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  • #76
    Originally posted by Brent View Post
    As for Alex Smith, the homer in me feels the need to at least defend him some. While I agree he's be awful, I'll that his rookie year, he never should have seen the field, that team had players starting that couldn't even get a roster spot on most teams this season. When Norv was there, he was learning an entirely new offense for the second year in a row. Same with last year, except there was a guy calling plays that couldn't tell the difference between 1st-and-ten and 3rd-and-1. As for this year, Martz is there and Alex is on his fourth playbook in four years. That's a bit ridiculous. I don't think all the blame should be on him for being thrust into a situation that really wasn't that nurturing for a young QB. Also, if I am not mistaken, he's still younger than some/all of the 1st round QBs from this year.

    He's supposed to be one of the hardest workers according to Martz, and he's there so I assume he knows better than we do.
    People seem to forget, that despite having three years under his belt, he has only 2 years worth of starts. And that doesn't include 4 games last year when he was injured.

    His first year, he was so raw he didn't even know how to drop back from the pocket correctly so I think that year wasn't really a good measure either. All-in-all it's hard to say anything about Smith because we are judging one year of production from two years ago.

    But we can say this. Alex Smith has shown plenty of flashes of the tools that he brings to the table. He has a good frame, good height and has continued to gain weight since getting in the league. He is athletic with a pretty strong/accurate arm and can throw well on the run and has pretty good escapability. Most importantly, he is a hard worker and has always put in the time and effort to learn the 4 offenses and study film (ever OC has said so). A lot of QB's have a limited ceiling due to lack of athleticism, intelligence, work ethic, etc. Smith doesn't have those limitations, so thats why there is still A LOT to like about what he brings to the table in terms of his tools.

    The two areas which he has struggled - mechanics and reading his progressions quickly are things that most young QB's struggle with. All of his offenses have traditionally been timing offenses, the WCO and the Air Coryell don't throw to open WR's as often as the spread offense, without good mechanics it makes these timing routes nearly impossible. However, under Turner (who worked tirelessly with his mechanics, Smith really improved in this area. We should expect a similar effect with Martz). Reading progressions faster should come with more experience in a single offense, if he ever gets the chance.

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    • #77
      Originally posted by Burns336 View Post
      The guy that you should be hoping Alex Smith follows is Drew Brees. He started out terrible in SD.
      Actually, Brees was servicable his first year starting. He completed a higher percentage of his passes that year than Phillip Rivers, Jason Campbell, Marc Bulger, Derek Anderson, Trent Edwards, or Eli Manning did this year. He threw more TDs than INTs, and had a higher passer rating than Eli Manning, Trent Edwards, or Marc Bulger had this season. Brees wasn't great, but a team could get by with him.

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      • #78
        Originally posted by no love View Post
        (who worked tirelessly with his mechanics, Smith really improved in this area. We should expect a similar effect with Martz).
        You obviously didn't see what Martz did with the Senior Bowl QBs this year. Martz is brutal on QBs.

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        • #79
          Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
          Actually, Brees was servicable his first year starting. He completed a higher percentage of his passes that year than Phillip Rivers, Jason Campbell, Marc Bulger, Derek Anderson, Trent Edwards, or Eli Manning did this year. He threw more TDs than INTs, and had a higher passer rating than Eli Manning, Trent Edwards, or Marc Bulger had this season. Brees wasn't great, but a team could get by with him.
          Interesting. I didn't even bother to look at stats, but I live in San Diego and remember everyone calling for his head. Then Rivers got drafted and he turned into the All-Pro Brees. People hated Brees, then didn't know what to do or how to act when the team finally let him go in favor of an unproven rookie.

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          • #80
            Originally posted by Burns336 View Post
            Interesting. I didn't even bother to look at stats, but I live in San Diego and remember everyone calling for his head. Then Rivers got drafted and he turned into the All-Pro Brees. People hated Brees, then didn't know what to do or how to act when the team finally let him go in favor of an unproven rookie.
            The problem Brees had was twofold. One, He had Doug Flutie backing him up, and people just love that guy, no matter how he plays. Two, they were distrustful of any sign of suck from a QB they drafted after the Ryan Leaf incident.

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            • #81
              Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
              Actually, Brees was servicable his first year starting. He completed a higher percentage of his passes that year than Phillip Rivers, Jason Campbell, Marc Bulger, Derek Anderson, Trent Edwards, or Eli Manning did this year. He threw more TDs than INTs, and had a higher passer rating than Eli Manning, Trent Edwards, or Marc Bulger had this season. Brees wasn't great, but a team could get by with him.
              But the next year when you thought he had turned the corner he was abysmal and was eventually benched in favor of Doug Flutie. He was serviceable in 2002 true, but he more so a game manager than the Brees we know of today. And he didn't have it all together until 2004.

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              Originally posted by Borat
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              • #82
                Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
                The problem Brees had was twofold. One, He had Doug Flutie backing him up, and people just love that guy, no matter how he plays. Two, they were distrustful of any sign of suck from a QB they drafted after the Ryan Leaf incident.
                The second really put an end to brees' tenure. Leaf Syndrome.

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                • #83
                  Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
                  You obviously didn't see what Martz did with the Senior Bowl QBs this year. Martz is brutal on QBs.
                  That was a few days worth of work, not an entire offseason. All the beat writers have been saying that he was looking better this year than in any of the years previous to this year. Granted this is OTAs we are talking about but in that short amount of time, Martz has already changed Alex's mechanics to what need feels is right and continually gushes over him.

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
                    The problem Brees had was twofold. One, He had Doug Flutie backing him up, and people just love that guy, no matter how he plays. Two, they were distrustful of any sign of suck from a QB they drafted after the Ryan Leaf incident.
                    Axctually, the problem was threefold. Those two plus the San Diego offense's lack of talent. There is a reason so few of the starting offensive linemen and starting wide receivers from the Chargers 2003 team were

                    A. In the NFL
                    B. In the NFL and getting playing time
                    C. In the NFL and playing well

                    by 2004.

                    WR: David Boston
                    WR: Reche Caldwell
                    LT: Damion McIntosh
                    LG: Kelvin Garmon
                    C: Cory Raymer
                    RG: Phil Bogle
                    RT: Courtney VanBuren

                    IIRC, by 2006, 2 of these guys were still in the league. Caldwell, who's claim to fame was being the Patriots leading receiver among their dismal 2006 WR squad and McIntosh, who is on the once great now terrible Kansas City offensive line.

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                    • #85
                      Originally posted by Ness View Post
                      But the next year when you thought he had turned the corner he was abysmal and was eventually benched in favor of Doug Flutie. He was serviceable in 2002 true, but he more so a game manager than the Brees we know of today. And he didn't have it all together until 2004.
                      He did regress under Marty, but that's because Marty isn't near as good a QB coach as Mike Riley is. But Brees had shown signs that he was at least capable of not burying his own team.

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
                        He did regress under Marty, but that's because Marty isn't near as good a QB coach as Mike Riley is. But Brees had shown signs that he was at least capable of not burying his own team.
                        Yes...as did Alex Smith. Especially at the start of the 2006 season. Too bad we didn't have the defense of 2007 and the offense of 2006. But we probably would have if Norv Turner didn't leave.

                        "Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
                        -San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
                        Originally posted by Borat
                        Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.

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                        • #87
                          Originally posted by Ness View Post
                          Yes...as did Alex Smith. Especially at the start of the 2006 season. Too bad we didn't have the defense of 2007 and the offense of 2006. But we probably would have if Norv Turner didn't leave.
                          Alex Smith never threw more TDs than INTs, never threw for more than 3,000 yards, never threw over 60%. Factor in how he's been undermined by the head coach and veteran teamates, and I just don't see him developing in san fran.

                          Stand Tall and Shake the Heavens!
                          The Destroyer Is Manifest!
                          I reserve the rights to retract any posts made betwen midnight and 5 AM PST due to being really, really drunk

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                          • #88
                            Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
                            Alex Smith never threw more TDs than INTs, never threw for more than 3,000 yards, never threw over 60%. Factor in how he's been undermined by the head coach and veteran teamates, and I just don't see him developing in san fran.
                            Drew Brees threw the ball more in 2002. And he averaged less per pass. And during that season he had what, one more touchdown than he did interceptions? While Alex was tied with 16 touchdowns and 16 interceptions? And Brees completed around just sixty percent of his passes while Smith had 58 percent. The difference in that could be the amount of passes the team receivers dropped. Not really a big deal if we're comparing those two seasons.

                            "Every light must fade, every heart return to darkness!"
                            -San Francisco 49ers: Five Time Super Bowl Champions-
                            Originally posted by Borat
                            Oh, my bad. Didn't realize SWDC was the pinnacle of class and grace.

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                            • #89
                              Originally posted by Ness View Post
                              Drew Brees threw the ball more in 2002. And he averaged less per pass. And during that season he had what, one more touchdown than he did interceptions? While Alex was tied with 16 touchdowns and 16 interceptions? And Brees completed around just sixty percent of his passes while Smith had 58 percent. The difference in that could be the amount of passes the team receivers dropped. Not really a big deal if we're comparing those two seasons.
                              It's not a big deal individually, but the fact that Brees was slightly better in every catagory makes a significant difference overall. He threw for more yards, more TDs, more accurately, took fewer sacks, fumbled the ball fewer times, and had a slightly higher adjusted net yards per attempt.

                              Stand Tall and Shake the Heavens!
                              The Destroyer Is Manifest!
                              I reserve the rights to retract any posts made betwen midnight and 5 AM PST due to being really, really drunk

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                              • #90
                                Originally posted by DragonFireKai View Post
                                Alex Smith never threw more TDs than INTs, never threw for more than 3,000 yards, never threw over 60%. Factor in how he's been undermined by the head coach and veteran teamates, and I just don't see him developing in san fran.
                                It never came out who on the team "undermined" him and we don't know if they were veterans or not. And while yes he was undermined by the head coach, it's a head coach who might not be around thing time next year.

                                He may develop in SF if he ever gets a coach for more than one year. Until then we will never know.

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