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  • #46
    there wont be another serious incident IMO

    i cant remember where i read it but i was reading something he said and basically he was saying that he didnt want his daughter to grow up with an angry dad who does the things he has done (grudoe?sp)

    basically he realised he had to becoem much more responsible and has taken his career very seriously ever since, with the suspension training, all of the anger management classes, i think hes doing a sean taylor (RIP) where by hes turning the corner maturity wise and the effects were obvious, taylor upped his game and lived up to his incredible potential and haynesworth from what we saw this season has done the same, hopefuly it continues

    he is the heart of our defense and jeff fisher said he aint going anywhere so i guess hes gonna be a titan for a long while

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    • #47
      Gurode and Haynesworth are friends now, so their is no bad blood between the two, they were hanging out at the pro bowl and Gurode was saying its behind them and Haynesworth is a good guy.

      Although Ill be the first to admit it was scary, I was watching that game as it happened and it easily could of ended alot worse, when you think about the football player who lost his eyesight and career to a referee flag, you can see permanent injury or death to a cleat to the face...Im glad it worked out the way it did, was a very scary play seeing Gurode's head exposed.





      Originally posted by Scott Wright
      I guarantee that if someone picks Cam Newton in the Top 5 they will regret it.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by TacticaLion View Post
        That wasn't the point... at all. Try to follow it this time:

        Titans' fans keep saying how the face stomp was ONE incident... yet he stomped on a teammate during training camp. So, the stomping wasn't only one incident, but happened more than once. Considering 99% of the players in the NFL last their entire career without stomping on a player, and Haynesworth has done it twice, I'd call it an "issue".

        Believe what you will: teams haven't forgotten the incident, and probably wont.
        I did follow you, but you didnt follow me. Ive said many players get into fights in training camps. It happens about every other day. Its to be expected with the heat. Training camp skirmishes dont count as incidents. And how do you know the stomping happened more than once? The article you posted said he kicked a player.

        Originally posted by kmartin575 View Post
        The most dominant defensive presence in the NFL? A guy who finally performed in a contract year? If Haynesworth is the most dominant defensive presence in the NFL then the defensive talent in the league has gone to ****.
        Its obvious you've probably only watched Haynesworth play a few times in his career if even. In fact im willing to bet you are making this statement based on stats. If you watched Haynesworth at all this season you would know that he was the most dominant defensive force. Hes one of the main reasons LaBoy and Odom got overpayed this offseason. He probably would've won defensive MVP had he played a couple more games.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Cashmoneydrew View Post
          I did follow you, but you didnt follow me. Ive said many players get into fights in training camps. It happens about every other day. Its to be expected with the heat. Training camp skirmishes dont count as incidents. And how do you know the stomping happened more than once? The article you posted said he kicked a player.



          Its obvious you've probably only watched Haynesworth play a few times in his career if even. In fact im willing to bet you are making this statement based on stats. If you watched Haynesworth at all this season you would know that he was the most dominant defensive force. Hes one of the main reasons LaBoy and Odom got overpayed this offseason. He probably would've won defensive MVP had he played a couple more games.
          Sorry but that is still just your opinion, AND the opinion of a fan of the team he plays for. Not exactly a credible opinion IMO. You could make a case for guys like Freeney and Tommie Harris being more dominant defensive forces when healthy.

          And one season of great play does not make a player the most dominant in the league. Countless other players have played above and beyond when their contract was on the line.

          Sorry but i'm not buying it. Until this season Haynesworth was just a face in the crowd.

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          • #50
            I'm about as unbiased on this as you can get so here's my two cents:

            Not sure what the big deal is with "off the field issues" and Haynesworth. The stomping was horrible and unforgivable but he has kept his act clean and everyone deserves and 2nd chance. Other then that stomping, he's never really done anything else except for all the rumbling about his bad attitude. As long as he plays the way he did last season, no one will care about his attitude.

            On the flip side, Titan fans seem to be severly overrating him. He's been average thru his entire career until last season and considered somewhat of a malcontent until his play came around. While you Titan fans are all saying he ahs turned a corner in his life and is a better person, you don't know that for sure. He could have very well dropped the malcontent label simply because people were willing to ignore it with his play being at such a high level. You guys are just throwing your opinion out there that he has turned the corner and that his value is thru the roof but fact is that you don't know that for sure and teams don't trade based on the opinion that he turned the corner, they trade based on what he has done and what he can do for them.

            All that said, You've got a guy that was dominant last season. One of the 3 best DL in the league last season. He is still young and could anchor a line for years to come. Those players don't grow on trees and hold a good amount of value. However, he comes with his fair share of questions. Has he really gotten past the malcontent phase or were people willing to overlook it based on his play? Is he really the total package or was last year a fluke and a by product of being in a contract year? Which is the real Haynesworth, the average, big body for the 1st couple years of his career, or the dominating, QB wrecker that took the field last season?

            Too many questions for him to be worth 2 1sts the way Titan fans are stating but I don't see why, with his value being at it's peak, he couldn't fetched a solid mid 1st round pick from a team like Carolina.

            I really feel like too many people are split on him here. Non Titan fans bring up the stomping and try to say he is worth way less then he is and Titan fans act as if he's the 2nd coming of Reggie White and hype him as a world beater when he really only has one good year to go with rumored attitude problems and average play during the rest of his career. His value is lower then Titan fans are saying and higher then some other guys on here are giving him credit for.

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            • #51
              There is no doubt AH has questions about whether he can repeat this performance and whether he will even try as hard once he is paid. I'm just recounting his value last season, not saying he is now the best defender in the league or anything.

              For the right price the Titans may trade him, but they'd be giving up the single most important reason they made the playoffs last season (Defense, and without AH, forget it) and that would probably come at a price no team would be willing to match because of the fact he isn't a proven player quite yet. He may not be worth two 1sts or whatever with everything weighed up, but after last season, the Titans would be fools to accept anything less than "wow" value in a trade. Just the mere chance he could return in 08+ and play just as good if not better means he's worth keeping and signing long term, so the value offered in trade would have to offset that possibility and make it worth the Titans' while to not try and see. A single 1st just doesn't seem worth opting out on gambling with AH - after all, a DP is a gamble too. Probably a much bigger one than even AH.
              Last edited by OzTitan; 03-10-2008, 04:14 AM.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Cashmoneydrew View Post
                I did follow you, but you didnt follow me. Ive said many players get into fights in training camps. It happens about every other day. Its to be expected with the heat. Training camp skirmishes dont count as incidents. And how do you know the stomping happened more than once? The article you posted said he kicked a player.
                I understand completely. I know that training camp skirmishes are common. Someone mentioned how this was the only time something like this happened... but it's not. Hartwig, a center, was shoved to his knees (after a play) and Haynesworth kicked him in the chest. A deliberate kick. Gurode, a center, happened to be on the ground and was stomped. I don't think he should've been punished for the Hartwig incident, but it shows that it wasn't the first time.
                Left NFLDC: 20080918.

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                • #53
                  Ive said my piece and Im done with this thread after this post. AH has played well in seasons before this contract year. I think those of you who say he was average are really just basing your judgement on his stats from those years. But hey, whatever, I think he'll have another excellent season this year, and another clean season and all the doubters will slowly start to come around.

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                  • #54
                    look at it this way...do you really want a 320 lb shaun alexander on your hands (ie. a player who performed very well in a contract year, adn then fell off after recieving a huge contract)? because potentially, thats what AH will become...im not saying thats a given, but the potetnial for that to happen is there. It a big gamble, but i dont think the titans will trade him
                    Originally posted by Mr. Goosemahn
                    The APS is strong in this one.
                    Originally posted by killxswitch
                    Tears for Fears is better than whatever it is you happen to be thinking about right now.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by A Perfect Score View Post
                      look at it this way...do you really want a 320 lb shaun alexander on your hands (ie. a player who performed very well in a contract year, adn then fell off after recieving a huge contract)? because potentially, thats what AH will become...im not saying thats a given, but the potetnial for that to happen is there. It a big gamble, but i dont think the titans will trade him
                      Im not really sure Shaun Alexander is a good comparison for that analogy. He was a perrenial 1200+ yd rusher before his contract year, and he's been dogged by injuries plus the loss of hutchinson.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by nobodyinparticular View Post
                        The most dominant in one year out of 5. Before last year, Haynesworth was considered one of the bigger busts of his draft class.
                        Not true...he's been an immature jackass most of his career but I don't think anyones ever questioned his impact on the field. I've seen him argued as the top DT in the NFL even before this career year. That may not have been true, but he was still a very good player who just had alot of injuries and made alot of bad choices.

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                        • #57
                          The quick way to sum this up is that up to this point Haynesworth career is more on par with the Shayn Rodgers and Kris Jenkins of the world then the Warren Sapps of the world. All good players who could take over a game but Sapp was just on a whole nother level. Haynesworth isn't anywhere near the Sapp level of play yet and alot of Titans fans a treating him as such.

                          He did have good years before last season and he always had potential but Titans fans talking about his play before this season are fooling themselves. He had good years, not great years and he also had alot of issues and was very inconsistent with stretches where he wouldn't see the field for large chucks at a time. So yes at times he was a very good player even before this last season but by and large his career coming into last season was very average.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Joeyjr09 View Post
                            The quick way to sum this up is that up to this point Haynesworth career is more on par with the Shayn Rodgers and Kris Jenkins of the world then the Warren Sapps of the world. All good players who could take over a game but Sapp was just on a whole nother level. Haynesworth isn't anywhere near the Sapp level of play yet and alot of Titans fans a treating him as such.
                            He was an elite DT last season. What do you want us to say? That he was elite but not quite as elite as a future HOF'r once was? It's hard to diminish a season and performance that you saw in front of you because of how good a player was in the past. It's not even relevant to me, all I know is how important he was last season for the Titans. Part of that is scheme too, not just AH - Jim Schwartz relies heavily on front 4 pressure and doesn't adjust when there is none. That also helped magnify AH's importance. Again, I don't think anyone here is suggesting he is now a career elite DT, he just had a very, very good season even when missing a few more games to injury and not coming back completely healthy. I'm not really sure how it compares to previous DT seasons and I don't really care, last year the Titans were not a playoff team without AH.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by OzTitan View Post
                              He was an elite DT last season. What do you want us to say? That he was elite but not quite as elite as a future HOF'r once was? It's hard to diminish a season and performance that you saw in front of you because of how good a player was in the past. It's not even relevant to me, all I know is how important he was last season for the Titans. Part of that is scheme too, not just AH - Jim Schwartz relies heavily on front 4 pressure and doesn't adjust when there is none. That also helped magnify AH's importance. Again, I don't think anyone here is suggesting he is now a career elite DT, he just had a very, very good season even when missing a few more games to injury and not coming back completely healthy. I'm not really sure how it compares to previous DT seasons and I don't really care, last year the Titans were not a playoff team without AH.
                              Were you serious with this? You don't care to compare him with other DTs? This entire thread is about his trade value, and to gauge trade value you have to compare him to other players that have been dealt such as Rodgers and Jenkins to see where you think his value lies. I'm not diminishing his value based on what Sapp did in the past. I was simply using players such as Sapp, Rodgers and Jenkins as gauges as to where his trade value is really at. And that was the topic of this thread. What his trade value would be. Not what he means to the Titans or how good of a year he had last season.

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Joeyjr09 View Post
                                Were you serious with this? You don't care to compare him with other DTs? This entire thread is about his trade value, and to gauge trade value you have to compare him to other players that have been dealt such as Rodgers and Jenkins to see where you think his value lies. I'm not diminishing his value based on what Sapp did in the past. I was simply using players such as Sapp, Rodgers and Jenkins as gauges as to where his trade value is really at. And that was the topic of this thread. What his trade value would be. Not what he means to the Titans or how good of a year he had last season.
                                Well the DT that got moved from Green Bay to Cleveland fetched a second rounder, so AH would probably receive a better offer.

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