PDA

View Full Version : Penn State Sanctions


soybean
07-23-2012, 09:02 PM
Can we start a new thread to talk about the sanctions? I didn't want to have to sift through the sandusky trial thread and they're essentially two different points.

Anyways, what do you guys think?

Too be honest I don't really agree with the ruling.

What I would honestly do is just give them a financial blow. 10 million dollars for 10 years. 1 million to each of the victims and the rest to various charities the advocating awareness and prevention of child sexual abuse.

I honestly think all these "football" related punishments are a bit empty and do nothing except decimate the school which derives a lot of their economy from the football program.

The worst is vacating wins. That is and always will be the most r3tarded punishment ever.

Giantsfan1080
07-23-2012, 09:07 PM
They will be getting fined over $100 million taking into account the NCAA and Big Ten sanctions.

jrdrylie
07-23-2012, 09:23 PM
There are people out there who don't agree with these sanctions because it punishes current students and other sports. But my question is, what punishment doesn't? Fine them $250 million because that sure as hell would hurt current students in the terms of increased tuition and fees.

Smooth Criminal
07-23-2012, 09:27 PM
Theres literally no way for the NCAA to punish the right program, almost ever. USC and OSU for the most part punished the wrong people. But that's how it works, and doing nothing is not the solution. It's almost more of a punishment of deterrent to future schools than it is a retaliation to a crime.

But the alternative is worse. They did these horrific things to protect the program. Fitting that it is instead the downfall.

BigDawg819
07-23-2012, 09:35 PM
The are an institution of higher learning and without question they put the welfare of the football program over the welfare of children. No punishment will ever fit that crime. Frankly them sustaining a football program at all some will argue isn't fair. This crime will never go away for the victims, nor anyone associated with college football.

I cannot comprehend how people actually can contest the punishment being too harsh....

kwilk103
07-23-2012, 09:54 PM
There are people out there who don't agree with these sanctions because it punishes current students and other sports. But my question is, what punishment doesn't? Fine them $250 million because that sure as hell would hurt current students in the terms of increased tuition and fees.

not sure i agree with that

1. players are able to transfer now or at the end of the season without sitting out a year

2. if they want to remain at penn state, they will still be able to play football

3. if they want to remain at penn state, but not play football, they will still have their scholarship honored

they still get a good education for free, which is the point of college

Brothgar
07-23-2012, 09:57 PM
not sure i agree with that

1. players are able to transfer now or at the end of the season without sitting out a year

2. if they want to remain at penn state, they will still be able to play football

3. if they want to remain at penn state, but not play football, they will still have their scholarship honored

they still get a good education for free, which is the point of college

I think they are talking about the current students who aren't members of the football team.

WCH
07-23-2012, 10:02 PM
I'm not sympathetic to the current students. Do you realize how many schools have football teams that are barely worth watching? Most of them.

So PSU students don't get to root for their team to win the conference or make a bowl game. They don't get to claim that their iconic coach has the record for most wins. Boohoo.

If Penn State were to lose state funding, then I'd feel terrible for the students.

Philliez01
07-23-2012, 10:19 PM
If you don't penalize them because you are fearful of "hurting the current students", then all schools that committed some type of infraction would just clean house each time a scandal would occur. Yeah it sucks, but that's life at times. It was awful that lower-level employees lost their job at Enron, etc. But that's what happens when you have corruption up top.

Anyway, I think the vacating the wins was stupid and merely to satisfy the wave of anti-JoePa being the winningest coach ever. I mean, the guy is vile as far as I'm concerned but the ONLY person that it affects is dead. So he died thinking he was the winningest coach ever. Just stupid. What happens if they somehow find out that Paterno knew in '91 or something?

My idea was stupid but I liked it. Every dollar earned by the PSU football program for six years goes right to an on-campus charity for sex abuse. Maybe not "on-campus" but if Penn State is going to try and make this "OK", they have to go above and beyond just as the NCAA did for the punishment.

I'd even support trying to get the Big-10 to emulate the "THON" thing PSU does and make it a national day of child abuse recognition. It could really do great things.

soybean
07-23-2012, 10:38 PM
If you don't penalize them because you are fearful of "hurting the current students", then all schools that committed some type of infraction would just clean house each time a scandal would occur. Yeah it sucks, but that's life at times. It was awful that lower-level employees lost their job at Enron, etc. But that's what happens when you have corruption up top.

Anyway, I think the vacating the wins was stupid and merely to satisfy the wave of anti-JoePa being the winningest coach ever. I mean, the guy is vile as far as I'm concerned but the ONLY person that it affects is dead. So he died thinking he was the winningest coach ever. Just stupid. What happens if they somehow find out that Paterno knew in '91 or something?

My idea was stupid but I liked it. Every dollar earned by the PSU football program for six years goes right to an on-campus charity for sex abuse. Maybe not "on-campus" but if Penn State is going to try and make this "OK", they have to go above and beyond just as the NCAA did for the punishment.

I'd even support trying to get the Big-10 to emulate the "THON" thing PSU does and make it a national day of child abuse recognition. It could really do great things.

That's way too radical. There's operating costs and the school derives a lot of things from the profit of the football team.

SolidGold
07-23-2012, 10:48 PM
Penn State should have been punished as an institution but to basically target football only makes no sense to me. The administrators who covered this up are responsible - not the football team. Paterno was a figurehead and the big name that the media was out to crucify and they did - sending him to his grave. Granted he does share part of the blame.

I just fail to see the logic of punishing a football program full of players and coaches who had nothing to do with the Sandusky issue. PSU is going to face civil suits from the victims and be forced to pay out money as an institution which I have no problem with.

I am just waiting on Emmert to actually start investigating other programs for shady recruiting practices, schools covering for student athletes who cheat, players getting money from boosters etc.

Ozzy
07-23-2012, 10:53 PM
I would say what Penn State got is worse than the Death penalty for SMU.

But really, what else could one do, this was all revolving around the football program.

All the top people in the football program were aware of this from 1998 and possibly before then. No one ever questioned anything or tried to stop anything?

Hell all they would of had to do, the presidents and higher ups, along with Joe Pa, is ban Sandusky from access to football buildings and deny him access to bowl games and all Penn State events.

If they would have done this in 1998, none of this would have happened at all.



Instead they did nothing and allowed him completely and unquestioned access at all times till 2011. As said in the FBI report, they basically allowed Sandusky perfect opportunities for over a decade to develop relationships with potential victims and carry out sexual abuse.

So really, the fact is that they did not want to hurt the Penn State image, and tried to hide it all, hope it went away. I am glad that the Penn State football program is being hurt by all of this. The students are not being hurt, the football program is. Sure the athletic department will take a hit but it is not like they don't already have top of the line facilities in place for those other sports.

Yes the current football players had nothing to do with it, but it was the football program leaders, Joe Pa, the president and others who were protecting and trying to save the image of Penn State football. Well that is destroyed, it was before the trail and now it literally is afterwards. It had to be done regardless of fairness to current players or past players.

If college football programs got bowl bans, losing scholarships etc. for players getting a free par of shoes...

I would sure hope a football program and upper college officials allowing known sexual abuse of young boys to occur under their watch would get a little harsher punishment.

And they did.

Philliez01
07-23-2012, 11:00 PM
That's way too radical. There's operating costs and the school derives a lot of things from the profit of the football team.

Yeah, I realized that a few weeks ago and it was the ultimate knee-jerk. It was stupid but I liked it in my Utopian world.

Uhm also....this is just my idea but I decided to do something other than complain....let me know what you all think...

https://www.change.org/petitions/all-ncaa-affiliated-schools-create-and-or-endorse-a-national-day-of-thon#

iowatreat54
07-24-2012, 11:56 AM
As predicted, the Paterno clan is unhappy with the punishments, and actually wanted to be consulted by the NCAA before any penalties were doled out. Basically, they wanted to try and prevent them from taking the Ws.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/13950741-419/paterno-family-reacts-to-ncaa-sanctions.html

The release of the Freeh report has triggered an avalanche of vitriol, condemnation and posthumous punishment on Joe Paterno. The NCAA has now become the latest party to accept the report as the final word on the Sandusky scandal. The sanctions announced by the NCAA today defame the legacy and contributions of a great coach and educator without any input from our family or those who knew him best.

Very curious. So, if you get caught stealing a car, the court should interview your family on what type of punishment you should receive. Good to know.

JoeJoeBrown
07-24-2012, 12:01 PM
Yeah, I realized that a few weeks ago and it was the ultimate knee-jerk. It was stupid but I liked it in my Utopian world.

Uhm also....this is just my idea but I decided to do something other than complain....let me know what you all think...

https://www.change.org/petitions/all-ncaa-affiliated-schools-create-and-or-endorse-a-national-day-of-thon#

Mega props to you man. Fight the good fight and get this movement going.

descendency
07-24-2012, 12:09 PM
They will be getting fined over $100 million taking into account the NCAA and Big Ten sanctions.

And that's before the civil lawsuits (which will come after the criminal trials are over) total over 100 million.

Cigaro
07-24-2012, 12:48 PM
YASWRhCXWKY

The Great Jonathan Vilma
07-24-2012, 01:21 PM
Let them burn. They deserve anything they get. What the institution allowed is unforgivable.

On that note, I am glad that the NCAA took steps necessary to minimize the negative impacts on the current student athletes enrolled in the program. They are not at fault. Hopefully many of them move on and succeed in other programs.

descendency
07-24-2012, 10:38 PM
They look almost as happy as when someone gets into the NCAA tournament...

Brothgar
07-24-2012, 10:42 PM
I'm more concerned about the students who aren't athletes I imagine these actions will hurt the regular students by taking money away from the university which will likely result in higher tuition.

sbh15
07-24-2012, 11:38 PM
I almost wish they had put some sort of ban on getting money from bowls and some restriction on BCS bowls rather than not letting them play in them all together. that part of the punishment seems to be worse for the players than any others. it's not like these kids are NFL players and they can just move somewhere new without batting an eyelash (or whatever that saying is) transferring colleges can be a pretty big deal you leave a lot behind

WCH
07-25-2012, 12:37 AM
I'm more concerned about the students who aren't athletes I imagine these actions will hurt the regular students by taking money away from the university which will likely result in higher tuition.

I crunched the numbers the other day, and if they pay it over a four or five year period, and if enrollment stays roughly the same as it was last year, I think it comes out to about $200-300 per student, per year.

They could easily pass the fine onto the student body as a part of their annual tuition increase. Almost nobody would notice, because tuition goes up almost every year. They might even spread the tuition increase out over a ten year span, but the fine is almost certainly going to be passed onto the students.

wogitalia
07-25-2012, 01:08 AM
Basically what it all boils down to is that these punishments all target everyone who had nothing to do with the crimes and nobody that did, except for maybe JoePa, who is dead and couldn't care less (so a completely empty target).

Current players, past players, current students, past students, the current administration, every other sporting team at the college are the targets of this penalty.

I know they had to penalise someone because vengeance and all that but this punishment just seems entirely misdirected to me. Again, I guess it's hard to target all the people that have already lost their jobs and had their names tarnished forever.

I'm not a PSU fan in anyway but I can certainly see why their students, players and alumni would complain about the punishment given that they are the ones it is punishing and they did nothing wrong.

WCH
07-25-2012, 02:14 AM
The institution is being punished for institutional failures. If Penn State were a private, for-profit institution, they'd probably be brought to the brink of liquidation after a scandal of this magnitude (see: Arthur Andersen, LLP).

Smooth Criminal
07-25-2012, 06:38 AM
That's how the NCAA works. Can't go back in time and punish the right people. Look at OSU and USC for examples. Wrong players and coaches get bowl bans.

But you can't just have the schools clean house and that be it. If so, schools would just have to fire a few people and replace them for their punishment. Really doesn't deter schools from violations at all. Have to punish the institution, even if it appear unfair, mainly to deter future violations. Bush and Pryor hurt their teams, and got out of there before the sanctions were made.

Same scenario at Penn State. Except that I think they got off very light, harboring a child rapist and letting him continue to molest kids on campus is far worse than getting tattoos, cars, or houses, and should have been punished by more than just extra scholarship losses and bowl bans.

Smooth Criminal
07-25-2012, 06:43 AM
I almost wish they had put some sort of ban on getting money from bowls and some restriction on BCS bowls rather than not letting them play in them all together. that part of the punishment seems to be worse for the players than any others. it's not like these kids are NFL players and they can just move somewhere new without batting an eyelash (or whatever that saying is) transferring colleges can be a pretty big deal you leave a lot behind


I read the Big Ten was going to donate Penn States share of bowl money to charity. Don't know for how many years.

And transferring colleges is not a big deal. A very large percentage of college kids transfer at some point anyway.

Once again, people are losing sight of who the real victims are. And they are not the Penn State fans, players, or students. They are the children that got raped. I don't feel bad for anyone else.

Giantsfan1080
07-25-2012, 07:38 AM
I think the NCAA actually did a really god job of hurting Penn State while keeping collateral damage to a minimum.

A big +1 to what WCH and NJX said also. The players can leave without any penalty.

Hines
07-25-2012, 02:19 PM
Wow, other college coaches are outside the university halls stalking and trying to recruit players to their school. They can't step outside without getting hounded. I guess PSU players are locking themselves inside due to that. What a shame.

JoeJoeBrown
07-25-2012, 02:53 PM
Wow, other college coaches are outside the university halls stalking and trying to recruit players to their school. They can't step outside without getting hounded. I guess PSU players are locking themselves inside due to that. What a shame.

College football is a ******* dirty, disgusting sport.

I've really eased up on my fandom the past several years. The past two especially so.

Iamcanadian
07-25-2012, 03:17 PM
seriously. this. i have no idea why everyone keeps whining about current students/athletes. they can bloody well go elsewhere if they think this hurt their education, or their athletic career. transferring is simply not that difficult, and moreso when the NCAA is making it as easy as possible for current athletes. the entire university ****** up and they can pay the price. no part of me would have mourned at all if their football program had had to be completely disbanded. no part of me would feel any differently if it'd been my alma mater that'd made it as easy as possible for a guy like sandusky to operate.

We finally agree on something. Big 10 fan here and I said right from the beginning that Penn St. should be kicked out of the conference for this mess.
It brings shame on every Big 10 institution by keeping them a member of the conference.

wogitalia
07-25-2012, 10:59 PM
seriously. this. i have no idea why everyone keeps whining about current students/athletes. they can bloody well go elsewhere if they think this hurt their education, or their athletic career. transferring is simply not that difficult, and moreso when the NCAA is making it as easy as possible for current athletes. the entire university ****** up and they can pay the price. no part of me would have mourned at all if their football program had had to be completely disbanded. no part of me would feel any differently if it'd been my alma mater that'd made it as easy as possible for a guy like sandusky to operate.

That's just wrong mate. A very small part of the administration of the university ****** up, everyone else was entirely innocent in this incident. The current players didn't commit the crimes or allow it, the current staff didn't, the current students didn't, the womens volleyball team sure didn't, the vast majority of the alumni played no part in it.

To go back to the original quote that you responded to... had this been the whole Arthur Anderson thing... this punishment is akin to penalising their other clients and the firms that picked up those clients because AA ****** up. Those clients and the firms left picking up the pieces didn't do the crime so punishing them serves no recuperative purpose or do anything but punish people who didn't do the deed.

I'm not saying what happened was right, it obviously wasn't, but targeting everyone who had nothing to do with it and no one that did just seems ridiculous to me. No one being punished by these penalties had any part in the crime.

I don't really have any alternative punishment, it's clearly hard to punish these people who are already all gone, lifetime bans from ever being involved in education/coaching/administration/etc would be a good start, stripping Paterno of wins was fine, forcing the college to set up some kind of charitable institution and fund it would be fine. Costing 10 kids a year a chance to go to college, punishing those already enrolled, punishing the other teams that now have to play PSU and not make as much money, punishing all the other athletic departments that depend on the football program and that type of thing does nothing for the victims, does nothing for those impacted, it does nothing for anyone except punish innocents in my book.

Should all Catholics be stoned to death because a few priests violated some children? Should they all pay and be held responsible for something they had absolutely nothing to do with and knew nothing about?

iowatreat54
07-26-2012, 08:33 AM
Ya, I really fail to see how this punishes current students. Oh no, you basically don't have a football team and the NCAA ruined your "college experience." gtfo

I fail to see how it punishes other PSU sports. Is the athletic dept. going to generate less revenue? Well obviously. Do other sports benefit from that revenue? Of course. But it's not like the NCAA said, "Hey, let's screw over women's softball by punishing the football program," and likewise I would be pissed if they didn't punish the football program just because they make money that supports other programs. That's what you get if your entire athletic dept. relies on football funds, and your football program screws up.

Finally, while I can see how this punishes the innocent players on the team currently, the NCAA gave each and everyone of them free pass to transfer and play at any other school in the entire country, without sitting out a year or any other restrictions, and will let them be on scholarship. Oh no, you have to move to a new school. Do you know how many people in the country wish they had that option? And further, it hurts future kids from receiving an education? Give me a break, that is the worst argument ever. Yes, because those extra 10 scholarships are the ONLY ones being offered to these kids.

Santonio10
07-26-2012, 09:00 AM
The NCAA has no right to give out any sanctions in this case. PSU is tryig to play damage control and accepted these sanctions to shut everyone up a little bit. This is not a football issue. This did not give Penn State an advantage on the football field. This is a criminal case that hasn't even finished yet. If the NCAA is now punishing schools for criminal activities, then why hasn't Virginia received any Sanctions for the murder that took place by a lacrosse player? Where do they draw the line?

It took them 4 years to sanction USC but it takes them only a few days to come up with one of the most severe sanctions ever put in place? Not ony are they severe, but they punish the players who weren't even involved? What ever happened to due process in this country?

iowatreat54
07-26-2012, 09:03 AM
I used to actually get irritated with the amount of denial you've been in (as well as other PSU fans), but now it's actually becoming quite hilarious the more you talk, kind of like the joke the Paterno family has become.

Keep up the good fight, buddy.

andyjo672
07-26-2012, 09:36 AM
The NCAA has no right to give out any sanctions in this case. PSU is tryig to play damage control and accepted these sanctions to shut everyone up a little bit. This is not a football issue. This did not give Penn State an advantage on the football field. This is a criminal case that hasn't even finished yet. If the NCAA is now punishing schools for criminal activities, then why hasn't Virginia received any Sanctions for the murder that took place by a lacrosse player? Where do they draw the line?

It took them 4 years to sanction USC but it takes them only a few days to come up with one of the most severe sanctions ever put in place? Not ony are they severe, but they punish the players who weren't even involved? What ever happened to due process in this country?

Let me lay it out simply for you because you're clearly delusional. UVA administration didn't actively cover up this crime for OVER A DECADE to ensure the image of their lacrosse team wasn't tainted. Please, stop acting like you're the victim here. Your football team is going to suck, you can deal with that. Jesus, between this and the PSU message boards I'd swear there is something seriously wrong with the water in central PA. Cult's of Personality like this (or see North Korea or Jim Jones) are really, truly terrifying. And if you PSU fans think you're better than those other groups I've got some bad news for you.

Giantsfan1080
07-26-2012, 09:56 AM
It's funny that the first smart thing that happened at that campus was the PSU president accepting the sanctions and now the students and a good deal of BoT members are mad at him. The delusion there is sickening.

Also, the due process thing has no bearing on this what so ever. PSU is a member of the NCAA and therefore can withdrawl from that club if they think their rights have been messed with. Due process has nothing to do with this.

jrdrylie
07-26-2012, 10:10 AM
The NCAA has no right to give out any sanctions in this case. PSU is tryig to play damage control and accepted these sanctions to shut everyone up a little bit. This is not a football issue. This did not give Penn State an advantage on the football field. This is a criminal case that hasn't even finished yet. If the NCAA is now punishing schools for criminal activities, then why hasn't Virginia received any Sanctions for the murder that took place by a lacrosse player? Where do they draw the line?

It took them 4 years to sanction USC but it takes them only a few days to come up with one of the most severe sanctions ever put in place? Not ony are they severe, but they punish the players who weren't even involved? What ever happened to due process in this country?

No, they didn't gain an advantage from this. But the cover up did help them. Had this come out right away, it would have hurt recruiting. Covering it up prevented that. So technically it wasn't an advantage, it was more of a prevention of a disadvantage.

And the NCAA definitely had the right to give sanctions. Here are some of the bylaws Penn State violated

For intercollegiate athletics to promote the character development of participants, to enhance the integrity of higher education and to promote civility in society, student-athletes, coaches, and all others associated with these athletics programs and events should adhere to such fundamental values as respect, fairness, civility, honesty and responsibility. These values should be manifest not only in athletics participation, but also in the broad spectrum of activities affecting the athletics program

Individuals employed by or associated with a member institution to administer, conduct or coach intercollegiate athletics shall act with honesty and sportsmanship at all times so that intercollegiate athletics as a whole, their institutions and they, as individuals, represent the honor and dignity of fair play and the generally recognized high standards associated with wholesome competitive sports.

Individuals employed by or associated with member institutions for the administration, the conduct or the coaching of intercollegiate athletics are, in the final analysis, teachers of young people. Their responsibility is an affirmative one, and they must do more than avoid improper conduct or questionable acts. Their own moral values must be so certain and positive that those younger and more pliable will be influenced by a fine example. Much more is expected of them than of the less critically placed citizen.

iowatreat54
07-26-2012, 10:32 AM
It's funny that the first smart thing that happened at that campus was the PSU president accepting the sanctions and now the students and a good deal of BoT members are mad at him. The delusion there is sickening.

Also, the due process thing has no bearing on this what so ever. PSU is a member of the NCAA and therefore can withdrawl from that club if they think their rights have been messed with. Due process has nothing to do with this.

Agreed. I actually think Erickson, and O'Brien for that matter, are handling things very well, or as well as they can.

JoeJoeBrown
07-26-2012, 10:33 AM
I'm just trying to figure out what Santonio's handle is on the BWI board.

andyjo672
07-26-2012, 11:05 AM
I'm just trying to figure out what Santonio's handle is on the BWI board.

That board reminds me of a group of overweight women at dinner telling each other how beautiful they all are while complaining that so-and-so celebrity is getting too skinny. Can we see the dessert menu?

JoeJoeBrown
07-26-2012, 11:10 AM
That board reminds me of a group of overweight women at dinner telling each other how beautiful they all are while complaining that so-and-so celebrity is getting too skinny. Can we see the dessert menu?

On a much smaller scale, BWI is displaying the type of herd mentality that allowed the horrors of Nazism (yes, I invoked Godwin).

The Germans only saw that the Nazis elevated the country out of a severe depression and were able to rationalize away the horrors that were being carried out under their noses.

As a side note, I really want to read Santonio's posts there. Come on Santonio, give us your handle.

Giantsfan1080
07-26-2012, 11:13 AM
I'm just trying to figure out what Santonio's handle is on the BWI board.

Tom McAndrew?

iowatreat54
07-26-2012, 11:23 AM
So, I just read this elsewhere, but with all the stories coming out now over other schools' coaches at PSU and what not, one specifically mentioned was Illinois. Apparently there was a blog post or story about it, and one of the comments from the person that wrote it was, "Oh, so now they notice a coach that isn't supposed to be on campus."

Gave me a pretty good laugh for the morning.

Santonio10
07-26-2012, 11:28 AM
I don't understand why you guys go to the BWI board when you dont really care anything about PSU or about what really happened there. The NCAA punished PSU for "the atmosphere." one of the punishments was making sure PSU players are keeping up with their academics and are required to report to someone from the NCAA. First of all, why isnt every school forced to do this? Second, PSU had the highest graduation amongst major college football programs and the highest among african American athletes. But yet they need to keep their academics in order? So suddenly the NCAA care about academics? By allowing PSU players to transfer to any school without losing any eligibility they are clearly putting football ahead of academics. Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

What metric do you use to measure the atmosphere of a program btw?

Santonio10
07-26-2012, 11:29 AM
you mean like when they found sandusky guilty? or are you unaware of what due process is, what it means, and why it's utterly meaningless when you're not interacting with the government?

Sandusky got his due process and is rightfully in prison. What about Tim Curley and Gary Schultz? Clearly no one cares about due process for them

Smooth Criminal
07-26-2012, 11:30 AM
That board reminds me of a group of overweight women at dinner telling each other how beautiful they all are while complaining that so-and-so celebrity is getting too skinny. Can we see the dessert menu?

Hahahahahahahahahaha classic

And people go to the board at this point because it's so entertaining.

iowatreat54
07-26-2012, 11:35 AM
I don't understand why you guys go to the BWI board when you dont really care anything about PSU or about what really happened there. The NCAA punished PSU for "the atmosphere." one of the punishments was making sure PSU players are keeping up with their academics and are required to report to someone from the NCAA. First of all, why isnt every school forced to do this? Second, PSU had the highest graduation amongst major college football programs and the highest among african American athletes. But yet they need to keep their academics in order? So suddenly the NCAA care about academics? By allowing PSU players to transfer to any school without losing any eligibility they are clearly putting football ahead of academics. Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

What metric do you use to measure the atmosphere of a program btw?

No, it would be hypocritical if the NCAA forced the players to transfer so that they could play meaningful football, or took away their scholarships. It's not like the NCAA said they were doing this all to preserve academic integrity, but then took scholarships away from current players which would prevent them from obtaining an education. Any and all PSU players are allowed to stay on scholarship and receive an education from PSU while continuing to play for the football team. However, if they would like to transfer and still play football somewhere, they are free to do so without penalty.

I think someone needs to learn the definition of hypocritical. It's like the Iowa fans that complain that the school is hypocritical for cracking down on binge drinking and underage drinking, but entered a sponsorship agreement with Budweiser.

iowatreat54
07-26-2012, 11:46 AM
I'm just trying to figure out what Santonio's handle is on the BWI board.

...

I don't understand why you guys go to the BWI board when you dont really care anything about PSU or about what really happened there. The NCAA punished PSU for "the atmosphere." one of the punishments was making sure PSU players are keeping up with their academics and are required to report to someone from the NCAA. First of all, why isnt every school forced to do this? Second, PSU had the highest graduation amongst major college football programs and the highest among african American athletes. But yet they need to keep their academics in order? So suddenly the NCAA care about academics? By allowing PSU players to transfer to any school without losing any eligibility they are clearly putting football ahead of academics. Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

What metric do you use to measure the atmosphere of a program btw?

http://bwi.rivals.com/showmsg.asp?fid=36&tid=156556746&mid=156556746&sid=890&style=2

Penn State tied Stanford last year with the #1 Top Grad Rate among BCS teams.

And, PSU's African-American Grad rate equalled Stanford's FB Graduation rate of 87%.

PSU's high academic performance also had no achievement gap between Whites and Blacks in Grad Rates.

If the NCAA truly supported Academics over Athletics, they would be Trying to Get Players to STAY at Penn State, instead of leaving for "athletic" reasons, to go to lower Grad Rate Schools.

It just shows how the NCAA doesn't give a Rat's Rear End about Academics, when they are punishing the program with the best overall Academic Ranking, as published last December.


Hmmm possibly...

WCH
07-26-2012, 11:56 AM
I don't understand why you guys go to the BWI board when you dont really care anything about PSU or about what really happened there. The NCAA punished PSU for "the atmosphere." one of the punishments was making sure PSU players are keeping up with their academics and are required to report to someone from the NCAA. First of all, why isnt every school forced to do this? Second, PSU had the highest graduation amongst major college football programs and the highest among african American athletes. But yet they need to keep their academics in order? So suddenly the NCAA care about academics? By allowing PSU players to transfer to any school without losing any eligibility they are clearly putting football ahead of academics. Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

What metric do you use to measure the atmosphere of a program btw?

They're allowing it as an option. I'm guessing that any player who's close to graduation is going to stay at Penn State and finish their coursework. Any transfers are likely to come from the freshman and sophomore classes. They can easily transfer and still finish their coursework on schedule.

Giantsfan1080
07-26-2012, 11:58 AM
So yes Santonio does not know what due process is.

JoeJoeBrown
07-26-2012, 02:00 PM
I don't understand why you guys go to the BWI board when you dont really care anything about PSU or about what really happened there. The NCAA punished PSU for "the atmosphere." one of the punishments was making sure PSU players are keeping up with their academics and are required to report to someone from the NCAA. First of all, why isnt every school forced to do this? Second, PSU had the highest graduation amongst major college football programs and the highest among african American athletes. But yet they need to keep their academics in order? So suddenly the NCAA care about academics? By allowing PSU players to transfer to any school without losing any eligibility they are clearly putting football ahead of academics. Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

What metric do you use to measure the atmosphere of a program btw?

When I'm in the mood for sheer insanity, it's great to read it just to see how insular and vile humanity can be.

A community of online people that not only do not condem, but comment on another's persons post of (and I paraphrase but it's close) "Was it rape if there was no blood?" is a sick place indeed.

The crazy conspiracy theories crack me up. "This is retaliation for JoePa pushing for instant replay" in response to the B1G penalty.

"This has nothing to do with football!" (Just ignore the fact that the school executive for student discipline was fired for trying to get the football team to follow school rules and police procedures. On campus and off campus. No extra benefits to having a large number of starters clean up a stadium for breaking into a house and assaulting a student instead of getting suspended and serving jail time.)

There is so much craziness that isn't shot down and mocked by sane PSU people. I guess the sane ones left. The moderators are definitely insane for allowing a lot of that nonsense to go on.

So once or twice a week, it's work a read.

Santonio10
07-26-2012, 02:41 PM
Right to a fair trial. I'm losing my mind haha

JHL6719
07-26-2012, 03:17 PM
When I'm in the mood for sheer insanity, it's great to read it just to see how insular and vile humanity can be.

A community of online people that not only do not condem, but comment on another's persons post of (and I paraphrase but it's close) "Was it rape if there was no blood?" is a sick place indeed.

The crazy conspiracy theories crack me up. "This is retaliation for JoePa pushing for instant replay" in response to the B1G penalty.

"This has nothing to do with football!" (Just ignore the fact that the school executive for student discipline was fired for trying to get the football team to follow school rules and police procedures. On campus and off campus. No extra benefits to having a large number of starters clean up a stadium for breaking into a house and assaulting a student instead of getting suspended and serving jail time.)

There is so much craziness that isn't shot down and mocked by sane PSU people. I guess the sane ones left. The moderators are definitely insane for allowing a lot of that nonsense to go on.

So once or twice a week, it's work a read.



Great point. They're probably Slippery Rock fans now. Wont be much difference on the field.

StickSkills
07-26-2012, 04:14 PM
not sure i agree with that

1. players are able to transfer now or at the end of the season without sitting out a year

2. if they want to remain at penn state, they will still be able to play football

3. if they want to remain at penn state, but not play football, they will still have their scholarship honored

they still get a good education for free, which is the point of college

Players have had coaches (not from PSU) outside their apartments, the football building and their classes waiting to talk to them (no exaggeration on that). There are no rules for coaches to recruit them to transfer. Also, most of the players are taking summer classes. Tell me how that doesn't affect them?

Also, so far over 50 players have publically stated that they're staying at PSU, including the entire starting defense. I think Redd is the only starter on offense that hasn't publically stated that he is staying. Only 1 player has indicated that he's transferring (Nowicki to Illinois, although O'Brien said today that not a single player has said that they're transferring).

Lets face it, the transfer rules that the NCAA set up just for this was to disassemble the PSU team.

StickSkills
07-26-2012, 04:16 PM
When I'm in the mood for sheer insanity, it's great to read it just to see how insular and vile humanity can be.

A community of online people that not only do not condem, but comment on another's persons post of (and I paraphrase but it's close) "Was it rape if there was no blood?" is a sick place indeed.

The crazy conspiracy theories crack me up. "This is retaliation for JoePa pushing for instant replay" in response to the B1G penalty.

"This has nothing to do with football!" (Just ignore the fact that the school executive for student discipline was fired for trying to get the football team to follow school rules and police procedures. On campus and off campus. No extra benefits to having a large number of starters clean up a stadium for breaking into a house and assaulting a student instead of getting suspended and serving jail time.)

There is so much craziness that isn't shot down and mocked by sane PSU people. I guess the sane ones left. The moderators are definitely insane for allowing a lot of that nonsense to go on.

So once or twice a week, it's work a read.
oh how wrong you are...

The full story on Vicky Triponey (http://safeguardoldstate.org/the-vicky-triponey-timeline-of-terror/).

WCH
07-26-2012, 08:00 PM
Lets face it, the transfer rules that the NCAA set up just for this was to disassemble the PSU team.

It was so that players can have a shot to play in a bowl game, if they want to. USC Juniors and Seniors were also allowed to transfer without penalty.

andyjo672
07-27-2012, 02:08 PM
Right to a fair trial. I'm losing my mind haha

Sandusky got a fair trial. Schultz and Curley will get a fair trial. I don't know what you're talking about at all.

scottyboy
07-27-2012, 06:28 PM
I don't understand why you guys go to the BWI board when you dont really care anything about PSU or about what really happened there. The NCAA punished PSU for "the atmosphere." one of the punishments was making sure PSU players are keeping up with their academics and are required to report to someone from the NCAA. First of all, why isnt every school forced to do this? Second, PSU had the highest graduation amongst major college football programs and the highest among african American athletes. But yet they need to keep their academics in order? So suddenly the NCAA care about academics? By allowing PSU players to transfer to any school without losing any eligibility they are clearly putting football ahead of academics. Seems pretty hypocritical to me.

What metric do you use to measure the atmosphere of a program btw?

I think a good metric to measure "atmosphere" is the covering up of a pervert and child molester in your football program for almost a decade.

Santonio10
07-28-2012, 12:28 PM
I think a good metric to measure "atmosphere" is the covering up of a pervert and child molester in your football program for almost a decade.

He wasnt in our program. Sadusky was retired at the time. If you read the Freeh report, you would know that.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2012, 12:33 PM
He wasnt in our program. Sadusky was retired at the time. If you read the Freeh report, you would know that.

Yet was still allowed to hang out at the campus, attend football games, have a PSU salary and office and so on. Just give it up already.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2012, 12:40 PM
Also this picture taken after Paterno already knew what Sandusky was doing. He looks real concerned.

http://www.singleblackmale.org/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/06-23-19_jerry-sandusky-and-joe-paterno_original.jpg

scottyboy
07-28-2012, 12:56 PM
He wasnt in our program. Sadusky was retired at the time. If you read the Freeh report, you would know that.

Everything that you, and all these ridiculously blind and ignorant supporters, stand for sickens me. Like it actually makes me sick to my stomach.

scottyboy
07-28-2012, 12:59 PM
He wasnt in our program. Sadusky was retired at the time. If you read the Freeh report, you would know that.

The denial is just incredible. It's seriously unreal. We had a known pedophile walking around our campus and we covered it up and defended him because JoePa is god and WE ARE PENN ST so you can all suck it and are all jealous haters. It's un-*******-real.

Seriously, everyone backing penn state in this scandal (like those such as yourself in such denial) are an embarrassment to the human race. A ******* child molester. A ******* PEDOPHILE. He was waking around your campus and screwed up the lives and heads of so many innocent children, yet you're all too concerned about the ******* image of Penn st's football program and Joepa. It's just a disgrace, it really is. The excuses are just laughable. The defenses are hilarious. It's just sickening all the way around how people, such as yourself, can have such a standpoint. It's just a disgrace and disgusting

Smooth Criminal
07-28-2012, 01:16 PM
He wasnt in our program. Sadusky was retired at the time. If you read the Freeh report, you would know that.

Yes, he was just allowed to hang around the facilities and bring children on campus for his charity. And invite children to games.

But good thing Penn State was in the right and made sure he want on the coaching staff.

Nalej
07-28-2012, 03:25 PM
They should all be in jail. Including the governor.

Santonio10
07-28-2012, 04:04 PM
Sandusky got a fair trial. Schultz and Curley will get a fair trial. I don't know what you're talking about at all.

I'm talking about the rush to judgement of everyone involved. Everyone is jumping to conclusions because they read a summary of the Freeh report. Anyone who actually read it knows that Freeh jumps to some big conclusions with any evidence and without even talking to the 4 main people involved. Schultz and Curley will go to trial, we will find out more, and then we can begin to draw conclusions. The evidence against Paterno in the Free report is almost non existent. People claim the "atmosphere" was the issue, but can't possibly know why without reading the report. The Freeh group themselves said that the NCAA shouldn't have used it for punishment, and that they should have done their own investigation. The Freeh report is a joke but everyone assumes they know what happened because they read a summary, or they heard a news person regurgitate the same summary without reading it or knowing any facts whatsoever.

It's funny that people claim the we have "blind" faith are also the people who won't even read the Freeh report. Laziness is not a excuse for ignorance.

Santonio10
07-28-2012, 04:06 PM
Yes, he was just allowed to hang around the facilities and bring children on campus for his charity. And invite children to games.

But good thing Penn State was in the right and made sure he want on the coaching staff.

The Freeh report says that there was no connection between Sandusky retiring and the 98 investigation.

brat316
07-28-2012, 04:08 PM
Shouldn't someone else punish the school? I know joe was the one leading the cover up, but it was the school who empowered him.

Santonio10
07-28-2012, 04:24 PM
The denial is just incredible. It's seriously unreal. We had a known pedophile walking around our campus and we covered it up and defended him because JoePa is god and WE ARE PENN ST so you can all suck it and are all jealous haters. It's un-*******-real.

Seriously, everyone backing penn state in this scandal (like those such as yourself in such denial) are an embarrassment to the human race. A ******* child molester. A ******* PEDOPHILE. He was waking around your campus and screwed up the lives and heads of so many innocent children, yet you're all too concerned about the ******* image of Penn st's football program and Joepa. It's just a disgrace, it really is. The excuses are just laughable. The defenses are hilarious. It's just sickening all the way around how people, such as yourself, can have such a standpoint. It's just a disgrace and disgusting

My god no one in there right mind thinks pedophilia is ok. Can you stop trying to act like supporting Penn State means we support child rape. I never said what happened was ok. So get that through your head. I don't support the decision that was made. I stand up for JoePa because there is no proof that he was even involved in the decision, let alone the cover up. Not because I think he was god, but because I think it's what's fair. Would you like it if the media labeled some close to you as a child rapist enabler without any proof?

You claim that Paterno was part of the cover up, but you probably didn't read more than the summAry of the report. B*******. Learn the facts before you write things about people. You are simply incapable of thinking for yourself and only accept the popular opinion.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2012, 04:26 PM
The Freeh report says that there was no connection between Sandusky retiring and the 98 investigation.

Did Paterno let Sandusky hang around the campus and see him with other children when he knew of all the allegations against Sandusky?

Santonio10
07-28-2012, 04:29 PM
Did Paterno let Sandusky hang around the campus and see him with other children when he knew of all the allegations against Sandusky?

No. The administration who signed his retirement contract and those who gave him emeritus status did.

Giantsfan1080
07-28-2012, 04:34 PM
No. The administration who signed his retirement contract and those who gave him emeritus status did.

So how about the picture I posted earlier of them when Paterno already knew of the 98 incident? Why did Paterno lie to the Grand Jury saying he only knew of the McQueary incident when he also knew about the 98 incident?

Paterno also had the most control in limiting Sandusky's access to the football facilities and he never barred Sandusky from them fully knowing of all the assaults that took place by JS.

scottyboy
07-28-2012, 05:11 PM
My god no one in there right mind thinks pedophilia is ok. Can you stop trying to act like supporting Penn State means we support child rape. I never said what happened was ok. So get that through your head. I don't support the decision that was made. I stand up for JoePa because there is no proof that he was even involved in the decision, let alone the cover up. Not because I think he was god, but because I think it's what's fair. Would you like it if the media labeled some close to you as a child rapist enabler without any proof?

You claim that Paterno was part of the cover up, but you probably didn't read more than the summAry of the report. B*******. Learn the facts before you write things about people. You are simply incapable of thinking for yourself and only accept the popular opinion.

Holy ******* blinders batman.

It's the stance of denial that you and so many other penn st fans that just makes this so much worse.

the attitude of Nalej is what makes me feel sorry for some psu fans, players and alum because this is so awful and stains their school.

but you, this denial, this sick "going to the grave" with JoePa when there's been emails, reports and other evidence of JoePa knowing and not doing enough which is just sickening. Right, I should learn the facts. Those emails aren't real. JoePa clearly didn't know that he had a child rapist amongst him.

Even if JoePa for some reason didn't know, then you're idol and god of psu is a moron for not knowing.

But no, it's clearly unfair to JoePa. Let's pity him and how the big bad media and national attention has painted this saint into a monster so wrongfully.

Stop defending him to, and beyond, the grave. It's embarrassing. It's taking away from the true disgrace that occurred and penn st fans, such as yourself, are now trying to play victim and claim JoePa is innocent. He's such a saint. His hands are CLEARLY clean of this.

LEAVE JOEPA ALONE

Smooth Criminal
07-28-2012, 05:20 PM
The Freeh report says that there was no connection between Sandusky retiring and the 98 investigation.

Irrelevant.

Ignoring the Freeh report, which you seem like you would love to do, by Paterno's own grand jury testimony he knew that something of a sexual nature was going on with Sandusky and young boys as early as 2001. According to the Freeh report this was a lie and Paterno knew as early as 1998.

Knowing that, and the fact that Sandusky was allowed to use campus facilities and work around children through his arrest is enough for me to connect the dots. Even while the grand jury was being conducted and between then and his arrest, Sandusky wasnt banned from campus and still brought young boys around campus. Plenty of people knew he was raping kids and no one did a damn thing about it. Everyone that knew allowed him to continue to use campus facilities and work with children with the charity.

They knew, and didn't stop it. That's enough for me, and I don't know how it's not enough for any human with a brain. Anyone that knew of these allegations, and I mean anyone, should have done everything within their power to stop it. None of them did, making them all pretty ****** people.

Let's make this real simple. Just answer one question for me. When do you think Joe Paterno first knew about Sandusky raping boys on campus?

andyjo672
07-28-2012, 05:32 PM
I'm talking about the rush to judgement of everyone involved. Everyone is jumping to conclusions because they read a summary of the Freeh report. Anyone who actually read it knows that Freeh jumps to some big conclusions with any evidence and without even talking to the 4 main people involved. Schultz and Curley will go to trial, we will find out more, and then we can begin to draw conclusions. The evidence against Paterno in the Free report is almost non existent. People claim the "atmosphere" was the issue, but can't possibly know why without reading the report. The Freeh group themselves said that the NCAA shouldn't have used it for punishment, and that they should have done their own investigation. The Freeh report is a joke but everyone assumes they know what happened because they read a summary, or they heard a news person regurgitate the same summary without reading it or knowing any facts whatsoever.

It's funny that people claim the we have "blind" faith are also the people who won't even read the Freeh report. Laziness is not a excuse for ignorance.

Ok, you're being VERY dense. You're the one that said they deserved a fair trial and when I pointed out that they were getting one you then said 'but people are already being mean'. Those are two different things. Figure out which one you're actually angry about. First, both the court of public opinion and NCAA legislation are NOT bound by your constitutional rights. Get over it.

Secondly, to your point about not supporting child rapists. We agree, we don't think you do. But, you certainly don't seem to respect the true crimes that occurred. Let me put it in another scenario that maybe sheds light on why everyone in the world thinks you guys are being immature, disgusting little children about this. Say your neighbors house burns to the ground. They lose everything. Their lives are devastated by what occurred. These people are literally standing outside the burning remains of everything they had accumulated throughout their entire lives. Then they overhear you, their neighbor, whining like a brat about how the house fire increased the air temperature in the neighborhood requiring you to run your air conditioner a little bit more than usual. That brat is how the rest of the world, who maintains their sanity, views PSU supporters like yourself.

Santonio10
07-28-2012, 06:21 PM
Ok, you're being VERY dense. You're the one that said they deserved a fair trial and when I pointed out that they were getting one you then said 'but people are already being mean'. Those are two different things. Figure out which one you're actually angry about. First, both the court of public opinion and NCAA legislation are NOT bound by your constitutional rights. Get over it.

Secondly, to your point about not supporting child rapists. We agree, we don't think you do. But, you certainly don't seem to respect the true crimes that occurred. Let me put it in another scenario that maybe sheds light on why everyone in the world thinks you guys are being immature, disgusting little children about this. Say your neighbors house burns to the ground. They lose everything. Their lives are devastated by what occurred. These people are literally standing outside the burning remains of everything they had accumulated throughout their entire lives. Then they overhear you, their neighbor, whining like a brat about how the house fire increased the air temperature in the neighborhood requiring you to run your air conditioner a little bit more than usual. That brat is how the rest of the world, who maintains their sanity, views PSU supporters like yourself.

So, would it be right to blame the fire on the brats father without any evidence? And since everyone is so convinced he knew in 98, please show provide the evidence. This isn't about Sandusky. Sandusky is behind bars for the rest if his life and rightfully so. This is about a rush to judgement on a man who can't even defend himself. If Curley testifies that Paterno was the one who tried to cover it up, then I will accept it and move on. But IF YOU READ THE REPORT, you would find the evidence against Paterno is VERY slim. I don't understand how people can say such nasty things about a someone without even knowing why. I guess it's too hard for some to read and formulate their own opinion anymore.

Smooth Criminal
07-28-2012, 06:44 PM
I don't care if he was the leader of the coverup or told them he was against the cover up and didn't want to be a part of it.

His own testimony says he knew in 2001. Starting at that moment he should have done everything in his power to stop Sandusky. And he did not.

All of those things are undeniable. And that is enough to make him a pretty ****** person. Sorry I don't care how much money you donated or how many wins you have or how many kids you helped graduate. He let young boys continue to be raped. Yes, that out weighs everything else to me. That is simply unforgiveable.

And you didnt answer my only question.

andyjo672
07-29-2012, 12:58 AM
So, would it be right to blame the fire on the brats father without any evidence? And since everyone is so convinced he knew in 98, please show provide the evidence. This isn't about Sandusky. Sandusky is behind bars for the rest if his life and rightfully so. This is about a rush to judgement on a man who can't even defend himself. If Curley testifies that Paterno was the one who tried to cover it up, then I will accept it and move on. But IF YOU READ THE REPORT, you would find the evidence against Paterno is VERY slim. I don't understand how people can say such nasty things about a someone without even knowing why. I guess it's too hard for some to read and formulate their own opinion anymore.

Here's where you're making another mistake. Nobody, except for you guys, give a damn about Joe Paterno. If he's culpable or not doesn't make the least bit of difference. The culture that was formulated by his success and power as a coach allowed people in power at PSU make awful decisions to continue making decisions at the expense of victims of Sandusky's crimes. That's the crux of everyone's anger.

Again, you're reaching at straws. Based on all of your responses I don't actually know what you're mad at. In some instances you claim that you're pissed because PSU football is being punished. When I say that's justified you then switch course and simply say that you're mad that Joe Paterno's name is being dragged through the mud. Find a stance and stick with it otherwise all you appear to be doing is trying to find any kind of ad hoc evidence that you're being screwed (again, no pun intended).

ETA: The fact that you call him your "father" further demonstrates the extent that a cult of personality was developed at your campus. That's terrifying, truly. Furthermore, and I'm not trying to grandstand, but this should NEVER be about Sandusky. It's about the victims of his crimes and the fact that you continually skirt that further enhances the perception that you're far more concerned with what happens to PSU and their football program that you are or were about the actual crimes committed.

WCH
07-29-2012, 01:09 AM
Edit: doesn't matter.

descendency
07-29-2012, 06:20 AM
No. The administration who signed his retirement contract and those who gave him emeritus status did.

I agree with you on that point. None of what went on at Penn State seems to make a damn bit of sense.

Santonio10
07-29-2012, 09:35 AM
I agree with you on that point. None of what went on at Penn State seems to make a damn bit of sense.

I agree. I think Tom Corbett and the BOT are a lot more involved than anyone may realize yet. I have a feeling that this will get uglier. Everything that has happened so far has been taking attention off of them and it all just seems too fishy. JoeJoe has been calling this one, but I think there are bigger fish to fry than Curley, Schultz, Spanier or Paterno

Smooth Criminal
07-29-2012, 10:04 AM
Doesn't mean they don't all deserve to be fried though.

Figuratively of course. Only Sandusky deserves to be literally fried.

Santonio10
07-29-2012, 10:05 AM
Here's where you're making another mistake. Nobody, except for you guys, give a damn about Joe Paterno. If he's culpable or not doesn't make the least bit of difference. The culture that was formulated by his success and power as a coach allowed people in power at PSU make awful decisions to continue making decisions at the expense of victims of Sandusky's crimes. That's the crux of everyone's anger.

Again, you're reaching at straws. Based on all of your responses I don't actually know what you're mad at. In some instances you claim that you're pissed because PSU football is being punished. When I say that's justified you then switch course and simply say that you're mad that Joe Paterno's name is being dragged through the mud. Find a stance and stick with it otherwise all you appear to be doing is trying to find any kind of ad hoc evidence that you're being screwed (again, no pun intended).

ETA: The fact that you call him your "father" further demonstrates the extent that a cult of personality was developed at your campus. That's terrifying, truly. Furthermore, and I'm not trying to grandstand, but this should NEVER be about Sandusky. It's about the victims of his crimes and the fact that you continually skirt that further enhances the perception that you're far more concerned with what happens to PSU and their football program that you are or were about the actual crimes committed.

I didn't mean that Paterno was my father. I was simply trying to say that it's not right to blame someone without any proof of their involvement (the father was a bad choice in hindsight haha). I'm upset at both to be honest. The NCAA is punishing Penn State for the atmosphere that Joe created. Everyone has been piling on Joe, but can't possibly know why without reading the report. The NCAA made an exception for PSU with these punishments and it's insane. Emmert is an ass and shouldn't be in charge. He claims to care about academics all of the sudden (as they make millions off of their football talent BTW) but while he was at LSU they had an abysmal 60% graduation rate. Also, while he was at Washington, a player raped a girl and was subsequently covered up. Tell me how that man has any right to punish PSU for this? No one at PSU was still eligible because of the decision they made. The atmosphere at PSU is about academic integrity in addition to success on the field, but we get punished for this by a guy who doesn't care about academics or about crimes being covered up to keep players eligible. Again, this is a criminal case that in no way gave PSU an advantage on the field.

andyjo672
07-29-2012, 10:22 AM
I didn't mean that Paterno was my father. I was simply trying to say that it's not right to blame someone without any proof of their involvement (the father was a bad choice in hindsight haha). I'm upset at both to be honest. The NCAA is punishing Penn State for the atmosphere that Joe created. Everyone has been piling on Joe, but can't possibly know why without reading the report. The NCAA made an exception for PSU with these punishments and it's insane. Emmert is an ass and shouldn't be in charge. He claims to care about academics all of the sudden (as they make millions off of their football talent BTW) but while he was at LSU they had an abysmal 60% graduation rate. Also, while he was at Washington, a player raped a girl and was subsequently covered up. Tell me how that man has any right to punish PSU for this? No one at PSU was still eligible because of the decision they made. The atmosphere at PSU is about academic integrity in addition to success on the field, but we get punished for this by a guy who doesn't care about academics or about crimes being covered up to keep players eligible. Again, this is a criminal case that in no way gave PSU an advantage on the field.

Wait, so because he didn't punish people previously you don't deserve a punishment? Fine, I've gone over the speed limit without getting caught therefore let's just abolish speed limit laws for everyone. See how stupid that kind of argument is? Also, can PSU stop with this academic integrity BS. You're an OK university. Stop with this. Everyone points to the PSU players graduation rates but the more I find out about JoPa the more I'm starting to believe he pulled strings to pump those numbers up. Remember, JoPa's players never got in trouble with the law either. It wasn't until later that people realized that was because JoPa would take care of it without alerting the proper authorities.

Also, who cares WHO does the punishing. Just because he doesn't have a perfect history doesn't take away from the fact that there was a cover up at your university that was done in an effort to keep that football's sterling reputation intact that deserved a massive punishment.

Seriously, each of your replies is getting more and more desperate and further away from the actual issues at hand. Give it up. And no more about PSU's academics. You're squarely in the middle of the BIG in terms of academic prestige, nobody cares.

ETA: Also, for the 2nd time I'll say this. NOBODY CARES ABOUT JOE PATERNO! That type of 'poor us, look what you're doing to Joe Paterno' is EXACTLY what I was talking about in the post you quoted. Stop whining about something so trivial in the face of the horrors faced by the victims. Jesus.

andyjo672
07-29-2012, 10:24 AM
I agree. I think Tom Corbett and the BOT are a lot more involved than anyone may realize yet. I have a feeling that this will get uglier. Everything that has happened so far has been taking attention off of them and it all just seems too fishy. JoeJoe has been calling this one, but I think there are bigger fish to fry than Curley, Schultz, Spanier or Paterno

Also, I love the fact that you continually point out to us that everything is speculation on our part and we should wait for the facts to emerge and then you come out with stuff like this. I guess if speculation benefits only YOUR cause it is perfectly fine.

BigDawg819
07-29-2012, 11:39 AM
I love how Santonio leaves out the part that Penn State agreed to these sanctions..................

Smooth Criminal
07-29-2012, 11:55 AM
Like they had a choice in the matter.

"Accept these sanctions or we will shut down your program for 4 years."

They could have said were taking half the scholarships and Penn State would have had to have accepted it.

Santonio10
07-29-2012, 12:51 PM
I love how Santonio leaves out the part that Penn State agreed to these sanctions..................

I never said I that I agreed with that decision either. Doesn't mean the NCAA had any right to do this. This isn't the first questionable thing the President has done. If these men are guilty of what of what they are accused of then they deserve jail time, not NCAA punishment. I just want to know the truth about what happened. That's it.

Smooth Criminal
07-29-2012, 01:11 PM
The NCAA can give out any sanctions it wants. I don't know what you don't understand about that. Much like the NFL being able to suspend players who have never gotten arrested. It's really not that difficult to understand.

And the truth is a ton of people knew Sandusky was raping kids and no one did enough about it to ever stop him.

brat316
07-29-2012, 01:21 PM
The NCAA can give out any sanctions it wants. I don't know what you don't understand about that. Much like the NFL being able to suspend players who have never gotten arrested. It's really not that difficult to understand.

And the truth is a ton of people knew Sandusky was raping kids and no one did enough about it to ever stop him.

Which I think is dumb, since they were made to govern sports and have a level playing field.

Shouldn't they now keep a close eye on all criminal activities that are a part of sports? Like the Iowa WR selling drugs?

BigDawg819
07-29-2012, 01:27 PM
I never said I that I agreed with that decision either. Doesn't mean the NCAA had any right to do this. This isn't the first questionable thing the President has done. If these men are guilty of what of what they are accused of then they deserve jail time, not NCAA punishment. I just want to know the truth about what happened. That's it.

They put a football program above stopping a child molesting predator. The NCAA took action because THEY DIDN'T STOP A CHILD MOLESTING PREDATOR! The Penn State Hierarchy CHOOSE TO COVER UP A CHILD MOLESTING PREDATOR!

Santonio10
07-29-2012, 01:36 PM
They put a football program above stopping a child molesting predator. The NCAA took action because THEY DIDN'T STOP A CHILD MOLESTING PREDATOR! The Penn State Hierarchy CHOOSE TO COVER UP A CHILD MOLESTING PREDATOR!

So where in the Freeh Report is the proof that the decision they made had anything to do with the image of the football program?

Smooth Criminal
07-29-2012, 01:39 PM
Which I think is dumb, since they were made to govern sports and have a level playing field.

Shouldn't they now keep a close eye on all criminal activities that are a part of sports? Like the Iowa WR selling drugs?

If a school or team was supporting a drug ring I'm sure they would.

If one player on Penn State molested a kid, the school wouldn't be getting punished like this. Unless the entire leadership of the program chose to cover it up and let it continue.

Smooth Criminal
07-29-2012, 01:42 PM
So where in the Freeh Report is the proof that the decision they made had anything to do with the image of the football program?

Does it matter why they did it? Certainly doesn't to me. They did it.

And really? Use some common sense. Why else would they do it? Cause it didn't bother them at all that he was raping kids?

That's not even the most troubling part. The worst part is that it was allowed to continue for years after many people knew about it.

andyjo672
07-29-2012, 01:44 PM
So where in the Freeh Report is the proof that the decision they made had anything to do with the image of the football program?

If it wasn't why loop Joe Paterno into meetings for it at all?

Borat
07-29-2012, 02:26 PM
njx with a sig? I haz a confused.

Philliez01
07-29-2012, 03:09 PM
Reasonable doubt doesn't equate to any reason to doubt.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2012, 10:26 AM
Also you still haven't answered my question as to why Paterno lied to the Grand Jury about the 98 incident?

iowatreat54
07-30-2012, 11:10 AM
Also you still haven't answered my question as to why Paterno lied to the Grand Jury about the 98 incident?

Probably something along the lines of he reported it to his bosses, so his responsibility in the matter was completely absolved. Or he didn't have any proof of anything, just hearsay. Or he's just the football coach, and had no power to get anything done at PSU. Probably a combination of all those, maybe more excuses about how little Paterno knew or had no power at the university.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2012, 11:13 AM
Well in the Freeh Report it states that in Paterno's Grand Jury testimony he said that he never knew of any incidents that took place between Sandusky and little children. He knew about the 98 incident and lied to the Grand Jury during the 01 questioning.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2012, 11:39 AM
Best NJX post ever!!! I would put that in my sig but it's too long.

JoeJoeBrown
07-30-2012, 04:22 PM
Santonio, how many did you order?

http://oi48.tinypic.com/qznfjk.jpg

Santonio10
07-30-2012, 05:58 PM
Well in the Freeh Report it states that in Paterno's Grand Jury testimony he said that he never knew of any incidents that took place between Sandusky and little children. He knew about the 98 incident and lied to the Grand Jury during the 01 questioning.

What is the evidence that he knew about '98? Whether he knew anything or not, '98 was fully investigated and DA Gricar closed the case. Sandusky was exonerated of any sexual behavior according to the report done by John Seasock.

Smooth Criminal
07-30-2012, 06:28 PM
Even of Paterno didn't know in 98, does that change anything? Cause it obviously doesn't to a sane person. By his own admission he knew in 2001, so it really doesn't make any difference to me when between 1998 or 2001 he knew. Either way he was wrong.

And communist has just become a bad word in America. No one really remembers what it actually means but if I call you one it's bad.

Giantsfan1080
07-30-2012, 06:30 PM
He did know in 98. There's testimony that they told him about the incident.

BRAVEHEART
07-30-2012, 07:12 PM
This is getting sad.

JoeJoeBrown
07-30-2012, 08:50 PM
I can't believe that t shirt I posted above. I've been harping on it, but there is a disgustingly huge percentage of PSU fans that are sick, twisted cultists.

It's why I believe the whole football program should have been banned from the NCAA for two years. There is a whole bunch of reprogramming that a large amount of people need to go through. These people are sick and it utterly disgusts me.

This repulsion has nothing to do with football or rivalries or whatever. It has to do with wiping out as many seeds of corruption as possible. There is no introspection in this large group of cultists, just reflexive defensive posturing as a bunch of brainwashed psychos reject reality.

Smooth Criminal
07-31-2012, 01:02 AM
I just don't understand why. There's not anyone in the world I would support with just the things Joe admitted to have done, let alone a football coach. And I have plenty of smart normal otherwise same friends than are acting, a little less childish, but pretty much like Santonio. They want the statue back, think Paterno is being mistreated, and are the most upset about losing Paternos wins.

I liked Joe, but you let kids get molested? Get the **** out.

wogitalia
07-31-2012, 02:04 AM
I can't believe that t shirt I posted above. I've been harping on it, but there is a disgustingly huge percentage of PSU fans that are sick, twisted cultists.

It's why I believe the whole football program should have been banned from the NCAA for two years. There is a whole bunch of reprogramming that a large amount of people need to go through. These people are sick and it utterly disgusts me.

This repulsion has nothing to do with football or rivalries or whatever. It has to do with wiping out as many seeds of corruption as possible. There is no introspection in this large group of cultists, just reflexive defensive posturing as a bunch of brainwashed psychos reject reality.

Don't act like any other big football program and the school attached to it would act any differently if they got punished like this for something that the vast majority had nothing to do with and absolutely no control over. Any time you punish 100% of the population for something that .0001% of the population did you will get people being outraged and the more moronic of them will go to extreme lengths. (see Auburn tree poisoning for a similar thing). That's basically what it comes down to. A dozen people did something wrong and a few hundred thousand are being punished for it.

What happened was disgraceful, no one is arguing that (I hope) but does punishing everyone really fit in this situation? Again, people like njx might think that transferring means nothing but to a great many people it is a huge deal, some people can't move due to family or financial reasons, not everyone can or is happy to live a nomadic lifestyle or uproot their entire existence.

I think some form of punishment was needed but such wide reaching punishment just spreads the punishment to everyone who didn't have anything to do with it and really lessens the impact it has on those that actually did do something wrong.

To be honest I couldn't really care less other than it feels wrong to me, I don't have any affiliation at all with PSU and couldn't care less if they are a football power or not, I just think that this particular punishment is using a nuke when a few well placed bullets were all that was needed.

JoeJoeBrown
07-31-2012, 08:52 AM
transferring is NOT a big deal, and it's LESS of a big deal for a scholarshipped athlete. period. further, if you don't want to uproot, you're not being forced to. you just don't get to root for a bunch of dudes who supported child molestation. boo-*******-hoo. or you don't get to play for a scumbag and represent him in bowl games. you're STILL not being punished.

it's like telling your kid, 'johnny, i didn't say you needed to sit in the corner, you can go play outside with your friends.' only to hear, 'and have to uproot myself?! stop punishing me!'

it's ******* pathetic and it speaks not only to how poorly y'alls generation copes with not getting every single thing you want, but how incapable you are at articulating why you think you deserve it. it sucks that transferring may mean you have to make some new friends. it sucks that it's sort of like finding a job in the real world. it sucks that we can't just shut our eyes and pretend that joe paterno was actually a saint, just so penn state students can continue to root for their football team. it sucks that football players aren't losing a year of eligibility of they want to go play someplace else for free on whatever scholarships they're offered. it sucks that the football program wasn't even closed down and those players can continue to bloody play at penn state if they so choose and those poor, oppressed students can continue to root for them. it sucks that every single other football program in the country is probably also harboring hundreds of child rapists and the ncaa just really must hate penn state to go so out of its way to tarnish paterno. :njx:

honestly, at this point, i wish they had punished the school and the students. i wish they'd taken away penn state's accreditation, and banned it's sports teams from playing in any NCAA competition. at least then there might be some slight bit of truth in all the bitching y'all are doing.

+1,000,000,000^1,000,000,000

iowatreat54
07-31-2012, 10:11 AM
That's basically what it comes down to. A dozen people did something wrong and a few hundred thousand are being punished for it.

Wait, waaaaait....

Could you explain how "a few hundred thousand" are being punished? I hope you are just exagerrating, and only mean a few hundred, but surely you are not including PSU fans and alumni as being "punished" because they will have a crappy football team...

I can buy that the current players are being punished to an extent, and then even the other programs that rely on PSU football revenue, but even that isn't unprecedented.

Grizzlegom
07-31-2012, 11:33 AM
Yea I don't really see how alumni and fans are being punished. With the payment being spread over a few years, they will still make profit each year and continue to be able to fund the other sports. I don't think they'll increase tuition to help pay the NCAA. A postseason ban, is that really that big of a deal? That really hurt USC, and Ohio State didn't it. So there will be an inferior team on the field for 4-10 years thanks to the lost scholarships? Welcome to the early 2000s. I'm sure Iowa fans remember the infamous 6-4 game.

I had to deal with some douchebags at the mall that one day but I haven't stopped wearing my PSU gear and nobody has said anything to me outside of that one day right after the Freeh report came out. Maybe its just me but I really don't feel like I'm being punished in any way by all this.

Giantsfan1080
07-31-2012, 11:40 AM
Yea I don't really see how alumni and fans are being punished. With the payment being spread over a few years, they will still make profit each year and continue to be able to fund the other sports. I don't think they'll increase tuition to help pay the NCAA. A postseason ban, is that really that big of a deal? That really hurt USC, and Ohio State didn't it. So there will be an inferior team on the field for 4-10 years thanks to the lost scholarships? Welcome to the early 2000s. I'm sure Iowa fans remember the infamous 6-4 game.

I had to deal with some douchebags at the mall that one day but I haven't stopped wearing my PSU gear and nobody has said anything to me outside of that one day right after the Freeh report came out. Maybe its just me but I really don't feel like I'm being punished in any way by all this.

Well that's because you're obviously a reasonable human being.

iowatreat54
07-31-2012, 11:43 AM
Well that's because you're obviously a reasonable human being.

Agreed. Also, the 6-4 game was amazing and I hope we have an equally great game this year.

I do think it sucks for the PSU students, alumni, and fans, but don't think they are being punished at all. I hope they don't try to raise tuition because that would be messed up. I can see raising ticket prices and other prices associated with athletics, but even that would probably piss off some people.

Grizzlegom
07-31-2012, 11:48 AM
Agreed. Also, the 6-4 game was amazing and I hope we have an equally great game this year.


As heartbreaking as many of the Iowa games have been since 2000, they do tend to be great games. Between the 6-4 game and those two games in 2008 and 2009, even though they are losses, they are a few of the more memorable games we've had.

iowatreat54
07-31-2012, 12:25 PM
As heartbreaking as many of the Iowa games have been since 2000, they do tend to be great games. Between the 6-4 game and those two games in 2008 and 2009, even though they are losses, they are a few of the more memorable games we've had.

I think the Iowa-PSU "rivalry" has been really entertaining over the last decade, and I think the fans of both teams (at least online) seem to have embraced it. Plus, it always seems like for whatever reason, the Iowa-PSU game, regardless if it's at Iowa or PSU, seems to either be high profile, a night game, or have some added extra attention to it. I think the media loved playing up Ferentz being from Pennsylvania, and probably now will play up the Ferentz-Belichick-O'Brien-Little Ferentz connections.

wogitalia
07-31-2012, 08:51 PM
transferring is NOT a big deal, and it's LESS of a big deal for a scholarshipped athlete. period. further, if you don't want to uproot, you're not being forced to. you just don't get to root for a bunch of dudes who supported child molestation. boo-*******-hoo. or you don't get to play for a scumbag and represent him in bowl games. you're STILL not being punished.

it's like telling your kid, 'johnny, i didn't say you needed to sit in the corner, you can go play outside with your friends.' only to hear, 'and have to uproot myself?! stop punishing me!'

So now the fans are cheering for the people who "supported" the child molestation? Not for the football team? Really? So supporting a football team that but for a very select few involved in it had nothing to do with that is now supporting child rape.

As for your kid in the corner, it is a lot like that, except you are getting it entirely wrong, it's like the kids outside are playing dodgeball and there is a prize for the winner and you tell the kid, you are allowed to go out there and play with them but you aren't allowed to win because your teacher last year who is now at another school got a speeding ticket.

Sure they don't have to transfer, unless they want to actually play for something in football, unless they want to compete. If they want to win anything then they have to transfer, not because they did something wrong but because a select few enabled a criminal.

Put it this way, say it was the Broncos and your entire fan base was told that because of something that your former GM did entirely unrelated to football that for the next 4 years your team isn't allowed to win anything, are you not being punished then? If you say that it wouldn't matter you are a pretty poor fan in my book. Football may not be important to you but to a great many, sitting down on Sunday and watching your team and hoping they win is important, taking that away from them for something they didn't do is a pretty harsh punishment, in my book at least.

Wait, waaaaait....

Could you explain how "a few hundred thousand" are being punished? I hope you are just exagerrating, and only mean a few hundred, but surely you are not including PSU fans and alumni as being "punished" because they will have a crappy football team...

I can buy that the current players are being punished to an extent, and then even the other programs that rely on PSU football revenue, but even that isn't unprecedented.

It isn't about having a crappy football team, they may well have had that anyway, it's about having a football team that isn't allowed to win anything. Making it harder to win is one thing but making it impossible, well that takes everything away, that is punishing the fans of that team.

Say it came out today that at the 1996 Olympics that one of the US coaches had murdered someone and that another administrator witnessed it and didn't do anything about, would you as a nation not be punished if the IOC came out and said that no US Olympian may win a medal this year as a result of those two people? Your athletes may all compete under the Olympic flag if they wish but if they compete under the USA flag they are ineligible for medals. Can you not see how that is punishing the fans or the current athletes who dreamed of representing the US at the Olympics? Your Olympic team didn't cheat or do anything to give them an unfair advantage at winning but two people made awful decisions and as a result everyone else is paying the price.

That is what is happening hear, imo. Again, I couldn't care less about PSU, I have no affiliation, don't particularly like anything about the school or its football program but that doesn't mean I don't think that the people they've punished here are not those that did the crime. Maybe that's just me...

iowatreat54
07-31-2012, 09:02 PM
I fail to see how the US not being able to compete in the Olympics is a punishment to me in any way. Do I cheat for the US? Of course. But that's like saying my favorite tv show being canceled is a direct punishment to me. Just because I would have slightly less entertainment in my life doesn't make it a punishment.

Like wise, not being able to watch a competitive football team is not a punishment to the fans. They have about 20 other teams to cheer for, specifically wrestling and women's volleyball.

wogitalia
07-31-2012, 09:15 PM
I fail to see how the US not being able to compete in the Olympics is a punishment to me in any way. Do I cheat for the US? Of course. But that's like saying my favorite tv show being canceled is a direct punishment to me. Just because I would have slightly less entertainment in my life doesn't make it a punishment.

Like wise, not being able to watch a competitive football team is not a punishment to the fans. They have about 20 other teams to cheer for, specifically wrestling and women's volleyball.

Maybe it's just me then... I still remember that my mums favourite punishment for me was taking away things that I liked doing so maybe I'm just someone that when they have something they like taken away feels punished! I know if you told me the Vikings weren't able to win anything for the next 4 years I'd be pretty damn shattered, if we'd cheated I'd be annoyed as hell but would understand it (hell if you aren't cheating you aren't trying hard enough right?) but if it was for something that had nothing to do with football I'd be pretty damn annoyed at me being punished by it. Just think there is a big difference between cheating, for which you should be punished and something that has nothing to do with the actual competition and being punished for that.

I think those involved should be punished as much as possible I just don't think this punishment actually hits those involved, again for me it feels like the dropped a nuke on PSU after all those involved had already caught the first flight out and avoided it.

PS.. missed the TV show thing first time round... I'd say it's more akin to that show continuing but you not being able to watch it because some guy on your street did something wrong. In this case the show is still running but you aren't allowed to watch it because of someone else. Something like a lockout is more like a show getting cancelled, where no one gets to watch it, sure everyone is worse off by not being able to enjoy it but it wasn't targeted. To be a punishment for me it takes being singled out and having something taken away, rather than no one getting that thing in which case it's just unfortunate.

iowatreat54
07-31-2012, 09:22 PM
Well it's probably that we disagree that it had nothing to do with football. I feel that one of the big reasons that this was all covered up was to protect the football program. By not coming out with it sooner, they created an advantage in that the football team wasn't punished initially. Had it been reported in 98 or 01, there would have likely been a slap on the wrist and the football program's reputation tainted, causing possibly less interest from recruits and certainly less interest from tv networks and bowls (aka less money).

So I firmly believe the cover up, regardless of who the main culprit(s) were, was done to preserve the reputation of the football team.

wogitalia
07-31-2012, 09:42 PM
Well it's probably that we disagree that it had nothing to do with football. I feel that one of the big reasons that this was all covered up was to protect the football program. By not coming out with it sooner, they created an advantage in that the football team wasn't punished initially. Had it been reported in 98 or 01, there would have likely been a slap on the wrist and the football program's reputation tainted, causing possibly less interest from recruits and certainly less interest from tv networks and bowls (aka less money).

So I firmly believe the cover up, regardless of who the main culprit(s) were, was done to preserve the reputation of the football team.

There are almost certainly elements of it being that. I don't think the fine element was unjust, really it's taking away any ability to win that to me misses the target. Even the scholarships aren't a huge deal, that could be seen as a fair football punishment for those who think there was a significant competitive advantage gained. Taking away the ability to win though just hits everyone invested in the program, be it emotionally, physically or financially, who hasn't done anything wrong.

I do think something was needed and I think the fine, vacated wins and even scholarships would have done. The fine hits the administration, the vacated wins don't mean anything to normal fans (they still won those games when both teams were doing everything to win) and only really hit Paterno for his part in it. The scholarships are the reminder over the next 4 years. Taking away winning going forward though to me doesn't target anyone who did the crimes and only impacts those left picking up the pieces.

As I've said though, I really couldn't care less about the PSU program and what's done is done! I just personally think the punishment was overreaching.

JoeJoeBrown
08-01-2012, 09:10 AM
Ok, apparently the portion of PSU idiots is even more sizable than I had thought.

70,000 PSU fans lambast ESPN for slamming Paterno. (http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/07/31/70000-Penn-state-fans-lambast-ESPN-for-slamming-Paterno)

Showing no signs of higher intelligence, over 70,000 Penn State students and fans of Penn State "liked" a Facebook comment on the Penn State page that demands ESPN apologize for “dragging Joe Paterno though the dirt.” The comment is directed toward Penn State president Rodney Erickson, and claims that ESPN didn’t treat Paterno or Penn State with justice.
In opposition to their claims is the evidence from the Freeh Report, which states that Paterno acted with “callous and shocking disregard for child victims.”
But don’t hold students to the facts. They are out to right a grievous wrong, according to the post on Facebook:
“Even until the day he passed away, Coach Paterno lived with gracious integrity and still to this day, has been the only staff member to admit he was wrong.
I also ask that ESPN give a sincere and public apology for dragging the school, Joe Pa, the victims, and the fans, alumni, and families of Penn State through the dirt by giving an unfair and completely biased, opinionated report.”
And then, in a hilariously inappropriate analogy, the post goes on to say: “We do not remove the Lincoln Memorial because he started the Civil War, rather we leave it as a reminder of the good he’s done.”
Lincoln: freeing slaves.
Paterno: freeing Sandusky so he can maim young men for life.
Now there’s the kind of thinking that justifies sending your kid to college.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2012, 09:21 AM
Is that Lincoln quote for real?

WCH
08-01-2012, 10:05 AM
Maybe it's because of social media groupthink, but a lot of PSU fans seem to be handling this with a lot less class than fans of previous schools who've faced NCAA sanctions.

iowatreat54
08-01-2012, 10:12 AM
You know, for all the arguments that PSU fans and students keep making for the academic integrity of the university, how they graduate players, how they are a world class university, etc., they have some really moronic fans. (not all of them)

As I'm sure you all have seen, they will pull up a recent news story, for example Iowa RB Deandre Johnson getting a disorderly house citation and then arrested/cited for speeding and eluding cops. Some PSU fan(s) will make the argument that the NCAA should investigate and sanction Iowa, since that's what they did to PSU.

Smooth Criminal
08-01-2012, 10:14 AM
I've never laughed so hard at those idiots. The Lincoln quote is priceless. They really must not understand history. Should probably add that to their GECs

jrdrylie
08-01-2012, 10:15 AM
Is that Lincoln quote for real?

Yeah, it's definitely real.

http://img833.imageshack.us/img833/6343/pennstate.png

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2012, 10:17 AM
I'm speechless. I thought it was maybe just a few students that were still in denial but apparently not.

JoeJoeBrown
08-01-2012, 10:19 AM
Is that Lincoln quote for real?

Yes. (https://www.facebook.com/pennstate/posts/10151927721180268) These people are seriously stupid.

jrdrylie
08-01-2012, 10:24 AM
Some of the better comments on that post

What I don't understand is why is everyone attacking Joe Paterno and Penn State? They were not the ones who actually hurt those kids. Yes, they could have, and probably should have taken things up to a higher level. They probably followed t...heir "protocol" for reporting these incidents. Why is everyone putting blame on those who did not harm the children instead of the man who did? When will we grow up and put the blame where it should go and stop pointing fingers at everyone else?

Never since the Salem witch hunts or the McCarthy era have people in this country gotten it so wrong by following the media and rumors instead of looking at the facts. I mean, that lady in Florida killed her daughter and even she was not guilty. It's ok, the truth will come out that Tom Corbett and The Second Mile were part of a pedophile ring in Philly and used JoePa as a coverup to hide their secrets.

I love all the people on here still blaming JoPa for what sandickhead did when are you all going to wake up and realize JoPa did what he was suppose to do and yes he felt bad by not doing more, he reported it to his superiors and they assured him it would be takin care of then when it wasn't a lot of the jackasses there and on here put the blame on JoPa the man passed being a devoted coach and a hero to a lot of people so lets just keep blaming him all y'all that blame him need a reality check and wake the hell up

To the people who think Joe Pa did something wrong! You obviously never played football...he has much more on his mind then be the cop of the state of PA...he did what he was soposed to do an that was tell his hire ups...NONE of us know anymore then just that...weather he did or didn't go further is a matter of opinion...the fact remains justice wasn't served...what did the NCAA have to do with this? NOTHING...

WCH
08-01-2012, 10:32 AM
To the people who think Joe Pa did something wrong! You obviously never played football...he has much more on his mind then be the cop of the state of PA...he did what he was soposed to do an that was tell his hire ups...NONE of us know anymore then just that...weather he did or didn't go further is a matter of opinion...the fact remains justice wasn't served...what did the NCAA have to do with this? NOTHING...

I'm so tired of reading this argument. When your employee comes to you and says "I saw a child being raped in our facilities" you tell him "call the police, right now."

There's simply no other acceptable action.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2012, 10:39 AM
You wouldn't wait until the weekend is over because you didn't want to bother anyone? You are the worst.

iowatreat54
08-01-2012, 11:02 AM
I'm so tired of reading this argument. When your employee comes to you and says "I saw a child being raped in our facilities" you tell him "call the police, right now."

There's simply no other acceptable action.

Even if that didn't happen, I can understand that night/next day if Paterno was told they would handle it. He assumed that they would report it to the police. But then weeks, months, YEARS go by, and you still see the man on campus and with kids? Yet you don't do anything because your boss said they'd take care of it? How anyone can sit around and do NOTHING for years is beyond me.

As I've always stated, I don't think he actively tried to cover up. But I do no longer respect him for not doing anything and allowing Sandusky to roam the campus with children. And I swear if anyone comes back with he did what he was supposed to or didn't have the power or if he did more he could get arrested, I will go off on you.

BuckeyeDan17
08-01-2012, 07:41 PM
I just read on CNN.com that PSU's insurance company is seeking to deny coverage. Has this already been discussed?

http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/25/us/pennsylvania-penn-state-insurer/index.html?hpt=ju_bn2

Sorry if this was covered already, but what if a court decision is reached and PSU is denied coverage for the lawsuits, what then?

EDIT: assuming the lawsuits even come to fruition

Philliez01
08-01-2012, 09:35 PM
America really needs to re-teach students what communism, socialism, McCarthyism, and **** it; everything that ends with "ism" means.

Giantsfan1080
08-01-2012, 09:38 PM
America really needs to re-teach students what communism, socialism, McCarthyism, and **** it; everything that ends with "ism" means.

And promptly kill anyone on the spot that uses "gate" at the end of anything that is considered a scandal.

Philliez01
08-01-2012, 09:53 PM
And promptly kill anyone on the spot that uses "gate" at the end of anything that is considered a scandal.

Life would've been so different if the DNC HQ'ed itself at a Ritz-Carlton.

Smooth Criminal
08-03-2012, 09:54 AM
Idiotic Penn State fans will be celebrating Joe Paterno day next April 9th to celebrate the 409 wins that he used to have.

Should rename this accessory to child molestation day.

iowatreat54
08-09-2012, 05:57 PM
So not really sure if this should go here, but this thread gave me a really good laugh.

http://bwi.rivals.com/showmsg.asp?fid=36&tid=156868749&mid=156868749&sid=890&style=2

What would happen if all Penn State alumni and fans didn't watch a single game in which our Nittany Lions weren't playing? What would happen to B10 ratings if they lost the viewership of the entire state of Pennsylvania and much of the rest of the Mid-Atlantic region? What if ABC regional 3:30 kickoffs drew a goose egg east of Ohio? Do you think Emmert, Delaney, BTN, ESPN/ABC might realize that the damage they've inflicted upon Pennsylvania can boomerang right back at them?

I'm pretty scared that without the ENTIRE state of Pennsylvania and much of the rest of the Mid-Atlantic region, that the BTN would likely fold. PSU fandom is just so large, it probably makes up about 75% (if not more) of the entire Big Ten fanbase. There's no way the other 11 schools could provide as many viewers as PSU does. We're all ******.

Ron
08-10-2012, 07:46 AM
I wish they shut down the ******* football program for good. Im so sick of ******* PSU and their fans. They shouldn't be outraged they should just be ******* ashamed. Let'em burn.

Complex
08-10-2012, 09:43 PM
Feds probe possible Sandusky child porn ring


(CBS/AP) U.S. Postal inspectors are leading a federal investigation into whether former Penn State assistant football coach Jerry Sandusky shared child pornography with other individuals, CBS News has learned.

Analyzing a computer seized from Sandusky, investigators are also looking into whether he sent "seductive letters" across state lines for sexual purposes. Some of these letters were said to be sent to some of his sexual abuse victims.

CBS News has learned that at the end of 2011, allegations were forward by the U.S. Attorney for the Middle District of Pennsylvania. that Sandusky used the mails to seduce individuals to cross state lines for sexual purposes, with trips and gifts offered. Investigators are looking at 6-7 victims who might have gotten letters.

Also in March of this year, U.S. Postal inspectors were tasked to investigate The Second Mile charity, which was founded by Sandusky. That investigation is on hold, awaiting for documents to be released by the State Attorney.

A source has been told that child pornography was found in at least one of Sandusky's computers. According to the source, there is no evidence that the pornography was of his victims. There is also no mention of a ring or sharing of boys with others. CBS News investigative producer Pat Milton reports that a second source said that none of Sandusky's victims have indicated that there was shared sex with them, Sandusky and any other individual.

The investigation is being carried out of the U.S. Postal Inspectors office in Harrisburg, Pa. and the U.S. Attorney Office of the Middle District of Pennsylvania.

"I haven't heard a thing about this latest allegation," Sandusky's attorney Joe Amendola, told CBS News. "Jerry continues to maintain his innocence. We think the allegation is ridiculous."

Sandusky, Penn State's defensive coordinator during the program's best years, was arrested in November on dozens of child sex abuse charges. He was convicted in June of 45 criminal counts.

Meanwhile, Penn State's board of trustees will meet this weekend to consider whether to ratify a consent decree with the NCAA that imposed penalties for how the university handled the Sandusky child molestation scandal.

Board chairwoman Karen Peetz told fellow trustees Thursday in an email, which was obtained by The Associated Press, that said there was confusion about how Penn State accepted the sanctions and whether it was the "best course" for the university.

"We have heard from President (Rodney) Erickson and from our legal team," Peetz wrote. "We have had an opportunity to speak our minds. I appreciate everyone's candor and your sincere and heartfelt comments. However, it is now time to put this matter to rest and to move on."

The resolution before the board would say that it "wishes to and hereby does ratify" the consent decree.

"We are leaders of this university," Peetz told the trustees. "We need to lead."

A notice posted on Penn State's website said the 5 p.m. Sunday telephone conference would be broadcast live online.

The NCAA on July 23 barred the school from postseason play for four years, fined it $60 million and invalidated 112 of the football team's wins for the way school officials handled abuse complaints against Sandusky.

Penn State also was stripped of future scholarships, and several high-profile players have decided to transfer to other schools since the penalties were announced. The team opens play at home Sept. 1 against Ohio University.

The NCAA concluded Penn State suffered "an unprecedented failure of institutional integrity leading to a culture in which a football program was held in higher esteem" than its own values, those of the NCAA and higher education, "and most disturbingly the values of human decency."

Penn State acquiesced to the penalties, with Erickson signing the agreement. Two days later, the trustees met in secret before issuing a statement that called the sanctions difficult but the alternatives worse.

Some trustees, alumni and others have reacted angrily. The family of former football coach Joe Paterno, who died in January, and a trustee who said others supported him have sought to appeal the NCAA's decision, but the organization has said the decision is not subject to appeals.http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57491185/feds-probe-possible-sandusky-child-porn-ring/

WCH
08-12-2012, 12:58 AM
So not really sure if this should go here, but this thread gave me a really good laugh.

http://bwi.rivals.com/showmsg.asp?fid=36&tid=156868749&mid=156868749&sid=890&style=2


I noticed that they weren't ballsy enough to suggest leaving the Big-10.

descendency
08-12-2012, 11:53 AM
Feds probe possible Sandusky child porn ring


http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57491185/feds-probe-possible-sandusky-child-porn-ring/

Good to see them investigating what the internet was rumoring for ages.

descendency
08-12-2012, 11:58 AM
America really needs to re-teach students what communism, socialism, McCarthyism, and **** it; everything that ends with "ism" means.

The problem is that by the time you get to those chapters in the history books, it's time for the final exams.

Smooth Criminal
08-14-2012, 05:29 PM
CNN reporting that Penn State's accreditation is in jeopardy. Won't happen of course, but another bad headline they have to deal with.

Complex
08-14-2012, 09:07 PM
Witness: I Saw Sandusky And Penn State Booster Abuse Boys On Private Plane
A witness interviewed by federal authorities in the widening Penn State investigation claims he saw Jerry Sandusky and one of the school's prominent boosters sexually abusing boys on a private plane, RadarOnline.com is reporting exclusively.

The witness was interviewed by the U.S. Postal Inspectors with the FBI present. RadarOnline.com broke the news that a new investigation into a pedophile ring is now being conducted by federal authorities.

And while Postal Inspectors are also trying to determine if Sandusky shared pornography through the mail and sent seductive letters to his victims, the biggest bombshell is the allegation leveled by the witness who was interviewed within the past few weeks.

PHOTOS: Disney's Most Scandalous & Scandal Free Stars

That man, who has a strong tie to the booster he is accusing, says that Sandusky and the booster abused two boys on a private plane in Pennsylvania, a source close to the situation tells RadarOnline.com exclusively.

"The witness doesn't know if the boys are victims who have already been identified or not," the source told Radar. "He claims it happened on a private plane, with no pilot or crew around and that he was an eyewitness.

"His claim is being taken seriously by investigators. They have already asked another man who is connected to one of the victims if he knew anything about this. And they are following up with other potential witnesses."

PHOTOS: Celebs Who Have Done Jail Time
http://www.radaronline.com/exclusives/2012/08/sandusky-penn-state-investigation-booster-abused-boys-private-plane

descendency
08-14-2012, 09:57 PM
RadarOnline = internet tabloid. Proceed with caution.

Complex
08-14-2012, 10:36 PM
RadarOnline = internet tabloid. Proceed with caution.

They were the 1st to find out that the feds were investigating Sandusky pedoo ring.

Philliez01
08-14-2012, 11:04 PM
They were the 1st to find out that the feds were investigating Sandusky pedoo ring.

It's funny you write this, it's actually getting to the point where I expect TMZ to break a significant sports story before ESPN. I know we roll our eyes at these websites but more and more, they are breaking stories quicker than others.

descendency
08-14-2012, 11:53 PM
It's funny you write this, it's actually getting to the point where I expect TMZ to break a significant sports story before ESPN. I know we roll our eyes at these websites but more and more, they are breaking stories quicker than others.

They might have some inside information, but one thing I've learned over the years is that tabloid magazines (and sites) will run info on hunches and 1 source.

They get stuff right because of it, but then they get a fair amount of stuff wrong too or at least it isn't "right".

It's like shooting fish in a barrel with a Mac-10. Of course you'll hit a few.

Giantsfan1080
08-15-2012, 07:35 AM
TMZ has a pretty high rate of always being first but also correct. I think they go for 2 sources. In fact I'm sure it's happened but I don't remember TMZ ever being wrong about a story.

JoeJoeBrown
08-15-2012, 09:17 AM
TMZ has a pretty high rate of always being first but also correct. I think they go for 2 sources. In fact I'm sure it's happened but I don't remember TMX ever being wrong about a story.

I'd say that TMZ is far more accurate than ESPN. They are terrible.

Complex
08-16-2012, 10:49 AM
GQ publishes excerpts from Joe Posnanski’s bio on Joe Paterno
Posted by Ben Kercheval on August 15, 2012, 10:00 AM EDT
Sue and Joe Paterno AP

Joe Posnanski‘s biography on longtime Penn State coach Joe Paterno, titled “Paterno”, will be available in book stores Tuesday, Aug. 21.

Posnanski, a former senior writer for Sports Illustrated, was asked by Paterno last summer to spend the 2011 season writing the book. Then, the Jerry Sandusky scandal happened, and everything changed. Paterno later died in January after a battle with lung cancer.

The current issue of GQ has the a few excerpts from the book — the full preview will be posted on the publication’s website Monday — which you can read below.

Here they are without further comment, courtesy of GQ.com:

Paterno’s son, Scott, reads the grand jury case against Sandusky for the first time:

Scott Paterno was the first in the family to understand that the Pennsylvania grand jury presentment that indicted Jerry Sandusky could end his father’s career. This wasn’t surprising; Scott tended to be the most realistic—or cynical, depending on who you asked—in the family. He had run for Congress and lost and along the way tasted the allure and nastiness of public life. He had worked as a lawyer and as a lobbyist. He would sometimes tell people, “Hey, don’t kid yourself, I’m the asshole of the family.” When Scott read the presentment, he called his father and said, “Dad, you have to face the possibility that you will never coach another game.”

As the Sandusky scandal explodes, the Paterno family hires a high-powered PR specialist, Dan McGinn, to help navigate the storm:

This is when McGinn learned just how far Paterno’s influence and reputation had fallen. He asked [family adviser Guido] D’Elia for the name of one person on the Penn State board of trustees, just one, whom they could reach out to, to negotiate a gracious ending. D’Elia shook his head.

“One person on the board, that’s all we need,” McGinn said.

D’Elia shook his head again. “It began in 2004,” he whispered, referring to an old clash Paterno had with [university president Graham] Spanier. “The board started to turn. We don’t have anybody on the board now.”

That’s when McGinn realized that this was going to be the worst day of Joe Paterno’s professional life.

At Paterno’s house the day after he is fired via late-night telephone call from the Penn State board of trustees:

On Thursday, Paterno met with his coaches at his house. He sobbed uncontrollably. This was his bad day. Later, one of his former captains, Brandon Short, stopped by the house. When Brandon asked, “How are you doing, Coach?” Paterno answered, “I’m okay,” but the last syllable was shaky, muffled by crying, and then he broke down and said, “I don’t know what I’m going to do with myself.” Nobody knew how to handle such emotion. Joe had always seemed invulnerable. On Thursday, though, he cried continually.

“My name,” he told Jay, “I have spent my whole life trying to make that name mean something. And now it’s gone.”


LMAO JoePa

JoeJoeBrown
08-16-2012, 01:36 PM
LMAO JoePa

“My name,” he told Jay, “I have spent my whole life trying to make that name mean something. And now it’s gone.”

What a ******* loser. Crying about his name that he built up while covering for an active pedophile to protect his name.

So angry thinking about this jackass.

Giantsfan1080
08-16-2012, 01:42 PM
'Highly Incriminating' Evidence in Jerry Sandusky Case Could Lead to New Charges:


Prosecutors in the Jerry Sandusky child sex abuse case said they had a "great deal" of "highly incriminating" evidence they never brought up during Sandusky's trial, evidence that could be related to pending criminal charges.
The statements are part of a transcript released Thursday from a closed-door meeting held in June, after Sandusky had been found guilty of 45 counts of child sex abuse.



"We turned over transcripts of other potential victims and transcripts relating to the Penn State University and some of the potential events involving Penn State's connection with this case that I think would be highly sought by the media and that would not be in the best interests, again, of anybody, especially potentially ongoing matters to be disclosed," Fina said, according to the transcript.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/highly-incriminating-evidence-jerry-sandusky-penn-state-sealed/story?id=17019014#.UC026aAsFs4