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Troy Aikman- HOF worthy?

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  • #61
    Originally posted by Geo View Post
    Aikman as a first ballot HOF, lol. There's bound to be at least Cowboys fan who doesn't disappoint in embarrassing themselves.

    We're talking about a guy who threw more than 20 TDs only once is his career, that's pathetic. 16 game seasons, and he averaged exactly 1 TD pass per game played: 165 TDs and 141 INTs in 165 GS/165 GP. He couldn't even average 8.0 passing yards per attempt in one season in his career, when he had Michael Irvin and Alvin Harper.

    Now credit where it's due, the Cowboys drafted Aikman first overall and he helped win a Super Bowl (the other two, meh). So he delivered on that great expectation, and not just as a first overall pick QB but as a first overall pick QB for a franchise that was in the dumps. That's big. And of course, he was a great player in his time. He was part of one of the NFL's dynasties. That all automatically earns him the discussion/debate.

    But not HOF worthy. The problem with Aikman is that he wasn't truly great for a long enough period of time nor was he good enough for a much longer period of time. He falls just shy in the former, and the concussions aren't enough to excuse the latter.

    Maybe he was your childhood hero/idol, I loved the guy when I was younger, but get a freaking grip. He was a product of Jimmy Johnson and the running game. Once the former left and the latter declined, Aikman dropped off hard.

    In his last four seasons (97-00) as the starting QB of the Cowboys, Aikman "led" the Cowboys to a 24-28 record and the once super-accurate passer couldn't even muster a 60 percent completion rate in one single season.

    This is the Hall of Fame. The Greatest of the Great. You put Aikman in, **** you might as well put Phil Simms, Boomer Esiason, and God knows who else in the years to come.
    Embarrassed myself huh?

    http://www.profootballhof.com/hof/me...?player_id=254

    You do realize Aikman has already been inducted into the Hall of Fame on his first try, don't you?

    Oh, you didn't? Try the Pro Football Hall of Fame website sometime, it works wonders.

    He was voted in by his peers as a FIRST BALLOT HALL OF FAMER. This is not a Cowboy fan "embarrassing himself", this is a fact.

    God damn, Haters gotta hate I guess.

    I have people in here arguing with me that he "shouldn't get in" and they don't even know that he has already been inducted. Jesus.

    Comment


    • #62
      Originally posted by Nalej View Post
      He IS in already. That's not the debate.
      The debate is do you think he deserves to be in.

      I'll call him a Game Manager. You can call him a team player.
      You can argue all you want of what he COULD have done.
      I'll just stick to what he DIDN'T do.
      He put up avg stats on a great team.

      As for 6 Pro Bowls? I'll go back to T. Holt.
      He's been to 7 and been All Pro twice (1st n 2nd team)
      Still, Holt needs to prove himself.


      Football is a team sport but you go to the HOF based on your indivisual accomplishments... plus rings.

      you have a good argument i must say

      Sig by BK

      “They have one guy, he’s pretty short. But he can go out and play. He can be a little aggravating too.’’ -- Joe Flacco talking about Brent Grimes.

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      • #63
        With their high-powered offense and stingy defense, the 13-3 Cowboys swept through the 1992 NFL playoffs, scoring a combined total of 116 points in three games including a 52-17 victory over the Buffalo Bills in Super Bowl XXVII. Aikman's 22 of 30 for 273 yards passing and four touchdowns earned him Super Bowl MVP honors.

        Over the next three seasons, the Cowboys enjoyed three consecutive 12-4 records and victories in Super Bowls XXVIII and XXX. Aikman, wide receiver Michael Irvin, and running back Emmitt Smith delivered an offensive attack that opponents found nearly impossible to contain. When defenses focused on Irvin and/or Smith, Aikman would find tight end Jay Novacek or wide receiver Alvin Harper. In the 1994 NFC Divisional Playoff Game against the Green Bay Packers, Aikman completed 23 of 30 passes for 337 yards. Irvin, Novacek, and Harper, each had more than 100 yards receiving. Aikman's 94-yard touchdown pass to Harper was the longest play from scrimmage in NFL post-season history at the time.

        With 90 wins in the 1990s, Aikman became the winningest starting quarterback of any decade in NFL history. Unfortunately, during his final two seasons, injuries began to take a toll on the Dallas quarterback and the team's winning ways. Finally, after the 2000 season, the Cowboys' six-time Pro Bowl selection announced his retirement from football. His career statistics include 32,942 yards and 165 touchdowns for a passer rating of 81.6.


        Oh and Geo, how nice of you to use his final injury plagued seasons (with no receiving threats at all on the team) as a measuring stick.

        This is why statistics are crap. Because people manipulate them.

        Comment


        • #64
          Originally posted by njx9
          or they're arguing that he wasn't worthy, whether he made it on the first ballot or not, which is the question the thread actually asks. but i'm sure you're still not embarrassed by a lack of ability to comprehend fairly simple english.

          the amount of rabid, vapid, mouth froth generated by certain groups of fans anytime one of "their players" is even remotely insulted is pretty entertaining.
          Go back and read the posts. Only about half of the naysayers realize that he's even in the HoF and are debating whether he belongs there.

          The rest, Such are Geo, are making fun of me for calling him a first ballot HoFer -- implying that he hasn't been inducted yet.

          So thanks for the input, but you're wrong.

          Comment


          • #65
            I posted stats to show performance level in a big game -- I also posted stats that show he was the winningest QB of his time.

            Far different from showing career stats, or harping on overall bad seasons.

            Like YFS said above -- look at the big game performance when it counts.

            Comment


            • #66
              Look you guys can argue all you want. The fact is, a panel of his peers and former NFL greats decided that Aikman was good enough to be inducted on his first ballot.

              Now that might now mean anything to some of you, but it means just about everything to me.

              No matter who the player, or what team they played for. If you get in on the first or second ballot -- you belong there in my opinion.

              Comment


              • #67
                Originally posted by njx9
                so it ONLY counts when he did well? what a crappy, intellectually dishonest argument. but i guess you'll also spin his nearly 1:1 td/int ratio.

                and his career stats are somehow irrelevant? heh, that's entertaining.

                some people shouldn't leave their team forums.
                NJX, are you honestly going to tell me that when a player performs well in HUGE games, that we should view it the same way as if that player blew a team out in week 1?

                Or how about the other way around? Are you going to tell me if a player is a regular season superstar, but can't pull it together in the playoffs -- we shouldn't take the atmosphere or type of games into account?

                You don't believe that. You're just arguing.

                Comment


                • #68
                  Literally, I actually forgot Aikman was already voted in the HOF. That's incredibly disappointing yet also extremely hilarious.

                  So on that point I apologize to you, Burnsy.

                  That is worse than Art Monk getting in. Hell, that is worse than Warren Moon getting in.
                  Pugnacity, testosterone, truculence, and belligerence.

                  Comment


                  • #69
                    Originally posted by Geo View Post
                    Literally, I actually forgot Aikman was already voted in the HOF. That's incredibly disappointing yet also extremely hilarious.

                    That is worse than Art Monk getting in. Hell, that is worse than Warren Moon getting in.
                    That's fine dude... I'm just saying -- He's already in.

                    I wouldn't expect anyone to remember the players that aren't on their teams anyway, but if you're going to call me an embarrassment, make sure that I am first haha.

                    Comment


                    • #70
                      I don't know how I forgot that, it's actually kind of sad. And it's not like it's the greatest injustice in the world, because for a period of time Aikman was great, but obviously I wouldn't have voted for him myself.

                      Then again I would vote for Edgerrin James, so I'm probably just as guilty as you, Burns. (not first ballot of course)
                      Pugnacity, testosterone, truculence, and belligerence.

                      Comment


                      • #71
                        Originally posted by Burns336 View Post
                        With 90 wins in the 1990s, Aikman became the winningest starting quarterback of any decade in NFL history. Unfortunately, during his final two seasons, injuries began to take a toll on the Dallas quarterback and the team's winning ways. Finally, after the 2000 season, the Cowboys' six-time Pro Bowl selection announced his retirement from football.
                        Until now, anyway. Peyton Manning currently has 101 wins in the 00s with a year left to build upon that total.


                        The problem arises when people use statistics like a drunk uses a lamp post: for support instead of illumination.

                        If luck is where preparation meets opportunity, then clutch is where failure meets luck.

                        <Add1ct> setting myself on fire can't be that hard
                        <Add1ct> but tackling a mosquito might prove a challenge

                        Comment


                        • #72
                          Isn't Brady also primed to break that record?
                          Pugnacity, testosterone, truculence, and belligerence.

                          Comment


                          • #73
                            Originally posted by Burns336 View Post
                            NJX, are you honestly going to tell me that when a player performs well in HUGE games, that we should view it the same way as if that player blew a team out in week 1?

                            Or how about the other way around? Are you going to tell me if a player is a regular season superstar, but can't pull it together in the playoffs -- we shouldn't take the atmosphere or type of games into account?

                            You don't believe that. You're just arguing.
                            njx does like to argue, but he is right nonetheless.

                            Comment


                            • #74
                              Originally posted by njx9
                              read and understood, but thanks. but don't let your homerism get in the way of an honest assessment.
                              That's the greatest comeback. You can never knock it. LOL.

                              Of course he's gotta be a homer because he believes Troy Aikman was worthy to be a HOFer. What a crazy homeristic thought.

                              Comment


                              • #75
                                Originally posted by Geo View Post
                                Isn't Brady also primed to break that record?
                                Brady needs 3 wins next year. Barring a 15-16 win Patriot season combined with a 0-1 win Colt season, Manning will leave the decade with that record.


                                The problem arises when people use statistics like a drunk uses a lamp post: for support instead of illumination.

                                If luck is where preparation meets opportunity, then clutch is where failure meets luck.

                                <Add1ct> setting myself on fire can't be that hard
                                <Add1ct> but tackling a mosquito might prove a challenge

                                Comment

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