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Multiple teams about to repeat the mistake of passing on a QB in the first?

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  • Multiple teams about to repeat the mistake of passing on a QB in the first?

    I keep reading and hearing that teams like Washington, Seattle and Cleveland could potentially pass on a chance to take Clausen, if he's there when they pick. I just can't help but wonder if they will be making the same mistake as teams who passed on a chance to take someone like Matt Ryan, Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman, and Joe Flacco. Yeah, there are questions about Clausen, but there were questions about those guys too. How much better off would a team like Cleveland be if they had taken Sanchez or Freeman when they had the chance last year. The Browns could have done the trade down with Jets last year and still taken Freeman...but they chose to trade down again. Now they have Jake Delhomme and Seneca Wallace.

  • #2
    I don't think the Seahawks or Browns will take Clausen. Pete Carroll still has Matt Hasselbeck (who could still be a good quarterback again in my opinion), and he just traded a third-round pick for Charlie Whitehurst, so he's got to think pretty highly of him. They got their quarterbacks, now they can worry about addressing needs on both the offensive and defensive lines, as well as in the secondary. Mike Holmgren pretty much flat-out said that he wasn't really that high on Clausen, and he did just trade for Seneca Wallace and sign Jake Delhomme. I guess he's going to wait a little bit longer. Ultimately it's looking like Clausen will be going to Buffalo, with an outside shot of going to Washington.

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    • #3
      I would hate Clausen if he went to Buffalo. I think that Clausen is going to have the better NFL career of the top QBs this year. Clausen didn't play on a very good team and it was a pro style offense. While Bradford has all the talent in the world, he'll have to adjust and that can't be done before the season starts. Clausen has the tools to be a legitimate franchise QB, and I hope that the 'Skins pick him even though that looks unlikely at this point.

      Originally posted by ElectricEye
      I'm a whiny little kunt. Feel sorry for me as I go masturbate to a picture of my mom dressed as a teletubby.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by Halsey View Post
        I keep reading and hearing that teams like Washington, Seattle and Cleveland could potentially pass on a chance to take Clausen, if he's there when they pick. I just can't help but wonder if they will be making the same mistake as teams who passed on a chance to take someone like Matt Ryan, Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman, and Joe Flacco. Yeah, there are questions about Clausen, but there were questions about those guys too. How much better off would a team like Cleveland be if they had taken Sanchez or Freeman when they had the chance last year. The Browns could have done the trade down with Jets last year and still taken Freeman...but they chose to trade down again. Now they have Jake Delhomme and Seneca Wallace.
        If you honestly put Clausen in the same class as Ryan or Sanchez than you take him with your pick BUT you cant compare him with Quinn, Freeman, and Flacco and expect the Skins, or even Seattle and Cleveland to take him in the top 5-7. Theres a reason those guys didnt go until the late teens/early twenties. Your paying a top 5-7 pick a TON of money and if you take a qb with that pick he needs to be a top prospect with a full rounded game. Now everyone sees these guys differently but I dont put Clausen in that category. His value is right in the late teens/early twenties range but he would be an overpaid reach pick in the top 7. Now will one of those teams trade up into the mid first area if hes still there? They should and I think likely would. I would say Seattles 14th overall is perfect value but with them bringing in Whitehurst Im not sure they want to draft a qb that early.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Halsey View Post
          I keep reading and hearing that teams like Washington, Seattle and Cleveland could potentially pass on a chance to take Clausen, if he's there when they pick. I just can't help but wonder if they will be making the same mistake as teams who passed on a chance to take someone like Matt Ryan, Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman, and Joe Flacco. Yeah, there are questions about Clausen, but there were questions about those guys too. How much better off would a team like Cleveland be if they had taken Sanchez or Freeman when they had the chance last year. The Browns could have done the trade down with Jets last year and still taken Freeman...but they chose to trade down again. Now they have Jake Delhomme and Seneca Wallace.
          Completely agree.

          This is completely anecdotal (and if somebody wants to crunch the numbers, be my guest). But I think the percentage of QBs taken in the first round who succeed is starting to get better. The rules changes have made it to the point where it's almost impossible NOT to succeed as a quarterback. Hell, we've seen three of the best rookie seasons in NFL history in the past few years (Roethlisberger, Ryan, and Flacco).

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          • #6
            Don't be fooled by past history. Sometimes it will cause some errors in judgment. The only reason why so many teams passed on Aaron Rodgers was because of the previous failures of Jeff Tedford-coached QB's. Rodgers wasn't them, but teams, and many fans, still dissed him for that. Just because Matt Ryan was so good as a rookie doesn't mean Stafford or Sanchez or Freeman is going to me. Totally irrelevant, but the NFL is a copycat league and that often leads to mistakes.

            Alex Smith, Brady Quinn, David Carr, Ryan Leaf, Byron Leftwich, Akili Smith, Cde McNown, Wrecks Grossman, Kyle Baller, JP Losman, Vince Young, Jason Campbell, Tim Couch, Heath Shuler, Matt Leinart.... it all depends on how good the guy really is.

            Teams overrate QB's as much as any other position, while at the same time you get your Warner's and Brees and Favre's and Brady's and Romo's or Schuab's who were either undrafted, or drafted after round one.

            A team does need a good-great QB to be good though, there's no doubt there. It just depends how good you think Clausen and Bradford are. I don't see any greatness in either guy, personally.
            I watched the OU vs Texas games and was just as impressed, if not more, with Colt McCoy than I was with Sam Bradford, and Bradford was behind the better OL usually.

            Is it Sam's 6-4 vs McCoy's 6-2 that makes everyone love Sam more than Colt? Or does Sam have a better fastball?
            I know that in the 1991 draft, Seattle was trying to decide between two QBs, and they simply chose Dan McGwire over the other guy because Dan was bigger, taller. That other guy was Brett Favre.

            I'll take the shorter Drew Brees over the taller Jamarcus Russell any day, even though Russell's arm is also stronger. He's bigger, taller and has a stronger arm. JaMarcus must be better.

            I still think the Rams should, without question, take nDominator Suh because he's the best player, and least risky pick. Best and surest. Take him. Any Rams fans here? What do you think? Are you guys split on that?

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            • #7
              There is a reason many of the same teams are picking in the Top 10 on a regular basis.
              Scott Wright, President
              Draft Countdown.com
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              • #8
                Originally posted by Scott Wright View Post
                There is a reason many of the same teams are picking in the Top 10 on a regular basis.
                Because picking DTs, WRs, OTs and the like before you have a quarterback is like a business hiring the best IT guy in the ******* world before having a CEO.

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                • #9
                  I sure hope so. Jimmy at 9 would be sa-weet.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Scott Wright View Post
                    There is a reason many of the same teams are picking in the Top 10 on a regular basis.
                    I'd be interested to hear or read your take on why there continues to be signs that teams like Washington and Cleveland are not going to take Clausen. Yeah, I know they may be misleading people, but let's just assume for now that they're truly not interested in Clausen. Why is it that some people see Clausen as the #1 QB prospect while others think he's a late first rounder or second rounder. It can't be all about his personality. You'd think these teams would realize they need to take a shot at a talented QB and just accept that every QB prospect has questions. Clausen must have kicked someone's dog or something.

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by yourfavestoner View Post
                      Completely agree.

                      This is completely anecdotal (and if somebody wants to crunch the numbers, be my guest). But I think the percentage of QBs taken in the first round who succeed is starting to get better. The rules changes have made it to the point where it's almost impossible NOT to succeed as a quarterback. Hell, we've seen three of the best rookie seasons in NFL history in the past few years (Roethlisberger, Ryan, and Flacco).
                      +1

                      Just wanted to do that because I completely agree with that statement and I see it as a major development in the sport. QB's have it easy nowadays...remember when QBs were magical beings with the will and power of the gods...molded from Zeus himself?

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                        How much better off would a team like Cleveland be if they had taken Sanchez or Freeman when they had the chance last year.
                        Who knows. But here's one we do know - how much better off were the Browns when they moved back into the first round to draft Brady Quinn in 2007?

                        If NFL teams don't think Clausen is going to be that guy for whatever reason, and it really sounds like the NFL isn't as high on Jimmy as draftniks and fans are, then obviously they're not going to spend a high first round pick on him. I don't see why that's so outrageous.

                        Your post brings up Josh Freeman and Joe Flacco, but they were taken 17th and 18th respectively. So it's not as NFL teams propelled them to the top of their boards simply because they were quarterbacks. Value is still a consideration, and it doesn't sound as if the NFL is as high on Clausen as others are.

                        If Jimmy turns into a world beater, then other teams may indeed kick themselves for passing on him. But if his career is closer to that of Quinn, or Russell, or Smith, or Carr, etc etc, then I don't think anyone will view the decision to pass as a mistake.

                        Originally posted by Scott Wright View Post
                        There is a reason many of the same teams are picking in the Top 10 on a regular basis.
                        There are multiple reasons why some of the same teams are picking in the Top Ten on a regular basis, though. Instability at QB is very likely one of the big ones, but the mere act of selecting a Top Ten QB doesn't change that. The guy actually has to develop into "the guy" and solve that problem with his play. If he doesn't, then said team is probably still going to be picking in the top ten (ala Detroit from '03 to '07).

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by yourfavestoner View Post
                          Because picking DTs, WRs, OTs and the like before you have a quarterback is like a business hiring the best IT guy in the ******* world before having a CEO.
                          What good is a CEO if all of your business critical data is compromised by poor networking security practices?

                          Everyone knows QB is the most important position, but you can't just draft a QB with no other pieces in place. I'm not gonna say you need to build the team first or picking the QB is always the way to go. I think finding the balance of enough talent around him and the right guy at QB is the only way it can ever be successful.

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by RavenOfProphecy View Post
                            I don't think the Seahawks or Browns will take Clausen. Pete Carroll still has Matt Hasselbeck (who could still be a good quarterback again in my opinion), and he just traded a third-round pick for Charlie Whitehurst, so he's got to think pretty highly of him. They got their quarterbacks, now they can worry about addressing needs on both the offensive and defensive lines, as well as in the secondary. Mike Holmgren pretty much flat-out said that he wasn't really that high on Clausen, and he did just trade for Seneca Wallace and sign Jake Delhomme. I guess he's going to wait a little bit longer. Ultimately it's looking like Clausen will be going to Buffalo, with an outside shot of going to Washington.
                            Good analysis on Seattle. I think if Bradford were there they would take him and if Stafford and Sanchez were there this year for them they would take them. I'm not down on Jimmy Clausen, i think he'll be first round pick, but i wouldnt take him in the top 14 picks.

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                            • #15
                              Because Sanchez is clearly the reason the Jets went from 9-7 to 9-7, despite getting a lot more talented, and better coaching.

                              This thread is total crap, because if Sanchez and Matt Ryan never improve from where they are at this point, they aren't making anyone lose sleep, so you're banking all of this on them becoming stud QBs.

                              And if they felt that Bradford or Clausen were going to be pro bowl QBs, they'd be taking them no doubt.
                              Originally posted by SNIPER26
                              fwiw, i amz deunks ofs myt ass. ilo vez drinmoinz befotre i post. wha t a hreat ideas.z.

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