PDA

View Full Version : Official Training Camp Thread


bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 10:03 AM
This is the official training camp thread. Anything about the training camp over the next couple of months, post in here. Any other threads about what happened in training camp will be locked.





Congratulations! You have found your eigth Scavenger Hunt Ticket!

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/8369/newpicture9id6.png

Below is a clue to finding your next ticket:

"Where can you find talk about Run DMC, a nice peice of ass and a baby horse?"

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 10:04 AM
I'll start it up with discussing what we were saying in the Giants team discussion, and thats how Ross didn't have a good first day. Im not gonna kill him for it, he has to adjust to rule changes, whereas Smith is doing the same thing he did in college. So I expect an adjustment period for Ross. Now if he's continues with this throughout training camp, then I'll start to worry. But not now.

scottyboy
05-14-2007, 11:41 AM
agreed BBD. I mean this is a lot for a kid to handle. I mean, the shock that your in the NFL! plus learning new system and playbook, getting on the field for the first time since last college season. He's nervous and competing for a starting job. Give him time.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 01:27 PM
Gotta love Kiwi's character, the way he handles himself and his attitude, etc. These are the type of guys I like to root for. I think he'll pick it up quickly, and there won't be as many growing pains compared to other guys. Kiwi is a smart guy, a BC guy, so I think the fruits of the transition will be seen by week 8 of the regular season.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=xRo1PGqjl0k

Jughead10
05-14-2007, 01:51 PM
Those are snappy sunglasses and polo he is sporting there in that video.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 01:53 PM
Those are snappy sunglasses and polo he is sporting there in that video.

Its not uncommon to see me with that kind of polo and slacks on. Kiwi has good taste.


Preppies > 85 Bears

Jughead10
05-14-2007, 01:54 PM
Its not uncommon to see me with that kind of polo and slacks on. Kiwi has good taste.


Preppies > 85 Bears

Tom Coughlin's hat from that same golf event >>> 85 Bears and Preppies.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 01:57 PM
Tom Coughlin's hat from that same golf event >>> 85 Bears and Preppies.

Dare I say his hat is > 86 Giants?



*thinks*

Jughead10
05-14-2007, 01:59 PM
Dare I say his hat is > 86 Giants?



*thinks*

I'd say the combination of that hat and Parcell's Polo covering his man tits > 86 Giants.

Now that I have brought this completely off topic.

But either way I'm real exicted about Steve Smith. I think he is gonna be our #3 right from the get go with possibly being our #2 by the end of the season. Moss might only have to come in on special sets now.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 02:04 PM
I think he'll be our 3, and unless Toomer goes down, will stay there. Sinorice...I dont know where he fits now. For the time being, one of the 2 will get the short end of the stick if Toomer stays healthy. Im guessing it will be Sinorice. Coughlin sounded very pleased with Smith so far.

Giantsfan1080
05-14-2007, 02:06 PM
I was always on high and Smith and was calling for the Giants to take him a while back now. With that being said Moss kind of grew on me a little when I actually saw him play. He is just so much faster than everyone on the field that he could be very good if we utilize him the right away. Our WR set has a chance to be one of the best in the NFL. We have our burner, posession guy, do it all guy, and a go up and catch it guy. We have all the bases covered for Eli the coaching staff needs to get it together and use these guys the right away. I'm not even including Shockey in that discussion or a screen to Jacobs where we can rumble over people. There are many options so I hope Coughlin and Co. get creative.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 02:12 PM
I think a rotation between Sinorice and Smith is ideal to start the season. See which one plays the slot better, and which one Eli is more comfortable throwing to.

Sinorice should see more snaps on the vertical routes, and smith more on the underneath. Although that could start becoming predictable...


I really don't know how its gonna work out right now. I foresee one of them getting screwed out of playing time, which seems like the more likely scenario. Its gonna be difficult to get all of them on the field at once, especially with our potential LT issues, empty sets aren't ideal, and 4 WR sets aren't standard either.

Jughead10
05-14-2007, 02:25 PM
Either way most say WRs don't break out until their third year. Which would be next season for Moss. And if I had to guess now, I would say Toomer won't be a Giant in 2008.

bigbluedefense
05-14-2007, 02:28 PM
Oh I agree. The pick was more of a long term investment. Im just trying to figure out whats the best way to utilize all of them for this upcoming season.

Im hoping Sinorice can pack on more weight. He's too frail right now. I would like him to be a #2 in the future like Santana if possible. This kid was a 2nd round draft pick. A pick that we traded 2 2nd round picks to move up for. It would be a shame if we invested that much into a guy who is just a slot receiver his whole career.

Giantsfan1080
05-14-2007, 02:33 PM
I think he can develop into a #2 but as you said he def. needs to add some more muscle. I think Smith is one of those rookies who can come in and produce right away so I'm not worried about the 3 year syndrome with him.

scottyboy
05-14-2007, 02:37 PM
Dare I say his hat is > 86 Giants?



*thinks*

hopefully his hat wont go flying off like TC's did during the season lol

ricky bobby
05-14-2007, 07:30 PM
I take it this thread includes mini camps?

"WR Willie Idlette (Wake Forest) and WR Tyrone Timmons (Mississippi Valley State) were added to the mini-camp roster on a tryout basis today."

I watched this guy vs. Florida State, man is he fast. He is probably only 150 pounds though.

ricky bobby
05-15-2007, 09:03 AM
If both Sinorice Moss and Steve Smith have a great training camp preseason, what are the chances that Amani Toomer spends his last season on the bench?

bigbluedefense
05-15-2007, 12:17 PM
Sounds like the Giants have high hopes for Boss. He really needs to develop his blocking skills in training camp. Even then, he'll have plenty of growing pains during the regular season when the speed of the game takes its toll on his technique.

Im expecting him to come around as a blocker at best by week 8. I think the first 8 weeks will be rough for him. This is the problem with having so much hope invested in rookies. You can't honestly expect to see an immediate impact. Im hoping we can survive the first 8 weeks with a .500 win loss record, then make our move in the 2nd half when all our rookies start realizing their potential.

That would go against the grain though, seeing that we're more of a hot starter cold finisher type of team the past 2 years.

Giantsfan1080
05-15-2007, 12:47 PM
Thats because we had some type of expectations that we were a Super Bowl team. Since the expectations are lower we're going to start off a little slow and hit our stride midseason. In all seriousness though we're lucky we have Pope as our TE coach because he did an excellent job with Shockey and Shancioe. I thought Shank was really becoming an above average blocking TE last year. Shockey we all know has improved by peaps and bounds as well and that is one of his strengths. We may not see a lot of 2 TE sets the first 3 or 4 games untill Boss gets that part of his game up to par.

bigbluedefense
05-15-2007, 12:56 PM
He's gonna whiff on alot of blocks during the PS and first couple of games. With blocking, your first step is usually what makes you or breaks you. That takes practice and a trained eye to realize quickly where you have to move with your first step right away. With Jacobs, we need to run alot of 2 TE sets, I don't know if Finn is big enough to be a lead blocker for Jacobs.

In the mean time, I guess we'll see more iform and less 3 WR sets compared to last year. I don't think we'll run so many 3 WR sets with Jacobs back there. If we do, you'll more likely see Droughns in the backfield on those situations.

Giantsfan1080
05-15-2007, 01:11 PM
Do you think we'll see Droughns lead blocking for Jacobs at all or do we still not believe in 2 RB sets.

bigbluedefense
05-15-2007, 01:15 PM
Do you think we'll see Droughns lead blocking for Jacobs at all or do we still not believe in 2 RB sets.

Doubt it. If we're using a fullback, it will be Finn. Droughns will be a RB for us. I don't expect him to see any looks at FB.

2 RB sets are traditionally used in passing situations, it provides more speed out of the backfield. Its a dying formation because youre better off using a 2 TE package. You get better routes out of the pass game, and its less obvious of a passing play when you do pass out of that situation, plus better run blocking.

Giantsfan1080
05-15-2007, 01:18 PM
Well last year with Tiki and Jacobs we could have used some of those 2 Rb sets. The defense would not have known what was coming at them. Jacobs and Droughns are more similar so that makes sense to use the 2 TE sets.

scottyboy
05-15-2007, 02:38 PM
well, our best option at kicker right now is missing mini camp with laparoscopic surgery for his apendicitis. He should be fine by July's camp.

bigbluedefense
05-15-2007, 03:19 PM
Thats one thing that worries me. In a division as competitive as ours, we're relying on essentially a rookie kicker to come through in the clutch and make crucial field goals for us. That could bite us in the rear this season.

scottyboy
05-15-2007, 03:20 PM
Thats one thing that worries me. In a division as competitive as ours, we're relying on essentially a rookie kicker to come through in the clutch and make crucial field goals for us. That could bite us in the rear this season.

couldnt agree more. Plus, its not like he was high pick/well known college kicker. Not many people now much about him at all

Damix
05-15-2007, 03:28 PM
couldnt agree more. Plus, its not like he was high pick/well known college kicker. Not many people now much about him at all


He was probably the best kicker coming out that year.

scottyboy
05-15-2007, 03:32 PM
He was probably the best kicker coming out that year.

but he was undrafted right? even still, he isnt well known, or a high pick like sebastian or nugent.

I hope he does well, but i honestly can say i've never seen the kid kick in college.

BaLLiN
05-15-2007, 04:33 PM
Brandon Myles got waived, I thought he could be good, anyway it will be tough with this new kicker, but I hope he can learn to be dependable unlike feely was, if he can kick one field goal in three times while being pressured by a crowd in overtime, I'll be good (Feely missed 3 times in overtime at seattle)

Forenci
05-17-2007, 04:14 PM
To honest, I'm not worried if Ross had some trouble in his mini-camp, because honestly, I think CB is one of the hardest posistions to transistion to in the NFL. Very rarely will you ever see a rookie cornerback do well in mini-camps, it's generally you want to see good improvement during the actual Training Camp in a month or so.

hugegmenfan
05-21-2007, 09:01 AM
couldnt agree more. Plus, its not like he was high pick/well known college kicker. Not many people now much about him at all

im worried too but i do not understand why we are not going out and gettin a vet FA kicker? keep huston and a vet and whoever plays better in camp/preseason gets the job. guys like john carney, vanderjact, etc are FA who i would give a look.

LTgiants
05-25-2007, 04:23 PM
im worried too but i do not understand why we are not going out and gettin a vet FA kicker? keep huston and a vet and whoever plays better in camp/preseason gets the job. guys like john carney, vanderjact, etc are FA who i would give a look.


why would go sign a guy like john vanderjagt or carney when you just traded for lawrence tynes about 2 days ago

edit i didnt realize your post was old

ricky bobby
05-25-2007, 06:25 PM
why would go sign a guy like john vanderjagt or carney when you just traded for lawrence tynes about 2 days ago

edit i didnt realize your post was old
There's a new LT in town.

Damix
07-29-2007, 04:15 PM
Wilson has been moved to Free Safety while Butler is playing with the first team as the strong safety, kind of a weird set up.

bigbluedefense
07-29-2007, 04:19 PM
Wilson has been moved to Free Safety while Butler is playing with the first team as the strong safety, kind of a weird set up.

Wilson is not a FS by any means. I think theyre just rewarding Butler for having a good offseason and sending a message to Demps that he needs to pick it up if he wants to stay in the starting lineup. Its more of a coaching ploy than a legitimate starting rotation.

I think it will be an open race at both safety positions. Im curious to see our rook too, and see what he can do. Butler is the only pure FS Ive seen in our lineup, we'll see what he can do.

Damix
07-29-2007, 04:53 PM
Wilson is not a FS by any means. I think theyre just rewarding Butler for having a good offseason and sending a message to Demps that he needs to pick it up if he wants to stay in the starting lineup. Its more of a coaching ploy than a legitimate starting rotation.

I think it will be an open race at both safety positions. Im curious to see our rook too, and see what he can do. Butler is the only pure FS Ive seen in our lineup, we'll see what he can do.


That why I feel its so weird, Butler could of competed to take Demps position last year if he was healthy at the start of training camp, but wasn't and was the back up FS all year, now that they are demoting Demps why is Butler being inserted into the lineup as a SS?

This is all per giants.com btw.

scottyboy
07-29-2007, 05:53 PM
kiwi is struggling in coverage, but that is expected and should improve quickly. Bradshaw is looking very shifty and elusive, all 3 TE's showed great receiving skills(we knew shockey could but still...) Osi looked fired up and ready to be a leader with his play and even his words. Jared Lornezen looked GREAT and i feel Tim will be cut leaving Wright and Hefty Lefty as the 2 backup QB's

Go_Eli
07-29-2007, 06:59 PM
Shameless plug, but everything you need to know about today...

http://www.ny-footballgiants.com/news/

And that'll be a daily

BigDawg819
08-01-2007, 05:03 PM
What's the deal with the Strahan holdout? Is it about retiring or getting more money?

scottyboy
08-01-2007, 06:41 PM
I honestly believe that he just wants to miss parts of training camp. He does want more money as well. He figures if he pulls this retiring to try and get more $ and miss some camp. I believe he'll show up in about a week, and will play. I still have faith in him, like him alot and know the Giants need him. Many other fans(on the Giants main forum site) believe he's just an @$$ and we dont need him and will be better off with out him, but they're wrong.

HerthaFootballFan
08-01-2007, 07:46 PM
Anyone else just extatic with the potential of our offense? I think that Jacobs could easily turn out to be a annual probowl candidate with Bradshaw as a good COP guy. I think they're great compliments. And the passing game has me excited as well, once Diehl or Whimper establish themselves as the guy at LT and Eli can develop confidence in his blockers I think we'll see him hit a new level with 7 legit quality receiving targets, Shockey, Plax, Toomer, Smith, Moss, Boss and Tyree (a guy who really does the little things despite lacking the pure tools to be a game changer)

scottyboy
08-02-2007, 03:17 PM
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e275/rnargi/P1011096.jpg

this is what i love to see. the trainers and assitant coaches are wearing them. also Jesse Armstead is all around camp evaluating and giving advice, I'd love to see him be a future LB coach or possibly DC in the future

Giantsfan1080
08-02-2007, 03:44 PM
Armstead is going to make a great coach very soon. I bet by next year he'll be an assistant somewhere.

Turtlepower
08-03-2007, 11:48 AM
So I guess that Osi and blitzing LBs are having field days with our o-line. I really hope this is not a sign of things to come...

Giantsfan1080
08-03-2007, 12:32 PM
So I guess that Osi and blitzing LBs are having field days with our o-line. I really hope this is not a sign of things to come...

It's a sign to come to see how improved our defense will be. From that the O-Line will gain numerous hours of playing against a good defense therefore gaining numerous hours of experience. That's how you have too look at it.

Jughead10
08-03-2007, 01:38 PM
FYI...good old Luke P, has already missed 4 days of training camp with the Bucs because of a tweaked back. It is almost just too predictable.

Giantsfan1080
08-03-2007, 01:45 PM
FYI...good old Luke P, has already missed 4 days of training camp with the Bucs because of a tweaked back. It is almost just too predictable.

Certainly not a suprise there.

scottyboy
08-03-2007, 03:16 PM
now Butler has been playing with the 1st team at safety with Gibril while Demps has been with the 2nd team. Now what are the chances Butler starts with Gibril over Demps this year? and if Butler beats him out and Johnson shows alot of promise as our backup, are there any chances we trade Demps(if anyone wants him) for possibly a kicker? I want to have faith in Will and want him to do well, but if Butler plays better, i'd rather see butler on the field...

LTgiants
08-03-2007, 03:24 PM
i no the kickers aren't doing that good right now but why would you trade will demps for a kicker that just seems like a waist why wouldn't you try to trade him for a lineman if James butler wins the job?

scottyboy
08-03-2007, 03:27 PM
LT, because i'm not sure what calibur of OL we could get in return. I dont really want to trade Demps, if he loses the starting job, he'd be a great vet to have around and be insurance in case of injury...

LTgiants
08-03-2007, 03:34 PM
LT, because i'm not sure what calibur of OL we could get in return. I dont really want to trade Demps, if he loses the starting job, he'd be a great vet to have around and be insurance in case of injury...

thats true but i still cant see the point if we were gonna shop demps around for a kicker

bigbluedefense
08-03-2007, 07:29 PM
Im in favor of benching Gibril. I don't think he's anything special quite honestly. If he doesn't step it up, I wouldnt mind seeing him on the bench.

Go_Eli
08-03-2007, 08:10 PM
Wilson is lighting it up in camp. Doesn't mean he will during the season but he's been one of the best defensive players on the field.

bigbluedefense
08-04-2007, 02:03 PM
Wilson is lighting it up in camp. Doesn't mean he will during the season but he's been one of the best defensive players on the field.

Well, I don't know. I hope he can make the leap. There should be an open competition for both safety spots in my opinion. Let them battle it out on the field.

Tim Lewis held our secondary back so bad, its like you don't know what you got until this year. Ugh...

Go_Eli
08-04-2007, 03:35 PM
Well, I don't know. I hope he can make the leap. There should be an open competition for both safety spots in my opinion. Let them battle it out on the field.

Tim Lewis held our secondary back so bad, its like you don't know what you got until this year. Ugh...

Exactly. Which is why I think it's stupid when people pin all the secondary problems on guys like Corey Webster and Demps.

bigbluedefense
08-06-2007, 03:36 PM
Our line is struggling to pick up the blitz. Not a good sign so far.

Kiwi is supposedly a madman off the blitz. But I view it as more of an issue with the oline than the defense getting crazy pressure. They HAVE to get it together. Everyone in our division is gonna blitz like hell this year. If they can't pick up the blitz, we're dead in the water.

scottyboy
08-06-2007, 03:56 PM
Our line is struggling to pick up the blitz. Not a good sign so far.

Kiwi is supposedly a madman off the blitz. But I view it as more of an issue with the oline than the defense getting crazy pressure. They HAVE to get it together. Everyone in our division is gonna blitz like hell this year. If they can't pick up the blitz, we're dead in the water.

diehl is learning, and plus he's going up against Osi, whos just amazing, but he'll have to face Ware so...

the blitzing part is scaring me, if we cant pick that up, we're in deep trouble.

also, Whimper has be VERY unimpressive...

bigbluedefense
08-06-2007, 04:21 PM
diehl is learning, and plus he's going up against Osi, whos just amazing, but he'll have to face Ware so...

the blitzing part is scaring me, if we cant pick that up, we're in deep trouble.

also, Whimper has be VERY unimpressive...

Whimper is a bust. Throw him at RT, or at OG and see if he's salvageable. He will not be a LT in this league.

scottyboy
08-06-2007, 04:32 PM
i agree, i doubt whimper will ever be able to cut it at OL in the NFL. and BBD, what do you think about our kicking situation?

bigbluedefense
08-06-2007, 06:20 PM
i agree, i doubt whimper will ever be able to cut it at OL in the NFL. and BBD, what do you think about our kicking situation?

worried like hell. it was a mistake not resigning feely.

scottyboy
08-06-2007, 06:23 PM
worried like hell. it was a mistake not resigning feely.

kickers dont need to be in great shape, lets give good ol' Brad Daliuso a call!!!
hell, even just ol' Anderson is looking good right now. if we dont draft Jeremy Ito next year, I'm gonna flip...

Go_Eli
08-06-2007, 08:40 PM
Whimper is a bust. Throw him at RT, or at OG and see if he's salvageable. He will not be a LT in this league.

4th round pick a bust? Yeah okay....

Anyway...lots of injuries tonight...not good, not good at all...

http://www.ny-footballgiants.com/news/

NYGibril28
08-06-2007, 10:38 PM
love Michael Jennings' car, any1 else agree?

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 09:46 AM
4th round pick a bust? Yeah okay....

Anyway...lots of injuries tonight...not good, not good at all...

http://www.ny-footballgiants.com/news/

Why not? He was drafted with the intent of being the future LT of our franchise after 2 years of development. So far all indications point to him not being that guy. That qualifies as a bust if it holds true. Just because he was drafted in the 4th doesnt mean anything. He wasn't drafted as a "if he pans out then great" type of deal, there was a fair amount of faith put into him being our future LT. And he has not lived up to those expectations. If you were drafted with the intent of being a starter, and never achieve that goal, you are a bust, regardless of what round you were picked in.

Look at the Ravens. They drafted Gaither with the intentions of him being their future LT. In the 5th round at that. If he doesnt even crack the starting lineup, then he's a bust. Plain and simple.

Giantsfan1080
08-07-2007, 12:56 PM
Any news on the severity of the Gerris Wilkinson injury? We can't really take a hit in our LB corps considering the lack of depth there.

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 01:00 PM
Any news on the severity of the Gerris Wilkinson injury? We can't really take a hit in our LB corps considering the lack of depth there.

Don't worry. My boy Chase will hold down the weakside :)

Giantsfan1080
08-07-2007, 01:02 PM
Don't worry. My boy Chase will hold down the weakside :)

I don't mind that at all. I'm pretty sure he just returned to practice also. I just pray this is the year most of our guys stay healthy. In the last 3 years the amount of injuries has been ridiculous.

Giantsfan1080
08-07-2007, 01:03 PM
On another note Mike and the Mad Dog are at Giants Training Camp and they have a lot of interviews set up. I think Reese is the first and he's coming on soon.

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 01:04 PM
I don't mind that at all. I'm pretty sure he just returned to practice also. I just pray this is the year most of our guys stay healthy. In the last 3 years the amount of injuries has been ridiculous.

Im starting to think that the conditioning of the players has something to do with it.

I think if we get more injuries this year, its time to fire our Strength and Conditioning coach. Because we got rid of all the injury prone guys, theres really nothing else to point the finger to other than the coach, who would be out the door if we have a bad season anyway.

Giantsfan1080
08-07-2007, 01:08 PM
Im starting to think that the conditioning of the players has something to do with it.

I think if we get more injuries this year, its time to fire our Strength and Conditioning coach. Because we got rid of all the injury prone guys, theres really nothing else to point the finger to other than the coach, who would be out the door if we have a bad season anyway.

The funny/sad thing is I remember one of the major points Coughlin said in his first press conference was he would stop all these injuries. He got a new S&C coach, changed the weight room habits, etc. Unfortunately the injury situations has gotten worse under him.

Jughead10
08-07-2007, 01:09 PM
Im starting to think that the conditioning of the players has something to do with it.

I think if we get more injuries this year, its time to fire our Strength and Conditioning coach. Because we got rid of all the injury prone guys, theres really nothing else to point the finger to other than the coach, who would be out the door if we have a bad season anyway.

So far the only significant injury is Wilkinson. Kuehl I guess as well. But that seems to be a freak thing. How the hell does a snapper get hurt anyway?

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 01:10 PM
So far the only significant injury is Wilkinson. Kuehl I guess as well. But that seems to be a freak thing. How the hell does a snapper get hurt anyway?

Maybe we're cursed?

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 01:12 PM
The funny/sad thing is I remember one of the major points Coughlin said in his first press conference was he would stop all these injuries. He got a new S&C coach, changed the weight room habits, etc. Unfortunately the injury situations has gotten worse under him.

Theyre probably too tight. I know Parcells never believed in practicing during Minicamps. He felt the entire offseason should be dedicated to getting your body physically ready, then practicing technique during TC.

Im not sure if Coughlin does that with our guys.

Giantsfan1080
08-07-2007, 01:16 PM
So far the only significant injury is Wilkinson. Kuehl I guess as well. But that seems to be a freak thing. How the hell does a snapper get hurt anyway?

I still haven't heard what happened. As for the injuries we haven't even played one game yet so all hold our breath. I was speaking more to the last couple of regular seasons though.

Jughead10
08-07-2007, 01:30 PM
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c137/BluntedNT/Gifs/Sports/romo.gif

Nothing to do with Traning Camp, but I felt like posting it.

Giantsfan1080
08-07-2007, 01:44 PM
Good stuff there Jughead.

scottyboy
08-07-2007, 03:42 PM
So far the only significant injury is Wilkinson. Kuehl I guess as well. But that seems to be a freak thing. How the hell does a snapper get hurt anyway?

for kuehl it was his calf. i guess after snapping, he just turned the wrong way when standing up. kinda makes sense... i guess.

we need Gerris for depth and special teams even. also, gibril has back spasms, but as long as they dont reach Lukey P or the artist formally known as will peterson level, he should be fine.

and ross has a butt injury... great

Jughead10
08-07-2007, 03:53 PM
for kuehl it was his calf. i guess after snapping, he just turned the wrong way when standing up. kinda makes sense... i guess.

we need Gerris for depth and special teams even. also, gibril has back spasms, but as long as they dont reach Lukey P or the artist formally known as will peterson level, he should be fine.

and ross has a butt injury... great

Wilkinson out 2-4 weeks with a dislocated knee cap. Thats actually better than having it to do with any of the ligaments.

Gibiril and Ross seem like nothing and more precautionary. Seems like they would be playing if this was the regular season.

Go_Eli
08-07-2007, 05:05 PM
The Giants' injuries really aren't that bad. Some people are overreacting.

scottyboy
08-07-2007, 05:11 PM
whew gald to hear that with Gerris. its only dislocated and its 2-4 weeks. he can rest it during the preseason and be fully ready for the season.

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 06:48 PM
Yeah but now he wont get any PS practice in. I wanted to see him in PS. Im not exactly sold on him being a long term answer at WILL. He plays like a softee to me, so I really wanted to see what he was made of. Guess we'll have to wait and see when the games start counting for that =/

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 07:00 PM
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c137/BluntedNT/Gifs/Sports/romo.gif

Nothing to do with Traning Camp, but I felt like posting it.


that would so be my new sig if i didnt get a Ray Rice one.

Go_Eli
08-07-2007, 07:28 PM
Why not? He was drafted with the intent of being the future LT of our franchise after 2 years of development. So far all indications point to him not being that guy. That qualifies as a bust if it holds true. Just because he was drafted in the 4th doesnt mean anything. He wasn't drafted as a "if he pans out then great" type of deal, there was a fair amount of faith put into him being our future LT. And he has not lived up to those expectations. If you were drafted with the intent of being a starter, and never achieve that goal, you are a bust, regardless of what round you were picked in.

Look at the Ravens. They drafted Gaither with the intentions of him being their future LT. In the 5th round at that. If he doesnt even crack the starting lineup, then he's a bust. Plain and simple.

I don't buy that. He's not a first round pick. He was a project 4th round pick that every coach, player and fan knew would take time to see what he really had.

It'd be different if he was a first round pick that completely stunk it up. He's a medium risk, high reward player. If he becomes a viable right tackle, is he a bust then?

What about failed project? Or somewhat failed project? Maybe we should wait to watch all 4 preseason games and see what he does against real competition.

If Gaither doesn't pan out...the Ravens still did well. Bust in the supplemental draft in this NFL? Doubt it. Gaither is the perfect low risk, high reward player.

bigbluedefense
08-07-2007, 07:38 PM
I don't buy that. He's not a first round pick. He was a project 4th round pick that every coach, player and fan knew would take time to see what he really had.

It'd be different if he was a first round pick that completely stunk it up. He's a medium risk, high reward player. If he becomes a viable right tackle, is he a bust then?

What about failed project? Or somewhat failed project? Maybe we should wait to watch all 4 preseason games and see what he does against real competition.

If Gaither doesn't pan out...the Ravens still did well. Bust in the supplemental draft in this NFL? Doubt it. Gaither is the perfect low risk, high reward player.

If he pans out at RT, yeah he's salvaged. But if you were drafted with the intent of being a starter, and you never become that, then to me youre a bust. Not being drafted in the 1st round doesn't excuse you from the bust category. Its not just reserved for them. A busted draft pick is anyone who doesn't pan out. Thats how I look at it at least.

Gaither is a 5th round choice yes. But his selection will in all likelihood prevent Baltimore from drafting another LT prospect early in the next draft, possibly beyond that. Now if he doesn't pan out, how is he not a bust? The team put considerable faith in his development, regardless of what round he was drafted in. Now if it doesnt work and he never cracks the starting lineup, that faith was unwarranted and valueable time, money, and games were lost on a player who never panned out. Thats a bust.

As for supplemental draft picks being excused from the bust category, look no further than the immortal Dave Brown to refute that line of reasoning.

Go_Eli
08-07-2007, 08:03 PM
If he pans out at RT, yeah he's salvaged. But if you were drafted with the intent of being a starter, and you never become that, then to me youre a bust. Not being drafted in the 1st round doesn't excuse you from the bust category. Its not just reserved for them. A busted draft pick is anyone who doesn't pan out. Thats how I look at it at least.

Gaither is a 5th round choice yes. But his selection will in all likelihood prevent Baltimore from drafting another LT prospect early in the next draft, possibly beyond that. Now if he doesn't pan out, how is he not a bust? The team put considerable faith in his development, regardless of what round he was drafted in. Now if it doesnt work and he never cracks the starting lineup, that faith was unwarranted and valueable time, money, and games were lost on a player who never panned out. Thats a bust.

As for supplemental draft picks being excused from the bust category, look no further than the immortal Dave Brown to refute that line of reasoning.

I few a bust as a guy who comes in and everyone expects great things out of him because of college. Willie Jo is a bust. If he was a 4th rounder, is he still a bust? No, but as a 1st rounder, he's a bust. Still decent depth but not a great 1st round selection.

Now was Whimper brought in and did we expect great things out of him? Yeah but I think everyone had to think maybe he won't work. If the giants drafted a left tackle next year in the first and he absolutely stinks, he's a bust. Why? Giants expected him to be a starter for the next 10 years. Is Whimper? I don't think so. Giants' fans HOPED he'd be the starter for the next 10 years. No one knows.

I said in today's NFL, I can't see a bust coming from the supplemental draft. If Gaither stinks it up...he's not a major investment. He's a 5th round supplemental pick signed to a dirt cheap contract.

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 01:39 PM
The offensive line is getting mauled. And we have no one with even a glimer of hope to hold down the LT spot if Diehl gets injured. This is not good. Especially considering Diehl isn't exactly playing like Orlando Pace himself at LT.

I think we need to make a trade. Perhaps trade a 5th to Cleveland for that Tackle Reese was considering earlier in the offseason? Something has to be done. Right now Im not feeling good at all about our offensive line. Even if the guy we trade for is a stopgap guy for 1 year, its worth a 5th round pick, maybe even a 4th. We can't go into the season with this line if it continues to struggle. That could shatter Eli's confidence once and for all.


And jeez Coughlin, please implement some more WCO and 3 step drops into our playbook to neutralize the poor play of our oline. You cannot run air coryell when your line sucks. *sigh*

Jughead10
08-08-2007, 01:43 PM
I heard there are more 3 step drops this year so far. Also Diehl is that last person I would worry about getting hurt. I believe he has started every game since the day he was drafted. Of course now that I said this he will go down tomorrow.

Giantsfan1080
08-08-2007, 01:45 PM
The offensive line is getting mauled. And we have no one with even a glimer of hope to hold down the LT spot if Diehl gets injured. This is not good. Especially considering Diehl isn't exactly playing like Orlando Pace himself at LT.

I think we need to make a trade. Perhaps trade a 5th to Cleveland for that Tackle Reese was considering earlier in the offseason? Something has to be done. Right now Im not feeling good at all about our offensive line. Even if the guy we trade for is a stopgap guy for 1 year, its worth a 5th round pick, maybe even a 4th. We can't go into the season with this line if it continues to struggle. That could shatter Eli's confidence once and for all.


And jeez Coughlin, please implement some more WCO and 3 step drops into our playbook to neutralize the poor play of our oline. You cannot run air coryell when your line sucks. *sigh*

I'm not going to put much stock into how our o-line looks before the first preseason game is even played. Diehl will be average at the LT spot and our right side of the line gets better and better with Snee gaining more experience. I believe we only gave up 19 sacks last year not including the one Eagles game where we gave up 7. That includes having Whitfield in the LT spot looking terrible for the last quarter of the year. Diehl will be fine at LT by the time the season starts.

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 01:48 PM
I heard there are more 3 step drops this year so far. Also Diehl is that last person I would worry about getting hurt. I believe he has started every game since the day he was drafted. Of course now that I said this he will go down tomorrow.

Thanks Jug. When he goes down Im blaming you. :p


I do think we need to make a trade though. Id even take Bob Whitfield back for another year.





Wait, did I just say that?

Go_Eli
08-08-2007, 01:49 PM
Oh no, offensive line struggling!

http://www.harvsworld.com/images/panic_button.jpg

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 01:51 PM
I'm not going to put much stock into how our o-line looks before the first preseason game is even played. Diehl will be average at the LT spot and our right side of the line gets better and better with Snee gaining more experience. I believe we only gave up 19 sacks last year not including the one Eagles game where we gave up 7. That includes having Whitfield in the LT spot looking terrible for the last quarter of the year. Diehl will be fine at LT by the time the season starts.

Thats a misleading stat. Eli kept chucking it up for INTs instead of taking sacks last year. Our oline was not playing well when Petitgout went down. I bet we were one of the worst lines when it came to hurries.

And even PS isn't a good indication, because from what i read, our line struggles with blitz pickup, and teams rarely blitz in the PS.

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 01:53 PM
Oh no, offensive line struggling!

http://www.harvsworld.com/images/panic_button.jpg


http://www-psychology.concordia.ca/fac/dugas/Pictures/Worried%20Man.jpg

Giantsfan1080
08-08-2007, 01:54 PM
Thats a misleading stat. Eli kept chucking it up for INTs instead of taking sacks last year. Our oline was not playing well when Petitgout went down. I bet we were one of the worst lines when it came to hurries.

And even PS isn't a good indication, because from what i read, our line struggles with blitz pickup, and teams rarely blitz in the PS.

Your right about that but in the first half of the year the line was very good except for the Eagles game and Eli wasn't throwing INT's. Everyone always ripped Luke at the LT spot and now that we have a replacement for him then people are getting nervous. Diehl has played every spot on the line and has done a good job all the time. He never gets hurt and has a great confidence and work ethic that will help him succeed. I really think the O-Line is not going to that big of a problem. I think Spags is just throwing some pretty crazy stuff at them right now and they aren't in "game shape" to take care of it. Come Week 1 the Line will be fine.

Go_Eli
08-08-2007, 01:56 PM
Now I haven't been in camp or anything so I don't know if this is true, but a thought...

What if the offensive line "struggles" were because of the rotation of some guys? Every report I've read has said the line has struggled...but guys like O'Hara, Snee, and McKenzie are never mentioned (for good and bad).

Maybe the Giants are subbing younger guys in and out who are fighting to make the team. I know Whimper is getting reps with the 1st team, who's to say Zach Piller, Grey Ruegamer, Todd Londot and Matt Lentz aren't either? Maybe the line stinks because the line is always been changed and switch up.

Don't know if this is true, but it's a thought. It's not like guys can hit Manning or any other QB so why not mix it up in front of him?

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 01:57 PM
Your right about that but in the first half of the year the line was very good except for the Eagles game and Eli wasn't throwing INT's. Everyone always ripped Luke at the LT spot and now that we have a replacement for him then people are getting nervous. Diehl has played every spot on the line and has done a good job all the time. He never gets hurt and has a great confidence and work ethic that will help him succeed. I really think the O-Line is not going to that big of a problem. I think Spags is just throwing some pretty crazy stuff at them right now and they aren't in "game shape" to take care of it. Come Week 1 the Line will be fine.

I sure hope so. I still believe though we need to make a trade for depth purposes. Whimper is getting his booty rocked with the first unit. He can't be our #2 on the depth chart.

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 02:01 PM
Now I haven't been in camp or anything so I don't know if this is true, but a thought...

What if the offensive line "struggles" were because of the rotation of some guys? Every report I've read has said the line has struggled...but guys like O'Hara, Snee, and McKenzie are never mentioned (for good and bad).

Maybe the Giants are subbing younger guys in and out who are fighting to make the team. I know Whimper is getting reps with the 1st team, who's to say Zach Piller, Grey Ruegamer, Todd Londot and Matt Lentz aren't either? Maybe the line stinks because the line is always been changed and switch up.

Don't know if this is true, but it's a thought. It's not like guys can hit Manning or any other QB so why not mix it up in front of him?

From what I hear, Diehl and Whimper are getting first team reps. Diehl alot more so then Whimper. They need to stop letting Whimper practice with the 1st team because he's a lost cause this year (and probably beyond). He's taking valuable reps away from Diehl. He needs all the practice he can get.

Giantsfan1080
08-08-2007, 02:04 PM
I sure hope so. I still believe though we need to make a trade for depth purposes. Whimper is getting his booty rocked with the first unit. He can't be our #2 on the depth chart.

That would be fine with me. You can never have enough depth on the lines.

Go_Eli
08-08-2007, 02:11 PM
From what I hear, Diehl and Whimper are getting first team reps. Diehl alot more so then Whimper. They need to stop letting Whimper practice with the 1st team because he's a lost cause this year (and probably beyond). He's taking valuable reps away from Diehl. He needs all the practice he can get.

I know, but that's just left tackle. The reports haven't been "the LT position is getting abused" (though it kind of has been)...it's "the entire line is struggling".

O'Hara, Snee and McKenzie have their spots locked up. Maybe some younger guys are getting reps to see who the backups will be and that's what's causing the line troubles?

scottyboy
08-08-2007, 03:43 PM
Thanks Jug. When he goes down Im blaming you. :p


I do think we need to make a trade though. Id even take Bob Whitfield back for another year.





Wait, did I just say that?

i dont know you anymore. who are you, and what have you done to the real BBD?

Giantsfan1080
08-08-2007, 03:49 PM
Is anyone else really excited to see what Jacobs can do with the majority of the carries? He just has an aura about him that I think he will be a very good back.

Turtlepower
08-08-2007, 04:04 PM
Is anyone else really excited to see what Jacobs can do with the majority of the carries? He just has an aura about him that I think he will be a very good back.

He's nasty...

Does anyone have any good pics of Ross at training camp? I've been looking for them for awhile.

bigbluedefense
08-08-2007, 06:47 PM
i dont know you anymore. who are you, and what have you done to the real BBD?

That just shows you how confident I am in Whimper being our #2 LT on the depth chart. You know you suck when Bob Whitfield is better than you.

They have to make some kind of move (trade), if not for the starting lineup, then at least for depth purposes.

We're thin at OG, and LT. Bringing in a LT via trade, preferably Schaffer from Cleveland allows us to movie Diehl back to OG which gives us depth at OG, and we can always move Diehl out to LT if that guy gets injured. That gives us adequate depth at both OG and LT.

If we have to bite the bullet for a year and give up a 4th for him, Im starting to think we should do it. Theres too much at stake this year to go in the season with paperthin depth on the leftside, and average at best starters.

scottyboy
08-08-2007, 07:22 PM
That just shows you how confident I am in Whimper being our #2 LT on the depth chart. You know you suck when Bob Whitfield is better than you.

They have to make some kind of move (trade), if not for the starting lineup, then at least for depth purposes.

We're thin at OG, and LT. Bringing in a LT via trade, preferably Schaffer from Cleveland allows us to movie Diehl back to OG which gives us depth at OG, and we can always move Diehl out to LT if that guy gets injured. That gives us adequate depth at both OG and LT.

If we have to bite the bullet for a year and give up a 4th for him, Im starting to think we should do it. Theres too much at stake this year to go in the season with paperthin depth on the leftside, and average at best starters.

im confident everywhere on the OL except backup tackle. we were hurt badly with injuries last year, and depth at SOME positions helped us get in the playoffs. if an OT goes down, we're gonna be in trouble.

snee, kareem and Ohara are solid and i feel great about them. i feel rich and DD can hold down the left side fairly well. but, being on the O-line, they get LOTS of contact EVERY play and to think one may get dinged up(at the least) is crazy to think. we need depth to calm my nerves.

on a side note, I'm hearing Tynes is improving and settling in. if more confidence on getting the 3 points means having to sacrifice some kick off power, then be it. i dont wanna carry 2 kickers, but we'll see

Go_Eli
08-08-2007, 08:08 PM
Dear Giants' fans,

I am writing this letter to say lay off the offensive line. Don't be so quick to push me next time.

Sincerely,
http://www.adambowick.com/images/Panic%20button.jpg

Jughead10
08-10-2007, 07:43 AM
We are gonna get a long look at both Sinorice Moss and Steve Smith tomorrow. Both Toomer and Plax aren't dressing apparently. Moss and Smith should get some serious time with the first team, which seems to be intact other than the WR position.

bigbluedefense
08-10-2007, 11:28 AM
We are gonna get a long look at both Sinorice Moss and Steve Smith tomorrow. Both Toomer and Plax aren't dressing apparently. Moss and Smith should get some serious time with the first team, which seems to be intact other than the WR position.

Good. Im looking forward to it. My main concern is the leftside of that line. Offensively, i think thats our biggest question mark. And of course, Brandon Jacobs.


I guess defensively the 2 guys to keep an eye on are Ross and Kiwi. Im gonna keep an eye on Blackburn and DeOssie as well.

Giantsfan1080
08-10-2007, 11:50 AM
I'm very excited to watch Smith, Deossie, and Boss play.

Jughead10
08-10-2007, 11:57 AM
Good. Im looking forward to it. My main concern is the leftside of that line. Offensively, i think thats our biggest question mark. And of course, Brandon Jacobs.


I guess defensively the 2 guys to keep an eye on are Ross and Kiwi. Im gonna keep an eye on Blackburn and DeOssie as well.

Ross isn't playing.

The following players missed practice yesterday and will not play against Carolina: WR Amani Toomer (knee), WR Plaxico Burress (ankle), DT Fred Robbins (calf), CB Aaron Ross (glute), CB E.J. Underwood (hip), S Michael Stone (hip), LB Gerris Wilkinson (knee), OC Todd Londot (ankle), and LS Ryan Kuehl (calf/Achilles).

Giantsfan1080
08-10-2007, 12:30 PM
Ross isn't playing.

The following players missed practice yesterday and will not play against Carolina: WR Amani Toomer (knee), WR Plaxico Burress (ankle), DT Fred Robbins (calf), CB Aaron Ross (glute), CB E.J. Underwood (hip), S Michael Stone (hip), LB Gerris Wilkinson (knee), OC Todd Londot (ankle), and LS Ryan Kuehl (calf/Achilles).

I wanted to see Underwood as well. I've really heard nothing coming out of camp about him.

Jughead10
08-10-2007, 12:32 PM
I wanted to see Underwood as well. I've really heard nothing coming out of camp about him.

You really didn't hear all that much about him in camp last year before the games either. And then all of a sudden he was playing well and was the nickel CB with the first team when Madison sat one game.

Giantsfan1080
08-10-2007, 12:37 PM
You really didn't hear all that much about him in camp last year before the games either. And then all of a sudden he was playing well and was the nickel CB with the first team when Madison sat one game.

That's true but at the time he was a UDFA and as you said no one really heard about him. This training camp we all know the coaches were high on him and we have heard squat. I even heard Reese praise every CB on the team and he didn't even mention Underwood. It's just weird we haven't heard one little thing on him especially when the secondary is a major focal point for this team.

bigbluedefense
08-10-2007, 01:52 PM
Im stumped about the Underwood mystery myself. Perhaps he had a bad offseason and fell off the map? Maybe he's injured and just never spoken about?


Who knows, we'll find out soon enough.

bigbluedefense
08-10-2007, 01:57 PM
I have a feeling that Jay Alford is gonna surprise alot of us in PS. Just a hunch.

Jughead10
08-10-2007, 02:02 PM
I have a feeling that Jay Alford is gonna surprise alot of us in PS. Just a hunch.

He's got a huge motor, and as a rotational player I think he can excel and really cause some havoc. But as an everday player, I'm not so sure. Think of Trent Cole on the inside. Cole is a force when you limit his snaps, but when he has to play a majority of the time, he dies down.

bigbluedefense
08-10-2007, 02:04 PM
He's a got a huge motor, and as a rotational player I think he can excel and really cause some havoc. But as an everday player, I'm not so sure. Think of Trent Cole on the inside. Cole is a force when you limit his snaps, but when he has to play a majority of the time, he dies down.

I have no problem with that. We're not asking him to be Tommie Harris, just provide adequate pressure when we sub out Robbins, and in the nickel, provide an additional inside pass rusher. I think he can do that for us this year. I don't know if he'll ever be a fulltime starter though, but even if he provides solid rotation for us this year Ill be happy with him.

Jughead10
08-10-2007, 02:07 PM
I have no problem with that. We're not asking him to be Tommie Harris, just provide adequate pressure when we sub out Robbins, and in the nickel, provide an additional inside pass rusher. I think he can do that for us this year. I don't know if he'll ever be a fulltime starter though, but even if he provides solid rotation for us this year Ill be happy with him.

Agreed. Looking at him he just doesn't look like a DT. He has a very strange body type.

bigbluedefense
08-10-2007, 02:15 PM
Agreed. Looking at him he just doesn't look like a DT. He has a very strange body type.

He can definately use a couple of pounds if he wants to become a fulltime guy. For now though, I like him as is, it will help him in his situational role better.

Our division has some bulky interior lines, perhaps on passing downs we can neutralize that with some speed. Im still worried about going against those interior lines with no NT though. I hope that doesn't bite us in the butt.

Jughead10
08-15-2007, 03:55 PM
What's the deal with Chris Patrick? Anyone heard anything on him?

Jughead10
08-15-2007, 03:58 PM
What's the deal with Chris Patrick? Anyone heard anything on him?

Nevermind. 5 mintues after I posted this, I read he was waived. Thank god we didn't use a supplemental pick on him.