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Joe Flacco/Matt Ryan

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  • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
    I'm a hypocrite!
    At least you admit it.

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    • I also admit that I have no desire to get into some long, dumb argument in which stats are spun and definitive statements are made despite a lack of definitive proof. Been there, done that, not interested. It's not like anyone's mind will be changed.

      Besides, if you think Flacco hasn't played up to being the #18 pick in the Draft, you're obviously not a reasonable, knowledgeable person in my book.
      Last edited by Halsey; 10-20-2010, 12:10 AM.

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      • I accept your surrender. Let's move on.

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        • Obviously we need more time to evaluate both of them, I just haven't been all that impressed with Ryan. I think his rookie year while great, was a bit exaggerated. And while he's grown the past 2 years since then, he hasn't grown at the pace everyone expected. It just seems like he's reached a ceiling, if he improves, I don't see him improving by much over what he is already.

          But again, it's ony 5 games into his 3rd year, so its obviously too early to say anything just yet, so i'm probably reaching premature conclusions.

          Having that said, I do think he's good enough. And at the end of the day, that's all you ask for.

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          • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
            Every QB needs good people coaching and playing around him. Just because QB is the most important position doesn't mean others don't matter. Arguing this or that QB needs a good running game, coaching, defense, etc goes for every QB. There's no such thing as a QB who 'carries' a team. How can a QB carry a team single handedly when he's not even on the field half the game.
            how is any of this relevant at all? at all? like in any way? enormous scarcrow here, no one was saying the other positions dont matter, but theyre definitely not quite as important though.

            youve made quite a few of these absurd comments in this thread where youre hypocritical then create scarecrows to tear down then follow it up with broad generalizations where you essentially say nothing.

            and no a QB doesnt 'single handedly carry a team' no one said that that i saw and obvs thats not true, but some teams lean on their qbs more than others so the qb is carrying more of the burden than usual, therefore hes picking up the slack for the rest of his teammates who arent meeting the demands. in team sports no player can single handedly carry a team, but they can pick up the slack of other players and carry a lot more than there share of the load, thus they are sometimes said to be 'carrying the team,' but never single handedly.

            Originally posted by Halsey View Post
            I also admit that I have no desire to get into some long, dumb argument in which stats are spun and definitive statements are made despite a lack of definitive proof. Been there, done that, not interested. It's not like anyone's mind will be changed.
            Bolded is a lot like what you do in almost every thread and have done repeatedly in this one. make a generalization or broad sweeping statement that cant really be proven either way or is just extremely stupid like the ones above that i wasted my time pointing out.

            I dont even think Ryan sucks, but hes not nearly as good as youre making him out to be and to some he hasnt lived up to the lofty expectations set by his rookie year. hes been above average, nothing more. I think hes got Brady/Eli potential personally, but hes still a work in progress where the progress seems to have slowed a little.

            killswitch is completely right here, youre not responding because you cant, youre just being a huge homer then not defending your points.
            Last edited by hockey619; 10-20-2010, 09:55 AM.
            Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
            Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

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            • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
              Matt Ryan went 9-5 last year, through for 22 TDs and nearly 3,000 yards. It's a myth that Ryan was bad last year. You either didn't watch him or play too much fantasy football if you think he was terrible.

              and you said you didnt want stats being 'spun' or have stats coming up because theyre a waste?

              hmm interesting that thats exactly what youre doing....
              Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
              Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

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              • There's just no point in debating with someone who thinks Kyle Orton, Jay Cutler, Michael Vick, etc. are better than Matt Ryan. 32 out of 32 NFL teams would rather have Ryan than those guys.

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                • Originally posted by hockey619 View Post
                  and you said you didnt want stats being 'spun' or have stats coming up because theyre a waste?

                  hmm interesting that thats exactly what youre doing....
                  Yep, win-loss record, passing yards and touchdowns are just stats. They don't have any meaning beyond that.

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                  • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                    There's just no point in debating with someone who thinks Kyle Orton, Jay Cutler, Michael Vick, etc. are better than Matt Ryan. 32 out of 32 NFL teams would rather have Ryan than those guys.

                    What happened to not liking when 'definitive statements were made WITHOUT DEFINITIVE PROOF?'

                    Orton has far and away outplayed Ryan this year. The other two are arguable as i showed and you ignored before.

                    Really, there is no point in debating when youre wrong.
                    Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
                    Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                      Yep, win-loss record, passing yards and touchdowns are just stats. They don't have any meaning beyond that.
                      yeah and his 14 INTs and five fumbles were conveniently left out as was his mediocre completion percentage and average/above average all around rating. leaving the negative out and just highlighting the positives is definitely 'twisting the numbers' just done very blatantly and poorly.

                      But those one are just stats right? those are the ones that when brought up dont count cause theyre against your case so thats not fair? or are you gunna claim those numbers are twisted because once again youre being a huge hypocrite and homer?
                      Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
                      Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

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                      • Here's a definitive statement for you: Kyle Orton is playing on a one year contract.

                        That's a fact and there's a reason for it. Don't let Orton's marginally better stats fool you. The Broncos would be begging him to sign an extension if he was on Ryan's level. Do you think Matt Ryan would play on a one year contract? Are you really that naive?

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                        • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                          Yep, win-loss record, passing yards and touchdowns are just stats. They don't have any meaning beyond that.
                          are you aware that you are contradicting your self so many times in this theard?
                          RIP Sean Michael Taylor

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                          • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                            Young, Favre, Vick, Cutler, McNabb and Orton over Ryan? Please. Not if you want to win games in 2010. I won't bother with the lame arguments people will make for why any of those guys is better than Ryan right now. If you can't see Ryan is better, I can't help you.
                            This is a great post. "hey you dont agree with me so your obviously wrong!".


                            Originally posted by WMD
                            Jesse realizing Walt was Santa Claus could really shake things up.
                            Originally posted by gpngc
                            I don't know how old you are, but if you can get to 24/25 without getting arrested or killed, you've done well for yourself lol.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Halsey View Post
                              Here's a definitive statement for you: Kyle Orton is playing on a one year contract.

                              That's a fact and there's a reason for it. Don't let Orton's marginally better stats fool you. The Broncos would be begging him to sign an extension if he was on Ryan's level. Do you think Matt Ryan would play on a one year contract? Are you really that naive?
                              Its definitively stupid though and completely wrong. and that I know for a FACT.

                              His contract is given to him based on A) past performance and B) projection for the future. His current pay isnt based on what hes doing RIGHT NOW because when he signed the deal NO ONE KNEW HED PLAY THIS WELL, THEYRE NOT PSYCHIC


                              What in the name of all things sane and holy does the years on his contract have to do with ANYTHING??????? Are you ******* serious? Its not based on how hes playing THIS YEAR if it was signed in the past. you gotta admit you were incredibly wrong to bring that up.

                              So far this year Orton is outplaying Ryan.
                              Last edited by hockey619; 10-20-2010, 10:25 AM.
                              Originally posted by Thumper/JBCX/Bixby
                              Orton will never be in the same class as the Drew Brees or the Peyton Mannings or the Tom Bradys of the world. Kevin Kolb has the potential to be that kind of player.

                              Comment


                              • We're not talking about just this year, and Orton hasn't been outplaying Ryan. We're talking about misguided people thinking Matt Ryan is a below average starting QB. Guys like Kyle Orton do not rank above Ryan as a starting QB on any reasonable list. Ryan is making franchise QB money on a winning team. Kyle Orton has to play on a one year contract for a bad team.

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