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locseti
01-23-2007, 09:31 PM
Yeah, he also was a god-awful decision maker who only had a good year because Higgins could outrun the entire defense. Sorry, not buying it.

Kolb and Edwards are probably going to have similar draft day grades.

Cant argue with his questionable decision making but the same can be said of Edwards. Some NFL coaching can help rectify these tendencies though.

Difference is that Palmer played a fairly good team in a very bad conference, Edwards played on the worst team in a fairly good conference. Stanford wasn't just bad this year, they were god-awful. Add in the fact that Edwards is a better athlete than Palmer, and there is no doubt who is more likely to succeed at the next level.

Stanford was horrendous this year, and their line was terrible, but so was UTEPS. I think they are similar prospects, with the edge going to Edwards who will almost certainly be selected much sooner. We'll find out more after the game this weekend.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-23-2007, 10:01 PM
Stanford was horrendous this year, and their line was terrible, but so was UTEPS. I think they are similar prospects, with the edge going to Edwards who will almost certainly be selected much sooner. We'll find out more after the game this weekend.

Uh, what? Stanford gave up more than twice as many sacks as UTEP did.

I'm sorry, Palmer is a worse Kerry Collins. No thanks.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-23-2007, 10:13 PM
QBs are extremely rare this year.
My top two are Quinn and Edwards.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-23-2007, 10:17 PM
Did anybody notice that during the press conference Al mentioned AP.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-23-2007, 10:24 PM
According to Scott the Raiders were looking at Kareem Brown.

sup3rk1ng
01-23-2007, 10:27 PM
who do you think the raiders will sign as their oc

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-23-2007, 10:53 PM
NIPs in the HoF.good job Xon.First Raider to be enshrined.

locseti
01-23-2007, 10:57 PM
Stanford was horrendous this year, and their line was terrible, but so was UTEPS. I think they are similar prospects, with the edge going to Edwards who will almost certainly be selected much sooner. We'll find out more after the game this weekend.

Uh, what? Stanford gave up more than twice as many sacks as UTEP did.

I'm sorry, Palmer is a worse Kerry Collins. No thanks.

Ya, they play against superior competition and Edwards only played 8 games, so an inexperienced QB was back there getting sacked. But Edwards will go alot earlier than Kolb and Palmer, and I'd like to address other needs at that time in the draft. I don't like Edwards more than Palmer, Kolb is who I prefer out of the three.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-23-2007, 10:58 PM
I dont think the Raiders will go QB day one or for the future for that matter.tehy'll give Walter another year.and then they may go after JDB.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-23-2007, 11:04 PM
Ya, they play against superior competition and Edwards only played 8 games, so an inexperienced QB was back there getting sacked. But Edwards will go alot earlier than Kolb and Palmer, and I'd like to address other needs at that time in the draft. I don't like Edwards more than Palmer, Kolb is who I prefer out of the three.

Well, first off, TC Ostrander is far from inexperienced.

Secondly, what are you talking about. How can you saw UTEP's o-line was nearly as bad as Stanfords when they obviously played a lot better (no matter the quality of competition). How else are you qualifying o-line quality?

Edwards ended up on his ass way more often than Palmer. End of dicussion.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-23-2007, 11:06 PM
I dont think the Raiders will go QB day one or for the future for that matter.tehy'll give Walter another year.and then they may go after JDB.

I wounldn't be terribly suprised if Al Davis went after a quarterback at some point in the mid rounds (remember, we're likely to have at least 2 3rd rounders as well), even if just to spark some heat under Walter's butt.

We'll have to see I guess.

locseti
01-23-2007, 11:12 PM
Ya, they play against superior competition and Edwards only played 8 games, so an inexperienced QB was back there getting sacked. But Edwards will go alot earlier than Kolb and Palmer, and I'd like to address other needs at that time in the draft. I don't like Edwards more than Palmer, Kolb is who I prefer out of the three.

Well, first off, TC Ostrander is far from inexperienced.

Secondly, what are you talking about. How can you saw UTEP's o-line was nearly as bad as Stanfords when they obviously played a lot better (no matter the quality of competition). How else are you qualifying o-line quality?

Edwards ended up on his ass way more often than Palmer. End of dicussion.

Um, Im not saying UTEPs is as bad as Stanfords oline. Im saying UTEPs Oline isnt that great either.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-23-2007, 11:27 PM
Stanford was horrendous this year, and their line was terrible, but so was UTEPS.

You sure about that?

If you'd like to provide some proof that UTEP's line was even below average, that would be great.

locseti
01-24-2007, 12:11 AM
Stanford was horrendous this year, and their line was terrible, but so was UTEPS.

You sure about that?

If you'd like to provide some proof that UTEP's line was even below average, that would be great.

Scott Wright on Jordan Palmer : "Tough, strong, and relatively durable considering the beating he took at times behind a sub par offensive line"

You're right, terrible was probably the wrong adjective to use in describing the UTEP line. Now let's move on.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-24-2007, 12:13 AM
damn it.the browns are looking at Kalil.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-24-2007, 12:24 AM
damn it.the browns are looking at Kalil.

I still do think he's a bit small, although I don't know what scheme Kiffin is going to employ (if he sticks to Shell's general theme, Kalil is definitely not the guy).

Crow
01-24-2007, 04:40 AM
Grove looked a lot better as a rook. Hopefully, the new OL coach can get him...and Gallery...back to the form they showed that year.

portermvp84
01-24-2007, 09:45 AM
I wanna see the Gallery we saw in college, he was a beast. New o-line coach hopefully will get him on pace to stay at a postion and do good.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-24-2007, 10:06 AM
Grove looked a lot better as a rook. Hopefully, the new OL coach can get him...and Gallery...back to the form they showed that year.

I wouldn't be opposed to taking a tackle in the 2nd round or a bit later (although I'm not sure what will be left at that point). Gallery physically looks like a RT now, so even if he starts playing well, I think that'll be the best spot. And if he can work his weight down, we could just plug in the draftee at RT.

Xonraider
01-24-2007, 12:58 PM
I'm starting to think Norv might have led us to an 7-9 or 8-8 ifwe had kept him.

RaiderLifer
01-24-2007, 01:13 PM
I'm starting to think Norv might have led us to an 7-9 or 8-8 ifwe had kept him.

I have to agree. Although I still don't think he was the long term answer his offense wasn't the joke that was on the field last year. That is why I have high hopes for this year, Ryan is going to be left alone to work his magic and our offense will be brought back to this century. If we could have had an offense ranked 15th-22nd we could have won 8-9 games. Lead us out of the woods Kiffin!!!!!!!!!!! 8)

Xonraider
01-24-2007, 01:28 PM
Look at my new sick sig.

locseti
01-24-2007, 01:41 PM
Look at my new sick sig.

That is classic!

slightlyaraiderfan
01-24-2007, 02:01 PM
I got this from Xon's link:

Davis was, as ever, fascinating, combative, revealing. He peppered his post-news conference remarks with the F-word, insinuated that he wanted to draft Matt Leinart last year, and called last season ``a year of infamy.''
Might Al consider taking a QB if he said something like that?....or he mentioned Leinart because of his SC ties.

Windy
01-24-2007, 02:31 PM
I got this from Xon's link:

Davis was, as ever, fascinating, combative, revealing. He peppered his post-news conference remarks with the F-word, insinuated that he wanted to draft Matt Leinart last year, and called last season ``a year of infamy.''
Might Al consider taking a QB if he said something like that?....or he mentioned Leinart because of his SC ties.

yea i read that in a few different papers. makes me wonder if lombardi was the one making the picks.

locseti
01-24-2007, 02:33 PM
I got this from Xon's link:

Davis was, as ever, fascinating, combative, revealing. He peppered his post-news conference remarks with the F-word, insinuated that he wanted to draft Matt Leinart last year, and called last season ``a year of infamy.''
Might Al consider taking a QB if he said something like that?....or he mentioned Leinart because of his SC ties.

Wonder what he really said. Man, Al Davis is like that childhood friend you've known your whole life. No matter how ridiculous he sounds while speaking drunk at your wedding, you stand by him and support him cause you've been through so much together.

Stash
01-24-2007, 03:50 PM
In the PC, Kiffin said something about how the players would play hard and play happy. My interpretation would be that he intends to keep Moss/Porter and expects them to give more effort next season. I hope thats not what he was implying because I want those bums gone, especially Moss. If Kiffin were to keep them around, do you guys think that would completely rule out CJ as the Raiders pick?

slightlyaraiderfan
01-24-2007, 04:02 PM
In the PC, Kiffin said something about how the players would play hard and play happy. My interpretation would be that he intends to keep Moss/Porter and expects them to give more effort next season. I hope thats not what he was implying because I want those bums gone, especially Moss. If Kiffin were to keep them around, do you guys think that would completely rule out CJ as the Raiders pick?
He also said everybody has a clean slate, and it sounded like they're going to stay...but we also can't take too much from what was said yesterday.

RaiderNation
01-24-2007, 05:35 PM
In the PC, Kiffin said something about how the players would play hard and play happy. My interpretation would be that he intends to keep Moss/Porter and expects them to give more effort next season. I hope thats not what he was implying because I want those bums gone, especially Moss. If Kiffin were to keep them around, do you guys think that would completely rule out CJ as the Raiders pick?
He also said everybody has a clean slate, and it sounded like they're going to stay...but we also can't take too much from what was said yesterday.

dont most coaches say that when their first hired?

RaiderLifer
01-24-2007, 05:44 PM
In the PC, Kiffin said something about how the players would play hard and play happy. My interpretation would be that he intends to keep Moss/Porter and expects them to give more effort next season. I hope thats not what he was implying because I want those bums gone, especially Moss. If Kiffin were to keep them around, do you guys think that would completely rule out CJ as the Raiders pick?
He also said everybody has a clean slate, and it sounded like they're going to stay...but we also can't take too much from what was said yesterday.

dont most coaches say that when their first hired?

Al was asked after the PC if Moss was going to be a Raider next year and he said he couldn't speculate on that. That makes me think he might be gone. Also if you think back to the PC he spent much more time addressing the JP situation than Moss. Right now I think he is going to try and trade Moss because he has more value and he is going to try and make Porter happy. He also dropped several hints that drafting a QB is not out of the question. Now I'm starting to question what the hell we are going to do. :?

bills_red
01-24-2007, 06:11 PM
Senice they locked my tread on NFL

What do you think of Terdell Sands.
I heard some poeple say this guy is pretty good. What do you think of him?
Will he fit the Bills Tampa 2?

Paranoidmoonduck
01-24-2007, 06:12 PM
Eh, he did a solid job in the rotation this year, but he wasn't anything special. If not for his size, he wouldn't even be talked about.

Stash
01-24-2007, 06:44 PM
In the PC, Kiffin said something about how the players would play hard and play happy. My interpretation would be that he intends to keep Moss/Porter and expects them to give more effort next season. I hope thats not what he was implying because I want those bums gone, especially Moss. If Kiffin were to keep them around, do you guys think that would completely rule out CJ as the Raiders pick?
He also said everybody has a clean slate, and it sounded like they're going to stay...but we also can't take too much from what was said yesterday.

dont most coaches say that when their first hired?

Yeah, sorry. I left out the part where he mentioned 'getting the ball to the star players' and then he said they would play happy, hard, etc. Thats what lead me to believe he wanted to keep Moss/Porter. I guess we're just gonna have to wait and see how all this pans out.

bernbabybern820
01-24-2007, 06:45 PM
Senice they locked my tread on NFL

What do you think of Terdell Sands.
I heard some poeple say this guy is pretty good. What do you think of him?
Will he fit the Bills Tampa 2?

very solid run stuffer. comes out in passing situations. that is all.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-24-2007, 08:12 PM
Grove looked a lot better as a rook. Hopefully, the new OL coach can get him...and Gallery...back to the form they showed that year.The # of fumbled snaps this year was inexcusabel.hes dead to me.

raidersfanxxx
01-24-2007, 09:26 PM
next season is the last chance for grove and gallery for me.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-24-2007, 09:28 PM
next season is the last chance for gallery for me.

RaiderLifer
01-24-2007, 09:39 PM
next season is the last chance for grove and gallery for me.

As long as they get some solid coaching I really believe they will make progress towards reaching the potential we all know they had coming in. If they don't show improvement this year, I too am done with them.

portermvp84
01-24-2007, 10:22 PM
Me too, I think we have gave them plenty of chances to show us what they can do. We should just play it out and see what goes on next season, if they improved keep them if not boot them.

RaiderNation
01-24-2007, 10:47 PM
Me too, I think we have gave them plenty of chances to show us what they can do. We should just play it out and see what goes on next season, if they improved keep them if not boot them.

what team would want to pick ip gallerys huge contract? i think we should ride his contract out. then make our decision on either hes here to stay or hes gone

Komp
01-24-2007, 10:47 PM
Man, we might not a good football team at the moment but we sure are entertaining. I seriously have no idea what pick we are going to make. I can't wait for the draft.

Yah, I liked Turner and didn't think he got a fair shake. I couldn't wait for Callahan to get his ass booted out tho.

RaiderNation
01-24-2007, 11:40 PM
can some1 help me with my sig? i keep tryn to put a quote under there and it isnt working. what am i doing wrong?

RaiderLifer
01-24-2007, 11:43 PM
Just was looking at Gil Brandt's All Rookie Team and not only did M.Huff make the team but I found something pretty impressive. We had seven picks in the draft one of them went on IR immediately (Bing) and we still had the third most rookie starts in the league behind Green Bay (12 picks) and Buffalo (9 picks). I know a lot of them (especially McQuistan's) were bad starts but I think it's a good sign that were getting the young guys experience (just wish it wasn't experience at losing). The 16 starts out of Huff, and Howard, and 14 out of Boothe is good production IMO. If Bing can bulk up I think we could end up with 3 long term starters on D out of the first four rounds, not to mention one of the fastest line backing crews in the league. If we could do the same (or better) on the offensive side of the ball this year we are on our way to a solid foundation. 8) 8) 8)

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-25-2007, 12:14 AM
yeah I saw that to.
the LBs and the secondary are awesome for this team.

RaiderNation
01-25-2007, 12:38 AM
a howard/bing/morrison LB crew would be dominant for years to come. plus with our young secondary and burgess isnt slowing down. we will have to address our dline in the next couple of years. sapp will retire soon. im hoping a good 3-5 more years out of burgess. and tyler brayton isnt good. i think we need to draft a DE in this years or nexts in the top 3 rounds. our biggest need on D is another DT. a big run stuffer in the middle. if we trade down and say CJ,AD,russell and quinn arnt there i think branch would help us ALOT. im pretty sure in nexts year FA theres a good DT out there. im pretty sure simon off of the colts wont resign with them. also the possibility of freeney and grant

Paranoidmoonduck
01-25-2007, 12:44 AM
I liked a few things I saw from Bing in the preseason, I would just like to see him build up some lower body strength and bulk (he is noticabley bigger than the rest of our entire linebacking corps from the waist up). I think the only concern is what Howard will end up doing. He played great last year filling gaps on the weakside, but I think they want to use him on the strong-side (which I know he can do) and probably be an extra rusher at times (which he might not be able to do).

If it works out, this corps could be really good. That said, I wouldn't be opposed to taking an outside linebacker with potential late on the 2nd day just as insurance, we don't have a lot of depth as it is.

RaiderNation
01-25-2007, 12:52 AM
what was bings injury? if he wasnt injuried do u think he would have started?

slightlyaraiderfan
01-25-2007, 12:52 AM
what was bings injury? if he wasnt injuried do u think he would have started?
Neck stinger

Paranoidmoonduck
01-25-2007, 12:57 AM
Oakland was looking for a reason ot put Bing on IR to free up a roster spot. Treat it like a kind of redshirt, I guess.

So no, he wasn't bound to start. I think Sam Williams did a pretty fine job this past season though. I do recall Al saying in some interview that they hadn't used Howard how they planned, so I have no doubt Bing will get his shot.

edit:
Keep in mind that I said Bing did some things I liked in the preseason, not that he was anywhere near starting. He didn't have a great grasp of the position (understandable), but he did show he has the athleticism to play the spot.

One thing that would be neat would be keep the 'backer corps as it is, but use Bing the same way we've used Gibson recently (4th LB of sorts), on more often. He could probably play that hybrid position really well for the time being.

RaiderNation
01-25-2007, 01:00 AM
oh ic. also whos gonna be our starting TE if we dont draft/pick up one in FA? madsen?anderson?

Paranoidmoonduck
01-25-2007, 01:09 AM
oh ic. also whos gonna be our starting TE if we dont draft/pick up one in FA? madsen?anderson?

I think we could survive with them for now, although I think Madsen will have to play a sort of hybrid split back role. I like Miller and can stand Olsen, but with our extensive needs on offense, I'm not sure they're worth the high 2nd round picks they'd require. I'd much rather see a someone like Staley, Ugoh, Leonard, Tyler, etc. A good later option would be Ben Patrick of Delaware. He's a good athlete, and has been performing well this off-season, first in the Shrine Bowl, and now the Senior Bowl practices.

RaiderLifer
01-25-2007, 02:46 AM
oh ic. also whos gonna be our starting TE if we dont draft/pick up one in FA? madsen?anderson?

I think we could survive with them for now, although I think Madsen will have to play a sort of hybrid split back role. I like Miller and can stand Olsen, but with our extensive needs on offense, I'm not sure they're worth the high 2nd round picks they'd require. I'd much rather see a someone like Staley, Ugoh, Leonard, Tyler, etc. A good later option would be Ben Patrick of Delaware. He's a good athlete, and has been performing well this off-season, first in the Shrine Bowl, and now the Senior Bowl practices.

I like the Ben Patrick idea. I would rather have Staley or another highly rated OT than Miller or Olsen. The best case scenario is filling one of those positions through free agency. I have a feeling we are going to be relatively quite this offseason though. I really want Leonard but unless we make a trade I don't see it happening...unless he runs really well at the combine.

portermvp84
01-25-2007, 09:41 AM
Any certain reason why we keep Derrick Gibson around jw?

Komp
01-25-2007, 09:44 AM
Never mind I always thought Gibson had a big contract for some reason but I just looked it up and I think its a reasonable fee for his services. Might as well keep him around.

Windy
01-25-2007, 01:40 PM
http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders/ci_5083163

Kiffin sighted with Greg Knapp.

portermvp84
01-25-2007, 02:25 PM
I say we give knapp the OC job, so we can get a little more insight on the offensive side of the ball.

Crow
01-25-2007, 03:01 PM
I wonder if Knapp would be bringing that ZBS with him.

USC wasn't a ZBS offense, was it? I never paid theit OL that much attention.

bernbabybern820
01-25-2007, 03:16 PM
Me too, I think we have gave them plenty of chances to show us what they can do. We should just play it out and see what goes on next season, if they improved keep them if not boot them.

what team would want to pick ip gallerys huge contract? i think we should ride his contract out. then make our decision on either hes here to stay or hes gone

he would be moved to guard if he struggles again next year imo.

locseti
01-25-2007, 04:39 PM
Greg Knapp? :evil:

RaiderLifer
01-25-2007, 05:42 PM
I wonder if Knapp would be bringing that ZBS with him.

USC wasn't a ZBS offense, was it? I never paid theit OL that much attention.

I remember reading somewhere that they did use a version of ZBS. Not sure where or how credible the source was but I specifically remember reading it.

Komp
01-25-2007, 06:04 PM
That would make Kalil a definite draft target for us....

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-25-2007, 07:34 PM
It said Knapp was also interested in a USC job.

Windy
01-25-2007, 08:50 PM
http://raiders.scout.com/2/613020.html

Raiders to Interview OL Coach.

Windy
01-25-2007, 08:55 PM
I saw this at another place.


At the bottom of this article it says that Pete Carroll expects the Raiders to pick Russell. Obviously he's the not decision maker but it's interesting.

http://www.thedesertsun.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070125/SPORTS04/701250346/1031/sports04



Carroll hinted at who he expects the Raiders to select with the first pick of the NFL Draft. He said that Kiffin prefers a vertical passing offense that suits LSU quarterback JaMarcus Russell better than Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn.

"The kid from LSU is exactly what they're looking for," Carroll said, "more so than the kid from Notre Dame.

RaiderLifer
01-25-2007, 09:39 PM
http://raiders.scout.com/2/613020.html

Raiders to Interview OL Coach.

This answers the ZBS question. I'm excited for the switch. Here is to hoping that it sticks and our lineman can become comfortable for the first time in years. 8)

slightlyaraiderfan
01-25-2007, 09:50 PM
I saw this at another place.


At the bottom of this article it says that Pete Carroll expects the Raiders to pick Russell. Obviously he's the not decision maker but it's interesting.

http://www.thedesertsun.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070125/SPORTS04/701250346/1031/sports04



Carroll hinted at who he expects the Raiders to select with the first pick of the NFL Draft. He said that Kiffin prefers a vertical passing offense that suits LSU quarterback JaMarcus Russell better than Notre Dame quarterback Brady Quinn.

"The kid from LSU is exactly what they're looking for," Carroll said, "more so than the kid from Notre Dame.
Things are pointing to us drafting a QB, but as i've said before...we'll have to wait and see, especially with Davis.

RaiderNation
01-25-2007, 09:53 PM
i really hope we dont draft a qb. only way i wanna draf a qb in the 1st is either trade down or if we pick CJ/AD and one of them slides and we trade up for them. mayb moss/porter/jordan and our 2nd and a 5th or something liek that

Paranoidmoonduck
01-25-2007, 10:10 PM
I honestly would prefer Calvin Johnson, but if we draft a QB, so be it. I'll support them (them hopefully means Quinn) and hope for the best.

RaiderNation
01-25-2007, 10:16 PM
are we still going to be that vertical offence al wants? or r we gonna run a up to date offencE? if still vertical id want russell and quinn if more up to date. i still want CJ and AD of those 2 though

RaiderLifer
01-25-2007, 10:31 PM
The way I understand it, the Raiders have not only already interviewed former Atlanta Falcons offensive coordinator Greg Knapp and line coach Tom Cable, but offered jobs to both of them Wednesday.

Knapp is believed to be lukewarm to the idea for two reasons: 1) He is still under contract to the Falcons for another year and will get paid regardless; and 2) He will not be a play-caller on a team coached by Lane Kiffin.

Cable is a former line coach at Cal and UCLA and a head coach at Idaho before coaching with Atlanta last season. Haven't heard whether he will take the job or not.

http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/

raidersfanxxx
01-25-2007, 10:33 PM
http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders/ci_5083163

Kiffin sighted with Greg Knapp.

sounds good to me. bring him and gibbs so we can get this thing going :D .

RaiderLifer
01-25-2007, 10:38 PM
http://www.insidebayarea.com/raiders/ci_5083163

Kiffin sighted with Greg Knapp.

sounds good to me. bring him and gibbs so we can get this thing going :D .

The link above outlines why Gibbs is unlikely

Xonraider
01-25-2007, 11:21 PM
The ZBS suckes last time.. I hope we move Gallery to OG

Stash
01-25-2007, 11:39 PM
I don't know about this Cable guy as an OL coach. The article said he was the OL caoch in ATL last year, but I don't remember Atlantas OL being any good. Would that really be much of an improvement?

RaiderNation
01-25-2007, 11:46 PM
The ZBS suckes last time.. I hope we move Gallery to OG

who would be our OT be then?

RaiderLifer
01-25-2007, 11:55 PM
I don't know about this Cable guy as an OL coach. The article said he was the OL caoch in ATL last year, but I don't remember Atlantas OL being any good. Would that really be much of an improvement?

ATL-2939 rushing yards 5.5 ypc...37 sacks allowed....32 touchdowns

Oak-1519 rushing yards 3.9 ypc...72 sacks allowed....12 offensive TD's

That would be quite an improvement. Even after accounting for the Vick factor. 8) 8)

Paranoidmoonduck
01-26-2007, 12:08 AM
The ZBS suckes last time.. I hope we move Gallery to OG

What is this last time you're refering to?

tylaw24
01-26-2007, 12:25 AM
I don't know about this Cable guy as an OL coach. The article said he was the OL caoch in ATL last year, but I don't remember Atlantas OL being any good. Would that really be much of an improvement?

ATL-2939 rushing yards 5.5 ypc...37 sacks allowed....32 touchdowns

Oak-1519 rushing yards 3.9 ypc...72 sacks allowed....12 offensive TD's

That would be quite an improvement. Even after accounting for the Vick factor. 8) 8)

You also have to factor in the QB changes that happened throughout the course of the season. Vick started all 16 games last season.

RaiderLifer
01-26-2007, 12:50 AM
I don't know about this Cable guy as an OL coach. The article said he was the OL caoch in ATL last year, but I don't remember Atlantas OL being any good. Would that really be much of an improvement?

ATL-2939 rushing yards 5.5 ypc...37 sacks allowed....32 touchdowns

Oak-1519 rushing yards 3.9 ypc...72 sacks allowed....12 offensive TD's

That would be quite an improvement. Even after accounting for the Vick factor. 8) 8)

You also have to factor in the QB changes that happened throughout the course of the season. Vick started all 16 games last season.

You can factor in all the crappy the crappy Qb's we trotted out there and it would still be a clear upgrade. :shock:

Crow
01-26-2007, 05:14 AM
The ZBS suckes last time.. I hope we move Gallery to OG

What is this last time you're refering to?

We tried it during Norv's last year with the guy who coached Baltimore's OL during Jamal Lewis' 2K season. Something-or-other Colletto. It was a complete disaster.

That said, it's a good scheme. If the coaching is good, we could do some real damage with it.

Also, what exactly makes Russell a better fit for a verticle passing game than...say...Andrew Walter?

Komp
01-26-2007, 07:37 AM
The ZBS suckes last time.. I hope we move Gallery to OG

What is this last time you're refering to?

We tried it during Norv's last year with the guy who coached Baltimore's OL during Jamal Lewis' 2K season. Something-or-other Colletto. It was a complete disaster.

That said, it's a good scheme. If the coaching is good, we could do some real damage with it.

Also, what exactly makes Russell a better fit for a verticle passing game than...say...Andrew Walter?

Good question...Russell is like an Andrew Walter with less experience and a slightly better arm....is that worth the #1 pick?

portermvp84
01-26-2007, 09:23 AM
The ZBS suckes last time.. I hope we move Gallery to OG

What is this last time you're refering to?

We tried it during Norv's last year with the guy who coached Baltimore's OL during Jamal Lewis' 2K season. Something-or-other Colletto. It was a complete disaster.

That said, it's a good scheme. If the coaching is good, we could do some real damage with it.

Also, what exactly makes Russell a better fit for a verticle passing game than...say...Andrew Walter?

Good question...Russell is like an Andrew Walter with less experience and a slightly better arm....is that worth the #1 pick?

He know I think AD is worth the number on overall not J Russell.

portis_clinton
01-26-2007, 09:24 AM
The more I think about it, the more I think Lane Kiffen will give Andrew Walter a chance next year, since he's seen how productive he can be in the PAC 10.

So I think the pick would be between Calvin Johnson and Adrian Peterson, but don't they have alot invested in Lamont Jordan?

01-26-2007, 09:42 AM
Do you guys think Terdell Sands can play in the 3-4 as a deffensive end?

Also what is your opinion on Langston Walker? Is he worth a look in FA? What were his strengths and weaknesses?

portermvp84
01-26-2007, 09:55 AM
The more I think about it, the more I think Lane Kiffen will give Andrew Walter a chance next year, since he's seen how productive he can be in the PAC 10.

So I think the pick would be between Calvin Johnson and Adrian Peterson, but don't they have alot invested in Lamont Jordan?

Yeah i could see that too, we won't draft J Russell I really wanna see Adrian Peterson in Silver and Black. Lamont was suppose to be the man but he got injured doesn't hit the holes well enough.

Xonraider
01-26-2007, 10:53 AM
Do you guys think Terdell Sands can play in the 3-4 as a deffensive end?

Also what is your opinion on Langston Walker? Is he worth a look in FA? What were his strengths and weaknesses?

Terdell can definetly play 3-4 DE, IMO.

Walker's pro's are these:
Size
FG blokcing ability.

Thats it.

Crow
01-26-2007, 12:33 PM
The more I think about it, the more I think Lane Kiffen will give Andrew Walter a chance next year, since he's seen how productive he can be in the PAC 10.

So I think the pick would be between Calvin Johnson and Adrian Peterson, but don't they have alot invested in Lamont Jordan?

He's due a 4.75 million dollar roster bonus this offseason. I really don't see Al writing that check.

Do you guys think Terdell Sands can play in the 3-4 as a deffensive end?

Also what is your opinion on Langston Walker? Is he worth a look in FA? What were his strengths and weaknesses?

Sands as a 3-4 DE...possibly. Problem is, he really hasn't proven that he has the stamina for a starter's share of snaps. Other than that, the guy is a heckuva player.

Walker is something of an enigma. During the Gruden/Callahan years, Walker was a damn good tackle. He filled in at both left and right tackle, as Sims and Kennedy had some injury issues, and performed very well on both sides.

Since then, though, he's been arguably the worst performer on a bad O-line. I can't really hate on him for it, as the entire offense has been a joke. Seems a little ignorant to single one man out.

He's a huge man. 6'8, 340ish. Before everything turned to sh/t, he was damn hard to get around. Pretty good feet. Never really had that mean streak you want, though. Doesn't flash a lot of power for a man his size, but has demonstrated the ability to get to the 2nd level.

If you've got a good OL coach who can undo the damage we've done to him, he could turn out to be a FA gem. Then again, he may be broken now.

stl9erfan
01-26-2007, 02:31 PM
just curious, why do some of you want AD with the first pick? a possible injury prone running back at number 1? and you guys have Lamont. he's not the greatest, but there are so many other needs on the offense then running back.

personally i think you guys should take CJ, Russel, Quinn, or Thomas.

if you guys draft a qb, how good will he be when Porter and Moss are both gone?Moss should have been better than he played, but he just wants out of Oakland.

drafting CJ automatically makes Walter or Aaron Rogers better. He might atcually wanna play football. and its not very often you find a Randy Moss replacment.

taking Thomas would farther help your line, making both the RB and QB better. this pick isnt likely, but it wouldnt hurt.

granit, i'm a browns fan, but i like to keep an eye on the raiders. there's my 2 cents.

portermvp84
01-26-2007, 02:37 PM
When Lamont is healthy and not trying alwaysshed off bockers, he has done alright. I figure if he gets hurt or doesn't do anything at all we should get rid of him after thise next season.

slightlyaraiderfan
01-26-2007, 02:59 PM
just curious, why do some of you want AD with the first pick? a possible injury prone running back at number 1? and you guys have Lamont. he's not the greatest, but there are so many other needs on the offense then running back.

personally i think you guys should take CJ, Russel, Quinn, or Thomas.

if you guys draft a qb, how good will he be when Porter and Moss are both gone?Moss should have been better than he played, but he just wants out of Oakland.

drafting CJ automatically makes Walter or Aaron Rogers better. He might atcually wanna play football. and its not very often you find a Randy Moss replacment.

taking Thomas would farther help your line, making both the RB and QB better. this pick isnt likely, but it wouldnt hurt.

granit, i'm a browns fan, but i like to keep an eye on the raiders. there's my 2 cents.
We desperatly need a running game, and theres a possibility that Lamont could get cut. I would rather trade down and get Marshawn, then take AP #1(All the scouts have him with 5-10 value). I've been wanting CJ, for quite a long time...but a good running game is always a bigger need.

raiderfan_89
01-26-2007, 03:48 PM
I say the Raiders need some help.
;D
not that much though.

RaiderLifer
01-26-2007, 03:50 PM
Michael Smith just reported that Moss is not accepting Kiffin's phone calls. Apparently he stated he does not want to talk speak with him...Way to give a guy a fair shake Moss. Trade his ass now :evil:

Stash
01-26-2007, 04:30 PM
ATL-2939 rushing yards 5.5 ypc...37 sacks allowed....32 touchdowns

Oak-1519 rushing yards 3.9 ypc...72 sacks allowed....12 offensive TD's

That would be quite an improvement. Even after accounting for the Vick factor. 8) 8)

Thanks for the stats, I'm glad to see the that Cable was pretty successful and hopefully he can help the Raiders O-line.


just curious, why do some of you want AD with the first pick? a possible injury prone running back at number 1? and you guys have Lamont. he's not the greatest, but there are so many other needs on the offense then running back.

I agree that Jordan and the raiders run game isn't bad enough to use the #1 overall pick on, so I hope they don't use it on AP. I think AP will be a very good RB in the NFL, but I just think that Lynch isn't much of a step down from AP and he is projected to go in the mid 1st. So if the Raiders decide they want to draft a rb, my hope is that they trade down, get what they can for the pick, and draft Lynch in the mid 1st. I still want the Raiders to take CJ though, especially if Moss looks to be gone.

raidersfanxxx
01-26-2007, 05:53 PM
we need to do some wheelin and dealin with moss and porter. they are huge cancers to the team. and as for LJ....hes ok in my book, at least he cares.

RaiderNation
01-26-2007, 07:58 PM
we need to do some wheelin and dealin with moss and porter. they are huge cancers to the team. and as for LJ....hes ok in my book, at least he cares.

moss is as good as gone. if we keep porter i think we will go with AD. even if we keep jordan. let AD have some time to learn the offence with lamont and then trade lamont next year. id prefer CJ over AD though

Paranoidmoonduck
01-26-2007, 08:17 PM
I'd prefer CJ over anyone by a hefty margin at this point.

RaiderNation
01-26-2007, 08:27 PM
dante stallowrth is a FA this year? any chance we snag him? hes from the sacramento area. id want him if moss,porter and we dont draft CJ

Xonraider
01-26-2007, 09:45 PM
just curious, why do some of you want AD with the first pick? a possible injury prone running back at number 1? and you guys have Lamont. he's not the greatest, but there are so many other needs on the offense then running back.

personally i think you guys should take CJ, Russel, Quinn, or Thomas.

if you guys draft a qb, how good will he be when Porter and Moss are both gone?Moss should have been better than he played, but he just wants out of Oakland.

drafting CJ automatically makes Walter or Aaron Rogers better. He might atcually wanna play football. and its not very often you find a Randy Moss replacment.

taking Thomas would farther help your line, making both the RB and QB better. this pick isnt likely, but it wouldnt hurt.

granit, i'm a browns fan, but i like to keep an eye on the raiders. there's my 2 cents.

Aaron Rodgers

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-26-2007, 10:38 PM
dante stallowrth is a FA this year? any chance we snag him? hes from the sacramento area. id want him if moss,porter and we dont draft CJi think Philly will try really hard to keep him in Philly.I dont see him going anywhere.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-27-2007, 12:23 AM
apparently Moss doesnt like Kiffin. :D :D :D :D
now get him outta here Kiffin.

RaiderNation
01-27-2007, 12:28 AM
apparently Moss doesnt like Kiffin. :D :D :D :D
now get him outta here Kiffin.

trade him, our 3rd and next years 3rd for mike vick :wink: that means we still got the woodson comp this year too. then draft CJ/AD. OL wouldnt be as much of a problem but still needs to be adressed.

D4rk 0ne
01-27-2007, 01:11 AM
apparently Moss doesnt like Kiffin. :D :D :D :D
now get him outta here Kiffin.

trade him, our 3rd and next years 3rd for mike vick :wink: that means we still got the woodson comp this year too. then draft CJ/AD. OL wouldnt be as much of a problem but still needs to be adressed.
That would be implausible in terms of cap space.

NIN1984
01-27-2007, 09:41 AM
We can't bring Moss or Porter back next season they both quit on the team, why would anyone want quitters?

cut or trade them they must go, Look how hard guys like Fargas and Curry were playing that's the type of players I want

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-27-2007, 11:02 AM
Porter didnt technically quit he just pissed off Art to the point where he was never allowed to play.Im alright with Porter staying.
Moss has gotta go.

Komp
01-27-2007, 12:35 PM
Yah I agree with that, Porter is at least salvageable depending on whether he still gets along with his teammates. Moss can go somewhere else and pout. It's too bad cause he has so much talent, but he doesn't have the heart.

RaiderNation
01-27-2007, 01:00 PM
Yah I agree with that, Porter is at least salvageable depending on whether he still gets along with his teammates. Moss can go somewhere else and pout. It's too bad cause he has so much talent, but he doesn't have the heart.

agree with everything u said

RaiderLifer
01-27-2007, 03:39 PM
Brian Leonard is really impressing me

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-27-2007, 03:47 PM
not having NFL network sucks. :cry:

Paranoidmoonduck
01-27-2007, 03:56 PM
Also, what exactly makes Russell a better fit for a verticle passing game than...say...Andrew Walter?

I think the term vertical offense is a bit funny. If we trade Moss, we end up with Porter and Curry (and maybe CJ), and Kiffin, who didn't really run many go routes down as USC.

Honestly, I think that Russell is going to be a better QB than Walter will, and that's enough for me. Not that I'm clamoring for him, I remain on the CJ bandwagon.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-27-2007, 04:38 PM
theres no doubt that Russell can throw the ball farther than Walter can but Walter also has good arm strength.so QB is not a day one need in my book.

how are things going on in the SB?

RaiderNation
01-27-2007, 04:41 PM
theres no doubt that Russell can throw the ball farther than Walter can but Walter also has good arm strength.so QB is not a day one need in my book.

how are things going on in the SB?

i agree. i think walter is smarter than russell. walter would have done WAY better if we didnt do so many 7 step drops. if lamont was healthy our running game would have helped walter too because the d would respect the run more. i think we cant pass up CJ here. every draft theres a chance to get a franchise qb. there rarely a chance to get an athlete like CJ or even AD. i prefer brohm over both of theses qb's too. i think if walter doesnt do good brohm will be our man next year

Paranoidmoonduck
01-27-2007, 05:12 PM
theres no doubt that Russell can throw the ball farther than Walter can but Walter also has good arm strength.so QB is not a day one need in my book.

how are things going on in the SB?

Treating the running of our offense as a matter of arm strength is just ridiculous. I like Russell a hell of a lot more as a prospect than I liked Walter, and I think both he and Quinn will likely be significantly more successful in the long run.

EDIT: Walter's football IQ was a major question coming out of college as well.

Xonraider
01-27-2007, 06:20 PM
theres no doubt that Russell can throw the ball farther than Walter can but Walter also has good arm strength.so QB is not a day one need in my book.

how are things going on in the SB?

Treating the running of our offense as a matter of arm strength is just ridiculous. I like Russell a hell of a lot more as a prospect than I liked Walter, and I think both he and Quinn will likely be significantly more successful in the long run.

EDIT: Walter's football IQ was a major question coming out of college as well.

Russell's decision making ability, toughness and accuracy are just average.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-27-2007, 06:33 PM
Russell's decision making ability, toughness and accuracy are just average.

His decision making is typically quite good, but it is punctuated by fairly dumb decisions every once in a while. I've not yet heard anything negative about his toughness, and his accuracy has always seemed quite good (considering how quick he is whipping the ball out of there).

I'm not a huge supporter of bringing Russell here to Oakland, but to act like Walter is anything but a cheaper and less talented option is stupid.

slightlyaraiderfan
01-27-2007, 08:08 PM
Raiders are #10 in the latest America's Game...which is on right now.

RaiderNation
01-27-2007, 08:22 PM
Raiders are #10 in the latest America's Game...which is on right now.

what?

slightlyaraiderfan
01-27-2007, 09:23 PM
Raiders are #10 in the latest America's Game...which is on right now.

what?
On NFL Network, they had a countdown of the greatest super bowl teams. The Raiders have had two teams, and today they showed us at #10. It was beautiful

Crow
01-27-2007, 09:30 PM
The illegal gear specialist was pretty amusing.

RaiderNation
01-27-2007, 11:40 PM
can some1 tell me whats wrong with my sig on the quote thing. its not working

RaiderLifer
01-28-2007, 12:06 AM
can some1 tell me whats wrong with my sig on the quote thing. its not working

Wish I could help you I can't even figure out how to edit my profile so that I can ad an avatar and sig. If you could help me with that maybe Karma will make someone come along and help you :lol:

portermvp84
01-28-2007, 12:56 AM
Raider Nation i do like your avatar.

RaiderNation
01-28-2007, 01:03 AM
Raider Nation i do like your avatar.

lol thanks

Windy
01-28-2007, 02:18 AM
http://www.latimes.com/sports/college/usc/la-spw-uscfbrep26jan26,1,5770971.story?coll=la-headlines-sports-coll-usc&ctrack=1&cset=true

Booty glad to have Sarkisian back
By Gary Klein, Times Staff Writer
January 26, 2007

USC quarterback John David Booty said Thursday that he was elated quarterbacks coach Steve Sarkisian chose to remain with the Trojans but was sad to see offensive coordinator Lane Kiffin go.

The Oakland Raiders hired Kiffin as head coach Monday, three days after Sarkisian pulled his name from consideration.

"I was happy Sark stayed; I didn't want to start over new with somebody else," Booty said. "I would have understood if he was to go because it's one of those once-in-a-lifetime opportunities. But to have him back makes it a little easier on me."

Booty said he could not predict how the offense would be affected without Sarkisian and Kiffin sharing responsibilities as they did the past two seasons.

"It's hard to tell because they both played such a big role in the play-calling," he said. "It will be interesting to see how or if anything changes.

"Maybe I can go play for [Kiffin] one day. That would be awesome. I love Kiff and I hate to see him leave, but it's a head coach job in the NFL, and you dream about being his age and getting the opportunity."

Carroll has said that Sarkisian would assume complete control of the offense. He also appointed his son Brennan, the Trojans' tight ends coach, to fill Kiffin's spot as recruiting coordinator.

Graduate assistant Yogi Roth on Thursday accepted a position as an offensive assistant on Kiffin's Raiders staff.

"I've had a great experience and learned a lot here the last two years, and I'm looking forward to another great opportunity," Roth said.

Mark Jackson, who was USC's director of football operations from 2001-2004, also has joined the Raiders' organization, several sources said.

raidersfanxxx
01-28-2007, 04:04 AM
interesting

Metz
01-28-2007, 11:12 AM
I wonder what this means for Lombardi.

RaiderNation
01-28-2007, 01:07 PM
[url]

Mark Jackson, who was USC's director of football operations from 2001-2004, also has joined the Raiders' organization, several sources said.[/quote]

any1 know what hes doing?

Crow
01-28-2007, 01:32 PM
I wonder what this means for Lombardi.
Nothing.

RaiderNation
01-28-2007, 02:44 PM
any1 know how many picks we have?

i think we got 1 1st,1 2nd,2 3rds, 1 4th, 1 5th, 1 6th and 1 7th correct?

Crow
01-28-2007, 04:26 PM
Right now, I think we're looking at 1,2,3,4,5,5,6,7. Maybe another 5 or 6 for the Bobby Hamilton trade.

portermvp84
01-28-2007, 04:28 PM
We need to trade for another 2nd and 3rd.

portermvp84
01-28-2007, 04:30 PM
I wonder what this means for Lombardi.

Dude, thats a sweet sig.

RaiderNation
01-28-2007, 04:54 PM
Right now, I think we're looking at 1,2,3,4,5,5,6,7. Maybe another 5 or 6 for the Bobby Hamilton trade.

didnt we get a 3rd for the woodson trade?

Paranoidmoonduck
01-28-2007, 05:00 PM
Right now, I think we're looking at 1,2,3,4,5,5,6,7. Maybe another 5 or 6 for the Bobby Hamilton trade.

didnt we get a 3rd for the woodson trade?

Wasn't a trade. 'Twas a signing, which means that we may get an additional 3rd rounder of compensation, but it is by no means a set deal. We could just as easily wind up with an extra 5th.

RaiderNation
01-28-2007, 06:58 PM
Right now, I think we're looking at 1,2,3,4,5,5,6,7. Maybe another 5 or 6 for the Bobby Hamilton trade.

didnt we get a 3rd for the woodson trade?

Wasn't a trade. 'Twas a signing, which means that we may get an additional 3rd rounder of compensation, but it is by no means a set deal. We could just as easily wind up with an extra 5th.

oh ok

RaiderLifer
01-28-2007, 09:18 PM
Right now, I think we're looking at 1,2,3,4,5,5,6,7. Maybe another 5 or 6 for the Bobby Hamilton trade.

didnt we get a 3rd for the woodson trade?

Wasn't a trade. 'Twas a signing, which means that we may get an additional 3rd rounder of compensation, but it is by no means a set deal. We could just as easily wind up with an extra 5th.

When do the comp picks get announced? I would think that a guy that was franchised twice and signed a big free agent deal would constitute a third in compensation. How exactly determine the compensation? :?

Paranoidmoonduck
01-28-2007, 09:22 PM
It's based off how much a team collectively loses and gaines in the free agent period. We lost considerably more than we gained, so I would expect at least another 4th rounder, but you never know.

Woodson had a pretty good year, that bodes well.

portermvp84
01-28-2007, 09:31 PM
Woodson did awesome this year, why wasn't he that good with us for the last three years?

RaiderNation
01-28-2007, 09:37 PM
Woodson did awesome this year, why wasn't he that good with us for the last three years?

cuz hes a panzy

RaiderLifer
01-28-2007, 11:33 PM
Apparently Moss cussed out Kiffin during their introductory phone call

http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/

Metz
01-28-2007, 11:39 PM
I wonder what this means for Lombardi.

Dude, thats a sweet sig.

Thanks, dude

Paranoidmoonduck
01-28-2007, 11:50 PM
Apparently Moss cussed out Kiffin during their introductory phone call

http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/

Man, this hire got exciting fast!

I agree with the author though, if this increases motivation to trade Moss, it is a good thing.

RaiderNation
01-29-2007, 12:18 AM
Apparently Moss cussed out Kiffin during their introductory phone call

http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/

Man, this hire got exciting fast!

I agree with the author though, if this increases motivation to trade Moss, it is a good thing.

best thing i have heard all week

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-29-2007, 12:26 AM
Itd be best that Kiffen get rid of him quick.just to show he doesnt like whiners.

RaiderNation
01-29-2007, 12:35 AM
Itd be best that Kiffen get rid of him quick.just to show he doesnt like whiners.

i agree.

RaiderLifer
01-29-2007, 12:45 AM
Dump him. Even some of the other players have voiced their displeasure with the preferential treatment he was shown. Walter talks mildly about a need for an updated play book and gets benched Moss calls out the entire organization weekly and gets coddled. Trade him to the last place he wants to go with the worst QB situation/run game/oline....wait that's us... :oops:...Just get rid of him :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:

Jimmy
01-29-2007, 08:13 AM
Are you guys going to Hold on To Nnamdi Asomugha? (No, i didnt have to google search it)

I assume his contract is up, and (although i dont know your Cap situation) he will want a large bonus, at least 5 years, 30-40 Million. And thats underestimating. Bailey gets 60 over 7 years, and Asomugha is gonna get every penny he can get. Now Idk, are you guys most likely going to resign him? Because Denver shure could use a ballhawk opposite bailey with Physical tools (ala lenny walls, even though he couldnt cover a rigormortis patient)

good luck in your quest to return to contention in the AFC west/ wait till davis dies/ which ever comes first.

actually i take the which ever comes first thing back... it aint happening under Al.

oh and a quick reminder, Humans can live up to 120 years. you have fun with that... (another, what... 40 years? :lol:) although then again, he doesnt look to be in that great of a state.

Seriously though, best wishes to the raiders barring Davis

NIN1984
01-29-2007, 08:26 AM
Al Davis loves CBs look how long he kept Woodson around, Asomugha has 1 year left and I'm pretty sure Raiders will keep him

Jimmy
01-29-2007, 08:40 AM
Al Davis loves CBs look how long he kept Woodson around, Asomugha has 1 year left and I'm pretty sure Raiders will keep him

thanks

portermvp84
01-29-2007, 09:53 AM
I remembered we signed Tyrone Poole last off season, did he do anything this season?

Komp
01-29-2007, 12:54 PM
Yah I believe he was the 3rd CB behind Fabian/Nnamdi. He played alright from what I saw.

RaiderLifer
01-29-2007, 02:09 PM
Looks like Knapp is on board....I for one am very excited about this move. He is a solid NFL mind to use as a sounding board for Kiffin. I'm really starting to get optimistic about this season. I should just put down the Kool Aid and step away from the table before I get out of hand..

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/01/29/SPG11NQVKN2.DTL

slightlyaraiderfan
01-29-2007, 02:17 PM
Can't say it's a bad signing, since he won't be calling the plays...I remember seeing Falcons fans being uphappy with his play-callling.

All signs are pointing to ZBS.

RaiderLifer
01-29-2007, 02:39 PM
Can't say it's a bad signing, since he won't be calling the plays...I remember seeing Falcons fans being uphappy with his play-callling.

All signs are pointing to ZBS.

I don't put too much stock in what happened last year in Atlanta. They were trying to reinvent the wheel to make Vick happy and effective. I still remember when he was a possible head coaching candidate and an up and comer on the offensive side of the ball. I like the hire a lot.

locseti
01-29-2007, 02:52 PM
Can't say it's a bad signing, since he won't be calling the plays...I remember seeing Falcons fans being uphappy with his play-callling.

All signs are pointing to ZBS.

Forgot Kiffin will be calling he plays, Knapp will be there to help better acclimate him to the pro game. Good move. I would have a very different opinion of the move if Knapp were to be calling the plays..

Xonraider
01-29-2007, 03:42 PM
Yah I believe he was the 3rd CB behind Fabian/Nnamdi. He played alright from what I saw.

Him, Routt and Carr alternated that spot.

raidersfanxxx
01-29-2007, 06:09 PM
Can't say it's a bad signing, since he won't be calling the plays...I remember seeing Falcons fans being uphappy with his play-callling.

All signs are pointing to ZBS.

I don't put too much stock in what happened last year in Atlanta. They were trying to reinvent the wheel to make Vick happy and effective. I still remember when he was a possible head coaching candidate and an up and comer on the offensive side of the ball. I like the hire a lot.

we landed are guy, so im happy. glad to see things moveing in the right direction.

portermvp84
01-29-2007, 09:49 PM
I like the guy, he's a little conservative on the offense. He's a way better upgrade than old bed and breakfast Tom Walsh.

Shiver
01-30-2007, 01:16 AM
The Greg Knapp hire was good, only because Lane Kiffin will call the plays during the game. His only problem was his play-calling idiocy.

RaiderLifer
01-30-2007, 03:52 PM
I am not a big fan of his but does anyone think we will make a play for Garcia in the offseason? I wouldn't have given it a second thought but the Knapp hire has me wondering? I was one who thought there was zero chance that Al drafts a QB in the first (history tells us that it's highly unlikely) but some of the comments made by Carroll, Kiffin, and Al himself have me second guessing that position. So what do you think the chances we draft a QB at #1 are? I still say it's somewhere around 30% If we do bring in a vet (almost certain even if we do go QB at 1) who do you think it will be? Garcia, Rattay, Huard? What do you think will happen and what do you want to happen? For the record I would like AD or CJ but if Al falls in love with one of these QB's I'll be excited to have them.

slightlyaraiderfan
01-30-2007, 05:13 PM
I'm sure we are going to look at some vet QB...I'm cool with Garcia, just as long as it isnt Plummer.

AlexDown
01-30-2007, 05:48 PM
Any reason why they would not go after Ramsey?

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-30-2007, 06:30 PM
I'm sure we are going to look at some vet QB...I'm cool with Garcia, just as long as it isnt Plummer.same i actually like the thought of Garcia.

RaiderLifer
01-30-2007, 06:37 PM
I wouldn't mind Ramsey and I wouldn't mind Carr if he is released.

SubNoize
01-30-2007, 06:51 PM
I've been a fan forever and have been opposed to drafting a QB in past years as well, but I think it would be a mistake to pass on Russell or Quinn this year. Walter is not the long term answer and bringing in a washed up vet hasn't worked in the lasy few years. Porter and Curry or Gabriel can still be a threat and if we can fix the line Jordan has proved he can rush for 1000 and catch. We need a franchise signal caller this year!!!!

edgrenade
01-30-2007, 07:04 PM
Garcia's arm isn't strong enough.

portermvp84
01-30-2007, 07:29 PM
He's getting up there in age. I don't wanna see Snake in Oakland, the only good thing I like is the boot leg, he is the master at that.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-30-2007, 08:45 PM
I've been a fan forever and have been opposed to drafting a QB in past years as well, but I think it would be a mistake to pass on Russell or Quinn this year. Walter is not the long term answer and bringing in a washed up vet hasn't worked in the lasy few years.based off what exactly? Porter and Curry or Gabriel can still be a threat and if we can fix the line Jordan has proved he can rush for 1000 and catch.why so he can fool around in the backround and not run forward like hes done this past year.

SubNoize
01-30-2007, 09:13 PM
based on what? how about the undeniable evidence of a majority of losses because of turn overs made by these veterans brooks and collins. and add that on top of walters happy feet and no presence in the pocket. he can not feel his blind side at all. as for jordan he only had to dance because of poor line play. you have an obsession for AD but the problem is he has durability issues and is not worth the first overall pick.

portermvp84
01-30-2007, 09:44 PM
Yeah and thats why, we need to trade down a couple of draft picks to get him. I'd rather take AD over JR, based on the fact that I'm not to impressed with any of the QB's in this draft. I personally hope we either traded down and take AD, or take CJ number one.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-30-2007, 09:56 PM
based on what? how about the undeniable evidence of a majority of losses because of turn overs made by these veterans brooks and collins. and add that on top of walters happy feet and no presence in the pocket. he can not feel his blind side at all. as for jordan he only had to dance because of poor line play. you have an obsession for AD but the problem is he has durability issues and is not worth the first overall pick.i wouldnt be able to feel my blindside for very long either when i am asked to do 7 step drop backs with the worse Oline in the league.
Walter never had a fair chance.He was put in the worse Oline,worst TEs,worse WRs,a poor running game, and the worst OCs.
No Lamont costs to much money for him to dance around in the backfield and try and run around guys instead of running em over.
AP has more power,more speed,and better vision than Lamon does and can bring more to the table than Quinn or Russell.
AP can bring stability,consistency,and a gameplan.

RaiderNation
01-30-2007, 10:59 PM
if russell driops into the picks around 20, do u think we would trade up to get him? a J russ CJ/AD comb would look good. what do u think we would give up for it? mayb our 2nd, moss/porter/jordan and a like a 5th

Paranoidmoonduck
01-30-2007, 11:19 PM
if russell driops into the picks around 20, do u think we would trade up to get him? a J russ CJ/AD comb would look good. what do u think we would give up for it? mayb our 2nd, moss/porter/jordan and a like a 5th

If he falls that far I wouldn't put it past Al Davis. That said, it would really suprise me if Russell falls that far (unless scouts sour on him before the draft).

Stuff about Walter

I think the problem was that 5 minutes into the game Walter couldn't even feel his back, much less the pressure beyond it. I have a hard time faulting a man who was sacked 7 times in a half for getting happy feet.

RaiderNation
01-30-2007, 11:27 PM
if russell driops into the picks around 20, do u think we would trade up to get him? a J russ CJ/AD comb would look good. what do u think we would give up for it? mayb our 2nd, moss/porter/jordan and a like a 5th

If he falls that far I wouldn't put it past Al Davis. That said, it would really suprise me if Russell falls that far (unless scouts sour on him before the draft).

Stuff about Walter

I think the problem was that 5 minutes into the game Walter couldn't even feel his back, much less the pressure beyond it. I have a hard time faulting a man who was sacked 7 times in a half for getting happy feet.

mayb if hedoes something dumb like he did something like reggie bush did( talked to a agent early or something). if we dont pick him and if lions,browns,texans,phins and carolina dont pick him we have a chance because the teams15-22 wont pick him

Komp
01-30-2007, 11:34 PM
if russell driops into the picks around 20, do u think we would trade up to get him? a J russ CJ/AD comb would look good. what do u think we would give up for it? mayb our 2nd, moss/porter/jordan and a like a 5th

Jamarcus won't make it out of the top 10 unless he sucks it up big time at the Combine. There are enough teams with "average" QBs in the 8-15 picks that will take him. Someone I could see falling [especially cause I don't think he is going to put up a blazing 40 time] is Marshawn Lynch. Scott has Pittsburgh taking him but I don't see his style fitting the Steelers and if Green Bay passes on him he could fall all the way to the Jets at 25. The RB classes have been excellent the past two years so there are a lot of teams with young RB's that have either started their first year or are about to inherit the majority of the carries [CAR - Williams, NE - Maroney, Giants - Jacobs etc]

Paranoidmoonduck
01-30-2007, 11:36 PM
if russell driops into the picks around 20, do u think we would trade up to get him? a J russ CJ/AD comb would look good. what do u think we would give up for it? mayb our 2nd, moss/porter/jordan and a like a 5th

Jamarcus won't make it out of the top 10 unless he sucks it up big time at the Combine. There are enough teams with "average" QBs in the 8-15 picks that will take him. Someone I could see falling [especially cause I don't think he is going to put up a blazing 40 time] is Marshawn Lynch. Scott has Pittsburgh taking him but I don't see his style fitting the Steelers and if Green Bay passes on him he could fall all the way to the Jets at 25. The RB classes have been excellent the past two years so there are a lot of teams with young RB's that have either started their first year or are about to inherit the majority of the carries [CAR - Williams, NE - Maroney, Giants - Jacobs etc]

If Houston is going to pick a runner, it is going to be Lynch. If they don't, Lynch could fall a bit, but not very far I think.

gettembuck
01-31-2007, 09:47 AM
I'd love to trade down from #1, but looking at the teams and the players available....would anybody even be willing to trade up?

portermvp84
01-31-2007, 09:47 AM
They won't pass on Lynch, they passed on Reggie. THey're are in dire need of a good young healthy back. I think Lynch fis that mold.

SubNoize
01-31-2007, 09:51 AM
Well, I'm going to agree to disagree on this. every year the fans are going to argue that there's no need for a QB and this person fits better. bottom line is this franchise needs change and in my opinion it would speak volumes to buck the trend and take a franchise QB. As for drafting a RB, if we do it's a possibility to pick up Bush in the second round. My idea draft would be to Get Russell, Staley, and then Newton in rd.3. If we get a second 3rd round I'd hope a guy like Crowder would be there. Also Kareem Brown seems like he can fall to the 4th I'd like to pick him up there. My other scenario would be to go Russell, Bush and then Newton and Free, again if two 3's, and Brown or Bazuin in the 4th... I really like Newton as a big threat in the red zone, I live in AZ so i watch a lot of pac 10 football and this guy is legit.

gettembuck
01-31-2007, 10:55 AM
nm

SubNoize
01-31-2007, 11:52 AM
Walsh, Slater, Ward , and Ford were all told they can seek employment elsewhere, meaning they're off the staff!!! If they don't leave they'll be scouts for this year until their contracts expire next year. Also Darryl Sims our asst. D-line coach was asked to re-interview for his job, if not re-hired also prob. a sout teamer. Glad to see Kiffin cleaning house.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/sports/football/nfl/oakland_raiders/16586680.htm

SimonRath
01-31-2007, 12:00 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson

slightlyaraiderfan
01-31-2007, 12:06 PM
Walsh, Slater, Ward , and Ford were all told they can seek employment elsewhere, meaning they're off the staff!!! If they don't leave they'll be scouts for this year until their contracts expire next year. Also Darryl Sims our asst. D-line coach was asked to re-interview for his job, if not re-hired also prob. a sout teamer. Glad to see Kiffin cleaning house.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/sports/football/nfl/oakland_raiders/16586680.htm
Good, we need a completely new enviroment(on offense).

slightlyaraiderfan
01-31-2007, 12:07 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

SimonRath
01-31-2007, 12:10 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?

slightlyaraiderfan
01-31-2007, 12:50 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?
The Giants gave up a lot to get Eli, who was taken 3 spots ahead of them. The Falcons will pretty much have to give up this years and next years draft to acquire the #1. The Falcons arent stupid.

If Schaub was available, it might be different...but he isnt going anywhere.

SimonRath
01-31-2007, 01:18 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?
The Giants gave up a lot to get Eli, who was taken 3 spots ahead of them. The Falcons will pretty much have to give up this years and next years draft to acquire the #1. The Falcons arent stupid.

If Schaub was available, it might be different...but he isnt going anywhere.

Schaub probably will get traded.. the falcons would be really dumb not to trade him.. yea, the only way i would want to trade up to #1 would be if we throw in Schaub.. so it could be

Oakland gets:
Matt Schaub
#10 pick

Atlanta gets:
#1 pick

locseti
01-31-2007, 01:22 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?
The Giants gave up a lot to get Eli, who was taken 3 spots ahead of them. The Falcons will pretty much have to give up this years and next years draft to acquire the #1. The Falcons arent stupid.

If Schaub was available, it might be different...but he isnt going anywhere.

Schaub probably will get traded.. the falcons would be really dumb not to trade him.. yea, the only way i would want to trade up to #1 would be if we throw in Schaub.. so it could be

Oakland gets:
Matt Schaub
#10 pick

Atlanta gets:
#1 pick

hmmm

slightlyaraiderfan
01-31-2007, 01:34 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?
The Giants gave up a lot to get Eli, who was taken 3 spots ahead of them. The Falcons will pretty much have to give up this years and next years draft to acquire the #1. The Falcons arent stupid.

If Schaub was available, it might be different...but he isnt going anywhere.

Schaub probably will get traded.. the falcons would be really dumb not to trade him.. yea, the only way i would want to trade up to #1 would be if we throw in Schaub.. so it could be

Oakland gets:
Matt Schaub
#10 pick

Atlanta gets:
#1 pick
I'm pretty sure the Falcons are intending to keep Schaub.

SimonRath
01-31-2007, 01:39 PM
why would we.. we got Vick and Schockly

slightlyaraiderfan
01-31-2007, 01:48 PM
why would we.. we got Vick and Schockly
Petrino is not giving just giving Vick the starting job nod right away, I thought that was pretty evident by his comments he made when he was hired.

SimonRath
01-31-2007, 01:54 PM
why would we.. we got Vick and Schockly
Petrino is not giving just giving Vick the starting job nod right away, I thought that was pretty evident by his comments he made when he was hired.

Of couse Vick will get the job.. he's still our franchise
DJ will be #2 cause he is a good backup

gettembuck
01-31-2007, 02:45 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?
The Giants gave up a lot to get Eli, who was taken 3 spots ahead of them. The Falcons will pretty much have to give up this years and next years draft to acquire the #1. The Falcons arent stupid.

If Schaub was available, it might be different...but he isnt going anywhere.

Schaub probably will get traded.. the falcons would be really dumb not to trade him.. yea, the only way i would want to trade up to #1 would be if we throw in Schaub.. so it could be

Oakland gets:
Matt Schaub
#10 pick

Atlanta gets:
#1 pickIs this a realistic trade scenario?

Windy
01-31-2007, 02:49 PM
i'd be very upset if we do trade down especially to #10. i'd at least want a first rounder in 2008.

bernbabybern820
01-31-2007, 03:03 PM
i do think Walter has talent but anyone who thinks he doesn't hold the ball too long is crazy. After a few hundred times of getting sacked you would realize that you have to get rid of the ball faster since your o-line is shot.

SubNoize
01-31-2007, 03:27 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

AlexDown
01-31-2007, 03:37 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-31-2007, 05:46 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson

Based on past deals I can only imagine the deal would look something like this.

Our 1st rounder for 2 1st rounders (one this year and one next), 2 2nd rounders (same), a 3rd, and a 4th.

So basically your entire first day+, along with your first two selections next year.

Can you stomach that?

portermvp84
01-31-2007, 06:02 PM
I don't think Walter is the answer, we should try to trade for Schaub. Or try to sign somebody this off season.

LookItsAlDavis
01-31-2007, 06:45 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson

Based on past deals I can only imagine the deal would look something like this.

Our 1st rounder for 2 1st rounders (one this year and one next), 2 2nd rounders (same), a 3rd, and a 4th.

So basically your entire first day+, along with your first two selections next year.

Can you stomach that?

what if you throw schaub in there? then would you remove next years first rounder?

Paranoidmoonduck
01-31-2007, 06:47 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson

Based on past deals I can only imagine the deal would look something like this.

Our 1st rounder for 2 1st rounders (one this year and one next), 2 2nd rounders (same), a 3rd, and a 4th.

So basically your entire first day+, along with your first two selections next year.

Can you stomach that?

what if you throw schaub in there? then would you remove next years first rounder?

It all depends on Al. I think he would probably be willing to remove a 2nd rounder and maybe a 4th or something, depending on how he feels about Schaub.

I can guarantee that Al Davis will never trade down unless he is getting a king's ransom.

Xonraider
01-31-2007, 06:53 PM
It'd take 2 1sts, this years thrid, a 4th and a conditional next years 2nd or 3rd + Schaub to get the 1st pick.

Crow
01-31-2007, 06:53 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson
uhh move up from #10? A whole damn lot.

not that much... like what?
The Giants gave up a lot to get Eli, who was taken 3 spots ahead of them. The Falcons will pretty much have to give up this years and next years draft to acquire the #1. The Falcons arent stupid.

If Schaub was available, it might be different...but he isnt going anywhere.

Schaub probably will get traded.. the falcons would be really dumb not to trade him.. yea, the only way i would want to trade up to #1 would be if we throw in Schaub.. so it could be

Oakland gets:
Matt Schaub
#10 pick

Atlanta gets:
#1 pickIs this a realistic trade scenario?

Not at all. Atlanta would have to give up some more 1st day picks. Schaub may have some hype behind him, but he doesn't have that type of value.

Crow
01-31-2007, 06:55 PM
what would the Falcons have to give up to get your #1 pick so we can get Calvin Johnson

Based on past deals I can only imagine the deal would look something like this.

Our 1st rounder for 2 1st rounders (one this year and one next), 2 2nd rounders (same), a 3rd, and a 4th.

So basically your entire first day+, along with your first two selections next year.

Can you stomach that?

what if you throw schaub in there? then would you remove next years first rounder?

Not a chance in hell.

Crow
01-31-2007, 07:08 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better...

I don't know if Russell will be a bust or not, but he's too high risk for my taste. Especially considerig he plays a position that we don't even know for certain needs to be addressed.

Peterson makes us instantly better because we don't have a viable featured RB. Peterson has insane talent and vision...something LaMont Jordan and Justin Fargas just don't bring to the table.

Nothing helps an OL gel faster than a RB who can make something out of next-to-nothing. Havign a guy like that in the backfield will have the linemen thinking along the lines of "If I do my job, this guy could take one to the house." Right now, they're probably thinking "I we all don't do our jobs perfectly, LaMont will probably get dropped for a loss."

A stud RB makes all sorts of problems go away. Look at the teams who tend to win the close games, the teams that can hold onto a lead late in the game. They run the ball really well. They can pound it inside, or bounce it outside when the defense tightens up the middle.

Jordan can't get outside. He doesn't see the cutback lanes. Fargas is fast and played his ass off this past season, but he's a back up.

AP can do it all and would really help take pressure off our WRs...whoever we have left at the position, anyway.

Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "

What have Quinn or Russell done? Not a thing.

Walter is already on the roster. The investment has already been made. Guys like Tim Rattay, etc, wouldn't cost us a draft pick. David Carr would only cost us a 3 or 4. These things alone make them more palatable than either Quinn or Russell, IMO. Neither looks like a #1 overall pick to me. Nothing "safe" about either guy. Neither comes close to being a "sure thing".

But, as always, I rate the importance of a stud RB over that of a stud QB. You win a lot more games running the ball and playing defense than you do trying to throw 30+ times a game because your ground game is only "pretty good".

Paranoidmoonduck
01-31-2007, 07:12 PM
I hardly see Peterson as any more of a "sure" thing than I see either Russell or Quinn. Sure, quarterbacks by nature have a bit more flop potential, but I'm starting to have my doubts that Peterson is the most NFL fit runner in this draft.

Honestly, all I want is the best and safest player in this draft. That player is Calvin Johnson.

SubNoize
01-31-2007, 07:40 PM
some good points out there finally, but as far as a RB making an o-line faster i'm not buying that, all you have to do is look no further than the AZ Cardinals with Edge, a premiere back like that made a tiny improvement but overall, the line was still a sore spot all year. As far as what Russell has done... He's engineered some amazing comebacks in the 4th quarter ( ND game was impressive but expected). I watched this guy march on ASU in person and kill the Devils dreams with a completion to Doucet, which gave some people deja-vu this year in Tenn. when he did almost the same thing. Now I know 2 examples aren't going to sell you, but the guy shows confidence and poise in pressure situations, where Walter and Brady have failed. This guy has excelled in a tough conference and i think he has star potential, may not be safe but Gallery was the "safe" pick at one time too. I would like to see a RB taken as well, how bout unloading Moss and a 2nd and future picks to the Packers for that # 16 and take Lynch???

Crow
01-31-2007, 08:22 PM
some good points out there finally, but as far as a RB making an o-line faster i'm not buying that, all you have to do is look no further than the AZ Cardinals with Edge, a premiere back like that made a tiny improvement but overall, the line was still a sore spot all year.

They went from the worst rushing season in recent memory to having a 1000 yard back and a ground game that defenses actually had to account for. It wasn't great, but it was certainly more than a "tiny improvement".

Arizona this year helps make my point more than hurt it. Barry Sanders in Detroit goes without saying. LT in San Diego is a great example. Their OL was horrible, but LT still got it done until the line caught up with him a couple years ago.

Hell, look at the change from Jordan to Fargas. Jordan's hesitance was hurting us as much as anything the OL wasn't doing right. When he went down and Fargas became the go-to guy, our ground game improved. Not much, but enough that anyon could notice. Why? See the hole-Hit the hole. Don't dance. Don't overthink things. Don't try to make every run an 80 yarder. If the play is designed to go through the B gap, and there was a small glimmer of daylight there, Fargas hit it, got his 3, 4 8, 9 yards and got up ready for the next play. Smart running helps a lot. Smart running from someone of great talent: Huge difference.

As far as what Russell has done... He's engineered some amazing comebacks in the 4th quarter ( ND game was impressive but expected). I watched this guy march on ASU in person and kill the Devils dreams with a completion to Doucet, which gave some people deja-vu this year in Tenn. when he did almost the same thing. Now I know 2 examples aren't going to sell you, but the guy shows confidence and poise in pressure situations, where Walter and Brady have failed.

Are you referring to Walter at ASU or in Oakland? If you're talking about this past season in Oakland, forget about it. The only thing you can take from 2006 is that every offensive staff firing we've done thusfar was completely warranted. You can't pull two guys off the couch after a friggin' decade and expect them to know how to run an offense. Sadly, we had to sit through a year of less than scientific research to prove that theory.

This guy has excelled in a tough conference and i think he has star potential,

No arguments.

may not be safe but Gallery was the "safe" pick at one time too.

And he played really well before we dumped our line coach and started bringing in new line coaches every year with different blocking schemes.

I would like to see a RB taken as well, how bout unloading Moss and a 2nd and future picks to the Packers for that # 16 and take Lynch???

If Green Bay would take Moss and we could get Lynch at 16, I'd bite. Definitely. So long as we didn't have to give up too much more than Moss and that 2.

But I'd take Calvin Johnson at #1, not Russell.

Crow
01-31-2007, 08:25 PM
I hardly see Peterson as any more of a "sure" thing than I see either Russell or Quinn. Sure, quarterbacks by nature have a bit more flop potential, but I'm starting to have my doubts that Peterson is the most NFL fit runner in this draft.

Makes sense, and I know a few others who put Lynch ahead of Peterson...if only because of durability concerns.

Honestly, all I want is the best and safest player in this draft. That player is Calvin Johnson.

Definitely a #1 overall caliber player. I'm just really iffy abotu a WR that high. But, in this case, I'm definitely willing to make an exception.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-31-2007, 08:40 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

RaiderLifer
01-31-2007, 09:02 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

If he started winning games for us you would support him. If he was a stud QB for us you would love him just like the rest of us. We all have our opinions about these prospects but as soon as they put on the Silver and Black we all wish them the best. I would prefer other prospects but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for him.

RaiderLifer
01-31-2007, 09:07 PM
Freddie B. Retired it's on raiders.com. Good to see the youth movement continue but I'll always have love for Freddie B. 8)

portermvp84
01-31-2007, 09:12 PM
He wasn't a bad Wr's coach. We could of kept him around.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-31-2007, 09:19 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

If he started winning games for us you would support him. If he was a stud QB for us you would love him just like the rest of us. We all have our opinions about these prospects but as soon as they put on the Silver and Black we all wish them the best. I would prefer other prospects but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for him.no i wouldnt support him.id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety.

NIN1984
01-31-2007, 09:35 PM
we need a qb

portermvp84
01-31-2007, 10:14 PM
We need a decent QB.

Stash
01-31-2007, 10:24 PM
we need a qb

no we don't

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-31-2007, 10:26 PM
we need a qbon day 2.

RaiderNation
01-31-2007, 10:33 PM
as of right now, who do u want more... quinn or russell. theres a chance we pick one. its hard to choose for me because i want Ck or AD so much. quinn is a better decion maker and i think better acc. russell has a HUGE arm and is 6'6 260 pounds. quinn is more of a for sure deal but russell has a bigger potenial

RaiderLifer
01-31-2007, 10:34 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

If he started winning games for us you would support him. If he was a stud QB for us you would love him just like the rest of us. We all have our opinions about these prospects but as soon as they put on the Silver and Black we all wish them the best. I would prefer other prospects but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for him.no i wouldnt support him.id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety.

So you've never been wrong about a prospect? Damn you should talk to Al about a scouting job or something. Look I'm not trying to run smack but if Jamarcus started winning games and proving the critics (you) wrong you sure as hell would support him. If you let what you thought about a prospect in college affect your feelings about them when they are putting in solid work for the Raiders than who exactly are you rooting for? Is it the team or guys you hand picked that were good or bad for the organization?

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-31-2007, 10:38 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

If he started winning games for us you would support him. If he was a stud QB for us you would love him just like the rest of us. We all have our opinions about these prospects but as soon as they put on the Silver and Black we all wish them the best. I would prefer other prospects but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for him.no i wouldnt support him.id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety.

So you've never been wrong about a prospect? Damn you should talk to Al about a scouting job or something. Look I'm not trying to run smack but if Jamarcus started winning games and proving the critics (you) wrong you sure as hell would support him. If you let what you thought about a prospect in college affect your feelings about them when they are putting in solid work for the Raiders than who exactly are you rooting for? Is it the team or guys you hand picked that were good or bad for the organization?no if he was picked and he did lead us to the playoffs id root for him.i dont see that happening.
but this is what he said.
but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for himand then this is what i said.
id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety
basically if he was picked i wouldnt root for him untill he led us to the playoffs.

RaiderLifer
01-31-2007, 11:27 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

If he started winning games for us you would support him. If he was a stud QB for us you would love him just like the rest of us. We all have our opinions about these prospects but as soon as they put on the Silver and Black we all wish them the best. I would prefer other prospects but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for him.no i wouldnt support him.id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety.

So you've never been wrong about a prospect? Damn you should talk to Al about a scouting job or something. Look I'm not trying to run smack but if Jamarcus started winning games and proving the critics (you) wrong you sure as hell would support him. If you let what you thought about a prospect in college affect your feelings about them when they are putting in solid work for the Raiders than who exactly are you rooting for? Is it the team or guys you hand picked that were good or bad for the organization?no if he was picked and he did lead us to the playoffs id root for him.i dont see that happening.
but this is what he said.
but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for himand then this is what i said.
id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety
basically if he was picked i wouldnt root for him untill he led us to the playoffs.

We're splitting hairs here and we both want what's best for the team. I would prefer CJ, AD or trading down but if Russell is the choice I am going to cheer every god damned completion and not sit with my arms crossed and pout until he leads us to the playoffs. So what if he plays well and we win 6,7, or maybe even 9 games? If he is taking snaps for the Raiders next year I will support him until he proves in the pros that he isn't worth my support. I guess that is just where we differ. I respect your opinion on the man I just am not ready to call him a heap of nothing before he takes a snap in the NFL.

doingthisinsteadofwork
01-31-2007, 11:53 PM
I would like for someone to explain to me (mostly doingthisinsteadofwork) why Russell will be a bust or the next Ryan Leaf... and also why Peterson would instanly make us better... Second, what has Walter or any FA Qb available done to make them a more viable option at QB than Quinn or Russell? just trying to hear an intelligent response and not anything to the tune of "because I said so"

If you have seen his comments from since he has been here, his attitude is pretty goes like this. He only wants CJ or AD in the first, and doesn't want a QB in the first because he will only accept one of these two players. He goes on to back this up buy making statements like they are both going to be bust to enforce the idea of taking a CJ or AD first.

Other things he says is no QB could do anything behind the OL that he has but he forgets that the Raiders are in the state of rebuilding. I don't know why he thinks that saying drafting rookie QBs is a mistake beacuse they won't have the immediate impact to help this team. He thinks Andrew Walter (he was benched in the season right) is the future of this team. That is the vibe I get from him.
So Al should automatically waste a #1 pick on a QB to get killed behind our Oline?that doesnt make any sense.
Art Shell also benched Tim Brown and started Willie Gault and Merv Fenandez ahead of Brown.does that mean Brown was bad at his position?no it doesnt.
I never compared Russell to Leaf.I merely said that like Leaf, Russell has a great arm.but lets look at Russell's other positives other than a great arm.........he doesnt have any.
He cant read defenses up to standard,has poor decision making,is lazy and cares more about money than about the game.
Alot of great college QBs have great arms but never make it in the NFL.
I never said that Walter is the future.I merely said that Al will give him another chance.
If anything this past season, Walter proved to be a tough QB who when given made good reads and good throws.
AP makes the game better because he is much more reliable.He'll bring consistency,a gameplan,and stability, not to mention someone you can rely on.
No i wont only accept 2 players.
If Al was to draft Quinn I wouldnt cry about it.its extremely unlikely he does but if he did i would support Quinn.
Russell i would never support.
I like the thought of Alan Branch as well.

If he started winning games for us you would support him. If he was a stud QB for us you would love him just like the rest of us. We all have our opinions about these prospects but as soon as they put on the Silver and Black we all wish them the best. I would prefer other prospects but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for him.no i wouldnt support him.id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety.

So you've never been wrong about a prospect? Damn you should talk to Al about a scouting job or something. Look I'm not trying to run smack but if Jamarcus started winning games and proving the critics (you) wrong you sure as hell would support him. If you let what you thought about a prospect in college affect your feelings about them when they are putting in solid work for the Raiders than who exactly are you rooting for? Is it the team or guys you hand picked that were good or bad for the organization?no if he was picked and he did lead us to the playoffs id root for him.i dont see that happening.
but this is what he said.
but if Russell's name is read I will be rooting my ass off for himand then this is what i said.
id prepare for another 4 years of mediocrety
basically if he was picked i wouldnt root for him untill he led us to the playoffs.

We're splitting hairs here and we both want what's best for the team. I would prefer CJ, AD or trading down but if Russell is the choice I am going to cheer every god damned completion and not sit with my arms crossed and pout until he leads us to the playoffs. So what if he plays well and we win 6,7, or maybe even 9 games? If he is taking snaps for the Raiders next year I will support him until he proves in the pros that he isn't worth my support. I guess that is just where we differ. I respect your opinion on the man I just am not ready to call him a heap of nothing before he takes a snap in the NFL.i wouldnt like the pick cause i think its a mistake.i dont like Russell as a prospect.
for this season if he were to be picked and he did well id be a fan.

Paranoidmoonduck
01-31-2007, 11:59 PM
as of right now, who do u want more... quinn or russell. theres a chance we pick one. its hard to choose for me because i want Ck or AD so much. quinn is a better decion maker and i think better acc. russell has a HUGE arm and is 6'6 260 pounds. quinn is more of a for sure deal but russell has a bigger potenial

I think if we do pick a QB that Russell is more likely, and he's probably the guy I'd pick as well (at this point, I'm putting a certain amount of faith in the fact that the scouts haven't found a reason to hate him yet).

Vespasian
02-01-2007, 01:11 AM
If the Raiders took CJ first overall I'd have to seriously consider not watching football any longer.

That is how serious a mistake I think that selection would be.

Vespasian
02-01-2007, 01:13 AM
as of right now, who do u want more... quinn or russell. theres a chance we pick one. its hard to choose for me because i want Ck or AD so much. quinn is a better decion maker and i think better acc. russell has a HUGE arm and is 6'6 260 pounds. quinn is more of a for sure deal but russell has a bigger potenial

I think if we do pick a QB that Russell is more likely, and he's probably the guy I'd pick as well (at this point, I'm putting a certain amount of faith in the fact that the scouts haven't found a reason to hate him yet).

Now that Knapp is in the fold I think Russell is the less likely choice. Russell is supposed to be another Vick type QB, the type of QB that Knapp doesn't know how to handle.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-01-2007, 01:23 AM
Now that Knapp is in the fold I think Russell is the less likely choice. Russell is supposed to be another Vick type QB, the type of QB that Knapp doesn't know how to handle.

Because he is black? Otherwise I don't understand. Russell is nothing like Vick. On top of that, I don't think Knapp has any real say.

I also don't understand your aversion to the selection of CJ.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-01-2007, 01:25 AM
as of right now, who do u want more... quinn or russell. theres a chance we pick one. its hard to choose for me because i want Ck or AD so much. quinn is a better decion maker and i think better acc. russell has a HUGE arm and is 6'6 260 pounds. quinn is more of a for sure deal but russell has a bigger potenial

I think if we do pick a QB that Russell is more likely, and he's probably the guy I'd pick as well (at this point, I'm putting a certain amount of faith in the fact that the scouts haven't found a reason to hate him yet).

Now that Knapp is in the fold I think Russell is the less likely choice. Russell is supposed to be another Vick type QB, the type of QB that Knapp doesn't know how to handle.
Vick type QB? He's nothing like Vick...he's drawn comparisons to Culpepper.

Vespasian
02-01-2007, 01:31 AM
I also don't understand your aversion to the selection of CJ.

Well I think that I've ranted on it a number of times here. CJ is a talented WR no doubt but he is not the player nor does he play the position that the Raiders need to address with their first selection in the draft.

WR's are nice to have but they are not the real difference makers on the team as they are dependant position. They are dependant on the line providing protection for the QB and then their reliant on the QB making the throw. All a WR can do is run his route and hope for the best.

If we don't have the QB that we need then we should take a QB ahead of CJ.

If we do have the QB we need then we should take AP ahead of CJ as a premier RB will have a far greater impact on the success of the offence. To look at our offence and say that we need a WR is willfull blindness IMO.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-01-2007, 01:37 AM
I'm not saying we need a wide reciever. I'm saying that CJ is the best pick.

Russell and Quinn have question marks. Peterson is being passed up in a lot of scouts minds by Lynch, and his style by not be conducive to the NFL game. No defensive player is worth the #1 overall at this point in time.

CJ is the best player. He appears to be the most level-headed player. He is miles ahead of any other player at his position.

Also, I've never understood your logic regarding this. A WR is no more reliant on a QB and the o-line than a QB is reliant on his wideouts (and o-line). And a RB relies on the o-line more than either of the two.

You still haven't addressed the Vick comment.

TheChampIsHere
02-01-2007, 02:04 AM
Now that we brought in Kiffin and Knapp and are likely to run some variation of the WCO or at least not a pound the rock/vertical offense, Im really starting to like the idea of signing Damon Huard, I think he could do real well here.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-01-2007, 02:07 AM
Now that we brought in Kiffin and Knapp and are likely to run some variation of the WCO or at least not a pound the rock/vertical offense, Im really starting to like the idea of signing Damon Huard, I think he could do real well here.
Well, we did do pretty good with picking up a back-up QB from Kansas City in the past.

portermvp84
02-01-2007, 09:31 AM
I will agree with CJ is the best overall on the board. Wide recivers are a dime a dozen and they're really easy to get. We should draft Ad in the first and see what's out there in the later rounds.

gettembuck
02-01-2007, 09:38 AM
Thoughts on trading Moss and our 2nd to GB for their 1st?

RaiderLifer
02-01-2007, 10:51 AM
Thoughts on trading Moss and our 2nd to GB for their 1st?

I would do a back flip. We could end up with CJ and Lynch. That alone would make our draft a success. CJ is the best player available at a position that we got very little production from last year and Lynch is a tough quick runner with great hands. I would love a scenario like that. 8) 8) 8) 8)

slightlyaraiderfan
02-01-2007, 11:11 AM
I will agree with CJ is the best overall on the board. Wide recivers are a dime a dozen and they're really easy to get. We should draft Ad in the first and see what's out there in the later rounds.
Wide receivers like CJ aren't a "a dime a dozen"

portermvp84
02-01-2007, 12:02 PM
But ti's also kind of hard to pass up on Adrian Peterson.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-01-2007, 12:02 PM
Now that we brought in Kiffin and Knapp and are likely to run some variation of the WCO or at least not a pound the rock/vertical offense, Im really starting to like the idea of signing Damon Huard, I think he could do real well here.

Kiffin runs a vertical offense, and while Knapp is a west coast dude, he won't be calling the plays.

SubNoize
02-01-2007, 12:11 PM
looks like Cable is set to coach our O-line, hopefully announced very soon... look after the Freddy B. stuff.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/sports/football/nfl/oakland_raiders/16595167.htm

RaiderLifer
02-01-2007, 12:50 PM
looks like Cable is set to coach our O-line, hopefully announced very soon... look after the Freddy B. stuff.

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/sports/football/nfl/oakland_raiders/16595167.htm

I like the hire. Read his bio and it looks like he has the goods. Now we just have to keep him around for more than one year so our guys can get comfortable.

liverhgnbn
02-01-2007, 01:37 PM
You dont draft a RB in hopes of helping your offensive line, you build your offensive line up then get the running back. This has been seen time and time again and if you dont agree just go to footballoutsiders.com and see the studies yourself.

The gap between AP and LJ will not be much especially if our line is still terrible (although i think it will be much improved next year). So drafting Ap or Lynch doesnt do anything for us in the immediate future.

And you CJ people need to get off of it, theres no reason to draft a WR that high and CJ isn't good enough to defy logic here. We have plenty of WR and even if one is traded we have depth at that position plus this is a good draft for WR.

Teams need good/great qb's and yes there have been anomoly's but those teams needed great defenses and great offensivelines to compensate for their bad qb play. I dont want to count on every other aspect of the team to be amazing just to be able to compete because the QB play is bad.

You can argue Walter's value, honestly I'm not down on him. I dont blame him for any of his play last season. However, I dont see anything in him that makes me think that I should pass up the chance for Quinn/Russell to let him play.

Schilly
02-01-2007, 01:50 PM
I do believe that CJ could be the best player in the draft, but I think we can pick up a reciever in the second or even third round that could be a stud receiver. As messed up as our offense is right now, wide receiver should not be our first pick in the draft. Look at the playoffs and see how many teams were there that had just ok receivers.
I think we need to take a chance on Russell this year if he really impresses at the combine like I expect him to. I am starting to get tired of always wondering who our next quarterback is going to be. It would be nice to finally have a franchise quarterback again.
I would rather have AP than CJ too. I would rather draft a guy who is going to touch the ball 25 times a game rather than 8. He is going to kick a$$. I think Thomas would even be a better choice than CJ at this point.

Windy
02-01-2007, 02:31 PM
some solid assistant hires so far.

clemson offensive coordinator interviewed for the qb coach job.

http://charleston.net/assets/webPages/departmental/news/Stories.aspx?section=sports&tableId=128956&pubDate=2/1/2007

bernbabybern820
02-01-2007, 04:08 PM
as of right now, who do u want more... quinn or russell. theres a chance we pick one. its hard to choose for me because i want Ck or AD so much. quinn is a better decion maker and i think better acc. russell has a HUGE arm and is 6'6 260 pounds. quinn is more of a for sure deal but russell has a bigger potenial

i like quinn better since he already has experience with a bad o-line. its not like he wouldnt be prepared on getting hit every play.

Troy Smith looks like a stud the whole regular season. Why? Because his o-line did a great job giving him the protection he needed. He goes into the NC and he is not used to having to throw the ball early so he has a bad game.

02-01-2007, 04:08 PM
congrats on hitting 100

RaiderLifer
02-01-2007, 04:36 PM
some solid assistant hires so far.

clemson offensive coordinator interviewed for the qb coach job.

http://charleston.net/assets/webPages/departmental/news/Stories.aspx?section=sports&tableId=128956&pubDate=2/1/2007

Sounds like a pretty sought after OC. Don't know much about him but it seems like a solid hire as a QB coach if it were to go down. Kiffin>>>>Shell, Knapp>>>>>>>Walsh/Shoop, Tom Cable>>>>Jackie Slater....so far so good. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Paranoidmoonduck
02-01-2007, 06:09 PM
You dont draft a RB in hopes of helping your offensive line, you build your offensive line up then get the running back. This has been seen time and time again and if you dont agree just go to footballoutsiders.com and see the studies yourself.

The gap between AP and LJ will not be much especially if our line is still terrible (although i think it will be much improved next year). So drafting Ap or Lynch doesnt do anything for us in the immediate future.

And you CJ people need to get off of it, theres no reason to draft a WR that high and CJ isn't good enough to defy logic here. We have plenty of WR and even if one is traded we have depth at that position plus this is a good draft for WR.

Teams need good/great qb's and yes there have been anomoly's but those teams needed great defenses and great offensivelines to compensate for their bad qb play. I dont want to count on every other aspect of the team to be amazing just to be able to compete because the QB play is bad.

You can argue Walter's value, honestly I'm not down on him. I dont blame him for any of his play last season. However, I dont see anything in him that makes me think that I should pass up the chance for Quinn/Russell to let him play.

While I agree on some of the points you hit on, the issue isn't how to build a team, it's what to do with the pick.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-01-2007, 06:11 PM
You dont draft a RB in hopes of helping your offensive line, you build your offensive line up then get the running back. This has been seen time and time again and if you dont agree just go to footballoutsiders.com and see the studies yourself.

The gap between AP and LJ will not be much especially if our line is still terrible (although i think it will be much improved next year). So drafting Ap or Lynch doesnt do anything for us in the immediate future.

And you CJ people need to get off of it, theres no reason to draft a WR that high and CJ isn't good enough to defy logic here. We have plenty of WR and even if one is traded we have depth at that position plus this is a good draft for WR.

Teams need good/great qb's and yes there have been anomoly's but those teams needed great defenses and great offensivelines to compensate for their bad qb play. I dont want to count on every other aspect of the team to be amazing just to be able to compete because the QB play is bad.

You can argue Walter's value, honestly I'm not down on him. I dont blame him for any of his play last season. However, I dont see anything in him that makes me think that I should pass up the chance for Quinn/Russell to let him play.the talent on the Oline is there.its the coaching thats the main problem.now that we have Cable on board he should greatly help with the Oline troubles.if you really think that Slater and Eatmen were good Oline coahces and it was because of the talent that was the problem then your wrong.
No drafting a RB will have a much more immediate impact than drafting a WR or QB.especially QB.
QBs ussually take at least 3 years to develop and cant start from day the same cant be said for RBs.Like Ves said WRs are dependant on a QB to throw the ball and the line to provide protection for the QB.
No we dont not have enough WR talent.with Moss and Porter gone.no one is a proven starter beyond Curry.
Al hates Gabriel.
Morant cant hold on the ball
Francis will end up on the IR.
Buchanon and Madsen are ok but not starter material.
RB is the smartest pick here.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-01-2007, 06:29 PM
The Raider offense was so bad last year, that most of the top players are needs and will be improvments. We also don't know how Kiffen feels about Walter, so he might take Quinn or Russell to make this franchise his own.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-01-2007, 06:50 PM
The Raider offense was so bad last year, that most of the top players are needs and will be improvments. We also don't know how Kiffen feels about Walter, so he might take Quinn or Russell to make this franchise his own.he did say there was talent at the QB position on this team.and he also said that he was going to watch alot of film from this past year.

Komp
02-01-2007, 06:53 PM
Whoever said CJ isn't good enough is on crack. He's the best WR prospect in years and he put up those numbers playing with a HORRIBLE QB in Reggie Ball. I do see what you are saying with how unpredictable early WR picks can be [ex. Peter Warrick], but we are still waiting for Gallery to come around [if he ever does] so we won't be picking an OT. AP has injury concerns and probably isn't worth the #1 pick for that reason. If Kiffin isn't sold on either of the QB's or if we pick up someone like Huard I don't see how we cannot take CJ unless we trade down. At that point he would be the only guy that fills a need that is worth the #1 pick.