway
5.Daryl Smith


MLB
1.Brian Urlacher
2.D’Qwell Jackson
3.Curtis Lofton
4.London Fletcher
5.James Laurinaitis

3-4

DE
1.Haloti Ngata
2.Justin Smith
3.JJ Watt
4.Calais Campbell
5.Ray McDonald

NT
1.Vince Wilfork
2.BJ Raji
3.Sione Pouha
4.Jay Ratliff
5.Cam Thomas

OLB
1.Terrell Suggs
2.DeMarcus Ware
3.Clay Matthews
4.Tamba Hali
5.Aldon Smith

ILB
1.Patrick Willis
2.Jerod Mayo
3.Lawrence Timmons
4.Navorro Bowman
5.Sean Lee

CB
1.Darrelle Revis
2.Nnamdi Asomugah
3.Jonathon Joseph
4.Ladarius Webb
5.Joe Haden

S
1.Ed Reed
2.Adrian Wilson
3.Eric Weddle
4.Troy Polamalu
5.Kam Chancellor

Sloopy
05-11-2012, 06:01 AM
I didn't really pay attention to the top 5 offensive players thread. Is this top 5 this season? or top 5 overall?

Scotty D
05-11-2012, 06:12 AM
I didn't really pay attention to the top 5 offensive players thread. Is this top 5 this season? or top 5 overall?

Top 5 overall. Not really a prediction of the Top 5 players for next season but its more if you held a gun to my head and told me to list the Top 5 players right now.

Bixby (Thumper)
05-11-2012, 07:22 AM
4-3 Defensive Ends:
1. Jared Allen
2. Trent Cole
3. Julius Peppers
4. Jason Pierre-Paul
5. Charles Johnson


Trent Cole is extremely underrated, still. He doesn't get his due when people talk about elite defensive ends because people still put him beneath Allen, Peppers and now Jason Pierre-Paul. He's just as good, if not better. He's had 55 sacks the past 5 years (and never less than 9 in a season) and he's also one of the best run stoppers in the NFL at his spot. The only pass rushers who beat those numbers are DeMarcus Ware and Jared Allen.
I put Charles Johnson at #5 because IMO he's the best combination of run stopping / pass rushing out of all the 4-3 ends after the top 4. 20.5 sacks the past two seasons along with 102 tackles.


4-3 DT
1. Geno Atkins
2. Kevin Williams
3. Richard Seymour
4. Ahtyba Rubin
5. Brodrick Bunkley


Brodrick Bunkley is one of those guys you don't appreciate until he's gone. He's an absolute animal in run support. Look at the Eagles rush defense before Bunkley started, look at what happened when he took over as a starter and look what happened when he was traded away (the numbers reflect his presence). Then look at the numbers in Denver. He. Just. Stops. The. Run. Incredibly strong. He'll improve the Saints' running game and he'll free up Curtis Lofton to do what the Saints are paying him to do. Bunkley is really an under the radar player who deserves more respect.


4-3 OLB
1. Sean Weatherspoon
2. Daryl Smith
3. Von Miller
4. Lance Briggs
5. Chad Greenway

3-4 DE
1. Justin Smith
2. Calais Campbell
3. JJ Watt
4. Haloti Ngata
5. Ray McDonald

3-4 NT
1. Sione Pouha
2. Vince Wilfork
3. Jay Ratliff
4. Casey Hampton
5. Paul Soliai

3-4 OLB
1. Clay Matthews
2. Terrell Suggs
3. James Harrison
4. DeMarcus Ware
5. Cameron Wake


Clay Matthews didn't show up on the stat sheet like he did last year but make no mistake, the dude is an animal. Best athlete at 3-4 OLB in the NFL. He can do it all. He can be a terror off the edge when rushing the passer and he's the best coverage 3-4 OLB in the NFL.


MLB
1. Patrick Willis
2. London Fletcher
3. Brian Cushing
4. Navarro Bowman
5. Daryl Washington / Lawrence Timmons


London Fletcher is STILL criminally underrated. This guy ages like wine. He's so crafty on the field. He led the NFL in tackles and stops last year. He had the second lowest passer rating when thrown at out of any ILB. He had the second lowest completion % when thrown at out of any ILB. He's an all around player who makes plays in all facets of the game and he is a veteran leader for the Redskins defense. The man is still an absolute stud. He really looks like he could play well into his forties. Also, just to blow your mind a little bit, Fletcher hasn't missed a game in his NFL career (that's 224 games). Think about that, a linebacker that has been active for 224 consecutive games. Linebackers take so much punishment and Fletcher hasn't missed a game, now look him in the eyes and tell him you can't play because your hammy hurts.

Ray Lewis is still awesome but he's not the dynamic playmaker he used to be. He'll still fill the heck out of a gap, be the heart and soul of a defense and play his heart out but he's not a game changer anymore. 2 sacks, 2 forced fumbles, 2 TFL, 7 passes defended and 1 interception last year. Maybe it's just because I have a soft spot for athleticism but I'd take young, dynamic playmakers like Daryl Washington and Lawrence Timmons over an old Ray Lewis. Daryl Washington had 5 sacks, 2 interceptions, 7 passes defended and 11 TFL loss last year. Lawrence Timmons had a down year last year b/c he moved around more but in the two years prior he had 10 sacks, 6 forced fumbles, 2 interceptions, 13 passes defended and 14 TFL.


CB:
1. Darrelle Revis
2. Nnamdi Asomugha
3. Jonathan Joseph
4. Brent Grimes
5. Brandon Flowers


When do we start talking about Revis as an all-time great?
People saying Nnamdi had a down year are out of their minds. He led the NFL in snaps per target (11.5) and he was 5th in the NFL in yards/coverage snap (.7 yards per coverage snap). Still shutdown. Victor Cruz is pretty much his kryptonite though.
I anticipate adding Patrick Peterson to the top 3 of this list next year.


Safety
1. Ed Reed
2. Troy Polamalu
3. Eric Weddle
4. Tyvon Branch
5. Jairus Byrd


I'm going with conventional wisdom on this one. Ed Reed is still dangerous as hell in deep coverage. Troy Polamalu might not be as agile in coverage but he's got a nose for the ball and he's a difference maker in run support. These two are the top two for now but they've got a heap of young safeties ready to make the leap behind them.
Tyvon Branch is the best man coverage safety in the NFL. Runs like a corner and he's not afraid to stick his nose in there in run support. Just a beast.
Jairus Byrd is a poor man's Ed Reed. He's not a strong run supporter but if you target him deep, he can make you pay. Rangy center field type FS.
And there are a couple younger players who I think are right on the cusp of making this list like Earl Thomas, Eric Berry, Nate Allen, Kam Chancellor and Malcolm Jenkins. They've all got the talent, all they need is a big season.

Rosebud
05-11-2012, 07:44 AM
No offense, but Kiwi's not even the best OLB on his own team, hell Jacquain Williams is closer t o Kiwi than Kiwi is to Boley. He's a great run stuffer and is a good DE, but he's not that good as just a 4-3 OLB. Boley BTW should be in these lists, he's one of the few LBs that can really man up and shutdown the freak TEs that tore the NFL a new asshole this year. He's not a great run stuffer, but he's good there and a great pass rusher.

I'll try and post mine after work.

Scotty D
05-11-2012, 07:56 AM
No offense, but Kiwi's not even the best OLB on his own team, hell Jacquain Williams is closer t o Kiwi than Kiwi is to Boley. He's a great run stuffer and is a good DE, but he's not that good as just a 4-3 OLB. Boley BTW should be in these lists, he's one of the few LBs that can really man up and shutdown the freak TEs that tore the NFL a new asshole this year. He's not a great run stuffer, but he's good there and a great pass rusher.

I'll try and post mine after work.

I messed up with schemes and had to make a change. He got bumped off but you make good points.

DoughBoy
05-11-2012, 07:59 AM
Boley and Bulluck were on the same team at one time.... If only KB didnt shred his knee, that would probably be the best coverage LBer units of all-time.

scottyboy
05-11-2012, 08:05 AM
yay, new more eagles homers, just what we need!

i like Scotty's list, I'd say Corey Webster is better than Webb, don't think Webb's top 5, but other than that, very solid list. I might post my own

Sloopy
05-11-2012, 08:15 AM
3-4 OLB
1. Clay Matthews
2. Terrell Suggs
3. James Harrison
4. DeMarcus Ware
5. Cameron Wake


Clay Matthews didn't show up on the stat sheet like he did last year but make no mistake, the dude is an animal. Best athlete at 3-4 OLB in the NFL. He can do it all. He can be a terror off the edge when rushing the passer and he's the best coverage 3-4 OLB in the NFL.


I'm not saying he isn't, but it is certainly debatable as he isn't clearly the best 3-4 OLB in coverage. Both Suggs and Ware are no slouches and last year in the playoffs, Suggs man covered Dre at times during the game.

Just saying

Giantsfan1080
05-11-2012, 08:18 AM
yay, new more eagles homers, just what we need!

i like Scotty's list, I'd say Corey Webster is better than Webb, don't think Webb's top 5, but other than that, very solid list. I might post my own

Webb actually reminds me a lot of Webster. He flys under the radar like Webster but he is that good. I don't have a problem with him top 5. I've also come to the point where I don't care where Webster ends up on these rankings. We know he's great and that's all I care about. It's like the Eli situation.

RCAChainGang
05-11-2012, 08:20 AM
Freeney and Mathis dropped off everyone's list? I understand cause they are getting up in age and it was a rough year.

Sloopy
05-11-2012, 08:28 AM
4-3

DE
1.Jared Allen
2.Jason Pierre Paul
3.Jason Babin
4. Chris Long
5.Trent Cole

DT
1.Ndamukong Suh
2.Kevin Williams
3.Geno Atkins
4.Athyba Rubin
5. Cullen Jenkins

OLB
1.Von Miller
2.Lance Briggs
3.Sean Weatherspoon
4.Chad Greenway
5.Daryl Smith

I can't even argue with the OP on 4-3 OLB, it's pretty accurate

MLB
1.D’Qwell Jackson
2.London Fletcher
3.James Laurinaitis
4. David Hawthorne
5. Brian Urlacher

Urlacher is being a little overrated in his old age but you can't keep him off a top 5 list

3-4

DE
1.Justin Smith
2. Haloti Ngata
3.JJ Watt
4.Calais Campbell
5.Ray McDonald

NT
1.Vince Wilfork
2. Sione Pouha
3. Isaac Sapoaga
4. Paul Soliai
5. Casey Hampton

OLB
1.Terrell Suggs
2.DeMarcus Ware
3. Clay Matthews III
4. Aldon Smith
5. Tamba Hali

ILB
1.Patrick Willis
2. Brian Cushing
3. David Harris
4.Navorro Bowman
5. Ray Lewis

Lewis may be slipping and close to retirement, but like Urlacher, you can't make a list without him.

CB
1.Darrelle Revis
2.Nnamdi Asomugah
3.Jonathon Joseph
4.Ladarius Webb
5.Joe Haden

Again can't argue with the OP here

S
1.Ed Reed
2.Adrian Wilson
3.Eric Weddle
4.Troy Polamalu
5.Kam Chancellor

Same here

EDIT: Justin Smith over Haloti Ngata

K Train
05-11-2012, 08:36 AM
I am gonna have to think about 43 linebackers, but i got 34 linebackers and both defenses dlines

4-3

DE
1.Julius Peppers
2.Jared Allen
3.Dwight Freeney
4.Mario Williams
5.Jason Pierre Paul

DT
1.Ndamukong Suh
2.Kevin Williams
3.Richard Seymour
4.Marcel Dareus
5.Kyle Williams


3-4

DE
1.Haloti Ngata
2.Justin Smith
3.JJ Watt
4.Darnell Dockett
5.Brett Keisel

NT
1.Vince Wilfork
2.BJ Raji
3.Sione Pouha
4.Jay Ratliff
5.??????

OLB
1.Demarcus Ware
2.James Harrison
3.Clay Matthews
4.Tamba Hali
5.Lamaar Woodley

ILB
1.Patrick Willis
2.Jerod Mayo
3.Brian Cushing
4.David Harris
5.Lawrence Timmons

CB
1.Darrelle Revis
2.Nnamdi Asomugah
3.Asante Samuel
4.Joe Haden
5.Jonathan Joseph

S
1.Ed Reed
2.Eric Berry
3.Troy Polamalu
4.Malcolm Jenkins
5.Antrel Rolle

Bixby (Thumper)
05-11-2012, 08:39 AM
Webb actually reminds me a lot of Webster. He flys under the radar like Webster but he is that good. I don't have a problem with him top 5. I've also come to the point where I don't care where Webster ends up on these rankings. We know he's great and that's all I care about. It's like the Eli situation.

By what objective measure is Corey Webster great?

Webster is good, no doubt but are you Giants fans really going to get your panties in a bunch because people aren't saying he's top 5? There is literally no argument you could make that would say he's top 5. Top 15? Absolutely. Top 10? Sure, you could argue that. But top 5? Eh..

Giantsfan1080
05-11-2012, 08:45 AM
By what objective measure is Corey Webster great?

Webster is good, no doubt but are you Giants fans really going to get your panties in a bunch because people aren't saying he's top 5? There is literally no argument you could make that would say he's top 5. Top 15? Absolutely. Top 10? Sure, you could argue that. But top 5? Eh..

Did I say Webster belongs in the top 5? Umm no I didn't. I just said no one ranks him properly when doing CB rankings. You've been around for only 10 minutes but we used to have posters leaving him out of top 10 and 15 rankings. Like I said I don't care at this point and yes I think he's great. Since the 07 playoff run he's shut down pretty much every WR on him except for Vincent Jackson and a few other taller WR's. If I had to put a rank on him I'd say he's in the 6-8 range. You're not fooling anyone JBCX.

Bixby (Thumper)
05-11-2012, 09:09 AM
Did I say Webster belongs in the top 5? Umm no I didn't. I just said no one ranks him properly when doing CB rankings.


This is a thread about the "top five at each position (defense)", no? If you don't think Webster belongs in the top five then why are you complaining about people not respecting him?

scottyboy
05-11-2012, 09:09 AM
By what objective measure is Corey Webster great?

Webster is good, no doubt but are you Giants fans really going to get your panties in a bunch because people aren't saying he's top 5? There is literally no argument you could make that would say he's top 5. Top 15? Absolutely. Top 10? Sure, you could argue that. But top 5? Eh..

what? After your homer list you're coming out with this? I said i feel he's better than Webb, that's it. And with webb in the top 5, it'd put Webster there. He's borderline top 5, I just feel he's better than webb, although webb is a superb corner.

How many accounts are you going to make?

Bixby (Thumper)
05-11-2012, 09:15 AM
what? After your homer list you're coming out with this? I said i feel he's better than Webb, that's it. And with webb in the top 5, it'd put Webster there. He's borderline top 5, I just feel he's better than webb, although webb is a superb corner.

I wasn't actually going to take issue with your homer comment but since you're bringing it up again... How am I a homer for listing Trent Cole and Nnamdi Asomugha as top five players at their positions? I had more Cowboys (Ratliff, Ware, Carr) on my lists than Eagles.

EDIT: Additionally, two others had Cole in their top 5 and three out of three lists made already (not by me) had Nnamdi in their top 5. Clearly I'm just a crazed homer though. Wtf.

How many accounts are you going to make?

What? :confuse:

scottyboy
05-11-2012, 09:18 AM
Cole over JPP and mainly Peppers

Bunkley top 5. He's the same as webster, excellent player, top 10, but not top 5.

bigbluedefense
05-11-2012, 09:49 AM
Honestly, I don't know if I'd put Pepp in my top 5 DEs. I have to think about it.

bigbluedefense
05-11-2012, 09:51 AM
Well, let me rephrase that. He's not a top 5 edge guy. By edge guy I'm grouping 4-3 DEs along with 3-4 OLBs.

K Train
05-11-2012, 09:55 AM
he might not show up as a top sack guy consistently, but every single time i watch him he makes a ridiculous impact

bigbluedefense
05-11-2012, 09:57 AM
When his motor is on. If Peppers motor was on all the time he'd be a HOFer and arguably in a GOAT conversation.

Sloopy
05-11-2012, 10:09 AM
what? After your homer list you're coming out with this? I said i feel he's better than Webb, that's it. And with webb in the top 5, it'd put Webster there. He's borderline top 5, I just feel he's better than webb, although webb is a superb corner.

How many accounts are you going to make?

As a Ravens fan I have to agree with this.

Webster has put up more seasons of note when putting them in a list for top 5 overall.

Other than this year, Webb has been a nickel/dime guy.

If this is an overall list, Webb may not even belong on it

If we are making the list based on this year alone, Webb is probably top 5 but if its this year alone I need to change my list.

Pack_Attack_4
05-11-2012, 01:14 PM
My reputation took a huge hit bec I did this top 5 OFF . So please be kind

DE
1.Allen
2.Peppers
3.JPP
4.Cole
5.Willaims

DT
1.Suh
2.Ngata
3.K.Williams
4.Wilfork
5.Raji

OLB
1.Suggs
2.Ware
3.Matthews
4.Briggs
5.Harrison

MLB
1.Willis
2.Urlacher
3.Lewis
4.Fletcher
5.Jackson

CB
1. Revis
2.Namdi
3.Woodson ( my fav player)
4.Joseph
5.Webb

S
1.Reed
2.Troy
3.Weddell
4.Berry
5.Earl Thomas

gpngc
05-11-2012, 01:18 PM
Ed Reed is one of the greatest players in NFL history but AT THIS POINT IN TIME he is not near the No. 1 safety in the NFL. Sooooo... lifetime achievement, fine, but there are definitely a bunch of safeties I'd rather have than him RIGHT NOW.

Rosebud
05-11-2012, 01:20 PM
When his motor is on. If Peppers motor was on all the time he'd be a HOFer and arguably in a GOAT conversation.

His motor has been pretty damn consistently on playing infront of Urlacher and Briggs.

VernonLawson89
05-11-2012, 01:28 PM
http://photojournalist.blogs.pressdemocrat.com/files/2012/01/49ers_blog_015.jpg

SuperMcGee
05-11-2012, 01:36 PM
Jairus Byrd is a poor man's Ed Reed. He's not a strong run supporter but if you target him deep, he can make you pay. Rangy center field type FS.

I think statements like this are too influenced by his rookie year. Byrd has improved astronomically in the run game. Always takes the right angle and makes a whole lot more plays inside the box.

phlysac
05-11-2012, 02:37 PM
Safety
1. Ed Reed
2. Troy Polamalu
3. Eric Weddle
4. Tyvon Branch
5. Jairus Byrd


And there are a couple younger players who I think are right on the cusp of making this list like Earl Thomas, Eric Berry, Nate Allen, Kam Chancellor and Malcolm Jenkins. They've all got the talent, all they need is a big season.


How far down these lists would one expect to see a name like Dashon Goldson?

YAYareaRB
05-11-2012, 02:51 PM
could a case be made for Dashon Goldson? played out of this world last season on a stacked defense

Raiderz4Life
05-11-2012, 02:57 PM
Imma agree with Scotty, Bixby's list doesn't sit right with me. Cole at 2 no way, Bunkley no, Nnamdi...maybe but idk.

G Mobile
05-11-2012, 03:17 PM
Ed Reed is one of the greatest players in NFL history but AT THIS POINT IN TIME he is not near the No. 1 safety in the NFL. Sooooo... lifetime achievement, fine, but there are definitely a bunch of safeties I'd rather have than him RIGHT NOW.

I think there are a ton of safeties who offer more in run defense, but no one makes more of an impact in the passing game than Ed Reed even still. He is a guy that must be accounted for on every snap and dynamically changes the back end. He still is the best center fielder out there.

BigBanger
05-11-2012, 03:32 PM
When his motor is on. If Peppers motor was on all the time he'd be a HOFer and arguably in a GOAT conversation.
If you don't think Peppers is making the Hall of Fame, then there aren't any DEs from the 00s that will (Strahan is the only DE that I think you could say was better than him without hesitating). Peppers is one of the most respected players in the game (especially at his position), and has been for about a decade now. I get the motor concern, but that is mostly overblown due to his one terrible season in Carolina when he couldn't beat TEs off the edge (when he had 2 or 2.5 sacks during the entire season). But he has been playing like a defensive MVP since he stepped foot in Chicago. He was even named NFC Defensive Player of the Year while in Carolina. He has 100 career sacks, 7 Pro Bowls, 5 All Pro's. He's been to a Super Bowl... And he's not done. He's still playing some of his best football with no talent around him on the front line. He's going to be a Hall of Famer, probably a first ballot guy.

Anyway...


4-3

DE

1. Jared Allen, Minnesota Vikings
2. Jason Pierre-Paul, New York Giants
3. Julius Peppers, Chicago Bears
4. Justin Tuck, New York Giants
5. Charles Johnson, Carolina Panthers
6. Mario Williams, Buffalo Bills
7. Trent Cole, Philadelphia Eagles
8. Chris Long, St Louis Rams
9. Jason Babin, Philadelphia Eagles
10. Dwight Freeney, Indianapolis Colts

There is a lot of competition for DEs and if you can't remember past last season, you probably forgot all about Justin Tuck. Since he had a strong finish and another good playoff run, I'm keeping him in the Top 5. Constant health problems have derailed a perennial All Pro defensive end, but there is no doubt that he is one of the prototype's where every year 43 defenses are looking for 'the next Justin Tuck'. Guys like Babin and Freeney fell on my list due to run defense issues (and Freeney's down season).


DT

1. Ndamukong Suh, Detroit Lions
2. Geno Atkins, Cincinnati Bengals
3. Richard Seymour, Oakland Raiders
4. Cullen Jenkins, Philadelphia Eagles


OLB

1. Von Miller, Denver Broncos
2. Jon Beason, Carolina Panthers
3. Lance Briggs, Chicago Bears
4. Sean Weatherspoon, Atlanta Falcons
5. Chad Greenway, Minnesota Vikings


MLB

1. Brian Urlacher, Chicago Bears
2. D’Qwell Jackson, Cleveland Browns
3. Paul Posluszny, Jacksonville Jaguars
4. James Laurinaitis, St Louis Rams
5. Curtis Lofton, New Orleans Saints

Jonathan Vilma sould make this list, but due to the suspension, it's hard to put him on him there.



3-4


DE

1. Haloti Ngata, Baltimore Ravens
2. Justin Smith, San Francisco 49ers
3. J.J. Watt, Houston Texans
4. Calais Campbell, Arizona Cardinals
5. Darnell Dockett, Arizona Cardinals


NT

1. Vince Wilfork, New England Patriots
2. Sione Pouha, New York Jets
3. BJ Raji, Green Bay Packers
4. Isaac Sopoaga, San Francisco 49ers
5. Paul Soliai, Miami Dolphins
6. Jay Ratliff, Dallas Cowboys
7. Antonio Garay, San Diego Chargers
8. Casey Hampton, Pittsburgh Steelers

Casey Hampton has been underrated his entire career since so many other players garner the attention with impact plays, but with his decline last year I think it shows how much of an impact he's had on that defense since he's been there. I think he's had a Hall of Fame caliber career and he should go down in history as one of the best NTs to ever play the game.


OLB

1. DeMarcus Ware, Dallas Cowboys
2. James Harrison, Pittsburgh Steelers
3. Terrell Suggs, Baltimore Ravens
4. LaMarr Woodley, Pittsburgh Steelers
5. Clay Matthews, Green Bay Packers
6. Tamba Hali, Kansas City Chiefs
7. Cameron Wake, Miami Dolphins
8. Brian Orakpo, Washington Redskins
9. Aldon Smith, San Francisco 49ers

Woodley seems to be the most underrated 34 OLB in the NFL. Until Suggs last two seasons I have had him (Woodley) ranked in the Top 3. But Suggs has actually improved his pass rushing so much over the last two seasons that he's now been in the argument for best defensive player in the NFL, let alone the best pass rusher or 34 OLB. His injury hurts him going into next season, but Suggs was arguably the best defensive player in the NFL last year. Hard to keep him out of the Top 3 for his position with that in mind. Aldon Smith was great, but he was great for a rookie. He's still a situational guy, but his talent and potential to be one of the best 34 OLBs in the NFL is certainly there. Right now he's a little too one dimensional (and hidden on a great defense) for me to put him ahead of some of the elite OLBs or guys just a notch below elite.


ILB

1. Patrick Willis, San Francisco 49ers
2. Derrick Johnson, Kansas City Chiefs
3. Lawrence Timmons, Pittsburgh Steelers
4. London Fletcher, Washington Redskins
5. Ray Lewis, Baltimore Ravens
6. NaVorro Bowman, San Francisco 49ers
7. David Harris, New York Jets
8. Jerod Mayo, New England Patriots
9. Sean Lee, Dallas Cowboys
10. Brian Cushing, Houston Texans


CB

1. Darrelle Revis, New York Jets
2. Joe Haden, Cleveland Browns
3. Jonathon Joseph, Houston Texans
4. Charles Woodson, Green Bay Packers
5. Carlos Rogers, San Francisco 49ers
6. Brandon Carr, Dallas Cowboys
7. Nnamdi Asomugah, Philadelphia Eagles
8. Brandon Flowers, Kansas City Chiefs
9. Corey Webster, New York Giants
10. Ladarius Webb, Baltimore Ravens


S

1. Troy Polamalu, Pittsburgh Steelers
2. Dashon Goldson, San Francisco 49ers
3. Ed Reed, Baltimore Ravens
4. Earl Thomas, Seattle Seahawks
5. Eric Weddle, San Diego Chargers
6. Eric Berry, Kansas City Chiefs
7. George Wilson, Buffalo Bills
8. Patrick Chung, New England Patriots

yo123
05-11-2012, 03:40 PM
A lot of you have Kevin Williams way too high. He's not nearly the player he used to be.

bigbluedefense
05-11-2012, 04:19 PM
If you don't think Peppers is making the Hall of Fame, then there aren't any DEs from the 00s that will (Strahan is the only DE that I think you could say was better than him without hesitating). Peppers is one of the most respected players in the game (especially at his position), and has been for about a decade now. I get the motor concern, but that is mostly overblown due to his one terrible season in Carolina when he couldn't beat TEs off the edge (when he had 2 or 2.5 sacks during the entire season). But he has been playing like a defensive MVP since he stepped foot in Chicago. He was even named NFC Defensive Player of the Year while in Carolina. He has 100 career sacks, 7 Pro Bowls, 5 All Pro's. He's been to a Super Bowl... And he's not done. He's still playing some of his best football with no talent around him on the front line. He's going to be a Hall of Famer, probably a first ballot guy.


I won't be surprised if he ends his career as a HOFer. I'm just not ready to put him there right here right now. He still has more to do before he's in the hall. Will he get there? Probably.

But if he played the game the way Jared Allen plays it, the guy would be an instant HOF player this very second, and would probably be in the conversation with Reggie White and Deacon Jones as GOAT for DEs. He had that kind of potential.

WCH
05-11-2012, 04:51 PM
If you don't think Peppers is making the Hall of Fame, then there aren't any DEs from the 00s that will (Strahan is the only DE that I think you could say was better than him without hesitating). Peppers is one of the most respected players in the game (especially at his position), and has been for about a decade now. I get the motor concern, but that is mostly overblown due to his one terrible season in Carolina when he couldn't beat TEs off the edge (when he had 2 or 2.5 sacks during the entire season). But he has been playing like a defensive MVP since he stepped foot in Chicago. He was even named NFC Defensive Player of the Year while in Carolina. He has 100 career sacks, 7 Pro Bowls, 5 All Pro's. He's been to a Super Bowl... And he's not done. He's still playing some of his best football with no talent around him on the front line. He's going to be a Hall of Famer, probably a first ballot guy.


125 sacks seems to be the magic number for HoF pass rushers (at least since they started recording sacks). Leslie O'Neal looks like the only guy to hit that mark who probably won't get in. Likewise, only a couple of modern pass rushers have gotten in without hitting the 125 mark.

Peppers will probably get there, but he's hardly a slam dunk at this point.

gsorace
05-11-2012, 05:29 PM
People are going to read this post and disregarded it as blatant homerism but I don't care.

David Harris is unquestionably better than Jerod Mayo and I have no idea how anybody can watch both players and come away thinking Mayo is better.

That is all.

asdf1223
05-11-2012, 06:20 PM
Adrian Wilson doesn't belong on these lists.

Grizzlegom
05-11-2012, 07:35 PM
I know Aldon Smith had a great rookie season and all but seeing him on top 5 lists for 34 OLB is really hard to justify IMO. He only played about half the defensive snaps for the 9ers and was rarely on the field in obvious running situations. To me, the top five, in any order, are far and away DeMarcus Ware, Tamba Hali, Cameron Wake, James Harrison, and Clay Matthews. Obviously Terrell Suggs would slot in there depending on whether you consider him a DE or OLB as he plays arguably the truest hybrid DE/OLB of anyone in the league.

Giantsfan1080
05-11-2012, 07:51 PM
Love Tuck but I understand why people have left him off after last year and I don't have a problem with it. When healthy he's top 5 easily but we don't see it often.

tjsunstein
05-11-2012, 08:05 PM
Peppers, Allen, and Pierre Paul should show up on all 43 DE lists.

I'm actually surprised that Woodson/Williams weren't on any non-Packer fan lists. They both had a ton of momentum going into last year. I guess it makes sense though because our defense was torched but it was mostly because of lack of anything in the front 7 other than Raji and Matthews, which brings me to Raji. Where is he on these lists? I have a hard time believing he isn't a top 5 NT/DE, something.

Splat
05-11-2012, 08:10 PM
I was ready for my Tamba Hali rant but he is getting some love so carry on.

TheFinisher
05-12-2012, 08:09 AM
Jay Ratliff has become pretty overrated and does not belong on any top 5 list. He was unique at the position when he was younger and still had that athleticism to consistently beat C/Gs to get in the backfield, it was pretty special. He would still struggle when asked to handle double teams but you accepted it because of his unusual ability to penetrate. However, he's really declined athletically over the past 3 years and no longer threatens the A Gap. Now he's just a very undersized NT who struggles holding the point, gets worn down by Halftime, and offers little in pass rushing situations... remember all the Dallas fans that wanted to draft a DL to generate more interior pressure?

Just off the top of my head; Raji, Wilfork, Sopoaga, Pouha, Soliai, and Garay are all true 34 NTs I'd take on my team before Ratliff. He's just living off name recognition at this point.


On another note, I'm happy to see Sean Lee getting a little love. He definitely deserves top 5 consideration at ILB, I think most Cowboy fans would agree that he was our best defensive player last season... and that includes DWare.

Sloopy
05-12-2012, 08:13 AM
Ed Reed is one of the greatest players in NFL history but AT THIS POINT IN TIME he is not near the No. 1 safety in the NFL. Sooooo... lifetime achievement, fine, but there are definitely a bunch of safeties I'd rather have than him RIGHT NOW.

Yes but this again isn't a this year thing.

Also, I still don't think you could count him out of say, a top 10. There just aren't enough good safeties in this league.

People are going to read this post and disregarded it as blatant homerism but I don't care.

David Harris is unquestionably better than Jerod Mayo and I have no idea how anybody can watch both players and come away thinking Mayo is better.

That is all.

Agreed (10 char)

TheFinisher
05-12-2012, 09:10 AM
Edge Players (43 DEs, 34 OLBs)

1. Jason Pierre-Paul
2. Jared Allen
3. Terrell Suggs
4. Demarcus Ware
5. Julius Peppers
6. James Harrison
7. Mario Williams
8. Tamba Hali
9. Trent Cole
10. Jason Babin

Interior Lineman (43 DTs, 34 DEs, 34 NTs)

1. Justin Smith
2. Haloti Ngata
3. Ndamukong Suh
4. Calais Campbell
5. Vince Wilfork
6. Darnell Dockett
7. Richard Seymour
8. B.J. Raji
9. Geno Atkins
10. Phil Taylor

Linebackers (43 M/W/S, 34 ILBs)

1. Patrick Willis
2. Brian Cushing
3. Navarro Bowman
4. Derrick Johnson
5. Lance Briggs
6. Lawrence Timmons
7. Ray Lewis
8. Brian Urlacher
9. David Harris
10. Jon Beason

Cornerbacks

1. Darrelle Revis
2. Johnathan Joseph
3. Nnamdi Asomugha
4. Joe Haden
5. Ladarius Webb
6. Brandon Flowers
7. Champ Bailey
8. Brandon Carr
9. Carlos Rogers
10. Corey Webster

Safeties

1. Troy Polamalu
2. Eric Weddle
3. Ed Reed
4. Eric Berry
5. George Wilson
6. Earl Thomas
7. Dashon Goldson
8. Tyvon Branch
9. Kam Chancellor
10. Jairus Byrd

Bixby (Thumper)
05-12-2012, 10:24 AM
I'm going to break step and actually make an argument for my guy. :freakout:

Trent Cole is being underrated in this thread. Perhaps some of you need to see more Trent Cole because let me tell you, he is dominant. Let me say this again: In the past five years, Trent Cole has 55 sacks (thats 11 per year). Do you know who has more in that same time frame? Jared Allen and DeMarcus Ware. That. Is. It.

Year in and year out, there's Trent Cole, producing. In the past five years he's never had less than 9 sacks and he's only missed three games. Who else has that sort of reliability and consistency? Nobody.


Each of the past three years he's been top five in total QB disruptions. He was fifth in 2011 despite missing two games. He was third in 2010. He was fifth in 2009. And that includes 3-4 outside linebackers. If you were to only include 4-3 ends Trent Cole would've placed 3rd in 2011, 2nd in 2010 and 4th in 2009. Even when he's not putting up sacks, he's making an impact.
He's been top seven in stops per snap played over the past three years. He was 7th in 2011, 4th in 2010 and 4th in 2009. He's not just a pass rusher, he's a run stopper too.
In total stops he was 10th in 2011 despite playing significantly fewer snaps than anyone else in the top ten. He was third in 2009. He was fourth in 2008.
When teams ran to Trent Cole's side in 2011 they averaged 2.42 yards per carry, the second best mark in the NFL. In 2010 teams averaged 3.04 yards per carry when running behind the left tackle. In 2009 opponents averaged 2.7 yards when running left, the third best mark in the NFL.
Despite gaudy sack numbers from Jason Babin, Trent Cole is the straw the stirs the drink. Trent Cole consistently demanded more attention and freed up Jason Babin. In two games without Trent Cole the Eagles put up three sacks. In the other 14 games with Trent Cole the Eagles averaged 3 sacks per game.


I don't know what else he has to prove to prove that he's better than Julius Peppers, Dwight Freeney and Mario Williams. He consistently out performs them on the field. Is it because he's not 6'6" with freakish workout numbers? Less media hype? You'll be hard pressed to find me any player in the NFL that plays as hard as Trent Cole, is as polished as Trent Cole and has the same amount of skill set diversity. Trent Cole can go around you. He can go through you. He can do whatever you ask and he's done it for years now.

I just don't understand it, Cole is a premier player in this league and people continue to slight him (at least in my eyes). He's better than Julius Peppers, Dwight Freeney and Mario Williams. And I'd argue that Trent Cole is better than James Harrison and Tamba Hali too, Harrison and Hali wouldn't be nearly as effective in a 4-3 as Trent Cole is but Trent Cole could sure as hell play in a 3-4 defense IMO.

And to the people who prefer Justin Tuck: He has 44.5 sacks the past five years, a full 10.5 less than Trent Cole (Tuck has missed 4 games, Cole: three). And check the run support numbers as well, they don't match up. Cole is better. Plus Tuck matches up against guards often whereas Trent Cole makes his living solely against left tackles.

Anyways, carry on. :go:

The Great Jonathan Vilma
05-12-2012, 11:35 AM
Honestly, I don't see an issue with having Trent Cole in the top 5. I too think he is awesome and underrated due to not having the perfect measurables of some of the other guys. I don't necessarily know if I'd put him top 2, but IMO you could certainly debate the 3-6. There is no set order for this, with many personal biases and assumptions (yes, I know you haven't watched all the snaps for all the guys) for each ranking anyway. At least there is detail supporting the Cole claim. I don't point 'homer' on this one.

Remember when there was all this discussion of Aso > Revis? Seem long gone. Let's see how Aso and others on the Eagles rebound from last seasons disaster.

I am very intrigued to see Aldon Smith this season. Von Miller was obviously awesome, but I want to see how Smith develops. He was dominant in the playoffs. Let's see how his overall game improves this season start to finish.

Lastly, I'm intruiged to see more of Sean Lee. He was outstanding last season and should be in the discussions to get in the back half of lists I think. He is very solid in coverage and appears to be a playmaker. He surprises people and I think can be a guy who quietly sits around 4-6 for a long while.

vidae
05-12-2012, 11:57 AM
I honestly can't believe Brandon Carr is making any top 5 list. He wasn't even the best corner on the Chiefs, Brandon Flowers was, and it wasn't close. Ugh. If Carr was still a Chief he'd be nowhere on any top 5 lists, but because he's a Cowboy he's a top 5 corner? :njx: :facepalm:

Also, my boy Derrick Johsnon should be getting a lot more love for 3-4 ILBs. Just sayin.

Go_Eagles77
05-12-2012, 01:17 PM
I'm going to break step and actually make an argument for my guy. :freakout:

Trent Cole is being underrated in this thread. Perhaps some of you need to see more Trent Cole because let me tell you, he is dominant. Let me say this again: In the past five years, Trent Cole has 55 sacks (thats 11 per year). Do you know who has more in that same time frame? Jared Allen and DeMarcus Ware. That. Is. It.

Year in and year out, there's Trent Cole, producing. In the past five years he's never had less than 9 sacks and he's only missed three games. Who else has that sort of reliability and consistency? Nobody.


Each of the past three years he's been top five in total QB disruptions. He was fifth in 2011 despite missing two games. He was third in 2010. He was fifth in 2009. And that includes 3-4 outside linebackers. If you were to only include 4-3 ends Trent Cole would've placed 3rd in 2011, 2nd in 2010 and 4th in 2009. Even when he's not putting up sacks, he's making an impact.
He's been top seven in stops per snap played over the past three years. He was 7th in 2011, 4th in 2010 and 4th in 2009. He's not just a pass rusher, he's a run stopper too.
In total stops he was 10th in 2011 despite playing significantly fewer snaps than anyone else in the top ten. He was third in 2009. He was fourth in 2008.
When teams ran to Trent Cole's side in 2011 they averaged 2.42 yards per carry, the second best mark in the NFL. In 2010 teams averaged 3.04 yards per carry when running behind the left tackle. In 2009 opponents averaged 2.7 yards when running left, the third best mark in the NFL.
Despite gaudy sack numbers from Jason Babin, Trent Cole is the straw the stirs the drink. Trent Cole consistently demanded more attention and freed up Jason Babin. In two games without Trent Cole the Eagles put up three sacks. In the other 14 games with Trent Cole the Eagles averaged 3 sacks per game.


I don't know what else he has to prove to prove that he's better than Julius Peppers, Dwight Freeney and Mario Williams. He consistently out performs them on the field. Is it because he's not 6'6" with freakish workout numbers? Less media hype? You'll be hard pressed to find me any player in the NFL that plays as hard as Trent Cole, is as polished as Trent Cole and has the same amount of skill set diversity. Trent Cole can go around you. He can go through you. He can do whatever you ask and he's done it for years now.

I just don't understand it, Cole is a premier player in this league and people continue to slight him (at least in my eyes). He's better than Julius Peppers, Dwight Freeney and Mario Williams. And I'd argue that Trent Cole is better than James Harrison and Tamba Hali too, Harrison and Hali wouldn't be nearly as effective in a 4-3 as Trent Cole is but Trent Cole could sure as hell play in a 3-4 defense IMO.

And to the people who prefer Justin Tuck: He has 44.5 sacks the past five years, a full 10.5 less than Trent Cole (Tuck has missed 4 games, Cole: three). And check the run support numbers as well, they don't match up. Cole is better. Plus Tuck matches up against guards often whereas Trent Cole makes his living solely against left tackles.

Anyways, carry on. :go:
The last time I tried to say that it was even arguable that Trent Cole was better than Mario Williams I became the laughing stock of the thread. I don't know what it is about Cole but he continues to get criminally under-rated on these forums.

Anyway, no one should be putting Jason Babin above Cole on their lists.

Look at their stats from 2009 when both were on the same team for the first time (in a more tradition 4-3 defensive front)

Cole - 12.5 sacks, 57 tackles
Babin - 2.5 sacks, 12 tackles

Sure, Cole was a starter and Babin a backup (to Juqua Parker), but the eagles rotate their DEs so much that their number of snaps were probably a lot closer than you would think (though I can't find the exact numbers so I may be wrong).
The point is, I love Babin, but he's a one-dimensional system DE. He lines up wide and runs full speed around the RT on damn near every play, which is why he can rack up sacks so well. The man should give Jim Washburn his first born child because he would probably still be a journeyman (and a hell of a lot poorer) without him.
Cole is a complete DE who could thrive in any 4-3 defense in the NFL.

scottyboy
05-12-2012, 01:25 PM
cole absolutely belongs up there. He's probably 5 behind Allen, JPP, Peppers and Mario

AntoinCD
05-12-2012, 01:34 PM
From reading this thread a lot of people seem to be overlooking players like James Ihedigbo, Brandon Deaderick, Kyle Love, Rob Ninkovich, Tracey White, Sterling Moore, Kyle Arrington, Jermaine Cunningham, Jeff Tarpinian etc

And to me that is more insulting than people overlooking Trent Cole

:tomatoes:

Raiderz4Life
05-12-2012, 01:40 PM
cole absolutely belongs up there. He's probably 5 behind Allen, JPP, Peppers and Mario

I'd put him behind those as well. I love me some Cole but he's not better than those 4 imo.

phlysac
05-12-2012, 11:25 PM
The fact that he hasn't made a single list yet shows me just how underrated this guy is. I'm good with that.

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/5103/ice01.jpg

VernonLawson89
05-12-2012, 11:30 PM
My boy Ice!

ramsrule
05-13-2012, 10:06 AM
Many may think I am biased, but Mr. Long is one of the top 5 DE in the league.

NY+Giants=NYG
05-13-2012, 11:41 AM
Many may think I am biased, but Mr. Long is one of the top 5 DE in the league.

I don't consider him a top 5 DE at all. This year was his 1st year of double digit sacks. Other than that he has been average. I think he is good, but nothing more after that.

21ST
05-13-2012, 11:54 AM
You guys do know that London Fletcher plays in a 3-4 right? Or does it not matter what postion they actually play?

VAfy-ya
05-13-2012, 12:55 PM
Looking at the first page and trying to figure out when did Sean Lee and Darryl Washington(really) become better than David Harris, as 3-4 ILBs go. Harris never gets any love and its ashame because he's hella good.

VAfy-ya
05-13-2012, 12:57 PM
The fact that he hasn't made a single list yet shows me just how underrated this guy is. I'm good with that.

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/5103/ice01.jpg

And he never will....which is just fine. Hopefully that makes him easier to re-sign after the season as well.

Bixby (Thumper)
05-13-2012, 01:15 PM
From reading this thread a lot of people seem to be overlooking players like James Ihedigbo, Brandon Deaderick, Kyle Love, Rob Ninkovich, Tracey White, Sterling Moore, Kyle Arrington, Jermaine Cunningham, Jeff Tarpinian etc

El Oh El. You think those guys are being slighted in a thread about top 5 players at their spots? Ohmagawd. Homer much?

vidae
05-13-2012, 01:24 PM
El Oh El. You think those guys are being slighted in a thread about top 5 players at their spots? Ohmagawd. Homer much?

I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic, you just missed it. Completely.

Bixby (Thumper)
05-13-2012, 01:29 PM
I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic, you just missed it. Completely.

http://narwhaler.com/img/pj/7/skeptical-cat-PJ7R2v.jpg

vidae
05-13-2012, 01:48 PM
http://narwhaler.com/img/pj/7/skeptical-cat-PJ7R2v.jpg

http://i284.photobucket.com/albums/ll36/Bigsteve87/Gifs/DidntReadlolElmo.gif

scar988
05-13-2012, 02:55 PM
Jonathan Babineaux should be in the top 5 4-3 DT's. And Grimes and Samuel are easily two of the top 5 CB's in the NFL. no other corners had under a 5.00 YPA allowed last year.

The Great Jonathan Vilma
05-13-2012, 03:08 PM
Looking at the first page and trying to figure out when did Sean Lee and Darryl Washington(really) become better than David Harris, as 3-4 ILBs go. Harris never gets any love and its ashame because he's hella good.

I was thinking the same thing but choose not to comment on him as a Jets player, but I agree. I personally think he is exceptional. He can pretty much do everything you require; inside run, outside run, blitz, coverage, be physical, leadership, let his play do that talking (on this team that is worth noting. I honestly don't even know what his voice sounds like).

I haven't seen much of Daryl Washington, but Sean Lee I think is very good, and commented on in my last post.

Fico
05-13-2012, 10:18 PM
For anyone leaving Brian Cushing out of your top 5 ILB's, I respect your opinion but you're wrong and I hate you.

scottyboy
05-14-2012, 05:24 AM
Jonathan Babineaux should be in the top 5 4-3 DT's. And Grimes and Samuel are easily two of the top 5 CB's in the NFL. no other corners had under a 5.00 YPA allowed last year.

go away scar, nobody misses your homerism.

I wouldn't rank Samuel a top 5 corner because I like my corners to be able to at least pretend to tackle.

and if he's an eagle, you don't put his name there.

nobodyinparticular
05-14-2012, 09:08 AM
I honestly can't believe Brandon Carr is making any top 5 list. He wasn't even the best corner on the Chiefs, Brandon Flowers was, and it wasn't close. Ugh. If Carr was still a Chief he'd be nowhere on any top 5 lists, but because he's a Cowboy he's a top 5 corner? :njx: :facepalm:

Also, my boy Derrick Johsnon should be getting a lot more love for 3-4 ILBs. Just sayin.

Yeah, I didn't get that either. I know some people were down on Flowers a couple games last year, but Carr never came close to closing the gap.

But he's a Cowboy and now he is top 10? Yikes.

Also, as much as I hate it, DJ deserves consideration. He's gone from a solid/unspectacular OLB to a big player at ILB.

On a homer note, what does Tommy Kelly have to do to get mentioned even once in this thread? He has the most sacks from the DT position over the past two years and he is a pocket disrupting animal.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2012, 09:27 AM
Geno <3

I love Geno Atkins. He's like a young Tommie Harris.

Scotty D
05-14-2012, 02:37 PM
There is a ton of talent at 34 ILB right now. Its hard to squeeze in the top 5.

WCH
05-14-2012, 02:53 PM
Looking at the first page and trying to figure out when did Sean Lee and Darryl Washington(really) become better than David Harris, as 3-4 ILBs go. Harris never gets any love and its ashame because he's hella good.

Harris has always been criminally underrated, even during his Michigan days.

Bob Sanders Dreadlock
05-14-2012, 07:40 PM
Geno <3

I love Geno Atkins. He's like a young Tommie Harris.

Hate you Bill Polian. I wanted him so bad.

Bulldogs
05-14-2012, 08:32 PM
Jonathan Babineaux should be in the top 5 4-3 DT's. And Grimes and Samuel are easily two of the top 5 CB's in the NFL. no other corners had under a 5.00 YPA allowed last year.

Come on now, this is getting ridiculous. Just like Thomas Decoud is a top 10 safety right now right? To say Grimes and Samuel are easily two of the top 5 corners makes you one of the biggest homers on the board. I'd say both readily deserve a spot in the top 10 (arguable in Samuel's case) but you go way overboard on this. A top 5 corner would not have been traded for a 7th round pick. Babineaux also regressed last season.

Sloopy
05-14-2012, 08:51 PM
The fact that he hasn't made a single list yet shows me just how underrated this guy is. I'm good with that.

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/5103/ice01.jpg

Made my list... just saying


Looking at the first page and trying to figure out when did Sean Lee and Darryl Washington(really) become better than David Harris, as 3-4 ILBs go. Harris never gets any love and its ashame because he's hella good.

Another problem solved with my list... just saying... again

bigbluedefense
05-14-2012, 09:04 PM
Hate you Bill Polian. I wanted him so bad.

I wanted him bad too. Can't say I hate Jerry Reese though.

Funny you mention it though, I thought that Geno and Daryl Washington were both locks to be Colts. I thought both would fit that defense like a glove.

Can you imagine a dline with Mathis and Freeney on the edges with Geno in the middle, and Daryl Washington playing the role of Derrick Brooks at WILL?

It would be sick.

VernonLawson89
05-14-2012, 10:43 PM
http://i.imgur.com/R5ljU.png

BaLLiN
05-15-2012, 01:48 AM
My list solely based off of last year:

4-3

DE
1.Jared Allen
2.Jason Pierre Paul
3.Julius Peppers
4.Trent Cole
5.Jason Babin
6. Chris Long
7. Cliff Avril
8. Chris Clemons
9. Justin Tuck
10. Elvis Dumervil


DT
1.Ndamukong Suh
2. Geno Atkins
3.Richard Seymour
4.Jurrell Casey
5.Tommy Kelly
6.Ahtyba Rubin
7. Kevin Williams
8. Domata Peko
9. Karl Klug
10. Marcell Dareus

OLB
1.Von Miller
2.Lance Briggs
3.Chad Greenway
4.Sean Weatherspoon
5. Michael Boley
6. James Anderson
7. Daryl Smith
8. DJ Williams
9. Leroy Hill
10. DeAndre Levy


MLB
1.London Fletcher
2.D’Qwell Jackson
3.Brian Urlacher
4.Curtis Lofton
5.James Laurinaitis
6.Paul Posluszny
7.Rolando McClain
8. Stephen Tulloch
9. David Hawthorne
10. Pat Angerer

3-4

DE
1.Justin Smith
2.Haloti Ngata
3.Calais Campbell
4.JJ Watt
5. Darnell Dockett
6. Glenn Dorsey
7.Ray McDonald
8. Tyson Jackson
9. Randy Starks
10. Cory Redding

NT
1.Vince Wilfork
2.BJ Raji
3.Sione Pouha
4.Isaac Sopoaga
5.Cam Thomas
6. Jay Ratliff
7.Casey Hampton
8.Terrence Cody
9. Antonio Garay
10. Kelly Gregg

Really hard to do...


OLB
1.Terrell Suggs
2.Tamba Hali
3.DeMarcus Ware
4.Lamar Woodley
5.Aldon Smith
6.Clay Matthews
7.James Harrison
8.Cameron Wake
9. Antwuan Barnes
10. Jarret Johnson/Conor Barwin

ILB
1.Patrick Willis
2.Navorro Bowman
3.Lawrence Timmons
4.Sean Lee
5. Nick Barnett
6. Brian Cushing
7.David Harris
8. Derrick Johnson
9. Jerod Mayo
10.Karlos Dansby


CB
1.Darrelle Revis
2.Jonathon Joseph
3.Joe Haden
4.Ladarius Webb
5. Carlos Rogers
6. Corey Webster
7. Charles Woodson
8. Nnamdi Asomguha
9. Brandon Browner
10. Brandon Flowers

FS
1.Eric Weddle
2.Ed Reed
3. Reggie Nelson
4. Earl Thomas
5. Dashon Goldson
6 Kenny Phillips
7. Jarius Byrd
8. Malcolm Jenkins
9. Thomas Decoud
10. Oshiomogho Atogwe

SS
1. Kam Chancellor
2.Troy Polamalu
3.Roman Harper
4. Tyvon Branch
5. George Wilson
6. Adrian Wilson
7. Charles Godfrey
8. Charlie Peprah
9. Donte Whitner
10....

Brodeur
05-15-2012, 02:16 AM
I would like to take the time to point out that Suh is not that good. He was outplayed frequently last year by Corey Williams, and is nowhere near the best 4-3 DT in the league.

21ST
05-15-2012, 06:34 AM
My list solely based off of last year:

4-3

DE
1.Jared Allen
2.Jason Pierre Paul
3.Julius Peppers
4.Trent Cole
5.Jason Babin
6. Chris Long
7. Cliff Avril
8. Chris Clemons
9. Justin Tuck
10. Elvis Dumervil


DT
1.Ndamukong Suh
2. Geno Atkins
3.Richard Seymour
4.Jurrell Casey
5.Tommy Kelly
6.Ahtyba Rubin
7. Kevin Williams
8. Domata Peko
9. Karl Klug
10. Marcell Dareus

OLB
1.Von Miller
2.Lance Briggs
3.Chad Greenway
4.Sean Weatherspoon
5. Michael Boley
6. James Anderson
7. Daryl Smith
8. DJ Williams
9. Leroy Hill
10. DeAndre Levy


MLB
1.London Fletcher
2.D’Qwell Jackson
3.Brian Urlacher
4.Curtis Lofton
5.James Laurinaitis
6.Paul Posluszny
7.Rolando McClain
8. Stephen Tulloch
9. David Hawthorne
10. Pat Angerer

3-4

DE
1.Justin Smith
2.Haloti Ngata
3.Calais Campbell
4.JJ Watt
5. Darnell Dockett
6. Glenn Dorsey
7.Ray McDonald
8. Tyson Jackson
9. Randy Starks
10. Cory Redding

NT
1.Vince Wilfork
2.BJ Raji
3.Sione Pouha
4.Isaac Sopoaga
5.Cam Thomas
6. Jay Ratliff
7.Casey Hampton
8.Terrence Cody
9. Antonio Garay
10. Kelly Gregg

Really hard to do...


OLB
1.Terrell Suggs
2.Tamba Hali
3.DeMarcus Ware
4.Lamar Woodley
5.Aldon Smith
6.Clay Matthews
7.James Harrison
8.Cameron Wake
9. Antwuan Barnes
10. Jarret Johnson/Conor Barwin

ILB
1.Patrick Willis
2.Navorro Bowman
3.Lawrence Timmons
4.Sean Lee
5. Nick Barnett
6. Brian Cushing
7.David Harris
8. Derrick Johnson
9. Jerod Mayo
10.Karlos Dansby


CB
1.Darrelle Revis
2.Jonathon Joseph
3.Joe Haden
4.Ladarius Webb
5. Carlos Rogers
6. Corey Webster
7. Charles Woodson
8. Nnamdi Asomguha
9. Brandon Browner
10. Brandon Flowers

FS
1.Eric Weddle
2.Ed Reed
3. Reggie Nelson
4. Earl Thomas
5. Dashon Goldson
6 Kenny Phillips
7. Jarius Byrd
8. Malcolm Jenkins
9. Thomas Decoud
10. Oshiomogho Atogwe

SS
1. Kam Chancellor
2.Troy Polamalu
3.Roman Harper
4. Tyvon Branch
5. George Wilson
6. Adrian Wilson
7. Charles Godfrey
8. Charlie Peprah
9. Donte Whitner
10....

London Fletcher doesn't play in a 4-3

bearfan
05-15-2012, 07:20 AM
I am curious as I have not seen Von Miller play, how does he top the OLB lists after one year?

Rosebud
05-15-2012, 07:47 AM
I am curious as I have not seen Von Miller play, how does he top the OLB lists after one year?

Great blitzer/ass rusher, strong against the run with natural cover skills. He had an exceptional rookie year and already plays like Marcus Washington, in a couple years we could be talking about the absolute best linebacker in the NfL.

bigbluedefense
05-15-2012, 08:02 AM
I second the notion on Suh being overrated. Don't get me wrong, I love Suh and hope he has a bounceback year, but he didn't have a very good year last year. He was pretty mediocre.

Plus I'm concerned about all the off field stuff. This guy just doesn't get it off the field, and I didn't see that coming. Now he's doing a dating reality show? Get it together Suh. Work on that pass rush.

Go_Eagles77
05-15-2012, 09:41 AM
Great blitzer/ass rusher, strong against the run with natural cover skills. He had an exceptional rookie year and already plays like Marcus Washington, in a couple years we could be talking about the absolute best linebacker in the NfL.

http://i.imgur.com/3hAbO.gif

WCH
05-15-2012, 12:22 PM
There aren't enough good ass rushers in the NFL.

senormysterioso
05-15-2012, 12:29 PM
4-3

DE
1.Jared Allen
2.Julius Peppers
3.Jason Pierre Paul
4.Jason Babin
5.Trent Cole

DT
1.Ndamukong Suh
2.Kevin Williams
3.Geno Atkins
4.Richard Seymour
5. Kyle Williams

OLB
1.Von Miller
2.Lance Briggs
3.Sean Weatherspoon
4.Chad Greenway
5.Daryl Smith


MLB
1.Brian Urlacher
2.D’Qwell Jackson
3.Curtis Lofton
4.London Fletcher
5.James Laurinaitis

3-4

DE
1.Haloti Ngata
2.Justin Smith
3.JJ Watt
4.Calais Campbell
5.Ray McDonald

NT
1.Vince Wilfork
2.BJ Raji
3.Sione Pouha
4.Jay Ratliff
5.Cam Thomas

OLB
1.Terrell Suggs
2.DeMarcus Ware
3.Clay Matthews
4.Tamba Hali
5.Aldon Smith

ILB
1.Patrick Willis
2.Jerod Mayo
3.Lawrence Timmons
4.Navorro Bowman
5.Sean Lee

CB
1.Darrelle Revis
2.Nnamdi Asomugah
3.Jonathon Joseph
4.Charles Woodson
5.Joe Haden

S
1.Ed Reed
2.Adrian Wilson
3.Eric Weddle
4.Troy Polamalu
5.Kam Chancellor

scar988
05-15-2012, 01:17 PM
Come on now, this is getting ridiculous. Just like Thomas Decoud is a top 10 safety right now right? To say Grimes and Samuel are easily two of the top 5 corners makes you one of the biggest homers on the board. I'd say both readily deserve a spot in the top 10 (arguable in Samuel's case) but you go way overboard on this. A top 5 corner would not have been traded for a 7th round pick. Babineaux also regressed last season.

Again, no other corners in the NFL allowed less than 5.00 yards per attempt. Both of these guys allowed under 4.61 yards per attempt. idk about you but a corners first job is to cover.

Decoud is a top 10 Free Safety. not safety in general.

scar988
05-15-2012, 01:19 PM
go away scar, nobody misses your homerism.

I wouldn't rank Samuel a top 5 corner because I like my corners to be able to at least pretend to tackle.

and if he's an eagle, you don't put his name there.

2 things:
1) I know you missed me for things like the NFFL and FWF... or do we forget so quickly... and oh yeah, I got a pocket full of ***** and there's a reason for it
2) As an eagle, I put his name in there too. in a heartbeat. Again, under 5.00 yards per attempt. only 4 guys to get there the past 4 years are Asomugha, Revis, Grimes and Samuel... those 4 are 4 of my top 5 corners in the NFL

ATLDirtyBirds
05-15-2012, 01:21 PM
I second the notion on Suh being overrated. Don't get me wrong, I love Suh and hope he has a bounceback year, but he didn't have a very good year last year. He was pretty mediocre.



Does he even have a damn responsibility in that defense? It's like the dude has never seen a trap before in his life.

scottyboy
05-15-2012, 04:49 PM
2 things:
1) I know you missed me for things like the NFFL and FWF... or do we forget so quickly... and oh yeah, I got a pocket full of ***** and there's a reason for it
2) As an eagle, I put his name in there too. in a heartbeat. Again, under 5.00 yards per attempt. only 4 guys to get there the past 4 years are Asomugha, Revis, Grimes and Samuel... those 4 are 4 of my top 5 corners in the NFL

holy **** nuts just disappear again, seriously. and neg rep? really? my god go back to your 2 cent website. no one misses your ignorance here. At least my homerism is entertaining.

21ST
05-15-2012, 05:30 PM
LONDON FLETCHER HAS NOT PLAYED IN A 4-3 defense in years. Stop going off what other people are doing. Love the fletch love though

scar988
05-15-2012, 05:58 PM
holy **** nuts just disappear again, seriously. and neg rep? really? my god go back to your 2 cent website. no one misses your ignorance here. At least my homerism is entertaining.

I used the neg rep feature for what it is. It's used when someone probably is being a d-bag like you were and well, calling them out on it.

Everyone is a homer. If they told you they weren't they'd be lying.

and btw, free country. I'll be here as long as I want to be. I don't break forum rules by being a homer.

Rosebud
05-15-2012, 06:00 PM
http://i.imgur.com/3hAbO.gif

You don't think he looks like someone that needs to be a great ass rusher, just to have a chance?

http://tinyurl.com/7x3vroq

Brodeur
05-15-2012, 06:02 PM
Does he even have a damn responsibility in that defense? It's like the dude has never seen a trap before in his life.

Gunther is a useless coordinator.

vidae
05-15-2012, 06:23 PM
Gunther is a useless coordinator.

Yes, yes he is. He is awful.

Brodeur
05-15-2012, 06:26 PM
Yes, yes he is. He is awful.

So, you want him back is what you're saying? Okay, give the Lions Romeo and it will be settled.

fenikz
05-15-2012, 09:28 PM
this sexy man beast isn't on enough(any?) lists

http://www1.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Daryl+Washington+Arizona+Cardinals+v+San+Francisco +YOets08DAhDl.jpg

phlysac
05-15-2012, 09:50 PM
this sexy man beast isn't on enough(any?) lists


I absolutely LOVE Daryl Washington. I loved him coming out, and wondered about his transition to a 3-4 MIKE. He has done tremendously and he could remain near the top for a long time. I just don't know how he could regularly be included in a top-5 3-4 ILB list just yet. Not as a knock on him, there are just so many great ILBs right now.

mightytitan9
05-17-2012, 01:34 PM
I am
4-3

DE
1.Julius Peppers
2.Jared Allen
3.Dwight Freeney
4.Mario Williams
5.Jason Pierre Paul


Isn't Freeney considered a 3-4 OLB now?

mightytitan9
05-17-2012, 01:41 PM
The last time I tried to say that it was even arguable that Trent Cole was better than Mario Williams I became the laughing stock of the thread. I don't know what it is about Cole but he continues to get criminally under-rated on these forums.

Anyway, no one should be putting Jason Babin above Cole on their lists.

Look at their stats from 2009 when both were on the same team for the first time (in a more tradition 4-3 defensive front)

Cole - 12.5 sacks, 57 tackles
Babin - 2.5 sacks, 12 tackles

Sure, Cole was a starter and Babin a backup (to Juqua Parker), but the eagles rotate their DEs so much that their number of snaps were probably a lot closer than you would think (though I can't find the exact numbers so I may be wrong).
The point is, I love Babin, but he's a one-dimensional system DE. He lines up wide and runs full speed around the RT on damn near every play, which is why he can rack up sacks so well. The man should give Jim Washburn his first born child because he would probably still be a journeyman (and a hell of a lot poorer) without him.
Cole is a complete DE who could thrive in any 4-3 defense in the NFL.

LOL that stat is so out there it shouldn't even be used. There is no accuracy to it, he played on other teams before the Titans where far less talented DE's got more sacks.

You can argue Cole is better than Babin, but don't use horrible stats like that to try to back it up.

mightytitan9
05-17-2012, 01:50 PM
FS
1.Eric Weddle
2.Ed Reed
3. Reggie Nelson
4. Earl Thomas
5. Dashon Goldson
6 Kenny Phillips
7. Jarius Byrd
8. Malcolm Jenkins
9. Thomas Decoud
10. Oshiomogho Atogwe


I think Weddle is probably one of the most overrated guys in the league. And i'm not a fan of Michael Griffin really, but I do know I'd take him over several guys on the list.

I don't really know how you can have Reggie Nelson that high right now. Personally, I think Earl Thomas is probably the best FS in the NFL right now.

Oh, and you forgot Eric Berry on SS.

vidae
05-17-2012, 02:07 PM
So, you want him back is what you're saying? Okay, give the Lions Romeo and it will be settled.

We are about to become mortal enemies.

phlysac
05-22-2012, 03:32 PM
could a case be made for Dashon Goldson? played out of this world last season on a stacked defense

YtVz7HjyY2g

RCAChainGang
05-22-2012, 03:41 PM
YtVz7HjyY2g

He gets my vote. Dude is a flying monkey out there.

Matthew Jones
05-22-2012, 05:08 PM
Roughly ranked based on recent play:

Defensive End (4-3):

1. Julius Peppers
2. Mario Williams
3. Jason Pierre-Paul
4. Jared Allen
5. Trent Cole

Defensive End (3-4):

1. Justin Smith
2. Calais Campbell
3. Randy Starks
4. Darnell Dockett
5. J.J. Watt

Defensive Tackle:

1. Haloti Ngata
2. Vince Wilfork
3. Ndamukong Suh
4. Richard Seymour
5. Kevin Williams

Outside Linebacker (4-3):

1. Von Miller
2. Jerod Mayo
3. Kamerion Wimbley
4. Daryl Smith
5. Erin Henderson

Outside Linebacker (3-4):

1. DeMarcus Ware
2. Terrell Suggs
3. Aldon Smith
4. Tamba Hali
5. Clay Matthews

Inside Linebacker:

1. Patrick Willis
2. NaVorro Bowman
3. Karlos Dansby
4. London Fletcher
5. Brian Cushing

Cornerback:

1. Darrelle Revis
2. Nnamdi Asomugha
3. Joe Haden
4. Brandon Flowers
5. Champ Bailey

Safety:

1. Ed Reed
2. Troy Polamalu
3. Eric Berry
4. Eric Weddle
5. Kam Chancellor

MetSox17
05-22-2012, 05:24 PM
Eric Weddle, Troy Polamalu and Kam Chancellor ahead of Earl Thomas is quite the fail.

Matthew Jones
05-22-2012, 06:06 PM
Eric Weddle, Troy Polamalu and Kam Chancellor ahead of Earl Thomas is quite the fail.

Polamalu is one of the biggest defensive playmakers in the NFL and Eric Weddle creates a ton of turnovers while also providing excellent deep coverage (was not burned for a pass of 30 yards or more all season.) Chancellor is surprisingly good in coverage as well. Thomas certainly ranks among the top ten safeties but I would like to see him make some more plays in the ball; he seemed like a bigger playmaker last year.

igglefanz
05-22-2012, 10:35 PM
Roughly ranked based on recent play:

Defensive End (4-3):

1. Julius Peppers
2. Mario Williams
3. Jason Pierre-Paul
4. Jared Allen
5. Trent Cole



Really??? I mean I may be one of the biggest Jared Allen fanboy's on the forum but if you look at the last 4 years there is no way that either Williams or Peppers is better then Allen. JPP had a great season last year and has tremendous upside but Really? Here is stat lines for the last 4 years. CT= combined Tackles, ST=Solo Tackles, SK=Sacks, PD= Passes Deflected, FF Forced Fumbles, INT=Interceptions and SFT=Saftey

Williams 135 CT, 114 ST, 34.5 SK, 6 PD, 8 FF, 0 INT, 0 SFT
Peppers 184 CT, 152 ST, 43.5 SK, 23 PD, 16 FF 4 INT 0 SFT
Allen 231 CT, 177 ST, 62 SK, 16 PD, 13 FF 4 INT 4 SFT

I have yet to figure out why people will not give Allen the respect he deserves. I know both Peppers and Williams are better as of athletes but really? I mean Jared Allen nearly broke the sack record with a team that had a horrid secondary and an anemic offense that allowed other teams to run all over them. The ONLY argument I can see is JPP could be better this upcoming year then Allen I hate to admit it being an Eagle's fan but He is going to be great.

bigbluedefense
05-23-2012, 11:17 AM
Earl Thomas is the best FS in the league.

His range is unbelievable.

And Jared Allen is the best DE in the league. No question about it.

TACKLE
05-28-2012, 02:13 PM
If these lists are for top 5 for 2012, I would quite comfortably put PP as a top 5 CB.

bigbluedefense
05-29-2012, 03:15 PM
Geno Atkins is the best 3 tech in the league. Yeah, I said it.