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moc182
04-16-2007, 10:49 AM
http://scout.scout.com/a.z?s=73&p=9&c=4&pid=88&yr=2008

Haven't gotten to give it a good look yet, but on first glance I like it.

Newbs24
04-16-2007, 10:53 AM
Pretty good list based on what people have seen. Alot of film has still not been released and from what these guys have seen it is a fair assesment. Many of the guys that are 2 stars just haven't been evaluated all that much to rank them with the others. After summer, I would expect a very different list around the 50-75 spots. It always does but I really can't complain all that much. I do think Stephen Good should be a 5* though. BooBoo Cissoko should also be a little higher, around the 15-17.

gstock05
04-16-2007, 11:48 AM
I was surprised at how good it was. My only issue being Brewster not being a 5 star player because he's listed as a center. Other than that, it doesnt matter

reigle9
04-16-2007, 12:51 PM
I wonder if they actually have a different opinion on Pryor or they're just trying to be different than Rivals?

Acreboy
04-16-2007, 12:56 PM
Man OU is cleaning house...

DoWnThEfiElD
04-16-2007, 01:05 PM
Its ok, better than ESPN, but still nothing special. I have no problem with Brown being 1 overall at this point.

504 to ATL
04-17-2007, 01:05 PM
OU looks good now but what if these guys dont get better in their senior seaason while other players suddnely gain media popularity a la Joe McKnight this past year.

Dont trust these rankings until senior season is deep underway.

M.O.T.H.
04-17-2007, 01:23 PM
Kalil's brother is a Giant.

On a different note... It makes me feel old when I see some of these kids were born in 1990... that's crazy.

Nice to see some interest in South Carolina.

bwillie26
04-17-2007, 01:41 PM
To me, it looks like the latter part of the list comes down to who has the best offer list.

BigJohn98
04-17-2007, 03:49 PM
I prefer Rivals. Scout's rankings suck. Sam McGuffie as a four star?

Michigan
04-17-2007, 08:37 PM
I prefer Rivals. Scout's rankings suck. Sam McGuffie as a four star?

rivals lists mcguffie with a 40" vert, 3.78 s-shuttle, and a 335 lb bench. basically superman numbers. did he really have 44 td's last year?

Music and Football
04-17-2007, 08:55 PM
I prefer Rivals. Scout's rankings suck. Sam McGuffie as a four star?

JC at Rivals said that Sam McGuffie isn't even being considered for 5 star status. Just sayin'...

volman88
04-17-2007, 09:06 PM
Thats a weak qb class compared to 07.

YAYareaRB
04-17-2007, 09:10 PM
Oklahoma's recruiting class is looking great

Gchu83
04-18-2007, 04:29 PM
Oklahoma's recruiting class is looking great

Ya...OU has a chance to have the #1 recruiting class in the nation, pretty crazy considering their troubles the past 2 seasons.

I really wish UT didn't pass on Calhoun, rumor was that UT was his runaway #1 choice but Mack chose to stay away because of grade issues. Hopefully that won't come back to bite us.

Darrell Scott would really be an amazing addition to UT. Many consider this was somewhat of a disappointing class for Mack Brown (not going after RJ Washington, Calhoun, and losing out on Good).

DoWnThEfiElD
04-18-2007, 05:36 PM
I'm so sick of hearing about McGuffie, bring on Scott

Newbs24
04-19-2007, 10:16 AM
I'm so sick of hearing about McGuffie, bring on Scott

Michigan fans are starting to smarten up. Scott along with Jermie Calhoun are the Top 2 RBs in this class. Then everybody else is way behind them.

Space Ghost
04-19-2007, 03:53 PM
On a different note... It makes me feel old when I see some of these kids were born in 1990... that's crazy.

They make me feel small and I am vintage '89 material. That generally happens often when you are barely 5'8" :(

Smashmouth
04-19-2007, 09:38 PM
I'm so sick of hearing about McGuffie, bring on Scott
McGuffie is better than Scott
1.Better Stats
2 Better Mesurables McGUFFIE IS FASTER.
3.Did this against better competition.

Smashmouth
04-19-2007, 09:39 PM
Michigan fans are starting to smarten up. Scott along with Jermie Calhoun are the Top 2 RBs in this class. Then everybody else is way behind them.What Calhoun and his 4.64 forty you think he can play FB.

Newbs24
04-19-2007, 10:13 PM
I see someone is hooked into the Sam McGuffie hype.

P-L
04-19-2007, 10:32 PM
I've heard some teams aren't even recruiting McGuffie as a RB...

metafour
04-19-2007, 10:36 PM
I dont really understand this McGuffie hype. I dont follow Texas recruiting that much so I only really know what I hear on Message Boards. He's talked up like a god on message boards and by recruitniks, apparently he has absolutely no flaw: he's a freakish athlete, he put up monster numbers against amazing competition, and his film looks terrific.....then why isn't this guy getting love by recruiting services? From all that I've heard about this kid he should be a Noel Devine type in which he's a surefire 5-star and one of the top 5 players in the country no matter who you ask. Instead he's countlessly mentioned as only the 3rd, 4th (if not even lower) best RB in the class. Whats the deal here? Is this just a display of some HUGE fan overrating? The information just doesn't match.

gstock05
04-20-2007, 09:33 AM
A. McGuffie wasn't offered by Texas.

B. He's white, and there are two other very talented backs in the state.

C. He's a bit undersized.


The whole debate over McGuffie is why or why he hasn't received more love. I don't think he's in the top 3 backs in the country, but he should easily be a top 10 runningback, and he's going to give some team an explosive playmaker. You can't argue against his production, highlights, and measurables.

I don't think the Devine comparison is good at all, I'd say more like CJ Spiller or even Reggie Bush like in terms of play-style. Not sure about ability.

Newbs24
04-20-2007, 09:56 AM
McGuffie will end up being a slot reciever in college. He doesn't touch Noel Devine. Why? Devine had the ability to break tackles from multiple defenders. I laugh at the McGuffie is better than Scott comment. The stats were pretty damn close. The competition wasn't that far off. Nobody knows who is faster plus Scott is 6-1 215 (right now) and has a college ready body. He runs through, around or by people. McGuffie can fly and might be faster but I cant see him being ready for the grind of a college season. Scott and Calhoun both are. I would say Sam is a Top 10 back but there are some good ones that haven't been mentioned. Sam gets the most love because very few white kids have his measureables.The kicker is, very few white kids do a damn thing at the college level as a RB. I am white and I just don't see a good white RB in the near future at a legit school.

Edit: Sam has great vision to go with the speed. The thing I see is he can be arm tackled. Samuel, Calhoun, Scott and Williams all can break guys off that are hanging on their arms. I also haven't seen Sam try and take a hit on the sideline to get the extra yards. He has put on some bulk to try and become a back that can take and deliver hits but I have yet to see him do it. I like guys that run between the tackles and don't bounce it outside everytime they get the ball. Thats what I have seen on tape and I would also like to hear what the SCOUTS attribute to Sam being ranked lower than the others.

bwillie26
04-20-2007, 12:42 PM
A. McGuffie wasn't offered by Texas.

B. He's white, and there are two other very talented backs in the state.

C. He's a bit undersized.


The whole debate over McGuffie is why or why he hasn't received more love. I don't think he's in the top 3 backs in the country, but he should easily be a top 10 runningback, and he's going to give some team an explosive playmaker. You can't argue against his production, highlights, and measurables.

I don't think the Devine comparison is good at all, I'd say more like CJ Spiller or even Reggie Bush like in terms of play-style. Not sure about ability.

WTF does that have to do with anything?

Newbs24
04-20-2007, 02:16 PM
WTF does that have to do with anything?

Alot considering the lack of production that white RBs have had on the college football game. I know it shouldn't apply because it doesn't mean every white RB will fail in college but it is hard to overlook. I think it matters more than what people would want or believe.

metafour
04-20-2007, 03:43 PM
Rich man's version of Tre Smith ;)

http://nfldraft.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?pr_key=278

bwillie26
04-20-2007, 04:01 PM
Alot considering the lack of production that white RBs have had on the college football game. I know it shouldn't apply because it doesn't mean every white RB will fail in college but it is hard to overlook. I think it matters more than what people would want or believe.

Race should never be a discussion. It's senseless and stupid.

It would be the equivalent of me saying black QB's are a waste to develop since they have never been able to win a Super Bowl. Thus, teams should draft and develop all white QB's.

It's idiotic and race issues belong NOWHERE in football.

If you can play, you can play -- whether your black, white, pink, maroon, orange or even albino.

gstock05
04-20-2007, 04:25 PM
Name the last White runningback who started in the NFL?

It's not racist. Just saying that the statistics are against him as far as being a dominating runningback. Fortunately, people have film and other things to study in which they can make some real evaluations haha.

metafour
04-20-2007, 05:31 PM
Name the last White runningback who started in the NFL?

It's not racist. Just saying that the statistics are against him as far as being a dominating runningback. Fortunately, people have film and other things to study in which they can make some real evaluations haha.

I dunno man, Tre Smith won "Mr Football" in Florida (Classification 5A) after posting nearly 2000 yards and 30+ TDs or something like that. We love Tre (famous for having a 100 yard game against Bama a few years back) but he really never materialized into much. Its the white RB curse.

HuskerNation
04-20-2007, 06:06 PM
Race should never be a discussion. It's senseless and stupid.

It would be the equivalent of me saying black QB's are a waste to develop since they have never been able to win a Super Bowl. Thus, teams should draft and develop all white QB's.

.

Doug Williams won a super bowl genius.

bwillie26
04-20-2007, 07:12 PM
Name the last White runningback who started in the NFL?

Name me the last black QB to win a Super Bowl. Just so happens that the last QB to do so played with the last real great white RB. Pretty ironic. :)

Doug Williams won a super bowl genius.

Captain obvious comes running into the discussion.

But 1 out of 41 would fuel my point of reference in how idiotic it is to bring up race. Players like Randall Cunningham, Warren Moon, Donovan McNabb, etc., are all very good QB's, but still none of whom have won a Super Bowl. But how do you like me bringing that into a discussion when judging the talent of a potential NFL quarterback? Pretty idiotic, eh?

This isn't a race discussion. The is an issue of an idiotic remark made to justify why someone may not be better than someone else of another color.

Let me make the same generalization about that towards black politicians and why Barack Obama. Let me make the same generalization again towards black QB's and why they cannot and will not succeed in the NFL.

It's idiotic stereotyping that is being thrown around that has NO PLACE in this discussion.

My use of NFL QB's is nothing more than an example to show how stupid it is to bring race into any discussion in sports.

Again I will say, it doesn't matter what color you are -- if you can play, you can play. End of discussion.

elway777
04-20-2007, 07:15 PM
Matt Kalil deserves some respect being the freak that he is.

HuskerNation
04-20-2007, 08:23 PM
Name the last White runningback who started in the NFL?

Name me the last black QB to win a Super Bowl. Just so happens that the last QB to do so played with the last real great white RB. Pretty ironic. :)



Captain obvious comes running into the discussion.

But 1 out of 41 would fuel my point of reference in how idiotic it is to bring up race. Players like Randall Cunningham, Warren Moon, Donovan McNabb, etc., are all very good QB's, but still none of whom have won a Super Bowl. But how do you like me bringing that into a discussion when judging the talent of a potential NFL quarterback? Pretty idiotic, eh?

This isn't a race discussion. The is an issue of an idiotic remark made to justify why someone may not be better than someone else of another color.

Let me make the same generalization about that towards black politicians and why Barack Obama. Let me make the same generalization again towards black QB's and why they cannot and will not succeed in the NFL.

It's idiotic stereotyping that is being thrown around that has NO PLACE in this discussion.

My use of NFL QB's is nothing more than an example to show how stupid it is to bring race into any discussion in sports.

Again I will say, it doesn't matter what color you are -- if you can play, you can play. End of discussion.

You said that black QB's have never been able to win "A" superbowl, that means that they have never won one. Which is obiously false. Good day sir.

Smashmouth
04-20-2007, 09:13 PM
McGuffie will end up being a slot reciever in college. He doesn't touch Noel Devine. Why? Devine had the ability to break tackles from multiple defenders. I laugh at the McGuffie is better than Scott comment. The stats were pretty damn close. The competition wasn't that far off. Nobody knows who is faster plus Scott is 6-1 215 (right now) and has a college ready body. He runs through, around or by people. McGuffie can fly and might be faster but I cant see him being ready for the grind of a college season. Scott and Calhoun both are. I would say Sam is a Top 10 back but there are some good ones that haven't been mentioned. Sam gets the most love because very few white kids have his measureables.The kicker is, very few white kids do a damn thing at the college level as a RB. I am white and I just don't see a good white RB in the near future at a legit school.

Edit: Sam has great vision to go with the speed. The thing I see is he can be arm tackled. Samuel, Calhoun, Scott and Williams all can break guys off that are hanging on their arms. I also haven't seen Sam try and take a hit on the sideline to get the extra yards. He has put on some bulk to try and become a back that can take and deliver hits but I have yet to see him do it. I like guys that run between the tackles and don't bounce it outside everytime they get the ball. Thats what I have seen on tape and I would also like to hear what the SCOUTS attribute to Sam being ranked lower than the others.You don't know a thing about football do you.McGuffie will never be a Slot receiver catching the football is not his best.I from Florida and iv'e seen Devine play what he played against the weakest teams in South Florida not to forget he didn't break many tackles.Scott true size is 5ft 11 in 198 McGuffie is 5ft 10in 190 were he measured in at the Rivals Junior Day.McGuffie is clearly faster watch the tapes Scott never out runs the angles always has to stiff arm to get past plus on Scott tapes the teams he played against look awful looks like a bunch of JV teams.You said McGuffie bounces it all out side well when you run a 4.28 you might as well do that.But Scott on his tapes runs to the outside all the time to.Whites do very little at RB what a racist statement it's not because of talent it's because of people like you who don't want to give them a fair chance.Pull up the top High School Teams in the Country a lot of them have White Rb but a lot of them have to switch positions.Or the kids don't want to play rb so they never go out for it.Just to let you know McGuffie will bee a 5-star in the next batch Scouts puts out.

bwillie26
04-20-2007, 09:13 PM
You said that black QB's have never been able to win "A" superbowl, that means that they have never won one. Which is obiously false. Good day sir.

When you get directly smacked in the face with a reply; talk semantics, will save you every time.

Smashmouth
04-20-2007, 09:14 PM
You said that black QB's have never been able to win "A" superbowl, that means that they have never won one. Which is obiously false. Good day sir. What over 20 years ago not a good reply.

Smashmouth
04-20-2007, 09:18 PM
I dunno man, Tre Smith won "Mr Football" in Florida (Classification 5A) after posting nearly 2000 yards and 30+ TDs or something like that. We love Tre (famous for having a 100 yard game against Bama a few years back) but he really never materialized into much. Its the white RB curse.
What curse would that be Luke Staley won the Doak Walker award as the best back in the Country.Tre never got a fair chance and would say him and Kenny Irons are about the same player which looked about right from their Pro Days.

Smashmouth
04-20-2007, 09:23 PM
I've heard some teams aren't even recruiting McGuffie as a RB...
Thats why he hears from Michgan every day and the RB Coach tells him he could start next year.Plus Pete Carrol just offered him as a RB.The ones that have offered him are recruiting him as a rb because he's let teams know that he wants to play rb or don't bother with him.

metafour
04-20-2007, 09:46 PM
Tre never got a fair chance and would say him and Kenny Irons are about the same player which looked about right from their Pro Days.

LOLz.

We love Tre, he always gave 110% and never complained about anything, but he flat out wasn't a very good football player.

HuskerNation
04-20-2007, 09:46 PM
What over 20 years ago not a good reply.

Who gives a sh*t when it was. They still have won one. Just cause they haven't won one lately makes no diff.

HuskerNation
04-20-2007, 09:48 PM
xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Smashmouth
04-20-2007, 09:50 PM
LOLz.

We love Tre, he always gave 110% and never complained about anything, but he flat out wasn't a very good football player.Based on what he performed when called upon.Guess Jacobs was not that good either.

Smashmouth
04-20-2007, 09:51 PM
Who gives a sh*t when it was. They still have won one. Just cause they haven't won one lately makes no diff. What won 1 out of 40 you got me there.

HuskerNation
04-20-2007, 09:53 PM
What won 1 out of 40 you got me there.

The point was that they have won one. He said they haven't. God some of you guys are thickheaded.

Jericho@SC
04-21-2007, 01:32 AM
Matt Kalil deserves some respect being the freak that he is.

Elway, what do you think Matt's upside is at the college level? He's got great measurables and he's really polished.

Is it a stretch to think he could be a 5-star and be an All-American/1st Rounder at USC.

metafour
04-21-2007, 07:26 AM
Based on what he performed when called upon.Guess Jacobs was not that good either.

Jacobs' situation was nowhere close. He was stuck behind two future Top 5 picks and decided to leave because he realized he would never get any significant playing time after both Williams and Brown decided to stay for their SR seasons. He ended up making the NFL and seeing significant touches, where-as Smith has no shot. Not only was Smith passed by Kenny Irons who came after him, but also Brad Lester and Ben Tate (17 year old true Freshman) this past year.

Smashmouth
04-21-2007, 12:47 PM
Jacobs' situation was nowhere close. He was stuck behind two future Top 5 picks and decided to leave because he realized he would never get any significant playing time after both Williams and Brown decided to stay for their SR seasons. He ended up making the NFL and seeing significant touches, where-as Smith has no shot. Not only was Smith passed by Kenny Irons who came after him, but also Brad Lester and Ben Tate (17 year old true Freshman) this past year.Jacobs is not a RB and the Giants will find out this year he's a TE who wants to play RB he's just to tall to make it full time.Smith has no shot if thats the case might not want to take a chance on Irons they are basically the same player.
Smith 4.5 forty,37in Vertical ,10ft Broad Jump,3.96 Short Shuttle and 6.72 3-Cone.
Irons 4.45 forty,38in Vertica, 10ft. Broad Jump 4.17 Short Shuttle and 7.0 3- Cone.
Tubervile never gave Smith a chance put him against USC the best team in the Country with know line help then plays a scrub team and puts Irons in.Irons played better against the srubs so smith loses his starting job.
,

Smashmouth
04-21-2007, 12:48 PM
The point was that they have won one. He said they haven't. God some of you guys are thickheaded.
Chill Dude if your a big Williams fan thats okay

elway777
04-21-2007, 12:57 PM
Elway, what do you think Matt's upside is at the college level? He's got great measurables and he's really polished.

Is it a stretch to think he could be a 5-star and be an All-American/1st Rounder at USC.

Not really he has a real high ceiling, and the frame to be around the 310-320 pound range. He's 6-7 right now and about 277 with above average strength. What people love about him is his quickness and athleticsicm for his size. He also is very tenacious with a great motor. I don't know about his draft stock, it's way too early for that, but he seems to have the pedigree and the ability to play at the top level.

gstock05
04-21-2007, 02:51 PM
Comparing black quarterbacks to white runningbacks is useless. First off, there are NO white starting runningbacks in the NFL. Superbowls are won by teams, not individuals. So the black quarterback never winning a superbowl arguement is rediculous. Second, there are numerous Black quarterbacks starting amongst all ranks of football. Not for white runningbacks with the exception of highschool.


The fact of the matter is.. quarterback is a position which depends on intellegence and arm strength. Runningback is a position that depends on speed and tackle breaking ability.

I'm as white as it can get, but biologically, african americans are better built for speed. They have a higher ratio of fast twitch muscle fibers in comparison to most other races. However, there are a few people who break this trend... ie Sam McGuffie. It's nothing to do with race. Nobody is saying white runningbacks can't succeed because they're white. White runningbacks just arent as common because white athletes with the skill set to be a runningback are more rare than black athletes.

JeffSamardzijaIRISH
04-21-2007, 03:37 PM
Comparing black quarterbacks to white runningbacks is useless. First off, there are NO white starting runningbacks in the NFL. Superbowls are won by teams, not individuals. So the black quarterback never winning a superbowl arguement is rediculous. Second, there are numerous Black quarterbacks starting amongst all ranks of football. Not for white runningbacks with the exception of highschool.


The fact of the matter is.. quarterback is a position which depends on intellegence and arm strength. Runningback is a position that depends on speed and tackle breaking ability.

I'm as white as it can get, but biologically, african americans are better built for speed. They have a higher ratio of fast twitch muscle fibers in comparison to most other races. However, there are a few people who break this trend... ie Sam McGuffie. It's nothing to do with race. Nobody is saying white runningbacks can't succeed because they're white. White runningbacks just arent as common because white athletes with the skill set to be a runningback are more rare than black athletes.

That's cuz they gotta run from the popo... jk jk

Smashmouth
04-21-2007, 11:37 PM
Comparing black quarterbacks to white runningbacks is useless. First off, there are NO white starting runningbacks in the NFL. Superbowls are won by teams, not individuals. So the black quarterback never winning a superbowl arguement is rediculous. Second, there are numerous Black quarterbacks starting amongst all ranks of football. Not for white runningbacks with the exception of highschool.


The fact of the matter is.. quarterback is a position which depends on intellegence and arm strength. Runningback is a position that depends on speed and tackle breaking ability.

I'm as white as it can get, but biologically, african americans are better built for speed. They have a higher ratio of fast twitch muscle fibers in comparison to most other races. However, there are a few people who break this trend... ie Sam McGuffie. It's nothing to do with race. Nobody is saying white runningbacks can't succeed because they're white. White runningbacks just arent as common because white athletes with the skill set to be a runningback are more rare than black athletes.First QB is the leader and if you know anything about team sports it all starts there.All RB's need a good line and passing game your not playing 7year old popwarner were 1-player can just out run every body.If your white then your a disgrace. If blacks have higher ratio of fast twitch muscle fibers based on what a white is now the fastest in the world in the 400 meters.Well i guess you think whites are smarter and quick thinkers on their feet thats why you see 95 percent of fighter pilots white and 95 percent of special forces white so they should make the best qb's by your logic.Now for football speed not track speed you need power and quickness more than straight speed.Well young one you know who some of the strongest and quickest people on the planet are olympic weightlifters which is dominate by whites.The promblem is white kids feel they want get a chance so they don't even try to play rb and the truth is people like your self push this belief with the garbage of this race is better for a certain position.But what you don't know is your hurting the sport it needs to be more balance if not only one race of people will follow it.Thats why for Nascar to grow bigger they need to get blacks to watch it but if there is no black drivers they want watch it.Don't think this can't happen in football also.

ChazMonk
04-22-2007, 08:15 PM
Back to recruiting and calmness. It's being rumored that both Brewster and Shugarts committed to OSU over the weekend. Anyone out there here anything? If it is confirmed then damn! Adams, Brewster and Shugarts, all top lineman. This is sweet news for the Bucks.

eaglesfan_45
04-22-2007, 08:47 PM
the top 100 i look at is better alot better in my opinion.


http://www.cstv.com/recruiting/recruiting2007.html (http://www.cstv.com/recruiting/recruiting2007.html)

gstock05
04-22-2007, 09:18 PM
First QB is the leader and if you know anything about team sports it all starts there.All RB's need a good line and passing game your not playing 7year old popwarner were 1-player can just out run every body.If your white then your a disgrace. If blacks have higher ratio of fast twitch muscle fibers based on what a white is now the fastest in the world in the 400 meters.Well i guess you think whites are smarter and quick thinkers on their feet thats why you see 95 percent of fighter pilots white and 95 percent of special forces white so they should make the best qb's by your logic.Now for football speed not track speed you need power and quickness more than straight speed.Well young one you know who some of the strongest and quickest people on the planet are olympic weightlifters which is dominate by whites.The promblem is white kids feel they want get a chance so they don't even try to play rb and the truth is people like your self push this belief with the garbage of this race is better for a certain position.But what you don't know is your hurting the sport it needs to be more balance if not only one race of people will follow it.Thats why for Nascar to grow bigger they need to get blacks to watch it but if there is no black drivers they want watch it.Don't think this can't happen in football also.



I feel dumber for even reading this. First off, go back and re-read my post. I never said there aren't fast white kids etc. etc. I said that as a whole population, african americans on average will have higher ratios of fast twitch muscle fibers.

If blacks have higher ratio of fast twitch muscle fibers based on what a white is now the fastest in the world in the 400 meters

Yeah... you totally got my point. All white people on earth are slower than all black people, regardless of age, weight, or health.

No seriously... I'm not talking about individuals. I'm simply talking about the population average in which more black people are generally faster than more white people. Doesn't mean all white guys are slow, or vice versa.

Well i guess you think whites are smarter and quick thinkers on their feet thats why you see 95 percent of fighter pilots white and 95 percent of special forces white so they should make the best qb's by your logic.

Uhh... read my post. I mentioned the whole arguement against black quarterbacks is ********, and that anybody of any race can play quarterback regardless of age, race, as long as you have the right intellect and arm strength. And for your arguement for fighter pilots, you do realize that the white population in the US is enormously larger than the black population right? Secondly, that has absolutely nothing to do with my arguement. Flying an airplane does not = playing quarterback regardless of the fact that it takes fast decisionmaking. By your logic, every MLB player should be a good quarterback due to their fast decisionmaking.

Now for football speed not track speed you need power and quickness more than straight speed.Well young one you know who some of the strongest and quickest people on the planet are olympic weightlifters which is dominate by whites.

Once again, I'm getting dumber. Power and quickness = track speed more often than not. Check out the number of NFL wide receivers who were track stars. 90% of the time, they were the fastest track kid in their highschool. Especially in the short sprints. Look up Bo Jackson, Randy Moss, Ted Ginn, Adrian Peterson... etc. It's not always the case as there are more skills involved, but the fact of the matter is...there simply arent many white athletes who have the proper body proportions and genetic build to play runningback on the highest level. . Furthermore, Powerlifters don't need fast twitch muscle fibers to lift a lot of weight. Powerlifting is largely based on being over 260 lbs, having a wide frame, and having short arms and legs thus giving better leverage to the lifter. FWIW, if you're comparing offensive linemen, then yes, I suppose powerlifters would be a decent comparison. Please tho, get a clue about football training and explosive weight lifting regimens.

The promblem is white kids feel they want get a chance so they don't even try to play rb and the truth is people like your self push this belief with the garbage of this race is better for a certain position.But what you don't know is your hurting the sport it needs to be more balance if not only one race of people will follow it

I played football in highschool...almost all of the schools we played had white runningbacks including ours. No white kids feel they don't have the chance to play runningback. And furthermore, no coach in his right mind would play a black runningback for the sole purpose that he's black.

The NFL does not need more "white runningbacks." Would it be good to see? Sure. However, until more white, asian, indian, hispanic... etc runningbacks start proving they can rush for 2000 yards in the NCAA, we won't see them playing as starters in the NFL. And believe what you want about race superiority or whatnot. I would, and will never believe any race is superior to the other. We are all humans and are just the same as one another save our bodies. However, if you're that naive to not believe in the fact that certain races have variances that lend to certain physical skillsets.. then I'm argueing with a brick wall. FWIW, african americans also have denser bones which generally places them at a disadvantage in swimming. Asians get intoxicated more easily than most other races due to alcohol not being a part of their diet in the past. Their bodies haven't adapted to being able to filter out the alcohol as well as other cultures. Many Andes mountain living latinos have short arms and broad chests so they can maintain oxygen level easier in high altitudes.

I can go on and on... but I'll let you do your own research instead of being ignorant.

Smashmouth
04-22-2007, 10:23 PM
I feel dumber for even reading this. First off, go back and re-read my post. I never said there aren't fast white kids etc. etc. I said that as a whole population, african americans on average will have higher ratios of fast twitch muscle fibers.

(Like I said on what facts you don't have any.You do know most blacks in america have white genes in there blood line don't you.)



Yeah... you totally got my point. All white people on earth are slower than all black people, regardless of age, weight, or health.

No seriously... I'm not talking about individuals. I'm simply talking about the population average in which more black people are generally faster than more white people. Doesn't mean all white guys are slow, or vice versa.

(What give some fact you do know baseball takes a lot white athletes away from football)



Uhh... read my post. I mentioned the whole arguement against black quarterbacks is ********, and that anybody of any race can play quarterback regardless of age, race, as long as you have the right intellect and arm strength. And for your arguement for fighter pilots, you do realize that the white population in the US is enormously larger than the black population right? Secondly, that has absolutely nothing to do with my arguement. Flying an airplane does not = playing quarterback regardless of the fact that it takes fast decisionmaking. By your logic, every MLB player should be a good quarterback due to their fast decisionmaking.

(Know anybody can't play qb just like rb regarless of the percent of whites in the population whites are smarter and quicker thinkers than blacks thats why they fly planes,or make up spercial forces and yes MLB is dominate by whites because of this.Here is your logic blacks make up 15 percent of the population but only 5 percent of pilots or the special forces why.)



Once again, I'm getting dumber. Power and quickness = track speed more often than not. Check out the number of NFL wide receivers who were track stars. 90% of the time, they were the fastest track kid in their highschool. Especially in the short sprints. Look up Bo Jackson, Randy Moss, Ted Ginn, Adrian Peterson... etc. It's not always the case as there are more skills involved, but the fact of the matter is...there simply arent many white athletes who have the proper body proportions and genetic build to play runningback on the highest level. . Furthermore, Powerlifters don't need fast twitch muscle fibers to lift a lot of weight. Powerlifting is largely based on being over 260 lbs, having a wide frame, and having short arms and legs thus giving better leverage to the lifter. FWIW, if you're comparing offensive linemen, then yes, I suppose powerlifters would be a decent comparison. Please tho, get a clue about football training and explosive weight lifting regimens.

(Dummy i'am not talking about power lifters i'am talking about the clean and jerk and the snatch which the olympic lifters are some of the fastest guys in the world in 20yd sprints.I guess you know nothing about weightlifting or football for that matter because we teach thse lifts in Florida to our football team nad you need to be athletic to perform these.)



I played football in highschool...almost all of the schools we played had white runningbacks including ours. No white kids feel they don't have the chance to play runningback. And furthermore, no coach in his right mind would play a black runningback for the sole purpose that he's black.

(wrong again boy. Google Kevin Harris read his interview were some colleges told his dad who was his coach that they couldn't recruit a white RB.

The NFL does not need more "white runningbacks." Would it be good to see? Sure. However, until more white, asian, indian, hispanic... etc runningbacks start proving they can rush for 2000 yards in the NCAA, we won't see them playing as starters in the NFL. And believe what you want about race superiority or whatnot. I would, and will never believe any race is superior to the other. We are all humans and are just the same as one another save our bodies. However, if you're that naive to not believe in the fact that certain races have variances that lend to certain physical skillsets.. then I'm argueing with a brick wall. FWIW, african americans also have denser bones which generally places them at a disadvantage in swimming. Asians get intoxicated more easily than most other races due to alcohol not being a part of their diet in the past. Their bodies haven't adapted to being able to filter out the alcohol as well as other cultures. Many Andes mountain living latinos have short arms and broad chests so they can maintain oxygen level easier in high altitudes.

(Well Luke Staley won the Doak Walker Award and never got a fair shot. You believe that one race is inferior because you belive blacks are born with some superior fast twitch muscle fibers. I guess you need to take an anatomy class, no one is born with superior fast twitch muscle fibers, you develop them by the way you train. Just like people that run long distance develop slow twitch. Fast twitch is developed by basketball, sprints, football. Which is the sports most young black kids play. A reason Mcguffie was fast because he was a junior olympic Gymnist.)

I can go on and on... but I'll let you do your own research instead of being ignorant.

(no what you are is some white nerd whose mommy never let him get out and play with the boys.)

Here's a clip of sme OLYMPIC WEIGHTLIFTING.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=14PMKBtlZy4

gstock05
04-23-2007, 12:01 AM
(Like I said on what facts you don't have any.You do know most blacks in america have white genes in there blood line don't you.)


Uhhh no crap. Everyone knows that. But they make up about 10 percent of the gene pool at most for most african americans. And once again, I'm just stating in majority. Learn how to use statistics... IE looking at sample means, and judging population means in comparison to each other. It's pretty useful.



(What give some fact you do know baseball takes a lot white athletes away from football)

That still has nothing to do with the arguement. Baseball is trying to find a bigger base among african americans, whereas more white athletes grow up playing baseball. Anyway, there are black athletes baseball steals as well.

(Know anybody can't play qb just like rb regarless of the percent of whites in the population whites are smarter and quicker thinkers than blacks thats why they fly planes,or make up spercial forces and yes MLB is dominate by whites because of this.Here is your logic blacks make up 15 percent of the population but only 5 percent of pilots or the special forces why.)

This is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. If you would actually think for about 10 seconds, you could think of 20 reasons as to why there is a 10 percent difference between air force pilots and black population.

I'll just give a few....

1. The Air Force is Highly selective, which lends to picking the best students out of the best schools. Most black students don't come from a background with funds for elite schools. Bad school systems = bad students. Simple fact. White kids who graduate from these schools are just the same as their black counterparts.

2. The air force may be seen as a very white type of institution which may scare some black students away.

3. Being in a special forces unit, and flying a plane isn't exactly rocket science. I have a hard time believing that the reason for the difference is because flying an airplane, and being a special forces person is simply too challenging. If they're such intellectually stimulating jobs, why aren't there more asians, indians, latinos.. etc in the job?

4. The Air Force Academy is located in Colorado. Not exactly an area with a high african american population. Distance is a factor within choosing a college such as the air force academy.

5. Dan Marino scored a 15 or so on his wonderlic test. He was a pretty good quarterback. There have been numerous smart quarterbacks who blew, and made terrible decisions. Many dumb quarterbacks were awesome as well.

there are so many factors.. i could name more, but don't feel like wasting my time.


Dummy i'am not talking about power lifters i'am talking about the clean and jerk and the snatch which the olympic lifters are some of the fastest guys in the world in 20yd sprints.I guess you know nothing about weightlifting or football for that matter because we teach thse lifts in Florida to our football team nad you need to be athletic to perform these.)


You got me. I know nothing about football. I also know nothing about weight lifting or any other type of training. FWIW, they teach those types of lifts to all types of people. Believe it or not, sprinters use those types of lifts too. And just because you can clean and jerk, doesn't mean you're faster than someone else.


wrong again boy. Google Kevin Harris read his interview were some colleges told his dad who was his coach that they couldn't recruit a white RB.

Thats cool. There was a mexican guy who once told my friend he'd never be a receiver. So obviously all Mexicans think white guys cant be receivers.

1 incident doesnt mean all people act the same. God you're dumb. Not saying it doesn't happen, just saying, in the wider view of things, white runningbacks arent discriminated against...

Well Luke Staley won the Doak Walker Award and never got a fair shot. You believe that one race is inferior because you belive blacks are born with some superior fast twitch muscle fibers. I guess you need to take an anatomy class, no one is born with superior fast twitch muscle fibers, you develop them by the way you train. Just like people that run long distance develop slow twitch. Fast twitch is developed by basketball, sprints, football. Which is the sports most young black kids play. A reason Mcguffie was fast because he was a junior olympic Gymnist



No I believe all races are the same, but there is genetic variance in the way people of different races are born.

Secondly, you don't develop fast twitch muscle fibers from playing basketball, sprints, and football. Well actually, you're partially right, however there is MUCH more to it than that. Here are some links to back some of this info up... And BTW... some people are born with more fast twitch muscle fibers. Why do you think some kids are just naturally fast who don't even work out? You absolutely can change your muscle complexion from fast to slow twitch, or vice versa, but your genetics will play a large part in how much you change that.


no what you are is some white nerd whose mommy never let him get out and play with the boys


If by nerd, you mean I'm not a dumb redneck.. then yes. You are correct. By the way, nice online insult. I really feel the burn.


Check out this article...

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=5speed

Then a few others on muscle training

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/cs/exercisephysiology/a/aa080901a.htm

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson33.htm

504 to ATL
04-23-2007, 02:36 AM
Holy S**t can you guys stop quoting one another. These posts are getting ridiculously long.

And can we get back on topic please and stop getting derailed.


so back to highschool recruiting.

How do you feel about the scout 100, and what news have you heard concerning committments.

JB Shugarts going to _____?

roidrunner
04-23-2007, 08:40 AM
im just disappointed that louisville is not on anyones interest levels. that saddens me

Newbs24
04-23-2007, 09:55 AM
Apparently you can't be white and think white RBs aren't that good at big time college football? I could care less what color your skin is but facts are facts and recent history speaks for itself. I guess when McGuffie becomes a great RB like smashmouth thinks he will or becomes a slot reciever like I think he will, we can come back here and see who doesn't know anything about football.

Anyways. The Browneyes have a very good class starting to shape up. I wish Michigan had crazy talent like Ohio does where they can choose which 4 or 5 star they want to recruit or don't want to. I will take their leftovers like Mealer (praying he doesn't get a Browneye offer). Michigan needs to step their recruiting up. I think we get Witherspoon in August and hopefully more commits come as HS winds down for the Juniors.

JCarver27
04-23-2007, 10:42 AM
how cute

1010101010

Smashmouth
04-23-2007, 11:42 AM
Uhhh no crap. Everyone knows that. But they make up about 10 percent of the gene pool at most for most african americans. And once again, I'm just stating in majority. Learn how to use statistics... IE looking at sample means, and judging population means in comparison to each other. It's pretty useful.

(Your wrong again it's more than 50 percent.)



That still has nothing to do with the arguement. Baseball is trying to find a bigger base among african americans, whereas more white athletes grow up playing baseball. Anyway, there are black athletes baseball steals as well.
(yeah and my point more balcks grow up playing football than whites you say look at the population of whites better yet why don't you go ou to the parks and you will see who's playing baseball or football.)


This is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard. If you would actually think for about 10 seconds, you could think of 20 reasons as to why there is a 10 percent difference between air force pilots and black population.

I'll just give a few....

1. The Air Force is Highly selective, which lends to picking the best students out of the best schools. Most black students don't come from a background with funds for elite schools. Bad school systems = bad students. Simple fact. White kids who graduate from these schools are just the same as their black counterparts.
(wrong again dummy there are more white kids going to under funded schools then black kids the same reason more whites are on welfare than blacks .But if you served in the armed forces which i can tell you haven't pilots or special forces chose the best and whites allways score better on the apptitude test,I don't think a black from the inner city is worst off than a white from the poor mountain areas yet these whites seem to make to the Academy Schools.)

2. The air force may be seen as a very white type of institution which may scare some black students away.
(If the Air force scares off blacks thats the same argument i told you scares off whites from playing rb)

3. Being in a special forces unit, and flying a plane isn't exactly rocket science. I have a hard time believing that the reason for the difference is because flying an airplane, and being a special forces person is simply too challenging. If they're such intellectually stimulating jobs, why aren't there more asians, indians, latinos.. etc in the job?
(It's not just intellectually it's also phyiscally demanding maybe there not up to who knows but the fact is whites make up 70 percent of the country but make up 95 percent of the special forces.)

4. The Air Force Academy is located in Colorado. Not exactly an area with a high african american population. Distance is a factor within choosing a college such as the air force academy.

(what you still in the 1960's i don't think black people are afraid to live anywere nor should they be)

5. Dan Marino scored a 15 or so on his wonderlic test. He was a pretty good quarterback. There have been numerous smart quarterbacks who blew, and made terrible decisions. Many dumb quarterbacks were awesome as well.

there are so many factors.. i could name more, but don't feel like wasting my time.

(Were not talking about the wonderlic were talking about how fast you can see things in front of you process it then make a decision)


You got me. I know nothing about football. I also know nothing about weight lifting or any other type of training. FWIW, they teach those types of lifts to all types of people. Believe it or not, sprinters use those types of lifts too. And just because you can clean and jerk, doesn't mean you're faster than someone else.

(yeah they teach it to all types of people but it's whites who dominate at it.No it don't mean your faster but football is more quickness than track speed and for 20 yds you want find anybody quicker then olympic lifters)


Thats cool. There was a mexican guy who once told my friend he'd never be a receiver. So obviously all Mexicans think white guys cant be receivers.

1 incident doesnt mean all people act the same. God you're dumb. Not saying it doesn't happen, just saying, in the wider view of things, white runningbacks arent discriminated against...

(if you read the article you would see they are Kevin Harris runs a 4.4 forty and won the state of Florida in weightlifting yet hardly nobody wants him)



No I believe all races are the same, but there is genetic variance in the way people of different races are born.

Secondly, you don't develop fast twitch muscle fibers from playing basketball, sprints, and football. Well actually, you're partially right, however there is MUCH more to it than that. Here are some links to back some of this info up... And BTW... some people are born with more fast twitch muscle fibers. Why do you think some kids are just naturally fast who don't even work out? You absolutely can change your muscle complexion from fast to slow twitch, or vice versa, but your genetics will play a large part in how much you change that.
(you can think that garbage if you want but that would be the same as me saying since whites come from cultures that are way more advanced then black cultures we must have developed a bigger brain right)dumb dumb i coach football and yes somebody might come out who's faster but when you ask what he's done as a kid he either played one of the sports to help develop fast twitch or he was allways out side running around were as most white kids now a days are inside the house growing up which want develop much fast twitch.


If by nerd, you mean I'm not a dumb redneck.. then yes. You are correct. By the way, nice online insult. I really feel the burn.


Check out this article...

http://www.t-nation.com/findArticle.do?article=5speed

Then a few others on muscle training

http://sportsmedicine.about.com/cs/exercisephysiology/a/aa080901a.htm

http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/drobson33.htm

dddddddddddddddddddddddd

Smashmouth
04-23-2007, 11:55 AM
Apparently you can't be white and think white RBs aren't that good at big time college football? I could care less what color your skin is but facts are facts and recent history speaks for itself. I guess when McGuffie becomes a great RB like smashmouth thinks he will or becomes a slot reciever like I think he will, we can come back here and see who doesn't know anything about football.

Anyways. The Browneyes have a very good class starting to shape up. I wish Michigan had crazy talent like Ohio does where they can choose which 4 or 5 star they want to recruit or don't want to. I will take their leftovers like Mealer (praying he doesn't get a Browneye offer). Michigan needs to step their recruiting up. I think we get Witherspoon in August and hopefully more commits come as HS winds down for the Juniors.

you can think what you want but you dont need to tell a young black kid he's inferior mentally nor should you tell a young white kid he's inferior.All i'am saying is no matter the color give every body a fair chance which is not happening when it comes to whites at certain positions.

gstock05
04-23-2007, 12:24 PM
Well I'm not going to argue any more. We both have our own opinions and we can just leave it there.

Anyway, this thread has fallen way off topic

Smashmouth
04-23-2007, 08:24 PM
Im also done with this arguement but you wanted to know what makes fast decision makers. Take a look at this article it has some interesting information.

http://castefootball.us/viewarticle.asp?ID=22873

Also take a look at these IQ scores.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:IQ_and_the_Wealth_of_Nations

http://www.scienceblog.com/cms/node/7669

CM4
05-14-2007, 09:31 PM
haha Darrell thinks you guys are ridiculous keep it goin..

BufFan71
06-17-2007, 11:05 AM
i feel bad for w/e school takes Matt Patchan, (5 star OT) ranked like 3rd best OT 6'7 265....
i was at a UCF camp while he was there, and the kid is a giant sissy, who cried b/c he lost in a match of tug-of-war to a smaller kid