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Booger
05-03-2007, 10:24 AM
Here are a few points of contention we can discuss:

Buy or Sell the following:

1. Chris Simms will be the opening day starter
2. Gaines Adams was the right selection at #4 overall
3. In 3 years, this will be the draft we look back on as the re-birth of our defense.
4. Keyshawn will be brought back to Tampa Bay this season (as per Schefter's report that Key would gladly re-join the Bucs if Gruden gave him a call).
5. Jon Gruden will be fired if the team doesnt finish with at least 7 wins.

1. Sell - Garcia was brought in to start; see recent Gruden comments about protecting Garcia.
2. Buy - while Okoye must have been tempting, it spoke volumes to me that Petrino passed him up at #8 as well.
3. Buy - I trust Kiffin's eye for talent much more than all of you haters of this draft. We drafted speed and potential, let the re-moulding of the D begin.
4. Sell - at the vet min, bringing back Meshawn would make some sense to mentor Clayton and Stovall. But I can't see a Johnson/Gruden reunion happening.
5. Sell - I think that Gruden/Allen made all of the right moves this offseason, adding a vet QB, some o-line help, and a lot of defensive help (experience and youth) without sacrificing our cap situation. I think that improvement over last year will be enough to keep his job.

-black
05-03-2007, 10:56 AM
1. Buy

2. Buy

3. Sell

4. Buy

5. Sell

StaticGator
05-03-2007, 11:32 AM
1. Sell
2. Buy
3. Sell
4. Sell
5. Buy

Beans
05-03-2007, 11:39 AM
buy
buy
buy
buy
sell

simms2clayton
05-03-2007, 11:39 AM
Here are a few points of contention we can discuss:

Buy or Sell the following:

1. Chris Simms will be the opening day starter
2. Gaines Adams was the right selection at #4 overall
3. In 3 years, this will be the draft we look back on as the re-birth of our defense.
4. Keyshawn will be brought back to Tampa Bay this season (as per Schefter's report that Key would gladly re-join the Bucs if Gruden gave him a call).
5. Jon Gruden will be fired if the team doesnt finish with at least 7 wins.

1. Sell-batted balls r' us
2. Buy - he would have been the right selectoin at 3 with Thomas still on the board. Monte needs a pass rush. I think Adams will have a better career than Rice.
3. Buy (no I am going with the 2006 draft [/sarcasm])
4. Sell-Gruden doesn't want him and we are already deep at WR
5. Sell - The Glazers know how good a coach Gruden is in a tough division, but I am confident we will get at least 7 wins)

-black
05-03-2007, 11:58 AM
how are we deep at WR????????????????????????????

Tampa 2 4 life
05-03-2007, 12:44 PM
1: Buy
2: Buy
3: Buy
4: Sell
5: Sell (If the Glazers see improvement, Gruden will stay.)

Watchman
05-03-2007, 12:48 PM
1. Sell - I just don't seem him beating out Garcia
2. Buy - Addressing the pass rush was the #1 priority
3. Sell - I don't think that will be accomplished in 1 offseason
4. Sell - Why bring in KJ, they need to see who the real Clayton is and if Stovall can be a solid WR in the league
5. Sell - I think the Glazers said they wanted to see improvement, not a specific win total. I'm still not sure there is a better alternative for HC right now.

-black
05-03-2007, 12:57 PM
why bring back Meshawn? because he is a competitive and productive player and this is something our WR core needs. If we can bring in David Boston then we can bring in Key. If we can sign 1000 QB's, then we can bring in Key. If we can sign another TE (giving us 4 potential starters or producers) then we can bring in Key

Watchman
05-03-2007, 02:16 PM
why bring back Meshawn? because he is a competitive and productive player and this is something our WR core needs. If we can bring in David Boston then we can bring in Key. If we can sign 1000 QB's, then we can bring in Key. If we can sign another TE (giving us 4 potential starters or producers) then we can bring in Key

I agree he is competitive and produces on the field, but all reports were he was a problem in the locker room, and I don't see why a 4-12 would look to add a known or even potential problem in the locker room.

There is also the financial aspect to KJ, his contract with CAR was something like 4 years $14M with a $5M signing bonus. Now if KJ wants to sign a contract like Stevens just did that could be another thing, but again the potential of a locker room issue is still there and an unnecessary risk in my mind.

-black
05-03-2007, 02:31 PM
he wasnt a problem in the locker room. He just had differences with Gruden. Key is NOT a T.O type where he disrupts teamates. He is not like Randy Moss where he stops working hard. Key is a competitor and loves football and his personality was high strung. Gruden did not like that, he wants to be the most high strung personality in the huddle.

winning can cure everything, and at that point we were not winning. Im sure if Gruden and Key talked they could reconcile their differences. But Key was NOT a cancer to the team....

Watchman
05-03-2007, 03:16 PM
If the Bucs were 12-4 then I'm sure KJ and Gruden would be fast friends. But this won't be a 12-4 team, with or without KJ.

Merlin
05-03-2007, 03:18 PM
Sell

Buy

Buy

Sell

Sell - I think too much water has passed under the bridge, Key embarrassed himself and the whole organisation with his sideline brain-fart!
I wouldn't want him back.

Three Step Drop
05-03-2007, 03:32 PM
1. Sell. I think it will be a good training camp battle but i have a feeling Garcia is in the box seat at the moment.

2. Buy. If he can get enough support from the inside of the DL

3. Sell. Hopefully the start but will take a lot of luck for them all to make an impact.

4. Sell. I believe the Giants are in the box seat for Keyshawn at the moment

5. Sell. I think the Glazers will support Gruden for the long run - we gave up too much to kick him off this early.

simms2clayton
05-03-2007, 04:05 PM
how are we deep at WR????????????????????????????

Joey Galloway, Michael Clayton, Maurice Stovall, David Boston, Paris Warren, Ike Hilliard, Chas Gessner and Chad Owens (more of a return specialist but he will operate as a reserve WR).

simms2clayton
05-03-2007, 04:07 PM
why bring back Meshawn? because he is a competitive and productive player and this is something our WR core needs. If we can bring in David Boston then we can bring in Key. If we can sign 1000 QB's, then we can bring in Key. If we can sign another TE (giving us 4 potential starters or producers) then we can bring in Key

Maurice Stovall has more upside than Key and was drafted to be our #3 possesion WR last year. Also, Michael Clayton can step up. No need for another possession WR in Tampa. Not worth his attitude.

Caddy
05-03-2007, 04:18 PM
Here are a few points of contention we can discuss:

Buy or Sell the following:

1. Chris Simms will be the opening day starter
2. Gaines Adams was the right selection at #4 overall
3. In 3 years, this will be the draft we look back on as the re-birth of our defense.
4. Keyshawn will be brought back to Tampa Bay this season (as per Schefter's report that Key would gladly re-join the Bucs if Gruden gave him a call).
5. Jon Gruden will be fired if the team doesnt finish with at least 7 wins.



1. Buy: Can't see Garcia beating him out but it will be close.
2. Buy: Realistically, who else was there that would have made more sense?
3. Buy: More hope than anything. I think the draft has a lot of potential that needs to be realised.
4. Sell: Not gonna happen.
5. Sell: His contract expires so he won't need to be fired.

-black
05-03-2007, 08:01 PM
Joey Galloway, Michael Clayton, Maurice Stovall, David Boston, Paris Warren, Ike Hilliard, Chas Gessner and Chad Owens (more of a return specialist but he will operate as a reserve WR).

this is deep???????? a list full of slot 3rd stringers at best or either players who have not proven themselves at all?????

please dont tell me you seriously are saying this is our deep WR core

Caddy
05-03-2007, 08:49 PM
this is deep???????? a list full of slot 3rd stringers at best or either players who have not proven themselves at all?????

please dont tell me you seriously are saying this is our deep WR core

Our corp of wide receivers is very much quantity over quality at this stage unfortunately.

-black
05-03-2007, 08:55 PM
deep on bodies, not deep in terms of interchanceable bodies and production

etk
05-03-2007, 09:35 PM
Here are a few points of contention we can discuss:

Buy or Sell the following:

1. Chris Simms will be the opening day starter
2. Gaines Adams was the right selection at #4 overall
3. In 3 years, this will be the draft we look back on as the re-birth of our defense.
4. Keyshawn will be brought back to Tampa Bay this season (as per Schefter's report that Key would gladly re-join the Bucs if Gruden gave him a call).
5. Jon Gruden will be fired if the team doesnt finish with at least 7 wins.



1. Buy
2. Buy
3. Sell
4. Sell
5. Buy

Phrost
05-04-2007, 01:10 AM
Here are a few points of contention we can discuss:

Buy or Sell the following:

1. Chris Simms will be the opening day starter
2. Gaines Adams was the right selection at #4 overall
3. In 3 years, this will be the draft we look back on as the re-birth of our defense.
4. Keyshawn will be brought back to Tampa Bay this season (as per Schefter's report that Key would gladly re-join the Bucs if Gruden gave him a call).
5. Jon Gruden will be fired if the team doesnt finish with at least 7 wins.


1. Buy: It will be a training camp battle in which I think Simms wins.
2. Buy: I will not lie, CJ would have been nice but an elite pass rusher was a greater need. Though I want Calais Campbell in 08, oh well.
3. Sell: Good bargain talent. Nothing special, no Brooks', Barber's, or Sapp's this year.
4. Sell: He doesn't have "it" anymore. We don't need an old, slow, version of Stovall. It will be a shock to Key's system when he realizes no one wants him.
5. Sell: If we show "any" improvement this year, especially with any young talent, Gruden will be back.

simms2clayton
05-04-2007, 07:32 AM
3. Sell: Good bargain talent. Nothing special, no Brooks', Barber's, or Sapp's this year.

Huh?

We don't know how good our players will be one day?

What if Sears becomes All-Pro? We picked up by far the best pass rusher in this draft and he seems to have a great attitude and with some good coaching from Kiffin I think he could be better than Simeon Rice.

Just because you don't draft a future Hall of Famer doesn't mean you can't rebuild a defense in the draft.

Caddy
05-04-2007, 07:34 AM
Huh?

We don't know how good our players will be one day?

What if Sears becomes All-Pro? We picked up by far the best pass rusher in this draft and he seems to have a great attitude and with some good coaching from Kiffin I think he could be better than Simeon Rice.

Just because you don't draft a future Hall of Famer doesn't mean you can't rebuild a defense in the draft.

Phrost can see into the future. I think he knows what he is talking about. ;)

Phrost
05-04-2007, 03:45 PM
Phrost can see into the future. I think he knows what he is talking about. ;)

It was a pre-season analysis, if you don't like it don't read it. Just predictions and opinions mixed with a fact here and there.

Caddy
05-04-2007, 07:06 PM
It was a pre-season analysis, if you don't like it don't read it. Just predictions and opinions mixed with a fact here and there.

I'm pretty sure I was joking mate.

Watchman
05-14-2007, 06:45 PM
are you sure you're sure?

Caddy
05-14-2007, 08:08 PM
are you sure you're sure?

No:confused: I was joking about not joking.

Watchman
05-15-2007, 10:11 AM
No:confused: I was joking about not joking.


You're kidding?

Caddy
05-15-2007, 03:58 PM
You're kidding?

I don't know? Am I?

etk
05-15-2007, 04:04 PM
Very productive discussion here, boys.

Watchman
05-16-2007, 10:34 AM
Very productive discussion here, boys.

You're right. I'm going to post a poll to see who everyone thinks is the best long snapper in the league.

Phrost
05-16-2007, 02:47 PM
You're right. I'm going to post a poll to see who everyone thinks is the best long snapper in the league.

http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e4/darthjango1/Parcells.gif

Beans
05-16-2007, 03:08 PM
Very productive discussion here, boys.

Why does every discussion need to be thought-provoking?





SO TODAY I HAD A TURKEY SANDWICH

Watchman
05-16-2007, 04:10 PM
Why does every discussion need to be thought-provoking?





SO TODAY I HAD A TURKEY SANDWICH

What kind of bread?