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eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 11:26 AM
Agreed Kolb is not cutler

You're right, he's much better ;).

killxswitch
03-11-2010, 11:35 AM
Derrick Morgan and Everson Griffen are physically superior prospects but I personally think that Brandon Graham and Jerry Hughes will have a higher level of production in the pros.

It's all about college production. Hughes and Graham had 10+ sacks this past year both, and Griffen and Morgan didn't afaik. You don't just suddenly "learn" how to sack the quarterback in the NFL if you didn't pick it up in college.

All of the greatest pass rushers (Michael Strahan, Simeon Rice, Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers) were extremely productive (10+ sacks/year) in college. Many of the busts @ DE were guys who had little production in college but were seen as having high "potential" due to measurables.

I say, go with the guy that has the stats in college, despite being smaller or not as fast.

I came here to comment on Marlin Jackson, and I will, but FYI Morgan had 12.5 sacks and was the ACC DPOY last season.

I hope you guys get some solid years out of Jackson. He is a likable and hard-working guy, and when healthy he is very physical. He lost some serious speed after his first knee injury which made him a liability at corner. I don't know if that loss is permanent or if he just got hurt again before he could get back to what he was.

He did well as a safety for the Colts. I was hoping we could bring him back to replace Sanders (who will get hurt again) for cheap but I am not surprised someone picked him up.

Morton
03-11-2010, 02:03 PM
Speaking of Dick Jauron, he was amazing at developing secondary players in Buffalo, Jabari Greer, Terrence McGee, Leodis McKelvin, Jairus Byrd, Donte Whitner and George Wilson. And he was actually able to develop a ton of good players over the course of his coaching career. I'm excited to see what he can do with Macho Harris and Quintin Demps.


The one good thing about hte safety position next year is that our DC (McDermott) was a safety in college, and our "assistant" DC (Jauron) was a Pro Bowl safety in the NFL when he played for Detriot and Cincinnati back in the day.

If anybody should be able to evaluate and train DBs, it's these two guys.


And speaking of being excited, I can't wait for Cornelius Ingram and Stewart Bradley to get healthy, absolutely CANNOT WAIT, Bradley will get the defense on track and Ingram will just be yet another weapon for the offense.

Ingram was supposed to be one of the top TE in last year's draft until the injuries derailed him. If he comes back even at 90%, and lives up to his level of talent, the Eagles could easily have the best TE duo in the NFL.

The amount of weapons this offense could potentially have (Maclin, Jackson, McCoy, Weaver, Celek, Ingram, Avant) is just ridiculous. Now all that they have to do is insure that the guy throwing to these weapons is the right guy. :)

Todd Bertuzzi
03-11-2010, 02:30 PM
Part of me wants to trade Kolb well his value is high.

eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 02:35 PM
The one good thing about hte safety position next year is that our DC (McDermott) was a safety in college, and our "assistant" DC (Jauron) was a Pro Bowl safety in the NFL when he played for Detriot and Cincinnati back in the day.

If anybody should be able to evaluate and train DBs, it's these two guys.



Ingram was supposed to be one of the top TE in last year's draft until the injuries derailed him. If he comes back even at 90%, and lives up to his level of talent, the Eagles could easily have the best TE duo in the NFL.

The amount of weapons this offense could potentially have (Maclin, Jackson, McCoy, Weaver, Celek, Ingram, Avant) is just ridiculous. Now all that they have to do is insure that the guy throwing to these weapons is the right guy. :)
I live 15 minutes from Eagles TC, and make just about every practice I can. Ingram was looking like a potential monster, homerism aside. I saw hundred of balls thrown his way, and I only remember seeing him drop 1. He is HUGE. I remember looking at him among the rest of the team (notice I said team, not receiver) and he was tall. He is so tall, but was very lanky, and hopefully has begun filling out a bit more. His blocking was better than I expected, but I only got to see 2 or 3 drills where he was blocking before he re-injured himself. If he can stay healthy, the Eagles will have a nasty pair of TEs in the future. IDK about the best, because Dallas has a great set of TEs down there, but it will be one of the best if both can remain healthy.

I believe both McNabb and Kolb can/will have success in the offense. The playcalling will need to be adjusted a bit during the transition, but the offense has weapons everywhere.

eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 02:37 PM
Part of me wants to trade Kolb well his value is high.

IDK if Kolb is even worth a first rounder, let alone two of them, but if he is what the coaches feel (the future), we need to keep him. The only way I would trade him is if the team plans on extending McNabb for another 3 or 4 years and the Eagles would get at least a first round pick in return for Kolb, because I too feel he will be successful with the team.

Morton
03-11-2010, 02:43 PM
Part of me wants to trade Kolb well his value is high.

If some idiot GM offers two first rounders for him, you do it in a heartbeat. Two first rounders for a guy originally drafted in the second round?

On the other hand, if they offer a single first rounder, you might be a bit more hesitant, but I personally think that a high first rounder offered for him might still be enticing to you as a GM, especially if it's a high pick and you can get an impact player like Eric Berry with it, AND you realistically think that McNabb still has more than a few years left in the tank.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 04:51 PM
If the Eagles trade Kolb they've really screwed themselves over, I know that a lot of you don't necessarily think Kolb is great, but we have to admit he is good and has the potential to be in the top 1/2 of the NFL as a starter. Kolb is only 26 and at the very least with Kolb at the helm the Eagles have gotten themselves 7-8 more years of stability, Kolb is the future QB of the Eagles. At the very least Kolb has shown he can effectively manage the offense and get it moving and there are no guarantees that the Eagles will find that again in time for McNabb's imminent departure.

There is a reason why Tom Heckert wants him, there is a reason why Jim Harbaugh heaped praise on him, there is a reason Andy Reid isn't trading him, there are reasons why teams across the NFL want Kolb, he is good with the potential to be very good. He is smart, studious and is more accurate than D-Mac, to me McNabb is the playmaker the guy who is going to make plays with athletic ability and Kolb is the guy who is going to be the QB that picks defenses apart not with extended plays by moving around but instead he'll take defense apart using precision and rhythm which is what the WCO is based off of.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 04:52 PM
Oh and the Eagles are hosting Justin Fargas and Hank Baskett tomorrow.

I expect Baskett to sign, what other options does he have?

igglefanz
03-11-2010, 08:28 PM
Well time i guess to give my 2 cents on the issue. Personally I would take what we can get as long as its a good offer for Kolb. What i see in him isn't enough for the eagles to ever win a super bowl with. Once teams get film on him He is just another Derek Anderson. He will give us a good first few years but there is no huge upside with him. May at best get one maybe 2 pro bowls in an injury plagued season for other QB's. The way the league is now you want a superstar and playmaker at QB. Of the final 8 teams 7 had studs at QB and one rookie.

We get what we can for Kolb, bring in a QB this draft as there is a couple of sleepers in early round 3 like Pike or Sneed which i feel can be just as good if not better then kolb in a couple of seasons. Resign Mcnabb for 2-3 years and have him take us as far as we can get. This team is really ready to win now we don't need to have a full season of catchup for Kolb. We are more likely to win a super bowl in the next 2 years with Mcnabb then we ever will with Kolb.

brat316
03-11-2010, 08:42 PM
I was listening to ESPN radio this morning, and Sal said that the Eagles want a first round pick for either qb Kolb or McNabb. And the Eagles usually never back down.


Also most teams feel that the Eagles will drop Vick, and will not pay him 3 million bonus to be the third string qb.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 09:24 PM
There is a rumor going around that the Eagles are going to make a push for Ray Edwards. Edwards was tagged at a first round level and would require the Eagles to surrender the #24 pick. Edwards is 25 years old, he is 6'5" and 265 pounds. Is he worth it? Maybe, he would certainly be a nice addition but I'm not sure he is worth the cost of a first round pick. Although there is a legitimate point that he is better than anything the Eagles could get at #24 at DE. Who would you rather have? Edwards or Everson Griffen? Edwards or Carlos Dunlap? Ray Edwards or Greg Hardy? Those are likely the three options who will be available at #24.

Opinions?

Here is the link btw. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/11/eagles-saints-could-make-a-run-at-ray-edwards/

Bob Grotz of the Delaware County Times recently reported that the Eagles "are expected" to make a run at Minnesota defensive end Ray Edwards. The four-year veteran has been tendered at the first-round level.

Honestly I think that would be a great addition, the only thing is the price, I can't get over giving up the first round pick.

Go_Eagles77
03-11-2010, 09:46 PM
No way would I give up a 1st rounder for Edwards, hell I'd have a hard time giving up a 2nd. Anyone can get 9 1/2 sacks playing on that line.

frubulubu
03-11-2010, 09:47 PM
I was listening to ESPN radio this morning, and Sal said that the Eagles want a first round pick for either qb Kolb or McNabb. And the Eagles usually never back down.


Also most teams feel that the Eagles will drop Vick, and will not pay him 3 million bonus to be the third string qb.

Wouldnt be shocked if the Eagles would be lured by a first this year and a first the following year, for Kolb.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 10:00 PM
Wouldnt be shocked if the Eagles would be lured by a first this year and a first the following year, for Kolb.

Haha the Eagles are asking for the #6 pick and the #14 pick for Kolb, I think its clear they don't want to give him up.

frubulubu
03-11-2010, 10:10 PM
Haha the Eagles are asking for the #6 pick and the #14 pick for Kolb, I think its clear they don't want to give him up.

It sure seems that way. I would be thrilled if Carroll would gave us those picks though. It sure is nice to dream a little.

eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 10:16 PM
There is a rumor going around that the Eagles are going to make a push for Ray Edwards. Edwards was tagged at a first round level and would require the Eagles to surrender the #24 pick. Edwards is 25 years old, he is 6'5" and 265 pounds. Is he worth it? Maybe, he would certainly be a nice addition but I'm not sure he is worth the cost of a first round pick. Although there is a legitimate point that he is better than anything the Eagles could get at #24 at DE. Who would you rather have? Edwards or Everson Griffen? Edwards or Carlos Dunlap? Ray Edwards or Greg Hardy? Those are likely the three options who will be available at #24.

Opinions?

Here is the link btw. http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/03/11/eagles-saints-could-make-a-run-at-ray-edwards/



Honestly I think that would be a great addition, the only thing is the price, I can't get over giving up the first round pick.

IDK, thats honestly a tough one if you ask me. If I knew for sure that Graham would be available, I say no, but after Graham there isn't anyone who I am a big fan of, at least at 24 anyway. I like Ray Eadwards, but not sure I'd give up 24 for him...

frubulubu
03-11-2010, 10:50 PM
Edwards played along the Williams and the Mullet. Im not sure he would produce the same numbers with our d-line. My best guess is no, but thats only a guess. Id rather keep the pick.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 10:52 PM
It sure seems that way. I would be thrilled if Carroll would gave us those picks though. It sure is nice to dream a little.

Even if Carroll did that I doubt the Eagles would pull the trigger, having a nice back-up is great especially given D-Mac's propensity for being injured. And the Eagles aren't dumb, this is likely the last draft where top picks have the rights to whatever money the feel they deserve and the Eagles are one of the most fiscally savvy organizations in the business and I doubt they'll want to be one of the last teams stuck with a monster contact.

Plus who would they take that would infinitely improve the Eagles? The Eagles need a LDE, CB depth, LB depth and maybe an offensive lineman. Who do they take? Is Derrick Morgan and Joe Haden/Anthony Davis worth the money they'll get payed and the future franchise QB? IMO They aren't and I feel like the Eagles could grab similar players later like Greg Hardy and John Jerry or Maurkice Pouncey and Alex Carrington.

eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 11:05 PM
Edwards played along the Williams and the Mullet. Im not sure he would produce the same numbers with our d-line. My best guess is no, but thats only a guess. Id rather keep the pick.

It may drop off, but I'd say only a little. I like Edwards, he plays with good leverage and is another high motor guy.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 11:08 PM
It may drop off, but I'd say only a little. I like Edwards, he plays with good leverage and is another high motor guy.

From what I've heard (Vikings fans) he is an underachiever who doesn't always play the way someone with his physical capabilities should.

eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 11:09 PM
Even if Carroll did that I doubt the Eagles would pull the trigger, having a nice back-up is great especially given D-Mac's propensity for being injured. And the Eagles aren't dumb, this is likely the last draft where top picks have the rights to whatever money the feel they deserve and the Eagles are one of the most fiscally savvy organizations in the business and I doubt they'll want to be one of the last teams stuck with a monster contact.

Plus who would they take that would infinitely improve the Eagles? The Eagles need a LDE, CB depth, LB depth and maybe an offensive lineman. Who do they take? Is Derrick Morgan and Joe Haden/Anthony Davis worth the money they'll get payed and the future franchise QB? IMO They aren't and I feel like the Eagles could grab similar players later like Greg Hardy and John Jerry or Maurkice Pouncey and Alex Carrington.

If we could get Morgan and Davis or McClain or a top FS, I say do it, but there are no guarantees, and it is a big risk going out and doing that. Money wise it may not make as much sense because now yu have to find another potential franchise QB, which will cost more money, but that is the only major drawback to it. But this talk is all a mott point, because no one will give up two first for Kolb, and no one will give up a first either if you ask me, and the Eagles would accept nothing less.

eaglesalltheway
03-11-2010, 11:12 PM
From what I've heard (Vikings fans) he is an underachiever who doesn't always play the way someone with his physical capabilities should.

From watching him, as I sazid, he plys with great leverage, especially in the pass game. He has underachieved through his career, but came on the last two years, with help from the rest of that talented d-line. It seems to me the competition drove him a bit more, and that competition is her in Philly. I've seen him track a RB down running around Allen's corner (the few times that does happen) and gotten in on screen plays. His motor issues come from being tired, which is why the Vikings have rotated players in for him more than the rest of their DL, and the Eagles have the personnel to keep up that rotation.

frubulubu
03-11-2010, 11:21 PM
From what I've heard (Vikings fans) he is an underachiever who doesn't always play the way someone with his physical capabilities should.

According to him, he dosent pay attention while his offense is on the field. My cousin who happens to be a Viking fan also shares the same view in regards to Edwards.

Morton
03-11-2010, 11:30 PM
Ray Edwards is a decent DE who gets alot of free pressures and sacks due to the presence of the Williams brothers and Jared Allen. And even so, he only accumulated 8.0 sacks last year, with 4.0 earned against teams with bad offensive lines (Detriot and Green Bay). He is not an elite talent by any means.

Basically speaking, he wouldn't be much more of an upgrade over Victor Abiamiri or Jacqua Parker. Maybe slightly, but the difference wouldn't be dramatic.

Giving up the #24 pick for him would be a mistake, in my opinion. I'd much rather see the Eagles take a chance on a guy like Brandon Graham or Jerry Hughes, or even Everson Griffen, with that pick.

Morton
03-11-2010, 11:33 PM
Even if Carroll did that I doubt the Eagles would pull the trigger, having a nice back-up is great especially given D-Mac's propensity for being injured. And the Eagles aren't dumb, this is likely the last draft where top picks have the rights to whatever money the feel they deserve and the Eagles are one of the most fiscally savvy organizations in the business and I doubt they'll want to be one of the last teams stuck with a monster contact.

Plus who would they take that would infinitely improve the Eagles? The Eagles need a LDE, CB depth, LB depth and maybe an offensive lineman. Who do they take? Is Derrick Morgan and Joe Haden/Anthony Davis worth the money they'll get payed and the future franchise QB? IMO They aren't and I feel like the Eagles could grab similar players later like Greg Hardy and John Jerry or Maurkice Pouncey and Alex Carrington.

I would do it for maybe one or two players in this draft: If either Gerald McCoy or Eric Berry fall, somehow, and the Eagles are in position to trade for the Seahawk's #6 pick and grab either one, it'd be worth it.

An elite player like McCoy or Berry could totally transform the defense.

Thumper
03-11-2010, 11:44 PM
McCoy is such a terrible fit for this defense, the Eagles run a two gap system which means in short that the defensive tackles are looking to stuff the run first and rushing the passer second. Gerald McCoy lacks the discipline, physical strength and ability to play in a 2 gap scheme, he just doesn't fit. If the Eagles want to draft a DT I really would look at Dan Williams, Terrence Cody or Brian Price, guys who are extremely stout against the run and guys who have the strength to hold up against the run, have the base to stuff the line which is what the scheme calls for. I really would love to see Dan Williams as an Eagle but the liklihood of that happening isn't very high and the sensibility is even lower when you consider the Eagles already have Mike Patterson, Brodrick Bunkley, Antonio Dixon (who IMO is going to be the best DT on the Eagles) and Trevor Laws.

Antonio Dixon is a monster, when he went in against Dallas I really noticed him, he has the base to hold up against the run better than any Eagles DT and he has the strength and power to push the pocket after he is sure there is no run. Personally I really think Dixon should be a starter on this defense within the next 2-3 seasons. He is a beast of a DT who really fits what the Eagles like to do on defense with their tackles.

Eric Berry would be nice, but... the Eagles already have 3 FS/CB players and I doubt they will want a 4th, sure he is better than all of them but why upgrade that spot when you could make a bigger improvement at say LE, OL or LB? Personally I really have a lot of faith in Marlin Jackson and Macho Harris, Harris gets bashed on a lot for his performance at Denver but outside of that game he was actually pretty solid, especially when you consider that he was still learning the FS spot, he was a 5th round draft pick and that he was playing 2 spots on a complex Eagles defense. I think the Eagles have something in Macho, he is physical and plays with a TON of fire.

frubulubu
03-12-2010, 12:19 AM
I have to ride Thumper coat tail on this one, lol. McCoy, would not fit the bill for what we run on D lineman. Cody is a player that intrigues me, and would love to see big guy play for us. Berry, however, would be excellent pick.

eaglesalltheway
03-12-2010, 06:49 AM
McCoy would be a great UT for us. Our in our defense, only the NT has repsonsibilities for more than one gap, and that's Bunk. Its not like McCoy sucks at run stopping either, he is pretty damn good there, and would fit in perfect as the UT next to Bunk. IDK where you get the idea that both our DTs are responsible for two gaps on a consistent basis. There are plays where you will find it looking over games, (certain blitzes, and some zone plays where our DEs drop into coverage) but for the most part the UT has responsibilites for only one gap. Not to mention McCoy can bring that extra pass rush from the front 4 that we want. McCoy would be a monster in our defense, and fits pretty well honestly. Ifthe Eagles had a reasonable way to get him, I'd be all for it.

Morton
03-12-2010, 10:46 AM
Thumper: OK, maybe you're right about McCoy, BUT regardless of how many free safeties or cornerbacks you have, if you have the chance to take a once-in-a-decade kind of talent like Eric Berry who could take your defense to the next level, you JUMP on it.

Again, I would be willing to trade Kevin Kolb for a single draft pick if and only if you can get a sure-fire impact player (or as close to as possible) like Eric Berry.

Even when the Titans had a few solid running backs already, they drafted Chris Johnson because his talent just blew them away. How'd that work out for them?

You simply must take elite talent if it's available, even if it's not a position of need for you at the time. That's how good teams turn into dynasties.

eaglesalltheway
03-12-2010, 01:26 PM
Thumper: OK, maybe you're right about McCoy, BUT regardless of how many free safeties or cornerbacks you have, if you have the chance to take a once-in-a-decade kind of talent like Eric Berry who could take your defense to the next level, you JUMP on it.

Again, I would be willing to trade Kevin Kolb for a single draft pick if and only if you can get a sure-fire impact player (or as close to as possible) like Eric Berry.

Even when the Titans had a few solid running backs already, they drafted Chris Johnson because his talent just blew them away. How'd that work out for them?

You simply must take elite talent if it's available, even if it's not a position of need for you at the time. That's how good teams turn into dynasties.

I defintiely agree with this, unless you already have an elite player at the position already.

Todd Bertuzzi
03-12-2010, 02:33 PM
You all highly overrate Kolb.

eaglesalltheway
03-12-2010, 02:38 PM
You all highly overrate Kolb.

Is Kolb worth a first rounder? I say no, but if some team is willing to trade a first roundr for him, I say it would be a good deal if the Eagles could get that impact player on Defense. I think Kolb will be a good QB, just not as good as McNabb.

Sniper
03-12-2010, 02:55 PM
You all highly overrate Kolb.

HE IS TEH ROXORZZZZZ FIRST EVERZ QBZ TO THROWZZZZZZZ 300 YARDZZZZZ FIRST TWO GAMEZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!! awesomeness KOLB WOO!

Thumper
03-12-2010, 03:41 PM
HE IS TEH ROXORZZZZZ FIRST EVERZ QBZ TO THROWZZZZZZZ 300 YARDZZZZZ FIRST TWO GAMEZZZZZZZZZ!!!!!!!!!! awesomeness KOLB WOO!

You contribute so much to these conversations...

Sniper
03-12-2010, 03:57 PM
You contribute so much to these conversations...

EVERZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

We can't all contribute as much as you. What with the daily "McNabb sucks", "KOLBZ IS BETTER THAN TOM BRADYZZZZ", and other useless posts. It's pretty tough to get on your level.

Thumper
03-12-2010, 03:58 PM
Thumper: OK, maybe you're right about McCoy, BUT regardless of how many free safeties or cornerbacks you have, if you have the chance to take a once-in-a-decade kind of talent like Eric Berry who could take your defense to the next level, you JUMP on it.

Again, I would be willing to trade Kevin Kolb for a single draft pick if and only if you can get a sure-fire impact player (or as close to as possible) like Eric Berry.

Even when the Titans had a few solid running backs already, they drafted Chris Johnson because his talent just blew them away. How'd that work out for them?

You simply must take elite talent if it's available, even if it's not a position of need for you at the time. That's how good teams turn into dynasties.

Okay, that all sounds nice in theory, take the BPA and develop into a dynasty, great... if only things were that simple. See now you've stacked one spot with 4 similar players if you take Eric Berry, now you've got Marlin Jackson, Macho Harris and Quintin Demps (who are 26, 24 and 24) sitting on the bench wasting away. And sure now you've got amazing depth at FS and potentially an elite FS but you're still left with a gaping hole at LE when you could've taken Derrick Morgan or Jason Paul-Pierre. So what combo do you want? Derrick Morgan & Marlin Jackson or Victor Abiamiri & Eric Berry? In my mind, I'm taking Morgan and Jackson.

Yes I realize this is all irrelevant to the Eagles but this could develop into a nice discussion about drafting theory.

Thumper
03-12-2010, 04:05 PM
EVERZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

We can't all contribute as much as you. What with the daily "McNabb sucks", "KOLBZ IS BETTER THAN TOM BRADYZZZZ", and other useless posts. It's pretty tough to get on your level.

Daily? You might want to look the definition of daily up. And McNabb sucks? I was on this bandwagon for about 2 weeks after the Dallas loss, McNabb is the guy the Eagles should stick with if they're committed to winning now and I've said that often over the course of the past month or so. If the Eagles want to start building for the future then Kolb is the guy who should get the playing time. And I dare you to find me a post where I said Kolb is better than Tom Brady, you can't do it.

Once again, thanks for contributing so much to these discussions now can you please take your pointless homerism, your stupid rants and your zzzz elsewhere? You never contribute anything conducive to discussion.

Quick Synopsis of all Sniper's posts: "ZOMGZZ THIS GUY ROCKZZ", "Can you write in English", "Michigan rulezz", "ZOMGZZ THIS GUY SUCKZZ" or "YOU SUCK".

brat316
03-12-2010, 04:52 PM
Is Kolb worth a first rounder? I say no, but if some team is willing to trade a first roundr for him, I say it would be a good deal if the Eagles could get that impact player on Defense. I think Kolb will be a good QB, just not as good as McNabb.

But the problem is no team is willing to trade a first for him. The Eagles and Thumper highly overrate Kolb's trade value.

eaglesalltheway
03-12-2010, 08:15 PM
But the problem is no team is willing to trade a first for him. The Eagles and Thumper highly overrate Kolb's trade value.

The Eagles are asking a lot yes, but as I've said before, they don't expect a team to trade a first rounder, especially two. By asking for two first rounders they are essentially saying, "We want him, stay away."

eaglesalltheway
03-12-2010, 08:17 PM
Okay, that all sounds nice in theory, take the BPA and develop into a dynasty, great... if only things were that simple. See now you've stacked one spot with 4 similar players if you take Eric Berry, now you've got Marlin Jackson, Macho Harris and Quintin Demps (who are 26, 24 and 24) sitting on the bench wasting away. And sure now you've got amazing depth at FS and potentially an elite FS but you're still left with a gaping hole at LE when you could've taken Derrick Morgan or Jason Paul-Pierre. So what combo do you want? Derrick Morgan & Marlin Jackson or Victor Abiamiri & Eric Berry? In my mind, I'm taking Morgan and Jackson.

Yes I realize this is all irrelevant to the Eagles but this could develop into a nice discussion about drafting theory.

Honestly, I'd rather have Berry and Abiamiri. Keep in mind their are other DEs in this draft who we could get that would contribute, and we know Macho and Demps could play some corner, would add some depth there to ease the logjam at FS, but most likely at least one, if not both would be released or traded on draft day.

brat316
03-12-2010, 08:58 PM
Seriously Abiamiri hasn't been healthy at all and even when he is he doesn't make much of an impact.

He is Jerome McDougal but not first round pick, and McDougal made more of an impact when healthy.

frubulubu
03-12-2010, 09:06 PM
Seriously Abiamiri hasn't been healthy at all and even when he is he doesn't make much of an impact.

He is Jerome McDougal but not first round pick, and McDougal made more of an impact when healthy.

With the hit he gave Eli in his rookie year, he was well worth the first round pick.

Sniper
03-12-2010, 09:30 PM
Quick Synopsis of all Sniper's posts: "ZOMGZZ THIS GUY ROCKZZ", "Can you write in English", "Michigan rulezz", "ZOMGZZ THIS GUY SUCKZZ" or "YOU SUCK".

You forgot P.K ************* SUBBANZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!

eaglesalltheway
03-12-2010, 10:48 PM
Seriously Abiamiri hasn't been healthy at all and even when he is he doesn't make much of an impact.

He is Jerome McDougal but not first round pick, and McDougal made more of an impact when healthy.

in this instance, its more on my opinion about the FSs. I believe Berry is THAT good, and Jackson scares me with his injuries.

Thumper
03-13-2010, 03:08 PM
Winston Justice and Quintin Demps just took a huge jump up the my favorite Eagles list.

http://www.courierpostonline.com/article/20100313/NEWS01/3130340/1006/news01

Morton
03-13-2010, 10:16 PM
I just re-watched the Brandon Graham highlight reel on youtube, and I came away even more impressed than when I first saw it a few months ago. I think alot of people are so impressed by Brandon's pass-rushing abilities that they overlook just how great he is against the run. I mean, watching that video you see that kid dropping RBs in the backfield so consistently it's scary. It's like he *lives* in the opponent's backfield.

"With the 24th pick in the 2010 NFL Draft, the Philadelphia Eagles select... Brandon Graham"

Please please please make it happen, Draft Gods!

Thumper
03-13-2010, 10:27 PM
I just re-watched the Brandon Graham highlight reel on youtube, and I came away even more impressed than when I first saw it a few months ago. I think alot of people are so impressed by Brandon's pass-rushing abilities that they overlook just how great he is against the run. I mean, watching that video you see that kid dropping RBs in the backfield so consistently it's scary. It's like he *lives* in the opponent's backfield.

"With the 24th pick in the 2010 NFL Draft, the Philadelphia Eagles select... Brandon Graham"

Please please please make it happen, Draft Gods!

And... the draft gods deny your request.

Daniel Jeremiah a former NFL scout has said that three teams he talked to actually have Graham over Morgan. Keep in mind that means that at least three have him over Morgan. If Graham makes it past the Jaguars, Dolphins, 49ers, Seahawks, Titans, Falcons and Bengals there is absolutely no way I can see the New England Patriots passing him up.

Brandon Graham won't be an Eagle, its all a pipe dream now, I'd set my sights on Everson Griffen or Carlos Dunlap, neither of whom are even within 5 bajillion levels of Brandon Graham's level.

Sergio Kindle plz, SLB on 1st/2nd and DE on 3rd down.

Morton
03-13-2010, 11:21 PM
Dammit.

He's probably going to the Jaguars, Titans, or Falcons, right?

Maybe the Eagles can trade up or something. Anyway, I might be happy with Derrick Morgan or Everson Griffen, but PLEASE NO CARLOS DUNLAP. If I see them draft Dunlap I'm going to punch somebody.

brat316
03-13-2010, 11:25 PM
Dunlap is garbage.

frubulubu
03-13-2010, 11:30 PM
Dunlap is garbage.

Amen...Amen!

Morton
03-13-2010, 11:42 PM
Carlos Dunlap might work hard in the NFL and turn out to be decent one day, but at this point, he's simply not worth a first round pick. Maybe a second or third rounder, as a project pick, but no way in the first round. If a team picks him in the first, they're stupid.

Also, I wouldn't be entirely upset if the Eagles picked Jerry Hughes at #24 if Brandon Graham is off the board. He's kind of undersized to be an end, and projects better as a 3-4 OLB, but he could probably bulk up and play DE like Trent Cole.

So to recap, in the first round I want: Brandon Graham, and if he's off the board, I would be happy with Jerry Hughes, and if he's off the board, I wouldn't mind Everson Griffen or Derrick Morgan. If they're off the board, and so are Earl Thomas, Sean Weatherspoon, and Mike Iupati, trade down.

Thumper
03-13-2010, 11:57 PM
Dunlap is a pile of crap, I've been saying that ever since July. If the Eagles draft him I will flip a ***** and stuff might go flying, the front office might get a congratulatory cake laced with cyanide (like Andy would let them pass a cake up) or I might just sit there and pray that Dunlap turns into a decent DE and just hope he fills his potential. Right now he is worse than Jamaal Anderson, at least Anderson is effective against the run.

As much as I love Jerry Hughes, he isn't going to be the Eagles LE. Would I mind? Nope, but Andy Reid won't make the call especially in a run heavy division like the NFC East.

Right now if Graham and Kindle are off the board I want the Eagles to trade into the second round and just grab an extra few 2nds and 3rds. And then draft Kareem Jackson and Alex Carrington.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 12:07 AM
Profootballweekly draft magazine, states that, Bunk and Patterson are mediocore. Im i the only one that disagrees with these people?

Morton
03-14-2010, 12:10 AM
They're slightly above average at best. They're pretty solid at stopping the run, but they rarely get penetration into the backfield.

I dunno, I think Bunkley would be really solid if they could upgrade Patterson with somebody like a Gerald McCoy type.

Also, I think both of them would be better if they had a stud LDE, then they wouldn't have to worry so much about collapsing the pocket if both DEs could apply pressue instead of just one.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 12:40 AM
Profootballweekly draft magazine, states that, Bunk and Patterson are mediocore. Im i the only one that disagrees with these people?

Mediocre? Hardly, they're the second best DT combination in the entire NFL. People like to bag on them because they don't collapse the pocket but what people need to realize is that rushing the passer isn't what they're being told to do. Bunkley and Patterson are told to stop the run, they're in charge of two gaps just like 3-4 NTs and they're supposed to look to stop the run before they rush the passer.

Whoever writes that magazine needs to think about what they're writing, ever since Bunkley and Patterson have started together they only allow 97.6 yards per game on the ground, 5th in the NFL since they started together in 2007 and they hold runners to a 3.7 YPC average. Compare that to what the Eagles had going with Darwin Walker and Corey Simon (24th in the league from 1996-2006, 120.1 YPC and a 4.1 YPC average). Yeah, I'd say Bunk and Patterson are above average.

Morton
03-14-2010, 12:44 AM
But you do agree they could use an upgrade over Patterson within the next 1-2 years, right?

Thumper
03-14-2010, 12:50 AM
But you do agree they could use an upgrade over Patterson within the next 1-2 years, right?

Could he be upgraded? Sure he could, just about anyone in the NFL could be upgraded but why upgrade Mike Patterson when the defense has been so effective with him at DT? He does his job well.

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/cover-3/2009/cover-3-rise-underrated-part-1
In his fourth NFL season, Eagles tackle Mike Patterson isn't within shouting distance of the "Baby Sapp" nickname he used to carry at USC. Now, he's more about the physical battle inside than the marquee moments he had in college. When I asked Mike Tanier for the name of an underrated Philadelphia defender, Patterson's was the first that came through my Inbox. Mike said that Patterson had played at a near-Pro Bowl level all season, so I thought it was time to break out the microscope and get to work. Adam Caplan of Scout.com and SIRIUS NFL Radio classified Patterson as "a wide-bodied player who has become more of a physical run defender on Philadelphia's front-four. He'll never be classified as an impact player, but he's been very consistent on running downs. He's a durable defensive lineman who should have many solid years to come."

The Eagles will ask Patterson and fellow starting tackle Brodrick Bunkley (who impressed me more than Patterson last season during the Eagles' playoff run) to man up against different linemen -- there's less of the static "0/1-tech/3-tech" packages you see with some other 4-3 fronts. The first thing I noticed about Patterson was his ability to shake off a double team and get back in the play. He first did this on a six-yard Frank Gore run with 10:28 left in the first quarter. Right guard Chilo Rachal and right tackle Adam Snyder pinched inside to blow Patterson out of the A-gap and give Gore room to run. But Patterson sifted through the blocks and helped take Gore down. He seems to have a better ability to deal with man-on-man power situations than Bunkley, who was frequently overwhelmed by center Eric Heitmann when Bunkley was lined up over the ball. On the next play, it was the focus on Patterson, and Vernon Davis' release against an over front (strong-side alignment) that allowed end Juqua Parker to blast through, unobstructed, and bat Alex Smith's pass down.

The Eagles adapted to the 49ers' frequent shotgun snaps with wide fronts and different pressure concepts. Parker's deflection left San Francisco with third-and-4 at the Philly 33. Now, Patterson stunted to the right at the snap while Bunkley took the double-team up top, and got to Smith quickly enough to cause an early throw and end the drive.

Later in the first quarter, Patterson finally got to have some fun. After a 12-yard Gore run with 5:45 left (this was another double on Patterson -- the 49ers were countering Philly's wider defensive line splits with blocking schemes designed to move a tackle one way, and the accompanying linebacker the other), there was a double-team inside, so Gore took it outside and was tackled by Parker for a one-yard gain. On the next play, Patterson found himself in the moment every interior lineman lives for after all that extra attention: On second-and-9 from the San Francisco 40, the Niners tried Gore up the middle and Rachal single-blocking Patterson. Not a good idea, as Patterson simply wedged his way inside, pulled off Rachal, and stopped the play for no gain.

The first part of being impressed by constant double-teams on a tackle is the constant double-team concept itself. The second part is watching what happens in single-blocking situations. I learned this when I wrote about Ndamukong Suh two weeks ago, and I pitied the poor quarterback whenever some joker called for a scheme that didn't have anywhere from two to eight people directly on Suh at all times.

Patterson started the second half with a bang, displaying his ability to mess things up at the point for any rushing attack. With first-and-10 at the Eagles' 43, he simply blew through the Rachal/Snyder double-team and stopped Gore for a loss of one yard. On Gore's next run, he peeled off Rachal again and limited Gore to a two-yard gain. Both Bunkley and Patterson seem most effective as gap-fill tackles as opposed to the kind who will take a head-on approach and either bull through or slide off a block (Shaun Rogers' specialty in Cleveland). In this game, Patterson found more and more success filling the right B-gap and either splitting the double or shading the guard and exploiting the mismatch. If they take double-teams straight on, it's more likely to be one way, intentional or not, to gum up blockers and get other defenders involved.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 08:27 AM
"Philly has drafted well the past two years. In '08, they traded out of first and still landed WR Desean Jackson (49th overall). Last year they got another dangerous WR in Jeremy Maclin(19th overall) and landed Brian Westbrook's heir apparent, LeSean McCoy, in the second. It made up for a run of weak picks, including DE Jerome McDougle, injury prone G Shawn Andrews and mediocre DTs Brodrick Bunkley and Mike Patterson.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 08:32 AM
Thats the article on Profootball Draft. The whole magazine is a train wreck. It also says that Peters should move inside and draft and should draft a LT.

brat316
03-14-2010, 10:21 AM
I think Patterson was much better when he played at a lower weight. Now that he has bulked up either because he was told to or just happened naturally. He isn't the same type of player he was in college or his rookie year, or even part of his second year.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 12:56 PM
Thats the article on Profootball Draft. The whole magazine is a train wreck. It also says that Peters should move inside and draft and should draft a LT.

That is just stupid, he actually played well at LT IMO. He has mental lapses and thats when he lets sacks go (he only allowed 6) but when he was on, he was nearly unbeatable off the edge, just look at the Dallas games he shut DeMarcus Ware down for 2 games, completely dominating him the first time even while Jason Peters had an injured ankle. Not to mention, Jason Peters was a man amongst boys in the run game and he was a beast in the screen game. Personally I really like Jason Peters and I think him and Todd Herramens are going to be one of the best left sides in football for a few years to come.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 09:24 PM
I like Peters too, and cant wait to see him in action in his second year in a green, uni. This magazine was a complete waste of money. They also had K. Moreno, of the Broncos as a mediocre rookie back.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 09:26 PM
I like Peters too, and cant wait to see him in action in his second year in a green, uni. This magazine was a complete waste of money. They also had K. Moreno, of the Broncos as a mediocre rookie back.

That is 100% accurate, Moreno was SUPER mediocre last season.

Go_Eagles77
03-14-2010, 09:27 PM
To be honest, Moreno was pretty average last season, he was vastly outperformed by Buckhalter. I LOVED Moreno prior to the draft too, wanted him on the eagles bad.

Edit: Thumper beat me to it.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 09:32 PM
Dont want to start any mediocre thread, but I believe he led the rookies in rushing, although I can be wrong.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 09:34 PM
To be honest, Moreno was pretty average last season, he was vastly outperformed by Buckhalter. I LOVED Moreno prior to the draft too, wanted him on the eagles bad.

Edit: Thumper beat me to it.

I left the room for a while and missed a few picks and I was super mad the Broncos took him, I think the quote was "Stupid Broncos, why are you screwing up the Eagles draft, you already have a freaking stable of runners, you signed like 5... Josh McDaniels you're an idiot and I hate you."

Thumper
03-14-2010, 09:35 PM
Dont want to start any mediocre thread, but I believe he led the rookies in rushing, although I can be wrong.

Yeah he did but he averaged 3.8 yards a carry and LeSean McCoy, Beanie Wells and Donald Brown were all more effective when given the chance.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 09:47 PM
Not to mention the hype he had coming out of college, right?

Morton
03-14-2010, 09:47 PM
Dammit, this sucks.

There's no way in hell the Eagles can possibly get Brandon Graham now. Everyone's saying he's getting picked in the top 15 for sure now, because teams have him graded ahead of Derrick Morgan.

Lame.

Go_Eagles77
03-14-2010, 09:51 PM
While I think DE is our #1 need, I would take Sean Weatherspoon or Kyle Wilson over any DE we have a reasonable shot at with our pick.

superman8456
03-14-2010, 09:52 PM
Give us Derrick Morgan then.

He ran train on Bryan Bulaga, and he is supposed to be some top 3 tackle in this class. I'll happily welcome him.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 09:53 PM
We can always trade up , Mort.

Morton
03-14-2010, 09:56 PM
Morgan's probably going to be gone by #24 also.

Morgan, Pierre-Paul, and Graham will all be gone by #24 for sure. The only ones left will be Dunlap, Griffen, and some other scrubs. The last thing I want to see is Andy reach for a scrub DE if the good ones are gone, so like other people said, they need to draft the best player available at that point - if it's Kyle Wilson or a linebacker like Sean Weatherspoon, or a safety that falls like Earl Thomas.

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 10:02 PM
I would be happy with my man, Wilson.

brat316
03-14-2010, 10:21 PM
Grifffen seems like a good player.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 10:29 PM
Right now based on my latest mock, JPP, Morgan, Graham, McClain, Weatherspoon, Wilson, Thomas and Jerry Hughes are all gone by pick #24. I'm going with Kindle to the Eagles and that is assuming he makes it to the Eagles after the Dolphins, 49ers (2x) and Patriots get off the clock and that isn't even guaranteed.

I don't think the draft stacks up well for the Eagles, where the Eagles are picking I think that WR, RB, TE, Interior Offensive line and DT are the strongest spots, all spots that don't need to be upgraded. No need for Williams or Tate because of Jackson and Maclin, no need for Matthews or Best because of McCoy, no need for Gresham because of Celek and Ingram, interior offensive line has a ton of money invested in it already so I doubt Iupati or Pouncey is the pick and there is no need for Price or Cody because of Patterson, Bunkley, Dixon and Laws.

Right now if no front 7 players drop to the Eagles I'm looking right at Kareem Jackson who is the best fit for the Eagles scheme if Kyle Wilson is off the board.

eaglesalltheway
03-14-2010, 10:29 PM
I like Griffin, not nearly as much as Graham or Morgan, but if he was the pick I would be content with it, though I agree I'd rather have Weathersoon or Thomas, or maybe even a CB if they are available.

Go_Eagles77
03-14-2010, 10:40 PM
If all the big guys are off the board, I would love for the eagles to trade back and get a bunch of solid to good players in the 2nd - 4th rounds which have excellent value this year.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 10:41 PM
Grifffen seems like a good player.

Ehh I guess he is good, he is a freak in terms of measurables and has potential that is sky high but the mental aspect of the game isn't there, he doesn't have gap discipline against the run at all. He is strong in terms of weight room strength but on the field he plays like he is 230 pounds, he doesn't hold his ground against the run and he is purely a finesse pass rusher, and a streaky one at that, his jump off of the snap can be great but it is also inconsistent. That and everyone at USC who scouts have talked to question his motivation and wonder whether he will do the small things. And his motor is so hot and cold.

Thumper
03-14-2010, 10:42 PM
If all the big guys are off the board, I would love for the eagles to trade back and get a bunch of solid to good players in the 2nd - 4th rounds which have excellent value this year.

Agree 100%

frubulubu
03-14-2010, 10:47 PM
What about Wimbley going to the Raiders, today for a third. Should the Eagles made a move?

Thumper
03-14-2010, 10:55 PM
What about Wimbley going to the Raiders, today for a third. Should the Eagles made a move?

Nope, Chris Clemons is better than him.

eaglesalltheway
03-14-2010, 10:55 PM
If all the big guys are off the board, I would love for the eagles to trade back and get a bunch of solid to good players in the 2nd - 4th rounds which have excellent value this year.

This isn't directed specifically towards you, I'm just having a mini-rant here...

I don't understand why everyone always says we should trade down "if _____ isn't there". Its been going on for the last few seasons and though there have been cases where it worked out, we can't rely on it too much. There really isn't that much room for any rookies to make a significant impact onthis roster, with those spots being at second RB, third TE, OL depth, LE (maybe additional DE depth as well), OLB, maybe FS, CB, and maybe P. In many cases it will make sense to do so, but with very little true needs, we would just end up having wasted picks. When the Eagles have traded down in recent years, they seem like they try to minimize the later round picks in the current draft, simply becuase they don't have many needs, and the needs they do have aren't pressing With the extra picks we have for this draft, I can see the Eagles trading up a little more easily than I can see them trading down. People, most likely thumper, will bring up how the Eagles won't want to be one of the last teams to overpay for a rookie, but let me say this... In recent history, when the Eagles truly want a player, they have shown they are not afraid to pull the trigger. Now I can see the Eagles trading down this draft as well, if the players that we expect to be gone are gone, but remember this time last year... who thought we'd even have a shot at drafting Maclin? I know I didn't, as was the case with most of us Eagles fans, and the whole board. If the Eagles do trade down, expect the Eagles to continue the tradition of stockpiling picks in future drafts moreso than accepting later picks in this draft. And that is because the Eagles know they don't really have the room for all these extra late round guys whose chances of making the roster are minimal.

eaglesalltheway
03-14-2010, 10:56 PM
What about Wimbley going to the Raiders, today for a third. Should the Eagles made a move?

No, Wimbley isn't worth a third IMO, and isn't a good fit for our Defense.

Morton
03-14-2010, 11:34 PM
No way ALL of the DEs like Jerry Hughes, JPP, Morgan, Graham, and Griffen will be gone by #24. At least one or two will slip into that spot, imho.

But if that's a problem, why can't the Eagles move UP in the draft this year? They have like 3 third round picks they can package for a move up the board, right?

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 01:32 PM
No way ALL of the DEs like Jerry Hughes, JPP, Morgan, Graham, and Griffen will be gone by #24. At least one or two will slip into that spot, imho.

But if that's a problem, why can't the Eagles move UP in the draft this year? They have like 3 third round picks they can package for a move up the board, right?

Thats what I was saying earlier, we allknow the Eagles will move up if they feel they have to.

superman8456
03-15-2010, 04:39 PM
Is safety not a position of need anymore with the signing of Marlin Jackson?

I wouldn't be surprised with either Ryan Matthews or Nate Allen. I wouldn't mind Kareem Jackson either.

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 07:55 PM
Is safety not a position of need anymore with the signing of Marlin Jackson?

I wouldn't be surprised with either Ryan Matthews or Nate Allen. I wouldn't mind Kareem Jackson either.

I personally am not comfortable at FS right now, simply because we don't know how healthy Jackson's knees are. If the team feels he will be healthy, and stay healthy, it shouldn't be a major need at all.

frubulubu
03-15-2010, 08:25 PM
The health of Marlin Jackson and if he can play safety, are issues.

Thumper
03-15-2010, 08:30 PM
The health of Marlin Jackson and if he can play safety, are issues.

He has played safety for long stretches of his career, his junior year at Michigan and 2006 in the NFL.

frubulubu
03-15-2010, 08:34 PM
Eagles kicking the tires on RFA Mike Bell.

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 11:09 PM
Eagles kicking the tires on RFA Mike Bell.

If the Eagles would get any free agent, restricted or not, I want it to be Thomas Jones. I'm not a big fan of replacing an old back with another old back, but he has the skill set to be a weapon in our offense and is a more powerful, stright ahead RB than Shady is right now. Honestly though, I'd almost rather get a younger RB in the draft.

Thumper
03-15-2010, 11:18 PM
If the Eagles would get any free agent, restricted or not, I want it to be Thomas Jones. I'm not a big fan of replacing an old back with another old back, but he has the skill set to be a weapon in our offense and is a more powerful, stright ahead RB than Shady is right now. Honestly though, I'd almost rather get a younger RB in the draft.

The chiefs signed Thomas Jones

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 11:19 PM
The chiefs signed Thomas Jones

When, I was just at my buddies house for about 4 hours, I assume it was then...

Thumper
03-15-2010, 11:22 PM
When, I was just at my buddies house for about 4 hours, I assume it was then...

like a week ago
http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/sports/professional/professional_football/article/NFLN10_20100309-223205/329425/

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 11:24 PM
like a week ago
http://www2.timesdispatch.com/rtd/sports/professional/professional_football/article/NFLN10_20100309-223205/329425/

*Facepalm myself*...

B-Dawk
03-15-2010, 11:25 PM
i like the thought of a vet rb rather than a rookie, and bell is a good hard nose runner

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 11:37 PM
i like the thought of a vet rb rather than a rookie, and bell is a good hard nose runner

It depends who the RB is. I like this draft for "change of pace" backs for us. There are some bigger backs in this draft who fit our offense well, though I must say Bell wouldn't be a bad idea. What is the compensation for Bell?

Edit: no compensation is worth a shot defintiely

brat316
03-15-2010, 11:38 PM
He has played safety for long stretches of his career, his junior year at Michigan and 2006 in the NFL.

Man those are long stretches in his career 2 years out of what 8,9 years.

eaglesalltheway
03-15-2010, 11:40 PM
Man those are long stretches in his career 2 years out of what 8,9 years.

Not to mention that season with the Colts he only started ~6 games...

I'm honestly not worried about Jackson making the transition to FS, he has the mentality and the playing style, and is a smart enough player to pick it up. My concerns with him are roughly half way between the ground and his waist.

frubulubu
03-16-2010, 07:50 AM
It depends who the RB is. I like this draft for "change of pace" backs for us. There are some bigger backs in this draft who fit our offense well, though I must say Bell wouldn't be a bad idea. What is the compensation for Bell?

Edit: no compensation is worth a shot defintiely

Bell was tendered at the lowest level. There is no compensation for the Saints. However, they get the chance to match the offer if they wish.

Morton
03-16-2010, 11:01 AM
Marlin Jackson was purely a risk/reward type of signing. If he pans out and plays, great, if he doesn't they're NOT counting on him to.

Chances of him playing a full season effectively are about 10-15% or so. That's why they gave him a short term contract loaded with incentives.

They still need to sort out the safety position. The quesiton is: are they comfortable letting Demps, Harris, and Jackson fighting for the starter's job, or are they going to throw another guy into the mix and go after a safety in the draft?

eaglesalltheway
03-16-2010, 12:28 PM
Bell was tendered at the lowest level. There is no compensation for the Saints. However, they get the chance to match the offer if they wish.I realize dthat after I posted it, which is why I put the "edit" in there, lol

Marlin Jackson was purely a risk/reward type of signing. If he pans out and plays, great, if he doesn't they're NOT counting on him to.

Chances of him playing a full season effectively are about 10-15% or so. That's why they gave him a short term contract loaded with incentives.

They still need to sort out the safety position. The quesiton is: are they comfortable letting Demps, Harris, and Jackson fighting for the starter's job, or are they going to throw another guy into the mix and go after a safety in the draft?

It depends on who is available. If Earl Thomas is somehow available at 24, the team may draft him (depending on who else is available) and try any of the three backup FSs at CB, which all are capable of playing, If that would be the case, expect one or two of the backup FSs to be cut.

Thumper
03-16-2010, 03:48 PM
Mike Bell will be an Eagle, according to Jeff McClane (worked with the Eagles last year in FO, now is a writer for NFP) the Eagles are currently negotiating a contact and he might be signed by tonight.

EDIT: And now he has been signed to an offer sheet according to Adam Schefter (who gets this from Bell's agent) the deal is a one year, $1.7 million offer sheet with Eagles. The Saints have 7 days to match.

Morton
03-16-2010, 04:43 PM
Looks like the Eagles won't be drafting a running back this year.

I was kind of hoping for a Toby Gerhart / Ben Tate pick in the 3rd round, but ah well.

brat316
03-16-2010, 05:00 PM
It would be stupid not to draft a running back this year, when you have might get a vet for 1 year. Hardest thing for rookies to do his pick up the blitz, why not let them learn for a year.

frubulubu
03-16-2010, 08:27 PM
Hello Mr. Tapp, goodbye Mr. Clemons.

superman8456
03-16-2010, 08:48 PM
I'm extremely confused by the whole Tapp ordeal.

My first question is: Why? We have a RDE in Trent Cole. He should not and will not be moving. Are they going to move Tapp to LDE? This just seems like a good idea in adding a solid player to the rotation, but unnecessary because I want Trent Cole getting as many snaps as possible.

The deal was a little hefty as well. Chris Clemons (I kind of liked him, dont quite know why) and a 4th. We have two 4ths, so not a big deal, but still.

frubulubu
03-16-2010, 08:54 PM
I'm extremely confused by the whole Tapp ordeal.

My first question is: Why? We have a RDE in Trent Cole. He should not and will not be moving. Are they going to move Tapp to LDE? This just seems like a good idea in adding a solid player to the rotation, but unnecessary because I want Trent Cole getting as many snaps as possible.

The deal was a little hefty as well. Chris Clemons (I kind of liked him, dont quite know why) and a 4th. We have two 4ths, so not a big deal, but still.

Does this mean we arent drafting end, in the first?

Thumper
03-16-2010, 08:57 PM
Darryl Tapp is a good player, he is a 3 down end who can play LE and RE as well as the joker spot on occasion. He is 6'1" and 270 pounds so there is not a problem with him size wise.

I hate citing Profootballfocus but I think that I'm going to here, he ranked 17th overall for defensive ends. He only got 2 sacks which isn't good but he also had 15 QB hits and 13 hurries from his spot. He graded out 4th overall against the run, so he is a good run stuffer.

here is an old scouting report from cbs.com:
Positives: Built for power, showing a low center of gravity, above average upper body muscle tone, thick legs, tight abdomen and fluid lateral agility … Comes off the ball with an explosive burst, gaining instant penetration, especially when he uses his hands to disengage … Has an instinctive feel for the game and can read on the run and make proper adjustments … Flashes the strength to stack and shed and rarely loses containment, despite his lack of size … plays with leverage, using his hands to control and neutralize the double teams … Can defeat the block with quickness and has the feet to disengage … Will never give up on the play, showing the change of direction agility and lateral range to string plays wide … Hits with a thud and is a secure tackler who does a good job of keeping his pads low … Has exceptional pass rush moves, as he is active with his hands to counter inside and has a spin move to slip past slower offensive tackles.

Negatives: Lacks ideal height and bulk, but has just a little more room to add weight … Has a fine short area burst, but will lose mirror on the receiver if he has to cover long distances (will not win foot races into the deep secondary) … When he fails to use his hands to control, he is quickly engulfed and neutralized … Best playing along the line, as his height issues cause him to struggle some locating the ball when dropping off in zone coverage … Can play off the edge, but does not have the size to be effective plugging holes when working in-line.

Tapp is an undersized defensive end, but has a defined upper body with thick muscles, tight waist and hips, good abdomen definition, thick thighs and calves, low body fat and the potential to carry at least another ten pounds of bulk. Unlike most undersized edge rushers, Tapp is very capable of holding his ground at the point of attack. He is a high-energy type who has the ability to get off the ball and get instant penetration.

Tapp is a quick-twitch athlete whose above average hand usage allows him to disengage and shed and still close on the ball immediately. For a player of his size, he generates very good strength and leverage to run over the slower offensive tackles. He has that low center of gravity and power in his anchor that makes it hard for blockers to push him back. He has the instincts to sniff out the play and does a good job of reading and adjusting on the run.

Most undersized defensive ends struggle to play the run, but it is very rare to see Tapp get covered up by the tight end and offensive tackle or lose containment. He is just that rare athlete who knows how to use his strength to control the point of attack (see 2005 Virginia matchup vs. offensive tackle D'Brickshaw Ferguson). Even when taking on double teams, he has good success gaining the split. He uses his hands well to control and get off blocks, and has the foot balance to disengage and leverage from the outside.

One thing you see on film is his lateral movement. He shows good effort in his pursuit and is consistent stringing out the plays. He just does not give up on the play, but while some might consider him a potential linebacker prospect in the 3-4, he does not have the timed speed to be effective in pass coverage. He is best when playing down the line, not when dropping back in the second level, where he can lose sight of the ball.

When Tapp hits a ballcarrier, he generates good force behind his tackles. He has the strength to explode into runners and tries to jar the ball loose. He is also an effective wrap-up tackler who won't miss much when he targets an opponent. His hands are weapons, as he can control and get rid of blockers quickly. He would have trouble getting into the play otherwise at his size. He uses those hands to guard his legs vs. the chop block and continue his flow to the ball.

As a pass rusher, he can generate the short area burst to close, combining that quickness and strength to punish the passer. He has enough burst to accelerate around the corner and close the deal on the passer. He has the loose hips to redirect and takes good angles in pursuit. Adding to his draft stock is his ability to cover punts on special teams and use his leaping ability to block kicks.

While he might not have the explosive speed of a Dwight Freeney (who does?), he is a technically sound player with a great motor and impressive power. If he was four inches taller, he would be up on the draft podium very early in the day.

Morton
03-16-2010, 10:57 PM
Great move!

I like this alot. Pure low-risk / high-reward, just like the Marlin Jackson signing.

frubulubu
03-16-2010, 11:47 PM
Remove Mort and me, the rookies, and how many active posters did we have here?

brat316
03-16-2010, 11:52 PM
There were quite a few last year, its died down since Basza, Sniper, and EATW stop posting. Well Basza stopped completely, Sniper and EATW make apperences.

Even Go Eagles doesn't post as much. Also Cunningham and B-dawk.

Thumper
03-16-2010, 11:53 PM
If the Eagles draft another front 7 player early, the defense should be a lot better. With Bradley coming back and Tapp being brought in the run defense should at least be much better than it already was and they were pretty decent last year until the Dallas games where Felix Jones just raped the Eagles defense over and over again.

Right now the defensive end talent just got an upgrade, Chris Clemons was useless and now he joins a platoon at LE that should be better with him there, now the rotation consists of Cole, Tapp, Abiamiri, Parker and Howard. You could potentially add another player to that mix, right now just by looking at that I'd say the Eagles are going to bring in a situational pass rusher because Tapp and Abiamiri are run stuffers and Parker and Howard are aging, there is no adequate back up for Trent Cole. I'd look out for Jermaine Cunningham, Rahim Alem, Jason Worilds, Ricky Sapp or Thaddeus Gibson in rounds 2-3 or potentially even Jerry Hughes or Sergio Kindle in round 1, you can never have too many pass rushers and the Eagles really struggled to pressure Tony Romo in 3 games against him.

Thumper
03-16-2010, 11:57 PM
Remove Mort and me, the rookies, and how many active posters did we have here?

I post a lot. EATW occasionally drops by now, he used to be much more frequent. Bsaza is our team leader but I don't think I've seen a post from him ever. Sniper occasionally shows up. Todd Bertuzzi comes around in stretches, Go_Eagles77 pops up here and there. I know that you and Morton aren't particularly fond of me but I do enjoy having some other Eagles posters here.

Morton
03-17-2010, 12:01 AM
I was looking at profootballfocus again and I noticed that Tapp led the league in tackles in 2009.

I'm starting to like this signing more and more.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 01:40 AM
http://www.fieldgulls.com/2010/3/16/1376383/tapp-traded-to-eagles-for-de-chris#comments

Seahawks fans HATE this move which means I love it, they think Tapp was far and away their best end and that he will probably get double digit sacks on a line that has a player like Trent Cole.

So lets get this straight, we got a guy who is top 5 in QB hits last season, had 13 pressures, led the NFL in tackles from the DE spot and ranked 4th overall in run defense? The Eagles just owned the Seahawks.

Tapp is just entering his prime as well and every single Seahawks fan (or close to it) figured he has a lot of untapped potential (no pun intended). And everyone fricken' loves the guy, clearly he is a fan favorite.

frubulubu
03-17-2010, 08:07 AM
I post a lot. EATW occasionally drops by now, he used to be much more frequent. Bsaza is our team leader but I don't think I've seen a post from him ever. Sniper occasionally shows up. Todd Bertuzzi comes around in stretches, Go_Eagles77 pops up here and there. I know that you and Morton aren't particularly fond of me but I do enjoy having some other Eagles posters here.

I enjoy talking to everyone here, including you. I might not see eye to eye always, but thats whats makes it fun at times. Eventhough, it seems like I dislike or even talk thrash to some, on here. When you are posting out of this board, I will always jump on your coat tail if someone is messing with you. So far, I have one guy out of the Browns board that keeps neg reping me, but he was talking thrash to one of us.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 01:34 PM
Shawn Andrews is cut... and with the 24th pick in the NFL draft the Philadelphia Eagles select offensive guard Mike Iupati out of Idaho

frubulubu
03-17-2010, 01:44 PM
Shawn Andrews is cut... and with the 24th pick in the NFL draft the Philadelphia Eagles select offensive guard Mike Iupati out of Idaho

Agree 100%. Now can we give the boot to his brother.

Go_Eagles77
03-17-2010, 01:47 PM
I doubt that this changes much draft-wise. I don't think the eagles were counting on Shawn to come back and start at RG, and I think they still have hopes for Stacy Andrews. I think if the eagles go OL in round 1 it's Maurkice Pouncey with the question marks at both C and G, considering he can play both, but I've believed that since before Andrews was cut anyway.

brat316
03-17-2010, 01:51 PM
Yeah center is pretty important position I don't think Jackson is coming back next year from that ACL injury.

Morton
03-17-2010, 02:18 PM
I'm still going to be pissed if they take an offensive lineman in the first round, especially if an elite prospect like Earl Thomas or Brandon Graham falls to them.

I just know Andy is going to use the signing of Tapp as an excuse to ignore any elite DEs in the draft. WE DON'T NEED A FIRST ROUND OL. NO.

Go_Eagles77
03-17-2010, 02:27 PM
I still think Defense is the first priority, but I'm actually starting to come around to it. I wouldn't mind a Nick Mangold/Alex Mack type player in Pouncey to anchor the line for the next 10+ years.

Morton
03-17-2010, 03:11 PM
There are too many good defensive prospects in the bottom of the first round this year to reach for an offensive lineman.

I will punch a hole in the wall if they take somebody like Maurkice Pouncey or John Jerry at #24 if Earl Thomas, Brandon Graham, or Sean Weatherspoon are still on the board.

Go_Eagles77
03-17-2010, 03:30 PM
There are too many good defensive prospects in the bottom of the first round this year to reach for an offensive lineman.

I will punch a hole in the wall if they take somebody like Maurkice Pouncey or John Jerry at #24 if Earl Thomas, Brandon Graham, or Sean Weatherspoon are still on the board.
I agree with that. I'm saying if the value isn't there on defense I wouldn't be opposed to looking elsewhere.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 04:46 PM
There are too many good defensive prospects in the bottom of the first round this year to reach for an offensive lineman.

I will punch a hole in the wall if they take somebody like Maurkice Pouncey or John Jerry at #24 if Earl Thomas, Brandon Graham, or Sean Weatherspoon are still on the board.

none of those 3 will be on the board, I'm 100% sure that Suh, McCoy, Berry, JPP, Joe Haden, Dan Williams, Rolando McClain, Kyle Wilson, Earl Thomas, Sean Weatherspoon, Earl Thomas and Jerry Hughes will be off the board by pick #24, Griffen, Kindle and Price could potentially be gone as well.

The Eagles will have their choice of workout warriors though, non of whom I want on the Eagles, pass on Dunlap, don't even consider Taylor Mays, pass on Patrick Robinson, Darryl Washington isn't needed and he would be a reach, Griffen is all potential at this point and doesn't fit what the Eagles want if the need to win now.

Personally I'd rather have Iupati or Pouncey than Dunlap, Mays, Robinson, Washington or Griffen just because the interior of the offensive line struggled so much with Jay Ratliff last year.
Pouncey is a stud center who can do it all, he shows the power to create space up the middle for the run game and he has the fluidity to mirror any pass rusher inside. Pouncey is the ultimate weapon against a 3-4 defense, he can handle the nose one on one and thus the guards are able to nuetralize the linebackers, something the Eagles struggle with. Seriously go read a scouting report on Pouncey, the guy is a complete and total stud at the C spot and he literally has everything you want. He is so good that there are rumors that the Broncos might take him at pick #11. He plays smart, he plays agressive and he plays extremely well.

And if the Eagles are looking to upgrade RG, I see no better option than Iupati. Iupati has more agression in his leg than Shawn Andrews had in his entire body. Iupati is MEAN and agressive. I don't think I can accurately depict how mean he is, think Jon Runyan type of mean but only more intimidating and scary, can you imagine a raging 6'5" 330 pound somoan charging at you with every intention of knocking you out of the game? If the Eagles want a tougher identity this is the way to go. He could be the presence in the run game at RG that the Eagles have lacked since Shawn Andrews was good. He is a dominating run blocker that would really open holes up for Shady McCoy.

superman8456
03-17-2010, 06:19 PM
****.

I'm kinda pissed we cut Shawn Andrews. Did he not want to rework a deal? Maurkice Pouncey or Mike Iupati 1st round pick is a lock now. I'm not that mad about it.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 06:47 PM
****.

I'm kinda pissed we cut Shawn Andrews. Did he not want to rework a deal? Maurkice Pouncey or Mike Iupati 1st round pick is a lock now. I'm not that mad about it.

I'm kind of happy, Shawn Andrews was just taking up money and a roster spot. Plus if the Eagles do draft Iupati or Pouncey it allows the Eagles to get the best out of their offensive talent, it gives McNabb time to find DeSean, Jeremy and Brent and it gives LeSean, Leonard and now Mike Bell more room to run.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 07:09 PM
I'm just going to toss something out there, on offense the Eagles are really explosive but I think they're also really finesse. I think the Eagles might need to ugly it up on offense a bit and get some physical players like Iupati and Demaryius Thomas that can rough up some defenses. Same goes for the defense, they need players that are going to just be super physical like Major Wright who is growing on me, TJ Ward or Chad Jones because while Quintin Mikell is very solid, he isn't very intimidating and nobody fears going over the middle with him there and I doubt Marlin Jackson will do that. Right now the guy on the team who might develop into the physical presence is Macho Harris.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 07:52 PM
I'm throwing together a quick mock:
1- Mike Iupati OG Idaho
2- Patrick Robinson CB Florida St.
3- Major Wright S Florida
3- Jason Worilds DE Virginia Tech
4- Larry Asante S Nebraska
5- Adam Ulatoski OT Texas

superman8456
03-17-2010, 07:59 PM
I'm kind of happy, Shawn Andrews was just taking up money and a roster spot. Plus if the Eagles do draft Iupati or Pouncey it allows the Eagles to get the best out of their offensive talent, it gives McNabb time to find DeSean, Jeremy and Brent and it gives LeSean, Leonard and now Mike Bell more room to run.

But it also tells us that they were happy enough with Winston Justice to make him our future right side of the line. We also have no G that can really step up. Stacy is unproven right now and Nick Cole is a great backup, but you dont want him as a 16 game starter.

Morton
03-17-2010, 08:41 PM
Thumper: I'm pretty sure at least ONE of the following is going to be available at #24: Sean Weatherspoon, Earl Thomas, Brandon Graham, Everson Griffen, Derrick Morgan, and Kyle Wilson.

No way do ALL of them get picked before #24 because there is going to be a run on offensive lineman in the top 15 picks which will push alot of the defensive prospects down the board.

If the Eagles select an OL over one of those prospects it will be a big mistake.

eaglesalltheway
03-17-2010, 09:31 PM
I'm still going to be pissed if they take an offensive lineman in the first round, especially if an elite prospect like Earl Thomas or Brandon Graham falls to them.

I just know Andy is going to use the signing of Tapp as an excuse to ignore any elite DEs in the draft. WE DON'T NEED A FIRST ROUND OL. NO.
It all depends who is available. I'd love having Pouncey.
I still think Defense is the first priority, but I'm actually starting to come around to it. I wouldn't mind a Nick Mangold/Alex Mack type player in Pouncey to anchor the line for the next 10+ years.

If Graham or Thomas are available, I would like them, but remember just yesterday we were saying how it seems none of the DEs or Fas will be available? Nothing has changed in terms of their stock, so if they would be gone we have other options. This is another year where the Eagles have set themselves up in good position to take a player at a position of need with good value.

eaglesalltheway
03-17-2010, 09:50 PM
I'm just going to toss something out there, on offense the Eagles are really explosive but I think they're also really finesse. I think the Eagles might need to ugly it up on offense a bit and get some physical players like Iupati and Demaryius Thomas that can rough up some defenses. Same goes for the defense, they need players that are going to just be super physical like Major Wright who is growing on me, TJ Ward or Chad Jones because while Quintin Mikell is very solid, he isn't very intimidating and nobody fears going over the middle with him there and I doubt Marlin Jackson will do that. Right now the guy on the team who might develop into the physical presence is Macho Harris.
Though I agree the team is a bit finesse, we do have uglies in Peters and Jackson, I just hope he can be healthy. Bradley isn't a finesse guy, and neither are Bunk or Patterson. Sheldon is far from a finesse guy. I can't see Macho being that physical presence though. It may have been being a rookie, but I didn't see him as a guy who will lay a big hit, or strike fear into the ballcarrier.
I'm throwing together a quick mock:
1- Mike Iupati OG Idaho
2- Patrick Robinson CB Florida St.
3- Major Wright S Florida
3- Jason Worilds DE Virginia Tech
4- Larry Asante S Nebraska
5- Adam Ulatoski OT Texas

I love Iupati, like the 2nd and 3rd rounders, but after that its meh. I can't see the team drafting two safeties, and Ulatoski is poop on a stick. I doubt Asante would be available in the 4th as well.
But it also tells us that they were happy enough with Winston Justice to make him our future right side of the line. We also have no G that can really step up. Stacy is unproven right now and Nick Cole is a great backup, but you dont want him as a 16 game starter.
I just want to mention I told you guys not to give up on Justice.

eaglesalltheway
03-17-2010, 09:57 PM
Thumper: I'm pretty sure at least ONE of the following is going to be available at #24: Sean Weatherspoon, Earl Thomas, Brandon Graham, Everson Griffen, Derrick Morgan, and Kyle Wilson.

No way do ALL of them get picked before #24 because there is going to be a run on offensive lineman in the top 15 picks which will push alot of the defensive prospects down the board.

If the Eagles select an OL over one of those prospects it will be a big mistake.

I can see Wilson and Griffen being available, and I would prefer Iupati or Pouncey over both. Honestly, I think Iupati will be gone too.

frubulubu
03-17-2010, 10:07 PM
Wilson, looks like someone I would love in midnight green.

Thumper
03-17-2010, 11:07 PM
If the Eagles don't go Pouncey or Iupati and decide to go defense, now with a serviceable and decent LE in the fold I think the Eagles should focus on the back 7 especially since Stewart Bradley is coming back, unless Brandon Graham is there for the Eagles. If Brandon Graham is gone the Eagles NEED to get help for the back 7, they gave up 27 touchdowns last year and the secondary is aging and in need of a talent that the Eagles can build around for the future.

cunningham06
03-18-2010, 12:17 AM
Though I agree the team is a bit finesse, we do have uglies in Peters and Jackson, I just hope he can be healthy. Bradley isn't a finesse guy, and neither are Bunk or Patterson. Sheldon is far from a finesse guy. I can't see Macho being that physical presence though. It may have been being a rookie, but I didn't see him as a guy who will lay a big hit, or strike fear into the ballcarrier.


I agree with you here, except for the part about Macho. He flies around the field and seems to enjoy hitting. His problem is that he still has a lot to learn about the safety position, which is to be expected. Once he has a better understanding of what he's doing out there, I think he is PLENTY physical and could be an intimidating FS. It's Mikell who I thought regressed a bit this year. As far as a SS goes, he is an adequate tackler, but he isn't the in-the-box safety that Michael Lewis was for example.

eaglesalltheway
03-18-2010, 06:06 AM
I agree with you here, except for the part about Macho. He flies around the field and seems to enjoy hitting. His problem is that he still has a lot to learn about the safety position, which is to be expected. Once he has a better understanding of what he's doing out there, I think he is PLENTY physical and could be an intimidating FS. It's Mikell who I thought regressed a bit this year. As far as a SS goes, he is an adequate tackler, but he isn't the in-the-box safety that Michael Lewis was for example.

I agree with you there, but Mikell offers exponentially greater value in coverage than Lewis did. I'd rather have Mikell than Lewis 10 times out of 10, as Mikell is still pretty good in the run game.

eaglesalltheway
03-18-2010, 06:08 AM
I'd also like to add that Mikell "regressed" because he had a guy who was new to the defense in at the other Safety spot, and he was doing some different things than he did the previous year. Once we have an answer for FS, expect Mikell to revert back to his 2008 season.

Morton
03-18-2010, 10:30 AM
Here's my most recent flowchart for the #24 spot:

#1. Brandon Graham --->
|
|
\---> #2. Derrick Morgan --->
|
|
|
\---> #3. Earl Thomas OR Kyle Wilson --->
|
|
|
\---> #4. Jerry Hughes OR Sean Weatherspoon --->
|
|
|
\------> #5. Mike Iupati OR Maurkice Pouncey --->
|
|
|
\------> Trade Down!

frubulubu
03-18-2010, 01:56 PM
I have a feeling we are trading down,

Thumper
03-18-2010, 04:02 PM
And there goes Darren Howard. The Eagles are saving some serious money this offseason they've cut Shawn Andrews, Brian Westbrook, Will Witherspoon and now Howard.

Thumper
03-18-2010, 04:05 PM
And then Kevin Curtis is cut, man the Eagles are saving bank.

EDIT:
Look at the contracts that are being dumped and redone this offseason:
Shawn Andrews, Kevin Curtis, Will Witherspoon, Brian Westbrook and Darren Howard are cut
Stacy Andrews has his contract reworked for less money
The Eagles managed to dump Reggie Brown and Chris Clemons

And they're resigned Jason Avant, Leonard Weaver and they've signed Marlin Jackson and Mike Bell off the FA market and then they've traded for and extended Darryl Tapp. It looks like the Eagles are making good personnel moves that both improve the team and save money, the only move I don't like is cutting Will Witherspoon.

Morton
03-18-2010, 04:13 PM
Thumper, what do you think are the chances they are clearing space for something like, maybe trading WAY up into the upper portion of the first round for a big contract paid out to somebody like Eric Berry?

Just thinking of things they can do with the extra $$$.

Thumper
03-18-2010, 04:19 PM
Thumper, what do you think are the chances they are clearing space for something like, maybe trading WAY up into the upper portion of the first round for a big contract paid out to somebody like Eric Berry?

Just thinking of things they can do with the extra $$$.

I doubt it, they won't want to be one of the last teams paying a monster contract for a top 10 players considering that the 2011 draft might have the pay allotted for each pick. The Eagles are very money savvy they don't want that.

But what I think it does do is that it frees the Eagles to make moves in 2011 free agency which will be a monster class. Now in 2011 FA there are the guys who would normally be there and the guys who were tendered this year. So the cash the Eagles are saving this year will allow them to spend more in 2011 free agency.

But with a little bit of extra cash floating around it might give the Eagles a little bit more freedom in the draft and I wouldn't be surprised to see the Eagles move up a bit in the draft, not top 10 but maybe around 16-18 to grab Brandon Graham, Earl Thomas or even Derrick Morgan if he falls.

Sniper
03-18-2010, 04:27 PM
Kevin Curtis gone! Praise the Lord!

frubulubu
03-18-2010, 04:37 PM
I wonder who goes next? Maybe McNabb?

Morton
03-18-2010, 04:44 PM
I wonder who goes next? Maybe McNabb?

That's never happening, lol.

Andy Reid is never going to give up on his #2 draft pick.

Thumper
03-18-2010, 05:21 PM
I wonder who goes next? Maybe McNabb?

No, right now the Eagles aren't cutting players that are essential to team success ala Tampa Bay last season. They're still committed to winning now and they're actually making good moves IMO, they're cutting high salary players and replacing them with younger, less expensive and in some cases more productive talent.

eaglesalltheway
03-18-2010, 05:24 PM
I like the moves, both Curtis and Howard were no longer worht the money they were getting and there are players at their positions who can get the job done better, and cheaper. It also is making the team a bit younger as well. Thumper, I know you highly doubt the Eagles trade up bigtime for a top 10 type player, and I don't see it as THE most possible idea ever, but like I said before, the Eagles pull the trigger on guys they want, and if they want a top ten guy bad enough, they WILL pull the trigger. I do see trading up into that 16-18 range as the far more likely solution however.

Thumper
03-18-2010, 05:38 PM
I just don't think its feasible, not only because of money but because the Eagles only have 6 picks so it isn't like they've got a ton of ammo. I doubt the Eagles would surrender an entire draft to grab a player they liked and it would cost a lot to move up high enough to grab Eric Berry.

Plus the 16-18 range is right around the range the Eagles trade up to, Shawn Andrews was drafted at #16, Jerome McDougle was drafted at #15 and Jeremy Maclin was drafted at #19.

Thumper
03-18-2010, 05:55 PM
And the numbers are...

LeSean McCoy is now #25
Darryl Tapp is #91
Marlin Jackson is #28
Jordan Norwood is now #19
Chad Hall is #16
Hank Baskett is once again #84

frubulubu
03-18-2010, 08:23 PM
Any chance now that Derrick Johnson sign his tendered, that we can trade for him? It might be doubtful, since we only have 6 picks.

frubulubu
03-18-2010, 09:49 PM
When does the schedule come out, anyone know?

Thumper
03-18-2010, 10:57 PM
When does the schedule come out, anyone know?

No but I know the teams, next years schedule is no joke like it was this season.

* Home: Dallas (11-5), Giants (8-8), Washington (4-12), Green Bay (11-5), Minnesota (12-4), Atlanta (9-7), Houston (9-7), Indianapolis (14-2).

* Away: Dallas (11-5), Giants (8-8), Washington (4-12), Chicago (7-9), Detroit (2-14), San Francisco (8-8), Jacksonville (7-9), Tennessee (8-8).

Translaion, watch out defense Dallas, New York, Green Bay, Minnesota, Atlanta, Houston and Indy are coming to town which translates to Tony Romo, Eli Manning, Aaron Rodgers, Brett Favre, Matt Ryan, Matt Schaub and Peyton Manning are coming to town combined with Miles Austin, Steve Smith, Hakeem Nicks, Greg Jennings, Sidney Rice, Percy Harvin, Roddy White, Andre Johnson and Reggie Wayne.

And the Eagles are also facing a who's who of running backs next year with them going against Felix Jones, Adrian Peterson, Michael Turner, Frank Gore, Maurice Jones-Drew and Chris Johnson.

And out of 13 teams the Eagles will face, 10 of them will compete for playoff spots, the only gimmes are Chicago, Detroit and Washington.

Morton
03-18-2010, 11:08 PM
Correction: the only gimme is going to be Detroit.

And even they might be tougher than expected if they have a great draft and Matthew Stafford matures over the summer into a decent quarterback.

This is easily the most brutal schedule for the Eagles in years. They'll be playing the NFC North, which will have two of the best NFC teams in it next year (Minnesota and Green Bay) and two teams potentially stronger than they were in 2009 (Chicago and Detriot). And they play the AFC South, home to two elite offenses (Indianapolis and Houston) and the best running back in the NFL (Tennessee). And of course, on top of that they have to play in the NFC East, which is going to be rough next year too - The Giants can't be any worse than they were in 2009, and the Cowboys are still one of the top 5 teams in the NFL next year most likely. And I have a feeling that Shanahan's Skins are going to be a lot less of a pushover than Zorn's Skins were.

Seriously, if they end up as 11-5 or better next year, they will have earned every little bit of it, unlike in 2009. At least we'll know if the team is good or not early in the season - there will be no quality mirages due to a weak schedule next year, that's for damn sure.

frubulubu
03-18-2010, 11:19 PM
Many of the teams that were good this year, might not be as good, for the up coming season. It happens every year, and you simply dont know until its late in the season. That having been said, I dont see us winning 11 games this season. If were lucky we will be battling for a wildcard spot.

Thumper
03-18-2010, 11:54 PM
I agree with everything said so far, right now it looks really tough. But who knows until the season, injuries could take place amongst numerous other things. But like Morton said, if this team makes the playoffs next season we'll know that they earned it and there will be no easy wins on that schedule.

But don't forget every team on our schedule is looking at their schedule and thinking "The Eagles are going to be tough". The Eagles are only going to be better, injuries hit this team hard and the team was really young and on paper next years team already looks better.

frubulubu
03-18-2010, 11:59 PM
Agree with Thump. If we can have a great draft, and a healthy Ingram, this team will be feared.

eaglesalltheway
03-19-2010, 06:19 AM
The schedule does look to be very tough, but if you look at the schedule closely, we play the toughest teams at home, which will help. Keep in mind the Eagles will always win a game or two that we think they won't and lose a game or two we think they won't.

eaglesalltheway
03-19-2010, 06:24 AM
I just don't think its feasible, not only because of money but because the Eagles only have 6 picks so it isn't like they've got a ton of ammo. I doubt the Eagles would surrender an entire draft to grab a player they liked and it would cost a lot to move up high enough to grab Eric Berry.

Plus the 16-18 range is right around the range the Eagles trade up to, Shawn Andrews was drafted at #16, Jerome McDougle was drafted at #15 and Jeremy Maclin was drafted at #19.

It is definitely feasible. You say the Eagles may not want to be one of the last teams to overpay for a top 10 guy, I'm sure there are plenty of teams in the top 10-15 who feel the same. Which means they may accept less for that top pick in return than in normal years. The Eagles still have a few extra picks, I think it will be 8 picks once the compensatory picks are added in, and they have two third rounders. will #24 and a third rounder be enough to trade up into the top 10? Maybe, though it is easily possible a team between 10 and 15 would accept that trade, no matter which 3rd rounder it is.

Edit: With the trade for Tapp, the Eagles now only have 8 picks this year, and the Eagles are expected to receive two 7th round compensatory picks. The Eagles have plenty of ammo. Even though comp picks can't be traded, that's 8 picks that can be traded in this season, plus the ones in next years draft.

frubulubu
03-19-2010, 11:26 PM
Looks like the Eagles will allow Babin walk to the Titans. Im going on a wild guess and say they will draft a DE somewhere in this years draft.

eaglesalltheway
03-20-2010, 10:55 AM
I could easily see us getting two DEs in this draft. I can also see getting two CBs, but that is less likely. We'll definitely see at least two members of the secondary being drafted, most likely one SS and one CB.

Morton
03-20-2010, 11:56 AM
I don't understand why everyone immediately says "Now a high pick on a DE is a must!"

They just traded for Tapp, who projects to be an every-down starter at LDE. This would make Parker and Abiamiri rotational players and provide adequate depth at the position, as long as they draft a project DE in one of the later rounds (like a Daniel Teo-Nesheim or Alex Carrington type).

I would love to get a stud DE like Brandon Graham or Derrick Morgan, but the more I look at the roster right now, the more glaring the need in the secondary is. And they could probably use a good linebacker over a DE also.

Thumper
03-21-2010, 09:22 PM
I'm going to take a step out of my normal Andy Reid bashing and appreciate him for a few moments.

We all love to bash this guy, he passes too much, he doesn't run enough, he is fat, he doesn't manage time well and while that all might be true lets just forget about that for a few seconds and realize that Andy Reid is one hell of a coach. He took one of the worst teams in the NFL and made them into one of the best teams of the decade, third after the Patriots and Colts, he has taken the team to the playoffs 8/11 years and he just can flat out coach. He is consistent as well.

But for the sake of this post, I'm going to stick with one aspect of his coaching career, he knows how to coach quarterbacks. Look at what he has done, he learned from Mike Holmgren and he hasn't looked back. Way back in 1982 he worked with a guy named Steve Young at BYU and eventually he made his way to the Green Bay Packers where he worked with Brett Favre. He can't be credited with finding them but you get the idea, he worked with some great players. Then when he became a QB coach he really started finding talent, he single handily found Matt Hasselbeck, he went to his pro-day, he told Holmgren to draft him and Hasselbeck went on to have a good career in Seattle. Andy Reid made the call on Donovan McNabb who is likely the third most successful QB of the past decade who might someday find his bust in canton. Andy Reid drafted AJ Feely, developed him, Feely saved the Eagles playoff hopes one year and eventually Andy was able to get a second out of him. Finally his latest QB has been Kevin Kolb and everything points to Kolb at least being a serviceable starter. The only QB that Andy has really swung and missed on was Andy Hall, a 6th round pick from Delaware. When you throw in players like Jeff Garcia, Mike Vick and Mark Brunell, all of whom worked with Andy Reid at various stages in their careers to the already impressive pool of quarterbacks you can see that Andy Reid knows his QBs.

So lets look at all the QBs Andy Reid has been around, Steve Young, Brett Favre, Mark Brunell, Matt Hasselbeck, Donovan McNabb, AJ Feely, Jeff Garcia, Kevin Kolb and Michael Vick. Amazing. Andy Reid is truly a QB guru.

EDIT: On that list are a grand total of 36 pro-bowl nominations, 6 1st team all-pro awards and 5 MVP trophies

frubulubu
03-21-2010, 09:33 PM
You can remove Jeff Garcia and Mike Vick from that list.

Thumper
03-21-2010, 09:34 PM
You can remove Jeff Garcia from that list.

why? Andy Reid worked with him so he is on the list, as a matter of fact I'd go as far as to say that Andy Reid resurrected his career because Jeff Garcia was a nobody after stints in Cleveland and Detroit.

frubulubu
03-21-2010, 09:43 PM
Ok, I'll give you the Lazarus story, but Mike Vick, is a no no. For the record, I dont hate on Reid, I think highly of him, even if he is fat and chokes in the big games.

Thumper
03-21-2010, 10:02 PM
Ok, I'll give you the Lazarus story, but Mike Vick, is a no no. For the record, I dont hate on Reid, I think highly of him, even if he is fat and chokes in the big games.

Is Vick not a reclamation project? Remember that Vick wasn't much of a QB in Atlanta, he was more of a playmaker than a real QB. When he got out of jail, Andy Reid put him through QB school, he went back and taught him the basics. We don't know how well that will work out, but Andy Reid did help teach Vick some mechanics so that he could make it in the NFL again.

frubulubu
03-21-2010, 10:30 PM
We will see if he can become the qb AR envisions him. One more QB, to add to your list is the great Doug Pederson.

eaglesalltheway
03-22-2010, 07:55 AM
I don't understand why everyone immediately says "Now a high pick on a DE is a must!"

They just traded for Tapp, who projects to be an every-down starter at LDE. This would make Parker and Abiamiri rotational players and provide adequate depth at the position, as long as they draft a project DE in one of the later rounds (like a Daniel Teo-Nesheim or Alex Carrington type).

I would love to get a stud DE like Brandon Graham or Derrick Morgan, but the more I look at the roster right now, the more glaring the need in the secondary is. And they could probably use a good linebacker over a DE also.

I think there are only very few who still say DE is a major need. However, there are only 4 DEs, and the last few seasons the Eagles have carried 6. That may be less likely now, but I can see the Eagles getting two DEs, though I wouldn't expect them to draft one before the third round or so now.

cunningham06
03-22-2010, 02:35 PM
I'm not sold on Tapp, but I believe that there are other areas in more need of improvement, unless a great DE opportunity falls into our lap.

eaglesalltheway
03-22-2010, 03:35 PM
I'm not sold on Tapp, but I believe that there are other areas in more need of improvement, unless a great DE opportunity falls into our lap.

Is he an elite DE? No, but from what I've seen and heard he is a very solid DE who is good in both the run and passing game. He may not have perfect height, but (like Cole) plays with great leverage to compensate for his lack of ideal size, particularly height. He has a great motor and will definitely help take up blockers for our LBs when asked. He will help the defense a good bit. As an added bonus, he is a player with a great attitude and was well liked.

Edit: I am much more sold on Tapp than I am Jackson, we'll just say that.

cunningham06
03-22-2010, 05:55 PM
Is he an elite DE? No, but from what I've seen and heard he is a very solid DE who is good in both the run and passing game. He may not have perfect height, but (like Cole) plays with great leverage to compensate for his lack of ideal size, particularly height. He has a great motor and will definitely help take up blockers for our LBs when asked. He will help the defense a good bit. As an added bonus, he is a player with a great attitude and was well liked.

Edit: I am much more sold on Tapp than I am Jackson, we'll just say that.

Agreed on Jackson. We haven't properly addressed the FS position since Dawkins left. I mean plugging in Demps when he clearly wasn't ready, having Macho change from CB to S, bringing in Sean Jones who is a better fit at SS, and now a player coming off of injury in Marlin Jackson?

Of the group we have I like Macho the best because I think he has the potential to solve this issue, but if we could just invest a high pick on a safety like Earl Thomas, we could solve this recurring problem.

As for Tapp... Sure when he came in to the NFL, Trent Cole was undersized (mainly weight wise). At 6'3 that's not totally detrimental to the DE position. But look at DE's under 6'3, they are not nearly as successful. Leverage is a very important part of the game, but for players who are 6'1 or under you need damn good speed to get around the edge. Dwight Freeney who is the same height as Tapp ran under 4.5 coming out of college, whereas Tapp is in the 4.8 range. I'm not saying he is going to be a detriment, he will play the position fine, but I do not expect him to be an impact player. I expect 5 or fewer sacks from him this season.

Thumper
03-22-2010, 06:49 PM
You're expecting less sacks because he is short? I don't understand that. He was miscast as a RE and is a much better fit at LE, his top speed isn't good as you've pointed out but he is quick off the snap and he plays hard. And his height might actually be an advantage because he is built low and has natural power, leverage and he uses it well to defend against the run.

I'm expecting 6-9 sacks.

cunningham06
03-22-2010, 07:04 PM
You're expecting less sacks because he is short? I don't understand that. He was miscast as a RE and is a much better fit at LE, his top speed isn't good as you've pointed out but he is quick off the snap and he plays hard. And his height might actually be an advantage because he is built low and has natural power, leverage and he uses it well to defend against the run.

I'm expecting 6-9 sacks.

Exactly. The best pass rushers in the league, with few exceptions, are 6'3 and taller. Notable exceptions are Dwight Freeney and Elvis Dumervil (although he is in a different system and therefore not an applicable comparison). As a shorter player, it's harder to pull off an effective swim or to get your hands on a tackle before they've got their hands on you. That's why you need to have excellent speed and quickness to compensate.

In regards to the run I think he will do well, he is stout and powerfully built. However, I think what this defense needs to be truly great is an impact pass rusher opposite Trent Cole.

eaglesalltheway
03-22-2010, 07:26 PM
Agreed on Jackson. We haven't properly addressed the FS position since Dawkins left. I mean plugging in Demps when he clearly wasn't ready, having Macho change from CB to S, bringing in Sean Jones who is a better fit at SS, and now a player coming off of injury in Marlin Jackson?

Of the group we have I like Macho the best because I think he has the potential to solve this issue, but if we could just invest a high pick on a safety like Earl Thomas, we could solve this recurring problem.

As for Tapp... Sure when he came in to the NFL, Trent Cole was undersized (mainly weight wise). At 6'3 that's not totally detrimental to the DE position. But look at DE's under 6'3, they are not nearly as successful. Leverage is a very important part of the game, but for players who are 6'1 or under you need damn good speed to get around the edge. Dwight Freeney who is the same height as Tapp ran under 4.5 coming out of college, whereas Tapp is in the 4.8 range. I'm not saying he is going to be a detriment, he will play the position fine, but I do not expect him to be an impact player. I expect 5 or fewer sacks from him this season.

To be fair to Tapp, he is a completely different player than Freeney, but honestly, there aren't many DEs like Freeney. Tapp plays with more power, which is needed in our defense, and is a much better fit at LE than Freeney is, as Thumper eluded to. I think 6-8 sacks from Tapp isn't out of the question, any more than that is great, because he is not really a double digit type of sack guy. He regains some lost value as a pass rusher in the run game, which from our LE, I want, especially with the OLs in our division and the RBs.

Morton
03-22-2010, 07:59 PM
Here's an idea I had recently to solve some of our LB problems:

Jerry Hughes as SAM.

He's 6'2", 255lbs, and runs a 4.5 40 at that size. He's also a great athlete with fluid movement and great hips as evidenced by his combine performance, and he's a prolific pass-rusher as evidenced by his college stats.

The more I think about it, the more I am intrigued by this idea of putting Hughes in as a LB. If we have Darryl Tapp starting on the LDE side, he's great against the run even if he isn't the best pass rusher. He'll be the first line of defense against the run on the left side. With Hughes on the same side, you also get an explosive pass-rusher in addition to a great athlete that can drop into coverage and a LB who is big enough @ 255lbs to deal with tight ends like Jason Witten, and big running backs like Brandon Jacobs.

WILL(??) --- MIKE(Bradley) --- SAM (Hughes)

That's a 254lb MIKE, and a 255lb SAM, and then whoever you plug in @ WILL. That's alot more beef @ LB than we had this year.

Thumper
03-22-2010, 08:16 PM
Not really.... Gocong is 263 pounds and he started the year at SLB.

Do you really want another SLB who can't cover? Because personally I want one who can cover tight ends so that tight ends will stop gashing the Eagles.

Morton
03-22-2010, 08:38 PM
Not really.... Gocong is 263 pounds and he started the year at SLB.

Do you really want another SLB who can't cover? Because personally I want one who can cover tight ends so that tight ends will stop gashing the Eagles.

Who's to say Hughes can't cover?

I watched his combine drills and he looks as fluid in the movement drills as a safety.

Obviously, this doesn't necessarily mean he CAN cover, but I'm saying the possibilities are there. Imagine if he CAN, and he can rush the passer and stop the run. That would be an amazing SAM.

superman8456
03-22-2010, 08:56 PM
Sounds like a SAM that would be poorly used in our system. Give me a LB that can cover and play the run

Thumper
03-22-2010, 08:59 PM
Chris Gocong lit up the combine as well as anyone recently, how do you think he caught the attention of teams coming from a small school like Cal-Poly? His measurements were through the roof and he actually out tested Shawn Merriman at the combine.

I'm not against Hughes, he would certainly be a fantastic pass rusher but I think he is too similar to Trent Cole, Cole is a rarity at his spot, he plays the run extremely well and he is quick against the pass. Hughes has not displayed the same run stopping ability that Trent Cole has and I don't think he could be an effective everydown LE. As a situational guy, he would be great at DE.

But I don't want to wait on another DE moving to OLB for the Eagles, it hasn't worked yet. If the Eagles want to have any hope of stopping the absolute stable of tight ends in the NFC East they absolutely need to get a guy who can play the pass. Moving from DE to OLB is a completely different beast than you think it is. You have to learn how to play coverage, you need to learn how to cover certain routes, you need to learn zone coverage, you have to have instincts and can't barrel into offensive linemen anymore because now you have to sniff out the run, you have to learn footwork. I don't have the patience to watch another DE try and move to OLB, just get a real SLB like Donald Butler, Sergio Kindle or potentially even Sean Weatherspoon.

Morton
03-22-2010, 09:39 PM
So do you think they should stick with one of the LBs they already have as their SAM, or draft one?

Thumper
03-22-2010, 09:40 PM
So do you think they should stick with one of the LBs they already have as their SAM, or draft one?

I know the Eagles really like Fokou so I'm not sure if they will do anything in the draft, he could certainly be upgraded but Fokou showed enough athletic ability last year to make the Eagles think he can start, all he needs to fix is his mental focus, he plays out of control at times and gets costly penalties.

frubulubu
03-22-2010, 09:41 PM
Has Andy Reid drafted a linebacker in the first round, since becoming HC? No. He has to stop doing what he does and take a stud LB in the first if one is available. Someone like mention that can cover and also stop the run. Gocong was a DE, and was converted to LB. We have corners playing safety. We use to have RB playing FB, until Weaver came along and how good was he? Get players that play there position and leave them there.

superman8456
03-22-2010, 09:42 PM
I actually have faith in Moise Fokou. It was a little bit of an adjustment for him, but he responded well. I'm fairly confident we will address the position with a 3rd, 4th, or 5th, but it is not a position held with high value from the Eagles. Maybe a guy like AJ Edds.

Definitely don't expect a 1st to be used there. I believe its going to be OL/DL. I'm hoping for a trade up to get Anthony Davis or Everson Griffen.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 06:26 AM
Here's an idea I had recently to solve some of our LB problems:

Jerry Hughes as SAM.

He's 6'2", 255lbs, and runs a 4.5 40 at that size. He's also a great athlete with fluid movement and great hips as evidenced by his combine performance, and he's a prolific pass-rusher as evidenced by his college stats.

The more I think about it, the more I am intrigued by this idea of putting Hughes in as a LB. If we have Darryl Tapp starting on the LDE side, he's great against the run even if he isn't the best pass rusher. He'll be the first line of defense against the run on the left side. With Hughes on the same side, you also get an explosive pass-rusher in addition to a great athlete that can drop into coverage and a LB who is big enough @ 255lbs to deal with tight ends like Jason Witten, and big running backs like Brandon Jacobs.

WILL(??) --- MIKE(Bradley) --- SAM (Hughes)

That's a 254lb MIKE, and a 255lb SAM, and then whoever you plug in @ WILL. That's alot more beef @ LB than we had this year.
Hughes at SLB is even worse than Hughes at LE. He will struggle mightily in coverage, and we don't need another LB with trouble covering. Not to mention Hughes would be learning a whole new position and learning different technique. You saw how that went with Gocong. Then it brings us back to the history of the Eagles under Reid, they never use a high pick on a LB, and SLB is the least valuable of the LB positions in our defense. Hughes at LB is a bad idea because it will prevent him from reaching his potential, not to mention it is a bad fit and would just extend the problem we have at the position.
Not really.... Gocong is 263 pounds and he started the year at SLB.

Do you really want another SLB who can't cover? Because personally I want one who can cover tight ends so that tight ends will stop gashing the Eagles.
The obvious answer is no, lol. Hughes will have an incredibly rough time in coverage, especially against the TEs in our division.
Who's to say Hughes can't cover?

I watched his combine drills and he looks as fluid in the movement drills as a safety.

Obviously, this doesn't necessarily mean he CAN cover, but I'm saying the possibilities are there. Imagine if he CAN, and he can rush the passer and stop the run. That would be an amazing SAM.

I really hope you are joking, or exaggerating, or something, because this is absolutely insane sounding. He wasn't even the most fluid of the tweeners in that drill, and there were many LBs at the combine much more fluid than him. The problem with imagining is that if you have to imagine it, it probably isn't true.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 06:30 AM
So do you think they should stick with one of the LBs they already have as their SAM, or draft one?

I think the Eagles will draft a SLB, and in the 3rd to 5th round, like superman said. Gocong has started, as well as Fokou, so the experience is there. I feel the position can be upgraded, so I would hope the Eagles at least are looking for SLBs to draft.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 06:32 AM
Has Andy Reid drafted a linebacker in the first round, since becoming HC? No. He has to stop doing what he does and take a stud LB in the first if one is available. Someone like mention that can cover and also stop the run. Gocong was a DE, and was converted to LB. We have corners playing safety. We use to have RB playing FB, until Weaver came along and how good was he? Get players that play there position and leave them there.

I think the only LBs Reid would take in the first would be Witherspoon or McClain, and lets face it, neither will be available, most likely.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 06:33 AM
I actually have faith in Moise Fokou. It was a little bit of an adjustment for him, but he responded well. I'm fairly confident we will address the position with a 3rd, 4th, or 5th, but it is not a position held with high value from the Eagles. Maybe a guy like AJ Edds.

Definitely don't expect a 1st to be used there. I believe its going to be OL/DL. I'm hoping for a trade up to get Anthony Davis or Everson Griffen.

I would love the Davis pick, but I doubt we have to trade up for Griffen. He should go right around 24-30 if you ask me.

Morton
03-23-2010, 12:26 PM
I'm sure this has been suggested before but I never really got a clear answer on this:

Why haven't the Eagles tried to just start Gocong as a DE, his natural position in college?

brat316
03-23-2010, 12:44 PM
I think, I'm not sure, but he doesn't have that first step to fire off the line, and holding up against the run. He might be better playing in a 3-4.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 01:27 PM
I think, I'm not sure, but he doesn't have that first step to fire off the line, and holding up against the run. He might be better playing in a 3-4.

This, and he never had any pass rush moves, AT ALL. His sacks in college came off of pure speed against slower OTs.

Morton
03-23-2010, 09:29 PM
None of you guys think they're going to go secondary in the first round? (i.e. Earl Thomas or Kyle Wilson)

I think that's a very strong possibility given the ages of their two starting cornerbacks, and the free safety mess they have right now.

Go_Eagles77
03-23-2010, 09:31 PM
I would personally be thrilled with Kyle Wilson, he's one of my favorite prospects and fits a big need. Can't see Thomas being there but would be thrilled with him too, that would allow the eagles to put Marlin Jackson at nickel CB.

Morton
03-23-2010, 09:34 PM
I would be thrilled with either one of those two also.

The question is: are the Eagles going to go for them in the first round or go DL/OL?

Like I said, I think it's a strong possibility given the ages of Brown and Samuels, BUT Andy just *loves* drafting OL/DL, so I don't know.

Thumper
03-23-2010, 09:35 PM
None of you guys think they're going to go secondary in the first round? (i.e. Earl Thomas or Kyle Wilson)

I think that's a very strong possibility given the ages of their two starting cornerbacks, and the free safety mess they have right now.

I think there is a very good chance CB is the pick, not FS. The Eagles have Macho Harris, Marlin Jackson and Quintin Demps at FS, they already have a logjam. At CB I completely agree and it should be noted that Troy Vincent and Bobby Taylor were 31 and 29 when Lito Sheppard and Sheldon Brown were drafted, and Sheldon Brown and Asante Samuel are currently right around the same age.

Kyle Wilson, Kareem Jackson or Devin McCourty, one of them will be Eagles after the first round.

Morton
03-23-2010, 09:41 PM
Another question is: if both Kyle Wilson and Earl Thomas are off the board at #24, and assuming Haden goes in the top 10, do they reach for the third worst cornerback, trade down, or go for a different position in the first round and grab a cornerback in the second?

Thumper
03-23-2010, 09:41 PM
I would be thrilled with either one of those two also.

The question is: are the Eagles going to go for them in the first round or go DL/OL?

Like I said, I think it's a strong possibility given the ages of Brown and Samuels, BUT Andy just *loves* drafting OL/DL, so I don't know.

That isn't true, people say that Andy loves drafting big guys early, he has only drafted 1 offensive lineman in the first round. Otherwise he has stuck with the midrounds, free agency and UDFA for offensive linemen (or trade as the case may be with Jason Peters).

Thumper
03-23-2010, 09:44 PM
Another question is: if both Kyle Wilson and Earl Thomas are off the board at #24, and assuming Haden goes in the top 10, do they reach for the third worst cornerback, trade down, or go for a different position in the first round and grab a cornerback in the second?

CBs go early and if the Eagles want Kareem Jackson or Devin McCourty they're going to have to grab one of them early. Many draft experts and scouts now agree that Joe Haden, Kyle Wilson, Kareem Jackson and Devin McCourty are now all first round prospects and Mel Kiper actually thinks that 3-4 CBs will go in the 18-30 range.

The corners that figure to be available in the second aren't nearly as good as Jackson or McCourty who are legitimate first round prospects.

superman8456
03-23-2010, 10:11 PM
I'm not a fan of this CB class. I don't think there is a real top talent at our available pick (I do like Haden and Wilson, however, but I dont like Kareem Jackson with #24 pick).

Right now I'm confident in my "trading up a couple spots for Anthony Davis" pick. Just makes too much sense.

brat316
03-23-2010, 10:16 PM
If that many Cbs go in the first someone is bound to slide down.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 10:20 PM
None of you guys think they're going to go secondary in the first round? (i.e. Earl Thomas or Kyle Wilson)

I think that's a very strong possibility given the ages of their two starting cornerbacks, and the free safety mess they have right now.
It is a strong possibility, but it all depends on who is available. If there is more value at the secondary than the Eagles feel is at OL/DL, I'm sure a CB or Safety would be the pick.
I would personally be thrilled with Kyle Wilson, he's one of my favorite prospects and fits a big need. Can't see Thomas being there but would be thrilled with him too, that would allow the eagles to put Marlin Jackson at nickel CB.I honestly don't know much about Wilson, besides the fact a lot of guys like him, so I can't comment on him, but I'd love Thomas, though like you say, there is a snowball's chance in hell that Thomas is available for us.

I would be thrilled with either one of those two also.

The question is: are the Eagles going to go for them in the first round or go DL/OL?

Like I said, I think it's a strong possibility given the ages of Brown and Samuels, BUT Andy just *loves* drafting OL/DL, so I don't know.

As I said before, if there is more value at CB or FS, they will pick one... Also, no "s" at the end of Samuel. I'm a nitpicky ************, lol.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 10:23 PM
I think there is a very good chance CB is the pick, not FS. The Eagles have Macho Harris, Marlin Jackson and Quintin Demps at FS, they already have a logjam. At CB I completely agree and it should be noted that Troy Vincent and Bobby Taylor were 31 and 29 when Lito Sheppard and Sheldon Brown were drafted, and Sheldon Brown and Asante Samuel are currently right around the same age.

Kyle Wilson, Kareem Jackson or Devin McCourty, one of them will be Eagles after the first round.

I like McCourtey, I think he would be a great player for us. He's a little less physical than Sheldon, but plays a similar style.

Go_Eagles77
03-23-2010, 10:29 PM
The only CBs I would for sure take at 24 are Joe Haden (obviously) and Kyle Wilson. McCourty is pushing it (I would take an OL over him), and I think Kareem Jackson is a fairly big reach there. I think the value of a Jerome Murphy in the 2nd is much greater than Kareem Jackson in the 1st.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 10:29 PM
Another question is: if both Kyle Wilson and Earl Thomas are off the board at #24, and assuming Haden goes in the top 10, do they reach for the third worst cornerback, trade down, or go for a different position in the first round and grab a cornerback in the second?
I hate to sound like a skipping record, b ut it all depends on the situation and who is available. The Eagles could trade up to ensure they get one of those players, or an Anthony Davis like superman says (if he falls that far). We can speculate all we want, and in the end it will probably mean nothing because something will happen during the draft that none of us expected. We could trade up for a number of players, stay put and get a linemen like a Pouncey if they are available, or trade down and gain some value. It is impossible to know right now.
I'm not a fan of this CB class. I don't think there is a real top talent at our available pick (I do like Haden and Wilson, however, but I dont like Kareem Jackson with #24 pick).

Right now I'm confident in my "trading up a couple spots for Anthony Davis" pick. Just makes too much sense.
I can see some situations where this can happen, and I'd love it. I watched a lot of Rutgers this year, and there are quite a few of their players that I really like, Davis is one of them.
If that many Cbs go in the first someone is bound to slide down.

If there is a run on CBs, Thomas or Graham may be avialable, as well as Iupati. Luckily the Eagles are in a position that they can make the best out of just about any situation that comes up in this draft.

frubulubu
03-23-2010, 10:31 PM
I like Wilson, as well, personally. But im not getting my hopes up high on acquiring him. I do want to take a moment to thank everyone on here, for talking Eagle football with me. Being out here in Detroit, all I hear is Lion football, and talking to you guys about my team, really helps! Thank you all!

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 10:31 PM
The only CBs I would for sure take at 24 are Joe Haden (obviously) and Kyle Wilson. McCourty is pushing it (I would take an OL over him), and I think Kareem Jackson is a fairly big reach there. I think the value of a Jerome Murphy in the 2nd is much greater than Kareem Jackson in the 1st.

I must agree with this, for the most part, really the only thing I feel differently about is this... I'd only want Davis or Iupati, maybe Pouncey, over McCourty. Besides that, I feel the same way.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 10:32 PM
I like Wilson, as well, personally. But im not getting my hopes up high on acquiring him. I do want to take a moment to thank everyone on here, for talking Eagle football with me. Being out here in Detroit, all I hear is Lion football, and talking to you guys about my team, really helps! Thank you all!

Stop sucking up :).

From what everyone else is saying, it must be hard not to like Wilson.

frubulubu
03-23-2010, 10:40 PM
Im a Fresno St. fan, go ahead and bring the jokes, lol. But I got to see him often. He is physical and plays good when having to tackle in the open field. He does not get beat often, and give up the big play.

Todd Bertuzzi
03-23-2010, 10:41 PM
I love McCourty and have him as my second favourite CB in this class. With that being said, I wouldn't feel comfortable spending a first on him even though I realize that's likely what it's going to take to get him. If CB is the direction we decide to go, I would hope we trade down into the 2nd because it's such a deep class. McCourty isn't flashy or anything. He's just a reliable corner who would be a perfect fit to come in as our nickel next year.

eaglesalltheway
03-23-2010, 10:51 PM
I love McCourty and have him as my second favourite CB in this class. With that being said, I wouldn't feel comfortable spending a first on him even though I realize that's likely what it's going to take to get him. If CB is the direction we decide to go, I would hope we trade down into the 2nd because it's such a deep class. McCourty isn't flashy or anything. He's just a reliable corner who would be a perfect fit to come in as our nickel next year.

I have to agree to a point, there are a few players that could be available that I like more, and I'd prefer we trade down a bit if possible if they are gone. But if we would vbe unable to trade down and he was the pick, I wouldn't be upset with the pick at all.

frubulubu
03-23-2010, 11:09 PM
Ok, Jordan signed his tender and Mike Bell is an Eagle. Westy is still available and Harbaugh said he is not going to sign him. How about we bring him back and start a 3 headed monster again?

eaglesalltheway
03-24-2010, 06:10 AM
Ok, Jordan signed his tender and Mike Bell is an Eagle. Westy is still available and Harbaugh said he is not going to sign him. How about we bring him back and start a 3 headed monster again?

I don't think either side is interested. Honestly, I could see the Eagles still drafting a RB in the 3rd or 4th round this year and going that route with a 3 headed monster, which would mean the end of Eldra Buckley, who I like a lot, but if it was for a Gerhart, Hardesty, Tate, Blount, or Starks, I'd love it.

jriles0522
03-24-2010, 10:34 AM
Hey guys, we've been linked pretty heavily to Gocong since you signed Tapp and we traded Wimbley away.

Can you give me a quick run down about why you guys are letting him go, and how he'd fair as an OLB in a 3-4?

Just haven't seen him play much. It was weird too, during the first press conference with Holm, Heckert, Mangini was saying how similar they are in talent evaluation and specifically mentioned Gocong as a guy he wanted, but Heckert took just before his pick.

eaglesalltheway
03-24-2010, 10:39 AM
Hey guys, we've been linked pretty heavily to Gocong since you signed Tapp and we traded Wimbley away.

Can you give me a quick run down about why you guys are letting him go, and how he'd fair as an OLB in a 3-4?

Just haven't seen him play much. It was weird too, during the first press conference with Holm, Heckert, Mangini was saying how similar they are in talent evaluation and specifically mentioned Gocong as a guy he wanted, but Heckert took just before his pick.

We haven't let him go, he's a RFA and the compensation is a 4th rounder, I believe. In our defense he was inconsistent. At SLB for us, his strong suit was playing the run. As a pass rusher, he never really made the impact we expected, he always seemed like he was a step from reaching the quarterback. In coverage, he is as useful as the pile of dirt he is standing on. He has been playing out of position IMO, and would fare much better in the 3-4 if you ask me. If the Browns are willing to trade a 4th rounder for him, I wouldn't be sad to see him go, honestly.

frubulubu
03-24-2010, 01:57 PM
I just read that Andy officially stated that Dmac is on the trading blick.

Thumper
03-24-2010, 04:29 PM
OMFG Jeff McClane says the Rams have an offer on the table for Donovan McNabb, their second round pick and AJ Atgowe. Pull the trigger, take that deal!

Go_Eagles77
03-24-2010, 04:35 PM
Haha I was waiting for you to post that Thumper. If true I think they should do it, everyone knows Kolb is the future and I think what is practically a first round pick and a pro bowl caliber player is too good to pass up. Still can't really see it happening.

brat316
03-24-2010, 04:38 PM
Do it, damn it. No one is going to give you a first round pick.

LonghornsLegend
03-24-2010, 04:56 PM
I'd be so freakin jealous if you guys got #33 AND Otogwe, wtf?!?! STL would have to be stupid to take that, and you guys would be favorites in the NFC to me. STL is rebuilding with a crappy ass team, that type of deal would only make sense to me for a team who was a QB away from a serious run but oh well.



It be crazy if you guys didn't take that.

superman8456
03-24-2010, 05:14 PM
Think of all the possibilities we would have with the #24 and #33 pick.

Morton
03-24-2010, 05:37 PM
Is Atogwe even that good?

I mean, he's not exactly young in DB terms. I don't know how many more years a 29 year old safety has in him.

The #33 pick would be nice though. It's practically like having another first round pick, and with the new schedule that allows teams to regroup overnight after the first round is in the books, it would be much more valuable.

I'd prefer the #33 pick and, say, a third or fourth rounder.

Thumper
03-24-2010, 06:32 PM
And then the denial starts coming in, Rams' management have claimed they've got no offer on the table for McNabb. Other sources have said that Oakland and Buffalo currently are the two biggest suitors. Basically its a matter of who you trust, are you going to trust Philly reporters that are reporting #33 and Atgowe or are you going to trust Rams' management who probably wouldn't confirm a deal is in place even if there was one.

Thumper
03-24-2010, 07:03 PM
Also the Raiders are freaking stupid as hell. There is a Raiders poster on one of the Raiders boards who has a great track record, he predicted both DHB and Mitchell a month before the draft, he said that Gibril Wilson was released days before it became public and he knew Jeff Garcia was signing with the Raiders a week prior to the knowledge going public. He is well respected and he is usually spot on over at Raidersfans.net

This guy says that prior to the Cromartie trade there was a deal on the table that looked like this:
Jets get Scrabble
Raiders get McNabb and a Jets LB (wasn't named, probably David Harris)
Eagles get Jets first round pick

And he claims that Al Davis pulled out at the last second, that is a great trade for all sides IMO, how much do you want to bet that Joe Haden's 40 time was the deal breaker. Effing Al Davis.

Morton
03-24-2010, 08:06 PM
Man, this constant rumormongering and then subsequent denial is getting REAL OLD.

I just want something done NOW and I want to stop getting my chain jerked.

eaglesalltheway
03-24-2010, 09:07 PM
OMFG Jeff McClane says the Rams have an offer on the table for Donovan McNabb, their second round pick and AJ Atgowe. Pull the trigger, take that deal!
This is the first I;ve heard Atogwe in the deal as well, and if that is the case, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
Haha I was waiting for you to post that Thumper. If true I think they should do it, everyone knows Kolb is the future and I think what is practically a first round pick and a pro bowl caliber player is too good to pass up. Still can't really see it happening.
I'm skeptical about AJ being in there, but I honestly think I'd still accept that trade for just the 33rd, honestly.

Think of all the possibilities we would have with the #24 and #33 pick.

Many, we could get a any combination of CB, LB, DE, OL or S (if Atogwe wouldn't be involved in the trade). Trading up into the top 10 could be likely and secure a top talent, though I don't know if there is anyone worth it honestly.

eaglesalltheway
03-24-2010, 09:08 PM
Man, this constant rumormongering and then subsequent denial is getting REAL OLD.

I just want something done NOW and I want to stop getting my chain jerked.

I think that's how McNabb feels...

eaglesalltheway
03-24-2010, 09:10 PM
Is Atogwe even that good?

I mean, he's not exactly young in DB terms. I don't know how many more years a 29 year old safety has in him.

The #33 pick would be nice though. It's practically like having another first round pick, and with the new schedule that allows teams to regroup overnight after the first round is in the books, it would be much more valuable.

I'd prefer the #33 pick and, say, a third or fourth rounder.

He is that good. If he were on a competitive team that had national attention, he'd have been a Pro-Bowler at least once in the last two years, if not both. He is very good.

frubulubu
03-24-2010, 09:48 PM
Hell muthaf'n Naw, McNabb cant be traded away this year!

Thumper
03-25-2010, 09:14 AM
Whoever leaked the Rams trade should be fired, it appears to be off the table now.

Tommy Lawlor has said the Raiders, Jaguars and Bills are the three teams that are chasing after him.

619
03-25-2010, 10:05 AM
Swap first round picks with the Raiders and we add in our third rounder. Good deal?

From there you guys could easily trade up for Berry who I'm sure would be of great interest.

Morton
03-25-2010, 10:34 AM
619: It's pointless to even speculate about McNabb -> Oakland because we all know Al Davis is never going ot give up on his first round draft pick JaMarcus.

frubulubu
03-25-2010, 01:48 PM
PFT: "McNabb trade inevitable"

eaglesalltheway
03-25-2010, 02:51 PM
Whoever leaked the Rams trade should be fired, it appears to be off the table now.

Tommy Lawlor has said the Raiders, Jaguars and Bills are the three teams that are chasing after him.

It seems that way to me too, which is a shame, becuase that is the best trade scenario I could see for us.

frubulubu
03-25-2010, 06:27 PM
Ok, So McNabb and Samuel go to Oakland and We get Asomugha? Thats the latest on the rumors.

619
03-25-2010, 07:04 PM
Ok, So McNabb and Samuel go to Oakland and We get Asomugha? Thats the latest on the rumors.

I can't tell sarcasm over the internet but I'm guessing this is it.

Thumper
03-25-2010, 07:13 PM
HELL GOD DAMN NO, keep Aso, I like Samuel and I want draft picks.

Morton
03-25-2010, 07:14 PM
That's f*ckin awful. That better not be true.

Thumper
03-25-2010, 07:54 PM
Listen I think we need to taper expectations for when Kolb is going to start, FACT: If Kolb starts, the Eagles will not make the playoffs and there is a strong case for the Eagles having a top 10 pick. Think about what happened with Green Bay. The idea is to help the entire team and with a top 10 pick two years in a row (from the Raiders in 2010) you could potentially get Eric Berry & Patrick Peterson or Eric Berry and Robert Quinn or Eric Berry & Greg Rosmeus.

frubulubu
03-25-2010, 08:11 PM
I can't tell sarcasm over the internet but I'm guessing this is it.

I saw this on PFT, but I think its far fetched.

camp_eagles
03-25-2010, 08:57 PM
PFT: "McNabb trade inevitable"

Also according to Florio Terry Bradshaw is dead and the Redskins were his preseason superbowl pick

frubulubu
03-25-2010, 09:18 PM
Also according to Florio Terry Bradshaw is dead and the Redskins were his preseason superbowl pick

Terry Bradshaw is alive? :eek:

eaglesalltheway
03-26-2010, 06:13 AM
Ok, So McNabb and Samuel go to Oakland and We get Asomugha? Thats the latest on the rumors.

That trade would be **** on a stick for both teams.

superman8456
03-26-2010, 10:37 PM
I was on another Eagles board and I read somewhere that during the two Cowboys games, Asante would not listen to McDermott. The guy didnt provide a link, but I'm a little worried about Asante's attitude. Mybe thats why he is being rumored in the Oakland deal.

eaglesalltheway
03-26-2010, 10:39 PM
I was on another Eagles board and I read somewhere that during the two Cowboys games, Asante would not listen to McDermott. The guy didnt provide a link, but I'm a little worried about Asante's attitude. Mybe thats why he is being rumored in the Oakland deal.

I wouldn't count on any info that doesn't have a link, otherwise, I just interpret another guy saying that as him may as well be saying "this is what I think happened."

frubulubu
03-26-2010, 10:43 PM
I was on another Eagles board and I read somewhere that during the two Cowboys games, Asante would not listen to McDermott. The guy didnt provide a link, but I'm a little worried about Asante's attitude. Mybe thats why he is being rumored in the Oakland deal.

He sure didnt do this with JJ. Everybody respected him.