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Paul
04-29-2007, 04:27 PM
Alright our draft is over, so let’s give the grade for the players we got. So let’s disregard the Brown pick for next year (even though it is ridiculously badass). And grade the draft for players we got.


1. Anthony Spencer - Dream pick. Strong, mean motherfuker who will make teams anguish of the thought of him and ware attacking. A+

2. James Marten - Not flashy pick, but a necessary one. Provides much needed depth. B

3. Isaiah Stanback - ....Was alittle shocked with this one. But after some research an intriguing developmental guy. C

4. Doug Free - Loved this pick. Been hoping for this guy for awhile. Athletic, experienced, I believe he can be a LT. A

5. Nick Folk - Will be much better on kickoffs then Grammatica. Very good leg. Will compete for the job. But a kicker was not on my personal grade list.C

6. Deon Anderson - Stocky, strong body. But not the biggest fan of this one, but hopefully he'll prove me wrong. C-

7. Courtney Brown - Next to the Spencer pick, this is my favorite so far. One the only small school guy I actually looked into before the draft, and I frickin loved that we got him. Potential is tremendous. Couldn't be happier. A+

8. Alan Ball - Not much to know about this guy. 6-1 175lb 4.45. He's alittle skinny. Was not overly productive. D

Grade - B

j05son
04-29-2007, 05:38 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Dream pick. Strong, mean motherfuker who will make teams anguish of the thought of him and ware attacking. A+

Nice pick. Both Levi Brown and Joe Thomas said Spencer was the toughest to block. Encouraging. Glad we both had nice drafts and we were able to deal with each other...

Dcboys94
04-29-2007, 05:58 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Good player, gave the top OT's the hardest time, should compete to start opposite D-Ware. A

2. James Marten - Shot up draft boards after workouts. another highly drafted BC OL. Good pick. C+

3. Isaiah Stanback - Was real Happy with this one. thought maybe 5th round, but at least we got him. Should make a good reciever. 6-2 3/8 216, 4.5 forty, good hands. Athlete . B

4. Doug Free - Decent pick, small school guy...decent pick. C

5. Nick Folk - should compete for starting job eventually. C+

6. Deon Anderson - Hope he proves worthy. D+

7. Courtney Brown - Great value especially in the 7th...compared to chris mcallister. A+

8. Alan Ball - Not much to know about this guy. 6-1 175lb 4.45. D

Overall- B-

pocketaces
04-29-2007, 06:23 PM
oooppps see below

D-Unit
04-29-2007, 06:24 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Great Pick. Addressed a big need. Got the guy our front office really wanted. Will have an immediate impact. Value was right on as New England wanted him. Once we jumped in front of them to grab him, they traded out of their second pick in the first round. Serious DROY Candidate. Bright Future in Dallas. A+

2. James Marten - Solid Pick. Addressed a need. Shores up our OL depth with a quality player. Arguably the best RT prospect in the draft. Nice way to back up Columbo. B

To get an A: Tank Tyler at 53 or Trade up for a WR.

3. Isaiah Stanback - Gritt Pick. Took some balls to take Stanback here, but we can't be totally surprised as we were shown the signs. RanchReport.com called this one. Fact that we wanted him and got him raises the grade. Jason Garrett must have some ideas for "Slash". B-

To get an A: Josh Beekman, Antonio Pittman, Tanard Jackson, Fred Bennett, Paul Soliai, Manny Ramirez

4. Doug Free - Great Pick! Happiest moment of the draft for me as I felt like Jerry finally got my memo! Wanted Free in Round 3, so getting him here made me excited. Terrorized by the thought of not having anyone other than Ugly Man McQuistan behind Flozell, put those worries to rest. A+

5. Nick Folk - Solid Pick. Glad that our Front Office does not get strayed by mock draft artists opinions of players. Crosby would've been a mistake. Folk is less heralded, but more consistent and steady. Has kicked a 61 yarder before. Very happy to know we have our kicker for the future. Addressed a need. Good value. Will have instant impact as Gramatica will get cut. This is what Day 2 picks are for. A

6. Deon Anderson - Solid Pick. No guarantees here, but he's a great option to give a shot at. We haven't had a legit FB since Moose. Lousaka Polite and Hoyte are trying but they are not skilled FBs. Anderson has a chance to be the answer. Jarrett was around when Moose was here. We got a guy we wanted. Fair value. Fits a need. Has a chance to start soon. B

7. Courtney Brown - Great Pick. Tremendous potential and upside. Fills a need. Good value. Fact that we're not looking for a starter and he'll have the chance to groom is a plus. I have a feeling we have a player here. A

8. Alan Ball - Bad Pick. But what the hell. It's a 7th rounder. Fits the mold of a Wade Phillips CB. Tall, lanky, good size. He'll be taught to jam receivers off the line and disrupt routes to buy time for pass rushers to attack. C

To get an A: Walter Thomas, Quintin Echols, Keith Jackson

Final Grade - A-

To get an A+: Move up in Rnd 2 for Dwayne Jarrett

KILLERSANTA
04-29-2007, 06:26 PM
Browns 1st rounder next year - Awesome Trade, Should be a Top 10 pick!

1. Anthony Spencer - Great Pick, knew it would happen. Had it in my mock...(This is the 5-6 year in a row I nailed there first round pick :) )

3. Doug Free - Great Pick, Could be a Future LT. Didn't think he would last as long as he did...Great Value!!!!

4. James Marten - Good Pick, Add soild Depth

4. Courtney Brown - Great Pick, Should be a nickle Corner

6. Isaiah Stanback - Good Pick, Was super Pissed, But then I list to the interview and found out he runs a 4.3 Fothy. He was hurt when he ran a 4.5. Should be a Great PR for us. No more of newman getting Jack!

6. Deon Anderson - Soild Pick...I love Blocking FB's....But now we have 3 FB's.........

7. Nick Folk - OK Pick, I like Automatic...Automatic makes 100% of his FGs 75% of the time!

7. Alan Ball - Bad pick - Way to small and Not that Fast......


(I know this isn't the way the draft happen, But this way makes me happier :) )


Grade.....B........Would be an A, If we drafted a NT! If Fergy Goes down we're F'ed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Other then no NT, I love this draft!

pocketaces
04-29-2007, 06:31 PM
heres Gil Brandts and/or Pat Kirwans Analysis on all our picks:

Anthony Spencer- Pat Kirwan's Analysis
I really like this player. In the new Cowboys 3-4 defense, they really are a four-man rush team and occasionally a five-man rush team. Spencer had 21 sacks in college and 11 forced fumbles, which might be the best in the whole draft. The ripple effect of this selection is Bobby Carpenter probably moving inside. When I interviewed Spencer, I was shocked at how strong he is. Try these numbers on for size -- 525 pounds on the bench press, 610 pounds on the squat, 365 pounds power clean. This guy is NFL-ready now.


James Marten- Gil Brandt's Analysis
Marten is a tall player who looked really good at the Combine. He came from a small high school in Indiana. He didn't play a lot young and doesn't have a lot of experience. He won't start this year, but he's a good project.


Issah Stanback- Gil Brandt's Analysis
Stanback (6-2, 216) could be a super player. He's got mobility, speed and a great arm. He can do just about anything you want him to do.



Doug Free- Gil Brandt's Analysis
Free (6-6 1/4, 324) was my 77th-ranked player. He came to Northern Illinois as a tight end and has been a four-year starter (more than 45 games). There were some questions about his strength, but I saw tape of him in 2005 where he knocked down Michigan DT Alan Branch twice. This is a very athletic guy; he teammates called him "Doug Freak."


Nick Folk- Gil Brandt's Analysis
This was my top-ranked kicker. He can punt and place kick. He prefers to only place kick, but hes a guy who can fill two positions with one roster spot if you have to.


Deon Anderson- Gil Brandt's Analysis
Anderson is a former defensive end. The Cowboys entered the draft without a real fullback on their roster. Hes a very aggressive lead blocker and he can catch the ball; he should be a good fit.


Courtney Brown- Gil Brandt's Analysis
He had a great workout at San Jose State's Pro Day. He had an extraordinary workout, running very fast (4.5) with a great vertical jump and very good three-cone drill. He's a big, tall corner.


Alan Ball Gil Brandt's Analysis
He's a big tall corner. He's 6-1, 183 and ran a 4.52. He's a corner with special teams skills.

Overall I would give our draft a B+

Achilles33
04-29-2007, 07:06 PM
Getting Cleveland's first rounder next year, which will be a top 10 pick at worst, is a great move by Jerry. A+

1. Anthony Spencer- Great pick. Him and D-Ware coming off the edge is going to be amazing. I can't even imagine what Wade is going to do with our defense. If it isn't top 3 it will be a dissapointment. A+

2. James Marten- A solid pick. A good, tough, BC O-lineman. Provides solid depth and could be a starter down the line. C+

3. Isaiah Stanback- A good pick hear IMO. THis kid is one hell of an athlete. He got drafted by the Orioles last year and hasn't played baseball since high school. He missed qualifying for states at Washington this year by .02 in the 100 meter. His 4.58 40 time on DC.com is when he is injuried, he is a 4.35 now. His 60 meter is 6.68, and 100 is 10.48, so he has plenty of speed. He has great size as well at 6-2 and 216 pounds. He can play QB and WR, and KR. He can be a great gadget play weapon. He can also hold the PAT's, and if something goes wrong he has the athletiscism to make something happen. Also has a cannon arm, 2nd only to JaMarcus Russell in this draft. B

4. Doug Free- A GREAT value pick. SHould have gone in the 2nd round. Adds great and much needed depth to our offensive line. His only knock is strength, and after an off-season in the NFL with a strength coach, this kid could be a quality LT. He is my front runner to replace Flo in 2008. A

5. Nick Folk- It is a kicker. He has a cannon leg, and should help us immediatly on kickoffs. If he gets his accuracy down he good be pretty good. We will see what happens. C-

6. Deon Anderson- A head stratcher, but is is the 6th round. This kid blows people up. If we use a FB, this kid could help our running game right away. C

7. Courtney Brown An Amazing pick. This kid has all the tools to be a starting CB down the line. He also had great production in college. At 6-1 200 pounds he runs a 4.32. He can sit and learn because our CBs are set, but down the line this kid could turn out to be something special. A+

8. Alan Ball Don't really know much about this kid. Him being 175 scares me a bit. It is the 7th round, so whatever. I would have liked either Walter Thomas or Ramonce Taylor here. D

Overall Grade: A-

Oh and DCboys94, how can you possibly give Doug Free a C? That is an amazing pick. He is definitly in the A range.

pocketaces
04-29-2007, 07:17 PM
Reading the Giants thread, their saying we dropped the ball in this draft. HAHAHAHA. What a hoot!

mat33
04-29-2007, 07:34 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - I love this pick, I saw him dominate against Notre Dame and have been a fan of his since, should be a great compliment to Ware. A+

2. James Marten - Not really a huge fan of this one, he has limited upside and is not very athletic. C+

3. Isaiah Stanback - Raw as a WR but has superstar potential, could be a great player down the road. He will be used on end-arounds and WR-options, should provide major entertainment. A

4. Doug Free - Loved this pick. a super athletic, experienced, guy who could come in and compete for Columbo's job from day one, tremendous value pick. A+

Overall I give the draft an A, primarily for the Spencer, Stanback, Brown picks.

5. Nick Folk - Monster leg who should have a major impact, will be a tremendous KO specialist and should be the futur kicker. I would have prefered Mason Crosby though. B

6. Deon Anderson - Small, powerful, and nasty, should compete with both Polite and Hoyte from day one. B

7. Courtney Brown - This is my favorite pick. This guy has as much potential as any corner in the draft. He has the size of an Anthony Henry, with the athleticism of Newman, could be a star. A+++

8. Alan Ball - I thinhk that the management just wanted the day to end, so they picked the first name on the list alphabetically. No way he even makes the Practice Squad. D-

Overall I say an A, primarily based off of the Spencer, Stanback, and Brown picks.

leroyisgod
04-29-2007, 07:35 PM
1. Anthony Spencer-I believe we reached a little bit and gave up too much too get him, but I really like him. He's big, fast, nasty and mean. Having Spencer and Ware coming off the ends will scare a lot of teams.
A-

2. James Marten- This is a solid pick. Marten is extreme versatile.
B-

3. Isaiah Standback- A pretty big reach, but I like him. He gives us the slash option that we've needed. We can now break out the trick plays.
B

3. Doug Free- In my opinion, Free is the future LT of our team.
A

4. Nick Folk- We could've waited to pick a kicker until later.
C

5. Deon Anderson- not sure why we drafted a FB. Could've signed him as a FA.
C-

6. Courtney Brown- A very good pick at this point in the draft. CB has good size and speed. He'll be our future nickel back for several years.
A

7. Alan Ball- Haven't heard much about this guy.
D+

Overall- B+

We had a very solid draft and picked up a round 1 draft pick next year.

bigbluedefense
04-29-2007, 07:39 PM
Reading the Giants thread, their saying we dropped the ball in this draft. HAHAHAHA. What a hoot!

Nooooooo, I think Dallas did great. Spencer was a great pickup. Marten was solid value. The only knock I have is I think you guys shouldve gotten that Kicker Crosby.

Getting Spencer + a future 1st rounder instantly gives you guys a B+ to me. The rest of the draft couldve been a little better, but still, great draft by Dallas.

I think Washington and Philly didn't do so hot. Washington, lol, what idiots. Oh well, I love it.

Achilles33
04-29-2007, 07:42 PM
Hey BBD, get reading to say hello to Darren McFadden next year.

LSUALUM99
04-29-2007, 07:43 PM
Nooooooo, I think Dallas did great. Spencer was a great pickup. Marten was solid value. The only knock I have is I think you guys shouldve gotten that Kicker Crosby.

Getting Spencer + a future 1st rounder instantly gives you guys a B+ to me. The rest of the draft couldve been a little better, but still, great draft by Dallas.

I think Washington and Philly didn't do so hot. Washington, lol, what idiots. Oh well, I love it.


Crosby wasn't the universially regarded #1 kicker. In fact, on Gosselin's position analysis, he was the #3 K in the draft.

bigbluedefense
04-29-2007, 07:50 PM
Crosby wasn't the universially regarded #1 kicker. In fact, on Gosselin's position analysis, he was the #3 K in the draft.

Thats interesting. I haven't done much hw on kickers.

Hey BBD, get reading to say hello to Darren McFadden next year.

Not worried about him at all. The guy that worries me is Spencer. This allows you guys to move Ware to SOLB, his more natural position.

The only thing is, Im not too big on Carp moving inside. I know that is what the scheme will ask of him to do, but Carp is more of a Mike Vrabel OLB. I think they shouldve kept developing him in that role. I think his talents won't be fully utilized in his new role, although it will probably help the overall defense in this new scheme change.

But overall, I like the move. I still think the DEs will have a huge impact on the defense moreso than anything else.

Does this mean that Bradie James's days as a starter are done? I liked Bradie. I thought he was a good player.

fryman
04-29-2007, 07:57 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Great pick and trades. Will contribute right away, and challenge for the starting spot. Between him, Ware and Ellis we should have a good pass rush and good depth. A

2. James Marten - I am not impressed by Marten. He is good depth, but that is all I really see him being in his career, and he was picked too early to just be depth. C

3. Isaiah Stanback - I don't like this pick at all. If he plays WR he will be the 6th WR, which makes it hard to keep him on the active roster. As a quarterback he doesn't have very good decision making skills and is unrefined. Also he hasn't shown return ability either. I find it hard to believe he makes the roster. D

4. Doug Free - Love the pick. We got great value here. I really believe with his athleticism that he can become our next LT. Give him a one year to get his strength and conditioning up to the NFL level and he will start to challenge for the spot. A

5. Nick Folk - I know many people don't like this pick, but I actually do. Mason Crosby was over rated by fans and there was a reason why he was the 3rd K taken. Folk was split with Medlock as the best K by most scouts. Finally a K with the talent to be the Cowboys kicker for a long time. A

6. Deon Anderson - I thought Cory Anderson would be the better pick, but considering how many FB were taken with Cory being passed over scouts must have seen something that I overlooked. Deon is a good run blocking FB though, and that is just what we need. B-

7. Courtney Brown - Loved this pick. Brown was definitely on my list of prospects I wanted. He has all the potential in the world, just needs some time to develop. Needs to put in the hard work to improve or he wont turn out though. A

8. Alan Ball - Ball has the ability to be at least a dime corner somewhere, but I don't think that is Dallas. With the resigning of Reeves and Jones and drafting of Brown there were better picks. Ball did have a good senior year and was a four year starter. Wasn't a flashy player in college, more like Newman in playing the receiver not the ball. A little on the slow and light side. good value though, several scouts had him in the 5th and 6th rounds. B-

Overall grade- A the fact that we likely will have a top ten pick next year bumped the grade up.

Achilles33
04-29-2007, 07:58 PM
No BBD, Spencer is our SOLB. Ware is a natural WOLB. How do you figure he is a SOLB? Spencer, is the bigger, more compact player.

bigbluedefense
04-29-2007, 08:02 PM
No BBD, Spencer is our SOLB. Ware is a natural WOLB. How do you figure he is a SOLB? Spencer, is the bigger, more compact player.

I like Spencer as a pure pass rusher better than Ware. He has more moves, and has a better motor.

Ware can cover very well, and for the immediate future, is better moving to SOLB. He doesn't have a great arsenal of pass rush moves, but is great against the run, and great in coverage. He's better off being moved to the strongside where he can drop back more, and use his speed rush against slower thicker RTs.

Its hard for a DE converted LB to develop coverage skills. Its better off using Spencer as a WOLB for the time being while he develops his coverage skills. Ware is already polished in that regards, he should be moved to the strongside.

Achilles33
04-29-2007, 08:05 PM
No way, Ware is definitly a better pass rusher. He is faster, more athletic, and A LOT more fluid. Spencer may have more moves, but you can learn moves. Spencer is shorter, stronger, and bigger. He will be better against the run. Ware is a WOLB. I don't think there is any way he moves either.

bigbluedefense
04-29-2007, 08:10 PM
No way, Ware is definitly a better pass rusher. He is faster, more athletic, and A LOT more fluid. Spencer may have more moves, but you can learn moves. Spencer is shorter, stronger, and bigger. He will be better against the run. Ware is a WOLB. I don't think there is any way he moves either.

Wade moves his pass rushers around. I dont think its out of the question to see Ware lined up on the strongside at times.

Pass rushing moves are not as simple as you think. If Ware didn't learn em by now, chances are he won't learn em. Pass rushing is a game of chess between the rusher and the Tackle. You have to set them up during the coarse of the game. I don't see Ware doing that. He has 2 standard pass rush moves, and never sets his guy up. Doesn't use his hands well either. I like his speed on the RT. It presents a more favorable matchup. If he doesn't improve on that this upcoming year, don't expect him to ever improve upon that part of his game. Its now or never for him in that regards.

Either way, I think they will be moved around. Theres almost no distinction between SOLB and WOLB in Wade's scheme. Expect to see both of them man both OLB positions often.

Achilles33
04-29-2007, 08:13 PM
Oh I know they will be moved around. But in the base defense, and the majority of the snaps, Ware is the WOLB, Spencer is the SOLB. And I think Ware will explode this season I expect 17+ sacks. Parcells was holding him back. Wade Phillips will unleash him. Ware probably has more moves, but Parcells the control freak probably said no. Either way, Ware and Spencer coming off the edge will be fun, good luck. Our secondary will only benefit from this as well.

thule
04-29-2007, 08:24 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Great pick and trades. Will contribute right away, and challenge for the starting spot. Between him, Ware and Ellis we should have a good pass rush and good depth. The more I read the more I fall in love. A smart player with that much talent warrants an A+

3. James Marten - Marten is a wildcard. My hunch is that we moved down to take Usama..but NO snatched him. Marten was plan B. I just about cried when we didn't take Free..but here is the thinking. We have no swing tackle with the loss of Fabini. Procter is currently our backup OG...we needed depth. Marten actually has mroe athletic ability than people give him credit for...he has enough to pinch start at LT if needed to. I like this pick from a depth standpoint...this also gives us a RT if Columbo faulters. The organization isn't sold on Columbo which is why I think this move was made in the end...you could see it from his contract...this is the #1 position fight in TC...should be fun to watch. Another smart kid in the draft I love it.

4. Isaiah Stanback - When I saw this pick I was sad...I obviously really wanted Free although I didn't think he would get the nod anyways. But most of my Stanback hate came from Tubby. 4.3 speed at 6-2 doesn't fall much further. Stanback gives us a 3rd QB on game day something that woulda been Crayton. He gives us a guy who can stretch the field vertically. After breaking him down he really seems like a Miles Austin type of player which questions where Austin will be after this year...another interesting TC battle. C

4. Doug Free - I was shocked actually...I thought our staff was done with the OL with the Marten pick. What can I say...this guy with 1 season under his belt is going to be a stud. He has everything you look for..and if he wasn't injured this year would have been the 2nd tackle off the board. I can't wait to see him in 2008. A+

5. Nick Folk - I was surprised by this pick. I had Crosby over him in my rankings...but I'm going to trust the scouts. Folk is going to make this team as a KOS...especially since we won't be carrying 3 QB's on the roster again this year. He's got a big boot...can also punt gotta like that. If something were to ever happen to McBriar. People might say we went kicker to early...but Crosby went off the board shortly after so I'm not buying it. Great time to snatch him up if he was our guy. Reminds me a lot of when Wade drafted Jason Elam. B

6. Deon Anderson - I had a hunch we would be touching FB in this draft. Garretts offense is much like the offense that the cowboys ran in the 90's. We needed a fullback to punch people in the mouth in the hole...yet the hands to be able to catch in the flats. Fills a need and our type of guy...solid pick. B+

7. Courtney Brown - One of my darkhorses to go early. I really don't see what seperated him from a guy like Usama Young. OBviously he has the numbers to be a starting CB in this league...will be interesting to see where he fits. Another fun TC position to watch. I don't believe Reeves was tendered...so our nickel spot will be Glenn/Jones/Bulter(i'm only hearing good things about)/Brown I still think Glenn holds the spot but the 4 spot will be fun to watch who wins. A+

8. Alan Ball - Don't have a lot of information on the guy. He ran fast and has size...thats about all I can get. Probably has a outside shot at a PS guy. If he could put on about 10-15lbs without losing his athletic ability he might make the team in 08. D

Overall grade- A

thule
04-29-2007, 08:27 PM
BBD and Tnew...I would just like to come out and say that unlike Parcells scheme...phillips 34 uses the Sam backer as the primary 4th rusher.

bigbluedefense
04-29-2007, 08:36 PM
BBD and Tnew...I would just like to come out and say that unlike Parcells scheme...phillips 34 uses the Sam backer as the primary 4th rusher.

Well, from what Ive seen, more often than not, he's sending both at the qb. So it doesn't really matter. Both OLBs are pretty much pass rushers in this new scheme. Both have very similar responsibilities.

Expect lots of pass rushing from both him and Ware. Coverage is gonna fall on Carp's shoulders.

I liked Carp's rush moves. I think he wouldve worked out at OLB. But whatever, Wade knows infinitely more than I do. I'll take his word for it.

robert_in_bigd
04-29-2007, 08:44 PM
Well, I am not as bullish on this draft as others. Here is my read

Overall Draft: C -- We came into the draft in need of NT, WR, DB and OL and we only addressed OL in any serious form.

Spencer: B -- Best rusher in the draft and BBD is right. WOLB and Ware moves to his natural SOLB. Unfortunately this gives us 5 starting OLB with at least two of them devaluing like a Yugo fresh out of the dealer lot.

Marten: B+ -- A bit of a stretch but gives us a future RT if he works hard. Like his nastiness.

Free: B -- Good value pick. Like the potential with our three developmental Tackle. McQuistan, Free adn Marten.

Stanbeck: F -- Look like a Jerry wanna Antwan Randle EL move. Not a Pro QB.

Nick Folk: F -- Kicker with accuracy issues of a tee. Great.

Deon Anderson: F -- 3 full backs. Great. We just tendered Polite and have Hoyt.

Courtney Brown: B -- Good value.

Alan Ball: F -- Maybe he can serve lunch during training camp and eat some food.


To me there are two silver lingings to this draft which I think Jerry completely messed up after the trade. 1) Ware goes to natural position which mean Bradie hits the pines if Carpenter can play like he did in Seattle. 2) Cleveland will suck next year and I prefer James Stewart to McFadden -- faster, more elusive, bettre pass catcher and bigger. Plays in a messed up system for a super star Tail Back. Reminds me of Barry Sanders with 40 extra pounds and hands to catch a pass.

This roster + picks has too many SS, too many OLB, too many FB, too many low potential CB and we did not solve WR, NT or Safety. Love our Tackle situation in terms of depth.

Kind of upset, don't think any player picked will make a meaningful contribution to the 07 team.

But just football......... G night.

thule
04-29-2007, 08:51 PM
So harsh....we have 4 OLBs....Ellis is in his contract year and coming off an ACL injury. Burnett has always played Ware's backup and gets about 50% of the snaps on defense in non-base defenses. Spencer will give us insurance if Ellis isn't back healthy enough...and keep Ellis fresh...not bad.

We have Hoyte who is a project who can't catch..and constantly missed blocks in the hole..sure if he hits you your done...but he had more than his fair share of wiffs. Polite is just the opposite...Parcells kept trying to get him at TE...because he just doesn't have the base to block in the hole our out in space...he had great hands...but not the blocker that is needed for Garrett's scheme. Got to give props...Dallas went out and got a guy who will fit their scheme...I don't see how that is a F.

nrcirc
04-29-2007, 09:02 PM
Well, I am not as bullish on this draft as others. Here is my read

Overall Draft: C -- We came into the draft in need of NT, WR, DB and OL and we only addressed OL in any serious form.

Spencer: B -- Best rusher in the draft and BBD is right. WOLB and Ware moves to his natural SOLB. Unfortunately this gives us 5 starting OLB with at least two of them devaluing like a Yugo fresh out of the dealer lot.

Marten: B+ -- A bit of a stretch but gives us a future RT if he works hard. Like his nastiness.

Free: B -- Good value pick. Like the potential with our three developmental Tackle. McQuistan, Free adn Marten.

Stanbeck: F -- Look like a Jerry wanna Antwan Randle EL move. Not a Pro QB.

Nick Folk: F -- Kicker with accuracy issues of a tee. Great.

Deon Anderson: F -- 3 full backs. Great. We just tendered Polite and have Hoyt.

Courtney Brown: B -- Good value.

Alan Ball: F -- Maybe he can serve lunch during training camp and eat some food.


To me there are two silver lingings to this draft which I think Jerry completely messed up after the trade. 1) Ware goes to natural position which mean Bradie hits the pines if Carpenter can play like he did in Seattle. 2) Cleveland will suck next year and I prefer James Stewart to McFadden -- faster, more elusive, bettre pass catcher and bigger. Plays in a messed up system for a super star Tail Back. Reminds me of Barry Sanders with 40 extra pounds and hands to catch a pass.

This roster + picks has too many SS, too many OLB, too many FB, too many low potential CB and we did not solve WR, NT or Safety. Love our Tackle situation in terms of depth.

Kind of upset, don't think any player picked will make a meaningful contribution to the 07 team.

But just football......... G night.

Well said. Because we are going to get next year top 10 pick, I have to give them a C+, otherwise is a D.

Texico From Mexico
04-30-2007, 07:00 AM
Grade D

Spencer: Nice Addition and much needed. Pasing up a blue chip QB when we do not have one might come back to haunt this team.....as well as Miami!

Hope they can turn the two firsts next year in for a franchise QB or RB. This team has neither.

But it dosent really matter because thanks to the Raiders they just handed another Superbowl Trophy to New England. With The off season moves and now Moss that team will not be stoped. Everyone take your hat off to an organization who really knows how to do the right things. I wish we could learn a thing or two from that team....sigh

Modano
04-30-2007, 09:44 AM
Grade D

Spencer: Nice Addition and much needed. Pasing up a blue chip QB when we do not have one might come back to haunt this team.....as well as Miami!

Hope they can turn the two firsts next year in for a franchise QB or RB. This team has neither.

But it dosent really matter because thanks to the Raiders they just handed another Superbowl Trophy to New England. With The off season moves and now Moss that team will not be stoped. Everyone take your hat off to an organization who really knows how to do the right things. I wish we could learn a thing or two from that team....sigh

You forgot to say how godly was Jimmy Johnson!

bigbluedefense
04-30-2007, 09:53 AM
You can't give Dallas any less than a B because they got the guy who they wanted in round 1 plus an extra round 1 pick for next year's very talented draft. That in itself warrants a B.

The rest of the draft was not that great. Below average quite honestly. But still, to get Spencer and a 1st for next year was great. Jerry did a poor job with the rest of his picks, but he made up for it early on. I'll give him a B after further evaluation.

Modano
04-30-2007, 10:11 AM
You can't give Dallas any less than a B because they got the guy who they wanted in round 1 plus an extra round 1 pick for next year's very talented draft. That in itself warrants a B.

The rest of the draft was not that great. Below average quite honestly. But still, to get Spencer and a 1st for next year was great. Jerry did a poor job with the rest of his picks, but he made up for it early on. I'll give him a B after further evaluation.

Don't you like the picks of Free and Marten?

bigbluedefense
04-30-2007, 10:16 AM
Don't you like the picks of Free and Marten?

I like Marten, but I think they reached a little. I don't think they shouldve gotten Free, getting 2 guys at that position wasn't really necessary. Especially with the amount of money already invested in that oline.

Outside of Brown, I was not a big fan of any of these Tackles. Marten is serviceable, probably best suited at RT, but thats about it.

Crosby should have been picked. While some have him rated lower, most have him as the best kicker in the draft, and some projected him as a round 2 pick at one point. I think with Dallas's kicker situation, passing up on Crosby was a mistake.

They shouldve invested in a WR earlier as well. Im not too big on the QB they drafted.

But like I said, it was still a great draft for the simple fact that you have 2 first round picks in next year's draft, which should be an amazing draft class.

I know theres talks of trading both picks to move up, but honestly, with the depth in next year's draft, Dallas is much better off keeping both picks and getting 2 quality players opposed to 1.

Im sure drawing up mock drafts will be hella fun for all the Cowboy fans this upcoming year. Having 2 firsts is a draft geek's dream come true.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 11:01 AM
I like Marten, but I think they reached a little. I don't think they shouldve gotten Free, getting 2 guys at that position wasn't really necessary. Especially with the amount of money already invested in that oline.

Outside of Brown, I was not a big fan of any of these Tackles. Marten is serviceable, probably best suited at RT, but thats about it.

Crosby should have been picked. While some have him rated lower, most have him as the best kicker in the draft, and some projected him as a round 2 pick at one point. I think with Dallas's kicker situation, passing up on Crosby was a mistake.

They shouldve invested in a WR earlier as well. Im not too big on the QB they drafted.

But like I said, it was still a great draft for the simple fact that you have 2 first round picks in next year's draft, which should be an amazing draft class.

I know theres talks of trading both picks to move up, but honestly, with the depth in next year's draft, Dallas is much better off keeping both picks and getting 2 quality players opposed to 1.

Im sure drawing up mock drafts will be hella fun for all the Cowboy fans this upcoming year. Having 2 firsts is a draft geek's dream come true.

I normally agree with you BBD but to say we get a B because of next year's draft is a stretch. Next year's 1 is as yet to be a player. Who knows what that becomes. So, I just think the 1 is like saying "well we got an D" but I will give you and D+ cuz you may in the future do better on the test."

Not one player in this draft will play for the Cowboys in any meaningful way, including Spencer. If Wade does what I think he will the Front Seven will be much improved in pass rushing and the impact of a Rookie like Spencer will be minimal. Spencer was a luxury pick IMHO. AGAIN, he is the best rusher in the draft and he is a bette WOLB propsect than Ware. Ware is a much better SOLB and can actually cover a TE -- something Roy Williams can not do -- on first and second down.

The OL picks are good. Rather have my Tackle prospects than the Giants or any other team in the NFL. While Colombo and Flo are mediocre to say the least Free, Marten and McQuistan have talent. I think, baring injury, we have our answers at two key positions come 2008 and 2009.

The rest of the picks are pure garbage. Jones blew it on the WR front, the NT front and the DB front. We have not improved 1 bit in these positions since last year. Not 1.

We will continue to get killed covering Backs and TEs. If you spread the field on us and we don't get a sack we are still too slow in the middle of the field.

Carpenter will need to move inside which is another "developmental" year if you ask me plus you now verified Jones made a mistake with either Ayodele or James' contracts.

If Fergie goes down forget the season or one of the starting WR -- we are in deep pooh. Hurd and Crayton are not 1s. Austin could be put is raw. Pick a name NT is not ready unless we get someone off the waiver wire or get Kris Jenkins.

While last year's Cowboy draft may not have picked the best players b/c we went with Bill Guys (i.e., poor athletes for the picks) at least it made sense. Every pick made sense and you could see how they could help the team THAT YEAR.

This year, outside of Spencer as a third down guy, I see nothing of value to the 2007 team.

Grade D+ to C.

Modano
04-30-2007, 11:57 AM
This year, outside of Spencer as a third down guy, I see nothing of value to the 2007 team.

Grade D+ to C.

I can't wait the day you will be forced to admit that you were wrong, because Spencer will start for us.

And you have always the same type of argument. Always. We're too slow, our Safeties are crappy, our OTs are crappy etc etc.

1. Hamlin is not a bad cover safety. He had a bad 2006 season, but before that he was regarded as a good cover safety.
2. Colombo had a great season for us, there's NO WAY you can say he wasn't good. And Flozell didn't have a great year, because he was incosistent. But he had like 8-9 great games. He was still recovering from an acl injury, I think this year he will play bettere.
3. Say what you want about Roy Williams but he's a true playmaker. If the pass rush will increase he will a lot of occasions to make big plays.
4. If Carpenter will play inside that doesn't mean tha it will another developmental year or so on. Carpenter practiced as both ILB and OLB for all of last year. He can make an impact from day 1. Dqwell Jackson played very good for the Browns last year, and he was a rookie with no experience in Crenell defense. And we can make the same examples for a lot of rookies.
And with Carpenter inside you won't be able to use the "we are too slow in the middle of the field" argument. Because Ayodele/James will be the run thumper (every 3-4 needs one) and Carpenter will play in a Donnie Edwards position.

About the NT. Tell me one guy we could have picked that could have make an impact. The only legit NT prospect was Soliai, and there were big question marks about him.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 12:18 PM
Hi Modano, I hope I am wrong but I don't think so. I said earlier let us talk in October. On your points

1. Hamlin is average. A better SS prospect. We have 5 SS types.
2. Colombo and Flo are fine. Mediocre means average. We are average.
3. Roy Williams a play maker? Occassionally, but more often than not a liability. As they say a broken clock is right twice a day. Playing "go-for-broke" may sometimes help Roy make a play but 2005 and 2006 have opened up my eyes to what he is. A huge mistake as a DB UNLESS he turns it around by reshaping his body and game. He gives up huge pass plays and is never in position to knock a ball down when playing man.
4A. Carpenter is a very talented player. I am sure he will excel at ILB eventually but if you care to notice his best game (Seattle) was at OLB. ILB is a hard position to "get" unless you invest serious "on field" time.
4B. Carpenter is no Edwards in coverage. Maybe Burnett can be.
5. Well NT would not have yielded a starter but a quality back-up with potential would be nice....... Soliai, Thomas, Tyler, even Branch would have been great in this draft and we could have grabbed any of them.
6. You have admitted Ayodele or James are a Jerry Jones bust special. Glad to hear it finally from a fan.

LSUALUM99
04-30-2007, 12:34 PM
I give us a C for this year at best.

I don't like Spencer nearly as much as guys here do. I think he's a good pass rusher but he's a bit stiff to make a seamless move to OLB. I think that Carpenter is a far better OLB than Spencer. Spencer will be the better pass rusher but Carpenter is a better all around player.

We did not address the secondary until late and unless Isiah makes the transition to WR as smoothly as the Cowboys hope (I don't think it will be, but I could be wrong) then the WR position received zero help in that area.

The other players are ok, but we didn't address the major issues that this team had going into the draft but we didn't reach either. So, I'll give us a C.

I do not think you can grade on a curve because we traded to get next year's 1st from Cleveland. You will grade that draft including the first round pick so you can't count that in your assessment for this year.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 01:10 PM
Agree on the analysis Thule. I was harsher on the grade becuase I felt there WERE GUYS THERE for Jones to improve the team this year. He just blew it.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 01:29 PM
Free was a great pick, I don't see how you guys are hating on that pick. With an NFL strength coach (his only knock is strength) he could be a quality LT. He was great value as well. Marten and Free give us some good felxibility and depth for the future. Jerry said in the draft wrap-up press conference that they are now starting to draft o-lineman higher so the o-line isn't terrible like it was from 1999-2005. He said they have now put a new emphasis on the o-line, and that is good, because o-line is the most important part of football. Our starters on the o-line are great, and now we got the depth behind them as well. I am really excited about this season. I expect no worse than atleast being in the NFC Title game.

D-Unit
04-30-2007, 01:34 PM
I give us a C for this year at best.

I don't like Spencer nearly as much as guys here do. I think he's a good pass rusher but he's a bit stiff to make a seamless move to OLB. I think that Carpenter is a far better OLB than Spencer. Spencer will be the better pass rusher but Carpenter is a better all around player.

We did not address the secondary until late and unless Isiah makes the transition to WR as smoothly as the Cowboys hope (I don't think it will be, but I could be wrong) then the WR position received zero help in that area.

The other players are ok, but we didn't address the major issues that this team had going into the draft but we didn't reach either. So, I'll give us a C.

I do not think you can grade on a curve because we traded to get next year's 1st from Cleveland. You will grade that draft including the first round pick so you can't count that in your assessment for this year.
That's a fair assessment considering how much you don't like the Spencer selection. I know you were anxious to draft a CB there. I guess from the sound of it, our front office liked Ross, Merriweather and Spencer at 22. With Ross of the board to the Giants that left Merriweather and Spencer. I'm happy we were able to gain a first and jump back in for Spencer. I didn't want Houston, Wright or Wilson at 22 (the next 3 CBs that were selected) and Safety (Weddle) didn't warrant selection either.

I do believe that WR had value, but as I've said a hundred billion times, I don't believe you need elite, expensive WRs to win. Average to above average is sufficient. Developing WRs also often times takes years even for elite prospects. So naturally, the defensive selection of OLB was fine.

I still hold that NT was our biggest need in the draft and we failed to address it, so I probably need to factor that into my grade.

The development corners that we have are fine. I didn't think we needed a starter right away. Courtney Brown has nice potential and both give Wade players to mold and work with.

I loved the way we used the draft to seal up smaller needs on Day 2. We picked up 2 potential starters for 2007 in FB & K. Then addressed our depth at OL, CB and WR/QB/KR/PR/H (all in one - Stanback).

Our remaining concerns in my mind are possibly upgrades at NT, OG, RB and back ups at C, ILB, DE (I think we need a vet). We'll see how the season progresses as more concerns may arise... like FS. I really think Doug Freak can be our LT of the future. I do.

Bottom line, I think we should've found a way to upgrade NT and I wish we had moved up for a WR in round 2. Other than that, I came away extremely pleased with the job done.

D-Unit
04-30-2007, 01:35 PM
Agree on the analysis Thule. I was harsher on the grade becuase I felt there WERE GUYS THERE for Jones to improve the team this year. He just blew it.
I'm curious to know where you think we blew it and who we should've taken.

Macarthur
04-30-2007, 01:35 PM
I think the draft was good. Not great. I would have liked one of the WR's in the 2nd, but I'm willing to give that up for the 1 next year.

Spencer will be great. I think the OL will be very solid. I think this draft hinges on Steinbeck. If he becomes Crayton with 4.3 speed, then I think this draft is quite easily a great draft. I just think we have to wait a while to see how this one works out. It certainly isn't bad or horrible like many on here want to claim. I swear there are some that will hammer Jerry no matter what he does.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 02:06 PM
I agree. Is Stanback turns into Crayton with 4.3 speed, which he has, Crayton is only 4.58, this draft would go from good to amazing. Darren McFadden next year baby. I don't see how people are disgarding that. I am really excited about Stanback.

nrcirc
04-30-2007, 02:18 PM
I believe if we could draft Tank Tyler, Jason Hill, Jonathan Ware, Andy Alleman, or Marcus McCauley at 67, I will gave us a B.

22,895
04-30-2007, 02:18 PM
I normally agree with you BBD but to say we get a B because of next year's draft is a stretch. Next year's 1 is as yet to be a player. Who knows what that becomes. So, I just think the 1 is like saying "well we got an D" but I will give you and D+ cuz you may in the future do better on the test."

Not one player in this draft will play for the Cowboys in any meaningful way, including Spencer. If Wade does what I think he will the Front Seven will be much improved in pass rushing and the impact of a Rookie like Spencer will be minimal. Spencer was a luxury pick IMHO. AGAIN, he is the best rusher in the draft and he is a bette WOLB propsect than Ware. Ware is a much better SOLB and can actually cover a TE -- something Roy Williams can not do -- on first and second down.

The OL picks are good. Rather have my Tackle prospects than the Giants or any other team in the NFL. While Colombo and Flo are mediocre to say the least Free, Marten and McQuistan have talent. I think, baring injury, we have our answers at two key positions come 2008 and 2009.

[B]The rest of the picks are pure garbage. Jones blew it on the WR front, the NT front and the DB front. We have not improved 1 bit in these positions since last year. Not 1.

We will continue to get killed covering Backs and TEs. If you spread the field on us and we don't get a sack we are still too slow in the middle of the field.

Carpenter will need to move inside which is another "developmental" year if you ask me plus you now verified Jones made a mistake with either Ayodele or James' contracts.

If Fergie goes down forget the season or one of the starting WR -- we are in deep pooh. Hurd and Crayton are not 1s. Austin could be put is raw. Pick a name NT is not ready unless we get someone off the waiver wire or get Kris Jenkins.

While last year's Cowboy draft may not have picked the best players b/c we went with Bill Guys (i.e., poor athletes for the picks) at least it made sense. Every pick made sense and you could see how they could help the team THAT YEAR.

This year, outside of Spencer as a third down guy, I see nothing of value to the 2007 team.

Grade D+ to C.

Bingo! the posts robert_in_bigd have been on the money of what I would have said.

We passed up on good CB and WRs and also that big NT. Instead we got that Washington QB who never did anything when we (USC Trojans) played them, a FB and a Kicker. The O-Linemen that we got should be pretty good. Spencer
should be good I guess, but we have a lot of money invested into out LBs and one of them is gonna sit on the bench the majority of the time.

jdnoyes
04-30-2007, 02:24 PM
I agree with your assesment of spencer LSU, but I think his stiffness dosn't matter near as much in Wade's scheme as it would have in Bill's. I don't think Spencer will be asked to do much at all this year except rush the pasher which he should do very well. Carp on the other hand was a SAM more in the Parcells mould, a guy who was versitile against the run, rushing or in coverage. I think Wade got his guy to fit his scheme. Hopefully he'll still be creative and use Carps talents the best way possible. Just a different philosophy in how Bill likes his OLB's and how Wade does.

Paul
04-30-2007, 02:28 PM
Dear god I hate Skip Bayless.


Cowboys made the stupidest move in passing on Brady Quinn....I'm not sold on Tony "Romeo"... He's 5'11 and sidearm...they made a big mistake.


Why is this man on TV?

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 02:33 PM
OMG Paul you just read my mind. I was about to post the same thing. I was just watching first and 10, lmao. He is the dumbest analyst I have ever seen. TOny Romo is 6'2 1/2'' and has an over the top release. How do these idiots actually get hired. He also said that Ginn will be a start and it was a great pick at 9. He is the worst analyst I have ever seen. When we have McFadden or Stewart next year, I will be laughing in there faces. We easily had a top 5 draft, and he is callling it the worst draft. LMAO. Just wait until Spencer is D.R.O.Y.

Oh and LSU, why are you so obsessed with getting a CB? We are fine there. Plus, don't look past Courtney Brown, that kid could turn into something. Our DBs are all fine, we just need pressure, and now with the addition of Spencer, Ware only getting better and better, and Wade Phillips' schemes, we are going to own. I expect a top 3 defense, and a top 5 total in INT's. I don't think at CB is necessary even next year. I hope we go RB with the cleveland's pick (McFadden or Stewart) and WR with our pick (Sweed or Doucet).

Modano
04-30-2007, 02:35 PM
Bingo! the posts robert_in_bigd have been on the money of what I would have said.

We passed up on good CB and WRs and also that big NT. Instead we got that Washington QB who never did anything when we (USC Trojans) played them, a FB and a Kicker. The O-Linemen that we got should be pretty good. Spencer
should be good I guess, but we have a lot of money invested into out LBs and one of them is gonna sit on the bench the majority of the time.

Stanback will play WR.

LSUALUM99
04-30-2007, 02:38 PM
While I couldn't agree more with the assessment that Skip Bayless is a total moron; to say that the Cowboys had a top 5 draft is not something I even remotely agree with.

Again, we traded out of the 1st round (we did go back into the round later) for NEXT year's pick. That means that next year's draft will be looked at as better because of it, but you can't give us credit this year and then next year say it was an 'A' because we got McFadden. That's giving credit twice.

I think we had a very average draft this year but set ourselves up for a potentially very good draft next year.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 02:39 PM
LSU, why do you want a CB so bad?

With the pressure we will have this year, Newman is easily a pro-bowler, and Henry should be one of the best #2's in the league.

LSUALUM99
04-30-2007, 02:44 PM
LSU, why do you want a CB so bad?

With the pressure we will have this year, Newman is easily a pro-bowler, and Henry should be one of the best #2's in the league.


Because CB is the most premium position in the NFL. If you can draft one and he becomes a super star you save 50 million on the cap space and get alot more freedom in your defensive scheme.

Pressure on the QB is essential, arguably the most essential thing you need to be successfull on defense. However, there are alot of different ways to go about that. CB on the other hand, there isn't another way to play man to man than having a CB on an offensive player.

CB is a very difficult position to 'substitute' for. It's right up there with QB or LT.

Yes, Newman is good. But for some reason you seem to think that he'll never get hurt or that a great CB couldn't get actual playing time.

For instance, since we see lots of 3 wr sets wouldn't it be smart to have ANOTHER good CB to cover the slot guy since none of our safeties can and Aaron Glenn is in his last year on this team?

You know that term, BPA? That's what drafting a CB is if he's there. With scarcity, you should take him because he'll earn his paycheck from day one.

nrcirc
04-30-2007, 02:48 PM
A "D".

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/columnists/rgosselin/stories/043007dnspogosselingrades.3827e9f.html

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 02:50 PM
I am not against a CB, but I don't really think we need one, and who would you have taken at 22 or 26 that was BPA? Not Chris Houston, he was so overhyped, and his selection proved it. This was a horrible CB draft. Plus, we are going to give a mega contract to Terence Newman this year. And I think we will go offense with both of our #1's next year. Probably WR and RB.

Modano
04-30-2007, 02:53 PM
A "D".

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/spt/columnists/rgosselin/stories/043007dnspogosselingrades.3827e9f.html

He gave us a D and Philly a C? No way Philly had a better draft than us. They had serious problem at CB and LB and they didn't resolve them by any means.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 02:53 PM
Thats why I never trust experts.

duckseason
04-30-2007, 02:59 PM
While I couldn't agree more with the assessment that Skip Bayless is a total moron; to say that the Cowboys had a top 5 draft is not something I even remotely agree with.

Again, we traded out of the 1st round (we did go back into the round later) for NEXT year's pick. That means that next year's draft will be looked at as better because of it, but you can't give us credit this year and then next year say it was an 'A' because we got McFadden. That's giving credit twice.

I think we had a very average draft this year but set ourselves up for a potentially very good draft next year.

We surely need to factor in the raping of the Browns in our overall draft grade. Just because the pick will be made next year doesn't mean that we don't deserve credit for it today. The solution to the whole giving credit twice issue- would be to just temper our praise next year. Our expectations will rightfully be higher going in, and we should grade our draft as such. If we come away with an average draft despite having the extra 1st, then we deserve a low grade. If we do something spectacular with the extra pick, then it needs to be tempered with the fact that we indeed had an extra pick. And we should all look back on this draft and be thankful that we had the foresight and patience to cultivate something great. There's just no way that we can't include this coup in this years grade. It was the highlight of our draft.

Modano
04-30-2007, 03:02 PM
Because CB is the most premium position in the NFL. If you can draft one and he becomes a super star you save 50 million on the cap space and get alot more freedom in your defensive scheme.

Pressure on the QB is essential, arguably the most essential thing you need to be successfull on defense. However, there are alot of different ways to go about that. CB on the other hand, there isn't another way to play man to man than having a CB on an offensive player.

CB is a very difficult position to 'substitute' for. It's right up there with QB or LT.

Yes, Newman is good. But for some reason you seem to think that he'll never get hurt or that a great CB couldn't get actual playing time.

For instance, since we see lots of 3 wr sets wouldn't it be smart to have ANOTHER good CB to cover the slot guy since none of our safeties can and Aaron Glenn is in his last year on this team?

You know that term, BPA? That's what drafting a CB is if he's there. With scarcity, you should take him because he'll earn his paycheck from day one.

You know that I want a CB too, even in round 1.
But I still give us a B. First because you have to consider that we pick the guy we wanted plus adding a next year top 15 selection.
I like Spencer, I wasn't the biggest fan of drafting an OLB, but with Carpenter moving inside I like the idea of having two beastly rushers. Wade defense is all based on putting pressure with your OLB.
Then we picked two great OLs who could be starter. Free is a a great prospect, Kiper thinks that he has a great chance of being a very good LT. Marten is a mauler and he can be our future RT. With those guys we could be set at OT for years to come (hopefully). Philadelphia made his great line by drafting player not to contribute immediately. Herremans and their C (I forgot his name) weren't starters for their first year, now they are both good players. They drafted last year Justice to be their LT of the future.
I wanted a WR too, but with all the best guys gone by our third pick, I don't if we were able to pick a future starter. We have good #3 and #4 in Crayton, Austin and Hurd. So I like the pick of Stanback because he can be a different type of player.
Maybe we should have add a CB in the third instead of Marten but there were CB with good starting potential avaible?

Number 10
04-30-2007, 03:36 PM
Alright I am hoping to eventually get to every team in the league, but I'm starting with the NFC East teams.

I liked the Anthony Spencer pick, gives a nice compliment to Ware and I think Carpenter is better suited inside...is that the plan? Anyway, Spencer would scare me a little bit though because I question his speed on the field, looked slow to me at times on tape.

Really liked the Marten pick, I would have taken him here for sure int he 3rd had be been there. Everyone lables him a RT for sure, but I think there is some LT potential in him, he really impressed me at that spot this past season. Do you think he'll be the starter there (LT) in 2008?

Stanback was a pretty bad pick IMO. I really don't see him projecting that well at WR but due to a lack of tape on him catching balls and running routes, it's hard to really evaluate the pick. I think the Cowboys could have used a WR with more promise there but it's not like any rook at that point was going to break into the top 3 WR on the depth chart anyway.

Never liked Free....many Giants fans asked about him leading up to the draft and I never really saw a lot of promise in him. Should be able to give you depth though and as a 4th round pick, you can't be upset with that. I don't see him ever being a starter at the NFL level though.

Folk...honestly I don't scout kickers, I just go by what I read on the internet about them. From what I read, I would have taken Crosby there but not a big deal. Is he expected to make the roster?

Anderson....did you really need a FB? Last year's FB is slipping my mind but I thought he did a find job last year.

Brown was a nice sleeper pick, many experts had him ranked pretty high. I think you could have used a CB a little earlier though, perhaps instead of Free. Don't know much about Ball other than remember him getting burnt by Rutgers a couple times, but 7th rounders....eh.

I gave you guys a B-....thought you could have used a better WR and CB but I like the depth along the line you added and Spencer could end up being one of the better players from this class if he gets a little faster...Phillips may have a field day with him.

Also, who are your backup QBs? Oh and I did not equate next year's 1st rounder into the equation....but obviously it will give you the extra edge in next year's draft.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 03:40 PM
Free is an amazing pick. His only knock is strength, and everyone builds strength once they hit the NFL. He is the front runner to be our LT in 2008 IMO.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 03:42 PM
Kiper gave us a B by the way.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 03:59 PM
I'm curious to know where you think we blew it and who we should've taken.

Assuming we keep Cleveland 2nd and Spencer is gone by 36 ......... could swap out some stuff and get similar.......

36- Sidney Rice (WR)
53- Gerald Alexander (S)
87- Paul Soliai (NT)
122- Doug Free (LT)
159- Mike Coe (CB)
195- Jacob Ford (OLB)
200- Jordan Palmer (QB)
212- Ben Patrick (TE)
234- Brandon Siler (ILB)
237- 370lbs Thomas (NT)

Assuming we keep order we actually used and try validate actual picks ..

26 -- Spencer (OLB)
67 -- Paul Williams (WR) or Jacoby Jones (WR)
103 -- Paul Soliai (NT)
122 -- Doug Free (LT)
195- Jordan Pamer (QB)
200- Courntey Brown (CB)
234- Brandon Siler (ILB)
237- 370lbs Thomas (NT)

All these guys where around for him

Macarthur
04-30-2007, 04:02 PM
Because CB is the most premium position in the NFL. If you can draft one and he becomes a super star you save 50 million on the cap space and get alot more freedom in your defensive scheme.

No. QB is the premium position. I would put CB right there with pass rusher as 2a or 2b, and LT as 3.



Pressure on the QB is essential, arguably the most essential thing you need to be successfull on defense. However, there are alot of different ways to go about that. CB on the other hand, there isn't another way to play man to man than having a CB on an offensive player.

Sure you must have a CB, but a good rush makes a CB better. A good CB doesn't make your rush any better.



You know that term, BPA? That's what drafting a CB is if he's there. With scarcity, you should take him because he'll earn his paycheck from day one.

I think they liked Ross, a lot. He probably was their choice behind Spencer.

D-Unit
04-30-2007, 04:30 PM
Several interesting items discussed. Thanks for the discussion guys.


On not drafting a top CB in Rnd 1...
- There's no way in hell I don't make that deal with CLE so that I can draft a CB at 22. After Aaron Ross at 20, no CB went until 41 (Houston). The value was not there.

On not drafting a CB in Rnd 2...
- We passed on Eric Wright here. While I think Wright has better potential, in all honestly, I think Courtney Brown has just as much of a chance to succeed... without the character concerns.
- By trading down, we picked up an extra 4th. I don't know if we would've ended up with Doug Free without the trade down. I'm really happy with Free.

On needing a CB because we fact 3 WR sets...
- You're essentially talking about the Nickel Back. We had other bigger concerns than NB. DE and OT certainly fitting the bill. I think between Aaron Glenn, Jacques Reeves and Courtney Brown we have sufficient NB options for 2007.

On CB being a means of helping the pass rush...
- While I definately agree, we already have capable starters at CB while we didn't at OLB. Ellis is not the answer. Carpenter will be a great ILB. James and Ayodele are both very nice complementary players. Carpenter has the chance to be a STAR. Our defense NEEDS that Bad Ass Middle LB and I fully believe Carp can be that guy. Our "Urlacher" in the Middle. I love what he can bring at SILB because first of all, he is smart, he can diagnose plays quickly... secondly he has the size to take on blockers, tall enough to see where the play is going, he can stuff the run, he can cover and what I am most excited to see is him providing the BLITZ from the INSIDE! I can't wait!!! With Ware and Spencer attacking from the outside and Carp attacking from the inside, that is just DEADLY.

On drafting a CB to put us in good financial cap status...
- We're already spending the money on Henry. T-New WILL BE resigned. We better not be in the mind set that we need to draft a CB because we plan to let Newman walk. So unless the idea is to cut or restructure Henry's contract, we really cannot afford to spend more than a Day 2 pick's salary on CB. Sure we'd love to increase the depth talent, and I think we did ok.


The only legit argument out there is us passing on Eric Wright in Round 2, which would have cost us James Marten and Doug Free or us passing on AJ Davis, Tanard Jackson, John Bowie or Fred Bennett in Round 4. I'm not ready to cry over any of those guys.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 04:39 PM
Stanback:

http://play.rbn.com/play.asx?url=nfl/nfl/open/cowboys/wmdemand/player_video_stanback_042907.wmv&proto=mms?mswmext=.asx

I love it!

D-Unit
04-30-2007, 04:55 PM
Stanback:

http://play.rbn.com/play.asx?url=nfl/nfl/open/cowboys/wmdemand/player_video_stanback_042907.wmv&proto=mms?mswmext=.asx

I love it!
Hmmm... this could get interesting... I don't think we've ever had a QB draw play. Now we do. I like the way the guy makes things happen with the ball in his hands. I hope JG can use him right. Otherwise, he's just another Woody Dantzler.

LSUALUM99
04-30-2007, 05:32 PM
Macarthur,

Acutally CB is the most premium position in the NFL. It's the highest average salary and out of 32 teams, at least 15 of them have Good / Average startering QBs. In fact, there are about 20 decent starting QB's in the league. However, there are not 40 decent starting CB's (2 per team). So that means that it's harder to get a good CB than a good QB.

Don't confuse 'premium' with most important.

It's very important to get a good RB, but it's not that hard to find one. So there isn't a premium on them. It's very hard to find a good CB. That's the difference.

D-Unit,

Well, my issue is that no one drafted on the OL solves an immediate need. There is an immediate need to fix one of the WORST (24th in the league) pass defenses in the NFL. For all the talk about pass rush, we still ended up at the league average in sacks AND we have Bobby Carpenter who we drafted for OLB who has pass rush ability to plug in. I don't hate the Spencer pick, but there are other options currently on the team that could help the pass rush. There are no other options at CB that can help our pass defense.

The real key is Hamlin. That signing makes or breaks this draft. If Hamlin comes in and helps stabilize the pass defense then there was no need to get a DB. If he doesn't then we have few options currently on the team to fix it.

That is the reason why I say if we don't finish with a top 10 pass defense then the draft is a failure.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 05:42 PM
Think about what Stanback could do. We can do some QB runs and draws, then he fakes the draw, pulls up, and hits T.O. or Glenn for a TD. He does have a cannon.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 05:51 PM
Achilles33 you have a vivid imagination if you see Stanback doing anything of meaning in 07 or 08.

Im_a_Romosexual
04-30-2007, 06:07 PM
Hmmm... this could get interesting... I don't think we've ever had a QB draw play. Now we do. I like the way the guy makes things happen with the ball in his hands. I hope JG can use him right. Otherwise, he's just another Woody Dantzler.

BP had Romo do a QB Draw for a 2 point conversion and other goal line situations

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 06:13 PM
But Stanback is way faster and more athletic. And no robert in big D, stanback will have an immediate impact in certain situations. Like Brad Smith, but better. He could do some draws and keeps, and then fake a draw or hand-off, pull up, and hit TO or Terry for a 60 yard TD.

Paul
04-30-2007, 06:24 PM
I wasn't exatcly sure if Achilles was really Tnew or not, but It's more the obvious now.

fryman
04-30-2007, 06:29 PM
Stanback will have as much impact as Skyler Green did.

I hope he turns out, but I doubt he will. He really isn't very athletic for a WR, and he isn't good at QB. Also he wasn't productive running in college. If you put him in near the goal line I wouldn't trust him throwing, so teams will key in on the run.

Achilles33
04-30-2007, 06:40 PM
Stanback is a great athlete. He was drafted in baseball last year and hadn't played since high school. He missed qualifying for nationals last year at washington in the 100 meter by .02. And he wasd a great runner in college. He will have a much better impact than Skyler Green did.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 06:55 PM
Ok, we are discussing a 3rd string QB / 5th string WR. / Unemployed Football Player.

Fascinating. Can we move along?

Im_a_Romosexual
04-30-2007, 06:55 PM
could you get worse than green?

Staubach12
04-30-2007, 07:20 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Great pick. He'll let Carp play inside, and he'll be one heck of a pass-rusher, and a player on our team that should start soon. I like it, especially with the trade for the Browns' 1st next year. A

2. James Marten - Wasn't a huge fan. I thought Jason Hill would have been a much better pick here. I really don't see Marten turning into anything. D

3. Isaiah Stanback - I like this pick. It was a bit of a surprise, but he's a great athelete, and I think he could play QB in this league, and even if he can't, we can always move him to WR. B-

4. Doug Free - Great pick. Our LT of the future here. He should be starting in a year or two. A

5. Nick Folk - Wasn't in love with this one. I wanted Crosby more here. I don't see why we'd pass on him just because he had a bad Combine. Oh well... D

6. Deon Anderson - Meh. I really don't like this, either. I thought Hoyte did fine at FB last year, and we should keep him there. Anderson isn't exactly spectacular, either. D-

7. Courtney Brown - Spectacular pick here. I love Brown, and I think he might even be our #2 in a few years. He's got the tools, now we just need to develop him. A

8. Alan Ball - Didn't like this. He's not really that great IMO, and not really worth getting drafted even in the 7th. F

Grade - C+

Texico From Mexico
04-30-2007, 10:51 PM
Dear god I hate Skip Bayless.



Why is this man on TV?

Because he is 100% right on that issue. I guess you people have not been watching the same Romo as me. Bad feet, Bad mechanics....sure is can pull things out of his butt on the run...but so could Steve Young. The difference, Young was a leader and a pocket passer. Romo = Neither. All he will ever be is a backup QB. This team had a chance to groom a true blue chip qb and passed......they will regret this in the long run.

22,895
04-30-2007, 11:18 PM
Dr. Z from SI gave us a C in our Draft.

D-Unit
04-30-2007, 11:19 PM
Because he is 100% right on that issue. I guess you people have not been watching the same Romo as me. Bad feet, Bad mechanics....sure is can pull things out of his butt on the run...but so could Steve Young. The difference, Young was a leader and a pocket passer. Romo = Neither. All he will ever be is a backup QB. This team had a chance to groom a true blue chip qb and passed......they will regret this in the long run.
How bout you do us all a favor and just go away until that "long run" comes to pass?

Romo has bad feet? LOL. His escapability in the pocket is one of his biggest strengths. Don't even start about mechanics being a determining factor in the success or definition of a QB. JaMarcus Russell has terrible mechanics and was the consensus #1 QB and #1 pick of the draft... should I go on and start to name all the successful QBs in the league who didn't have perfect mechanics? Ryan Leaf had good mechanics... Where did that take him?

fryman
04-30-2007, 11:33 PM
How bout you do us all a favor and just go away until that "long run" comes to pass?

Romo has bad feet? LOL. His escapability in the pocket is one of his biggest strengths. Don't even start about mechanics being a determining factor in the success or definition of a QB. JaMarcus Russell has terrible mechanics and was the consensus #1 QB and #1 pick of the draft... should I go on and start to name all the successful QBs in the league who didn't have perfect mechanics? Ryan Leaf had good mechanics... Where did that take him?

also many scouts say that Quinn has bad footwork in the pocket, and some mechanics problems that they don't think can be fixed.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 11:41 PM
Let us hold on a second here on mechanics and feet ..... when you are JeMarcus RUssell and have a CANON plus good touch plus accurate plus 6'6 .... mechanics are not as important.

... when you are Tony Romo, 6'2 with an adequate arm. Mechanics are very important. So is lifting. Ask Tom Brady. He was manufactured in New England. Once he got his feet together his velocity got better, his accuracy got better and once he hit the weights his arm strength improved.

For Tony, being efficient mechanically and well conditioned physically is very important and a major improvement need of his.

robert_in_bigd
04-30-2007, 11:43 PM
Quinn's biggest issue are his feet. He does have bad footwork which for all of Charlie Weiss blah blah hype did not improve much. If Quinn cleans up his footwork he drastically improves his accuracy and goes from very good to great arm.

jdnoyes
05-01-2007, 12:46 AM
Because he is 100% right on that issue. I guess you people have not been watching the same Romo as me. Bad feet, Bad mechanics....sure is can pull things out of his butt on the run...but so could Steve Young. The difference, Young was a leader and a pocket passer. Romo = Neither. All he will ever be is a backup QB. This team had a chance to groom a true blue chip qb and passed......they will regret this in the long run.

Why are you even a fan of this team, all you have done for over a year is complain about every player and coach on the team. Who on the team do you like? I can't imagine being a fan and having such a horrible outlook on my own team. This is the time of year when people are positive about the future of their team, heck even Browns fans have hope now. It's a great time to be a football fan, we're all in the running for the superbowl.

Weren't you banned from this site anyways?

D-Unit
05-01-2007, 01:52 AM
Let us hold on a second here on mechanics and feet ..... when you are JeMarcus RUssell and have a CANON plus good touch plus accurate plus 6'6 .... mechanics are not as important.

... when you are Tony Romo, 6'2 with an adequate arm. Mechanics are very important. So is lifting. Ask Tom Brady. He was manufactured in New England. Once he got his feet together his velocity got better, his accuracy got better and once he hit the weights his arm strength improved.

For Tony, being efficient mechanically and well conditioned physically is very important and a major improvement need of his.
I don't care. Nobody in the league is without improvement. Romo is legit. He's our QB and there ain't no way in hell I will be regretting passing on Quinn. If we had drafted him, I would've been PISSED OFF!

leroyisgod
05-01-2007, 08:12 AM
Let's look at Brett Favre for a second. Romo and Favre have a lot of the same similarities. The only thing that Favre has over Romo is the arm. That's not saying that Romo's arm isn't sufficient. He has a pretty good arm, I just wouldn't call it a cannon.

robert_in_bigd
05-01-2007, 08:52 AM
I don't care. Nobody in the league is without improvement. Romo is legit. He's our QB and there ain't no way in hell I will be regretting passing on Quinn. If we had drafted him, I would've been PISSED OFF!


Did I say otherwise D-Unit? I think you need to speak to Texico -- he hates Romo. I like Romo but he is still raw in spite of his ridiculous Pro Bowl selection

robert_in_bigd
05-01-2007, 08:54 AM
Tony is the type of player that needs to be proficient at the kraft. He is not the "talent is bursting all over" type player.

Comparing Tony to Russell or Elway or Aikman or Favre in terms of physical skills is not fair to Tony.

Tony can be just as good and succssful but he needs to work at his kraft harder and smarter than others.

herniateddisc
05-21-2009, 11:18 PM
I can't wait the day you will be forced to admit that you were wrong, because Spencer will start for us.

And you have always the same type of argument. Always. We're too slow, our Safeties are crappy, our OTs are crappy etc etc.

1. Hamlin is not a bad cover safety. He had a bad 2006 season, but before that he was regarded as a good cover safety.
2. Colombo had a great season for us, there's NO WAY you can say he wasn't good. And Flozell didn't have a great year, because he was incosistent. But he had like 8-9 great games. He was still recovering from an acl injury, I think this year he will play bettere.
3. Say what you want about Roy Williams but he's a true playmaker. If the pass rush will increase he will a lot of occasions to make big plays.
4. If Carpenter will play inside that doesn't mean tha it will another developmental year or so on. Carpenter practiced as both ILB and OLB for all of last year. He can make an impact from day 1. Dqwell Jackson played very good for the Browns last year, and he was a rookie with no experience in Crenell defense. And we can make the same examples for a lot of rookies.
And with Carpenter inside you won't be able to use the "we are too slow in the middle of the field" argument. Because Ayodele/James will be the run thumper (every 3-4 needs one) and Carpenter will play in a Donnie Edwards position.

About the NT. Tell me one guy we could have picked that could have make an impact. The only legit NT prospect was Soliai, and there were big question marks about him.

Oldie but goodie.

herniateddisc
05-21-2009, 11:19 PM
Let us hold on a second here on mechanics and feet ..... when you are JeMarcus RUssell and have a CANON plus good touch plus accurate plus 6'6 .... mechanics are not as important.

... when you are Tony Romo, 6'2 with an adequate arm. Mechanics are very important. So is lifting. Ask Tom Brady. He was manufactured in New England. Once he got his feet together his velocity got better, his accuracy got better and once he hit the weights his arm strength improved.

For Tony, being efficient mechanically and well conditioned physically is very important and a major improvement need of his.

Oldie but goodie.

herniateddisc
05-21-2009, 11:20 PM
Assuming we keep Cleveland 2nd and Spencer is gone by 36 ......... could swap out some stuff and get similar.......

36- Sidney Rice (WR)
53- Gerald Alexander (S)
87- Paul Soliai (NT)
122- Doug Free (LT)
159- Mike Coe (CB)
195- Jacob Ford (OLB)
200- Jordan Palmer (QB)
212- Ben Patrick (TE)
234- Brandon Siler (ILB)
237- 370lbs Thomas (NT)

Assuming we keep order we actually used and try validate actual picks ..

26 -- Spencer (OLB)
67 -- Paul Williams (WR) or Jacoby Jones (WR)
103 -- Paul Soliai (NT)
122 -- Doug Free (LT)
195- Jordan Pamer (QB)
200- Courntey Brown (CB)
234- Brandon Siler (ILB)
237- 370lbs Thomas (NT)

All these guys where around for him

Oldie but goodie.

E-Man
05-22-2009, 05:44 PM
Not to be on anyone's side here, but why are you bumping these threads? What do you hope to gain outside of internet pride? I think you're only hurting your cause here.

herniateddisc
05-23-2009, 10:13 PM
I think you're only hurting your cause here.

You mean showing history to prove a point?

I really have no cause other than to call a spade a spade. But I really can't stand how intellectually dishonest and hyper-sensitive (younger) people are today.

This whole debate is a microcosm of society -- one half says whatever they want no matter if it is unicorns and pixie dust then they attack the other side for calling it unicorns and pixie dust .... then once it is proven over time they are/were wrong -- the pixie dust/unicorn dupes simply change the goal posts, deny what they wrote/said earlier and claim they were right all along.

Sad. Make a statement, insult the opposition, lie about them, eventually get proven wrong, deny you said it, say you were mis-understood, change the debate even when facts are presented, and then repeat cycle.

But it is what it is. And facts are nettlesome things.

E-Man
05-23-2009, 10:33 PM
You mean showing history to prove a point?

I really have no cause other than to call a spade a spade. But I really can't stand how intellectually dishonest and hyper-sensitive (younger) people are today.

This whole debate is a microcosm of society -- one half says whatever they want no matter if it is unicorns and pixie dust then they attack the other side for calling it unicorns and pixie dust .... then once it is proven over time they are/were wrong -- the pixie dust/unicorn dupes simply change the goal posts, deny what they wrote/said earlier and claim they were right all along.

Sad. Make a statement, insult the opposition, lie about them, eventually get proven wrong, deny you said it, say you were mis-understood, change the debate even when facts are presented, and then repeat cycle.

But it is what it is. And facts are nettlesome things.

It's just that you have a bad reputation form what I see as an antagonizer man. It's cool that you were right, but you have this us against them mentality. We're all fans of the same team, and at the end of the day we want the Cowboys to win. I want some peace in here ya know. Debates are cool as long as no one gets too prideful. We're all right and wrong about things........except Skip Bayless. He's always wrong, no matter how right he is.:D

Gribble
05-24-2009, 01:11 PM
I normally agree with you BBD but to say we get a B because of next year's draft is a stretch. Next year's 1 is as yet to be a player. Who knows what that becomes. So, I just think the 1 is like saying "well we got an D" but I will give you and D+ cuz you may in the future do better on the test."

Not one player in this draft will play for the Cowboys in any meaningful way, including Spencer. If Wade does what I think he will the Front Seven will be much improved in pass rushing and the impact of a Rookie like Spencer will be minimal. Spencer was a luxury pick IMHO. AGAIN, he is the best rusher in the draft and he is a bette WOLB propsect than Ware. Ware is a much better SOLB and can actually cover a TE -- something Roy Williams can not do -- on first and second down.

The OL picks are good. Rather have my Tackle prospects than the Giants or any other team in the NFL. While Colombo and Flo are mediocre to say the least Free, Marten and McQuistan have talent. I think, baring injury, we have our answers at two key positions come 2008 and 2009.

The rest of the picks are pure garbage. Jones blew it on the WR front, the NT front and the DB front. We have not improved 1 bit in these positions since last year. Not 1.

We will continue to get killed covering Backs and TEs. If you spread the field on us and we don't get a sack we are still too slow in the middle of the field.

Carpenter will need to move inside which is another "developmental" year if you ask me plus you now verified Jones made a mistake with either Ayodele or James' contracts.

If Fergie goes down forget the season or one of the starting WR -- we are in deep pooh. Hurd and Crayton are not 1s. Austin could be put is raw. Pick a name NT is not ready unless we get someone off the waiver wire or get Kris Jenkins.

While last year's Cowboy draft may not have picked the best players b/c we went with Bill Guys (i.e., poor athletes for the picks) at least it made sense. Every pick made sense and you could see how they could help the team THAT YEAR.

This year, outside of Spencer as a third down guy, I see nothing of value to the 2007 team.

Grade D+ to C.

Oldie but goodie?

DeCrunkMAn
05-24-2009, 06:18 PM
1. Anthony Spencer - Great Pick. Addressed a big need. Serious DROY Candidate. Bright Future in Dallas. A+


To get an A+: Move up in Rnd 2 for Dwayne Jarrett

for some reason this made me laugh real hard

D-Unit
05-24-2009, 06:34 PM
for some reason this made me laugh real hard
HAHAHAHAHA. That makes me laugh real hard too.

Sadly, he's only shown flashes and has been a nonfactor splitting time with Ellis. DROY... LOOOOOL HAHAHAHAha.

Future still bright though! :p

As for Jarrett.... Wow, he's been good for nothing. I was wrong wrong wrong. Dead Wrong.

herniateddisc
05-24-2009, 07:28 PM
Oldie but goodie?
'Yeah, oldie.

I have no problem with what I get wrong as well as right.

herniateddisc
05-24-2009, 07:29 PM
It's just that you have a bad reputation form what I see as an antagonizer man.

With all due respect, the antagonizers where the ones saying Madden, idiot, et al.

But yo, great weekend.