Dallas Cowboys Discussion

[Poet3334]

Hey, while we're rehashing the game I think Hatcher deserves some props. When he got head-butted by McKenzie (I think), he was smart enough to put up his hands and not retaliate so that he didn't draw an offsetting foul. That was a heads up move by a rookie.

Good call.

[D-Unit]

Anthony Henry has been getting burnt all year. I think there is real reason for concern.

[Poet3334]

Anthony Henry has been getting burnt all year. I think there is real reason for concern.

You know, he didn't even turn his damn head around on that Burress Touchdown. Just complete faceguarding. It was ridiculous.

[dpl85]

Parcells was highly critical of our DE's especially Spears in his press conference today. If we're going to be hatin on somebody it shoud be Spears. Parcells said a change to the starting lineup is possible, hopefully it would be Ratliff.

[Burns336]

i think spears is doing just fine... he plays in a 3-4, hes not going to provide that much pressure. hes in there to take away the run and ive seen him come up big on multiple occasions this year. I like how we use a rotation but i think the starters should stay as they are.

Henry regressed yesterday, i thought after he had a good game against the colts and then showed up in the game after that, we wouldnt have any more problems, but that was pretty bad play by him on the TD.. The endzone is so short and he saw plax was going for the corner, i would think it would be natural for him to turn around and gaurd the jump ball instead of face gaurding? oh well.

[Poet3334]

I want to see Hatcher in there.

[dpl85]

i think spears is doing just fine... he plays in a 3-4, hes not going to provide that much pressure. hes in there to take away the run and ive seen him come up big on multiple occasions this year. I like how we use a rotation but i think the starters should stay as they are.

Henry regressed yesterday, i thought after he had a good game against the colts and then showed up in the game after that, we wouldnt have any more problems, but that was pretty bad play by him on the TD.. The endzone is so short and he saw plax was going for the corner, i would think it would be natural for him to turn around and gaurd the jump ball instead of face gaurding? oh well.
The lack of pass rush is only a relatively small part of it, Spears is also playing pretty poorly against the run.

[bigbluedefense]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

[DMWSackMachine]

I hate to call you out, D-Unit, but you are delusional if you think that Henry has been playing badly. I just have to shake my head at how clueless people can be sometimes. Corners get beat from time to time, that's what they do. On the Burress TD, Henry had perfect coverage. There is not a defensive back in the league that could have, or would have, played that one iota better. If you want more proof of Henry's stellar play, you should check out KC Joyner's latest article on ESPN.com. He has Henry ranked as the #1 most under-rated CB in the entire league, and shows his metrics for the year, which happen to be near the top of the league. You should know better.

Btw, BBD, I composed a huge post in response to your game-breakdown, but my comp wiped it out, and I'm too depressed to re-do it right now. It was good, though. :wink:

[bigbluedefense]

I hate to call you out, D-Unit, but you are delusional if you think that Henry has been playing badly. I just have to shake my head at how clueless people can be sometimes. Corners get beat from time to time, that's what they do. On the Burress TD, Henry had perfect coverage. There is not a defensive back in the league that could have, or would have, played that one iota better. If you want more proof of Henry's stellar play, you should check out KC Joyner's latest article on ESPN.com. He has Henry ranked as the #1 most under-rated CB in the entire league, and shows his metrics for the year, which happen to be near the top of the league. You should know better.

Btw, BBD, I composed a huge post in response to your game-breakdown, but my comp wiped it out, and I'm too depressed to re-do it right now. It was good, though. :wink:

Can you give me a quick breakdown? Sounds like its time for a new PC too.

[Modano]

[quote=DMWSackMachine]

Can you give me a quick breakdown? Sounds like its time for a new PC too.

Or to buy a mac instead of a pc :D

[Poet3334]

I hate to call you out, D-Unit, but you are delusional if you think that Henry has been playing badly. I just have to shake my head at how clueless people can be sometimes. Corners get beat from time to time, that's what they do. On the Burress TD, Henry had perfect coverage. There is not a defensive back in the league that could have, or would have, played that one iota better. If you want more proof of Henry's stellar play, you should check out KC Joyner's latest article on ESPN.com. He has Henry ranked as the #1 most under-rated CB in the entire league, and shows his metrics for the year, which happen to be near the top of the league. You should know better.

Btw, BBD, I composed a huge post in response to your game-breakdown, but my comp wiped it out, and I'm too depressed to re-do it right now. It was good, though. :wink:

He had perfect coverage, but he didn't turn to look for the ball. If he had he would have broken it up. That was a mistake.

[bigbluedefense]

[quote=DMWSackMachine]

Can you give me a quick breakdown? Sounds like its time for a new PC too.

Or to buy a mac instead of a pc :D

lol, I knew someone was gonna say that.

[Staubach12]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

I agree about the NT issue. If we had a better pass rusher there, and that would make the entire defense better. That being said, this isn't a strong year for NTs in Free Agency or the draft, so unless we trade, I don't think that that's a fixable problem right now and we'll have to just work around it.

[bigbluedefense]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

I agree about the NT issue. If we had a better pass rusher there, and that would make the entire defense better. That being said, this isn't a strong year for NTs in Free Agency or the draft, so unless we trade, I don't think that that's a fixable problem right now and we'll have to just work around it.

Okeye could be a good 2nd round project. For a team with really no glaring weakness, like the Cowboys look at the moment, Okeye in the 2nd could be a nice pickup. He's only 19, room to grow, and if BP can coach him up, he'll have potential to be a NT for the future.

Im not saying he's the answer, but he's worth a try.

[Staubach12]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

I agree about the NT issue. If we had a better pass rusher there, and that would make the entire defense better. That being said, this isn't a strong year for NTs in Free Agency or the draft, so unless we trade, I don't think that that's a fixable problem right now and we'll have to just work around it.

Okeye could be a good 2nd round project. For a team with really no glaring weakness, like the Cowboys look at the moment, Okeye in the 2nd could be a nice pickup. He's only 19, room to grow, and if BP can coach him up, he'll have potential to be a NT for the future.

Im not saying he's the answer, but he's worth a try.

I would be a fan of us getting him, but we also have bigger needs in round two depending on where we go in the 1st. I'm just not sure if we'd be able to pick him there with all the neeeds we have.

[bigbluedefense]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

I agree about the NT issue. If we had a better pass rusher there, and that would make the entire defense better. That being said, this isn't a strong year for NTs in Free Agency or the draft, so unless we trade, I don't think that that's a fixable problem right now and we'll have to just work around it.

Okeye could be a good 2nd round project. For a team with really no glaring weakness, like the Cowboys look at the moment, Okeye in the 2nd could be a nice pickup. He's only 19, room to grow, and if BP can coach him up, he'll have potential to be a NT for the future.

Im not saying he's the answer, but he's worth a try.

I would be a fan of us getting him, but we also have bigger needs in round two depending on where we go in the 1st. I'm just not sure if we'd be able to pick him there with all the neeeds we have.

You guys need oline naturally. I think Blaylock is out of reach at this point, his stock is soaring and alot of teams have the same concerns, so he'll be gone before you get the chance to nab him.

The next best crop of OGs are similar grade, and you can nab one of them in the 3rd, leaving the 2nd round open to an Okeye I think. Ive been very big on Manuel Ramirez, and he looks like he's a 3rd rounder at this moment. If you go LT in round 1, Okeye in round 2, and Ramirez in Round 3, I think that would be a very productive 1st 3 rounds.

Your other concern is FS I would assume. This can be had in later rounds as well, remember, this is a very good Safety class. Nelson, Landry, Griffin, and Merriweather are all going to be good players, and one of them will fall in this draft. Im predicting it will be Merriweather, and he'd be worth trading down for in let's say the 3rd round, even if you have to give up a 4th and a 5th for him.

1. LT
2. Okeye
3. Manuel Ramirez
3. Brandon Merriweather
4. Gone
5. Maybe Gone

I think you'd settle for that, that would be very productive in my eyes.

[Poet3334]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

I agree about the NT issue. If we had a better pass rusher there, and that would make the entire defense better. That being said, this isn't a strong year for NTs in Free Agency or the draft, so unless we trade, I don't think that that's a fixable problem right now and we'll have to just work around it.

Okeye could be a good 2nd round project. For a team with really no glaring weakness, like the Cowboys look at the moment, Okeye in the 2nd could be a nice pickup. He's only 19, room to grow, and if BP can coach him up, he'll have potential to be a NT for the future.

Im not saying he's the answer, but he's worth a try.

I would be a fan of us getting him, but we also have bigger needs in round two depending on where we go in the 1st. I'm just not sure if we'd be able to pick him there with all the neeeds we have.

You guys need oline naturally. I think Blaylock is out of reach at this point, his stock is soaring and alot of teams have the same concerns, so he'll be gone before you get the chance to nab him.

The next best crop of OGs are similar grade, and you can nab one of them in the 3rd, leaving the 2nd round open to an Okeye I think. Ive been very big on Manuel Ramirez, and he looks like he's a 3rd rounder at this moment. If you go LT in round 1, Okeye in round 2, and Ramirez in Round 3, I think that would be a very productive 1st 3 rounds.

Your other concern is FS I would assume. This can be had in later rounds as well, remember, this is a very good Safety class. Nelson, Landry, Griffin, and Merriweather are all going to be good players, and one of them will fall in this draft. Im predicting it will be Merriweather, and he'd be worth trading down for in let's say the 3rd round, even if you have to give up a 4th and a 5th for him.

1. LT
2. Okeye
3. Manuel Ramirez
3. Brandon Merriweather
4. Gone
5. Maybe Gone

I think you'd settle for that, that would be very productive in my eyes.

I don't know if go free safety. If we do, I think it will be early. I like the idea of going heavy on both sides of the line early.

[Staubach12]

I actually forgot to mention this. Marcus Spears has been a big disappointment so far. He's nothing more than an average 3-4 DE. You don't invest the 16th pick in the draft on an average DE. Thats simply not acceptable. Right now Luis Castillo is light years ahead of him, and Canty is definately better than him.

Id sub him out for Hatcher or Ratliff. They have both come up huge this year and are excellent pass rushers. I think they'd give your defense more spark in pass rushing situations, Spears simply is not getting good pressure on 1st and 2nd down. Like I said before, I wouldn't be surprised if he is your version of William Joseph. A guy with all the physical gifts in the world, but for some unexplainable reason, can't translate it on the field.

Another note, the complaints about the ILBs blitzes. Their lack of pressure isn't necessary a testament to the ILBs, I think its moreso a testament to the NT position.

Ferguson is a very serviceable NT against the run, but he is not a presence in the middle like Hampton or Williams. He doesn't have to be doubled all the time, and because of that, the ILB blitz doesn't come unblocked. He needs to do a better job occuping linemen so his backers can come unblocked. Thats the real issue with the ILB blitz.

I agree about the NT issue. If we had a better pass rusher there, and that would make the entire defense better. That being said, this isn't a strong year for NTs in Free Agency or the draft, so unless we trade, I don't think that that's a fixable problem right now and we'll have to just work around it.

Okeye could be a good 2nd round project. For a team with really no glaring weakness, like the Cowboys look at the moment, Okeye in the 2nd could be a nice pickup. He's only 19, room to grow, and if BP can coach him up, he'll have potential to be a NT for the future.

Im not saying he's the answer, but he's worth a try.

I would be a fan of us getting him, but we also have bigger needs in round two depending on where we go in the 1st. I'm just not sure if we'd be able to pick him there with all the neeeds we have.

You guys need oline naturally. I think Blaylock is out of reach at this point, his stock is soaring and alot of teams have the same concerns, so he'll be gone before you get the chance to nab him.

The next best crop of OGs are similar grade, and you can nab one of them in the 3rd, leaving the 2nd round open to an Okeye I think. Ive been very big on Manuel Ramirez, and he looks like he's a 3rd rounder at this moment. If you go LT in round 1, Okeye in round 2, and Ramirez in Round 3, I think that would be a very productive 1st 3 rounds.

Your other concern is FS I would assume. This can be had in later rounds as well, remember, this is a very good Safety class. Nelson, Landry, Griffin, and Merriweather are all going to be good players, and one of them will fall in this draft. Im predicting it will be Merriweather, and he'd be worth trading down for in let's say the 3rd round, even if you have to give up a 4th and a 5th for him.

1. LT
2. Okeye
3. Manuel Ramirez
3. Brandon Merriweather
4. Gone
5. Maybe Gone

I think you'd settle for that, that would be very productive in my eyes.

I really see WR as a bigger need than LT right now. BP really likes McQuistan, and Flo is playing alright so far, nothing great, but he's not playing terrible either. So, actually I could see that happening. Mine would be

1.WR
2.Okoye
3.Ramirez
3.Merriweather

[D-Unit]

I hate to call you out, D-Unit, but you are delusional if you think that Henry has been playing badly. I just have to shake my head at how clueless people can be sometimes. Corners get beat from time to time, that's what they do. On the Burress TD, Henry had perfect coverage. There is not a defensive back in the league that could have, or would have, played that one iota better. If you want more proof of Henry's stellar play, you should check out KC Joyner's latest article on ESPN.com. He has Henry ranked as the #1 most under-rated CB in the entire league, and shows his metrics for the year, which happen to be near the top of the league. You should know better.

Btw, BBD, I composed a huge post in response to your game-breakdown, but my comp wiped it out, and I'm too depressed to re-do it right now. It was good, though. :wink:
* bent over waiting for spanking *

[Poet3334]

I hate to call you out, D-Unit, but you are delusional if you think that Henry has been playing badly. I just have to shake my head at how clueless people can be sometimes. Corners get beat from time to time, that's what they do. On the Burress TD, Henry had perfect coverage. There is not a defensive back in the league that could have, or would have, played that one iota better. If you want more proof of Henry's stellar play, you should check out KC Joyner's latest article on ESPN.com. He has Henry ranked as the #1 most under-rated CB in the entire league, and shows his metrics for the year, which happen to be near the top of the league. You should know better.

Btw, BBD, I composed a huge post in response to your game-breakdown, but my comp wiped it out, and I'm too depressed to re-do it right now. It was good, though. :wink:
* bent over waiting for spanking *

:lol:

[bigbluedefense]

I hate to call you out, D-Unit, but you are delusional if you think that Henry has been playing badly. I just have to shake my head at how clueless people can be sometimes. Corners get beat from time to time, that's what they do. On the Burress TD, Henry had perfect coverage. There is not a defensive back in the league that could have, or would have, played that one iota better. If you want more proof of Henry's stellar play, you should check out KC Joyner's latest article on ESPN.com. He has Henry ranked as the #1 most under-rated CB in the entire league, and shows his metrics for the year, which happen to be near the top of the league. You should know better.

Btw, BBD, I composed a huge post in response to your game-breakdown, but my comp wiped it out, and I'm too depressed to re-do it right now. It was good, though. :wink:
* bent over waiting for spanking *

:lol:

Forgot to mention this before, but theres no need to mock other posters DMWSackMachine, they got their opinions, you got yours. I know you didn't mean it in that fashion, but you gotta be careful, words on a screen don't necessarily come out the way you want them to be interpretted.

To comment on the statement that sparked the comments, I agree with DMWSackmachine on this one. I think he played well most of the game. Outside of the TD catch, he held Burress in check with not much help from the pass rush. And that TD was near impossible to defend, the ball was spot on and Burress is too strong to not get it.

[Staubach12]

Actually, about Okoye, I've heard he's down to 290, so he might be better in a Tampa 2 rather than the 3-4. That's no good...

[DMWSackMachine]

Scott is at it again. I don't know what he's got against Colombo, but he ain't letting it go:

I get a lot of questions and comments via e-mail and the message boards but one thing that constantly amazes me is the high opinion that Dallas Cowboy fans have of offensive tackle Marc Colombo. A former first round pick of the Chicago Bears who was derailed by injuries early in his career, Colombo was essentially picked up off the street by Dallas and somehow ended up starting at right tackle for them, based more on a lack of other options than his talent. There is no doubt that Colombo has played above expectations this season but that really isn't saying much because it was a bit of a surprise that he even made an NFL roster. Still, any team that has Marc Colombo starting for them is in serious trouble and the fact that Cowboy fans say he has been their best offensive lineman at times speaks volumes about the state of that group. In fact, I have had more than one pro scout tell me that they are shocked Colombo is even in the league let alone starting. That might be a little extreme but the bottom line is that he isn't nearly as good as the countless legions of Dallas fanatics would try and lead you to believe.

Even if you do accept the premise that Colombo is a capable starter in the league, which I do not, offensive tackle is still a major concern for the Cowboys because Flozell Adams is merely a shell of his former self. One way or another the team is going to have to make upgrades to the o-line next offseason but don't let the Dallas die-hards sell you on Colombo being a stud and the long-term answer at right tackle because that just simply is not and won't ever be the case.


I hate to say it, but I think he made up the part I bolded. That's just a ridiculous statement. The bottom line is this: Colombo has given up a very limited amount of sacks this season. I think the total is now at 3 or 4 (and the one that Kiwi got was not a sack, and even if it was you can't blame Colombo for it, Romo scrambled right into the defender after he was blocked for the entire play).

The best answer to all his criticism will come in the off-season. When Colombo is handed a nice, big contract in the 2-4mil per year range, than we will see what Scott has to say. You don't face guys like Strahan, Peppers, Mathis, and Darren Howard and hold your own unless you are a pretty solid player. It just doesn't happen. I wonder what he has up his a$$ on this one.

[DMWSackMachine]

Just to add a bit to that, Bill Parcells doesn't blow sunshine up people's arses. When Pettiti was over there stinking up the joint, he wasn't telling us that he was the next Eric Williams, and when Vollers, Ryan Young, Torrin Tucker et al were doing their thing, he was deadly honest. So the only other option would be that Bill Parcells is full of sh*t and Scott Wright the Great and his "anonymous sources" know better than he does. Call me funny, but I'll trust the guy with the hardware.

[Jughead10]

and the one that Kiwi got was not a sack, and even if it was you can't blame Colombo for it, Romo scrambled right into the defender after he was blocked for the entire play

How is the Kiwi one not a sack? It might not have been Colombo's fault but it was a sack.

[D-Unit]

How can Scott hate this guy?

http://www.preisvergleich.org/pimages/Columbo-Season-2_92__9889948_20.jpg

[Burns336]

So guys, i figured the numbers and henry is better than alot of us thought. He and Newman are actually a great tandem. So far this season Henry is being targeted 6.25 times per game (75 on the season) and only gives up 6.5 yards per attempt. Newman is only being targeted 3.67 times per game, (44 on the season) but is giving up 7.8 yards per completion.

Both of those are very good considering Newman has maybe given up one touchdown since '04 (i never heard the final verdict from the colts game) and Henry hasnt given up all that many.

I wish i had ESPN insider so i could see the figures for gamble and hall because they apparently are extremely overrated (which we already knew) and ESPN has the figures to prove it.

If anyone wants to keep track of the amount of passes thrown at each corner over the next few games we should be able to have accurate figures at the end of the season, but its hard to tell who the ball if being thrown at sometimes and im not sure what exactly counts as being "targeted".

[Poet3334]

Scott is at it again. I don't know what he's got against Colombo, but he ain't letting it go:

I get a lot of questions and comments via e-mail and the message boards but one thing that constantly amazes me is the high opinion that Dallas Cowboy fans have of offensive tackle Marc Colombo. A former first round pick of the Chicago Bears who was derailed by injuries early in his career, Colombo was essentially picked up off the street by Dallas and somehow ended up starting at right tackle for them, based more on a lack of other options than his talent. There is no doubt that Colombo has played above expectations this season but that really isn't saying much because it was a bit of a surprise that he even made an NFL roster. Still, any team that has Marc Colombo starting for them is in serious trouble and the fact that Cowboy fans say he has been their best offensive lineman at times speaks volumes about the state of that group. In fact, I have had more than one pro scout tell me that they are shocked Colombo is even in the league let alone starting. That might be a little extreme but the bottom line is that he isn't nearly as good as the countless legions of Dallas fanatics would try and lead you to believe.

Even if you do accept the premise that Colombo is a capable starter in the league, which I do not, offensive tackle is still a major concern for the Cowboys because Flozell Adams is merely a shell of his former self. One way or another the team is going to have to make upgrades to the o-line next offseason but don't let the Dallas die-hards sell you on Colombo being a stud and the long-term answer at right tackle because that just simply is not and won't ever be the case.


I hate to say it, but I think he made up the part I bolded. That's just a ridiculous statement. The bottom line is this: Colombo has given up a very limited amount of sacks this season. I think the total is now at 3 or 4 (and the one that Kiwi got was not a sack, and even if it was you can't blame Colombo for it, Romo scrambled right into the defender after he was blocked for the entire play).

The best answer to all his criticism will come in the off-season. When Colombo is handed a nice, big contract in the 2-4mil per year range, than we will see what Scott has to say. You don't face guys like Strahan, Peppers, Mathis, and Darren Howard and hold your own unless you are a pretty solid player. It just doesn't happen. I wonder what he has up his a$$ on this one.

Goes to show you what some "pro scouts" know. The guy's playing well. Period. End of story. Whether or not we address the line later based upon other factors is one thing, but to cast doubt on what your eyes plainly see, unless you've got some other agenda is wrong.

[thule]

So guys, i figured the numbers and henry is better than alot of us thought. He and Newman are actually a great tandem. So far this season Henry is being targeted 6.25 times per game (75 on the season) and only gives up 6.5 yards per attempt. Newman is only being targeted 3.67 times per game, (44 on the season) but is giving up 7.8 yards per completion.

Both of those are very good considering Newman has maybe given up one touchdown since '04 (i never heard the final verdict from the colts game) and Henry hasnt given up all that many.

I wish i had ESPN insider so i could see the figures for gamble and hall because they apparently are extremely overrated (which we already knew) and ESPN has the figures to prove it.

If anyone wants to keep track of the amount of passes thrown at each corner over the next few games we should be able to have accurate figures at the end of the season, but its hard to tell who the ball if being thrown at sometimes and im not sure what exactly counts as being "targeted".

I have an insider and can't find anything on stats as far as thrown at and avg yardage per catch. But I have read the Newman vs. Henry stats on a couple of sites.

[Burns336]

the newest kc joyner article, when he writes about henry as being underrated he gives the yards per completion and the number of times they have been thrown at this year (i just divided by 12 to get per game numbers) and i know the article goes into talking about gamble and hall but i cant view that part.

[Poet3334]

How can Scott hate this guy?

http://www.preisvergleich.org/pimages/Columbo-Season-2_92__9889948_20.jpg

I know I don't.

[Poet3334]

The Panthers are blowing another game.

[thule]

the newest kc joyner article, when he writes about henry as being underrated he gives the yards per completion and the number of times they have been thrown at this year (i just divided by 12 to get per game numbers) and i know the article goes into talking about gamble and hall but i cant view that part.

I have insider...and it does not talk about Gamble or Hall. I cannot find anything from this. Just a link to view some of his book. This article is also pretty old. About a month now.

[Burns336]

the newest kc joyner article, when he writes about henry as being underrated he gives the yards per completion and the number of times they have been thrown at this year (i just divided by 12 to get per game numbers) and i know the article goes into talking about gamble and hall but i cant view that part.

I have insider...and it does not talk about Gamble or Hall. I cannot find anything from this. Just a link to view some of his book. This article is also pretty old. About a month now.

Its not the article from nov. 6th about the secondary hindering us... im having trouble getting back to it now, but ill post a link as soon as i get to it. its got figures and mentions gamble and hall.

[Burns336]

alright dude, see if you can find it here....
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/insider/columns/story?columnist=joyner_kc&id=2679672&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumnist%3djoyner_ kc%26id%3d2679672

headline reads "Hall, Gamble don't deserve hype" so im assuming it breaks them down

[thule]

alright dude, see if you can find it here....
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/insider/columns/story?columnist=joyner_kc&id=2679672&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumnist%3djoyner_ kc%26id%3d2679672

headline reads "Hall, Gamble don't deserve hype" so im assuming it breaks them down

Hall is giving up 10.8 yard per attempt. He has also given up a 40+ yard pass in 4 of his last 8 games.

Gamble is at 11 yards per attempt.

[thule]

My Two Round Big Board

Round One
1- Justin Blalock (won't likely be available...but OG don't go real early)
2- Tank Tyler (Should be available later...has been great all year)
3- Reggie Nelson (Probabally the best ball skills of all the safety)
4- McCauley/Hughes (one will be gone by the time we pick)
5- Michael Johnson (this guy is fast could jump to round one post combine)

Round Two
1- Ryan Kalil (showed in the bowl game he can produce)
2- Tony Ugoh (he could play LT or RT...very balanced blocker)
3- Tom Zbikowski (Couldn't be worse then Davis...contribute right away)
4- Johnnie Lee Higgins (been UTEP's only weapon all year and been dominant)
5- Steve Smith (Smart, polished, nfl ready, quick...I like that combo)

Random Draft Thoughts
Parcells just seems to be touting JJ's horn week in week out saying he is happy with the 31/29 split. I think if we have a team interested in JJ and Bush is sitting there we trade him. His contract comes up next year I believe...and he will be looking for good money. Personally I love Bush....if he works out good I would love to take a ticket on him.

My new later round qb is none other then Kevin Kolb. A local prospect should allow us for good scouting. Not only that but the kid has showed up every game this year. Every Game. He has been solid his whole career...but hit a bit of a slump last year. This year he has been golden. Kept his team in every game...they lost 3 games and the biggest margin was 4. They lost to Miami by 3. Kolb is the main reason for that. He alway had a good int/td ratio. He threw 3 INT's all year and in those games they won by 42,17,20 points. He played efficient when he needed too. My only worry is...will he last till the 4th round or later...I don't know if we'll have a shot at him on the 2nd day.

The OG isn't that great this year but it is rather deep. Guys like Grubbs and Beekman look like solid 2nd round guys. But guys like Sears/Young/Kalil are all guys who could play OG in the NFL. Not to mention if a guy like Arnold comes out from LSU...we all know how parcells likes them SEC players. It could get interesting to see how early we address this.

You'll notice a couple of new names on my lists. Part of this is due to the fact that we are out of the range for guys like Ginn/Long/Baker Another fact is I got to watch alot of solid prospects in their bowl games.

[thule]

My Two Round Big Board

Round One
1- Justin Blalock (won't likely be available...but OG don't go real early)
2- Tank Tyler (Should be available later...has been great all year)
3- Reggie Nelson (Probabally the best ball skills of all the safety)
4- McCauley/Hughes (one will be gone by the time we pick)
5- Michael Johnson (this guy is fast could jump to round one post combine)

Round Two
1- Ryan Kalil (showed in the bowl game he can produce)
2- Tony Ugoh (he could play LT or RT...very balanced blocker)
3- Tom Zbikowski (Couldn't be worse then Davis...contribute right away)
4- Johnnie Lee Higgins (been UTEP's only weapon all year and been dominant)
5- Steve Smith (Smart, polished, nfl ready, quick...I like that combo)

Random Draft Thoughts
Parcells just seems to be touting JJ's horn week in week out saying he is happy with the 31/29 split. I think if we have a team interested in JJ and Bush is sitting there we trade him. His contract comes up next year I believe...and he will be looking for good money. Personally I love Bush....if he works out good I would love to take a ticket on him.

My new later round qb is none other then Kevin Kolb. A local prospect should allow us for good scouting. Not only that but the kid has showed up every game this year. Every Game. He has been solid his whole career...but hit a bit of a slump last year. This year he has been golden. Kept his team in every game...they lost 3 games and the biggest margin was 4. They lost to Miami by 3. Kolb is the main reason for that. He alway had a good int/td ratio. He threw 3 INT's all year and in those games they won by 42,17,20 points. He played efficient when he needed too. My only worry is...will he last till the 4th round or later...I don't know if we'll have a shot at him on the 2nd day.

The OG isn't that great this year but it is rather deep. Guys like Grubbs and Beekman look like solid 2nd round guys. But guys like Sears/Young/Kalil are all guys who could play OG in the NFL. Not to mention if a guy like Arnold comes out from LSU...we all know how parcells likes them SEC players. It could get interesting to see how early we address this.

You'll notice a couple of new names on my lists. Part of this is due to the fact that we are out of the range for guys like Ginn/Long/Baker Another fact is I got to watch alot of solid prospects in their bowl games.

[Modano]

It looks like every year Bill picks an LSU player.. Who do you think he will draft this year? I think that he will go for Landry in the first or Bowe in the second...

[thule]

It looks like every year Bill picks an LSU player.. Who do you think he will draft this year? I think that he will go for Landry in the first or Bowe in the second...

We would have to trade up to acquire either player. Bowe is probabally a mid to early 2nd rounder depending on workouts...and Landry is a top 15 pick. I really don't see either of those players.

I really like Will Arnold. I haven't heard a peep about if he is thinking of coming out early. But this kid has great size and is a pretty smart player. I could see us snag him off the board in the second round. Just look at him...looks like a Parcells OLmen.
http://vmedia.rivals.com//IMAGES/Player/photo/ARNOLDWILL150.JPG

[dpl85]

Scott should read this article or at least the part concerning Columbo. It says he has only given up one sack to this point in the season and has not been called for holding once. I'm sure nothing will change his mind anyway, but it's a good read.



http://www.cowboysplus.com/topstorync/stories/120506cpcowlede.250857d.html

[leroyisgod]

Scott should read this article or at least the part concerning Columbo. It says he has only given up one sack to this point in the season and has only been called for holding once. I'm sure nothing will change his mind anyway, but it's a good read.



http://www.cowboysplus.com/topstorync/stories/120506cpcowlede.250857d.html

He did have that crappy block on the field goal that was blocked -vs- Washington, but I feel he's done an admirable job this year.

[bigbluedefense]

Come on guys, let's show some more respect for the owner of the site.

How does everyone here feel about MBIII vs JJ? I personally feel that MBIII fits your system better.

[leroyisgod]

Come on guys, let's show some more respect for the owner of the site.

How does everyone here feel about MBIII vs JJ? I personally feel that MBIII fits your system better.

I think MBIII is obviously the hot one right now, but we need both of them in there. JJ gives you that home run threat that MBIII lacks. And MBIII gives you that explosiveness and tough running that JJ lacks.

[bigbluedefense]

Im not a big fan of homerun threats personally. MBIII runs for average, thats what you want. He puts you in 3rd and short situations, he keeps drives alive and takes time off the clock, and can be trusted in the goalline. With a power runner like him, he may not provide instant homerun ability like Jones, but after pounding a defense for 3 quarters, he'll break one in the 4th. I think your offense runs with much more efficiency with MBIII. If its a contract year for JJ, id let him go, he's not worth reinvesting into. You can find his replacement in the later rounds this year.

Ive always felt that unless you have a premiere RB, theres no point in resigning the one you got. Theres so many talented RBs in the draft each year, youre better off getting fresh legs.

[DMWSackMachine]

and the one that Kiwi got was not a sack, and even if it was you can't blame Colombo for it, Romo scrambled right into the defender after he was blocked for the entire play

How is the Kiwi one not a sack? It might not have been Colombo's fault but it was a sack.

I wrote a huge response to BBD's game breakdown yesterday, but when I submitted it to the site it got wiped out. I'm going to rehash it sometime this week, but you know how depressing it is when you spend a lot of time and effort on a post and it gets erased.

But anyhow, I wrote in detail about that "sack", and I find it funny that no one has brought this up, but it was a textbook case of the "tuck rule" that has become so infamous. Romo was moving forward, pumped the ball once, and never brought it back to his body, he took a step or two and was hit and the ball came out. According to the rule, which has been discussed ad-naseum on NFL Network, ESPN, and FSN, it should have been ruled as an incomplete pass. I am shocked that no one has picked up on this. I was freaking out watching the game as it happened. Just a blatant oversight.

[Jughead10]

and the one that Kiwi got was not a sack, and even if it was you can't blame Colombo for it, Romo scrambled right into the defender after he was blocked for the entire play

How is the Kiwi one not a sack? It might not have been Colombo's fault but it was a sack.

I wrote a huge response to BBD's game breakdown yesterday, but when I submitted it to the site it got wiped out. I'm going to rehash it sometime this week, but you know how depressing it is when you spend a lot of time and effort on a post and it gets erased.

But anyhow, I wrote in detail about that "sack", and I find it funny that no one has brought this up, but it was a textbook case of the "tuck rule" that has become so infamous. Romo was moving forward, pumped the ball once, and never brought it back to his body, he took a step or two and was hit and the ball came out. According to the rule, which has been discussed ad-naseum on NFL Network, ESPN, and FSN, it should have been ruled as an incomplete pass. I am shocked that no one has picked up on this. I was freaking out watching the game as it happened. Just a blatant oversight.

Oh I disagree. He definately brought that ball back down to his body. The ball was below his shoulder after the pump when Kiwi hit it. How else could Kiwi hit it directly with a lowered helmet?

[bigbluedefense]

Meh, the tuck rule is a bogus rule anyway. They never enforce it, it was arguably one of the worst calls in playoff history, no one ever calls the tuck rule. I personally feel it was a fumble, I can't say for 100% because I need to see a replay, but I saw no indication the first time how it would not be a fumble.

Did anyone else notice TO pull a Plaxico on Romo's 2nd INT? I know it was way overthrown, but he couldve tried to tackle Demps or something, he just stopped and put his hands down.

[DMWSackMachine]

Oh I disagree. He definately brought that ball back down to his body. The ball was below his shoulder after the pump when Kiwi hit it. How else could Kiwi hit it directly with a lowered helmet?

That is not the rule. The rule states that the quarterback must bring the ball into his body and "tuck it in" between his torso and arm. In theory, the QB can pump once, then run around for 35 seconds in the pocket, get hit, and fumble and it would still be an incomplete pass. Once the motion of the arm has started forward, the QB is considered to be in the act of passing until the ball is gone or he tucks it away. There is no arguing this. It wasn't even close.

Meh, the tuck rule is a bogus rule anyway. They never enforce it, it was arguably one of the worst calls in playoff history, no one ever calls the tuck rule. I personally feel it was a fumble, I can't say for 100% because I need to see a replay, but I saw no indication the first time how it would not be a fumble.

Did anyone else notice TO pull a Plaxico on Romo's 2nd INT? I know it was way overthrown, but he couldve tried to tackle Demps or something, he just stopped and put his hands down.

I agree that it's a bogus rule, and I agree that (judging by intent) it should have been a fumble. But according to the rules the game is played by it was an incomplete pass, and not only did they miss the call, but I haven't heard it mentioned anywhere over the last couple days. It's almost like it never happened. Supposedly, the reason why they don't change it is because of an inability to write a rule that is pratical enough to enforce in a game. It has been looked over time and time again, and they refuse to change it. Fine. But it should be called fairly, and I believe that the NFL should issue the Cowboys an apology for missing what could have been a critical call in a huge game after they have gone to such lengths to justify not only the validity of this rule, but the importance of it as well. It's BS.


Yes, I did notice T.O. loafing it on that one. It happens all the time with WR. Plax isn't the only one. But it isn't the same as what Plaxico did at Tennesee. He was in position to actually prevent the Int, whereas TO was only able to save his team a chunk of yards. Still, not something you want to see out of your 10mil per year WR.

[DMWSackMachine]

Meh, the tuck rule is a bogus rule anyway. They never enforce it, it was arguably one of the worst calls in playoff history, no one ever calls the tuck rule. I personally feel it was a fumble, I can't say for 100% because I need to see a replay, but I saw no indication the first time how it would not be a fumble.

Did anyone else notice TO pull a Plaxico on Romo's 2nd INT? I know it was way overthrown, but he couldve tried to tackle Demps or something, he just stopped and put his hands down.

Btw, that is not true, either. Last year in a game against Washington, Jake Plummer made a play in which the ball was dropped and recovered in the endzone by his own lineman for a safety, in a game that Washington lost narrowly. It was reviewed and ruled and incomplete pass by virtue of the tuck rule. It could be argued that it cost the Skins the game.

Also, Mike Perriera has stated that it is usually a rule that comes into play 8 to 12 times a season, and it regularly called by his officials. I, personally, have only seen it called 3 times in the last two years. But it is actually used on a mandatory basis.

[bigbluedefense]

Any concerns over TO's drops this year? He couldve kept some key drives going in that game had he not dropped the ball. That could come back and haunt you guys in a key moment in the playoffs if he doesn't work on that.

And Id just like to state, with all the big names on your defense, like Ware, Roy, James etc, to me the best player on that defense is clearly Terrance Newman. I know he doesn't cover one player the entire game, but whoever he is covering at any given moment is covered, all game. He's a top 3 corner in my book, 3rd to only Champ and McCallister.

One thing he does need to work on is breaking on the ball and creating turnovers. In fact, the entire Dallas secondary is more of a "cover the guy" kind of secondary, meaning they don't necessarily play the ball. I think thats why you see a lack of INTs out of this defense, even though they have a stellar secondary. If TNew can pick the ball like Champ, you could make a strong case for him being the 2nd best in the league.

[D-Unit]

Without Newman, we are a terrible team. That's how much I respect his play. You are exactly right about our secondary. Roy is our interception specialist... that alone speaks volumes about their ability to create turnovers.

Which is a big reason why... Reggie Nelson is my #1 player on my big board.

My DC Big Board:
1. Reggie Nelson - There are still Pat Watkins supporters...and I'm still in support of keeping him on the team. ...but Nelson is the answer.

2. OT (BPA) - Don't tell me McQuistan is our future.

3. Tank Tyler - A beastly lineman. Some wonder if he could play NT in the 3-4, but I think he could.

4. Justin Blalock - Been a favorite for a long time... but there are other ways to fill OG.

5. Michael Griffin - Love what he brings to the table.

[Number 10]

Without Newman, we are a terrible team. That's how much I respect his play. You are exactly right about our secondary. Roy is our interception specialist... that alone speaks volumes about their ability to create turnovers.

Which is a big reason why... Reggie Nelson is my #1 player on my big board.

My DC Big Board:
1. Reggie Nelson - There are still Pat Watkins supporters...and I'm still in support of keeping him on the team. ...but Nelson is the answer.

2. OT (BPA) - Don't tell me McQuistan is our future.

3. Tank Tyler - A beastly lineman. Some wonder if he could play NT in the 3-4, but I think he could.

4. Justin Blalock - Been a favorite for a long time... but there are other ways to fill OG.

5. Michael Griffin - Love what he brings to the table.

I agree with you on Newman. A big part of me wishes Balaskonis was still here so I could give him props for being all about him this past offseason. I told him that he was overrating Newman, but the kid is the real deal.

Your draft...I think no matter what, I don't care who falls, you have to take the BA OL. You have enough 1st round talent on the D, and you can find a coverage safety in round 2 or 3.

[thule]

Without Newman, we are a terrible team. That's how much I respect his play. You are exactly right about our secondary. Roy is our interception specialist... that alone speaks volumes about their ability to create turnovers.

Which is a big reason why... Reggie Nelson is my #1 player on my big board.

My DC Big Board:
1. Reggie Nelson - There are still Pat Watkins supporters...and I'm still in support of keeping him on the team. ...but Nelson is the answer.

2. OT (BPA) - Don't tell me McQuistan is our future.

3. Tank Tyler - A beastly lineman. Some wonder if he could play NT in the 3-4, but I think he could.

4. Justin Blalock - Been a favorite for a long time... but there are other ways to fill OG.

5. Michael Griffin - Love what he brings to the table.

Have you watched Michael Johnson outta arizona?

[Burns336]

as far as TO's drops go im not to worried, although i am confused. Sometimes romo will throw a bullet and hes got no problem snagging it, most of the drops come on regularly throw balls and wide open catches. I dont know if he is thinking about the run after catch and not concentrating or if he is thinking about a td celebration or what. he just needs to focus and it will be fine. all i can say is that he does things for this team that keyshawn, and for that matter, just about everyone outside the top 10 in the league couldnt do.

I wish newman was a little more aggressive but at the same time i see guys like arron glenn who go for the pick and sometimes it backfires. for example, the infamous santana moss game a year ago -- glenn could have batted one of the td's down but he went for the pick and didnt get it. Or you guys going for the pick on romo instead of batting that ball to crayton down.

Ive noticed one of Newmans picks got lost in the stats this year as well. Stats show that he has 1 pick returned for 12 yards but i know he picked off eli's overthrow to plax in the first game in the endzone for a touchback and i dont think its recorded.

As far as the mbIII/ jj debated, i think JJ has changed his style, he almost does the "jamal lewis" baby steps before he gets going and i think its really messing him up. He used to run alot harder in the sense that he would cut more and try to keep going after first contact and i think his prior injuries have resulted in him going down easy as if hes trying to avoid a third injury. If he got one more injury, he would be labled as an injury prone back for sure, but at the same time he needs to start running like he used to -- the system hasnt changed but he has. If he can return to his old form, i think MBIII stays as the "back-up" even though playing time is about even right now.

[Burns336]

alright dude, see if you can find it here....
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/insider/columns/story?columnist=joyner_kc&id=2679672&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2finsider%2fcolumns%2fstory%3fcolumnist%3djoyner_ kc%26id%3d2679672

headline reads "Hall, Gamble don't deserve hype" so im assuming it breaks them down

Hall is giving up 10.8 yard per attempt. He has also given up a 40+ yard pass in 4 of his last 8 games.

Gamble is at 11 yards per attempt.

very interesting, thanks for taking the time to look that up. Hall is overrated plain and simple -- but im sure you've seen the argument now that atlantas scheme is what is getting him burnt.... :roll:

[D-Unit]

Without Newman, we are a terrible team. That's how much I respect his play. You are exactly right about our secondary. Roy is our interception specialist... that alone speaks volumes about their ability to create turnovers.

Which is a big reason why... Reggie Nelson is my #1 player on my big board.

My DC Big Board:
1. Reggie Nelson - There are still Pat Watkins supporters...and I'm still in support of keeping him on the team. ...but Nelson is the answer.

2. OT (BPA) - Don't tell me McQuistan is our future.

3. Tank Tyler - A beastly lineman. Some wonder if he could play NT in the 3-4, but I think he could.

4. Justin Blalock - Been a favorite for a long time... but there are other ways to fill OG.

5. Michael Griffin - Love what he brings to the table.

Have you watched Michael Johnson outta arizona?
No, but Mel Kiper is trying his darndest to get some attention on him.

[thule]

Without Newman, we are a terrible team. That's how much I respect his play. You are exactly right about our secondary. Roy is our interception specialist... that alone speaks volumes about their ability to create turnovers.

Which is a big reason why... Reggie Nelson is my #1 player on my big board.

My DC Big Board:
1. Reggie Nelson - There are still Pat Watkins supporters...and I'm still in support of keeping him on the team. ...but Nelson is the answer.

2. OT (BPA) - Don't tell me McQuistan is our future.

3. Tank Tyler - A beastly lineman. Some wonder if he could play NT in the 3-4, but I think he could.

4. Justin Blalock - Been a favorite for a long time... but there are other ways to fill OG.

5. Michael Griffin - Love what he brings to the table.

Have you watched Michael Johnson outta arizona?
No, but Mel Kiper is trying his darndest to get some attention on him.

He sorta turned me on to him. If he runs as good as kiper says...I think he would be a good option.

But really 3 Safeties could go before we pick. Landy/Nelson/Griffin I don't think it happens but good to keep our eyes open for something else. I don't think parcells goes west coast to often.

[bigmac076]

My Big Board:

1. OG - Justin Blalock - if he gets taken early we need to go NT or skill
2. CB - Marcus McCauley - would definetly be a quick contributor
3. S - Reggie Nelson - Nelson has natural skills that noone can be taught
4. NT - Tank Tyler - can sure up our d-line and give us youth across the board
5. WR - Sidney Rice - perfect blend of size and speed

Im not sold on tossing JJ out just yet. I think this is just a hot topic at the time, because of the fact that Barber is getting all the press. I like having the 2 to switch the running styles and keeping defenders guessing. I'd like to see us grab a QB late to add te depth we need. On day one I'd see us grab at least one skill and maybe a NT. Im looking for them to grab an OL from FA and an OL on day-one of the draft. If it doesnt look like a situation where we are gonna get a NT we should go back to the skill spots.

[bigbluedefense]

You guys can't have Reggie Nelson! We need him more! :evil: :evil:





:(

[D-Unit]

My Big Board:

1. OG - Justin Blalock - if he gets taken early we need to go NT or skill
2. CB - Marcus McCauley - would definetly be a quick contributor
3. S - Reggie Nelson - Nelson has natural skills that noone can be taught
4. NT - Tank Tyler - can sure up our d-line and give us youth across the board
5. WR - Sidney Rice - perfect blend of size and speed

Im not sold on tossing JJ out just yet. I think this is just a hot topic at the time, because of the fact that Barber is getting all the press. I like having the 2 to switch the running styles and keeping defenders guessing. I'd like to see us grab a QB late to add te depth we need. On day one I'd see us grab at least one skill and maybe a NT. Im looking for them to grab an OL from FA and an OL on day-one of the draft. If it doesnt look like a situation where we are gonna get a NT we should go back to the skill spots.
Have you seen McCauley play? Or are you basing this off "experts" opinions? Just asking.

[dpl85]

Come on guys, let's show some more respect for the owner of the site.

How does everyone here feel about MBIII vs JJ? I personally feel that MBIII fits your system better.
I can only assume this was directed at me but I'm a little confused. How was that disrespectful to Scott? I was just voicing a dissenting opinion in what I believe was a respectful manner.

[Poet3334]

Come on guys, let's show some more respect for the owner of the site.

How does everyone here feel about MBIII vs JJ? I personally feel that MBIII fits your system better.
I can only assume this was directed at me but I'm a little confused. How was that disrespectful to Scott? I was just voicing a dissenting opinion in what I believe was a respectful manner.

I just think Scott's assessment of Columbo is incorrect.

[bigbluedefense]

Come on guys, let's show some more respect for the owner of the site.

How does everyone here feel about MBIII vs JJ? I personally feel that MBIII fits your system better.
I can only assume this was directed at me but I'm a little confused. How was that disrespectful to Scott? I was just voicing a dissenting opinion in what I believe was a respectful manner.

I don't think it was you. I couldve sworn I read somewhere someone call him an idiot or something. Maybe I read something wrong.

[draftguru151]

Does anyone have the video of Williams intercepting mcnabb last year?

[LSUALUM99]

Ok, some of the comments from people that I respect on this board are completely off base. I have no idea why, but your information is just plain wrong.

First - On the secondary / interception issue. Dallas is #8 in the NFL in INTs at 14. 16 INTS would be good enough for 4th place, it's not as if Dallas isn't doing a good job of intercepting the ball, in fact, Dallas' Defense is 4th in the entire NFL at causing turn overs. Compared to say Washington which is dead last.

Second - regarding the OL. Dallas is #8 in the NFL in total rushing yards (without a rushing QB like Tennessee and Atlanta to skew the stats btw). Dallas is 2nd in the NFL in rushing TDs. Dallas is 4th in the NFL in passing yards. Dallas is 15th in the NFL in Sacks allowed, despite the fact that Bledsoe took a disproportionate amount of sacks at the position than most NFL quarterbacks.

If it's known that Dallas doesn't have a feature back like LT, LJ or Emmit Smith. It's known that TO drops too many passes and Witten had been underperforming early in the season. It's known that Romo is an inexperienced QB. Now, how can anyone know all this, and look at the statistics and then conclude that the OL is a major problem?

If Shaun Alexander and LJ are said to be successful b/c of their OL. If Denver's RB's are given no credit because of the OL. If Edgerrin James is given a pass b/c the OL is bad in Arizona, then how does the Dallas OL get so little respect? The bottom line is that the OL is not only not bad, it's actually GOOD.

READ WITH ME - the Dallas OL is GOOD. It's not a weakness of the team. The facts are hard to bear for some people but they are indeed facts.

You cannot conclude the Rushing proficiency is due to a stud back. You cannot conclude that the WR's are destroying teams. You cannot conclude that John Elway is the QB so the OL doesn't matter. You have to conclude that either ROMO is the best QB in the game (which is a silly conclusion) or that the OL is indeed Good.

[D-Unit]

You guys can't have Reggie Nelson! We need him more! :evil: :evil:





:(
You guys are drafting Landry.

[draftguru151]

I agree with you on Newman. A big part of me wishes Balaskonis was still here so I could give him props for being all about him this past offseason. I told him that he was overrating Newman, but the kid is the real deal.

He IMed me telling me to vote for Newman for the pro bowl.

[bigbluedefense]

Ok, some of the comments from people that I respect on this board are completely off base. I have no idea why, but your information is just plain wrong.

First - On the secondary / interception issue. Dallas is #8 in the NFL in INTs at 14. 16 INTS would be good enough for 4th place, it's not as if Dallas isn't doing a good job of intercepting the ball, in fact, Dallas' Defense is 4th in the entire NFL at causing turn overs. Compared to say Washington which is dead last.

Second - regarding the OL. Dallas is #8 in the NFL in total rushing yards (without a rushing QB like Tennessee and Atlanta to skew the stats btw). Dallas is 2nd in the NFL in rushing TDs. Dallas is 4th in the NFL in passing yards. Dallas is 15th in the NFL in Sacks allowed, despite the fact that Bledsoe took a disproportionate amount of sacks at the position than most NFL quarterbacks.

If it's known that Dallas doesn't have a feature back like LT, LJ or Emmit Smith. It's known that TO drops too many passes and Witten had been underperforming early in the season. It's known that Romo is an inexperienced QB. Now, how can anyone know all this, and look at the statistics and then conclude that the OL is a major problem?

If Shaun Alexander and LJ are said to be successful b/c of their OL. If Denver's RB's are given no credit because of the OL. If Edgerrin James is given a pass b/c the OL is bad in Arizona, then how does the Dallas OL get so little respect? The bottom line is that the OL is not only not bad, it's actually GOOD.

READ WITH ME - the Dallas OL is GOOD. It's not a weakness of the team. The facts are hard to bear for some people but they are indeed facts.

You cannot conclude the Rushing proficiency is due to a stud back. You cannot conclude that the WR's are destroying teams. You cannot conclude that John Elway is the QB so the OL doesn't matter. You have to conclude that either ROMO is the best QB in the game (which is a silly conclusion) or that the OL is indeed Good.

Just want to clarify a couple of things.

1. The team does a good job at INTs, but most are from the LB core. How many of those INTs are attributed to your corners? Probably less than 40%, which goes back to my statement that the corners play the man and not the ball. The LBs in your scheme primarily hover in the middle and play a zone, so theres a chance for INTs, but the secondary does not get many INTs. I probably shouldve specified this, I made the error of attributing their lack of INTs to the entire defense, and I was incorrect for doing that.

2. The oline. The oline has played well since Romo came in. Ive stated before that Bledsoe has made this oline look much worse than it really is. In fact, he's made every oline he's played with look much worse than it is. But at the same time, Romo is one of the best qb's in the game at buying time. He's very elusive. He is on the opposite spectrum, he makes them look better than they really are. I personally think theyre a middle tier oline, not the best, not the worst.

3. The oline isn't bad, no doubt. But looking at this team, what other needs do you really have? You have a solid WR core. Im not sold on WR as a need, I think Crayton is solid at the 3 spot, and you can get later round WRs to fill an injury void if need be. RB is good with the 1, 2 punch you have. Defense is set in all positions except FS, but its too early to give up on Watkins, and with the safety depth in this draft, one can be had in round 2. So what else is there to draft? Ive said it before, and I'll say it again. You can never have TOO much oline. For a team with really no key areas of concern, I think drafting an olinemen in round 1 makes perfect sense. And an OG in round 3 in a draft rich in OG talent would make perfect sense too. Middle tier oline is good, but a top tier oline is even better. In a game decided in the trenches, why not go for it?

[D-Unit]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

[bigmac076]

My Big Board:

1. OG - Justin Blalock - if he gets taken early we need to go NT or skill
2. CB - Marcus McCauley - would definetly be a quick contributor
3. S - Reggie Nelson - Nelson has natural skills that noone can be taught
4. NT - Tank Tyler - can sure up our d-line and give us youth across the board
5. WR - Sidney Rice - perfect blend of size and speed

Im not sold on tossing JJ out just yet. I think this is just a hot topic at the time, because of the fact that Barber is getting all the press. I like having the 2 to switch the running styles and keeping defenders guessing. I'd like to see us grab a QB late to add te depth we need. On day one I'd see us grab at least one skill and maybe a NT. Im looking for them to grab an OL from FA and an OL on day-one of the draft. If it doesnt look like a situation where we are gonna get a NT we should go back to the skill spots.
Have you seen McCauley play? Or are you basing this off "experts" opinions? Just asking.

Mostly off rankings, I hate making these boards so early because I like to see what these guys do at the combine/school visits then make one accordingly. I really think we need a young CB to plug in before Glenn leaves though. Where do you stand on CB?

[Poet3334]

Does anyone have the video of Williams intercepting mcnabb last year?

That's the picture in my avatar.

[Staubach12]

For me at CB, I am very high on Jonathan Wade from Tennessee. He plays very well, and he's going in the mid-rounds. Big steal IMO. I really want him.

[D-Unit]

I'm a Daymeion Hughes fan through and through.

[bigmac076]

I'm a Daymeion Hughes fan through and through.

Ill make sure I catch the Holiday bowl

[$KidCowboy$]

Any concerns over TO's drops this year? He couldve kept some key drives going in that game had he not dropped the ball. That could come back and haunt you guys in a key moment in the playoffs if he doesn't work on that.

TO has alligator arms. Most have his drops have been when he loses concentration on the ball either looking for a hit upfield or expecting one. It's very easy to have happen. Being a wide reciever myself, the hardest thing is keeping your eye on the ball going across the middle. But..it's something a NFL superstar reciever should be able to to. Even if you watch replays of the ones that a hit was not coming, you can see his eyes are upfield rather on the ball. It's something I hope Haley is trying to correct..But hey, hes top 5 in almost every NFC WR catagory, so I'll take the drops..for now.

Now that I'm on the topic of WR's...
If you can find it, watch the video of Terry Glenn getting of the line on his deep in against the Giants. I watched it on NFLNetwork. Unbelievable how quick he is. I love him. Top 3 or 4 number 2 recievers in the league without a doubt. He seems to be stronger this year too, more power after the catch...when he decides to run with it. Both him and TO have been blocking tremendously downfield.

Patrick Crayton keeps impressing me. He makes tremendous catches, and his concentration is what TO should watch tape of. Takes contact and RARELY drops balls. On the out that was almost intercepted by Wilson, his concentration was amazing to be able to catch that ball after seeing it go through a players hands. He's a natural hands catcher, unlike TO. Also blocks well. Great learning curve for a "QB/WR/Return Specialist" coming out of college. Plays like a vet. I belive that it was him blocking on that big swing pass to Glenn.

Miles Austin is close to breaking one on a kickoff. I thought losing Tyson Thompson was going to be a huge loss, but im liking Austin more and more every week. Big, strong, fast. HUGE calves. "Goofy" according to Parcells (rookie awareness). We had great field position against NYG off kickoffs. A MAJOR factor in our win.

Sam Hurd=lucky. Twice this season he's been in the right place in the right time and has had a HUGE impact on the game. The recoveries against the Panthers and of Kiwi's fumble were huge.

[M.O.T.H.]

Any concerns over TO's drops this year? He couldve kept some key drives going in that game had he not dropped the ball. That could come back and haunt you guys in a key moment in the playoffs if he doesn't work on that.

TO has alligator arms. Most have his drops have been when he loses concentration on the ball either looking for a hit upfield or expecting one. It's very easy to have happen. Being a wide reciever myself, the hardest thing is keeping your eye on the ball going across the middle. But..it's something a NFL superstar reciever should be able to to. Even if you watch replays of the ones that a hit was not coming, you can see his eyes are upfield rather on the ball. It's something I hope Haley is trying to correct..But hey, hes top 5 in almost every NFC WR catagory, so I'll take the drops..for now.

Now that I'm on the topic of WR's...
If you can find it, watch the video of Terry Glenn getting of the line on his deep in against the Giants. I watched it on NFLNetwork. Unbelievable how quick he is. I love him. Top 3 or 4 number 2 recievers in the league without a doubt. He seems to be stronger this year too, more power after the catch...when he decides to run with it. Both him and TO have been blocking tremendously downfield.

Patrick Crayton keeps impressing me. He makes tremendous catches, and his concentration is what TO should watch tape of. Takes contact and RARELY drops balls. On the out that was almost intercepted by Wilson, his concentration was amazing to be able to catch that ball after seeing it go through a players hands. He's a natural hands catcher, unlike TO. Also blocks well. Great learning curve for a "QB/WR/Return Specialist" coming out of college. Plays like a vet. I belive that it was him blocking on that big swing pass to Glenn.

Miles Austin is close to breaking one on a kickoff. I thought losing Tyson Thompson was going to be a huge loss, but im liking Austin more and more every week. Big, strong, fast. HUGE calves. "Goofy" according to Parcells (rookie awareness). We had great field position against NYG off kickoffs. A MAJOR factor in our win.

Sam Hurd=lucky. Twice this season he's been in the right place in the right time and has had a HUGE impact on the game. The recoveries against the Panthers and of Kiwi's fumble were huge.

I diagree, he goes directly to the sidelines, he doesnt run down the middle of the field. He has been great but, he wont take any back for 6, not with his style. I'm still very happy with him.

[draftguru151]

Does anyone have the video of Williams intercepting mcnabb last year?

That's the picture in my avatar.

:lol: Nice, just trying to get the video, one of my friends is an Eagle's fan, just trying to bring up some nice memories.

[$KidCowboy$]

Any concerns over TO's drops this year? He couldve kept some key drives going in that game had he not dropped the ball. That could come back and haunt you guys in a key moment in the playoffs if he doesn't work on that.

TO has alligator arms. Most have his drops have been when he loses concentration on the ball either looking for a hit upfield or expecting one. It's very easy to have happen. Being a wide reciever myself, the hardest thing is keeping your eye on the ball going across the middle. But..it's something a NFL superstar reciever should be able to to. Even if you watch replays of the ones that a hit was not coming, you can see his eyes are upfield rather on the ball. It's something I hope Haley is trying to correct..But hey, hes top 5 in almost every NFC WR catagory, so I'll take the drops..for now.

Now that I'm on the topic of WR's...
If you can find it, watch the video of Terry Glenn getting of the line on his deep in against the Giants. I watched it on NFLNetwork. Unbelievable how quick he is. I love him. Top 3 or 4 number 2 recievers in the league without a doubt. He seems to be stronger this year too, more power after the catch...when he decides to run with it. Both him and TO have been blocking tremendously downfield.

Patrick Crayton keeps impressing me. He makes tremendous catches, and his concentration is what TO should watch tape of. Takes contact and RARELY drops balls. On the out that was almost intercepted by Wilson, his concentration was amazing to be able to catch that ball after seeing it go through a players hands. He's a natural hands catcher, unlike TO. Also blocks well. Great learning curve for a "QB/WR/Return Specialist" coming out of college. Plays like a vet. I belive that it was him blocking on that big swing pass to Glenn.

Miles Austin is close to breaking one on a kickoff. I thought losing Tyson Thompson was going to be a huge loss, but im liking Austin more and more every week. Big, strong, fast. HUGE calves. "Goofy" according to Parcells (rookie awareness). We had great field position against NYG off kickoffs. A MAJOR factor in our win.

Sam Hurd=lucky. Twice this season he's been in the right place in the right time and has had a HUGE impact on the game. The recoveries against the Panthers and of Kiwi's fumble were huge.

I diagree, he goes directly to the sidelines, he doesnt run down the middle of the field. He has been great but, he wont take any back for 6, not with his style. I'm still very happy with him.

Yeah thats what I thought until I watched it over again. I may be wrong, but it looks like hes trying to find a seam and he keeps stringing it out towards the sideline. When he does find one, he usually gets through it and then starts toward the sideline again. I feel like if a team doesn't collapse down towards the sideline enough he will have one man to beat and then open sailing. IMO 4.47 speed should be enough to not get caught. It's just a feeling I had watching some of those returns. It's different than the Patrick Crayton "I caught the punt now im running right at the sideline" kind of return (granted, a kick return. But I felt the need to express how much I hate Crayton's PR style) for sure. He's looking to get upfield I think, and presses to the sideline to try to find a gap. May be wrong though.

[Poet3334]

Does anyone have the video of Williams intercepting mcnabb last year?

That's the picture in my avatar.

:lol: Nice, just trying to get the video, one of my friends is an Eagle's fan, just trying to bring up some nice memories.

I managed to find it at a site called cowboysvids.com. I can link it, but it's there under the archives section.

[fryman]

Does anyone have the video of Williams intercepting mcnabb last year?

That's the picture in my avatar.

:lol: Nice, just trying to get the video, one of my friends is an Eagle's fan, just trying to bring up some nice memories.

it's like second highlight in- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YI16QMQvv_A



EDIT: just checked out the one Poet posted and it is better.

[D-Unit]

I have VERY HIGH hopes for Miles Austin. I like him a lot.

I think he could be our future #1 receiver.

[Ward]

I have VERY HIGH hopes for Miles Austin. I like him a lot.

I think he could be our future #1 receiver.

I like Sam Hurd better personally. Two different kinds of players, but I think Hurd is going to be big-time.

[LSUALUM99]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

[bigbluedefense]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

We just have a difference of opinion on this one. Im highly opposed to the notions that stats can tell the whole story, if thats the case, then Elway wasn't a great quarterback because he had a mid 50s completion %, and we all know that to be a poor assumption. If thats also the case, than most years the team with the best record should win the superbowl, since logic tells you moreos than not, the best team should win. However we know that to be incorrect, the best record usually doesn't win the SB if anything.

I also have a difference of opinion on draft quality. I personally feel that skill position players are highly overrated. I think its more important to build your trenches in the early rounds. You can have the best WR in the world, if you don't have an oline that can give him time to run routes, he's worthless. See Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds as an example. At the same time, you can have an average WR, if he has 5 seconds to get open, he'll get open. See KC's WR core, Philly's WR core, or SD's core as examples of that. It all starts with the lines, on both sides of the ball. Id invest my money in the trenches before anything else. Especially on a team with no glaring weakness at the skill positions like yours.

But drafting/FA philosophies are just that. There truely is no right or wrong answer in the approach. Thats just a difference of opinion.

[bigbluedefense]

Any concerns over TO's drops this year? He couldve kept some key drives going in that game had he not dropped the ball. That could come back and haunt you guys in a key moment in the playoffs if he doesn't work on that.

TO has alligator arms. Most have his drops have been when he loses concentration on the ball either looking for a hit upfield or expecting one. It's very easy to have happen. Being a wide reciever myself, the hardest thing is keeping your eye on the ball going across the middle. But..it's something a NFL superstar reciever should be able to to. Even if you watch replays of the ones that a hit was not coming, you can see his eyes are upfield rather on the ball. It's something I hope Haley is trying to correct..But hey, hes top 5 in almost every NFC WR catagory, so I'll take the drops..for now.

Now that I'm on the topic of WR's...
If you can find it, watch the video of Terry Glenn getting of the line on his deep in against the Giants. I watched it on NFLNetwork. Unbelievable how quick he is. I love him. Top 3 or 4 number 2 recievers in the league without a doubt. He seems to be stronger this year too, more power after the catch...when he decides to run with it. Both him and TO have been blocking tremendously downfield.

Patrick Crayton keeps impressing me. He makes tremendous catches, and his concentration is what TO should watch tape of. Takes contact and RARELY drops balls. On the out that was almost intercepted by Wilson, his concentration was amazing to be able to catch that ball after seeing it go through a players hands. He's a natural hands catcher, unlike TO. Also blocks well. Great learning curve for a "QB/WR/Return Specialist" coming out of college. Plays like a vet. I belive that it was him blocking on that big swing pass to Glenn.

Miles Austin is close to breaking one on a kickoff. I thought losing Tyson Thompson was going to be a huge loss, but im liking Austin more and more every week. Big, strong, fast. HUGE calves. "Goofy" according to Parcells (rookie awareness). We had great field position against NYG off kickoffs. A MAJOR factor in our win.

Sam Hurd=lucky. Twice this season he's been in the right place in the right time and has had a HUGE impact on the game. The recoveries against the Panthers and of Kiwi's fumble were huge.

I also agree that Crayton is gonna be a good player. If you noticed, Crayton and Romo have great chemistry. Romo is very comfortable checking down to Crayton, and he's an important piece to this offense for Romo. He has sure hands, and will make tough catches. He's like your Toomer, he keeps drives going when s--t hits the fan. I think he's a solid 3, and with more time to develop, can become a solid 2 as a possession receiver.

[LSUALUM99]

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/6242424


Check the rankings --- again, the rankings here are not some random determination. It's based on the fact that they analyze all the plays in the NFL for each weak statistically.

[Poet3334]

I have VERY HIGH hopes for Miles Austin. I like him a lot.

I think he could be our future #1 receiver.

I like Sam Hurd better personally. Two different kinds of players, but I think Hurd is going to be big-time.

I think they're going to compliment each other very well. I think this young group has tremendous potential.

[Poet3334]

You're seeing better O-line play because of Romo, but more importantly, I think there is better cohesion between the group. Playing together speaks volumes for a unit. Our line is an example of that. Are they perfect? Not by any means, but they are gelling. You can make a case for LSU's argument because of the success we're having. You can make a case for D-Unit and BBD's argument because having consistent quality depth in the trenches is crucial in the league today. I enjoy the posts you guys make. Excellent reads.

[Poet3334]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2688355


What do you guys think?

[leroyisgod]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2688355


What do you guys think?

Parrish? I don't think there's any reason to sign him at this point.

[DMWSackMachine]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

We just have a difference of opinion on this one. Im highly opposed to the notions that stats can tell the whole story, if thats the case, then Elway wasn't a great quarterback because he had a mid 50s completion %, and we all know that to be a poor assumption. If thats also the case, than most years the team with the best record should win the superbowl, since logic tells you moreos than not, the best team should win. However we know that to be incorrect, the best record usually doesn't win the SB if anything.

I also have a difference of opinion on draft quality. I personally feel that skill position players are highly overrated. I think its more important to build your trenches in the early rounds. You can have the best WR in the world, if you don't have an oline that can give him time to run routes, he's worthless. See Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds as an example. At the same time, you can have an average WR, if he has 5 seconds to get open, he'll get open. See KC's WR core, Philly's WR core, or SD's core as examples of that. It all starts with the lines, on both sides of the ball. Id invest my money in the trenches before anything else. Especially on a team with no glaring weakness at the skill positions like yours.

But drafting/FA philosophies are just that. There truely is no right or wrong answer in the approach. Thats just a difference of opinion.

I agree with both of you, in spots. First of all, of all the positions in the NFL to evaluate, OT is said to be the easiest and least risky. Simply put, there are less moving parts/variables to take into account, and you usually don't have the added burden of dealing with the "swollen head syndrome" that skill position players get when they start having success, because OL generally go unnoticed, and hence un-flattered.

Because of all this, the absolute cream of the crop O-lineman rarely ever escape notice. Usually when they do, it's a result of them playing for a small school (like LA), or injuries/lack of opportunity to show what they have. Hence, you are almost never going to get a shot at the Pace, Ogden, Boselli, Munoz, Walter Jones, Hutchinson, Roaf, Faneca or Andrews types without using a top pick on them.

We have no shot at the top OTs this year because of our draft position likely being in the late 20s to early 30s. However, because OGs are thought to be less valuable and/or rare, the top prospects at that position usually drop down to the second half of round one. This year, to me, the only guy fitting that profile has got to be Blalock. If we go OL in round 1, it has to be him, period. I don't want to take a shot at the second tier OTs like Levi Brown. I would much rather wait until at least the end of round 2 to take a shot at a OT, and even then I would rather not.

To me, there are two types of O-lineman. The can't-miss kind and the developmental kind. Usually it takes a top 20 pick to get ahold of the can't misses, and the developmental kind can be found almost as easily at the end of round 6 as the end of round 1. So, to me, it's either Thomas, Long, Baker or Blalock in the 1st, or wait til later.

I do not think we have a huge need at OL. However, I would agree that it is probably our biggest one, simply because of the lack of holes elsewhere. But if we are going to draft one that high, I want a dominator inside like Justin. Otherwise, we can bolster it with some later round developmental types.

I am on board with the idea of building a dominant offensive line, and if we have a shot at that, we should definitely go for it. The value of having a unit like that cannot be overstated. Our success in the early 90s all began up front with those big boys.


I'm starting to think that we should take a look at Anthony Spencer, though. We simply must have more pressure on the QB, and if that means bringing him in to play ROLB and moving DeMarcus to SOLB, then so be it, but we just are not generating enough pressure, and that cannot be accepted.

Our needs, imo:

1. OG/OL
2. FS
3. Pass rush
4. Pass rush
5. Pass rush
6. Pass rush
7. RB

[Poet3334]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

We just have a difference of opinion on this one. Im highly opposed to the notions that stats can tell the whole story, if thats the case, then Elway wasn't a great quarterback because he had a mid 50s completion %, and we all know that to be a poor assumption. If thats also the case, than most years the team with the best record should win the superbowl, since logic tells you moreos than not, the best team should win. However we know that to be incorrect, the best record usually doesn't win the SB if anything.

I also have a difference of opinion on draft quality. I personally feel that skill position players are highly overrated. I think its more important to build your trenches in the early rounds. You can have the best WR in the world, if you don't have an oline that can give him time to run routes, he's worthless. See Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds as an example. At the same time, you can have an average WR, if he has 5 seconds to get open, he'll get open. See KC's WR core, Philly's WR core, or SD's core as examples of that. It all starts with the lines, on both sides of the ball. Id invest my money in the trenches before anything else. Especially on a team with no glaring weakness at the skill positions like yours.

But drafting/FA philosophies are just that. There truely is no right or wrong answer in the approach. Thats just a difference of opinion.

I agree with both of you, in spots. First of all, of all the positions in the NFL to evaluate, OT is said to be the easiest and least risky. Simply put, there are less moving parts/variables to take into account, and you usually don't have the added burden of dealing with the "swollen head syndrome" that skill position players get when they start having success, because OL generally go unnoticed, and hence un-flattered.

Because of all this, the absolute cream of the crop O-lineman rarely ever escape notice. Usually when they do, it's a result of them playing for a small school (like LA), or injuries/lack of opportunity to show what they have. Hence, you are almost never going to get a shot at the Pace, Ogden, Boselli, Munoz, Walter Jones, Hutchinson, Roaf, Faneca or Andrews types without using a top pick on them.

We have no shot at the top OTs this year because of our draft position likely being in the late 20s to early 30s. However, because OGs are thought to be less valuable and/or rare, the top prospects at that position usually drop down to the second half of round one. This year, to me, the only guy fitting that profile has got to be Blalock. If we go OL in round 1, it has to be him, period. I don't want to take a shot at the second tier OTs like Levi Brown. I would much rather wait until at least the end of round 2 to take a shot at a OT, and even then I would rather not.

To me, there are two types of O-lineman. The can't-miss kind and the developmental kind. Usually it takes a top 20 pick to get ahold of the can't misses, and the developmental kind can be found almost as easily at the end of round 6 as the end of round 1. So, to me, it's either Thomas, Long, Baker or Blalock in the 1st, or wait til later.

I do not think we have a huge need at OL. However, I would agree that it is probably our biggest one, simply because of the lack of holes elsewhere. But if we are going to draft one that high, I want a dominator inside like Justin. Otherwise, we can bolster it with some later round developmental types.

I am on board with the idea of building a dominant offensive line, and if we have a shot at that, we should definitely go for it. The value of having a unit like that cannot be overstated. Our success in the early 90s all began up front with those big boys.


I'm starting to think that we should take a look at Anthony Spencer, though. We simply must have more pressure on the QB, and if that means bringing him in to play ROLB and moving DeMarcus to SOLB, then so be it, but we just are not generating enough pressure, and that cannot be accepted.

Our needs, imo:

1. OG/OL
2. FS
3. Pass rush
4. Pass rush
5. Pass rush
6. Pass rush
7. RB

Excellent point. I go back and forth with drafting another hybrid given the depth with have at that position. But the lack of pressure is troubling. I think we should also consider briging in a penetrating DT to provide push up the middle. That would help our all of our linebackers get better pressure. All of those near misses DWare has would be sacks since the QB wouldn't have anywhere to go.

[Poet3334]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

We just have a difference of opinion on this one. Im highly opposed to the notions that stats can tell the whole story, if thats the case, then Elway wasn't a great quarterback because he had a mid 50s completion %, and we all know that to be a poor assumption. If thats also the case, than most years the team with the best record should win the superbowl, since logic tells you moreos than not, the best team should win. However we know that to be incorrect, the best record usually doesn't win the SB if anything.

I also have a difference of opinion on draft quality. I personally feel that skill position players are highly overrated. I think its more important to build your trenches in the early rounds. You can have the best WR in the world, if you don't have an oline that can give him time to run routes, he's worthless. See Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds as an example. At the same time, you can have an average WR, if he has 5 seconds to get open, he'll get open. See KC's WR core, Philly's WR core, or SD's core as examples of that. It all starts with the lines, on both sides of the ball. Id invest my money in the trenches before anything else. Especially on a team with no glaring weakness at the skill positions like yours.

But drafting/FA philosophies are just that. There truely is no right or wrong answer in the approach. Thats just a difference of opinion.

I agree with both of you, in spots. First of all, of all the positions in the NFL to evaluate, OT is said to be the easiest and least risky. Simply put, there are less moving parts/variables to take into account, and you usually don't have the added burden of dealing with the "swollen head syndrome" that skill position players get when they start having success, because OL generally go unnoticed, and hence un-flattered.

Because of all this, the absolute cream of the crop O-lineman rarely ever escape notice. Usually when they do, it's a result of them playing for a small school (like LA), or injuries/lack of opportunity to show what they have. Hence, you are almost never going to get a shot at the Pace, Ogden, Boselli, Munoz, Walter Jones, Hutchinson, Roaf, Faneca or Andrews types without using a top pick on them.

We have no shot at the top OTs this year because of our draft position likely being in the late 20s to early 30s. However, because OGs are thought to be less valuable and/or rare, the top prospects at that position usually drop down to the second half of round one. This year, to me, the only guy fitting that profile has got to be Blalock. If we go OL in round 1, it has to be him, period. I don't want to take a shot at the second tier OTs like Levi Brown. I would much rather wait until at least the end of round 2 to take a shot at a OT, and even then I would rather not.

To me, there are two types of O-lineman. The can't-miss kind and the developmental kind. Usually it takes a top 20 pick to get ahold of the can't misses, and the developmental kind can be found almost as easily at the end of round 6 as the end of round 1. So, to me, it's either Thomas, Long, Baker or Blalock in the 1st, or wait til later.

I do not think we have a huge need at OL. However, I would agree that it is probably our biggest one, simply because of the lack of holes elsewhere. But if we are going to draft one that high, I want a dominator inside like Justin. Otherwise, we can bolster it with some later round developmental types.

I am on board with the idea of building a dominant offensive line, and if we have a shot at that, we should definitely go for it. The value of having a unit like that cannot be overstated. Our success in the early 90s all began up front with those big boys.


I'm starting to think that we should take a look at Anthony Spencer, though. We simply must have more pressure on the QB, and if that means bringing him in to play ROLB and moving DeMarcus to SOLB, then so be it, but we just are not generating enough pressure, and that cannot be accepted.

Our needs, imo:

1. OG/OL
2. FS
3. Pass rush
4. Pass rush
5. Pass rush
6. Pass rush
7. RB

Excellent point. I go back and forth with drafting another hybrid given the depth with have at that position. But the lack of pressure is troubling. I think we should also consider briging in a penetrating DT to provide push up the middle. That would help our all of our linebackers get better pressure. All of those near misses DWare has would be sacks since the QB wouldn't have anywhere to go.

[Poet3334]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

We just have a difference of opinion on this one. Im highly opposed to the notions that stats can tell the whole story, if thats the case, then Elway wasn't a great quarterback because he had a mid 50s completion %, and we all know that to be a poor assumption. If thats also the case, than most years the team with the best record should win the superbowl, since logic tells you moreos than not, the best team should win. However we know that to be incorrect, the best record usually doesn't win the SB if anything.

I also have a difference of opinion on draft quality. I personally feel that skill position players are highly overrated. I think its more important to build your trenches in the early rounds. You can have the best WR in the world, if you don't have an oline that can give him time to run routes, he's worthless. See Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds as an example. At the same time, you can have an average WR, if he has 5 seconds to get open, he'll get open. See KC's WR core, Philly's WR core, or SD's core as examples of that. It all starts with the lines, on both sides of the ball. Id invest my money in the trenches before anything else. Especially on a team with no glaring weakness at the skill positions like yours.

But drafting/FA philosophies are just that. There truely is no right or wrong answer in the approach. Thats just a difference of opinion.

I agree with both of you, in spots. First of all, of all the positions in the NFL to evaluate, OT is said to be the easiest and least risky. Simply put, there are less moving parts/variables to take into account, and you usually don't have the added burden of dealing with the "swollen head syndrome" that skill position players get when they start having success, because OL generally go unnoticed, and hence un-flattered.

Because of all this, the absolute cream of the crop O-lineman rarely ever escape notice. Usually when they do, it's a result of them playing for a small school (like LA), or injuries/lack of opportunity to show what they have. Hence, you are almost never going to get a shot at the Pace, Ogden, Boselli, Munoz, Walter Jones, Hutchinson, Roaf, Faneca or Andrews types without using a top pick on them.

We have no shot at the top OTs this year because of our draft position likely being in the late 20s to early 30s. However, because OGs are thought to be less valuable and/or rare, the top prospects at that position usually drop down to the second half of round one. This year, to me, the only guy fitting that profile has got to be Blalock. If we go OL in round 1, it has to be him, period. I don't want to take a shot at the second tier OTs like Levi Brown. I would much rather wait until at least the end of round 2 to take a shot at a OT, and even then I would rather not.

To me, there are two types of O-lineman. The can't-miss kind and the developmental kind. Usually it takes a top 20 pick to get ahold of the can't misses, and the developmental kind can be found almost as easily at the end of round 6 as the end of round 1. So, to me, it's either Thomas, Long, Baker or Blalock in the 1st, or wait til later.

I do not think we have a huge need at OL. However, I would agree that it is probably our biggest one, simply because of the lack of holes elsewhere. But if we are going to draft one that high, I want a dominator inside like Justin. Otherwise, we can bolster it with some later round developmental types.

I am on board with the idea of building a dominant offensive line, and if we have a shot at that, we should definitely go for it. The value of having a unit like that cannot be overstated. Our success in the early 90s all began up front with those big boys.


I'm starting to think that we should take a look at Anthony Spencer, though. We simply must have more pressure on the QB, and if that means bringing him in to play ROLB and moving DeMarcus to SOLB, then so be it, but we just are not generating enough pressure, and that cannot be accepted.

Our needs, imo:

1. OG/OL
2. FS
3. Pass rush
4. Pass rush
5. Pass rush
6. Pass rush
7. RB

Excellent point. I go back and forth with drafting another hybrid given the depth with have at that position. But the lack of pressure is troubling. I think we should also consider briging in a penetrating DT to provide push up the middle. That would help our all of our linebackers get better pressure. All of those near misses DWare has would be sacks since the QB wouldn't have anywhere to go.

[Poet3334]

I'm with BBD.

Stats are like bikinis... they show some things, but not all.

LSU, pull that bikini down and you'll see what we see! :lol:

Actually No, the numbers only show the truth. Your quote is generally a quote that someone says when they have their mind made up and refuse to use actual numbers to validate their point.

When taken in context, numbers tell the WHOLE story. It's like a respected coach once said, you are what you are. People say all the time that a team is 'not really a 500 team' or a team is 'not nearly as good as the record indicates'. Well, no, actually they are. Trends can be used to qualify that statement, but you can't use trends without Data to make your point.

For instance, the 'best' team in the NFL over the course of the season has been the Chicago Bears. Both by record and by the quality of play. Now, notice I said the course of the season. Also, the best team in the last 8 games has been the Dallas Cowboys. (Data supplied by footballoutsiders.com). Now, you can analyze everything you want in the NFL, but if you want to look at the offensive production of the Dallas Cowboys you have to say the OL has been performing Good.

Could it be improved? Sure, but that's where we differ on the use of the money / draft picks. The dfference between a 1st round OL and a 5th round OL is not nearly as great as a 1st round CB and a 5th Round CB or a 1st round WR and a 5th round WR.

Diminshing returns, that's the key component to realize in the draft and in Free Agency.

That's why I'm opposed to drafting an OL in the first round of the draft. The potential for impact isn't as great as in a 'skill' position player.

We just have a difference of opinion on this one. Im highly opposed to the notions that stats can tell the whole story, if thats the case, then Elway wasn't a great quarterback because he had a mid 50s completion %, and we all know that to be a poor assumption. If thats also the case, than most years the team with the best record should win the superbowl, since logic tells you moreos than not, the best team should win. However we know that to be incorrect, the best record usually doesn't win the SB if anything.

I also have a difference of opinion on draft quality. I personally feel that skill position players are highly overrated. I think its more important to build your trenches in the early rounds. You can have the best WR in the world, if you don't have an oline that can give him time to run routes, he's worthless. See Andre Johnson and Eric Moulds as an example. At the same time, you can have an average WR, if he has 5 seconds to get open, he'll get open. See KC's WR core, Philly's WR core, or SD's core as examples of that. It all starts with the lines, on both sides of the ball. Id invest my money in the trenches before anything else. Especially on a team with no glaring weakness at the skill positions like yours.

But drafting/FA philosophies are just that. There truely is no right or wrong answer in the approach. Thats just a difference of opinion.

I agree with both of you, in spots. First of all, of all the positions in the NFL to evaluate, OT is said to be the easiest and least risky. Simply put, there are less moving parts/variables to take into account, and you usually don't have the added burden of dealing with the "swollen head syndrome" that skill position players get when they start having success, because OL generally go unnoticed, and hence un-flattered.

Because of all this, the absolute cream of the crop O-lineman rarely ever escape notice. Usually when they do, it's a result of them playing for a small school (like LA), or injuries/lack of opportunity to show what they have. Hence, you are almost never going to get a shot at the Pace, Ogden, Boselli, Munoz, Walter Jones, Hutchinson, Roaf, Faneca or Andrews types without using a top pick on them.

We have no shot at the top OTs this year because of our draft position likely being in the late 20s to early 30s. However, because OGs are thought to be less valuable and/or rare, the top prospects at that position usually drop down to the second half of round one. This year, to me, the only guy fitting that profile has got to be Blalock. If we go OL in round 1, it has to be him, period. I don't want to take a shot at the second tier OTs like Levi Brown. I would much rather wait until at least the end of round 2 to take a shot at a OT, and even then I would rather not.

To me, there are two types of O-lineman. The can't-miss kind and the developmental kind. Usually it takes a top 20 pick to get ahold of the can't misses, and the developmental kind can be found almost as easily at the end of round 6 as the end of round 1. So, to me, it's either Thomas, Long, Baker or Blalock in the 1st, or wait til later.

I do not think we have a huge need at OL. However, I would agree that it is probably our biggest one, simply because of the lack of holes elsewhere. But if we are going to draft one that high, I want a dominator inside like Justin. Otherwise, we can bolster it with some later round developmental types.

I am on board with the idea of building a dominant offensive line, and if we have a shot at that, we should definitely go for it. The value of having a unit like that cannot be overstated. Our success in the early 90s all began up front with those big boys.


I'm starting to think that we should take a look at Anthony Spencer, though. We simply must have more pressure on the QB, and if that means bringing him in to play ROLB and moving DeMarcus to SOLB, then so be it, but we just are not generating enough pressure, and that cannot be accepted.

Our needs, imo:

1. OG/OL
2. FS
3. Pass rush
4. Pass rush
5. Pass rush
6. Pass rush
7. RB

Excellent point. I go back and forth with drafting another hybrid given the depth with have at that position. But the lack of pressure is troubling. I think we should also consider briging in a penetrating DT to provide push up the middle. That would help our all of our linebackers get better pressure. All of those near misses DWare has would be sacks since the QB wouldn't have anywhere to go.

[Modano]

I think that the problem with our pass rush is more with the scheme than the players..
We've invested an 18th pick on Carpenter, i don't want him to sit on the bench.. I think that with a dominant NT our pass rush could step to another level..

[Poet3334]

I think that the problem with our pass rush is more with the scheme than the players..
We've invested an 18th pick on Carpenter, i don't want him to sit on the bench.. I think that with a dominant NT our pass rush could step to another level..

I agree.

[bigbluedefense]

In terms of pass rush, I think you have to give Carp at least until the end of next year before you write him off, so I don't think Spencer should be looked at.

I think the issue at pass rush comes down to 2 things.

1. Lack of a dominant NT
2. LE not generating any pressure

Marcus Spears has been a huge disappointment. He is simply not producing like he should. He's been very average this year. Pressure from his side would make a 4 man rush out of your defense that much better.

More importantly though, youre not getting any push up the middle, and that starts with the NT. Ferguson is very serviceable in the run game, but to truely have a dominant pass rush you must have that NT who can swallow the interior of the oline, and Ferguson is not that guy.

I don't think theres a viable replacement in this draft either, so youre just gonna have to make do with what you got. Okeye I guess has potential, but most feel he's a 4-3 NT/UT from what I heard, he has no realistic shot at succeeding as a 3-4 NT. I thought he did, considering he's only 19, but I guess not.

And of course, youd love to see DWare work on his pass rushing techniques in the offseason. Perhaps hiring a dline/rushbacker coach who can work more exclusively with him will help accelerate his learning curve.

Maybe even signing Kelly Gregg in the offseason would improve your push up the middle. But I don't know if he would be any better than Fergy. Maybe passing up on Gabe Watson was a mistake for you guys, he couldve been the guy if Parcells could motivate him.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[Poet3334]

I'm looking for big things for Carp next year. I think he'll be more comfortable and stronger. Plus I think he'll have a more defined role whether it be inside or outside.

[Burns336]

Id actually like to take a flyer on parrish... He cant be worse than davis/watkins (at least i dont think he could) and maybe a good secondary such as ours will allow him to feel more comfortable and do some of the things he used to do. Maybe we could squeeze some production out of him for a few games, much like troy vincent(last year? i think) after everyone had him labeled as washed up. Who knows, if Bill does it, im sure he sees something, and if we dont look at him, im sure Bill doesnt think he would help. With the Romo move and then and switch to Gramatica, wouldnt it be great to see us bring in an old FS and have him turn out to be another perfect move...

[Burns336]

Id actually like to take a flyer on parrish... He cant be worse than davis/watkins (at least i dont think he could) and maybe a good secondary such as ours will allow him to feel more comfortable and do some of the things he used to do. Maybe we could squeeze some production out of him for a few games, much like troy vincent(last year? i think) after everyone had him labeled as washed up. Who knows, if Bill does it, im sure he sees something, and if we dont look at him, im sure Bill doesnt think he would help. With the Romo move and then and switch to Gramatica, wouldnt it be great to see us bring in an old FS and have him turn out to be another perfect move...

[Burns336]

Id actually like to take a flyer on parrish... He cant be worse than davis/watkins (at least i dont think he could) and maybe a good secondary such as ours will allow him to feel more comfortable and do some of the things he used to do. Maybe we could squeeze some production out of him for a few games, much like troy vincent(last year? i think) after everyone had him labeled as washed up. Who knows, if Bill does it, im sure he sees something, and if we dont look at him, im sure Bill doesnt think he would help. With the Romo move and then and switch to Gramatica, wouldnt it be great to see us bring in an old FS and have him turn out to be another perfect move...

[Burns336]

Id actually like to take a flyer on parrish... He cant be worse than davis/watkins (at least i dont think he could) and maybe a good secondary such as ours will allow him to feel more comfortable and do some of the things he used to do. Maybe we could squeeze some production out of him for a few games, much like troy vincent(last year? i think) after everyone had him labeled as washed up. Who knows, if Bill does it, im sure he sees something, and if we dont look at him, im sure Bill doesnt think he would help. With the Romo move and then and switch to Gramatica, wouldnt it be great to see us bring in an old FS and have him turn out to be another perfect move...

[Burns336]

Id actually like to take a flyer on parrish... He cant be worse than davis/watkins (at least i dont think he could) and maybe a good secondary such as ours will allow him to feel more comfortable and do some of the things he used to do. Maybe we could squeeze some production out of him for a few games, much like troy vincent(last year? i think) after everyone had him labeled as washed up. Who knows, if Bill does it, im sure he sees something, and if we dont look at him, im sure Bill doesnt think he would help. With the Romo move and then and switch to Gramatica, wouldnt it be great to see us bring in an old FS and have him turn out to be another perfect move...

[Poet3334]

In terms of pass rush, I think you have to give Carp at least until the end of next year before you write him off, so I don't think Spencer should be looked at.

I think the issue at pass rush comes down to 2 things.

1. Lack of a dominant NT
2. LE not generating any pressure

Marcus Spears has been a huge disappointment. He is simply not producing like he should. He's been very average this year. Pressure from his side would make a 4 man rush out of your defense that much better.

More importantly though, youre not getting any push up the middle, and that starts with the NT. Ferguson is very serviceable in the run game, but to truely have a dominant pass rush you must have that NT who can swallow the interior of the oline, and Ferguson is not that guy.

I don't think theres a viable replacement in this draft either, so youre just gonna have to make do with what you got. Okeye I guess has potential, but most feel he's a 4-3 NT/UT from what I heard, he has no realistic shot at succeeding as a 3-4 NT. I thought he did, considering he's only 19, but I guess not.

And of course, youd love to see DWare work on his pass rushing techniques in the offseason. Perhaps hiring a dline/rushbacker coach who can work more exclusively with him will help accelerate his learning curve.

Maybe even signing Kelly Gregg in the offseason would improve your push up the middle. But I don't know if he would be any better than Fergy. Maybe passing up on Gabe Watson was a mistake for you guys, he couldve been the guy if Parcells could motivate him.

I'm looking forward to seeing Carp next year with a little more strength and experience.

[Poet3334]

I can't wait to see Carp next year. A year under his belt should do him a world of good.

[Poet3334]

I can't wait to see Carp next year. A year under his belt should do him a world of good.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[thule]

Everyone here wants a 2 gap DT it looks like. I personally don't agree. Between Furgy and Newman...they have been the reason our defense has been so dominate. If Canty/Spears quit playing like robots I think we would be number 1 instead of 4. But Furgy has demanded double teams all year...and when he hasn't he has got to the QB. What we need is someone to take him off the field maybe 1 every 4 times out and someone to play the NT in the Nickle. I don't think a Glover type guy is a need. Ratliff gets great pressure in the nickle from the inside...yet he gets double teamed about half the time.

With this break down I think Tank Tyler is the guy we need. He has been disruptive all year long even getting into the backfield. He has the potential to be a dominate NT of the future....and could play a great NT in the nickle...making teams decide who to double. Who would you double on this line?

Ware-Tank-Ratliff-Hatcher

Not sold yet? Lets look back at Pepper Johnson. Parcells loves NT's with nicknames :P


For the most part I agree with LSU as stated before. You try to get skill position players early. Which is why I was high on Ginn. But if we are picking in the 26-32 range...we dont' have a very good shot at landing a player like that. I mean we likely won't have a shot at blalock/any good ot/wr. So I agree...that if CB is the best playmaking position available we attack it. Because I would much rather address OT/OG later then pick Levi. He is solid but could pick someone up similar to him later in the draft.

D I remember breaking down Austin in training camp. Saying watch out for him he could be our future number one. Well now its back to our three year program.

Year One - Learn the System
Year Two - Refine your Skills
Year Three - Show me something.

This Draft will show a lot as far as what we see in our future WR corps. The only WR I could see us bringing in is a quick guy. I mean realistically he only needs to be better then Rector. He needs to have return abilities and he would take over Green.

If I'm in the front office...and Ginn falls out of the top 10...I'm trying as hard as I can to trade up. I'm offering singleton/coleman/davis/crayton/hurd w/e it takes to move up.

[scoopdawg]

I think that the problem with our pass rush is more with the scheme than the players..
We've invested an 18th pick on Carpenter, i don't want him to sit on the bench.. I think that with a dominant NT our pass rush could step to another level..
alot of factors are included in run stuffing and a NT would do ok

[scoopdawg]

I think that the problem with our pass rush is more with the scheme than the players..
We've invested an 18th pick on Carpenter, i don't want him to sit on the bench.. I think that with a dominant NT our pass rush could step to another level..

I agree.
i dont agree

[CTCowboysFan]

I looked at Scott's new mock, he has us taking Levi Brown to apparently take the place of Colombo.....and he said it speaks volumes about the state of the group that he is starting. Is it just me or has Colombo actually played well this season? I know we could use OL, but I would rather have an OG to replace Rivera than a RT to replace Colombo. Thoughts>>>>?

[CTCowboysFan]

I looked at Scott's new mock, he has us taking Levi Brown to apparently take the place of Colombo.....and he said it speaks volumes about the state of the group that he is starting. Is it just me or has Colombo actually played well this season? I know we could use OL, but I would rather have an OG to replace Rivera than a RT to replace Colombo. Thoughts?

[CTCowboysFan]

I looked at Scott's new mock, he has us taking Levi Brown to apparently take the place of Colombo.....and he said it speaks volumes about the state of the group that he is starting. Is it just me or has Colombo actually played well this season? I know we could use OL, but I would rather have an OG to replace Rivera than a RT to replace Colombo. Thoughts?

[CTCowboysFan]

I looked at Scott's new mock, he has us taking Levi Brown to apparently take the place of Colombo.....and he said it speaks volumes about the state of the group that he is starting. Is it just me or has Colombo actually played well this season? I know we could use OL, but I would rather have an OG to replace Rivera than a RT to replace Colombo. Thoughts?

[thule]

Anyone find Scotts Scouting report on Kolb strikingly familiar to another Dallas QB?

Does not have the ideal height that you look for...Passing numbers were inflated by playing in a passing system...Accuracy is dodgy, especially on deep balls...Gets too many passes batted down at the line...Worked mostly out of the shotgun...Is going to have to learn how to run a pro style offense and read defenses...Didn't always play against top competition...Mechanics and throwing motion need work.

[thule]

I looked at Scott's new mock, he has us taking Levi Brown to apparently take the place of Colombo.....and he said it speaks volumes about the state of the group that he is starting. Is it just me or has Colombo actually played well this season? I know we could use OL, but I would rather have an OG to replace Rivera than a RT to replace Colombo. Thoughts?

We have about 4 pages accumulated talking about this matter alone...reading back through the pages wouldn't be a bad idea.

[Poet3334]

I think that the problem with our pass rush is more with the scheme than the players..
We've invested an 18th pick on Carpenter, i don't want him to sit on the bench.. I think that with a dominant NT our pass rush could step to another level..

I agree.
i dont agree

I do

[DMWSackMachine]

This site is getting out of control. Doesn't Scott have a webmaster or someone that can stop all the BS? :roll:

[Poet3334]

This site is getting out of control. Doesn't Scott have a webmaster or someone that can stop all the BS? :roll:

Calm down. It's not that serious.

[Ward]

This site is getting out of control. Doesn't Scott have a webmaster or someone that can stop all the BS? :roll:

Calm down. It's not that serious.

http://blog.mediacatalyst.com/images/seriousbusiness.jpg

[Poet3334]

This site is getting out of control. Doesn't Scott have a webmaster or someone that can stop all the BS? :roll:

Calm down. It's not that serious.

http://blog.mediacatalyst.com/images/seriousbusiness.jpg

I will behave.

[Poet3334]

We signed Tony Parrish.

http://cowboys.beloblog.com/

[CTCowboysFan]

Hey I have been trying to post this for a few days but because of some DEBUG thing that pops up everytime I post this is the first time it seems to have worked.

I wanted to comment on Scotts mock and him saying with the Cowboys starting Marc Colombo it speaks volumes about the state of the position. I think Colombo has played very well. I can't even tell you his stats for sacks allowed but I know there aren't that many. I think the Cowboys could replace RG before RT. Rivera was a mistake to sign; not worth the money. At center I think Gurode is fine. At LG Kosier has been OK, but I like him. At LT Flozell Adams has been good but how many years can he go? So I'd say a starting RG and a LT to develop and the O-Line is fine.

Thoughts?

[thule]

Hey I have been trying to post this for a few days but because of some DEBUG thing that pops up everytime I post this is the first time it seems to have worked.

I wanted to comment on Scotts mock and him saying with the Cowboys starting Marc Colombo it speaks volumes about the state of the position. I think Colombo has played very well. I can't even tell you his stats for sacks allowed but I know there aren't that many. I think the Cowboys could replace RG before RT. Rivera was a mistake to sign; not worth the money. At center I think Gurode is fine. At LG Kosier has been OK, but I like him. At LT Flozell Adams has been good but how many years can he go? So I'd say a starting RG and a LT to develop and the O-Line is fine.

Thoughts?

For the second time...as if you didn't look at the last page. Take some time and check out the last 3 or so pages so you dont' ask the same topic of discussion that we have talked about for well over a month.

[Paul]

Good to add a vet Saftey to the mix, but never seen him play much, so my judgment is still to come. But he does have a rating of 85 on Madden :D

[dpl85]

I think Parrish will back up Roy at SS, provide veteran depth and hopefully play well on special teams. I know he was really good before the injury, he picked off Bledsoe twice last year and returned one for a TD. I don't think he would be a consideration for FS, he's much more of a SS who is somwhat limited in coverage.

Here's a scouting report of Parrish from the 2006 Sporting News Scouting Guide magazine.

Strengths: Physical and has excellent quickness. Has the upper body strength to play off blocks efficiently and get to balls. Excels at diagnosing the run and has good range.

Weaknesses: Limited in man coverage; can match up with most tight ends and backs but struggles with slot and wide receivers. Lacks top speed.

Bottom Line: Parrish finished last season on injured reserve. The 49ers need his leadership and toughness. Grade 7.8, ranked 20th among safeties

[D-Unit]

Parrish??? Eh, not the worst pick up.

[fryman]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.

[Poet3334]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.

I'm still hoping he can contribute something. I'd hate to have a wasted 4th round pick.

[Poet3334]

I'm hoping Parrish is healthy. If he is, we'll see what he can do. I think it was a good pickup. Nothing to lose, everything to gain.

[smittyjs]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.Didn't know he was moved to RB :shock:

[yno88]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2688355


What do you guys think?

Nice call.

[Poet3334]

In case anyone needs a gift idea:

http://www.cowboysonlineproshop.com/

[D-Unit]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.

I'm still hoping he can contribute something. I'd hate to have a wasted 4th round pick.
It's not like 4th round picks are guaranteed players or anything.

Now Jacob Rogers and Stephen Peterman... Those were complete wastes. You hate to bust on 2nd rounders. 3rd rounders are bustable...but Peterman never even made it in a game as far as I remeber.

[Poet3334]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.

I'm still hoping he can contribute something. I'd hate to have a wasted 4th round pick.
It's not like 4th round picks are guaranteed players or anything.

Now Jacob Rogers and Stephen Peterman... Those were complete wastes. You hate to bust on 2nd rounders. 3rd rounders are bustable...but Peterman never even made it in a game as far as I remeber.

No, but I think everyone likes to hit on those kind of picks.

[D-Unit]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.

I'm still hoping he can contribute something. I'd hate to have a wasted 4th round pick.
It's not like 4th round picks are guaranteed players or anything.

Now Jacob Rogers and Stephen Peterman... Those were complete wastes. You hate to bust on 2nd rounders. 3rd rounders are bustable...but Peterman never even made it in a game as far as I remeber.

No, but I think everyone likes to hit on those kind of picks.
Sure, but that's the nature of drafts that people need to understand. It's not a total waste in a way because we find out that they aren't what we hoped and aren't left wondering what could have been had we not taken them. LOL.

[Poet3334]

anybody else hoping Skyler is gone for good this time? After the switch to RB I haven't seen a place for him on this team.

I'm still hoping he can contribute something. I'd hate to have a wasted 4th round pick.
It's not like 4th round picks are guaranteed players or anything.

Now Jacob Rogers and Stephen Peterman... Those were complete wastes. You hate to bust on 2nd rounders. 3rd rounders are bustable...but Peterman never even made it in a game as far as I remeber.

No, but I think everyone likes to hit on those kind of picks.
Sure, but that's the nature of drafts that people need to understand. It's not a total waste in a way because we find out that they aren't what we hoped and aren't left wondering what could have been had we not taken them. LOL.

Yeah. We hardly knew ya Skyler!

[CTCowboysFan]

I looked at Scott's new mock, he has us taking Levi Brown to apparently take the place of Colombo.....and he said it speaks volumes about the state of the group that he is starting. Is it just me or has Colombo actually played well this season? I know we could use OL, but I would rather have an OG to replace Rivera than a RT to replace Colombo. Thoughts?

We have about 4 pages accumulated talking about this matter alone...reading back through the pages wouldn't be a bad idea.

Oh really. Thanks for heads up. :roll:

btw I didn't meant to repost that 3 times something was whacky.

[CTCowboysFan]

Hey I have been trying to post this for a few days but because of some DEBUG thing that pops up everytime I post this is the first time it seems to have worked.

I wanted to comment on Scotts mock and him saying with the Cowboys starting Marc Colombo it speaks volumes about the state of the position. I think Colombo has played very well. I can't even tell you his stats for sacks allowed but I know there aren't that many. I think the Cowboys could replace RG before RT. Rivera was a mistake to sign; not worth the money. At center I think Gurode is fine. At LG Kosier has been OK, but I like him. At LT Flozell Adams has been good but how many years can he go? So I'd say a starting RG and a LT to develop and the O-Line is fine.

Thoughts?

For the second time...as if you didn't look at the last page. Take some time and check out the last 3 or so pages so you dont' ask the same topic of discussion that we have talked about for well over a month.

For the second time I didn't see that I already posted it. when I posted this before it said DEBUG or whatever so I thought it didn't work.

And boy I am impressed that you have been talking about this for the last month. You deserve a cookie. I mean golly jee why don't I just crown you king cowboys fan. :D

[Poet3334]

Hey I have been trying to post this for a few days but because of some DEBUG thing that pops up everytime I post this is the first time it seems to have worked.

I wanted to comment on Scotts mock and him saying with the Cowboys starting Marc Colombo it speaks volumes about the state of the position. I think Colombo has played very well. I can't even tell you his stats for sacks allowed but I know there aren't that many. I think the Cowboys could replace RG before RT. Rivera was a mistake to sign; not worth the money. At center I think Gurode is fine. At LG Kosier has been OK, but I like him. At LT Flozell Adams has been good but how many years can he go? So I'd say a starting RG and a LT to develop and the O-Line is fine.

Thoughts?

For the second time...as if you didn't look at the last page. Take some time and check out the last 3 or so pages so you dont' ask the same topic of discussion that we have talked about for well over a month.

For the second time I didn't see that I already posted it. when I posted this before it said DEBUG or whatever so I thought it didn't work.

And boy I am impressed that you have been talking about this for the last month. You deserve a cookie. I mean golly jee why don't I just crown you king cowboys fan. :D

Just to make it short and sweet, I just said that Columbo's played well, and Scott was way off base with his comments. Just my opinion.

[CTCowboysFan]

Just to make it short and sweet, I just said that Columbo's played well, and Scott was way off base with his comments. Just my opinion.

Thanks! Nice to see what others think.

[DMWSackMachine]

Scott has been taking pot-shots at Colombo all year long now. It's like he knows something that everyone else doesn't. Call me funny, but when you allow 1 sack all year long (the result of the QB stepping up unexpectedly into the rusher), and have ZERO holding penalties on a line that is near the top of the league in rushing yards despite not having an elite RB.....that should say something.

Stupid ol' Parcells, though, he seems to be under the impression that Colombo has been pretty good. I wish there was a way that Scott could clue him in to just how bad his player is, how does someone get a job as a head coach and not even know his own players?

[CTCowboysFan]

And the thing is, its not just Scott. A lot of people out there misunderstand the Cowboys offensive line. It is not that bad. You can credit most of Bledsoe's sacks to who else, Drew Bledsoe. Nobody can protect a statue, and that's literally what Drew Bledsoe was. He had the worst pocket presence of any starter in the league. He could not step up or around, all he could do was trip over himself. Now that Romo is in that is no longer a problem. Colombo has done a good job, along with Flo/Ko and Gurode. I still don't like Rivera that much. I think he was overpaid to come here and hurt his back on a tread mill, then never be the same.

[bigbluedefense]

I think you guys should nab Manuel Ramirez in the 3rd round. He's a plow at OG, and reminds me of Larry Allen. He's not as good of course, but he'd be a monster in the run game. And with his strength, maybe he can help Flo out on the leftside and allow Flo to concentrate more on the outside speed rush.

[CTCowboysFan]

well, it looks like the Cowboys are looking at quarterback Tommy Maddox.

credit: DMN

[Staubach12]

So, I met this girl at a party. I was wearing my Dallas Cowboys hat, and she said "Hey! My cousin used to play for them!" I said, "Who is he?" Turns out she's Stephen Peterman's cousin. Pretty cool.

[CTCowboysFan]

So, I met this girl at a party. I was wearing my Dallas Cowboys hat, and she said "Hey! My cousin used to play for them!" I said, "Who is he?" Turns out she's Stephen Peterman's cousin. Pretty cool.

Hey that is pretty cool.....wish I could meet someone who was connected with the Boys at one time.

[fryman]

I think you guys should nab Manuel Ramirez in the 3rd round. He's a plow at OG, and reminds me of Larry Allen. He's not as good of course, but he'd be a monster in the run game. And with his strength, maybe he can help Flo out on the leftside and allow Flo to concentrate more on the outside speed rush.

He has been my second choice behind Blalock since season started. I would love to get him.

[Staubach12]

I think you guys should nab Manuel Ramirez in the 3rd round. He's a plow at OG, and reminds me of Larry Allen. He's not as good of course, but he'd be a monster in the run game. And with his strength, maybe he can help Flo out on the leftside and allow Flo to concentrate more on the outside speed rush.

He has been my second choice behind Blalock since season started. I would love to get him.

I really like him, too. I'd take him in the 2nd. If he falls to the third, and we don't take him, I'm going to be so mad.

[D-Unit]

We should address OG in FA.

[CTCowboysFan]

Not sure if you guys heard this but Newman and Canty exchanged punches in the locker room. I guess Canty threw Newman's clothes on the floor while T-New was gone, then when Newman came back he asked who done it and he was told Canty did so he threw Canty's stuff on the floor. This resulted in the fight. It was broken up rather quickly though, and it doesn't seem like it will become that big of a deal.

[thule]

We should address OG in FA.

/agreed

I hate to beat a dead horse...but it seems that this is direction we are going. If we address OG in the draft. Who is the leader of our OL. Flo?Koiser?Gurode?Columbo none of those guys have the name of a leader imo. Take a look around the league at the top OLs.

A quick example. Living in the midwest I'm forced to have a vikings game on TV every sunday. So I have a pretty good idea at what happens with them. You'll notice last year their line was in total disarray. Why is this? Because their leader of their ol was out for the year. Now they don't have that great of a OL this year....but they are playing better as a unit. Also factor in that they are learning a new blocking scheme doesn't make things any easier.

My point is...you need a leader at every level. In the secondary...how good did they play with Woodson back there. In the LB corps Bradie is diong a great job. On the DL Furgy is doing a decent job...like to see more aggression to his teammate from time to time. This is where Roy needs to step up in the secondary. When their our blown coverages it should be his fault. Because he is the leader out there...between him and bradie everything should be lined up. Thats why the veteran pressence of Glenn is somewhat underrated. When he is in there he knows what to do in every situation. Thats why I would really love to get a young guy in there to learn from our veteran unit.

Bottom line is....an OL needs a leader. Romo can point out blitzers but we need a guy would can call blocking schemes at the line and do it correctly. That comes from experience. Personally I'm looking for a 28-29 year old guy who has about 5-7 years of starting experience.

[Number-94]

Not sure if you guys heard this but Newman and Canty exchanged punches in the locker room. I guess Canty threw Newman's clothes on the floor while T-New was gone, then when Newman came back he asked who done it and he was told Canty did so he threw Canty's stuff on the floor. This resulted in the fight. It was broken up rather quickly though, and it doesn't seem like it will become that big of a deal.

Well guess Newman isn't as smart as we thought he was. I mean c'mon Newman tried to fight Canty? Bad decision.

Got thinking, lets just blame it on TO I mean its his fault and he's tearing the team apart. :lol:

[CTCowboysFan]

Yeah but then again Newman is pretty quick he could just Jackie-Chan Canty's arse. :lol:

[Number-94]

The Rumble in the Jungle II.

[Poet3334]

We should address OG in FA.

Eric Steinbach?

[fryman]

Spears and Canty were both involved in different "scuffles" early in the week. Didn't say who Canty's was with, so maybe it was Newman.

As long as Spears and Canty are getting more aggressive I am happy, as long as they don't take anybody out for gameday.

[Poet3334]

Spears and Canty were both involved in different "scuffles" early in the week. Didn't say who Canty's was with, so maybe it was Newman.

As long as Spears and Canty are getting more aggressive I am happy, as long as they don't take anybody out for gameday.

Canty's scuffle was with Cory Proctor.

[Burns336]

where did that info come from? i hope its not a big deal, the last thing we need is the team losing its unity.

[Number-94]

where did that info come from? i hope its not a big deal, the last thing we need is the team losing its unity.

Was from The Dallas Morning News. I just hope he brings this attitude to the game tomorrow.

[D-Unit]

We should address OG in FA.

Eric Steinbach?
I dunno...

I like Vince Manuwai, but I doubt the Jags let him see the light of FA.

Any of these guys would be cool too.
Derrick Dockery, UFA, Washington Redskins
Ryan Lilja, RFA, Indianapolis Colts
Sean Locklear, RFA, Seattle Seahawks
Floyd Womack, UFA, Seattle Seahawks
Kris Dielman, UFA, San Diego

One guy who I really like is Jordan Black. He's been playing tackle, but he also has NFL experience at RG too. I like him A LOT for us and I do think he'll test his unrestricted free agency.

[Ward]

We should address OG in FA.

Eric Steinbach?
I dunno...

I like Vince Manuwai, but I doubt the Jags let him see the light of FA.

Any of these guys would be cool too.
Derrick Dockery, UFA, Washington Redskins
Ryan Lilja, RFA, Indianapolis Colts
Sean Locklear, RFA, Seattle Seahawks
Floyd Womack, UFA, Seattle Seahawks
Kris Dielman, UFA, San Diego

One guy who I really like is Jordan Black. He's been playing tackle, but he also has NFL experience at RG too. I like him A LOT for us and I do think he'll test his unrestricted free agency.

Black and Dockery are both hometown boys who might legitimately want to come home to play for the Cowboys.

[Poet3334]

We should address OG in FA.

Eric Steinbach?
I dunno...

I like Vince Manuwai, but I doubt the Jags let him see the light of FA.

Any of these guys would be cool too.
Derrick Dockery, UFA, Washington Redskins
Ryan Lilja, RFA, Indianapolis Colts
Sean Locklear, RFA, Seattle Seahawks
Floyd Womack, UFA, Seattle Seahawks
Kris Dielman, UFA, San Diego

One guy who I really like is Jordan Black. He's been playing tackle, but he also has NFL experience at RG too. I like him A LOT for us and I do think he'll test his unrestricted free agency.

Black and Dockery are both hometown boys who might legitimately want to come home to play for the Cowboys.

And the're both pretty young. No more 30 something O-linemen signings.

[Pokeys]

The Aints are going to get a beating similar to the one we handed them in preseason! :)

Off to the game now.

[Poet3334]

The Aints are going to get a beating similar to the one we handed them in preseason! :)

Off to the game now.

Lucky bastard :)

[fryman]

....And that is why Julius is the starter.

[thule]

....And that is why Julius is the starter.

Found it funny that TO caught them all.

[Paul]

Julius has been waiting for that one.

[BX]

What the hell.

2nd rounder for Josh Brown.

[thule]

What the hell.

2nd rounder for Josh Brown.

2nd would be high...but I would be willing to give a third. I'll give Gramatica until the end of the season tho until I think its worth it. He has shown an ability to be clutch. This time of possesion and Karney are killing us.

[BX]

At this point I'm willing to trade Bill Parcells for a good kicker.

[thule]

Our defense looks run down for some reason. I just don't konw about this game...NO looks to have more heart at this point.

[pocketaces]

we are being totally out coached and the saints want this game more than we do

[bigbluedefense]

Coaching smoaching. You guys are losing because you getting absolutely no pass rush, the pass rush is a joke right now.

And you can't blitz too much, because theyre spreading you out, so you need a rush out of 4, and youre not getting it.

[pocketaces]

again coaching

[pocketaces]

of course myself, madden and micheals dont know what were talking about

[pocketaces]

hahahaha now its just gotten comical... ASS WHOOOOPING..cant rush cant cover cant anything

[thule]

hahahaha now its just gotten comical... ASS WHOOOOPING..cant rush cant cover cant anything

We are still in this....we just can't get our offense enough on the field to get in a rhythm.

I wonder if this is zimmers fault...or if its just our players. The fault has to go somewhere?

[BX]

Hey, his arm works after all.

[Jughead10]

A lot of it I think is lack of speed on defense. This defense isn't as fast as some make it out to be. Minus Newman of course.

That doesn't fare well for when the Saints come to us.

I had a feeling this would happen against the Saints and bet the over on Reggie Bush's total yards at over 84.5

[bearsfan_51]

What was that about Bears fans being bitter cause the Cowboys are the class of the NFC?

what happen to Pat Watkins? Did he get injured or something?

[Paul]

The was off game, of all off games. Defense looked terrible. After that first sack from Demarcus and run by Julius I was excited, man was I wrong. Romo's decision making was terrible also, and the one TD to TO was pure luck, it should of been intercepted.

But one good thing, it does bring romo back down to earth. we'll still in great shape for the playoffs and if anything Julius will finally cross 1,000yd mark. We'll bounce back next week

[Modano]

that's not pass rush or so on.. we simply got out-coached. The saints ran the same 3 schemes all game.. Parcells did nothing to match Payton's gameplan..

[diabsoule]

hahahaha now its just gotten comical... ASS WHOOOOPING..cant rush cant cover cant anything

We are still in this....we just can't get our offense enough on the field to get in a rhythm.

I wonder if this is zimmers fault...or if its just our players. The fault has to go somewhere?

Hey Thule, just letting you know that Devery Henderson had 92 yards receiving. Our bet was that he had to have over 88.

[Paul]

It's hard for me to say, but when I saw the Reggie bush run after the screen, I was cheering for him. That was sick.

[Modano]

and I don't know.. yeah, Watkins had a couple of bad games..but can he be worse than Davis? I don't think so..Davis is just garbage...

[diabsoule]

Just wanted to say good game, guys. I don't know what happened there. I thought the game was going to be close.

[sweetness34]

It's hard for me to say, but when I saw the Reggie bush run after the screen, I was cheering for him. That was sick.

WHHHAAAAATTTT????????? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

You're kidding me right dude? You were rooting for the other team to score?

[thule]

hahahaha now its just gotten comical... ASS WHOOOOPING..cant rush cant cover cant anything

We are still in this....we just can't get our offense enough on the field to get in a rhythm.

I wonder if this is zimmers fault...or if its just our players. The fault has to go somewhere?

Hey Thule, just letting you know that Devery Henderson had 92 yards receiving. Our bet was that he had to have over 88.

I'll have the sig up tomorrow i'm guessing.

[thule]

Just wanted to say good game, guys. I don't know what happened there. I thought the game was going to be close.

Well its pretty obvious>>>to beat the cowboys you keep their offense off the field. Our defense always plays fresh because we control the clock. I loved the way the Saints played this game. Nice to see that type of gameplan come into play. Almost something you would see in madden.

[Paul]

It's hard for me to say, but when I saw the Reggie bush run after the screen, I was cheering for him. That was sick.

WHHHAAAAATTTT????????? :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock: :shock:

You're kidding me right dude? You were rooting for the other team to score?

LOL maybe I worded wrong, I meant after he scored I was cheering and cursing seeing how sick it was.

[Bearsfan123]

you know what i think it was, I think its what happened to sexy rexy. Romo came in as an unknown (this year) but now after a couple games people have tape on him. And know his tendencies. Itll be much harder for him from now on most likely. Not positive, might just be an off day but i think its that the opposition has tape on Romo. Good evening

[Paul]

you know what i think it was, I think its what happened to sexy rexy. Romo came in as an unknown (this year) but now after a couple games people have tape on him. And know his tendencies. Itll be much harder for him from now on most likely. Not positive, might just be an off day but i think its that the opposition has tape on Romo. Good evening

I agree, and having your former Offensive Coordinator on the other side didn't help either. Sean did a great job.

[Number-94]

Well...no excuses we got killed. The only person who had a good game was Newman they kept away from where he was and he showed his tackling skills. Roy Wlliams and Davis got PWNED. But, I think we are asking to much of Roy to play center field.

We need a LB that can man up a TE or RB. This is why I wanted them to sign Julian Peterson, I think he would of been a big differnence to what we are now. Something else that bugs me how the hell do we get beat by a blocking FB for 3TDs.

Last but certainly not least...fire Zimmer and get an actual 3-4 DC!

[Ward]

I felt like we would lose this game, but a blowout is embarassing.

[sweetness34]

What the hell happened? Was it overlooking them or what?

[Paul]

Well...no excuses we got killed. The only person who had a good game was Newman they kept away from where he was and he showed his tackling skills. Roy Wlliams and Davis got PWNED. But, I think we are asking to much of Roy to play center field.

We need a LB that can man up a TE or RB. This is why I wanted them to sign Julian Peterson, I think he would of been a big differnence to what we are now. Something else that bugs me how the hell do we get beat by a blocking FB for 3TDs.

Last but certainly not least...fire Zimmer and get an actual 3-4 DC!

NO MORE LB!! sorry, as I said before we invested to much money and to many picks on linebackers.

[Number-94]

Can anyone tell me why after the 77 yard run we ran about 5 more times got atleast 6 yards then pass...pass..and pass some more until we have to pass to win?

Don't know about you all but in all the games I seen him coach the Giants, Jets, and Patriots I never remember seeing him abandoning the run like that before.

[Number-94]

Well...no excuses we got killed. The only person who had a good game was Newman they kept away from where he was and he showed his tackling skills. Roy Wlliams and Davis got PWNED. But, I think we are asking to much of Roy to play center field.

We need a LB that can man up a TE or RB. This is why I wanted them to sign Julian Peterson, I think he would of been a big differnence to what we are now. Something else that bugs me how the hell do we get beat by a blocking FB for 3TDs.

Last but certainly not least...fire Zimmer and get an actual 3-4 DC!

NO MORE LB!! sorry, as I said before we invested to much money and to many picks on linebackers.

Well, maybe I worded it wrong. Can be a FS too. I just don't feel like Bill can trust Roy to man up on someone like Bush to have an effective pass rush.

[Poet3334]

Can anyone tell me why after the 77 yard run we ran about 5 more times got atleast 6 yards then pass...pass..and pass some more until we have to pass to win?

Don't know about you all but in all the games I seen him coach the Giants, Jets, and Patriots I never remember seeing him abandoning the run like that before.

God-awful coaching. All across the board.

[thule]

Can anyone tell me why after the 77 yard run we ran about 5 more times got atleast 6 yards then pass...pass..and pass some more until we have to pass to win?

Don't know about you all but in all the games I seen him coach the Giants, Jets, and Patriots I never remember seeing him abandoning the run like that before.

We don't have the dominate OL that he has had in the past. Instead our WR are our strength. So we use the pass to set up the run. I'm sure parcells wishes we could rush 40 times a game but we just don't have the blocking.

[Poet3334]

Well...no excuses we got killed. The only person who had a good game was Newman they kept away from where he was and he showed his tackling skills. Roy Wlliams and Davis got PWNED. But, I think we are asking to much of Roy to play center field.

We need a LB that can man up a TE or RB. This is why I wanted them to sign Julian Peterson, I think he would of been a big differnence to what we are now. Something else that bugs me how the hell do we get beat by a blocking FB for 3TDs.

Last but certainly not least...fire Zimmer and get an actual 3-4 DC!

NO MORE LB!! sorry, as I said before we invested to much money and to many picks on linebackers.

Well, maybe I worded it wrong. Can be a FS too. I just don't feel like Bill can trust Roy to man up on someone like Bush to have an effective pass rush.

I agree with Paul. There isn't much speed back there. It was very apparent on the screens. And how many more games do we have to endure before we get some kind of freakin' pressure. Frustrating.

[dpl85]

I was at the game and all I can say is WOW, that was unbelievable and unexpected. That was without a doubt the worst loss and feeling I've experienced live at the stadium. I'm not really surprised that we lost but surprised with the way in which we lost. I hate to say it but I think we quit at some point probably late in the 3rd or early in the 4th. I'm not going to even attempt to comment on the game as I know I will probably overreact and be irrational, maybe I'll comment on it tomorrow. :cry: :cry: :cry:

[Burns336]

at least it happened now and not in the playoffs. hopefully this grounded us and allows us to evaluate all of the weaknesses we have. id rather go in playing like underdogs and fighting, than having a cocky attitude.


first off, parcells got outcoached by another one of his pupils; probably because they arent as stubborn as him, they take all the good he has to offer but they also modernize. How many times are we going to try and run Julius up the gut instead of off tackle until we figure out that he cant run between the gaurds. ours gaurds blow anyways. the 77 yarder was nice, but for the most part he has been shut down up the middle for the past 5 games. I thought the whole reasoning of the 2 back system was to have barber to pound and julius to stretch? maybe im ********.

our safeties cant cover for **** and its almost becoming sickening because the only time ive heard roys name called over the past 3 games is for getting beat deep. no bit hits, no forced fumbles, no sacks, were hardly putting him in the box for christ sakes. davis blows. watkins blows.

Romo looked like ****, but i think he'll get over it. He definately isnt another rex grossman although bears fans would love to believe it. I dont ever see romo with a passer rating of 1.3 or having 18 turnovers in 7 games.

TO -- alligator arms on one occasion and the drop over his shoulder was pathetic. he better get this dropped ball **** off his consious quick.

D-ware, nice for about the first quarter in a half and then his motor wore out. he had no pass rush to go along with the rest of a pathetic rush from the line.

They dinked and dunked us all over the field and got most of their yards after the catch. linebackers played like **** as a whole.

carpenter still looks like a loser.



most of all, the chips didnt fall our way tonight. No turnovers, no momentum, the parcells 15 yard penalty. it just wasnt our night.


+++POSITIVES+++ Newman, badass as always. Ferguson swallowed quite a few guys, Henry had some plays but also played that deep ball terribly, glenn was a beast.

[thule]

We can complain about our lack of pressure. But I has to come down to Zimmer. Think about this....Roy and Davis are playing deep cover 2 somewhere near 80% of the plays. We blitz occasionally but it doesn't seem like we blitz as much as some of the other 3-4 teams. With our corners playing close man to man and the ability to match up with alot of the top WR's combo's in the league. Personally I'd like to see us work some more robber coverages with our safeties to allow roy not to have to play deep. To me this screams d-cordinator.

[Modano]

We're in a must win situation once again. If we win the next two games we'll have the #3 seed in the NFC. Hope that Romo puts that game behind his shoulder..
This year we've showed the ability to win when it really matters, to come from behind and to go forward when we had our backs against the wall.. Now it's time to do that once again. Our playoffs begin next saturday..

This f***** blocked FG against the Redskins is haunting us...

[yourfavestoner]

Just curious, but how is Akin Ayodele working out for you guys? He was a perennial underachiever in Jacksonville, but he was a monster against the run when he wanted to be.

[ricky bobby]

What a shame. Just when the Cowboys were being discussed as the best team in the NFC. This is the first time i came onto this thread and i noticed a pattern. After a loss everybody on this thread blaims coaching and the coordinators. We do that on the Giants thread also. I give credit to the Saints, they completely outplayed and outcoached you guys. Some of the plays Sean Payton pulled off were amazing. I especially liked the double fake to McCallister, then Bush, and the long throw down field to Henderson. The giants are playing the Saints in two weeks, i'm a little worried.

[Modano]

Just curious, but how is Akin Ayodele working out for you guys? He was a perennial underachiever in Jacksonville, but he was a monster against the run when he wanted to be.

He's having a great year.. Obviously he doesn't play the nickle defense, but he's making some plays against the run..

[Jughead10]

I'd like to thank Bill Parcells for not rushing Marion Barber much and thus preserving my chances to make my fantasy playoffs if a few things go right tonight.

[bigmac076]

Tuna's excuse for throwing the red flag was horrendous. "Uh, my coach upstairs said I should throw it". That penalty couldn't have come at a worse time. Instead of the review team just simply overturning the call of a complete pass, and it being 3rd and 20 on the Cowboys 43. It was 1st and 10 Saints at the Cowboys 28. And the score at the time was 14-7 Saints.

[Jughead10]

Tuna's excuse for throwing the red flag was horrendous. "Uh, my coach upstairs said I should throw it". That penalty couldn't have come at a worse time. Instead of the review team just simply overturning the call of a complete pass, and it being 3rd and 20 on the Cowboys 43. It was 1st and 10 Saints at the Cowboys 28. And the score at the time was 14-7 Saints.

As dumb as it sounds, the right move there would have been to call a time out before the Saints could snap the ball. That way the booth upstairs would have had more time to look at it and decide if it should be challenged. Andy Reid does that from time to time.

[bigbluedefense]

I think you guys are overreacting. It was one loss, a bad one at that, but still...one loss. The team didn't show up to play, its as simple as that. You can see a lack of emotion out of the Cowboys for that game, they totally underestimated the Saints.

You can blame coaching for some of the woes, but honestly, this game was all about execution.

You couldn't stop the run, you couldn't rush the passer. Thats it. Thats what it came down to. You passed alot because you were down so much. The offensive gameplan was an aftershock of the horrible defensive play.

Dallas is a great run stuffing team, but they did not get the job done against the run against the Saints. And the Saints spread them out with 5 WR often. When you get spread out like that, you should get pressure with a 4/5 man rush, and Dallas tried it. But they didn't get pressure. The bottomline is your linemen and Ware weren't winning their individual assignments and not creating pressure on Brees. Even when you guys did blitz, it didn't do a thing. No one got pressure, whether you sent 7 or 4, it made no difference. Roy had to be in coverage, what else is he supposed to do when you have a suspect FS and a 5 WR set? Did he get his ass busted? Yes he did. Roy is not a good pass coverage safety. And it seems like the only tackle he knows how to do is a horsecollar. And Payton took advantage of that. He picked on your safeties all game.

But to neutralize that weakness, you gotta generate a pass rush. And quite simply, the pass rush was mediocre at best the entire game outside of the first drive. To me, this game came down to the pass rush and run defense, and Dallas simply didn't do a good job in either.

And let's give NO credit. Theyre one heck of a team. I know their defense is suspect, but they are a very good team. Theres no luck involved in this "cinerella story". They are the real deal.

[LSUALUM99]

Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.

[bigbluedefense]

Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.

Youre gonna anger alot of people with that statement my friend. I agree with you, but most on this board are gonna call for your head.

I wouldn't call Witten overrated. I actually like him alot. He thrives on a balanced attack. Witten is a great blocker and WR. He's at his best when you guys could do both, that allows him to catch LBs off guard and run out in patterns and catch balls.

When youre in must pass situations, his play decreases because he doesn't have elite speed to simply break an LB, but he's still damn good. Great hands, great route running, thick body, I like Witten alot.

[Paul]

Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.

Youre gonna anger alot of people with that statement my friend. I agree with you, but most on this board are gonna call for your head.



I agree completely, right now Merriman is the better player. But Dware isn't terrible or a bust, Ware is still gonna make alot of probowls and get alot of sacks, so I'm happy with the pick overall. It's not his fault he's not a freak of nature like Merriman.

[bearsfan_51]

Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.

Youre gonna anger alot of people with that statement my friend. I agree with you, but most on this board are gonna call for your head.

I wouldn't call Witten overrated. I actually like him alot. He thrives on a balanced attack. Witten is a great blocker and WR. He's at his best when you guys could do both, that allows him to catch LBs off guard and run out in patterns and catch balls.

When youre in must pass situations, his play decreases because he doesn't have elite speed to simply break an LB, but he's still damn good. Great hands, great route running, thick body I like Witten alot.


Sound like you like him a bit TOO much eh? :lol:

[bigbluedefense]

Ok, lets not overreact.

The bottom line is that NO is a better team than anyone was giving them credit for.

Their offense is sick. Their defense can't really stop the run but if you get up early you don't have to worry about that from a defense.

Romo has come back down to earth. That's not all bad. I'd rather he come back down to earth now than later. He does now need to play within the system more. He seems to be throwing off his back foot too much.

DWare played a very good game, but toward the end of the game he started to lose contain. It's official, DWare is good, Merriman is a better player. No more comments on this until proven otherwise, Merriman is the better player.

Terry Glenn is a stud still. Witten is starting to make me think he's overrated.

The penalty on Parcells was terrible. He should of just called a time out but the brain fart really sucked.

Overall, Roy Williams and Keith Davis played Terrible. KD needs to be benched, he's absolutely terrible.

Youre gonna anger alot of people with that statement my friend. I agree with you, but most on this board are gonna call for your head.

I wouldn't call Witten overrated. I actually like him alot. He thrives on a balanced attack. Witten is a great blocker and WR. He's at his best when you guys could do both, that allows him to catch LBs off guard and run out in patterns and catch balls.

When youre in must pass situations, his play decreases because he doesn't have elite speed to simply break an LB, but he's still damn good. Great hands, great route running, thick body I like Witten alot.


Sound like you like him a bit TOO much eh? :lol:

Hey now, youre the one with homosexual friends

:lol:

Nothing wrong with some meat in the derriere....a woman's derriere that is.

[D-Unit]

Is that the subject of the conversation today? More Merriman vs. Ware debates??? We gonna make new judgements after every game? It's old.

First off, I'd rather have Ware... but even if Merriman was better, I'd still rather have Ware. Merriman may not be on roids now, but he definately used them to get where he is.

What the better debate is... is which front 7 is better? San Diego or Dallas?

I think it's San Diego hands down. I like our secondary much better... but talking about the front 7... San Diego is better... and the supporting cast is a big factor in comparing Merriman to Ware.

[bigbluedefense]

No one wants to make this a Ware/Merriman debate, we all know what Ware needs to work on to become as good of a pass rusher as Merriman. Its up to Ware to take his game to that next level. Right now, he's not on the same level as Merriman, but with some offseason work, maybe he can be next year.

More importantly...the downlinemen. Should this now be an issue addressed in the draft?

I think the push youre getting from the 3 down linemen has been mediocre. Fergy is still great, but not dominant, but theres no solution here because theres no NTs in the draft.

But what about 3-4 DEs? Should this be addressed now? Do you hold out hope that Spears can get it together, or give up on him? What about Canty, he started out hot, but has now gotten cold. What to do with him?

Im really starting to think that Marcus Spears is your William Joseph. Ive said it before, and the more I watch him the more I believe it. He has all the physical ability in the world, but for whatever reason, cannot and will not put it together.

Now DE might be an area of concern to put on the big board.

[fryman]

No one wants to make this a Ware/Merriman debate, we all know what Ware needs to work on to become as good of a pass rusher as Merriman. Its up to Ware to take his game to that next level. Right now, he's not on the same level as Merriman, but with some offseason work, maybe he can be next year.

More importantly...the downlinemen. Should this now be an issue addressed in the draft?

I think the push youre getting from the 3 down linemen has been mediocre. Fergy is still great, but not dominant, but theres no solution here because theres no NTs in the draft.

But what about 3-4 DEs? Should this be addressed now? Do you hold out hope that Spears can get it together, or give up on him? What about Canty, he started out hot, but has now gotten cold. What to do with him?

Im really starting to think that Marcus Spears is your William Joseph. Ive said it before, and the more I watch him the more I believe it. He has all the physical ability in the world, but for whatever reason, cannot and will not put it together.

Now DE might be an area of concern to put on the big board.

I think Ratliff would get a shot at a starting position before we bring somebody in. Also we have Hatcher who has looked good, even though he seemed to be more of a project.


Also I don't think the problem in the game was execution, at least not on defense. I just think Dallas came into the game unprepared. It seemed like the Saints came into the game with a different gameplan, and Dallas was taken by surprise. They were able to keep Dallas on edge all game.

[bigbluedefense]

No one wants to make this a Ware/Merriman debate, we all know what Ware needs to work on to become as good of a pass rusher as Merriman. Its up to Ware to take his game to that next level. Right now, he's not on the same level as Merriman, but with some offseason work, maybe he can be next year.

More importantly...the downlinemen. Should this now be an issue addressed in the draft?

I think the push youre getting from the 3 down linemen has been mediocre. Fergy is still great, but not dominant, but theres no solution here because theres no NTs in the draft.

But what about 3-4 DEs? Should this be addressed now? Do you hold out hope that Spears can get it together, or give up on him? What about Canty, he started out hot, but has now gotten cold. What to do with him?

Im really starting to think that Marcus Spears is your William Joseph. Ive said it before, and the more I watch him the more I believe it. He has all the physical ability in the world, but for whatever reason, cannot and will not put it together.

Now DE might be an area of concern to put on the big board.

I think Ratliff would get a shot at a starting position before we bring somebody in. Also we have Hatcher who has looked good, even though he seemed to be more of a project.


Also I don't think the problem in the game was execution, at least not on defense. I just think Dallas came into the game unprepared. It seemed like the Saints came into the game with a different gameplan, and Dallas was taken by surprise. They were able to keep Dallas on edge all game.

I don't think it was entirely coaching. Yes, the staff couldve done a better job, but most of the time it was just poor execution. Let me break it down.

-The bomb pass TD to Henderson. They came out in Iform. Dallas calls Cover 2. NO runs a PA fake end around bomb pass to Henderson for a TD. This was actually the perfect playcall by the defense, it just was a horrible play by Davis, the FS. The Cover 2 had the Corners stay home so if it was an end around, you had it covered, if it was a run up the gut, the LBs should fire the gaps, and if its a deep ball, the safety in the Cover 2 picks it up. Perfect playcall. But, Davis just did a horrible job closing in, and Henderson made the play for a TD. It wasn't like Brees hit him in the soft spot of the Cover 2, Brees hit him right in front of Davis. Davis is supposed to break that ball up, instead TD.

-The Reggie Bush screen pass for a TD. Dallas didn't blitz like hell on that play, everyone stayed home. The problem was, everyone got blocked, and people missed tackles. Thats not a coaching error, thats execution. Its a coaching error if you call an all out blitz on a screen, because you play right into their hands, but that was not the case.

-You can have the brightest X and O guy in the world. Theres not a scheme in the world that is built to stop the run. Stopping the run is strictly a personnell problem. Dallas is a very good run stuffing defense, but yesterday, they weren't. Those FB runs...the LBs are supposed to fire those gaps, theres no scheme you can draw up to stop that, thats pure execution.

-The bomb pass on Roy Williams, he simply got beat. That penny defense you guys got was built to stop it. The CB got beat, then Roy came by to help, he gets beat. There were 2 guys there that couldve held their assignment, but both got burned. They couldve used some pass rush out of the front 4, but again, thats execution. Ware and crew simply were not winning their individual matchups. The problem I can see with this defense is having Roy back there instead of a FS, but who do you trust more, Roy or Keith Davis? Still, I'll go 50/50 on this one. They shouldn't have came out with 1 safety, but at the same time, the guys just got beat.

-The FB flat routes...you gotta believe that your LBs are good enough to stop that. Come on, theyve stopped better guys out of the backfield, they could definately pick him up, but for whatever reason, didn't.

-The onside kick...come on, no one expects that. No coach can save you on that one, its up to the special teams to be more aware.

-Brees having all day to throw was due to a poor pass rush. Dallas blitzed plenty of times out of the nickel, it never got there. Whether you sent 7 or 4, no one got to Brees. Guys simply were not winning their individual assignments in the pass rush.

This NO offense really isn't anymore dynamic than the Colts offense. But the difference was you guys generated a rush on the Colts and didn't against NO. And you couldn't stop the run. I think thats the real issue, pass rush, and you couldn't stop the run. Thats why you lost.

[pocketaces]

o.k. my take on this game is that we just came off a HUGE win in new york and we played the saints in the preseason and just abused them. imo dallas took them lightly and paid the price. this happens to young teams from time to time. we still have everything in front of us. we can win the division and make the playoffs and really theres nobody in the nfc that we cant beat. i think we still have a chance to go to the superbowl even though we have obvious flaws to our team. name one team in the nfc that doesnt have a weakness or a question mark somewhere. there isnt one. it was very dissapointing but it was just 1 loss. if we lose next week in atlanta then we will no longer be in 1st in our division and then it might be time to panic but i think its to early to jump off the bridge right now. one thing is for sure, we will see what were made of and how romo will respond to adversity in 6 short days.

[D-Unit]

o.k. my take on this game is that we just came off a HUGE win in new york and we played the saints in the preseason and just abused them. imo dallas took them lightly and paid the price. this happens to young teams from time to time. we still have everything in front of us. we can win the division and make the playoffs and really theres nobody in the nfc that we cant beat. i think we still have a chance to go to the superbowl even though we have obvious flaws to our team. name one team in the nfc that doesnt have a weakness or a question mark somewhere. there isnt one. it was very dissapointing but it was just 1 loss. if we lose next week in atlanta then we will no longer be in 1st in our division and then it might be time to panic but i think its to early to jump off the bridge right now. one thing is for sure, we will see what were made of and how romo will respond to adversity in 6 short days.
If we lose, we're right with the Giants and Eagles. Things aren't so merry around here anymore. Once you lose a game the way we did, you get exposed and the rest of the NFL copies the blue print. The Colts are still reeling from that. It's up to our coaching staff to come up with adjustments.

[pocketaces]

yeah if we lose were tied with the giants or eagles (they play each other this weekend) but they own the tie breakers. and as far as a blueprint, sean tottally out coached us but also their d.c. is very good ant he was also from our staff so we were very well scouted.

[dpl85]

I want to believe this was just an abberation and not indicative of how good or bad we really are. If we lose next week we don't deserve to make the playoffs anyway, it's a one game season right now. We have to run the ball a lot more to take the onus off Tony like Pitt did with Ben.

[bigbluedefense]

I want to believe this was just an abberation and not indicative of how good or bad we really are. If we lose next week we don't deserve to make the playoffs anyway, it's a one game season right now. We have to run the ball a lot more to take the onus off Tony like Pitt did with Ben.

Yup, thats how you "fix" the offense if thats what you guys want to assume. I think it was just an off day, but there are some things that teams will use against Dallas to stop Romo, like play contain with their ends and blitz a DB or bring pressure up the middle with MIKE blitzes.

But I think the answer to that is simply running the ball more. I was surprised that BP just thrusted Romo into the mix like he did, I honeslty expected him to have a Ben like role. I think now that Romo has had 1.5 bad games in a row (1st half against Giants), I think he'll bring in the reigns a little.

Defensively...I don't know if there is an adjustment that can be done. He moved Ware around that game, he blitzed, there really wasn't anything else to do, outside of DB blitzes.

I think teams will start to use NO's blueprint of picking on your safeties. If thats the case, youre gonna have to go with more man coverage schemes.

This puts a lot of pressure on Carp to defend the TE in man coverage, because the zone schemes are vulnerable deep because of your safeties. So now its time for Carp to earn his money. I thought he did a good job last night when on the field, but he needs field time to learn. Why isn't BP giving him more field time?

[Paul]

1. Aaron Rouse
2. Dwayne Bowe
3. Manni Rameriez

??

[Ward]

Question, is Fasano in the doghouse or injured? I hadn't heard anything but he's done nothing the past 2 games.

[CTCowboysFan]

Just wanted to make a couple of quick comments.

Some will say that Payton's idea of an onside kick when up by 18 was unnecessary and I agree but I bet Parcells couldn't give a rats you know what that Payton did that.

And yes Payton did outcoach Parcells, though I will say he certainly knew more about our team then we knew about his. He knew Tony Romo inside and out, and more importantly Gibbs knew this defense and how to exploit it.

We got killed nonetheless. It's embarassing, and I can't wait to move on.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I also wanted to vent something else...I am talking about Terrell Owens.

I hope he stays a Cowboy, oh yes I hope. I hope he's a Cowboy all the way until the end of the 2006 season. That's right, I want TO gone after this season....I want Bill back and Owens out. My reasoning is this. Terrell Owens has been productive, no doubt about it. 9 TD's, 971 yards so far this season. But I don't care. Any #1 receiver could have those stats. My problem is Owens drops all these passes and has an excuse for every single one. He can't just accept it and move on, he has to make a case for himself. He has to say he is unhappy. Well I don't want him to stick around another season, long enough to poison our team. Jerry sold his soul to the devil on this one, and hopefully we can rectify the situation before it's too late. Owens is nothing more than a 10 million dollar a year decoy. Get him out at the end of the year and don't let him back in Dallas.

All this being said I want to finish the season with him and whatever happens, happens. If he is on the team and we go deep in the playoffs fine. But either way he is out at seasons end.

Thoughts?

[cowboyz]

i think he's been well behaved. he's always had a problem with drops. he always opens up the field for others.

the worst part is he doesn't seem to be able to get separation, the only time he's open is when he's on shallow crossing routes. i thought teams figured him out when they started press coverage on him, but lately they've been playing away.

for $10m a year they should be able to get more. imo, i think they'll keep him next year, then when BP leaves let him go. if they let TO go, i can't see this team being nearly as explosive offensively and unless he thinks the defense is going to turn bearish they won't have a chance at a super bowl.

[CTCowboysFan]

I don't want to give away right now my theory for the Cowboys draft, but if Owens does indeed leave this year is heavy at the WR position and would be a great opportunity to grab a stud. I mean of course the offense would lose some explosiveness but I think the offense could stay productive.

[fryman]

I was going to post on TO, but decided not to. Since he has been brought up though-

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

I don't really think we should cut him though. I just think we need to spread the ball around more, like last year.

[CTCowboysFan]

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.

[fryman]

If Owens leaves a rookie is not the answer to replacing him. I would not feel comfortable with Crayton as the #2. We may draft a WR, but if Owens leaves a FA WR will be brought in.

I still am not sure if Parcells will draft a WR though, with two young promising WRs.

[thule]

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.

TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.

[Poet3334]

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.

TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.

If the "suicide/overdose" didn't distract the team, then I don't know what will.

[Pokeys]

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.

Same... :cry:

[CTCowboysFan]

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.

TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.

Oh I know he drops passes, and I know he did before he got here. Yes on the statsheet he will always be a top WR because of all the passes thrown his way. He's bound to catch some.... Also TO may have heart but he is too emotional and he lets every little thing bother him which overshadows his "heart" and I'll bet Tony Romo has more heart than TO. At least Romo plays for the love of the game. TO has to feed his family :roll:

[thule]

I don't really have a problem with him off the field, but like I have already said I have a problem with the drops. Even bigger than the drops are how much we try to force him the ball though. that has been bugging me more and more. Half the time when he is thrown to he isn't open.

Yeah but the thing is you always feel that pressure to force the ball to him, and I feel if we drafted a home grown wide receiver we wouldn't feel that kind of pressure and could spread the ball to Glenn, Crayton, Witten, and the rookie WR.

And like you said TO hasn't necessarily been that big of a distraction off of the field but it's only a matter of time before he is.

TO is still a top WR in the NFL. No matter how you slice it. What you don't understand is that he has always dropped balls. I don't suppose you watched the game in the playoffs when it was SF and GB in the conf championship and TO had about 11 drops. But who made the seemingly impossible catch to win the game. TO...he will drop balls but he is a great player who has heart.

I can't think of one player on this team that has more heart.

Oh no I know he drops passes. And I know he did before he got here. Yes on the statsheet he will always be a top WR because of all the passes thrown his way. Also TO may have heart but he is too emotional, he lets every little thing bother him which overshadows his "heart" and I'll bet Tony Romo has more heart than TO. At least Romo plays for the love of the game. TO has to feed his family :roll:

Just to add to my arguement. Look at Tory Holt. He has had quite a few drops today. He is a "me" player. He is emotional. Yet he is a top WR in this league. I bet you wouldn't be asking for his head if he played for us. I just don't get where your coming from. The best WR's in the league are emotional. Thats what makes them the best. TO is under a magnifined glass so his mistakes are played out by the media more then any other player. Don't read into the media...otherwise it'll be a rollercoaster ride.

[CTCowboysFan]

Just to add to my arguement. Look at Tory Holt. He has had quite a few drops today. He is a "me" player. He is emotional. Yet he is a top WR in this league. I bet you wouldn't be asking for his head if he played for us. I just don't get where your coming from. The best WR's in the league are emotional. Thats what makes them the best. TO is under a magnifined glass so his mistakes are played out by the media more then any other player. Don't read into the media...otherwise it'll be a rollercoaster ride.

Yes Torry Holt has dropped passes tonight which is why the announcers are saying it's uncharacteristic for him, that's the difference. You expect TO to drop passes, from Holt you don't expect it. And Holt is emotional mostly in his head and with his play on the field, he isn't crazy emotional like TO. There aren't headlines of Holt sleeping in meetings, talking like he doesn't listen to the coach, or having any accidental overdoses. Where I am coming from is that TO is a time bomb, I know that sounds typical of the media but he is a basket case the sooner we realize this the better; and yes I would rather have Holt and would not be calling for his head because he wouldn't have a Sunday conversation talking about all of the flaws in the organization. Heart and stupidity are two different things. TO is under the magified glass which is why he should make an even bigger effort not to give the media a story but he gets enjoyment out of it. To take a quote for Bill, he sucks the media right in. It seems like to me you believe every word TO says when he tells people that everything he does is magnified and how much heart he has. Its all BS. I just hope we can get out this relationship before it gets to much worse. If he's back next year I will be very upset and will expect a lot of controversy. Year 1 you can usually get by with TO, year 2 your pushing it. Let's not push it.