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  • #76
    Yet you can sit there and claim there was no fire in Michael Jordan's case when there was PLENTY of smoke. And I have a huge problem with the term "cheated." I agree that they broke an NFL rule. No doubt about it. There is absolutely ZERO proof that the Patriots used any of the video taped signals inside of that same game. ZERO. As a matter of fact, there is more proof that Jordan might have bet on basketball then there is that the Patriots used any of their video work in game.

    Yet it's OK for you to call them cheaters and assume they did use the tapes in game because of some stupid cliche. But suggest Jordan bet on basketball and ooooh no, don't go there!

    It's all a hypocrisy. A pretty funny one too. And by admitting you hate Bill Belichick, you're proving that you are just looking for every reason to talk **** as much as I am looking for every reason to defend him. We can go in circles alld ay if that's what you want.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by Jay View Post
      Yet you can sit there and claim there was no fire in Michael Jordan's case when there was PLENTY of smoke. And I have a huge problem with the term "cheated." I agree that they broke an NFL rule. No doubt about it. There is absolutely ZERO proof that the Patriots used any of the video taped signals inside of that same game. ZERO. As a matter of fact, there is more proof that Jordan might have bet on basketball then there is that the Patriots used any of their video work in game.

      Yet it's OK for you to call them cheaters and assume they did use the tapes in game because of some stupid cliche. But suggest Jordan bet on basketball and ooooh no, don't go there!

      It's all a hypocrisy. A pretty funny one too. And by admitting you hate Bill Belichick, you're proving that you are just looking for every reason to talk **** as much as I am looking for every reason to defend him. We can go in circles alld ay if that's what you want.
      did michael jordan's betting give his team an unfair advantage?


      Originally posted by mythbusta
      i love my pedestal. thats why im the mythbusta.
      who dey?

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      • #78
        I don't know, did Pete Rose's betting give his team an unfair advantage?

        Oh and... the man you are all pinning your hopes and dreams on... :

        MAYBE THE MEDIA SHOULD EYEBALL WALSH

        Though we're edging ever closer to becoming part of the "real" media, we're still a long way away from having the kind of time and resources that would allow us to engage in a comprehensive investigation of a key figure in one of the various stories about which we often tend to blather.

        If, for example, we had the time and/or the resources, we'd devote a chunk of it to finding out more about Matt Walsh.

        Precious little has been done by the media to find out more about him, or to get a general feel for whether he generally can be believed. From our perspective, we think that what he says (and how he says it) about Spygate II will say much about whether he is credible. Until he talks, however, there's work that can be done to get a better idea of who he is and what he's about.

        For starters, the contention that Walsh secretly recorded conversations with Pats V.P. of player personnel Scott Pioli is great way to get a good feel for whether Walsh is a truth-teller. Walsh's lawyer calls the rare public utterance from Pioli a "complete fabrication." So if the Pats and/or Pioli can prove that it happened, the failure of Walsh to tell the truth to his lawyer on that topic would be relevant in connection with an assessment of whether he's telling the truth about what he might eventually tell Senator Arlen Specter (R-Pa.) or anyone else.

        Other easily available information to scrutinize is Walsh's bio for his current job. In it, he says that he "served primarily as an Area Scout and Video Assistant from 1996-2003" with the Patriots. But Pioli told the Boston Globe that Walsh was never an Area Scout. So if the Pats and/or Pioli can prove this, it would be another strike against him.

        In fact, Walsh's overall bio requires the full-blown Fran Foley treatment. Based on the article regarding his then-looming nuptials, he was 28 in July 2004 and is a Gemini. Thus, he's presently 31. Unless he pulled a Doogie Howser (or a Forrest Gump), it's hard to cram everything he claims to have done into the period of time that would require him to get a college degree, play two years of pro hockey, train with the U.S. National Bobsled team, spend a year working for an Arena League team, seven with the Pats, one with NFL Europe, and then become an assistant golf pro in Hawaii.

        The article about his wedding describes his time with the Pats as including "operations, public relations, video/game planning, area scout." Game planning? Um. Okay.

        Other questions about Walsh should be asked. Such as, for example, how he found -- and how he can afford -- a Washington, D.C. lawyer who specializes in white-collar crime and government investigations. Could it be that Senator Specter hooked Walsh up with Michael Levy, and/or that Levy is handling the matter at no charge as a "favor" to the Senator?

        So while we're uncomfortable with the notion that NFL Security is looking up on the guy, we think that the media has an obligation to do so, especially if the media (us included) is going to continue to write about the inflammatory things that Walsh supposedly knows.

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        • #79
          Originally posted by Jay View Post
          I don't know, did Pete Rose's betting give his team an unfair advantage?

          Oh and... the man you are all pinning your hopes and dreams on... :
          I honestly have no idea, because he also coached his team. But i would venture a guess no.

          But you brought up this MJ betting argument, and thats not cheating. Thats just stupidity.

          and a reply to the top post:

          why in the hell would they tape teams, but not try to get an advantage out of it? That train of thought doesn't make any sense.
          Last edited by Bengals1690; 02-18-2008, 04:38 PM.


          Originally posted by mythbusta
          i love my pedestal. thats why im the mythbusta.
          who dey?

          Comment


          • #80
            They try to get an advantage out of EVERYTHING. Every team does. Every team watchs all types of film. I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that Bill Belichick operates inside every possible grey area possible and would take unflushed stool samples out of hotel shitters if it meant he could figure out something for a game plan. And I don't think it is completely ridiculous to think any or every other team does the same thing. And other teams have been caught breaking NFL rules. Some pretty major ones like salary cap and tampering, etc.

            Jordan had the ball in his hands more than any other Chicago Bull. Of course he could effect games. That one is a no brainer. I'm not saying he did or didn't, but you know, where there's smoke, there's fire, so by NFLDraftcountdown.com bylaw 36.4 article 6 section 8 amendment 2c, we are therefor to assume he did...

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            • #81
              Originally posted by Bengals1690 View Post
              I honestly have no idea, because he also coached his team. But i would venture a guess no.

              But you brought up this MJ betting argument, and thats not cheating. Thats just stupidity.

              and a reply to the top post:

              why in the hell would they tape teams, but not try to get an advantage out of it? That train of thought doesn't make any sense.
              First off, Pete Rose has said that he bet his team to win every time, which theoretically would not change the outcome of the game, in most cases.

              Second, it has been said before that the patriots tape defenses of other teams to keep a record of what tendencies those teams have as far as play calling. Nobody has proven that the patriots have taped signals and used them in games.

              As far as the Walsh tapes, nodoby can prove (other than BB) that the Patriots actually ordered and used the tapes from the Rams walkthrough. It boils down to Walsh's word against BB's word, no proof anywhere. Also, he could be bringing this up now just to make money and remain out of trouble. Why not bring it up after the 2nd superbowl, or the 3rd which was equally as hyped as this past superbowl?
              Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, Bruins, Texas Longhorns

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              • #82
                Originally posted by Jay View Post
                I don't know, did Pete Rose's betting give his team an unfair advantage?

                Oh and... the man you are all pinning your hopes and dreams on... :
                I don't think Pete Rose should be barred from the HOF, and if it does turn out BB cheated, I don't think he should be barred from the NFL either. What Pete Rose did was not cheating, he always bet on his team. Yes, it probably did affect the games. If he bet on the game, he would be more likely to pitch his closer or top reliever, but I digress.


                The article about his wedding describes his time with the Pats as including "operations, public relations, video/game planning, area scout." Game planning? Um. Okay.
                If he broke down film, he helped with the game planning...

                If you really believe that BB didn't use the spygate film in games, I have some land to sell you...
                I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.
                Hunter S. Thompson

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by Jay View Post
                  They try to get an advantage out of EVERYTHING. Every team does. Every team watchs all types of film. I have absolutely no doubt whatsoever that Bill Belichick operates inside every possible grey area possible and would take unflushed stool samples out of hotel shitters if it meant he could figure out something for a game plan. And I don't think it is completely ridiculous to think any or every other team does the same thing. And other teams have been caught breaking NFL rules. Some pretty major ones like salary cap and tampering, etc.

                  Jordan had the ball in his hands more than any other Chicago Bull. Of course he could effect games. That one is a no brainer. I'm not saying he did or didn't, but you know, where there's smoke, there's fire, so by NFLDraftcountdown.com bylaw 36.4 article 6 section 8 amendment 2c, we are therefor to assume he did...
                  If he's trying to gain an advantage out of everything, why do you believe that he wouldn't use it in the games? That seems like the biggest advantage of them all.

                  Comment


                  • #84
                    Originally posted by skarocksoi View Post
                    If he's trying to gain an advantage out of everything, why do you believe that he wouldn't use it in the games? That seems like the biggest advantage of them all.
                    BECAUSE HE SAID HE DIDNT!!! PEOPLE DON'T EVER LIE!!!
                    I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.
                    Hunter S. Thompson

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                    • #85
                      theorotically, couldnt belicheat have taped the defensive signals then:

                      sync them up with the game footage; then when you see the same hand signal x amount of times, and everytime its a certain blitz/coverage (lets use cb blitz for example)

                      then when you play that team again, and the o-coord or brady sees that signal, they could audible to a more favorable play

                      is that possible?

                      cred 2 BoneKrusher

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by kwilk103 View Post
                        theorotically, couldnt belicheat have taped the defensive signals then:

                        sync them up with the game footage; then when you see the same hand signal x amount of times, and everytime its a certain blitz/coverage (lets use cb blitz for example)

                        then when you play that team again, and the o-coord or brady sees that signal, they could audible to a more favorable play

                        is that possible?
                        Yes, it is likely that is what happened. But I think it is naive to rule out the possibility that they had people breaking it down DURING the games to be used in the second half.
                        I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.
                        Hunter S. Thompson

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                        • #87
                          thats what i thought they would do; i also assumed they could get the tape at halftime, and have the signals halfway through the 3rd at the latest

                          at least if i was the coach and cheated, thats what i would do

                          oh, and the blind homerism in this thread is annoying

                          cred 2 BoneKrusher

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by kwilk103 View Post
                            thats what i thought they would do; i also assumed they could get the tape at halftime, and have the signals halfway through the 3rd at the latest

                            at least if i was the coach and cheated, thats what i would do

                            oh, and the blind homerism in this thread is annoying
                            Ya, no kidding.

                            Personally, I have no problem that they cheated. But if you get caught, own up to it and accept your punishment. If you ain't cheatin' you ain't tryin'
                            I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.
                            Hunter S. Thompson

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                            • #89
                              It's not blind homerism to defend your team from pure speculation, which is exactly what is happening with the Walsh tapes. Nobody has seen these tapes (outside of Walsh, and supposedly others) yet people are willing to condemn the patriots as having cheated before the superbowl in 2001 against the rams.
                              Patriots, Red Sox, Celtics, Bruins, Texas Longhorns

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by Bigburt63 View Post
                                It's not blind homerism to defend your team from pure speculation, which is exactly what is happening with the Walsh tapes. Nobody has seen these tapes (outside of Walsh, and supposedly others) yet people are willing to condemn the patriots as having cheated before the superbowl in 2001 against the rams.
                                Maybe because they were caught illegally taping earlier this year already?
                                I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me.
                                Hunter S. Thompson

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