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View Full Version : 2007 will be the last year mcnabb is in an eagle uniform


Shockey80
05-02-2007, 01:24 AM
says sal palentonio


If you have comcast cable go to on demand and watch the taping of daily news live if your in the philadelphia general area is where I saw this.

But Palentonio says he is due 6.3 million next year, followed by 10 million in 2009. He also says their cap wouldn't take much of a hit if they release him after this season.

It wouldnt shock me to be honest

SFbear
05-02-2007, 01:59 AM
I don't believe it. Still Rex Grossman is an FA after this season...hmmmm. Come back to Chicago McNabb. =)

Shiver
05-02-2007, 02:02 AM
It depends on how he does this year, in my opinion. To say anything right now smacks of overreaction.

255979119
05-02-2007, 02:09 AM
If he is healthy and plays well he'll retire with Philly.

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 08:28 AM
One thing about Philly.....they have no remorse cutting players. It could be anybody, they'll cut you if they feel you don't provide any immediate results for them.

Theres no player loyalty. In a way its good, thats why they stay so competitive.

Philly also has an uncanny ability of knowing when a player is washed up, and cutting them at the perfect time. So if Philly cuts McNabb, its because he's done for.

If thats truely part of their gameplan, which isn't out of the question, then the Kolb pick looks like a wise decision.

Jughead10
05-02-2007, 08:35 AM
The Kolb pick is wise anyway. I said before that if McNabb spends a good portion of this season injured he is done in Philly forever.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 08:38 AM
What player has left Philly as a cut and had a productive career afterwards? You could argue Troy Vincent and Trotter, but not significant. Trotter only returned to god-like form when he came back to the Eagles in 2004. The team traded Hollis Thomas, who had a great year for New Orleans. Other than that, they seem to have done very well with letting players go. I do think that Rod Hood and Michael Lewis will have success, but they were signed to above-market value contracts that the Eagles wouldn't pay.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 08:41 AM
As an Eagles fan, I'm looking at reality. McNabb has helped rebuild the franchise, and he still has the smarts and the accuracy and the arm to make a difference. However, his inability to stay healthy is a big concern. As I have mentioned, the last time he played a full season in the NFL was 2003. He has had 3 major surgeries in the last 5 years and he is now 31. It is very possible that his years of max production are over.

Personally, I want Donnie to come back and dominate. I'd like to see him get 2 more years as an Eagle because I think Kolb will take that long (at least) to be groomed. The team can win right now with a healthy McNabb (assuming quality playcalling from Reid and Mornenweig). I'm not going to say he's done before the season even begins.

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 08:43 AM
As an Eagles fan, I'm looking at reality. McNabb has helped rebuild the franchise, and he still has the smarts and the accuracy and the arm to make a difference. However, his inability to stay healthy is a big concern. As I have mentioned, the last time he played a full season in the NFL was 2003. He has had 3 major surgeries in the last 5 years and he is now 31. It is very possible that his years of max production are over.

Personally, I want Donnie to come back and dominate. I'd like to see him get 2 more years as an Eagle because I think Kolb will take that long (at least) to be groomed. The team can win right now with a healthy McNabb (assuming quality playcalling from Reid and Mornenweig). I'm not going to say he's done before the season even begins.

If Philly cuts McNabb, being a Giants fan and knowing Philly decently well, its almost a guarantee that McNabb is done. Maybe not done done, but he will not be a reliable week in week out qb.

I still like Beck better than Kolb though.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 08:46 AM
If the Eagles cut McNabb, where does he even go to play? Most teams out there have younger QB's starting and earning their stripes. I'm not sure he can go many places and start. That will help seal his fate as well.

Nitschke-Hawk
05-02-2007, 09:30 AM
He'd be a perfect fit in Green Bay when Favre retires. I'll take a top 5 QB.

portermvp84
05-02-2007, 09:43 AM
I think he'll have a good come back season and put up some good numbers. He'll keep his job there's no way the Eagles would release their franchise quarterback.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 09:45 AM
McNabb could go to Green Bay, but would he really want to go in there and have to win over the fans after Favre retires? Talk about an absolute no-win situation...

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 09:45 AM
I think he'll have a good come back season and put up some good numbers. He'll keep his job there's no way the Eagles would release their franchise quarterback.

If he plays all 16 games and plays well, there is no way the Eagles let him go after 2007-2008. That is pretty much a guarantee. As I said earlier, I'd like McNabb to stay with the Eagles for another 2 seasons.

Sportsfan486
05-02-2007, 10:14 AM
McNabb could go to Green Bay, but would he really want to go in there and have to win over the fans after Favre retires? Talk about an absolute no-win situation...

Packer fans are a supportive and positive group, as long as he showed up and played we'd love to have him.

*editted for safety*

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 10:18 AM
I really don't think they'd necessarily welcome him as warmly and as quickly as you say. Following in the shoes of an all-time great is very difficult. I don't think Donnie would have as easy a time there as you think.

Sniper
05-02-2007, 10:27 AM
If the Eagles continue their playcalling as it was during the Garcia era, McNabb will be fine and may even play out his contract. The beating he takes as a result of passing 65-70% of the time is too much and is the main reason he gets hurt so much. Now that Reid realizes Westbrook is the best playmaker in this offense and Tony Hunt can between the tackles, we could see a consistent rushing attack from the Birds.

umphrey
05-02-2007, 10:28 AM
Trust me, most Packers fans are expecting Rodgers as their next QB so if we got McNabb people would love him.

You also have to remember that we've watched Favre set the interception record.

FloridaFootball
05-02-2007, 10:28 AM
Theres also reports from ESPN that the eagles are no longer negotiating contracts with McNabb.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 10:31 AM
If the Eagles continue their playcalling as it was during the Garcia era, McNabb will be fine and may even play out his contract. The beating he takes as a result of passing 65-70% of the time is too much and is the main reason he gets hurt so much. Now that Reid realizes Westbrook is the best playmaker in this offense and Tony Hunt can between the tackles, we could see a consistent rushing attack from the Birds.

I agree on most points here. However, McNabb wasn't taking a ton of shots when he was throwing 65-70% of the time in 2006. The ACL tear occurred on a simple run out of bounds. The ACL was frayed and just snapped. It was a long time coming, I think. Regardless, using the run 45% of the time to set up the pass and to control the clock is a good strategy regardless. I think we'll see a 3-headed monster in 2007 with Westbrook, Tapeh, and Buckhalter/Hunt. It will be very interesting.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 10:32 AM
Theres also reports from ESPN that the eagles are no longer negotiating contracts with McNabb.

What the heck does that mean? McNabb is signed through 2013. What kind of negotiations would the team be going through right now?

Number 10
05-02-2007, 10:33 AM
If he suffers another serious injury and Kolb impresses during practices, I would not be suprised.

But both of those would have to happen.

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 10:36 AM
I agree on most points here. However, McNabb wasn't taking a ton of shots when he was throwing 65-70% of the time in 2006. The ACL tear occurred on a simple run out of bounds. The ACL was frayed and just snapped. It was a long time coming, I think. Regardless, using the run 45% of the time to set up the pass and to control the clock is a good strategy regardless. I think we'll see a 3-headed monster in 2007 with Westbrook, Tapeh, and Buckhalter/Hunt. It will be very interesting.

He just looks real stiff out there, doesn't he?

He's so stiff, it just looks like he can snap something at any moment. His moves are robotic, he's not that flexible anymore, and he looks like he doesn't carry his weight as well as he used to. I think regardless of how many times he throws, durability will be a concern.

Of course, throwing less decreases teh chances of injury. I think we'll see him run out of the pocket alot less this year.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 10:36 AM
If McNabb goes down or is unable to start the season, Feeley would be the starter right now. Kolb is nowhere near ready to play in the NFL. He needs 2 years of development on the sidelines to get the WCO down, then he'll need another year as a starter to begin to grasp the nuances. He is a project. McNabb is more than capable of leading this team to success for the next 2 years while Kolb prepares himself.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 10:39 AM
He just looks real stiff out there, doesn't he?

He's so stiff, it just looks like he can snap something at any moment. His moves are robotic, he's not that flexible anymore, and he looks like he doesn't carry his weight as well as he used to. I think regardless of how many times he throws, durability will be a concern.

Of course, throwing less decreases teh chances of injury. I think we'll see him run out of the pocket alot less this year.

McNabb looked very stiff in 2005, when he bulked up to 255 lbs. In 2006, he was down to 230 and looked very trim and fit. He regained some of his mobility, and he looked much more athletic. I assume McNabb will come back for 2007 in the 220-225 range with a thicker leg base. You are correct that he isn't carrying his weight as well. That could be a function of age affecting his metabolism, and his body thickening up with time.

McNabb has stayed in the pocket more and more the last few years. With the injuries and surgeries, he has become a pure pocket passer pretty much out of necessity because he doesn't have the burst he used to. He can still move, but he isn't an explosive runner anymore.

neko4
05-02-2007, 10:44 AM
He'd be a perfect fit in Green Bay when Favre retires. I'll take a top 5 QB.

Theres this guy named Aaron Rodgers

PalmerToCJ
05-02-2007, 11:25 AM
It depends on how he does this year, in my opinion. To say anything right now smacks of overreaction.

Agreed.

If McNabb simply stays healthy this year I really doubt he's gone.

Nitschke-Hawk
05-02-2007, 11:38 AM
Theres this guy named Aaron Rodgers

Who still hasn't played a meaningful down. I'll take the elite quarterback over the unproven quarterback, if he was so good, the front office wouldn't be as eager for Favre to return.

Finsfan79
05-02-2007, 12:27 PM
He would be fun down here in south florida. McNabb to Ginn and Chambers? Ronnie out of the backfield and the booker kid was compared often to westbrook in college

DeathbyStat
05-02-2007, 02:32 PM
If he gets hurt again...then he will be gone.

Ewing
05-02-2007, 02:57 PM
If the Eagles cut one of the top three quarterbacks in the game in order to have a Houston quarterback be the starter I will seriously think Matt Millen is their GM.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 03:00 PM
If the Eagles cut one of the top three quarterbacks in the game in order to have a Houston quarterback be the starter I will seriously think Matt Millen is their GM.

McNabb isn't a top 3 QB. Top 3 are Manning/Brady, then Carson Palmer.

Once a player makes the pros, it doesn't matter where they went to school. Some of the greatest players in NFL history went to small schools. Some of the biggest busts in history came from big time programs. You make no competent point here.

Ewing
05-02-2007, 03:04 PM
McNabb isn't a top 3 QB. Top 3 are Manning/Brady, then Carson Palmer.

Once a player makes the pros, it doesn't matter where they went to school. Some of the greatest players in NFL history went to small schools. Some of the biggest busts in history came from big time programs. You make no competent point here.

Once Palmer leads a team to four straight NFC Championship games then you can come back to me.

You don't make a good point either. Every single Houston quarterback has been an absolute failure in the NFL. That doesn't make you think for a second that Kolb will suck?

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 03:09 PM
Coming from a Giants fan....


NEVER question Andy Reid's drafts. The man knows what he's doing. I think him and Bill Parcells were the best drafting HCs in the league.

Ewing
05-02-2007, 03:13 PM
NEVER question Andy Reid's drafts. The man knows what he's doing. I think him and Bill Parcells were the best drafting HCs in the league.

Freddie Mitchell over Chad Johnson.

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 03:17 PM
Freddie Mitchell over Chad Johnson.

4 NFC championships plus 1 SB appearance.


Case closed. How many AFC championships did Cinncy go to in the same time span?

Shockey80
05-02-2007, 03:20 PM
Coming from a Giants fan....


NEVER question Andy Reid's drafts. The man knows what he's doing. I think him and Bill Parcells were the best drafting HCs in the league.

nah. He's overrated.

Ewing
05-02-2007, 03:22 PM
4 NFC championships plus 1 SB appearance.


Case closed. How many AFC championships did Cinncy go to in the same time span?

You really think Freddie Mitchell is a better receiver than Ocho Cinco? If 85 had the Philly defense with him in Cincy then there's no telling how many AFC championships they would have gotten to.

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 03:26 PM
You really think Freddie Mitchell is a better receiver than Ocho Cinco? If 85 had the Philly defense with him in Cincy then there's no telling how many AFC championships they would have gotten to.

But youre killing Reid for one player, when overall, he's built an amazing team. He drafted that Philly defense youre referring to.

I don't question his drafting because his drafting style has gotten him a consistent winner year in and year out. Not many teams can say the same thing.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 03:30 PM
Once Palmer leads a team to four straight NFC Championship games then you can come back to me.

You don't make a good point either. Every single Houston quarterback has been an absolute failure in the NFL. That doesn't make you think for a second that Kolb will suck?

I'm an Eagles fan, and I'm telling you that Palmer is a better QB right now than Donovan McNabb. No homerism at all. By your logic, Kurt Warner is a better QB than McNabb, Palmer, and everyone else in the league other than Tom Brady and Favre because he won a Super Bowl and appeared in a second Super Bowl the next year. McNabb's huge run in the playoffs occurred from 2000-2004. That run ended 3 seasons ago. Since that time, he has played in 19 total regular season games and 0 playoff games. He hasn't stayed healthy recently, so he shouldn't be considered a top 3 QB. You can make a top 5 argument, but even that is suspect.

How did I not make a good point? A small sampling of Football Greats:

Mike Singletary, Baylor
Walter Payton, Jackson St.
Jack Lambert, Kent St.
Art Shell, Maryland Eastern Shore
Deacon Jones, Mississippi Vocational
Joe Greene, North Texas St.
Steve Largent, Tulsa
Warren Moon, West Los Angeles Junior College

"Every single Houston QB has been an absolute failure in the NFL..." Completely irrelevant point. There have been 3 QB's from Houston taken in the draft in the last 17 years: David Klingler, Andre Ware, and Chuck Clements. Clements never made a roster, and Klingler and Ware busted. Concerning? Sure. I am worried that the team made a big mistake by taking Kolb that early and deciding to call him a project for the future. Is this empirical evidence that Kevin Kolb will suck? Absolutely not. There is no relation between Kolb and these 3 other QB's. They are not the same person, they are not in the same situation, and they do not have the same skills, coaches, offensive system, teammates, etc. Also, 3 QB's in 17 years is not indicative of any sort of trend or rule.

In other words, don't mess with the big dogs. Bow your head in shame.

Shockey80
05-02-2007, 03:31 PM
But youre killing Reid for one player, when overall, he's built an amazing team. He drafted that Philly defense youre referring to.

I don't question his drafting because his drafting style has gotten him a consistent winner year in and year out. Not many teams can say the same thing.

All he does is draft O-Linemen that fall, and defensive players. He hasnt drafted an offensive skill position player whos good besides Westbrook and Mcnabb.

bearsfan_51
05-02-2007, 03:33 PM
Let's not kid ourselves folks, if McNabb is cut he's coming home to Chicago unless Grossman unexpectedly excells this year. He's talked about growing up wanting to play for the Bears, our team is a Superbowl contendor, and our QB is on a one year contract.

Not to mention that Angelo said last year if he had the #1 pick he'd have taken Vince Young.

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 03:34 PM
All he does is draft O-Linemen that fall, and defensive players. He hasnt drafted an offensive skill position player whos good besides Westbrook and Mcnabb.

And look at the results.


Ive said it before, and I'll say it a million times over. SKILL POSITION PLAYERS ARE OVERRATED.

ESPECIALLY WIDE RECEIVERS.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 03:35 PM
All he does is draft O-Linemen that fall, and defensive players. He hasnt drafted an offensive skill position player whos good besides Westbrook and Mcnabb.

Um... LJ Smith, Reggie Brown, Correll Buckhalter, AJ Feeley. He's filled in the rest with carryovers (Chad Lewis, Deuce Staley) and FA signings/trades (John Ritchie, TO, Kevin Curtis, Stallworth, James Thrash).

Lots of what the Eagles do is about system, and many of their skill players do not have traditional big play skills. However, between the excellent OLine, the play of McNabb, and spectacular coaching, the Eagles have been consistently good for most of the last 8 seasons. They have 6 of the last 7 division titles.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 03:36 PM
You know, it's funny. The user names keep changing, but their arguments and points are just as stupid. Regardless, it's a ton of fun to own these ignoramii.

Neo
05-02-2007, 03:37 PM
Thats laughable

Ewing
05-02-2007, 03:38 PM
I'm an Eagles fan, and I'm telling you that Palmer is a better QB right now than Donovan McNabb. No homerism at all. By your logic, Kurt Warner is a better QB than McNabb, Palmer, and everyone else in the league other than Tom Brady and Favre because he won a Super Bowl and appeared in a second Super Bowl the next year. McNabb's huge run in the playoffs occurred from 2000-2004. That run ended 3 seasons ago. Since that time, he has played in 19 total regular season games and 0 playoff games. He hasn't stayed healthy recently, so he shouldn't be considered a top 3 QB. You can make a top 5 argument, but even that is suspect.

Go look at my previous posts. I do believe the rings and wins arguement is overrated but to get a conference championship game four years in a row is extremely impressive. McNabb when he's healthy is one of the top three in the game. You want to argue that?

How did I not make a good point? A small sampling of Football Greats:

Mike Singletary, Baylor
Walter Payton, Jackson St.
Jack Lambert, Kent St.
Art Shell, Maryland Eastern Shore
Deacon Jones, Mississippi Vocational
Joe Greene, North Texas St.
Steve Largent, Tulsa
OJ Simpson, City College of San Francisco
Warren Moon, West Los Angeles Junior College

When I did I bash all small school players? I'm talking about Houston quarterbacks.

"Every single Houston QB has been an absolute failure in the NFL..." Completely irrelevant point. There have been 3 QB's from Houston taken in the draft in the last 17 years: David Klingler, Andre Ware, and Chuck Clements. Clements never made a roster, and Klingler and Ware busted. Concerning? Sure. I am worried that the team made a big mistake by taking Kolb that early and deciding to call him a project for the future. Is this empirical evidence that Kevin Kolb will suck? Absolutely not. There is no relation between Kolb and these 3 other QB's. They are not the same person, they are not in the same situation, and they do not have the same skills, coaches, offensive system, teammates, etc. Also, 3 QB's in 17 years is not indicative of any sort of trend or rule.

Did I say Kolb would suck without a doubt? No, I didn't. It makes me raise an eyebrow that any team would consider starting a quarterback from a school that gave us David Klingler and Andre Ware. Let alone drafting one with your first pick in the draft.

In other words, don't mess with the big dogs. Bow your head in shame.

What the **** does that have to do with anything?

Ewing
05-02-2007, 03:40 PM
But youre killing Reid for one player, when overall, he's built an amazing team. He drafted that Philly defense youre referring to.

I don't question his drafting because his drafting style has gotten him a consistent winner year in and year out. Not many teams can say the same thing.

I'm not killing him for one player but that's a pretty big screw up draft wise. I do agree that he's one of the best drafting coaches in the league though.

Shockey80
05-02-2007, 03:41 PM
Um... LJ Smith, Reggie Brown, Correll Buckhalter, AJ Feeley. He's filled in the rest with carryovers (Chad Lewis, Deuce Staley) and FA signings/trades (John Ritchie, TO, Kevin Curtis, Stallworth, James Thrash).

Lots of what the Eagles do is about system, and many of their skill players do not have traditional big play skills. However, between the excellent OLine, the play of McNabb, and spectacular coaching, the Eagles have been consistently good for most of the last 8 seasons. They have 6 of the last 7 division titles.

those guys are all pretty mediocre for the most part.

And the Eagles havent been good enough. when it comes down to the big situation, they fail to come through.

Ewing
05-02-2007, 03:44 PM
those guys are all pretty mediocre for the most part.

And the Eagles havent been good enough. when it comes down to the big situation, they fail to come through.

A Giants fan bashing the Eagles without any logic? I didn't see that coming.

bearsfan_51
05-02-2007, 03:48 PM
those guys are all pretty mediocre for the most part.

And the Eagles havent been good enough. when it comes down to the big situation, they fail to come through.
So if you don't win the Superbowl your organization is a failure? Is this the logic you're using?

MNRunLeft
05-02-2007, 03:48 PM
If McNabb were to be cut and Tavaris Jackson doesn't progress as planned I think Minnesota would be the ideal fit for him. He knows Childress and his system and I'm sure Childress would be extact to get him.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 03:52 PM
Go look at my previous posts. I do believe the rings and wins arguement is overrated but to get a conference championship game four years in a row is extremely impressive. McNabb when he's healthy is one of the top three in the game. You want to argue that?

Okay, you want rings and wins? Since the 2004/2005 season, McNabb has played in 19 games. In those games, the Eagles are 9-10. In those seasons, McNabb has 0 playoff appearances. When fully healthy, McNabb is on par with my top 3, but his lack of health the last 2 consecutive seasons discounts his potential effectiveness in my mind. In addition, we do not know what kind of physical shape he will be in when he returns from the ACL injury in 2007. He could have lost a lot of mobility and strength. I will argue that McNabb should not be in the top 3 because he has missed 13 games the last 2 seasons and has had 2 major season-ending surgeries during that time.

When I did I bash all small school players? I'm talking about Houston quarterbacks.

Houston is a small school and a non-major program. They have a very abbreviated history with NFL QB's. The fact that 2 QB's were first round busts 15 and 17 years ago, respectively, means nothing in the scheme of things. 2 busts a long time ago from the same school means that those 2 QB's were busts, and it sucks. 2 QB busts is not a sample size that indicates any trend at all. Your point is taken, but it is neither strong nor highly relevant.

Did I say Kolb would suck without a doubt? No, I didn't. It makes me raise an eyebrow that any team would consider starting a quarterback from a school that gave us David Klingler and Andre Ware. Let alone drafting one with your first pick in the draft.

Your original quote was "Every single QB from Houston has been an absolute failure. What makes you think for a second that Kolb won't suck?" You are revising what you said initially. Either you overstated your initial point, or you're restating your opinion in a way that leaves you an exit if Kolb were to succeed. No matter what you happen to do here, you overgeneralized and made yourself look silly.

What the **** does that have to do with anything?

You made a series of irrelevant, irrational, ill-informed, and/or ignorant statements, and I called you out on all of them. Don't argue football with a real fan unless you really know the game.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:05 PM
those guys are all pretty mediocre for the most part.

And the Eagles havent been good enough. when it comes down to the big situation, they fail to come through.

Eagles 2000 to 2006/2007: 75-21 Regular Season Record, 5 division titles, 5 playoff appearances, 8-6 playoff record, 4 NFC Championship appearances, 1 NFC title/Super Bowl appearance. 0 Super Bowl wins.

Giants 2000 to 2006/2007: 58-38, 2 division titles, 4 playoff appearances, 2-4 playoff record, 1 NFL title/Super Bowl appearance. 0 Super Bowl wins.

The difference: 17 regular season W's, 1 playoff appearance, 3 division titles, 6 playoff W's. Say what you want about mediocre players. The Eagles have the results that matter as of late.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:11 PM
Wait, no more BS points that I get to blow up? You guys are done already? I thought you at least had some sort of weak comeback...

bigbluedefense
05-02-2007, 04:15 PM
Wait, no more BS points that I get to blow up? You guys are done already? I thought you at least had some sort of weak comeback...

Eli Manning is the big11111!!!!!

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:18 PM
That's more like it... haha

PACKmanN
05-02-2007, 04:29 PM
ontill Kolb can prove anything, McNabb a eagle...

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:30 PM
I don't even know what to say about that post, PACK... I'm pretty speechless.

PACKmanN
05-02-2007, 04:41 PM
I don't even know what to say about that post, PACK... I'm pretty speechless.

Kolb has done nothing, they are not going to cut a pro bowl QB for a QB that has done nothing in the nfl. Thats just dumb.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:43 PM
Agreed. I think what Palentonio is reporting is that McNabb's tenure with the Eagles is potentially coming to an end after this next season. Regardless, given McNabb's large contract and injury history, it would be incredibly difficult for the Eagles to get fair value for him in a trade.

keylime_5
05-02-2007, 04:50 PM
If they win the NFC again or if they win in Glendale then Sal will be changing his tune. I say if Philly doesn't go far in the playoffs then they might get rid of McNabb and rebuild that offense. But if I were them I'd hang on to him, good franchise QBs don't grow on trees.

RaiderNation
05-02-2007, 04:51 PM
i 2 more years tell hes gone not 1

skinzzfan25
05-02-2007, 04:54 PM
I really like McNabb as a person and a player. I have a lot of respect for him.

I'd be glad to get him out of the division though.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:55 PM
If they win the NFC again or if they win in Glendale then Sal will be changing his tune. I say if Philly doesn't go far in the playoffs then they might get rid of McNabb and rebuild that offense. But if I were them I'd hang on to him, good franchise QBs don't grow on trees.

With McNabb, my first goal is having him in shape and healthy for Week 1 against the Packers. That is priority #1 right now. If he is healthy, there is no reason that the Eagles cannot compete for the NFC East title and a playoff spot. I can't say that they're the best team in the NFC, but when healthy, they should win games and make the playoffs. Once you make the playoffs, anything goes.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:56 PM
I really like McNabb as a person and a player. I have a lot of respect for him.

I'd be glad to get him out of the division though.

Just because McNabb is gone, it doesn't mean the Eagles are going to stink. In fact, it could spell trouble for the rest of the division because if Kolb develops like the Eagles think he can, the Eagles will remain competitive and perhaps dominant in the East for another 5-7 years...

Sniper
05-02-2007, 04:56 PM
Didn't OJ win a Heisman at SC? Sorry going back to an earlier post. I guess they're kind of a big deal.

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 04:56 PM
You might have caught an error I made, Snipe. Appreciate that.

Sniper
05-02-2007, 05:09 PM
No problem America's Poster

yourfavestoner
05-02-2007, 05:29 PM
This thread made me laugh.

Ewing
05-02-2007, 05:30 PM
Okay, you want rings and wins? Since the 2004/2005 season, McNabb has played in 19 games. In those games, the Eagles are 9-10. In those seasons, McNabb has 0 playoff appearances. When fully healthy, McNabb is on par with my top 3, but his lack of health the last 2 consecutive seasons discounts his potential effectiveness in my mind. In addition, we do not know what kind of physical shape he will be in when he returns from the ACL injury in 2007. He could have lost a lot of mobility and strength. I will argue that McNabb should not be in the top 3 because he has missed 13 games the last 2 seasons and has had 2 major season-ending surgeries during that time.

I said the arguement was overrated. I just find it extremely impressive a quarterback made it to four straight confrence championships on the same team. Keep in mind the Eagles were playing with a McNabb that wasn't at one hundred percent. When McNabb is completely healthy there only a handful of players in the league I would take over him. While I agree the he could have lost mobility I say we reverse judgement until he actually plays.

Houston is a small school and a non-major program. They have a very abbreviated history with NFL QB's. The fact that 2 QB's were first round busts 15 and 17 years ago, respectively, means nothing in the scheme of things. 2 busts a long time ago from the same school means that those 2 QB's were busts, and it sucks. 2 QB busts is not a sample size that indicates any trend at all. Your point is taken, but it is neither strong nor highly relevant.

So because I bash one school's history of quarterbacks I hate all small schools? Granted they've only had three and all three of them were awful. The two that got drafted in the first round are among the top ten busts of all-time. We're talking like they were kind of bad; they were down right awful. History does tend to repeat itself. However, there are players who break the trend all together. Larry Johnson broke the mold of Penn State running back busts. I still think Kolb isn't going to fair well the in the NFL. I highly doubt he'll be as good as McNabb. If he proves me wrong then so be it.

Your original quote was "Every single QB from Houston has been an absolute failure. What makes you think for a second that Kolb won't suck?" You are revising what you said initially. Either you overstated your initial point, or you're restating your opinion in a way that leaves you an exit if Kolb were to succeed. No matter what you happen to do here, you overgeneralized and made yourself look silly.

Read my statement again. "What makes YOU think for a second that Kolb won't suck?" I think he's going to be an average player at best in the NFL. More than likely he'll be bad. So what makes you think he'll succeed?

You made a series of irrelevant, irrational, ill-informed, and/or ignorant statements, and I called you out on all of them. Don't argue football with a real fan unless you really know the game.

You've got some ego on you. You know that?

bsaza2358
05-02-2007, 09:26 PM
I said the arguement was overrated. I just find it extremely impressive a quarterback made it to four straight confrence championships on the same team. Keep in mind the Eagles were playing with a McNabb that wasn't at one hundred percent. When McNabb is completely healthy there only a handful of players in the league I would take over him. While I agree the he could have lost mobility I say we reverse judgement until he actually plays.

I think it's very impressive, but when the same QB has been injured for 2 straight seasons and is coming off an ACL surgery at age 31, you cannot claim he is top 3. I would love to agree with you, but I can't. Don't you think it's odd that you're arguing with a devoted Eagles fan about the actual quality of their franchise QB?

So because I bash one school's history of quarterbacks I hate all small schools? Granted they've only had three and all three of them were awful. The two that got drafted in the first round are among the top ten busts of all-time. We're talking like they were kind of bad; they were down right awful. History does tend to repeat itself. However, there are players who break the trend all together. Larry Johnson broke the mold of Penn State running back busts. I still think Kolb isn't going to fair well the in the NFL. I highly doubt he'll be as good as McNabb. If he proves me wrong then so be it.

You make a fair point about the small schools. I was just pointing out that there's not an extended history of draft picks and QB's from Houston. 2 epic busts 15-17 years ago does not mean that all Houston QB's will not succeed. I can't tell you that Kolb will be awesome or even competent. I'm just saying give him 2 years to sit behind McNabb and a season of starting before you start decaliring all Houston QB's busts. If Kolb were a Tedford QB, you'd have a better argument.

Read my statement again. "What makes YOU think for a second that Kolb won't suck?" I think he's going to be an average player at best in the NFL. More than likely he'll be bad. So what makes you think he'll succeed?

I don't make judgements about players before they take a snap in the NFL. I might suspect that this will happen, but I'm not going to go all out and declare that the guy will be a bust just because he came from the same school as 2 other busts from the early 1990's. You could easily be right, but I'm not going to say any player in the draft won't succeed until I see him playing on the field in the NFL.

You've got some ego on you. You know that?

Of course I have an ego. I'm America's Poster...

cunningham06
05-02-2007, 09:37 PM
I said the arguement was overrated. I just find it extremely impressive a quarterback made it to four straight confrence championships on the same team. Keep in mind the Eagles were playing with a McNabb that wasn't at one hundred percent. When McNabb is completely healthy there only a handful of players in the league I would take over him. While I agree the he could have lost mobility I say we reverse judgement until he actually plays.



So because I bash one school's history of quarterbacks I hate all small schools? Granted they've only had three and all three of them were awful. The two that got drafted in the first round are among the top ten busts of all-time. We're talking like they were kind of bad; they were down right awful. History does tend to repeat itself. However, there are players who break the trend all together. Larry Johnson broke the mold of Penn State running back busts. I still think Kolb isn't going to fair well the in the NFL. I highly doubt he'll be as good as McNabb. If he proves me wrong then so be it.



Read my statement again. "What makes YOU think for a second that Kolb won't suck?" I think he's going to be an average player at best in the NFL. More than likely he'll be bad. So what makes you think he'll succeed?



You've got some ego on you. You know that?

Damnit, you again? Why do you insist on picking teams that I like and arguing stupid uninformed points? First the Texans, now the Eagles. I agree on the point that McNabb is a top qb when healthy, but you have no idea what you are talking about when it comes to Kolb.

Kolb is going to a team that was able to get a lot out of Jeff Garcia. Jeff Garcia isn't secretly great, he was just in a good system in Philly, and had a great offensive line in front of him. The Eagles offensive line is really quite good, and really helps the qb out. Kolb will have plenty of time to throw the ball once he gets to play. He's a pocket passer, and is very accurate. He isn't a mental case or anything, so what reason do you have to believe that he will suck?

I'm dissapointed that I didn't find this thread earlier. McNabb barring more injuries will be in Philly for a while.

ny10804
05-02-2007, 09:52 PM
Don't know if this has been mentioned, but McNabb was a leading MVP candidate prior to his injury.

VY10
05-03-2007, 11:30 AM
Kolb is a good qb with a lot of starting experience. I doubt he will be a major bust.

bsaza2358
05-03-2007, 11:36 AM
God, I thought this thread was dead... Please be done!

GiantRutgersFan
05-03-2007, 01:43 PM
I have said it before, and I will say it again. Considering the injurys, Mcnabb is a middle of the road Quarterback.


Yea, he's top 5 or 6 when playing, but he is constantly injured. if Mcnabb was any other position, he wouldnt be regarded as an elite player because of the injurys

bsaza2358
05-03-2007, 01:52 PM
Even with injuries, McNabb is in the top 40% of QB's in the NFL. He has to reprove himself physically before he can regain his status. Obviously, the Eagles are worried about his future.

bigbluedefense
05-03-2007, 03:00 PM
GRF, please tell me that was a typo.....


its injuries, not injurys.

I myself make a grammar mistake here and there, and spelling mistakes....so I won't kill you for it, but seeing that word makes my eyes bleed.

bsaza2358
05-03-2007, 03:18 PM
I'll give GRF a pass for making a decent and legitimate point without pissing the rest of the forum off.

bigbluedefense
05-03-2007, 03:22 PM
Very true Bsaza...very true.

Sniper
05-05-2007, 03:56 PM
I have said it before, and I will say it again. Considering the injurys, Mcnabb is a middle of the road Quarterback.


Yea, he's top 5 or 6 when playing, but he is constantly injured. if Mcnabb was any other position, he wouldnt be regarded as an elite player because of the injurys

This coming from the guy who calls Eli Manning "Mr. Clutch". Middle of the road, sure bud. Philly's "middle of the road" QB has led them to 5 division titles, 3 NFC Title Games and a Super Bowl. Let me know when Elijah wins a playoff game

sweetness34
05-05-2007, 04:57 PM
I love Rexy but I'd love to see Donovan in Chicago again playing for his hometown team, that would be awesome.

Sniper
05-05-2007, 06:03 PM
Stop saying that! Reid will hear you and trade McNabb to Chitown for another lineman;)

sweetness34
05-05-2007, 09:40 PM
Stop saying that! Reid will hear you and trade McNabb to Chitown for another lineman;)

We'll trade you Lance Briggs and Rexy for McNabb and a 4th rounder. And throw in a couple trucks full of chiken noodle soup and you've got a deal.

Sniper
05-05-2007, 09:49 PM
Excuse me? Lance Briggs? We don't believe in having three very good linebackers at the same time, when would Matt McCoy play? Silly trade offer.

I'm countering with Leak, whoever your #5 DE is, and a 2008 1st rounder to be used on CB Morgan Trent of Michigan for Donovan

Achilles33
05-06-2007, 06:38 AM
Like Bsaza is saying, keep McNabb for 2 years and groom Kolb.

I would have taken Stanton, Beck, and Edwards over him though. Stanton will be the best QB from this draft class. And that includes Quinn and Russell.

Addict
05-06-2007, 07:30 AM
We'll trade you Lance Briggs and Rexy for McNabb and a 4th rounder. And throw in a couple trucks full of chiken noodle soup and you've got a deal.

http://www.clfinearts.com/Sunday%20B%20Morning%20-%20Soup%20Chicken%20Noodle.jpg

that's your dealmaker right there!

jonbrodo17
05-06-2007, 07:47 AM
Like Bsaza is saying, keep McNabb for 2 years and groom Kolb.

I would have taken Stanton, Beck, and Edwards over him though. Stanton will be the best QB from this draft class. And that includes Quinn and Russell.

The problem is that Kolb is supposedly best for their offense. D-McNabb has been the face of our franchise since 1999 and Kevin Kolb isn't gonna change that, they're only gonna let Donovan go if he can't play 100% and who wants a 30+ QB on his last legs?

bsaza2358
05-07-2007, 09:13 AM
I think the Redskins might want an aging veteran who has name value. They can overpay him, stunt the growth of Campbell, and completely screw their cap...

bsaza2358
05-07-2007, 09:15 AM
Oh, and Sniper, McNabb led the Eagles to 5 playoff berths, 4 division titles, 4 NFC Championship games, and 1 Super Bowl. I don't count the 2006 playoff berth as McNabb's. That was an Andy Reid-engineered, Jeff Garcia-assisted playoff berth.

Sniper
05-08-2007, 03:25 PM
This is true my bad. Regardless, he's a great "middle of the road" qb compared to Eli

Geo
05-08-2007, 03:47 PM
Oh, and Sniper, McNabb led the Eagles to 5 playoff berths, 4 division titles, 4 NFC Championship games, and 1 Super Bowl. I don't count the 2006 playoff berth as McNabb's. That was an Andy Reid-engineered, Jeff Garcia-assisted playoff berth.
I'd sooner give credit for the Eagles' 2001-2004 "run" on the defense than Donovan McNabb, especially considering Jeremiah Trotter was and is more of a leader than McNabb ever will be (as has been openly acknowledged from the Eagles camp throughout the years), and I wouldn't hesitate to also credit the (poor) state of the NFC in that period. The NFC East especially was weak.

bsaza2358
05-08-2007, 03:54 PM
You can't discount the Eagles' run because you think the NFC was weak. No one said peep about the Bills' run in the early 90's when the AFC was considerably weaker. Not a fair point, Geo

bsaza2358
05-08-2007, 03:57 PM
I wish this thread would just die, though...

Geo
05-08-2007, 04:00 PM
(1) It's not fair to argue that the Eagles were able to make 4 straight NFCCGs because the NFC was weak in the frame? Especially when the Eagles only won 1 of those 4 NFCCGs, despite having HFA for the last 3, because they faced a team (the 04 Atlanta Falcons) that they had essentially had no chance of losing to? Why on Earth not?

(2) The point about the AFC is/was brought up in the Bills' case, but the Bills at least won an unprecedented 4 straight AFCCGs and proved to be the cream of the crop from their conference, even if they were beat badly in the last 3 Super Bowls (2 of which at the hands of a dynasty). That lessened the sting of that particular criticism.

bsaza2358
05-08-2007, 04:09 PM
It's not apples and oranges. Certainly, the Bills executed well in their AFCCG's, but their level of competition was not all that different. The Eagles lost to the 2001 Rams (lost 20-17), the 2002 Bucs (dominated), and the 2003 Panthers (barely lost to NE). The Eagles had a very nice run. They made it to the 2001 and 2003 championship games on coaching and defense. They won the 2002 berth early, and an injured McNabb couldn't stack up. The 2004 season was a cakewalk.

bsaza2358
05-08-2007, 04:09 PM
Regardless, the 2001-2005 playoff run for the Eagles is irrelevant to McNabb's status with the team. Let us move on.

Geo
05-08-2007, 05:30 PM
I think it's relevant, as the team can go back to that level of play with Kolb as long as they play great defense and run the ball. The latter will prove difficult by the very nature of Reid's mindset. I'll say this for McNabb though, the Eagles haven't done as good a job as they could have of supplying him with weapons.

The team has drafted so poorly at the wide receiver position that they had to sign a malcontent headcase to give McNabb the closest thing he's ever had to an elite receiver, and unsurprisingly McNabb had the best year of his career with and reached the Super Bowl, but that relationship had to end the next year as we all saw. They brought in a great fit for the offense in Donte Stallworth, but let him walk as well. I'm not crazy about the Kevin Curtis signing, truth be told - he has a better chance of staying healthy for 16 games unlike Stallworth, but I'll take my chances with Stallworth to make plays which win playoff games.

They also let Duce Staley go, but at least have had the wisdom to re-sign Brian Westbrook and recently draft Tony Hunt. I think that duo could be the best backfield they have had since Staley was a part of the team and helped punish opponents, although it remains to be seen if McNabb or Kolb reaps the most benefit of those particular moves.

Phrost
05-08-2007, 05:37 PM
Buccaneers...Gruden loves vets and he needs a Q capable of running his vertical WCO.

SFbear
05-08-2007, 05:59 PM
Buccaneers...Gruden loves vets and he needs a Q capable of running his vertical WCO.

We'll take McNabb and you guys can have Grossman.

Grossman + Gruden = greatest sitcom in the history of mankind.

Geo
05-08-2007, 06:14 PM
McNabb is from Chicago ...

bryanGENE
05-09-2007, 11:54 AM
For McNabb's fate, see Daunte Culpepper

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 12:02 PM
Yes, McNabb is automatically going to have the same fate as Culpepper. He has the same build, size, and work ethic. He has the same training staff. He has a coach who throws him out on the field when he's not ready. [/sarcasm]

I cannot say that McNabb will be recovered, but you cannot simply say that he won't because Duante Culpepper, who is 2-3 inches and 40+ lbs more than McNabb, couldn't bounce back and do well. I'm sure the mobility will be limited, but McNabb was always a better QB than Culpepper. If he's on the field, he'll be playing at near 100%.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 12:02 PM
Please, can we end this thread? It has become irrelevant...

eacantdraft
05-09-2007, 12:08 PM
I love how Eagles fans love unproven Kevin Kolb. The rate of failure of 2nd round QB's is horrendous. Better not put all of your eggs in one basket.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 12:18 PM
What are you even talking about? Kolb is being groomed as a QB of the future. He's not going to play for at least 2 seasons. No one is in love with him. I think he's getting more 'dap' from non-Eagles fans than Eagles fans.

And, don't you think that having AJ Feeley signed as a backup for the next 3 seasons, keeping McNabb, and drafting Kolb is diversifying and not "putting all the eggs in 1 basket"?

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 12:21 PM
Yeah, I love how the Falcons fan is telling the Eagles not to put all their eggs in 1 basket at QB. They traded their most valuable QB asset in Schaub to allow a troubled Mike Vick to continue to lead their offense, then brought in Joey Harrington to be the backup...

bryanGENE
05-09-2007, 01:19 PM
Yes, McNabb is automatically going to have the same fate as Culpepper. He has the same build, size, and work ethic. He has the same training staff. He has a coach who throws him out on the field when he's not ready. [/sarcasm]

I cannot say that McNabb will be recovered, but you cannot simply say that he won't because Duante Culpepper, who is 2-3 inches and 40+ lbs more than McNabb, couldn't bounce back and do well. I'm sure the mobility will be limited, but McNabb was always a better QB than Culpepper. If he's on the field, he'll be playing at near 100%.

McNabb hasn't always been the best quarterback. McNabb will get injured again, go to another team, try to succeed and fail.

bryanGENE
05-09-2007, 01:20 PM
Let me add the Eagles don't make the playoffs this year.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 01:40 PM
Without a healthy McNabb, the Eagles probably don't make the playoffs in 2007.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 01:42 PM
McNabb has been the best QB in that draft. There is no argument. Culpepper may have had better numbers by a little, but Culpepper had better weapons around him always. Regardless, McNabb has a better winning percentage, more playoff appearances, and more playoff success. The Vikings have never beaten the Eagles when McNabb and Culpepper were on the field. It isn't even an arguable point.

eacantdraft
05-09-2007, 02:16 PM
Yeah, I love how the Falcons fan is telling the Eagles not to put all their eggs in 1 basket at QB. They traded their most valuable QB asset in Schaub to allow a troubled Mike Vick to continue to lead their offense, then brought in Joey Harrington to be the backup...


I'm a Falcons fan???

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 02:22 PM
I saw the sig and assumed you were a Falcons fan. Regardless, you were dead wrong.

eacantdraft
05-09-2007, 02:56 PM
I saw the sig and assumed you were a Falcons fan. Regardless, you were dead wrong.

I'm a fan of the legendary Ron Mexico, headline grabber VD transmiter extraodinare.

2nd round QB's for the last 10 years have barely over 10% regular starting %, the worst of any first day draft rounds. Other than Drew Brees, there isn't much to crow about.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 03:03 PM
The argument doesn't hold water for me. Historical trends in terms of stats are much more reliable. The fact that NFL QB scouting in the second round in the last 10 years has been poor doesn't mean that Kolb will bust. These are all individual players in specific situations under specific coaches. There is no relevant relationship here. It's not like the Tedford QB's, who haven't done squat in the NFL.

eacantdraft
05-09-2007, 03:22 PM
The argument doesn't hold water for me. Historical trends in terms of stats are much more reliable. The fact that NFL QB scouting in the second round in the last 10 years has been poor doesn't mean that Kolb will bust. These are all individual players in specific situations under specific coaches. There is no relevant relationship here. It's not like the Tedford QB's, who haven't done squat in the NFL.

And we know how well day 1 Houston QB's have done in the NFL.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 03:38 PM
Irrelevant. Past Houston QB's with zero ties to Kolb failing in the NFL under different coaches on different teams in different eras has no bearing on Kolb's success. Andy Reid has a track record of drafting and developing QB's. He did it in Green Bay with Hasselbeck, Favre, and Brunell, and he did it in Philly with McNabb and Feeley. Hell, he even won games with Koy Detmer and Garcia. Reid's track record is much more telling than the success of QB's from the same school over 15 years ago.

bsaza2358
05-09-2007, 03:39 PM
BTW, I'm not saying that Kolb is a lock to succeed. I'm saying that you can't say he'll be a bust until he's out on the field and showing what he's got. I'll say that about any player from the 2007 draft.

Stash
05-09-2007, 10:30 PM
2nd round QB's for the last 10 years have barely over 10% regular starting %, the worst of any first day draft rounds. Other than Drew Brees, there isn't much to crow about.

The fact that you are using this as an argument is just silly. You might as well come out and say something stupid like "4th round TE's have a high bust percentage." The reason 2nd round QB's don't start is because they don't get as much of an opportunity as a QB taken in the 1st. Teams don't have much invested in a QB taken outside of the 1st round so that QB will more often than not be on a short leash.

Psycho
05-10-2007, 12:05 AM
Somewhere right now, TO is laughing sinisterly.

bsaza2358
05-10-2007, 09:47 AM
I still can't believe that this topic isn't dead. Can't we put this thing down like a 16 year old golden retriever with cancer, AIDS, and a staph infection?