MMA Discussion Thread - SPOILERS!

[JF4]

Kongo is replacing Herring in the fight against Cain...

[Ravens1991]

are you serious? That is going to be a awesome ass fight!!!

[josh07039]

Kongo is replacing Herring in the fight against Cain...This is going to be a huge test for both of them. Velasquez will need to go up against an elite striker and Kongo will need to go up against a great wrestler. This really will determine if Kongo can be seen as a legit contender. He obviously needs to show some competence in his takedown defense against a guy that isnt mostapha al turk who really just kinda hugged his legs to try to take him down. the big thing is that Kongo's impressive wins are against strikers like Cro Corp and Hardonk and right now the heavyweight division has some enormous wrestlers, so for anyone to get a title shot they really need to be a wrestler to show that it wont just be utter domination on the ground.

I think if Velasquez wins it will be similar to Carwin beating Gonzaga in that he will not be an immediate contender for the title, but he will instantly put himself in the conversation rather than being an up and comer.

Right now I'm leaning towards Kongo because of the experience factor. I just think it is more likely that Velasquez will make a mistake. We all know that a mistake against Kongo means death. I will say I'm very conflicted about it because I can easily see Velasquez coming in with a good gameplan and just dominating on the ground.

[MetSox17]

Anyone on Undisputed right now?

[MetSox17]

Can someone tell me how in the hell i'm supposed to download Bader and Escudero?

[E-Man]

This is going to be a huge test for both of them. Velasquez will need to go up against an elite striker and Kongo will need to go up against a great wrestler. This really will determine if Kongo can be seen as a legit contender. He obviously needs to show some competence in his takedown defense against a guy that isnt mostapha al turk who really just kinda hugged his legs to try to take him down. the big thing is that Kongo's impressive wins are against strikers like Cro Corp and Hardonk and right now the heavyweight division has some enormous wrestlers, so for anyone to get a title shot they really need to be a wrestler to show that it wont just be utter domination on the ground.

I think if Velasquez wins it will be similar to Carwin beating Gonzaga in that he will not be an immediate contender for the title, but he will instantly put himself in the conversation rather than being an up and comer.

Right now I'm leaning towards Kongo because of the experience factor. I just think it is more likely that Velasquez will make a mistake. We all know that a mistake against Kongo means death. I will say I'm very conflicted about it because I can easily see Velasquez coming in with a good gameplan and just dominating on the ground.

Another good post from you my man. This matchup will be another one of those test matchups. Kongo's always been praised for his standup, but everyone sees his grappling game as his kryptonite. Not only is he terrible on the ground outside of GnP, but in the past he has shown to have some of the worst takedown defense at heavyweight. Cain is a monster at wrestling, that's his whole game. If Kongo can stop Cain's takedowns then he's ready for a title shot somewhere down the line. His stand up is pretty underrated, and if he can have a Chuck Liddell type game of sprawl and brawl he'll do some real damage.

Cain on the other hand is probably the best heavyweight prospect to come along in a while. He's a great wrestler, and his striking is pretty good at this stage. A wrestler that can knock you out standing is the most dangerous type of fighter. You can't just commit to defending their strikes when the threat of a takedown always looms. In 2 years Cain will be talked about the same way Fedor is, and I actually think he'll be better than Fedor when he hits his peak. Now however it's a toss up against Kongo. He can outgrapple Cheick, but how many of Kongo's shots can he take? I'm picking Cain right now to pull out the win, but this matchup is 50/50 to me.

[josh07039]

I love talking MMA/ this is an intriguing matchup/ your comments got me thinking more about it.

I wonder if perhaps Kongo's takedown D has improved with his time at the Wolfslair. They seem to be establishing themselves as a gym that legitimately makes fighters better when they get there. Obviously Al Turk was nothing special and Hardonk has no desire to take a fight to the ground, so its difficult to know if he has brought his takedown d from inept to decent. Also keep in mind that Kongo will have a good reach advantage(regardless of what the tale of the tape says that night), so if he can effectively use the jab to establish distance and then carefully use leg kicks to weaken Velasquez' base, it goes a long way in avoiding the takedown. Kongo will also have to punish Velasquez any time he goes in for the takedown with knees to the body. Weakening the legs and the core will be key. Also, it is conceivable that Velasquez, like many young fighters, doesn't want to just rely on his wrestling and he will want to show he can strike with Kongo.

I think Velasquez' biggest weakness could be pride. He needs to play it safe. Any moment that Kongo is not on the ground is borrowed time. Kongo's standup game has to be treated with respect and caution. Velasquez will need to take advantage of Kongo's less than stellar footwork, corner him against the cage, take him down, and then pound the **** out of him.

I will be rooting for Velasquez because I don't care for the French, but I feel like Kongo has the better shot. Now that I've said all this, Its going to end up being like Cro Cop vs. Gonzaga. Just to spite me, Velasquez will win by a quick knockout.

[ccB]

Carmelo Marrero made Kongo his ***** on the ground, unless he has completely dedicated himself to wrestling for the past two years I can't see this match up going any better for him. This fight probably has some title implications, especially if Kongo pulls it out.

[josh07039]

Carmelo Marrero made Kongo his ***** on the ground, unless he has completely dedicated himself to wrestling for the past two years I can't see this match up going any better for him. This fight probably has some title implications, especially if Kongo pulls it out. That Marrero fight was brutal for Kongo, however, I just feel like with a good gameplan that focuses on maintaining distance, Kongo may be able to keep it on the feet long enough.

[Cicero]

Anyone watching TUF right now? It's fight time.

[Ravens1991]

yea I am, and TUF sucks this year IMO

[Cicero]

yea I am, and TUF sucks this year IMO

Seriously. The only person who impressed me somewhat was Demarques.

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

I am watching also. I don't think it sucks but it isn't as good as previous seasons. I really like 4 guys altogether.

[Cicero]

Is this the worst fight I have ever seen?

[josh07039]

Is this the worst fight I have ever seen?Lawson was ridiculously tired in the second round and Dent showed no desire to finish the fight. Dana was right on with his post fight rant. Dent was also crappy on his back, doing nothing to improve his position.

I agree that the talent pool seems to be a lot less impressive this season. There are so many more guys that I see having little shot at making it in the UFC.

Who are your 4 guys Ravens/Wizards/Orioles?

[UKfan]

Andre Winner honestly is extremely talented on the UK side, he just looked tentative in his first fight in the house. I wish Che Mills had made it :(

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

Lawson was ridiculously tired in the second round and Dent showed no desire to finish the fight. Dana was right on with his post fight rant. Dent was also crappy on his back, doing nothing to improve his position.

I agree that the talent pool seems to be a lot less impressive this season. There are so many more guys that I see having little shot at making it in the UFC.

Who are your 4 guys Ravens/Wizards/Orioles?

I like these 3 a lot

http://image.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/johnson(3).jpg
http://dyn.ifilm.com/resize/image/stills/people/500194_1.jpg
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1443/etrhapril0876tk0rt9.jpg

[ccB]

I like these 3 a lot

http://image.examiner.com/images/blog/wysiwyg/image/johnson(3).jpg
http://dyn.ifilm.com/resize/image/stills/people/500194_1.jpg
http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1443/etrhapril0876tk0rt9.jpg

My favorite 3 as well, you will see all 3 of these fellas in the UFC. Andre Winner has been on the scene for a while, he's the type of fighter who could of made it to the UFC without being on TUF. He was my favorite to win the show pre-season debut.

[ccB]

Andre Winner honestly is extremely talented on the UK side, he just looked tentative in his first fight in the house. I wish Che Mills had made it :(

Yup without a doubt, MMA hardcores have known about Winner for sometime. I was absolutely shocked that Che didn't make the show, when I heard who was on the cast he was one of my picks to go far and he didn't even make it past the pre-lims.

[josh07039]

I like those three as possessing the best combination of potential and polish. I also Like Richie Whitson as having a lot of potential but still needing a few years. He showed some good athleticism and the possibility for an effective/unorthodox standup that comes from odd angles. Training with Team Quest will go a long way to making him better.

[E-Man]

I will be rooting for Velasquez because I don't care for the French, but I feel like Kongo has the better shot. Now that I've said all this, Its going to end up being like Cro Cop vs. Gonzaga. Just to spite me, Velasquez will win by a quick knockout.


That would be funny if Kongo got beat like that. Like I mentioned, I can see this fight go either way. Kongo's strikes look slow, but they're very effective. If he dropped Cain I wouldn't be shocked since Cain's chin has never been tested. But Cain is something special. If he came and overwhelmed Kongo to a TKO I would not be shocked. He's a gifted athlete with a great camp. Either way though, this fight shows how great UFC's matchmaking usually is. It's an intriguing matchup on paper, and from a business sense they can't lose. If Kongo wins he's easy to market against Lesnar or Carwin. All three guys are huge and ripped, and any combination of matchups with them can garner interest. If Cain wins then he has a real good victory that can propell him into the upper echelon of heavys in the UFC. I really hope he doesn't sniff a title shot until late 2010 at the earliest though. I want to see him get tested in all areas before taking on a title shot. Plus I eagerly hope that in 2011 him and Dos Santos are fighting for a title. Both guys look to be real great fighters in the future.

As far as TUF goes, put me down for Winner. At this stage he looks like he's very polished, and that goes a long way when it comes to fighting on TUF.

[josh07039]

That would be funny if Kongo got beat like that. Like I mentioned, I can see this fight go either way. Kongo's strikes look slow, but they're very effective. If he dropped Cain I wouldn't be shocked since Cain's chin has never been tested. But Cain is something special. If he came and overwhelmed Kongo to a TKO I would not be shocked. He's a gifted athlete with a great camp. Either way though, this fight shows how great UFC's matchmaking usually is. It's an intriguing matchup on paper, and from a business sense they can't lose. If Kongo wins he's easy to market against Lesnar or Carwin. All three guys are huge and ripped, and any combination of matchups with them can garner interest. If Cain wins then he has a real good victory that can propell him into the upper echelon of heavys in the UFC. I really hope he doesn't sniff a title shot until late 2010 at the earliest though. I want to see him get tested in all areas before taking on a title shot. Plus I eagerly hope that in 2011 him and Dos Santos are fighting for a title. Both guys look to be real great fighters in the future.

As far as TUF goes, put me down for Winner. At this stage he looks like he's very polished, and that goes a long way when it comes to fighting on TUF.I agree 100% about the UFC matchmaking being great. There are always complaints that people can make, but for the most part Joe Silva does a great job. I think that putting Kongo against Velasquez is a much better matchup than Herring. It is amazing how even with all the injuries that occur, Silva manages to fill cards with intriguing matchups. It is one of the big reasons that a UFC pay per view is so much better money than a boxing one.

[El Peefs?????]

Well UFC Unleashed has broke me. Ive always refused to get a next gen haha but I want to play this g'damn game. In a month or so after I pay off my car repairs im getting a system. I honestly prefer a PS3 tenfold, but I may just be cheap and get 360.

[El Peefs?????]

Alright Ive got a link here all MMA fans should enjoy. Its the full 'Pride Decade' series highlighting all of Pride's run. I think a lot of guys on this thread are a bit more recent than good ol Pride so I hope they will enjoy it also. There will always be an argument about who had better fighters between UFC & Pride, but one thing thats undeniable was the sheer entertainment of Pride fights & events. Nothing in MMA will ever top them imo.

So anyways here is the link, been watching them for awhile. A lot of good fight footage, interviews, history etc.

Enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/user/PrideDecade

[ccB]

Well UFC Unleashed has broke me. Ive always refused to get a next gen haha but I want to play this g'damn game. In a month or so after I pay off my car repairs im getting a system. I honestly prefer a PS3 tenfold, but I may just be cheap and get 360.

Get 360 so we can play!!!!

[ccB]

Is this the worst fight I have ever seen?

There is a Renzo Gracie fight versus some Japanese pro wrestler that I have on one of my pride dvd's, it is the worst/most boring fight I've ever seen. Renzo refuses to grapple with the guy and instead opts to "show off" his striking skills, and he punches like an 8 year old girl it is awful. In terms of excitement, last weeks episode of TUF is like Diaz v Gomi compared to that awful awful fight.

[E-Man]

Alright Ive got a link here all MMA fans should enjoy. Its the full 'Pride Decade' series highlighting all of Pride's run. I think a lot of guys on this thread are a bit more recent than good ol Pride so I hope they will enjoy it also. There will always be an argument about who had better fighters between UFC & Pride, but one thing thats undeniable was the sheer entertainment of Pride fights & events. Nothing in MMA will ever top them imo.

So anyways here is the link, been watching them for awhile. A lot of good fight footage, interviews, history etc.

Enjoy!

http://www.youtube.com/user/PrideDecade

PRIDE was fun back then. I only got into them at the end of their run, but outside of the UFC they were the only other top org that MMA has seen. They hoarded in some really good fighters, and they pit them all against each other. I like that video, so thanks for the link.

[djp]

So is anyone sick of UFC Undisputed yet? I don't want to buy the game and get sick of it after a few days.

[PACKmanN]

thoughts on these predictions;

Drew McFedries OVER Xavier Foupa Pokam
Dan Miller OVER Chael Sonnen
Frankie Edgar OVER Sean Sherk
Matt Sera OVER Matt Hughes
Rashad Evans OVER Lyoto Machida

what should i look to change and some in-depth info would be nice.

[josh07039]

thoughts on these predictions;

Drew McFedries OVER Xavier Foupa Pokam
Dan Miller OVER Chael Sonnen
Frankie Edgar OVER Sean Sherk
Matt Sera OVER Matt Hughes
Rashad Evans OVER Lyoto Machida

what should i look to change and some in-depth info would be nice.
Personally I am taking
X- Has a more varied stand up game and that is what this fight will probably end up being, a stand up war. However, in a fight like this one, it could go either way. A brawl with two powerful strikers gives each guy a punchers chance. Forgive the cliche.
Miller-Sonnen cut a crazy amount of weight in a really short span and Miller has good submissions/wrestling that should cause problems.
Sherk-Edgar is a Jersey boy, but Sherk is massive, especially compared to the small Edgar. If Sherk plays it smart and keeps taking him down/tiring him out with him size advantage, this should be one sided. All bets are off if Sherk tries to be exciting and keep it standing.
Hughes- Hughes should be able to take him down at will and control him on the ground and put a pounding on him. I would ordinarily say that a guy should watch for Serra's submissions, but Hughes is such a beast that unless he does something moronic, he shouldn't have to worry. He somehow cannot be choked out and his GNP is obviously like a well oiled machine, so it should be hard to grab an arm or leg.
Machida- Rashad is known to get behind and Machida is great at getting a lead and keeping it. I think Rashad's speed advantage is overblown because of Machida's footwork. Machida's great speed coupled with his footwork should neutralize rashad's speed. The big if is Rashad's hand speed coupled with Machida's chin. How can anyone say Machida has a good or a bad chin? If he gets caught, how will he react? This match is very much the enigmatic chess match that the UFC Is billing it as, however, Machida is my guy.

[E-Man]

Rashad vs. Lyoto. This could end up being MMA's Ali/Frazier. These dudes are that good. MMA is still new, and right now at 205 these two are the fighters with the best skill set. These two guys are undefeated for a reason, and that reason isn't for fighting cans their whole careers. This fight is very similar to two top point guards going at it like Steve Nash against Tony Parker or something similar. One guy is extremely technically sound, and the other is a guy with massive amount of athleticism. I think that athleticism will give Rashad the decision. Here's why I think he'll win. Everyone talks about how no one has figured out Lyoto yet, and that's a true assessment. But one thing that Rashad has in his favor is that he's quick enough to win the exchanges when Lyoto comes inside. Let's keep one thing real here. Lyoto's main game is striking. He may be elusive with great footwork, but the fact still remains that he's going to stand the whole fight. He may take the fight down to the ground if there's a chance, but he usually favors to out point people on the feet. Well how come everyone forgets that Rashad has lightning fast jabs, and crisp boxing? When Lyoto moves in, Rashad will tag him multiple times with a few jabs, and Rashad will then move away. Rashad is actually quicker than Lyoto on the feet, even though Lyoto's mechanics are better. But the kicker is how Rashad adjusts to Lyoto's trips. Rashad can stick and move fast enough to stay out of range, but Lyoto has some really good trips. The thing that swings this in Rashad's favor is the fact that Rashad is just as good as Chuck Liddell when it comes to staying off his back, and Rashad is also a monster when it comes to adjusting during a fight. If Rashad adjusts to Lyoto's trips early, he can use that to cause damage while moving away from Lyoto, thus causing Lyoto to actually chase Rashad. Lyoto's is not used to chasing people, and that puts him at a disadvantage. Also Rashad has the wrestling edge too. He hasn't shot for many takedowns since the Bisping fight back in late 2007, but Lyoto would be a fool not to know that Rashad has a serious wrestling game. Rashad is not Tito, and he won't telegraph his takedowns like Tito does. Another thing that goes in Rashad's favor is the fact that his strikes will do more damage over the course of the fight. Lyoto is showing that Karate can be useful, but Karate strikes aren't known to cause a ton of damage. So Lyoto's shots may not wear on Rashad as Rashad's will, but Lyoto's plan is really just to keep out of taking alot of damage. So he's mostly going to keep backpedaling and circling while using strikes to win on points. He's a very hard man to catch while doing that. But here's how the fight will go down for Rashad. Rashad will use his boxing and head movement to keep Lyoto at bay for the first couple of rounds. He'll use alot of jabs, and by the end of the second round he'll use those jabs as a set up for some power shots. In the 3rd and 4th round Rashad will probably throw some Thai kicks to wear Lyoto down, and in round 5 he'll look to capitalize on that by scoring some take downs for some ground and pound to a decision. I say Rashad wins 4 rounds to one, to win a decision.

Hughes will beat Serra by decision. Hughes is stronger than Serra, and contrary to idiot belief he isn't crappy on the ground. Serra's chance is to get a flash knockout, or to win on the ground. Both guys are old, so Hughes still has that advantage. Hughes will take Serra down, and keep him there the whole fight.

Sherk versus Edgar is a head scratcher of a match-up, because Edgar's one loss is to a guy that is basically a young Sherk in Gray Maynard. Edgar's game is his wrestling, Sherk's game is his wrestling. Sherk is stronger, and more experienced than Edgar. Edgar may be quicker than Sherk, but that's hard to say. Sherk controls Edgar to a decision.

Dan Miller armbars Chael Sonnen. Chael's arms are magnets for armbars. lol

I don't know much about Xavier Foupa-Pokam except for the fact that he's usually won by finishing his fights. I also know that Mcfedries has good hands, but is prone to a submission. I'm going with Professor X by early sub, just based on a gut feeling. Don't put too much stock in this pick.

[Rob S]

Rashad vs. Lyoto. This could end up being MMA's Ali/Frazier. These dudes are that good. MMA is still new, and right now at 205 these two are the fighters with the best skill set. These two guys are undefeated for a reason, and that reason isn't for fighting cans their whole careers. This fight is very similar to two top point guards going at it like Steve Nash against Tony Parker or something similar. One guy is extremely technically sound, and the other is a guy with massive amount of athleticism. I think that athleticism will give Rashad the decision. Here's why I think he'll win. Everyone talks about how no one has figured out Lyoto yet, and that's a true assessment. But one thing that Rashad has in his favor is that he's quick enough to win the exchanges when Lyoto comes inside. Let's keep one thing real here. Lyoto's main game is striking. He may be elusive with great footwork, but the fact still remains that he's going to stand the whole fight. He may take the fight down to the ground if there's a chance, but he usually favors to out point people on the feet. Well how come everyone forgets that Rashad has lightning fast jabs, and crisp boxing? When Lyoto moves in, Rashad will tag him multiple times with a few jabs, and Rashad will then move away. Rashad is actually quicker than Lyoto on the feet, even though Lyoto's mechanics are better. But the kicker is how Rashad adjusts to Lyoto's trips. Rashad can stick and move fast enough to stay out of range, but Lyoto has some really good trips. The thing that swings this in Rashad's favor is the fact that Rashad is just as good as Chuck Liddell when it comes to staying off his back, and Rashad is also a monster when it comes to adjusting during a fight. If Rashad adjusts to Lyoto's trips early, he can use that to cause damage while moving away from Lyoto, thus causing Lyoto to actually chase Rashad. Lyoto's is not used to chasing people, and that puts him at a disadvantage. Also Rashad has the wrestling edge too. He hasn't shot for many takedowns since the Bisping fight back in late 2007, but Lyoto would be a fool not to know that Rashad has a serious wrestling game. Rashad is not Tito, and he won't telegraph his takedowns like Tito does. Another thing that goes in Rashad's favor is the fact that his strikes will do more damage over the course of the fight. Lyoto is showing that Karate can be useful, but Karate strikes aren't known to cause a ton of damage. So Lyoto's shots may not wear on Rashad as Rashad's will, but Lyoto's plan is really just to keep out of taking alot of damage. So he's mostly going to keep backpedaling and circling while using strikes to win on points. He's a very hard man to catch while doing that. But here's how the fight will go down for Rashad. Rashad will use his boxing and head movement to keep Lyoto at bay for the first couple of rounds. He'll use alot of jabs, and by the end of the second round he'll use those jabs as a set up for some power shots. In the 3rd and 4th round Rashad will probably throw some Thai kicks to wear Lyoto down, and in round 5 he'll look to capitalize on that by scoring some take downs for some ground and pound to a decision. I say Rashad wins 4 rounds to one, to win a decision.

Hughes will beat Serra by decision. Hughes is stronger than Serra, and contrary to idiot belief he isn't crappy on the ground. Serra's chance is to get a flash knockout, or to win on the ground. Both guys are old, so Hughes still has that advantage. Hughes will take Serra down, and keep him there the whole fight.

Sherk versus Edgar is a head scratcher of a match-up, because Edgar's one loss is to a guy that is basically a young Sherk in Gray Maynard. Edgar's game is his wrestling, Sherk's game is his wrestling. Sherk is stronger, and more experienced than Edgar. Edgar may be quicker than Sherk, but that's hard to say. Sherk controls Edgar to a decision.

Dan Miller armbars Chael Sonnen. Chael's arms are magnets for armbars. lol

I don't know much about Xavier Foupa-Pokam except for the fact that he's usually won by finishing his fights. I also know that Mcfedries has good hands, but is prone to a submission. I'm going with Professor X by early sub, just based on a gut feeling. Don't put too much stock in this pick.

Thats ridiculous. Nobody really cares about machida or knows who he is in the mainstream. The world stopped for Ali-Frazier.........and if you mean excitement wise, I dont see it either. Both guys love to counter and while I think either guy could knock the other one out, neither has shown a penchant for putting on exciting fights.........

[E-Man]

Thats ridiculous. Nobody really cares about machida or knows who he is in the mainstream. The world stopped for Ali-Frazier.........and if you mean excitement wise, I dont see it either. Both guys love to counter and while I think either guy could knock the other one out, neither has shown a penchant for putting on exciting fights.........

I don't mean in terms of notoriety, MMA has a long way to go before having fighters that recognizable. I'm talking in terms of how good the fights are. This is a 50/50 fight, and I think the loser gets another shot at the winner in a year.

[Rob S]

I don't mean in terms of notoriety, MMA has a long way to go before having fighters that recognizable. I'm talking in terms of how good the fights are. This is a 50/50 fight, and I think the loser gets another shot at the winner in a year.

I suppose, but do u really see Machida-Rashad being that good from an entertainment standpoint. The casual fan hates how machida usually fights and Rashad even puts me to sleep (altho his explosiveness makes for amazing moments).

Also, with the depth at 205, I dont really see a rematch that soon unless the fight demands a rematch. With cash cows like Rampage and Forrest and a guy like Shogun on the comeback trail (not to mention The Spider looming) 205 is looking pretty loaded.

[E-Man]

I suppose, but do u really see Machida-Rashad being that good from an entertainment standpoint. The casual fan hates how machida usually fights and Rashad even puts me to sleep (altho his explosiveness makes for amazing moments).

Also, with the depth at 205, I dont really see a rematch that soon unless the fight demands a rematch. With cash cows like Rampage and Forrest and a guy like Shogun on the comeback trail (not to mention The Spider looming) 205 is looking pretty loaded.

Well the casual fans might not like the fight, but I'm talking about within MMA circles. Like Sherdog, MMA Weekly, MMA Junkie, etc. would really love this fight. Maybe the casuals are to the point that they would enjoy a counter chess match. Look at the Demian Maia/Jason MacDonald fight. That would a ground clinic with very few punches, and the crowd loved it. The crowd also cheers when a guy passes into side control now. Maybe they're ready for a counter chess match..........but then again. Rashad is hated(for ridiculous reasons) and Lyoto has a track record of booing fans.

As for the rematch, I think it could happen next year based on other top guys taking each other out. Rampage is obviously next in line, especially if Rashad wins. Forrest and Anderson will fight in a few months, and Anderson won't fight Lyoto. Shogun is still a mystery. If he looks good again, then I'm sure he'll be in the mix, but you never know if the right guy comes along. Jon Jones and Ryan Bader will be pretty good, but they're still too young to garner interest for a title fight.

[josh07039]

I suppose, but do u really see Machida-Rashad being that good from an entertainment standpoint. The casual fan hates how machida usually fights and Rashad even puts me to sleep (altho his explosiveness makes for amazing moments).

Also, with the depth at 205, I dont really see a rematch that soon unless the fight demands a rematch. With cash cows like Rampage and Forrest and a guy like Shogun on the comeback trail (not to mention The Spider looming) 205 is looking pretty loaded.
If Forrest wins against Silva, he immediately puts himself back in the picture. I assume because of the timing, Forrest would take another fight before getting another title shot. Possibly a rematch with Shogun? I know Shogun is interested in avenging that loss. I am not sold on the new and improved shogun without a win against a top contender.

If Silva wins, he could be one fight away from being a #1 contender. The problem with Silva is that he seems difficult in his matchmaking because he seems to refuse to fight any of his buddies, Machida and I think Shogun. So it would be tough to get him the proper credentials at 205. Additionally, If he doesn't have a great performance against Forrest, Dana might get pissed and not want him to hold two belts. One last complication, depending upon how Wanderlei does at middleweight, the UFC could want that fight to happen.

Obviously, whoever wins the title will be facing rampage next, but if it is an exciting fight, I could easily see the loser fighting Shogun, Forrest(If he wins), or Silva(With a win and if he agrees to fight).

In terms of the entertainment aspect, i think it could prove to be a joy for hardcore fans, but not the type of brawl that the masses would enjoy. I have always enjoyed watching Machida because I don't need non stop punching to be entertained. In his last fight, Machida was more exciting and stopped the fight earlier. Perhaps he is transitioning to being cautiously aggressive rather than primarily cautious.

[Hines]

I'm going to try hard to go to a bar or watch the fights on a stream tomorrow. So pumped. Haven't had my computer around so how is everyone liking the game? Who does everyone fight with?

[Ravens1991]

Its tough to say who will win the fight. E-man brings up valid points but IDK if Rashad can out point the point master himself Machida. He nearly lost to Bisping, I feel he lost the 1st round to Liddell, and he was losing to Griffin before finishing him. I dont think Lyoto will be finished.

If he can adjust to Lyoto mid fight IDK if he has the conditioning to do it. He gassed bad against Bisping.

Personally i am not a big fan of either, I think both will have a great fight with Rampage

[bernbabybern820]

Well the casual fans might not like the fight, but I'm talking about within MMA circles. Like Sherdog, MMA Weekly, MMA Junkie, etc. would really love this fight. Maybe the casuals are to the point that they would enjoy a counter chess match. Look at the Demian Maia/Jason MacDonald fight. That would a ground clinic with very few punches, and the crowd loved it. The crowd also cheers when a guy passes into side control now. Maybe they're ready for a counter chess match..........but then again. Rashad is hated(for ridiculous reasons) and Lyoto has a track record of booing fans.

As for the rematch, I think it could happen next year based on other top guys taking each other out. Rampage is obviously next in line, especially if Rashad wins. Forrest and Anderson will fight in a few months, and Anderson won't fight Lyoto. Shogun is still a mystery. If he looks good again, then I'm sure he'll be in the mix, but you never know if the right guy comes along. Jon Jones and Ryan Bader will be pretty good, but they're still too young to garner interest for a title fight.

I'm far from a casual fan but i could definitely picture it being a boring fight. Both are aware of their opponents countering skills so i see them both being very cautious. It could very well be a fight with both fighters waiting for each other to make a mistake with very few spurts of action.

[josh07039]

I'm far from a casual fan but i could definitely picture it being a boring fight. Both are aware of their opponents countering skills so i see them both being very cautious. It could very well be a fight with both fighters waiting for each other to make a mistake with very few spurts of action.
I am such a nerd that positioning, footwork, and feigning entertain me. Don't get me wrong, I love action packed brawls and exciting matchups on the ground, but there is something so satisfying about watching a technical matchup. I'm not talking about an actionless fight that involves running away. I have a sneaky feeling that Machida may push the action a little more. I've been rewatching Rashad's fights and his constantly bouncing around, which could make it easier for Machida to use his trips and push the action. However, who the hell knows? Could be five rounds of booing with Machida shamefully winning the belt or five round of lay n pray with Rashad shamefully retaining.

[E-Man]

I'm far from a casual fan but i could definitely picture it being a boring fight. Both are aware of their opponents countering skills so i see them both being very cautious. It could very well be a fight with both fighters waiting for each other to make a mistake with very few spurts of action.

Those type of fights are entertaining to me. MMA has been in need of a good counter vs. counter fight. I like brawls too, but give me technique any day.

[Rob S]

Those type of fights are entertaining to me. MMA has been in need of a good counter vs. counter fight. I like brawls too, but give me technique any day.

I disagree there. Counter vs counter is kinda lame imo. I have been training stand up my entire life so I can appreciate the mental game even when there is no punching, but when it goes over the course of an entire fight it sucks balls. Rashad is boring imo. He is explosive, thats the only exciting thing about him. Machida I appreciate more.

[josh07039]

I disagree there. Counter vs counter is kinda lame imo. I have been training stand up my entire life so I can appreciate the mental game even when there is no punching, but when it goes over the course of an entire fight it sucks balls. Rashad is boring imo. He is explosive, thats the only exciting thing about him. Machida I appreciate more.
I agree with you on Rashad. He is a much more boring fighter than Machida. Machida is cautious with Rashad is just boring sometimes. Rashad just kinda does nothing for long stretches hoping his opponent makes a mistake. Machia on the other hand uses his footwork, trips, etc, to avoid damage while forcing his opponent into a bad position.

[Cicero]

Here we go!

[josh07039]

Here we go!Sherk looks like he is in another weight class.

[Cicero]

37 wins jeez I forgot he had so many.

[Cicero]

Sherk isn't winning this one unless he gets a KO in this last minute.

[josh07039]

Sherk isn't winning this one unless he gets a KO in this last minute.Sherk did what I feared, he tried to win a standup battle rather than winning with his clear advantage size/ground game.

[E-Man]

So did Sherk have some brain damage or something? How in the hell does he play into the one weakness that gave Edgar the edge? It would be one thing if Frankie stuffed his takedowns, but Sherk only went for two the whole fight. I guess he doesn't want to move up for a title shot. Edgar looked real good though. He's added some striking to his wrestling arsenal. If he doesn't do it at 155, he'll be a contender at 145.

[josh07039]

So did Sherk have some brain damage or something? How in the hell does he play into the one weakness that gave Edgar the edge? It would be one thing if Frankie stuffed his takedowns, but Sherk only went for two the whole fight. I guess he doesn't want to move up for a title shot. Edgar looked real good though. He's added some striking to his wrestling arsenal. If he doesn't do it at 155, he'll be a contender at 145.
Well he did nothing to suggest that he can handle a big guy because Sherk didn't use his size at all. Edgar did show the ability to get up after the one double legs sherk pulled off.He put on an impressive performance with his movement and varied stand up.

So far with Edgar and the way the second bout is playing out, my picks are not going well.

[Cicero]

Miller can't even get off his back.

[josh07039]

Miller can't even get off his back.Im shocked how good Sonnen looks after his drastic weight cut in such a short time.

[Cicero]

Im shocked how good Sonnen looks after his drastic weight cut in such a short time.

Ya, being on top of someone for 15 minutes doesn't test your endurance too much though.

[josh07039]

Ya, being on top of someone for 15 minutes doesn't test your endurance too much though.
Im not necessarily talking about endurance, after a big weight cut, they can lose some explosiveness/strength. I figured he might lose some of his ability to control miller on the ground.

[E-Man]

Well he did nothing to suggest that he can handle a big guy because Sherk didn't use his size at all. Edgar did show the ability to get up after the one double legs sherk pulled off.He put on an impressive performance with his movement and varied stand up.

So far with Edgar and the way the second bout is playing out, my picks are not going well.

Me neither. My picks are going to suck hard tonight unless I have a nice "run" here. I almost picked Kryzstof until I found that he was on the undercard. Oh well, at least Chael Sonnen aka The Saaaaaaaad Panda had a nice showing. His line of being the fastest white guy ever is hilarious. lol

Hopefully this next fight gives us some fireworks. I've heard that this Professor X cat is pretty good.

[josh07039]

Me neither. My picks are going to suck hard tonight unless I have a nice "run" here. I almost picked Kryzstof until I found that he was on the undercard. Oh well, at least Chael Sonnen aka The Saaaaaaaad Panda had a nice showing. His line of being the fastest white guy ever is hilarious. lol

Hopefully this next fight gives us some fireworks. I've heard that this Professor X cat is pretty good.I loved hearing that line. And my prelim card picks weren't terrible, by I don't really care about those, I worry about main card.

Prof X has got some good kickboxing skills.

[Cicero]

Here will be the stand up brawl for all of the casual fans.

[Cicero]

Well then...

[josh07039]

Here will be the stand up brawl for all of the casual fans.WOW. BRUTAL.

[E-Man]

DAMN!!!!!!!

[E-Man]

lol Why does Mcfedries always win when I pick against him, and he loses when I pick him? That was a sick KO.

[josh07039]

lol Why does Mcfedries always win when I pick against him, and he loses when I pick him? That was a sick KO. Im shocked that X wasn't a little more cautious, using leg kicks to keep some distance. It seems like I keep picking people that come in with stupid gameplans.
Sherk-Dumbass
Miller-Not exactly stupid, but really wasted his gas tank in dumb ways
Prof X- Don't let him hit you in the face repeatedly.

[josh07039]

Ok I need this fight to go my way to salvage my picks.

[E-Man]

Im shocked that X wasn't a little more cautious, using leg kicks to keep some distance. It seems like I keep picking people that come in with stupid gameplans.
Sherk-Dumbass
Miller-Not exactly stupid, but really wasted his gas tank in dumb ways
Prof X- Don't let him hit you in the face repeatedly.

The way tonight is going, Hughes' gameplan will consist of pulling guard against Serra, and end up getting subbed.

OT: Iron Mike sighting! lol @ Tyson. Every time I see him I picture him hitting kids and stomping on their testicles. lmao

[josh07039]

The way tonight is going, Hughes' gameplan will consist of pulling guard against Serra, and end up getting subbed.

OT: Iron Mike sighting! lol @ Tyson. Every time I see him I picture him hitting kids and stomping on their testicles. lmaoI could see him doing anything that is not GNP because no one I picked seems to be doing what they should.

[Cicero]

Wow that was a close fight.

[josh07039]

Wow that was a close fight.Kinda boring. Serra's only exciting moment came because of a headbutt.

[E-Man]

Please judges give this to Hughes. I need at least one pick right.

[josh07039]

Please judges give this to Hughes. I need at least one pick right. Yup, Im glad it worked out that way for my sake, but Hughes didn't look that impressive.

[E-Man]

lol @ Matt Serra's expression when he heard that Matt won.Hughes should've won. Serra didn't do jack outside of that headbutt. Hughes didn't do much either, but he did more. Serra didn't even outstrike Hughes on the feet, he just got hit with weak jabs and straights while hoping for that big punch. I hope Hughes retires though. He doesn't have it anymore, and he has one of the best careers MMA has seen so far.

[josh07039]

lol @ Matt Serra's expression when he heard that Matt won.Hughes should've won. Serra didn't do jack outside of that headbutt. Hughes didn't do much either, but he did more. Serra didn't even outstrike Hughes on the feet, he just got hit with weak jabs and straights while hoping for that big punch. I hope Hughes retires though. He doesn't have it anymore, and he has one of the best careers MMA has seen so far.I'd argue that when he was in his prime, he was the most physically dominant fighter of anyera. His takedowns and Slams were just unstoppable. If only he had developed any semblance of a stand up.

edit:Not his era, any era.

[Cicero]

Well it's clear who won that round. That's one really risky thing about Evan's style is that if he makes one mistake it's not hard for him to lose the round.

[josh07039]

Well it's clear who won that round.Rashad always starts slow, there is nothing I can take from convincingly winning a round or even two. I was just starting to feel confident in Forrest when Rashad knocked him out.

[Cicero]

Wowww what a finish!

[josh07039]

Rashad You Got Knocked The **** Out
UFC execs are crying right now because of the possibility of a season of TUF with Rashad and Rampage.

[MetSox17]

Oh someone please tell me Rashad got his ass handed to him.

[josh07039]

Oh someone please tell me Rashad got his ass handed to him.
Badly. Lost the first round because he did nothing. Machida then just knocked him the **** out. Machida once again didn't get hurt. Rashad crumpled with the last blow with his legs trapped underneath him awkwardly. Machida crushed him.

[ccB]

I laugh at all who doubted the Dragon! The baddest man on the planet without a doubt!

[E-Man]

God Dammit! **** me in the ass! DAMN! DAMN! DAMNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN!





Props to Machida. He's a great fighter. He deserved it.

[Cicero]

Rashad was too one dimensional. The only thing he brought to this fight was boxing. I thought maybe he would bring something new here because I really didn't think Machida was the kind of person you're going to survive trying to box. Machida attempted to take him down once, he used his kicks, and he used his fists.

[MetSox17]

Badly. Lost the first round because he did nothing. Machida then just knocked him the **** out. Machida once again didn't get hurt. Rashad crumpled with the last blow with his legs trapped underneath him awkwardly. Machida crushed him.

Ah, i love it! How did he get knocked out?

[josh07039]

I laugh at all who doubted the Dragon! The baddest man on the planet without a doubt!Never doubt the precision and footwork. He is a monster.

[josh07039]

Ah, i love it! How did he get knocked out?Machida landed what I think was a left after Rashad went for a kick. Rashad went down and Machida started just swinging from ever angle. rashad got back up but was clearly still dazed. Machida pushed him against the cage and just swarmed his with left and right hooks.

[bernbabybern820]

Damn Rashad tried to prove me right by making it a boring fight but Machida was having none of it.

[bernbabybern820]

Never doubt the precision and footwork. He is a monster.

Plus speed kills. And drinking your urine helps as well.

[josh07039]

Plus speed kills. And drinking your urine helps as well.You're preaching to the choir on drinking your own urine.

[E-Man]

You know what pisses me off? Rashad is a great fighter who always improves, and he puts the time and effort to be a champion. He's grown tremendously since TUF, and he's what MMA needs. A guy who always looks to get better, and who has sharpened his skills. But people hate on him for the most asinine reasons, and they created dumbass strawman arguments because he didn't fight in PRIDE, or is a Japanese or Brazilian, or because he was on TUF. I'm sick of this hating in MMA of fighters who put in work to make the sport grow. I'm tired of people hating on fighters so bad that they down so badly that when they lose, they act like it's the Super Bowl time.Well you know what? **** the elitist asshole MMA fans! **** the ones who hate on a guy for trying to be the best. Lyoto won that fight straight up, and he's the best at 205 now. That still doesn't mean that Rashad is some sorry ass loser who got lucky like the stupid Japanophiles and internet tough guys say. I saw a highly anticipating fight to where a damn great fighter beat another damn great fighter that didn't figure him out. So when people start hating on Lyoto for dumb ass reasons, I'm already getting my **** 'em in now. I'm still a Rashad fan, and I'll always have respect for Machida. I'm going to take this loss like a man, and admit that I was wrong and give props to the better fighter. No excuses from me because my favorite fighter got his ass kicked.

[josh07039]

You know what pisses me off? Rashad is a great fighter who always improves, and he puts the time and effort to be a champion. He's grown tremendously since TUF, and he's what MMA needs. A guy who always looks to get better, and who has sharpened his skills. But people hate on him for the most asinine reasons, and they created dumbass strawman arguments because he didn't fight in PRIDE, or is a Japanese or Brazilian, or because he was on TUF. I'm sick of this hating in MMA of fighters who put in work to make the sport grow. I'm tired of people hating on fighters so bad that they down so badly that when they lose, they act like it's the Super Bowl time.Well you know what? **** the elitist asshole MMA fans! **** the ones who hate on a guy for trying to be the best. Lyoto won that fight straight up, and he's the best at 205 now. That still doesn't mean that Rashad is some sorry ass loser who got lucky like the stupid Japanophiles and internet tough guys say. I saw a highly anticipating fight to where a damn great fighter beat another damn great fighter that didn't figure him out. So when people start hating on Lyoto for dumb ass reasons, I'm already getting my **** 'em in now. I'm still a Rashad fan, and I'll always have respect for Machida. I'm going to take this loss like a man, and admit that I was wrong and give props to the better fighter. No excuses from me because my favorite fighter got his ass kicked.1.Chill a bit. Just relax. It's his first loss, he will be back. I know it sucks when your favorite fighter loses, but it's just a setback.
2. I do not like Rashad. He rubs me the wrong way. However, I don't think he's gotten lucky. He has powerful/quick hands and great wrestling. He works hard with a great camp, and there is no discounting that. However, with all that said, I still don't like him. I could give my reasons, but that will just start an argument that will go nowhere. We have our own perspectives and you are allowed to like him, while I fall on the other side.

[Ravens1991]

It was possibly the most boring round in UFC history until the end of round 1. When Machida attacks he is one of the most exciting fighters out there. But he doesnt really attack often.

[Cicero]

http://img40.imageshack.us/img40/3950/machidagif.gif

[E-Man]

1.Chill a bit. Just relax. It's his first loss, he will be back. I know it sucks when your favorite fighter loses, but it's just a setback.
2. I do not like Rashad. He rubs me the wrong way. However, I don't think he's gotten lucky. He has powerful/quick hands and great wrestling. He works hard with a great camp, and there is no discounting that. However, with all that said, I still don't like him. I could give my reasons, but that will just start an argument that will go nowhere. We have our own perspectives and you are allowed to like him, while I fall on the other side.

lol I'm already calm now. I had to get my angry pissed rant in. You should see me last year when the Cowboys lost all those games. lol I'm an emotional fan at times. Ok so you don't like the guy, but at least you respect him. Nobody knows a thing about respect in the sports game. Too many people act like he's a nobody TUFer, and I'm tired of it. For a bunch of MMA fans who constantly scream and whine about what's good for the sport and how casual fans bring the integrity of the sport down, these elitist jack wipes never give the fighters the respect they deserve.


Now it's time to praise Lyoto. I said before the fight that the winner would be head and shoulders above the rest, and he is. I'm really glad that the championship is in the hands of a smart fighter like him. We know where he goes from here, he fights Rampage later this year. I already pick Lyoto, but you can never count ole Quinton out. Rashad will probably go on to fight Shogun or Thiago Silva. I would pick him over those guys too, because they have too many holes in their striking for a guy as quick as Rashad. Rashad will probably win 2 or 3 in impressive fashion, and he'll be in the title hunt again.

[Mr. Hero]

I'm not a huge MMA fan, but I do catch fights cause some of my buddies are and I love watching Machina, I just love the way he moves and forces his opponents to expose themselves as they try and hit him.

[MaxV]

Machida vs. Shogun.


I want this to happen.

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

I think Chuck Norris might have met his match
http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Gallery/Fighting/2008/01/02/SokoudjouMachida02a.jpg

[Mr. Hero]

I think Chuck Norris might have met his match
http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Gallery/Fighting/2008/01/02/SokoudjouMachida02a.jpg

almost forty years ago...
JLO1YIWQuXE

[jayceheathman]

1.Chill a bit. Just relax. It's his first loss, he will be back. I know it sucks when your favorite fighter loses, but it's just a setback.
2. I do not like Rashad. He rubs me the wrong way. However, I don't think he's gotten lucky. He has powerful/quick hands and great wrestling. He works hard with a great camp, and there is no discounting that. However, with all that said, I still don't like him. I could give my reasons, but that will just start an argument that will go nowhere. We have our own perspectives and you are allowed to like him, while I fall on the other side.

1. My favorite fighter is not losing in a little over one month to GSP! :) GSP is going down. :) My second favorite fighter is going to destroy Brock and gain the title back.
2. I cant wait to see the day that Machida gets his ass handed to him.

[Chucky]

1. My favorite fighter is not losing in a little over one month to GSP! :) GSP is going down. :) My second favorite fighter is going to destroy Brock and gain the title back.
2. I cant wait to see the day that Machida gets his ass handed to him.

I laugh at anyone who thinks that GSP will lose. I would throw down a sig bet that GSP will most definately win.

[jayceheathman]

I laugh at anyone who thinks that GSP will lose. I would throw down a sig bet that GSP will most definately win.

I am so down with that. I love Thiago.

[Chucky]

I am so down with that. I love Thiago.

Done.... Loser wheres the sig of the winners choice for 2 weeks?

[josh07039]

I laugh at anyone who thinks that GSP will lose. I would throw down a sig bet that GSP will most definately win.I think he will win, but I think being that confident is a bit ridiculous. Thiago is a dangerous human being.

[Chucky]

I think he will win, but I think being that confident is a bit ridiculous.

I'm not that confident... I just think that he will... and would be willing to put down a bet for the Canadian.

[jayceheathman]

Done.... Loser wheres the sig of the winners choice for 2 weeks?

Sounds good to me. Thiago is going to destroy him. I love watching him fight.

[E-Man]

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lol I've been saving this for the first time Rashad loses. Part of me wishes he went off on the MMA world like this for comedic gold.:D


And I think GSP takes Alves, but it's close.

[Ravens1991]

I agree Thiago is my favorite WW. Him and GSP are the only WW in the world that can take Penn IMO.

It will be a good fight.



But how about Sherk VS. Edgar, Edgar is my favorite LW I am glad he beat Sherk.

[josh07039]

I agree Thiago is my favorite WW. Him and GSP are the only WW in the world that can take Penn IMO.

It will be a good fight.



But how about Sherk VS. Edgar, Edgar is my favorite LW I am glad he beat Sherk.I like Edgar because he is a wrestling coach at Rutgers. I still feel like Sherk was downright stupid and could've won the fight with a good gameplan, but Edgar was really impressive. He showed a good standup and the one time he was taken down he got right back up. I think if Edgar keeps improving, his combination of striking and wrestling will be dangerous for other top lightweights.

[ccB]

I think Chuck Norris might have met his match
http://slam.canoe.ca/Slam/Gallery/Fighting/2008/01/02/SokoudjouMachida02a.jpg

LOL @ Everlast from House of Pain in the background.

[Cicero]

I am so down with that. I love Thiago.

Thiago = my fukcin boyyyyyyyyyy ya **** GSP Thiago is giong to fukv him pu soooooo bad,

[MaxV]

1. My favorite fighter is not losing in a little over one month to GSP! :) GSP is going down. :) My second favorite fighter is going to destroy Brock and gain the title back.
2. I cant wait to see the day that Machida gets his ass handed to him.

Yeah, I wouldn't hold my breath on any of those.

[Ravens1991]

Has Rashad luck run out? He tied against Tito Ortiz(not even a top 10 LHW, maybe not top 15), he won a super close decision to Bisping(not a 1st tier MW). He was losing to Liddell before KTFO him, he was also losing to Griffin before finishing him. Do you think that he had just a great run of luck and will go back to being a 2nd-3rd tier LHW, or do you think he is a elite LHW?

[josh07039]

Has Rashad luck run out? He tied against Tito Ortiz(not even a top 10 LHW, maybe not top 15), he won a super close decision to Bisping(not a 1st tier MW). He was losing to Liddell before KTFO him, he was also losing to Griffin before finishing him. Do you think that he had just a great run of luck and will go back to being a 2nd-3rd tier LHW, or do you think he is a elite LHW?
Im not sure you can say he isn't a top LHW, but I do think that he isn't elite. He has improved his stand up greatly, but as that has happened he has gotten away from using takedowns at all. He is not Chuck Liddell in his prime where he can get away with using takedown D and throwing for the knockout every fight.
With Tito and Bisping, many fighters win a close decision or two that some people feel could've gone the other way. It was kinda lucky getting the draw against Tito, but most fighters have a decision or two on their record that came from luck. With Bisping, once again, outside of the very dominant fighters, everyone has a close decision that they gutted out.
I don't think luck had to do with coming from behind on Forrest and Chuck. I used to think so, but I realize it was just sour grapes. Rashad against liddell wasn't utter domination and Rashad picked his spot. With Forrest, he just caught him after getting battered for two rounds. That isn't luck, just power.
With all that said, I think Rashad in terms of talent is still top 5, but when fighting some of the other contenders, could start racking up a few losses here and there. It is a really tough division at the top, especially is shogun's resurgence is real.

[bernbabybern820]

Has Rashad luck run out? He tied against Tito Ortiz(not even a top 10 LHW, maybe not top 15), he won a super close decision to Bisping(not a 1st tier MW). He was losing to Liddell before KTFO him, he was also losing to Griffin before finishing him. Do you think that he had just a great run of luck and will go back to being a 2nd-3rd tier LHW, or do you think he is a elite LHW?

Ya a bit overrated but we should all give credit to Tito as well. He should have beaten Rashad and probably would have beat Machida if he held on to the triangle instead of switching to an armbar.

[Rob S]

My thoughts:

1) GSP-Alves will be a great fight and Alves will be the toughest test for GSP at WW.....someone is actually bigger than him. However, GSP is the favorite and rightfully so.

2) Lyoto is the man, BUT if anyone can give him problems I think Rampage can fit the bill. If he follows the gameplan of explode, clinch, takedown from the clinch, I think he has a chance. He is explosive enough to close the distance and strong enough to hold on once he gets inside. And Machida, while pretty much impossible to TD with a shot, may be more prone from the clinch. No striker really has a shot imo.

3) Anyone else excited for DREAM? JZ vs Kawajiri should be sick, plus Mayhem vs Jacare, Kid Yamamoto, Gegard Mousasi vs Mark Hunt, and some good freak show fights! Pretty strong offering imo.

[E-Man]

Has Rashad luck run out? He tied against Tito Ortiz(not even a top 10 LHW, maybe not top 15), he won a super close decision to Bisping(not a 1st tier MW). He was losing to Liddell before KTFO him, he was also losing to Griffin before finishing him. Do you think that he had just a great run of luck and will go back to being a 2nd-3rd tier LHW, or do you think he is a elite LHW?

Sorry bro, but Rashad has never been lucky or overrated. The Tito tie is weird one, because Tito grabbed the cage so many times in that second round to give himself the edge. Who knows what would've happened if Tito didn't commit those fouls? The Bisping fight was atrocious, but Rashad didn't look himself that fight. He gassed early, and Rashad isn't the type to have bad cardio. The Chuck fight is the biggest myth about Rashad. Rashad wasn't losing the fight, and then just hit a haymaker. He baited Chuck the whole time, didn't do much in the first round, and dominated the second. The only reason why Chuck won the first round was because he was aggressive while Rashad timed him, the whole second round Rashad controlled on the feet by winning those exchanges. Rashad had trouble to Forrest in the first, but I actually think he won that second round. His strikes were more effective that round. It could go either way, but I give the edge to Rashad based on the fact that he wasn't phased by Forrest's strikes while getting more powerful strikes in. The third round was all his. I'm not being biased when I say this, but Rashad is the number two guy hands down. Even last night he looked better than most guys at 205. He was so damn quick on his feet! It sounds crazy since Lyoto got him good, but Lyoto is just that damn good. Anyone else that Lyoto fights would look worse than that if Lyoto chooses to be the aggressor. Rampage is a really good fighter, but his footwork is not quick enough to keep up with Lyoto. He would get tripped and mounted easily. Shogun? Pfft! He keeps his arms and base too open to straight punches. Liddell caught him good more than a few times, and Lyoto or Rashad would've made Shogun pay for coming inside. Jardine would have a surprising chance against Lyoto, since his kicks could keep Lyoto from going full out like he did against Rashad. Still, Lyoto could play the point game while waiting to get close to Jardine's kryptonite in his chin. Who else at 205 is there? Wanderlei Silva? Even though his fans are some of the most delusional in the world, he would'nt even beat some middle of the road guys at 205. Jon Jones? In a few years his length and speed could give Lyoto fits. You're talking about a guy who has the same size as a massive light heavyweight like Forrest and Bonnar, who has the speed of someone lighter. If Lyoto is still king in two years, Jon Jones may end up being his toughest test to date. But right now Jones is way too green for Machida. If someone is going to beat Machida it's going to have to be by a lucky punch, or a helluva game plan. I still think the best guy to do it is Rashad. He played a good game early, but he didn't give Lyoto anything to think about when he came forward. Maybe if Rashad threw more kicks inside, and went for more take downs, the fight might have lasted longer.

[UKfan]

It still amazes me how little respect Bisping gets, oh well, we'll see come the Hendo fight.

[josh07039]

No way Rashad won round two against Griffin, that is nonsense. Griffin dominated him for the both of the first two rounds with sharp leg kicks.

As for your analysis of the Liddell fight, I think it falls somewhere between your view and the other one expressed. In round 1, Rashad was probably biding his time, waiting for a mistake, and timing Liddell. However, while doing that, Liddell was busier and easily won the first round. Liddell got caught in the second. Is it because Rashad waited for the mistake and had quicker hands? Yes. You can't give say a guy didn't lose a round because he was planning stuff for later.

I think in terms of Rashad's status in the LHW division.
Machida- owned his ass

I still believe Forrest could beat him if given another shot. He slipped while attempting a kick and then Rashad pounded him out on the ground, but before that point he was dominating with his reach advantage and leg kicks. I think the size advantage and Forrest's leg kicks would to slow Rashad down as the fight went on and Griffin would win a unanimous decison.

I would probably take Rampage against Evans because Rampage could bully him with his size advantage and he Rampage also has a really good chin. Additionally, If Rashad decided to start trying to take his down, Rampage has good takedown D and great brute strength to get back up. Rampage might struggle because he doesn't do much but punch. However, In his fight with Jardine he showed a willingness to shoot for a takedown. Despite the constant talk about Rashad's wrestling pedigree, people forget that Rampage is a good wrestler too.

I think Rashad defeats Shogun, even if Shogun is back. Shogun leaves himself open when he is swinging wildly and with Rashad's great hand speed, he would have a good chance at knocking him out.

If Rich Fraklin starts making waves in the divison, he would be an interesting matchup. Franklin is a very well rounded fighter and would enjoy a reach advantage against rashad. However, I think Rashad would beat him with his speed and athleticism, possibly taking him down and pounding him out.

After those guys, I would say Jardine would be an interesting fight, but that aint happening.

[ccB]

Has Rashad luck run out? He tied against Tito Ortiz(not even a top 10 LHW, maybe not top 15), he won a super close decision to Bisping(not a 1st tier MW). He was losing to Liddell before KTFO him, he was also losing to Griffin before finishing him. Do you think that he had just a great run of luck and will go back to being a 2nd-3rd tier LHW, or do you think he is a elite LHW?

I think you are underrating Tito a bit, he's a douche but he was ranked in the bottom portions of the top 10 when he fought Rashad.

I think as of know Rashad is still a top tier LHW, his next fight will be the determine whether he stays there or not. With that said, I think if Rashad fought Machida 10 times, Machida would win 10/10. I just don't see a way he could conceivably beat Machida. It is almost like a Rich Franklin/Anderson Silva scenario, Rich was the clear cut #2 guy at MW but he had no answer for Silva. I think that is the case with Evans/Machida right now.

[ccB]

It still amazes me how little respect Bisping gets, oh well, we'll see come the Hendo fight.

It's because of the competition he's faced, I personally think he has the potential to be a top tier MW and if Anderson stays at LHW I could see Bisping being a champion one day. Right now I am leaning towards picking Hendo over Bisping, but it won't be a cake walk, Bisping is one of the most well rounded fighters in the MW division.

[UKfan]

From what I understand Bisping has been concentrating heavily on his wrestling for the Hendo fight which is encouraging, if he can keep it standing that fight gets a lot closer to 50/50, realistically I think Hendo takes it, but Bisping gets no respect at all...

[ccB]

From what I understand Bisping has been concentrating heavily on his wrestling for the Hendo fight which is encouraging, if he can keep it standing that fight gets a lot closer to 50/50, realistically I think Hendo takes it, but Bisping gets no respect at all...

If it turns into a stand up war I think Bisping has the advantage. Sure Hendo has that huge overhand right, but Bisping is clearly a more technically advanced striker. If Hendo doesn't get Bisping to the mat I think he will lose the fight. I think a lot of people do not give Bisping respect because he came from TUF and because of his abrasive personality. I personally love the guy and think he is extremely talented.

[E-Man]

Now that I think about it, Jardine is the man that would beat Machida........if he fights him now. Jardine wins after a loss, an loses after he wins. He just lost, so if he fought Machida next the powers of Jardine would make him pull out the upset. Jardine is the most dangerous man to face now. lol

[MaxV]

I think you guys are underestimating Shogun. I think he has what it takes to challenge Machida.

[Ravens1991]

how would Shogun beat Machida?

[fenikz]

how would Shogun beat Machida?

shogun can beat anyone in many ways

[MaxV]

how would Shogun beat Machida?

Dude, are you serious? A guy with that kind of quickness, power and technique has a chance against anyone.

Just because Shogun hasn't looked his best lately doesn't mean he's finished. He can still regain his old form. And do you not remember what this guy was in Pride?

I'm a big fan of Machida, but he can be beat.

[Rob S]

I am a huge Shogun fan, he is my favorite fighter, but Machida eats up strikers. I would never count Shogun out, but I think Machida is a terrible style matchup for him. Final Conflict 2005 Shogun can beat anyone tho.

I am going to go watch his fight with Lil Nog right now actually now that I am thinking about it.

[ccB]

Dude, are you serious? A guy with that kind of quickness, power and technique has a chance against anyone.

Just because Shogun hasn't looked his best lately doesn't mean he's finished. He can still regain his old form. And do you not remember what this guy was in Pride?

I'm a big fan of Machida, but he can be beat.

I am a big fan of Shogun, but I don't see him fairing much better against Machida than Rashad did. The only way you'll see the "Old Shogun" is if he goes back to Japan where they will turn their heads so he can start juicing again. Not saying he's not a good fighter anymore, but he will never have that explosion that he had in pride again, he's a different fighter now. I really don't see him fairing any better against Machida than Evans did. To me a Shogun v Machida fight would be very similar to the Thiago Silva v Machida fight, and we all know how well that went for Silva. I am not saying he doesn't have any chance, because it's MMA everyone has a chance, but I think his chances would be very slim.

[Ravens1991]

yea I dont see how Shogun would be quick enough to even get a strike. I mean he could wait til Lyoto thinks he is hurt and when Lyoto comes in to finish he just swings for the fences

[ccB]

yea I dont see how Shogun would be quick enough to even get a strike. I mean he could wait til Lyoto thinks he is hurt and when Lyoto comes in to finish he just swings for the fences

Shogun COULD knock out Machida if he got a clean shot on him, but I really can't see a way Machida would let Shogun get that shot in. Shogun would have to get Machida in the Thai clinch and knee the living hell out of him, but I really don't see Machida letting him get close enough to do that.

[Ravens1991]

true, I really dont know how you beat Machida. You could get rocked, and when Machida comes in you hope you can catch him. Yes that would be a dumb style for a fight but IDK what else could work

[MetSox17]

Can anyone send me or post a link to where i can see yesterday night's fights? I'm trying everything on google and i can't find anything useful.

[Donno]

http://www.mmalinker.com/fighter/Rashad-Evans/MR/1/0/21/15964/i/Lyoto_Machida_vs_Rashad_Evans.html

[UKfan]

OK, so I am now online on XBL, 3-0 so far in "Player Match" mode, but haven't fought a ranked match, if anyone fancies a fight or two, add my GT Bunj1986.

[Caddy]

OK, so I am now online on XBL, 3-0 so far in "Player Match" mode, but haven't fought a ranked match, if anyone fancies a fight or two, add my GT Bunj1986.

I've found it incredibly laggy and in ranked matches people constantly leave once they are being submitted or knocked out.

[UKfan]

I haven't had a d/c so far, went 3-0 in "Player Match" and 1-1 in Ranked matches, I have read lots of people are d/c though

[ccB]

I started off 11-5 in ranked matches but I'm on a 4 fight losing streak.

[Ravens1991]

one thing I dont like about the game is that it is a button masher.

[trkaline]

I want to say the only way you beat Machida is by shooting him, but I'm not so sure he wouldn't dodge the bullets.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

one thing I dont like about the game is that it is a button masher.


Yeah I found that Frank Mir is so difficult to beat but so easy to win with when I'm playing with my buddies. None of the HW's really can stop his submissions and they gave him incredible striking. Personally I hate being non Muy Thai guys who don't have high head kicks. It's too hard to play with guys like Leben or Serra who are hard to take down people and have short armed hooks.

[Ravens1991]

I agree I was playing my friend yesterday and he was Anderson Silva, I was wanderlie. He just was doing body kicks the whole time. It was dumb. Also you cant throw strikes as the same time as the other guy. There are classic UFC photos of Wand VS. Chuck both getting tagged w/ a big right at the same time. You cant do that in the game so I am just eating body kicks. I was getting so pissed off.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

The game in general is very good considering all of the different aspects of MMA. I think it could stand to be a little more fluid but still comparing it to the old UFC games on dreamcast in which matches lasted 10 seconds, I'm happy with the game. One thing I don't like is if you are damaged and the screen goes black and white meaning one more hit will knock you out, all you have to do is shoot and your guy will regain his composure. I was playing my buddy and I got him into that screen like 5 times and he kept shooting every time to save himself. I'm also not sure if you can knee someone when they try to shoot in on you, I've tried but it just goes over his head.

[UKfan]

The game in general is very good considering all of the different aspects of MMA. I think it could stand to be a little more fluid but still comparing it to the old UFC games on dreamcast in which matches lasted 10 seconds, I'm happy with the game. One thing I don't like is if you are damaged and the screen goes black and white meaning one more hit will knock you out, all you have to do is shoot and your guy will regain his composure. I was playing my buddy and I got him into that screen like 5 times and he kept shooting every time to save himself. I'm also not sure if you can knee someone when they try to shoot in on you, I've tried but it just goes over his head.

You can, if you have got to the 3rd MT levels in career mode it tells you how to in the task list there, I believe it is LT+a and LT+b that hits a knee prior to takedown attempt.

[Ravens1991]

how do you increase your levels? I never knew about that. Is it just by winning fights or is it by increasing your points through sparring?

[Dr. Gonzo]

how do you increase your levels? I never knew about that. Is it just by winning fights or is it by increasing your points through sparring?

There are training camps assigned to fighters in career mode. There are tasks that are worth points and you level when you complete enough tasks and get enough points.

[E-Man]

I totally forgot about the Super Hulk tournament tonight. It's probably going to be shameful, but I have this curiosity about it to at least watch the thing on a stream. I see Mousassi walking away the winner, and Canseco embarrassing himself tonight. After Canseco gets brutally beat down, stupid ESPN and boxing "analysts" will talk about how barbaric "Ultimate Fighting" is, and I'll be happy that I stopped watching ESPN to notice or care.

[Rob S]

I totally forgot about the Super Hulk tournament tonight. It's probably going to be shameful, but I have this curiosity about it to at least watch the thing on a stream. I see Mousassi walking away the winner, and Canseco embarrassing himself tonight. After Canseco gets brutally beat down, stupid ESPN and boxing "analysts" will talk about how barbaric "Ultimate Fighting" is, and I'll be happy that I stopped watching ESPN to notice or care.

Its a damn good card on top of that tourney as well, worth a watch for sure. JZ vs Kawajiri reeks of awesomeness.

[Ravens1991]

yes I wish we could get some of those fighters into the UFC, they will make exciting fights. Kawijiri,Melendez,JZ,Itsushia,Sakurai would all be great additions

[Rob S]

btw, can anyone validate that its going to be on MMA TV?

[Ravens1991]

There are training camps assigned to fighters in career mode. There are tasks that are worth points and you level when you complete enough tasks and get enough points.

o so when you can pick your training camp you can improve it there. I always spar and just pick team quest. How do you go see the tasks to improve?

[E-Man]

Its a damn good card on top of that tourney as well, worth a watch for sure. JZ vs Kawajiri reeks of awesomeness.

You got that right. Kid's coming back, and we get to see Jacare again.

[Ravens1991]

Poor Joe Warren. The guy is real talented, he would could have been a gold medalist if he wasnt caught smoking bud. He is extremly undersized (he wrestled at 121 pounds w/ 24 hour weigh ins.) He is going to die against Kid.

[UKfan]

o so when you can pick your training camp you can improve it there. I always spar and just pick team quest. How do you go see the tasks to improve?

When you pick the team (and 1 of the 2 people) you should see a date, when you get to that date, there will be an octagon symbol on your calendar and that's the week of your camp invite, on that week go to action instead of spar or train and you will go to the camp and be given some tasks to complete in a sparring session, each task being 10 pts, 7 tasks per session, after you get to 150pts, you level up and get new skills, eg for BJJ you get the rubber guard at lvl 2 etc...

Hope that helps.

[Ravens1991]

Who can take Lyoto???? Place your thoughts.

I think Soko can, hopefully he gets his act together. He is amazingly talented. He took Lyoto down twice in the 1st round of there fight but got swept immediately(still a great feat taking Lyoto down). I dont think he did a lot of training off his back because you could see it in his face he lookedl like he didnt know what to do. he was able to hit Lyoto more then anyone else has in the octagon(still not a lot). I wish he was still in the UFC, his natural ability makes a lot of interesting fights. In a couple of years he can be a champ, but there is a chance he wont get it together, his conditioning and his BJJ have looked pathetic, while his striking, takedowns and takedown defense have looked fabulous. I hope he gets his act together he is the most talented guy at 205 IMO.

So who do you think can take Lyoto?

[MaxV]

Well, the most obvious answer is Anderson Silva, although Machida is a VERY difficult matchup for Silva.

[Ravens1991]

they will never fight, so excluding Anderson.

[Rob S]

I'm calling a Rampage win right now.

I still make Lyoto the favorite against anybody, but I see Page doing it.

[MaxV]

they will never fight, so excluding Anderson.

Why do you assume that? Silva could easily move up in weight.

There is NO WAY in hell Anderson Silva is a natural MW.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

Why do you assume that? Silva could easily move up in weight.

There is NO WAY in hell Anderson Silva is a natural MW.

Well it depends on if he has aspirations in dedicating himself to become the 205 champ, or if he's content with dabbling with a few 205ers and defending his 185 belt until his contract is expired and he can retire.

[Ravens1991]

they are like best friends, they are training partners and Silva said he would never fight Lyoto

[MaxV]

they are like best friends, they are training partners and Silva said he would never fight Lyoto

Oh, ok, that works. :)

[Ravens1991]

yea lol, I know Henderson and Rampage fought as real good friends but Brazilians seem to take there friendship more seriously, unless its BTT VS. Chute Box

[MaxV]

Well, they could have an argument over a girl or something..... :)

Never say never.

[E-Man]

I think Machida will have to be taken out by a long reach guy, or an incredibly quick guy.Forrest could give him some problems, and pull out the win with a real good game plan. I'd still favor Machida to get some sweeps in though. Jon Jones is way too green for Lyoto right now, but in 2 years or more he'd be a real threat. His speed and strength is incredible, and I can't wait to see if he'll apply the full package to it.

Rampage has a shot with his great chin and power, but Lyoto would run circles around him. Rampage also is an emotional fighter. If he gets frustrated he'll start looking for that big knockout too much, leaving him wide open for counters. He also doesn't check low kicks. He can really threaten Machida with his hooks. He's got 5 rounds to get that big knockout. Even if he's getting outstruck and outpointed before hand, Rampage can get that one devastating blow that gives him the belt. It's unlikely though.

Rashad has lightning fast quickness and footwork, and he can still give Machida trouble. One thing I saw Saturday in between the only rounds was Greg Jackson and Rashad very confident about something. I think they were wanting to time Lyoto, but Lyoto did the reverse. Greg Jackson is taking way too much heat for losing to a guy who looks unstoppable. He really wants another shot, and with his pedigree you wonder if he could work out a win. I'd favor Lyoto though, the guy fought really close to perfection Saturday.

Shogun, Shogun, Shogun. His quickness on his feet, and variation of his strikes could cause some damage to Lyoto. While he's not as quick as Rashad, Shogun would certainly give Lyoto more to think about than quick jabs and straights. He'd throw a ton of kicks and takedowns in the mix, but he'll still leave himself open. If he gets tagged like he did many times against Chuck, he'll get knocked out very early. His takedown defense is still below average too. Shogun offers an exciting fight, but Lyoto once again is too good.

Jardine? He takes weird angles like Lyoto, is very unpredictable, and his kicks can hurt any man. If he gets some body and leg kicks in early, he can really wear down Lyoto. Jardine's chin is his kryptonite though. If Jardine had a better chin, he might be champ now. Lyoto can get him a few times if he's not careful. I'd favor Lyoto for his patience. When you make a mistake against Lyoto, he capitalizes more than any other fighter.

Luiz Cane is a wild card, because that guy must not know what pain is. He's a little like Rampage, he takes hits and doesn't even get phased by them. If he offered some more with his strikes, then he could have a real chance. Lyoto is just the better fighter though,and Cane isn't ready for a guy like that.

Anderson Silva will never fight Lyoto since they train together. Just for the fun of it though, I'd love to imagine it. Anderson would beat Lyoto, and he'd do it handily. People don't realize how good Anderson is. The guy literally has only two minor weaknesses, and those two are extremely minor. You can out wrestle him, but he's worked on his take down defense to the point to where it's really hard to take him down. Then the other weakness isn't really a weakness at all. It's just that there are better BJJ guys than him on the ground, and they're all well respected black belts. Hell Anderson himself is a pretty damn good black belt himself. On the feet, there's no one better in all of MMA right now. Anderson doesn't take many hits, and he's so damn accurate with his strikes. If he fought Lyoto, his reach, speed, footwork, and power would shut Lyoto down. Machida's karate might be hard to penetrate, but Anderson's Muay Thai will kill you if he wants it to. I don't care what people say, Anderson is the best fighter there is in MMA. The guy is textbook at everything!

Sub Zero. He can freeze Machida with his ice ball, and Lyoto won't escape his sliding technique. Sub Zero is the greatest fighter of all time. He defeated Bruce Lee, Chuck Norris, Batman, Master Chief, M. Bison, Fedor(Fedor's only real loss), and Buddha in a single tournament. When I go to bed at night, I ask God to spare me from Sub Zero, sine Sub Zero is the only unbeatable fighter there is. In fact I'm so scared of him that I have to post a pic of him in tribute. Oh mighty Sub Zero, please spare us from your amazingly unbeatable wrath!

http://i244.photobucket.com/albums/gg33/y23155/Sub-Zero.jpg

[fenikz]

Anyone else watching Dream?

[UKfan]

My super crazy thought for the day, Houston Alexander. Just cos dude is reckless as hell and swings for the fences. We all know he sucks otherwise, but I'd give him a punchers chance lol.

[fenikz]

Machida vs Lesnar who do you got?

[UKfan]

Machida Ftmfew!!

[E-Man]

Anyone else watching Dream?

Yeah I am now, and this last fight needs to hurry up. I'm seriously about to fall out of my chair. I'm so sleepy right now.

[E-Man]

WTF? I stayed up until 8:30 in the morning for it to end like this? This smoke monkey testicles.

[UKfan]

The other thing they need to sort about Undisputed is the matchups online, like, this my third ranked match, and they put me in with a Lvl 56 guy.

Ugh, I had a guy who was 56-14 mounted with Machida against Rampage, he kept on trying to roll to his back and I was countering so his stamina was way down, went for the triangle and he d/c, ffs! 2-2 in ranked now.

[SuperKevin]

Jose Canseco lost his MMA debut to that giant Korean guy in 77 seconds yesterday. Sad.

[Ravens1991]

Well that Korean guy is a world class kick boxer, he is no can.



But how about Joe Warren taking Kid, I am shocked.

[MetSox17]

Noob question, but how in the hell am i supposed to sprawl against a takedown attempt?

I have pretty solid standup but when i go up against wrestlers they seem to have their way with their takedowns.

[E-Man]

I was scared that they were gonna give it to Kid, but Warren deserved to win that fight. Sure all the Japanophiles will tell you that he didn't do anything to win that fight, but it's not like Kid mysteriously winded up on his back. If a guy wants to put you on the ground and succeeds, then that should go in his favor for controlling you. Warren also had a seriously sick chin. Kid tagged him with some real good shots, and he just kept coming. The dude is a future star for certain.

[UKfan]

Noob question, but how in the hell am i supposed to sprawl against a takedown attempt?

I have pretty solid standup but when i go up against wrestlers they seem to have their way with their takedowns.

Twirl the right stick quickly, like you would for a sub.

[Ravens1991]

I was scared that they were gonna give it to Kid, but Warren deserved to win that fight. Sure all the Japanophiles will tell you that he didn't do anything to win that fight, but it's not like Kid mysteriously winded up on his back. If a guy wants to put you on the ground and succeeds, then that should go in his favor for controlling you. Warren also had a seriously sick chin. Kid tagged him with some real good shots, and he just kept coming. The dude is a future star for certain.


I agree I know LnP sucks, but I hate when someone says takedowns shouldnt be worth points, you should get points for imposing your will against someone and putting the fight where you want to go.

[E-Man]

Anyone else see what Sokoudjou did? I used to root for the guy, but I really want him to get his ass whupped now. That's basically the worst line in MMA to cross. It's not like he's fighting in the street.

[ccB]

I agree I know LnP sucks, but I hate when someone says takedowns shouldnt be worth points, you should get points for imposing your will against someone and putting the fight where you want to go.

Well technically in japan Takedowns aren't worth points. They have a different judging system. I really think the US Judging criteria needs to be fixed. If you repeatedly take someone down without doing any damage from the position you gain you shouldn't be rewarded for it. Matt Hughes for example did absolutely nothing with his dominant position against Matt Serra. In Japan Matt Serra would of won that fight.

Joe Warren deserved the win over Kid because he damaged Kid from that dominant position, Kid was busted up after the fight. The fight was judged closer than it would be in America where Warren would of been awarded an easy decision, because in Japan trying to finish the fight is a big part of the judging, and Kid arguably tried to finish the fight more than Warren did. But Warren's aggression edged out Kid's attempts to finish the fight. The right man won that fight.

[ccB]

Anyone else see what Sokoudjou did? I used to root for the guy, but I really want him to get his ass whupped now. That's basically the worst line in MMA to cross. It's not like he's fighting in the street.

I think he did that in an attempt to turn "heel" to the Japanese audience and thus give him more options from a marketing stand point. Japanese crowds love to root against someone, Yoshiro Akiyama because a huge draw in Japan because all the Japanese fan's wanted to see him get his ass kicked.

[fenikz]

I much prefer Japan's judging system, it makes for more exciting fights and UFC has always overvalued take downs

[ccB]

I much prefer Japan's judging system, it makes for more exciting fights and UFC has always overvalued take downs

Me too, the American rules are making it so that MMA is dominated by Wrestlers, where as in Japan every style is on a level playing field.

[Rob S]

yellow cards ftw!

[E-Man]

I think that there are benefits to both the Japanese and Western scoring system.

The Japanese system is good to have fighters work. It also helps that judging the whole fight in it's entirety for those times to where a fighter fights not to lose. I don't think it's good not to score takedowns though. If you want the fight on the ground and you take it there, it should be counted in your favor. The best thing about Japanese scoring though is their knowledge of grappling. If a guy is on the bottom being very active, then it won't go against him. Pulling guard wouldn't hurt a fighter, and it can be a real good place for submission experts to work.

The Western scoring system is really good for something linear. With the Japanese scoring, there's too much room for interpretation as to which part of the fight mattered more. If a guy comes out dominating in the first two rounds, gases, and then get's dominated and nearly KOed the third round, who wins? Is it the guy who got closer to finishing late in the third, or is it the guy who thoroughly picked apart his opponent for most of the fight? With the Western scoring system there's no question as to who would win that particular fight. The West does overvalue takedowns like y'all have mentioned. Takedowns are good, but if a guy is being more active while you're laying there hoping not to get subbed or knocked out he should get the edge.

If there was a way to blend both systems I'd be all for it. Of course the best system of all time was the old UFC's that had no rules. lol I'm not saying that MMA should go back to that. I'm just saying that system always had a clear cut winner. They also had the funniest haircuts and stances back then. Who could ever forget guys like old Harold Howard? lol

[FuzzyGopher]

Does this thread include the ultimate fighter show? If so, what a candy ass Falkner was in that last episode. I would be flipping my **** if I was his coach, I don't get the guys that go on this show with no heart.

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

Does this thread include the ultimate fighter show? If so, what a candy ass Falkner was in that last episode. I would be flipping my **** if I was his coach, I don't get the guys that go on this show with no heart.

Yea that dude Frank showed heart but he is not a good fighter.

[Hines]

Played the game last night and tonight. Last night I was pretty good, but tonight I sucked balls. Sick game. I am going to have to save my money to buy the game.

[josh07039]

Yea that dude Frank showed heart but he is not a good fighter.I think he just realized that he had nothing left. However, him quiting shows that he probably doesn't have the heart of a fighter. Lester came in battered after fighting recently but still gave it his all. With that said, Lester did look a little gunshy after losing his teeth so brutally in his last fight. Lester has heart, but doesn't seem to have the skill to go along with it.

[E-Man]

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/evans-rampage-to-coach-tuf-10-17675

Rampage and Rashad coaching TUF? What? Shogun may get a title shot? What? Weird news to me.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/evans-rampage-to-coach-tuf-10-17675

Rampage and Rashad coaching TUF? What? Shogun may get a title shot? What? Weird news to me.

Hmm strange, although HW's on TUF is gonna be great. Damn I guess Shogun and Wanderlei have the next shot which I don't agree with. The Jardine Silva match wouldn't make sense as a #1 contender match as Jardine just lost to Rampage and Silva to Lyoto.

[josh07039]

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/evans-rampage-to-coach-tuf-10-17675

Rampage and Rashad coaching TUF? What? Shogun may get a title shot? What? Weird news to me.Im not shocked about the TUF coaching because just from a logistical standpoint, having a guy with limited English skills would make it difficult to coach. However, Shogun getting a title shot is wholly undeserved. He beat Coleman in absolutley pitiful fashion and beat Chuck Liddell on his last legs. And even with the Liddell fight, on the knockout punch, the only thing that saved shogun was Chuck's slower hands because Shogun dropped his other hand while swinging wildly and just beat chuck with superior hand speed. I'd rather put the belt on hold for a little while than have an undeserving guy fight for it. Forrest coming off a loss would be more deserving because of his superior level of competition recently and even then it is an undeserving fighter.

[Ravens1991]

what did Sokojduo do?


Also maybe its because i am a wrestler, but if a guy gets a ton of takedowns and the bottom man doesnt do anything the wrestler should win. But if the bottom man is attempting sweeps and submissions the bottom man should win.

[comahan]

what did Sokojduo do?


Also maybe its because i am a wrestler, but if a guy gets a ton of takedowns and the bottom man doesnt do anything the wrestler should win. But if the bottom man is attempting sweeps and submissions the bottom man should win.

Kept punching the guy when the ref stepped in, just punching around the ref. He got like 93 extra shots in, it was terrific.

[josh07039]

what did Sokojduo do?


Also maybe its because i am a wrestler, but if a guy gets a ton of takedowns and the bottom man doesnt do anything the wrestler should win. But if the bottom man is attempting sweeps and submissions the bottom man should win.He was pounding a guy on the ground, the ref stopped the fight and he kept going for a little while.

As for being on the ground, I agree that just physically dominating a guy on the ground, even if you don't inflict much damage, is enough to win a fight. With the stand ups, you can't just be incredibly boring and use your weight to lay on a guy, you need to do enough to keep it on the ground.

I will say that I believe that the stand up rule, from a competitive stand point, is nonsense. I think if you can lay on a guy and keep him down then you should win. However, MMA is a business and as a spectator I want excitement like everyone else.

[fenikz]

This isn't wrestling, you aren't supposed to try winning by points

[E-Man]

It just shocks me how Rampage wanted the title back so bad, and now he isn't fighting for it when he's the clear cut number one guy. What went wrong here? Some people say he's ducking Lyoto, but how do we know that he couldn't back out of coaching TUF? Maybe he is ducking Machida, but we really don't know all the details. We just know that he was set to face the winner of Rashad/Lyoto, and now he's facing the loser in Rashad. Shogun doesn't deserve a shot, but from a marketing standpoint he is the best they can get. His knockout over Chuck should have given him some exposure to fans, so he wouldn't be a complete unknown like Luiz Cane(who I would put ahead of Shogun in line). In terms of octagon achievements, Cane is the top guy that's free right now. Jardine just lost to Rampage, Shogun hasn't done enough in the UFC yet, Vera hasn't done enough at 205 yet, and everyone else that is a possible contender is already penciled for future fights.

It also creates an interesting position for the UFC if Rashad beats Rampage, and Lyoto beats Shogun. Do you give Rashad a title shot so soon against a guy that beat him? Or if Forrest wins do you give it to a guy that shouldn't be higher than Rashad due to Rashad beating him, and both being 1-0 since their encounter? Do you put the 205 title on hold? Do you have a freakshow match with the heavyweight champ? Since Forrest would beat Anderson in this scenario, any fantasy fight with Anderson and Lyoto loses luster.

[josh07039]

I think Rampage's decision is two fold. Firstly, he seems to really dislike Rashad. Secondly, his recent comments regarding being a more well rounded fighter. While Rashad is by no means easy competition, because of how ridiculous Machida is, Rashad is a tune up fight to incorporate new things into his game.

Also, if Forrest beats Silva, Rashad beats Rampage, and Machida retains, I think that Forrest would deservedly get the next title shot. Just because Rashad beat him, doesn't mean he is forever ahead of him on the totem pole unless they have a rematch. Also, it wasn't like Rashad dominated him. Forrest won the first two rounds and then got caught in the third. Forrest would be beating the pound for pound king who has never been beaten in the UFC. Not only would that prove him to be deserving of the title shot, but it would be a good story line(Solving the puzzle that is Anderson Silva and he will attempt to solve Machida next).

Meanwhile, Rashad would be coming off a victory against impressive competition, but Rampage doesn't have the same unbeatable persona as Silva and Machida have. Rampage is tough, but it isn't like he has a style like Machida or Silva that people find impossible to beat.

This whole scenario is based on a lot of ifs, and the only one that seems to be very probable is Machida's victory. The other two fights could easily go either way. In fact, I would say that Rampage and Silva will be the favorites. Silva has never been beaten, and Rashad is coming off his first loss.

[LTgiants]

just got undisputed anyone want to play?

[UKfan]

For the next Undisputed, they have to do something about the d/c issue, it's ******* ridiculous! I had a guy beat with a flying armbar and he d/c after the tap, stupid. Really turns you off from playing online IMO.

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

What is d/c??

[fenikz]

disconnect

[comahan]

I havent done any random online fights. Ive just fought CCB, DJP, and Fenikz a combined 800 or so times. Zero disconnections! Although, Fenikz's controller did die in the middle of one fight.

[UKfan]

Hmmm, I should stick to fighting you guys, I haven't had 1 yet with an SWDCer.

[Rob S]

I think you are all misinterpreting the Japanese scoring system.

It does reward takedowns, just not as much. They actually have an order of stuff to look for in a fight and it is (in order of importance):

1. the effort made to finish the fight via KO or submission,
2. damage given to the opponent,
3. standing combinations and ground control,
4. takedowns and takedown defense,
5. aggressiveness, and
6. weight (in the case that the weight difference is 10 kg/22 lb or more).

I feel that takedowns placed about right.....and if the man who got the takedown lands effective blows/goes for submission he gets the credit. But if the bottom man is doing the work, he wins. It makes perfect sense to me.

[josh07039]

I think you are all misinterpreting the Japanese scoring system.

It does reward takedowns, just not as much. They actually have an order of stuff to look for in a fight and it is (in order of importance):

1. the effort made to finish the fight via KO or submission,
2. damage given to the opponent,
3. standing combinations and ground control,
4. takedowns and takedown defense,
5. aggressiveness, and
6. weight (in the case that the weight difference is 10 kg/22 lb or more).

I feel that takedowns placed about right.....and if the man who got the takedown lands effective blows/goes for submission he gets the credit. But if the bottom man is doing the work, he wins. It makes perfect sense to me.Earlier I wasn't referring to scoring takedowns, I was referring to being on the ground and being forced to stand up. I recognize the excitement factor and I like watching stand up battles. I just feel that from a sporting standpoint, being able to keep a guy down, even if you aren't doing much damage, you should be allowed to. However, I recognize that isn't feasible and I probably wouldn't want that as a fan anyhow.

The scoring system makes sense and places things in the correct order, I was just talking about my opinion.

[fenikz]

i also have undisputed my xbox live name is fenikz602 (i cant believe fenikz was taken)

[Rob S]

Earlier I wasn't referring to scoring takedowns, I was referring to being on the ground and being forced to stand up. I recognize the excitement factor and I like watching stand up battles. I just feel that from a sporting standpoint, being able to keep a guy down, even if you aren't doing much damage, you should be allowed to. However, I recognize that isn't feasible and I probably wouldn't want that as a fan anyhow.

The scoring system makes sense and places things in the correct order, I was just talking about my opinion.

meh......if guys are working on the ground it stays there. Thats cool, I get it and love watching ground game. But when a guy is just holding someone down while mounting no offense, they should be stood up. It is akin to a clinch in boxing. Just because someone may be strong enough to hold someone for an entire fight, should they be able to do it, no, it goes against the integrity of the sport. I think that is the same case in MMA as well. Takedowns have a place (just like a clinch in boxing), but the main goal of the take down should be its use to facilitate doing more damage to your opponent , not to lay and pray a decision.

[josh07039]

meh......if guys are working on the ground it stays there. Thats cool, I get it and love watching ground game. But when a guy is just holding someone down while mounting no offense, they should be stood up. It is akin to a clinch in boxing. Just because someone may be strong enough to hold someone for an entire fight, should they be able to do it, no, it goes against the integrity of the sport. I think that is the same case in MMA as well. Takedowns have a place (just like a clinch in boxing), but the main goal of the take down should be its use to facilitate doing more damage to your opponent , not to lay and pray a decision. I think the comparison to the clinch in boxing is different, because clinching is used to stop boxing. Using wrestling to overwhelm an opponent is part of mma. I don't think no action should be acceptable, but sometimes a guy will be throwing body shots and not doing much damage or be trying to improve position but not doing it very effectively and it is brought up. I think both of those circumstances are boring but are part of the sport. Sometimes a wrestler can keep a guy down and not do much damage or improve his position because the guy on the bottom has a good game off the back.

[Rob S]

I think the comparison to the clinch in boxing is different, because clinching is used to stop boxing. Using wrestling to overwhelm an opponent is part of mma. I don't think no action should be acceptable, but sometimes a guy will be throwing body shots and not doing much damage or be trying to improve position but not doing it very effectively and it is brought up. I think both of those circumstances are boring but are part of the sport. Sometimes a wrestler can keep a guy down and not do much damage or improve his position because the guy on the bottom has a good game off the back.

It is a different comparison only when the TD is used in a way to mount an attack isnt it? A clinch effectively stops the action of a fight. Using a TD to stop the action of a fight (L&P) or even to put the fight in a situation where nothing major will occur, in the case of the body shots you mentioned, does roughly the same thing. Not to the same extreme of course because the ground is a fighting medium in MMA, while the clinch game isnt in boxing. However, a TD can be used, and often is used, the same way as a clinch.

The bolded part is why I love the Japanese system. We give the guy credit for the TD, but if he is being controlled by the guy on the bottom that ground control should supersede the TD in judging imo. The main thinking would be, sure you got the TD, but the guy is imposing his will on you anyway so you got nothing out of it and therefore he is winning the fight because he is in control.

[josh07039]

It is a different comparison only when the TD is used in a way to mount an attack isnt it? A clinch effectively stops the action of a fight. Using a TD to stop the action of a fight (L&P) or even to put the fight in a situation where nothing major will occur, in the case of the body shots you mentioned, does roughly the same thing. Not to the same extreme of course because the ground is a fighting medium in MMA, while the clinch game isnt in boxing. However, a TD can be used, and often is used, the same way as a clinch.

The bolded part is why I love the Japanese system. We give the guy credit for the TD, but if he is being controlled by the guy on the bottom that ground control should supersede the TD in judging imo. The main thinking would be, sure you got the TD, but the guy is imposing his will on you anyway so you got nothing out of it and therefore he is winning the fight because he is in control.We are basically agreeing for the most part, I am just offering a bit of a devils advocate. I don't like LnP and I agree that if you can control a guy from the bottom then you should be awarded points even if your opponent was awarded points for a takedown.

Basically, I just think that sometimes the ref is too quick to stand guys up on when they are on the ground if someone isn't absolutley mauling the other guy or obviously working a submission.

This is slightly related because of ref influence, but I was watching the Nover Bradley fight today and Joe Rogan said that there needs to be a rule that allows a fight to restart if the ref makes a mistake. What are everyone's views on that? I think that it makes sense to have that, but it needs to be like a reversed call in football or baseball where there is incontrovertible proof that the stoppage was bad and the decision needs to be made in a very short time period to not allow a fighter to recover too much.

[Rob S]

We are basically agreeing for the most part, I am just offering a bit of a devils advocate. I don't like LnP and I agree that if you can control a guy from the bottom then you should be awarded points even if your opponent was awarded points for a takedown.

Basically, I just think that sometimes the ref is too quick to stand guys up on when they are on the ground if someone isn't absolutley mauling the other guy or obviously working a submission.

This is slightly related because of ref influence, but I was watching the Nover Bradley fight today and Joe Rogan said that there needs to be a rule that allows a fight to restart if the ref makes a mistake. What are everyone's views on that? I think that it makes sense to have that, but it needs to be like a reversed call in football or baseball where there is incontrovertible proof that the stoppage was bad and the decision needs to be made in a very short time period to not allow a fighter to recover too much.

No way.....thats absurd. A stoppage is a total judgment call. Bad stoppages do occur and they suck, but refs are trained to look for certain things and if they see something, they should have all the power. It is far too dangerous not to stop a fight immediately. Furthermore, this would cause ref to perhaps not stop some fights when their instincts say they should and that would be a disaster, especially with 4 oz gloves where one shot can make such a huge impact. Nobody has died yet in the UFC and the refs are a big reason why. The ONLY thing I could see this being used for is a submission where a guy didnt really tap, but it was stopped. Even then, you can never really restart the fight with the same flow. Once one fighter thinks he has won and another thinks he lost, everything goes out the window. I know I would be ill prepared to fight if I had been awarded a victory then had it reversed. I dont think we can mess with a refs' discretion, it would be a disaster imo.

[E-Man]

^^^ Co sign. I've seen some terrible stoppages before(the Koscheck is the most absurd one that happened recently), but they should be pure judgment calls. The Matt Brown/Pete Sell fight was a ridiculous restart.

[josh07039]

^^^ Co sign. I've seen some terrible stoppages before(the Koscheck is the most absurd one that happened recently), but they should be pure judgment calls. The Matt Brown/Pete Sell fight was a ridiculous restart.Well Pete Sell/Matt Brown was just ridiculous, but it wasn't really a restart. It was almost stopped, but then allowed to continue.

I just think that with a fight like the Nover one when the other fighter is clearly 100% fine and already defending himself as the fight is being stopped, there needs to be something to be done. Not for any debatable stoppage, because even, Xavier Fouka Pokam was yelling about an early stoppage against Mcfedries. I understand every point made, and I agree that the flow of the fight will not be regained, but then is that really as unfair as one fighter who is 100% fine being robbed?

[Ravens1991]

how do you get out of the thai clinch? whenever I fight Wanderlei he gets me in it and I cant escape I am just blocking and its pissing me off

[LTgiants]

how do you get out of the thai clinch? whenever I fight Wanderlei he gets me in it and I cant escape I am just blocking and its pissing me off

pull down on the right stick works for me and i dont get kneed in the face.

[Ravens1991]

yea I figured out to push the right stick away from the direction he is moving you.

[josh07039]

Kimbo on TUF. I'm not entirely surprised after he didn't accept a contract with Strikeforce and the next season of TUF being heavyweights.
I find that so hilarious after how he was billed as the next big thing by EliteXC. Firstly he is terrible, but there is a chance he could win a fight or two because this is the level of competition he should be facing. They have had some pretty green guys in the past and maybe there will be some that are willing to stand with him to try to knock out the internet joke(I know he got knocked out by a light heavyweight, but there is no debating where he would want the fight to be). I wonder how he is going to act in the house and be treated by his fellow castmates. The funniest thing would be if he comes in like a big man because of youtube and the exposure he has had.

I hate to say this, but I am still intrigued by the guy. I never expected him to be great, but I think he will always be interesting to me for indefinable reasons.

[MetSox17]

Kimbo on TUF. I'm not entirely surprised after he didn't accept a contract with Strikeforce and the next season of TUF being heavyweights.
I find that so hilarious after how he was billed as the next big thing by EliteXC. Firstly he is terrible, but there is a chance he could win a fight or two because this is the level of competition he should be facing. They have had some pretty green guys in the past and maybe there will be some that are willing to stand with him to try to knock out the internet joke(I know he got knocked out by a light heavyweight, but there is no debating where he would want the fight to be). I wonder how he is going to act in the house and be treated by his fellow castmates. The funniest thing would be if he comes in like a big man because of youtube and the exposure he has had.

I hate to say this, but I am still intrigued by the guy. I never expected him to be great, but I think he will always be interesting to me for indefinable reasons.

I'd love to see him win his fight to get on the show, because of everything you said, although i don't believe he will come in with a big head. First, he got knocked off his internet pedestal in embarrassing fashion, and he always seemed to be a humble guy despite all the exposure he got. If the guys they put on THAT show are anything like the guys that are on this current season of TUF, he has a shot at winning, but i honestly don't expect him to do much.

[josh07039]

I'd love to see him win his fight to get on the show, because of everything you said, although i don't believe he will come in with a big head. First, he got knocked off his internet pedestal in embarrassing fashion, and he always seemed to be a humble guy despite all the exposure he got. If the guys they put on THAT show are anything like the guys that are on this current season of TUF, he has a shot at winning, but i honestly don't expect him to do much. I agree with him coming in humbly, because he always seems like a decent guy that was the victim of over hyping from elitxc.

I would love for him to be able to win a fight or two and I do think it is feasible. Realistically, this is his level of competition, young fighters that have many holes in their games. Also, just seeing him on a UFC event would make my year. After all the crap Dana White talked about him, I would love to see him make a little noise on TUF.

Also, how awesome will it be if he is on Rampage's team? Seeing those two big personalities together would be phenomenal.

[E-Man]

Haha I was just about to post the Kimbo news. I'm not gonna lie, I'm intrigued a bit. I'm no Kimbo hater, but I always wanted him to lose in EliteXC since they were so corrupt with his fights. He seems like a cool guy, and I would do the same thing he did. That's a ton of money and sponsorships he got. Skill wise he's garbage. That's not debatable since he got knocked out by the weakest punch possible. He may have improved, but Bas getting rid of him doesn't spell to well for his work ethic. Still, he's a huge draw. TUF 10 is gonna get huge ratings. You have two well known fighters coaching with bad blood, and now you have freaking Kimbo Slice. Love him or hate him, it's hard not to watch a guy that looks like Kimbo fight. He looks like a homeless black Santa Cluas. lol That's just something that makes you wanna watch.

[SeanTaylorRIP]

I've never got why people hated Kimbo so much. It's not his fault people jumped all over him. Hell I give mad props to a guy who can come from fighting on the streets for a couple hundred, to making six digits and being all over magazines. Hell he's played the game and is making money. The fact is still though that he is oldish and still so inexperienced. I know he's had some top training but IMO there is no chance he will win the show. Still between him and the coaches of page and Rashad it should be an interesting season. BTW the fact that he went on TUF over a multifight contract with Strike Force tells me Dana is paying him mad buck to be on the show. I wouldn't be surprised if Kimbo will be paid in the millions to be on the show. It will definitely be the highest rated season of TUF.Unfortunately thought we know that every episode even when he's not fighting will be centered around Kimbo. Regardless there is definitely going to be a split in the house.

[E-Man]

The reason people hated on Kimbo was the reason that MMA fans have a long history of hating. People just like to hate. There were legit reasons to hate how he was hyped, and to hate the questionable outcomes of his wins. Still, you can't blame Kimbo the man for taking the money and fighting. I actually respect the guy for trying out on TUF instead of taking a contract with Strikeforce or another org. Strikeforce would have payed him cheaper than EliteXC did, but it still would've been more lucrative than TUF payouts. I don't think Dana is paying Kimbo at all outside of more exposure for himself. The UFC doesn't have much to lose with Kimbo fighting on TUF anyway, and the gain is probably only short term. Kimbo probably wants to either test himself, or he wants to put his name into people's minds again for future endeavors. I bet it's the latter. Going on TUF will give him big time exposure again, and he'll probably try to parlay that into new sponsorships and what not.

It sucks Satoshi Ishii won't be on TUF though. It makes perfect sense for him to get experience in Sengoku before doing anything with the UFC, but I was really getting excited to see him training weekly. Lord knows how far his MMA career will go, but I would love to take a look at what he does in training.

[UKfan]

I'm interested to see Kimbo on TUF, if he can come in and show a ground game, earn his way to the UFC, I will be much more interested in the guy, I couldn't stand how he got into the MMA scene first time round, I see this as redemption almost.

Also, argh, ******* quitters on Undisputed!!!

[E-Man]

Why do I have a feeling the UK guy is about to make a knockout comeback?

[josh07039]

Why do I have a feeling the UK guy is about to make a knockout comeback?
The way the fight was hyped, I thought the same thing. Other than the end of round 1, not a great fight like the promos suggested.

[E-Man]

Yeah, that was a let down. The way they edited the beginning of round 3, it looked like a comeback was in order.

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

Man TUF was awesome tonight. Demarcus is a beast. He got tested today and showed he can take some shots and recover. He is easily my favorite fighter on the show.

[josh07039]

Man TUF was awesome tonight. Demarcus is a beast. He got tested today and showed he can take some shots and recover. He is easily my favorite fighter on the show.I thought that Demarcus looked really promising tonight, but he gassed really quickly and his GnP really didnt do any devastating damage. In the second round, he should've been able to do so much more damage and maybe even get the fight stopped. Im pretty sure he had him mounted at least once and did limited damage. Also, when he had his back, he need to finish that fight or at least inflict heavier damage. However, some of that was probably because of the furious first round that left him pretty tired.

As far as liking Demarcus, my only problem with him is that he always seems to play up for the cameras. I like guys that seem natural and don't work to become the star of the season by trying to act a certain way.

[RAVENS/WIZARDS/ORIOLES]

I thought that Demarcus looked really promising tonight, but he gassed really quickly and his GnP really didnt do any devastating damage. In the second round, he should've been able to do so much more damage and maybe even get the fight stopped. Im pretty sure he had him mounted at least once and did limited damage. Also, when he had his back, he need to finish that fight or at least inflict heavier damage. However, some of that was probably because of the furious first round that left him pretty tired.

As far as liking Demarcus, my only problem with him is that he always seems to play up for the cameras. I like guys that seem natural and don't work to become the star of the season by trying to act a certain way.

Yea he was definitely gassed because of them hits he took at the end of round 1. We all know he is very skilled and has a lot of potential but what I didn't know is how he would do in the later rounds and he showed that he can recover and he has a lot of heart. His GNP was weak tonight and he gave up a lot of good positions(2 mounts, and had Nick's back twice). I usually do not like the ones that are all in the camera but he is confident and he isn't going around starting fights(Junie). IMO he is like Bisping was when he was on TUF and Bisping was my favorite fighter in that TUF and still is in my top 5 favorite fighters. I really like Demarcus and I am glad to see him in the finals. I can not wait until Andre fights he is a monster.

[josh07039]

Yea he was definitely gassed because of them hits he took at the end of round 1. We all know he is very skilled and has a lot of potential but what I didn't know is how he would do in the later rounds and he showed that he can recover and he has a lot of heart. His GNP was weak tonight and he gave up a lot of good positions(2 mounts, and had Nick's back twice). I usually do not like the ones that are all in the camera but he is confident and he isn't going around starting fights(Junie). IMO he is like Bisping was when he was on TUF and Bisping was my favorite fighter in that TUF and still is in my top 5 favorite fighters. I really like Demarcus and I am glad to see him in the finals. I can not wait until Andre fights he is a monster.
I can understand people liking him and Bisping, they are just not my cup of tea. And I would never compare Demarcus to Junie. Demarcus tries to be more outgoing and more of a team leader to steal camera time, Junie was just a destructive moron.
I actually really starting disliking Bisping even more this season. I just dont really like all of his **** talking and the stupid crap he yells during the fight like a soccer hooligan yelling at a ref. I just see him as a bit of a cocky bully type.

Speaking of coaches, Henderson is so ridiculously chill. I feel like he is just stoned out of his mind constantly. And during fights, he's hilarious. He just yells the same thing repeatedly. Often the thing he yells isn't something that can be easily done and the fighter may not be able to do it at that moment. I think it was Lester v. Faulkner and Lester was pinned against the cage and Hendo kept yelling circle off the cage. Did it ever occur to him that Lester heard him and was trying his best, but just couldn't get it done?

jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab jab
circle circle circle circle circle circle circle circle circle circle circle

[E-Man]

lol I just noticed your post about Henderson. He's probably the most nonchalant guy ever on TUF. I gotta feeling that if he had a headcase like Junie, he'd just stare at him all day long until Junie got scared. lol Anyway, here's my picks for tomorrow night. Hopefully I get back on track after the awful picks for UFC 98.:)

Lawler over Shileds. I think Lawler will be too much for Shields. shields needs to get it to the ground to win, and I don't think he will. Lawler takes it by KO in round 2.

Arlovski takes Rogers. Arlovski has too much experience, speed, and power to get beat by a young brawler. In a few years Rogers may be pretty good, but he's still a young brawler now. Maybe he might shock everyone, but I think Arlovski gets the spectacular KO in the first.

Diaz takes Smith. Smith is a guy who throws big shots, but nothing else. Diaz is a guy with long reach and a good ground game. I think Diaz will just keep him at bay with pitty pat jabs all fight long. He may pull off a sub late, but I think it'll be a decision.

Riggs knocks out Baroni in the first. Baroni has been on the down side for years now. I'm not buying a "new" Baroni because he's beat three scrubs since getting drummed by Villasenor. Riggs will use his size to his advantage, and he'll bully Baroni.

Whitehead over Randleman. Randleman is shot. I'm pulling for him, but I think Whitehead will just beat him on points tomorrow.

[josh07039]

Im in the same boat in terms of UFC 98 picks. I usually don't bother counting the undercard, but I need to for 98 just to make my record passable. As for Strikeforce picks:

EDIT:MY PICKS SUCK!!!

[JF4]

http://mmajunkie.com/news/15113/lyoto-machida-to-defend-title-against-mauricio-shogun-rua-at-ufc-104-in-los-angeles.mma

Looks like Machida will have his first title defense against Shogun which is a bit of a shocker. I could think of a couple guys who probably deserve more of a shot but it should definitely be an interesting bout nonetheless

[fenikz]

Nice, Shogun can pull the upset

[UKfan]

Shogun is the best of the rest when you think about it, Rashad and Rampage tied up with TUF, Forrest is fighting Anderson, who else is there?!

[josh07039]

The rumors have been swirling for a while. I'm not happy about it, but I recognize there is no other options if they want to keep the new champ active. The only issue I have is that Shogun, whether or not you believe he is back, is not deserving of a title shot based on his recent resume. A shameful win over Mark Coleman and a knockout of Chuck(1-3 over his last 4 going into the fight) are not impressive. It sets a bad precedent that a fighter who is not deserving gets a title shot only because of convenience. Also, Shogun's all attack, wild style seems like it would play right into Machida's hands.

[fenikz]

my way too early prediction is Shogun 2nd round KO via clinch and knees

[josh07039]

my way too early prediction is Shogun 2nd round KO via clinch and kneesI predict Machida Round 2 by murder.

[UKfan]

Machida round 1 by whatever the hell he wants.

[E-Man]

I think Machida takes it in round 1. Shogun is much better than Thiago Silva, but his aggressive style will play right into Machida's hands. He'd be doing exactly what Machida wants him to do. Shogun has a chance to pull off the upset, but Shogun seems to be the type of fighter that Machida could put away early.

Anyone have picks for the WEC card tomorrow night too? I'm excited that we're getting two decent cards in back to back nights. I'll make picks after the weigh ins. You never know if a guy comes in overweight or looking out of shape.

[josh07039]

Randleman looks like ****, tired already?

[Mr. Hero]

The rumors have been swirling for a while. I'm not happy about it, but I recognize there is no other options if they want to keep the new champ active. The only issue I have is that Shogun, whether or not you believe he is back, is not deserving of a title shot based on his recent resume. A shameful win over Mark Coleman and a knockout of Chuck(1-3 over his last 4 going into the fight) are not impressive. It sets a bad precedent that a fighter who is not deserving gets a title shot only because of convenience. Also, Shogun's all attack, wild style seems like it would play right into Machida's hands.

I definitely think Machida should be able to just control shogun and put him down, but there's always the chance that shogun gets to him a few times with his aggressiveness, if lyoto doesn't put shogun down quickly I could see shogun wearing lyoto down more than anyone else we've seen him fight so far.

[E-Man]

Good lord, Scott Smith is a dumbass. Diaz is horrible at taking those low kicks. Every time Smith kicked low, Diaz took a ton of damage and exposed his chin. What does Smith do? He throws stupid haymakers. Has the man ever heard of mixing up his strikes? Sorry, but Diaz's striking is freaking terrible. Any competent guy would've tore his ass apart. He leaves himself wide open for almost everything.

[josh07039]

Good lord, Scott Smith is a dumbass. Diaz is horrible at taking those low kicks. Every time Smith kicked low, Diaz took a ton of damage and exposed his chin. What does Smith do? He throws stupid haymakers. Has the man ever heard of mixing up his strikes? Sorry, but Diaz's striking is freaking terrible. Any competent guy would've tore his ass apart. He leaves himself wide open for almost everything.
Finally, someone else says that Diaz' striking sucks. He just has loads of stamina to constantly throw punches, most of which are little pawing jabs. It was so obvious that every leg kick led to Diaz pretty much spreading his legs out as if he was about to do the Haka. As much as I hate Diaz and I think that his comments were dick, mabye smith should train with a real camp.

OMG ARLOVSKI DOWN.

[E-Man]

That was an early stoppage but.................WOW!!!!!!

[josh07039]

That was an early stoppage but.................WOW!!!!!!Actually, I though the same thing at first, but it really wasn't. Arlovski just crumpled after being pretty much pinned to the cage by a few shots.

Even I know that you don't just go straight back, jesus is Arlovski the dumbest person in the heavyweight division. Maybe he was just waiting for the flying knee?

[E-Man]

I can bet your ass that Dana is calling Bret's agent now. lol Good lord I had some small feeling this could happen, but my God. Wow. He's like another Carwin, except the opponent he beat was more legit than Gonzaga. He still needs to be tested by a guy with a better chin and grappling game, but you can't help but give him nothing but respect be knocking out everyone in front of him. Even including a big timer like Arlovski.

[E-Man]

Actually, I though the same thing at first, but it really wasn't. Arlovski just crumpled after being pretty much pinned to the cage by a few shots.

Even I know that you don't just go straight back, jesus is Arlovski the dumbest person in the heavyweight division. Maybe he was just waiting for the flying knee?

Yeah, the replays showed it was legit. Andrei was out on his feet. And lol with the flying knee. Andrei has me speechless. He goes from foolishly abandoning a damn good striking display against the best heavyweight of all time, to getting knocked out by a guy who has yet to be tested. I like Arlovski, but that's funny as hell. It's so mind bogging that I can't help but laugh.

[Tampa 2 4 life]

....I guess Arlovski's chin is that bad.

[josh07039]

I can bet your ass that Dana is calling Bret's agent now. lol Good lord I had some small feeling this could happen, but my God. Wow. He's like another Carwin, except the opponent he beat was more legit than Gonzaga. He still needs to be tested by a guy with a better chin and grappling game, but you can't help but give him nothing but respect be knocking out everyone in front of him. Even including a big timer like Arlovski. Dana will keep him in mind i suppose, but I think his only reaction is joy that a former UFC guy got embarrassed. According to him everyone who gets cut from the UFC is garbage so he must be happy.

Rogers only futrther proved that Arlovski's chin is garbage. I remember Rogers' last fight and he really wasn't that impressive beyond his power and that is still the case. He did look better in the muay thai department last fight, but he also showed a below average gas tank. Rogers still has not beaten anyone legit through superior skill. Obviously beating Arlovski is impressive for his resume, but like I said earlier and Barnett said during his interview, "Arlovski goes straight back and doesn't move his head." Shows nothing but Arlovski is stupid and Rogers has power.

Obviously a quick knockout is exciting, give notoriety, and adds to a highlight reel, but it really doesn't reveal as much about a fighter.

Lastly, I agree that Arlovski is a more legit fighter than Gonzaga, however, Carwin's win was more legit. Carwin's victory was a bit too quick as well, but revealed more about him. It showed his chin and his ability to handle adversity and get up over a really good ground fighter. Granted, he also showed he needs to incorporate more head movement. So, in terms of a resume, yes Arlovski is better, but Carwin's win against Gonzaga was more impressive.

[Tampa 2 4 life]

Lawler fell right into the guillotine. odd night.

[jayceheathman]

I'm ready for The California Kid to kick some ass.