Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Most dominating Defensive Star(s) ever???

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #16
    Originally posted by YAYareaRB View Post
    Didn't LT change how people blocked?
    Yes he did. Instead of letting a 3-4 rush backer have a free shot on the QB they actually started to block him!
    Originally posted by njx9
    i mean, why wouldn't the broncos take cam newton? they can play him at quarterback WITH tebow!

    Comment


    • #17
      Originally posted by TitleTown088 View Post
      "LT is in a class above his own". " LT far and away".


      LT was a great great player no doubt, but there are surely some other great players in the same class as him. He wasn't that much better than the other greats.

      It's like saying Joe Montana is in a class of his own... He is in the company of the other greats. He may be the best of the best, but he's not in his own echelon, and there in the hall of fame along with him because they were in the same "class" as him. Saying otherwise is subjective.
      Yes he is, and so is Joe.

      Junior! Junior Junior Junior, too many people just remember the broken down version that has been lurking around the NFL the last few years.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by no bare feet View Post
        Yes he did. Instead of letting a 3-4 rush backer have a free shot on the QB they actually started to block him!
        http://cornellsun.com/node/19046

        “The offenses started throwing the ball more, and then he came along and made them readjust all their schemes to be able to account for the great defensive player,” Knowles said.

        For the first time in years, offenses had to adjust to Taylor and attacking defenses, not the other way around, and this created modern football.

        Taylor spawned the need for a new breed of offensive lineman, and consequently, they ballooned in size and speed, especially on the quarterback’s blind side. (Michael Lewis, author of Moneyball, recently published a book about this evolution.) Blocking schemes changed to stop Taylor from blitzing unhindered. Before him, backs had picked up linebackers on all plays. But Taylor — who amassed 132.5 sacks in his career, the second-highest total ever at his retirement — could run through or around them to the ball carrier. New formations were created, such as Hall of Fame coach Joe Gibbs’ twin tight end or single back sets, in order to get a bigger player to block Taylor.


        Comment


        • #19
          Jason Taylor
          Ronnie Lott
          Junior Seau
          Joey Browner
          Deion Sanders

          sig by fenikz
          Originally posted by ImBrotherCain
          You are just a terrible person.
          Originally posted by bigbluedefense
          I have an iPhone.

          Comment


          • #20
            A few that deserve mention,
            -DT Warren Sapp, he was a force. Pass rusher, run stopper. He changed how teams played every week
            -DE Bruce Smith, great combination of size and speed/athletic ability.

            I don't know if people will accept this one or not, but I'm gonna throw it out there; Sean Taylor. The last two years of his career/life he was becoming one of the most disruptive forces I've seen on a football team. He covered so much ground and did everything you ask a safety to do and did it well. Wish we could have seen him really reach his full potential.

            sig by BoneKrusher

            PACKERS BADGERS BREWERS BUCKS

            Comment


            • #21
              Its hard comparing pass rushers from different eras, but nobody impacted an offensive gameplan or the way offenses played in general than LT.

              Deacon was dominant. Reggie was dominant. But they didn't change anything. Teams blocked them the same way they did the greats before them.

              That said, Titletown is right. He's not necessarily in a league of his own, but in my eyes theres no question he was the greatest defender ever.

              Whats overlooked is how Dick Butkus was LT before LT (not as dominant but the closest to LT). Butkus was close to as dominant, but he lacked the pass rushing element that LT had.

              Oddly enough, and maybe bf51 can back me on this bc im sure he knows about Butkus, I personally feel that Butkus couldve changed the game before LT did. Butkus would blitz up the middle and was unstoppable. Papa Bear just didn't do it often enough.

              I think if Butkus rushed the passer as much as LT did, he couldve had 130 or so sacks as well from the MIKE position. Maybe change blocking assignments the way LT did.

              Comment


              • #22
                Originally posted by bigbluedefense View Post
                Its hard comparing pass rushers from different eras, but nobody impacted an offensive gameplan or the way offenses played in general than LT.

                Deacon was dominant. Reggie was dominant. But they didn't change anything. Teams blocked them the same way they did the greats before them.

                That said, Titletown is right. He's not necessarily in a league of his own, but in my eyes theres no question he was the greatest defender ever.

                Whats overlooked is how Dick Butkus was LT before LT (not as dominant but the closest to LT). Butkus was close to as dominant, but he lacked the pass rushing element that LT had.

                Oddly enough, and maybe bf51 can back me on this bc im sure he knows about Butkus, I personally feel that Butkus couldve changed the game before LT did. Butkus would blitz up the middle and was unstoppable. Papa Bear just didn't do it often enough.

                I think if Butkus rushed the passer as much as LT did, he couldve had 130 or so sacks as well from the MIKE position. Maybe change blocking assignments the way LT did.
                Butkus could very well have had close to 100+ sacks, sacks weren't tracked as a stat until 1982.

                sig by BoneKrusher

                PACKERS BADGERS BREWERS BUCKS

                Comment


                • #23
                  Originally posted by senormysterioso View Post
                  A few that deserve mention,
                  -DT Warren Sapp, he was a force. Pass rusher, run stopper. He changed how teams played every week
                  -DE Bruce Smith, great combination of size and speed/athletic ability.

                  I don't know if people will accept this one or not, but I'm gonna throw it out there; Sean Taylor. The last two years of his career/life he was becoming one of the most disruptive forces I've seen on a football team. He covered so much ground and did everything you ask a safety to do and did it well. Wish we could have seen him really reach his full potential.
                  So many great players you could add:

                  Mike Curtis
                  Cornelius Bennett
                  Roger Wehrli
                  Mel Blount
                  Bob Lilly (imagine nobody mentioning Bob Lilly)

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Originally posted by senormysterioso View Post
                    Butkus could very well have had close to 100+ sacks, sacks weren't tracked as a stat until 1982.
                    i know that. but even so, i don't think he had 100 sacks. he didn't blitz often enough.

                    Butkus played in an era where he was as big as the linemen in front of him, and he was a standup MIKE. Teams didn't know how to block that.

                    Some will say that Deacon deserves to be higher on the list than Butkus, but I think Butkus gets a slight nod over him.

                    Deacon had help on that dline. The Fearsome Foursome was dominant. Butkus really didn't have anybody like that to play next to.

                    One knock on Butkus was his coverage. The guy wasn't Ray Lewis in coverage, but the guy was good in coverage. He played his zone, he played it well, and if you came in his area he'd crack you in your ribs.

                    His real downfall, and perhaps critique, was his health. The guy couldn't stay healthy. He blames Chicago for that, but who knows.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Originally posted by bigbluedefense View Post
                      Its hard comparing pass rushers from different eras, but nobody impacted an offensive gameplan or the way offenses played in general than LT.

                      Deacon was dominant. Reggie was dominant. But they didn't change anything. Teams blocked them the same way they did the greats before them.

                      That said, Titletown is right. He's not necessarily in a league of his own, but in my eyes theres no question he was the greatest defender ever.

                      Whats overlooked is how Dick Butkus was LT before LT (not as dominant but the closest to LT). Butkus was close to as dominant, but he lacked the pass rushing element that LT had.

                      Oddly enough, and maybe bf51 can back me on this bc im sure he knows about Butkus, I personally feel that Butkus couldve changed the game before LT did. Butkus would blitz up the middle and was unstoppable. Papa Bear just didn't do it often enough.

                      I think if Butkus rushed the passer as much as LT did, he couldve had 130 or so sacks as well from the MIKE position. Maybe change blocking assignments the way LT did.
                      While Butkus was something special and he was first. I still think Lambert was more prolific. It was basically Butkus, Lambert, LT, and then a break until Ray Ray. Butkus until 73', Lambert from 74'-84', and LT from 81'-93'.

                      Sacks were officialy kept up with until 82'. Lambert retired in 84' after missing most of the season because of injury and had 23.5 sacks. So he could have in the range of 110-130 sacks as well.


                      Silverback....still the best.

                      +rep to Jakey for the sig

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by terribletowel39 View Post
                        While Butkus was something special and he was first. I still think Lambert was more prolific. It was basically Butkus, Lambert, LT, and then a break until Ray Ray. Butkus in the until 73', Lambert from 74'-84', and LT from 81'-93'.

                        Sacks were officialy kept up with until 82'. Lambert retired in 84' after missing most of the season cause of injury and had 23.5 sacks. So he could have in the range of 110-130 sacks as well.
                        Im torn on my greatest MIKE of all time list. I have Butkus as the consensus #1, but ive fluctuated between Lambert and Singletary as #2.

                        Ray Lewis is probably #4 on my list.

                        As for MIKEs in general, I think Sam Huff was the first of the "modern" MIKEs. Tom Landry invented the 4-3 defense with the Giants and built it around Sam Huff.

                        So Huff is the first true 4-3 MIKE to play the game, and is an obvious HOFer, but I think Butkus was the most dominant of the bunch.

                        If we go by eras, it was probably

                        Huff 50s
                        Nietscke 60s
                        Butkus 70s
                        Lambert 70s/early 80s
                        Singletary 80s
                        Jr Seau 90s
                        Ray Lewis 2000s

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Yea, its almost too impossible to rank them. I put Lambert ahead because of my Steeler bias. But it's not like it can't be argued. It's not that far out there.

                          Thing that impresses me the most, is Lambert played at around 210 lbs probably. His rookie year he weighed in almost under 200 lbs. I'm almost positive Butkus played at around 230+ atleast. Which was around the size of most linemen.


                          Silverback....still the best.

                          +rep to Jakey for the sig

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by CC.SD View Post
                            Yes he is, and so is Joe.

                            Junior! Junior Junior Junior, too many people just remember the broken down version that has been lurking around the NFL the last few years.
                            No he's not and neither is Joe.

                            See that was subjective and easy.

                            Junior? and how just old are you wise one?

                            What do the vikings and marijuana have in common? Every time you put them in a bowl
                            they get smoked.

                            2010-2011 Super Bowl Champions
                            Hint:Not the Bears.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              I think the hagiography of these old players from the 70s and 80s, most of whom none of us have ever seen play, is a little ridiculous. I can tell you that twenty years from now Ray Lewis will be "the best LB of all time." Because there will be a few people pumping him up based on nostalgia and the young people will simply accept it.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Originally posted by Shiver View Post
                                I think the hagiography of these old players from the 70s and 80s, most of whom none of us have ever seen play, is a little ridiculous. I can tell you that twenty years from now Ray Lewis will be "the best LB of all time." Because there will be a few people pumping him up based on nostalgia and the young people will simply accept it.

                                While I agree, I don't think it is proper to list the study of Ray Lewis as hagiography. ha

                                What do the vikings and marijuana have in common? Every time you put them in a bowl
                                they get smoked.

                                2010-2011 Super Bowl Champions
                                Hint:Not the Bears.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X

                                Debug Information