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Shiver
01-01-2007, 08:54 PM
As far as the price for Calvin, there isn't a price too steep imo...Schaub + #10 for #2 or #1 imo.


I have a feeling Oakland takes Johnson. They like a Quarterback who can stretch the field, that isn't Schaub. I think Schaub is like Jeff Garcia, he needs to be in a WCO.

iloxygenil
01-01-2007, 08:57 PM
I think Johnson is the lowest on the Raiders chart atm. They know WRs don't make or break a team otherwise they'd have been elite last year with 2 all pro caliber WRs 1 of them with the talent to be the best WR in the game. I think they go with Quinn now that they are #1 overall, then that lets us trade up with Detroit for Johnson, even though they wouldn't select him...I'm not sure, it could be that Calvin falls as far as #7 if everything plays out right...then we could trade Schaub straight up for #7 with Minnesota imo.

But I think that the Falcons make a move with Detroit to get to #2 and pickup Johnson.

iloxygenil
01-01-2007, 10:56 PM
#20 from Boise State, very impressive as a Safety. I like him a lot, I've seen him all over the TV making plays. Not to mention he's their kick / punt return guy. Has great speed I would like him as a late round option.

scar988
01-01-2007, 11:49 PM
whoa, I just read that the Jaguars are interested in Matt Schaub. I want the #2 pick overall though. I would love to see this trade go down:

Atlanta gets:
#2 overall (Calvin Johnson)
Detroit gets:
#10 overall
#17 overall
Jacksonville gets:
QB Matt Schaub

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 12:05 AM
whoa, I just read that the Jaguars are interested in Matt Schaub. I want the #2 pick overall though. I would love to see this trade go down:

Atlanta gets:
#2 overall (Calvin Johnson)
Detroit gets:
#10 overall
#17 overall
Jacksonville gets:
QB Matt Schaub
Would be a great trade imo. For everyone involved.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 12:24 AM
whoa, I just read that the Jaguars are interested in Matt Schaub. I want the #2 pick overall though. I would love to see this trade go down:

Atlanta gets:
#2 overall (Calvin Johnson)
Detroit gets:
#10 overall
#17 overall
Jacksonville gets:
QB Matt Schaub

The #2 overall pick is worth 2600 points. The #10 and #17 combine only for 2250.

scar988
01-02-2007, 12:27 AM
whoa, I just read that the Jaguars are interested in Matt Schaub. I want the #2 pick overall though. I would love to see this trade go down:

Atlanta gets:
#2 overall (Calvin Johnson)
Detroit gets:
#10 overall
#17 overall
Jacksonville gets:
QB Matt Schaub

The #2 overall pick is worth 2600 points. The #10 and #17 combine only for 2250.
2 words:


Matt. Millen.

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 12:30 AM
It would be an incredible trade...that chart is decent, but I think its really just a guideline, it's not going to have to match identical. Jacksonville only has to give up a first round pick for Schaub, the Lions drop from 2-10 and add #17 and the Falcons get Calvin...

Shiver
01-02-2007, 12:35 AM
If we have two first round picks, I would rather stay put and add two impact players. :|

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 12:46 AM
If we have two first round picks, I would rather stay put and add two impact players. :|
I'll take Calvin. Just like we moved up and took Vick. We need a physical WR who will go up and get it and make a play for Mike. This is the guy, he has been for years, and if we get him it makes our WR corps one of the best in the league. I know they wont be the best, but when you have him at 1 Jenk at 2 Roddy in the slot and Finn on 3rd down...wow...how perfect is that?

3 wide set at.
6'5" 45"
6'5" 40"
6'1" 44"

3rd down / Goal Line
6'5" 45"
6'5" 40"
6'5" 15" (lol, jk, but I don't know Finn's vert)

That's unstoppable, because catching the ball is contagious.

Not to mention, he can catch the ball from a lefty...

Shiver
01-02-2007, 01:06 AM
Wide Receivers bust more often than other positions. Wide Receivers take longer to develop than other positions. I like Johnson, but I would much rather add two players to a team that can compete next season. Jenkins and White are still too young to completely give up on. Jenkins showed vast improvement this season. Roddy White had a rough sophomore season at times, but that is hardly uncommon for 2nd year receivers. It's way too early to do that. At least Matt Millen had an excuse for taking three first round receivers, because Charles Rogers was like Mr. Glass from the movie unbreakable. Yes, at times, drops were a large problem, but even Jerry Rice struggled with drops early in his career. Relying on young receivers was the problem, they all have those issues. We need a veteran, and a better WR coach, not a new receiver.

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 01:18 AM
Wide Receivers bust more often than other positions. Wide Receivers take longer to develop than other positions. I like Johnson, but I would much rather add two players to a team that can compete next season. Jenkins and White are still too young to completely give up on. Jenkins showed vast improvement this season. Roddy White had a rough sophomore season at times, but that is hardly uncommon for 2nd year receivers. It's way too early to do that. At least Matt Millen had an excuse for taking three first round receivers, because Charles Rogers was like Mr. Glass from the movie unbreakable. Yes, at times, drops were a large problem, but even Jerry Rice struggled with drops early in his career. Relying on young receivers was the problem, they all have those issues. We need a veteran, and a better WR coach, not a new receiver.
You can't pass on Calvin if you get a shot at him. He's Randy Moss with TO's strength and Jerry Rice's work ethic

d34ng3l021
01-02-2007, 01:29 AM
If we have two first round picks, I would rather stay put and add two impact players. :|

AMEN TO THAT BROTHER!

Do you think theres a chance that Rob Ryan (DC Raiders) moves laterally and maybe takes up our job as DC?

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 01:32 AM
If we have two first round picks, I would rather stay put and add two impact players. :|

AMEN TO THAT BROTHER!

Do you think theres a chance that Rob Ryan (DC Raiders) moves laterally and maybe takes up our job as DC?
At this point anything is possible...it's really just going to depend on the head coach, he's going to want to bring in some of his people...so I don't see it happening, but hey...ya never know...

d34ng3l021
01-02-2007, 01:37 AM
If we have two first round picks, I would rather stay put and add two impact players. :|

AMEN TO THAT BROTHER!

Do you think theres a chance that Rob Ryan (DC Raiders) moves laterally and maybe takes up our job as DC?
At this point anything is possible...it's really just going to depend on the head coach, he's going to want to bring in some of his people...so I don't see it happening, but hey...ya never know...

Yeah, true. If the big names arent available, I would really want to look into him. I think he might need some more experience and I dont know how he acts with players, but look at his resume: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rob_Ryan

He works WONDERS for secondaries. As the DB coach of the Cards in 95, the Cards had 32 interceptions...After we pick Reggie Nelson, we DEFINETLY have the talent to have one of the top secondaries in the league.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 01:51 AM
Wide Receivers bust more often than other positions. Wide Receivers take longer to develop than other positions. I like Johnson, but I would much rather add two players to a team that can compete next season. Jenkins and White are still too young to completely give up on. Jenkins showed vast improvement this season. Roddy White had a rough sophomore season at times, but that is hardly uncommon for 2nd year receivers. It's way too early to do that. At least Matt Millen had an excuse for taking three first round receivers, because Charles Rogers was like Mr. Glass from the movie unbreakable. Yes, at times, drops were a large problem, but even Jerry Rice struggled with drops early in his career. Relying on young receivers was the problem, they all have those issues. We need a veteran, and a better WR coach, not a new receiver.
You can't pass on Calvin if you get a shot at him. He's Randy Moss with TO's strength and Jerry Rice's work ethic

Look at the Chargers and Cowboys of '05, they were able to get two very good players, both of which stepped in a contributed immediately. We need that more than a receiver. We have holes in the secondary, offensive line, running back, defensive end as well as receiver. Quanity over quality in this case. Rich McKay built a dynasty with two first round picks, Derrick Brooks and Warren Sapp.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 02:15 AM
According to John Clayton; Atlanta is going to request interviews with Pittsburgh. Both Ken Whisenhunt and Russ Grimm. I would love to have either. :D

D-Rod
01-02-2007, 04:00 AM
I really want Russ Grimm as head coach, mainly because I think he can be the next Andy Reid: someone who realises that O-line and D-line win games and divisions (just look at the Philly O-line...).

I want someone to come in and say: fix that left side!

Sam Baker at #10, anyone?

Also, McKay and Blank have a habit of pulling off one major signing each offseason - how about Steinbach...

That would probably fix the left side...

Then the rest of the draft can be on D.

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 10:18 AM
Before joining the Raiders, the 19-year coaching veteran spent four seasons as linebackers coach on Bill Belichick's New England Patriots coaching staff.

That's the only line you need to know about Bob Ryan to know he'd be okay. Anyone who learned under Bill has turned out golden.

But Ken Wisenhunt would be AMAZING simply because he's creative and he knows what he's doing. Would the guy from Louisville come out to be an offensive coordinator? That'd be pretty solid.

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 10:20 AM
I really want Russ Grimm as head coach, mainly because I think he can be the next Andy Reid: someone who realises that O-line and D-line win games and divisions (just look at the Philly O-line...).

I want someone to come in and say: fix that left side!

Sam Baker at #10, anyone?

Also, McKay and Blank have a habit of pulling off one major signing each offseason - how about Steinbach...

That would probably fix the left side...

Then the rest of the draft can be on D.
We MAY decide to change our offensive line, but we dont have the size and power to switch from ZBS...so...I don't see that happening...I think maybe there's a way to meld the two styles, and just bring in a monster LT someone who can give Vick time to breath, then just get everyone else to just block their guy, don't worry "where's Vick" Let Vick worry about where the blocking is going if he decides to run, I think that would solve a lot of the problems.

D-Rod
01-02-2007, 11:42 AM
there's no reason that the ZBS has to be filled with late round cast-offs. all it requires is athleticism. Sam Baker has plenty of athleticism, as does Steinbach. The scheme is not the problem. The problem is prioritisation. Gibbs has convinced everyone that he can produce a serviceable O-line with minimal investment of salary and draft picks. That just isn't working right now. Hopefully McKay (and the new coach) can see that, and provide the scheme with the talent to make it work properly.

One major free agent - Steinbach - and one major draft pick - Baker.

Do i really think it will happen? No. But i still think that it is the only way to fix our offense.

The great thing is, those are the ONLY changes that need to be made to our offense. The skills positions are set. Those two huge investments, then all the remaining cash and picks can be spent on D.

Steinbach will get Shaffer-like money - $6 mill per year. Consider that as the money we get back from Peerless. Then Baker costs us a high pick (#10 is not silly money). But we are fine for picks this year, assuming Schaub gets us something decent.

That's at least 6 picks that can be spent entirely on Defense. We'd be absolutely rocking. This team is SO close. We just need to fix that O-line.

scar988
01-02-2007, 12:53 PM
We MAY decide to change our offensive line, but we dont have the size and power to switch from ZBS...so...I don't see that happening...I think maybe there's a way to meld the two styles, and just bring in a monster LT someone who can give Vick time to breath, then just get everyone else to just block their guy, don't worry "where's Vick" Let Vick worry about where the blocking is going if he decides to run, I think that would solve a lot of the problems.
maybe it's just me, but why do we need to get this monster LT? Why can't we just get a guy who is great at pass blocking and is an averaged sized (6'5" 300-315) OT? You don't need a monster at LT to be good in pass blocking. you need players that are good in pass blocking to be goo in pass blocking. we have the C-RG-RT locked up for the next few years, and they are all good at pass blocking. at LG I think we should take a chance and put 6'4" 310 36" armed Frank Omiyale at LG. it would help in pass blocking and he has the quickness to play guard in the ZBS at an extremely high level. Then either sign Steinbach (6'6" 290) and use him at LT (he is extremely quick and coudl play LT) or draft a guy like Joe Staley (6'5" 300) and have him play LT. overall though we don't need that huge guy because size can be a burden more than a blessing. IMO the ideal line for us would be:
LT - Eric Steinbach => 6'6" 290
LG - Frank Omiyale => 6'4" 310
C - Todd McClure => 6'2" 286
RG - Kynan Forney => 6'3" 307
RT - Todd Wiener => 6'5" 298

scar988
01-02-2007, 12:55 PM
there's no reason that the ZBS has to be filled with late round cast-offs. all it requires is athleticism. Sam Baker has plenty of athleticism, as does Steinbach. The scheme is not the problem. The problem is prioritisation. Gibbs has convinced everyone that he can produce a serviceable O-line with minimal investment of salary and draft picks. That just isn't working right now. Hopefully McKay (and the new coach) can see that, and provide the scheme with the talent to make it work properly.

One major free agent - Steinbach - and one major draft pick - Baker.

Do i really think it will happen? No. But i still think that it is the only way to fix our offense.

The great thing is, those are the ONLY changes that need to be made to our offense. The skills positions are set. Those two huge investments, then all the remaining cash and picks can be spent on D.

Steinbach will get Shaffer-like money - $6 mill per year. Consider that as the money we get back from Peerless. Then Baker costs us a high pick (#10 is not silly money). But we are fine for picks this year, assuming Schaub gets us something decent.

That's at least 6 picks that can be spent entirely on Defense. We'd be absolutely rocking. This team is SO close. We just need to fix that O-line.
D-Rod. I have seen a lot of Baker and he is very smart to come back. he isn't al that great in pass blocking and I have seen him get blown off the line against pac-10 competition. we don't need to spend a top 10 pick on a guy like Baker. we need to use a 2nd rounder on a OT like Staley, Harris or Ugoh. (IMO it's not that we aren't using first roudn picks, it's that we aren't using first DAY picks on them)

Smokey Joe
01-02-2007, 12:59 PM
whoa, I just read that the Jaguars are interested in Matt Schaub. I want the #2 pick overall though. I would love to see this trade go down:

Atlanta gets:
#2 overall (Calvin Johnson)
Detroit gets:
#10 overall
#17 overall
Jacksonville gets:
QB Matt Schaub
Do you really think you can get the 17 overall pick just for Schaub? :?

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 01:14 PM
I think we can get the #7 overall pick straight up for Schaub. But the trade you are talking about. We give up #10 overall AND Matt Schaub and gain the #2 pick...the #17 pick goes straight to Detroit...

D-Rod
01-02-2007, 03:35 PM
i dunno, scar. i've been impressed with baker whenever i've seen him, and scott seems to rate him highly too. however, it may be a moot point if he doesn't come out...

steinbach at LT is an interesting thought. I know the Bengals have tried it occasionally when Levi Jones was injured, but I think it was with mixed success... that said, he certainly has the tools to be an OT, if he can focus only on that.

as for LG, it seemed this year that ojinnaka was ahead of omiyale. maybe ojinnaka will get it done, though he seemed to get very little push against the eagles when weiner went down injured.

by the way, what do you think about levi brown? do you think he is athletic enough to fit the system? i'm not sure, but he could be an option if he has a great combine.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 03:39 PM
there's no reason that the ZBS has to be filled with late round cast-offs. all it requires is athleticism. Sam Baker has plenty of athleticism, as does Steinbach. The scheme is not the problem. The problem is prioritisation. Gibbs has convinced everyone that he can produce a serviceable O-line with minimal investment of salary and draft picks. That just isn't working right now. Hopefully McKay (and the new coach) can see that, and provide the scheme with the talent to make it work properly.

One major free agent - Steinbach - and one major draft pick - Baker.

Do i really think it will happen? No. But i still think that it is the only way to fix our offense.

The great thing is, those are the ONLY changes that need to be made to our offense. The skills positions are set. Those two huge investments, then all the remaining cash and picks can be spent on D.

Steinbach will get Shaffer-like money - $6 mill per year. Consider that as the money we get back from Peerless. Then Baker costs us a high pick (#10 is not silly money). But we are fine for picks this year, assuming Schaub gets us something decent.

That's at least 6 picks that can be spent entirely on Defense. We'd be absolutely rocking. This team is SO close. We just need to fix that O-line.

I agree wholeheartedly. A lot of teams use stretch run, zone scheme. Gibbs is the only one who tries to nickle and dime the position. I would love to have a O-Line like the Colts;

LT - Tarik Glenn (all-AFC) 6'5" 330
LG - Ryan Lilja 6'2" 290
OC - Jeff Saturday 6'5" 295
RG - Jake Scott 6'5" 295
RT - Ryan Diem 6'6" 320

They have mobile interior lineman to execute their stretch plays, but they have mammoth Tackles to provide Peyton with top notch protection. They also have more talent than we do, with two pro-bowl players.

D-Rod
01-02-2007, 03:48 PM
Exactly. And why do they have that line? Because they invested high draft picks and cash.

I DO appreciate the benefits of Gibbs' scheme. We get better O-line performance per dollar/draft pick than any other team, and that enables us to invest more in other areas of the team. However, the fundamental flaw with that reasoning is that there is no point being able to afford a $130 million QB if he gets 0.5 seconds to pass each time...

I have a ton of respect for McKay, but on this issue i really wish i could just shake some sense into him! Maybe he'll listen to me because i'm a lawyer too...

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 03:52 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next year

Shiver
01-02-2007, 04:09 PM
Exactly. And why do they have that line? Because they invested high draft picks and cash.

I DO appreciate the benefits of Gibbs' scheme. We get better O-line performance per dollar/draft pick than any other team, and that enables us to invest more in other areas of the team. However, the fundamental flaw with that reasoning is that there is no point being able to afford a $130 million QB if he gets 0.5 seconds to pass each time...

I have a ton of respect for McKay, but on this issue i really wish i could just shake some sense into him! Maybe he'll listen to me because i'm a lawyer too...

He let Gibbs have too much authority in drafting issues. However, if we hire Whisenhunt, that won't be an issue anymore. :lol: It's highly unlikely Whisenhunt wouldn't bring in "his" guys. Forney could fit any scheme, Weiner and McClure I don't know. Then again, not sure why they were extended in the first place. :roll:

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:18 PM
i dunno, scar. i've been impressed with baker whenever i've seen him, and scott seems to rate him highly too. however, it may be a moot point if he doesn't come out...

steinbach at LT is an interesting thought. I know the Bengals have tried it occasionally when Levi Jones was injured, but I think it was with mixed success... that said, he certainly has the tools to be an OT, if he can focus only on that.

as for LG, it seemed this year that ojinnaka was ahead of omiyale. maybe ojinnaka will get it done, though he seemed to get very little push against the eagles when weiner went down injured.

by the way, what do you think about levi brown? do you think he is athletic enough to fit the system? i'm not sure, but he could be an option if he has a great combine.Brown is not athletic enough to play LT in the NFL. he isn't even athletic enough to play OT in the ZBS and IMO is the 2nd worst fit for our scheme in the draft because he is a waist bender not a knee bender. he just powers people over.

I agree wholeheartedly. A lot of teams use stretch run, zone scheme. Gibbs is the only one who tries to nickle and dime the position. I would love to have a O-Line like the Colts;

LT - Tarik Glenn (all-AFC) 6'5" 330
LG - Ryan Lilja 6'2" 290
OC - Jeff Saturday 6'5" 295
RG - Jake Scott 6'5" 295
RT - Ryan Diem 6'6" 320

They have mobile interior lineman to execute their stretch plays, but they have mammoth Tackles to provide Peyton with top notch protection. They also have more talent than we do, with two pro-bowl players.
All they did was use high picks on lineman. 2nd, 3rd rounders. not the 310 overall on a guy who didn't fit the ZBS. Diem is a guy who fits our ZBS. IMO if we got 2 2nds and used one on Joe Staley (6'5" 300 and another ofrmer TE) and anther on Ben Grubbs (former TE who at 6'3" 317 is still great size) we woudl be set at OL. we just don't need to use a top 10 pick on a guy who we coudl get minimal drop off from with the next round down. IMO the pass blockers in the draft go like this:

1) Thomas
2) Staley
3) Grubbs
4) Harris
5) Baker (if he comes out)
I agree that we need to quit nickel and diming it. IMO we need to at least use a full dollar on a 2nd rounder.

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:23 PM
Exactly. And why do they have that line? Because they invested high draft picks and cash.

I DO appreciate the benefits of Gibbs' scheme. We get better O-line performance per dollar/draft pick than any other team, and that enables us to invest more in other areas of the team. However, the fundamental flaw with that reasoning is that there is no point being able to afford a $130 million QB if he gets 0.5 seconds to pass each time...

I have a ton of respect for McKay, but on this issue i really wish i could just shake some sense into him! Maybe he'll listen to me because i'm a lawyer too...again, why do we need a top 10 pick. let's go back to that Indy OL and see where they were drafted:
OT - Tarik Glenn - 1st round
OT - Ryan Diem - 4th round
OG - Ryan Lilja - undrafted
OG - Jake Scott - 5th round
OC - Jeff Saturday - undrafted.

now lets look at our line and where guys where originally drafted (if we get Staley at LT and use Omiyale at LG):
LT - Joe Staley - 2nd round
LG - Frank Omiyale - 5th round
C - Tod McClure - 7th round
RG - Kynan Forney - 7th round
RT - Todd Wiener - 2nd round

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:25 PM
He let Gibbs have too much authority in drafting issues. However, if we hire Whisenhunt, that won't be an issue anymore. :lol: It's highly unlikely Whisenhunt wouldn't bring in "his" guys. Forney could fit any scheme, Weiner and McClure I don't know. Then again, not sure why they were extended in the first place. :roll:
I agree. I think we will keep the ZBS that Gibbs has. Only we will say that we need some 2nd and 3rd round guys. I don't see the guys there at 10 that fit his scheme but I do see the guys there in the 2nd and 3rd that do.

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:25 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next yearhe would be good as Norwood's complement.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 04:26 PM
You really love the ZBS don't you? Well, you may not ever see it again. As Rich McKay said it's up to the new HC who is on his staff. Considering Whisenhunt and Grimm believe in big, mauling, man blocking lines I would say that it is highly unlikely they keep the current system and players. The only coaching candidate that wouldn't change things up too much is if they hire the QB/AHC from Indianapolis, Jim Caldwell.

vatech=accdomination
01-02-2007, 04:30 PM
i keep hearing ATL detroit trade talks, are thse true(im hearing Vick for the #2 pick and something else)which would give Schaub Calvin Johnson.

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:30 PM
You really love the ZBS don't you? Well, you may not ever see it again. As Rich McKay said it's up to the new HC who is on his staff. Considering Whisenhunt and Grimm believe in big, mauling, man blocking lines I would say that it is unlikely they keep the current system and players.I don't know Shiver. and yes I do like the ZBS, I just don't see how a guy like Vick can be protect by big maulers who aren't that quick in pass pro. I like how the ZBS works with the lineman we have. Wiener and Forney fit a mauling scheme though and maybe we coudl expiriement with spending money to get Steinbach to play LG have Wiener go to LT and then draft a really quick lineman to play Rt.

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:30 PM
i keep hearing ATL detroit trade talks, are thse true(im hearing Vick for the #2 pick and something else)which would give Schaub Calvin Johnson.where are you hearing this? Vick isn't going to be traded and financially cannot be traded.

vatech=accdomination
01-02-2007, 04:33 PM
thats what thought, ive heard it from alot of optimistic detroit fans.

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:35 PM
thats what thought, ive heard it from alot of optimistic detroit fans.they would be smarter to want Schaub since Martz loves Schaub and our #10. We would need at least 4 years of first rounders to even consider trading Schaub.

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 04:37 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next yearhe would be good as Norwood's complement.


when do you think Ian would go in the draft next year?

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:39 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next yearhe would be good as Norwood's complement.


when do you think Ian would go in the draft next year?3rd maybe 4th if he came out this year.

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 04:42 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next yearhe would be good as Norwood's complement.


when do you think Ian would go in the draft next year?3rd maybe 4th if he came out this year.

i would be very happy if we get Ian... then when Dunn retires we got Norwood and Johnson.. sweet...

Smokey Joe
01-02-2007, 04:54 PM
I think we can get the #7 overall pick straight up for Schaub. But the trade you are talking about. We give up #10 overall AND Matt Schaub and gain the #2 pick...the #17 pick goes straight to Detroit...
Teams are willing to give up a high first round choice for Schaub?

scar988
01-02-2007, 04:54 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next yearhe would be good as Norwood's complement.


when do you think Ian would go in the draft next year?3rd maybe 4th if he came out this year.

i would be very happy if we get Ian... then when Dunn retires we got Norwood and Johnson.. sweet...yup. It wouldn't matter who the starter is because the carries would go 50-50.

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 04:55 PM
What you guys think about Ian Johnson
Eventhough we just drafted Jerious Norwood i would really like the falcons to draft Ian Johnson next yearhe would be good as Norwood's complement.


when do you think Ian would go in the draft next year?3rd maybe 4th if he came out this year.

i would be very happy if we get Ian... then when Dunn retires we got Norwood and Johnson.. sweet...yup. It wouldn't matter who the starter is because the carries would go 50-50.

So what are the chances we can trade for a position to draft Calvin Johnson?

scar988
01-02-2007, 05:06 PM
no idea. It woudl be a Schaub and #10 for the #1 or 2 kind of trade.

2drama
01-02-2007, 05:07 PM
thats what thought, ive heard it from alot of optimistic detroit fans.

hear say
living in Michigan i don't think so
our management is not that smart

we could not afford vick

Shiver
01-02-2007, 05:31 PM
I think we can get the #7 overall pick straight up for Schaub. But the trade you are talking about. We give up #10 overall AND Matt Schaub and gain the #2 pick...the #17 pick goes straight to Detroit...
Teams are willing to give up a high first round choice for Schaub?

I doubt it. I would say low end to mid-first is all we could get.

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 05:41 PM
no idea. It woudl be a Schaub and #10 for the #1 or 2 kind of trade.

Would the Falcons be willing to do that?

Shiver
01-02-2007, 05:47 PM
no idea. It woudl be a Schaub and #10 for the #1 or 2 kind of trade.

Would the Falcons be willing to do that?

Conjecture

Definition: a conclusion deduced by surmise or guesswork

Who knows.

scar988
01-02-2007, 05:48 PM
no idea. It woudl be a Schaub and #10 for the #1 or 2 kind of trade.

Would the Falcons be willing to do that?no idea, but I think it would be a smart move.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 05:52 PM
I wonder how long it will take to get a Head Coach? Either one of the Pittsburgh guys would be fine by me.

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 06:11 PM
I don't care who we get, I just want them to come in and CLEAN HOUSE. I mean come in and get rid of the trash and bring in some class. I wouldn't mind a monster mauling OL. But it would take a LOT of draft picks, which would be hard to come up with. But I also want them to get us the most we possibly could get from Schaub, which imo, is #10 + Schaub for #2...hopefully landing us Calvin Johnson, but if not, it would land us Gaines Adams

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 06:26 PM
have any of you guys heard anything about Tyrone Prothro?? Ever since he broke his leg i have heard nothing about him. he was a great WR and a man i wanted the Falcoons to draft if he didn't get hurt

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 06:33 PM
I think about it, and I wonder, if they come in here from Pit, will we move to the 3-4 again? And if we do...we look REALLY solid imo, just as solid if not more so than the 4-3.

RDE - Coleman
NT - Jackson
LDE - Babs / Shrop

LOLB - John Abraham
LMLB - Keith Brooking
RMLB - Ed Hartwell
ROLB - Michael Boley

Then inside of that we can switch that like crazy for pass rush etc. Ideal Pass Rush looks like this for me.

RDE - Coleman
NT- TJ Jackson / Shropshire
LDE - John Abraham

LOLB - Michael Boley
LMLB - Keith Brooking
RMLB - Jordan Beck
ROLB - Demorrio Williams

IMO, that's a SICK front 7, sure we need more depth...but wow. Carrington would be a great rush OLB backup as well. There are SO many great things that could happen with this switch. That way we don't resign Patrick Kerney, and then we are looking at having some room under the cap to work with. If we stick with the 4-3 we're going to have to bring in another DE, either PK or spending a fairly high draft pick on one. There is a LOT of talent in our front 7 and those guys could absolutely dominate I think. Then that would let our DBs play man coverage a lot more too...wow...I'm not a big fan of 3-4 most of the time, but it seems to be working, and we could look at some of these undersized DEs that would move out and become rush LBs much like Shawn Merriman.

I think whoever comes here with whatever scheme is looking at a potentially great defense. We have most of the puzzle pieces just missing an elite Safety (actually just a decent one lol) then offensive line.

Those lineups are without the draft as well. So...wow...what if we go out and get a guy like Q Moses as a pass rush specialist...what if we bring in a guy like Adam Carriker who could be a nasty 3-4 DE...I mean...if we want to make the switch, I think this is the year to go ahead and get it done, and I think it maximizes our talent, by keeping D-mo on the field more often.

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 06:35 PM
have any of you guys heard anything about Tyrone Prothro?? Ever since he broke his leg i have heard nothing about him. he was a great WR and a man i wanted the Falcoons to draft if he didn't get hurt
He will be playing in Alabama next season. What happened was the doctor's had to re-break his leg after they screwed up the first couple surgerys and they had to do more to fix what happened. I have hear that he is still walking with a severe limp and may never be able to play the game again. They don't expect him to return at the level he was playing at.

I agree with you, I liked him a lot as a WR, he was phenomenal.

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 06:46 PM
have any of you guys heard anything about Tyrone Prothro?? Ever since he broke his leg i have heard nothing about him. he was a great WR and a man i wanted the Falcoons to draft if he didn't get hurt
He will be playing in Alabama next season. What happened was the doctor's had to re-break his leg after they screwed up the first couple surgerys and they had to do more to fix what happened. I have hear that he is still walking with a severe limp and may never be able to play the game again. They don't expect him to return at the level he was playing at.

I agree with you, I liked him a lot as a WR, he was phenomenal.

That stinks, i really liked the way he played, he played like a hall of famer..

SimonRath
01-02-2007, 06:58 PM
hey guys if Amobe Akoye were to fall to us in like the 2nd or even the 3rd would we get him even f we dont need a DT

scar988
01-02-2007, 07:03 PM
I think about it, and I wonder, if they come in here from Pit, will we move to the 3-4 again? And if we do...we look REALLY solid imo, just as solid if not more so than the 4-3.

RDE - Coleman
NT - Jackson
LDE - Babs / Shrop

LOLB - John Abraham
LMLB - Keith Brooking
RMLB - Ed Hartwell
ROLB - Michael Boley

Then inside of that we can switch that like crazy for pass rush etc. Ideal Pass Rush looks like this for me.

RDE - Coleman
NT- TJ Jackson / Shropshire
LDE - John Abraham

LOLB - Michael Boley
LMLB - Keith Brooking
RMLB - Jordan Beck
ROLB - Demorrio Williams

IMO, that's a SICK front 7, sure we need more depth...but wow. Carrington would be a great rush OLB backup as well. There are SO many great things that could happen with this switch. That way we don't resign Patrick Kerney, and then we are looking at having some room under the cap to work with. If we stick with the 4-3 we're going to have to bring in another DE, either PK or spending a fairly high draft pick on one. There is a LOT of talent in our front 7 and those guys could absolutely dominate I think. Then that would let our DBs play man coverage a lot more too...wow...I'm not a big fan of 3-4 most of the time, but it seems to be working, and we could look at some of these undersized DEs that would move out and become rush LBs much like Shawn Merriman.

I think whoever comes here with whatever scheme is looking at a potentially great defense. We have most of the puzzle pieces just missing an elite Safety (actually just a decent one lol) then offensive line.

Those lineups are without the draft as well. So...wow...what if we go out and get a guy like Q Moses as a pass rush specialist...what if we bring in a guy like Adam Carriker who could be a nasty 3-4 DE...I mean...if we want to make the switch, I think this is the year to go ahead and get it done, and I think it maximizes our talent, by keeping D-mo on the field more often.just no. I don't want to go to the disaster that is the 3-4 again. It doesn't fit what we have our personenel here for. I woudl rather go to a Tampa 2:
LE - Draft Pick or Patrick Kerney/Paul Carrington
NT - Grady Jackson/Darrell Shropshire/Tommy Jackson
UT - Rod Coleman/John Babineaux
RE - John Abraham/Chauncey Davis
WLB - Demorrio Williams/Keith Brooking
MLB - Keith Brooking/Jordan Beck
SLB - Michael Boley/Jordan Beck/Ike Reese
LCB - Hall
RCB - Williams
FS - Draft pick
SS - Crocker

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 07:50 PM
I think about it, and I wonder, if they come in here from Pit, will we move to the 3-4 again? And if we do...we look REALLY solid imo, just as solid if not more so than the 4-3.

RDE - Coleman
NT - Jackson
LDE - Babs / Shrop

LOLB - John Abraham
LMLB - Keith Brooking
RMLB - Ed Hartwell
ROLB - Michael Boley

Then inside of that we can switch that like crazy for pass rush etc. Ideal Pass Rush looks like this for me.

RDE - Coleman
NT- TJ Jackson / Shropshire
LDE - John Abraham

LOLB - Michael Boley
LMLB - Keith Brooking
RMLB - Jordan Beck
ROLB - Demorrio Williams

IMO, that's a SICK front 7, sure we need more depth...but wow. Carrington would be a great rush OLB backup as well. There are SO many great things that could happen with this switch. That way we don't resign Patrick Kerney, and then we are looking at having some room under the cap to work with. If we stick with the 4-3 we're going to have to bring in another DE, either PK or spending a fairly high draft pick on one. There is a LOT of talent in our front 7 and those guys could absolutely dominate I think. Then that would let our DBs play man coverage a lot more too...wow...I'm not a big fan of 3-4 most of the time, but it seems to be working, and we could look at some of these undersized DEs that would move out and become rush LBs much like Shawn Merriman.

I think whoever comes here with whatever scheme is looking at a potentially great defense. We have most of the puzzle pieces just missing an elite Safety (actually just a decent one lol) then offensive line.

Those lineups are without the draft as well. So...wow...what if we go out and get a guy like Q Moses as a pass rush specialist...what if we bring in a guy like Adam Carriker who could be a nasty 3-4 DE...I mean...if we want to make the switch, I think this is the year to go ahead and get it done, and I think it maximizes our talent, by keeping D-mo on the field more often.just no. I don't want to go to the disaster that is the 3-4 again. It doesn't fit what we have our personenel here for. I woudl rather go to a Tampa 2:
LE - Draft Pick or Patrick Kerney/Paul Carrington
NT - Grady Jackson/Darrell Shropshire/Tommy Jackson
UT - Rod Coleman/John Babineaux
RE - John Abraham/Chauncey Davis
WLB - Demorrio Williams/Keith Brooking
MLB - Keith Brooking/Jordan Beck
SLB - Michael Boley/Jordan Beck/Ike Reese
LCB - Hall
RCB - Williams
FS - Draft pick
SS - Crocker
But we don't have the same people on defense anymore. Jackson would be a difference maker, not to mention Coleman as a DE? There's just no negatives to this honestly. I don't see why you think this would be a disaster? I mean I like the 4-3, nothing wrong with it, but I don't want cover 2, because I don't want Jimmy Williams in zone coverage, I want him in man, I also want Deangelo in Man. Cover 2 is fine, but I don't want the Tampa 2.

I don't think we'll bump Demorrio up over Keith either...even though he's an incredible playmaker on defense for us. We'll see what happens, but I think 3-4 could work in Atlanta, and if we get the Pitt guys we should prolly expect to see a switch to that system.

scar988
01-02-2007, 08:31 PM
But we don't have the same people on defense anymore. Jackson would be a difference maker, not to mention Coleman as a DE? There's just no negatives to this honestly. I don't see why you think this would be a disaster? I mean I like the 4-3, nothing wrong with it, but I don't want cover 2, because I don't want Jimmy Williams in zone coverage, I want him in man, I also want Deangelo in Man. Cover 2 is fine, but I don't want the Tampa 2.
no there are a lot of negatives, cheifly that we woudl lose a lot of the great pass rush we get. I think it woudl be good to use maybe 10 plays a game but we don't have that NT who can play every single down. Tampa 2 uses a lot (I mean almost 75%) of man coverage from the corners. I just has 2 deep safeties and the MLB drops deep sometimes. but for the most part it is a zone blitz scheme with man corners.
I don't think we'll bump Demorrio up over Keith either...even though he's an incredible playmaker on defense for us. We'll see what happens, but I think 3-4 could work in Atlanta, and if we get the Pitt guys we should prolly expect to see a switch to that system.It wouldn't be bumping Demo over Keith. IT woudl be cutting Hartwell, movign Keith to MLB in the Tampa 2 because that's where he fits and putting Demorrio as the main WLB in it. If we get the pitt guys I doubt we switch system because they are offensive. They oudl hire the best DC for our personel. IMO it's Clancy Pendergast. the guy from Arizona who runs a variation on the Tampa 2 where the OLB's are featured the MLB is more of a run stuffer and the corners are in Man 95% of the time.

btw, the Bears gave us permission to talk to Rivera. The "short list" is:
1) Ken Whisenhunt
2) Ron Rivera
3) Russ Grimm
4) Steve Mariucci
IMO another idea for the coachign staff could be:
HC - Ron Rivera
OC - Steve Mariucci
DC - Donnie Henderson

Shiver
01-02-2007, 09:36 PM
btw, the Bears gave us permission to talk to Rivera. The "short list" is:
1) Ken Whisenhunt
2) Ron Rivera
3) Russ Grimm
4) Steve Mariucci


I will not be a Falcons fan if we hire Mariucci. A man can only bear so much. :x

iloxygenil
01-02-2007, 09:54 PM
But we don't have the same people on defense anymore. Jackson would be a difference maker, not to mention Coleman as a DE? There's just no negatives to this honestly. I don't see why you think this would be a disaster? I mean I like the 4-3, nothing wrong with it, but I don't want cover 2, because I don't want Jimmy Williams in zone coverage, I want him in man, I also want Deangelo in Man. Cover 2 is fine, but I don't want the Tampa 2.
no there are a lot of negatives, cheifly that we woudl lose a lot of the great pass rush we get. I think it woudl be good to use maybe 10 plays a game but we don't have that NT who can play every single down. Tampa 2 uses a lot (I mean almost 75%) of man coverage from the corners. I just has 2 deep safeties and the MLB drops deep sometimes. but for the most part it is a zone blitz scheme with man corners.
I don't think we'll bump Demorrio up over Keith either...even though he's an incredible playmaker on defense for us. We'll see what happens, but I think 3-4 could work in Atlanta, and if we get the Pitt guys we should prolly expect to see a switch to that system.It wouldn't be bumping Demo over Keith. IT woudl be cutting Hartwell, movign Keith to MLB in the Tampa 2 because that's where he fits and putting Demorrio as the main WLB in it. If we get the pitt guys I doubt we switch system because they are offensive. They oudl hire the best DC for our personel. IMO it's Clancy Pendergast. the guy from Arizona who runs a variation on the Tampa 2 where the OLB's are featured the MLB is more of a run stuffer and the corners are in Man 95% of the time.

btw, the Bears gave us permission to talk to Rivera. The "short list" is:
1) Ken Whisenhunt
2) Ron Rivera
3) Russ Grimm
4) Steve Mariucci
IMO another idea for the coachign staff could be:
HC - Ron Rivera
OC - Steve Mariucci
DC - Donnie Henderson
Well sounds good to me. I just want it done. Ken is definitely my top choice, hope it happens very soon.

Shiver
01-02-2007, 10:14 PM
I want either of the Steelers coaches. That is the style that I believe wins games and championships, tough, sound, physical football.

Shiver
01-03-2007, 12:04 AM
Here is what I really like about Whisenhunt; his offense is much more conducive to Michael Vick's talents.

Ben Roethlisberger averages a 20+ yard, or "explosive" pass for every 8.6 attempts, an absurd number, by far the best in the NFL.

Under Reeves' offense; Vick had a 20+ yard pass for every 10.2 attempts, a very high number.

Under Knapp; Vick had a 20+ yard pass for every 11.9 attempts, not very special.

Vick excells at throwing the ball, behind a conventional line, in a vertical passing attack as seen in '02. He wasn't comfortable in Knapp's offense, and he wasn't exactly quiet in his criticisms, but he was subtle in his criticisms.

scar988
01-03-2007, 12:07 AM
Here is what I really like about Whisenhunt; his offense is much more conducive to Michael Vick's talents.

Ben Roethlisberger averages a 20+ yard, or "explosive" pass for every 8.6 attempts, an absurd number, by far the best in the NFL.

Under Reeves' offense; Vick had a 20+ yard pass for every 10.2 attempts, a very high number.

Under Knapp; Vick had a 20+ yard pass for every 11.9 attempts, not very special.

Vick excells at throwing the ball, behind a conventional line, in a vertical passing attack as seen in '02.I think a good pass blocking OL doesn't necessarily have to be a conventional one. IMO we just need to use a 2nd rounder on a OT and either move Omiyale to LG or get a LG in the 3rd or 4th.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 01:57 AM
Joe Staley can have a huge impact on our offensive line, and CJ will have an even bigger impact on this team if we can get them round 1 and 2 and then Grubb in round 3...that would make our offense pretty intense...but leaves us without a Safety still...

scar988
01-03-2007, 02:23 AM
Joe Staley can have a huge impact on our offensive line, and CJ will have an even bigger impact on this team if we can get them round 1 and 2 and then Grubb in round 3...that would make our offense pretty intense...but leaves us without a Safety still...that woudl be great but realistically I see us trading Schaub to Jacksonville for 17. I also see our coaching staff as this:
HC - Ken Whisenhunt
OC - Russ Grimm (if he doesn't take the steelers job why not bring him in as the OC for at least a year?)
QB - Bill Musgrave (why not keep who is working?)
RB - no idea but someone who knows their ****
WR - Terence Mathis (expressed interest and knows the postion well, woudl be respected as the best Falcon WR ever)
OL/TE - Gibbs/Cable/Barone/Dalman (despite what you think I think Whisenhunt woudl keep our OL coaches for at least one year to see what the scheme is about. Cable and Grimm would be in full charge of the pass blocking while Gibbs woudl only have influence on run blocking with Barone and Dalman as the all around assistant)
DC - Donnie Henderson (good coordinator when allowed to run his own defense. woudl run a man corner wiht zone blitz D.)
DL - Johnson/Lombardi (again why throw away what is working?)
LB - no idea but someone who knows their ****
DB - no idea but someone who knows their ****
ST - DeCamillis/Hoffman (again why quit what works?)

Shiver
01-03-2007, 03:33 AM
I think if we sign Whisenhunt, he would operate like a Sean Payton, calling the plays in addition.

ATLDirtyBirds
01-03-2007, 05:44 AM
My decision was made a long time ago that I wanted Wisenhunt, he just seems like the perfect man for the job.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 11:11 AM
My decision was made a long time ago that I wanted Wisenhunt, he just seems like the perfect man for the job.
Yeah I think he'd be really good here...but I really like Petrino as well, his offensive attack is relentless it just keeps coming all game long, there is no backing off for that offense and I really like that.

Shiver
01-03-2007, 01:11 PM
Whisenhunt is interviewing on Thursday; BRING HIM HOME BLANK.


He has this calm presence about him that he will function as if he did it all his life. He never panics and he's absolutely brilliant. He'll make the call that makes the most sense, that requires calm and presence. He won't be plucking things out of the air or choking on a hot dog. Coaches do all kinds of crazy stuff; there is a legion of ways they can panic in those situations. This guy is cold-blooded in the clutch.

You want to strive for balance, but the running game especially establishes a mental toughness, a physical toughness with your team.

About the time he decided to look into coaching, it found him in the form of Vanderbilt coach Rod Dowhower. His former coordinator in Atlanta, Dowhower needed a special teams and tight ends coach and thought of Whisenhunt.

"I just watched the way he prepared, the way he played, the way he communicated, his demeanor," said Dowhower, now retired in Arizona.

"I was just impressed with the way he went about his business. He's very smart. When he coached our special teams, that was about the best thing on our team other than our defense."

Two virtues come to Dowhower when he talks about Whisenhunt: His smarts and his toughness. He still recalls his former tight end continuously throwing a favorite block.

"When I went to the Falcons I watched him on film wham those noses on the lead nose play over and over again. They did it over and over and over. I'm surprised he has normal shoulders. He's one of the toughest guys I've seen play."

Dan Henning, who coached him in Washington and Atlanta and helped get him hired by the Jets, uses similar words to describe Whisenhunt.

"He leans on approaching players on an intelligent basis, but this is a tough guy," said Henning, offensive coordinator of the Carolina Panthers. "He has a mental toughness about him that makes him excel.

"He learned every position. He was on our depth chart in 1986 as a backup quarterback as well as starting at tight end. He's very bright and has a creative mind. I think he'll do very well. He leans toward things to take advantage of the intelligence of the players he's coaching."

http://www.post-gazette.com/images2/20040222hoWhisenhuntB_230.jpg

bearsfan_51
01-03-2007, 01:13 PM
Chicago media seems to think that Rivera is a much more serious candidate in Arizona than Atlanta. What's your feeling/read on this?

Shiver
01-03-2007, 01:22 PM
Chicago media seems to think that Rivera is a much more serious candidate in Arizona than Atlanta. What's your feeling/read on this?

The hot rumour is Ken Whisenhunt, because of his offensive background and Atlanta roots. However Rivera is still on "the short list." Honestly though, Blank has made it very clear that Atlanta's search for a coach will be private, so who knows at this point. Right now they've only been confirmed to have asked permission to talk to Whisenhunt, Grimm and Rivera. Honestly I would be fine with any of them. They will be an upgrade over our Atlanta 49ers coaching staff of the past three seasons.

D-Rod
01-03-2007, 02:00 PM
Interesting that Whiz actually looks a little like Cowher...

I think that he would be a great hire. He has lit up his area of expertise in a way that Mora never did as DC. It would be so upsetting for the Steelers to choose him ahead of Grimm. For all his Atlanta ties, I'd be amazed if he chose the Falcons over the Steelers, who are still essentially a Superbowl talented team.

Let's hope that Grimm gets the Steelers... he has more Pittsburgh ties, and is the official assistant head coach. We shall see...

If he does come, I'd agree that Musgrave would be a good choice as OC (unless he brings his own guy). Musgrave's main failing in JAX was playcalling - and that privilege would remain with Whiz, I would hope. As a coach, Musgrave is outstanding. Only downside is that he would be less able to focus on Vick.

As for DC, it is there that I hope Blank could pull off a coup, grabbing a top-notch current NFL DC, like one of the Ryans (who do not appear interested in HC jobs just yet...). To do that requires a major sales pitch, and serious cash: Blank's forte.

MY DREAM TEAM:

HC: Whiz
OC: Musgrave
DC: Rob Ryan (more likely than Rex, IMO)

D-Rod
01-03-2007, 02:24 PM
incidentally, jordan black could be a very good fit for our O-line. I doubt that KC lets him go, but he'd probably be available for less than crazy money.

Shiver
01-03-2007, 02:25 PM
I think the best defensive scheme for us is the Tampa 2. We have athletic linebackers, quick D-Lineman, Jimmy Williams and DeAngelo Hall tackle well and jam well. We would be two safeties away from being a perfect fit. On offense we need a new Left Side, a power back, and a vertical passing attack. Vick is comfortable with the deep post, crossing routes, dig routes, yet we rarely ran those routes under Knapp.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 03:40 PM
Ken is definitely my top choice right now. I think after he comes to Atlanta tomorrow sees our facilities and sees how Blank works and how good he is and how free he would be with power here, wow. How could he turn us down? I wouldn't doubt if he never even goes to visit the Cardinals. Yet, at the same time I really would like to see us interview a few coaches. What if something weird happened and we had like co-head coaches...Whisenhunt for one and the guy from the Bears as the other? That'd be kinda cool, but I guess you have to have 1 head coach. My choice would be Ken for the HC and the guy from Chicago as our 'backup' HC =) lol. I really just want a NASTY defense brought to town, our offense can be fixed easily by 1 trade up and pick, and a few offensive linemen, with a good mind calling plays (hello Ken Whisenhunt)

scar988
01-03-2007, 04:07 PM
Chicago media seems to think that Rivera is a much more serious candidate in Arizona than Atlanta. What's your feeling/read on this?

The hot rumour is Ken Whisenhunt, because of his offensive background and Atlanta roots. However Rivera is still on "the short list." Honestly though, Blank has made it very clear that Atlanta's search for a coach will be private, so who knows at this point. Right now they've only been confirmed to have asked permission to talk to Whisenhunt, Grimm and Rivera. Honestly I would be fine with any of them. They will be an upgrade over our Atlanta 49ers coaching staff of the past three seasons.Whis is a hit but I have been hearing rumblings of Norm Chow and Chow would bring in Donnie Henderson more than likely to run a Tampa 2 variation. I would love to see a coahign staff of:
HC/OC - Norm Chow
DC - Donnie Henderson.
lots of good guys available this year which is a good thing.

D-Rod
01-03-2007, 04:20 PM
Whis is a hit but I have been hearing rumblings of Norm Chow and Chow would bring in Donnie Henderson more than likely to run a Tampa 2 variation. I would love to see a coahign staff of:
HC/OC - Norm Chow
DC - Donnie Henderson.
lots of good guys available this year which is a good thing.

As I understand it, Henderson left Detroit because Marinelli wanted a Tampa 2 and Henderson was more a Man-Blitz guy.

Not convinced by Chow as HC material. He's also old, so doesn't really fit the bill for Blank and his continuity... Would be a fantastic OC, but I doubt we could pry him away with a lateral.

scar988
01-03-2007, 04:29 PM
Whis is a hit but I have been hearing rumblings of Norm Chow and Chow would bring in Donnie Henderson more than likely to run a Tampa 2 variation. I would love to see a coahign staff of:
HC/OC - Norm Chow
DC - Donnie Henderson.
lots of good guys available this year which is a good thing.

As I understand it, Henderson left Detroit because Marinelli wanted a Tampa 2 and Henderson was more a Man-Blitz guy.

Not convinced by Chow as HC material. He's also old, so doesn't really fit the bill for Blank and his continuity... Would be a fantastic OC, but I doubt we could pry him away with a lateral.Henderson has a cover 2 safety zone blitz front 7 man corners. that is what he would run as it is basically a modified Tampa 2 that he ran in both New York and Baltimore. Chow is old but he coudl easily be here another 15 years. He woudl fit for us and could be a great schemer for us.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 04:46 PM
AHHH I can't handle it, too many great coaches out there this year...bring one of them home McKay I don't care who! Just as long as he's the right one!

Shiver
01-03-2007, 04:51 PM
AHHH I can't handle it, too many great coaches out there this year...bring one of them home McKay I don't care who! Just as long as he's the right one!


Exactly, all of them have better credentials than Jim Mora did.

scar988
01-03-2007, 05:09 PM
AHHH I can't handle it, too many great coaches out there this year...bring one of them home McKay I don't care who! Just as long as he's the right one!


Exactly, all of them have better credentials than Jim Mora did.so did Lovie Smith, but we passed on him too.

D-Rod
01-03-2007, 05:17 PM
Henderson has a cover 2 safety zone blitz front 7 man corners. that is what he would run as it is basically a modified Tampa 2 that he ran in both New York and Baltimore. Chow is old but he coudl easily be here another 15 years. He woudl fit for us and could be a great schemer for us.

Well, that scheme does sound good to me. Problem is, we are distinctly lacking in safeties able to pull that off. Milloy is a liability in deep coverage, as is Crocker. We could bring in Nelson, but Milloy is unlikely to go anywhere, and he would limit the effectiveness of that scheme, IMO. Maybe it would have to be a cover 1. Nelson may just be able to pull it off! Thoughts?

As for Chow, he'll be 61 before the draft. That's old. Maybe he'd be a decent stopgap, and I'm not saying it won't happen, but his age is certainly a negative.

D-Rod
01-03-2007, 05:18 PM
[quote=Shiver]so did Lovie Smith, but we passed on him too.

hindsight is 20/20, but seriously, what a stupid decision... hopefully McKay will have more input this time round.

Jonathan_VIlma
01-03-2007, 06:35 PM
I've read that the Falcons are interested in our first year offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer, because they think his offense fits Vick.

It contains a lot of motion, and a very uptempo style of play, which includes a lot of fakes. The problem is, that you have to be terribly smart to pick up all the plays, and the motion fakes, and have the smarts to run it, since a lot of the calls happen to be the quarterbacks on.

The nature of the offense fits Vick, but I'm not sure he's smart enough to run it.

Shiver
01-03-2007, 06:47 PM
The Falcons are being through. I haven't heard Brian's name come up, but he has a fine resume', especially when it comes to developing Quarterbacks, Brees, Rivers. Vick does fine in a conventional, old school, deep passing attack. In '02 he was a great passer, no one ever doubted him as such. It was only under Knapp that he hasn't performed to expected levels.

Vick when there is motion; passer rating of 103.5.. :shock:

According to Adam Schefter the coach in the 'pole' position is Ken Whisenhunt, though.

bearsfan_51
01-03-2007, 07:25 PM
I had forgotten this untill now, but back when the Falcons needed a coach it was believed that Lovie Smith was the favorite in Atlanta and that Jerry Angelo would hire Jim Mora if they couldn't lure Nick Saban away. Kinda funny how things work out.

scar988
01-03-2007, 07:26 PM
I've read that the Falcons are interested in our first year offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer, because they think his offense fits Vick.

It contains a lot of motion, and a very uptempo style of play, which includes a lot of fakes. The problem is, that you have to be terribly smart to pick up all the plays, and the motion fakes, and have the smarts to run it, since a lot of the calls happen to be the quarterbacks on.

The nature of the offense fits Vick, but I'm not sure he's smart enough to run it.Vick has the intelligence to run it. people think that just because Vick talks like a gangster that he is stupid. the man has average intelligence. HE coudl pick up the scheme. As long as he is allowed to audible some as well that would be huge. Knapp didn't want anyone to audible. not even when he had Steve Young or Jeff Garcia.

Shiver
01-03-2007, 07:54 PM
I had forgotten this untill now, but back when the Falcons needed a coach it was believed that Lovie Smith was the favorite in Atlanta and that Jerry Angelo would hire Jim Mora if they couldn't lure Nick Saban away. Kinda funny how things work out.


:x

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 08:13 PM
I really just want all the speculation to end now as far as a coach goes, so we can really find out if we'll make a move somewhere in the draft. I'm thinking if we get Ken Whisenhunt we actually will make a move up to #1 or 2 to get Calvin...he has those GA Tech ties and he knows that this is a guy who will shape the image of our offense for years to come. I think if he comes, we get CJ too, that's why he's my top choice right now.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 08:15 PM
Anyone watching this LSU game? Why is Laron considered the top Safety in this year's draft? He's not at all impressive to me. I'm watching for him specifically and the only thing I've seen happen is him not put a lick on a guy when he had the chance to to prevent a TD, but he didn't make the hit and they scored...hrmm

Shiver
01-03-2007, 09:21 PM
I really just want all the speculation to end now as far as a coach goes, so we can really find out if we'll make a move somewhere in the draft. I'm thinking if we get Ken Whisenhunt we actually will make a move up to #1 or 2 to get Calvin...he has those GA Tech ties and he knows that this is a guy who will shape the image of our offense for years to come. I think if he comes, we get CJ too, that's why he's my top choice right now.

I think if we hire Whisenhunt we go O-Line, that's the biggest need, and the area that would need the most tweaking. We need a whole new Left Side; there are two top tier lineman that may be at our 10th pick; Levi Brown and Justin Blaylock. Brown could come in a start at LT right away, he reminds me of Marcus McNeil minus the spine stenosis. Blaylock has the look of a 10+ year perennial all-pro at Guard. The staple of the Pittsburgh Steelers has been the dominating force on the O-Line, with Marvel Smith, Alan Faneca and Jeff Hartings. In '02 Vick was only sacked 33 times, in 421 attempts. He has been sacked far more often in the past three seasons. In the seven wins this season, Vick has been sacked 12 times, in the nine losses he was sacked 33 times. Protection has been an issue, specifically in obvious passing situations in the 4th QTR. We need to protect him better. When we do, we win.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 09:56 PM
I definitely know the OL is a problem, but man, the elite lines in the NFL are comprised of 2nd day guys.

scar988
01-03-2007, 10:13 PM
even if we get Whisenhunt I still doubt we go OL in the first. OL if very deep thsi year and a 2nd and 3rd roudner coudl start for us.

iloxygenil
01-03-2007, 11:04 PM
I hope Calvin stays in school.

This would allow us without the temptation of trading up for him to trade Schaub away for whatever the best offer is...which at this point without Calvin in the draft I may want an additional 2nd and 3rd instead of the single #1 pick.

scar988
01-03-2007, 11:34 PM
I hope Calvin stays in school.

This would allow us without the temptation of trading up for him to trade Schaub away for whatever the best offer is...which at this point without Calvin in the draft I may want an additional 2nd and 3rd instead of the single #1 pick.I woudl love to get another first roudner more. I woudl love to get 2 firsts and have a first day of say:
10 - FS Reggie Nelson
17 - DE Quentin Moses
42 - OT Joe Staley
74 - RB Gary Russell

Shiver
01-04-2007, 01:14 AM
I definitely know the OL is a problem, but man, the elite lines in the NFL are comprised of 2nd day guys.

Last year is the primary reason I believe in getting talented line play. the Super Bowl was Seattle vs Pittsburgh. Those two lines had five first round picks, that is 50%, that doesn't even count Marvel Smith who was a high 2nd round pick. Pittsburgh has drafted two of their lineman in the first round, signed another first round guy, have one high 2nd round pick, high 3rd round pick. It's no surprise why they have an elite NFL line. Todd Weiner is our only day one guy, and Wayne Gandy, who is too old to notice it.

BTW

Falcons | Team receives permission to interview Singletary
Wed, 3 Jan 2007 21:35:17 -0800

Steve Wyche, of the Atlanta Journal-Constitution, reports the Atlanta Falcons have received permission to interview San Francisco 49ers assistant head coach Mike Singletary. He will likely meet with team officials within the next week.


We are confirmed to be interviewing Whisenhunt, Rivera, Singletary, Tomlin. All of them are fine by me. As long as we avoid any WCO coach, or college coach, I will be happy.

Whisenhunt has the Georgia connections. Rivera and Singletary both have been involved in Super Bowl victories. Tomlin has a Rich McKay connection.

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 01:48 AM
I want to break free from the 49er connections.

I really like the list that we have put together, it's like Arthur reads the friggin messageboard around here. But how could you hate to have Petrino? He's one of my top choices. The only name on the list that I think is missing is Cam Cameron. But, I'm thinkin we won't have too many meetings...then again...Arthur might take his time this go round...but I hope he just hits it off with one of these guys when they come in and we can just cancel the other ones. I just want to know what kind of OC and DC whoever it is is going to bring in. I want him to come in like a buzzsaw and just hack the crap out of all this pathetic coaching staff we have here. That and all these SUCKY 49er rejects.

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 12:33 PM
Ahhh! All this speculation is killing me. I want to know what's going on! I really just wish there was a way to fast forward a little bit and see who is going to be here and what kind of prospects they are going to draft. I would imagine the draft wouldn't change too much because McKay will still run it, but I'm sure this new coach will look at it somewhat differently allowing different types of players to be looked at. I hope we don't lose our speed kills mentality on the edges, but I want some mammoths on the lines.

Shiver
01-04-2007, 12:35 PM
I want to break free from the 49er connections.

I really like the list that we have put together, it's like Arthur reads the friggin messageboard around here. But how could you hate to have Petrino? He's one of my top choices. The only name on the list that I think is missing is Cam Cameron. But, I'm thinkin we won't have too many meetings...then again...Arthur might take his time this go round...but I hope he just hits it off with one of these guys when they come in and we can just cancel the other ones. I just want to know what kind of OC and DC whoever it is is going to bring in. I want him to come in like a buzzsaw and just hack the crap out of all this pathetic coaching staff we have here. That and all these SUCKY 49er rejects.

The only 49er I wouldn't mind is Mike Singletary. He's tough, everywhere he's gone he's had tremendous success, he brings authority that only a Hall of Fame, Super Bowl winner can bring. He was the Ravens LB coach, then assistant head coach for the overachieving 49ers who actually had a better record than we did.

SimonRath
01-04-2007, 01:27 PM
Ok. if we dont trade up to get my man Calvin Johnson.. what you guys think abotu picking up Jeff Samardzija in the second round if he falls to us?

scar988
01-04-2007, 01:50 PM
Ok. if we dont trade up to get my man Calvin Johnson.. what you guys think abotu picking up Jeff Samardzija in the second round if he falls to us?IMO he isn't worth a first day pick with his questionable commitment to either sport.

bearsfan_51
01-04-2007, 02:03 PM
I want to break free from the 49er connections.

I really like the list that we have put together, it's like Arthur reads the friggin messageboard around here. But how could you hate to have Petrino? He's one of my top choices. The only name on the list that I think is missing is Cam Cameron. But, I'm thinkin we won't have too many meetings...then again...Arthur might take his time this go round...but I hope he just hits it off with one of these guys when they come in and we can just cancel the other ones. I just want to know what kind of OC and DC whoever it is is going to bring in. I want him to come in like a buzzsaw and just hack the crap out of all this pathetic coaching staff we have here. That and all these SUCKY 49er rejects.

The only 49er I wouldn't mind is Mike Singletary. He's tough, everywhere he's gone he's had tremendous success, he brings authority that only a Hall of Fame, Super Bowl winner can bring. He was the Ravens LB coach, then assistant head coach for the overachieving 49ers who actually had a better record than we did.
Singletary would be a terrible hire for the Falcons, IMO. According to Cold Pizza he's the front-runner.

Shiver
01-04-2007, 02:03 PM
If we get a 2nd round receiver, I would hope it would be Dwayne Bowe.

scar988
01-04-2007, 02:05 PM
Singletary would be a terrible hire for the Falcons, IMO. According to Cold Pizza he's the front-runner.why? he coudl put in a good scheme defensively and he could easily find a good OC for us.

bearsfan_51
01-04-2007, 02:09 PM
Singletary would be a terrible hire for the Falcons, IMO. According to Cold Pizza he's the front-runner.why? he coudl put in a good scheme defensively and he could easily find a good OC for us.
From where? Singletary has never been around a good offensive coach. Not as a player, not as a coach. I think his actually experience and success as a coach is drastically overrated, and while I think he could be a decent fit in some places (Lions last year) I don't think he would have a clue what to do with Michael Vick, or who to find that could do something with him.

At least in the case of Rivera, the Falcons defense is suited for the cover 2, Rivera has experience as a playcaller, and he's been in an organization and under coaches that understand dynamic offenses (Andy Reid).

Shiver
01-04-2007, 02:13 PM
According to NFL Total Access, Whisenhunt is the front-runner. Apparently, after toughness and resume, whoever sells McKay and Blank on their plan for Vick will get the job.

scar988
01-04-2007, 02:14 PM
Singletary would be a terrible hire for the Falcons, IMO. According to Cold Pizza he's the front-runner.why? he coudl put in a good scheme defensively and he could easily find a good OC for us.
From where? Singletary has never been around a good offensive coach. Not as a player, not as a coach. I think his actually experience and success as a coach is drastically overrated, and while I think he could be a decent fit in some places (Lions last year) I don't think he would have a clue what to do with Michael Vick, or who to find that could do something with him.

At least in the case of Rivera, the Falcons defense is suited for the cover 2, Rivera has experience as a playcaller, and he's been in an organization and under coaches that understand dynamic offenses (Andy Reid).
Brian Billick is one of the best offensive minds in the recent century and he was a coach under him. IMO he could bring in a defense like the 4-3 they ran in 85 and would be a good HC for us thorough his motivation and IMO would be a good locker room officer as well as a guy who woudl hire 2 good schemers. I could see Donnie Henderson coming in as the dC if Singletary came in.

Shiver
01-04-2007, 02:24 PM
This speculation is killing me!

Shiver
01-04-2007, 02:42 PM
Cowher stepping down definitely affects us, in a negative way. Now Whisenhunt has to choose between Pittsburgh and Atlanta.

D-Rod
01-04-2007, 02:50 PM
Cowher stepping down definitely affects us, in a negative way. Now Whisenhunt has to choose between Pittsburgh and Atlanta.

was always going to happen. however, i suspect that grimm may actually have a better chance to be steeler HC. he has much longer ties to the organisation than Whiz. however, it's going to be close.

as to singletary, i think he could be a great HC. this is my vision: the HC doesn't HAVE to be the guy calling the plays, or coming up with technical schemes. that is the role of the coordinators (though S could definitely have impact on the D).

the head coach IS the team. the team takes on his persona. he works with guys in training, pushes them to excel. would you like the falcons to take on the personality of singletary? hell yes. all he needs is some good coordinators; that is another thing altogether.

we shall have to see. it's nice to have something to think about other than the crapness of last season.

SimonRath
01-04-2007, 03:00 PM
Ok. if we dont trade up to get my man Calvin Johnson.. what you guys think abotu picking up Jeff Samardzija in the second round if he falls to us?IMO he isn't worth a first day pick with his questionable commitment to either sport.

i forgot about his baseball life... nevermind

SimonRath
01-04-2007, 03:04 PM
How about these late round WR's:

Matt Trannon-Michigan State
Rhema McKnight-Notre Dame
Dallas Baker-Florida
Steve Breston-Michigan

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 03:06 PM
I don't want to try to promote someone who is going to have such a HUGE learning curve for the HC position. I like him, and I wouldn't mind him coming in to be the LB coach here, because, well...he's amazing. Anyway, he's already got that job, I just don't want to elevate him. I'm looking forward to seeing who comes in here, but Whisenhunt is DEFINITELY the TOP choice in my book. He's the man to guide Vick to the Hall of Fame and us to the Super Bowl.

Whisenhunt is not going to choose Pitt over ATL. He is going to have the chance to have the best owner in the NFL and the best facilities. He's going to be the one leading us to the promised land. I didn't want to pick a favorite until our coach was decided, but I'm really getting my hopes up that he sells Blank. He and Ron Rivera are my two favorites...I think the DC up in Pitt is going to get that job.

SimonRath
01-04-2007, 03:08 PM
What positions do you think the Falcons need to address in the draft?

Jonathan_VIlma
01-04-2007, 03:08 PM
I've read that the Falcons are interested in our first year offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer, because they think his offense fits Vick.

It contains a lot of motion, and a very uptempo style of play, which includes a lot of fakes. The problem is, that you have to be terribly smart to pick up all the plays, and the motion fakes, and have the smarts to run it, since a lot of the calls happen to be the quarterbacks on.

The nature of the offense fits Vick, but I'm not sure he's smart enough to run it.Vick has the intelligence to run it. people think that just because Vick talks like a gangster that he is stupid. the man has average intelligence. HE coudl pick up the scheme. As long as he is allowed to audible some as well that would be huge. Knapp didn't want anyone to audible. not even when he had Steve Young or Jeff Garcia.
I never said that Vick was stupid, I just said he wasn't smart enough. All I've heard since Mora has been there is that the "West Coast Offense takes time."

Sorry but offensive systems don't take that long. If the west coast offense took that long for Vick to absorb and he still struggles, then he'll struggle even more in a playbook in which I've seen one play repeated all season, which is a quick swing WR screen.

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 03:12 PM
How about these late round WR's:

Matt Trannon-Michigan State
Rhema McKnight-Notre Dame
Dallas Baker-Florida
Steve Breston-Michigan
How bout that Tomlinson kid from Navy.

I know he hasn't done a whole lot of pass catching, but I saw him make some catches that would make CJ jealous when I was watching their bowl game...not to mention he's prolly the best blocking WR in this draft, due to the offense he's been running. I really wouldn't mind him at all, he's a sleeper favorite of mine.

scar988
01-04-2007, 03:13 PM
I never said that Vick was stupid, I just said he wasn't smart enough. All I've heard since Mora has been there is that the "West Coast Offense takes time."

Sorry but offensive systems don't take that long. If the west coast offense took that long for Vick to absorb and he still struggles, then he'll struggle even more in a playbook in which I've seen one play repeated all season, which is a quick swing WR screen.
the WCO takes 3-5 years. even Steve Young took that long to learn it. so yeah, he picks us schemes pretty fast since he had a good command for it in the 2nd year.

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 03:14 PM
I've read that the Falcons are interested in our first year offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer, because they think his offense fits Vick.

It contains a lot of motion, and a very uptempo style of play, which includes a lot of fakes. The problem is, that you have to be terribly smart to pick up all the plays, and the motion fakes, and have the smarts to run it, since a lot of the calls happen to be the quarterbacks on.

The nature of the offense fits Vick, but I'm not sure he's smart enough to run it.Vick has the intelligence to run it. people think that just because Vick talks like a gangster that he is stupid. the man has average intelligence. HE coudl pick up the scheme. As long as he is allowed to audible some as well that would be huge. Knapp didn't want anyone to audible. not even when he had Steve Young or Jeff Garcia.
I never said that Vick was stupid, I just said he wasn't smart enough. All I've heard since Mora has been there is that the "West Coast Offense takes time."

Sorry but offensive systems don't take that long. If the west coast offense took that long for Vick to absorb and he still struggles, then he'll struggle even more in a playbook in which I've seen one play repeated all season, which is a quick swing WR screen.
Actually they do...look at all the great QBs, 3-5 years before they caught on, AND they had better playcalling and route design.

So, you lose.

Vick is plenty smart, he went to Virginia Tech, not Georgia Southern. He has been handcuffed and unable to audible, I think you're going to see plenty of audibles and checks, and our offense is going to flourish. Vick wont become pass hungry trying to force things because if he sees it then he can change the play, and we all know he loves to run, so he's not afraid to switch from pass to run. It'll be great.

Shiver
01-04-2007, 05:05 PM
I wouldn't be surprised if Rich McKay goes for someone he knows. Jim Caldwell is the Assistant HC for the Indianapolis Colts, and Quarterback coach, he served the same function in Tampa Bay with McKay. Mike Tomlin is another guy; he's a hot commodity, considering how improved the Vikings defense was this year. Both have the Rich McKay connection. Jim Caldwell, Ken Whisenhunt and Cam Cameron all have wonderful offensive pedigrees. I think that is what is needed.

Whisenhunt interviewed today
Cameron will interview this week
Caldwell can't be interviewed until next week


Those are the three I like.

SimonRath
01-04-2007, 05:33 PM
How about Andre Caldwell in the mid to late rounds?? he's 6'1" 206.. he's got a nice size, an catch and is frickin fast...

SimonRath
01-04-2007, 05:38 PM
Who would you rather have LaRon Landry or Reggie Nelson..... I'd say LaRon Landry all the way

Shiver
01-04-2007, 05:48 PM
I have finally settled on the coach I want;

http://www.colts.com/images%5Cnews_photos%5Cfeature/2005_caldwell_jim1.jpg

1. His impressive resume; He's been the QB coach of the best QB in the league. The Assistant Head Coach to the most winning team in the NFL.

2. Michael Vick; he told Cris Carter how much he wanted to be like Peyton Manning, in how the offense is ran. He always had a problem with Greg Knapp's offense, constantly asking to run a more free, up tempo approach. If Jim Caldwell cannot make Michael Vick live up to his talent, no one can.

3. Scheme wise, we have the talent to live up to his scheme. The only thing were missing is a Tarik Glenn type of elite LT. The Colts run a very similar run scheme as we already do. If Caldwell got the receivers and Vick live up to talent level, we'd have an elite offense.

4. It's all about connections! Jim Caldwell was in Tampa Bay, with Tony Dungy, under Rich McKay. Rich knows Jim and can trust him.

We cannot interview him until next week, per NFL rules.

Shiver
01-04-2007, 06:15 PM
This just on NFL Total Access; Alex Gibbs is stepping away, and finally retiring. The only roadblock to a OL pick is gone now.

scar988
01-04-2007, 07:50 PM
This just on NFL Total Access; Alex Gibbs is stepping away, and finally retiring. The only roadblock to a OL pick is gone now.I hope we keep the basic ideals of a ZBS though. like the colts have. I just don't really thing we need a first roudn pick at OL. I think we need a guy in the 2nd like Staley.

01-04-2007, 07:55 PM
This just on NFL Total Access; Alex Gibbs is stepping away, and finally retiring. The only roadblock to a OL pick is gone now.I hope we keep the basic ideals of a ZBS though. like the colts have. I just don't really thing we need a first roudn pick at OL. I think we need a guy in the 2nd like Staley.

Since when did the Colts use a ZBS?

scar988
01-04-2007, 08:19 PM
This just on NFL Total Access; Alex Gibbs is stepping away, and finally retiring. The only roadblock to a OL pick is gone now.I hope we keep the basic ideals of a ZBS though. like the colts have. I just don't really thing we need a first roudn pick at OL. I think we need a guy in the 2nd like Staley.

Since when did the Colts use a ZBS?the colts run a zone stretch play a a big part of their running attack. They have used it since they got Edgerrin James. He ran in in Miami with the ZBS in Miami and their attack fits the basic ideals of it. they don't use the cut block but they do use a ZBS.

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 08:27 PM
Who would you rather have LaRon Landry or Reggie Nelson..... I'd say LaRon Landry all the way
If we needed a Strong Safety sure...but we don't...we need a Free Safety...that's why Nelson is the pick.

bearsfan_51
01-04-2007, 08:39 PM
Who would you rather have LaRon Landry or Reggie Nelson..... I'd say LaRon Landry all the way
If we needed a Strong Safety sure...but we don't...we need a Free Safety...that's why Nelson is the pick.
You need both.

iloxygenil
01-04-2007, 10:03 PM
Who would you rather have LaRon Landry or Reggie Nelson..... I'd say LaRon Landry all the way
If we needed a Strong Safety sure...but we don't...we need a Free Safety...that's why Nelson is the pick.
You need both.
And that's why you're not a Falcons fan, and that's why you don't what we need as much as I do. The Falcons have 2 Strong Safetys on the roster already that are very capable...Milloy and Crocker. Crocker is not a Free Safety he was playing out of position all season long. We only need a Free Safety, so stick to the Bears.

scar988
01-04-2007, 10:05 PM
Who would you rather have LaRon Landry or Reggie Nelson..... I'd say LaRon Landry all the way
If we needed a Strong Safety sure...but we don't...we need a Free Safety...that's why Nelson is the pick.
You need both.
And that's why you're not a Falcons fan, and that's why you don't what we need as much as I do. The Falcons have 2 Strong Safetys on the roster already that are very capable...Milloy and Crocker. Crocker is not a Free Safety he was playing out of position all season long. We only need a Free Safety, so stick to the Bears.if Milloy retires then we would need a new SS but Milloy only has one year left and IMO if we move to a Tampa 2 that one year will move to a none and we will sign a guy like Hamlin for our SS spot and then draft a guy like Nelson.

iloxygenil
01-05-2007, 01:20 AM
Who would you rather have LaRon Landry or Reggie Nelson..... I'd say LaRon Landry all the way
If we needed a Strong Safety sure...but we don't...we need a Free Safety...that's why Nelson is the pick.
You need both.
And that's why you're not a Falcons fan, and that's why you don't what we need as much as I do. The Falcons have 2 Strong Safetys on the roster already that are very capable...Milloy and Crocker. Crocker is not a Free Safety he was playing out of position all season long. We only need a Free Safety, so stick to the Bears.if Milloy retires then we would need a new SS but Milloy only has one year left and IMO if we move to a Tampa 2 that one year will move to a none and we will sign a guy like Hamlin for our SS spot and then draft a guy like Nelson.
But Crocker is a Strong Safety. I think he has the speed and tackling ability to make it as a SS, but as a FS, he just couldn't cover the ground, he didn't know what he was doing well enough in space, as a SS he wouldn't be required to do as much of that and would be able to help us in run support how Milloy does now, which I think he'd be very good at, also can lay a guy out on a short slant, which we need, Milloy doesn't seem to good at doing that.

Shiver
01-05-2007, 01:51 AM
I'm with BF51, we need both. Milloy is only a 4th linebacker at this point. Chris Crocker cannot cover if his job, and it is, dependent on it.

Shiver
01-05-2007, 02:38 AM
The coveted coordinator (Whisenhunt) interviewed Thursday with Atlanta Falcons officials in a session that sources said left both sides very impressed.


Whisenhunt, Cameron, Caldwell are my top-3. In my opinion, a offensive coach who can reinvigorate the talent on that side of the ball is needed.

iloxygenil
01-05-2007, 10:54 AM
The coveted coordinator (Whisenhunt) interviewed Thursday with Atlanta Falcons officials in a session that sources said left both sides very impressed.


Whisenhunt, Cameron, Caldwell are my top-3. In my opinion, a offensive coach who can reinvigorate the talent on that side of the ball is needed.
I am glad to hear that! I really like him and I really want to land him here...why do we have to have all these rules about you have to interview a certain number of candidates and all...I mean I know you want it to be fair, but once you find your guy you're going to hire him no matter what, so why waste the other people's time? If I knew I was only being interviewed as a formality I wouldn't even want to come.

I think Crocker would be a fine SS. But a long time ago I talked about Aaron Rouse coming in as a SS. If he's there in the 3rd round, which I anticipate he will be, I think he'd be a good choice, if Ben Grubbs is already gone. I really think if we could get a 2nd and 3rd for Schaub along with a pick next year based on his playing time, that we'd be better off than if we got another first round pick. Because with the additional 2nd and 3rd we could make sure we land the players we want more than likely. For instance we could get Joe Staley in the 2nd, but still also spend a 2nd round pick on a guy like Ben Grubbs, if we don't expect him to fall to the third, or if we find someone who slips (like Jimmy last year) we could make it happen. Then with the extra 3rd we could get Aaron Rouse and an additional guy like maybe a solid RB.

iloxygenil
01-05-2007, 03:27 PM
If Atlanta gets Whisenhunt as a head coach, who then becomes our Antwaan Randle El? We're going to need one, so who will it be? Could the answer be the dreaded one? Teddy Ginn...

I know I know we don't want to take him @ 10, but if we get a 1st and 3rd for Schaub, and it's the #17 from Jacksonville do we take Nelson @10 and Ginn @17? I love his speed, and I love his open field ability and ESPECIALLY love having a return threat on this team. Could it be that he would fit that role?

Shiver
01-05-2007, 03:41 PM
If Atlanta gets Whisenhunt as a head coach, who then becomes our Antwaan Randle El? We're going to need one, so who will it be? Could the answer be the dreaded one? Teddy Ginn...

Ted Ginn doesn't fit that role. What made Randel-El dangerous was his passing potential in trick plays, Ginn doesn't have that.

I know I know we don't want to take him @ 10, but if we get a 1st and 3rd for Schaub, and it's the #17 from Jacksonville do we take Nelson @10 and Ginn @17? I love his speed, and I love his open field ability and ESPECIALLY love having a return threat on this team. Could it be that he would fit that role?

:shock:

That isn't going to happen.

Shiver
01-05-2007, 03:48 PM
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a123/GrammarGangster/coaches.jpg


:lol:

scar988
01-05-2007, 05:34 PM
If Atlanta gets Whisenhunt as a head coach, who then becomes our Antwaan Randle El? We're going to need one, so who will it be? Could the answer be the dreaded one? Teddy Ginn...

I know I know we don't want to take him @ 10, but if we get a 1st and 3rd for Schaub, and it's the #17 from Jacksonville do we take Nelson @10 and Ginn @17? I love his speed, and I love his open field ability and ESPECIALLY love having a return threat on this team. Could it be that he would fit that role?Ginn is a 2nd rounder on draft day. mark my words.

iloxygenil
01-05-2007, 06:08 PM
If Atlanta gets Whisenhunt as a head coach, who then becomes our Antwaan Randle El? We're going to need one, so who will it be? Could the answer be the dreaded one? Teddy Ginn...

I know I know we don't want to take him @ 10, but if we get a 1st and 3rd for Schaub, and it's the #17 from Jacksonville do we take Nelson @10 and Ginn @17? I love his speed, and I love his open field ability and ESPECIALLY love having a return threat on this team. Could it be that he would fit that role?Ginn is a 2nd rounder on draft day. mark my words.

I have to say that I agree, but at the same time, that 40 number could really open up some people to really want him. I hope he doesn't run up to his potential on that day so we do get a shot at him.

Shiver have you forgotten that the tender offer will be a 1st and 3rd if we don't change that? If it is a mid first rounder I would expect a 3rd rounder to come along with it.

Bucky
01-05-2007, 06:49 PM
You guys can't expect to actually get a first and a third can you? If you don't compromise that i'm afraid to tell you that you will lose him for nothing nest year

Shiver
01-05-2007, 07:01 PM
You guys can't expect to actually get a first and a third can you? If you don't compromise that i'm afraid to tell you that you will lose him for nothing nest year

Not I.

frogstomp
01-05-2007, 07:45 PM
If Atlanta gets Whisenhunt as a head coach, who then becomes our Antwaan Randle El? We're going to need one, so who will it be? Could the answer be the dreaded one? Teddy Ginn...

I know I know we don't want to take him @ 10, but if we get a 1st and 3rd for Schaub, and it's the #17 from Jacksonville do we take Nelson @10 and Ginn @17? I love his speed, and I love his open field ability and ESPECIALLY love having a return threat on this team. Could it be that he would fit that role?Ginn is a 2nd rounder on draft day. mark my words.

I have to say that I agree, but at the same time, that 40 number could really open up some people to really want him. I hope he doesn't run up to his potential on that day so we do get a shot at him.

Shiver have you forgotten that the tender offer will be a 1st and 3rd if we don't change that? If it is a mid first rounder I would expect a 3rd rounder to come along with it.

You're lucky to get a first, nevermind included with something else.

njx9
01-05-2007, 07:51 PM
wouldn't it be more beneficial to your team, as i've read things, to try to trade schaub and whatever else it would take for a decent LT? even if you drafted a guy in april, it's likely that vick is 29 before he's really turning into a stud. why not try to trade a QB to a desperate team for a 2nd or 3rd year LT who could be great sooner?

i only ask because it seems unlikely that you'll have a top five pick and be able to secure an instant stud and further unlikely that the team will trip, fall, and find another mcneill.

scar988
01-05-2007, 09:08 PM
wouldn't it be more beneficial to your team, as i've read things, to try to trade schaub and whatever else it would take for a decent LT? even if you drafted a guy in april, it's likely that vick is 29 before he's really turning into a stud. why not try to trade a QB to a desperate team for a 2nd or 3rd year LT who could be great sooner?

i only ask because it seems unlikely that you'll have a top five pick and be able to secure an instant stud and further unlikely that the team will trip, fall, and find another mcneill.well most tackles start out just fine.

iloxygenil
01-05-2007, 11:51 PM
1st and 3rd is what it takes from the highest tender. I couldn't care less what you armchair GMs say about what Schaub's value is. It means nothing more than what I think, but you'll never tell me my opinion is wrong, especially when it's based on fact. A middle first and middle 3rd isn't too much to give up for a franchise type QB. So, until the speculation ends and we get what we can for him, don't tell me I'm wrong to think we'll get a first and third. Especially since that's what the NFL set up for compensation for a Restricted Free Agent signed to the max tender.

That being said...any news on how the interviews went compared to Whisenhunt's yesterday which left both sides "very impressed"

Shiver
01-06-2007, 12:43 AM
wouldn't it be more beneficial to your team, as i've read things, to try to trade schaub and whatever else it would take for a decent LT? even if you drafted a guy in april, it's likely that vick is 29 before he's really turning into a stud. why not try to trade a QB to a desperate team for a 2nd or 3rd year LT who could be great sooner?

i only ask because it seems unlikely that you'll have a top five pick and be able to secure an instant stud and further unlikely that the team will trip, fall, and find another mcneill.

I am trying to ignore all the Schaub stuff until something actually happens. My mind can only handle so much speculation. :lol: Although thinking of this, I would love to do that. However; how many teams have a young LTs are teams willing to trade away?

Although most Tackles start right away and play okay, which is better than a 36-year old LT that was getting owned week in and out.

DraftMichaelHuff
01-06-2007, 12:53 AM
I agree with the notion that we need 2 safeties and my two favourite players in the draft this year Rouse and Nelson would be ideal. Crocker was aquired for a 4th which in many cases is used to draft a player used for depth in m,any NFL teams, so i say draft the two safeties see them light a fire under Milloy and Crocker, if they cant match it with the young guys they can become great depth. I belive that with the two safetys drafted Nelson would beat out Crocker in TC but ROuse would be held back and learn from Milloy for a year. Imagine Hall Nelson Rouse Williams all under 24 for the next 7-8 years

I also agree that a 2nd and 3rd just might be better than an additional 1st for Shaub judging by the depth at our postions of need in the draft imagine Nelson, then Staley and Charles Johnson in the 2nd followed by Rouse and a HB TE or OG in the 3rd plus a possible compensatory pick in the 3rd, that would be a great oppurtunity for the new HC to set up his plan

Also as the draft nears am i being real in thinkin staley could still be there by our 2nd pick?

Finally im getting confused about who to support for the head coaching job, I liked Wisenhunt but his style at the steelers was more of a power running game which our Rb's and O line arent build for, will he adapt it? I like the run and shoot style O for Vick but it seems Whis mainly used I formation with 2 rbs? Cameron, i also like but i cant tell if it is him or his players that make the other one good if that makes sense? Also did anyone else here Dan Reeves today talking about how hed love to coach vick again?
What about Whis (operating like sean payton, calling the plays) as HC
Reeves OC and Rob Ryan DC, who makes a lateral move from an almost perenial celler dweller and presses and blitzes the hell out of everyone? thoughts

Shiver
01-06-2007, 01:14 AM
Whisenhunt's style is more akin to what Reeves did with Vick. That is, play-action, throwing vertically down the field. That is, let Vick do what he was very comfortable doing in '02, throwing the deep dig, skinny post, and crossing routes. The only thing is to succeed in that offense we would need a new Left side of the O-Line, and maybe a low-price bruiser back to rotate in with our current ensemble. On defense we don't need much, just a new FS. I think Milloy could suffice for one more season, he wasn't the one getting beat deep, as long as we don't put that role on him he'd be alright as a stop gap in the box strong safety.

I think Cameron and Caldwell would bring in offenses probably mesh with our players right away better than Whisenhunt's offensive styling. However, McKay already said that scheme isn't going to be a deciding factor in the hire, instead the candidate's credentials are. Overall I would like Whisenhunt, but if he goes back to Pittsburgh I wouldn't cry over it. He's a very good candidate, but this year has a lot of good ones, offensive minded and defensive minded.

DraftMichaelHuff
01-06-2007, 01:23 AM
Cool man so maybe Whis, Reeves could work well together with the offense as they appear to have similiar styles. Also do you think Rob Ryan would make a lateral move from the raiders or only for a HC?
I cant tell you how happy id be to have Nelson start at FS and see Aaron Rouse(all 6'4 226 of him) learn for a year under one of the best SS of the past 5-10 years
When you say left side of the line and FS would perhaps
1st FS Nelson
2nd LTStaley
2nd B-(from Shaub) DE Charles Johnson
3rd Aaron Rouse
3rd (b from shaub and/or compensatory) LG Ben Grubbs/ Mansfeild Wrotto
seem ideal/realistic to your line of thought as well?

Or perhaps go all out for a guy like Eric Steinbach

Shiver
01-06-2007, 01:29 AM
Nah, no Reeves. He would love to coach Michael Vick again, but it isn't going to happen.

Shiver
01-06-2007, 01:30 AM
Falcons diligent in search for next coach

By STEVE WYCHE
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution
Published on: 01/07/07

The Falcons wrapped up the first week of their coaching search deciding whether one of the four candidates they interviewed the past four days was impressive enough to hire or if they need to dig deeper.

Team president and general manager Rich McKay and owner Arthur Blank, who promised due diligence in finding Jim Mora's successor, moved quickly and judiciously in staking their course of action. They have been stealth in their dealings, declining to speak to the media since charting their plan in generalities at a news conference Monday after announcing Mora's termination.

"I don't want you to have the impression that in the next 48 hours, five days or 10 days that we will have a head coach in place," McKay, who has not been available for comment, said Monday. "It is the most important decision we make as a franchise and one that we do not take lightly."

So far, the Falcons have interviewed the hot assistant coaches: Ken Whisenhunt (Pittsburgh offensive coordinator), Ron Rivera (Chicago defensive coordinator), Cam Cameron (San Diego offensive coordinator) and Mike Singletary (San Francisco assistant head coach); candidates who have drawn the attention of most of the four other teams who either fired their coaches or whose coaches resigned this past week.

Atlanta, Miami, Oakland, Arizona and Pittsburgh all have head coach vacancies.

There is no indication that the Falcons would approach one of a few former head coaches currently out of work or working as assistant coaches — Mike Sherman, Mike Martz or Steve Mariucci. Instead, their lot seems cast toward a young, promising assistant, who, if successful, could stick around for years and grow with a roster that, for the most part, is in its athletic prime — a candidate much like Mora was three years ago when he was given his break to become a head coach for the first time.

Possible candidates who have not been interviewed could include Minnesota defensive coordinator Mike Tomlin, who worked with McKay in Tampa, New York Giants defensive coordinator Tim Lewis, and Tennessee Titans offensive coordinator Norm Chow, who, at 60, might be the oldest prospect on the radar.

With Blank eager to win a Super Bowl, it is not out of the realm of possibility that he could try to lure a coach under contract to Atlanta. Bill Cowher, who resigned but still has his rights retained by the Steelers for a year, Tennessee's Jeff Fisher and Indianapolis coach Tony Dungy are ideal candidates with big-time credentials.

It could be costly, as compensation — draft picks and cash — would be in order, as well as a big contract to the targeted coach. Money isn't an issue with Blank, though, who has lavished his franchise.

However, parting with draft picks — the Falcons have the No. 10 selection in the first two rounds — could be hard to justify, since the roster is flawed and a new coach would want to augment personnel.

McKay went through such a high-stakes swap in 2002, when Tampa Bay parted with $8 million and four first- and second-round draft picks to secure coach Jon Gruden from Oakland. McKay left the Buccaneers shortly thereafter for the Falcons.

Representatives for some of the coaching candidates said the Falcons forsaking on-field talent for a coach seems highly unlikely.

http://www.ajc.com/falcons/content/sports/falcons/stories/2007/01/05/0107falconssearch.html

I assume next week on the dockett is Jim Caldwell and Brian Schottenheimer as well, per NFL rules we can't talk to them until next week. They are two names I've heard come up as well. I haven't heard Tim Lewis until now, he definitely isn't someone I would want.

iloxygenil
01-06-2007, 01:56 AM
I think we're just taking our time with Whisenhunt, I think he pretty much locked it up, but I really like the idea of having the Bears defense in Atlanta...wow...imagine Vick working opposite a defense who got him the ball back 4+ times a game, and didn't allow anything. I think we could be looking at something truly amazing if that happens.

Shiver
01-06-2007, 02:10 AM
The thing about Whisenhunt; I think if he can get the Pittsburgh job he'll take that, with us next on the list, Arizona after that, etcetera. He could've bolted last year, but didn't, maybe because he knew he would have a crack at that sweet gig.

I would love Rivera, but only if he brings along a great OC.

scar988
01-06-2007, 02:13 AM
The thing about Whisenhunt; I think if he can get the Pittsburgh job he'll take that, with us next on the list, Arizona after that, etcetera. He could've bolted last year, but didn't, maybe because he knew he would have a crack at that sweet gig.

I would love Rivera, but only if he brings along a great OC.I think Whisenhunt wants to come back to GA. this is his dream job according to his former coaches.

Shiver
01-06-2007, 02:14 AM
Quote?

scar988
01-06-2007, 02:28 AM
Quote?I don't have one. that is just the rumor that has been floating around because of his GA roots (HS, college and pro player in GA and grew up here and is a metro ATL native)

Shiver
01-06-2007, 02:35 AM
Oh, your post made it out as if there was some tangible. I understand that, going home is big time motivation. Which is the only reason we even stand a chance in competing with Pittsburgh for him. After all, Blank fired Mora with a above .500 record after three seasons, while Pittsburgh has had two coaches in the modern football era. I would say there is a bit more pressure here, with Blank, than the Rooney family in Pittsburgh.

ATLDirtyBirds
01-06-2007, 07:59 AM
Too bad we'd have to give up alot for Dungy. He's exactly what I'd want here.

SimonRath
01-06-2007, 01:26 PM
if we cant get Calvin Johnson then i want Robert Mechem

Shiver
01-06-2007, 01:29 PM
I say we just sign a veteran, and get Roddy and MJ to mature. If that happens, with another year with Vick, we'll improve by default.

SimonRath
01-06-2007, 01:37 PM
I say we just sign a veteran, and get Roddy and MJ to mature.

like who would we sign?? Calvin will be the best choice but Robert is frickin good also

Shiver
01-06-2007, 01:39 PM
Adding another talented, but raw, rookie isn't going to help who we already have. MJ and Roddy have plenty of talent and have flashed it sporadically. We need them to develop, not panic and draft another receiver. As for which veteran; I don't really know the FA market that well. Although I am sure someone like an Eric Moulds will be out there.

SimonRath
01-06-2007, 01:42 PM
Adding another talented, but raw, rookie isn't going to help who we already have. MJ and Roddy have plenty of talent and have flashed it sporadically. We need them to develop, not panic and draft another receiver. As for which veteran; I don't really know the FA market that well. Although I am sure someone like an Eric Moulds will be out there.

We have given MJ plenty of chances... i say we make him like #3 0r #4... we do get Brian back so that will help a frickin lot

scar988
01-06-2007, 02:03 PM
I say we just sign a veteran, and get Roddy and MJ to mature.

like who would we sign?? Calvin will be the best choice but Robert is frickin good also
well I woudl do this for our WR situation:
cut Ashley Lelie.
hire Terence Mathis for WR coach to teach our WR's how to play the position right
draft Dallas Baker or Rhema McKnight in the 4th round to be our #4 WR.
use them liek this:

1) Roddy White (in a deep passing attack would be amazing. has great work ethic and his hands coudl be corrected by next year)
2) Jenkins
3) Finneran
4) Baker/McKnight
5) Jennings

SimonRath
01-06-2007, 03:51 PM
I say we just sign a veteran, and get Roddy and MJ to mature.

like who would we sign?? Calvin will be the best choice but Robert is frickin good also
well I woudl do this for our WR situation:
cut Ashley Lelie.
hire Terence Mathis for WR coach to teach our WR's how to play the position right
draft Dallas Baker or Rhema McKnight in the 4th round to be our #4 WR.
use them liek this:

1) Roddy White (in a deep passing attack would be amazing. has great work ethic and his hands coudl be corrected by next year)
2) Jenkins
3) Finneran
4) Baker/McKnight
5) Jennings

Close but no cigar

here's what I'd do

1. Again Hire Terence Mathis as WR coach
2. Cut Ashley Lelie
3. Try hard to trade up and get Calvin Johnson
4. If cant trade up then get a guy like Meachem(only if you can get him in the late rounds), McKnight, Breston, Trannon

so it would be
1)Calvin Johnson
2)Roddy White
3)Michael Jenkins/Brian Finneran
4)Jennings

DraftMichaelHuff
01-06-2007, 05:36 PM
As stupid as it sounds i see no problem with our WR situation as long as a new coach is signed like Terrance Moore, I really love the upsideof Roddy White evidenced on numerous plays last year and the potential to MJ to be a consistant target with the help of new coaching.

Also Whats with the push to cut Lelie? i agree that we dont overpay him but in a deep passing attack, say a 4 WR set with Alge Split in one slot imagine MJ and Alge doin intermediate and Roddy and Lelie on deep honestly i love the potential of out WR and would like it to stay unless there is a way to trade for Calvin that appears lopsided in our favour

iloxygenil
01-06-2007, 06:32 PM
Watching the Philly game made it just amazingly apparent to me that our WRs are just poorly coached. I've haded George Stewart for a long time, but our WRs don't up and fight for the ball they wait for it to get to them I am worried that cant be corrected. Calvin Johnson doesn't have that problem and he's EXTREMELY polished in blocking and going up and making the catch. I want him here if he declares and I hope he does in some way, because we have the leverage to move up to get him, but at the same time I don't want him because I want Reggie Nelson SO bad and I think we can help our team get where they need with this year's draft.

SimonRath
01-06-2007, 07:14 PM
Watching the Philly game made it just amazingly apparent to me that our WRs are just poorly coached. I've haded George Stewart for a long time, but our WRs don't up and fight for the ball they wait for it to get to them I am worried that cant be corrected. Calvin Johnson doesn't have that problem and he's EXTREMELY polished in blocking and going up and making the catch. I want him here if he declares and I hope he does in some way, because we have the leverage to move up to get him, but at the same time I don't want him because I want Reggie Nelson SO bad and I think we can help our team get where they need with this year's draft.

As i have been sayin we need Calvin.. of course about everyone has been sayin that...

iloxygenil
01-06-2007, 09:26 PM
Watching the Philly game made it just amazingly apparent to me that our WRs are just poorly coached. I've haded George Stewart for a long time, but our WRs don't up and fight for the ball they wait for it to get to them I am worried that cant be corrected. Calvin Johnson doesn't have that problem and he's EXTREMELY polished in blocking and going up and making the catch. I want him here if he declares and I hope he does in some way, because we have the leverage to move up to get him, but at the same time I don't want him because I want Reggie Nelson SO bad and I think we can help our team get where they need with this year's draft.

As i have been sayin we need Calvin.. of course about everyone has been sayin that...
Looks like we'll have to wait til next year to get him, just like everyone else. I heard on the stews that he is prolly goin back to school, which he said from the beginning.

ATLDirtyBirds
01-06-2007, 09:31 PM
David Bowe in round 2 ftw!

Shiver
01-06-2007, 10:56 PM
Peter King mentioned Jeff Tedford as a coach that McKay really likes. :roll: I hope that is inaccurate.

Jonathan_VIlma
01-06-2007, 11:34 PM
I've read that the Falcons are interested in our first year offensive coordinator Brian Schottenheimer, because they think his offense fits Vick.

It contains a lot of motion, and a very uptempo style of play, which includes a lot of fakes. The problem is, that you have to be terribly smart to pick up all the plays, and the motion fakes, and have the smarts to run it, since a lot of the calls happen to be the quarterbacks on.

The nature of the offense fits Vick, but I'm not sure he's smart enough to run it.Vick has the intelligence to run it. people think that just because Vick talks like a gangster that he is stupid. the man has average intelligence. HE coudl pick up the scheme. As long as he is allowed to audible some as well that would be huge. Knapp didn't want anyone to audible. not even when he had Steve Young or Jeff Garcia.
I never said that Vick was stupid, I just said he wasn't smart enough. All I've heard since Mora has been there is that the "West Coast Offense takes time."

Sorry but offensive systems don't take that long. If the west coast offense took that long for Vick to absorb and he still struggles, then he'll struggle even more in a playbook in which I've seen one play repeated all season, which is a quick swing WR screen.
Actually they do...look at all the great QBs, 3-5 years before they caught on, AND they had better playcalling and route design.

So, you lose.

Vick is plenty smart, he went to Virginia Tech, not Georgia Southern. He has been handcuffed and unable to audible, I think you're going to see plenty of audibles and checks, and our offense is going to flourish. Vick wont become pass hungry trying to force things because if he sees it then he can change the play, and we all know he loves to run, so he's not afraid to switch from pass to run. It'll be great.
Sorry, but just because Steve Young said so, doesn't mean it's always completely true. Pennington was brilliant in his first year in the West Coast offense. Just because it takes longer to pickup, doesn't mean you can't succeed.

Steve Young more then likely said that because he was the backup behind Montana for years, and after being in the system for so long, he was able to be thrown right into the fire, and adjust as he saw fit because it came easily to him not only physically, but mentally. That doesn't limit your success only one year into the system. The Saints, and Jets are both one year into their offensive and defensive systems and there's plenty of success. I'm sick of these ******** excuses for Vick. He's a hell of a talent, he just makes the wrong play at the wrong time.

Hence why I said if it takes him that long to pickup the West Coast system then he'd sure as hell struggle with Schottenheimer's. Pennington reportedly read up on the system during his rehab, and through every phase of the day while he was at the Jets facility (almost nine hours a day), to understand it completely.

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 12:02 AM
David Bowe in round 2 ftw!
I like the thought of this, but at the same time I hate it. I want David Ball the guy who broke all of Rice's records. I don't care what his 40 times are, he knows how to get in the endzone and knows how to catch the ball that's all I care about, we have all the 40 times we need on this team already.

I like Bowe's build, but he had a lot of random dropsies...and I know everyone gets that, but I just am not 100% on him yet, although I do like him as a prospect. At the same time my ideal draft atm (with getting a 2nd and 3rd for Schaub) goes something more like this...

#10 Reggie Nelson
#42 Joe Staley
(additional 2nd rounder) Charles Johnson / Lamarr Woodley
#74 Aaron Rouse
(additional 3rd rounder) Samson Satelle

scar988
01-07-2007, 12:09 AM
Peter King mentioned Jeff Tedford as a coach that McKay really likes. :roll: I hope that is inaccurate.why? Tedford seems to be pretty good with QB's.

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 12:53 AM
I am so tired of the speculation! Driving me insane! We still got atleast a week or so to go too

yourfavestoner
01-07-2007, 02:29 AM
SOLID SNAKE FTW!!!

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 11:55 AM
I'm wondering if we're waiting to hire Cam from San Diego. We can't sign him until after they are out of the playoffs, so, I think that may have something to do with it. Either him or maybe the Ron Rivera...I hope we haven't eliminated Whisenhunt yet =/ but we'll see before TOO long I hope! AUGH!

Shiver
01-07-2007, 02:56 PM
According to Mort; the Falcons may announce their new HC tommorow!

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 04:43 PM
According to Mort; the Falcons may announce their new HC tommorow!
Wow...it would have to be Whisenhunt wouldn't it? Because we can't take someone else's coach while they are still in the playoffs...right?

D-Rod
01-07-2007, 05:44 PM
if the rumour's correct, then it must be either Whiz or Singletary. Or it could be someone totally out of the blue. But you're right, it can't be Rivera or Cameron.

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 06:46 PM
if the rumour's correct, then it must be either Whiz or Singletary. Or it could be someone totally out of the blue. But you're right, it can't be Rivera or Cameron.
I am praying it's Whis as HC and then we can have Singletary as a DC...ohhhhwow...

SimonRath
01-07-2007, 06:48 PM
if the rumour's correct, then it must be either Whiz or Singletary. Or it could be someone totally out of the blue. But you're right, it can't be Rivera or Cameron.
I am praying it's Whis as HC and then we can have Singletary as a DC...ohhhhwow...

that would kick rear end

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 06:54 PM
if the rumour's correct, then it must be either Whiz or Singletary. Or it could be someone totally out of the blue. But you're right, it can't be Rivera or Cameron.
I am praying it's Whis as HC and then we can have Singletary as a DC...ohhhhwow...

that would kick rear end
That would be the start of a phenomenal coaching staff...I mean wow...amazing coaching staff...or even better, bring the DC from Chicago down here, Rivera, and then have Singletary be the LB coach, in the same position he had in San Fran, except move over to ATL =) Could be cool too..., but that's just wishful thinking

Shiver
01-07-2007, 07:06 PM
I heard Mike Singletary. I read, somewhere I forget, that he really impressed Arthur Blank and he's sold him as he's the man for the job. As long as he gets a good OC, I would be very happy. He is the antithesis of Jim Mora, he would bring a toughness and credibility that was sorely lacking.

DraftMichaelHuff
01-07-2007, 07:08 PM
That will teach me for trying to plan our draft this early, it seems everyday more juniors declare who are rumoured to go higher than the seniors crazy! I definatly like the look of Jamaal Anderson at 6"6 280
Also how does LT Ryan Harris compare with Joe Staley?
This HC stuff is killing me! i really hope singeltary is not the head coach unless he brings with him a killer OC

The Unseen
01-07-2007, 07:36 PM
http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=32825

Draft King
01-07-2007, 07:36 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2723700

Looks like we'll be picking up an offensive genius.

Draft King
01-07-2007, 07:36 PM
http://nfldraftcountdown.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=32825

Damn, posted at the same time.

Draft King
01-07-2007, 07:39 PM
If we pick him up, I'll be pretty happy, I remember reading that he was an offensive genius at Louisville from several posters here and he found ways to dominate on that side of the ball even with his star RB Michael Bush out with an injury.

BehrenMan007
01-07-2007, 08:11 PM
pretty good pickup in petrino...... just hope in two years he doesn't pull a saban.

Number 10
01-07-2007, 08:18 PM
Congrats on the Petrino pickup.....He'll help Vick out more than anyone has to this point.

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 08:24 PM
I don't believe it, but here it is:

Falcons nab Louisville's Petrino for head coach slotBy Pat Forde
ESPN.com


Louisville coach Bobby Petrino has accepted a five-year, $24 million offer from the Atlanta Falcons to become their new coach, according to a Louisville source.

The Cardinals have a previously scheduled 9 p.m. ET team meeting at which Petrino will tell his players, the source said. At least one player, running back George Stripling, said at 8:45 p.m. Sunday that the players had not been apprised that Petrino was leaving.

An announcement from the Falcons could come Monday.

Before the season, Petrino signed a 10-year, $25 million contract with Louisville athletic director Tom Jurich. Petrino had previously interviewed with Auburn, LSU, Notre Dame and the Oakland Raiders for other jobs, but announced in August that he would be at Louisville for the long haul.

"I can't tell you how happy I am with the commitment and the confidence that Tom Jurich has in me and the university has in me," Petrino said after signing the contract. "I also wanted to make sure that everyone understood, I know I've said it, that this is where my family wants to be. This is where I want to be. I want everyone to really believe it."

Louisville had just completed a 12-1 season climaxed by their first BCS bowl victory, over Wake Forest in the Orange Bowl. Petrino's record was 41-9 at Louisville, as he elevated the program into an annual national contender.

The leading candidate to replace Petrino figures to be Tulsa coach Steve Kragthorpe, who has taken the Golden Hurricane to three bowl games in four years after taking over one of the worst programs in the country.



SOOOOOOOO HAPPY

Shiver
01-07-2007, 08:27 PM
I am very surprised by this. I wasn't even aware he was a candidate, or had been interviewed. I heard about Whisenhunt, Cameron, Rivera, Singletary and so forth. This was out of the blue. However, the Louisville offense is the antithesis of Knapp's offense. It's high tempo and aggressive.

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 08:36 PM
I am very surprised by this. I wasn't even aware he was a candidate, or had been interviewed. I heard about Whisenhunt, Cameron, Rivera, Singletary and so forth. This was out of the blue. However, the Louisville offense is the antithesis of Knapp's offense. It's high tempo and aggressive.
They did say that they were going to keep it exceptionally private...Blank let what he wanted to leak...that's great...he definitely knows how to keep things on the DL.

Smooth Criminal
01-07-2007, 08:39 PM
I think its interesting that the fans on this board like the decision but the Falcons fans on another Falcons board are all pissed they didn't get Whis.

NIN1984
01-07-2007, 08:40 PM
I think this is a very smart move, Falcons are going in the right direction

Shiver
01-07-2007, 08:43 PM
I think its interesting that the fans on this board like the decision but the Falcons fans on another Falcons board are all pissed they didn't get Whis.

If you're referring to the Official Falcons MB, that's how they always are.

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 08:50 PM
I think its interesting that the fans on this board like the decision but the Falcons fans on another Falcons board are all pissed they didn't get Whis.
I love it This is a great hire and he was my pick early on, until I heard all about Whis...I really thought he was coming here. But I am STOKED about this offense that is going to set the NFL on fire. Non stop offense is amazing!

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 10:25 PM
Hiring Petrino a splendid move

http://www.ajc.com/blogs/content/shared-bl...ng_petrino.html

Some will question this move. Some will wonder why Arthur Blank is entrusting his NFL franchise to a guy who has spent only three seasons in the league, none as a head coach. Some will wonder if Bobby Petrino is just another of those college guys — Nick Saban, to name the most recent name — who finds his methods less effective when there’s a salary cap involved.

I am not among those people.

I believe this is a splendid hire.

Bobby Petrino is among the best technical coaches, college or pro or high school or sandlot, in the land. What he did at Louisville, a city school in a not-very-populous state with an overwhelming basketball tradition, will stand as one of the greatest coaching jobs of this or any century. I’m in Arizona awaiting Monday’s BCS title game and, if not for a wasted 18-point lead on a Thursday night before a frothing Rutgers crowd, Petrino and Louisville would have been, too.

Petrino just went 12-1 and won the rejuvenated Big East and the Orange Bowl to boot despite losing his best player, running back Michael Bush, in the third quarter of the season opener. Indeed, if Bush and quarterback Brian Brohm elect not to enter the NFL draft, Louisville is positioned to make another run at the national championship next season. That’s how well Petrino had built a program whose previous claims to fame were that Johnny Unitas played there and Lee Corso coached there.

Petrino is a shrewd offensive coach, which is what the Falcons — and Michael Vick especially — needed. But Petrino is not, contrary to popular belief, one of those offensive coaches who see the running game as being as outdated as the 8-track tape. His teams strike a balance. Louisville finished seventh among Division I-A schools in passing offense, 12th in rushing. His receivers get open and his quarterbacks find them, but his backs knock people over. His guys play hard and play smart.

It was no surprise that Auburn, having watched Petrino work with the Tigers offense for only one season (2002), sought to hire him to replace Tommy Tuberville barely a year later. (The clandestine process — flying the school president and AD, both of whom were subsequently deposed, to Sellersburg, Ind., on Bobby Lowder’s private plane to meet with Petrino while Tuberville was still on the job — was flawed and insulting, but the idea had merit.) Petrino is one of those smart and driven guys about whom you can just tell: He’s going to win big.

He won bigger than anyone ever had at Louisville, and he will win big with the Falcons. He will take the high-profile offensive pieces — Vick, Warrick Dunn, Alge Crumpler, Jerious Norwood, the many first-round wideouts — and maximize their gifts in a way Jim Mora and Greg Knapp never could and never would have. Petrino will have this team back in the playoffs within two seasons, perhaps within one.

That said, he comes with a caveat: He has the reputation of being a great tactician but a not-so-nice guy, and Blank, as we know, is hugely conscious of his club’s public image. Petrino could get away with bullying functionaries and trying to cow the media in a college setting, but the NFL brings brighter lights and deeper scrutiny. If Petrino can mind his manners and manage to give the appearance of being a team player in Flowery Branch, he’ll do this organization proud.

He’s no charmer, but neither is Bill Belichick. Mora got the job on charm and lost it because he didn’t have the technical wherewithal to harness a slew of resources. Petrino has the wherewithal. He can make the most of Vick, the most of this franchise. He’s not just another college coach getting in over his head. He’s a pure football coach who can win at any level. Can and will.


Wow...I love it.

steel man
01-07-2007, 10:30 PM
DO NOT GET MAD

But with this hire do you guys think this means the end for Mike Vick in ALT?

does this mean you guys will trade Vick to OAK. for Moss or Porter and some picks?

steel man
01-07-2007, 10:32 PM
also would you guys trade Vick or even Matt for Lance Briggs - LB Chi. ?

Shiver
01-07-2007, 10:39 PM
DO NOT GET MAD

But with this hire do you guys think this means the end for Mike Vick in ALT?


The hire means the end of Matt Schaub in Atlanta. Schaub is exclusively a WCO Quarterback and Knapp is gone. Vick is just a more talented equivalent to the several Quarterbacks that are mobile that have played under Petrino. Arthur Blank in his press release, the first thing he mentioned was Petrino's "innovation," clearly that has something to do with getting the most out of the talent on the offensive side of the ball.

Shiver
01-07-2007, 10:50 PM
Petrino is seen in coaching circles as impatient, as a guy who wants it all and wants it yesterday. Instead of biding his time in the NFL as the Jaguars offensive coordinator and eventually landing a head-coaching job (former Jags coach Tom Coughlin once told me Petrino was the best play caller he'd ever seen), he left the NFL for a less than lateral move to be the offensive coordinator at Auburn.


:)

iloxygenil
01-07-2007, 10:54 PM
Petrino is seen in coaching circles as impatient, as a guy who wants it all and wants it yesterday. Instead of biding his time in the NFL as the Jaguars offensive coordinator and eventually landing a head-coaching job (former Jags coach Tom Coughlin once told me Petrino was the best play caller he'd ever seen), he left the NFL for a less than lateral move to be the offensive coordinator at Auburn.


:)
Could this lead to Coughlin moving to ATL now that he will be fired?

Shiver
01-07-2007, 11:00 PM
The Falcons, for their part, just struck gold. A couple years back, I did a feature called the "Offensive Revolution" that prominently featured Petrino's offense. Though the other coaches I dissected in that piece (Urban Meyer, Mike Leach, Chris Petersen and Steve Spurrier) are all tremendous offensive minds, I considered Petrino to be at the very top of the list due to the way he mixed the spread with traditional, power running. He posted a top-10 offense all four years there. As a college follower, it's disappointing to see him go.

Number 10
01-07-2007, 11:01 PM
also would you guys trade Vick or even Matt for Lance Briggs - LB Chi. ?

Do you know anything about football outside of your video games?

bearfan
01-07-2007, 11:03 PM
so you guys already hired him?

Shiver
01-07-2007, 11:05 PM
so you guys already hired him?

5 years, 24 million, press conference is 2:00 tommorow.

Shiver
01-07-2007, 11:22 PM
After his stint at Carroll, Petrino's coaching trek led him to Weber State, Idaho, Arizona State, Nevada and Utah State before a stint at Louisville as offensive coordinator.

Starting in 1999, he spent two seasons as an NFL quarterbacks coach with Jacksonville and one as the Jaguars' offensive coordinator. He then returned to the college ranks to be Auburn's offensive coordinator for one season before going back Louisville as head coach in 2003.

While climbing the coaching ranks, Petrino was credited for developing future NFL quarterback Jake Plummer at Arizona State.

At Louisville, his teams were noted for high-scoring offenses built around a power running game. He has worked with classic dropback quarterbacks such as Brian Brohm and running quarterbacks such as Stefan LeFors.

"They made an outstanding hire," said Gil Brandt, longtime Dallas Cowboys executive and currently a senior analyst for NFL.com. "He's been in both the NFL and college football. He's got a brilliant mind. I think it's a super good hire."

Under Petrino, the Cardinals were also known for exotic formations and personnel groupings. After playing North Carolina last season, Petrino noted that the Cardinals used 90 different formations and personnel groups.

"He's got a great, great system, and he does an excellent job calling plays," Brandt said.

Petrino, the latest in the line of college coaches to make the jump to the NFL, signed a 10-year, $25 million contact extension with Louisville last July.

"I can't tell you how happy I am with the commitment and the confidence that [Louisville athletics director] Tom Jurich has in me and the university has in me," Petrino said after signing the contract. "I also wanted to make sure that everyone understood, I know I've said it, that this is where my family wants to be."

In recent years, college coaches have not been successful in making the jump to the NFL. Nick Saban, Steve Spurrier and Butch Davis all won national championships in college, but could not get the job done in Miami, Washington and Cleveland, respectively.

"I think that Saban was a guy that just wanted to go back to college football," Brandt said. "Butch got hung up with a team that was not very good. I'm not sure what happened to Spurrier. But everybody else [lost with the Redskins], including Joe Gibbs, who won less games than he's ever won in his career there with five this year ... maybe Spurrier wasn't as bad as we thought he was."

Petrino's career has not been totally smooth sailing. He was involved in an Auburn booster's plan to replace Tommy Tuberville two years ago.

During his time with the Jaguars, Petrino had Mark Brunell as his quarterback. A left-hander like Falcons quarterback Michael Vick, Brunell passed for 3,640 yards in 2000 and 3,309 in Petrino's season as offensive coordinator.

http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/sports/falcons/stories/2007/01/07/0108petrinoside.html

scar988
01-07-2007, 11:25 PM
also would you guys trade Vick or even Matt for Lance Briggs - LB Chi. ?
Vick isn't gettign traded
1we don't need a linebacker in any way.

iloxygenil
01-08-2007, 12:06 AM
also would you guys trade Vick or even Matt for Lance Briggs - LB Chi. ?
Sure...and maybe the Chargers will trade LT for your fullback too

DraftMichaelHuff
01-08-2007, 01:40 AM
This signing has the potential to be great and im very happy with it so far!. The reason it is not flat out great as yet is we are yet to see if he can lure a top flight DC rather than a Louisville right hand man. I really wish Rob Ryan or Mike Singletary becomes our DC/ Assitant Coach. Singletary would be great with the attitude he would bring coupled with the technical skills of Bobby Petrino. Whereas ROb Ryan probably has less of an agressive swagger but is a more proven coach who id love also

Also seeing as he is a extremely offensive minded guy do we think he will hand the duty of selecting a DC to blank and Mckay or insist he selects a DC himself?

I have no problem with him selecting offensive staff but id love to see the FO select the DC who then selects the respective D staff

D-Rod
01-08-2007, 02:00 AM
Great hire. Offense will be fine. But yes, it's all about the DC now. I would understand if Petrino wants to bring in his guys from Louisville, but I'd rather have a proven NFL DC.

Here's a scenario for you: Bob Ryan is being interviewed for the Raiders HC job, but OC Shoop is rumoured to be the favourite. If Ryan doesn't get the job, I'd be amazed if he sticks around after the snub. I'd think that coaching the huge talent on the Falcons D would be tempting. Also, Ryan ISN'T an "Assistant HC", which means that we could theoretically poach him by offering him the role of "DC and Assistant HC".

As for Singletary, it appears that he IS an Assistant HC, so we could not poach him just for DC.

Petrino on Offense (with Musgrave as OC but not calling plays) and Ryan on Defense would be SICK!

Oh yeah, and with Anderson declaring my new draft board at #10 is ALL d-line: Branch/Anderson/Adams/Okobi (Lville connection, will have monster combine IMO). Nelson would be a reach at #10; maybe a worthwhile reach, but a reach nonetheless, and I doubt that McKay abandons BPA. I'd expect a FS in FA or trade before the draft.

I'll explain how the 6'6", 280lb Anderson would fit in, along with resigning Kerney, when I get the time, but I'm sure you guys get the idea...

Shiver
01-08-2007, 02:11 AM
I've heard Shannahan comparisons.. :shock: In terms of offensive design and playcalling.

We can all only hope. What's ironic is when Shannahan took over in Denver, John Elway's career was at a crossroad, until he blossomed under the new direction. Hopefully in five years we can say the same thing.

fondoffilm
01-08-2007, 02:11 AM
Can we expect Paul Petrino to join the staff as well?

01-08-2007, 02:31 AM
So get this.

I hate Petrino-coach of my school's rival: UK.

I hate Petrino-coach of my NFL team's rival: Atlanta.

lol, but anyways, watch for ATL to totally change up the OL from smaller, quicker linemen to big, powerful linemen. That is what Petrino recruited at Louisville and I anticpate a few OL picks from him in the draft.

Kurt Quarterman maybe?

ATLDirtyBirds
01-08-2007, 05:02 AM
I'm stoked. I love the creativity this man brings to the table.

scar988
01-08-2007, 07:04 AM
Can we expect Paul Petrino to join the staff as well?now this question is reasonable. I would say as at least a WR coach... I could see us moving to a 3 WR base offensive set too with Griffith as a RB candidate with Norwood. it could be very interesting to see who we draft from rounds 2-7 now because of how he liked to use big OL

DraftMichaelHuff
01-08-2007, 07:06 AM
Posted: Mon Jan 08, 2007 6:00 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Great hire. Offense will be fine. But yes, it's all about the DC now. I would understand if Petrino wants to bring in his guys from Louisville, but I'd rather have a proven NFL DC.

Here's a scenario for you: Bob Ryan is being interviewed for the Raiders HC job, but OC Shoop is rumoured to be the favourite. If Ryan doesn't get the job, I'd be amazed if he sticks around after the snub. I'd think that coaching the huge talent on the Falcons D would be tempting. Also, Ryan ISN'T an "Assistant HC", which means that we could theoretically poach him by offering him the role of "DC and Assistant HC".

As for Singletary, it appears that he IS an Assistant HC, so we could not poach him just for DC.

Petrino on Offense (with Musgrave as OC but not calling plays) and Ryan on Defense would be SICK!

Oh yeah, and with Anderson declaring my new draft board at #10 is ALL d-line: Branch/Anderson/Adams/Okobi (Lville connection, will have monster combine IMO). Nelson would be a reach at #10; maybe a worthwhile reach, but a reach nonetheless, and I doubt that McKay abandons BPA. I'd expect a FS in FA or trade before the draft.

I'd love that situation in which you speak of with Rob Ryan to arise and i think the D would thrive under him, i will just re affirm again that i am 100% against a Loiusville right hand man being selected as a DC

I honestly dont think reggie nelson is a reach at number 10 he is a better player than whitner, allen and IMO even Huff who i loved, *points to outdated username* from last years draft, once again JMO. I, too really like Anderson as a prospect and hopefully we can trade Shaub for either #17 with the Jags and have a shot at him there on the back of a poor 40 time or grab a 2nd and 3rd pick and grab another great DE in this very deep class ie Charles Johnson in the 2nd

Also scar,
not sure of the correct procedure here but do you think its possible that you could make us a sig? and what is involved in that, do i PM you? send you pics? etc [/b]

scar988
01-08-2007, 07:45 AM
send me what you woudl like on the sig/avy and such and I will get one to you on saturday or sunday

iloxygenil
01-08-2007, 09:22 AM
I'm working on a Petrino one later today after class, I started it last night, but I got distracted playing NCAA 07 with the Louisville Cardinals. I'd really like to have some games to watch of them so I could see what kinda sets he was using, the highlight reels are nice, but the guy who makes them doesn't let the formation be shown so I have to kinda retrace it.

Jughead10
01-08-2007, 09:29 AM
I'm not sure how I feel about the Petrino signing for you guys. He is an offensive guru, and might be able to help out Vick a lot. However he lacks a lot of other aspects of the game. You guys will need a very good D-Coordinator still to take care of the otherside of the ball and I'm not sure how good Petrino is as far as personel decisions. Although I guess that is what a GM is for but normally coaches have a lot of imput there. Petrino was never known to be one of the better recruiters and talent evaluators in college football.

jbombul
01-08-2007, 09:43 AM
i think you are wrong jughead, petrino proved himself to be a outstanding recruiter. When your college is based in a small basketball state, you dont have alot of options. But he turned Louiville from pretender to contender. It would certainly take alot to get that school to what it is today, and he did it. Besides, i dont even know why you broght it up Recruiting is for college, it has nothing to do with the NFL. Welcome to the big times Petrino.

Congratulations Falcons Fans on a great hire. Its the step in the right direction. Now only if my lions can pull of a miracle off season....... :) or maybe Louiville will be interested in hiring matt millen to replace petrino :wink: :wink:

Jughead10
01-08-2007, 09:48 AM
i think you are wrong jughead, petrino proved himself to be a outstanding recruiter. When your college is based in a small basketball state, you dont have alot of options. But he turned Louiville from pretender to contender. It would certainly take alot to get that school to what it is today, and he did it. Besides, i dont even know why you broght it up Recruiting is for college, it has nothing to do with the NFL. Welcome to the big times Petrino.

Congratulations Falcons Fans on a great hire. Its the step in the right direction. Now only if my lions can pull of a miracle off season....... :) or maybe Louiville will be interested in hiring matt millen to replace petrino :wink: :wink:

He did turn Louisville from pretender to contender but he didn't do it with his recruiting. The talent there is still very very average. He lucked out with Brohm. He is a great offensive mind which is what turned that program around. Now that he is gone they are going to take a step backwards because the talent is still very very average for whoever the next coach is.

jbombul
01-08-2007, 10:01 AM
yea louiville will take a step back but i believe the falcons are takin a step forward

Shiver
01-08-2007, 10:33 AM
http://www.bengals.com/news/news.asp?story_id=5836


It sounds like Bengals WR coach Hue Jackson is following Petrino, and will be the OC. He worked with him in the '90s. Hopefully he can help get better production from our receivers, because he did a phenomenal job with the Bengals in developing TJ Houshmandzadeh and Chris Henry.

Shiver
01-08-2007, 11:43 AM
i think you are wrong jughead, petrino proved himself to be a outstanding recruiter. When your college is based in a small basketball state, you dont have alot of options. But he turned Louiville from pretender to contender. It would certainly take alot to get that school to what it is today, and he did it. Besides, i dont even know why you broght it up Recruiting is for college, it has nothing to do with the NFL. Welcome to the big times Petrino.

Congratulations Falcons Fans on a great hire. Its the step in the right direction. Now only if my lions can pull of a miracle off season....... :) or maybe Louiville will be interested in hiring matt millen to replace petrino :wink: :wink:

He did turn Louisville from pretender to contender but he didn't do it with his recruiting. The talent there is still very very average. He lucked out with Brohm. He is a great offensive mind which is what turned that program around. Now that he is gone they are going to take a step backwards because the talent is still very very average for whoever the next coach is.

That's a positive to me actually. Unlike coaches like Saban and Spurrier that had top notch talent at will, Petrino didn't, but still had a NC contender.

bigbluedefense
01-08-2007, 12:30 PM
i think you are wrong jughead, petrino proved himself to be a outstanding recruiter. When your college is based in a small basketball state, you dont have alot of options. But he turned Louiville from pretender to contender. It would certainly take alot to get that school to what it is today, and he did it. Besides, i dont even know why you broght it up Recruiting is for college, it has nothing to do with the NFL. Welcome to the big times Petrino.

Congratulations Falcons Fans on a great hire. Its the step in the right direction. Now only if my lions can pull of a miracle off season....... :) or maybe Louiville will be interested in hiring matt millen to replace petrino :wink: :wink:

He did turn Louisville from pretender to contender but he didn't do it with his recruiting. The talent there is still very very average. He lucked out with Brohm. He is a great offensive mind which is what turned that program around. Now that he is gone they are going to take a step backwards because the talent is still very very average for whoever the next coach is.

That's a positive to me actually. Unlike coaches like Saban and Spurrier that had top notch talent at will, Petrino didn't, but still had a NC contender.

I don't know enough about Petrino to fully commit to him. He sounds like a great signing. Hopefully he snags a DC who's also great, otherwise the defense will have issues.

Imagine if you guys nab Tim Lewis, who is surely to be fired by us? :lol:

I have a question though. What will happen to the ZBS now?

And does he run a complex offense? That could become an issue for Vick.

Shiver
01-08-2007, 12:35 PM
I agree, getting a top notch DC is critical.

The Zone Blocking scheme will change, surely. Petrino's offenses relied on a power run game, with bruisers, to win the game, after the spread attack scored a bevy of points.

I don't know how complicated it is. All I do know is that Dan Marino said on Inside the NFL a week ago that the offense the Falcons needed to run was an aggro, spread the field passing attack. He said that would be the best type of offense for Vick to run. Looks like the Falcons front office and Blank agreed.

bigbluedefense
01-08-2007, 12:44 PM
I agree, getting a top notch DC is critical.

The Zone Blocking scheme will change, surely. Petrino's offenses relied on a power run game, with bruisers, to win the game, after the spread attack scored a bevy of points.

I don't know how complicated it is. All I do know is that Dan Marino said on Inside the NFL a week ago that the offense the Falcons needed to run was an aggro, spread the field passing attack. He said that would be the best type of offense for Vick to run. Looks like the Falcons front office and Blank agreed.

To pull off a power run game with a spread offense, you need big hulking interior linemen and nimble pass protecting Tackles. Thats the only way I see it working, because if you commit too much bulk on the line to support the power run game, the pass protection will be poor in a spread play, and if you commit too much to pass protection, you won't have enough mass to adequately push defenses backwards in the power run game.

I don't think there will be a change at RB. I do see oline being addressed in this draft as well as WR. Safety should be addressed as well.

It sounds like he's very good at making the most of the talent he has, so ATL's draft should be very interesting. It will reflect what he personally thinks he can't fix with the current players on the team.

Shiver
01-08-2007, 12:47 PM
I agree, getting a top notch DC is critical.

The Zone Blocking scheme will change, surely. Petrino's offenses relied on a power run game, with bruisers, to win the game, after the spread attack scored a bevy of points.

I don't know how complicated it is. All I do know is that Dan Marino said on Inside the NFL a week ago that the offense the Falcons needed to run was an aggro, spread the field passing attack. He said that would be the best type of offense for Vick to run. Looks like the Falcons front office and Blank agreed.

To pull off a power run game with a spread offense, you need big hulking interior linemen and nimble pass protecting Tackles. Thats the only way I see it working, because if you commit too much bulk on the line to support the power run game, the pass protection will be poor in a spread play, and if you commit too much to pass protection, you won't have enough mass to adequately push defenses backwards in the power run game.

Which is why in Louisville his line was a mix of smaller 300-lbs lineman, with a few 320+ lineman mixed in at G and RT. In Atlanta, all he needs to do is revamp the Left side of the line.

As for Running Back, he did have Eric Shelton and Michael Bush to pound the rock, when need be. Maybe Bush declares and will be there in the early second for Atlanta to grap. I heard, and I personally think, Dunn will be a cap casuality. He's in the top-3 in cap charge for this team and his production has hardly merited it.

Also, it's official, per the Cincinnati Enquirer; Hue Jackson will be the Falcons OC. Promoted from his position at WR coach, look at his resume. :shock: He coached with Petrino at Arizona State. It sounds like Petrino is to maximize Vick's talents through design, Jackson to maximize White and Jenkins. Hopefully that will work.

Jughead10
01-08-2007, 12:50 PM
i think you are wrong jughead, petrino proved himself to be a outstanding recruiter. When your college is based in a small basketball state, you dont have alot of options. But he turned Louiville from pretender to contender. It would certainly take alot to get that school to what it is today, and he did it. Besides, i dont even know why you broght it up Recruiting is for college, it has nothing to do with the NFL. Welcome to the big times Petrino.

Congratulations Falcons Fans on a great hire. Its the step in the right direction. Now only if my lions can pull of a miracle off season....... :) or maybe Louiville will be interested in hiring matt millen to replace petrino :wink: :wink:

He did turn Louisville from pretender to contender but he didn't do it with his recruiting. The talent there is still very very average. He lucked out with Brohm. He is a great offensive mind which is what turned that program around. Now that he is gone they are going to take a step backwards because the talent is still very very average for whoever the next coach is.

That's a positive to me actually. Unlike coaches like Saban and Spurrier that had top notch talent at will, Petrino didn't, but still had a NC contender.

Brohm helped as well. He was a huge recruit, that Petrino really didn't have to recruit at all. His whole family had gone to Louisville his decision was made a long time ago. He didn't really have a NC contender until this year. Before that he played in the C-USA.

Shiver
01-08-2007, 12:53 PM
Hue Jackson profile;

http://assets.bengals.com/uploads/coaches/BFA159BDF04F4BFA9C8B99223434129D.jpg


1992-95: AC, Arizona State.
1996: Offensive coordinator, California.
1997-2000: Offensive coordinator, Southern California.
2001-02: AC, Washington Redskins.
2003: Offensive coordinator, Washington Redskins.
2004-2006: AC, Bengals.
2007-present: Offensive coordinator, Atlanta Falcons


During the last two seasons, Jackson has directed WRs Chad Johnson and T.J. Houshmandzadeh to status as the most productive receiving duo in Bengals history. The 2004 campaign saw them post the most yards (2252) and second-most catches (168) in a season by a Cincinnati wide receiving pair, and in 2005, they reset their yards mark at 2388 while also making the most catches ever (175) by two players.

I like this hire a lot. Hopefully this will kill the dropsies.

ATLDirtyBirds
01-08-2007, 12:58 PM
From what I understand Petrino likes a power rushing attack. Makes me think that we might be looking at AP and Lynch...

Shiver
01-08-2007, 01:01 PM
From what I understand Petrino likes a power rushing attack. Makes me think that we might be looking at AP and Lynch...

Acording to an SI article, his offense was 3/4 spread, 1/4 I formation, power rushing attack.

iloxygenil
01-08-2007, 01:09 PM
Very excited...we now have to make a move to get Calvin Johnson. We want him in ATL not in Tampa, and now he has officially declared for the draft according to ESPNews. I am STOKED about the offense we will have here, now we just have to go out and get the final offensive linemen that we need and a big time WR...hello Calvin.

iloxygenil
01-08-2007, 01:16 PM
I have been looking at Louisville's roster...Petrino put a TON of good talent there, they are a young team who would have challenged for a VERY VERY long time. They have a young WR I would LOVE to look at here in Atlanta. #7, Mario Urrutia, 6'6" 220 pound Sophomore. Next year he'd be a great guy to look for on our roster.

There are a TON of RBs that are lined up at Louisville, so I don't know what newbie Jughead was talking about but looks to me he did a hell of a job with recruiting.

Jughead10
01-08-2007, 01:24 PM
I have been looking at Louisville's roster...Petrino put a TON of good talent there, they are a young team who would have challenged for a VERY VERY long time. They have a young WR I would LOVE to look at here in Atlanta. #7, Mario Urrutia, 6'6" 220 pound Sophomore. Next year he'd be a great guy to look for on our roster.

There are a TON of RBs that are lined up at Louisville, so I don't know what newbie Jughead was talking about but looks to me he did a hell of a job with recruiting.

Urrutia can actually come out if he wants. He is a redshirt sophmore, and he has hinted in the past that if Brohm were to leave he would follow. He has recruited the RB position well, thats about it. Urrutia is a decent player but mostly onlt good because of his freakish size. Brohm and Bush were easy recruits to bring in. He didn't have to work at that much. Bush being from Louisville and Brohm having his entire family gone there with his brother on the staff.

I'm not sure how Petrino will be. I'm up in the air. He can certianly coach and call offense. But what else can he do? There are certainly a lot of question marks with him. Even more than their were with Butch Davis, who was 10x the recruiter, coach, and talent evaluator in college, and look what happened with him.

And Newbie? I only really posted it here in the Team thread rather than in the NFL forum because I really only wanna see what Shiver and Scar have to say about it and their opinions rather than dealing with all the other idiots over in the other forum.

Shiver
01-08-2007, 01:27 PM
Petrino mentioned getting a great DC is key. It sounds like Petrino/Jackson are here to get Vick, Jenkins and White to perform at a higher level than they have. As Mike Mayock pointed out; Vick didn't buy into the previous offense. Whereas Jenkins and White have underachieved. Getting them on the same page will pay off in a large way. It sounds like they're hoping scheme and coaching improves the offense, by default.

D-Rod
01-08-2007, 01:42 PM
Very excited about the Petrino - Jackson combo. Our offense could be crazy if they can harness the power of the VICK. Also, Jackson will be able to focus on the individual components of the Offense, since Petrino will be in charge of the scheme and playcalling. Then hopefully we also retain Musgrave to continue the good work with Vick. All money.

And i REALLY liked what Petrino and Blank said about the D-coordinator. It's easy to say that they want the best, but it was pretty clear that money is no object, Blank will get the best available. Rob Ryan, please. Interestingly, Petrino made it clear he prefers the 4 down linemen. However, doesn't rule out Ryan with his 4-3 fastball and 3-4 slider.

Bring it.

scar988
01-08-2007, 01:46 PM
rrutia can actually come out if he wants. He is a redshirt sophmore, and he has hinted in the past that if Brohm were to leave he would follow. He has recruited the RB position well, thats about it. Urrutia is a decent player but mostly onlt good because of his freakish size. Brohm and Bush were easy recruits to bring in. He didn't have to work at that much. Bush being from Louisville and Brohm having his entire family gone there with his brother on the staff.

I'm not sure how Petrino will be. I'm up in the air. He can certianly coach and call offense. But what else can he do? There are certainly a lot of question marks with him. Even more than their were with Butch Davis, who was 10x the recruiter, coach, and talent evaluator in college, and look what happened with him.

And Newbie? I only really posted it here in the Team thread rather than in the NFL forum because I really only wanna see what Shiver and Scar have to say about it and their opinions rather than dealing with all the other idiots over in the other forum.well considering he is a good motivator his offense should be good too. I don't mind his hire. IMO we need a good DC but he stressed that himself. Also ,he doesn't ahve to worry about getting personnel because have a great GM in Rich McKay who over the past 3 years has gotten us:

QB Matt Schaub
QB DJ Shockley
RB Jerious Norwood (I see him as a starter under Petrino)
FB Fred McCrary
WR Michael Jenkins
WR Roddy White
WR Adam Jennings
DE John Abraham
DE Chauncey Davis
UT Rod Coleman
NT Grady Jackson
UT John Babineaux
NT Darrell Shropshire
WLB Demorrio Williams
MLB Ed Hartwell
MLB Jordan Beck
SLB Ike Reese
SLB Michael Boley
LCB DeAngelo Hall
RCB Jimmy Williams
CB Jason Webster
S Chris Crocker
S Lawyer Milloy

that's quite a few starters and key backups right there

scar988
01-08-2007, 01:48 PM
Very excited about the Petrino - Jackson combo. Our offense could be crazy if they can harness the power of the VICK. Also, Jackson will be able to focus on the individual components of the Offense, since Petrino will be in charge of the scheme and playcalling. Then hopefully we also retain Musgrave to continue the good work with Vick. All money.

And i REALLY liked what Petrino and Blank said about the D-coordinator. It's easy to say that they want the best, but it was pretty clear that money is no object, Blank will get the best available. Rob Ryan, please. Interestingly, Petrino made it clear he prefers the 4 down linemen. However, doesn't rule out Ryan with his 4-3 fastball and 3-4 slider.

Bring it.I could see Singletary coming in as the DC/AHC for at least 3-4 years.

Shiver
01-08-2007, 01:48 PM
Very excited about the Petrino - Jackson combo. Our offense could be crazy if they can harness the power of the VICK. Also, Jackson will be able to focus on the individual components of the Offense, since Petrino will be in charge of the scheme and playcalling. Then hopefully we also retain Musgrave to continue the good work with Vick. All money.

And i REALLY liked what Petrino and Blank said about the D-coordinator. It's easy to say that they want the best, but it was pretty clear that money is no object, Blank will get the best available. Rob Ryan, please. Interestingly, Petrino made it clear he prefers the 4 down linemen. However, doesn't rule out Ryan with his 4-3 fastball and 3-4 slider.

Bring it.

Rob Ryan could take a lateral move, just to escape the Raiders, let alone a pay increase. What he could do with our personnel would be an awesome sight.

scar988
01-08-2007, 01:58 PM
Very excited about the Petrino - Jackson combo. Our offense could be crazy if they can harness the power of the VICK. Also, Jackson will be able to focus on the individual components of the Offense, since Petrino will be in charge of the scheme and playcalling. Then hopefully we also retain Musgrave to continue the good work with Vick. All money.

And i REALLY liked what Petrino and Blank said about the D-coordinator. It's easy to say that they want the best, but it was pretty clear that money is no object, Blank will get the best available. Rob Ryan, please. Interestingly, Petrino made it clear he prefers the 4 down linemen. However, doesn't rule out Ryan with his 4-3 fastball and 3-4 slider.

Bring it.

Rob Ryan could take a lateral move, just to escape the Raiders, let alone a pay increase. What he could do with our personnel would be an awesome sight.oh definitely we have the personnel to run all 3 looks he uses too:
4-3 (66%)
LE - Kerney or FA or Draft pick/Carrington/Mallard
NT - Jackson/Shropshire/Jackson
UT - Coleman/Babineaux
RE - Abraham/Davis
WLB - Brooking/Williams
MLB - Hartwell/Beck
SLB - Boley/Beck/Reese
3-4 (24%)
LE - Coleman/Babineaux
NT - Jackson/Jackson
RE - Shropshire
WOLB - Abraham/Davis/Carrington
WILB - Brooking/Beck
SILB - Hartwell/Beck
SOLB - Boley/Beck
46 (10%)
LE - Kerney or FA or Draft pick/Carrington/Mallard
NT - Jackson/Shropshire/Jackson
UT - Coleman/Babineaux
RE - Abraham/Davis
WLB - Brooking
MLB - Hartwell/Beck
SLB - Boley/Beck/Reese
SS - Williams

Shiver
01-08-2007, 02:04 PM
Jackson joins Falcons staff

Houshmandzadeh: 'Our loss is their gain'

BY MARK CURNUTTE | MCURNUTTE@ENQUIRER.COM
The Bengals are looking for a new wide receivers coach, and T.J. Houshmandzadeh is concerned.

The team’s No. 2 receiver confirmed this afternoon that receivers coach Hue Jackson is headed to Atlanta to become Falcons offensive coordinator Bobby Petrino.

Jackson told Houshmandzadeh about the job during phone conversations Friday and Saturday.


Petrino, who turned Louisville into a national college power, is being introduced this afternoon as Atlanta’s new coach – replacing Jim Mora, fired last week.

“It’s going to be hard for me,” Houshmandzadeh told the Enquirer. “Hue Jackson is the reason I got a chance to play. I didn’t play before he got to Cincinnati. Our loss is their gain.

“He will do well. He will be able to do more of what he wants to, even though he is working with a great offensive mind like Petrino. He obviously respects Hue and what Hue knows about the pro game.”

Jackson and Petrino were on the same Arizona State staff for two seasons, 1992-93; Jackson stayed through 1995. He had a season as offensive coordinator for Steve Spurrier with the Washington Redskins in 2003. He was offensive coordinator at California in 1996 and Southern Cal from 1997-2000.

Petrino and his Louisville staff visited Bengals training camp near Lexington, Ky. (Georgetown College) at least two times over the years.

The Bengals, as is club policy, do not comment on coaching searches involving any of their employees. Coach Marvin Lewis said last week that his entire staff of assistants was under contract for the 2007 season. Bengals president Mike Brown, however, has allowed his coaches to pursue promotions with other teams. After the 2003 season, former wide receivers coach Alex Wood was allowed to go to the Arizona Cardinals as offensive coordinator under Dennis Green. That move opened the spot for Jackson.

Under Jackson's guidance, Chad Johnson has made three consecutive AFC Pro Bowl teams.

Houshmandzadeh has emerged as a dangerous No. 2 receiver with more than 900 receiving yards in 2004 and 2005 before breaking the 1,000-yard mark in 2006.

Also, second-year wide receiver Chris Henry, despite repeated brushes with the law away from the stadium, has been a productive player on the field.

“I am happy for him, but selfishly, I wonder what’s going to happen with the wide receivers in Cincinnati,” Houshmandzadeh said.

Jackson stressed down-field blocking in the run game from his receivers and the goal of running for yards after the catch. Houshmandzadeh is especially talented at gaining yards after the catch.

With one of the NFL's most prolific offenses and a talented offensive coaching staff, the Bengals were ripe and remain ripe to be picked for coordinators. Quarterbacks coach Ken Zampese also has been a coordinator candidate in the past two years. Running backs coach Jim Anderson has interviewed for other jobs, as well, namely the head coaching position at Stanford University after the 2002 season.



Bengals Pro Bowl wide receiver Chad Johnson lost more than a coach Monday when receivers coach Hue Jackson was tapped to revive the career of quarterback Michael Vick as the Falcons new offensive coordinator.

“It’s like losing a father,” Johnson said. “Hue’s a gem. Michael Vick will be better than ever. Those receivers down there will be sitting there with their mouths hanging open because he makes the game so easy.

“I’m mad. I’m not doing very good right now. But I’m happy for Hue because he’s going to be doing what he always wanted to do.”

Hallelujah!

SimonRath
01-08-2007, 03:59 PM
My ATL Draft
*trade ATL round 2 & round 4 to Detroit Lions for their round 2 pick*

round 1:LaRon landry
round 2:Lamar Woodley
round 3:John Staley