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  • #91
    Originally posted by Iamcanadian View Post
    He's a junior and junior QB's are very raw especially when they aren't red-shirted a year. They usually blossom in their senior seasons. Teams are more and more going to have to gamble on potential at the QB position if they want any chance to get a true franchise QB.
    We still have to wait and see how Gabbert does at his pro day and yes, he will have to be really impressive in the interview process to remain a top 5 prospect. What college production did Sanchez have? Sanchez got drafted early based on his strong arm, other athletic potential/intangibles and how well he came across in the interview process.
    Right now, Gabbert's ceiling is off the charts and that is why, in a particularly strong draft, he is getting serious consideration to go #1 overall.
    The one year Sanchez played he played very well. The same cannot be said for Gabbert, who was mediocre at best all year. Sanchez showed good ball placement and command of the offense he was in. Gabbert looks very average.


    Pudge:
    you grade him as a second rounder? Honestly, I'll give him 3-5 round grade right now because he supposedly did well in interviews (something im not privy to). Hes got a solid arm, can extend plays, and size...and thats it. Thats all. His footwork is eh, his accuracy is inconsistent, idk i really dont see it with him.

    You said his pocket prescense was poor? Lets not sugar coat it, its freaking atrocious. If his first read isnt open (and he doesnt just force the throw anyway), he runs from the pocket, whether his pocket was perfect or not. if he stayed in school i think he wouldve had a snead like free fall. He looks scared to me, not something you want in a guy trying to lead men.
    Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
    Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

    Comment


    • #92
      Originally posted by hockey619 View Post
      The one year Sanchez played he played very well. The same cannot be said for Gabbert, who was mediocre at best all year. Sanchez showed good ball placement and command of the offense he was in. Gabbert looks very average.


      Pudge:
      you grade him as a second rounder? Honestly, I'll give him 3-5 round grade right now because he supposedly did well in interviews (something im not privy to). Hes got a solid arm, can extend plays, and size...and thats it. Thats all. His footwork is eh, his accuracy is inconsistent, idk i really dont see it with him.

      You said his pocket prescense was poor? Lets not sugar coat it, its freaking atrocious. If his first read isnt open (and he doesnt just force the throw anyway), he runs from the pocket, whether his pocket was perfect or not. if he stayed in school i think he wouldve had a snead like free fall. He looks scared to me, not something you want in a guy trying to lead men.
      Not sure that you're insinuating that Gabbert only played one year because he's played two full and a cameo appearance or two in his freshman season.

      I dont disagree with some of the things said about Gabbert in here but how is he any more of a risk than Cam Newton, who has only played one year and looks like he needs to improve his accuracy, an issue that probably keeps Jake Locker out of this discussion. To say nothing of the circus that seems to surround Newton.

      To say that there is a clear cut #1 QB isnt happening this year, dont be shocked at what comes off the board and in what order.

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      • #93
        For heaven's sake, stop licking Newton's balls for a second and realize that he's not going to be picked #1 overall with that character and that atrocious accuracy.

        Same goes with Gabbert. No QB in this class is worth of a first round pick, let alone #1 overall.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by Babylon View Post
          Not sure that you're insinuating that Gabbert only played one year because he's played two full and a cameo appearance or two in his freshman season.

          I dont disagree with some of the things said about Gabbert in here but how is he any more of a risk than Cam Newton, who has only played one year and looks like he needs to improve his accuracy, an issue that probably keeps Jake Locker out of this discussion. To say nothing of the circus that seems to surround Newton.

          To say that there is a clear cut #1 QB isnt happening this year, dont be shocked at what comes off the board and in what order.
          No insinuation at all, the above poster had said something about Sanchez not performing which wasnt true. he did perform very well, just not for very long. Gabbert didnt perform much at all, and maintained this mediocrity for quite a while.

          your other points ill discuss below with RC.

          Originally posted by RealityCheck View Post
          For heaven's sake, stop licking Newton's balls for a second and realize that he's not going to be picked #1 overall with that character and that atrocious accuracy.

          Same goes with Gabbert. No QB in this class is worth of a first round pick, let alone #1 overall.
          I agree, this QB class is unimpressive. I dont think Newton is number one overall worthy. I do think this class has potential but no one really stands out a ton. My rankings...

          1) Mallett - Late first rounder. Too many character concerns that i cant answer so that kinda hard. but he's the best passer in this class and it really aint too close, pocket prescense and accuracy arent always great but overall it got a lot better this year. Only question is character, something i dont have straight facts on, and makes some questionable decisions at times. Could be Derek Anderson, could be a better drew bledsoe and do pretty well.

          2) Stanzi - Second round. second best passer to me in this class, makes some eh decisions at times and the rush will bother him at times, but he throws down the field well, shows good mechanics and ball placement, and throws a nice fade. arm is solid, accuracy is pretty good but gets spotty under pressure. Only thing i saw that i really didnt like was he really stares down his recievers.

          3) Locker - Second to third round. Him and newton are actually pretty similar. Big arm, bad feet leading to shakey accuracy on the short timing throws. Locker appears to have the work ethic and personality of a good QB, but it doesnt seem to come natural to him which is why hes not a solid second round pick.

          4) Newton - Third or later. Bad feet leading to shakey accuracy. Questionable guy who early on will rub guys the wrong way until they get to know him, question being how long will that take and will he still be around? Ive said before: i could see him having a career path similar to vick. some success early but not putting in the work on the details (footwork, leading to accuracy issues) and being a runner not a passer. I think he could be a player, but his risk of really flaming out in spectacular fashion is pretty high. His dad's involvement scares me a bit too, too many questions with him and too many places where it could go wrong to have him higher than this imo.

          5) Gabbert - third to fifth. he scared in the pocket. awful pocket presence (i still have no idea how to spell that) inconsistent accuracy on all levels. Panics in the pocket and throws it into coverage. Solid arm and can extend plays. I dont see the high pick everyone is touting.


          I NEVER WATCHED PONDER, ENDERLE, AND KAEPERNICK PLAY SO I DONT KNOW IF THEYD FIT IN THEIR SOMEWHERE FOR THAT REASON.

          Dalton and McElroy: thought both were awful to eh as jrs, looked solid but unspectacular as seniors. Prefer McElroy a little more at this point, might become a decent to solid starter as his upside, gotta see some more of him before I really know though, profiles as more of a backup though.

          I really wanna see more but ive been so busy, might have some time next week. This is how i see it as of now.
          Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
          Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by RealityCheck View Post
            For heaven's sake, stop licking Newton's balls for a second and realize that he's not going to be picked #1 overall with that character and that atrocious accuracy.

            Same goes with Gabbert. No QB in this class is worth of a first round pick, let alone #1 overall.
            There has been NFL personnel that had a closer look in interviews and said Newton checked out perfectly in interviews. While I don't think he has close to pristine character, one team will fall in love and he's still a cinch Top 5 pick with Carolina, Buffalo, Cincinnati, and Arizona all in the market for a franchise QB. Of all people, you can't put your personal evaluation to the side and see it how NFL teams will? Has your draft record been that accurate in the past? How would you rate your grasp on predicting the NFL Draft?

            Like it or not, some people need to take their head out of their ass and realize that as many as 6 Quarterbacks could be off the board by the end of the Second Round. QBs will go higher than scouts and "experts" have them on their boards due to immense demand. It looks likely that two QBs will come off the board in the first 12 picks and it looks like those two will be Newton and Blaine Gabbert. Let me clarify, I don't think Gabbert is a Top 30 player in this draft... but I'm also not too full of my opinion to assume that teams will be able to land him in the Late 1st-Early 2nd where I think he deserves to go.

            So all of you that think no QB warrants a Top 20 selection, learn how to remove personal opinions when actually talking about projections for draft day. There is a ton of insider info out there that helps illustrate where teams expect players to come off the board. I'm a fan of using those available resources instead of assuming NFL teams will draft based on my personal board.

            big props to BoneKrusher for the sig & avatar
            - For daily NFL draft coverage:
            www.twitter.com/ryanlownes

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by ThePudge View Post
              There has been NFL personnel that had a closer look in interviews and said Newton checked out perfectly in interviews. While I don't think he has close to pristine character, one team will fall in love and he's still a cinch Top 5 pick with Carolina, Buffalo, Cincinnati, and Arizona all in the market for a franchise QB. Of all people, you can't put your personal evaluation to the side and see it how NFL teams will? Has your draft record been that accurate in the past? How would you rate your grasp on predicting the NFL Draft?

              Like it or not, some people need to take their head out of their ass and realize that as many as 6 Quarterbacks could be off the board by the end of the Second Round. QBs will go higher than scouts and "experts" have them on their boards due to immense demand. It looks likely that two QBs will come off the board in the first 12 picks and it looks like those two will be Newton and Blaine Gabbert. Let me clarify, I don't think Gabbert is a Top 30 player in this draft... but I'm also not too full of my opinion to assume that teams will be able to land him in the Late 1st-Early 2nd where I think he deserves to go.

              So all of you that think no QB warrants a Top 20 selection, learn how to remove personal opinions when actually talking about projections for draft day. There is a ton of insider info out there that helps illustrate where teams expect players to come off the board. I'm a fan of using those available resources instead of assuming NFL teams will draft based on my personal board.
              I wouldnt say cinch. What i'm seeing is no QBs takent till the 7th pick at the earliest. I'm not a huge Newton fan but someone could fall in love with him although i'm not exactly sure what they would be falling in love with. You could make the same argument for Locker and Gabbert to be a cinch for the top 5 and who knows they all might be by draft day.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by Babylon View Post
                I wouldnt say cinch. What i'm seeing is no QBs takent till the 7th pick at the earliest. I'm not a huge Newton fan but someone could fall in love with him although i'm not exactly sure what they would be falling in love with. You could make the same argument for Locker and Gabbert to be a cinch for the top 5 and who knows they all might be by draft day.
                I don't mean to seem like I'm attacking you personally, but there's no way the top 6 picks are all defenders and receivers. I have Newton 7th on my board, behind players that will receive a whole lot of consideration in the Top 6. Still, from what I've gathered from NFL personnel and insiders, it appears that there is 0 chance that there will not be two QBs taken in the Top 12 and at least one in the Top 5.

                With Newton and Gabbert, teams aren't going to be drooling about where they are now, but rather where they could be with some time and coaching. Each could be groomed to be solid starting Quarterbacks or more. Now, Gabbert is further ahead mechanically, that much is evident; however, Newton has that "it" factor and routinely took over games in college with both his legs and his arm. Footwork can be easily re-worked in the NFL and Cam doesn't seem to fear the three or four man rush quite like Gabbert does. He has accuracy issues now, largely due to his throwing mechanics. Still, if a team thinks they can coach Newton up to his potential, then he's worth a Top 3 pick easily. His upside as a potential franchise QB supersedes any other player in this draft.

                Basically, I'm with whoever says there is no slam-dunk, Top 5 value at the Quarterback position. However, I think Newton can't get past the Bengals at #4 if he gets past the Panthers & Bills in the first place. I don't say this with any bias... I'm not an Auburn fan. I call it like I see it. I don't want him on my Cincinnati Bengals, because he'll need a strong organization to keep him in line and maximize his potential. I think it IS a given that two QBs will go among the Top 15 picks and I still believe either Mallett or Locker could sneak into the 1st.

                I'll highlight this point on its own; Quarterback demand is higher than ever. Now we have some young players that haven't worked out... see San Francisco (Alex Smith), Miami (Chad Henne), Arizona (Matt Leinart), Tennessee (Vince Young), Carolina (Jimmy Clausen.) Others have to replace veterans... see Minnesota (Brett Favre), Cincinnati (Carson Palmer), Washington (Donovan McNabb), Seattle (Matt Hasselbeck.) Then you have the teams that need to upgrade the position or add a young franchise QB prospect if they expect to be very competitive in the future ... see Jacksonville (David Garrard), Buffalo (Ryan Fitzpatrick), Oakland (Jason Campbell.)

                That's 13 teams that could target a QB in the first two rounds if they want a legitimate shot at the playoffs in the future. Two will go Top 15, three will go first round, and at least seven will come off the board in the draft's first two days.

                big props to BoneKrusher for the sig & avatar
                - For daily NFL draft coverage:
                www.twitter.com/ryanlownes

                Comment


                • #98
                  ^
                  Not taking anything personal, it's called a discussion. You are probably right in that teams will value some of these guys higher based on need. I'm just not ready to say it will be one over the others because they all bring differant things to the table.

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                  • #99
                    Can we assume that no team will be interested in trading up to the #1 slot?
                    Last edited by slats7; 03-06-2011, 02:18 PM.

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                    • Voted for Peterson, because its a deep DL class is all I heard on NFL network. I would have voted for Gabbert though if he was a choice.
                      Jets, Mets, Knicks, and the U's too cool for uze

                      Sig by, Hitman D

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by slats7 View Post
                        Can we assume that no team will be interested in trading up to the #1 slot?
                        Were just not gonna see that unless there is a perceived slam dunk talent at #1, and even when that happens the team who is trading out of that spot is gonna need to have a nice consolation prize to fall back to. Nobody is even thinking about it when there isn't even a legit pick for #1 overall.


                        Had Suh came out this season maybe someone would consider it, he'd be head and shoulders above who is available this year.





                        Originally posted by Scott Wright
                        I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by slats7 View Post
                          Can we assume that no team will be interested in trading up to the #1 slot?
                          I'd say that's a very fair assumption.

                          big props to BoneKrusher for the sig & avatar
                          - For daily NFL draft coverage:
                          www.twitter.com/ryanlownes

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                          • Patrick Peterson is easily the bpa, so I would pick him.

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                            • I remember when Andrew Luck had not taken himself out of the Draft yet and people were like what about Clausen? Jimmy should get another shot. Now everyone is like Gabbert or Newton and no body cares about Clausen. Newton and Gabbert over Luck? Not in a million years.

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                              • Nah, Green or DT.

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