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Crow
02-10-2007, 08:33 PM
yea if he is hired then all signs point to russell obviously.
Not really. He's apparantly a good QB coach. We have a young QB on the roster in need of such a position coach. I wouldn't read too much into this right now.

wesbun27
02-10-2007, 09:00 PM
yea if he is hired then all signs point to russell obviously.
Not really. He's apparantly a good QB coach. We have a young QB on the roster in need of such a position coach. I wouldn't read too much into this right now.

Walter is terrible. Martinez has been working with Russell since he declared. If Russell is picked, By the time training camp starts Martinez would have work with him almost 8 months.

Stash
02-10-2007, 10:50 PM
yea if he is hired then all signs point to russell obviously.
Not really. He's apparantly a good QB coach. We have a young QB on the roster in need of such a position coach. I wouldn't read too much into this right now.

Walter is terrible. Martinez has been working with Russell since he declared. If Russell is picked, By the time training camp starts Martinez would have work with him almost 8 months.

First of all you can't say Walter is terrible, he didn't have a chance last season, no QB would in that situation. Secondly, I agree with Crow that we shouldn't read too much into this talking with Martinez thing, it could just be a smokescreen to make other teams think we are interested in Russell. But you never know.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-11-2007, 12:11 AM
yea if he is hired then all signs point to russell obviously.
Not really. He's apparantly a good QB coach. We have a young QB on the roster in need of such a position coach. I wouldn't read too much into this right now.

I'm sorry, but Martinez has been working with Russell a fair bit and he has apparently developed a good relationship with Russell. If you don't think that would factor into the potential hiring at all, you're deluding yourself.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-11-2007, 01:09 AM
yea if he is hired then all signs point to russell obviously.
Not really. He's apparantly a good QB coach. We have a young QB on the roster in need of such a position coach. I wouldn't read too much into this right now.

I'm sorry, but Martinez has been working with Russell a fair bit and he has apparently developed a good relationship with Russell. If you don't think that would factor into the potential hiring at all, you're deluding yourself.i think Martinez would only affect the pick if Al was looking QB in the 1st.otherwise I dont think he has much say in this matter.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-11-2007, 12:04 PM
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1171188288201140.xml&coll=2
i found this interesting.
Browns owner Randy Lerner made a mistake by reportedly telling Channel 3's Ramona Robinson that he would like to use the team's No. 1 draft pick on JaMarcus Russell, the quarterback from LSU.

Komp
02-11-2007, 12:18 PM
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1171188288201140.xml&coll=2
i found this interesting.
Browns owner Randy Lerner made a mistake by reportedly telling Channel 3's Ramona Robinson that he would like to use the team's No. 1 draft pick on JaMarcus Russell, the quarterback from LSU.

I need to invite that guy to my friends poker game... :lol:

Metz
02-11-2007, 12:52 PM
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1171188288201140.xml&coll=2
i found this interesting.
Browns owner Randy Lerner made a mistake by reportedly telling Channel 3's Ramona Robinson that he would like to use the team's No. 1 draft pick on JaMarcus Russell, the quarterback from LSU.

I need to invite that guy to my friends poker game... :lol:

i dont know. i thought the browns had bigger needs than QB. maybe hes bluffing just like everyone else does.

raidersfanxxx
02-11-2007, 01:39 PM
or maybe JR is a great QB

Paranoidmoonduck
02-11-2007, 01:53 PM
I have a hard time imagining that he would be so stupid to reveal who he wants to draft, so maybe it is a smokescreen. However, I don't think Lerner is neccesarily going to be the only voice heard in the Browns' war room (Crennell will likely make the pick).

However, this probably means that if Kiffin and Davis settle upon Russell that they won't trade down to aquire more picks (I never thought they would, but I know some of you did).

SubNoize
02-11-2007, 03:29 PM
Tabbed one more assistant, will probably be announced on Monday, we've hired Ted Gilmore from Nebraska (WR coach there) to handler the same posistion or TE unclear right now...

http://www.contracostatimes.com/mld/cctimes/sports/football/nfl/oakland_raiders/16675621.htm

I also doubt that Lerner could be that dumb to let that slip out... Hopefully we don't trade down and just snag Russell at #1 and let him join up w/ Martinez who he's familiarized himslef w/...

raidersfanxxx
02-11-2007, 06:21 PM
http://www.journalstar.com/blog/huskers.php?title=late_twist_gilmore_decides_to_st ay&more=1&c=1&tb=1&pb=1

our not....im sick of all these dudes backin out at the last sec. its getting real old!

Paranoidmoonduck
02-11-2007, 06:45 PM
Anyone think Callahan had any horror stories about Al Davis that made him change his mind?

Either way, I'm not heartbroken. Since Kiff has been hired this is the only coach I can recall turning us down (I might be wrong about that though).

RaiderNation
02-11-2007, 08:01 PM
what a d-bag

Crow
02-11-2007, 09:25 PM
Is anyone else really unnerved by the idea of adding so many coaches with little or no meaningful NFL experience? That could really blow up in our face.

Komp
02-11-2007, 11:51 PM
Is anyone else really unnerved by the idea of adding so many coaches with little or no meaningful NFL experience? That could really blow up in our face.

I think usually it would but the calibre of the coaches has been excellent so far. Not only that, but they are all "winners". Whether it has been on the college level [Kiffin] or in the NFL as players [Rathman] they know what it takes to win. Plus, I'd rather have younger coaches that can communicate well with the players and understand the nuisances of todays game than have the abortion that was the Shell/Walsh era where they just looked out of touch.

Oaktown1981
02-12-2007, 12:18 AM
Is anyone else really unnerved by the idea of adding so many coaches with little or no meaningful NFL experience? That could really blow up in our face.

Last year we had a staff with a lot of NFL experience so I don't think it could get much worse.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-12-2007, 01:03 AM
Is anyone else really unnerved by the idea of adding so many coaches with little or no meaningful NFL experience? That could really blow up in our face.

Eh, not particularly. This team was a ******* circus last year with probably more meaningful NFL experience on the staff than any other team could claim. Now we get to bring in a bunch of young and (presumably) talented guys who are going to be enthusiastic.

At least if this blows up in our face it'll be because we took a risk rather than imcompetent boobery.

AdrianWilson12
02-12-2007, 06:26 AM
I think the best case scenario is us swapping picks w/the AZ Cardinals and getting additional picks so the Cards could get Joe Thomas before the Lions do. Im pretty sure the Lions would take Joe Thomas at #2. So if the Raiders get the #3 pick, they'd have at least 3 of the 4 guys that Raider fans are coveting in Calvin Johnson, Jamarcus Russell, Brady Quinn and Adrian Peterson. I dont think you can go wrong with any of these guys but if i had to pick which one would have a more likely chance of being a bust, it'd probably be Russell. Only because hes the hardest to predict as a pro. The other 3 guys seem more pro-ready. Of course I could easily be wrong. Its just my opinion.

I agree the best case scenario right now has to be a swap with the Cardinals, but they have the no. 5 pick and not the no.3 pick....regardless, we would have no problem getting someone there....

The way I see it, there are 4 possibilities of who the Raiders might draft: Quinn, Russell, Calvin, and Peterson.

If we pull this trade, we can count on Calvin being gone, Tampa will eagerly grab him. I expect either DET or CLE will take Quinn with Thomas gone (ARI will pick Thomas of course) and then theres a good chance Peterson goes to CLE....But I dont think any of them would pick Russell, and if he does, that just means one of the other 4 fall to us. Whatever happens, we take the best of whos left of them and it is garunteed that 1 of them will be there so it works out great for the Raiders...

I hope Al doesnt get too greedy and try to make the Cardinals give up their whole future to get Joe Thomas. it really isnt much of a sacrifice for us to go from 1st to 5th and we could use the extra picks....However, if they go strictly by the trade chart, it really takes a boatload of picks for the Cards to move up and the Cards probly wont want to do it...Al needs to make sure he gets the deal done and not be too stubborn, its a great deal for us if we can just pick up their 2nd rounder, next years 2nd rounder and some other picks, maybe a couple 4th rounders or a 3rd rounder or sumthin.

And I think the Cards would be wanting to make this trade. At 5 overall, the prospects aren't great. The Cardinals would practically be forced to take DL, having their choice of Anderson, Branch and Gaines...but that is not really a big need for the Cards, theyd much rather get a LT and who knows who they'll get in the 2nd round? Joe Staley at best. But maybe not even him, they might have to take Ugoh who could easily just end up being a bust. The Cardinals would WANT to trade up and get Thomas, it would make a lot of sense for them.

Although I can see your logic for both sides, but from a Cardinals perspective it is extremely unlikely we would trade up to number 1, unless we got a very favourable deal in terms of value. Yes, Thomas would go a long way to solving the problems at Oline, but we have many needs on defence such as OLB, CB and FS, that we'd be giving up if we traded to you. The Cardinals also have a recent history of very little pick trading, not since 2003 can I remember us trading day 1 picks. Also, trading all those picks for a OT is a paradox, when its Quinn, Russell or Johnson's value we'd really be paying for.

gettembuck
02-12-2007, 03:09 PM
Anyone think Callahan had any horror stories about Al Davis that made him change his mind?

Either way, I'm not heartbroken. Since Kiff has been hired this is the only coach I can recall turning us down (I might be wrong about that though).Then Al should've countered with horror stories of the idiocy that is Bill Callahan.

RaiderNation
02-12-2007, 09:09 PM
dont know if this has been posted but..

http://www.sacbee.com/359/story/120893.html

we got a new RB coach

RaiderNation
02-12-2007, 09:22 PM
http://www.sacbee.com/360/story/119731.html

he could be a nice pick up. helped the niners gave a great rushing game this year. has had knee problems. worth the risk if niners dont resign?

http://49ers.com/team/roster_detail.php?PRKey=41&section=TE%20Roster

NIN1984
02-13-2007, 09:22 AM
I hope Kiffin likes Bing and makes him a starter

RaiderLifer
02-13-2007, 01:08 PM
I hope Kiffin likes Bing and makes him a starter

I think Bing was essentially red shirted to give him time to build his lower body strength and spend some time getting to know the position. I fully expect him to work into the rotation this year. Robert Thomas played really well last year and Sam Williams played better than could have been expected for a guy who has missed that much playing time over the last three years. That being said I think Bing's upside is higher than both of those guys. LB used to be a weakness for us but right now our back seven might have the brightest future in the entire league. Young talented and crazy fast. Kirk, Howard, Bing, Williams, Huff, Fab, Aso (and to a lesser extent even Carr) all have bright futures. Al has always believed in building the D around the backfield and he has done just that. Another pass rusher and a run stuffing DT and we could have a D that is tops in the league. 8) Now all we need is a competent O. :cry:

liverhgnbn
02-13-2007, 02:16 PM
You guys have any idea's for late round picks?

RaiderLifer
02-13-2007, 02:40 PM
You guys have any idea's for late round picks?

Don't know about "late" per say but I would really like to see us land Lorenzo Booker, or Dwayne Wright if we don't go RB in round 1. I really like Brandon Mebane, Paul Soliai or Kareem Brown depending on which one slides. If somehow Brandon Meriweather falls to our comp. pick I think he would be a steal. If we don't go Russell at 1 then I would also like to add Trent Edwards. If we don't go CJ at 1 I would like to add Brandon Myles, Paul Williams, or McKnight in the later rounds. I know there not really late round prospects but all I have been thinking about is what happens at 1 and what prospects we land in the mid-rounds to help fill our gaping holes not addressed at 1.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-13-2007, 06:05 PM
Brian Robinson DE Texas could be a day two steal.

RaiderNation
02-13-2007, 06:42 PM
do u think its to early to draft a C in round two? the usc guy is good but i think a good RT is a bigger need. if hes there in the 3rd u think we will get him?

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-13-2007, 06:43 PM
if Kalil was there in 3 Kiffen would jump all over him.I think hes most likely to go in the 2nd unfortunatley.

RaiderNation
02-13-2007, 06:45 PM
if Kalil was there in 3 Kiffen would jump all over him.I think hes most likely to go in the 2nd unfortunatley.

oh. u think theres any chance of trading up to get him???

Komp
02-13-2007, 07:22 PM
If there is any way Marcus Thomas [DT, Florida] falls to the 3rd/4th, we have to get him. The guy is a rd1 talent that made a bad decision. We have the leadership on the DL that will be able to mentor him [Burgess/Sapp]. If he is there in rd3 and we don't grab him I think its a mistake.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-13-2007, 07:41 PM
If there is any way Marcus Thomas [DT, Florida] falls to the 3rd/4th, we have to get him. The guy is a rd1 talent that made a bad decision. We have the leadership on the DL that will be able to mentor him [Burgess/Sapp]. If he is there in rd3 and we don't grab him I think its a mistake.

I don't think we need a UT that badly. Maybe if he's there in the 5th, but otherwise I wouldn't like it.

RaiderNation
02-13-2007, 07:42 PM
If there is any way Marcus Thomas [DT, Florida] falls to the 3rd/4th, we have to get him. The guy is a rd1 talent that made a bad decision. We have the leadership on the DL that will be able to mentor him [Burgess/Sapp]. If he is there in rd3 and we don't grab him I think its a mistake.

if he or sapp puts on 20 pounds i would no daught. but we need a huge DT to stop the run. sapp is more of a sacking DT

Komp
02-13-2007, 08:16 PM
If there is any way Marcus Thomas [DT, Florida] falls to the 3rd/4th, we have to get him. The guy is a rd1 talent that made a bad decision. We have the leadership on the DL that will be able to mentor him [Burgess/Sapp]. If he is there in rd3 and we don't grab him I think its a mistake.

if he or sapp puts on 20 pounds i would no daught. but we need a huge DT to stop the run. sapp is more of a sacking DT

How do we not need a UT? Sapp is done after another year....it would be nice to have his replacement there already. We'll find that big fat DT eventually, and Thomas is a great talent that will be available at a bargain price.

wesbun27
02-13-2007, 10:38 PM
If he is healthy we gotta pick up Pettigout

Stash
02-13-2007, 10:51 PM
If he is healthy we gotta pick up Pettigout

Thats what I was thinking, but if the Giants just cut him instead of trading him that indicates to me that something must be wrong with him.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-13-2007, 11:36 PM
If there is any way Marcus Thomas [DT, Florida] falls to the 3rd/4th, we have to get him. The guy is a rd1 talent that made a bad decision. We have the leadership on the DL that will be able to mentor him [Burgess/Sapp]. If he is there in rd3 and we don't grab him I think its a mistake.

if he or sapp puts on 20 pounds i would no daught. but we need a huge DT to stop the run. sapp is more of a sacking DT

How do we not need a UT? Sapp is done after another year....it would be nice to have his replacement there already. We'll find that big fat DT eventually, and Thomas is a great talent that will be available at a bargain price.no NT is a much bigger priority than UT is.Its also been proven that Sapp plays better with a NT next to him.In this division we have to face LT,LJ,and Shannahans system.Run Defense is a major priority.ANd if Sapp is done after this year why not just grab one next year.

raidersfanxxx
02-13-2007, 11:40 PM
i think sands is going to have a big year next year. and im sure we can pick up some one cheap in FA to rotate with him to keep him fresh.

liverhgnbn
02-14-2007, 01:57 AM
I think we've picked alot of offensive linemen in the draft in the last few years. I think it would be odd to keep adding them.

Boothe = Solid with Potential
Grove = Solid but average
Slaughter = Developing
Gallery = Victim of Bad coaching, IMO
McQuistan = They said he was a project when we drafted him, he is.

I just think we'd be better off picking up a few solid guys in FA, and maybe one starting caliber RT, than drafting linemen high again.

One guy I like for the later rounds is Mario Henderson, what do you guys think?

Metz
02-14-2007, 03:07 PM
I think we've picked alot of offensive linemen in the draft in the last few years. I think it would be odd to keep adding them.

Boothe = Solid with Potential
Grove = Solid but average
Slaughter = Developing
Gallery = Victim of Bad coaching, IMO
McQuistan = They said he was a project when we drafted him, he is.

I just think we'd be better off picking up a few solid guys in FA, and maybe one starting caliber RT, than drafting linemen high again.

One guy I like for the later rounds is Mario Henderson, what do you guys think?

I agree with you 100%. Drafting OL pretty high hasn't worked out for us "For whatever reason..." as Art Shell would say. I guess you can add TEs to that list too. This is my recent memory:

1st rd- Mo Collins (had a few good years)

1st rd - Matt Stinchcomb (complete bust)

2nd rd - Langston Walker (excellent Field Goal/PAT blocker but other than that he's a bust)

1st rd - Robert Gallery (last year to prove something)

2nd rd - Jake Grove (last year to prove something)

3rd rd - Paul McQuistan* (still raw; might have been a reach)

2nd rd - Doug Jolley (good rookie season but since then its been downhill)

2nd rd - Teyo Johnson (cant crack anyone's roster now)

slightlyaraiderfan
02-14-2007, 03:17 PM
According to Damix and rotoworld:

The Raiders reportedly have re-signed DT Terdell Sands to a four-year, 17-million-dollar contract.

The sizeable, run-stopping lineman will provide depth to an Oakland defense that turned some heads in 2006.

Crow
02-14-2007, 03:21 PM
Need vs Value. Always a fun debate.

From a need standpoint, it's not even close. We need a NT. But in terms of value...and the talent at DT available in this class...we may end up going for an UT. Some added pass rush inside would not be a bad thing. Kelly didn't do much with his opportunity this past season. Grabbing a guy like Thomas, and hoping he's not the next Fluff Hawthorne, might be the way to go.

Now, if we're sitting at 3:1, and both Marcus Thomas and Kareem Brown are there...I think we take Brown and see how far Thomas falls. Maybe we could land him a little later. If we don't upgrade our RE situation, we could move Kelly out there (he wasn't much of an outside pass rusher, but played the run really well at RE) and have a Sapp/Thomas rotation at UT and a Terd/Brown rotation on the nose. I could get happy about that.

On second thought, I think Thomas may well be this year's Antajj Hawthorne. Let's just grab Brown and start beefing Brayton up. He played some DT at Colorado, so the position won't be foreign to him.

Windy
02-14-2007, 03:50 PM
According to Damix and rotoworld:

The Raiders reportedly have re-signed DT Terdell Sands to a four-year, 17-million-dollar contract.

The sizeable, run-stopping lineman will provide depth to an Oakland defense that turned some heads in 2006.

yes. yes. yes.

Windy
02-14-2007, 04:00 PM
Does Kelly go to DE now? Sands got starter money.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-14-2007, 04:10 PM
Does Kelly go to DE now? Sands got starter money.
Or he could possibly take over Sands spot, and come in as relief as the 3rd DT.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-14-2007, 06:02 PM
We also re-signed Robert Thomas according to rotoworld:

Raiders re-signed LB Robert Thomas to a three-year contract.

The '02 first-round pick was a late bloomer but serves as a valuable nickel linebacker in Rob Ryan's defense. There's an outside chance he'll be competing with Sam Williams on the strong side in training camp.

RaiderLifer
02-14-2007, 06:29 PM
We also re-signed Robert Thomas according to rotoworld:

Raiders re-signed LB Robert Thomas to a three-year contract.

The '02 first-round pick was a late bloomer but serves as a valuable nickel linebacker in Rob Ryan's defense. There's an outside chance he'll be competing with Sam Williams on the strong side in training camp.


I thought Thomas played really well last year. I'm glad it was multiple years I think he can be another so called bust that we can get the most out of. With him Bing, Williams, and Thomas we might have the fastest OLB rotation in the league.

RaiderNation
02-14-2007, 06:32 PM
[b]CALVIN JOHNSON RAN A 4.33 40 REPORTABLY!!!

http://www.sptimes.com/2007/02/14/Bucs/Georgia_Tech_s_Johnso.shtml

LookItsAlDavis
02-14-2007, 07:27 PM
I'll wait for the combine to be impressed.

wesbun27
02-14-2007, 08:59 PM
[b]CALVIN JOHNSON RAN A 4.33 40 REPORTABLY!!!

http://www.sptimes.com/2007/02/14/Bucs/Georgia_Tech_s_Johnso.shtml

Ill wait til his pro day or combine to believe his 40

RaiderNation
02-14-2007, 09:32 PM
do u think there is a chance we draft CJ if we only get rid of moss and not porter?

wesbun27
02-14-2007, 10:07 PM
do u think there is a chance we draft CJ if we only get rid of moss and not porter?

i dont think so because of the star potential of Ronald Curry. The only 3 picks I would agree with would be Russell, Quinn and Thomas

TheChampIsHere
02-15-2007, 12:26 AM
What is all this talk of UT and NT being major needs. I would expect Raider fans to realize we already have young talented players on the roster. Sapp played at a pro bowl level at UT last year, but its true he may not have much left in the tank. But thats okay, Kelly is gonna be a solid starter at UT with good penetration ability. Sands was a beast last year and we just signed this mammoth NT to a 17 mill deal, thats starter money and thats because he is our starter. All we need is depth. And lets not forget about Hawthorne either, hes a project and I wont be shocked if he starts to show some signs soon. Only DB and MLB are less of a need than DT.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-15-2007, 12:47 AM
What is all this talk of UT and NT being major needs. I would expect Raider fans to realize we already have young talented players on the roster. Sapp played at a pro bowl level at UT last year, but its true he may not have much left in the tank. But thats okay, Kelly is gonna be a solid starter at UT with good penetration ability. Sands was a beast last year and we just signed this mammoth NT to a 17 mill deal, thats starter money and thats because he is our starter. All we need is depth. And lets not forget about Hawthorne either, hes a project and I wont be shocked if he starts to show some signs soon. Only DB and MLB are less of a need than DT.probably because Kelly is not that good in the pass rush.Sands hasnt proven himself as a consistent starter yet.Hawthorne hasnt shown anything at all that gives me hope.
this is the AFC West with LT,LJ,and Shannahan's system.Run D is important.

RaiderLifer
02-15-2007, 01:15 AM
What is all this talk of UT and NT being major needs. I would expect Raider fans to realize we already have young talented players on the roster. Sapp played at a pro bowl level at UT last year, but its true he may not have much left in the tank. But thats okay, Kelly is gonna be a solid starter at UT with good penetration ability. Sands was a beast last year and we just signed this mammoth NT to a 17 mill deal, thats starter money and thats because he is our starter. All we need is depth. And lets not forget about Hawthorne either, hes a project and I wont be shocked if he starts to show some signs soon. Only DB and MLB are less of a need than DT.probably because Kelly is not that good in the pass rush.Sands hasnt proven himself as a consistent starter yet.Hawthorne hasnt shown anything at all that gives me hope.
this is the AFC West with LT,LJ,and Shannahan's system.Run D is important.

I actually like Kelly much better at DE. Having him at DE for the running downs and bringing Huntley in for obvious passing downs is a good rotation opposite Burgess. Sands had limited playing time last year but he showed enough to be payed starter money and our run D was greatly improved when he was in there. Burgess, Sands, Sapp, Kelly is a solid starting rotation. Having only Hawthorne, Huntley, and Brayton behind them makes it a thin position but in now way a draft priority when we had the worst offense in memory.

NIN1984
02-15-2007, 05:23 AM
I would like to see Kelly back at DE

Burgess- Sapp- Sands- Kelly- I think that looks good for team 1

Huntley -Hawthorne- rookie/fa- Brayton - team 2

bernbabybern820
02-15-2007, 02:27 PM
I would like to see Kelly back at DE

Burgess- Sapp- Sands- Kelly- I think that looks good for team 1

Huntley -Hawthorne- rookie/fa- Brayton - team 2

agreed

RaiderLifer
02-15-2007, 02:33 PM
If Calvin Johnson really does run a 4.33 at the combine wouldn't that make him the most highly regarded WR prospect in the history of the NFL? I know that is really hard to quantify but I can't see a reason that this wouldn't be the case. So if (and it's a big if) he runs this well can we or even Detroit afford to pass on him? The irony is it is probably the right choice for Millen but because of the Charles Rogers and Mike Williams fiasco he can't pull the trigger. Knowing this if Tampa wins the coin toss and wants to trade up to take CJ (preventing someone from trading up with Detroit for CJ) and we don't want to select him shouldn't we jump at the opportunity to go to three, pick up extra picks and still have our choice of CJ/AD, if in fact that's who we want? If it comes time and we want Russell or AD it only makes sense to put out a little smoke screen about us taking CJ and try to get some picks out of Tampa. We run the risk of Detroit taking Russell or AD but it shouldn't be too hard to try and get Millen to show his hand a little bit and right now Thomas looks like the pick. Even if we only took their second and fourth this year to move down two spots we could use those to get back into the first for Marshawn or (I know it's crazy) package 33rd and 35th and Moss to the Redskins who are in need of extra picks and grab Russell and AD. I know it's a pipe dream but if it is clear Detroit wants Thomas I think we should entertain the idea. With all that being said I love CJ and if Al decides he's too good to pass up I'm with it. What do you guys think? Too big a risk? :?

Metz
02-15-2007, 07:12 PM
I think we need a beast at DE opposite of Burgess. someone like Simeon Rice or something. Kelly is more of a 3-4 end than a 4-3 end IMO. I think he'd be better off rotating at DT w/ Sapp + Sands. That way we'd have some good depth at DT. We could use some depth at DE though. Im pretty sure Lance Johnstone isn't coming back. Huntley's a nice backup. And Brayton... well he can use that motor of his and become a full-time waterboy. We have a lot of overpriced players on the roster. Heck, why not have an overpriced waterboy?

RaiderNation
02-15-2007, 07:52 PM
i hope we can try to get freeny or grant from F/A. one of them opposite burgess would give us a great pass rush. i hope we can get 1 of them, a vet olinemen, vet qb and a solid TE. then draft CJ in the first. if all those happened id be VERY happy

Komp
02-15-2007, 08:45 PM
Charles Grant would be an excellent pickup but I think he will get some pretty decent offers [maybe even from the Saints] in FA. I still think Marcus Thomas would be an excellent draft pick in the 3rd or 4th [I'm guessing he goes late 2nd - late 3rd if he performs well at the combine/pro day]. The dropoff in talent on the DL after our starting 4 is pretty steep.

As for CJ running a 4.33 40, I think if he runs that fast that Al will take him. He would most definitely be the most sought after WR in the history of the draft. You have to remind yourself that he put up numbers and has generated this much press while playing with an absolutely horrible thrower in Reggie Ball. I just don't see Al turning away from that kind of athlete, despite the need at QB.

RaiderNation
02-16-2007, 12:39 AM
as of right now if we could pick up one of these qbs which would it be? leftwich,carr,plummer or schaub.

as of right now i would want carr. he has expirence behind bad olines. has great arm. he improved last year alot. mayb our 3rd for him. or jordan and our 4th

RaiderLifer
02-16-2007, 12:56 AM
as of right now if we could pick up one of these qbs which would it be? leftwich,carr,plummer or schaub.

as of right now i would want carr. he has expirence behind bad olines. has great arm. he improved last year alot. mayb our 3rd for him. or jordan and our 4th

This is the order of what I would want...

Carr
Shaub (too expensive)
Leftwich
Migraines
Herpes
Cancer
Plummer

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-16-2007, 02:12 AM
Huard

Komp
02-16-2007, 08:02 AM
Yah I would take Carr first, Schaub/Huard second and than I don't think I'd be interested in any of the others...

02-16-2007, 08:06 AM
as of right now if we could pick up one of these qbs which would it be? leftwich,carr,plummer or schaub.

as of right now i would want carr. he has expirence behind bad olines. has great arm. he improved last year alot. mayb our 3rd for him. or jordan and our 4th

This is the order of what I would want...

Carr
Shaub (too expensive)
Leftwich
Migraines
Herpes
Cancer
Plummer

That's interesting seeing as David Carr has never outplayed Plummer.

NIN1984
02-16-2007, 10:15 AM
David Carr sucks, he holds on to the ball way too long he plays the game scared he misses wide open receivers all the time he has no confidence.

keep blaming the o-line but guess what he is a big part of the problem in Houston. I rather just let Walter play over him

wesbun27
02-16-2007, 10:44 AM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell

raidersfanxxx
02-16-2007, 12:41 PM
yeah, we dont need other teams junk. we have tryd that the past couple of years and look where that has got us. JR would be a great step in the right direction.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-16-2007, 12:43 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-16-2007, 12:48 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.which is why we should go Huard.

RaiderNation
02-16-2007, 01:03 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.which is why we should go Huard.

arnt gannon and huard pretty much the same qb?

wesbun27
02-16-2007, 02:18 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-16-2007, 02:29 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.
Comparing Carr to what Gannon became, which was an MVP...then yes, it would be a slap in the face.

LookItsAlDavis
02-16-2007, 02:30 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell

Didn't Al Davis do that with Jim Plunkett?

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-16-2007, 02:47 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.Huard has proven he can start in the NFL.thats more than any QB in the draft has done.

RaiderNation
02-16-2007, 05:28 PM
are we gonna franchise any1 this year?

raidersfanxxx
02-16-2007, 06:15 PM
no

wesbun27
02-16-2007, 08:00 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell

Didn't Al Davis do that with Jim Plunkett?

Al also picked up Collins,Brooks and Jeff George plus various other flops that were others teams trash

wesbun27
02-16-2007, 08:06 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.Huard has proven he can start in the NFL.thats more than any QB in the draft has done.

Huard doesnt solve anything for us next year other than giving a year for Russell to develop. But when Russell is picked, I rather have him in TC compete for the starting job

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-16-2007, 11:37 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.Huard has proven he can start in the NFL.thats more than any QB in the draft has done.

Huard doesnt solve anything for us next year other than giving a year for Russell to develop. But when Russell is picked, I rather have him in TC compete for the starting jobhow can you say he doesnt solve anything for us next year?you can say Long term but to say he cant do anything next year is BS.
To win you dont need a spectacular offense.All you need is a very good Defense,a good running game,and a game managing QB.Huard would put together two pieces of the puzzle.

RaiderNation
02-16-2007, 11:54 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.Huard has proven he can start in the NFL.thats more than any QB in the draft has done.

Huard doesnt solve anything for us next year other than giving a year for Russell to develop. But when Russell is picked, I rather have him in TC compete for the starting jobhow can you say he doesnt solve anything for us next year?you can say Long term but to say he cant do anything next year is BS.
To win you dont need a spectacular offense.All you need is a very good Defense,a good running game,and a game managing QB.Huard would put together two pieces of the puzzle.

agree with everything there. we got our defence. if we go AD in the first and get hauard from F/A id be very happy. if we go AD in the first i think that means we r tryn to win right now. drafting cj or russell i think means we r building for the future.

raidersfanxxx
02-17-2007, 01:38 AM
the reason why we are even where we are is cause of that theory. we need to get out of that "win now" stuff. face it, we need to start to from scratch. by the time JR and the O gel are D will be at there high point.

RaiderNation
02-17-2007, 01:49 AM
the reason why we are even where we are is cause of that theory. we need to get out of that "win now" stuff. face it, we need to start to from scratch. by the time JR and the O gel are D will be at there high point.

u know al davis isnt like that..."just win baby" and "commitmet to excellence" pretty much means build for right now

raidersfanxxx
02-17-2007, 02:04 AM
yeah, thats al all alright. but one of the main reasons why he picked up kiffin is cause he knows how big of a deal this draft is for us. he says it during the PC. he loved the fact that lane has been scouting these guys since high school and yadda yadda. he is given lane full control of the draft.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-17-2007, 02:13 AM
did you talk to AL and Lane about this.no.you didnt.Al is an autocrat.

raidersfanxxx
02-17-2007, 03:26 AM
your right, i did not talk to him. but he talked to us....if you go to 9:30 in the PC video he talks about it. soooo yeah. im sure lane has no say.


http://www.raiders.com/multimedia/ :roll:

Komp
02-17-2007, 09:51 AM
I would say that Al will definitely lean an ear to Lane when drafting. His knowledge in regards to NCAA is superior to Al's. Al of course has final say, but there will be some major input from Lane.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-17-2007, 02:16 PM
Al also mentions in the press conference that he held the same position at USC.Hes also been doing this alot longer than Lane has.He will give Lane some power.but to say hes given the draft to Lane is BS.AL has final say.

wesbun27
02-17-2007, 02:51 PM
Picking up Carr would be picking up someones trash again. We need to take Russell
I'd say Rich Gannon turned out pretty well.

Comparing Rich Gannon and David Carr is a huge slap in the face of Rich Gannon. Gannon was a establish backup QB in this League that wasnt given a fair shake to start. Gannon showed that he can lead a winning team on several different occasions. Carr is a #1 pick who showed flashes but hasnt lived up to his potential at all. Carr has mostly showed that he can take a sack. If David Carr had some good seasons Ill be for it but he hasnt. Plus Carr still has a huge cap number. Gannon was perfect for us at that time because we were running the WCO. Now we are running this new verstile vertical attack that USC runs. Damon Huard is 33 and really hasnt showed me much to warrant us picking him up and not taking Russell. Pete Carroll said that Russell is a better fit than Booty,Leinat and Palmer in that USC offense.Huard has proven he can start in the NFL.thats more than any QB in the draft has done.

Huard doesnt solve anything for us next year other than giving a year for Russell to develop. But when Russell is picked, I rather have him in TC compete for the starting jobhow can you say he doesnt solve anything for us next year?you can say Long term but to say he cant do anything next year is BS.
To win you dont need a spectacular offense.All you need is a very good Defense,a good running game,and a game managing QB.Huard would put together two pieces of the puzzle.

First of all this game managing QB system is risky football, boring for the fans(bad for attendance),puts a terrible amount of pressure on your defense/special teams and is starting to go out of style. You need a dominant Defense ala Ravens 2000 to succeed with that style of offense. And that was possibly the great defense ever. What happened to the game managers this year?? When Brad Johnson (the classic GM QB) was forced to make plays he couldnt and his team lost games and are now looking to pick up a QB. I also find it hard to believe that Kiffin and Davis are gonna run a conservative offense like that. The Bengals franchise did not turn around until they draft Carson Palmer. We need to take Russell

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-17-2007, 07:12 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-17-2007, 08:14 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.

RaiderNation
02-17-2007, 11:33 PM
i know this is likely wont happen but.....

say we go CJ in the first, how much do u think green bay would want for there 16th overall pick so we could get lynch? lynch should fall that far. mayb we trade moss/jordan, our 2nd, 4th and a future 3rd for it.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 01:29 AM
GB wants Lynch as well.i doubt they trade.

cowboyz
02-18-2007, 08:27 AM
what's the lowdown on langston walker, can he be a good G?

Menard4MVP
02-18-2007, 08:38 AM
GB wants Lynch as well.i doubt they trade.

Its says in you sig words to the effect of:

"Peterson is the most logical and likely pick. and thats why Davis will draft him?"

How did you dream that one up?

And since when did Davis use logic in the draft?

Menard4MVP
02-18-2007, 08:39 AM
what's the lowdown on langston walker, can he be a good G?

He's probably the worst lineman in football, he makes Gallery look like Orlando Pace.

Menard4MVP
02-18-2007, 08:44 AM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.

AlexDown
02-18-2007, 11:12 AM
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.


Wow.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 12:00 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 12:00 PM
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.


Wow.if he were to stay healthy he would be worth a 1st round otherwise he isnt.

Komp
02-18-2007, 12:07 PM
When Pennington is healthy he is in the top 1/2 of starting QB's in the league. He hasn't always been surrounded by a lot of talent with the Jets either [although the Curtis Martin/Santana Moss duo was nice].

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 12:13 PM
GB wants Lynch as well.i doubt they trade.

Its says in you sig words to the effect of:

"Peterson is the most logical and likely pick. and thats why Davis will draft him?"

How did you dream that one up?

And since when did Davis use logic in the draft?how did you dream up that Jamarcus Russell will solve all of our problems by himself?
Actually AD can do alot more than Russell can.he can start from day one,bring a running game,consistency,a gameplan,stability,the play action,and someone you can rely on.Russell cant do any of that.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 12:23 PM
heres another fact that you might like.
out of all the QBs selected in the 1st round only 16 are currently starting for their teams.16 QBs who were not drafted in round one are currently starting for their teams.
out of 12 QBs in the playoffs 6 were drafted in the 1st 6 were not drafted in round one.

Stash
02-18-2007, 01:54 PM
what's the lowdown on langston walker, can he be a good G?
He's probably the worst lineman in football, he makes Gallery look like Orlando Pace.
He did have a bad year this season, but so did the rest of the o-line. He showed promise in previous years so I would say that if he gets in the right situation with a good o-line coach he can be pretty good.


Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.

Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL

JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.

I would say Chad was worth a first rounder, he's a top ten QB IMO. Carson is definitely top 5 if not top 3. JP is the best QB that you never hear about, he had a really good season and should have been in the Pro Bowl instead of VY.

But I do agree that we shouldn't draft a QB this year. I would rather see what Walter or some FA can do and then think about a QB in a year or two if necessary. I don't want to waste 40 mil on some rookie who will most likley struggle big time.

wesbun27
02-18-2007, 02:31 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.

Windy
02-18-2007, 02:37 PM
i hope tui gets signed by some team.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 02:50 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 02:51 PM
i hope tui gets signed by some team.same and thats a kickass avy.
werent the bucs interested in him.and Gruden likes him.who knows.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-18-2007, 03:07 PM
1998
Curtis Enis
Less than 1500 career yards.
Fred Taylor
Victim of constant injury.
Robert Edwards
Two pro seasons seperated by four years.
John Avery
Could barely even find mention of him on the internet.

1999
Edgerrin James
Very good player, but only functioned at top level with a lot of support from passing game.
Ricky Williams
Dominant for very small stretch, mostly average.

2000
Jamal Lewis
One great year, a strong possibility of getting replaced soon.
Thomas Jones
Nice player who made an impact on his team, but not an elite runner by any stretch of the imagination.
Ron Dayne
'Nuff said
Shaun Alexander
One of the elite backs, but has had tremendous blocking during his great seasons.
Trung Candidate
Never came close to playing at the level he should have.

2001
LaDanian Tomlinson
Best back in the NFL, strong chance at HOF.
Deuce McAllister
Has shown flashes of being elite, but his career to date has been marred with injury.
Michael Bennett
Total flop.

2002
William Green
Total bust.
TJ Duckett
Has been a disapointment.

2003
Willis McGahee
Has shown some flashes, but isn't as explosive as some hoped, and at this point is probably pretty average.
Larry Johnson
Drafted into a great situation and made the most of it. Elite back.

2004
Steven Jackson
Great 2006, bright future. Elite back.
Chris Perry
At most a mediocre 3rd down back.
Kevin Jones
Has yet to show anything since his rookie year.

11/21 runners are currently starting for their team (including those sharing carries at this point in time).

wesbun27
02-18-2007, 03:10 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SB

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 03:48 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

wesbun27
02-18-2007, 04:17 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB? If you look at the QBs from previous drafts...not many of them match up JR potential

RaiderNation
02-18-2007, 04:18 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB?

ya pretty much

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 04:38 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB? If you look at the QBs from previous drafts...not many of them match up JR potentialWalter I dont know he would need a fair shot to let me think he could.George most likley.His first year in Oakland wasnt bad.
Id have to say that Leinart,Cutler,VY,and QUinn are all better prospects than Russell.Potential isnt everything.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 05:26 PM
I forgot about this.its pretty old but pretty funny.
http://kissmesuzy.blogspot.com/2006/11/f-k-it-im-throwing-it-downfield.html

wesbun27
02-18-2007, 06:48 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB? If you look at the QBs from previous drafts...not many of them match up JR potentialWalter I dont know he would need a fair shot to let me think he could.George most likley.His first year in Oakland wasnt bad.
Id have to say that Leinart,Cutler,VY,and QUinn are all better prospects than Russell.Potential isnt everything.





42 yr old Jeff George and Andrew Walter would of lead the Bears to a top 15 draft pick this year. Your saying potential isnt everything but potential is what the draft is all about. Nobody really knows who is gonna be good.

If Leinart,Young and Cutler were in this Draft it would still be between Young and Russell for the top spot. Russell would probably get the nod because he was a better passer coming into the draft

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 07:17 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB? If you look at the QBs from previous drafts...not many of them match up JR potentialWalter I dont know he would need a fair shot to let me think he could.George most likley.His first year in Oakland wasnt bad.
Id have to say that Leinart,Cutler,VY,and QUinn are all better prospects than Russell.Potential isnt everything.





42 yr old Jeff George and Andrew Walter would of lead the Bears to a top 15 draft pick this year. Your saying potential isnt everything but potential is what the draft is all about. Nobody really knows who is gonna be good.

If Leinart,Young and Cutler were in this Draft it would still be between Young and Russell for the top spot. Russell would probably get the nod because he was a better passer coming into the draftnot a 42 year old George but when he played.
maybe Walter he hasnt been given a fair shot.stop kidding yourself.Rex isnt a good QB.
WHen looking at QBs potential isnt everything.THey must be NFL ready.Russell is not at all NFL ready.
Cutler,Quinn,Leinart,and VY are all better prospects than Russell.

bernbabybern820
02-18-2007, 07:28 PM
1998
Curtis Enis
Less than 1500 career yards.
Fred Taylor
Victim of constant injury.
Robert Edwards
Two pro seasons seperated by four years.
John Avery
Could barely even find mention of him on the internet.

1999
Edgerrin James
Very good player, but only functioned at top level with a lot of support from passing game.
Ricky Williams
Dominant for very small stretch, mostly average.

2000
Jamal Lewis
One great year, a strong possibility of getting replaced soon.
Thomas Jones
Nice player who made an impact on his team, but not an elite runner by any stretch of the imagination.
Ron Dayne
'Nuff said
Shaun Alexander
One of the elite backs, but has had tremendous blocking during his great seasons.
Trung Candidate
Never came close to playing at the level he should have.

2001
LaDanian Tomlinson
Best back in the NFL, strong chance at HOF.
Deuce McAllister
Has shown flashes of being elite, but his career to date has been marred with injury.
Michael Bennett
Total flop.

2002
William Green
Total bust.
TJ Duckett
Has been a disapointment.

2003
Willis McGahee
Has shown some flashes, but isn't as explosive as some hoped, and at this point is probably pretty average.
Larry Johnson
Drafted into a great situation and made the most of it. Elite back.

2004
Steven Jackson
Great 2006, bright future. Elite back.
Chris Perry
At most a mediocre 3rd down back.
Kevin Jones
Has yet to show anything since his rookie year.

11/21 runners are currently starting for their team (including those sharing carries at this point in time).

great post. all the good running backs had good lines. all the bad ones had horrible ones. even the Dayne train had a couple of hundred yard games with Denver.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 08:41 PM
Raiders | Team could negotiate new deal with Curry
Sun, 18 Feb 2007 06:49:38 -0800

Jason Jones, of the Sacramento Bee, reports the Oakland Raiders will likely negotiate a new contract with WR Ronald Curry. Curry is due a $5 million roster bonus in the offseason in addition to a $1.5 million base salary.


Raiders | Sands could start in 2007
Sun, 18 Feb 2007 06:24:35 -0800

Jason Jones, of the Sacramento Bee, reports Oakland Raiders DT Terdell Sands could become a starter next season. The Raiders may consider reshuffling their defensive line by starting Sands at defensive tackle while moving DL Tommy Kelly from defensive tackle to defensive end. http://www.kffl.com/hotw/

wesbun27
02-18-2007, 11:02 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB? If you look at the QBs from previous drafts...not many of them match up JR potentialWalter I dont know he would need a fair shot to let me think he could.George most likley.His first year in Oakland wasnt bad.
Id have to say that Leinart,Cutler,VY,and QUinn are all better prospects than Russell.Potential isnt everything.





42 yr old Jeff George and Andrew Walter would of lead the Bears to a top 15 draft pick this year. Your saying potential isnt everything but potential is what the draft is all about. Nobody really knows who is gonna be good.

If Leinart,Young and Cutler were in this Draft it would still be between Young and Russell for the top spot. Russell would probably get the nod because he was a better passer coming into the draftnot a 42 year old George but when he played.
maybe Walter he hasnt been given a fair shot.stop kidding yourself.Rex isnt a good QB.
WHen looking at QBs potential isnt everything.THey must be NFL ready.Russell is not at all NFL ready.
Cutler,Quinn,Leinart,and VY are all better prospects than Russell.

your clearly biased against Russell

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-18-2007, 11:06 PM
1998
Peyton Manning
HoF.
Ryan Leaf
nuff said.
1999
Tim Couch
Isnt even in the NFL anymore and for good reason.
Akili Smith
Bust.
Donovan McNabb
Is a great QB.
Daunte Culpepper
Was good.but after Moss left.just not near what he used to be.
Cade McNown
Im not sure if hes in the NFL anymore.
2000
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.
2001
Michael Vick
THeres alot of mixed opinions on him.But theres no doubt that he wasnt worth the #1 overall pick.
2002
David Carr
Has been killed his whole entire career.But shows inconsistenty.
Joey Harrington
Career backup.
Patrick Ramsey
Nuff said.
2003
Carson Palmer
In the top ten if not top Five QBs in the NFL.
Byron Leftwich
Bust.
Kyle Boller
Bust.
Rex Grossman
By far the most inconsistent QB in the NFL.I'll give him underachiever.
2004
Eli Manning
Terribly Inconsistent.Not worth the #1 overall pick.
Ben Rothlisberger
Won the SB.But didnt play at all well in 06.
Phillip Rivers
Played great.
JP Losman
Didnt at all play well his first couple of years.Havent seen him play much at all this season.


Is drafting a QB in the first a gurantee that he'll be great, not at all.If you look at the odds, the odds might actually point against the chances of the QB drafted in the 1st doing great in the NFL.I liked last years QBs alot better than this years.And I think we should pass on the QBs coming out this year and go after someone in 09 if we have to.


13 of 22 QBs up there have led their teams to the playoffs. 3 QBs have led their teams to a Super Bowl.Rex did not lead his team to the playoffs.the running game and the defense did.a QB who can get an 11.0 QB rating in a game is not a good QB.
and Leftwich did not lead his team to the playoffs Garard did.ANd when they replaced Garard with Leftwich in the playoffs Leftwich played awful.
and for the most part most of these QBs were not worth a first round pick.so much for a 1st round QB not being a risky decision.

So what your saying is that the Bears got to the SB with another QB than Grossman or played with another HB instead of a QB. Rex Grossman was the starting QB and at times he palyed bad BUT he still took his team to the SBno he didnt he rode along with the running game and the defense.

So the Bears could of started Andrew Walter or Jeff George and still went to the SB? If you look at the QBs from previous drafts...not many of them match up JR potentialWalter I dont know he would need a fair shot to let me think he could.George most likley.His first year in Oakland wasnt bad.
Id have to say that Leinart,Cutler,VY,and QUinn are all better prospects than Russell.Potential isnt everything.





42 yr old Jeff George and Andrew Walter would of lead the Bears to a top 15 draft pick this year. Your saying potential isnt everything but potential is what the draft is all about. Nobody really knows who is gonna be good.

If Leinart,Young and Cutler were in this Draft it would still be between Young and Russell for the top spot. Russell would probably get the nod because he was a better passer coming into the draftnot a 42 year old George but when he played.
maybe Walter he hasnt been given a fair shot.stop kidding yourself.Rex isnt a good QB.
WHen looking at QBs potential isnt everything.THey must be NFL ready.Russell is not at all NFL ready.
Cutler,Quinn,Leinart,and VY are all better prospects than Russell.

your clearly biased against Russellhow exactly?I bet you havent seen him play outside the ND game.

Menard4MVP
02-19-2007, 08:52 AM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.

Menard4MVP
02-19-2007, 08:54 AM
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.


Wow.if he were to stay healthy he would be worth a 1st round otherwise he isnt.


Like Adrian Peterson?

He can't stay healthy either!

Hoisted by your own petard!!!

I knew it wouldn't take long.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

portermvp84
02-19-2007, 09:07 AM
Your avatar is huge, you might wanna resize it.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 11:41 AM
Chad Pennington
Not at all worth a 1st round pick.


Wow.if he were to stay healthy he would be worth a 1st round otherwise he isnt.


Like Adrian Peterson?

He can't stay healthy either!

Hoisted by your own petard!!!

I knew it wouldn't take long.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:McGahee and Gore had health problems in college to.But they havent had them in the NFL.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 11:43 AM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 12:02 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6485122?MSNHPHMA

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

RaiderNation
02-19-2007, 01:06 PM
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6485122?MSNHPHMA

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

lol good luck with that

Menard4MVP
02-19-2007, 02:10 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?

Menard4MVP
02-19-2007, 02:11 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?

Komp
02-19-2007, 02:15 PM
1998
Curtis Enis
Less than 1500 career yards.
Fred Taylor
Victim of constant injury.
Robert Edwards
Two pro seasons seperated by four years.
John Avery
Could barely even find mention of him on the internet.

1999
Edgerrin James
Very good player, but only functioned at top level with a lot of support from passing game.
Ricky Williams
Dominant for very small stretch, mostly average.

2000
Jamal Lewis
One great year, a strong possibility of getting replaced soon.
Thomas Jones
Nice player who made an impact on his team, but not an elite runner by any stretch of the imagination.
Ron Dayne
'Nuff said
Shaun Alexander
One of the elite backs, but has had tremendous blocking during his great seasons.
Trung Candidate
Never came close to playing at the level he should have.

2001
LaDanian Tomlinson
Best back in the NFL, strong chance at HOF.
Deuce McAllister
Has shown flashes of being elite, but his career to date has been marred with injury.
Michael Bennett
Total flop.

2002
William Green
Total bust.
TJ Duckett
Has been a disapointment.

2003
Willis McGahee
Has shown some flashes, but isn't as explosive as some hoped, and at this point is probably pretty average.
Larry Johnson
Drafted into a great situation and made the most of it. Elite back.

2004
Steven Jackson
Great 2006, bright future. Elite back.
Chris Perry
At most a mediocre 3rd down back.
Kevin Jones
Has yet to show anything since his rookie year.

11/21 runners are currently starting for their team (including those sharing carries at this point in time).

great post. all the good running backs had good lines. all the bad ones had horrible ones. even the Dayne train had a couple of hundred yard games with Denver.

How has McGahee's line been anything but awful? McGahee is a great RB btw, he just plays for a bad team.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 02:33 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, and a completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-19-2007, 02:48 PM
Dear Doingthisinsteadofwork,

Your posting habits border on that of trolling. You cling to what most Raider fans were saying more than five months ago, but have since realized differently.

You're entirely entitled to your opinion on Russell, as long as you acknowledge it is your opinion, not fact. I would also appreciate you not using Al Davis draft tendencies considering that there is a mounting pile of evidence that refutes the idea that it will play that much of a role in this year's draft.

Yours truly, Ducky

PS: Learn what a paragraph is. Please.

liverhgnbn
02-19-2007, 03:04 PM
Do you guys think Grove can play G? I think Kahil would be attractive for the Raiders in the 2nd but it would almost be a waste because I think Grove is a little bit of above average Center.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-19-2007, 03:16 PM
Do you guys think Grove can play G? I think Kahil would be attractive for the Raiders in the 2nd but it would almost be a waste because I think Grove is a little bit of above average Center.

At this point Grove is a below average center, but I'd rather not spend the 33rd pick on a center, at least not at this point.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 03:24 PM
like what tendencies exactly.the only thing that suggests Davis drafting Russell is his arm and the fact that theres a new head coach.i would like to hear more.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-19-2007, 03:29 PM
like what tendencies exactly.the only thing that suggests Davis drafting Russell is his arm and the fact that theres a new head coach.i would like to hear more.

What is your proof it won't happen?

slightlyaraiderfan
02-19-2007, 05:05 PM
like what tendencies exactly.the only thing that suggests Davis drafting Russell is his arm and the fact that theres a new head coach.i would like to hear more.
Davis has said he regrets not taking Leinart last year, so their goes our theory, of Davis not taking a QB in the 1st. And because he passed one up last year, he might take one just because.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 05:42 PM
like what tendencies exactly.the only thing that suggests Davis drafting Russell is his arm and the fact that theres a new head coach.i would like to hear more.

What is your proof it won't happen?AD and CJ are better prospects than Russell is and both can be considered needs.Russell could take three years to develop whereas AD and CJ can both start from day one.AD can bring more to this offense than Russell can and can do it quicker.AD or CJ are alot more intimidating to a defense than a rookie QB is.ANd would make the defense respect the offense more.
Id probably say due to Al Davis's past draft history.he would more likley go QB via FA or another round.unless of course assuming he has finally given in and will let Lane do most of it I think that, in that case Lane would more likley go Quinn.Quinn is a better prospect is more NFL ready and can make all the throws that would be required of him.Hes a safer pick.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-19-2007, 05:47 PM
I remember seeing the samething about Vince last year..."he needs 2-3 years to develop"

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 05:53 PM
I remember seeing the samething about Vince last year..."he needs 2-3 years to develop"and he still hasnt proven himself as a passer.as a runner yes.but not as a passer.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-19-2007, 06:03 PM
AD and CJ are better prospects than Russell is and both can be considered needs.Russell could take three years to develop whereas AD and CJ can both start from day one.AD can bring more to this offense than Russell can and can do it quicker.AD or CJ are alot more intimidating to a defense than a rookie QB is.ANd would make the defense respect the offense more.
Id probably say due to Al Davis's past draft history.he would more likley go QB via FA or another round.unless of course assuming he has finally given in and will let Lane do most of it I think that, in that case Lane would more likley go Quinn.Quinn is a better prospect is more NFL ready and can make all the throws that would be required of him.Hes a safer pick.

So your proof is opinion mixed with a tiny bit of semi-logical conjecture?

slightlyaraiderfan
02-19-2007, 06:11 PM
I remember seeing the samething about Vince last year..."he needs 2-3 years to develop"and he still hasnt proven himself as a passer.as a runner yes.but not as a passer.
He still exceeded everybody's expectations and won games. QB's that are drafted nowadays are expected to come in and play sooner, with so much money being involved.

LookItsAlDavis
02-19-2007, 06:11 PM
I remember seeing the samething about Vince last year..."he needs 2-3 years to develop"and he still hasnt proven himself as a passer.as a runner yes.but not as a passer.

He's a proven winner, and thats all that matters.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 06:44 PM
AD and CJ are better prospects than Russell is and both can be considered needs.Russell could take three years to develop whereas AD and CJ can both start from day one.AD can bring more to this offense than Russell can and can do it quicker.AD or CJ are alot more intimidating to a defense than a rookie QB is.ANd would make the defense respect the offense more.
Id probably say due to Al Davis's past draft history.he would more likley go QB via FA or another round.unless of course assuming he has finally given in and will let Lane do most of it I think that, in that case Lane would more likley go Quinn.Quinn is a better prospect is more NFL ready and can make all the throws that would be required of him.Hes a safer pick.

So your proof is opinion mixed with a tiny bit of semi-logical conjecture?its a two case secenario.and while were on the subject of proof wheres yours?

Paranoidmoonduck
02-19-2007, 06:54 PM
its a two case secenario.and while were on the subject of proof wheres yours?

My proof for what? The only thing I'm trying to prove is that your belief that Russell isn't even a viable option at this point is based upon a system of assumptions that seem to have little to no real basis in reality.

And every time you post you prove me right.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 06:55 PM
its a two case secenario.and while were on the subject of proof wheres yours?

My proof for what? The only thing I'm trying to prove is that your belief that Russell isn't even a viable option at this point is based upon a system of assumptions that seem to have little to no real basis in reality.

And every time you post you prove me right.once again avoiding the question.wheres your proof that the Raiders are leaning on picking Russell?

RaiderLifer
02-19-2007, 06:58 PM
its a two case secenario.and while were on the subject of proof wheres yours?

My proof for what? The only thing I'm trying to prove is that your belief that Russell isn't even a viable option at this point is based upon a system of assumptions that seem to have little to no real basis in reality.

And every time you post you prove me right.once again avoiding the question.wheres your proof that the Raiders are leaning on picking Russell?

Many of the quotes from the PC plus the quotes from Carroll and Al admitting he regrets not taking Leinert. Plus Monte mentioned that he thought the need for a new QB was something that was already covered during the interview process. I don't know about anything else but that is what makes me think we are leaning that way.

RaiderLifer
02-19-2007, 07:00 PM
its a two case secenario.and while were on the subject of proof wheres yours?

My proof for what? The only thing I'm trying to prove is that your belief that Russell isn't even a viable option at this point is based upon a system of assumptions that seem to have little to no real basis in reality.

And every time you post you prove me right.once again avoiding the question.wheres your proof that the Raiders are leaning on picking Russell?

Many of the quotes from the PC plus the quotes from Carroll and Al admitting he regrets not taking Leinert. Plus Monte mentioned that he thought the need for a new QB was something that was already covered during the interview process. I don't know about anything else but that is what makes me think we are leaning that way.

Oh yeah and the fact that we interviewed the guy training him (Martinez) for our QB coach position and to pick his brain about Russell.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-19-2007, 07:01 PM
Thanks to you guys for providing more evidence.

once again avoiding the question.wheres your proof that the Raiders are leaning on picking Russell?

Where did I say they were?

I take the fact that Al Davis expressed that he had wanted to pick Leinart last year (when Walter had been given even less of a chance to prove himself) as proof enough that his history of not selecting quarterbacks can be all but tossed out of the window.

When you toss that out the window, you have to look at things from normal draft perspective. Quarterback is arguably the weakest and most unstable position on our team right now, and it also has the least amount of money tied up in current players. Logic says that Russell has as good a shot as any other player, and it wouldn't be suprising to see Kiffin and his staff push for Russell either.

I don't think Russell is a lock, but I think he is a damn likely pick at this point in time.

RaiderNation
02-19-2007, 07:12 PM
bad news. both freeny and grant were franchised :evil:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2771491

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2771560

raidersfanxxx
02-19-2007, 08:49 PM
its ok. we need to spend all our money on the O anyway.

RaiderNation
02-19-2007, 08:56 PM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

Stash
02-19-2007, 10:36 PM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

RaiderNation
02-19-2007, 11:06 PM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

we have no pass rush on the other side of burgess. just wonder if we did. our d would be that much better

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-19-2007, 11:22 PM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

we have no pass rush on the other side of burgess. just wonder if we did. our d would be that much betterI think they're gonna move Kelly to RE.

RaiderNation
02-19-2007, 11:27 PM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

we have no pass rush on the other side of burgess. just wonder if we did. our d would be that much betterI think they're gonna move Kelly to RE.

we are moving a DT to DE? what a great pass rush

RaiderLifer
02-20-2007, 12:03 AM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

we have no pass rush on the other side of burgess. just wonder if we did. our d would be that much betterI think they're gonna move Kelly to RE.

we are moving a DT to DE? what a great pass rush

He played DE in 2004 and in part time action in only 10 games played he had 4 sacks. He's damn good against the run at DE too which is an even bigger need for our D. Moving Kelly to DE is a move that should have been made years ago. He is a perfect DE for run downs and Huntley on obvious pass plays. That tandem is fine for the time being. Much bigger priorities for this offseason. IMO

raidersfanxxx
02-20-2007, 12:11 AM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

we have no pass rush on the other side of burgess. just wonder if we did. our d would be that much betterI think they're gonna move Kelly to RE.

we are moving a DT to DE? what a great pass rush

He played DE in 2004 and in part time action in only 10 games played he had 4 sacks. He's damn good against the run at DE too which is an even bigger need for our D. Moving Kelly to DE is a move that should have been made years ago. He is a perfect DE for run downs and Huntley on obvious pass plays. That tandem is fine for the time being. Much bigger priorities for this offseason. IMO

could not agree more. we need to get some solid o-line help first and for most.

Menard4MVP
02-20-2007, 05:11 AM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!

Menard4MVP
02-20-2007, 05:13 AM
its a two case secenario.and while were on the subject of proof wheres yours?

My proof for what? The only thing I'm trying to prove is that your belief that Russell isn't even a viable option at this point is based upon a system of assumptions that seem to have little to no real basis in reality.

And every time you post you prove me right.

Great post.

This guy is a fool.

:lol:

Menard4MVP
02-20-2007, 05:16 AM
since those 2 are gone i want Patrick Kerney from ATL. not the fastest DE but is a great overall DE

I think it would be foolish for us to spend that kind of money on an old inury prone DE. We already have a great D and pretty good pass rush, the offense has much bigger needs.

we have no pass rush on the other side of burgess. just wonder if we did. our d would be that much betterI think they're gonna move Kelly to RE.

we are moving a DT to DE? what a great pass rush

He played DE in 2004 and in part time action in only 10 games played he had 4 sacks. He's damn good against the run at DE too which is an even bigger need for our D. Moving Kelly to DE is a move that should have been made years ago. He is a perfect DE for run downs and Huntley on obvious pass plays. That tandem is fine for the time being. Much bigger priorities for this offseason. IMO


EXACTLY.

You have diagnosed the RDE/Kelly/Huntley situation perfectly, we now have options on different downs with Brayton on the bench where he should be.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-20-2007, 10:38 AM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!uhh no it doesnt.to say he will bust in the NFL means its basically a prediction.to call him a bust would be past or present.if anything you just said that AP is already a bust.
ANd as for Russell hes all hype.lets face it if were not for the Sugar Bowl noone would be discussing him going to Oakland.just because he played one good game agaisnt a horrible defense everybody jumps right on the bandwagon.Hes got the same problems as QBs such as Culpepper,Leftwich an Leaf had out of college.
and please explain to me how picking only RUselll in this years draft will solve all of our problems.

Menard4MVP
02-20-2007, 12:17 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!uhh no it doesnt.to say he will bust in the NFL means its basically a prediction.to call him a bust would be past or present.if anything you just said that AP is already a bust.
ANd as for Russell hes all hype.lets face it if were not for the Sugar Bowl noone would be discussing him going to Oakland.just because he played one good game agaisnt a horrible defense everybody jumps right on the bandwagon.Hes got the same problems as QBs such as Culpepper,Leftwich an Leaf had out of college.
and please explain to me how picking only RUselll in this years draft will solve all of our problems.


I could try and navigate the tortuous recesses of your brain and therein plant an understanding of the English language but i feel i'd be wasting my time.

So let's stick to football.

How is Russell all hype exactly?

Wake up! People were talking Russell well before the Sugar Bowl, the Sugar Bowl was the litmus test, he passed with flying colors, i don't know what you were watching.

Same problems as Leftwich? what problems?

Same problems as DC - DC had 5-6 great years before injury.

Leaf? Leaf didn't even want to play, show me where Russell has said he doesn't want too?

Where did i say Russell was the answer to all out problems?

gettembuck
02-20-2007, 12:22 PM
Is preschool back in session? Just wondering if the little kiddies are done calling each other names.

Komp
02-20-2007, 02:09 PM
We are trying to recreate the Raider locker room within this forum....

slightlyaraiderfan
02-20-2007, 02:13 PM
Is preschool back in session? Just wondering if the little kiddies are done calling each other names.
^^^^^^

RaiderLifer
02-20-2007, 02:13 PM
Is preschool back in session? Just wondering if the little kiddies are done calling each other names.

It really is time to just smoke the peace pipe and move on. Some of us here are dogmatic in our views on Russell good or bad. There is going to be no changing anyones mind so the exercise of trying to do so is pretty futile. I don't mind a healthy debate but this business of telling someone you know for sure one way or another what we will do on draft day and what our pick (whoever that might be) will do in the pros is ridiculous. Let's try discussing something else for once...here I'll start.

If you could chose one FA to sign who would it be and why?

Mine would be Eric Steinbach because of his age and experience 62 starts for a 26 year old is amazing. Every position on the OL needs upgrading and he has the versatility to play multiple positions. Thoughts?

bernbabybern820
02-20-2007, 04:51 PM
1998
Curtis Enis
Less than 1500 career yards.
Fred Taylor
Victim of constant injury.
Robert Edwards
Two pro seasons seperated by four years.
John Avery
Could barely even find mention of him on the internet.

1999
Edgerrin James
Very good player, but only functioned at top level with a lot of support from passing game.
Ricky Williams
Dominant for very small stretch, mostly average.

2000
Jamal Lewis
One great year, a strong possibility of getting replaced soon.
Thomas Jones
Nice player who made an impact on his team, but not an elite runner by any stretch of the imagination.
Ron Dayne
'Nuff said
Shaun Alexander
One of the elite backs, but has had tremendous blocking during his great seasons.
Trung Candidate
Never came close to playing at the level he should have.

2001
LaDanian Tomlinson
Best back in the NFL, strong chance at HOF.
Deuce McAllister
Has shown flashes of being elite, but his career to date has been marred with injury.
Michael Bennett
Total flop.

2002
William Green
Total bust.
TJ Duckett
Has been a disapointment.

2003
Willis McGahee
Has shown some flashes, but isn't as explosive as some hoped, and at this point is probably pretty average.
Larry Johnson
Drafted into a great situation and made the most of it. Elite back.

2004
Steven Jackson
Great 2006, bright future. Elite back.
Chris Perry
At most a mediocre 3rd down back.
Kevin Jones
Has yet to show anything since his rookie year.

11/21 runners are currently starting for their team (including those sharing carries at this point in time).

great post. all the good running backs had good lines. all the bad ones had horrible ones. even the Dayne train had a couple of hundred yard games with Denver.

How has McGahee's line been anything but awful? McGahee is a great RB btw, he just plays for a bad team.

exactly why McGahee has has 1128, 1247, and 990 yards.... he would have more yards if he had a good line. anyone could get 1000 yards. i would consider 1300 yards a good season now unless you are splitting a lot of carries.

Komp
02-20-2007, 05:08 PM
I'm still trying to get over the fact that Trung Canidate was picked in the first round, wtf were they thinking.

Anyways, Steinbach is most definitely the free agent I would like to pick up. He immediately improves our OL from very bad to bad. Suddenly our left side on a ZBS actually looks nice [pending Gallery's conditioning entering the season].

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-20-2007, 09:14 PM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!uhh no it doesnt.to say he will bust in the NFL means its basically a prediction.to call him a bust would be past or present.if anything you just said that AP is already a bust.
ANd as for Russell hes all hype.lets face it if were not for the Sugar Bowl noone would be discussing him going to Oakland.just because he played one good game agaisnt a horrible defense everybody jumps right on the bandwagon.Hes got the same problems as QBs such as Culpepper,Leftwich an Leaf had out of college.
and please explain to me how picking only RUselll in this years draft will solve all of our problems.


I could try and navigate the tortuous recesses of your brain and therein plant an understanding of the English language but i feel i'd be wasting my time.

So let's stick to football.

How is Russell all hype exactly?

Wake up! People were talking Russell well before the Sugar Bowl, the Sugar Bowl was the litmus test, he passed with flying colors, i don't know what you were watching.

Same problems as Leftwich? what problems?

Same problems as DC - DC had 5-6 great years before injury.

Leaf? Leaf didn't even want to play, show me where Russell has said he doesn't want too?

Where did i say Russell was the answer to all out problems?actually they all werent ready for the NFL.at least not the mental part.
Russell was being seen as a 1st round prospect but not at all a top five prospect before the Sugar Bowl.
theres no doubt that the sky's the limit for Russells potential but drafting a guy off of potential and hype just isnt worht the #1 overall pick.
as for Dante Cullpepper hes shown that without the once usefull Moss hes a nobody.he played like crap the games before he was injured.and then when Brad Johnson came in Brad played alot better.
Did you hear what Leaf said after he was drafted by SD?
as for
And I suggest you look at your username for that last question you asked.

wesbun27
02-20-2007, 10:44 PM
[quote:2b4861c617="Paranoidmoonduck"]Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!uhh no it doesnt.to say he will bust in the NFL means its basically a prediction.to call him a bust would be past or present.if anything you just said that AP is already a bust.
ANd as for Russell hes all hype.lets face it if were not for the Sugar Bowl noone would be discussing him going to Oakland.just because he played one good game agaisnt a horrible defense everybody jumps right on the bandwagon.Hes got the same problems as QBs such as Culpepper,Leftwich an Leaf had out of college.
and please explain to me how picking only RUselll in this years draft will solve all of our problems.


I could try and navigate the tortuous recesses of your brain and therein plant an understanding of the English language but i feel i'd be wasting my time.

So let's stick to football.

How is Russell all hype exactly?

Wake up! People were talking Russell well before the Sugar Bowl, the Sugar Bowl was the litmus test, he passed with flying colors, i don't know what you were watching.

Same problems as Leftwich? what problems?

Same problems as DC - DC had 5-6 great years before injury.

Leaf? Leaf didn't even want to play, show me where Russell has said he doesn't want too?

Where did i say Russell was the answer to all out problems?actually they all werent ready for the NFL.at least not the mental part.
Russell was being seen as a 1st round prospect but not at all a top five prospect before the Sugar Bowl.
theres no doubt that the sky's the limit for Russells potential but drafting a guy off of potential and hype just isnt worht the #1 overall pick.
as for Dante Cullpepper hes shown that without the once usefull Moss hes a nobody.he played like crap the games before he was injured.and then when Brad Johnson came in Brad played alot better.
Did you hear what Leaf said after he was drafted by SD?
as for
And I suggest you look at your username for that last question you asked.[/quote:2b4861c617]

In your words what makes you think that Russell is gonna end up like Leaf??

wesbun27
02-20-2007, 10:51 PM
Since we got Kiffin as the coach does anyone expect a USC player to be drafted or signed??

Komp
02-20-2007, 11:52 PM
Yah POSSIBLY Kalil now that we might move towards a ZBS. Who knows, if Kiffin liked Steve Smith maybe he'll go for him in rds 4/5 or possibly Mebane cause Kiffin obviously knows enough about him from playing him every year. Other than that there are not a lot of USC/Pac 10 players in positions we need this year.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-21-2007, 02:13 AM
Yah POSSIBLY Kalil now that we might move towards a ZBS. Who knows, if Kiffin liked Steve Smith maybe he'll go for him in rds 4/5 or possibly Mebane cause Kiffin obviously knows enough about him from playing him every year. Other than that there are not a lot of USC/Pac 10 players in positions we need this year.

I think you can add Trent Edwards to that list.

I like Kalil, but I think that there are always a few ZBS friendly centers to be had in later rounds, it would be a bit of a waste. If I somehow become convinced that he is as good as Mangold was last year, I'm for it.

The idea of picking up Victor Abiamiri with the 33rd overall is pretty appealing as well.

Menard4MVP
02-21-2007, 07:04 AM
Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!uhh no it doesnt.to say he will bust in the NFL means its basically a prediction.to call him a bust would be past or present.if anything you just said that AP is already a bust.
ANd as for Russell hes all hype.lets face it if were not for the Sugar Bowl noone would be discussing him going to Oakland.just because he played one good game agaisnt a horrible defense everybody jumps right on the bandwagon.Hes got the same problems as QBs such as Culpepper,Leftwich an Leaf had out of college.
and please explain to me how picking only RUselll in this years draft will solve all of our problems.


I could try and navigate the tortuous recesses of your brain and therein plant an understanding of the English language but i feel i'd be wasting my time.

So let's stick to football.

How is Russell all hype exactly?

Wake up! People were talking Russell well before the Sugar Bowl, the Sugar Bowl was the litmus test, he passed with flying colors, i don't know what you were watching.

Same problems as Leftwich? what problems?

Same problems as DC - DC had 5-6 great years before injury.

Leaf? Leaf didn't even want to play, show me where Russell has said he doesn't want too?

Where did i say Russell was the answer to all out problems?actually they all werent ready for the NFL.at least not the mental part.
Russell was being seen as a 1st round prospect but not at all a top five prospect before the Sugar Bowl.
theres no doubt that the sky's the limit for Russells potential but drafting a guy off of potential and hype just isnt worht the #1 overall pick.
as for Dante Cullpepper hes shown that without the once usefull Moss hes a nobody.he played like crap the games before he was injured.and then when Brad Johnson came in Brad played alot better.
Did you hear what Leaf said after he was drafted by SD?
as for
And I suggest you look at your username for that last question you asked.[/quote:ae273c9543]



Again your lack of knowledge betrays you, as does your reliance on ESPN - lite sports critique ie:

"DC was crap without Moss"

Let me educate you on what happened in Minnesota. The interior of the offensive line collapsed and that led to the INTS and DC's terrible knee injury, Minnesota's line was a disaster, sure he missed Moss - who wouldn't?

Threee offensive line starters came in after DC was injured and the scheme was changed to help a line that had struggled, they played a short passing game, not the system they had used for DC.

You mean not ready like VY wasn't ready?

Show me how Russell isn't ready?

Oh and by the way all these players in the draft are "potential" at this point, it just happens that JR has much more upside than most.


"And I suggest you look at your username for that last question you asked."

Again your poor comprehension skills let you down.

How does my sig say to you that i think "Russell is the answer to all our problems"???

I don't think my sig even mentions the o-line, outside of ESPN lite garbage and opinion dressed up as fact, and hype loaded statements like "Russell will be a bust" you have nothing to say.

You still haven't answered my questions as to why AP will be picked by Al Davis, or why he's the most logical pick?

Komp
02-21-2007, 10:15 AM
Yah POSSIBLY Kalil now that we might move towards a ZBS. Who knows, if Kiffin liked Steve Smith maybe he'll go for him in rds 4/5 or possibly Mebane cause Kiffin obviously knows enough about him from playing him every year. Other than that there are not a lot of USC/Pac 10 players in positions we need this year.

I think you can add Trent Edwards to that list.

I like Kalil, but I think that there are always a few ZBS friendly centers to be had in later rounds, it would be a bit of a waste. If I somehow become convinced that he is as good as Mangold was last year, I'm for it.

The idea of picking up Victor Abiamiri with the 33rd overall is pretty appealing as well.

I really don't like Abiamiri, but I'm ok with taking a DL or an OL with the 33rd pick.

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 11:19 AM
Yah POSSIBLY Kalil now that we might move towards a ZBS. Who knows, if Kiffin liked Steve Smith maybe he'll go for him in rds 4/5 or possibly Mebane cause Kiffin obviously knows enough about him from playing him every year. Other than that there are not a lot of USC/Pac 10 players in positions we need this year.

I think you can add Trent Edwards to that list.

I like Kalil, but I think that there are always a few ZBS friendly centers to be had in later rounds, it would be a bit of a waste. If I somehow become convinced that he is as good as Mangold was last year, I'm for it.

The idea of picking up Victor Abiamiri with the 33rd overall is pretty appealing as well.

I really don't like Abiamiri, but I'm ok with taking a DL or an OL with the 33rd pick.

Assuming we get a comp pick at the end of the third, I'd really like to go OL at 33 (Sears, Staley, Grubbs, or Ugoh) and DL in the third with either our 65th or our comp. If Brian Leonard is there at 65 I think he should be the pick. 8) I love that kid.

slightlyaraiderfan
02-21-2007, 11:41 AM
Kiffen was on the Herd this morning, this time he sounded a lot more relaxed and a lot less like a robot. He described his talk with Moss as "great", just like his relationship with Al.

Oh, and he has Bon Jovi on his ipod...he just lost some major points in my book.

Komp
02-21-2007, 11:50 AM
Oh, and he has Bon Jovi on his ipod...he just lost some major points in my book.

lol...

bernbabybern820
02-21-2007, 02:18 PM
Kiffen was on the Herd this morning, this time he sounded a lot more relaxed and a lot less like a robot. He described his talk with Moss as "great", just like his relationship with Al.

Oh, and he has Bon Jovi on his ipod...he just lost some major points in my book.

so that definitely takes CJ out of the picture?

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 02:22 PM
Kiffen was on the Herd this morning, this time he sounded a lot more relaxed and a lot less like a robot. He described his talk with Moss as "great", just like his relationship with Al.

Oh, and he has Bon Jovi on his ipod...he just lost some major points in my book.

I wonder how much of that is him not wanting to effect his trade value and how much is real? A motivated Moss would be insane but he has burned some serious bridges including mine. I want to trade him but would hate to see him blow up somewhere else. :x

bernbabybern820
02-21-2007, 02:43 PM
http://raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=30103

lookie lookie here.. :D

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 02:51 PM
http://raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=30103

lookie lookie here.. :D

Yeah I saw that...Excited that he is motivated again but I'm not real keen on him taking Brown's number.

wesbun27
02-21-2007, 03:37 PM
Tim Brown probably told his to take the number

Windy
02-21-2007, 03:46 PM
this is just my theory. calvin johnson is one of the best wr prospects in history. if we take him with the #1 pick he will get a contract in the range of 60 Million.

Calvin Johnson-60 Million

Jerry Porter-big contract, not sure about the numbers

Ronald Curry-http://www.rotoworld.com/Content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?sport=NFL&id=788 big extension coming soon

you could switch curry or porter in the depth chart that's not the point. the point i'm trying to make is that we would have a TON of money locked up in the wr position and this is not including moss. who knows what could happen with moss. i'm not sure curry or porter could be a #3 wr with the money they make.

SubNoize
02-21-2007, 03:49 PM
with Porter being back on board reportedly and Curry set to start does this rule out CJ completely??? Both Curry and Porter are fairly young and i know we could always use an upgrade, but I kind of took this as we're focusing elsewhere either RB or QB, with myself leaning towards Russell. I figure Moss to still be out the door and hopefully something emerges from the combine like it did when we first traded for him, despite Kiffin's interview this morning where he stated otherwise. Kiffin seems to be steering us in the right direction and hopefully we can make a splash in FA and sign some solid players on the O-line.

portermvp84
02-21-2007, 03:58 PM
http://raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=30103

lookie lookie here.. :D

Yeah I saw that...Excited that he is motivated again but I'm not real keen on him taking Brown's number.

He got my trust back, t's only right he gets a good number. Maybe he'll put up good numbers lke TB did.

Komp
02-21-2007, 05:09 PM
Awesome. Glad to have him back on board. He has #1 WR potential. I like what I see from our guys this offseason so far. With both Gallery and Porter putting some new found efforts into getting into shape it should show next season.

RaiderNation
02-21-2007, 05:20 PM
http://raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=30103

lookie lookie here.. :D

Yeah I saw that...Excited that he is motivated again but I'm not real keen on him taking Brown's number.

hopefully this motivates him to being good again. him and curry would be good but i think CJ still has a high chance of us gettn him since moss is hopefully gonna be gone

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 05:31 PM
http://raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=30103

lookie lookie here.. :D

Yeah I saw that...Excited that he is motivated again but I'm not real keen on him taking Brown's number.

hopefully this motivates him to being good again. him and curry would be good but i think CJ still has a high chance of us gettn him since moss is hopefully gonna be gone


Lane Kiffin on "The Turd" says Moss is excited to be back. Of course it could be a smoke screen but worth a listen anyway. If Moss stays I think it rules out CJ and boils it down to AD and JR. IMO

http://insider.espn.go.com/insider/radio/archive?name=herd_podcast

RaiderNation
02-21-2007, 05:49 PM
http://raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=30103

lookie lookie here.. :D

Yeah I saw that...Excited that he is motivated again but I'm not real keen on him taking Brown's number.

hopefully this motivates him to being good again. him and curry would be good but i think CJ still has a high chance of us gettn him since moss is hopefully gonna be gone


Lane Kiffin on "The Turd" says Moss is excited to be back. Of course it could be a smoke screen but worth a listen anyway. If Moss stays I think it rules out CJ and boils it down to AD and JR. IMO

http://insider.espn.go.com/insider/radio/archive?name=herd_podcast

i wont believe anything until moss says he wants to come back and not just kiffin

locseti
02-21-2007, 07:58 PM
Porter gets paid way too much.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-21-2007, 08:47 PM
[quote:b4f5313de5="Only1pickJamarcusRusell"][quote:b4f5313de5="Paranoidmoonduck"]Looking at past trends tells you nothing about the actual player you'd be drafting. Russell is a supreme physical talent who has shown great confidence and a dominating presence on the field. He has tremendous potential, appears to be very coachable, and can make every single throw imaginable.

I'm not neccesarily saying he's the best pick, nor am I saying he's the most likely pick. But to deny that he is at least a very good prospect, ana completely possible option at this stage is deluding yourself.


Listing players who have busted is the educationally sub-normal level of draft debate.wow nice argument.or lack of one.


Thanks for describing every post you've made so far.Ive enjoyed reading your posts.All pretty much baseless accusations with nothing to support your theories.


LOL!!!

Oh the irony, this from the man that's already pronounced Jamarcus Russell a bust before he's taken ONE snap in the NFL!!!

Adrian Peterson will be a bust - see how easy it is?at least I can back up my statement.You cant.
ANd btw,if you actually can read it properly it says Russell will bust in the NFL.not hes a bust.
theres actually a difference in those two statements.
Id still like you to explain to me how drafting Russell and noone else will solve all of Oaklands problems.
we can all get a good laugh out of it.



Quite simply put.

LEARN TO READ YOU SIMPLETON.

If you saying he "will" bust in the NFL without playing a down, then you have automatically pronounced him a "bust" already, you cretin.

Go back to school you fool, your comprehension is very poor indeed.

Where have you backed up your assertion that Russell WILL bust in the NFL?

Peterson is already bust material because he can't stay on the field, Russell has no such problems!

NEXT!!!!uhh no it doesnt.to say he will bust in the NFL means its basically a prediction.to call him a bust would be past or present.if anything you just said that AP is already a bust.
ANd as for Russell hes all hype.lets face it if were not for the Sugar Bowl noone would be discussing him going to Oakland.just because he played one good game agaisnt a horrible defense everybody jumps right on the bandwagon.Hes got the same problems as QBs such as Culpepper,Leftwich an Leaf had out of college.
and please explain to me how picking only RUselll in this years draft will solve all of our problems.


I could try and navigate the tortuous recesses of your brain and therein plant an understanding of the English language but i feel i'd be wasting my time.

So let's stick to football.

How is Russell all hype exactly?

Wake up! People were talking Russell well before the Sugar Bowl, the Sugar Bowl was the litmus test, he passed with flying colors, i don't know what you were watching.

Same problems as Leftwich? what problems?

Same problems as DC - DC had 5-6 great years before injury.

Leaf? Leaf didn't even want to play, show me where Russell has said he doesn't want too?

Where did i say Russell was the answer to all out problems?actually they all werent ready for the NFL.at least not the mental part.
Russell was being seen as a 1st round prospect but not at all a top five prospect before the Sugar Bowl.
theres no doubt that the sky's the limit for Russells potential but drafting a guy off of potential and hype just isnt worht the #1 overall pick.
as for Dante Cullpepper hes shown that without the once usefull Moss hes a nobody.he played like crap the games before he was injured.and then when Brad Johnson came in Brad played alot better.
Did you hear what Leaf said after he was drafted by SD?
as for
And I suggest you look at your username for that last question you asked.[/quote:b4f5313de5]



Again your lack of knowledge betrays you, as does your reliance on ESPN - lite sports critique ie:

"DC was crap without Moss"

Let me educate you on what happened in Minnesota. The interior of the offensive line collapsed and that led to the INTS and DC's terrible knee injury, Minnesota's line was a disaster, sure he missed Moss - who wouldn't?

Threee offensive line starters came in after DC was injured and the scheme was changed to help a line that had struggled, they played a short passing game, not the system they had used for DC.

You mean not ready like VY wasn't ready?

Show me how Russell isn't ready?

Oh and by the way all these players in the draft are "potential" at this point, it just happens that JR has much more upside than most.


"And I suggest you look at your username for that last question you asked.[/quote:b4f5313de5]"

Again your poor comprehension skills let you down.

How does my sig say to you that i think "Russell is the answer to all our problems"???

I don't think my sig even mentions the o-line, outside of ESPN lite garbage and opinion dressed up as fact, and hype loaded statements like "Russell will be a bust" you have nothing to say.

You still haven't answered my questions as to why AP will be picked by Al Davis, or why he's the most logical pick?i dont know anything about your sig seeing as how you dont have one but I guess your refering to your username.only1pick Jamarcus Russell.Is like saying Jamarcus Russell is the only pick we need.
Russel is not mentally prepared yet for the NFL.not at all.
http://www.lsubeat.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070103/SPORTS0202/701030320
VY still hasnt developed as a passer yet.
I dont ever recall you asking about how AP is a more logical pick.AP is a more logical pick cause he can bring a running game,consistency,stability,the play action,a gameplan,makes defenses concentrate on him,and someone you can rely on.Not to mention that with Lamont Jordan getting paid the way he is and not at all earning his moneys worth is likely to be cut.WHich gives us what at the RB position?Not to mention that all though some of the fans think they Oakland needs a QB its not at all a lock that the coaching staff thinks so.and would they go round one at QB?

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-21-2007, 09:03 PM
for those that havent seen.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/players/02/20/first.person0226/
Also, the Raiders. I rooted for them growing up.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-21-2007, 09:15 PM
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/printedition/2007/02/21/sptfalcons0221a.html
The Falcons do not want to lose Schaub and plan to place a one-year contract tender on him, possibly in excess of $2 million, as well as a compensation attachment of a first and/or third-round draft pick.

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 09:29 PM
Did anybody else notice the Porter story is gone from Raiders.com now? It's still up on other sites but not on our home page. It's not archived either. fishy... :?

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 09:34 PM
Did anybody else notice the Porter story is gone from Raiders.com now? It's still up on other sites but not on our home page. It's not archived either. fishy... :?

I guess it if something had changed the link would no longer work. Never mind :oops:

RaiderNation
02-21-2007, 09:37 PM
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/printedition/2007/02/21/sptfalcons0221a.html
The Falcons do not want to lose Schaub and plan to place a one-year contract tender on him, possibly in excess of $2 million, as well as a compensation attachment of a first and/or third-round draft pick.

bad news :evil:

RaiderNation
02-21-2007, 09:38 PM
for those that havent seen.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/players/02/20/first.person0226/
Also, the Raiders. I rooted for them growing up.

best news ive heard all day :wink:

raidersfanxxx
02-21-2007, 10:53 PM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 11:11 PM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

Agree totally. I flip flop all the time between J-Russ, CJ, and AD. Seriously it's every other day I change.

RaiderNation
02-21-2007, 11:14 PM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

Agree totally. I flip flop all the time between J-Russ, CJ, and AD. Seriously it's every other day I change.

u should stay on the cj and ad band wagon. our defence needs to win now not in 3 years if russell develops. ad and cj will have a bigger impact for right now and the future

RaiderLifer
02-21-2007, 11:42 PM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

Agree totally. I flip flop all the time between J-Russ, CJ, and AD. Seriously it's every other day I change.

u should stay on the cj and ad band wagon. our defence needs to win now not in 3 years if russell develops. ad and cj will have a bigger impact for right now and the future

I like J-Russ a hell of a lot. Our defense is young and will continue to improve. I still believe that young QB's can make a significant impact and I think lately that's been proven (Big Ben, rivers, VY, and to a lesser extent Cutler and Leinert). Plus I don't need the playoffs now to be happy about next season. If we are average but the offense and a young QB are improving as the year progresses I am happy with that. We are the worst team in football and we should be thinking about both the short and long term future. I think all three of those prospects will help us now and in the future. Right now if any one of their names are called I will be excited. I appreciate your opinion but I'm still on the fence and I like J-Russ a lot more than most on this board.

RaiderNation
02-21-2007, 11:58 PM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

Agree totally. I flip flop all the time between J-Russ, CJ, and AD. Seriously it's every other day I change.

u should stay on the cj and ad band wagon. our defence needs to win now not in 3 years if russell develops. ad and cj will have a bigger impact for right now and the future

I like J-Russ a hell of a lot. Our defense is young and will continue to improve. I still believe that young QB's can make a significant impact and I think lately that's been proven (Big Ben, rivers, VY, and to a lesser extent Cutler and Leinert). Plus I don't need the playoffs now to be happy about next season. If we are average but the offense and a young QB are improving as the year progresses I am happy with that. We are the worst team in football and we should be thinking about both the short and long term future. I think all three of those prospects will help us now and in the future. Right now if any one of their names are called I will be excited. I appreciate your opinion but I'm still on the fence and I like J-Russ a lot more than most on this board.

big ben didnt do much he is just in a system that makes the qb do little, rivers was on the bench for 2 years but couldnt disagree with VY. but VY is a hole lot different than any other qb.

our defence is young overall but our best 2 players on d are probably burgess and sapp and they are both in there 30's. sapp will retire very soon and burgess has 3-4 more good years then he will slip.

russell wouldnt help us right now. he will be david carr the 2nd. he will get killed behind our line just like carr has. AD is the best pick for us because he bring alot of things no other prospect can. CJ will be a great down field WR. he will be what we thought moss would be but he also goes though the middle like TO. there are alot of prospects like russell that come out every year. there hasnt been one like CJ. a 6'5 230 and reportably ran a 4.33 40. AD is rare too. a larry johnson like rb that can out run you and run u over.

AlexDown
02-22-2007, 12:19 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

wesbun27
02-22-2007, 12:37 AM
I dont understand people who STILL want CJ! He would nothing but the 3rd or 4th on our deptth chart behingd Porter,Curry and possibly Gabriel. WR is not a need at all for the Raiders. QB is our biggest need

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 12:39 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

RaiderLifer
02-22-2007, 12:46 AM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

Agree totally. I flip flop all the time between J-Russ, CJ, and AD. Seriously it's every other day I change.

u should stay on the cj and ad band wagon. our defence needs to win now not in 3 years if russell develops. ad and cj will have a bigger impact for right now and the future

I like J-Russ a hell of a lot. Our defense is young and will continue to improve. I still believe that young QB's can make a significant impact and I think lately that's been proven (Big Ben, rivers, VY, and to a lesser extent Cutler and Leinert). Plus I don't need the playoffs now to be happy about next season. If we are average but the offense and a young QB are improving as the year progresses I am happy with that. We are the worst team in football and we should be thinking about both the short and long term future. I think all three of those prospects will help us now and in the future. Right now if any one of their names are called I will be excited. I appreciate your opinion but I'm still on the fence and I like J-Russ a lot more than most on this board.

big ben didnt do much he is just in a system that makes the qb do little, rivers was on the bench for 2 years but couldnt disagree with VY. but VY is a hole lot different than any other qb.

our defence is young overall but our best 2 players on d are probably burgess and sapp and they are both in there 30's. sapp will retire very soon and burgess has 3-4 more good years then he will slip.

russell wouldnt help us right now. he will be david carr the 2nd. he will get killed behind our line just like carr has. AD is the best pick for us because he bring alot of things no other prospect can. CJ will be a great down field WR. he will be what we thought moss would be but he also goes though the middle like TO. there are alot of prospects like russell that come out every year. there hasnt been one like CJ. a 6'5 230 and reportably ran a 4.33 40. AD is rare too. a larry johnson like rb that can out run you and run u over.

Look this has been debated to death and it's getting kind of nauseating. It boils down to how special I think Russell is. Your of the opinion that he is pretty ordinary, that is not my opinion. I have been raving to my friends about CJ for more than a year and I think he if he runs the time that is being reported he might be regarded as the best WR prospect of all time. I love him, but if Moss and Porter stay (signs are pointing to that) and we resign Curry I think we would have much greater needs to address in the first. Our opinions differ and like I said I like Russell alot more than you. JMO

RaiderLifer
02-22-2007, 12:48 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

You rip Curry and Porter (who was good in a vertical role in the past) for not being vertical WR's then you bring up these two QB's? I'm confused.

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 12:54 AM
this offseason is killing me.....everyday i have a new favorite for are #1 pick

Agree totally. I flip flop all the time between J-Russ, CJ, and AD. Seriously it's every other day I change.

u should stay on the cj and ad band wagon. our defence needs to win now not in 3 years if russell develops. ad and cj will have a bigger impact for right now and the future

I like J-Russ a hell of a lot. Our defense is young and will continue to improve. I still believe that young QB's can make a significant impact and I think lately that's been proven (Big Ben, rivers, VY, and to a lesser extent Cutler and Leinert). Plus I don't need the playoffs now to be happy about next season. If we are average but the offense and a young QB are improving as the year progresses I am happy with that. We are the worst team in football and we should be thinking about both the short and long term future. I think all three of those prospects will help us now and in the future. Right now if any one of their names are called I will be excited. I appreciate your opinion but I'm still on the fence and I like J-Russ a lot more than most on this board.

big ben didnt do much he is just in a system that makes the qb do little, rivers was on the bench for 2 years but couldnt disagree with VY. but VY is a hole lot different than any other qb.

our defence is young overall but our best 2 players on d are probably burgess and sapp and they are both in there 30's. sapp will retire very soon and burgess has 3-4 more good years then he will slip.

russell wouldnt help us right now. he will be david carr the 2nd. he will get killed behind our line just like carr has. AD is the best pick for us because he bring alot of things no other prospect can. CJ will be a great down field WR. he will be what we thought moss would be but he also goes though the middle like TO. there are alot of prospects like russell that come out every year. there hasnt been one like CJ. a 6'5 230 and reportably ran a 4.33 40. AD is rare too. a larry johnson like rb that can out run you and run u over.

Look this has been debated to death and it's getting kind of nauseating. It boils down to how special I think Russell is. Your of the opinion that he is pretty ordinary, that is not my opinion. I have been raving to my friends about CJ for more than a year and I think he if he runs the time that is being reported he might be regarded as the best WR prospect of all time. I love him, but if Moss and Porter stay (signs are pointing to that) and we resign Curry I think we would have much greater needs to address in the first. Our opinions differ and like I said I like Russell alot more than you. JMO

if somehow both moss and porter stay and curry i wouldnt mind the russell pick its just moss looks to be gone. told kiffin to f*ck off and he talked to greenbays GM. wait a second. u said we have to resign curry? does he have like 1 year remaining or something?

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 12:57 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

You rip Curry and Porter (who was good in a vertical role in the past) for not being vertical WR's then you bring up these two QB's? I'm confused.

yes i know garcia and huard dont have the greatest arms in the world but i think they can help walter and who ever else we have a lot. i think garcia has a good arm. he had stallworth as a wr and he went long to him a few times. i think if we trade for david carr on the otherhand would be a good fit also. great arm and expricence behind bad olines. he showed imprivement also last year

wesbun27
02-22-2007, 12:58 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

One thing Raider fans at the moment need understand is that our team is not ready to win now. We have a rookie coach...a mess of a oline...no kind of hope on offense yet other than our talented recievers. We need a to start fresh with a talented QB with loads of potential not Garcia or Huard

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 01:09 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

One thing Raider fans at the moment need understand is that our team is not ready to win now. We have a rookie coach...a mess of a oline...no kind of hope on offense yet other than our talented recievers. We need a to start fresh with a talented QB with loads of potential not Garcia or Huard

HAHAHAHA u r calling moss and porter talented? a guy who doesnt try and a guy whoback talked to our former head coach are talented? with a young playmkaer on offence our offence will have hope. i cant believe every1 is giving up on walter. every1 is sayn no qb could do good with this oline. so how could u just give up on him? better coaching will help walter alot. no more 7 step drops. 3-5 step drops will be way better. take away 10-15 sacks probably.

Paranoidmoonduck
02-22-2007, 01:19 AM
I like Russell because I think he has the mental goods to make it through the rough spots of getting this team back on track. I like Peterson because he has tremendous talent and could end up dominating a the pro level.

However, there isn't a doubt in my mind that Calvin Johnson is the best player in this draft, and that means I want him the most.

wesbun27
02-22-2007, 02:21 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

One thing Raider fans at the moment need understand is that our team is not ready to win now. We have a rookie coach...a mess of a oline...no kind of hope on offense yet other than our talented recievers. We need a to start fresh with a talented QB with loads of potential not Garcia or Huard

HAHAHAHA u r calling moss and porter talented? a guy who doesnt try and a guy whoback talked to our former head coach are talented? with a young playmkaer on offence our offence will have hope. i cant believe every1 is giving up on walter. every1 is sayn no qb could do good with this oline. so how could u just give up on him? better coaching will help walter alot. no more 7 step drops. 3-5 step drops will be way better. take away 10-15 sacks probably.

Im sorry did I really just see you write that Randy Moss isnt talented??

Menard4MVP
02-22-2007, 06:11 AM
Porter is back on board, and Al as good as said he was at the Kiffin PC, and maybe even Moss staying (which i doubt), there's no way we're taking CJ.

If Curry gets extended it's all over, Porter and Curry will start and we'll be taking a QB. If we take CJ and keep Porter and Curry then Davis is senile and should be taken out the building and sectioned.

Jordan is too expensive to cut and will be given one more chance to prove he doesn't suck.

Too much money tied up in the 4th highest paid RB in football for him to be let go.

gettembuck
02-22-2007, 10:43 AM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

One thing Raider fans at the moment need understand is that our team is not ready to win now. We have a rookie coach...a mess of a oline...no kind of hope on offense yet other than our talented recievers. We need a to start fresh with a talented QB with loads of potential not Garcia or HuardUnderstood, but many don't believe Russell to be that guy.

NIN1984
02-22-2007, 10:48 AM
I hope we still trade Moss.

Komp
02-22-2007, 11:52 AM
Yah the Russell pick is looking more and more logical each week and if you want to run a vertical offense [which btw we have no idea what type of offense Kiffin wants to go with] I'd rather have the best arm in the world at QB than a really good deep WR. Of course watch us trade down and pick Thomas at OT or something [which honestly would not be a bad pick either lol]. I've said it once, I'll say it again, we can pick any one of those guys and its a great pick, but CJ might be the position where we already have the most depth. :|

NIN1984
02-22-2007, 12:04 PM
With Porter back on board and plus Curry I don't think we need a WR not with the #1 overall pick. Maybe in rounds 2 or 3

plus moss might be back on board.

Russell seems like it could really happen, but than we could trade for Schaub. lol

this is crazy

Paranoidmoonduck
02-22-2007, 12:08 PM
Yah the Russell pick is looking more and more logical each week and if you want to run a vertical offense [which btw we have no idea what type of offense Kiffin wants to go with] I'd rather have the best arm in the world at QB than a really good deep WR. Of course watch us trade down and pick Thomas at OT or something [which honestly would not be a bad pick either lol]. I've said it once, I'll say it again, we can pick any one of those guys and its a great pick, but CJ might be the position where we already have the most depth. :|

Funny you should mention.

http://www.ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/

"Oh, yeah, it's basically, Jon Gruden's offense. That's the first thing I was told by Kiffin _ that he was a big fan of Jon Gruden," Brown said. "And this offense is almost verbatim Jon Gruden's offense. Obviously, J.P. likes that offense. (Offensive coordinator) Greg Knapp is very familiar with a West Coast system . . . and in this offense, they do have three-step drops, and I don't think there were too many of those in (Tom) Walsh's offense."

bernbabybern820
02-22-2007, 01:15 PM
I don't understand how Raider fans feel that CJ will make a better "immediate impact" over Russel. Why does that hold so much water for your argument considering the Raiders, being in the AFC, and being in an extremely hard division, don't look playoff bound anytime soon.

Raiders also have Porter and Curry comming back. Before the argument was "Porter and Moss are basically gone so we have to pick CJ". Now it's "Well, they still should draft him because Moss will probably be gone"

what type of offence do we run? verticle. are porter and curry vertical wrs? no. they sometimes can go deep but they dont really have the speed. moss sucks. we all know that. so a deep threat like CJ will help the run game because it will make the saftey play back to help on him. i know it will be very hard to compete in the afc but u know how al is with the "just win baby" and "comitment to excellence". those pretty much win now and still build for our future. russell will not help us win now. a vet qb like garcia or huard would because they have expirence.

One thing Raider fans at the moment need understand is that our team is not ready to win now. We have a rookie coach...a mess of a oline...no kind of hope on offense yet other than our talented recievers. We need a to start fresh with a talented QB with loads of potential not Garcia or Huard

HAHAHAHA u r calling moss and porter talented? a guy who doesnt try and a guy whoback talked to our former head coach are talented? with a young playmkaer on offence our offence will have hope. i cant believe every1 is giving up on walter. every1 is sayn no qb could do good with this oline. so how could u just give up on him? better coaching will help walter alot. no more 7 step drops. 3-5 step drops will be way better. take away 10-15 sacks probably.

they are

liverhgnbn
02-22-2007, 01:17 PM
Tim Brown is wrong, USC's offense is a vertical offense but it is an adaption of the WCO. Like Holmgren and all those years with Farve.

wesbun27
02-22-2007, 01:40 PM
:shock: Highlights of Russell

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ly_1gj5I-Bk

wesbun27
02-22-2007, 03:30 PM
Brooks has been released....its gonna save 5.72 on the cap

portermvp84
02-22-2007, 04:00 PM
He needed to be cut, part of the cancer is gone.

Komp
02-22-2007, 04:29 PM
Today is a happy day. We are halfway there, now we just have to trade Moss and I'll be a happy man.

Shiver
02-22-2007, 04:32 PM
33rd pick for Matt Schaub, then you take Calvin Johnson..


Thoughts?

NIN1984
02-22-2007, 04:33 PM
Tim Brown is wrong, USC's offense is a vertical offense but it is an adaption of the WCO. Like Holmgren and all those years with Farve.

Than Russell would be a nice fit if we wanna run something like what the Seahawks are doing...

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 05:28 PM
33rd pick for Matt Schaub, then you take Calvin Johnson..


Thoughts?

how about moss and our 3rd for schaub and ur 4th. i would still do that trade though

portermvp84
02-22-2007, 05:28 PM
33rd pick for Matt Schaub, then you take Calvin Johnson..


Thoughts?

I think it would be safer just to take JR number one.

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-22-2007, 06:04 PM
33rd pick for Matt Schaub, then you take Calvin Johnson..


Thoughts?no I would agree to that and giving away Moss.it can be this or any other pick just as long as hes gone.then draft AD.that would give us
QB Shaub
RB AD
WR Porter
WR Curry

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-22-2007, 06:05 PM
Porter is back on board, and Al as good as said he was at the Kiffin PC, and maybe even Moss staying (which i doubt), there's no way we're taking CJ.

If Curry gets extended it's all over, Porter and Curry will start and we'll be taking a QB. If we take CJ and keep Porter and Curry then Davis is senile and should be taken out the building and sectioned.

Jordan is too expensive to cut and will be given one more chance to prove he doesn't suck.

Too much money tied up in the 4th highest paid RB in football for him to be let go.why wait another year and watch the offense struggle.there'll be no such thing as a running game with him in the backfield.plus he blew out his MCL.no thanks.

Komp
02-22-2007, 06:13 PM
Yah that looks nice....we'd have to go after 1 or 2 of the top OL available in FA tho to do alright....still need a TE tho....

doingthisinsteadofwork
02-22-2007, 06:33 PM
The Oakland Raiders, armed with a new coach and a new way of thinking, are moving quickly to determine what direction they will take with their picks in the NFL Draft. The process began on Wednesday in Indianapolis when the team met with a prospect over dinner.

SilverandBlack.com and Scout.com has confirmed that Wisconsin offensive tackle Joe Thomas sat down for a formal meeting with the Oakland Raiders. The 6-foot-6, 311-pound behemoth is widely considered the top left tackle prospect on the NFL Draft board and will be a consideration for the Raiders – even with the first overall pick in the NFL Draft.

Ideally, Oakland would prefer to trade down two or three spots and pick up Thomas, netting the extra picks to help a team that has a number of areas that need improvement.

Thomas tore a ligament in his knee last year while playing defensive end – that’s right, defensive end. He came back and had another strong season for the Badgers in 2006.

The Raiders could use a man of his talents along the line, moving Robert Gallery back to right tackle. Thomas is considered a strong run blocker and a developing pass protector that could be a cornerstone for a franchise.

He is a player that will be in high demand at the top of the NFL Draft board, already meeting with Detroit and Cleveland.

An exclusive to follow...

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 07:00 PM
The Oakland Raiders, armed with a new coach and a new way of thinking, are moving quickly to determine what direction they will take with their picks in the NFL Draft. The process began on Wednesday in Indianapolis when the team met with a prospect over dinner.

SilverandBlack.com and Scout.com has confirmed that Wisconsin offensive tackle Joe Thomas sat down for a formal meeting with the Oakland Raiders. The 6-foot-6, 311-pound behemoth is widely considered the top left tackle prospect on the NFL Draft board and will be a consideration for the Raiders – even with the first overall pick in the NFL Draft.

Ideally, Oakland would prefer to trade down two or three spots and pick up Thomas, netting the extra picks to help a team that has a number of areas that need improvement.

Thomas tore a ligament in his knee last year while playing defensive end – that’s right, defensive end. He came back and had another strong season for the Badgers in 2006.

The Raiders could use a man of his talents along the line, moving Robert Gallery back to right tackle. Thomas is considered a strong run blocker and a developing pass protector that could be a cornerstone for a franchise.

He is a player that will be in high demand at the top of the NFL Draft board, already meeting with Detroit and Cleveland.

An exclusive to follow...

good news?

RaiderLifer
02-22-2007, 09:38 PM
The Oakland Raiders, armed with a new coach and a new way of thinking, are moving quickly to determine what direction they will take with their picks in the NFL Draft. The process began on Wednesday in Indianapolis when the team met with a prospect over dinner.

SilverandBlack.com and Scout.com has confirmed that Wisconsin offensive tackle Joe Thomas sat down for a formal meeting with the Oakland Raiders. The 6-foot-6, 311-pound behemoth is widely considered the top left tackle prospect on the NFL Draft board and will be a consideration for the Raiders – even with the first overall pick in the NFL Draft.

Ideally, Oakland would prefer to trade down two or three spots and pick up Thomas, netting the extra picks to help a team that has a number of areas that need improvement.

Thomas tore a ligament in his knee last year while playing defensive end – that’s right, defensive end. He came back and had another strong season for the Badgers in 2006.

The Raiders could use a man of his talents along the line, moving Robert Gallery back to right tackle. Thomas is considered a strong run blocker and a developing pass protector that could be a cornerstone for a franchise.

He is a player that will be in high demand at the top of the NFL Draft board, already meeting with Detroit and Cleveland.

An exclusive to follow...

good news?

I know we are going to talk to everyone but I didn't really see this coming. The first day of the combine I did not expect to have him be the guy we were sitting down to dinner with. :? :? :?

Stash
02-22-2007, 10:13 PM
I am so confused right now; I have no idea whos staying, whos going, and who we're gonna draft. Does anyone know how to fast forward life?

RaiderNation
02-22-2007, 11:19 PM
I am so confused right now; I have no idea whos staying, whos going, and who we're gonna draft. Does anyone know how to fast forward life?

do what cartman did in south park and try to freeze yourself lol

Komp
02-22-2007, 11:50 PM
I keep repeating myself, but there isn't a bad pick. We need to build the OL someway this year and I'm not sure we are an attractive destination in FA at the moment....drafting a LT makes sense, despite what has happened with Gallery. It is good to check out all of our options, if someone offers us a ton for the #1 pick come close to draft day its good to know whether or not we like the top OT on the board. Now, having said that, I'd much rather draft a skill player, but we'll see.

RaiderNation
02-23-2007, 12:59 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e24e5urBEJs

after watching this video, im starting to accually like russell more

RaiderNation
02-23-2007, 01:04 AM
also, any1 know where i can get a video of oakland like
doingthisinsteadofwork's? i want one of myab carr when he ran the int back against PIT or scrabble's

RaiderLifer
02-23-2007, 01:16 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e24e5urBEJs

after watching this video, im starting to accually like russell more

Everyone talks about his big arm but from watching videos and the games that I caught what impresses me is that he is really good at throwing the underneath stuff and quick slants as well. He might not be the ideal fit for the WCO but he can make all the throws so I wouldn't rule it out. His accuracy when pressured is amazing and he continues to look downfield no matter how many people are in his face. Right now him AD and CJ are all equal for me.

Windy
02-23-2007, 01:37 AM
http://ibabuzz.com/raidersblog/

Barry Sims could be back.

Menard4MVP
02-23-2007, 07:20 AM
Tim Brown is wrong, USC's offense is a vertical offense but it is an adaption of the WCO. Like Holmgren and all those years with Farve.


So you're saying Kiffin lied to him?

An interesting take.

:roll:

ricky bobby
02-23-2007, 07:23 AM
You guys need a TE right? I have a question. Would you trade away your second and third round picks for Jeremy Shockey? Just throwing it out there.

Menard4MVP
02-23-2007, 07:24 AM
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/printedition/2007/02/21/sptfalcons0221a.html
The Falcons do not want to lose Schaub and plan to place a one-year contract tender on him, possibly in excess of $2 million, as well as a compensation attachment of a first and/or third-round draft pick.

bad news :evil:

More great news.

No Leftwich, now no Schaub.

gettembuck
02-23-2007, 07:52 AM
You guys need a TE right? I have a question. Would you trade away your second and third round picks for Jeremy Shockey? Just throwing it out there. :lol:

no