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Scott Wright
11-09-2006, 08:27 AM
Discuss the Bengals here.

PalmerToCJ
11-09-2006, 08:25 PM
REPRESENT!

12-4 BABY!

8)

Scott Wright
11-11-2006, 12:04 PM
Only one reply in the last few days? Has everyone abandoned the Bengals bandwagon?

sweetness34
11-11-2006, 12:05 PM
Only one reply in the last few days? Has everyone abandoned the Bengals bandwagon?

:lol:

Nope, we've only got like one or two Bungle fans on this board. :lol:

critesy
11-11-2006, 01:31 PM
haha yeah sadly.

PalmerToCJ
11-11-2006, 04:37 PM
Only one reply in the last few days? Has everyone abandoned the Bengals bandwagon?

:lol:

Nope, we've only got like one or two Bungle fans on this board. :lol:

Hey, I remember us shredding your defense last year... Lucky you we kneed the ball on your 5 as time expired. I'll bring the trash too.

I'm still kickin'!

PalmerToCJ
11-11-2006, 04:39 PM
I would have more discussion in here but it's hard to talk to myself :lol:

I just hang out on the NFL board.

rainbeaukid2
11-11-2006, 04:42 PM
so you guys are looking to draft marcus thomas right? :lol:

PalmerToCJ
11-11-2006, 05:07 PM
With Mike "second chance" Brown as our owner I wouldn't doubt it. The problem is he has so much faith in Marvin that those are the guys he wants chooses staying true to the BPA theory.

Marvin himself wants nothing to do with the trouble makers but it's not his final call...

jmanz
11-12-2006, 12:36 PM
I would have more discussion in here but it's hard to talk to myself :lol:

I just hang out on the NFL board.

I'm doin my best to recruit for you, I have a buddy that is a huge bengal fan. I'm trying to get him to start posting on this site.

derza222
11-13-2006, 07:09 PM
I would have more discussion in here but it's hard to talk to myself :lol:

I just hang out on the NFL board.

You ever want some Bengals discussion I'm here. I'm a NYJ fan first but Cincy is a very close second.

This past weeks game was a heartbreaker. The fumble was a killer. The defense has a ton of trouble on third down too. Pass defense just gets shredded. LT had four touches, but just becuase they got in close and punched it in with him.

Tackling needs to improve, I think losing Landon hurt, a ton of linebackers were kept before the season but they've dropped like flies. Three guys that are good enough to start were lost to injury.
The pass rush needs some help, get some pressure off the secondary in those third down situations. But regardless, the coverage needs to be better, because they get torn up all game.

Also, the third down defense is terrible, it seems like every third and 8 or so gets converted. You'd figure they'd get a stop or two, but it seems like they never do. I wonder what opponents average against the Bengals D on first and second downs versus third, because I think the third down average would be much higher. That might be the downside to having corners that gamble like Tory James and Deltha O'Neal, you'll get your turnovers but the coverage isn't always good. The turnovers haven't come and it's been a killer for the defense, and that brings the whole team down.

On the upside, the line and offense overall looked much better today. Rudi was great as always but Brats went away from him too early AGAIN. I don't know why you pass most of the time with a 3 TD lead early in the third. I'll never understand it.

Palmer looked much better and more comfortable in the pocket all game. Chad FINALLY caught fire, more than a quarter of the way to 1000 yards in one game. He was unbelievable, got me out of my chair more than once.

Chris Henry seems like he could do so much more with his talent, and he has those off the field issues. He could have caught one of those passes in the endzone at the end of the game, a tough catch but it could have been made. Overall he really didn't step up and do much. Reggie Kelly didn't look too bad catching the ball either.

Overall a great game for the offense and the defense was crap (although you could figure that out from looking at the score). At least Palmer looked better, that's a good sign not only for this year but for future years, and Chad finally looked good. Defense should really be the focal point of this upcoming draft, and I hope they finally put a little emphasis on character.

PalmerToCJ
11-13-2006, 08:21 PM
Instead of making my usual multi paragraph post... I'll just say that I agree with everything you said Derza.

I understand Brat stayed with the pass because it was working so well but he has to realize it's not always about putting points on the board. Didn't Carson fumble the ball passing on first down?

Rudi was doing a great job and ONLY got 15 rushes in a game in which we lead by 21 points at half time. He should have had 25+ to milk the clock. It's hard to keep a team that's on your heels behind when you keep trading scores, you're bound to get burned.

Bleh, 11-5 ( :roll: ). There's still very limited hope. It's us, KC, Jacksonville for the wildcard. We own the tiebreaker over KC and hopefully we get it together and Jacksonville continues to struggle.

I'm still holding out hope. Hey, I guess come offseason I'll be glad to have a lower draft pick... Plus I remember last year saying that I had almost wished we didn't make the playoffs so we wouldn't have had the heartbreak of that game :roll: .

I'm sure I said I wouldn't ramble on, but I did.

11-5... BELIEVE!!!!!

Ravens1991
11-13-2006, 08:22 PM
Is Chris Henry a jerk in the locker room?

PalmerToCJ
11-13-2006, 08:39 PM
Is Chris Henry a jerk in the locker room?

Not as far as I've heard. He's well liked on the field, one of Carsons favorite players. Carson and Chad are the reason he's still on the team.

derza222
11-13-2006, 08:50 PM
Instead of making my usual multi paragraph post... I'll just say that I agree with everything you said Derza.

I understand Brat stayed with the pass because it was working so well but he has to realize it's not always about putting points on the board. Didn't Carson fumble the ball passing on first down?

Rudi was doing a great job and ONLY got 15 rushes in a game in which we lead by 21 points at half time. He should have had 25+ to milk the clock. It's hard to keep a team that's on your heels behind when you keep trading scores, you're bound to get burned.

Bleh, 11-5 ( :roll: ). There's still very limited hope. It's us, KC, Jacksonville for the wildcard. We own the tiebreaker over KC and hopefully we get it together and Jacksonville continues to struggle.

I'm still holding out hope. Hey, I guess come offseason I'll be glad to have a lower draft pick... Plus I remember last year saying that I had almost wished we didn't make the playoffs so we wouldn't have had the heartbreak of that game :roll: .

I'm sure I said I wouldn't ramble on, but I did.

11-5... BELIEVE!!!!!

I'm pretty sure he did fumble on first down. That play really was a killer. IMO if they run the ball that down and that turnover doesn't happen, they win the game. No excuse at all for Rudi to have 18 carries in a game where they had a 3 touchdown lead at halftime. I was watching it with my dad and it was killing us, he didn't get nearly enough carries. I'd almost be happy if Brat didn't come back next year if it meant Rudi got more carries. I did like more deep looks in the game though, it opened things up a bit and added momentum with big plays, they didn't throw enough deep balls in the Baltimore game IMO, that's the forte of Palmer, Chad, and Henry, so why not do it? Hopefully they get it together, and if not, the higher draft pick will be nice, get some defense in there.

Henry doesn't seem like the kind of guy that would be a jerk to his teammates, it's more his attitude towards everyone else that is the problem. Just my opinion though.

critesy
11-14-2006, 11:50 PM
sooooo..Ahmad Brooks :D

DHVF
11-15-2006, 12:20 AM
sooooo..Ahmad Brooks :DI hear he plays football

PalmerToCJ
11-15-2006, 04:49 PM
sooooo..Ahmad Brooks :DI hear he plays football

And well... He's been quiet of late, the boy needs to learn how to get off of blocks. The second he gets engaged he's out for the rest of the play. I LOVE what I see though, his #1 fan can still critique him...

BengalsPwn
11-15-2006, 11:18 PM
Its just another injury plagued season for us again. Dexter out, Pollack maybe done for his career, Tab out, AJ out, Odell.............. ********. Bengals really need to shore up that front 7 already. The d-line is getting no pressure after the first couple games this season, the lb core, granted is banged up, but are blowing off assignments and missing tackles. Since the front 7 is playing like garbage the safeties have to move up and the corners can only play 1-1 for so long and finally got burned last week. Can the draft get here any sooner. The season is probably lost now... unless this defense can get there act together.

PalmerToCJ
11-16-2006, 09:36 PM
Its just another injury plagued season for us again. Dexter out, Pollack maybe done for his career, Tab out, AJ out, Odell.............. dumb. Bengals really need to shore up that front 7 already. The d-line is getting no pressure after the first couple games this season, the lb core, granted is banged up, but are blowing off assignments and missing tackles. Since the front 7 is playing like garbage the safeties have to move up and the corners can only play 1-1 for so long and finally got burned last week. Can the draft get here any sooner. The season is probably lost now... unless this defense can get there act together.

Well put. Front seven is weak, the ends and LB's are lacking this year. I dont' think the DT's have been that bad. I only care to address it round one if one of the big guns is there. If not it's DE all the way.

diabsoule
11-18-2006, 12:57 PM
How do you think the game will go against the Saints on Sunday in New Orleans?

PalmerToCJ
11-18-2006, 08:23 PM
Hopefully well :lol:

Our Oline will never have a chance to get together though. Stacey Andrews will make his first start at ANY level on the Oline tomorrow at RG in place of Bobbie Williams who had an apendectomy.

This is big for saving any hope I have left. Sucks, I have to work. I take a TV that I get to watch but the customers have to interrupt me. I managed to escape working every game until this weekend.

If the offense clicks half as well as it did last weekend then it should be exciting to say the least.

Man, after watching Woodley today he would look GOOD in Bengals stripes.

PalmerToCJ
11-19-2006, 06:34 PM
Ahhh... Feels good to finally get a W.

Nice to see Chad shutting up his doubters and despite Bobbie Williams injury the Oline wasn't terrible.

Run the ball with Rudi = Victory. Plain and simple. Nice to see the D step it up. They still struggled on 3rd down and vs. the pass in general but made the big plays. The run D was there. Caleb played great.

Time to get this train rollin'.

critesy
11-19-2006, 06:47 PM
very nice win for the bengals...didnt get to see it so i dont have much to say about it right now.

11-19-2006, 07:32 PM
Bengals D played good for once. If they can play like that for the whole year then there is no reason why they can't go to the super bowl.

PalmerToCJ
11-19-2006, 09:31 PM
I'll come out and say it... I hate the Jags, Chiefs and Jets for the time being.

IF we can get into the playoffs we will obviously be on a roll so it would be good going into the playoffs however that's a monsterous IF at this point.

The 3rd down passing D is just terrible. Offense is really clicking though and the LB's stepped it up today. I liked the 3rd and 1 on the 4 yard goal line stop, big Sam stepped it up.

Pass rush didn't seem to be terrible. We at least were getting pressure via Jeanty, Smith and Geathers.

derza222
11-20-2006, 05:15 PM
I'll come out and say it... I hate the Jags, Chiefs and Jets for the time being.

IF we can get into the playoffs we will obviously be on a roll so it would be good going into the playoffs however that's a monsterous IF at this point.

The 3rd down passing D is just terrible. Offense is really clicking though and the LB's stepped it up today. I liked the 3rd and 1 on the 4 yard goal line stop, big Sam stepped it up.

Pass rush didn't seem to be terrible. We at least were getting pressure via Jeanty, Smith and Geathers.

Third down defense really needs some help. I don't know what they can do to fix it though. Pass rush? Corners? I don't know how much those will help on a third and 7. Great that they got Rudi in the game for awhile, maybe Brat is starting to learn a bit. And I loved Ocho Cinco getting the ball and making some plays, starting to shut up some doubters. He's probably my favorite player in the NFL, and I'm more of a Jets fan than a Bengals fan. Speaking of the Jets, why the hate? Also, D needs to stop relying on turnovers, if Brees doesn't throw those two picks in the EZ the game could have gone much differently...

PalmerToCJ
11-20-2006, 06:04 PM
HAHA. I'm opposed to any team that could prevent the Bengals from getting into the playoffs.

Currently we have the H2H advantage over the Chiefs but the Jets would get in before us with a similar record because they have a victory over a common opponent (Patriots). I don't mind them, it's just they're in the Bengals way so I'm opposed :lol:

The pass rush is indeed terrible but it wasn't that bad yesterday. Tory James is just lost out there and Madieu hasn't been as great in coverage lately.

Once or twice I saw LB's waiting at the line and neither rushing or in pass coverage. It was like it was 10 on 11.

A wins a win... I'll take it and oh... say 6 more.

11-5!!!!!!!!!!!

derza222
11-20-2006, 08:50 PM
HAHA. I'm opposed to any team that could prevent the Bengals from getting into the playoffs.

Currently we have the H2H advantage over the Chiefs but the Jets would get in before us with a similar record because they have a victory over a common opponent (Patriots). I don't mind them, it's just they're in the Bengals way so I'm opposed :lol:

The pass rush is indeed terrible but it wasn't that bad yesterday. Tory James is just lost out there and Madieu hasn't been as great in coverage lately.

Once or twice I saw LB's waiting at the line and neither rushing or in pass coverage. It was like it was 10 on 11.

A wins a win... I'll take it and oh... say 6 more.

11-5!!!!!!!!!!!

I think Joseph should just get all of James' playing time to be honest. And the pass rush...hopefully it gets addressed during the draft. I just don't know exactly how to help the third down D besides that. It's a huge problem though.

And trust me, the Jets will not keep the Bengals out of the playoffs. Pennington is far too inconsistant for us to make it to the playoffs. Did you see the first pick in the endzone? Coles was wide open in the corner, it should've been 7-0. Instead, he throws it right to Urlacher. Terrible. Plus his arm is about as strong as mine is.

Back to the Bengals after my Penny rant, at least the line is starting to look a little better. And Rudi has looked excellent for a few weeks now, he needs to keep getting touches. And I love the fact that Chad is on fire. Love it. In the last 2 games he's averaging 8.5 catches for 225 yds and 2.5 touchdowns :shock: . Eye popping numbers to say the least. I mean 11 catches for 450 yds and 5 touchdowns is a pretty good season for a bunch of receivers, forget in 2 games. Look who's on top of the NFL in receiving again...Chad is the man.

Who do you think would be a good pick in the first round, looking at the late teen to early twenty range we'll probably be looking at for Cincy? For some reason I feel like Marvin is going to be really high on Woodley, and he wouldn't be a bad pick. Abiamiri would be a nice selection as well. And if McCauley or Hall slips down there they'd need to consider it, same with Landry although that's next to impossible. Thoughts?

PalmerToCJ
11-20-2006, 10:49 PM
I agree completely on Woodley. For some reason the hunches I've had the past three years on our first rounder have been in the ballpark.

Woodley seems to have the physical tools and the college production that Marvin loves to see. Plus, he fills a monsterous need. I'm a big fan of Woodley so I really hope he is the pick. It MUST be the front four or if one of the better safties were to fall back. We're decent at DT but it'd be nice to have a difference maker on the line. With potentially losing Justin Smith though I think DT has to be ignored in favor of either Moses, Woodley or Abiamiri. If we don't have say Okam fall back round 1 then I very highly doubt we address DT after round 1. DE must be addressed round 1 or 2, preferably 2 with Saftey being addressed in the 2nd.

Stacey Andrews stepped it up big yesterday with his first career start at any level. It makes the hit to depth after losing Steinbach next year not so hateful. He's been quite the raw and long term project but it may actually work out.


I've been telling people on the main board for weeks that Chad is a top 5 WR, I'm just tired of all the haters. I kept telling them he'd be up there in the AFC recieving yards yet again and sure enough he leads the league.

Figures the Giants would lay over and die tonight :evil:

whodeygonnaarrestnext
11-21-2006, 04:01 PM
:D

PalmerToCJ
11-22-2006, 01:45 PM
Original :roll:

critesy
11-22-2006, 04:15 PM
:D

niiice first post man. HOFer right here.

critesy
11-26-2006, 12:03 AM
soooo, i'm looking forward to a Bengal win this Sunday.

PalmerToCJ
11-26-2006, 12:11 AM
Let's hope. Cleveland usually plays us decent regardless.

1 game at a time, we win this one and we've still got a shot.

Rudi should go insane tomorrow. I don't care how well we pass the ball, tomorrow it should be all about RUN RUN RUN.

Orange and Black
11-26-2006, 03:02 PM
It was Pass, Pass, and Pass some more. The Clowns are a true embarassment to the NFL. What a bunch of stinking losers.

TCU
11-26-2006, 06:42 PM
Im sick for noticing this, and am looking for an explanation.

vs. Carolina
http://assets.bengals.com/assets/default/gallery061022-5.jpg

vs. New Orleanes
http://assets.bengals.com/assets/default/gallery061119-1.jpg

vs Clevland
http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20061126/capt.a33642280e504a7bad0f7f1e79479e87.bengals_brow ns_football_ohas114.jpg


Notice anything differnt he has a differnt helmet / facemask in each game. This pictures are all from this year. So why Chad?

PalmerToCJ
11-26-2006, 07:06 PM
Those of you who notice the helmets are ate up :lol:

As for an explanation I have no idea...


WOOHOOO for today... BRING ON THEM RAVENS!!!!!!!!

We're going to be cooking some bird on Thursday. We own at home in primetime and Carson is on a roll and owns the Ravens.

PalmerToCJ
11-26-2006, 07:55 PM
Chris Perry broke his leg on that play :(

I swear, so much potential. Kenny Watson is a suitable backup.

We're just getting KILLED on injuries.

Orange and Black
11-26-2006, 08:11 PM
Chris Perry is like most former UM RB's.....hard on the outside, but soft on the inside. As much potential as he has, he'll never be able to withstand the punishment of a 16 game NFL schedule. Let's deal with him and move on in next year's draft.

PalmerToCJ
11-26-2006, 08:22 PM
Chris Perry is like most former UM RB's.....hard on the outside, but soft on the inside. As much potential as he has, he'll never be able to withstand the punishment of a 16 game NFL schedule. Let's deal with him and move on in next year's draft.

Ohio State fan? :lol:

PalmerToCJ
11-27-2006, 02:11 PM
The Bengals D is just iffy.

17th in Points Per Game
17th in Rushing Yards Per Game
Still dead last vs. the pass (Thanks Drew Brees 8) )
13th in Sacks (26) although that stat is skewed in my mind, we get sacks at insignificant points in games
3rd in INT's
Given up the most 1st downs

To our credit we experience the 2nd most pass attempts per game (for good reason).

BengalsPwn
11-27-2006, 03:51 PM
Chris Perry out for the season.... again. What a surprise. It still boggles my mind why we took him, when Rudi had just emerged and we had our chance at Steve Jackson and Kevin Jones who were gamebreakers there whole college careers not one year wonders like Perry. Then again the bengals love one year wonders like Akili Smith.

The defense shut out the browns. Too bad it was the browns... The offense is in full circle now and will probably put up 28+ the rest of the season. I think the defense will get us to the playoffs, but the lack of pass rush and run defense will come up short again unless the O-line gets shored up and our offense becomes unstoppable and just outscores everyone to the point that every team must pass to keep up.

derza222
11-27-2006, 04:00 PM
The Bengals D is just iffy.

17th in Points Per Game
17th in Rushing Yards Per Game
Still dead last vs. the pass (Thanks Drew Brees 8) )
13th in Sacks (26) although that stat is skewed in my mind, we get sacks at insignificant points in games
3rd in INT's
Given up the most 1st downs

To our credit we experience the 2nd most pass attempts per game (for good reason).

The bold stat (2nd most pass attempts against per game) not only makes the passing numbers look worse, but also makes the underlined stat (rushing against) look better. Plus the fact that teams have to play catch up with our offense or at least keep up means they don't have the chance to run it to ice games like they do with other teams. Overall the defense really needs a lot of help, Palmer has looked a lot better the past few games but the draft should be all about the defensive side of the ball (with a little concentration on the offensive line) but the skill positions should really be ignored for once. Especially WR, the Bengals have to stop drafting WR's they're more than set at the postion.

PalmerToCJ
11-27-2006, 05:44 PM
Well, we're 18th in YPC so that agrees with the 17th in YPG. The run D just as it has the past 2 seasons has really improved as the season progressed.


I wouldn't say to ignore WR in the later rounds this year. I mean our 4th WR yesterday was freaking Glenn Holt and Kwash will bolt, who knows if Chatman will stay. Then after next season I believe Henry is a RFA and who knows someone might take a chance on him. That leaves CJ, TJ, Tab and unproven Bennie Brazell. With that said, WR is a definete day 2 need rounds 5-7.

Our kick returners are just doomed. Tab (IR), Chatman (IR), Chris Perry (IR) and now Glenn Holt takes it, I honestly don't know who'll get it next if he's hurt.

derza222
11-27-2006, 06:32 PM
Well, we're 18th in YPC so that agrees with the 17th in YPG. The run D just as it has the past 2 seasons has really improved as the season progressed.


I wouldn't say to ignore WR in the later rounds this year. I mean our 4th WR yesterday was freaking Glenn Holt and Kwash will bolt, who knows if Chatman will stay. Then after next season I believe Henry is a RFA and who knows someone might take a chance on him. That leaves CJ, TJ, Tab and unproven Bennie Brazell. With that said, WR is a definete day 2 need rounds 5-7.

Our kick returners are just doomed. Tab (IR), Chatman (IR), Chris Perry (IR) and now Glenn Holt takes it, I honestly don't know who'll get it next if he's hurt.

I guess the run defense isn't that bad, although I think it would get worse over the course of a game if the defense got worn down.

As far as WR goes, next year I think CJ, TJ, Henry, Perry, and Brazell is an excellent core. If some sleeper falls to them or a guy with a nice size/speed combo, or even just good speed or size, falls down to them at a very good value then I guess it wouldn't be a terrible pick. I'd rather wait till the year after though and get a good small speedster in rounds 2 or 3. But if somebody who is a good fit for the slot falls to any spot, you're right it probably makes sense to take them. But I'd rather take a boom or bust guy this year later and if Henry leaves then look for a slot guy later on day 1.

PalmerToCJ
11-27-2006, 07:47 PM
The one good thing that would come from someone taking Henry is that we would get very good compensation.

In '08 after losing Steinbach and possibly Justin Smith we could have 3 3rd round picks. Marvin could be deadly with those (as long as he doesn't take another Frostee Rucker :roll: )

DE round 1 and Saftey round 2, possibly LB round 2. That's what we're looking at. The need for DE is too great and the quality to be had round one is so solid that it works out perfect for us.

I really think saftey will be the second rounder. We need depth and a playmaker at the saftey spot, Jackson isn't durable enough and KK is just a solid backup. LB is always a possibility with Marvin, all pending on whether Pollack plays again and if Odell is cut or even considered again.

If Pollack retires and Odell is cut that leaves Ahmad, Caleb, Jeanty, Landon, Nicholson and I'm not sure Simmons will be a Bengal next year. I must say Jeanty has been very impressive. Still I think our LB core is solid but not spectacular. We need playmakers on the defensive side, especially in the front 4. It'd be nice to address WLB.

I honestly think our defense is a DE and playmaking saftey away from being very solid.

FootballGod
11-27-2006, 09:04 PM
I am going to start this off by saying that I am going to assume that we finish the season at 8-8 or at best 9-7. That would give us a pick between 16-22. Lets go ahead and say that we average a 19th pick. Please tell me what you think. I can take the criticism and welcome it.

Round 1. Quinn Pitcock, DT, Ohio State Sr, 6-3, 295: I feel that he is the second best DT in the draft behind Alan Branch. Quinn would fit perfect into our 4-3 base defense and could also play DE when we switch to 3-4. Sam Adams and John Thornton are unproductive and old. Pitcock and Peko in the middle would look great for years to come.

Round 2. Aaron Ross, CB, Texas Sr, 6-1, 192: Currently leads the team with 5 interceptions and is third in tackles. This would be the 51st pick. I have him as the 6th best CB in the draft with Leon Hall, Marcus McCauley, Antoine Cason, Darrelle Revis, Daymeion Hughes all ahead of him. Another positive about him is that he is the punt returner for the Longhorns.

Round 3. Ahmad Brooks (2006)

Round 4. Justin Warren, ILB, Texas A&M Sr, 6-3, 245: Teams leading tackler by a mile. Ideal size and strength for an ILB. Scary to think that Odell and Pollack could not be back next year and Simmons is no longer a speedster. This would work well if we switch to a 3-4 but would also add depth, which we all know we need at this postion.

Round 5. Tra Battle, FS, Georgia Sr, 5-11, 185: A killer tackler with blitzing skills from the safety position. Tra would be a special teams maniac. A future starter after Jackson is gone. KK might be gone to free agency after this season. He would be a steal at this position, plus he is a Georgia Bulldog. They play great football down there and have outstanding coaches. Might be way to late to get him, still not sure yet.

Round 6. John Beck, QB, BYU Sr, 6-1, 218: AMAZING ARM STRENGHT. Can throw a ball 75 yards. Guaranteed to make any throw at the next level. Reads defenses well, makes quality adjustments, and makes quick checkdowns on receivers. Good pocket presence and fairly agile. Has played under 2 head coaches and two different offensive schemes, progressing quickly into new system. Gun slinger who would fit into the Matt Schaub type of a career backup who could manage an offense in a pinch behind Carson. It would be nice to get a backup that will be around for a while.

Round 7. Brent Celek, TE, University of Cincinnati Sr, 6'4", 260: Great runner after the catch. Averages 15 yards a catch this season. Hometown product who is the all-time leading receiver as TE for the Bearcats. Just what the fans wanted... a TE.

Tell me what you guys think. What would you change? Do you like the positions that were picked? Who Dey

PalmerToCJ
11-27-2006, 10:14 PM
I honestly think we'll finish 10-6 but anything could happen, I hope I'm right :lol:

The thing about your draft is where is the DE? Justin Smith will likely be allowed to leave via FA so that leaves Geathers/Robinson/Rucker(LOL). We really have a big need for a pass rushing impact DE such as Quentin Moses or Lamar Woodley. I think Woodley would be a fantastic fit for our offense.

We just struggle to generate a consistent pass rush off the edges, the DT's haven't been terrible of late in stopping the run and I'm waiting for Shaun Smith to get more PT... He was solid at DT last season.

As for Ross... If he has the potential to move to saftey I love the pick. It'd be nice to take a versitile DB second round so we could have depth at saftey/cornerback since I wouldn't doubt Tory James being gone after this year. Then we could have a backup CB (behind Joseph/Deltha) and a backup saftey and he could move into a starting spot when injuries occurred.

I'm not so sure we move to 3-4. The only way I really see that happening is if Breshnahan moves on and we get a DC that comes from a 3-4 defense.

I like the Celek pick, we need a TE but late rounds and he wouldn't be bad at all.




Stick around man, it's lonely in here :lol:

FootballGod
11-28-2006, 08:50 AM
I didn't hae a DE because I believe Woodley will be gone by the time we pick. If we cannot get a starting DE in the first 2 rounds then I don't think we should draft one. I am torn on this though. If we don't spend money on Smith then who do we spend it on. Our offense is locked up for years to come and is there a DE free agent that you would rather have instead on Smith? I drafted for value and not just to fill a position. If Woodley is there in the first round then I take him over Pitcock but that kills me to say becasue I am a huge buckeye fan. As far a Ross goes he could immediatly step into the nickle back situation with James leaving hopefully. Ross also returns punts for Texas so bye bye Ratliff say hello to dime coverage. Tra Battle will fight for the safety spot but KK has not played bad this year if you look at his numbers.

PalmerToCJ
11-28-2006, 10:11 AM
I see where you're coming from then with your picks.

I just think the contract that Smith will demand will be too much. I'd love to re-sign him but I'm not so sure I see it happening.

Regardless the first two rounds we must address DB and DL, I'm not that picky on which position. I don't see any intriguing LB prospects that Marvin might want to take a shot at.

BengalsPwn
11-28-2006, 01:19 PM
With so many question marks on defense on whose going to come back its hard to predict the draft. One thing I know is RB and WR should not even be considered. I know Perry is always injured but I think Quincy Wilson can come in for Rudi in case he goes down. Also we have CJ, TJ, Tab, Mcneal, Braziel, and im pretty sure we resign Chris so we are set at WR. O-line shouldnt be a concern either because we have great depth already. I could see us taking a TE in the draft though. If some how Greg Olsen were to slip to round 2 I hope we take him in a heart beat. The rest should be used on defense. D-line and S mostly. LB should be good if Pollack and Thurman are back. Jeanty, AJ, and Brooks provide great young depth. I could care less if we resign Smith or Simmons because they havnt wowed me a single time there whole careers. Madieu could use some help especially someone really solid like a Laron Landry or Griffin in round one or Rouse or Merriweather later on day one. CB is a postion that we can wait on. JJ is progressing fine and we still have Keiwan to play nickel. Tory James will probably be out and we have some decent depth behind them in Bauman. Overall this draft better be defense defense defense. My dream draft might go something like this

1. Quentin Moses DE UGA (I can still dream)
2. Greg Olsen TE UM
4. Aaron Rouse S/OLB VT
5. Marcus Thomas DT UF (yes I know more character risks, but the kid can play)
6. Baraka Atkins DE UM
7. Josh Gattis S WF

derza222
11-28-2006, 02:14 PM
I see where you're coming from then with your picks.

I just think the contract that Smith will demand will be too much. I'd love to re-sign him but I'm not so sure I see it happening.

Regardless the first two rounds we must address DB and DL, I'm not that picky on which position. I don't see any intriguing LB prospects that Marvin might want to take a shot at.

I have to believe that there is going to be some DE, be it Abiamiri, Crowder, some riser, anyone, that is more worth taking in the first than Pitcock.

You talking about Shaun Smith demanding a big contract? Not sure who you're going with there.

I definitely agree with the last thing you said, DB and DL need to be addressed.

PalmerToCJ
11-28-2006, 08:34 PM
lol I meant Justin Smith... I guess I should be more specific with a name like Smith :lol:

I agree about having a solid saftey if they were there but I'd rather take saftey round 2. Saftey is a position that it's easy to grab a solid player at later points in the draft (see Landry/Ko Simpson this year).

You know there will be some DE's that have their stock rise or drop drastically in the coming months (Manny Lawson/Kiwanuka last year).

Who knows, maybe Moses will drop (I doubt it).



My dream first rounder at this point though is Lamar Woodley, he's just a pass rushing fool that would be absolutely perfect for our defense.

derza222
11-29-2006, 04:41 PM
lol I meant Justin Smith... I guess I should be more specific with a name like Smith :lol:

I agree about having a solid saftey if they were there but I'd rather take saftey round 2. Saftey is a position that it's easy to grab a solid player at later points in the draft (see Landry/Ko Simpson this year).

You know there will be some DE's that have their stock rise or drop drastically in the coming months (Manny Lawson/Kiwanuka last year).

Who knows, maybe Moses will drop (I doubt it).



My dream first rounder at this point though is Lamar Woodley, he's just a pass rushing fool that would be absolutely perfect for our defense.

I agree with getting a solid safety day 2. Great guys can be found on the second day. The guy in my sig is having a Pro Bowl type year in his second season and was a 4th round pick. There are tons of great safeties that get found in the second.


I've said it before, I think Woodley is the pick, just a gut feeling. He'd be a great pick for this defense. Either way, theres going to be somebody at DE who rises or falls like you said and we'll be in the perfect position to snatch them come draft day. I have to believe unless an absolute stud like Landry, Hall, or Branch falls into our laps the pick is going to have to be a DE.

PalmerToCJ
11-29-2006, 09:47 PM
Weather will be terrible for tomorrow. Rain/Thunder and 10 MPH winds.

Given how lackluster our running game has been and how great our passing game has been this doesn't look good.

PalmerToCJ
11-30-2006, 01:40 PM
The boys better come to play today. If we lose this one our chances are very very slim.

Regardless of the weather we still need to produce.

11-5, BELIEVE!!!!!!!

derza222
11-30-2006, 02:41 PM
Weather will be terrible for tomorrow. Rain/Thunder and 10 MPH winds.

Given how lackluster our running game has been and how great our passing game has been this doesn't look good.

Has the running game really looked that poor, or has it been partially due to not running the ball enough? I mean it hasn't been as good as it was at other points in the year, but it's not terrible either. Just my opinion.

Either way, getting Rudi going and stopping Lewis will be keys to this game, as will not turning the ball over. I've got to believe whoever takes care of the ball better wins this game.

Also, on the bright side we could get some defensive stops on 3rd down and passing distance with the weather.

I'm looking forward to actually being able to watch this game, I don't get to see many Cincy games being from Jersey.

roidrunner
11-30-2006, 05:04 PM
i have a question. Who is more important to the bengels? CJ or Carson?? i was just wondering what you guys thought.

Ravens1991
11-30-2006, 10:21 PM
good game everyone

PalmerToCJ
11-30-2006, 10:27 PM
i have a question. Who is more important to the bengels? CJ or Carson?? i was just wondering what you guys thought.

Carson. Hands down. His accuracy and arm strength just can't be replaced. Chad is big for the team but the Oline/Carson are MUCH more important.

'Twas a good night to be a Bengals fan.

FREAKING RAVENS HAD TO RUIN OUR SHUTOUT :evil:

I'll comment more in the morning (have to study) but all I know is Jonathan Joseph is bringin' it. After tonight I believe he's the better CB over Marshall (my opinion of course).

derza222
12-01-2006, 04:49 PM
i have a question. Who is more important to the bengels? CJ or Carson?? i was just wondering what you guys thought.

Carson. Hands down. His accuracy and arm strength just can't be replaced. Chad is big for the team but the Oline/Carson are MUCH more important.

'Twas a good night to be a Bengals fan.

FREAKING RAVENS HAD TO RUIN OUR SHUTOUT :evil:

I'll comment more in the morning (have to study) but all I know is Jonathan Joseph is bringin' it. After tonight I believe he's the better CB over Marshall (my opinion of course).

Joseph had a pretty sick game last night. He needs to work on finishing plays though, he should've had at least 1 pick. Granted they were all very difficult catches to make, but he got both hands on about 5 balls and he should've come away with at least one of them.

I kind of think that the importance goes Line/Carson/Chad, because IMO without a line an offense is crap. If the line gives him time and opens some running lanes no matter who's playing the RB, TE, and WR we'll win the game. Just because the line is very important both running and passing I think they're more important. That's during the game though. Off the field I think Chad is really a good player for this team and works his ass off and wants to win, so he does help the drive to win for this team. Not saying he's more imporant, but you can't underrate his importance to the team. But IMO Carson is more overall impact by a bit.

PalmerToCJ
12-01-2006, 06:20 PM
The nucleus of this team is amazing.

TJ/Chad/Carson/Willie/Levi/Simmons/Braham... All of them are great individual players that only care about winning. Sucks that in the slump this year I realized how great these guys are, especially TJ/Carson/Willie.

Chad/TJ/Henry lead the league trios in Receptions, Yards and TD's.

If we can make this push to get into the playoffs it's going to benefit us greatly once we get in. Last year I still feel we very well could've beat Pitt with Carson in all game but ending the year that bad just wasn't the best.

All I know is the defense needs to keep bringing the heat on the QB and Jonathan Joseph needs to start over Tory James when Deltha comes back. Breshnahan did a great job of sending Dexter in on the run blitz last night and Peko/Adams were getting great initial penetration to stop Lewis.

Bengalsrz
12-01-2006, 08:22 PM
What a game, we are makin a great playoff run, if we keep playing like we have been, I think we have a shot at the SB.

PalmerToCJ
12-02-2006, 04:15 PM
What a game, we are makin a great playoff run, if we keep playing like we have been, I think we have a shot at the SB.

I wouldn't go that far, I just want to make the playoffs in the first place.

If we get in that means we're on a roll and we've beat some good teams so there's a potential for a deep run.

FootballGod
12-03-2006, 06:14 PM
KC lost today and Im loving it. I just hope Seattle will lose tonight as well.

PalmerToCJ
12-03-2006, 06:22 PM
KC lost today and Im loving it. I just hope Seattle will lose tonight as well.

I'm all about KC losing, those Browns are just helpful.

Broncos are GOING DOWN!!! Alexander is going to help out his NKY roots by getting a W to help the Bengals.

FootballGod
12-04-2006, 12:35 AM
Mock 2.0 I am going to start this off by saying that I am going to assume that we finish the season at 9-7. That would give us a pick around number 21. Please tell me what you think. I can take the criticism and welcome it.

Round 1. Quinn Pitcock, DT, Ohio State Sr, 6-3, 295: I feel that he is the second best DT in the draft behind Alan Branch. Quinn would fit perfect into our 4-3 base defense and could also play DE when we switch to 3-4. Sam Adams and John Thornton are unproductive and old. Pitcock and Peko in the middle would look great for years to come.

Round 2. Brandon Meriweather, SS, Miami (FL), 6' 195: There aren’t many players that have produced on the level of Brandon Meriweather. After serving as a backup and special teamer in 2003, he moved into the starting lineup and had 62 tackles, two for loss, with a pair of interceptions as a sophomore in 2004. During his junior season is where Meriweather took his game to an elite level. He finished the year with various All American honors after racking up 115 tackles, 13 for loss, with three interceptions. Brandon Meriweather is the total package at safety. His biggest impact comes in attacking the line of scrimmage. He is fearless, and is a force at stopping the run. But he is also an excellent blitzer and gets into the backfield on a consistent basis and makes plays. In coverage, he shows the ability to locate the ball and speed to get to the action and make plays. He also brings the versatility of being able to play at both safety spots. Will drop in the draft because of character issues, which Marvin has not been afraid to draft in the past.

Round 3. Ahmad Brooks (2006)

Round 4. Justin Warren, ILB, Texas A&M Sr, 6-3, 245: Teams leading tackler by a mile. Ideal size and strength for an ILB. Scary to think that Odell and Pollack could not be back next year and Simmons is no longer a speedster. This would work well if we switch to a 3-4 but would also add depth, which we all know we need at this postion.

Round 5. Marquice Cole, CB, Northwestern Sr, 5-9, 185 Punt returner. A little small for the position which will make him drop in the draft. Marquice is more quick than fast, which is why he would be the perfect nickle or slot corner in the NFL. He makes plays in close quarters but gets beat on deep passes. Good tackler.

Round 6. John Beck, QB, BYU Sr, 6-1, 218: AMAZING ARM STRENGHT. Can throw a ball 75 yards. Guaranteed to make any throw at the next level. Reads defenses well, makes quality adjustments, and makes quick checkdowns on receivers. Good pocket presence and fairly agile. Has played under 2 head coaches and two different offensive schemes, progressing quickly into new system. Gun slinger who would fit into the Matt Schaub type of a career backup who could manage an offense in a pinch behind Carson. It would be nice to get a backup that will be around for a while.

Round 7. Brent Celek, TE, University of Cincinnati Sr, 6'4", 260: Great runner after the catch. Averages 15 yards a catch this season. Hometown product who is the all-time leading receiver as TE for the Bearcats. Just what the fans wanted... a TE.

Tell me what you guys think. What would you change? Do you like the positions that were picked? Who Dey

rickscott
12-04-2006, 04:15 AM
When Celek ran 83 yds vs Rutgers, I was shocked to see that he was actually that big. He has fine speed and strength too as he displayed tossing tacklers off him. How's his blocking?

rickscott
12-04-2006, 04:26 AM
I think Pitcock is gone when we pick. I think a CB is more likely in Rd 1. We had great luck with Peko in Rd 4 so I think we'll pick up another DT in mid-rounds rather than Rd1. I do agree that with alot of uncertainty at LB we will take at least 1. How about the Safety from ND. That kid is a fine punt recturner and KO man too I think. Will he be around in rd 2 or is that too early for him? What about the DT from North Carolina? Tank Tyler. I hear he has played real well and he could be there if we do pick a DT in Rd 1?

PalmerToCJ
12-04-2006, 12:33 PM
I want Merriweather, I don't care how much people will bash the team. It's about production on the field. If he is there round 2 I'm all for taking him.

I'd like to see DL round 1 and Saftey round 2.

I like your 6th and 7th round picks.

Keep in mind that it's Mike Brown taking the poor character guys, Marvin has publicly said he doesn't want them.

FootballGod
12-04-2006, 04:01 PM
I do not care about the off the field stuff either and that is why I want to draft Meriweather. It takes talent to win in the NFL and he is a steal in the 2nd round. Give me talent over character anyday. By the way Thurman and Henry both make our team better.

PalmerToCJ
12-04-2006, 04:06 PM
I agree about the off field stuff.

It's an annoyance for sure as a fan because the media makes a big deal about it but it doesn't effect the team.

I'd rather have Chris Henry than ANY other WR taken in that draft and we got him round 3. With Odell his production last year alone was worth the pick. If it's truely a "Best Player Available" strategy then character is a non-issue.

We drafted an angel in David Pollack and he's turned out to probably be a wasted pick, as a fan I'd rather have an idiot that gets in trouble making plays than a church boy sucking it up.

Not that I'm saying I don't want good character guys but we have tons of them on the team already, we're just a few talented players away from a SB run. I'd rather have bad press and win a SB than get good press and not make the playoffs or make it and lose first round.

PalmerToCJ
12-07-2006, 10:22 PM
I'm so alone in here... I feel like a fat chick in a club.

BengalsPwn
12-08-2006, 10:16 AM
I live in S. florida so ive seen a lot of Merriweather and Im no that high on him bc of his trouble with bigger players. I would prefer a bigger safety someone who is already over 200lbs or one who is more sound in the tackling department. His tackling reminds me too much of Sean Taylor and thats not a good thing bc he just launchs himself like a missle hoping for the big one and lets big plays happen which is our problem already. Give me Landry or Nelson in the first or a guy like Aaron Rouse in the second or third if we can get our hands on a third round pick. Without Justin next year DE has to be the first round pick though.

PalmerToCJ
12-08-2006, 02:43 PM
I live in S. florida so ive seen a lot of Merriweather and Im no that high on him bc of his trouble with bigger players. I would prefer a bigger safety someone who is already over 200lbs or one who is more sound in the tackling department. His tackling reminds me too much of Sean Taylor and thats not a good thing bc he just launchs himself like a missle hoping for the big one and lets big plays happen which is our problem already. Give me Landry or Nelson in the first or a guy like Aaron Rouse in the second or third if we can get our hands on a third round pick. Without Justin next year DE has to be the first round pick though.

Yeah, he may not be the best fit for us then.

There will be a saftey there to be had 2nd round that can stuff the run and cover. Marvin would definetely take a guy average in coverage and run stopping over a guy that can only do well in one area and develope them.

12-08-2006, 06:25 PM
cardsalltheway. Want to make a sig bet on UK vs. IU 8)

Hellz yea. Two weeks good with you?

PalmerToCJ
12-08-2006, 06:28 PM
cardsalltheway. Want to make a sig bet on UK vs. IU 8)

Hellz yea. Two weeks good with you?

haha yeah, lets say we'll change avatars though I don't have any UK sigs.

UK wins, here's your avatar
http://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/us/sp/v/ncaaf/teams/1/80x60/kkd.gif

IU wins, here's my avatar
http://us.st11.yimg.com/us.st.yimg.com/I/cats-pause-shop_1925_19348264

Deal or you got something more hardcore :lol:

EDIT:

Actually I found a sig that would like nice after every post you make...

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a225/Hrod382/cats-pause-shop_1925_19348264.jpg

12-09-2006, 09:16 AM
How about both? Put it all on the line. :lol:

jmanz
12-09-2006, 09:44 AM
Yikes guys, another arrest....O'neal this time.....

PalmerToCJ
12-09-2006, 10:32 AM
How about both? Put it all on the line. :lol:

I'll let you pick one or the other for me if you all win and I'll pick one or the other for you... I have to show my Bengal pride somehow :lol:

bengalbuck
12-09-2006, 02:24 PM
It's looking like Pollack will likely be back next season, which is great news. I think it also means we don't have to spend a first day pick on the LB position.

This probably seems pretty obvious, but the first and second round picks almost have to be D line and cornerback don't they?

At CB, Jonathan Joseph looks good and has a great future (though he needs to spend some time learning how to catch). After him, the picture gets a little cloudy. Deltha hasn't had his best year. He gives too much cushion, doesn't tackle well in run support and seems to be unwilling to play through even relatively minor injuries. Plus, the DUI probably doesn't help either. Tory is getting old and probably won't be resigned. I'm hoping that Rashad Bauman comes back as I have always liked him as a nickle back. Kiewan Ratliff will be on the team, but he has disappointed the last two years and I think we will continue to have trouble on 3rd down if he sees the field a lot again next year.

The D line has been better lately and there are some solid players. Domata Peko has looked pretty good rotating in the middle. Big Sam Adams has had his moments and if he gets the knee healthy should be a solid contributor next year. Robert Geathers has looked pretty good as a situational pass rusher and should be given a high tender in RFA next offseason. I'm not sure if Justin Smith will be back next year, but if he leaves, there will be a huge hole at DE next year. Frostee Rucker, Eric Henderson and John Fanene are pretty much unknowns at this point. John Thornton and Brian Robinson are just okay. Overall, the line is okay but really lacking a top notch player that commands double teams and can get consistent pressure on the QB.

I guess my ideal draft would be:
Round 1: Bigtime DE like Moses, Woodley, Spencer
Round 2: Solid CB prospect that has the size to provide good run support and to cover the TE in nickle, maybe somebody like Revis
Round 4: TE
Round 5: DT
Round 6: WR
Round 7: OLB

12-09-2006, 03:35 PM
How about both? Put it all on the line. :lol:

I'll let you pick one or the other for me if you all win and I'll pick one or the other for you... I have to show my Bengal pride somehow :lol:

Good game. :evil:

PalmerToCJ
12-09-2006, 03:43 PM
How about both? Put it all on the line. :lol:

I'll let you pick one or the other for me if you all win and I'll pick one or the other for you... I have to show my Bengal pride somehow :lol:

Good game. :evil:

:lol:

You look good with all that blue. I'm glad our big guys showed up to play, made it entertaining for sure.

PalmerToCJ
12-09-2006, 03:50 PM
It's looking like Pollack will likely be back next season, which is great news. I think it also means we don't have to spend a first day pick on the LB position.

This probably seems pretty obvious, but the first and second round picks almost have to be D line and cornerback don't they?

At CB, Jonathan Joseph looks good and has a great future (though he needs to spend some time learning how to catch). After him, the picture gets a little cloudy. Deltha hasn't had his best year. He gives too much cushion, doesn't tackle well in run support and seems to be unwilling to play through even relatively minor injuries. Plus, the DUI probably doesn't help either. Tory is getting old and probably won't be resigned. I'm hoping that Rashad Bauman comes back as I have always liked him as a nickle back. Kiewan Ratliff will be on the team, but he has disappointed the last two years and I think we will continue to have trouble on 3rd down if he sees the field a lot again next year.

The D line has been better lately and there are some solid players. Domata Peko has looked pretty good rotating in the middle. Big Sam Adams has had his moments and if he gets the knee healthy should be a solid contributor next year. Robert Geathers has looked pretty good as a situational pass rusher and should be given a high tender in RFA next offseason. I'm not sure if Justin Smith will be back next year, but if he leaves, there will be a huge hole at DE next year. Frostee Rucker, Eric Henderson and John Fanene are pretty much unknowns at this point. John Thornton and Brian Robinson are just okay. Overall, the line is okay but really lacking a top notch player that commands double teams and can get consistent pressure on the QB.

I guess my ideal draft would be:
Round 1: Bigtime DE like Moses, Woodley, Spencer
Round 2: Solid CB prospect that has the size to provide good run support and to cover the TE in nickle, maybe somebody like Revis
Round 4: TE
Round 5: DT
Round 6: WR
Round 7: OLB

I agree about the CB situation. Joseph is a stud, James is a bum and Deltha is average this year and Keiwan doesn't have the speed. Peko looks like a future starter and we have enough depth to rotate guys in and out at DT, if Okam is there round one I'd be satisfied with that pick because it's quality over quantity.

My ideal draft...

Round 1: DE (Woodley would be great)
Round 2: Versitile DB prospect (ala Madieu) that can play either CB or S so we get added depth and a potential starter
Round 4: OL - We'll lose depth because of Steinbach leaving and if Braham is gone two of our backups are now starters. It's not a must but you can never be too strong at OL.
Round 5: TE
Round 6: Speedy WR that is a good KR/PR since Chatman may be gone and we need depth behind Tab.
Round 7: Whatever catches Marvins eye I guess.

rickscott
12-09-2006, 10:54 PM
Pollack has made it clear that if he returns and as mentioned, that is looking good, he would prefer to return as a DE rather than a LBer. I think the Bengals will accomodate him if that is the case and this would possibly allow J.Smith to leave and have Pollack replace him. I would like to see J. Smith resigned but we'll see. I think Steinbach is gone for sure. I look for a CB in Rd 1 again as O'Neal and James are both showing sings of slowing a bit and you can't have too many great corners.

rickscott
12-10-2006, 04:05 AM
We've now had 8 different guys arrested for various charges this year. Who do you blame? Of course it's the individual's fault but does Marvin have to take some blame here too. If he cut a couple of these guys would that end it? I know it goes on everywhere but we probably have had more than twice wqhat any other team has had this year.

derza222
12-10-2006, 09:33 AM
We've now had 8 different guys arrested for various charges this year. Who do you blame? Of course it's the individual's fault but does Marvin have to take some blame here too. If he cut a couple of these guys would that end it? I know it goes on everywhere but we probably have had more than twice wqhat any other team has had this year.

I think a lot of the blame has to go to Mike Brown, who loves giving second chances to players with bad histories. As far as the draft goes, I agree corner and D-line are probably the two biggest needs, safety and O-line will probably be addressed later as well, along with a speed WR and maybe some linebackers. Tight end may be addressed late as well.

PalmerToCJ
12-10-2006, 11:20 AM
Marvin has publicly admitted that he wants to stay away from low character guys yet Mike Brown encourages taking them on and well, he has the final say.

Marvin has done his job to prevent these things. He cut Mathias Askew, has sat out Henry 4 games by himself without the leagues suspensions, he asked the commish that they immediately suspend Odell for the year following his DUI.

What could he possibly do to stop guys like Deltha, Steinbach, McNeal etc. from doing these things? It's not like they've ever been caught for doing something bad up until now, some of it just boils down to bad luck.

With that said I think there is potential that if we sign Justin Smith back we will draft a CB round one again. Tory James is likely gone and Deltha was in Marvins doghouse before this happened for not playing through what he thought to be a minor injury.

I still think DE is the pick because I don't think Smith will stick around but if we did manage to get Smith back I'm all but sure it'll be CB again, we'll be set there for the next 5 years at least.

PalmerToCJ
12-10-2006, 06:53 PM
Robert Geathers is officially starting to impress me. The guy knows how to get after the QB. Peko is impressing me as well, very athletic for his size.

Jeanty may be a solid option for the future starting at OLB. He has a nose for the ball and is a solid tackler.

Funny to think the team played kinda sloppy and won by 17 :lol:

rickscott
12-10-2006, 08:39 PM
I hate seeing those 3rd and long changes that they make with the defensive personnel. It seems when they apply pressure, they are a much better defense than when they drop back as they did over and over today. A sloppy game by Palmer and still a nice win. Next 3 weeks are huge.

PalmerToCJ
12-10-2006, 10:03 PM
Yeah, this game is an even better example of why Tory James is a TERRIBLE CB. Deltha and Joseph better be our starters next week. I actually am not totally against seeing the three safties out there, it's just that either the QB scrambles and buys time or they burn Tory James.

I'm impressed by Geathers and the defense actually showing some moves this week instead of just flat out bull rushing every time.

That 4th and inches play where Sam Adams exploded through the line was just insane. Kaeshviharn is continuing to impress me as being a great backup, he makes some big plays.

Hopefully vs. Indy we'll have our entire starting line from last year back (Levi, Steinbach, Braham, Williams and Willie). That means a better rushing game and just better protection in general. It's going to be all about Rudi, if we pound the rock with Rudi then Peyton stays off the field. If we get into a shootout throwing long balls that plays to the Colts advantage.

Today it looked like the Colts had their defense full of Ohalete clones :lol:

PalmerToCJ
12-11-2006, 07:16 PM
I'm now kind of at a loss as to what we should draft this offseason in the first round, last year it was kind of obvious but now I'm not so sure.

Say we re-sign Justin Smith and let Tory James go packing (which we should and will)...

DE - Geathers now has double digit sacks and has proved to be a viable option at DE while Justin Smith is one of our more consistent defensive players and has a shot at 10 sacks as well.

S - While we do need a saftey for the future, DJax has been a solid saftey for us this year (when healthy) and KK is a solid backup for if DJax is hurt. I feel we do need to address saftey but I think it would be most to our benefit to address it round 2 because of need and quality.

DT - I never felt as if it was much of an option, only way I see it is if say Okam is available at that point. Peko has played great and between Sam Adams/Shaun Smith we have a meaty run stuffer and the run D has been great of late.

LB - Signs are pointing to Pollack probably returning, who knows about Odell and I'm unsure Simmons will be back although I expect it. The LB's that have been starting (Landon, Caleb and Jeanty) have been great lately. They make tackles and don't overpursue, I feel like LB shouldn't even be addressed at all in the draft. We still have Nicholson and Ahmad from this years draft.

CB - I'm starting to think there will be a chance of taking a CB two straight years in the first round. We're still sitting last in the NFL in passing yards/game and Tory James is done. Rumor has it Keiwan is gone when his contract is out and that leaves Deltha, Johnathan Joseph and our backups which don't see playing time. Deltha will be 30 next year and hasn't played the best this year when healthy. If we could have two solid cover CB's (Joseph and say Marcus McCauley WOW) then we could do more man coverage and be able to send more guys on the blitz and in run defense. I think it would be for the best of the defense as a whole.

OL - Levi, Whitworth, Ghiaciuc/Wilkerson (Braham Re-signing?), Bobbie Williams and Willie Anderson WILL be our starting offensive line next year. The only way we address OL is in the later rounds for depth that we will lose via Ghiaciuc/Whitworth moving into starting roles. There is no reason to address OL day one as you all know.

RB/WR/QB/FB - DUH :lol: , no concerns there.

TE - No one worthy and TE isn't a first day need for us.

rickscott
12-12-2006, 11:30 PM
I think our present DEs are very good IF we were to have a dominant blitzing OLB....maybe Pollack was the man, but I'm not sure we'll ever know. I hope they resign J.Smith since they will for sure let Steinbach go. They have to start dedicating some cash to the defense.

I understand the Commish told Mike Brown today to clean up our act here. I really don't care for the way Marvin has acted like his hands are tied to some extent. Come out in the media and put these guys on front street if you must and embarass the heck out of them but this stuff has to stop. I bet no other team has more than 3 arrests and it's a monthly thing with us and that is being kind.

I'm hoping we can get a shot at Daymeine Hughes the CB out of Cal in the draft. If not, I bet we can get a fine DT but I'm not sure there will be a dominant DE left for us if we go into the playoffs and have a pick in the mid-late 20s.

I hear that Dallas Clark is out along with Stokley. I sure hope so.

bengalbuck
12-13-2006, 12:59 AM
I'll add my two cents in bold

I'm now kind of at a loss as to what we should draft this offseason in the first round, last year it was kind of obvious but now I'm not so sure.

Say we re-sign Justin Smith and let Tory James go packing (which we should and will)...

DE - Geathers now has double digit sacks and has proved to be a viable option at DE while Justin Smith is one of our more consistent defensive players and has a shot at 10 sacks as well.
I'm not sure what to make of this position. I bet they try to get Geathers to sign a long term extension this offseason after giving him a RFA tender. He could be somewhat costly. Plus, there are rumblings that Pollack strongly prefers DE if he returns.

S - While we do need a saftey for the future, DJax has been a solid saftey for us this year (when healthy) and KK is a solid backup for if DJax is hurt. I feel we do need to address saftey but I think it would be most to our benefit to address it round 2 because of need and quality.
Agree completely. 4th or 5th round safety.

DT - I never felt as if it was much of an option, only way I see it is if say Okam is available at that point. Peko has played great and between Sam Adams/Shaun Smith we have a meaty run stuffer and the run D has been great of late.
Disagree a little. We have been looking for an interior pass rush for years (like last year when we were forced to move Geathers inside). If the right guy is there at DT, they will take him.

LB - Signs are pointing to Pollack probably returning, who knows about Odell and I'm unsure Simmons will be back although I expect it. The LB's that have been starting (Landon, Caleb and Jeanty) have been great lately. They make tackles and don't overpursue, I feel like LB shouldn't even be addressed at all in the draft. We still have Nicholson and Ahmad from this years draft.
Lots of solid depth but lacking a star and I'm not sure if Pollack or Brooks can be that guy, but I don't think we take a LB until late.

CB - I'm starting to think there will be a chance of taking a CB two straight years in the first round. We're still sitting last in the NFL in passing yards/game and Tory James is done. Rumor has it Keiwan is gone when his contract is out and that leaves Deltha, Johnathan Joseph and our backups which don't see playing time. Deltha will be 30 next year and hasn't played the best this year when healthy. If we could have two solid cover CB's (Joseph and say Marcus McCauley WOW) then we could do more man coverage and be able to send more guys on the blitz and in run defense. I think it would be for the best of the defense as a whole.
Agree wholeheartedly.

OL - Levi, Whitworth, Ghiaciuc/Wilkerson (Braham Re-signing?), Bobbie Williams and Willie Anderson WILL be our starting offensive line next year. The only way we address OL is in the later rounds for depth that we will lose via Ghiaciuc/Whitworth moving into starting roles. There is no reason to address OL day one as you all know.
Agree.

RB/WR/QB/FB - DUH :lol: , no concerns there.
I wouldn't be shocked to see a surprisingly early pick spent on a guy who is a WR/punt return specialist. We wanted Hester last year despite our WR depth.

TE - No one worthy and TE isn't a first day need for us.

PalmerToCJ
12-13-2006, 02:37 PM
Rickscott... Clark being out is money for us, he abused us last year. Now our only problem is that if Deltha doesn't play then Tory james is on Reggie Wayne :shock: . If that's the case they might as well just tell Madieu/Djax to head that way every time.



BengalBuck.... I hadn't heard the rumor about Pollack wanting to move back to DE, I wanted that all along. I just didn't see the desire to keep him at LB when I saw him as average, the potential was there but he did great last year when he was rushing from the DE spot. I'd really like to re-sign Justin Smith but he isn't some kind of DE stud...

I think Peko can be our source of an interior pass rush, he's got a good motor for a guy his size and Sam/Shaun Smith can be the run stuffers.

All I know is that CB looks to be our biggest need at this point, I'm encouraged with the DT/DE play of late and the LB's are picking it up.

I feel Ahmad Brooks can be a stud in this league, I think he was benched because he just got thrown out there too soon... Next year he can be big for us either in the middle or outside.

Given the way the first round will potentially play out there are all kinds of possibilities. Okam/Woodley/Spencer/McCauley/Hughes/Cason/Buster Davis etc. will all be there. It'll be interesting for sure...


This Monday sure will be fun, I can't wait.

BigDawg819
12-13-2006, 04:17 PM
We've now had 8 different guys arrested for various charges this year. Who do you blame? Of course it's the individual's fault but does Marvin have to take some blame here too. If he cut a couple of these guys would that end it? I know it goes on everywhere but we probably have had more than twice what any other team has had this year.


It all boils down to you reap what you sow. Marvin Lewis came to the Bengals and made it clear that he wanted to change the face of the organization and steer clear of low character guys. But year in and year out the Bengals pull the proverbial 180 and draft these high potential knuckleheads and all these incidents are a bad reflection on the organization and the league itself. Granted Chris Henry and Odell Thurman are players with unquestioned talent on the football field, but there are reasons that they were available when you guys drafted them. For god sakes Marques Colsten fell to the end of the 7th round because of reports of his inability to get along with the coaching staff at Hofstra. Whether this is Marvin Lewis' fault or Mike Brown's fault is a mute point, the question that has to be answered is when are these guys going to be held accountable for their actions and when will the Bengals come out and say talent is more important then character or will they make decisions based on character and talent and leave the knuckleheads's headaches to someone else. This is nothing new for the Bengals, remember this is the franchise that established the character clause in contracts referred to the Carl Pickens' clause and lest we forget the turmoil caused by now Patroit's role model Corey Dillon.

PalmerToCJ
12-13-2006, 04:27 PM
Mike Brown picks the players, period. That's who's fault it is for taking them, Brown has publicly admitted to it.

None of these players have had problems with the coaching staff. That was Dillions beef, he wanted out because we sucked and the final reason was he lost his job to Rudi and was unhappy.

Don't act as if the Ravens are clean though. McAlister has a DUI and another arrest, Sams has 2 DUI's, Rolle was arrested for assaulting his wife, Suggs was charged with assault, McNair has been arrested for DUI and weapons charges, Jamal with his drug dealing and we all know the Ray-Ray story. We're just hitting the same rough spot in off the field issues that you all encountered.

Marvin has taken action though, Askew was cut... He has inactivated Henry for 3 games for discipline, inactivated Deltha last Sunday, asked the league to hurry and suspend Odell the entire year following his DUI etc.

BigDawg819
12-13-2006, 04:54 PM
Mike Brown picks the players, period. That's who's fault it is for taking them, Brown has publicly admitted to it.

None of these players have had problems with the coaching staff. That was Dillions beef, he wanted out because we sucked and the final reason was he lost his job to Rudi and was unhappy.

Don't act as if the Ravens are clean though. McAlister has a DUI and another arrest, Sams has 2 DUI's, Rolle was arrested for assaulting his wife, Suggs was charged with assault, McNair has been arrested for DUI and weapons charges, Jamal with his drug dealing and we all know the Ray-Ray story. We're just hitting the same rough spot in off the field issues that you all encountered.

Marvin has taken action though, Askew was cut... He has inactivated Henry for 3 games for discipline, inactivated Deltha last Sunday, asked the league to hurry and suspend Odell the entire year following his DUI etc.

I love it when people want to make things personal. I was chiming in with some insight and you automatically bash on the Ravens. So lets get the facts straight shall we:

Rolle was arrested for assaulting his wife - this happened when he was a member of the Titans if I remember correctly


McNair has been arrested for DUI and weapons charges - again not a problem since he became a Raven


McAlister has a DUI and another arrest, Suggs was charged with assault, Jamal with his drug dealing and we all know the Ray-Ray story - all these events while wrong happened in the offseason not during the season.


Not to mention I don't believe I said in my post anything to the extent of the Ravens are better then the Bengals in regards to off the field conduct.
I was merely saying that this is not a problem that needs to blamed on somebody but a problem in evaluating talent and personnel. That is what needs to be addressed. These incidents are effecting the game and the bottom line is that if character were more of an issue then talent the Bengals would not have these problems.

12-13-2006, 04:58 PM
Mike Brown picks the players, period. That's who's fault it is for taking them, Brown has publicly admitted to it.

None of these players have had problems with the coaching staff. That was Dillions beef, he wanted out because we sucked and the final reason was he lost his job to Rudi and was unhappy.

Don't act as if the Ravens are clean though. McAlister has a DUI and another arrest, Sams has 2 DUI's, Rolle was arrested for assaulting his wife, Suggs was charged with assault, McNair has been arrested for DUI and weapons charges, Jamal with his drug dealing and we all know the Ray-Ray story. We're just hitting the same rough spot in off the field issues that you all encountered.

Marvin has taken action though, Askew was cut... He has inactivated Henry for 3 games for discipline, inactivated Deltha last Sunday, asked the league to hurry and suspend Odell the entire year following his DUI etc.

I love it when people want to make things personal. I was chiming in with some insight and you automatically bash on the Ravens. So lets get the facts straight shall we:

Rolle was arrested for assaulting his wife - this happened when he was a member of the Titans if I remember correctly


McNair has been arrested for DUI and weapons charges - again not a problem since he became a Raven


McAlister has a DUI and another arrest, Suggs was charged with assault, Jamal with his drug dealing and we all know the Ray-Ray story - all these events while wrong happened in the offseason not during the season.


Not to mention I don't believe I said in my post anything to the extent of the Ravens are better then the Bengals in regards to off the field conduct.
I was merely saying that this is not a problem that needs to blamed on somebody but a problem in evaluating talent and personnel. That is what needs to be addressed. These incidents are effecting the game and the bottom line is that if character were more of an issue then talent the Bengals would not have these problems.
wow :shock: :shock: :shock:

PalmerToCJ
12-15-2006, 05:59 PM
I was going off the basis for comparison. You know what it's like, players screw up and they act like the whole franchise is just trash and that's not the case with either team. Marvin Lewis is a class act and it just annoys me that people point the finger at him. We've taken in people with off field troubles as have you all and our teams have been pretty successful of late so it doesn't effect our on field (as some people will claim).


We claimed Skyler Green today off waivers. Not sure if he's just for WR or PR/KR. Guess we'll see, doubt he does much Monday night.

Kwash is on IR. Looks like he's played his last game as a Bengal.

FootballGod
12-17-2006, 11:21 AM
Bengals Mock Draft 3.0: I am going to start this off by saying that I am going to assume that we finish the season at 10-6. That would give us a pick around number 24. Please tell me what you think. I can take the criticism and welcome it.


Round 1. Michael Griffin, Safety, Texas Sr, 6-0, 205, 4.45: Very smooth and athletic. Tough, physical, aggressive, and a big hitter. Fluid hips and exceptional in coverage. A lot of experience against top competition. 4 blocked kicks this season. Jackson is in the last years of his career and would be the perfect person for Griffin to learn from. Griffin has the stuff to be a stud in this league for quit a while. Madieu and Griffin in the secondary together would be quit a force.

Round 2. Daniel Bazuin, DE, Central Michigan Sr, 6-3, 272: Absolute sack machine and is always in the backfield. Some of the most impressive stats that I have ever seen. Through his Junior season he had 25 career sacks and 48.5 tackles for loss. Had 16 sacks his junior year and followed that up with 8.5 this year. He will fall in the draft because he doesn't play for a power house. This is the perfect fit for Bengals. We need that pass rusher of the future to team up with Geather becasue Smith might be gone next season. Might be that second round steal that the Bengals have come to be known by.

Round 3. Ahmad Brooks (2006)

Round 4. Justin Warren, ILB, Texas A&M Sr, 6-3, 245: Teams leading tackler by a mile. Ideal size and strength for an ILB. Scary to think that Odell and Pollack could not be back next year and Simmons is no longer a speedster. This would work well if we switch to a 3-4 but would also add depth, which we all know we need at this postion.

Round 5. Marquice Cole, CB, Northwestern Sr, 5-9, 185 Punt returner. A little small for the position which will make him drop in the draft. Marquice is more quick than fast, which is why he would be the perfect nickle or slot corner in the NFL. He makes plays in close quarters but gets beat on deep passes. Good tackler.

Round 6. John Beck, QB, BYU Sr, 6-1, 218: AMAZING ARM STRENGHT. Can throw a ball 75 yards. Guaranteed to make any throw at the next level. Reads defenses well, makes quality adjustments, and makes quick checkdowns on receivers. Good pocket presence and fairly agile. Has played under 2 head coaches and two different offensive schemes, progressing quickly into new system. Gun slinger who would fit into the Matt Schaub type of a career backup who could manage an offense in a pinch behind Carson. It would be nice to get a backup that will be around for a while.

Round 7. Brent Celek, TE, University of Cincinnati Sr, 6'4", 260: Great runner after the catch. Averages 15 yards a catch this season. Hometown product who is the all-time leading receiver as TE for the Bearcats. Just what the fans wanted... a TE.

Tell me what you guys think. What would you change? Do you like the positions that were picked? Who Dey

PalmerToCJ
12-17-2006, 03:38 PM
Regardless of tomorrow nights outcome we leave the WC leader for the 3rd straight week via Jacksonvilles loss.

WOOHOOO... I don't care though, if we win out it doesn't matter what everyone else does.

FootballGod, I'll check out your mock later... I'm too busy taking all of this in :lol:

FootballGod
12-17-2006, 04:23 PM
Thats cool PalmertoCJ. The playoffs are in our hands for the rest of the season. All that we have to do is take care of our self the rest of the way and we are in.

PalmerToCJ
12-17-2006, 04:53 PM
Ok, I will still claim that it's hard to do a Bengals mock without knowing the future of Justin Smith. I think Woodley is a lock (if he makes it back to us) if Smith leaves. Honestly I still can't see us spending a first rounder on a saftey. Granted we need one for the future but saftey is a position where solid players can be found on day 2, I think a 4th rounder would be great to spend on a saftey.

Although we need a pass rusher I think if Justin Smith leaves we need a guy that is at least average in run stopping. For example I think if Moses and Woodley were there to be had round 1 Marvin wouldn't hesitate to take Woodley over Moses' pass rushing abilities. We can't have two players of situational pass rushing abilities starting all downs (Geathers/Draft pick). I don't think Bazuin would be the best fit to replace Smith who is just as good (if not better) at stopping the run as bringing heat on the QB.

CB is quickly becoming a potential first round need given Deltha being average and Tory James being trash. None of our backups have been able to step up to make a difference so I think it wouldn't be a half bad idea to address CB round 1. To be honest I'd really like to see CB addressed round 1 or 2 again this year because CB isn't a position you can really strike gold with in the later rounds.

If Smith stays...

1. CB/DT (only Okam really at DT)
2. Saftey (Wendling/Weddle maybe fall?)
4. QB (maybe, we need a long term backup)/KR-PR/OL/TE
5. "
6. "
7. "


It's hard to say what we'll do at LB. Jeanty is solid, Landon is decent, Odell is questionable, Ahmad is a future starter but at SLB or MLB?, Simmons is nearing the end, Pollack is questionable, Caleb is solid as a backup. I'm not sure what to think of it, Marvin loves them athletic LB's so maybe one will catch his eye in say round 2.

If Smith leaves...

1. Woodley (I'm hoping he drops)
2. Saftey/CB/Maybe LB.

rickscott
12-17-2006, 05:15 PM
If one of the absolute stud DTs drops to us than we'll certainly consider him but other than that, I thinik we'll be looking at CB with the 1st rd pick. I can definitely see the possiblility of a DE here too if Smith leaves, especially now that Pollack is gone.

PalmerToCJ
12-17-2006, 05:35 PM
If one of the absolute stud DTs drops to us than we'll certainly consider him but other than that, I thinik we'll be looking at CB with the 1st rd pick. I can definitely see the possiblility of a DE here too if Smith leaves, especially now that Pollack is gone.

IMO the pick WILL be DE if Smith is gone. There's plenty of depth and someone is bound to fall to us.

I agree, Okam is the only DT we really have a chacne for that I'm wanting to take. We have enough solid DT's just no playmaker, either we address DT round 1 or maybe day 2.

CB is a definete possibility, two solid young CB's for years to come would be a great addition to the offense. The rookie could rotate in with Deltha early on and hopefully challenge him for the starting spot later. It would be SWEET to have a decent CB fall to round 2 and us take Woodley first round if we don't re-sign Smith. CB's are rough to predict at this point because their draft position is impacted so much by their 40 (see Joseph, went from mid second to late first with his combine).

Xfactor
12-17-2006, 08:11 PM
Do you like the idea of drafting Lamar Woodley?

PalmerToCJ
12-17-2006, 09:56 PM
Do you like the idea of drafting Lamar Woodley?

Yes, I'm in love. He'd be a great replacement for Justin Smith if he leaves via FA.

AlexDown
12-17-2006, 10:00 PM
What do you think your team's gameplan for tomorrow's game?

You think they are going to be running the ball more then passing considering how had their run D has been this year?

PalmerToCJ
12-17-2006, 10:21 PM
What do you think your team's gameplan for tomorrow's game?

You think they are going to be running the ball more then passing considering how had their run D has been this year?

We will run for sure but we're a passing team first. I'd say you'll see plenty of runs to start out with but if we get them to start cheating no doubt there will be some bombs sent up top.

I see Rudi topping 100 tomorrow night but I expect the passing game to have the biggest impact.

FootballGod
12-17-2006, 11:13 PM
I am not that rapped up in Woodley as you are CarsontoCJ. He is only 6-2 and doesn't really come up big in big games. He is now labeled as a tweener and is not a pure DE. I would rather have Abiamiri than Woodley because he is more of a pure DE than Woodley. Woodley is built like a 3-4 OLB and I feel that he would have a hard time against NFL tackles because of his arm length. His arms look short to me. I obviously have no measurements on this but just from sight they look short for his body, which makes it hard to shed blockers.
I think that we will have something like the 24th pick in the draft. If this is true then the top 3 CB will most likely be gone. I would love to have M. McCauley from Fresno State because he is the fastest CB in the draft. He is a J. Joseph twin and would be great to have for years to come but I feel that Hall, Revis, and McCauley will all be gone by 24. No other CB is worthy of that high a pick. Originally McCauley was my pick in my mock but I am trying to be true to the draft and say that he will be gone.
Please take a look at Bazuin's stats and tell me why he is not a good fit. Bazuin is a sack master and will be a second round pick.
Safety might not be our pick in the first round but remember this, Ed Reed was selected #24 overall in the draft and look how he as turned out. Griffin is the real deal. Someone has to pick, why not us?

PalmerToCJ
12-17-2006, 11:26 PM
I understand where your picks are coming from, by no means am I bashing them.

I agree about the CB's, I'm hoping that McCauley will fall but I doubt it. That would be insane to have him and Joseph. I already feel like Joseph will emerge as a top CB, the guy is always around the ball... His only problem is he can't catch :lol:

My problem with Bazuin is do you see him as an every down DE? I haven't seen him play but everything I've seen has him pinned as a pass rusher, that's great but we need an every down DE (if Smith leaves). Part of why we were so bad against the run last year was because Geathers struggled as an every down DE.

Abiamiri would be a good pick IMO. By no means would that bother me, I just like what I see in production from Woodley.

I agree that Griffin is a great fit. Marvin puts a lot of emphasis on being good in coverage AND against the run, regardless of SS or FS. He'd be a nice grab but given Jacksons solid play and the fact that he has probably 2 years left in the tank I think we could wait to address saftey until later in the draft to groom one into a starter.

To me CB and DE (if Smith leaves) will be our most pressing needs, given how close we are to something special I think we have to draft players that can have an immediate impact. By no means would I be upset by a Griffin pick.

I'd much rather take Griffin than say Tank Tyler.

derza222
12-18-2006, 03:02 PM
I don't know how Bazuin is going to translate into the NFL, from what I've heard he is very slow off the ball, quick but gets a late start. Safety in the first might be a stretch. I agree it is tough to do a mock without knowing if Smith is staying or not. It might just be easiest to assume he is leaving and base all mocks off of that assumption (or assume he's staying). Either way there should be a known assumption.

Anyway, I went off on a tangent there for a bit. What about Anthony Spencer from Purdue as a DE? I know the size may not be great but he seems like a really good athlete and produced really well in college. Also, Josh Wilson the corner from Maryland could be interesting to look at, not great size but good speed and production, he could rise or stay in the second but either way he could be worth a look. Might be a shorter version of Joseph.

PalmerToCJ
12-18-2006, 04:27 PM
I'd really like to get Fred Bennett. Regardless we need a quick AND fast CB that can hold his own in man coverage. I'm not sure how Spencer would fit us.

Initially I just assumed Smith would be gone but now I'm not so sure. We should lose the contracts of Tory James, John Thornton and Eric Steinbach next year and I don't see us grabbing anyone in FA so that clears some space, along with the NFL expanding the cap number.

While I like Justin Smith, he's not a playmaker. He's solid in every aspect but not great, I hate to see him leave but it would be nice to try and find a DE in the draft. However if we re-sign Smith then we can have more freedom draft day and select CB/S or maybe LB/DT rounds 1 & 2. Should be interesting.

rickscott
12-18-2006, 04:56 PM
With the continuing developement of Geathers as a pass rusher, there is really not a need for J.Smith to be a double digit sacker. We will eventually get improved pass rush from the OLBs when they learn their trade and we will likley look for a Pollack replacement. By the way, about Pollack, did anyone see that he was alarmed that everyone would assume that he is retiring? Apparently it still hinges on the type of surgery that gets done. Remember, Kelly Washington had neck surgery before the draft also and he is fine. I think we will see Skyler Green as our primary PR tonight and I think he'll do well. He was a stud in college.

derza222
12-18-2006, 06:06 PM
With the continuing developement of Geathers as a pass rusher, there is really not a need for J.Smith to be a double digit sacker. We will eventually get improved pass rush from the OLBs when they learn their trade and we will likley look for a Pollack replacement. By the way, about Pollack, did anyone see that he was alarmed that everyone would assume that he is retiring? Apparently it still hinges on the type of surgery that gets done. Remember, Kelly Washington had neck surgery before the draft also and he is fine. I think we will see Skyler Green as our primary PR tonight and I think he'll do well. He was a stud in college.

Supposedly the type of surgery Pollack is having wouldn't be career ending. And that is a good point, Cincy could just go with a decent all-around end in the second or third as a replacement if they feel Geathers can get the job done.

A nice plus come draft day is Brooks' versatility, since unless the coaching staff determines he is definitely a better fit for MLB or SLB the Bengals can pick the best available MLB or SLB and just go from there.

Wilson could be the quick and fast corner who can play man that the Bengals need, and might rise up into the late first where they could select him. He's certainly fast, at 4.35 where Scott has him, and at his size should be quick. Height at 5'9 could be a bit of an issue but may not be so much of an issue. Interesting to check out.

rickscott
12-18-2006, 09:41 PM
Watching this Monday Night game, it doesn't appear our Bengals came to play tonight. That damn Chris Henry can take a seat for the rest of the night if I was coaching. His 1 handed efforts and drops are killing us and our defensive philosophy of allowing Manning all day to read and throw short just ain't working a bit.

PalmerToCJ
12-18-2006, 09:48 PM
Play calling is the biggest problem with this game. It's not so much execution, this freaking zone isn't working.

Tory James is still terrible.

rickscott
12-18-2006, 09:59 PM
I think it's Bresnahan having our LBers spend the night running with their backs to the opponent and allowing all these short passes over the middle. This is a piss poor effort by all of them. This was my bigggest concern, playing the game like you're afraid rather than attacking Manning and putting on some pressure.

Just about every one of our losses has been becasue the defense was forced to play passive and I blame Bresnahan for that

sweetness34
12-18-2006, 10:02 PM
Why is your OC running Rudi outside? :?

rickscott
12-18-2006, 10:05 PM
We miss Chris Perry on passing downs and 3rd down. He has that outside speed. I guess they feel that they have to show that once in awhile.

PalmerToCJ
12-18-2006, 10:06 PM
We miss Chris Perry on passing downs and 3rd down. He has that outside speed. I guess they feel that they have to show that once in awhile.

Perry would've been HUGE this game. Oh well, it is what it is.

rickscott
12-18-2006, 10:57 PM
Well, they definitely played poorly tonight and next week will be tough too. It's up to them if they want to go to the playoffs, they got to play.

FootballGod
12-18-2006, 11:08 PM
Good God to we need Pollack and Thurman back next year. I pray that Pollack will return and if he does then he needs to be back at DE. He is a stud at DE and has that Linebacker type of quickness. I don't care what Thurman has done in the past if he can return clean and play like he did his rookie season. He could have been rookie of the year. We need them both. What do you guys think of putting Pollack back at DE if he returns?

rickscott
12-18-2006, 11:14 PM
Tonight, I didn't think iut was as much personnel as philosophy. We played defense like we were afraid. Our offensive line played poorly too. Can't blame Carson for being erratic when he's running for his life every down. This is the way the season began midpoint went with him being knocked down every other pass.

ccB
12-18-2006, 11:30 PM
Good God to we need Pollack and Thurman back next year. I pray that Pollack will return and if he does then he needs to be back at DE. He is a stud at DE and has that Linebacker type of quickness. I don't care what Thurman has done in the past if he can return clean and play like he did his rookie season. He could have been rookie of the year. We need them both. What do you guys think of putting Pollack back at DE if he returns?I thought Pollacks career was over?

rickscott
12-19-2006, 03:22 AM
Pollack was quoted in the paper as saying that he was alarmed when friends called him to discuss his retirement. He says it's way to early for that topic to be thought of yet as it will depend on what type of surgery gets done and how it all turns out.

PalmerToCJ
12-21-2006, 11:45 PM
Tonight, I didn't think iut was as much personnel as philosophy. We played defense like we were afraid. Our offensive line played poorly too. Can't blame Carson for being erratic when he's running for his life every down. This is the way the season began midpoint went with him being knocked down every other pass.

So true on every point. The players themselves weren't terrible (with the exception of the horribly beat up Oline), the play calling and shceme on defense was just terrible. I believe they're all fixable problems.

Carson is mortal when he loses faith in the Oline. We saw it in the middle of the season and we saw it again Monday night. If he loses faith in the Oline he starts rushing throws and dancing around in the pocket. When he has faith in the Oline he just sits back there and makes the passes calm and cool.

Sunday the protection MUST improve. If Carson is comfortable we win, if not we struggle like Monday and the middle of the season. The Oline is EVERYTHING to this team, much more so than the defense.

Bengalsrz
12-23-2006, 07:24 AM
Basically our whole O-line is out, or we would be doing much better...

rickscott
12-23-2006, 09:29 PM
I think the main problem when Carson gets erratic is that he doesn't have the room to complete his follow through and his release point is higher making balls sail on him. As mentioned, if they give him time, we'll be fine.

PalmerToCJ
12-23-2006, 09:43 PM
Willie is probable. Whitworth only had his first bad game against Freeney so you can understand that. Levi is quesitonable and Braham is out.

Give Carson time and we win, plain and simple. Given the health - or lack thereof - of the offensive line that's a big question mark at this point.

Just watch Carson though, if he gets protection he'll just sit back there cool and calm. If not it's like he's figity and always pump faking. If he has protection he has the confidence in the line and even if he does get pressure he still gets out of it calm and cool.

The season is on the line tomorrow, we can still get in if we lose but it's going to take a whole lot. IMO we win and we're in.

BengalsPwn
12-24-2006, 08:00 AM
I think if the team wants to improve we need to clean house up top and get new coordinators both offensive and defensive. Of course I dont think Marvin should be gone but the only reason I see both sides of the ball play bad is bc the coaches dont put the players in a position to succeed. I believe with a new OC the offense can be taken to new heights. With the lame play calling right now if it wasnt for the talent on offense we would only put up like 6 points a game.

PalmerToCJ
12-24-2006, 11:10 AM
AGREED.

I hope Bratkowski gets a HC job somewhere. Mostly Breshnahan is our problem. It's honestly not so much the players, they've been making tackles.

Our defense is worst against the pass because we RUSH FOUR EVERYTIME!!! You can't expect the secondary to just lie back there and cover for days when there is no heat on the QB.

Breshnahan must go, Bratkowski won't be missed.

Our defense is not as bad as it looks (in talent), I mean did you see how many times the linebackers dropped back 10 yards on first down and Peyton just took what we gave him numerous times.

You can't lose because of play calling, I can take losing because players miss tackles but it was ALL scheme last Monday (on defense). The offense was mostly the Oline.

I wish Marvin would take over the defense for the last however many games we have... He did that to Leslie Frazier.

rickscott
12-24-2006, 08:52 PM
That was about the worst game I have ever seen Palmer play. He overthrew several receivers, rarely hit a guy in stride and then I am about sick of Chris Henry's 1 handed efforts. If Tab Perry was healthy, I think Henry skinny ass would be on the bench. Big players on this team have to step up and start playing big. Chad dropped a couple, Chad was called for a movement violation that cost another TD. Get your heads out of your ass! They don't deserve the playoffs but if Jets lose tomorrow we are still in if we beat the Steelers next week.

BengalsPwn
12-25-2006, 11:49 PM
Leon Washington just delivered a huge lump of coal to the bengals.

rickscott
12-26-2006, 03:43 AM
We are getting exactly what we deserve after embarassing losses to Tampa, and terrible games vs. Atl, SD and Denver. We can call ourselves a good team but these guys have to take the next step and prove it rather than just think it in their heads.

Time to think about next year? I was looking over the WR corp and wondering if there's any chance we maybe try to unload Chris Henry for a draft pick if there's any takers. We have Chad, TJ, Tab Perry, Glen Holt, Benny Brazille, KW, Skylar Green and an upcoming draft. I'm just wondering whether or not they unload Chris just as a way of saying we are tired of antics that distract the team. I know he may be a future star, but it seems if you throw to him 5 times, he catches 1 or 2 at most giving a piss-poor effort at that and then his off field stuff is troubling. Got any opinions?

FootballGod
12-27-2006, 02:21 PM
CB is the most important need on this team. Tory James is no longer able to play CB in the NFL. If you remember when we got him he was only supposed to be a stop gap for a year or two at most. We got more out of him than we thought we could and I thank him for that but its time to go. I dont think he will be offered a contract after this season. J-Jo is our starting CB next year for sure but O'Neil is getting up there in age as well. He is always up and down. Deltha is not the most consistant player out there. Hobson from Bengals.com said it himself, "O’Neal lives pretty far in Lewis’ doghouse these days and Joseph’s emergence hasn’t unlocked any doors. O'Neal has two years left on his deal, but two of his three seasons here have been injury plagued." Wouldn't it be nice to get another shut down CB so that he can learn for a year behind Deltha and maybe take over his spot in 2008.

Steinbach wants LT type of money when he is a Guard. He will get paid top 5 money from someone but I feel that it won't be us. Whitworth is more of a Guard than a Tackle. He only played tackle because of all the injuries to Levi.

I would rather spend the money on a defensive player than on Steinbach when we have his replacement. I am still not sure whether or not we should resign Justin Smith. I would not even call him average as a starter in the NFL. I feel that he is slightly below average as and NFL starter. He only has one move and thats the Bullrush, sorry but this is the NFL and you can't just push everyone around like in college Justin. He is not worth the money. I would rather get a different DE in the draft or Free Agency. I feel that the defense needs a major overhaul. A killer LB, CB, or Safety in free agency would also be better than resigning Smith. What do you guys think about this?

rickscott
12-28-2006, 03:36 AM
I sure hope we can lure a couple "quality" free agents to the team this year. I agree that CB is a definite need in either rd 1 or 2 and no later. I don't know about O'Neal, he was a stud his first year here and this year he plays very disinterested and without any passion at all. I agree James is done. I also think Simmons is about done and wouldn't mind seeing him cut loose. Maybe John Thornton also. I kinda liked Shaun Smith but he must be in the doghouse too. Remember, we get Frostee Rucker back but I thought he was taken way too high. I like J.Smith and we need more "try-hard" guys that always give max effort. He's a good run stopper for a DE and gets you 6-7 sacks too. I hope that we get a clean Odell back but I wouldn't bve surprised to see a move to trade Henry and cut loose Odell to make a point. With the return of Tab Perry and Benny Brazille, we would be pretty good still at WR if we could get a 3rd rd pick for CH. Maybe I'm dreaming. I know he's a stud but he could implode at any minute...especially with the offseason coming up.

PalmerToCJ
12-30-2006, 04:40 PM
I didn't go into depression, I just decided to ignore football for a few days :lol:

I agree. CB MUST be addressed round 1 or 2 of the draft, Marvin himself said the draft is the best route due to the cost of CB's in FA.

DT is NOT a first day need. Peko has a non-stop motor and is a very solid player already, between Robinson/Thornton/Sam we have enough guys for that other slot and Shaun Smith is a good player but Marvin has always had a thing against him (I think he felt he didn't practice well or something).

I would be completely comfortable taking CB/S round 1 and 2. We have enough depth at LB and young guys (Jeanty/Ahmad then Odell and Pollack being question marks). Right now I'm really hoping we re-sign Justin Smith, if not then CB and DE must be the day one picks.

Breshnahan was at least aggressive last week, still I wouldn't mind seeing another DC in there.

Bengalman999
12-31-2006, 12:05 AM
Along with a good CB or 2 we need to maybe find another good linebacker because Pollack is going to need surgery on his neck and it looks to be like 25% that he'd be able to play again, So don't be surprised if he doesn't return because not many people are able to walk away from a broken neck twice in the life without chances of getting paralyzed but it may not and you also have to consider that simmons is pretty much in the same position where he is getting old and on the edge of being to old to keep up, also maybe a decent tight end, for some reason Brown doesn't think tight end is an important position

12-31-2006, 12:07 AM
Along with a good CB or 2 we need to maybe find another good linebacker because Pollack is going to need surgery on his neck and it looks to be like 25% that he'd be able to play again, So don't be surprised if he doesn't return because not many people are able to walk away from a broken neck twice in the life without chances of getting paralyzed but it may not and you also have to consider that simmons is pretty much in the same position where he is getting old and on the edge of being to old to keep up, also maybe a decent tight end, for some reason Brown doesn't think tight end is an important position

You stole my avy. :evil:

PalmerToCJ
12-31-2006, 12:22 AM
Marvin laughs at the idea of addressing TE early, it's just not a need. TJ is the most productive WR on 3rd downs and in the red zone. In a sense he fills our role for TE while our actual TE's block. There is a very slim need for a TE, probably via FA or 6th/7th round.

I don't think LB is a big need. Caleb is a solid backup, Jeanty has some solid potential, Landon is productive, Ahmad has massive potential, Odell could be back, Nicholson could still be productive. Given how weak LB is in this class there's really not any reason to address it. It seems every year Marvin flirts with a LB in FA (Hartwell, Sharper, Arrington etc) so there's potential we go that route as well. The future could still be Jeanty/Odell/Ahmad and that's pretty solid, Ahmad WILL be a star in this league.

I'd be all over Michael Griffin round 1 and Aaron Ross round 2. Our secondary would be set for years.

I'm not convinced we need to re-sign Justin Smith so I'm just going to assume the Blackburns will take care of him and until he's officially gone I'll just ignore DE as a need. Geathers/Rucker/Smith would be enough for the near future. Given Geathers ability as a pass rusher he can be groomed into a solid starter, plus I think he'll only be like 24 next season.

Bengalman999
12-31-2006, 04:13 PM
All I gotta say is that we are the Boston Red Sox of the NFl with everything that has happened to us :(

Bengalman999
01-01-2007, 02:22 AM
I wonder why we don't start Geathers more, the guy was the first player on team to record over 10 sack since Reinard Wilson I believe in 2001 and the fact is he was sharing time with robinson. I mean he's in only his 3rd year going into his forth, so it's not like he has an age problem, I think Marvin and Bresnahan have been to reliant on the athleticsism of our defensive backs to make the big play but putting some pressure on the quarterback is what causes the bad throws in which we can intercept, because I know our D Line hasn't produced much in the recent years.

PalmerToCJ
01-01-2007, 11:38 AM
Peko is a keeper on the Oline, I think Geathers can be developed into an every down DE (as I said I think he's only like 23).

It would be really nice to get Woodley round one however we're up too high for that and we could potentially get McCauley which would be sweet. Griffin would be there for the taking and maybe, just maybe Reggie Nelson could fall back to us.

I think a certain amount of the lack of pressure on the QB is on Breshnahan. It's hard to get pressure on the QB sending 4 every time on 3rd and long.

Peko/Fanene/Shaun Smith may be the future starters at DT. I like what I see from Peko/Smith. At DE Geathers has potential to be an every down DE so that almost sets up our DL. Just depends on what we do with Justin Smith, it'd be nice to re-sign him for sure.

We MUST take a CB round 1 or 2. James sucks, Deltha has fallen out of favor and Joseph is our only solid starter. Saftey wouldn't be bad to address only if some stud, playmaking Saftey is there for the taking.

Next year I think we address the 2nd CB spot, Ahmad Brooks starts at SLB and bring pressure on the QB, our Oline gets healthy.

Next year we play the NFC West, AFC East and 2 easier fill in games. I'm honestly already anticipating a 13-3 season next year.


This year was just one of those years, we couldn't do things right ourselves and when we did we'd get screwed (see Tampa game). These kind of years are bound to happen, the Chargers fans are all too familiar.

rickscott
01-01-2007, 03:25 PM
For some reason, Shaun Smith has gotten in Marvin's doghouse and was inactive for the last 2 games. I do think we still have DT problems evidenced by the way Pitts ran down our throats. Our LBers, other than maybe a Brooks, are not the type can can step in a hole and make a stop at the line. I love what Caleb has done but he's a sideline to sideline guy and to be effective in run stopping, I sure hope Odell makes it back. I think we have quite a few holes. We absolutely have to have 1 CB that can become an eventual starter if not immediately and hopefully we draft 2 CBs that make the team. We need a young Safety unless makes Jones or Busing can really be NFL starters. We need a pass rushing DE to replace Smith. We need another gem like Peko. Right now, we have 2 LBers on this team that are of no use to the defense, Wilkens and Frazier are strictly Spec Teamers. They are valuable but I would prefer they be replaced with guys that can play both well. On offense, I'd like a TE, another WR and OG depth. Maybe even a RB late in the draft.....that's far more requests than we have draft picks but hopefully we can fill most of our needs. Hopefully we are aggressive in free agency and go after quality

deyebc
01-01-2007, 04:26 PM
1st Round
CB/DE
CB - Marcus McCauley hands down the best nfl prospect(size, build and speed to be the other good corner we need)

DE - If we decide to move to a 3/4 finally i'd say we pick up Adam Carriker from Nebraska as he's a big guy that can move.

DE - If we stay in a 4/3 then a more athletic DE like Victor Abiamiri.

2nd Round
DE/CB

CB - Fred Bennett of South Carolina, has a lot of upside and would be a good nickel CB until Deltha is done.

DE - Tim Crowder of Texas - Athletic and has good size. Will upgrade our pass rush from what Justin Smith did.



Also, Justin Smith will be gone unless we can sign him resonable. We might also take another lineback to replace Odell in the 3rd round since he wont be back as meth is a hard drug to beat.....

FootballGod
01-01-2007, 05:22 PM
Good first post but we dont have a 3rd round pick this year.

rickscott
01-01-2007, 07:35 PM
I have never heard anyone within the organization mention the idea of going to a 3-4. With downlinemen like Geathers, J. Smith(who is likely gone) and Frostee Rucker, they would all have to convert to OLBer and that is asking alot to have numerous guys switching positions. Also, Sam Adams was at his best as a 4-3 guy with the Ravens and I have to admit that I don't see him taking up to blockers too often anymore. I think we will remain a 4-3 and unless Bresnahan goes away, it seems we will be a very passive 4-3 that allows QBs to scan the field forever before making a throw.

deyebc
01-01-2007, 11:58 PM
It is not out of reach to think the bengals could move to a 3/4....

Geathers could be used in the same way that under-sized Terrel Suggs in Baltimore is being used in a DE/OLB, Sam Adams and Shaun Smith would be more than adequate at ng, drafting a 3/4 DE and mixing in Domato would fill the other end(this would leave out John Thornton and Bryan Robinson who are making more than they are worth to the team right now).

Then at linebacker is where you would need things to happen. IF Odell comes back you have Odell and Simmons in the middle (eventually Brooks for Simmons) with Jeanty (would be a great OLB in a 3/4 and could even line up at end on passing downs like joey porter) and L. Johnson on the outside.

A couple of things would have to fall into place for the bengals to switch to a 3/4, but none of which is too far-fetched and anything is better than the non-blitzing 4-3 being run now.

rickscott
01-02-2007, 09:14 PM
Listening to Marvin today, he made it quite clear that he doesn't expect Odell to be a member of the team. Maybe he's just making him sweat but I think Marvin is still pissed. Then, we go and sign Berryman of Iowa St to the practice squad after the kid has been arrested like 5 times in his Jr yr getting himself kicked out of the school. I don't get it? I don't know if a switch to 3-4 will take place but I do feel we need an upgrade in DT, CB....and now that I think of it, I was likely going to include LB and S too so we need lots of help on defense and unless Mike Brown goes out and gets us Adaluis Thomas, which would be huge, I doubt we can fill all of our needs in the draft.

rickscott
01-02-2007, 10:22 PM
Selfishness keeps being mentioned as one of the root causes for our teams problems this season. It is obvious to think that the finger points at Chad but I think it more likely points at Chris Henry, Delta O'Neal and Odell Thurman. These guys let the team down major by their off the field actions that led to suspensions and benchings. If Odell isn't forgiven and brought back (should he meet all league requirements for reinstatement), then hopefully he can be traded and get some value in return. For a rookie LBer, he was tops in tackles, 4 pics, 4 forced fumbles and brought a face of toughness to this defense that was lacking this year. I hope Marvin gives him 1 more chance, but who knows, maybe by next preseason, Odell will be in some alley doing crack, hopefully not. This offseason is really big to see if Chris Henry learned a lesson. I would think that just reading about D-Williams should convince Chris that staying home is the best thing during the season from now on.

deyebc
01-02-2007, 10:51 PM
No way Henry stops going out, I saw him down in Clifton the day after he got arrested for Marijuana poss.

FootballGod
01-03-2007, 11:03 PM
Who cares if he goes out as long as he keeps going long for TD grabs.

PalmerToCJ
01-03-2007, 11:39 PM
As far as the 3-4 debate goes... I'll say this, I HOPE against all HOPE that Breshnahan is GONE. He is entirely too careful in his play calling, games when we go at the QB we do well (that is not sending 4 every down), games we send 4 every time (see Indy game) we struggle.

I highly doubt we go 3-4. Unless a 3-4 guy is brought in, regardless for the defense to reach a top 15 level we need another CB and a new DC.

As far as the selfishness claims go I think a lot of it has to do with Deltha, Marvin was very PO'd at him before the DUI because he felt he wasn't as injured as he was letting on and the DUI just made it worse. It has to be him, Odell and Henry but clearly Henry has at least some respect from Marvin. Henry will never learn either, I'm full of crazy stories about him (police reports, first hand accounts etc. :lol: ).

I hope Odell gets another shot, if it doesn't work out it doesn't work out but the guy can flat out play. Him at the level he played his rookie year with Brooks beside him (WOW). Jeanty I'm very impressed with, Landon you always know the kind of production you'll get out of him.

Concerning the draft I see our needs as....

1a. CB (McCauley round 1, Bennet/Ross round 2).
1b. DE (Round one we'd likely trade down to get good value, round 2 there will be plenty to be had... I don't see Moses as a good fit).
2. S (Playmaker like Griffin would be sweet, then address CB round 2)

Regardless we MUST address 2nd starting CB in either FA or probably the draft. Marvin seems to prefer the draft and after hitting gold with Joseph why shouldn't he?

rickscott
01-04-2007, 03:40 AM
A guy I'm really starting to like in Rd 2 is Dan Bazuin DE . It appears that he could really end up being a player and I think the MAC guys kinda go unnoticed or somewhat disrespected to an extent questioning what they accomplished and who they did it against. I like the Fred Bennett kid too as he would be able to team with his old running mate Jonathan Joseph.

I would hope that if Thurman isn't back, we at l;east trade him rather than release him.

deyebc
01-05-2007, 04:37 PM
I completely agree that chuck needs to be relieved of his defensive play calling job. He may be a great motivator and a good disciplinarian(military background) but he does not call the game well. He plays too much cover two man that requires a ton of skill to be effective. We need a coordinator that will actually have the other team's offense questioning what kind of defense will be called next. Right now there is just not any mystery to what defense is going to be called and you do need to mix up your defensive play calls to be good(Ravens).....

PalmerToCJ
01-06-2007, 11:23 AM
I completely agree that chuck needs to be relieved of his defensive play calling job. He may be a great motivator and a good disciplinarian(military background) but he does not call the game well. He plays too much cover two man that requires a ton of skill to be effective. We need a coordinator that will actually have the other team's offense questioning what kind of defense will be called next. Right now there is just not any mystery to what defense is going to be called and you do need to mix up your defensive play calls to be good(Ravens).....

Agreed completely. Our defense is very predictable and I think even with players like on the Ravens and Bears we still wouldn't have a top 5 D given Breshnahans terrible play calling. In the few games he brought heat on the QB from safties and LB's we won other than Denver but that was the fault of the offense.

In a dream offseason...

Breshnahan gets fired
Justin Smith leaves BUT we draft Quentin Moses
2nd round Aaaron Ross, Josh Wilson or Fred Bennett
Odell is allowed to stay, Pollack is able to recover

PalmerToCJ
01-06-2007, 04:56 PM
Now that it seems like there's actually some regular posters in here... :lol:


What's your top 4 out of these guys that could be there round 1 of the draft (DE's we'll assume Justin Smith is gone)

Darrelle Revis
Marcus McCauley
Quentin Moses
Victor Abiamiri
Charles Johnson
Reggie Nelson
Michael Griffin

My list:

1. Reggie Nelson - Versitile, could play CB or S and Marvin likes those guys.
2. Darrelle Revis - Tory James is done, Deltha is average at best we need a #2.
3. Quentin Moses - I'd like him to be better in run support plus there are studs to be had round 2.
4. Marcus McCauley - Raw but so was Joseph.


Round 2 I like Tim Crowder, Fred Bennett and Aaron Ross.

deyebc
01-07-2007, 12:27 PM
1 Marcus McCauley - if he is still there at 18 we should grab him (he has the ability to be lockdown CB and those don't come around very often)
2 Victor Abiamiri - Solid player in college a lot like Geathers when he came out, but more matured.
3 Charles Johnson - great year but it's tough to call whether that will translate well into the pros
4 Michael Griffin - If he is still around there is a legitimate argument that they take him as the SS of the future (one year learning behind Dexter Jackson will work wonders). The downside is that you lose out on a position that is more needed such as DE or CB.


Quentin Moses won't be there when we pick and he is more of a 3/4 OLB than DE.
Darrelle Revis will be interesting with what time he runs at the combine. If he runs in the 4.35 range he is top 20.
Reggie Nelson - we already have a FS

PalmerToCJ
01-07-2007, 12:41 PM
The reason I like Nelson is he could be potentially swapped to CB if needed and Marvin doesn't like the use of a FS and SS... Just two safties that can both stop the run and cover well.

I'm growing on Abiamiri, I haven't seen anything from Johnson so I don't have much of an opinion on him.

I agree with you about taking a saftey, I think the only way we can is if they're a can't miss type player. I like Nelson because he could potentially start a year at corner then we could draft another and eventually he could replace Jackson (it'd be asking a lot but still he has the ability).

PalmerToCJ
01-07-2007, 09:44 PM
Have you all heard the rumor that Justin Smiths locker and everything has already been cleaned out? I had a friend tell me it but I'm not sure of it.

Given Anderson coming out the draft plays right into our hands with the great CB's and DE's to be had.

deyebc
01-08-2007, 01:43 AM
yeah it sucks to lose someone that is as solid as Justin Smith but with the talent at DE in this draft we have the possibility of bringing in a more explosive DE to team with Geathers.

FootballGod
01-08-2007, 01:52 PM
Have you all heard the rumor that Justin Smiths locker and everything has already been cleaned out? I had a friend tell me it but I'm not sure of it.

Given Anderson coming out the draft plays right into our hands with the great CB's and DE's to be had.
I have yet to see an Anderson vs. Moses comparison. I am not sure who would be the better pro at this point. Two of the top 3 DE's and CB's will on the board when we pick at 18. We are set up to have a great first round no matter what.
Justin's locker is cleared out. Sports talk in Cincinnati said so last week.

PalmerToCJ
01-08-2007, 02:45 PM
Yes, round one is shaping up lovely and given the talent coming in at DE it might be best to just wait off until round 2 for a DE.

Round 1...

Anderson, Moses, Revis or McCauley should be there. Anderson would be a better immediate fit given his build (6'6 280) to play every down but STL or someone else in front of us should be a runner for him. I'm hoping Brohm comes out and that makes one less player we would want go ahead of us (Panthers/St. Louis).

fischbowl
01-08-2007, 03:47 PM
I currently have the Bengals in a GM Mock

Any suggestions?

My basis is to switch to a 3-4.

deyebc
01-08-2007, 03:56 PM
It would be fantastic if they made the switch but as I posted earlier there are a lot of things that would have to fall into place for that to happen and it doesnt look like some of them will happen. Having said this I think the best picks in order of availability are:
1 Quentin Moses
2 Marcus McCauley/Darrelle Revis (I think after the combine we will have a better feel for which will be there)
3 Victor Abiamiri
4 Charles Johnson
5 Michael Griffin

derza222
01-08-2007, 04:21 PM
Yes, round one is shaping up lovely and given the talent coming in at DE it might be best to just wait off until round 2 for a DE.

Round 1...

Anderson, Moses, Revis or McCauley should be there. Anderson would be a better immediate fit given his build (6'6 280) to play every down but STL or someone else in front of us should be a runner for him. I'm hoping Brohm comes out and that makes one less player we would want go ahead of us (Panthers/St. Louis).

I honestly don't know if Anderson is going to be there, he's a sick pass rusher and there's talk he could rise after pre-draft workouts and go before Adams.

As for the guys you mentioned before, I'd personally go:
1. Nelson
2. Revis
3. Johnson
4. Griffin (I was thinking about Abiamiri but I think Griffin is safer)

Not a big fan of Moses or McCauley personally as they didn't produce well this year, but that's just me I guess. What about Glenn Dorsey if he comes out?

I heard somewhere that because of the bad corner play they're considering moving Madieu Williams back to corner (he was a CB/S coming out) so if that's true I guess they could just go best DB available and put Madieu wherever they need him...

PalmerToCJ
01-08-2007, 04:44 PM
Where did you see this Madieu rumor at? Wouldn't be the worst decision but I think given his production at saftey it'd be hard to move him back to corner with guys like McCauley and Revis there to be had round 1 (I think the only saftey there will be Griffin).


There's a lot to be decided between now and the draft (Justin Smith and maybe the Madieu move) that would have a large impact on who we take.

Regardless I am extremely confident it will be CB/DE/S.

derza222
01-08-2007, 04:49 PM
Where did you see this Madieu rumor at? Wouldn't be the worst decision but I think given his production at saftey it'd be hard to move him back to corner with guys like McCauley and Revis there to be had round 1 (I think the only saftey there will be Griffin).


There's a lot to be decided between now and the draft (Justin Smith and maybe the Madieu move) that would have a large impact on who we take.

Regardless I am extremely confident it will be CB/DE/S.

Actually I don't think the Madieu thing was that legit, it was a question I saw at some point. Doesn't make much sense now that I think about it, I'd rather he sticks at safety. What about DT depending on who's available? I agree it should be line or secondary, and tackle may not be that huge of a need but if he's the best DL/DB available I'd at least think about it.

PalmerToCJ
01-08-2007, 11:09 PM
There's no real need to pick a DT day one. Domata Peko was the second best rookie DT behind Ngata so he'll start... Then we signed big Sam, there's no reason to take a DT to sit next year when we're on the brink. Plus Marvin isn't a fan of DT's early (he is of CB's though) and he hit success with Peko and Smith/Fanene have potential to become starters.

LB isn't a huge need either, especially given how weak the class is this year. Miller/Brooks/Nicholson all have potential to start at MLB and be productive players. Jeanty is a productive SLB but Brooks could also move in there. Only real issue is WLB but Landon is a solid player and I think there are bigger needs than that slot.

Either way Ahmad Brooks WILL start next year, Pollack got good news, who knows about Odell. I'm sure Jeanty has earned a starting spot as well, he's great in run support. Caleb and Landon are not great but they're solid LB's. There is just no real big need for a LB at this point. I'm not sure what Simmons future is with the team, he might have one more year left in the tank... I thought Hardy may have back in '05 but Marvin cut him so who knows.

The issues at DE and CB are just too big to ignore.

CB we have our #1 Johnathan Joseph.... Then a bunch of question marks. Deltha has lost a lot of respect from Marvin (not because of the DUI but injury) and Tory James is TERRIBLE. Then that leaves Keiwan who is nothing more than a nickel back and some reserves who haven't seen the light of day. Our pass D was #31 for a reason and the pass rush wasn't great but not bad enough to cause them to be that bad, it's because the play of our #2 CB was so terrible.

At DE we have Geathers who still isn't an every down DE and Robinson who isn't anything special. Then Justin Smith is likely gone and he was a productive pass/run defense guy. I don't want Rucker taking that spot, there will be solid DE's to be had round 2 or round 1 so it has to be addressed here.

Grizzlegom
01-08-2007, 11:11 PM
hey i was just wondering how Ethan Kilmer did for u guys this year and what u think about his future in the NFL??

he was a Special teams beast for us at PSU and i was surprised and excited to see him get drafted but i havent seen many bengals games and i was wondering what u guys thought of him.

Shiver
01-09-2007, 12:50 AM
Hue Jackson is now the Falcons OC.


WOOT


That is all.

PalmerToCJ
01-09-2007, 12:32 PM
hey i was just wondering how Ethan Kilmer did for u guys this year and what u think about his future in the NFL??

he was a Special teams beast for us at PSU and i was surprised and excited to see him get drafted but i havent seen many bengals games and i was wondering what u guys thought of him.

He's a special teams beast for us as well. He's had some games at saftey (took a INT to the house vs. Saints) and had a lot of practice at WR.

He's a versitile guy that has a lot of job security given his speed, versitility and effort.





Onto Hue Jackson, I'm glad for him. He's a great motivator and communicates well with his player, I see no reason why he won't succeed as the OC and I wish him well... He earned it.

BengalsPwn
01-09-2007, 12:51 PM
Now all we got to do is can our OC and DC and we will be set for next year. Hopefully we take a great pass rushing DE in the first. There is a reason our corners look bad, its bc we get 0 pressure on the QB unless we blitz w/ our whole front 7. Moses or by some miracle Gaines is still there they should be the pick. In the second if Olsen or Griffin is there I would take one of them. CB is not our biggest weakness. We have JJ and Deltha w/ Keiwan as the nickel. I think SS and DE is the most important issues w/ TE there if the value is right.

PalmerToCJ
01-09-2007, 01:08 PM
While the pass rush wasn't great it wasn't the reason our pass D was so bad. We were middle of the road in sacks (16th) and Justin Smith was top 15 in getting pressure on the QB (hurries/sacks).

Tory James is gone, Deltha is back to being average... We must address CB, if Moses/Anderson aren't there then Revis/McCauley should be the pick.


About the assistants... You'd have to think with Jackson getting the OC job at ATL that Bratkowski will stay, while he isn't the best he isn't nearly as bad as Breshnahan. Breshnahan MUST be fired, he cost us several games himself. The Colts game was strictly on him, the players executed but they were executing a terrible game play and he didn't make the proper adjustments within the game.

deyebc
01-10-2007, 08:20 PM
Good we signed Geather to an extension before he became too expensive for us to pay him.

PalmerToCJ
01-10-2007, 11:14 PM
Agreed. He is a stud in the making, I was a basher of him before this year but he has impressed me vs. the run and vs. the pass.

More sacks and TFL's than Justin Smith.... AND he's 4 years younger. That tells you who we should've re-signed...

I hope we pay all 33 mil, that means he's a beast and reached all of his incentives.

BengalsPwn
01-12-2007, 12:05 PM
This would be my dream starting defense for next season:

RCB-D. O'neal
LCB-J. Joseph
FS-M. Williams
SS-D. Jackson
WLB-A. Nicholson
MLB-O. Thurman
SLB-A. Brooks
RDE-D. Pollack
NT-D. Peko
UT-S.Smith
LDE-R. Geathers

PalmerToCJ
01-12-2007, 08:43 PM
Nice. That's being optimistic though, we know Pollack/Odell probably won't start the first several games for sure so to be real we should probably scratch them out.

Mine (Including draft picks)

CB - Fred Bennett (eventually replacing Deltha)
CB - Johnathan Joseph
S - Dexter Jackson
S - Madieu Williams
WLB - Landon Johnson
MLB - Ahmad Brooks
SLB - Rashad Jeanty (I really like what I see from Jeanty)
LE - Robert Geathers
DT - Domata Peko
DT - Shaun Smith/Sam Adams rotation (I like what I see from Smith)
RE - Quentin Moses

Then we can hope Pollack/Odell become key pieces later in the season, but I doubt it. There will be some interesting players to watch. I want to see what kind of impact Nicholson, Geathers, Brooks and the new RE will have next year.

Joseph/Peko/Geathers will continue to mature, hopefully Shaun Smith sees a lot more PT. I don't expect much from Pollack/Odell.

Caleb is also a VERY solid backup.

PalmerToCJ
01-14-2007, 04:58 PM
Anyone have any bets on our record next year?

I'm going with 13-3.

AFC East (3-1), NFC West (4-0), Division (4-2), Titans/Chiefs (2-0).

Keeping in mind I thought we'd go 10-6 this year even before the injuries and figured we'd get in as a wildcard so I'm not a blind homer when it comes to picking how we'll finish.

Shiver
01-14-2007, 05:27 PM
Fill me in on Eric Steinbach; first of which will he be resigned?

PalmerToCJ
01-14-2007, 06:05 PM
Fill me in on Eric Steinbach; first of which will he be resigned?

No.

He's a very athletic LG and he is going to cash in big somewhere, he does his best work out in space.

deyebc
01-15-2007, 06:50 PM
Whitworth is better at Guard and should fill in nicely for Steinbach, but the major loss is the O-line Depth which aside from Stacy Andrews and Ben Wilkerson looks very thin. I could see the Bengals drafting a tackle/guard in the 4th/5th round....

PalmerToCJ
01-15-2007, 06:56 PM
Whitworth is better at Guard and should fill in nicely for Steinbach, but the major loss is the O-line Depth which aside from Stacy Andrews and Ben Wilkerson looks very thin. I could see the Bengals drafting a tackle/guard in the 4th/5th round....

Agreed. I fully expect a OT/OG type guy round 4 or 5, we take a hit to depth via Whitworth and Ghiaciuc moving into starting spots.

I'm pleased with Andrews at RG, it appears that project may be paying off. Then we have Wilkerson at C but no real tackle backups (not sure if anything will come of Kooistra). The good thing is in the event Willie/Levi get hurt Whitworth can slide in then one of our backups can play guard.

The more I look at it the more I think that if Patrick Willis falls back to us he will be the pick. Then Ahmad would be moved outside and Willis would be our MLB, he can rush the passer and stop the run... We could use that for sure and we know how much Marvin is in love with LB's. With that said I doubt he falls to us anyway just something I considered.

At this point Moses is looking like the most likely pick.

BengalsPwn
01-15-2007, 08:01 PM
Why would we take a LB? Even w/o Odell coming back we could use Brooks at MLB or AJ. Lets not forget that AJ was a shining star at rookie camp until he got hurt. I wouldnt be surprised if he broke into the starting rotation this season. He could play all LB spots too. He played WLB at FSU so he is fast enough and he is big enough to play SLB. He practiced at MLB during rookie camp so watch out for him there too. We got depth with Landon and Caleb. So LB wont be too big of a draft day need. Unless a big time LB prospect falls far into day 2 I dont believe we even draft a single one.

PalmerToCJ
01-15-2007, 10:35 PM
Think though how set we were last year when Marvin picked Ahmad...

I'm not saying it should be done, I'm just saying I wouldn't doubt it. Marvin was also in love with Thomas Howard and it was rumored he'd be our first rounder last year. Kendrell Bell/Lavar Arrington/Ed Hartwell/Jamie Sharper... The list goes on and on of LB's we've tried for when LB was a position of less need than others. If he see's a can't miss talent that is BPA (especially at LB) I wouldn't doubt him selecting that player.

As I said though, I fully expect Moses round one with a DB round 2. Then round 4/5 we address TE/OL and KR/PR round 6 or 7 then maybe a DT or something nifty in the remaining round.

BengalsPwn
01-16-2007, 02:38 PM
Think though how set we were last year when Marvin picked Ahmad...

I'm not saying it should be done, I'm just saying I wouldn't doubt it. Marvin was also in love with Thomas Howard and it was rumored he'd be our first rounder last year. Kendrell Bell/Lavar Arrington/Ed Hartwell/Jamie Sharper... The list goes on and on of LB's we've tried for when LB was a position of less need than others. If he see's a can't miss talent that is BPA (especially at LB) I wouldn't doubt him selecting that player.

As I said though, I fully expect Moses round one with a DB round 2. Then round 4/5 we address TE/OL and KR/PR round 6 or 7 then maybe a DT or something nifty in the remaining round.
Dont forget TAB man TAB.

deyebc
01-16-2007, 04:54 PM
Tab isn't a punt returner and even though he is jogging lightly with his reconstructed hip it is still unknown how well he'll come back....so it's not out of the question to draft a PR in the later rounds considering how bad our punt returners this year were.

BengalsPwn
01-16-2007, 05:56 PM
Tab was practicing PR in training camp before he got hurt and was looking pretty good at it from what they said at camp. Hopefully Brazell can return punts or try Keiwan again. It would be such a waste to draft just a returner late in the draft.

PalmerToCJ
01-16-2007, 08:53 PM
Tab isn't a punt returner and even though he is jogging lightly with his reconstructed hip it is still unknown how well he'll come back....so it's not out of the question to draft a PR in the later rounds considering how bad our punt returners this year were.

Amen.

Tab was becoming a decent WR and coming off his injury it would be nice to get a CB or WR that is a solid KR/PR to do both duties. No doubt Tab is a solid KR but off his injury who knows... He's not a PR either, not agile or quick enough.

Keiwan is a terrible PR, he's usually towards the bottom of the league in returns (I think we were 3rd from last this year).

Remember I said round 6 or 7... You act like we're blowing a big time draft pick.



I'm tired of people giving us a DT in the draft when we have so many other bigger needs, it's just ignorance of our team really.

quickcc
01-16-2007, 09:36 PM
I am going to start this off by saying that I am going to assume that we finish the season at 8-8 or at best 9-7. That would give us a pick between 16-22. Lets go ahead and say that we average a 19th pick. Please tell me what you think. I can take the criticism and welcome it.

Round 1. Quinn Pitcock, DT, Ohio State Sr, 6-3, 295: I feel that he is the second best DT in the draft behind Alan Branch. Quinn would fit perfect into our 4-3 base defense and could also play DE when we switch to 3-4. Sam Adams and John Thornton are unproductive and old. Pitcock and Peko in the middle would look great for years to come.




Pretty good prediction of 8-8.
We should have finished 12-5, If you don't believe me, let's take a little stroll down Washout Lane.
Remember Tampagate? The San Diego Meltdown? Denver? That final Steelers game with that traitor Santonio :).
My dad's been a Bengals fan for 20-25 years or so (I haven't even been on the planet quite that long) and he always says it's just nice to be able to be disappointed with an 8-8 finish.
Back in the mid-nineties people would have cried tears of joy at an 8-8 Cin City finish.
We know we're on the way up, so why am I hearing cries of "fire Marvin" around where I live and "Marvin's on the hotseat" by the likes of Jim Rome *cough* narcissist *cough*?

I know the discussion has shifted to O and ST, but I saw this post and couldn't pass it up.
No offense, FootballGod, but even if Pitcock is there -which somebody will probably buy into the hype and take him in the first 15- I'd absolutely hate this pick.
Pitcock is not an impact player, but he is surrounded by them (even if they don't get the credit they deserve yet) and he does not merit a 18th overall pick.
Where was Quinn when we needed him in the NC game? Playing hide-and-go-seek with the Florida O-line.


I love Pitcock and I hope he does well in the NFL, I'm also a OSU fan, but I don't think he should go nearly this high and I think if Mikey B. did take him with that pick it could potentially be another "Big Daddy"/ Klingler/ etc. type of pick. Not that Pitcock doesn't have the drive like Wilkinson didn't, but that it would be a disaster of comparable magnitude to a team clearly on a big upswing.

Now, I could be out of the loop, since I have no one offline to consistently discuss football with that researches, but I'm thinking maybe Michael Griffin with this first pick (or L. Landry if he somehow managed to fall this far.)
Not that I don't love Dexter Jackson, but I think he's going to hit the same age curve that Tory hit in the next year or two. When that happens, we need a guy who has the size and speed to come into the lineup and I'm not necessarily believing (just yet) that Kaesviharn is it.
Plus I hear that they might be trying to move Madieu over to CB which would open up the slot opposite Dexter for Griffin to step into early.
So, assuming they've lost all faith in Deltha (the way I have lost all faith in Tory) we'd end up with Madieu, Dexter, JonJo, and M. Griffin as our DBs.
I think that would be an excellent arrangement (particularly with Kaesviharn as extraordinary safety depth.)

I also would be extremely happy with either Omobi Okoye or a DeMarcus Tyler.
I know Okoye isn't supposed to fall this far, but neither was Claude Wroten last year (I think he fell to the fourth round) so who knows where a high-octane guy like Okoye could end up within the first.
DeMarcus could also fall to the second because there are so many playmakers on the board that other teams would probably take first; in which case, I would consider it a "steal" if the Bengals nabbed him there.
Forgive me if I don't exude much confidence in Sam Adams, but I saw teams running straight at him last year and winning those battles on a consistent basis. Injured or not, Big Sam didn't play like a former pro-bowler too much last year.
Age has a funny way of dealing with football, two years ago Tory was a pro-bowler and now the consensus is that he's done -I believe that consensus- and I think Sam might have hit the same point last year (I could be completely mistaken.)

Another thing I don't understand, why does everyone hate Frostee Rucker so vehemetly? I know he wasn't supposed to go until the seventh round last year, but obviously something changed in the weeks leading up to the draft. Just because the "experts" said he wasn't worthy of a pick earlier than the seventh round doesn't mean the teams agreed with those experts.
Anyone remember Brodrick Bunkley last year? He was supposed to go in the late first or second by almost all of the accounts that I saw. I think he ended up at 11th overall. I already mentioned Claude Wroten from last year. Almost every draft analysis book I read had him written off by the second easily, he ended up in the fourth or so.
So why is it so shocking to see a high-motor guy from an elite college program that was in the National Championship the year before jump up the board?
I may be the only guy here who will say this, but so far I can't disagree with the Frostee pick (outside of the spousal battery -only bastards, pardon my French, do that.)
He hasn't even touched the field in a regular season game yet. So can we cut him and Marvin a little slack?
Maybe this is the wrong crowd for slack.

Another interest of mine is whether or not Odell will be back next year.
Bengals.com is expectedly tight-lipped about him, so does anyone here know what the consensus is?
Don't forget this man was mini-RayLew last year, and he was a steal (talent-wise) in the second. I'm all for seeing him back next year -especially after giving Chris Henry a second, third, fourth, fifth, and nineteenth chance at returning- but I would like to know the general thoughts and your ideas about whether or not he even SHOULD come back.

Sincerely,
DA

BengalsPwn
01-17-2007, 12:57 PM
I am going to start this off by saying that I am going to assume that we finish the season at 8-8 or at best 9-7. That would give us a pick between 16-22. Lets go ahead and say that we average a 19th pick. Please tell me what you think. I can take the criticism and welcome it.

Round 1. Quinn Pitcock, DT, Ohio State Sr, 6-3, 295: I feel that he is the second best DT in the draft behind Alan Branch. Quinn would fit perfect into our 4-3 base defense and could also play DE when we switch to 3-4. Sam Adams and John Thornton are unproductive and old. Pitcock and Peko in the middle would look great for years to come.




Pretty good prediction of 8-8.
We should have finished 12-5, If you don't believe me, let's take a little stroll down Washout Lane.
Remember Tampagate? The San Diego Meltdown? Denver? That final Steelers game with that traitor Santonio :).
My dad's been a Bengals fan for 20-25 years or so (I haven't even been on the planet quite that long) and he always says it's just nice to be able to be disappointed with an 8-8 finish.
Back in the mid-nineties people would have cried tears of joy at an 8-8 Cin City finish.
We know we're on the way up, so why am I hearing cries of "fire Marvin" around where I live and "Marvin's on the hotseat" by the likes of Jim Rome *cough* narcissist *cough*?

I know the discussion has shifted to O and ST, but I saw this post and couldn't pass it up.
No offense, FootballGod, but even if Pitcock is there -which somebody will probably buy into the hype and take him in the first 15- I'd absolutely hate this pick.
Pitcock is not an impact player, but he is surrounded by them (even if they don't get the credit they deserve yet) and he does not merit a 18th overall pick.
Where was Quinn when we needed him in the NC game? Playing hide-and-go-seek with the Florida O-line.


I love Pitcock and I hope he does well in the NFL, I'm also a OSU fan, but I don't think he should go nearly this high and I think if Mikey B. did take him with that pick it could potentially be another "Big Daddy"/ Klingler/ etc. type of pick. Not that Pitcock doesn't have the drive like Wilkinson didn't, but that it would be a disaster of comparable magnitude to a team clearly on a big upswing.

Now, I could be out of the loop, since I have no one offline to consistently discuss football with that researches, but I'm thinking maybe Michael Griffin with this first pick (or L. Landry if he somehow managed to fall this far.)
Not that I don't love Dexter Jackson, but I think he's going to hit the same age curve that Tory hit in the next year or two. When that happens, we need a guy who has the size and speed to come into the lineup and I'm not necessarily believing (just yet) that Kaesviharn is it.
Plus I hear that they might be trying to move Madieu over to CB which would open up the slot opposite Dexter for Griffin to step into early.
So, assuming they've lost all faith in Deltha (the way I have lost all faith in Tory) we'd end up with Madieu, Dexter, JonJo, and M. Griffin as our DBs.
I think that would be an excellent arrangement (particularly with Kaesviharn as extraordinary safety depth.)

I also would be extremely happy with either Omobi Okoye or a DeMarcus Tyler.
I know Okoye isn't supposed to fall this far, but neither was Claude Wroten last year (I think he fell to the fourth round) so who knows where a high-octane guy like Okoye could end up within the first.
DeMarcus could also fall to the second because there are so many playmakers on the board that other teams would probably take first; in which case, I would consider it a "steal" if the Bengals nabbed him there.
Forgive me if I don't exude much confidence in Sam Adams, but I saw teams running straight at him last year and winning those battles on a consistent basis. Injured or not, Big Sam didn't play like a former pro-bowler too much last year.
Age has a funny way of dealing with football, two years ago Tory was a pro-bowler and now the consensus is that he's done -I believe that consensus- and I think Sam might have hit the same point last year (I could be completely mistaken.)

Another thing I don't understand, why does everyone hate Frostee Rucker so vehemetly? I know he wasn't supposed to go until the seventh round last year, but obviously something changed in the weeks leading up to the draft. Just because the "experts" said he wasn't worthy of a pick earlier than the seventh round doesn't mean the teams agreed with those experts.Anyone remember Brodrick Bunkley last year? He was supposed to go in the late first or second by almost all of the accounts that I saw. I think he ended up at 11th overall. I already mentioned Claude Wroten from last year. Almost every draft analysis book I read had him written off by the second easily, he ended up in the fourth or so.
So why is it so shocking to see a high-motor guy from an elite college program that was in the National Championship the year before jump up the board?I may be the only guy here who will say this, but so far I can't disagree with the Frostee pick (outside of the spousal battery -only bastards, pardon my French, do that.)
He hasn't even touched the field in a regular season game yet. So can we cut him and Marvin a little slack?
Maybe this is the wrong crowd for slack.

Another interest of mine is whether or not Odell will be back next year.
Bengals.com is expectedly tight-lipped about him, so does anyone here know what the consensus is?
Don't forget this man was mini-RayLew last year, and he was a steal (talent-wise) in the second. I'm all for seeing him back next year -especially after giving Chris Henry a second, third, fourth, fifth, and nineteenth chance at returning- but I would like to know the general thoughts and your ideas about whether or not he even SHOULD come back.

Sincerely,
DA

First off theres no way we can finish 12-5 unless your saying we would of lost in the playoffs.
Secondly, Madieu played nickel his rookie year and played well. But theres no way he could start at CB. His hips are way too stiff to play CB and thats why he is a FS.
Third, we hate Frostee bc he shouldnt of been picked there. Not only did his play on there field not merit a 3rd round pick, but he had off field issues, and is short and slow. Atleast Chris Henry had 1st round talent to go along w/ his issues. Wroten tested positive at the combine for a little thing called mary jane and thats why he fell. Also Bunkley was a late first rounder pre combine. He put up arguably the best combine results there. Also he had the stats to back up a top 15 pick.

PalmerToCJ
01-17-2007, 02:46 PM
Guys... We're not taking a DT day one... Whether you like it or not that's the way it is. Remember when we were a lock to take Travis Johnson? How'd that turn out? Peko is a starter, end of story. Shaun Smith is a good run stuffer and Sam has a year or two left in the tank so we can draft someone to develope (Peko was a pretty good pick, wouldn't you say?). Last year I kept telling everyone we wouldn't take a DT or TE day one and I kept hearing "how would you know" etc.... Just look at the past draft history for Marvin and the needs of our team and it's pretty obvious.

Reggie Kelly will be re-signed I'm sure, Tony Stewart as well... Tim Day might be groomed into the future starter and we might go without drafting a TE yet again this year.

Between CB/S/DE that will be the pick round 1, maybe Marvin falls in love with a LB but I doubt it.

Round 2 it's the same... CB/S/DE/LB. The only reason I consider LB is because Marvin is looking for that playmaker that he found in Odell, that's what made his defenses in Baltimore so great. Ahmad has that potential but you can never have too many good LB's.


I must say, I actually enjoyed the final Steelers game... It was like watching back in the day where if you won you were thrilled and if you lost you didn't really care, of course I would've cared more had I known the Broncos would've choked.

Luckily I haven't heard many calling for Marvin to be fired, that's just stupid. Ungrateful - uneducated bandwagon fans are the ones making those claims I'm sure. My only beef with Marvin is that he's too loyal (Tory James/Breshnahan) but that's not so bad.

quickcc
01-17-2007, 03:48 PM
I had typed in that we should have been "11-5" and then I remembered the Tampa game; I just forgot to change the second number.
We should have been 12-4 regular season.

I'm not saying I think Madieu should go corner, I'm just saying that that I've heard that's what they might be planning, so if that happens I'd look for a Michael Griffin to replace him at safety.

Like I said, Frostee hasn't touched a pro football field yet, and you never know about guys until they play. I'm sure people said that Marques Colston couldn't play, too, and that's why he fell to the seventh. How many teams would have picked Colston in the second or even first if they'd known the type of season he was going to have? Frostee may be the same type of guy, and he's coming in from a program well known to produce high-quality athletes. There must be a reason we chose him there, so I think everyone is just writing him off far too quickly as a bust.
Let's see what he can do next year, then if he isn't any good I might say the same things you guys are saying now.

Yeah, I know Claude Wroten popped positive for MJ, but that doesn't usually drop you three and a half rounds. . . Point in case, Ricky Williams (not that I'm saying he tested positive before his draft, but that I'm sure it was well known that he was a pothead.)
I think Bunkley and Wroten were probably picked about where they should have been (so far) but my point is that completely unpredictable things happen on Draft Day.


No doubt, Chris Henry has proved his worth time and time again (big YAC run in the Steelers game) but what I meant was that while Chris has clearly gotten several chances already, Odell seems to have been nixed for only one or two big indescretions.
I'm guessing that for the Bengals to have Odell so deep in the doghouse means that he must have been a constant gnawing distraction or some such a thing.
I just haven't heard any new recently about his future, which is why I'm asking whether or not you guys know if he's supposed to be back, or if they're completely undecided about his future or what.

To PalmertoCJ:

I wouldn't be too sure about not taking a DT on day one; that might not be Marv's style, but you have to remember that Mike B. is the one who makes the final call.
Peko is definitely one of the big steals of last year's draft; I appreciate Peko and I hope Peko becomes a starter. I've lost most of my faith in Adams, and I wouldn't be surprised if this is his last year. I don't even have a clue as to what's happening with Thornton, and you usually don't have a shorter heavier guy like Shaun Smith come in to stop teams in the hurry-up.
So you've got Peko whenever he's not tired, and Smith for teams that don't run the hurry-up, but outside of that and maybe John Thornton, who? Bryan Robinson? Yeah, that one hasn't worked out so well.

Not that it's a lock that they'll draft a DT, but if the right guy falls to them like an Okoye or Tyler, I would be happy if they did -even in the first.

I really don't think DT is their primary need, either. I think DB is. But I don't see that many lock-down CBs on the horizon for this draft. I haven't seen Darrelle Revis play (not that he'd be there at 18 anyway according to the experts) and I don't know about any other major corners that are going to be in this draft.
Which is why I'm rooting for Michael Griffin, Okoye, or Tyler to be our first round pick (in that order.)
But, as always:
In Marvin I Trust.

I enjoyed the final Steelers game, too. I just didn't enjoy the way it ended with Graham, the OT catastrophe, and the Broncos/49ers situation working out to where we would have gotten in. We should have won that game.
I was bouncing off the walls in my house when Chris Henry made the big TD reception, though.


So what would you guys think about Michael Griffin?

EDIT: I also meant to mention that while I completely disagree with ANY loss of faith in Marvin for this year I have heard a few people around say things like "Marvin needs to win this year or he's done" and "Marvin's on the hotseat" (the latter is a Jim Rome-ism.)

With a year this chock full of injuries, legal problems, and the like; why even throw a question to MARVIN?
He can't help it that his future HOFer QB was severely injured and thusly didn't perform quite as well this year (at least some of this year.)
He can't help it that eight of his players are childish individuals who can't stay out from behind bars.
He can't help it that he lost LBs (Pollack, Thurman, Simmons), WRs (Henry, Houshmandzadeh, T. Perry, Brazell, Chatman), O-Linemen (Braham, Jones, Anderson, Williams), and DBs (Tory, Deltha, Jackson) like they were going out of style.

So why blame him for those problems?

Nevertheless I hear it from -like you said- the "Bandwagon-Hoppers" and the Jim Romes of the world.
And I resent every bit of it.

Go Marvin!

Sincerely,
DA

BengalsPwn
01-17-2007, 08:55 PM
Too be honest I like Griffin alot but I hate his value at 18. In order to take him I think a trade down would be best maybe picking up a 3rd rounder since we dont have one. I would say 24 and up would be a nice place to draft him. But if a player like Moses, Okoye, Adams, Anderson, or Landry is at 18 we pick one of them first.

FootballGod
01-17-2007, 09:59 PM
I am going to start this off by saying that I am going to assume that we finish the season at 8-8 or at best 9-7. That would give us a pick between 16-22. Lets go ahead and say that we average a 19th pick. Please tell me what you think. I can take the criticism and welcome it.

Round 1. Quinn Pitcock, DT, Ohio State Sr, 6-3, 295: I feel that he is the second best DT in the draft behind Alan Branch. Quinn would fit perfect into our 4-3 base defense and could also play DE when we switch to 3-4. Sam Adams and John Thornton are unproductive and old. Pitcock and Peko in the middle would look great for years to come.




Pretty good prediction of 8-8.
We should have finished 12-5, If you don't believe me, let's take a little stroll down Washout Lane.
Remember Tampagate? The San Diego Meltdown? Denver? That final Steelers game with that traitor Santonio :).
My dad's been a Bengals fan for 20-25 years or so (I haven't even been on the planet quite that long) and he always says it's just nice to be able to be disappointed with an 8-8 finish.
Back in the mid-nineties people would have cried tears of joy at an 8-8 Cin City finish.
We know we're on the way up, so why am I hearing cries of "fire Marvin" around where I live and "Marvin's on the hotseat" by the likes of Jim Rome *cough* narcissist *cough*?

I know the discussion has shifted to O and ST, but I saw this post and couldn't pass it up.
No offense, FootballGod, but even if Pitcock is there -which somebody will probably buy into the hype and take him in the first 15- I'd absolutely hate this pick.
Pitcock is not an impact player, but he is surrounded by them (even if they don't get the credit they deserve yet) and he does not merit a 18th overall pick.
Where was Quinn when we needed him in the NC game? Playing hide-and-go-seek with the Florida O-line.


I love Pitcock and I hope he does well in the NFL, I'm also a OSU fan, but I don't think he should go nearly this high and I think if Mikey B. did take him with that pick it could potentially be another "Big Daddy"/ Klingler/ etc. type of pick. Not that Pitcock doesn't have the drive like Wilkinson didn't, but that it would be a disaster of comparable magnitude to a team clearly on a big upswing.

Now, I could be out of the loop, since I have no one offline to consistently discuss football with that researches, but I'm thinking maybe Michael Griffin with this first pick (or L. Landry if he somehow managed to fall this far.)
Not that I don't love Dexter Jackson, but I think he's going to hit the same age curve that Tory hit in the next year or two. When that happens, we need a guy who has the size and speed to come into the lineup and I'm not necessarily believing (just yet) that Kaesviharn is it.
Plus I hear that they might be trying to move Madieu over to CB which would open up the slot opposite Dexter for Griffin to step into early.
So, assuming they've lost all faith in Deltha (the way I have lost all faith in Tory) we'd end up with Madieu, Dexter, JonJo, and M. Griffin as our DBs.
I think that would be an excellent arrangement (particularly with Kaesviharn as extraordinary safety depth.)

I also would be extremely happy with either Omobi Okoye or a DeMarcus Tyler.
I know Okoye isn't supposed to fall this far, but neither was Claude Wroten last year (I think he fell to the fourth round) so who knows where a high-octane guy like Okoye could end up within the first.
DeMarcus could also fall to the second because there are so many playmakers on the board that other teams would probably take first; in which case, I would consider it a "steal" if the Bengals nabbed him there.
Forgive me if I don't exude much confidence in Sam Adams, but I saw teams running straight at him last year and winning those battles on a consistent basis. Injured or not, Big Sam didn't play like a former pro-bowler too much last year.
Age has a funny way of dealing with football, two years ago Tory was a pro-bowler and now the consensus is that he's done -I believe that consensus- and I think Sam might have hit the same point last year (I could be completely mistaken.)

Another thing I don't understand, why does everyone hate Frostee Rucker so vehemetly? I know he wasn't supposed to go until the seventh round last year, but obviously something changed in the weeks leading up to the draft. Just because the "experts" said he wasn't worthy of a pick earlier than the seventh round doesn't mean the teams agreed with those experts.Anyone remember Brodrick Bunkley last year? He was supposed to go in the late first or second by almost all of the accounts that I saw. I think he ended up at 11th overall. I already mentioned Claude Wroten from last year. Almost every draft analysis book I read had him written off by the second easily, he ended up in the fourth or so.
So why is it so shocking to see a high-motor guy from an elite college program that was in the National Championship the year before jump up the board?I may be the only guy here who will say this, but so far I can't disagree with the Frostee pick (outside of the spousal battery -only bastards, pardon my French, do that.)
He hasn't even touched the field in a regular season game yet. So can we cut him and Marvin a little slack?
Maybe this is the wrong crowd for slack.

Another interest of mine is whether or not Odell will be back next year.
Bengals.com is expectedly tight-lipped about him, so does anyone here know what the consensus is?
Don't forget this man was mini-RayLew last year, and he was a steal (talent-wise) in the second. I'm all for seeing him back next year -especially after giving Chris Henry a second, third, fourth, fifth, and nineteenth chance at returning- but I would like to know the general thoughts and your ideas about whether or not he even SHOULD come back.

Sincerely,
DA

First off theres no way we can finish 12-5 unless your saying we would of lost in the playoffs.
Secondly, Madieu played nickel his rookie year and played well. But theres no way he could start at CB. His hips are way too stiff to play CB and thats why he is a FS.
Third, we hate Frostee bc he shouldnt of been picked there. Not only did his play on there field not merit a 3rd round pick, but he had off field issues, and is short and slow. Atleast Chris Henry had 1st round talent to go along w/ his issues. Wroten tested positive at the combine for a little thing called mary jane and thats why he fell. Also Bunkley was a late first rounder pre combine. He put up arguably the best combine results there. Also he had the stats to back up a top 15 pick.
I agree with everything that you said. We were not a 12-4 team at all. Madieu is a safety for the rest of his nfl life. Bunkley WAS a top 15 pick after the combine because he did put up the sickest numbers out there.

PalmerToCJ
01-17-2007, 10:26 PM
Too be honest I like Griffin alot but I hate his value at 18. In order to take him I think a trade down would be best maybe picking up a 3rd rounder since we dont have one. I would say 24 and up would be a nice place to draft him. But if a player like Moses, Okoye, Adams, Anderson, or Landry is at 18 we pick one of them first.

I can agree with you on Griffin, the way Marvin is though he'll take a guy if he sees the potential (see Peko).

Okoye/Tyler are no where on my first round board. There will be someone there worth taking.

I see what you're saying about Shaun Smith and the hurry up, he's not an every down DT yet but Adams has some left in the tank (he's insane off the snap) and guys like Robinson/Fanene(Pass rushing threat)/Thornton are still on the team and they're adequate. We could take a DT round 4 or 5 or address it via FA. Note that 3 of our DT's were brought in during FA to be a starter (Robinson/Thornton/Adams) so Marvin seems to prefer DT's via FA or later in the draft. It's so rare to find a playmaking DT and their bust factor is so high in the early rounds. The CB/S/DE/LB route is better.

If Marvin thinks Willis is the next Ray Lewis do you actually think he'd hesitate to pick him, regardless of who we have at LB? He can put pressure on the QB and stop the run, sideline-sideline... We could move Ahmad to SLB and have Jeanty as a solid backup and just wait out Pollack. It all depends on what he does with Odell but what our defense is lacking is a playmaker. Madieu is sort of but other than that we've got nothing (KK maybe, those end zone picks were sweet :lol:). You can't have a top 15 defense without a playmaker and that's what Marvin is looking for. Ahmad/Madieu are the only ones with that potential on our D. Joseph is solid obviously but it's hard for a good CB to make plays because they throw away from him. LB's and S's are allowed to roam (obviously).

Nelson is a possibility (I think his stock shoots at the combine and we have no shot at him). He can hit like a saftey but cover like a CB (something Marvin LOVES) and he has speed (the biggest key to Marvin on defense).

Say we re-sign Justin Smith then I think it's between Revis/McCauley/Willis/Nelson/Griffin... One of them is bound to be there.

FootballGod
01-17-2007, 11:36 PM
Mock 4.0, Comments will come next week. Sorry guys I am really busy these days. Who Dey.

Round 1. Marcus McCauley, CB, Fresno St., Sr, 6-1, 205, 4.35
Round 2. Jarvis Moss, DE, Florida, Sr, 6-6, 255
Round 3. Brooks duh
Round 4. Justin Warren, ILB, Texas A&M, Sr, 6-3, 245
Round 5. Paul Soliai, DT, Utah, Sr, 6-4, 334
Round 6. Roderick Rodgers, Safety, Wisconsin, Sr, 6-2, 185, 4.45
Round 7. Brent Celek, TE, University of Cincinnati Sr, 6'4", 260
Tell me what you guys think. What would you change? Do you like the positions that were picked? Who Dey

deyebc
01-17-2007, 11:53 PM
Good mock I really think Marcus McCauley can be a shutdown corner in a couple years..... I don't think Moss will be there when we select, he is just too much of a physical freak....

PalmerToCJ
01-17-2007, 11:56 PM
Nice... Not sure if Moss will be there round 2 but I like it. McCauley is like a Joseph clone from the idea that people are saying yeah he's physically perfect for the position but what did he do in college... Well we saw what Marvin did with Joseph and I don't see why he can't do the same with McCauley.

I really like Celek, he'd be a sweet addition.

The one pick I don't like is Warren. ILB isn't a big deal given Simmons still being on the team, Caleb, Nicholson and Ahmad all being capable of MLB so we're good to go there.

I'd personally rather see a saftey round 4 or OL. IMO round 4 or 5 we have to address OL because of losing depth via players moving into a starting spot.

BengalsPwn
01-18-2007, 11:52 AM
In regards to Scotts mock, its alright......... Im just not a big fan of 1 year wonders. The bust rate on them is sooo high. I'll take anybody but Tyler. But Merriweather in the 2nd isnt too bad. He can play run and pass well but he has trouble with really big backs. Id be satisfied with Moses/Merriweather first day. I just hope we dont draft a CB first round unless Leon Hall drops to us.

gonzo1105
01-18-2007, 01:26 PM
Alright guys i'm the GM for the Bengals in the mock draft. I'm floating some ideas aroudn but thougth i'd get the opinion of the actual teams fan's....alright everybody that is suspended and FA's are considered resigned...I have acquired CB Drayton Florence and SS Terrence Kiel with the plans of moving Tory James to FS and inserting Jonathan Joseph at the other CB so they secondary is set for the most part for now. The positions I've looked at the most for the Bengals are DT(but they are very slim after the first 2), LB(probably not gonna be in position for any of the top 3), and TE(dont really want to take one), by the way T.J is now gone and Chris Henry is the # 2 WR. So what do you guys think I should address in the first round?

rickscott
01-18-2007, 02:26 PM
You've lost me. Was TJ part of a trade to acquire Florence and why would the team resign James who is worse than O'Neil? What happened to O'Neil? I take the best def. player on the board whether i's a LBer, DE or DT or even another CB.

gonzo1105
01-18-2007, 02:29 PM
T.J was traded for Drayton Florence, Terrence Kiel and a 4th rounder. All players are considered resigned. So hence Tory James automatically is back on the team as well as Justin Smith and Eric Steinbach. So the secondary is patched up pretty nicely with Florence and Joseph at CB, and James and Kiel at Safety(which is not great but still an upgrade over what you had). I have a couple players in mind for the pick just thought i should let u guys give me some opinions. I traded O'neil for draft picks, I feel he is an all or nothing CB and Joseph and Florence are better all around CB's

BengalsPwn
01-18-2007, 02:54 PM
I hope your not our gm. Arguably our best defensive player is our current starting FS Madieu Williams, so why you would aquire a terrible SS and move our worst CB to FS?

quickcc
01-18-2007, 05:00 PM
I hope your not our gm. Arguably our best defensive player is our current starting FS Madieu Williams, so why you would aquire a terrible SS and move our worst CB to FS?

I agree with BengalsPwn.
We'd seriously be screwed if you were our GM.

I can't say I'd be entirely against a Deltha trade, but we probably can't get much for him so unless we find a desperate team or something, I'd say keep him and draft into the CB slot early anyway.
That way, you've got Deltha for next year in case the hypothetical rookie can't hack it yet. And if Deltha turns out to be a great corner and this year was just a fluke, then you've got trade bait.
On the other hand trading away T.J. -who I think we just resigned long term- would be a disaster.
He's so consistent (especially on third down) and he's got the "big-play ability" even though he doesn't always show it.

An impact WR with an outstanding track record who's a high-character guy would be worth more than Florence, Kiel, and a 4th, too.
And I don't think that Steinbach, Smith, and James will be back (some combo might but more than likely it'll just be James.)

I don't think much in your hypothetical would be in the Bengals best interest or would be economical for next season.

On FootballGod's Mock:

I can't say anything much about McCauley because I haven't seen him at all or researched him, but Jarvis Moss in the second would be a dream pick if he manages to fall that far.
He could be the Manny Lawson Marvin was looking for last year, but in this year's draft.
The man's a physical freak. Did you see Moss dominate my beloved OSU in the NC? I'm sure if you were a Florida fan it was a symphony of destruction.

Can't really disagree with any of your other picks either (mostly because I haven't researched some of the guys) but there is one pick I'd like to see in the 5th-7th instead of Warren, Soliai, or Celek:
If Dallas Sartz (LB USC 6'5" 240) falls that far I'd love to invest one of those picks in him. He played like a beast in the Michigan game, and is a big guy that's pretty quick for his size.
I think Michigan's O-Line (with Long) was supposed to really be something, but they were completely circumvented by Sartz in the Rose Bowl.

Nothing against your mock, I'm just saying I'd like to see Dallas become a Bengal instead of any one of those guys.

Sincerely,
DA

gonzo1105
01-18-2007, 09:52 PM
I got a 4th and 7th for Deltha O'neal

quickcc
01-19-2007, 03:14 AM
I got a 4th and 7th for Deltha O'neal

I wouldn't necessarily be able to disagree with such a move if the Bengals made it in reality, but I would be wary of trading a guy like O'Neal because he could still be something. This year may have been a fluke.

Although, with a fourth and seventh rounder who knows what we might get.
We could get players the caliber of Domata Peko, Marques Colston, or maybe even someone of equivalent value to a Tom Brady with those picks.
Or we could end up with Maurice Clarett (yes, I know, he was picked in the third -I'm just using him as the poster-child of mid-round draft failure.)

I assume you were replying to my reply, but when I mentioned the fourth round pick in my previous post, I was referring to you talking about trading T.J. away for the fourth-rounder (plus Florence and Kiel.)

I also couldn't disagree with picking up Florence (from what I've seen of him) but he's certainly not worth anywhere near a T.J. -even with Kiel and the pick.
Now Maybe he'd be worth -say- a Brian Simmons (no offense to Brian, but we'll probably have even more solid linebackers to add after the upcoming draft, and Brian's getting up there a little) or someone like that, but the chances of us actually aquiring Florence specifically, are remote at best.

PalmerToCJ
01-19-2007, 03:34 PM
Am I the only one that thinks Tank Tyler is just a terrible pick?

Okoye I guess I can live with although I don't think it's likely, Tank Tyler is a clone of Sam Adams (now) and Shaun Smith in that he plays a few plays and he's shot... He also isn't great for the pass rush so what good would he do?

I'm really starting to consider Patrick Willis (if we re-sign Justin Smith only though).

Playmaker in the middle with him, put Ahmad at SLB then Landon at WLB. We have great backups in Jeanty/Caleb/Nicholson/Pollack?.

Then round 2 Fred Bennett/Chris Houston/Josh Wilson/Aaron Ross.

Round 4/5 go with OL and S, round 6 be creative and in the 7th go with Celek.

My dream offseason...

1. Re-Sign Justin Smith, Kevin Kaeshviharn, Landon Johnson, Anthony Wright, Doug Johnson, Kenny Watson, Chris Perry, Reggie Kelly, Tony Stewart, Scott Kooistra, Stacy Andrews, Shaun Smith, Caleb Miller, Rashad Bauman and Kyle Larson.

Draft:

Round 1. Patrick Willis | MLB | Ole Miss.
Round 2. Chris Houston | CB | Arkansas
Round 4. Michael Johnson | S | Arizona
Round 5. Mansfield Wrotto | OG | Georgia Tech
Round 6. Yamon Figures| WR | Kansas State
Round 7. Brent Celek | TE | Cincinnati

That draft gives us a playmaker at LB, a #2 CB, future S, project backup OG, blazing returner and a TE to groom to become the starter.

gonzo1105
01-19-2007, 06:49 PM
Well guys I made my 1st round pick in the Mock Draft and I took Paul Posluszny. Timmons and Willis were both gone before him.

rickscott
01-19-2007, 09:02 PM
I can live with that pick. He's an intelligent guy that will be a help probably immediately and may never be a real impact player but will be a solid player in the league for years.,

quickcc
01-19-2007, 10:23 PM
Well guys I made my 1st round pick in the Mock Draft and I took Paul Posluszny. Timmons and Willis were both gone before him.

Yeah, I would be happy with Posluszny being picked there in reality. Especially if worse comes to worst and it turns out we're not getting Pollack or Thurman back. This would be an even more essential pick if Landon Johnson and/or Caleb Miller leave via free agency.

Am I the only one that thinks Tank Tyler is just a terrible pick?

Yes, you are all alone here in the Twilight Zone. Lol. :)
Seriously though, I certainly wouldn't say he'd be a terrible pick. I'd rather have a young phenom in Okoye or some DB help in Griffin, but I'd be almost as pleased with Tyler as well.

Don't forget, this man is coming from a line that had three guys picked in the first last year (Williams, McCargo, Lawson) one of whom was Marvin's dream pick (Lawson) and Tyler still stepped up this year without their help and performed very well -obviously, well enough to be considered a first round pick despite not playing much before this year.

PalmerToCJ
01-20-2007, 10:56 AM
Tank Tyler is just like Shaun Smith and Sam Adams in that he plays a few plays and he's done. He's a run stuffer that we don't really need at this point. Plus he's a reach at 18 and we don't need to reach for a DT. Okoye maybe but Tyler would do little to improve our team.

Yes, I remember Marvin being in love with Lawson but that was because of his speed and athleticism, something Tyler lacks (obviously, being a big ole DT and all :lol: ) so that will have nothing to do with Marvin's opinion.

A guy that I think might be a Marvin Lewis type guy in round 2 is Aaron Rouse. Great combo of speed and size at Saftey and has the potential to move to LB.

What does everyone think about if Leon Hall fell to us (magically)? He really doesn't seem like the greatest fit and lacks the speed Marvin loves so to me he wouldn't be a lock pick there for us.

Still, my current favorite darkhorse pick is Patrick Willis. To put up the numbers he did with the small Dline he had is pretty amazing and he would be the playmaker we so desperately need.

rickscott
01-21-2007, 04:24 AM
What do you guys think about Dan Bazuin. I think he was 2nd in the nation in sacks in 05 and had 10 last year. He's a very hard worker and I would love to see him there for us in Rd 2. 6'3" 270 and runs a 4.70 is pretty good.

quickcc
01-21-2007, 01:27 PM
What do you guys think about Dan Bazuin. I think he was 2nd in the nation in sacks in 05 and had 10 last year. He's a very hard worker and I would love to see him there for us in Rd 2. 6'3" 270 and runs a 4.70 is pretty good.

I love Bazuin. I'd enjoy seeing him become a Bengal, just maybe not quite as high as the second.
I'd rather see a 3rd round pick aquired and used for Bazuin, but even according to this website, 2nd round could be just a bit high for him as of right now.
I don't understand why his draft stock isn't higher than it is, though, and I wouldn't be surprised if it rose considerably during the combine (since the pro scouts will get a much better comparison of him than Central Michigan's competition gave them.)
So maybe the Bengals second round pick would be a good place for Bazuin.

Tank Tyler is just like Shaun Smith and Sam Adams in that he plays a few plays and he's done. He's a run stuffer that we don't really need at this point. Plus he's a reach at 18 and we don't need to reach for a DT. Okoye maybe but Tyler would do little to improve our team.

Yes, I remember Marvin being in love with Lawson but that was because of his speed and athleticism, something Tyler lacks (obviously, being a big ole DT and all ) so that will have nothing to do with Marvin's opinion.

A guy that I think might be a Marvin Lewis type guy in round 2 is Aaron Rouse. Great combo of speed and size at Saftey and has the potential to move to LB.

What does everyone think about if Leon Hall fell to us (magically)? He really doesn't seem like the greatest fit and lacks the speed Marvin loves so to me he wouldn't be a lock pick there for us.

Still, my current favorite darkhorse pick is Patrick Willis. To put up the numbers he did with the small Dline he had is pretty amazing and he would be the playmaker we so desperately need.

You have a point, and I would rather have Okoye, but I don't think it would be a "terrible" pick if they took Tyler in the first.

What I meant by saying that he came off the same line as all those other guys is that Marvin has to like their philosophy when it comes to raising D-linemen. Otherwise he wouldn't have been nearly so excited about the prospect of nabbing Manny Lawson.

I wonder, with all of Marvin's good work this last year, where we could have been with a big, fast, athletic guy like Manny Lawson along the D-line.
Ahh, to dream of what might have been with all the pass-rush that Lawson could have potentially brought. Curses! Foiled by San Francisco again! lol. ;)

I can't disagree with Aaron Rouse; he seems like a Mike B. type of pick. As I've said several times now, I'd be happier with Michael Griffin to shore up our D-backfield but Aaron Rouse could be just as helpful.
Who knows with VA Tech guys what your going to get? They're almost always either "questionable" character guys (The Vicks, Jimmy Williams, etc.) or super high quality players (Michael Vick -again-, DeAngelo Hall etc.) with high-end motors and bad dispositions on the field.

Rouse is certainly big enough, fast enough, and nasty enough to play.

I really don't think I'd like to have Leon Hall be our first pick. I don't like the way he plays and I'm not a big fan of Michigan DBs (Marlin Jackson etc.) I agree with you, I don't think he'd fit that well or be the type of player Marvin wants.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Patrick Willis the guy that played almost an entire season with a broken arm the season before last? That really says something about the man.

Tough, fast, agile. Patrick Willis would be a good pick. My favorite thing about Willis is that he's a CHARACTER guy. Who knows what a young beast of a LB with a great prescence off the field could do for us?
Unfortunately, by the draft I don't think Willis will be a "Dark Horse" anymore. There's been a shortage of quality inside linebackers recently and I think once the drafters see that he's one of that rare breed, his stock will shoot straight up the charts.

I'd be as happy with that pick as I would be Griffin or Okoye (especially assuming we don't get Thurman or Pollack back.)

gonzo1105
01-21-2007, 08:06 PM
Hey guys just thought i'd keep you updated on the mock draft, if you dont know i'm the Cinci GM and i just took Victor Abiamari DE Notre Dame in the 2nd so so far its

Paul Posluszny LB Penn State
Victor Abiamari DE Notre Dame
Ahmad Brooks LB(3rd round supplemental draft)

FootballGod
01-22-2007, 11:16 AM
Dan Bazuin will be a second round DE when all is said and done. He had 16.5 sacks in his Junior season and over 10 this year. Just this week in the East-West game he had 2.5 sacks against the best seniors out there. He would be a great pick in the second round.

PalmerToCJ
01-22-2007, 11:40 AM
Via Bengals.com Marvin said that he is entertaining the idea of putting the franchise tag on Justin Smith. Whether that will be to trade him or try and sign him long term I'm unsure.

It'd be nice to sign him but with the depth of DE in the draft this year it's not a necessity.

rickscott
01-22-2007, 01:04 PM
Bengals fans, Another Bengal arrested. This time it's Jonathan Joseph with grass. This is getting very old......

PalmerToCJ
01-22-2007, 02:35 PM
Who would've thought, a NFL player smoking grass... Unheard of :lol:

Eh, this one doesn't bother me. DUI's are bad, riding in a car with weed is stupid but you can do a whole lot worse.

These NKY cops aren't too good about letting players off the hook, that might be as much of our problem as anything :lol:

deyebc
01-22-2007, 05:37 PM
Yeah it'd be interesting to know how many Steelers are let off by Pittsburgh cops....

rickscott
01-22-2007, 09:18 PM
Still, Don't you think this shows a total lack of respect for Marvin Lewis with the problems we had this past year and with him closing out the year with a tough talk? It seems now, Joseph will have to be sat down although it will likely be in preseason in order for Marvin not to look like he was all talk and no action. It just pisses me off that these guys continue to get in trouble. When have we last read about a Patriot or a Colt? This really doesn't happen with EVERY NFL team.

PalmerToCJ
01-22-2007, 10:46 PM
I know where you're coming from Rick... Mostly it's just flat out bad luck. Of all the guys that have been busted only a few were bad character guys. Joseph/Deltha/Steinbach/Askew/McNeal didn't really have a bad rap, Joseph was even considered good character.

This will be a Ravens esque thing. Around for a few years then it will dissapear entirely.

It just PISSES me off when people act like Marvin has no control of the team. Having no control over the team means them making bad statements to the press, bashing teammates, missing practices/meetings. That doesn't happen around here, just players being idiots in their spare time.

themaninblack
01-23-2007, 10:48 PM
This doesn't really worry me at all either, in fact almost all of the players that have gotten in trouble really don't bother me except for the gun/robbery/spousal abuse things. Alot of them are minor offenses that people get away with daily. It's just that with all the other arrests every one of them gets blown up even more and for stupid stuff like this i dont really care because id rather be dealing with some bad eggs sprinkled in with very minor offenders than be miserable for 10+ years again.

PalmerToCJ
01-24-2007, 03:31 PM
Given the first few practices and how I anticipate players to do at the combine here's how I see the favorites...

Round 1
1. Reggie Nelson
2. Marcus McCauley
3. Victor Abiamiri (IMO he plays himself into the 1st via senior bowl/combine)
4. Patrick Willis
5. Charles Johnson

Round 2
1. Aaron Rouse
2. Chris Houston
3. Rufus Alexander

I'm diggin' Rouse, with his size and speed he has to catch Marvin's eye. Especially the fact that he's solid in coverage.

Bengals78
01-24-2007, 05:14 PM
Given the first few practices and how I anticipate players to do at the combine here's how I see the favorites...

Round 1
1. Reggie Nelson
2. Marcus McCauley
3. Victor Abiamiri (IMO he plays himself into the 1st via senior bowl/combine)
4. Patrick Willis
5. Charles Johnson

Round 2
1. Aaron Rouse
2. Chris Houston
3. Rufus Alexander

I'm diggin' Rouse, with his size and speed he has to catch Marvin's eye. Especially the fact that he's solid in coverage.

Thats sounds solid to me only I am a sucker for Okoye and I would put him up there in rd 1. If he is available, he could very well be th best overall at that pick. and having a young stud like him couldnt hurt.
Im quite infatuated with Rouse too. But Weddle is still my boy for DB. Maybe not CB but i like him.

FootballGod
01-24-2007, 09:42 PM
Given the first few practices and how I anticipate players to do at the combine here's how I see the favorites...

Round 1
1. Reggie Nelson
2. Marcus McCauley
3. Victor Abiamiri (IMO he plays himself into the 1st via senior bowl/combine)
4. Patrick Willis
5. Charles Johnson

Round 2
1. Aaron Rouse
2. Chris Houston
3. Rufus Alexander

I'm diggin' Rouse, with his size and speed he has to catch Marvin's eye. Especially the fact that he's solid in coverage.
I dont think Nelson will be there when we pick. McCauley has yet to of shown any great skill at the senior bowl practice that would make a middle first round pick. I still like Moses and Johnson more that Abiamiri. I agree that he has made a push up the boards but I don't feel he is a top 20 pick. Willis is good value but I just don't like picking LBs in the first round when it is proven every year that there is great value at the position in rounds 3-4.

My dream draft would have us trade down into the lower 22-25 range (much like in 05) and pick up a third round pick because I think that defense is deep this year. Give me Darrelle Revis, Jarvis Moss, Marcus McCauley, Quentin Moses or a guy with great value at that point Abiamiri.

I do not like Rouse as a safety in the NFL he should add 15 pounds and switch to OLB, which he could because he is 6-4. He all ready has the speed edge over other OLB's and hits like one too. Not a good fit for us. I would move him to OLB.

FootballGod
01-24-2007, 09:47 PM
Does anyone think that we could pick up a third round pick if we trade down 4-7 picks in the draft? If we could would you do it?

themaninblack
01-24-2007, 11:04 PM
what about micheal griffin if we decide to move down? i really like his speed and agressiveness, even if he isnt the biggest guy.

PalmerToCJ
01-24-2007, 11:09 PM
Does anyone think that we could pick up a third round pick if we trade down 4-7 picks in the draft? If we could would you do it?

I would like to hope so but I'm not sure who would want to trade up.

Something I can see us doing though is if someone is there to be had in the 3rd Marvin wants then we manage a trade of a 3rd round next year because we could potentially have 3 3rd rounder via Steinbach/Smith compensation.

Today we showed interest in McCauley via Scott, he's like a Joseph clone. I do agree though that he's not the greatest value at 18 and I do assume Nelson will be gone but there's always a chance.

FootballGod
01-25-2007, 12:14 AM
McCauley not doing great according to The Dayton Daily News. He is giving up on plays and the coaches have been all over him about it for two days.
http://www.daytondailynews.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/osu/2007/01/23/ddn012407senior.html

rickscott
01-25-2007, 10:48 AM
Reading today's local Cincy paper, it appears there is some thought about moving Madeiu to CB and drafting a Safety to replace him so maybe some of these ideas are not too far off.

PalmerToCJ
01-25-2007, 11:56 AM
Reading today's local Cincy paper, it appears there is some thought about moving Madeiu to CB and drafting a Safety to replace him so maybe some of these ideas are not too far off.

Was it just an opinion type deal or are they hearing rumblings of this from within the organization? If that's the case then IMO Nelson is an absolute lock if he was to fall back to us. Griffin I'm not so sure about, Rouse seems like a Marvin guy in the second.

Scott said this of McCauley yesterday...

Marcus McCauley of Fresno St. probably had his best day of the week, showing excellent recovery speed, sticking to his man like glue and making a couple of nice pass breakups in 7-on-7's.

rickscott
01-25-2007, 01:33 PM
This came from Bresnaham stating that the organization was well aware of Madeiu's ability to move to CB and that all things are being considered to give this defense an identity.

PalmerToCJ
01-25-2007, 08:42 PM
This came from Bresnaham stating that the organization was well aware of Madeiu's ability to move to CB and that all things are being considered to give this defense an identity.

Hmmm.....

Interesting. Too bad there aren't really an FA safties that stick out, safties are best to address via FA.

FootballGod
01-25-2007, 10:47 PM
This came from Bresnaham stating that the organization was well aware of Madeiu's ability to move to CB and that all things are being considered to give this defense an identity.

Hmmm.....

Interesting. Too bad there aren't really an FA safties that stick out, safties are best to address via FA.
Hmmm......

Too bad Madieu is not a good corner. He doesn't have the speed to play CB. I love him at safety and I think he should stay there.

PalmerToCJ
01-25-2007, 11:20 PM
This came from Bresnaham stating that the organization was well aware of Madeiu's ability to move to CB and that all things are being considered to give this defense an identity.

Hmmm.....

Interesting. Too bad there aren't really an FA safties that stick out, safties are best to address via FA.
Hmmm......

Too bad Madieu is not a good corner. He doesn't have the speed to play CB. I love him at safety and I think he should stay there.

I wouldn't say that he would be a bad corner... He ran a 4.46 out of college and has pretty solid game speed, he's solid in coverage. He's no blazing player but he'd match up against the posessions guys most of the time and I don't see why he would be terrible.

Granted, I don't see why we should move him to CB now given his success at S and the depth at CB this year and while he isn't slow he's not the fastest DB out there by any means.

01-26-2007, 09:44 AM
How good can Kelly Washington be and what were his main strengths and weaknesses when he played for the Bengals?

Also are you guys resigning Justin Smith? I heard (prolly a rumor) he might not be back or at least will take a look at the market?

rickscott
01-26-2007, 11:17 AM
Kelly Washington has in the past 2 yhrs decided to become more of a team guy and realized he had to be a special teams guy also if he wanted some PT. He seemed to be injured alot and then he got behind Chris Henry. I like him alot, more as an insurance policy for the Bengals but IF the Browns picked him up, he may never be a star but he would be very solid. He's big, strong and seems like he's matured into a fine team player. I wouldn't really say he is a burner but still very solid.

PalmerToCJ
01-26-2007, 11:37 AM
Kwash is entertaining, I root for him to score or get a first down just because of his celebrations :lol:

I think he can be a decent #3 but not much else, he doesn't really stand out in any area and isn't a great route runner but he has some potential.

I think we should re-sign Justin Smith or use the money if we don't to sign a Nate Clements or big time FA.

Honestly I'm not sure if we'll re-sign him or not, usually I have an opinion either way but in his case I dont... I guess we'll see.

rickscott
01-26-2007, 02:56 PM
I hear he may be back also but we'll have to wait until we see the numbers he's asking. A NY team could blow us out of the water with an offer. I'd like him back if we can.

PalmerToCJ
01-26-2007, 05:37 PM
Via Bengals.com
From making free safety Madieu Williams a cornerback, to switching from a 4-3 to a 3-4, to isolating what area they need with what everyone is assuming is a defensive first-round pick at No. 18, Bresnahan stressed that it’s too early to lock into any direction.

I really doubt Madieu to CB and a swap to 3-4.

Knowing Breshnahan he'd only rush 3 everytime if we moved to the 3-4 :lol:

Another few interesting quotes (GH is Hobson the Bengals.com reporter and CB is Breshnahan.

GH: Are linebacker and corner the biggest needs?
CB: I think every position. I hate to isolate on one right now. I think we have to address the corner situation and big plays we gave up. But that’s not to side-step improving at the linebacker position. Making sure we’re solid at the defensive line. We’ve got some things there. You have Sam (defensive tackle Adams), who has worry about his health and getting on the field with more consistency. We’ve got to worry about Justin’s situation. There are lot of areas we have to look at.

That’s why I say it’s premature, it’s just a little premature to make definitive comments.

GH: After looking pretty good in a midseason stretch, Caleb (Miller) hardly played at all late in the year.
CB: He had some good games. He had some games where he made plays out of position. We’re looking to get guys in one position so they can focus and go. But with the injuries we had and playing with four linebackers in a game, guys have to know multiple positions and that limited some of the things that (Miller) did.

He’s a good player. He has athletic ability. He needs to make a total commitment to football. He’s got things he needs to get cleared up in his life and get focused and he knows that. He’ll be the first one to tell you that.

GH: What about Brooks?
CB: Brooks is going to be a good football player and I’ll leave it at that. He needs to mature. He needs to learn how to study the game and prepare as a pro.

GH: Deltha has two years left on his deal and Tory is up. Do you think they’ll be back?
CB: That’s premature on that, too. That has to do with the power upstairs.

GH: Deltha kind of ended it rough.
CB: Correct. Deltha has to get healthy and Deltha has to get back to the way he played two years ago. He’s got a challenge ahead of him, and you have to keep the pressure on them through competition.

GH: The big guy there is right end Justin Smith. If he re-signs, it’s a 4-3. But no matter what, you could replace Tory James with free safety Madieu Williams. You guys think he can make the move the corner, don’t you?
CB: He’s proven it. He’s a guy that can play corner. That’s an option you have to look at and weigh, and again that’s based on where we are in free agency. You've got Tory’s situation. You've got Deltha’s (O’Neal) situation.

PalmerToCJ
01-26-2007, 05:53 PM
Just because it's got me thinking I'll give my take on swapping to the 3-4.

Say we do the swap, here's what it opens up.

-We MUST draft a 3-4 pass rushing OLB (Anthony Spency, Jarvis Moss, Quentin Moses etc.) and it would almost be a first round need unless we took on say Adalius Thomas.
-We would still need a CB.
-You know Ahmad would be 1 ILB, Caleb/Simmons/Jeanty? would be in the running for the other. Jeanty/Landon would be the other OLB (I'd assume, not sure they're a great fit correct me if I'm wrong)
-Sam Adams moves to NT with Shaun Smith backing him up. Peko/Robinson move to the ends with Fanene having potential to start at end as well. I know Peko has NT potential but he has speed that I think would be best suited outside.
-Saftey would be a luxury still.

I don't think it's the best route, the play calling is too blah from Breshnahan and I think it'd make getting pressure on the QB even worse.

If we stick by the 4-3 we could sign a good impact FA (In house) in Justin Smith. Then our Dline is set, Ahmad in the middle with Landon at WLB and Jeanty at SLB (I still would love Patrick Willis then move Ahmad to SLB).

I just think we lack the LB depth at this point to do the 3-4 swap.

gonzo1105
01-26-2007, 08:15 PM
Hey guys just wanted to know what your thoughts were on my draft that I had on the fantasy forum. If your unaware would u be happy with this first let me tell u what we got rid of and acquired

Lost:
TJ Housh
Deltha O'neal

Gained:
Drayton Florence
Terrence Kiel
Draft Picks

1- Paul Posluszny LB Penn St
2- Victor Abiamiri DE Notre Dame
3- Ahmad Brooks LB Virginia
4A- Scott Chandler TE Iowa
4B- Ryan Smith CB Florida
4C- Steve Smith WR USC

rickscott
01-26-2007, 09:21 PM
Losing TJ, and having Chris Henry always on shakey ground makes a strength into a weakness.

BengalsPwn
01-27-2007, 11:26 AM
I think its about time we make the switch to 3-4. We pretty much got the players that fit. Lineup would be something like this w/o Pollack and Thurman:

CB-Deltha O'neal
CB-John Joseph
FS-Madieu Williams
SS-Dexter Jackson
OLB-Robert Geathers
ILB-AJ Nicholson
ILB-Ahmad Brooks
OLB-Rashad Jeanty
DE-Bryan Robinson
NT-Sam Adams/Shaun Smith
DE-Domata Peko

IF that happened then I wouldnt mind drafting Adam Carriker at 18 to provide more DE depth and at times move Peko over to NT.

rickscott
01-27-2007, 02:12 PM
The fact that Nicholson never even stepped on the field his rookie year tells me they must be disappointed in the guy. There are not too many rookies that make a team and never step foot on the field especially a LBer who you would think would have a nose for special teams. I don't know what they intend to do, but I don't think Nicholson is a guy that be counted on at this point.

PalmerToCJ
01-27-2007, 04:19 PM
Duh, I forgot completely about Geathers.

So I guess that would mean it'd be nice to draft a Patrick Willis if he was there or CB in the first.



After Okoyes Senior Bowl week I'm ready to cave and say I'd take him in the first :oops: . If he even falls that far though, he seems like a rare DT that can be a playmaker so I'm for it.