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View Full Version : 2012 49ers Gameday Thread: Week 6: Giants at 49ers


Borat
10-09-2012, 09:46 PM
Week 6:
Sunday, October 14, 2012
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-CdAuv6OjjyY/Txt5q-GkrrI/AAAAAAAABkg/BqsJwj8eCW8/s1600/NY+Giants+vs+San+Francisco+49ers.jpg

New York Giants (3-2)
At
San Francisco 49ers (4-1)

Location: The Stick
http://nfl49ers.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/100212-stick-header.jpg

Time: 1:25 pm pst
Line: SF -5
Announcers (FOX): TBA

The New York Giants. Our REAL rivals. It’s not the Rams. It’s not the Seahawks, nor the Cards. Not the Cowboys anymore. Not even the Raiders. It’s the Giants. Dammit. Damn you Giants. I don’t hate ‘em, … but I hate ‘em. So much pain. Soooooooooooooooo much. Dammit. Damn you Giants.

Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like 49ers/Giants rivalry has reached College Football level proportions. Except the winner isn’t getting some plaque with a bronze trophy of something stupid tacked onto it:

http://i.cdn.turner.com/sivault/multimedia/photo_gallery/0811/cfb.unusual.trophies/images/telephone-trophy.jpg
Like I said, … stupid.

Yeah, I really want this win. I don’t know if I’ve ever wanted a win this badly (playoffs excluded). Not that it will erase this:
http://timesyours.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/kyle-williams-fumble.jpg

And this:
http://www.sportsgrid.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/Punt-Return-Touched-e1327286296507.jpg

And, sigh, … this:
http://media.sacbee.com/smedia/2012/01/22/20/40/bTCv5.St.4.jpg

but a win will surely help me forget.

We went through the series history twice last year so I’m not going to do it again. Frankly, the Giants have delivered many more heartbreaks than the 49ers have (Dammit. Damn you Giants.). So let’s just skip it.

Except for this:
http://www.6magazineonline.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/jeff-garcia-tai-streets-matt-allen1.jpg

OK, enough ancient history. On to the game.

http://extras.mnginteractive.com/live/media/site36/2012/0124/20120124__SPORTS-FBN-GIANTS-NINERS-80-SJ~p1.jpg
Awwwwwwwkward.

I’ll admit it; I’m a fan of this guy:
http://jesusnsports.files.wordpress.com/2011/08/eli-manning.jpg
He’s won me over. Love the accuracy. Love his hurry-up game. Love how he controls the safeties. Dammit. Damn you Giants.

18-24 for 303 and 3 TDs. 156.2 QB rating. Nice.
So, hey, that’s what it feels like to have a top 5 QB.

http://l.yimg.com/iu/api/res/1.2/tSoBUiRaw2NohSHdNAUR.w--/YXBwaWQ9eXZpZGVvO2NoPTMyMztjcj0xO2N3PTMyMztkeD0xO2 R5PTE7Zmk9dWxjcm9wO2g9MzIzO3E9MTAwO3c9MzIz/http://media.zenfs.com/en_US/Sports/Getty_Images/201209162300828011594-p2.jpeg
Although Eli puts up that yardage in 3 quarters. Dammit. Damn you Giants.

But there’s this:
http://i.imgur.com/saFL7.png
Not pictured: Eli Manning.

The biggest matchup will be this:
http://snygiants.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/defensive-line.jpg
Freightening

VS.

This:
http://prod.static.49ers.clubs.nfl.com//assets/images/imported/SF/photos/Centerpiece_Images/Homepage/2012/10-October/100212-Line-CP3.jpg
Completely owned the Bills defen$ive line. Gonna have to do it again against another top end line.

Gotta give it up for the run game. 311 yards. Insane.
http://ww1.hdnux.com/photos/15/45/01/3559488/5/628x471.jpg
Frank is just criminally underrated. His vision is ridiculous.

And the Niners have taken the run game up a notch with this:
http://m.pressdemocrat.com/pix/121007-c547ac7079.jpg
He’s so tough to defend. That’s a new angle for the Giants to defend. Will be interesting to see how they handle it. I absolutely love it. LOVE it. I really hope they add a pass-package for him as an additional wrinkle.

The Giants offense will try and establish this:
http://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Ahmad+Bradshaw+Cleveland+Browns+v+New+York+J1h62vo FAgrl.jpg
30 carries, 200 yards last week vs. Cleveland. Psssssssshhh. ONLY 200 yards?
As usual, I’m not too concerned about the run game. Although, the refs better get their **** together on the whole “forward progress was stopped” garbage. I mean, it doesn’t affect the outcome of games, or, you know, Super Bowl appearances and things like that. Seriously, I’m not bitter.

But I am concerned about this:
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2012/10/08/sports/web_photos/08.1s062.Cruz1c--300x300.jpg
Eli to Cruz doesn’t result in overthrows and drops like it did with Fitz to Whatever-Not-Good-Receiver the Bills were rolling out there last week.

But, the Niners have a huge advantage with this:
http://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/NY-BK919_SPRTS__G_20120123200532.jpg
The TE wheel route to VD is the most unstoppable play in the league right now. I feel like they can go to it at any point and hit a big play.

And don’t forget that this happened:
http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/788533/vernon2.gif
VD has 6 receptions for 152 yards and 3 TDs in the two games last year. This offense is much more explosive this year, so he could be in for an even better performance.

The Giants won’t have to worry about this guy:
http://www.exposay.com/celebrity-photos/randy-moss-84-2012-nfl-preseason-week-0IynfK.jpg
I think he went surfing at Mavericks and got eaten by a shark, or something. Realistically, the only logical explanation for his lack of use is that the team thinks his run-blocking is a big detractor. That’s all I got. Otherwise, I’m baffled. But, if they have been holding him in reserve for this moment, I wouldn’t hate that at all. Unleash the beast!

Also, unlike the NFCCG, the Giants won’t have to worry about this:
http://www.news10.net/images/640/360/2/assetpool/images/111229065422_brett_swain640.jpg
Another lucky break for NY. Dammit. Damn you Giants.

Hopefully the Niners will be picking the brains of Brandon Jacobs and Mario Manningham for some nice insider info on the Giants’ offense. I picture it going something like this:
http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/7/2009/08/500x_custom_1251088891066_interrogation.jpg
Note: These are paid actors, portraying actual 49ers players and/or staff. Except for the dog, which belongs to Trent Baalke.

And finally, it was great to see involvement in the offense from this guy:
http://www3.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Kyle+Williams+Buffalo+Bills+v+San+Francisco+tdXmjb MhxByl.jpg
He’s got some Red Dead Redemption to deliver.

Also, THIS!!!:
http://nflhumor.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/250590_157884777686357_634221731_n.jpg

Standings
NFC West
1. San Francisco 49ers (4-1)
1. Arizona Cardinals (4-1)
3. Seattle Seahawks (3-2)
3. St. Louis Rams (3-2)

NFC East
1. New York Giants (3-2)
1. Philadelphia Eagles (3-2)
3. Dallas Cowboys (2-2)
4. Washington Redskins (2-3)

Special Note:
http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/c0.0.403.403/p403x403/47083_10151057510211875_2010314976_n.jpg

Real Giants wear black, and orange, and french vanilla.

Forenci
10-09-2012, 10:26 PM
Haha, I am looking forward to this game good sir. It really is a great rivalry.

Personally, I think you guys will beat us, but it will be a good game.

Ness
10-09-2012, 11:51 PM
I might not even see this game as I'll be traveling to a part of mainland China. Hopefully they have internet at the hotel.

Oh and hopefully Alex's sprained middle finger isn't an issue come game day.

binary
10-10-2012, 02:00 PM
This is gonna be epic. Will not sit down the entire game.

Rosebud
10-10-2012, 02:56 PM
Great game thread. I laughed my ass of at the notion of Jacobs or Mario having any information. It's gunna be a great game and I hope another heart break for you guys, which is only fair, cause yall did this to me while I was still a kid, now I'm a jaded adult-ish, incapable of enjoying this is as I once could've.

VAfy-ya
10-10-2012, 04:41 PM
Bravo Borat. The real Giants wear black and orange was a nice ending. Even as a Mets fan, I can appreciate that lol. Honestly, I want to win but would care less if we lost. I'm more worried about us expending too much energy and emotion trying to beat the G-Men and then coming out flat in a short turnaround against a very dangerous Seattle team with a defense that scares me to death. So I'm kind of indifferent at the moment.

Brent
10-10-2012, 05:01 PM
cause yall did this to me while I was still a kid, now I'm a jaded adult-ish, incapable of enjoying this is as I once could've.
A late 80's childhood or the 2002 comeback?

Rosebud
10-10-2012, 06:05 PM
A late 80's childhood or the 2002 comeback?

The comeback, after having last seen my team get eliminated from the playoffs via a superbowl raping, the likes of which we haven't seen since, the team ***** it up in an equally embarrassing manner.

Ness
10-11-2012, 10:49 AM
Hopefully the 49ers kill the Giants like they did the Bills and Jets.

Giantsfan1080
10-12-2012, 01:13 PM
Awesome job Borat. I can't wait for Sunday. You guys can win this game but I'll take the W again in the playoffs when we meet again.

Ness
10-12-2012, 07:04 PM
Kevin Gilbride and Jim Harbaugh already starting the fire. And indeed, the fire rises.


Anyways, I don't think the 49ers will be able to run the ball very well like the the last two games against the Giants. They're probably going to make Alex Smith beat them through the air.

YAYareaRB
10-12-2012, 07:48 PM
They're probably going to make Alex Smith beat them through the air.

So shall it be written, so shall it be done!

49erNation85
10-13-2012, 12:25 AM
sucks I have to work !! grr . Would love to have to watch this game. But end of seasonal job inventory has to be done Sunday it will be a long day.I just hope we win for sweet revenge from the play offs. And yes dam you Giants ! We need some excellent passing from both of our Qb 's this week and running to kick into ultra speed/high gear.

abaddon41_80
10-13-2012, 09:09 AM
Kevin Gilbride and Jim Harbaugh already starting the fire. And indeed, the fire rises.


Anyways, I don't think the 49ers will be able to run the ball very well like the the last two games against the Giants. They're probably going to make Alex Smith beat them through the air.

He did so in the regular season last year and was close to doing so with Michael Crabtree and Brett Swain in the playoffs. I believe he can definitely do it with the additions of Moss and Manningham, and Ginn back.

VAfy-ya
10-13-2012, 12:51 PM
It's not so much a matter of "if" any more with the passing offense. We just have to do it on a consistent basis. That's the problem. Guys have to excute and cut out all the damn penalties. We would have probably scored 60 on the Bills if not for all the drive-killing penalties that negated huge plays. And the secondary needs to step up. Aside from Goldie and Cully, they haven't played the kind of ball we're accustomed to seeing. Whitner already has 8 missed tackles....he had 6 for ALL of last season. Usually the secondary is the last group to get their act together because it takes a few games to build chemistry back there but these guys all played with each other last year. I didn't think it would take this long to get the cohesion we need. They have to step it up this week.

Ness
10-13-2012, 01:38 PM
Apparently Brown and Rogers have struggled so far this season. I wonder if that has to do with the lack of pass rush at times early on this on this year. Culliver on the other hand has played great.

Oh and please no dropped passes on Sunday.

Borat
10-13-2012, 02:21 PM
The real Giants host game 1 of the NLCS on Sunday. Wonder if that will effect the attendance.

VAfy-ya
10-13-2012, 03:41 PM
Apparently Brown and Rogers have struggled so far this season. I wonder if that has to do with the lack of pass rush at times early on this on this year.

There hasn't been a lack of a pass rush. We have more sacks and more hurries this year than we had at this point, last year. The pass rush is fine. Guys on the back-end just need to step up. It has nothing to do with the front seven.

Brent
10-13-2012, 03:55 PM
The real Giants host game 1 of the NLCS on Sunday. Wonder if that will effect the attendance.
can you imagine how ******* awesome it would be to see the Niners and then head down to AT&T to watch the Giants?

Borat
10-13-2012, 04:01 PM
can you imagine how ******* awesome it would be to see the Niners and then head down to AT&T to watch the Giants?

If I had more time to set it up, I would definitely be doing this.

Rosebud
10-13-2012, 04:55 PM
Kevin Gilbride and Jim Harbaugh already starting the fire. And indeed, the fire rises.


Anyways, I don't think the 49ers will be able to run the ball very well like the the last two games against the Giants. They're probably going to make Alex Smith beat them through the air.

Not sure I see that at all. We've got 3 healthy DTs of which one is a late round rookie, Kuhn, who I love, but still isn't very good right now, and the other is Marvin Austin, who hasn't played in two years and so still isn't in game shape. I'm much more worried about you guys running for 200+ on us than i am of your passing game.

Madirishman
10-13-2012, 06:14 PM
The real Giants host game 1 of the NLCS on Sunday. Wonder if that will effect the attendance.

Frisco fans have tome for both, especially since it's against NYG and what happened in January still salting the wound a little. They'll show and represent.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 09:46 AM
There hasn't been a lack of a pass rush. We have more sacks and more hurries this year than we had at this point, last year. The pass rush is fine. Guys on the back-end just need to step up. It has nothing to do with the front seven.

Not calling you out but do you have a link for this? I feel like we have been a lot more inconsistent at generating pressure this year. The only game where we had consistent pressure was the Jets. Ponder had all day to throw on most of his dropbacks and we didn't really harass Rodgers, Stafford and Fitzpatrick like we did opposing QBs last year

Justone2
10-14-2012, 10:19 AM
Aldon chased Rodgers all over the field at times and also Ponder beated us mostly on the run with Smith running after him most of the time.

Ness
10-14-2012, 11:20 AM
I won't be able to watch the entire game live like I thought I would. Maybe just half of it. I might just wait to download it. We'll see.

Ness
10-14-2012, 12:26 PM
Going to sleep now. Hopefully when I wake up the 49ers are off to a great start.

Borat
10-14-2012, 12:27 PM
Game starts in 3 hours. That's plenty of sleepy time.

Brent
10-14-2012, 04:45 PM
Came out looking great, defense has looked flat and as though we cannot keep up with their WRs.

Ness
10-14-2012, 04:58 PM
Just woke up and checked the score right before the half ended. Damn I though it would be a better result. Hopefully the 49ers take control of the second half.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 04:59 PM
Eli has all day to throw and the Giants receivers are making some sick catches. Not a good combination for us

Justone2
10-14-2012, 05:29 PM
First quarter all looked great but since then its really bad all around.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 05:37 PM
Pretty bad

Brent
10-14-2012, 05:44 PM
what a cluster-****

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 06:04 PM
Terrible game by the whole team. Missed field goals, no pressure on Eli, Smith making terrible forced throws, the offensive line being awful. Even Bradshaw got 100+ yards.

Borat
10-14-2012, 06:05 PM
The first quarter was fun.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 06:49 PM
Well at least the Cardinals, to the Bills no less, and Rams lost. One of two things is going to happen Thursday. We are either going to be very angry and destroy them or we are going to be very sulky and struggle mightily.

49ersfan_87
10-14-2012, 06:52 PM
The problem early in the game was missed opportunities and dumb coaching. That long pass that Manningham almost had, inserting Kaepernick for plays that caught nobody offguard, 2 missed FG's.

In the 2nd half, it was a big ST's return and a big rushing TD given up. Then 2 straight turnovers by Alex completely deflated the team. Then Rogers drops a pick that at the least, takes points off the board. May have had a shot at a big return (it was after 1 of Alex's INT's).

The worst play of the game? 4th and 15 inside the opponents 35, Alex throws 2 yards past the line of scrimmage. Unbelievably awful.

Some things to keep in mind- we've played 2 games against teams with winning records. The combined score in both games is 50-16, both losses by the 49ers. Anytime we face a winning team we look completely awful.

Now we face a Seahawks team thats riding sky high after upsetting the Patriots.

VAfy-ya
10-14-2012, 07:19 PM
Few thoughts...

Honestly, I'm not mad that we loss. Don't want to lose in that fashion but we needed this loss. We dont respond well as front-runners. We beat GB and Detroit, everyone is singing our praises. We respond by coming flat and lackluster against the Vikes. We steamroll the Jets and the Bills. Everyone is again singing our praises. We respond again, by another lackluster performance. Give the G-Men credit, they beat us up and down the field. But it just seems like we react better when ppl doubt us. And there will be ppl lined up to doubt us now. This team needs to learn how to respond better when the target is on you. Its just one bad game in October so I dont want to over-react too much but we have too much talent to lose like this.

I dont know what got into Alex but he was not himself today. Every int was a throw that Alex usually NEVER ever attempts. He never forces things and Im not sure why he felt like today was the day to start but he needs to remember the kind of play got him the success he had experienced up until today.

And as much as I like the WildKap, Roman was very reckless with it today. You dont sub out Alex after he just throws a 60 yard bomb to Moss to put us in scoring position. That's just a horrible decision. They need to be more selective with that package. Alot of times it seems to kill momentum, especially after a big play. Going into half-time was the perfect situation for it because most teams are expecting read-option to just run out the clock. But I dont like watching Alex convert a nice 3rd down throw, only to see him sit on the sideline for two plays. QBs need to get a rhythm going and that's the sure way kill a QB's rhythm.

And its very evident, this is a team that cant come from behind. Our offense isn't geared for it. Our passing offense works off our running game. We're not built to pass the ball 50 times. That's why its critical our QB doesn't turn the ball over like he did today. Maybe down the line the passing game will evolve but as for now, we HAVE to run the ball and stick with it for Roman and Alex to be at their best.

binary
10-14-2012, 07:50 PM
That just sucked on so many levels. I'd only use Kap near the goalline, I'm tired of the momentum/rhythm being killed.

Alex sucked today, what a suckfest. I know it wasn't his fault we got behind, but a good QB needs to bring the team back at home vs. a good team...he failed. crap, that sucked. The D couldn't stop Eli at all either in the first half, bleh.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 08:02 PM
Plenty of suck everywhere on the 49ers. Even things that are usually great, like Akers and the kickoffs coverage, were bad. The biggest problems were the lack of pressure on Eli, if you give any QB that much time they are going to beat you, and Alex Smith and the offensive line. The only offensive lineman that I don't remember having at least a couple of terrible plays was Staley, and he didn't even play the whole game. Smith's interceptions were just terrible decisions.

Borat
10-14-2012, 08:07 PM
We got smoked. I haz a sad.

But, hey, knowing Giants fans, we won't hear about this for the rest of the season. Not a word.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 08:08 PM
We got smoked. I haz a sad.

But, hey, knowing Giants fans, we won't hear about this for the rest of the season. Not a word.

Obligatory

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_wAxDMfEGhoY/TQrlbN4gYXI/AAAAAAAAAXg/kmwztAAni44/s400/Not%2BSure%2Bif%2Bserious.jpg

Borat
10-14-2012, 08:12 PM
Obligatory

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_wAxDMfEGhoY/TQrlbN4gYXI/AAAAAAAAAXg/kmwztAAni44/s400/Not%2BSure%2Bif%2Bserious.jpg

Yeah. That last line was dipped in sarcasm then topped with whipped sarcasm and also, sprinkles.

NY+Giants=NYG
10-14-2012, 08:20 PM
We got smoked. I haz a sad.

But, hey, knowing Giants fans, we won't hear about this for the rest of the season. Not a word.

I know I personally don't care. It's not like our fan base built this up as a rematch and let's get revenge. It was just another game and honestly one I thought we'd get blown out in. Good we got the win, but who cares. On to the next game.

Borat
10-14-2012, 08:25 PM
I know I personally don't care. It's not like our fan base built this up as a rematch and let's get revenge. It was just another game and honestly one I thought we'd get blown out in. Good we got the win, but who cares. On to the next game.

It's cool for you to go onto the next game now.

VAfy-ya
10-14-2012, 08:36 PM
No one will be talking about this game come December. Too much football left to panic. One thing I saw today that I thought I would never see....our D-Line wore down in the 4th quarter and got mauled. That's usually what we do to other teams but it was evident their O-Line wore us down late. It may be time to look at some sort of rotation as we see the defense getting up there in snaps on gameday. Almost like pitch count for the guys upfront. Those ints added to their workload so I think we need some kind of rotation, as all our front 7 guys play in our base and nickel package aside from Ice. That's unheard of and something we need to take into account when they see alot of snaps.

And I totally underestimated Haralson's injury in the grand scheme of things. Last year, we had three primary pass-rushers in Haralson, Brooks, and Aldon. This year we only have two in Aldon and Brooks and they are both are playing every down, as they are our ends in the nickel. We need to keep these guys fresh and we're lacking a effective 3rd option behind them, so these guys are playing virtually every snap on defense with no rest. These guys are really twenner OLB/DEs than true DEs so I think they're wearing down the more snaps they see later in games.

But its not the end of the world though. Fans have to put these early losses into perspective. The Ravens won today but they lost Ray Lewis for the year with a torn tricep. Lost LaDarius Webb for the year with a torn ACL. And Ngata sprained his MCL and is out for a few weeks. It could always be worst.

abaddon41_80
10-14-2012, 08:40 PM
I didn't think the defensive front was playing very good to begin with. They weren't getting dominated in the running game early on but they could not generate any type of pass rush from start to finish

VAfy-ya
10-14-2012, 09:08 PM
I didn't think the defensive front was playing very good to begin with. They weren't getting dominated in the running game early on but they could not generate any type of pass rush from start to finish

Because the Giants were running the ball decent enough and they had to respect the run. You have to understand, they were doubling and chipping Aldon and the inside guys didnt push the pocket in front of Eli well enough. Eli needs pressure in his face to affect him. He had a clean pocket to step up into because we couldn't push the pocket with four and when we did blitz up the middle, he was beating us with the hot reads and moving the chains. We got out-schemed today. When we dont dominate the run game, it effects our defense because we still have to respect the run on play-action and in certain formations we have to look for a run call. We didnt dominate early. We had some 'no gains' but the Giants kept sticking with it and getting a few good gains here and there and that was just enough for us to not be able to pin our ears back.

And you really have to give Eli credit, he made some ridiculous accurate throws where guys had great coverage. That kind of put the defense on its heels. We're not going to dominate every Sunday. You had a hot QB and team able to keep us honest with a run game. And we're throwing ints to give them short fields. I mean we forced our share of punts. Eli didn't even throw for 200 yards. But this defense has to stop the run effectively as it did last year. And this is a offense that absolutely, positively, can not turn the ball over. We had ONE game last year where we turned the ball over 3 times or more. We've already had two games this year where we did and we're only 6 games in. And this year, we're dropping pick 6's instead of taking them to the house and changing the momentum of games. Whitner dropped a sure pick 6 against the Vikes, Rogers dropped one today.

Borat
10-14-2012, 09:32 PM
As bad as I feel now, I have to live with the knowledge that once Dan finishes with this game, I'm going to feel 10 times worse.

Ness
10-14-2012, 10:40 PM
Damn I just saw the result. Good thing I didn't lose that much sleep over this disgrace of a performance. I'm really curious to see what the future holds. I'm not going to even download the actual broadcasted game. I saw the highlights and it just looked dreadful. Especially that pass on 4th down and 15. That is vintage Alex and I don't know why he does that. You need to give your receivers a chance to make a play. Honestly I hope the media asks him what he was thinking on the throw. I'd really like to know what his response would be. Alex's interceptions just looked terrible decisions. Really, I'm wondering if this guy is ever going to have a consistently good year. Or if he's ever going to dominate a decent to good defense with his arm. If the run game and/or defense falters for a prolonged period of time, can Alex deliver? Can he consistently bring a team from behind into a game? I don't think so. I'm guessing this is the best he'll ever get which is a sad, sad reality. This makes last week's performance against the Bills a fraudulent event.

Apparently the defense played flat as well. Whatever. I'm more concerned about our offense. It's an offensive league and you need an offense to compete. It was unrealistic to expect our defense to dominate like it did last year. Everyone essentially had a career year.

Meanwhile, Russell Wilson dominates against the Patriots as a rookie.

Brent
10-14-2012, 10:43 PM
As bad as I feel now, I have to live with the knowledge that once Dan finishes with this game, I'm going to feel 10 times worse.
might want to change your location, we dont play defense

Ness
10-14-2012, 10:44 PM
Plenty of suck everywhere on the 49ers. Even things that are usually great, like Akers and the kickoffs coverage, were bad. The biggest problems were the lack of pressure on Eli, if you give any QB that much time they are going to beat you, and Alex Smith and the offensive line. The only offensive lineman that I don't remember having at least a couple of terrible plays was Staley, and he didn't even play the whole game. Smith's interceptions were just terrible decisions.
Just like I said earlier, the pass rush was garbage. Zero sacks is inexcusable. I don't care how many "pressures" or whatever stat is floating out there. It's about finishing in this league. Get the dude on the ******* ground. Who was the last team that was praised for having a ****** sack total, yet a good amount of pressures, or what I like to call "ghost sacks"?

Meanwhile, the Giants delievered after being doubted in their pass rushing which was questioned by the media.

Ness
10-14-2012, 10:46 PM
...........................

Ness
10-14-2012, 10:59 PM
.............

49ersfan_87
10-14-2012, 11:54 PM
And here I thought Alex Smith had arrived after having a career game against the Bills. Then the very next week the Giants smack reality back into my face.

Damn the entire time on the plane I was thinking about how the 49ers could come back into the second half after the last score I had seen was the Giants leading 10 - 6, and when I get back into Macau I'll check the result and hopefully the 49ers had one. Lame.

Oh and LOL at Alex trying to be more than he actually is. Dude, you're not Drew Brees. Stop trying to gun that **** in there dumbfuck.

Every time you think Alex turns the corner...he doesn't. Look at that Seahawks game in 2006 where he had that beastly 4th quarter. Didn't play that well after. The Saints game last year, follows that up with the Giants game. The Bills game this year, the Giants game today.

Alex is who he is. He's inconsistent. And as long he's our QB the passing game won't be the biggest factor in our wins. If we don't get ahead early our pass game just falls apart against good teams. I think we have to accept who Alex is, and that at times he'll have some good games but he'll also have some average to bad games.

By my count, he's had 3 good (Packers, Lions, Bills) and 3 bad (Vikings, Jets, Giants) games this year.

Ness
10-15-2012, 12:01 AM
Every time you think Alex turns the corner...he doesn't. Look at that Seahawks game in 2006 where he had that beastly 4th quarter. Didn't play that well after. The Saints game last year, follows that up with the Giants game. The Bills game this year, the Giants game today.

Alex is who he is. He's inconsistent. And as long he's our QB the passing game won't be the biggest factor in our wins. If we don't get ahead early our pass game just falls apart against good teams. I think we have to accept who Alex is, and that at times he'll have some good games but he'll also have some average to bad games.

By my count, he's had 3 good (Packers, Lions, Bills) and 3 bad (Vikings, Jets, Giants) games this year.



Well the good news is that we only signed him to a three year deal. He'll be gone soon if he doesn't get his act together. It's a lot harder to find a franchise quarterback than anything.

Yes he's inconsistent and I as a fan am going to remember this game for a long time. Probably until the playoffs, which is when I'll really start to worry. I don't see Alex performing well enough to erase this disaster of a day. He just can't dominate against good defenses. This was the first good defense he's played this season and he choked. Plus he takes way too many sacks for my taste. I always cringe when Alex throws a ball instead of sit back with confidence assuming that it most likely be a completion for a nice gain. I'm assuming it will be most likely be a mistake. When Alex scores, I'm surprised. When he scores against a good defense, I'm even more surprised.

The Seahawks are another good defense coming up and the 49ers could be staring at a 4-3 record. We'll see how Alex does against them, but I'm guessing he'll choke again and confirm my thoughts. Especially on a short week. I'm pretty skeptical from here on out. Maybe Harbaugh is trying his best to give Alex the chance to take over a game and it's just failing.

Now that I think of it, what was the last good defense Alex Smith had a great game against, if ever? I want to say the Steelers from last year, but he didn't dominate in that game. Same with Seattle.

Special Note: When it's 4th and 15 with the game slipping away, you don't throw a two yard dump off pass to Vernon Davis. That was all on Alex and it was just a stupid decision. Someone blindfolded literally might have a better chance. All they have to do is throw the ball beyond 15 yards to give someone a chance at converting. Doesn't matter if it's picked off at that point. The main thing is that you tried. Just seemed like the 49ers gave up the game and wanted to hit the showers early.

Ness
10-15-2012, 12:41 AM
But its not the end of the world though. Fans have to put these early losses into perspective. The Ravens won today but they lost Ray Lewis for the year with a torn tricep. Lost LaDarius Webb for the year with a torn ACL. And Ngata sprained his MCL and is out for a few weeks. It could always be worst.

Right, the Ravens defense has suffered a serious blow, but their offense can still deliver. It's not that bad as it seems for the 5-1 Ravens. Their defense has been inconsistent all season long, but the offense has still kept them in the games. This isn't the case for the 49ers. Could you imagine of the 49ers lost a few of their susperstars on defense and the burden of winning shifted mostly to the offense? It would be ugly.

Ness
10-15-2012, 02:09 AM
Hilarious comments on the 49ers main board.

The loss was for all the lamers that waved Alex's flag and had the audacity to call him elite.

Alex Smith SUCKS. We cannot and will not win a Super Bowl with him. Period. End of story.

One thing Kaepernick has over Alex, he doesn't look terrified.

OMGZ!!! ALEX SMIFF SMOKED DA GIANTZ SOOOOO BADZ!!!

Alex Smith is who we thought he is. A game manager that can't go outside the script.

Alex Smith is safe sex. CK7 is raw doggin. Just put him in to see what he can do. We all know what Alex can do if the script is not perfect....NOTHING!!!

Both of these QB's are horrible. Im telling you, this team has serious problems at the most important position on the field.


LOL..you fans are bipolar. I told you all. LAST WEEK WAS AN ALEX SMITH FOG(Flash Of Greatness).

Unrealistic to believe that you can win a championship with this QB. Unless we have historic defense and special teams.....which we don't.

Let me guess Alex Lovers.... it was the defense's fault?

no wait, it was the OLine?

no wait, it was the receivers dropping the ball?

no wait, it was him "losing rhythm" because Kaep came in?

no wait, it was the play calling?

no wait, it was bad coaching?

Same stories for 7 years.

And if you expect the defense to play well when the offense stinks so bad and they stay on the field the entire second half of the game, then you are out of it.

True but he went 4/7 and had 83 yards, 11 yards avg for a 98 rating. I like to see more like a series or two.

Ness
10-15-2012, 02:44 AM
Few thoughts...

Honestly, I'm not mad that we loss. Don't want to lose in that fashion but we needed this loss. We dont respond well as front-runners. We beat GB and Detroit, everyone is singing our praises. We respond by coming flat and lackluster against the Vikes. We steamroll the Jets and the Bills. Everyone is again singing our praises. We respond again, by another lackluster performance. Give the G-Men credit, they beat us up and down the field. But it just seems like we react better when ppl doubt us. And there will be ppl lined up to doubt us now. This team needs to learn how to respond better when the target is on you. Its just one bad game in October so I dont want to over-react too much but we have too much talent to lose like this.

This team does have a lot of talent. Maybe the Giants just had a good game plan and luck was on their side, or maybe the league is starting to figure out San Francisco's bag of tricks. Force Alex Smith to beat you and you'll probably win the game, assuming you're a decent a team.


And its very evident, this is a team that cant come from behind. Our offense isn't geared for it. Our passing offense works off our running game. We're not built to pass the ball 50 times. That's why its critical our QB doesn't turn the ball over like he did today. Maybe down the line the passing game will evolve but as for now, we HAVE to run the ball and stick with it for Roman and Alex to be at their best.

Perhaps that is how this team should be built. Honestly you shouldn't built your team around a strong run game now and days. Doesn't make sense with the rules in place. It's a passing league. And as long as you have a QB, a real QB, you'll have a chance in any game at any time. New Orleans is what, 1-4, but if I was a Saints fan I'd still feel confident going into any game regardless of how terrible the defense is because I have one guy named Drew Brees. The team can give up 25 points, and he'll put up 30. The run game can suck and he'll put up big numbers. The team can turn the ball over 3 times, and the game is still within reach.

It's really an unsettling reality when you know what your best chance of consistently winning is only going to be because of the run game. What happens when the run game gets stopped or the defense doesn't show up for several games or is inconsistent. Then it will fall on Alex's shoulders, and well...I just don't see that ending well.

Ness
10-15-2012, 04:04 AM
And this is a offense that absolutely, positively, can not turn the ball over. We had ONE game last year where we turned the ball over 3 times or more. We've already had two games this year where we did and we're only 6 games in. And this year, we're dropping pick 6's instead of taking them to the house and changing the momentum of games. Whitner dropped a sure pick 6 against the Vikes, Rogers dropped one today.

And this is just sad. Because then now you're playing scared. You're playing not to lose the game instead of playing to win it. The offense, in particular the quarterback, needs to get better to the point that if you have a turnover or two the game isn't completely over when there is still plenty of time to play.

edgrenade
10-15-2012, 04:55 AM
One thing that has concerns me with the defense this season is the lack of a rotation. It seems like the same 11-12 guys are the only ones who play defense. We need to start rotating d-line

Ness
10-15-2012, 04:59 AM
By the way why does Alex NEVER pump fake? He's pumped fake like twice in two years.

abaddon41_80
10-15-2012, 05:24 AM
By the way why does Alex NEVER pump fake? He's pumped fake like twice in two years.

Well yesterday it is not like he had much time to. The Giants were on him as soon as he got the snap.

Ness
10-15-2012, 05:46 AM
Well yesterday it is not like he had much time to. The Giants were on him as soon as he got the snap.

Right, but he's had good protection at various points in time. The protection isn't always bad to the point that it's impossible to pump fake.

These small things are just really frustrating to swallow with Alex, because he seems like a smart guy that isn't prone to lapses in common sense. Never pump faking or throwing a ball two yards when it's 4th and 15...I just don't understand the "logic" behind things like this. Maybe his head isn't always in the game. What is troubling is those two specific things have happened more than a couple of times each.

abaddon41_80
10-15-2012, 05:59 AM
I don't understand the point of even having Vernon Davis, by far our most dangerous receiving threat, running a two-yard route on 4th and 15. I don't remember who our other receivers in on that play were but do we really want anyone else getting the ball on 4th and 15? Besides, if Alex Smith throws it deep into coverage there and it is an interception we are probably criticizing him even more.

Ness
10-15-2012, 07:10 AM
I don't understand the point of even having Vernon Davis, by far our most dangerous receiving threat, running a two-yard route on 4th and 15. I don't remember who our other receivers in on that play were but do we really want anyone else getting the ball on 4th and 15? Besides, if Alex Smith throws it deep into coverage there and it is an interception we are probably criticizing him even more.
Yeah I don't know why in the world a receiver is running that kind of route on 4th and 15.

If Alex throws a 4th interception at that point though, big deal. Who cares. The game is over if the pass is incomplete anyways. I'd rather him throw a pick than throw a two yard out pattern with 13 more yards to convert on a 4th. Hell, I'd rather have Smith take a sack looking for someone down the field than do what he did.

ViperVisor
10-15-2012, 07:43 AM
Complaining about the 4th and 15 play is ********.

3 min left and down 20.

I'm sure the yahoos would be very understanding of a play where a Vernon or someone is 20 yards down the field and goes for a pass and gets injured.

Ness
10-15-2012, 08:07 AM
Complaining about the 4th and 15 play is ********.

3 min left and down 20.

I'm sure the yahoos would be very understanding of a play where a Vernon or someone is 20 yards down the field and goes for a pass and gets injured.

It's football. Injuries happen at any time. That's not an excuse for throwing a two yard out on 4th and 15. And this isn't the first time it's happened either when the 49ers need to convert a mile, aren't backed up in their own territory, and a dump off pass is thrown. Makes zero sense.

So the 49ers shouldn't throw deep and try to convert and try to do the best they can to come back because someone could get hurt? In a professional football game?

The 49ers shouldn't have even thrown the ball then and just gave up at that point. Maybe taken a knee. Yeah I'm sure that would have made things a lot better. :facepalm:

Let's not pretend like any player or coach can do no wrong here.

abaddon41_80
10-15-2012, 08:13 AM
The fans would care if he threw a pick there. Even more than are currently screaming for Kaepernick would be doing so. The thing is, though, Kaepernick taking that bad sack after the long ball to Moss put us in the long fourth down

Ness
10-15-2012, 08:34 AM
The fans would care if he threw a pick there. Even more than are currently screaming for Kaepernick would be doing so. The thing is, though, Kaepernick taking that bad sack after the long ball to Moss put us in the long fourth down

Yeah, but who cares what the casual fan thinks. Most fans are idiots. I'd say 20% of any team's "fans" are probably worth talking to.

ViperVisor
10-15-2012, 08:58 AM
It is a perfect excuse.

You save your bullets for later.

It is utterly moronic to expose players to big risk with a 1% chance of winning that game.

And maybe would could of scored the 1 TD and then used 1 of our best 2-pt plays that you should keep in your back pocket for when you really need it.

Rosebud
10-15-2012, 09:47 AM
I don't understand the point of even having Vernon Davis, by far our most dangerous receiving threat, running a two-yard route on 4th and 15. I don't remember who our other receivers in on that play were but do we really want anyone else getting the ball on 4th and 15? Besides, if Alex Smith throws it deep into coverage there and it is an interception we are probably criticizing him even more.

I think that was a result of the pressure not letting the play fully develop. Looked like Vernon was trying to get to the sideline to cut up field on that wheel route that burned NO in the playoffs. Still have issues with a play call that takes that long to develop on 4th and 15 with the pressure we were getting, but that looked like a play that didn't get to develop.

Ness
10-15-2012, 10:03 AM
It is a perfect excuse.

You save your bullets for later.

It is utterly moronic to expose players to big risk with a 1% chance of winning that game.

And maybe would could of scored the 1 TD and then used 1 of our best 2-pt plays that you should keep in your back pocket for when you really need it.
Right then. So you agree. They should have just taken a knee and head to the showers early. Great idea.

dan77733
10-15-2012, 10:56 AM
Saw the game for the most part but since I was watching with my girlfriend and she wasnt feeling well, the game didnt mean much if anything to me.

All I will say is that we got our asses kicked, plain and simple. Dont mind the loss as long as we beat SEA and ARZ the next two weeks. I'll be happy.

Harbaugh needs to make a decision though - stay with Smith or trade him and go with Kaepernick. After that pass to Moss, it went all downhill in terms of any possible comeback. Smith forced passes but when he sees Kapernick with a stonger and better arm get playing time, I cant really blame him. The team sucked from top to bottom but whatever.

If losing to the Giants means that we'll beat SEA and ARZ, its a trade that I'll happily accept. If we lose to SEA and/or ARZ, then we have some serious problems.

abaddon41_80
10-15-2012, 01:56 PM
I literally heard a 49er fan use this reasoning for why we should bench Alex Smith, I am paraphrasing.

"If you force Alex to play from 2+ scores behind, put some pressure on him and just take away Vernon Davis he crumbles."

Breaking news: Force a QB into a must-pass situation, take away his only receiving threat and generate pressure without blitzing and the QB will play poorly. I have called every defensive coordinator in the NFL to let them know of this strategy.

binary
10-15-2012, 02:14 PM
It's freaking hard to find an elite QB, we don't have one. Alex has come back from big deficits, he's choked against big deficits...it happens with mid-tier guys...he's just an average guy. He's short term, and it's becoming more and more obvious.

What is UTTERLY dumb is calling for Kap right now, there is no excuse for tht sort of stupidity. This team has a small window right now, and growing pains would be devastating. Do people really think Kap would've been playing as good as Alex so far in his first year starting? How dumb can a fanbase be?

And who gives a crap about 4th and 15. What about bomb to Moss with some momentum and then we get to 2nd and 21?! wtf. What about the first two drives, team is moving the ball, then Roman goes mad scientist on everyone? Blegh.

49ersfan_87
10-15-2012, 02:23 PM
Complaining about the 4th and 15 play is ********.

3 min left and down 20.

I'm sure the yahoos would be very understanding of a play where a Vernon or someone is 20 yards down the field and goes for a pass and gets injured.

3 min left in the 3rd quarter.

It's freaking hard to find an elite QB, we don't have one. Alex has come back from big deficits, he's choked against big deficits...it happens with mid-tier guys...he's just an average guy. He's short term, and it's becoming more and more obvious.

What is UTTERLY dumb is calling for Kap right now, there is no excuse for tht sort of stupidity. This team has a small window right now, and growing pains would be devastating. Do people really think Kap would've been playing as good as Alex so far in his first year starting? How dumb can a fanbase be?

And who gives a crap about 4th and 15. What about bomb to Moss with some momentum and then we get to 2nd and 21?! wtf. What about the first two drives, team is moving the ball, then Roman goes mad scientist on everyone? Blegh.

Kaep doesn't look ready. He's doing OK in designed passes and runs, but QBing a whole game is a different story. Making reads, avoiding pressure, avoiding turnovers, taking advantage of the blitz, knowing when to run and when not to, etc.

binary
10-15-2012, 02:25 PM
Hilarious comments on the 49ers main board.

These are why I'll never return to the "popular" boards. They've learned absolutely nothing, even though they've looked like total imbeciles the last few years and have been wrong about virtually everything...from buying into Dingle, to buying into Hill, to we want carr, to criticizing Harbaugh for bringing back Alex last year...the stupidity reigns supreme over there.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 02:31 PM
Like I said, ppl are making more of this loss than they should. Typical Niner fan reaction. No one will be talking about this loss if we beat Seattle and Arizona. We would be 6-2 and have all the talking heads saying how we rebounded from the Giants loss and are again, the team to beat. Fans fall for this same **** every time. Football is week to week. Your only as good as your last game is the way most ppl look at these things but ppl should start focusing on the big picture. This team is still 4-2 and is in a great position in the NFC. The game is always evolving and you can never be stagnant in this league. A game like this gets players attention but also a staffs attention. I said before the season that we couldn't do the same thing we did last year and have success because the NFL always catches up to schemes the next year. And while the offense is still in the process of evolving, I feel the defense is still doing what it did last year. And that's good enough against most teams but the Giants have a good offensive staff and they just out-schemed us. Maybe now Fangio sees this and tweaks some things does some more exotic stuff upfront to help out players when maybe they aren't having their best day. But it isn't like they rolled up 500 yards of offense on us either. As bad as we played, we still only gave up 374 yards of offense. Aaron Rodgers nearly threw for that many against the Texans last night. The sky is not falling...

binary
10-15-2012, 02:34 PM
Like I said, ppl are making more of this loss than they should. Typical Niner fan reaction. No one will be talking about this loss if we beat Seattle and Arizona. We would be 6-2 and have all the talking heads saying how we rebounded from the Giants loss and are again, the team to beat. Fans fall for this same **** every time. Football is week to week. Your only as good as your last game is the way most ppl look at these things but ppl should start focusing on the big picture. This team is still 4-2 and is in a great position in the NFC. The game is always evolving and you can never be stagnant in this league. A game like this gets players attention but also a staffs attention. I said before the season that we couldn't do the same thing we did last year and have success because the NFL always catches up to schemes the next year. And while the offense is still in the process of evolving, I feel the defense is still doing what it did last year. And that's good enough against most teams but the Giants have a good offensive staff and they just out-schemed us. Maybe now Fangio sees this and tweaks some things does some more exotic stuff upfront to help out players when maybe they aren't having their best day. But it isn't like they rolled up 500 yards of offense on us either. As bad as we played, we still only gave up 374 yards of offense. Aaron Rodgers nearly threw for that many against the Texans last night. The sky is not falling...

I agree but this Kap stuff scares me, not b/c I'm an Alex fan but because is screams of desperation and/or a lack of decisiveness. I really thought this Offense took a few steps forward, and if so, there is no need for this gimmick crap against good teams.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 02:34 PM
Kaep doesn't look ready. He's doing OK in designed passes and runs, but QBing a whole game is a different story. Making reads, avoiding pressure, avoiding turnovers, taking advantage of the blitz, knowing when to run and when not to, etc.

Absolutely. The fact that he took that sack after the Moss rec shows that. You can not take a sack right there. He's awareness is not where it should be in the pocket. Not even close. He needs another year and off-season.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 02:39 PM
I agree but this Kap stuff scares me, not b/c I'm an Alex fan but because is screams of desperation and/or a lack of decisiveness. I really thought this Offense took a few steps forward, and if so, there is no need for this gimmick crap against good teams.

IMO, the WildKap is good when you have the league and trying keep the defense off balance, while running a ball-control offense and maintaining time of possession. But you can't be using it when your down a score or two. That's when you need a real QB in the pocket who can beat a team with his head and his arm, not his feet.

49ersfan_87
10-15-2012, 02:41 PM
Like I said, ppl are making more of this loss than they should. Typical Niner fan reaction. No one will be talking about this loss if we beat Seattle and Arizona. We would be 6-2 and have all the talking heads saying how we rebounded from the Giants loss and are again, the team to beat. Fans fall for this same **** every time. Football is week to week. Your only as good as your last game is the way most ppl look at these things but ppl should start focusing on the big picture. This team is still 4-2 and is in a great position in the NFC. The game is always evolving and you can never be stagnant in this league. A game like this gets players attention but also a staffs attention. I said before the season that we couldn't do the same thing we did last year and have success because the NFL always catches up to schemes the next year. And while the offense is still in the process of evolving, I feel the defense is still doing what it did last year. And that's good enough against most teams but the Giants have a good offensive staff and they just out-schemed us. Maybe now Fangio sees this and tweaks some things does some more exotic stuff upfront to help out players when maybe they aren't having their best day. But it isn't like they rolled up 500 yards of offense on us either. As bad as we played, we still only gave up 374 yards of offense. Aaron Rodgers nearly threw for that many against the Texans last night. The sky is not falling...

I still think this is a good team, a playoff team (although if the season started today, we'd miss it).

Right now, i'd say our weaknesses are defensive depth (especially at DL and OLB, we're getting worn out and that hurt us at the end where they gashed us), ST's (big returns given up+Akers missing FG's), and the passing game (ineffective half the time this year, ineffective when another team gets even a small lead on us).

What concerns me is we've never been blown out like last night. Not a huge worry because the Texans just got blown out (by a team we controlled for much of that game), and Tom Coughlin era Giants have had a lot of bad losses too. But it just feels weird to see a Harbaugh coached team get dominated in that fashion. I'm eagerly waiting to see how the 49ers respond against the Seahawks. They have a much better defense than the Giants so i'd be pleasantly surprised if the 49ers passing game is effective.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 02:43 PM
It's freaking hard to find an elite QB, we don't have one. Alex has come back from big deficits, he's choked against big deficits...it happens with mid-tier guys...he's just an average guy. He's short term, and it's becoming more and more obvious.

What is UTTERLY dumb is calling for Kap right now, there is no excuse for tht sort of stupidity. This team has a small window right now, and growing pains would be devastating. Do people really think Kap would've been playing as good as Alex so far in his first year starting? How dumb can a fanbase be?

And who gives a crap about 4th and 15. What about bomb to Moss with some momentum and then we get to 2nd and 21?! wtf. What about the first two drives, team is moving the ball, then Roman goes mad scientist on everyone? Blegh.

Excatly. Alex looked like **** but taking him out after that Moss throw was about the dumbest decision I've seen under Jimbaugh. It made absolutely no sense. We did the Giants a favor there. The WildKap had been ineffective all day up until that point. I'm sure they were glad to see CK come in the game after that play.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 02:51 PM
I still think this is a good team, a playoff team (although if the season started today, we'd miss it).

Right now, i'd say our weaknesses are defensive depth (especially at DL and OLB, we're getting worn out and that hurt us at the end where they gashed us), ST's (big returns given up+Akers missing FG's), and the passing game (ineffective half the time this year, ineffective when another team gets even a small lead on us).

What concerns me is we've never been blown out like last night. Not a huge worry because the Texans just got blown out (by a team we controlled for much of that game), and Tom Coughlin era Giants have had a lot of bad losses too. But it just feels weird to see a Harbaugh coached team get dominated in that fashion. I'm eagerly waiting to see how the 49ers respond against the Seahawks. They have a much better defense than the Giants so i'm not expecting Alex to play well.

It was bound to happen. You can't out-physical everyone, every Sunday. Like I said, ppl catch up with you in this league. Our success last year sparked a lot teams to focus on the trenches and get those physically tough players. We got beat at our own game and its not the first time. Ravens did it to us last year and we responded well from it.

And you're right about depth, I made a post about that on page 2 about the very same thing. That's what I mean by the loss will probably do more good than if we would have won. You look at things and see where you can get better more readily than after two huge blowout wins. I'm not worried at this point. Far too much football left for that.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 03:03 PM
And this is just sad. Because then now you're playing scared. You're playing not to lose the game instead of playing to win it. The offense, in particular the quarterback, needs to get better to the point that if you have a turnover or two the game isn't completely over when there is still plenty of time to play.

It's not about playing scared, its about being smart with the ball. Were we scared when we played the Bills? No, but we were smart with the ball. We valued the football last year. Up until yesterday, Alex valued the football. His 8/1 TD to int ratio spoke to that. All I'm saying is Alex doesn't need to go and think he has to become Brees because he's down a TD and start forcing the ball. Thats not what he's good at. Take what the defense gives you, and if we have to punt it, we punt it. You don't help out their offense by giving Eli Manning short fields. All three of those throws were just bad decisions. One was a bad throw and a bad decision. That first Rolle pick was especially dumb. How do you look off one safety than turn your head and just throw blindly into coverage without locating the other safety? Just a horrible decisions on Alex's part and something he doesn't normally do.

dan77733
10-15-2012, 04:56 PM
Excatly. Alex looked like **** but taking him out after that Moss throw was about the dumbest decision I've seen under Jimbaugh. It made absolutely no sense. We did the Giants a favor there. The WildKap had been ineffective all day up until that point. I'm sure they were glad to see CK come in the game after that play.

This. Agree 100%. Against a crappy Jets or Bills team, Harbaugh can get away with using Kaepernick in a wildcat but against a good coached team like the Giants, no way.

I have said this since last season and I'll say it again -

Harbaugh DOESNT have confidence in Smith period and I dont care how many times times he says that Smith is his QB. It's such bullcrap. There's a reason why Harbaugh went after Manning. It's because he knows that if he gets behind, Smith isnt bringing back the team to a win. If he did, he wouldnt keep taking Smith out for Kaepernick.

I'm just waiting until the Seahawks game. That will be the real test. If we lose, changes are needed. If we win, things will still have to be fine tuned and whatnot. I'm worried because as of right now, I can honestly say that im worried about us going 4-4 into the bye week. I may be the only one but if we play like we did against the Giants the next two weeks, I'll be shocked if we win either or both games.

Harbaugh needs to stop the gimmick crap. It DOESNT work unless you're facing a crappy ass team. Stick to the basics. And either let Smith play the entire game or quite honestly, move on, trade him and start Kaepernick.

People may think that doing that is the worse possible move but its not. The worse possible move is switching between the two during every game. Thats worse. Not only are you killing whatever momentum that you may have but you're also telling Smith that we dont have the confidence in you and then look what happens, interception after interception. UGH.

Oh well....one thing is for sure, Thursday's game against the Seahawks just became a million times more important than it was two days ago. UGH.

binary
10-15-2012, 05:03 PM
Like I said, ppl are making more of this loss than they should. .

Hmm, while I really WANT to believe this, it's tough because of who the opponent was. This was the team that prevented a 6th lombardi, this was a huge statement game. I almost put money on this one b/c I thought Harbaugh was going to come out and demolish this team. I could see this loss being a huge killer much more than I could see it being a rallying point...the Vikings game was a wake up call, this was a rape.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 05:25 PM
Hmm, while I really WANT to believe this, it's tough because of who the opponent was. This was the team that prevented a 6th lombardi, this was a huge statement game. I almost put money on this one b/c I thought Harbaugh was going to come out and demolish this team. I could see this loss being a huge killer much more than I could see it being a rallying point...the Vikings game was a wake up call, this was a rape.

There are no 'statement' games in October. Too much football left. We'll see the Giants down the road. That will be the real statement game. I like us better when our back's against the wall anyways. This team has a edge to it when ppl doubt us. We've lost that edge this year. The Vikes was a hiccup. A blowout like this....at home, is more in tune with a gut-check. Another loss against either the Hawks or the Cards will be a wake up call. I expected 6 losses this year. We're ahead of schedule in my eyes.

Ness
10-15-2012, 07:47 PM
It's not about playing scared, its about being smart with the ball. Were we scared when we played the Bills? No, but we were smart with the ball. We valued the football last year. Up until yesterday, Alex valued the football. His 8/1 TD to int ratio spoke to that. All I'm saying is Alex doesn't need to go and think he has to become Brees because he's down a TD and start forcing the ball. Thats not what he's good at. Take what the defense gives you, and if we have to punt it, we punt it. You don't help out their offense by giving Eli Manning short fields. All three of those throws were just bad decisions. One was a bad throw and a bad decision. That first Rolle pick was especially dumb. How do you look off one safety than turn your head and just throw blindly into coverage without locating the other safety? Just a horrible decisions on Alex's part and something he doesn't normally do.
First off, let's not compare Buffalo to New York. Mark Sanchez looked like a Hall of Famer against them. What Alex did in that game essentially means nothing. Or rather, it's not special.

Second, yes it's becoming apparently that Alex isn't good at just going into pass mode. Which is a sad reality. You need that guy if you want a chance at a Lombardi trophy. This team is trying to win a Super Bowl without a franchise quarterback, and it's hard for me to envision it happening.

ViperVisor
10-15-2012, 08:06 PM
The team isn't good at passing mode.

Other teams use it and practice it a lot more than us.

We are mixing in jumbo packages and read option stuff.


Cleveland did OK vs the Giants with whatever stuff they used. We are wanting to zig and zag down the field.

Ness
10-15-2012, 08:13 PM
The team isn't good at passing mode.

Other teams use it and practice it a lot more than us.

We are mixing in jumbo packages and read option stuff.


Cleveland did OK vs the Giants with whatever stuff they used. We are wanting to zig and zag down the field.

Cleveland got their asses kicked what are you talking about?

And sometimes it isn't just about practicing passing all time. How many teams have had a "just passing" offense yet still sucked? Remember Todd Haley's "tenure" with the Chiefs? All of those exotic passing formations and what not. They still sucked dick. Sometimes you need talented players with good instincts. It comes down to execution. Average joes off the street could practice a certain play a million times, doesn't mean they'll be good at it if they're inserted into a game. Why? Because they lack talent.

VAfy-ya
10-15-2012, 08:28 PM
First off, let's not compare Buffalo to New York. Mark Sanchez looked like a Hall of Famer against them. What Alex did in that game essentially means nothing. Or rather, it's not special.

Second, yes it's becoming apparently that Alex isn't good at just going into pass mode. Which is a sad reality. You need that guy if you want a chance at a Lombardi trophy. This team is trying to win a Super Bowl without a franchise quarterback, and it's hard for me to envision it happening.

I disagree. We went into passing mode last year when we were down big to the Eagles in the second half. Came back and won. We went into passing mode down late versus the Lions last year also, came back and won. And of course we all saw what happened late against the Saints in the playoffs. We've shown flashes. We haven't shown consistency with it and there in lies the problem. That's still part of the offense we need to work on and get better at. But I never have the feeling watching this offense, with Alex as the QB that were out of a game. Because normally, he isn't playing as bad as he was yesterday. Yesterday was a anomaly for Alex. Even when he was bad in the past, he wasn't 3 int bad. Yesterday was a case of Alex playing bad and that stupid WildKap screwing up the flow of the offense.

And where are the screen passes? I can't remember seeing a screen pass to a RB so far this year. The Giants front was very aggressive, should have incorporated some RB screens to negate that. And when we do screen, seems like we only screen on 3rd and a ton, never on early downs.

Ness
10-16-2012, 02:26 PM
Well you have to keep in mind that all of those defenses you listed, the Eagles, Lions, and Saints are terrible.

And yes Alex hasn't been this bad and his passes from what I saw on the highlights (still finishing the complete broadcast) were really off the mark more than usual. The gameplan for the offense just seemed weird. I think the offense got a little too creative.

Justone2
10-16-2012, 02:35 PM
The biggest problem in my eyes was the lack of running game. Both Gore and Hunter wheren't used enough just like in the Vikings Game. Only 8 carries for Gore and 4 for Hunter just won't cut it. Getting the run game going early with your RB opens up the rest and makes life so much easier.

abaddon41_80
10-16-2012, 02:54 PM
The Eagles defense was top 10 in the NFL last year, ness. I'll give you that New Orleans and Detroit are bad, though.

VAfy-ya
10-16-2012, 04:01 PM
Well you have to keep in mind that all of those defenses you listed, the Eagles, Lions, and Saints are terrible.

And yes Alex hasn't been this bad and his passes from what I saw on the highlights (still finishing the complete broadcast) were really off the mark more than usual. The gameplan for the offense just seemed weird. I think the offense got a little too creative.

Well the Giants defense wasn't great until we played them so it goes both ways....

And if I had one criticism of Jimbaugh/Roman is they get a little too 'cute' at times. Love the creativity but you have to know when to rein it in....sometimes they don't know when to say 'when'.

abaddon41_80
10-16-2012, 04:11 PM
I don't even know why I bother talking Alex Smith away from the 49ers section here. People there literally believe that Matt Stafford, Tony Romo, Jay Cutler and Philip Rivers have been better than Alex Smith this year. I don't know how to seriously respond to that

VAfy-ya
10-16-2012, 04:27 PM
I don't even know why I bother talking Alex Smith away from the 49ers section here. People there literally believe that Matt Stafford, Tony Romo, Jay Cutler and Philip Rivers have been better than Alex Smith this year. I don't know how to seriously respond to that

I don't know why anybody would talk about Alex outside our fanbase for any lengthy period of time. 80% of football fans feel that Alex is a average-below average QB who was a waste of a #1 overall selection. There's no glory in arguing against those ideals because honestly that's pretty much been the case for most of his professional career. Even though other circumstances also played a factor in his marginal play, those are the facts. His good stretches are just that. And until he sustains a couple of seasons of good play, perception will be his reality. There's no point in arguing against that perception, no matter how right you think are. The average fan, even the average one here will never give Alex the benefit of the doubt. If he's playing great its because of some other variable. If he's playing like crap, "same old Alex Smith". It's ppl around here who still say Eli isn't a elite QB. Why even waste your breath. Alex could lead this team to a SB and ppl will still say we won it despite Alex, not because he was in some way one of the catalysts that propelled us to victory.

Borat
10-16-2012, 05:33 PM
I don't even know why I bother talking Alex Smith away from the 49ers section here. People there literally believe that Matt Stafford, Tony Romo, Jay Cutler and Philip Rivers have been better than Alex Smith this year. I don't know how to seriously respond to that

THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I came to this realization over a year ago. Any mention of Alex Smith in the NFL forum will instantly bring on the hate. It doesn't matter if you have great stats to share, or a story about Alex, or even if I mention that I have a tenant in one of my rental houses named Alex Smith, all it does is spark lame jokes and memes. I implore everyone to not even mention him anymore outside of these walls. And that, is quite sad.

Borat
10-16-2012, 05:34 PM
Also, the short week is a killer on me to do the gameday thread. It will probably be short and lame (that's what she said).

Boooooooooooo.

Ness
10-16-2012, 08:41 PM
I don't even know why I bother talking Alex Smith away from the 49ers section here. People there literally believe that Matt Stafford, Tony Romo, Jay Cutler and Philip Rivers have been better than Alex Smith this year. I don't know how to seriously respond to that

Because, the people here are dumbasses plain and simple. Or rather, they don't watch enough games. Who are most of the fans here? Giants fans? We don't have many fans here of teams from the western part of the United States.

Ness
10-16-2012, 08:44 PM
I don't know why anybody would talk about Alex outside our fanbase for any lengthy period of time. 80% of football fans feel that Alex is a average-below average QB who was a waste of a #1 overall selection. There's no glory in arguing against those ideals because honestly that's pretty much been the case for most of his professional career. Even though other circumstances also played a factor in his marginal play, those are the facts. His good stretches are just that. And until he sustains a couple of seasons of good play, perception will be his reality. There's no point in arguing against that perception, no matter how right you think are. The average fan, even the average one here will never give Alex the benefit of the doubt. If he's playing great its because of some other variable. If he's playing like crap, "same old Alex Smith". It's ppl around here who still say Eli isn't a elite QB. Why even waste your breath. Alex could lead this team to a SB and ppl will still say we won it despite Alex, not because he was in some way one of the catalysts that propelled us to victory.

Also, Alex Smith will never be a fantasy football monster, which is how people rate quarterbacks this season. They don't have time to focus in and actually read beyond stat lines. This is a microcosm of our society in general.

Matt Schaub is also another guy that gets a bad rap because of his health issues the last few seasons, combined with the losing of the Texans franchise. However, when he's been a starter the Texans passing attack has usually been good. People forget about him though for the first time reasons despite being a good player. And he actually does put up fantasy football numbers.

Ness
10-16-2012, 08:46 PM
THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I came to this realization over a year ago. Any mention of Alex Smith in the NFL forum will instantly bring on the hate. It doesn't matter if you have great stats to share, or a story about Alex, or even if I mention that I have a tenant in one of my rental houses named Alex Smith, all it does is spark lame jokes and memes. I implore everyone to not even mention him anymore outside of these walls. And that, is quite sad.

Yes it's probably better that way. But when people here, some whom aren't actually as dense as those on team message boards, say something regarding the 49ers that is ridiculously inaccurate I feel obligated to school them.

Brent
10-16-2012, 08:47 PM
I came to this realization over a year ago. Any mention of Alex Smith in the NFL forum will instantly bring on the hate. It doesn't matter if you have great stats to share, or a story about Alex, or even if I mention that I have a tenant in one of my rental houses named Alex Smith, all it does is spark lame jokes and memes. I implore everyone to not even mention him anymore outside of these walls. And that, is quite sad.
who is this "Smith" character you speak of?

abaddon41_80
10-16-2012, 09:10 PM
Yes it's probably better that way. But when people here, some whom aren't actually as dense as those on team message boards, say something regarding the 49ers that is ridiculously inaccurate I feel obligated to school them.

Exactly. I mean, Matt Stafford, Jay Cutler and Philip Rivers being better than Smith this year is horribly inaccurate at best and a hilariously awful point of view at worst. You would have had to just watch Smith's worst couple of games and the others best games to think something like that.

phlysac
10-16-2012, 09:32 PM
I posted this on another forum. Apologies to those that have read it...

Disclaimer*

I watched the game knowing we lost big, and that Alex Smith played terribly. I watched the game without any emotional attachment, in that I knew the outcome in advance. With that said...


I didn't think it was as horrible as I thought it would be. Alot of blame to go around, but my biggest complaint is simply that of the bad timing of poor execution.

Smith's "DWalk" interception... He threw it up. It was a gamble, could've been avoided, but is precisely the type of throw that people have maligned Smith for never making. He threw deep when his man wasn't wide open. My question... why to Delanie?

Smith's "Manningham" interception. Bad, bad decision to force the throw in negative territory. Wasn't a terribly inaccurate pass, poor timing (look at some of Eli's misfires,) but a pass that shouldn't be thrown, and he rarely does.

Smith's "Crabtree" interception. Got away from him. Sailed. Bad pass. However, watch how Crabtree attacked the ball (or didn't) compared to how Victor Cruz attacked Manning's terribly thrown ball (worse than Smith's.) Cruz accelerated to the ball and jumped in front of the defender to make a great play. Smith's pass was poor, but Crabtree's reaction out of his break, was lazy.

Maybe I flip-flopped the picks, but they are what they are.


Next... Bad luck.

Manning threw 9 straight completions (I believe) in the 2nd quarter. 7 of these passes were caught in spectacular fashion. If any one of those passes falls incomplete, you could say, would've been a really, really tough catch. The receivers made every single one of them. Compare this to the deep ball to Manningham. It was NOT a drop. He made a tremendous effort. The luck comes in when he can't make the grab, when the Giants receivers had been.

Next... The Rogers drop...

This was his scouting report prior to last year. Simple, simple catch, and if he makes it, likely a pick-6.


All of these things I chalk up to bad luck and timing occurring at the worst possible times. Which is what happens when teams get beaten like this.


My biggest concern was the adjustment, or lack-there-of, to the Giants' run-blocking gameplan. They were brilliant. Sealing at both the 1st and 2nd levels. It was similar to how the 49ers execute in the ground game. No adjustment was made. Someone wasn't gap-sound in their assignments. It needs to be looked at.

And finally... The Kaepernick experiment. It's already been said. I'm all for Kap getting experience, but the timing of a majority of his snaps was poor and wreeked of desperation. Desperate to say "look at how creative we are." There's a time and place to experiment. Wrong time, wrong place.

dan77733
10-16-2012, 11:27 PM
We need to stop talking about the loss to the Giants. Forget it. Screw it. It's over and done with. This team needs to rebound with wins against the Seahawks and Cardinals. In SF, we need to win both games and go 6-2 heading into the bye week. The short week sucks but im happy that its now as opposed to November or December. If we lose either or both of the next two games, changes MUST be made but before we talk about any possible future changes, let's wait and see what happens with the next two games.

Rosebud
10-16-2012, 11:48 PM
Also, Alex Smith will never be a fantasy football monster, which is how people rate quarterbacks this season. They don't have time to focus in and actually read beyond stat lines. This is a microcosm of our society in general.

Matt Schaub is also another guy that gets a bad rap because of his health issues the last few seasons, combined with the losing of the Texans franchise. However, when he's been a starter the Texans passing attack has usually been good. People forget about him though for the first time reasons despite being a good player. And he actually does put up fantasy football numbers.

Schaub gets a fair bit of praise, but it's hard to really make the case he's as good as guys that have shown they can carry their team to wins in big games when he's yet play in a real big game in his career. Last year was supposed to be his chance to prove he can do it but he got hurt.

abaddon41_80
10-17-2012, 09:48 AM
Smith's "DWalk" interception... He threw it up. It was a gamble, could've been avoided, but is precisely the type of throw that people have maligned Smith for never making. He threw deep when his man wasn't wide open. My question... why to Delanie?

I posted this in another thread but I feel like it belongs here to.

http://ninerchatter.blogspot.com/2012/10/was-greg-cosell-actually-right.html?m=1

It is basically the exact same play. People killed Smith for not lobbing the ball into the air when it was clear Walker would get behind the defender right next to him but before the safety over the top commits to the inside of the field. On Sunday he did exactly what they wanted and look what happened. The safety runs under it and gets an interception.

Smith's "Crabtree" interception. Got away from him. Sailed. Bad pass. However, watch how Crabtree attacked the ball (or didn't) compared to how Victor Cruz attacked Manning's terribly thrown ball (worse than Smith's.) Cruz accelerated to the ball and jumped in front of the defender to make a great play. Smith's pass was poor, but Crabtree's reaction out of his break, was lazy.

I remember reading during or right after the game, it was either on Maiocco or Barrows' pages, that Crabtree was supposed to run the route in front of the defender.

Manning threw 9 straight completions (I believe) in the 2nd quarter. 7 of these passes were caught in spectacular fashion. If any one of those passes falls incomplete, you could say, would've been a really, really tough catch. The receivers made every single one of them. Compare this to the deep ball to Manningham. It was NOT a drop. He made a tremendous effort. The luck comes in when he can't make the grab, when the Giants receivers had been.

The 49ers simply don't make great catches. When is the last time you remember a 49ers receivers making an amazing catch in coverage or snatching the ball away from a defender? Every other team has at least a few of these types of plays this year but I cannot recall one for the 49ers.

Borat
10-17-2012, 12:48 PM
I got a lot of the new gameday thread done last night. Should finish sometime today.

binary
10-17-2012, 02:53 PM
The Giants took our soul, let's just admit it. We're screwed. Alex crumbles when we fall behind.

49ersfan_87
10-17-2012, 07:09 PM
The 49ers simply don't make great catches. When is the last time you remember a 49ers receivers making an amazing catch in coverage or snatching the ball away from a defender? Every other team has at least a few of these types of plays this year but I cannot recall one for the 49ers.

Weird, Manningham and Moss have made careers out of tough catches (Moss of course, do i even need to say Manningham considering his NFCCG/SB catches?). Basically, i don't think the receivers are the problem with our passing game.

The Giants took our soul, let's just admit it. We're screwed. Alex crumbles when we fall behind.

He was so good at it last year, and in 09, and has shown that ability before too. Don't know what it is, but this year he seems utterly incapable of engineering a comeback.

That being said, the sky isn't falling. He's improved and plays a lot better when we're tied or have a lead, but its concerning that any deficit looks hard to comeback from. We just have to remember to focus on the run game because thats our major offensive advantage. We're still a good team, but it is frustrating because IMO Alex has had 3 good (Packers, Lions, Bills) and 3 bad (Vikings, Jets, Giants) games. So we don't know which Alex we'll get.

abaddon41_80
10-17-2012, 08:17 PM
Weird, Manningham and Moss have made careers out of tough catches (Moss of course, do i even need to say Manningham considering his NFCCG/SB catches?). Basically, i don't think the receivers are the problem with our passing game.

Not really saying they are the main problem with the passing game but people are always talking about how Smith should throw it up an let the receiver go get it--when is the last time one of our receivers did go get it?

Brent
10-17-2012, 08:37 PM
The Giants took our soul, let's just admit it. We're screwed. Alex crumbles when we fall behind.
a team whose offense is based around the run game and defense can't come back in games? not shocking.

dan77733
10-17-2012, 09:30 PM
a team whose offense is based around the run game and defense can't come back in games? not shocking.

And that's why we're not a good enough overall team to win the SB. If we had a passing attack, we would have won the SB, not the Giants. :(

Ness
10-17-2012, 10:35 PM
Not really saying they are the main problem with the passing game but people are always talking about how Smith should throw it up an let the receiver go get it--when is the last time one of our receivers did go get it?

Well we also have to take into account that Alex's deep ball accuracy isn't that great with anyone not named Vernon Davis.

By the way I'm probably going to Hong Kong tomorrow morning which means I'll miss the game. I expect the 49ers to come out on top. I'll be royally pissed if I check NFL.com and find that the 49ers have lost. And I'll shoot myself if they get their asses kicked again. Especially if Russell Wilson looks like a Hall of Famer in the process. The sting of the 9 years before the previous season still lingers a little bit. And that is, when the talking heads build up the 49ers, they collapse. Harbaugh hasn't lost back to back games yet, and this past weekend just did not seem like the team we're accustomed to seeing. They're at home, the crowd should be roaring at the beginning. It's time to get back on track. This is a good opponent and the 49ers need to prove they're still top dog.