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  • #91
    Originally posted by Jughead10
    I only quickly skimmed through this but has anyone mentioned Edgerrin James. He is by far not a lock but he could get in.
    If he didn't get hurt maybe. I love Edge, he is a great player, but he didn't dominate for long enough.

    That is correct comahan
    I ******* LOVE YOU DG
    <3 dg

    Comment


    • #92
      For the OL argument, I think both Roaf and Ogden will get it, but for who is better, it's gotta be Ogden. Roaf is an amazing player, but Odgen may be the best OT ever (not saying he is, but he is closer than Roaf). I love Roaf, it was obvious how important he was to that offense last season when he was hurt, and this season as well. But pure dominance over a career, it's Ogden.

      That is correct comahan
      I ******* LOVE YOU DG
      <3 dg

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by draftguru151
        Originally posted by Jughead10
        I only quickly skimmed through this but has anyone mentioned Edgerrin James. He is by far not a lock but he could get in.
        If he didn't get hurt maybe. I love Edge, he is a great player, but he didn't dominate for long enough.
        His career isn't over. He'll be 29 in August and is already 17th or 18th I believe on the all time rushing list. People are saying Curtis Martin is a lock. When did Martin ever dominate? He compiled. James could easily do the same until he is 33. And end up with indentical numbers to Martin.

        EDIT: Actually James is currently 19th on the list. He coudl easily pass both Eddie George and Tiki Barber and move to 17th in his first game next year.

        Comment


        • #94
          Originally posted by draftguru151
          Originally posted by bearsfan_51
          Originally posted by Finsfan79
          Jason Taylor and Zach Thomas

          Definitely JT

          Kevin Carter could get in as well for the longevity of his career and what he has accomplished.
          God damn you Dolphins fans are the worst. Zach Thomas is not a sure fire HOF. I'm not having this debate again.

          And Kevin Carter is just stupid.
          Way to generalize because one Dolphin fan said something about Kevin Carter, who has been on the team for 2 years. :roll:

          Someone mentioned Ahman Green but Dolphins fans are the worst? Please.
          He has something against Zach Thomas (most likely from being a huge urlacher fan seems they often have a problem for some odd reason).

          As for Kevin Carter he would be a Ram if he did go in (he was dominate then and won a Ring then), I doubt he will but his numbers arent horrible for the length of time (longevity is looked at for the HoF in the NFL) if he keeps playing another 2-3 years and all. He is the third active leader in Sacks in the NFL currently behind Strahan and Jason Taylor

          http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/3235


          As for zach he has average over 150 tackles a year over a ten year career http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/4392

          he has done it in multiple systems with multiple D-Coordinators and Head Coaches so it is not just a single system letting him make the tackles. But, whatever he can believe what he wants. I will trust the opinion of the guys that actually have a vote instead of a kid on a message board :)

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by Jughead10
            Originally posted by draftguru151
            Originally posted by Jughead10
            I only quickly skimmed through this but has anyone mentioned Edgerrin James. He is by far not a lock but he could get in.
            If he didn't get hurt maybe. I love Edge, he is a great player, but he didn't dominate for long enough.
            His career isn't over. He'll be 29 in August and is already 17th or 18th I believe on the all time rushing list. People are saying Curtis Martin is a lock. When did Martin ever dominate? He compiled. James could easily do the same until he is 33. And end up with indentical numbers to Martin.

            EDIT: Actually James is currently 19th on the list. He coudl easily pass both Eddie George and Tiki Barber and move to 17th in his first game next year.
            Hey, hey... Martin did win the rushing title once! ... by one yard...

            Comment


            • #96
              Originally posted by Jughead10
              Originally posted by draftguru151
              Originally posted by Jughead10
              I only quickly skimmed through this but has anyone mentioned Edgerrin James. He is by far not a lock but he could get in.
              If he didn't get hurt maybe. I love Edge, he is a great player, but he didn't dominate for long enough.
              His career isn't over. He'll be 29 in August and is already 17th or 18th I believe on the all time rushing list. People are saying Curtis Martin is a lock. When did Martin ever dominate? He compiled. James could easily do the same until he is 33. And end up with indentical numbers to Martin.

              EDIT: Actually James is currently 19th on the list. He coudl easily pass both Eddie George and Tiki Barber and move to 17th in his first game next year.
              If he hands around for 4-5 years and is a compiler he could do it. But, that is a long time for a running back with wear and tear. It doesnt help his case that the year Indy ditches him they go the furtherest ever (even though it is a team game and people forget that often specially over QBs).

              I love Edge though, and I am biased from going to the U.

              Comment


              • #97
                Originally posted by frogstomp
                Originally posted by Jughead10
                Originally posted by draftguru151
                Originally posted by Jughead10
                I only quickly skimmed through this but has anyone mentioned Edgerrin James. He is by far not a lock but he could get in.
                If he didn't get hurt maybe. I love Edge, he is a great player, but he didn't dominate for long enough.
                His career isn't over. He'll be 29 in August and is already 17th or 18th I believe on the all time rushing list. People are saying Curtis Martin is a lock. When did Martin ever dominate? He compiled. James could easily do the same until he is 33. And end up with indentical numbers to Martin.

                EDIT: Actually James is currently 19th on the list. He coudl easily pass both Eddie George and Tiki Barber and move to 17th in his first game next year.
                Hey, hey... Martin did win the rushing title once! ... by one yard...
                It a very interesting topic. Taking biases aside because I have one here with Tiki, do you let more people in like Martin because of their total career compiling numbers. Or do you take more guys like Tiki, whose career numbers are decent but dominated for a course of a few years. Sure you are going to get that rare guy like Tomlinson who are both. However lets say James stays on this pace for 4 more years. Most likely he'll have close to 14,000 yards rushing but a 4.0 or 4.1 avg. Tiki on the other hand had three straight years like no other RB and averages 4.7 over his career. But his final rushing numbers will only be 10,400.

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by eazyb81
                  Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable

                  Sorry easy, but I gotta agree with Bohlieve here, please give some names of these guys who dominated Ogden. Ive been a Ravens fan since they came here in 96 and I dont remember these players. And name guys who Pace and Roaf played who were better.
                  You must have a short memory, because I remember guys like Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis, Shawne Merriman, and Derrick Burgess getting the best of Ogden over the past couple years. Sacks allowed is not the only stat to pay attention to when evaluating tackles - hurries are arguably more important, so you really have to use your own eyes and personal judgment.

                  At one time Ogden was a great tackle, but I don't see him as the best O-lineman of our generation, which was the original point of this argument. It's certainly not an open-and-shut case, but it's my opinion based off watching him play against the best DEs over the last few years. I'm sure his leg injuries have affected his balance, but the majority of OTs have fought through serious injuries as well, so I don't view this as a viable excuse.
                  I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                  And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                  Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by Bohleive
                    I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                    And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                    Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                    I'm sorry, but you're an idiot - do you even watch Baltimore games? The DEs I named did indeed line up against Ogden during the game; I know this may shock the hell out of you, but DEs sometimes change which side they line up on during a game....crazy, eh?

                    Finally, i'm not even arguing for Roaf - I think Pace is the best Olineman of our generation. I have no idea why you keep trying to change the argument over to Roaf; i'm guessing you have a serious case of ADD.


                    Originally posted by BrownsTown

                    If Chase Daniel finishes top 5 in the Heisman I'll cut my balls off.

                    2008 COTTON BOWL CHAMPIONS

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Bohleive
                      Originally posted by eazyb81
                      Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable

                      Sorry easy, but I gotta agree with Bohlieve here, please give some names of these guys who dominated Ogden. Ive been a Ravens fan since they came here in 96 and I dont remember these players. And name guys who Pace and Roaf played who were better.
                      You must have a short memory, because I remember guys like Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis, Shawne Merriman, and Derrick Burgess getting the best of Ogden over the past couple years. Sacks allowed is not the only stat to pay attention to when evaluating tackles - hurries are arguably more important, so you really have to use your own eyes and personal judgment.

                      At one time Ogden was a great tackle, but I don't see him as the best O-lineman of our generation, which was the original point of this argument. It's certainly not an open-and-shut case, but it's my opinion based off watching him play against the best DEs over the last few years. I'm sure his leg injuries have affected his balance, but the majority of OTs have fought through serious injuries as well, so I don't view this as a viable excuse.
                      I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                      And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                      Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                      How was Roaf over hyped dude went to 11 pro bowls and was the best LT in the game when he played IMO for sure top 3. The guy would take two some times even 3 guys out on a signal play time after time.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Splat420
                        Originally posted by Bohleive
                        Originally posted by eazyb81
                        Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable

                        Sorry easy, but I gotta agree with Bohlieve here, please give some names of these guys who dominated Ogden. Ive been a Ravens fan since they came here in 96 and I dont remember these players. And name guys who Pace and Roaf played who were better.
                        You must have a short memory, because I remember guys like Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis, Shawne Merriman, and Derrick Burgess getting the best of Ogden over the past couple years. Sacks allowed is not the only stat to pay attention to when evaluating tackles - hurries are arguably more important, so you really have to use your own eyes and personal judgment.

                        At one time Ogden was a great tackle, but I don't see him as the best O-lineman of our generation, which was the original point of this argument. It's certainly not an open-and-shut case, but it's my opinion based off watching him play against the best DEs over the last few years. I'm sure his leg injuries have affected his balance, but the majority of OTs have fought through serious injuries as well, so I don't view this as a viable excuse.
                        I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                        And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                        Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                        How was Roaf over hyped dude went to 11 pro bowls and was the best LT in the game when he played IMO for sure top 3. The guy would take two some times even 3 guys out on a signal play time after time.
                        How many times was he an All Pro? Just wondering. Not saying Roaf isn't a hall of famer, but pro bowls for OTs are useless. I'm sure Roaf didn't deserve at least 3 or 4 of those pro bowls.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Jughead10
                          Originally posted by Splat420
                          Originally posted by Bohleive
                          Originally posted by eazyb81
                          Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable

                          Sorry easy, but I gotta agree with Bohlieve here, please give some names of these guys who dominated Ogden. Ive been a Ravens fan since they came here in 96 and I dont remember these players. And name guys who Pace and Roaf played who were better.
                          You must have a short memory, because I remember guys like Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis, Shawne Merriman, and Derrick Burgess getting the best of Ogden over the past couple years. Sacks allowed is not the only stat to pay attention to when evaluating tackles - hurries are arguably more important, so you really have to use your own eyes and personal judgment.

                          At one time Ogden was a great tackle, but I don't see him as the best O-lineman of our generation, which was the original point of this argument. It's certainly not an open-and-shut case, but it's my opinion based off watching him play against the best DEs over the last few years. I'm sure his leg injuries have affected his balance, but the majority of OTs have fought through serious injuries as well, so I don't view this as a viable excuse.
                          I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                          And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                          Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                          How was Roaf over hyped dude went to 11 pro bowls and was the best LT in the game when he played IMO for sure top 3. The guy would take two some times even 3 guys out on a signal play time after time.
                          How many times was he an All Pro? Just wondering. Not saying Roaf isn't a hall of famer, but pro bowls for OTs are useless. I'm sure Roaf didn't deserve at least 3 or 4 of those pro bowls.
                          Roaf was on the all 90's team and that was before he came to KC and he got even better.

                          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL_1990s_All-Decade_Team

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by eazyb81
                            Originally posted by Bohleive
                            I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                            And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                            Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                            I'm sorry, but you're an idiot - do you even watch Baltimore games? The DEs I named did indeed line up against Ogden during the game; I know this may shock the hell out of you, but DEs sometimes change which side they line up on during a game....crazy, eh?

                            Finally, i'm not even arguing for Roaf - I think Pace is the best Olineman of our generation. I have no idea why you keep trying to change the argument over to Roaf; i'm guessing you have a serious case of ADD.
                            I was responding to someone else on Roaf. And of course I realize that they change who they lineup against, I even made that point with Merriman, who got no sacks when lined up against Ogden. And as for Peppers, no, he never lined up against him. Period. He doesn't get moved around; that's the way they play him.
                            And do you ever watch Ravens games? I haven't missed one since '98. Are you some kind of avid Ravens fan? My points stand.
                            I think you're the one with ADD. You keep changing your argument. What ever happened to a number of Pro Bowls not being a stat?
                            You're just spouting off bull****. Give some evidence to back up your opinion.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Jughead10
                              Originally posted by Splat420
                              Originally posted by Bohleive
                              Originally posted by eazyb81
                              Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable

                              Sorry easy, but I gotta agree with Bohlieve here, please give some names of these guys who dominated Ogden. Ive been a Ravens fan since they came here in 96 and I dont remember these players. And name guys who Pace and Roaf played who were better.
                              You must have a short memory, because I remember guys like Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis, Shawne Merriman, and Derrick Burgess getting the best of Ogden over the past couple years. Sacks allowed is not the only stat to pay attention to when evaluating tackles - hurries are arguably more important, so you really have to use your own eyes and personal judgment.

                              At one time Ogden was a great tackle, but I don't see him as the best O-lineman of our generation, which was the original point of this argument. It's certainly not an open-and-shut case, but it's my opinion based off watching him play against the best DEs over the last few years. I'm sure his leg injuries have affected his balance, but the majority of OTs have fought through serious injuries as well, so I don't view this as a viable excuse.
                              I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                              And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                              Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                              How was Roaf over hyped dude went to 11 pro bowls and was the best LT in the game when he played IMO for sure top 3. The guy would take two some times even 3 guys out on a signal play time after time.
                              How many times was he an All Pro? Just wondering. Not saying Roaf isn't a hall of famer, but pro bowls for OTs are useless. I'm sure Roaf didn't deserve at least 3 or 4 of those pro bowls.
                              Yeah, we all know about that southeast media bias, especially for the dynasty known as the early 90's New Orleans Saints - that franchise was just a Pro Bowl factory.



                              :roll:


                              Originally posted by BrownsTown

                              If Chase Daniel finishes top 5 in the Heisman I'll cut my balls off.

                              2008 COTTON BOWL CHAMPIONS

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by Splat420
                                Originally posted by Jughead10
                                Originally posted by Splat420
                                Originally posted by Bohleive
                                Originally posted by eazyb81
                                Originally posted by EdReedUnstoppable

                                Sorry easy, but I gotta agree with Bohlieve here, please give some names of these guys who dominated Ogden. Ive been a Ravens fan since they came here in 96 and I dont remember these players. And name guys who Pace and Roaf played who were better.
                                You must have a short memory, because I remember guys like Dwight Freeney, Julius Peppers, Robert Mathis, Shawne Merriman, and Derrick Burgess getting the best of Ogden over the past couple years. Sacks allowed is not the only stat to pay attention to when evaluating tackles - hurries are arguably more important, so you really have to use your own eyes and personal judgment.

                                At one time Ogden was a great tackle, but I don't see him as the best O-lineman of our generation, which was the original point of this argument. It's certainly not an open-and-shut case, but it's my opinion based off watching him play against the best DEs over the last few years. I'm sure his leg injuries have affected his balance, but the majority of OTs have fought through serious injuries as well, so I don't view this as a viable excuse.
                                I never said Roaf wasn't very good, just overhyped.
                                And as for your 'list'. None of those guys other than Freeny, for one game out of three, dominated Ogden. Peppers never even lined up against him, he's a LE. Burgess had 0 sacks against him this year and Mathis never lined up against him either. As for Merriman, he had 1 sack lined up against Pashos this season.
                                Just keep digging that hole. Strange how no one other than Missouri residents agree with you. Your argument is absurd.
                                How was Roaf over hyped dude went to 11 pro bowls and was the best LT in the game when he played IMO for sure top 3. The guy would take two some times even 3 guys out on a signal play time after time.
                                How many times was he an All Pro? Just wondering. Not saying Roaf isn't a hall of famer, but pro bowls for OTs are useless. I'm sure Roaf didn't deserve at least 3 or 4 of those pro bowls.
                                Roaf was on the all 90's team and that was before he came to KC and he got even better.

                                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NFL_1990s_All-Decade_Team
                                You've changed my mind on Roaf, he now makes my HOF list. I still don't think he was better than Ogden though.

                                Comment

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