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  • #46
    Originally posted by BeerBaron View Post
    Then maybe move Pettigrew to LT...... ;)
    I don't understand why you want to play this game. Do you really want me to break down Jerry Angelo's draft history? Dan Bazuin? Juaquin Iglesias? Chris Williams? The Jay Cutler trade? Cutler threw a **** ton of INTs last year and now he can't finish games because the line can't protect him. Enjoy your 3-1 record but I'll take Mayhew going forward.

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    • #47
      Originally posted by Scotty D View Post
      I don't understand why you want to play this game. Do you really want me to break down Jerry Angelo's draft history? Dan Bazuin? Juaquin Iglesias? Chris Williams? The Jay Cutler trade? Cutler threw a **** ton of INTs last year and now he can't finish games because the line can't protect him. Enjoy your 3-1 record but I'll take Mayhew going forward.
      I only think the Pettigrew pick takes heat because Oher was on the board which is a stupid reason. I thought it was a good pick at the time, and I still think it was a solid pick. Pettigrew can block and he is an excellent compliment to a young Stafford and someone to run routes underneath Calvin Johnson and the 2-3 defenders he brings with him. He just has bad hands, but he's young and most of the time he uses his hands and not his body, so there is a decent chance that improves.

      Thanks to BK for the sig

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      • #48
        The Lions FIGHT like no other. Thus why I'd take them over the other 3, who have given up a few times.


        Follow Me on Twitter!
        https://twitter.com/ShanePHallam

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        • #49
          Originally posted by Scotty D View Post
          I don't understand why you want to play this game. Do you really want me to break down Jerry Angelo's draft history? Dan Bazuin? Juaquin Iglesias? Chris Williams? The Jay Cutler trade? Cutler threw a **** ton of INTs last year and now he can't finish games because the line can't protect him. Enjoy your 3-1 record but I'll take Mayhew going forward.
          I make fun of JA being stupid all the time. I did it last night in the discussion thread saying how we'll surely fail to address the o-line situation this year, waiting until the 7th round to draft an uber-raw developmental type while drafting an undersized receiver, small school defensive lineman and an in the box safety with our first 3 picks.

          You guys put the fate of your franchise saving QB in Jeff ******* Backus who barely even moved to block Peppers on that play and who in his career, has been at the very best, average.

          If you passed on him for a DB...or another o-lineman...or a d-lineman....or basically anything useful position, I'd lay off.

          But Pettigrew is a ******* BLOCKING TE!! Very few things in the football world piss me off more than the thought of a BLOCKING TE. DO NOT USE A FIRST ROUND PICK ON A BLOCKING TE. I would take an athletic pass catching TE 100 out of 100 times and just teach him to try and block a little than take a blocking TE.

          Or how about this novel idea? Just use a ******* 6th lineman if you want to block. Do both. Jumbo package, 2 TEs, one receiver and one converted lineman.

          I mean for ***** sake, slap a number in the 80s on one your backup tackles so he check in at the position without having to check in as eligible if that's the problem.

          That is why I have a major problem with what the Lions did there. Even if they hated Oher's guts and took him completely off their draft board, they should have drafted something more useful than a blocking ******* TE.

          And don't even get me started on how pissed I am that we gave money and a roster spot to ******* Manumalefatass. God damn how I hate blocking ******* TEs.

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          • #50
            Originally posted by Shane P. Hallam View Post
            The Lions FIGHT like no other. Thus why I'd take them over the other 3, who have given up a few times.
            The thing is i think they can only get kicked in the nuts so many times before they fold, they need to hurry up and get a win before the team says **** it.
            RIP Sean Michael Taylor

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            • #51
              Originally posted by BeerBaron View Post
              I make fun of JA being stupid all the time. I did it last night in the discussion thread saying how we'll surely fail to address the o-line situation this year, waiting until the 7th round to draft an uber-raw developmental type while drafting an undersized receiver, small school defensive lineman and an in the box safety with our first 3 picks.

              You guys put the fate of your franchise saving QB in Jeff ******* Backus who barely even moved to block Peppers on that play and who in his career, has been at the very best, average.

              If you passed on him for a DB...or another o-lineman...or a d-lineman....or basically anything useful position, I'd lay off.

              But Pettigrew is a ******* BLOCKING TE!! Very few things in the football world piss me off more than the thought of a BLOCKING TE. DO NOT USE A FIRST ROUND PICK ON A BLOCKING TE. I would take an athletic pass catching TE 100 out of 100 times and just teach him to try and block a little than take a blocking TE.

              Or how about this novel idea? Just use a ******* 6th lineman if you want to block. Do both. Jumbo package, 2 TEs, one receiver and one converted lineman.

              I mean for ***** sake, slap a number in the 80s on one your backup tackles so he check in at the position without having to check in as eligible if that's the problem.

              That is why I have a major problem with what the Lions did there. Even if they hated Oher's guts and took him completely off their draft board, they should have drafted something more useful than a blocking ******* TE.

              And don't even get me started on how pissed I am that we gave money and a roster spot to ******* Manumalefatass. God damn how I hate blocking ******* TEs.
              So the 8 for 91 yards yesterday is pretty good for a blocking TE? He's not just a blocking TE and is still getting going from the ACL injury last year.

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              • #52
                Originally posted by Scotty D View Post
                So the 8 for 91 yards yesterday is pretty good for a blocking TE? He's not just a blocking TE and is still getting going from the ACL injury last year.
                When he is a Tony Gonzalez and both receiving and blocking well, fine, I'll concede. He's not there yet and that's not what he was seen as when he was a prospect. His big thing was that he was such a good blocker....which is a good quality if you're also a good receiver. Then hell yeah, be taken in the first round.

                But a TE who basically blocks and that's it....just convert a tackle. Seriously.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by umphrey View Post
                  I disagree. They are young across the board, with some holes and inconsistency. Vernon Davis can get open down the field consistently, but they need rookies Anthony Davis and Mike Iupati to pass block and Alex Smith to read it and make the throw. Sure I like Davis and Iupati, but with only 4 starts, they are much better run blockers than pass blockers and struggle picking up out of the ordinary blitzes. The same thing happens on defense. Clements is overrated (or he just sucks). Their secondary as a whole is pretty poor. Their outside linebackers are bad which forces Willis and Spikes to take on responsibilities they shouldn't have to, such as becoming big time pass rushers. Justin Smith is overrated as well.
                  Davis and Iupati have had two bad games and two good ones but when they have looked good, they have looked great. Give them a few more starts and they are set. Clements has been fantastic this season and it is a shame that one stupid play, after what was a great play to begin with, overshadowed that. Spencer is also a very good corner and Goldson and Mays are solid safeties. The secondary is actually above average, good at corner and average at safety. And Justin Smith is not overrated, he is one of the best 3-4 DEs in the league. The outside linebackers are not bad either, they just don't have one dominant pass rusher ala Ware or Matthews. They have a handful of guys that can get 5-7 sacks a year and put decent pressure on QBs, though.

                  I'm calling time of death on this argument. the 9ers aren't that talented. Either they are on year 3 (4?) of ridiculous underachieving or they've been overrated and either way the benefit of the doubt shouldn't be there anymore. Vernon and Crabtree, okay. there's obviously some talent in the LB corps. Mays. But Detroit is building something and the pieces are better than san fran's assortment. CALVIN, Best, Suh, Stafford, Delmas, even Pettigrew...i'm a fan of all these guys and the list keeps going.
                  From top to bottom the 49ers have a better team than Detroit outside of QB and WR, and it is not even an argument if you ask me.
                  Last edited by abaddon41_80; 10-04-2010, 05:18 PM.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Scotty D View Post
                    So the 8 for 91 yards yesterday is pretty good for a blocking TE? He's not just a blocking TE and is still getting going from the ACL injury last year.
                    he also had some painful painful drops on catches that might have won the game for them. I like Pettigrew and think he will be a top TE in the next year or so but I'd still throw him back in a second for OL help.

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                    • #55
                      I loved the Pettigrew pick, he was solid and safe. You know what you were getting with him. Let's not act like Oher was a considered sure-fire elite tackle. He was a boom or bust guy, and I (and the other teams that passed on him) weren't sold. Ravens were a team that could afford to gamble with him, and the Lions were not a team that could gamble with a 1st round pick.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by BRAVEHEART View Post
                        I loved the Pettigrew pick, he was solid and safe. You know what you were getting with him. Let's not act like Oher was a considered sure-fire elite tackle. He was a boom or bust guy, and I (and the other teams that passed on him) weren't sold. Ravens were a team that could afford to gamble with him, and the Lions were not a team that could gamble with a 1st round pick.
                        Depends on who you ask in regard to Oher. I had him as surefire. Had him rated - easily - as the Top OT. I know a lot of other people did too. It was the media and stupid scouts who just had way too long to think about him that brought his stock down.

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                        • #57
                          Originally posted by nepg View Post
                          Depends on who you ask in regard to Oher. I had him as surefire. Had him rated - easily - as the Top OT. I know a lot of other people did too. It was the media and stupid scouts who just had way too long to think about him that brought his stock down.
                          Draftniks were always high on him but NFL teams were obviously leery.

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                          • #58
                            The fact they passed on Oher doesn't help the Pettigrew cause...but he was a TE. Usually TE is one of the last pieces a team picks up when they're rebuilding. Just about any other position I would argue would have helped them more.

                            And even then, usually some very good ones are available after round 1.

                            I just hate almost everything about the pick.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by BeerBaron View Post
                              The fact they passed on Oher doesn't help the Pettigrew cause...but he was a TE. Usually TE is one of the last pieces a team picks up when they're rebuilding. Just about any other position I would argue would have helped them more.
                              I used to agree with you, but I disagree that you build a team piece-wise ie one unit after another.

                              I like the way Detroit is going about it. Take safe picks that are at the top of your draft board. Make sure to get a QB as soon as possible. If you don't like anyone with a #1 pick, then get a couple guys in the middle/late rounds and maybe a mid/low tier FA.

                              My point is, there are so many busts, you are almost always best off taking the player you have the most confidence in. 2 years ago the Lions needed to upgrade 20 or more starters, so why take a risk to fill one spot when you feel you have a sure thing at another spot? Then develop a game plan to utilize your studs and hide your duds. That is what a good, modern coach does. Hell, even if you only know how to draft quarterbacks but you are really good at it, draft them, develop them, and trade them. That is called the 90's Packers Ron Wolf strategy.

                              Thanks to BK for the sig

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Originally posted by umphrey View Post
                                I used to agree with you, but I disagree that you build a team piece-wise ie one unit after another.

                                I like the way Detroit is going about it. Take safe picks that are at the top of your draft board. Make sure to get a QB as soon as possible. If you don't like anyone with a #1 pick, then get a couple guys in the middle/late rounds and maybe a mid/low tier FA.

                                My point is, there are so many busts, you are almost always best off taking the player you have the most confidence in. 2 years ago the Lions needed to upgrade 20 or more starters, so why take a risk to fill one spot when you feel you have a sure thing at another spot? Then develop a game plan to utilize your studs and hide your duds. That is what a good, modern coach does. Hell, even if you only know how to draft quarterbacks but you are really good at it, draft them, develop them, and trade them. That is called the 90's Packers Ron Wolf strategy.
                                See, I don't what made Pettigrew better than a lot of other guys usually available later. He was a very good blocking TE in college, ok, that's nice, and he was good enough as a receiver. I don't think he has elite receiving TE skills, so the best you're getting there is a blocking TE who is also decent at catching. Something like a Heath Miller perhaps. And a perennially great Steelers team can afford to take a TE like that at the very end of the first round...add a final piece to the puzzle.

                                And if you're really sold that they shouldn't have picked Oher, here is a list of other guys I personally would have preferred them see over taking Oher.

                                Alex Mack - Very good center. A position that is becoming more and more important in the league. Raiola isn't anything spectacular...could even move one of them to guard and upgrade two spots. Who knows....he too would have been a spectacularly safe pick if that is the route they were trying to go.

                                Oher - obvious

                                Peria Jerry - Their d-line sucked just as bad as any other area on the field. They have Suh now, but at the time they had some real ****.

                                Vontae Davis - Turning into a pro bowl caliber corner. He'd be looking damn good for the Lions now as their secondary is perhaps their biggest area of weakness still.

                                Clay Matthews - LB or DE...**** it, he's dominating right now and would be worked in somewhere in that front 7 and be a major force.

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