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  • Ray Rice

    I'm just wondering why he isn't being considered a top talent? I mean he's putting up some ridiculous numbers and doing it against some very, very good defenses such as South Florida, UConn, West Virginia....and Navy and Maryland are not awful teams either. He's got good size and power as well, if he can post a sub 4.5 40 time I don't understand why he can't be rated ahead of someone like Slaton and be the number 2 back behind McFadden. Is there any reason specifically why he's not being as highly touted as I feel he should be? Or maybe he is and I just don't know of it?
    Glenn Dorsey will slip...

    Jets will not take McFadden...

  • #2
    Same reason as Mike Hart. He totes the rock a ridiculous amount of times because Mike Teel is, well, Mike Teel. Teams don't want to invest that much in a guy who might fall apart with nagging injuries. That aside, he doesn't have top end speed, which isn't a necessity but it does hurt his value a bit. His vision and ball protection are great, and he's pretty elusive and good at avoiding tackles, but the wear and speed factors make teams wary/disinclined to invest that much money in a guy who might not live up to the team's hopes.

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    • #3
      I wouldn't necessarily say he's got good size. Both he and Mike Hart are basically the same in terms of size, and that's one reason Hart isn't considered a better prospect. Speed wise I'd say the same thing. Rice is likely slightly faster than Hart, but I still think he runs around a 4.5. I also wouldn't really say those are "very, very good defenses." He's been held to 2.8 YPC against Cincinnati, and under 100 against Maryland and Norfolk State(although he did average 6.0 YPC against Norfolk and likely only played like the first half)

      And as has been previously mentioned, both he and Hart just get run into the ground by their respective teams. Rice is currently on pace to have 870 carries after his Junior year. That's just a ton of a carries for 3 years. Do I personally have a problem with it? No, but NFL teams are going to be wary of taking a guy high that has that much wear and tear on him.

      For both Hart and Rice I see the 3rd round, with a very outside shot if they run faster than expected at the combine of the late 2nd, but even that's a stretch IMO.



      Originally posted by Jakey
      WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

      i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

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      • #4
        Originally posted by nvot9 View Post
        if he can post a sub 4.5 40 time
        There's your answer.

        That being said, he looks a little faster this year. He's actually been better I think - faster, better hands, better pass protection. Earlier in the year we were having some problems at RG and FB, he's had more running room since then. Just because he's a third round pick doesn't mean he won't be successful in the NFL.

        I disagree about Teel. He was playing great before his thumb injury. He played well last weekend when he was healthier. Schiano is just really conservative, we have good backups that he won't use.

        Rice is only 5-7, but he is built like the proverbial **** house. I think the height actually helps him, but too many times have I seen him break a 20+ yard run only to be caught from behind by a defender before he can score a TD.

        It does puzzle me why Rice gets so much attention on our team though. Britt looks like a first round pick next year, and Zuttah/Sosa will possibly be drafted higher than Rice this year...maybe Greene too.

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        • #5
          5'7"? I thought he was more in the 5'9" range. He doesnt look that small, anyways it just boils down to lack of top notch physical tools. His size and speed are ok, but not great.

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          • #6
            Both Hart and Rice are listed by their respective teams at 5'9". Personally I think Hart and possibly Rice could come in at just over 5'9", but there's also certainly potential that they could both come in at closer to 5'8". And as was just said, just because they'll likely be 3rd round picks at best based on measurables, it doesn't mean they can't be successful.



            Originally posted by Jakey
            WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

            i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

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            • #7
              Rice is so thick though...

              Why is a 4.5 frowned upon?..lol..Thats still fast as hell. Breakaway speed is overrated..how many guys had breakaway speed, that flopped in the NFL?

              He should be a first round pick...I think he'll measure in at 5'8" 210 lbs, which isn't small by any stretch of the imagination, and I don't think he'll run a sub 4.5...Maybe in the 4.50-4.55 area, which is whats expected of him. He will KILL in the workouts though.

              The guy has all you look for...he almost never fumbles, has incredible vision, has proven he can catch the ball, and can pass block..He's a 3-down back...those guys tend to go pretty early. I have him as the 3rd best back, juniors included.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Travis 24 View Post
                Rice is so thick though...

                Why is a 4.5 frowned upon?..lol..Thats still fast as hell. Breakaway speed is overrated..how many guys had breakaway speed, that flopped in the NFL?

                He should be a first round pick...I think he'll measure in at 5'8" 210 lbs, which isn't small by any stretch of the imagination, and I don't think he'll run a sub 4.5...Maybe in the 4.50-4.55 area, which is whats expected of him. He will KILL in the workouts though.

                The guy has all you look for...he almost never fumbles, has incredible vision, has proven he can catch the ball, and can pass block..He's a 3-down back...those guys tend to go pretty early. I have him as the 3rd best back, juniors included.
                And that Rutgers sig doesn't make you seem a little biased or anything. Hey, I'm a Michigan fan, I admit I'm biased towards Hart. 4.5 isn't necessarily frowned upon, but it is by teams when the player in question is also undersized like both Rice and Hart are. I personally don't think 5'8"-5'9" 200+ is necessarily undersized, but I don't think you can act like that isn't at least slightly small when paired with fairly pedestrian 40 times.



                Originally posted by Jakey
                WWWWWWWWWTTTTTTTTTTTTFFFFFFFFFFF!!!

                i am literally gonna kick a baby to death!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Travis 24 View Post
                  Rice is so thick though...

                  Why is a 4.5 frowned upon?..lol..Thats still fast as hell.
                  In general? Oh sure. So is 4.7. In the NFL? Not so much.

                  Originally posted by Travis 24 View Post
                  Breakaway speed is overrated..how many guys had breakaway speed, that flopped in the NFL?
                  And how many guys in the NFL have succeeded in the NFL at 5'9 205 (which is what he is listed as) WITHOUT breakaway speed?

                  Originally posted by Travis 24 View Post
                  He should be a first round pick...I think he'll measure in at 5'8" 210 lbs, which isn't small by any stretch of the imagination, and I don't think he'll run a sub 4.5...Maybe in the 4.50-4.55 area, which is whats expected of him. He will KILL in the workouts though.
                  Isn't small by any stretch of the imagination? Compare 5'8 210 to starting running backs in the NFL. You won't find many that size in the NFL without elite speed.

                  Originally posted by Travis 24 View Post
                  The guy has all you look for...he almost never fumbles, has incredible vision, has proven he can catch the ball, and can pass block..He's a 3-down back...those guys tend to go pretty early. I have him as the 3rd best back, juniors included.

                  Everyone you look for? You mean like size or speed?

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                  • #10
                    Rice is an immortal god who has no weakness.

                    Really though i just dont know how he does it. He doesnt have elite size or speed. He just break tackles and finds ways to pick up yardage. His size is knocked by many for being too small, but really he hides behind the OL from the defense and picks up yardage. He's just an animal. I love him
                    We ALL bleed scarlet
                    New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
                    UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
                    Originally posted by PalmerToCJ
                    BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.

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                    • #11
                      A thread of Ray Rice without ScottyBoy is impossible :D

                      #MoncriefArmy

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Wo_oT88 View Post
                        A thread of Ray Rice without ScottyBoy is impossible :D
                        i saw this and saw like 8 posts without me and was floored. If there's one thing i know better than anyone here, it's RU!!! especially my boys Ray Ray, Foster, Greene, and really i could go all day, but those are my top boys
                        We ALL bleed scarlet
                        New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
                        UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
                        Originally posted by PalmerToCJ
                        BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I like Mike Hart a great deal, especially the way he plays the game and his love for the game, but I just don't see much explosion from him unfortunately. I'm less concerned with the deep speed, it's burst and explosion to get immediate yards versus bigger and faster defensive players that draws my concern. And apparently the concern of all 32 teams in the league, considering how we've seen some backs drop in the Draft or even go undrafted altogether (Darius Walker anyone?). Hart has done very well thanks to his tough running and excellent vision, hopefully he can continue to do it in the pros.

                          I think Ray Rice is a bit more explosive than Hart, and that helps him a good deal. I really would campaign for Rice come out after this season, despite the possible depth of backs: He can't improve his stock any more, really; he can't get bigger, faster, or more explosive; and next year's class will only be as top-heavy if not moreso given the juniors that don't declare this year, plus the talented sophomores who could declare after their junior season.

                          Really, take the cue from Maurice Drew. Enter the league and hopefully be drafted by a good team, do your best, and reach free agency as soon as possible.
                          Pugnacity, testosterone, truculence, and belligerence.

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                          • #14
                            No size, no speed, no dice.....


                            Both Hart and Rice are terrific natural runners and perfect back up/2nd back in a dual backfield. However, to be "that guy" something has to set you apart and niether have anything like that. I think they could probably be Rudi Johnson types, ie: clock killer for an explosive offense, but if your looking for your running game to be your focus, these guys are not for you.

                            Neither should be taken before the 3rd round....i probably wouldn't give them a look until day 2. I mean, outside of Curtis Martin, guys like this just don't make it as feature backs.

                            DChess resizing inc.

                            Reality is relative.

                            We don't give a DAMN for the whole state of Michigan

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Freddy G View Post
                              No size, no speed, no dice.....


                              Both Hart and Rice are terrific natural runners and perfect back up/2nd back in a dual backfield. However, to be "that guy" something has to set you apart and niether have anything like that. I think they could probably be Rudi Johnson types, ie: clock killer for an explosive offense, but if your looking for your running game to be your focus, these guys are not for you.

                              Neither should be taken before the 3rd round....i probably wouldn't give them a look until day 2. I mean, outside of Curtis Martin, guys like this just don't make it as feature backs.
                              i fail to see how size is such a huge issue with RB's. These guys arent blazers, but they get the job done, and nobody can argue that. There have been much faster guys who've dont worse in the NFL and slower guy who have done just fine. I could see both guys being feature backs for a NFL teams, easily
                              We ALL bleed scarlet
                              New York Giants Super Bowl 46 Champs
                              UNITED: I actually attend the college I root for
                              Originally posted by PalmerToCJ
                              BTW, if it's 3rd and 97... I'm throwing a screen pass to Brian Leonard and he will convert.

                              Comment

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