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TheBuffaloBills
12-02-2008, 04:24 PM
If we do get our act together and finish the season 9-7 or 10-6, then I think we should draft Alex Mack C from Cal. Duke Preston is terrible, especially when we play a 3-4 defense. I saw Duke run into his own player twice instead of blocking.

SuperMcGee
12-02-2008, 05:00 PM
Everyone knows Duke Preston is terrible. What was surprising was that Fowler was actually bad enough to be benched in favor of Preston. Yikes.

TheBuffaloBills
12-02-2008, 07:43 PM
I want to switch to a 3-4 Defense

RDE: Spencer Johnson

NT: Kyle Williams

LDE: Marcus Stroud

ROLB: Aaron Schobel

ILB: Poz, Kawika Mitchell

LOLB: Draft someone or put Kawika here and put DiGorgio at inside


We could do that know and it wouldnt be bad at all. We could perfect it in the off season. I want a defense that is feared like the Steelers, and blitz often.

Thoughts?

SuperKevin
12-02-2008, 07:47 PM
I want to switch to a 3-4 Defense

RDE: Spencer Johnson

NT: Kyle Williams

LDE: Marcus Stroud

ROLB: Aaron Schobel

ILB: Poz, Kawika Mitchell

LOLB: Draft someone or put Kawika here and put DiGorgio at inside


We could do that know and it wouldnt be bad at all. We could perfect it in the off season. I want a defense that is feared like the Steelers, and blitz often.

Thoughts?

Schobel would be a horrible OLB. He doesn't have the range for it. I think Chris Kelsay could do it but Schobel is strictly a 4-3 DE

TheBuffaloBills
12-02-2008, 08:54 PM
Schobel would be a horrible OLB. He doesn't have the range for it. I think Chris Kelsay could do it but Schobel is strictly a 4-3 DE

I know what you mean. I would have him be the pass rushing linebacker if anything. That is the only fault with the 3-4. If anything, Schobel would be a better 3-4 linebacker rather than a 3-4 end. Kelsay wouldn't be too bad at linebacker.

fischbowl
12-03-2008, 11:46 PM
Hey, at least Schobel doesn't need surgery

SuperKevin
12-05-2008, 06:18 AM
I remember earlier in the year when we actually looked like a good team I had offered to let people stay at my house if Buffalo played their playoff game in San Diego. Guess I was just a tad bit off on that one

fischbowl
12-05-2008, 08:32 AM
Fisch Mocks It Up!

1) Jermaine Gresham, TE, Oklahoma*
2) Jonathan Luigs, C, Arkansas
3) Dannell Ellerbe, LB, Georgia
4) Joe Burnett, CB, UCF
5) Henry Melton, DE, Texas
6) Andrew Woodruff, OT, Boise State
7) Louis Delmas, S, Western Michigan

SuperKevin
12-05-2008, 05:33 PM
Fisch Mocks It Up!

1) Jermaine Gresham, TE, Oklahoma*
2) Jonathan Luigs, C, Arkansas
3) Dannell Ellerbe, LB, Georgia
4) Joe Burnett, CB, UCF
5) Henry Melton, DE, Texas
6) Andrew Woodruff, OT, Boise State
7) Louis Delmas, S, Western Michigan

Few issues

Joe Burnett essentially provides us with a career nickel back and return specialist. We already have a lot of CBs like that.

Henry Melton is a tad too high right now for me.

Louis Delmas is way too low. There are rumblings of him flying near the top of the senior safety rankings, especially if he plays well at the Senior Bowl

SuperMcGee
12-05-2008, 06:11 PM
I'm not as high on Delmas as some others are, but he's right in that that is much too low for him.

fischbowl
12-05-2008, 06:23 PM
Few issues

Joe Burnett essentially provides us with a career nickel back and return specialist. We already have a lot of CBs like that.

Henry Melton is a tad too high right now for me.

Louis Delmas is way too low. There are rumblings of him flying near the top of the senior safety rankings, especially if he plays well at the Senior Bowl

True, Delmas has been playing well

Other one I made (because I love D-Rock and D-Fine)

1) Jamon Meredith, OT, South Carolina
2) Victor Harris, CB, Virginia Tech
3) Pat White, WR, West Virginia
4) Brian Toal, OLB, Boston College
5) Edwin Williams, C, Maryland
6) Cyril Obiozor, DE, Texas A&M
7) Woodny Turenne, CB, Louisville

SuperKevin
12-05-2008, 07:32 PM
True, Delmas has been playing well

Other one I made (because I love D-Rock and D-Fine)

1) Jamon Meredith, OT, South Carolina
2) Victor Harris, CB, Virginia Tech
3) Pat White, WR, West Virginia
4) Brian Toal, OLB, Boston College
5) Edwin Williams, C, Maryland
6) Cyril Obiozor, DE, Texas A&M
7) Woodny Turenne, CB, Louisville

I love Edwin Williams.

Jamon Meredith at 14 or so where we likely will pick??????

I'll have a mock up soon

Bills2083
12-05-2008, 07:35 PM
True, Delmas has been playing well

Other one I made (because I love D-Rock and D-Fine)

1) Jamon Meredith, OT, South Carolina
2) Victor Harris, CB, Virginia Tech
3) Pat White, WR, West Virginia
4) Brian Toal, OLB, Boston College
5) Edwin Williams, C, Maryland
6) Cyril Obiozor, DE, Texas A&M
7) Woodny Turenne, CB, Louisville

Out of Peters/Walker/Meredith, who would slide in to guard?

SuperKevin
12-05-2008, 07:37 PM
Out of Peters/Walker/Meredith, who would slide in to guard?

Meredith has experience at guard this year

SuperKevin
12-05-2008, 07:54 PM
I posted a mock in the Bills mock draft thread

SuperKevin
12-06-2008, 01:18 PM
Few roster updates

Rookie DE Chris Ellis is on IR now and DE/DT Corey Mace has been promoted to the active roster

Trent Edwards is doubtful for Sunday and listed as the 3rd string QB.

fischbowl
12-07-2008, 04:02 PM
I swear to God, I ******* hate Duke Preston

SuperKevin
12-07-2008, 04:51 PM
I give up. I just give up

fischbowl
12-07-2008, 04:52 PM
I won't give up, I won't!

But I will stop watching

fischbowl
12-07-2008, 05:02 PM
**** my life, really **** my life

SuperKevin
12-07-2008, 05:55 PM
I guess now we're just playing for draft position?

HoopsDemon12
12-07-2008, 08:45 PM
I won't give up, I won't!

But I will stop watching

ya i agree, what the hell happened!!!!???!! I know we're young but this is ridiculus... i was in scotland for 2 months.. i came home surprised to see 4-1.... am i bad luck!?

We cannot get into that endzone and tahst killin us... not to mention edwards seemed to have his confidence dissappear after the cuncussion...

Do we have a good shot at a decent pick? cause when we lose to a team taht won 1 game last year... thats ******.. no matter how much they improved...

TheBuffaloBills
12-08-2008, 01:25 PM
This is my dream first 3 picks:

1. Everett Brown
2. Chase Coffman
3. Best Center available

SuperKevin
12-08-2008, 07:05 PM
This is my dream first 3 picks:

1. Everett Brown
2. Chase Coffman
3. Best Center available

I could go with that except I think the team avoids drafting a strictly pass rush DE early after investing in Chris Ellis with a 3rd round pick. I don't agree with that but I feel that will be the case

TheBuffaloBills
12-08-2008, 11:03 PM
I could go with that except I think the team avoids drafting a strictly pass rush DE early after investing in Chris Ellis with a 3rd round pick. I don't agree with that but I feel that will be the case

I used to think the same thing, but if we get a new coach, they will realize the mess we have at DE. You could say for us to go with OLB, but we drafted Bowen too. Granted Bowen was a 5th rounder compared to Ellis being a 3rd, but they are about the same in my mind. I don't think Ellis will be a force in the NFL. Bowen is a question mark that could be good if he adds a little bulk.

Besides, who are the possible new head coaches?

Cowher
Schottemheimer
Del Rio (If fired)
Steve Spagnola

I dont know, those are just possibilities. I want to get a guy has made a name for himself in the league before.

SuperKevin
12-09-2008, 09:38 PM
I used to think the same thing, but if we get a new coach, they will realize the mess we have at DE. You could say for us to go with OLB, but we drafted Bowen too. Granted Bowen was a 5th rounder compared to Ellis being a 3rd, but they are about the same in my mind. I don't think Ellis will be a force in the NFL. Bowen is a question mark that could be good if he adds a little bulk.

Besides, who are the possible new head coaches?

Cowher
Schottemheimer
Del Rio (If fired)
Steve Spagnola

I dont know, those are just possibilities. I want to get a guy has made a name for himself in the league before.

I think Cowher and Schotty are both going to fight for the Browns job

SuperMcGee
12-12-2008, 12:41 AM
Schobel to IR. Very drawn out and predictable, but still sad.

But I just had a very random, exciting thought for next year:

Alvin Bowen.

SuperKevin
12-12-2008, 12:43 AM
Schobel to IR. Very drawn out and predictable, but still sad.

But I just had a very random, exciting thought for next year:

Alvin Bowen.

Think he can fill our hole at OLB for next year?

SuperMcGee
12-12-2008, 12:45 AM
No.
But I'm pretty sure he puts our coverage unit from our current #2 spot all the way up to #1.

bearsfan_51
12-12-2008, 12:53 AM
What would you guys say the % is of Dick Jauron getting fired? Maybe a bit hasty since he's kept the Bills relatively competitive, but he's been a head coach for 8 years and has only made the playoffs once.

fischbowl
12-12-2008, 08:54 AM
What would you guys say the % is of Dick Jauron getting fired? Maybe a bit hasty since he's kept the Bills relatively competitive, but he's been a head coach for 8 years and has only made the playoffs once.

Jauron doesn't get fired, but Turk Schonert does

SuperMcGee
12-12-2008, 12:28 PM
AVPromotion! You know it's coming.

Rob S
12-13-2008, 07:50 PM
AVPromotion! You know it's coming.

haha.....AVP has been around so long. Anyway, I think DJ gets at least one more year, as he should imo.

Rob S
12-14-2008, 02:46 PM
**** you losman

**** whoever called the play fake

******* give the ball to beast mode

**** this

BufFan71
12-14-2008, 03:08 PM
wow

im shocked

the coaches lost this game
if a player doesnt question the playcalling in an interview tonight, ill be surprised

SuperKevin
12-14-2008, 03:35 PM
Is it baseball season yet?

Rob S
12-14-2008, 03:42 PM
wow

im shocked

the coaches lost this game
if a player doesnt question the playcalling in an interview tonight, ill be surprised


i wouldnt say that much....the playcalling did not help, but that was all losman. In that situation u need to know a sack is fine. DJ was going for the kill, not needed and stupid imo, but he has a right to assume that his QB will at least know to protect the ball.

BufFan71
12-14-2008, 05:53 PM
at some point Losman has to realize there is going to be backside pursuit, and he either needs to try and run, or throw it away
anything but fumble the ball and lose us the game



on the bright side, did anyone else see Adam Sandler in the stands?

Bills2083
12-14-2008, 06:35 PM
at some point Losman has to realize there is going to be backside pursuit, and he either needs to try and run, or throw it away
anything but fumble the ball and lose us the game



on the bright side, did anyone else see Adam Sandler in the stands?

Are you sure that was not JP in the stands, and Adam Sandler on the field? Because whoever played quarterback for us today looked extremely pedestrian...

;)

TheBuffaloBills
12-14-2008, 10:32 PM
Man, I wonder whats going to happen to Duke Preston? The ref had some severe turf burn on his face. His nose skid the turf for a good yard.

ruthlessrussian
12-15-2008, 04:24 AM
0-5 in the division so far..

im seriously sick

CC.SD
12-15-2008, 01:21 PM
Goooooooo Bills!!!!!!!!!

Seriously, hope Marshawn does some legit stat-padding against the Denver D this week, if you guys stick it to Denver and the Chargers somehow get a win against Tampa Bay, week 17 is a winner take all in the AFC West with Denver at SD.

Fight on! Please?

SuperKevin
12-15-2008, 01:23 PM
Goooooooo Bills!!!!!!!!!

Seriously, hope Marshawn does some legit stat-padding against the Denver D this week, if you guys stick it to Denver and the Chargers somehow get a win against Tampa Bay, week 17 is a winner take all in the AFC West with Denver at SD.

Fight on! Please?

Its funny because working in San Diego I've had at least 4 phone calls and like 10 people ask me in person if the Bills will beat Denver next week.

CC.SD
12-15-2008, 02:03 PM
Its funny because working in San Diego I've had at least 4 phone calls and like 10 people ask me in person if the Bills will beat Denver next week.

and how do you respond? :D

Everyone in SD loves the Bills this week. I don't think seeing them get a win is really impossible; Denver's D-line is not good, so teams can run and QBs can get pockets. That's the kind of scenario that the phrase "Any Given Sunday" was made for.

Oh well. Crossing my fingers for you guys...and of course for the Bolts to knock off TB. Pretty crazy that we can go from 4-8 to alive in week 16.

fischbowl
12-15-2008, 02:54 PM
Completed Trades:

Philadelphia Eagles get:

OT Jason Peters

Buffalo Bills get:

1st Round Pick (17th ovr)

Peters has not been playing up to his Pro Bowl standards this year, and it is no secret that he wanted out of Western New York

--------------------------------------------

Buffalo Bills get:

1st Round Pick (14 ovr)
DE Mark Anderson

Chicago Bears get:

1st Round Pick (12 ovr)

By trading down two spots, we also fulfilled a need for a DE. In Aaron Schobel's absence, we truly lacked a solid pass rusher, a role that will now belong to Anderson.

-----------------------------------------------

Buffalo Bills get:

G Charlie Johnson
5th Round Pick

Indianapolis Colts get:

DT John McCargo

McCargo has been a true bust since we drafted him with the 26th overall pick in 2006. For him we get Charlie Johnson, a very versatile lineman from the Colts, who we believe has the potential to be a solid starter

-------------------------------------------------

Buffalo Bills get:

1st Round Pick (31 ovr)
2nd Round Pick (46 ovr)

New York Giants get:

1st Round Pick (14 ovr)

By trading down, we got more picks to satisfy our needs. We already had the 17th overall selection as well, so we managed to still have two first round picks and now two second round picks.

---------------------------------------------

DRAFT

1a) Eben Britton, OT, Arizona

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/britton.jpg

1b) James Laurinaitis, LB, Ohio State

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/laurinaitis.jpg

2a) Mike Mickens, CB, Cincinnati

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/mickens.jpg

2b) Chase Coffman, TE, Missouri

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/coffman.jpg

3) Edwin Williams, C, Maryland

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/williams.jpg

__________________________________________________ ____

How we'd finish it:

4) Kraig Urbik, G, Wisconsin

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/urbik.jpg

5a) Pat White, WR, West Virginia

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/white.jpg

5b) Brian Toal, OLB, Boston College

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/toal.jpg

6) Al Afalava, S, Oregon State

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/afalava.jpg

7) Dan Gronkowski, TE, Maryland

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm133/fischbowl/gronkowski.jpg

SuperMcGee
12-15-2008, 04:18 PM
Needs Drew Willy.

Really like McCargo trade, Johnson and a 5th is great return.

Dig the TE picks. Williams and Pat White are nice.

Anderson has gotten a lot less effective since entering the league, but it's a good mock. Between him and Ellis, someone would have to provide a spark. Hopefully.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
12-15-2008, 04:50 PM
Goooooooo Bills!!!!!!!!!

Seriously, hope Marshawn does some legit stat-padding against the Denver D this week, if you guys stick it to Denver and the Chargers somehow get a win against Tampa Bay, week 17 is a winner take all in the AFC West with Denver at SD.

Fight on! Please?

Sorry Bills fans, no disrespect, but I must request you lose on Sunday. Or I will ban you.


Regards,
CutlerChris

Bills2083
12-15-2008, 05:38 PM
Sorry Bills fans, no disrespect, but I must request you lose on Sunday. Or I will ban you.


Regards,
CutlerChris


CC, I probably have a better chance of winning the mega millions than I do being banned.

And no, this does not mean that you can ban me if the Bills somehow go against all odds and win. ;)

TheBuffaloBills
12-16-2008, 03:06 PM
Knowing the Bills, we will probably win the last 2 meaningless games.

SuperMcGee
12-16-2008, 03:10 PM
I don't know, we tend to always lose at the end of the year.
We're definitely not going to beat the Patriots, that's just obvious. I'm positive that a feel-good win is impossible after the Jets game. And it's the Patriots. We'll probably find a way to beat Denver, just because the Jauron Bills have 7-9 written all over them.

Bills2083
12-16-2008, 03:37 PM
According to Chris Brown, the Bills aren't ruling out starting Hamdan on Sunday.
IMO, this is good news. I never want to see JP throw another football in Buffalo. Unless of course he's on another team :)

619
12-16-2008, 03:40 PM
According to Chris Brown, the Bills aren't ruling out starting Hamdan on Sunday.
IMO, this is good news. I never want to see JP throw another football in Buffalo. Unless of course he's on another team :)

Hamdan of NFL Europe ? Whoa, that's awesome. :)

SuperMcGee
12-16-2008, 03:43 PM
Hamdan of NFL Europe ? Whoa, that's awesome. :)

Yes, it is.
I'd love to see Hamdan play. At the very least, this hopefully means that he'll come in when our starter inevitably struggles/makes an ass out of himself.

Bills2083
12-16-2008, 03:49 PM
Hamdan of NFL Europe ? Whoa, that's awesome. :)

Yup, you are correct.
He will be the next Kurt Warner ;)

http://www.cheddarheads.co.uk/nfle/nfle04/week0/ams02.jpg

fischbowl
12-17-2008, 06:51 AM
Jason Peters named to the Pro Bowl, lolz

SuperKevin
12-17-2008, 07:06 AM
Jason Peters named to the Pro Bowl, lolz

The Pro Bowl is officially worse than the MLB All Star Game now

Rob S
12-17-2008, 11:46 AM
Peters has been pretty sweet after the first 4 or 5 weeks.

SuperMcGee
12-17-2008, 12:42 PM
Pretty sweet at allowing sack-fumbles.

SuperKevin
12-17-2008, 01:26 PM
Peters going to the pro bowl makes me cry because it's only adding fuel to his demands. Hopefully it increases his trade value though

TheBuffaloBills
12-17-2008, 02:14 PM
I really want to see Hamden start. I want to see him play against a starting defense. I really want to know how he is.

CC.SD
12-17-2008, 03:17 PM
Sorry Bills fans, no disrespect, but I must request you lose on Sunday. Or I will ban you.


Regards,
CutlerChris

I accept this ruling humbly, yet sneakily pray for rebellion.

Bills2083
12-17-2008, 03:34 PM
Per text:
Gibran Hamdan to start on Sunday if Edwards is not ready to go.

fischbowl
12-17-2008, 07:52 PM
Per text:
Gibran Hamdan to start on Sunday if Edwards is not ready to go.

Sweet, Sunday at McFadden's is sure to be fun now

SuperMcGee
12-18-2008, 05:33 PM
We signed Jonathan Scott. There was a time in 05 when he was who I wanted us to draft more than anybody else in the 2006 draft. So this pretty much means he's having a career resurrection here. Just like Teddy Lehman.

Iamcanadian
12-21-2008, 10:32 AM
We signed Jonathan Scott. There was a time in 05 when he was who I wanted us to draft more than anybody else in the 2006 draft. So this pretty much means he's having a career resurrection here. Just like Teddy Lehman.

He couldn't win a starting job in Detroit and lost out as a backup. Nothing special here.

SuperMcGee
12-21-2008, 12:36 PM
He couldn't win a starting job in Detroit and lost out as a backup. Nothing special here.

Ummm... yeah. I wasn't being serious in any way. Except that I did like him 3 years ago.

Bills gonna win today! Freddy Jackson style.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
12-21-2008, 01:12 PM
Sorry Bills fans, I like you and everything, but we are going to annihilate you today in order to avoid one of the biggest collapses in NFL history of being 3 games up with 3 games to go and losing.

SuperKevin
12-21-2008, 01:14 PM
Sorry Bills fans, I like you and everything, but we are going to annihilate you today in order to avoid one of the biggest collapses in NFL history of being 3 games up with 3 games to go and losing.

We are going to beat you today thus setting up the biggest game of the year next week between you and the Chargers. It will be football's equivalent to a stell cage loser leaves town match.

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
12-21-2008, 01:26 PM
We are going to beat you today thus setting up the biggest game of the year next week between you and the Chargers. It will be football's equivalent to a stell cage loser leaves town match.

No, because we will lose by at least 3 scores in that situation.

SuperMcGee
12-21-2008, 02:06 PM
Just be glad Trent's groin healed enough and you don't have to face Hamdan. Collapse completion would be imminent.

SuperKevin
12-21-2008, 05:48 PM
I have recieved like 18 text messages from my Chargers fan friends giving me random updates about the game

TheBuffaloBills
12-21-2008, 06:13 PM
Your welcome C.C.S.D

BufFan71
12-21-2008, 06:16 PM
wow, i never expected us to win that game after the way it started

MichaelJordanEberle (sabf)
12-21-2008, 06:17 PM
You're all ******* banned.

SuperMcGee
12-21-2008, 06:17 PM
Bills gonna win today! Freddy Jackson style.

Now that's damn good style.

SuperKevin
12-21-2008, 07:02 PM
Man this team always finds a way to finish the season 7-9 or 8-8.

I actually think our offense is good for next year with the exception of a player or two on the OL. I think we have quality players at all the offensive skill positions right now. We really need to fix things up on defense though. Our secondary has been getting shredded week after week now. I'll have my new mock idea up soon

BufFan71
12-21-2008, 07:09 PM
if Steve Johnson continues to work hard, he will be our 2/3 wr next season.
I think our offense will be fine, they arent doing TOO bad this year.... maybe a real T.E and a center


defense desperatly needs schobel back... then they need to draft a playmaker at DE, Selvie or Orakpo
also, they need to make another FA signing in leroy Hill at OLB

SuperKevin
12-21-2008, 07:17 PM
if Steve Johnson continues to work hard, he will be our 2/3 wr next season.
I think our offense will be fine, they arent doing TOO bad this year.... maybe a real T.E and a center


defense desperatly needs schobel back... then they need to draft a playmaker at DE, Selvie or Orakpo
also, they need to make another FA signing in leroy Hill at OLB

I think our offense is fine with Robert Royal/Schouman/Fine at TE for now.

Honestly I'm thinking we should go with Taylor Mays with our first round pick. I've noticed that teams have been throwing deep over the middle against us with regularity and it's because we don't have an athletic centerfielder kind of safety back there. I think adding Mays to our defense will keep teams from trying to go deep against us and do to our defense what LaRon Landry is doing for Washington.

Bills2083
12-21-2008, 08:04 PM
What good pass-rushing DEs would be available in the 2nd round?

SuperKevin
12-21-2008, 08:05 PM
What good pass-rushing DEs would be available in the 2nd round?

Connor Barwin comes to mind.

BufFan71
12-22-2008, 12:03 PM
maybe we can draft Taylor Mays, and then traded up into the 1st and grab a pure pass rusher like George Selvie...

SuperKevin
12-22-2008, 01:30 PM
maybe we can draft Taylor Mays, and then traded up into the 1st and grab a pure pass rusher like George Selvie...

George Selvie shouldn't play DE in the NFL though. He'll be pushed around way too much

BufFan71
12-22-2008, 06:10 PM
George Selvie shouldn't play DE in the NFL though. He'll be pushed around way too much


yeah, i was actually reading up one the DE's

the one i actually really like if Everette Brown from FSU, hes explosive off the line, and he has a killer spin move
hes a really good pass rusher

ruthlessrussian
12-22-2008, 07:42 PM
You know, I have been actually thinking about the possibilities of taking Mays aswell. Mays is the type of draftpick that could make an instant impact on a team and really push the Bills defense to reach elite status.

The only part I dont like about it is fact that we would be using yet another top pick on secondary. Maybe it is not a bad thing, but it does seem like an over investment.

If Mays isnt the choice I would really like to see our oline addressed, especially the interior, but a tackle is not out of the question.

What are your guys thoughts on the how to adress the online right now. Should it be done through the draft or free agency or both?

BufFan71
12-22-2008, 07:47 PM
well, the offensive line..... i think one thing that could help them
is make them all lose about 20lbs this offseason
they (aside from butler) look so out of shape

also a center Like Mack wouldnt hurt

ruthlessrussian
12-22-2008, 07:53 PM
Too true. I was hoping after getting rid of *shudders* Mike Williams that we were moving in the direction of having an athletic oline. But after what I saw this season I couldnt agree with what you said more.

Yeah, Mack seems like a logical pick, but 12 or where ever the Bills pick would be too high for him and a mid second round pick might be too late.

SuperKevin
12-22-2008, 09:10 PM
Mack is a beast but I don't think there's that big of a drop off in talent at Center between him and say Antoine Caldwell in round 3

TheBuffaloBills
12-23-2008, 08:36 AM
Everette Brown is by far my most favorite DE in the draft. I am sure he will skyrocket before the draft though.

I did think of this,

Get Billick as the HC and get Nolan too.
Switch to 3-4 Defense
Sign Terrel Suggs (Billick would need to make a big push to get him on our team though)
Draft Tyson Jackson


Wow.

Bills2083
12-23-2008, 09:22 AM
What are your thoughts on Jason Brown from Baltimore?

SuperKevin
12-23-2008, 09:49 AM
What are your thoughts on Jason Brown from Baltimore?

Hmmm. Not bad. Too be honest I've been leaning more towards wanting to sign a veteran Center rather than draft one early. I also like that he can play guard if needed.

SuperMcGee
12-23-2008, 02:43 PM
What are your thoughts on Jason Brown from Baltimore?

I honestly have not seen too much of him this year but I was a big fan coming into the season, and I don't think he's had a bad year. I'd be thrilled to get him somehow.

Rob S
12-23-2008, 02:54 PM
lets try and use the draft thread......i know this is kind of all we are living for right now, but if that means this thread fading for a bit then so be it. I am not going to be a hardass on it or anything, but the thread does exist for a reason

SuperKevin
12-23-2008, 02:55 PM
lets try and use the draft thread......i know this is kind of all we are living for right now, but if that means this thread fading for a bit then so be it. I am not going to be a hardass on it or anything, but the thread does exist for a reason

I post mock drafts in there. All other general draft talk I keep here though

Rob S
12-23-2008, 10:07 PM
alright....maybe we can change that to a mock thread then....hmmm, I'll get on it

Rob S
12-23-2008, 10:11 PM
just realized we had both a mock thread and a draft discussion thread, they are now 1 thread for mocks and we can keep all discussion here.

Vox Populi
12-30-2008, 12:48 AM
Well... that was a... weird typical Bills season. Highs and Lows, no where in between. All the games had me shaking my head and pissed off at some point because of Jauron or Edwards doing something ******* ********.

Well... here are some things I have to say about what I'd like to happen for us fans...

1. Fire Jauron
We need a coach with some balls. I'm pretty sure Jauron has none and the only guy on the Bills staff I know has any is coach April. April needs another raise. He lost half his special teamers and still put out a great unit filled with first and second year players mostly.

Who do I want to be the new coach? Anyone who won't bring in a ******* Tampa-2, Cover-2 defense. I've had enough of this defensive scheme we are running. Dial up the blitz and get some pass rushers.

To throw an actual name out there, Schwartz is my favourite for the job. I'd actually prefer Spagnuolo but I don't think hes an option, he seems like an NFC guy to me, just a feeling.

2. Get a VP of Football Operations & a General Manager
I have no idea who there is that I'd like the Bills to pick up, but I'd just rather see something other than a handful of guys in charge of it. It just seems stupid to do it this way. Its nice to actually be able to blame individuals for failure rather than have it slowly sink through the group and just slow up things.

3. Free agency & thoughts
Get rid of Fowler and Preston. Sign someone who can play ball. We need someone with some POWER because the other 3 teams in the division all run a 3-4 with Wilfork and Jenkins holding the middle in NY and NE. The Dolphins will probably find someone solid there soon too. Apparently Matt Birk is a UFA, I know hes not a big man, but practicing against Pat Williams surely helped a bit... Of course Alex Mack is the one I really want though. That dude is MEAN out there and will definitely want a piece of Vince Wilfork.

The rest of the line I really don't have any gripes with. I know we were all hating Peters earlier and he didn't deserve that Pro-Bowl spot, but the guy IS a legit left tackle and has proven it. I'm not giving that away when there is no viable replacement for him. Not too big on the idea of never using the tight end and making them a sixth lineman like when Pennington was the right tackle.

The receivers, including tight ends... **** 'em. Not worth any investment at this point, there are other issues and theres some youth at TE already with Fine and Schouman, lets see where they end up.

Quarterback, I'm willing to ride with Edwards still, JP Losman is gone. Hadman isn't #2 as far as I am concerned. Bring a veteran in to be a backup. If Charlie Batch, Byron Leftwich or Jeff Garcia want to come over and backup Edwards, or in the case of Garcia, try and beat him out in camp, I'd be happy.

Running back. LOCKUP ACTION JACKSON. Him and Marshawn are a hell of a combo and a great duo. Need them around long term. Both offer more than just a rushing threat with their hands and Action Jackson can return the ball as well if we are down a returner.

Cornerback is fine, Greer needs an extension if he doesn't have one already. I don't care if we're paying solid coin out to 3 of them, we play in a division that needs to stop the Pats and their spread. Reggie Corner might have made some plays in the Denver game but he got abused most of the time this season.

Safety, we need an upgrade at wherever Whitner isn't playing and we need to get Whitner healthy. He faded hard down the stretch after the first few weeks of the season. We've got a lot of marginally talented backups, but Taylor Mays would have me grinning for weeks. He is my dream pick. Not worth trading up for though IMO. Keep the other safeties on the roster, see who can earn it in Camp and bring something to the special teams.

Linebacker. Crowell is gone, Ellison should never have been starting this year. Hes a backup through and through. Theres no real guys worth targeting in FA yet unless we want to shuffle a bit in which case I'd gladly take Vilma.

Defensive Line. We need help here more than anything, more specifically in getting a pass rush from the left end spot. Kelsay is a backup. I know Everette Brown plays there in college, but he doesn't seem like he'll be able to stick there at 250 pounds in the pros. Julius Peppers is a dream scenario obviously and I don't see any scenario where he leaves Carolina. The draft is a more likely scenario here where we take a couple of ends and see who sticks around in camp. We've got Ellis already as a potential pass rusher. I'd take a shot on Will Davis from Illinois in round 3 and Kyle Moore from USC in round 5 as well. Clinton McDonalds from Memphis looks like a workout warrior based on reports too and I could see him as a 6th round option. I really wouldn't mind seeing us investing 3 picks on Ends even if not all of them stick around. At least identify a need like cornerback last year.

This team has a lot of pieces, very few stars and just needs someone to bring them together better than Jauron. Some star power wouldn't hurt though

SuperKevin
12-30-2008, 01:24 AM
Am I the only one who would like to see Phil Savage brought in to be our GM? I thought he did a good job with personnel in Cleveland but poor coaching doomed him.

Rob S
12-30-2008, 10:18 AM
Am I the only one who would like to see Phil Savage brought in to be our GM? I thought he did a good job with personnel in Cleveland but poor coaching doomed him.

absolutely......he is a tremendous talent evaluator imo. I cant wait to see what happens with Juaron. My prediction is him getting another year.

fischbowl
12-30-2008, 02:27 PM
My Offseason plan:

CSPAN

Cut
Schonert
Preston
and
Neill

!

Bills2083
12-30-2008, 03:28 PM
nevermind.

The Dynasty
12-30-2008, 04:21 PM
Just saw on the bottom of ESPN news that Juaron will be back for the 2009 season....

BufFan71
12-30-2008, 04:24 PM
im in shock....
hes been 7-9 each year..


hes 2-22 against teams that finish with a winning record....

The Dynasty
12-30-2008, 04:33 PM
im in shock....
hes been 7-9 each year..


hes 2-22 against teams that finish with a winning record....

You shouldnt be shocked at all. This is Ralph Wilson all the way. He doesnt have a clue what he is doing, and Juaron is a cheap coach and Ralph is the cheapest owner in the league.

Rob S
12-30-2008, 04:52 PM
ugh.....this blows. If he didnt sign that extension he would be out on his ass, but ralph is too cheap to bite the bullet and eat the contract.

Rob S
12-30-2008, 04:56 PM
just think...maybe we could have shanny.....:(

TheBuffaloBills
12-30-2008, 05:57 PM
I am so bummed coming into the 09 season. Hopefully Turk will be gone. UGH, I am so pissed. This is the most pissed I am with the team in a very long time. We aren't going to win without a Coach damnit.

Bills2083
12-30-2008, 06:17 PM
I am so bummed coming into the 09 season. Hopefully Turk will be gone. UGH, I am so pissed. This is the most pissed I am with the team in a very long time. We aren't going to win without a Coach damnit.

Ralph said that we will not be changing anything in the front office for next season.
I'm pretty sure that we'll still have Turk here.:rolleyes:

fischbowl
12-30-2008, 06:31 PM
Ralph said that we will not be changing anything in the front office for next season.
I'm pretty sure that we'll still have Turk here.:rolleyes:

Ew. Nasty, Gross, Disgusting

BufFan71
12-30-2008, 06:57 PM
looks like the 2009 season already ended today

SuperMcGee
12-30-2008, 07:01 PM
looks like the 2009 season already ended today

Seriously, they should just give us the Lombardi Trophy now. Riding 10 yard cushions and Lee Evans fades all the way to Miami!

fischbowl
12-30-2008, 07:04 PM
Who else is a fan of CSPAN?

Bills2083
12-30-2008, 07:05 PM
The players are happy that Jauron is going to be here next year...
http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/players-excited-jauron-retained/5277356a-14f3-4587-b267-b2d245eb968b

fischbowl
12-30-2008, 07:05 PM
The players are happy that Jauron is going to be here next year...
http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/players-excited-jauron-retained/5277356a-14f3-4587-b267-b2d245eb968b

They've always loved Dick

SuperMcGee
12-30-2008, 07:06 PM
Booting Turk, Ryan "**** you" Neill, and The Duke? I'm down.

Bills2083
12-30-2008, 07:06 PM
Who else is a fan of CSPAN?

Me!
throw in Robert Royal too, please. And the cover-2

SuperKevin
12-30-2008, 07:07 PM
The players are happy that Jauron is going to be here next year...
http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/players-excited-jauron-retained/5277356a-14f3-4587-b267-b2d245eb968b

They love him because Dick doesn't jump down their throats when they play like ass. Mike Singletary would have murdered our OL at the beginning of the year

SuperMcGee
12-30-2008, 07:08 PM
The players are happy that Jauron is going to be here next year...
http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/players-excited-jauron-retained/5277356a-14f3-4587-b267-b2d245eb968b

Of course they are, he's a players coach. That's all you ever hear is how much the players like Dick.
Especially Ryan Neill.
[/immaturity] Sorry. I really am.

SuperKevin
12-30-2008, 07:08 PM
Me!
throw in Robert Royal too, please. And the cover-2

Robert Royal isn't bad. He's a more than adequate blocker and is reliable in the intermediate passing game. That's all we really need from our TE with the speed we have at WR

BufFan71
12-30-2008, 07:09 PM
Who else is a fan of CSPAN?


me, but i would like alot more people to be cut, including kelsay

The players are happy that Jauron is going to be here next year...
http://www.buffalobills.com/news/article-1/players-excited-jauron-retained/5277356a-14f3-4587-b267-b2d245eb968b

its distugsting...... these players are so soft, that it's no wonder why they get physically dominated, and can only beat the teams that are mentally week


Me!
throw in Robert Royal too, please. And the cover-2



god i hate the cover 2.... i would love for Jerry Gray to come back...
some of u might not agree with that

SuperMcGee
12-30-2008, 07:10 PM
Robert Royal isn't bad. He's a more than adequate blocker and is reliable in the intermediate passing game. That's all we really need from our TE with the speed we have at WR

That's not registering too well with me.

BufFan71
12-30-2008, 07:12 PM
That's not registering too well with me.


i think he meant reliable.. as in....


dropping passes in the 4th quarter
fumbling the ball in crucial situations....

Bills2083
12-30-2008, 07:13 PM
That's not registering too well with me.

lol, same with me.
I counted at least 3 drops by him vs. the Pats.

SuperKevin
12-30-2008, 07:14 PM
Sorry, earlier in the year he was one of our more consistent targets. Living in San Diego, it's really hard for me to catch a lot of Bills games, especially when they sucked down the stretch

BufFan71
12-30-2008, 07:16 PM
did u guys know

in jaurons last year as the Bears coach.. he was 7-9
he coached five games as lions HC


then 3 straight 7-9 years with us

no matter how much talent we bring in.... we will never get over the hump

Rob S
12-30-2008, 10:35 PM
Kawika Mitchell is sweet on blitzes, he should be going after the QB all the freaking time.

TheBuffaloBills
12-31-2008, 01:53 PM
Kawika Mitchell is sweet on blitzes, he should be going after the QB all the freaking time.

Yeah, when he rushes full head of steam straight through the middle of the line, its like 75% chance he will get a sack.

Rob S
01-02-2009, 04:30 PM
Talk about starting the offseason on the right foot. 1st we retain everyone, now this:
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3806195

I hate life as a bills fan

SuperMcGee
01-02-2009, 04:33 PM
I love it. Overrated chumps claiming they're worth millions when in fact they're not worth a spot above Bryan Scott.

I wish we still had Jim Leonhard. He had more heart than anyone on this team, and now he's playing very well in Baltimore. I don't know if he would've done the same with us, he wasn't that great when starting, but it was hard not to like the guy.

Rob S
01-02-2009, 04:38 PM
I love it. Overrated chumps claiming they're worth millions when in fact they're not worth a spot above Bryan Scott.

I wish we still had Jim Leonhard. He had more heart than anyone on this team, and now he's playing very well in Baltimore. I don't know if he would've done the same with us, he wasn't that great when starting, but it was hard not to like the guy.

very good ST guy. I dont think he woulda been great in Buffalo, but yeah he was a good guy to have around......guess we may need to take Mays.......and ignore DE again YAY!!

woodnick
01-03-2009, 11:41 AM
Hey guys, theres a forum mock thats being set up if anybody is interested. There are still something like 12 GM spots available if people are interested.

For people that haven't participated in a forum mock in the past they should check it out, they are tons of fun.

Sign-up deadline is tonight, so try to hurry.


http://www.draftcountdown.com/forum/...t=28445&page=3

TheBuffaloBills
01-03-2009, 07:51 PM
This is a video of the Bills singing "Twelve days of Christmas". I guarantee a laugh.

http://www.buffalobills.com/media-lounge/videos/bills-players-sing-twelve-days-of-christmas/c7ea5023-edb1-429b-8929-440044da8fa2

Poz wanted nothing to do with it, McKelvin was uncomfortable, and Lynch was great like always.

SuperKevin
01-03-2009, 07:58 PM
Half of these guys shouldn't even be on the team

Blake Costanzo just talked

Justin Jenkins did the best

TheBuffaloBills
01-03-2009, 10:55 PM
Ah man, McKelvin sounds like a little kid. LOL.

Bills2083
01-03-2009, 11:40 PM
Half of these guys shouldn't even be on the team

Blake Costanzo just talked

Justin Jenkins did the best

I was at the Bills game vs. the Pats.
They played the song over the intercom system.

You should've heard Jenkins - his voice was ringing throughout the stadium. It was pretty funny.

Rob S
01-04-2009, 05:29 PM
I was at the Bills game vs. the Pats.
They played the song over the intercom system.

You should've heard Jenkins - his voice was ringing throughout the stadium. It was pretty funny.

Yeah his voice was insanely loud haha...they played it like 10 times haha

Vox Populi
01-04-2009, 05:48 PM
I <3 Marshawn :D

TheBuffaloBills
01-04-2009, 08:01 PM
Ahhhh man, what is your predictions on our record next year?

I always say we will be around .500 coming into the season, but honestly, I think we will be 3-13

Rob S
01-04-2009, 08:05 PM
Ahhhh man, what is your predictions on our record next year?

I always say we will be around .500 coming into the season, but honestly, I think we will be 3-13

a lot depends on the offseason and trent's development (which will honge on the offseason anyway imo), so its too early to call imo

SuperKevin
01-04-2009, 10:53 PM
Optimistically I think we can go 9-7. Realistically it is more like 7-9

fischbowl
01-04-2009, 10:55 PM
Optimistically I think we can go 9-7. Realistically it is more like 7-9

7-9. The Jauron Special!

jdcozart
01-05-2009, 04:05 PM
Be easy on Jauron. I did a scouting/player personnel internship for the Bills over the summer. I saw him everyday for more than a month. He's one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. In all honesty the Bills are really young and don't have a ton of talent. I don't think that 7-9 is bad with the collection of talent the team has, but that's just my opinion.

fischbowl
01-05-2009, 04:44 PM
Be easy on Jauron. I did a scouting/player personnel internship for the Bills over the summer. I saw him everyday for more than a month. He's one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. In all honesty the Bills are really young and don't have a ton of talent. I don't think that 7-9 is bad with the collection of talent the team has, but that's just my opinion.

Sweet job, I do scouting too (well, for baseball). Yeah I'm a fan of him as a person and all but his play calling is way too conservative. I'd like to see him back with a new OC.

jdcozart
01-05-2009, 04:57 PM
Sweet job, I do scouting too (well, for baseball). Yeah I'm a fan of him as a person and all but his play calling is way too conservative. I'd like to see him back with a new OC.

Who do you scout for? That's really cool that you're a scout. I'm graduating in May so I still have to get a job, but the internship was a HUGE step...I'm not a fan of Schonert either.

fischbowl
01-05-2009, 09:49 PM
Who do you scout for? That's really cool that you're a scout. I'm graduating in May so I still have to get a job, but the internship was a HUGE step...I'm not a fan of Schonert either.

Cardinals. DII, DIII, and JuCo. I just started.

jdcozart
01-05-2009, 11:08 PM
Cardinals. DII, DIII, and JuCo. I just started.

That's really sweet man. Congratulations! I'm working hard to become a scout myself. I'm going to he Senior Bowl in a couple weeks and staying throughout to network and I have gotten into the NFL Combine the last two years and sat amongst the scouts and coaches so hopefully I'll be scouting same as you soon! Stay in touch because if and when I get in the league I've always wanted to make contacts in the other major sports so I could get some tickets to MLB/NBA games and hook my friend up with some NFL tickets. Shoot me an e-mail at jdcozart@bsu.edu. Oh, my name is Jon.

Iamcanadian
01-06-2009, 10:34 AM
Be easy on Jauron. I did a scouting/player personnel internship for the Bills over the summer. I saw him everyday for more than a month. He's one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. In all honesty the Bills are really young and don't have a ton of talent. I don't think that 7-9 is bad with the collection of talent the team has, but that's just my opinion.

I disagree. I can accept 7-9 this year which is only Edwards 2nd year as a starter but I will really question Jauron if he cannot produce a winner by next season. To be fair, our owner must keep the team intact and use his draft picks to improve the team and not just to replace FA's lost. This has been a familiar pattern for the past decade. Hopefully the money secured from the Toronto self off of games will provide us with enough income to change our philosophy.
Jauron is on the very hot seat for me. Win or else.

SuperKevin
01-06-2009, 10:35 AM
I disagree. I can accept 7-9 this year which is only Edwards 2nd year as a starter but I will really question Jauron if he cannot produce a winner by next season. To be fair, our owner must keep the team intact and use his draft picks to improve the team and not just to replace FA's lost. This has been a familiar pattern for the past decade. Hopefully the money secured from the Toronto self off of games will provide us with enough income to change our philosophy.
Jauron is on the very hot seat for me. Win or else.

I am in full agreement.

Rob S
01-06-2009, 07:34 PM
Be easy on Jauron. I did a scouting/player personnel internship for the Bills over the summer. I saw him everyday for more than a month. He's one of the nicest guys you will ever meet. In all honesty the Bills are really young and don't have a ton of talent. I don't think that 7-9 is bad with the collection of talent the team has, but that's just my opinion.

I'm sure he is, but that doesnt factor into him being on the hot seat or not. Rod Marinelli seems like maybe the classiest coach in the NFL. The way he handled the media this season was nothing short of remarkable, but he still went 0-16 and was fired (rightfully so). Juaron has to produce on the field, no ifs, ands, or buts about it. If you get FOUR YEARS (thats a lifetime for coaches now), you damn well better at least be able to muster one winning season. Next year has to be the year for DJ for sure. Maybe the team doesnt have winning record talent (I beg to differ, but that for another time), but it is the coach and GM's job to bring in players, and he has clearly not gotten it done if that is the case. Now, Ralph is cheap and I am sure we have lost players DJ wanted to keep and so on......but if you are going to coach the Bills, that means u get Ralph and u have to win with what u are supplied. Sorry, Buffalo may be a tougher place to win bc of Ralph's cheapness, but bc he is cheap doesnt mean a coach has a free pass to go 7-9 every year (look at DelRio in JAX, that man gets it done). If DJ cant do it with what Ralph is providing, let someone else have a shot......even if it fails it is an attempt to win. I would rather at least like to see my team aspire to something greater than continue to mire in mediocrity, which so far defines DJ's tenure as head coach of the Buffalo Bills.


ahhhh......that felt good

jdcozart
01-06-2009, 08:19 PM
I'm sure he is, but that doesnt factor into him being on the hot seat or not. Rod Marinelli seems like maybe the classiest coach in the NFL. The way he handled the media this season was nothing short of remarkable, but he still went 0-16 and was fired (rightfully so). Juaron has to produce on the field, no ifs, ands, or buts about it. If you get FOUR YEARS (thats a lifetime for coaches now), you damn well better at least be able to muster one winning season. Next year has to be the year for DJ for sure. Maybe the team doesnt have winning record talent (I beg to differ, but that for another time), but it is the coach and GM's job to bring in players, and he has clearly not gotten it done if that is the case. Now, Ralph is cheap and I am sure we have lost players DJ wanted to keep and so on......but if you are going to coach the Bills, that means u get Ralph and u have to win with what u are supplied. Sorry, Buffalo may be a tougher place to win bc of Ralph's cheapness, but bc he is cheap doesnt mean a coach has a free pass to go 7-9 every year (look at DelRio in JAX, that man gets it done). If DJ cant do it with what Ralph is providing, let someone else have a shot......even if it fails it is an attempt to win. I would rather at least like to see my team aspire to something greater than continue to mire in mediocrity, which so far defines DJ's tenure as head coach of the Buffalo Bills.


ahhhh......that felt good

Well I guess I'm going to have trouble looking at this objectively since I've worked with him and I'm very good friends with one of his daughters, but I don't know why you all think that the Bills have such great talent. I like most of the guys since I was around them every day too, but athletically who excites you? I like Lynch. I talked to him a lot and I think he's dynamic. I really like Fred Jackson and I think he's underrated. Evans is good, but he isn't near what he should be given the average performances out of the QB position. McGee is good and I like Stroud too. Roscoe is a beast but only on ST. Peters is special, but consistently unhappy with his contract situation. The WRs are average. Same with the LBs. Schobel is overrated and Kelsey is a great guy, but needs to be part of a rotation. Not a starter. The secondary is improved this year, but Whitner and Simpson just do not make big plays ala Polamolu, Reed, Sanders. I do not see a playoff team right now and the talent on the team isn't a reflection on Jauron. He doesn't have final say on personnel decisions even though the team doesn't have a GM. The team needs more special players like Lynch and Peters before I will call them playoff contenders. Right now 7-9 is the best the team can hope for again next year in a tough division.

SuperMcGee
01-06-2009, 08:34 PM
Well I guess I'm going to have trouble looking at this objectively since I've worked with him and I'm very good friends with one of his daughters, but I don't know why you all think that the Bills have such great talent. I like most of the guys since I was around them every day too, but athletically who excites you? I like Lynch. I talked to him a lot and I think he's dynamic. I really like Fred Jackson and I think he's underrated. Evans is good, but he isn't near what he should be given the average performances out of the QB position. McGee is good and I like Stroud too. Roscoe is a beast but only on ST. Peters is special, but consistently unhappy with his contract situation. The WRs are average. Same with the LBs. Schobel is overrated and Kelsey is a great guy, but needs to be part of a rotation. Not a starter. The secondary is improved this year, but Whitner and Simpson just do not make big plays ala Polamolu, Reed, Sanders. I do not see a playoff team right now and the talent on the team isn't a reflection on Jauron. He doesn't have final say on personnel decisions even though the team doesn't have a GM. The team needs more special players like Lynch and Peters before I will call them playoff contenders. Right now 7-9 is the best the team can hope for again next year in a tough division.

But you can't keep accepting mediocrity year after year after year. Even if a nice coach is doing all he can with the players he has, if that keeps resulting in missing the playoffs, then you have to see if some other coach can get them there, even if you don't know if it's possible. You can't just keep saying "good job" at 7-9.
Do the Dolphins have amazing talent? No, but look at what they did. And Jauron isn't doing the best he could be, anyway. Browns and 49ers at home? Swept by Jets and Dolphins? We could be doing better.
Against the poor teams we did beat (and should beat - we're not the least talented team in the league) and the good teams that beat us, this season was a showcase of poor coaching. Player underperformance was there, too, in high quantity. But it was not a good year for the staff. (Save Bobby April, he is glorious)

Rob S
01-06-2009, 08:46 PM
Bobby April ftw!

well said mcgee.

fischbowl
01-06-2009, 09:43 PM
But you can't keep accepting mediocrity year after year after year. Even if a nice coach is doing all he can with the players he has, if that keeps resulting in missing the playoffs, then you have to see if some other coach can get them there, even if you don't know if it's possible. You can't just keep saying "good job" at 7-9.
Do the Dolphins have amazing talent? No, but look at what they did. And Jauron isn't doing the best he could be, anyway. Browns and 49ers at home? Swept by Jets and Dolphins? We could be doing better.
Against the poor teams we did beat (and should beat - we're not the least talented team in the league) and the good teams that beat us, this season was a showcase of poor coaching. Player underperformance was there, too, in high quantity. But it was not a good year for the staff. (Save Bobby April, he is glorious)

April for Head Coach '10!

jdcozart
01-06-2009, 10:06 PM
April for Head Coach '10!

Bobby April is amazing! No arguement there.

Biscuit
01-16-2009, 02:41 PM
The Death Of The Tampa 2

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/...f-the-tampa-2/

The Death Of The Tampa 2

As we prepare to watch the NFC and AFC championship games on Sunday, I had a thought this week. Like any young aspiring writer, I scribbled it down on Tuesday. It was just a thought at the time, but I believe now is the time to talk about it.

I think the Tampa 2 defense is being phased out of the NFL.

Think about it. More important, think about it as you watch the championship games on Sunday between bowls of Texas chili and cold bottles of Miller High Life. There will be no Tampa 2, no undersized linebackers dropping to a spot and no safeties playing close to 20 yards off the line of scrimmage. No rushing the passer with your front four on third downs and playing coverage behind it, and no middle linebacker running down the middle of the field trying to keep up with a slot receiver who runs a 4.3 in the 40.

Instead, we will watch Pittsburgh (the No. 1 unit in total defense), Baltimore (No. 2 in total defense), Philadelphia (No. 3 in total defense) and Arizona (maybe the most surprising defense in the playoffs). All four of these defenses play with pressure in mind — zone blitzes, man coverage blitzes and even zero coverage blitzes. They don’t sit back and react. They don’t have a “top” to their defense so that nobody can get behind them. They don’t wait — they attack.

Ladies and gentlemen, this is the new defense in the NFL. Look, everyone in this league copies the best teams, and if you’re in the final four of the NFL playoffs, you are one of the best teams. Think about the teams who run the Tampa 2 scheme as their No. 1 call: Chicago, Minnesota, Buffalo, Tampa, Indianapolis and Detroit. Where are they now? At home, watching these four defenses go after quarterbacks, challenge receivers and create turnovers — instead of waiting for them to fall in their laps because of a bad decision by the quarterback.

Plus, Detroit just hired Jim Schwartz from the Tennessee Titans as their new head coach. Last time I checked, the Titans’ defense went after people, so you can forget about playing Tampa 2 in Detroit. In fact, you may never see it again.

My point is that the NFL is cyclical. It changes, it morphs into the “new rage,” and right now, that rage is blitz-happy defenses with corners who can play man to man and get in the face of highly paid wide receivers. They dictate not only the tone of the game, but they alter the game plans of opposing offenses. They tell the offense what they can and can’t do with their pressure.

This is how football generally works. It’s the same in the college game. Gone are the days of Jamel Halloway and the wishbone triple option attack at Oklahoma, and the days of Tommie Frazier at Nebraska. The University of Miami became great because they recruited defensive players who could run sideline to sideline and stop the triple option. Now it’s the “spread offense” and Tim Tebow. Everyone sets up in the shotgun and slings it all over the field. You now need to recruit quarterbacks who can throw and run, or defensive backs who can cover five-receiver sets. Football changes and so do the schemes that teams run.

For that reason, I see the end of the Tampa 2 in the near future. Sure, every team will run Cover 2 from time to time, but the days of it becoming the lead call in this league are short. Offenses have figured out ways to beat it. The seven-man run front it provides can be carved up by an athletic offensive line and a strong running game, and quarterbacks like Kurt Warner can eat it up with basic routes that expose the holes it allows.

Detroit will be the first team to throw it in the garbage, and soon, others will follow. Monte Kiffin is leaving the Bucs to challenge the SEC, Tony Dungy has retired and the rest of the coaches using the Tampa 2 might be searching for jobs if they don’t win next year.

Everything — even good things — come to an end in life, and now, in the NFL.

Matt Bowen, the writer, is a former Bill. He joined the team in 2006, when the Bills were implementing the Tampa-2, under Jauron and Fewell (who came from Chicago). The Bills have migrated from the Tampa-2 in 2006 because they did not have the personnel, to a Cover-2 in 2007 as their MLBs could not cover the larger zones and given those defenses miserable success against the Pats have again moved away from it to a standard 4-3.

Also the Tampa-2 and Cover-2 values speed and quickness and not stoutness. The Bills play December games where the elements come into play (see the last Pats game). Speed off the edge in those games are mitigated because in those games, teams pound the ball running.

Bowen was here, with the Bills, when they were running a Tampa-2 and that is Jauron's and Fewell's pedigree, he does include Buffalo on that list as being a Tampa-2 team. I believe they are migrating away from it as of 2008, and have made the efforts to move away from it. I believe the Bills are moving away from the Tampa-2 and Cover-2 being their base defense. Per what Bowen says above and because of what they did on the field this year, the personnel they acquired last offseason and the success of the Giants against the Pats juggernaut in the Super Bowl last year, it makes sense.

What the Giants, and what the Titans run is a standard 4-3. The Giants will use the blitz more but the Titans, who will play a lot of man-to-man and don't blitz as often, both rely on the front four to pressure the QB. The Bills used a base 4-3, but since they can't pressure with their front four they needed to back it up with a lot of nickle. Hence the Bills draft in 2008. They drafted three CBs. They drafted CBs while already having McGee, Greer, Youboty, and Will James on the roster, that plus Whitner can and plays the slot receiver on occasion. They want to move to man, and McKelvin has the traits to do so. The Bills just can't generate a pass rush from the front 4 and therefore need to play nickle to hold the fort.

Kawika is not a WLB in a Cover-2/Tampa-2, he is more stout then quick. He is much larger then what is required. Stroud is stout, can penetrate but the Bills do misuse him often by playing him on the nose straight on the guard. Spencer Johnson skill set allows him to line at DT and DE depending upon the personnel groupings. Furthermore, Ellis in the 3rd is a longer and larger DE and there were better rush OLBs who could play DE in the Tampa-2 still on the board (ie. Cliff Avril who went to the Lions). The Bills want their DEs to be athletic, heavy and long enough to attack the inside B and twist and stunt the A Gaps, not just rush the edge. They want their DEs to play the 1 alignment and control the B gap.

The Bills could still be using Cover-2 as their base, their personnel moves last year make little sense then. I don't believe they use it as their base, and they probably still have it in their package. But what Bowen states above, and I agree, is that the Tampa-2 Defense is dying, think of how the Patriots have manhandled the Bills in the past and the Colts since Dungy was there, that is also a compelling case for it to be already dead.

TheBuffaloBills
01-17-2009, 08:40 AM
I still think if we changed to a 3-4 and drafted as if we drafted for the 3-4, our defense could actually scare some teams. But it wont happen, which pisses me off.

Mr.Regular
01-17-2009, 08:27 PM
Hey Bills fans. Im working on a mock draft and am having trouble with your pick if both Orakpo and Brown are gone. Who would you for? What are your top needs and who would you draft in this scenario if trade downs are not an option?

TheBuffaloBills
01-18-2009, 10:45 PM
Hey Bills fans. Im working on a mock draft and am having trouble with your pick if both Orakpo and Brown are gone. Who would you for? What are your top needs and who would you draft in this scenario if trade downs are not an option?

Who else is gone? That is a terrible scenario for us. Who is the best lineman available?

Iamcanadian
01-19-2009, 12:30 AM
The Death Of The Tampa 2

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/...f-the-tampa-2/



Matt Bowen, the writer, is a former Bill. He joined the team in 2006, when the Bills were implementing the Tampa-2, under Jauron and Fewell (who came from Chicago). The Bills have migrated from the Tampa-2 in 2006 because they did not have the personnel, to a Cover-2 in 2007 as their MLBs could not cover the larger zones and given those defenses miserable success against the Pats have again moved away from it to a standard 4-3.

Also the Tampa-2 and Cover-2 values speed and quickness and not stoutness. The Bills play December games where the elements come into play (see the last Pats game). Speed off the edge in those games are mitigated because in those games, teams pound the ball running.

Bowen was here, with the Bills, when they were running a Tampa-2 and that is Jauron's and Fewell's pedigree, he does include Buffalo on that list as being a Tampa-2 team. I believe they are migrating away from it as of 2008, and have made the efforts to move away from it. I believe the Bills are moving away from the Tampa-2 and Cover-2 being their base defense. Per what Bowen says above and because of what they did on the field this year, the personnel they acquired last offseason and the success of the Giants against the Pats juggernaut in the Super Bowl last year, it makes sense.

What the Giants, and what the Titans run is a standard 4-3. The Giants will use the blitz more but the Titans, who will play a lot of man-to-man and don't blitz as often, both rely on the front four to pressure the QB. The Bills used a base 4-3, but since they can't pressure with their front four they needed to back it up with a lot of nickle. Hence the Bills draft in 2008. They drafted three CBs. They drafted CBs while already having McGee, Greer, Youboty, and Will James on the roster, that plus Whitner can and plays the slot receiver on occasion. They want to move to man, and McKelvin has the traits to do so. The Bills just can't generate a pass rush from the front 4 and therefore need to play nickle to hold the fort.

Kawika is not a WLB in a Cover-2/Tampa-2, he is more stout then quick. He is much larger then what is required. Stroud is stout, can penetrate but the Bills do misuse him often by playing him on the nose straight on the guard. Spencer Johnson skill set allows him to line at DT and DE depending upon the personnel groupings. Furthermore, Ellis in the 3rd is a longer and larger DE and there were better rush OLBs who could play DE in the Tampa-2 still on the board (ie. Cliff Avril who went to the Lions). The Bills want their DEs to be athletic, heavy and long enough to attack the inside B and twist and stunt the A Gaps, not just rush the edge. They want their DEs to play the 1 alignment and control the B gap.

The Bills could still be using Cover-2 as their base, their personnel moves last year make little sense then. I don't believe they use it as their base, and they probably still have it in their package. But what Bowen states above, and I agree, is that the Tampa-2 Defense is dying, think of how the Patriots have manhandled the Bills in the past and the Colts since Dungy was there, that is also a compelling case for it to be already dead.

The Cover 2 defense is far from dead. Tennessee uses it a lot as does the teams you mentioned. As long as Jauron is our HC we will be staying with the Cover 2 defense although teams are starting to switch around a lot to confuse defenses. If the 3-4 is all that great what happened to the Cowboys and why did San Diego fall to 8-8 or the Browns fall from 10-6.
Your right that defenses come and go if they are not funamentally sound but the Cover 2 comes directly from the great Steeler teams of the 70's so its been around for a long time and stood the test. The 3-4 is also here to stay although it fittles with its schemes as well as does the basic 4-3. All these teams have packages utilizing the Cover 2 defense to confuse their opponents just as Cover 2 teams will blitz ocassionally to confuse their opponents.
What has become clear is that if you don't have the ideal personnel to run this defense, you can have serious problems but the same holds true for a 3-4 team and a basic 4-3 team. The teams that acquire the best personnel for their defense have more success than those teams who use a defense but lack the personnel to run it properly.
These 3 defenses are here to stay for some time although they are all adding wrinkles to confuse their opponents.

Biscuit
01-20-2009, 08:42 AM
The Cover 2 defense is far from dead. Tennessee uses it a lot as does the teams you mentioned. As long as Jauron is our HC we will be staying with the Cover 2 defense although teams are starting to switch around a lot to confuse defenses. If the 3-4 is all that great what happened to the Cowboys and why did San Diego fall to 8-8 or the Browns fall from 10-6.
Your right that defenses come and go if they are not funamentally sound but the Cover 2 comes directly from the great Steeler teams of the 70's so its been around for a long time and stood the test. The 3-4 is also here to stay although it fittles with its schemes as well as does the basic 4-3. All these teams have packages utilizing the Cover 2 defense to confuse their opponents just as Cover 2 teams will blitz ocassionally to confuse their opponents.
What has become clear is that if you don't have the ideal personnel to run this defense, you can have serious problems but the same holds true for a 3-4 team and a basic 4-3 team. The teams that acquire the best personnel for their defense have more success than those teams who use a defense but lack the personnel to run it properly.
These 3 defenses are here to stay for some time although they are all adding wrinkles to confuse their opponents.

The C-2 is not dead, correct, but it is being used by fewer teams as a base package defense. That was the core point of the article and what I was saying. The C-2 truly is a terrible fit for the Bills, and based upon the personnel moves they made in 2008 I see that they have acknowledged it, especially with the defense they were running during the season. The C-2 encourages teams to run on you, if you can't generate a pass rush, and have lighter, quicker yet less stout players in your front 4 then teams will try to wash out your front and pound the ball. Buffalo suffered from all that in the past, they did not ever acquire the talent and furthermore they play in an environment where rushing the ball becomes a key for December games.

heavyduty
01-21-2009, 10:17 AM
i have been seeing more and more mock draft having the bills choosing an OT at #11 this year. It got me to thinking and with the high number of quality OT's comming out this year (the two smith's, oher, and monroe, all of which are ranked in scott's top 11 players in the draft) i think it could be very beneficial for the bills to get rid of greedy Jason Peters. Jason is a big time talent and because of that we could trade him for another star such as Anquan Boldin who wants out of arizona, or any other talented player teams would be willing to give up for Peters. We could also trade him for draft picks, including a 2nd 1st round pick. At number 11 we would then draft the best remain OT that fits our system the best to replace Peters. I know having Peters at LT and which ever OT we draft at RT would be great but I have been impressed with langston walker since his arrival in buffalo and believe we have greater needs then upgrading walker who is solid. What do yall think?

SimonRath
01-21-2009, 01:47 PM
the Falcons will take him off your hands since he "apparently" doesn't wanna be in buffalo :)

SuperMcGee
01-21-2009, 02:06 PM
Where does the thought of replacing Langston Walker come from? He's been our best lineman, nobody wants to replace him.

I don't see us trading Peters, and I don't think we go for one of the big tackles. Simple thoughts from me. I don't think it happens.

Thread merged to main discussion.

SuperKevin
01-21-2009, 02:15 PM
Where does the thought of replacing Langston Walker come from? He's been our best lineman, nobody wants to replace him.

I don't see us trading Peters, and I don't think we go for one of the big tackles. Simple thoughts from me. I don't think it happens.

Thread merged to main discussion.

i agree. I don't think we'll trade Peters but I can see us not resigning him when he's a FA.

Bills2083
01-21-2009, 04:44 PM
i agree. I don't think we'll trade Peters but I can see us not resigning him when he's a FA.


Wouldn't it be a better idea to trade Peters before free agency, if we're just going to lose him anyway?

Bills2083
01-21-2009, 04:50 PM
Also, don't forget to vote for the Bills.
http://www.chunky.com/ClickForCansAlreadyVoted.aspx

If the Bills win, Buffalo will get an extra 5,000 cans of soup for their local Feeding America food bank.

Mr.Regular
01-21-2009, 06:08 PM
Who else is gone? That is a terrible scenario for us. Who is the best lineman available?
I just did one where it went
Stafford
A. Smith
Curry
Crabtree
Brown
Orakpo
Monroe
Jenkins
Raji
J. Smith

I was thinking Maybin, Pettigrew, Maclin? Not sure though you guys would know better than me.

BufFan71
01-25-2009, 12:04 PM
Wouldn't it be a better idea to trade Peters before free agency, if we're just going to lose him anyway?

yeah hes still got like 2 more years on his contract


Where does the thought of replacing Langston Walker come from? He's been our best lineman, nobody wants to replace him.


I don't see us trading Peters, and I don't think we go for one of the big tackles. Simple thoughts from me. I don't think it happens.

Thread merged to main discussion.

When langston was a LT in oakland he was absolutely aweful.


its obvious the other plays want Jason, and the offensive line knows they are a better unit when Peters is in.

For a team full of players who think they are close to "getting over the hump"
what kind of message would it send to the players to trade a 2x Probowl, and probably your best player?

SuperMcGee
01-25-2009, 12:55 PM
When langston was a LT in oakland he was absolutely aweful.

Relevance? Walker is a great RT for the Bills, and I foresee him continuing to play there. Peters is still our LT. I don't get why you'd quote my post here.

Also, to call a non-Moorman player the best on the team is just foolish.

BufFan71
01-25-2009, 02:23 PM
Relevance? Walker is a great RT for the Bills, and I foresee him continuing to play there. Peters is still our LT. I don't get why you'd quote my post here.

Also, to call a non-Moorman player the best on the team is just foolish.

after i posted, i re-read it, but i was too lazy to change that....

i misread your quote

TheBuffaloBills
01-29-2009, 09:45 PM
after i posted, i re-read it, but i was too lazy to change that....

i misread your quote

Is there a youtube video of your avatar?

TheBuffaloBills
01-30-2009, 11:52 AM
Lynch is going to the probowl!

SuperMcGee
01-30-2009, 08:34 PM
Kollar was a cool guy, I liked him and I'll sort of miss him. I wish him the best working with Super Mario and company. I'm good with Sanders taking over, though. We still have a lot of good pieces to our line. Schobel needs to come back in a big way, though.

BufFan71
01-31-2009, 07:25 PM
Is there a youtube video of your avatar?


yeah but the vid is like 10mins long

SuperKevin
02-01-2009, 12:09 AM
Buffalo rules the 2009 HoF class with Bruce Smith and Ralph Wilson both getting in.

TheBuffaloBills
02-01-2009, 12:21 AM
Buffalo rules the 2009 HoF class with Bruce Smith and Ralph Wilson both getting in.

I am glad Ralph will get in. He truly deserves it.

fischbowl
02-01-2009, 12:22 AM
If theres any year to go to Canton, it's this one

Iamcanadian
02-01-2009, 01:14 AM
The C-2 is not dead, correct, but it is being used by fewer teams as a base package defense. That was the core point of the article and what I was saying. The C-2 truly is a terrible fit for the Bills, and based upon the personnel moves they made in 2008 I see that they have acknowledged it, especially with the defense they were running during the season. The C-2 encourages teams to run on you, if you can't generate a pass rush, and have lighter, quicker yet less stout players in your front 4 then teams will try to wash out your front and pound the ball. Buffalo suffered from all that in the past, they did not ever acquire the talent and furthermore they play in an environment where rushing the ball becomes a key for December games.

As I previously said, the teams that acquire the best players for their particular defense usually end up with the better defense no matter what scheme you use. HC's come and go, some prefer the 3-4, some prefer the basic 4-3 and some like the Cover 2. Each defense has its strengths and weaknesses and offenses will attack the weaknesses and try and defend the strengths. There is no proof that one defense is better than another. When Indy and Chicago got to the SB, the Cover 2 was the rage, NE and Pittsburgh have made the 3-4 look good and the Giants have made the basic 4-3 look good although they did use a lot of Cover 2 ideas like using Tuck as a underweight pass rushing DT. I just don't see many teams dropping the Cover 2 defense but I agree that maybe Buffalo could use some better qualified players to make it work better. We need a small DE(under 270lbs. and maybe smaller) who is a pass rushing specialist because in the end the Cover 2 starts with the front 4's ability to apply pressure. If it fails to apply pressure then it exposes the back 7 to an easy attack. The Cover 2 also depends on the front 4 penetrating and breaking up running plays before they get started but your right, the Cover 2's strength is against the pass and it is more vulnerable to running plays.
I don't think Buffalo is prepared to give up on the Cover 2 defense just yet, They made a commitment to it when they drafted Whitner, McCargo, Williams and drafted CB more suitable to the Cover 2. A switch doesn't make your defense immediately better, it just creates more holes where suitable personnel have to be found.
I think if our financial situation has improved through the sale of games to Toronto and we are able to retain our own FA's and maybe sign a few for ourselves then we are a team on the verge of being a solid playoff contender. Our QB is entering his 3rd year when most pro QB's finally blossom
and with a minor change here or there, it should be a very effective offense by next year. Our defense is in the same shape where an addition here or there should be enough for it to excel. This is not the time for a major overhaul of our defense which will then take another 2 or 3 years to jell. If we don't make a quantum leap next year then we may need to change HC's and it will be up to the new HC to decide if a defensive scheme change is necessary, it isn't going to happen under Jauron. He doesn't have the time left to rebuild the defense with a new scheme, he would be fired before then so he'll ride out the Cover 2 till he is either fired or he succeeds.

ruthlessrussian
02-08-2009, 03:39 PM
That about sums it up.

I would hate to see anything major happen to our defense minus some additions. The only reason we have been competitive the last couple of years is because of it. Our defense is a lot better then most people think, but it does need some work.

No big changes. No switching to 3-4 just because. Lets continue to work with what we have been building, use that continuity, and start winning some damn games.

Splat
02-17-2009, 12:45 PM
Bills re-sign special teams ace and WR Jenkins (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-bills-jenkins&prov=ap&type=lgns)

Crickett
02-17-2009, 01:08 PM
Justin Jenkins. I thought he and James Newson were going to be udfa gems back in the day.

Vox Populi
02-19-2009, 01:27 PM
Anyone else tired about hearing Schobel being a lot worse now than he used to be? I find that people are failing to realize that hes been the only pass rusher on the team for his entire career and that teams basically just need to take him out and then they are pretty much good to drop back and pass whenever they want as long as their linemen can recognize the rare times that we actually blitz the quarterback.

I really want us to get another pass rushing end in the draft or free agency, but I REALLY hope that we play them at Left End rather than screw with Schobel. If anything we should look for another mid-round pass rusher, like Ellis, again this year. I don't care if they don't contribute much as rookies as long as they aren't a pilon out there like Kelsay and Denney (assuming the tackles don't fall over).

I know we need pass rushers, but I think it should be from the left side rather than the right. I know Everette Brown played a lot of left end in college, he mostly played the left side against Boston College but apparently he played right end for them this year and left end last year?? If we pick up a first round end I REALLY want it to be Brown or no one.

diabsoule
02-21-2009, 11:19 PM
Bills | Crowell unlikely to return
Sat, 21 Feb 2009 14:48:16 -0800

Mark Gaughan, of The Buffalo News, reports Buffalo Bills LB Angelo Crowell, who is an impending free agent, is expected to sign with another team when free agency begins, according to league sources.

Bills | Greer unlikely to return
Sat, 21 Feb 2009 14:34:38 -0800

Mark Gaughan, of The Buffalo News, reports Buffalo Bills CB Jabari Greer, who is an impending free agent, is expected to sign with another team when free agency begins, according to league sources.

Bills2083
02-22-2009, 12:01 AM
Bills | Crowell unlikely to return
Sat, 21 Feb 2009 14:48:16 -0800

Mark Gaughan, of The Buffalo News, reports Buffalo Bills LB Angelo Crowell, who is an impending free agent, is expected to sign with another team when free agency begins, according to league sources.

Bills | Greer unlikely to return
Sat, 21 Feb 2009 14:34:38 -0800

Mark Gaughan, of The Buffalo News, reports Buffalo Bills CB Jabari Greer, who is an impending free agent, is expected to sign with another team when free agency begins, according to league sources.

The Bills offered Greer a 5-year, $20 million deal.
He'd be stupid to take that.

SuperMcGee
02-22-2009, 12:13 AM
That's nothing unexpected. At corner I feel we're just about set. 1-2 McCoverage with Corner or Youboty as a nickel, I can live with that. We need to bring in a new starter at linebacker, though. Ellison and the delivery man are just good backups (I'd prefer DiGiorgio). Bowen is just a STer.

Bills2083
02-22-2009, 12:15 AM
That's nothing unexpected. At corner I feel we're just about set. 1-2 McCoverage with Corner or Youboty as a nickel, I can live with that. We need to bring in a new starter at linebacker, though. Ellison and the delivery man are just good backups (I'd prefer DiGiorgio). Bowen is just a STer.

But...
If the Bills tried to resign Greer, then that means they feel having 3 good CBs is important.
So if we don't resign him, we have McGee, McKelvin, Youboty, and Corner.
But they might still want to sign/draft another one, right?

fischbowl
02-22-2009, 12:20 AM
We'd have to, CB now becomes priority. I agree with McGee, a starter has to be brought in at WLB

Bills2083
02-22-2009, 12:22 AM
We'd have to, CB now becomes priority. I agree with McGee, a starter has to be brought in at WLB

Two things...

1.) Do you think the cornerback would be a veteran/rookie, starter/backup?
2.) I thought Mitchell was WLB... Unless you're planning on sliding him over to SLB.

fischbowl
02-22-2009, 12:25 AM
Two things...

1.) Do you think the cornerback would be a veteran/rookie, starter/backup?
2.) I thought Mitchell was WLB... Unless you're planning on sliding him over to SLB.

I'd say it'd have to be a veteran. We already have a project in McKelvin.

Always mix up SLB and WLB, my fault

Bills2083
02-22-2009, 12:32 AM
I'd say it'd have to be a veteran. We already have a project in McKelvin.

Always mix up SLB and WLB, my fault


Do you know what good CBs will be available?
If they're not willing to give the money to Greer, then that means we'll have to get someone that isn't at Greer's talent level.

SuperMcGee
02-22-2009, 12:34 AM
But...
If the Bills tried to resign Greer, then that means they feel having 3 good CBs is important.
So if we don't resign him, we have McGee, McKelvin, Youboty, and Corner.
But they might still want to sign/draft another one, right?

Sure they would. But I just look at what we have and sort of like it. It's young and Youboty is unreliable, but there's no need for drastic change. I was pretty critical of McKelvin last year, McGee went from stellar to crap after the injury (he came on as the weeks passed, though). There will be another piece added to the group, yes. It's actually sort of an unreliable group as it stands, but I'm putting my trust in them. This is nothing more than how I feel, but what more do you want from me? I would take Jabari back without thinking twice about it, and welcome any new corner if it was a good investment, but we have bigger needs.

pysseddoph
02-24-2009, 12:12 PM
for me this year dont look good but next offseason is going to look great for the new HC.

with greer walking that is going to put pressure on the defense that wasnt there before. greer was pretty solid as the #1 corner. dont get your feathers in a bunch. by the simple fact that greer played right corner and matched more often than not against an offense's X or #1 receiver ...

with greer gone that is one thing. the other is the bills moving donte to free safety. for sake of argument ... donte hasnt been that stellar in coverage and he always seems to be just that step or 2 away from preventing the play. with him playing free safety that makes he responsible for backside coverage fulltime now. mcgee has always needed backside protection so with donte being the it guy ... throwing towards mcgee is going to be even more of an adventure. especially if mckelvin gets the nod at right corner where he eventually took over for an injured greer. yeah passing on the bills should be fun this year.

SuperMcGee
02-24-2009, 06:19 PM
for me this year dont look good but next offseason is going to look great for the new HC.

with greer walking that is going to put pressure on the defense that wasnt there before. greer was pretty solid as the #1 corner. dont get your feathers in a bunch. by the simple fact that greer played right corner and matched more often than not against an offense's X or #1 receiver ...

with greer gone that is one thing. the other is the bills moving donte to free safety. for sake of argument ... donte hasnt been that stellar in coverage and he always seems to be just that step or 2 away from preventing the play. with him playing free safety that makes he responsible for backside coverage fulltime now. mcgee has always needed backside protection so with donte being the it guy ... throwing towards mcgee is going to be even more of an adventure. especially if mckelvin gets the nod at right corner where he eventually took over for an injured greer. yeah passing on the bills should be fun this year.

I just foresee everybody effectively throwing underneath our massive cushions like they have been for 3 years. But good points nonetheless. I wouldn't say McGee has always needed that much protection, but he had enough rough games last year. Hopefully he comes in at 100% and can play like he did before getting hurt last year.

SuperMcGee
02-26-2009, 12:14 PM
Dockery and Royal to be cut.
Royal is no surprise despite his locker room presence.
Dockery is pricy but it caught me off guard. No pun intended.

fischbowl
02-26-2009, 12:25 PM
Dockery and Royal to be cut.
Royal is no surprise despite his locker room presence.
Dockery is pricy but it caught me off guard. No pun intended.

Dockery was a leader on the line and easily our best lineman second to Peters, stupid move

SuperMcGee
02-26-2009, 12:28 PM
Dockery was a leader on the line and easily our best lineman second to Peters, stupid move

I disagree with getting rid of Dockery. In my mind, Walker has been our best lineman, but that's besides the point. This is a hole that we didn't need to create for ourselves, even at his price.

TheBuffaloBills
02-26-2009, 02:16 PM
I really hope we cut Kelsay.

BuffaloBillsFan
02-26-2009, 02:42 PM
Wow, cutting Dockery was a surprise but I can't say I disagree. It's going to be really interesting to see what direction we go in free agency. I'm hopeful that we can rid ourselves of Schobel and Kelsay as well.

Rob S
02-26-2009, 06:49 PM
Hopefully I will be around more.......sorry for the extended absence. The DD move is interesting to say the least. I dont think anyone will argue that it improves our talent bc Dockery was at least average last year in what was a down year for him. However, it does save us a nice sum of money and IF(and thats a huge if) we use that money to sign a true difference maker, it could be worth it imo.

Also, the reasoning given seems to be that we are going to move to a lighter, more athletic line which I actually love. Whether it will come true, I have no idea, but it seem like a good plan to me because the behemoths we have had as of late have not been getting the job done.

Vox Populi
02-26-2009, 10:21 PM
If they go lighter up front, Jackson fits that style so much more than Lynch, the man is at full speed before anyone else is, I love it, but its not the best for Lynch's style IMO.

BuffaloBillsFan
02-27-2009, 03:20 PM
This free agency has been REALLY slow and boring, no big signings yet.

fischbowl
02-27-2009, 03:41 PM
This free agency has been REALLY slow and boring, no big signings yet.

We're never really FA contenders so yeah.......

BuffaloBillsFan
02-27-2009, 03:54 PM
We're never really FA contenders so yeah.......

I know but c'mon... Atleast a couple mediocre to slightly above average signings would be nice! Throw me a frikkin' bone here.

TheBuffaloBills
02-27-2009, 05:28 PM
If we sign Coles, who do we cut?

Jenkins?
Roscoe?
Reed?

BufFan71
02-27-2009, 05:40 PM
my guess would be Roscoe or Reed

JHCBills
02-27-2009, 08:25 PM
I don't want Coles... not for the money he's asking. I think if Steve Johnson is a diamond in the rough, we're A-OK at receiver. Evans, Reed, SJ, Roscoe, Hardy. We look pretty good. We'd look even better with a TE to compliment those guys.

Iamcanadian
03-01-2009, 12:20 PM
It is pretty obvious that we are still very limited in FA because we just don't have the revenue to throw around. We'll wait till the high price guys go and try and find a few gems from the remaining group.

marv levy's older brother
03-02-2009, 12:37 PM
What do you think he would get the bills in a trade?

TheBuffaloBills
03-02-2009, 05:52 PM
Please post in the discussion thread.

Anyways, not much. I would rather have him on our team to make PR returns and make the occasional highlight play than to trade him for crap. We gave him a new contract in the beginning of the season. Besides, who knows if we are even going to get Coles. I am calling it right now, he is going to be a Jet next year.

Rob S
03-02-2009, 07:24 PM
keep everything in the threads I designated......going to move this now.

TheBuffaloBills
03-02-2009, 10:00 PM
I see no chance of us getting Coles anymore. He is going to visit Cinncy tomorrow. Is there anything on Waters that is new?

Rob S
03-03-2009, 09:06 PM
well.........Coles left cinci with no contact and apparently we have signed drayton florence, so that something.

TheBuffaloBills
03-03-2009, 09:09 PM
I just don't get it.

Cut a QB, then sign a QB
Cut a OG, then sign a OG
Cut a CB, then sign a CB

We aren't progressing. I am getting really fumed.

SuperMcGee
03-03-2009, 11:45 PM
I just don't get it.

Cut a QB, then sign a QB - It was JP. Everyone knew this was coming.
Cut a OG, then sign a OG - $$$ (Hangartner is center for us, anyway)
Cut a CB, then sign a CB - $$$

We aren't progressing. I am getting really fumed.

Reasons in bold. Simple enough. You can't expect the Bills to progress too much in FA.

Florence is about what we needed to bring in at CB, but I've never been a huge fan. There was a lot of talk about bringing him in last year and I wasn't thrilled, after his year in Jacksonville that has dropped even further.

Rob S
03-04-2009, 08:33 AM
yeah I don't love Florence but as a nickel, he's pretty solid.

Flyboy
03-04-2009, 04:54 PM
Can some Bills' fans tell me what I should maybe expect from Greer going into next season?

Rob S
03-04-2009, 05:56 PM
please dont start new threads....gonna move this. Greer is really good tho.........a bit of a risk as a full time starter I guess, but Bills fans loved him as a flex guy between the nickel and #2 and he has awesome potential.

Vox Populi
03-04-2009, 07:23 PM
Greer's game is all about confidence. When he is on its really tough to do anything against him. When hes off, there are going to be a lot of quick short passes completed against him.

Iamcanadian
03-05-2009, 02:52 PM
Well, Greer signed with New Orleans so I guess Florence is our new starter. Should suit a Cover 2 style of play.

Rob S
03-05-2009, 03:37 PM
Well, Greer signed with New Orleans so I guess Florence is our new starter. Should suit a Cover 2 style of play.

McCoverage will start.......Florence will be the nickel

Iamcanadian
03-06-2009, 08:05 AM
McCoverage will start.......Florence will be the nickel

True. McKelvin and McGee should start.

gameplaya2435
03-07-2009, 04:56 PM
Wow, have fun with the complaints, locker room divisions, dropped passes and all around headaches this year. Good luck is all I can say.

TheBuffaloBills
03-07-2009, 04:58 PM
Wow, have fun with the complaints, locker room divisions, dropped passes and all around headaches this year. Good luck is all I can say.

Oh we will sir. I am pumped.

SuperMcGee
03-07-2009, 05:07 PM
Wow, have fun with the complaints, locker room divisions, dropped passes and all around headaches this year. Good luck is all I can say.

Better than trying to make fun out of whatever the hell Turk and Dick had planned before this.

S4L
03-07-2009, 05:07 PM
I am shocked that they would want to subject this young, rebuilding team to the T.O. virus. I'm not sure Edwards will survive. A one-year deal is perfect, though.

Best of luck, Buffalo.

Rob S
03-07-2009, 07:20 PM
one year should work: I will copy what I put in the TO thread:

TO is still a douche and always will be a douche, but I gotta think he has a plan here. It seems he is going to come in, own for a year, and then leave because god knows he doesnt want to be in Buffalo. As a Bills fan.....thats fine by me. He wont destroy the team in one year and if he does he is gone anyway......seems fairly safe to me. I have to at least applaud the attempt to win here by the Bills and one year minimizes the risk by a lot and if it works out, 6.5 is dirt cheap for TO.

ruthlessrussian
03-07-2009, 07:56 PM
Wow!! I am almost speechless.

My first thought was "really!... really?.... umm.."

But now im settled and have decided that this was actually a decent move.

I completely agree with Rob on this. TO picked the Bills for a reason. He definitely has a plan here. Let's just hope it all works out for the best.

Still unbelieveable.. Hey. Maybe Julius Peppers will want to be a Bill too!

fischbowl
03-08-2009, 09:58 PM
I can't tell you how disappointed I am with my team right now.

SuperMcGee
03-09-2009, 01:06 AM
I can't tell you how disappointed I am with my team right now.

Says the Rangers fan.

fischbowl
03-09-2009, 01:13 AM
Says the Rangers fan.

Hey! It was just that one night! I swear! Hell I even had my Kaleta t-shirt jersey under it the whole time!

OTcoach
03-09-2009, 09:11 AM
Signing T.O. is a great move!

We finally have a player on our team who is better than someone else on the other team.

Who in the league (let alone our division) can match up against Evans and T.O. ???

This one signing finally gives us a superstar who will sell tickets and bring some attention to Buffalo. I'm so sick of watching the NFL network and hearing all about Pittsuburgh, Dallas, Washington, Philly and New England.


Get your popcorn ready T.O. is bringing Buffalo back baby!

Rob S
03-09-2009, 10:46 AM
Fisch.....what should i do fantasy baseball? I have no clue here haha.

fischbowl
03-09-2009, 11:04 AM
Fisch.....what should i do fantasy baseball? I have no clue here haha.

I'll do up some stuff. Sorry.

Rob S
03-09-2009, 11:27 AM
I'll do up some stuff. Sorry.

dont worry about it.......I just wanted to make sure you didnt forget.

art vandelay
03-10-2009, 02:14 PM
Rest of the off-season
by art vandelay

The TO signing marked the big splash and turning point of our off-season. However, we need to finish strong if we want to make the playoffs.

1) Extend Peters. With our LG hole on the OL, I can't see us trading Peters to crete a hole at LT too. Give the man his money.

2) Trade our 4th round pick for Brian Waters. I'm normally not big on trades for vets but with the 1 year TO acquisition it's exciting to think what we could do this year and I don't want to start Kirk Chambers at LG (he's a great backup though).

3) Sign LB Cato June. Fits our system well, he visited, and we are weak at LB.

1) DB Malcolm Jenkins (Ohio State): Will play FS his first season then could shift to CB if we can't re-sign McGee next season or if he doesn't play well as a S.

2) DE Connor Barwin (Cincinnati): A DE that has Jared Allen potential. Has all of the tools that you look for in a top DE but just raw at this point. Can be a situational pass rusher this season and eventually grow into a 3 down DE.

3) TE Chase Coffman (Missouri): Really underrated right now. Can stretch the seam, has great hands, great measurables. This is a good TE class so Coffman falls a little due to injury.

4) Traded for Brian Waters

5) LB Tyrone McKenzie (South Florida) - Familiar with Bills coaches, can play MLB, athletic, versatile.

6) DT Clinton McDonald (Memphis) - Good guy for our DT rotation.

7) OL TJ Lang (Eastern Michigan): Good developmental prospect and depth.

Some UDFA's:
DE Brandon Swain (West Texas A&M)
WR Jordan Norwood (Penn State)
QB Chris Crane (Boston College)

fischbowl
03-10-2009, 03:12 PM
Rest of the off-season
by art vandelay

The TO signing marked the big splash and turning point of our off-season. However, we need to finish strong if we want to make the playoffs.

1) Extend Peters. With our LG hole on the OL, I can't see us trading Peters to crete a hole at LT too. Give the man his money.

2) Trade our 4th round pick for Brian Waters. I'm normally not big on trades for vets but with the 1 year TO acquisition it's exciting to think what we could do this year and I don't want to start Kirk Chambers at LG (he's a great backup though).

3) Sign LB Cato June. Fits our system well, he visited, and we are weak at LB.

1) DB Malcolm Jenkins (Ohio State): Will play FS his first season then could shift to CB if we can't re-sign McGee next season or if he doesn't play well as a S.

2) DE Connor Barwin (Cincinnati): A DE that has Jared Allen potential. Has all of the tools that you look for in a top DE but just raw at this point. Can be a situational pass rusher this season and eventually grow into a 3 down DE.

3) TE Chase Coffman (Missouri): Really underrated right now. Can stretch the seam, has great hands, great measurables. This is a good TE class so Coffman falls a little due to injury.

4) Traded for Brian Waters

5) LB Tyrone McKenzie (South Florida) - Familiar with Bills coaches, can play MLB, athletic, versatile.

6) DT Clinton McDonald (Memphis) - Good guy for our DT rotation.

7) OL TJ Lang (Eastern Michigan): Good developmental prospect and depth.

Some UDFA's:
DE Brandon Swain (West Texas A&M)
WR Jordan Norwood (Penn State)
QB Chris Crane (Boston College)

That draft is eerily similar to what we did :P

TheBuffaloBills
03-10-2009, 06:29 PM
If Everette Brown, and Orakpo are both off the board at 11, the Bills should draft Rey Maualuga. Though, it wouldn't be a great fit for our D, he would bring the tenacity we need. I'm sick of how our D is so unaggressive, and wimpy. I know we need a coverage linebacker, but he is raw and can become better in coverage. He made some interceptions, which proves he has potential. Maualuga is big, fast, and one of the hardest hitters. He is a guy that offensive players look out for. He is so intimidating. Rey's biggest knock on him, is that he can be overaggressive. That wouldn't be so bad for our D, actually that could improve our D. Poz would compliment Rey since Poz makes most of his tackles 8 yards back. Rey on the other hand can be our torpedo and get the TKFL and stuff the RB. Mauagluga and Kawika would be absolutely insane together on the outside. You would be lying if you said they weren't intimidating. With Poz in the middle, we could have one of the scariest LB core in the league. Name any player that would go across the middle when we would have Rey, Kawika, and Poz.

Look at some of Rey's game play, and you'll see him make plays.
Xp1dUZUMXxc

Rob S
03-10-2009, 08:12 PM
I like rey rey's game a lot......as you said tho not a great fit for the cover 2, but i think the cover 2 is g a y, so I would be fine with it. Rey and Kawika would be insane on blitzes and I am all about gettin pressure on the QB

art vandelay
03-12-2009, 09:10 PM
Not a big Rey fan. Overpursues a ton and doesn't wrap up well, just tries to kill people. Not a good fit for our system, IMO.

Rob S
03-13-2009, 11:39 AM
Picked up an authentic TO cowboys jersey for $5 and a bag of skittle from a disgruntled boys fan haha

Vox Populi
03-13-2009, 02:05 PM
We REALLY need to extend Peters so he doesn't hold out again this year. That would be bruuuutal. As for the draft, I am going to be upset if we pick anyone other than Brandon Pettigrew at this point. Complete that offense [assuming Edwards isn't a bum] and after that just hit defensive/offensive lines and linebackers with the rest of the picks. Signing a veteran LB would be nice too; no one available is going to be an impact starter, though they should be better than Ellison.

fischbowl
03-13-2009, 02:11 PM
We REALLY need to extend Peters so he doesn't hold out again this year. That would be bruuuutal. As for the draft, I am going to be upset if we pick anyone other than Brandon Pettigrew at this point. Complete that offense [assuming Edwards isn't a bum] and after that just hit defensive/offensive lines and linebackers with the rest of the picks. Signing a veteran LB would be nice too; no one available is going to be an impact starter, though they should be better than Ellison.

Yeah but what if Peters is the Peters of '08?

ruthlessrussian
03-13-2009, 05:40 PM
What is Peter's trade value at this point? I would think that it can't be to far off of what KC got for Allen.

BufFan71
03-14-2009, 12:21 PM
I honestly cannot believe some people would actually consider trading Peters...



the guy even though he had a bad season, is still our best OL...
we signed TO for one year. that means the coaches are in a win-now mindset... how does getting rid of your entire left side, and add a new center help?

esp when that LT is a 2 time probowler

Rob S
03-14-2009, 03:21 PM
We won't get rid of Peters, thats obviously not what Ralph is thinking. The man is 90 and he wants playoff football back in Buffalo. I think we hold on to Peters......maybe an extension gets done, maybe not.

BTW, I was just perusing the RFA lists and Richie Incognito could be an interesting guy........can play C or G and has been real solid the past 2 years. He would fit in nicely on our line and give us some flexibility in the draft. Only problem I see with that is that a 3rd round pick is the compensation, which is a bit high.

art vandelay
03-14-2009, 09:40 PM
I read that we still may re-sign Crowell and that we might bring in a big-name OG for a visit. Good to see that we aren't done yet.

LonghornsLegend
03-14-2009, 09:48 PM
I wish Dallas had a way to make a move for Peters, we sure could use him, but I hear he wants to be the top paid LT in the league and we probably can't afford that...It's a risk to give him that much money if he doesn't pick up his play but it's also risky to let him go to another team.


I don't know if you'd get a Jared Allen package because his last season wasn't as strong where as Allen was coming off an incredible year with no help around him...If you want to maximize what you get out of TO and Edwards, you have to re-sign the guy, too much potential left untapped.

fischbowl
03-14-2009, 10:24 PM
We won't get rid of Peters, thats obviously not what Ralph is thinking. The man is 90 and he wants playoff football back in Buffalo. I think we hold on to Peters......maybe an extension gets done, maybe not.

BTW, I was just perusing the RFA lists and Richie Incognito could be an interesting guy........can play C or G and has been real solid the past 2 years. He would fit in nicely on our line and give us some flexibility in the draft. Only problem I see with that is that a 3rd round pick is the compensation, which is a bit high.

Incognito is a character concern. I mean he won't divide the locker room like TO.....

Rob S
03-15-2009, 08:51 AM
Incognito is a character concern. I mean he won't divide the locker room like TO.....

I know.......I figure if were going for it tho, then we might as well go for it........maybe not the best strategy, but it is something to think about imo

Art, what big name OG are still out there?

Iamcanadian
03-17-2009, 01:40 PM
Rest of the off-season
by art vandelay

The TO signing marked the big splash and turning point of our off-season. However, we need to finish strong if we want to make the playoffs.

1) Extend Peters. With our LG hole on the OL, I can't see us trading Peters to crete a hole at LT too. Give the man his money.

2) Trade our 4th round pick for Brian Waters. I'm normally not big on trades for vets but with the 1 year TO acquisition it's exciting to think what we could do this year and I don't want to start Kirk Chambers at LG (he's a great backup though).

3) Sign LB Cato June. Fits our system well, he visited, and we are weak at LB.

1) DB Malcolm Jenkins (Ohio State): Will play FS his first season then could shift to CB if we can't re-sign McGee next season or if he doesn't play well as a S.

2) DE Connor Barwin (Cincinnati): A DE that has Jared Allen potential. Has all of the tools that you look for in a top DE but just raw at this point. Can be a situational pass rusher this season and eventually grow into a 3 down DE.

3) TE Chase Coffman (Missouri): Really underrated right now. Can stretch the seam, has great hands, great measurables. This is a good TE class so Coffman falls a little due to injury.

4) Traded for Brian Waters

5) LB Tyrone McKenzie (South Florida) - Familiar with Bills coaches, can play MLB, athletic, versatile.

6) DT Clinton McDonald (Memphis) - Good guy for our DT rotation.

7) OL TJ Lang (Eastern Michigan): Good developmental prospect and depth.

Some UDFA's:
DE Brandon Swain (West Texas A&M)
WR Jordan Norwood (Penn State)
QB Chris Crane (Boston College)

Interesting top 3 with good plan for contending while TO is on board. I really don't like Coffman all that much since we need a TE who can open up holes for Lynch much more than a receiving TE. Jenkins is intriguing because he really suits a Cover 2 team although #11 is a bit too high for him but is a possibility.

chapo123
03-20-2009, 01:16 PM
1. andre smith - ot
2. william moore - s/cb
3. connor barwin - olb
4. cornelius ingram - te
5. javon ringer - rb
6. travis bright - g
7. david johnson - qb